RE 15-16: PETER CHIARELLI: SOMEBODY WAITS

Peter Chiarelli was hired in the days and hours after the Edmonton Oilers won the McDavid draft lottery. There had to be a moment in time when he thought ‘this can’t possibly go sideways’ and yet the pressure is on full screw 12 months later. Can he get this team balanced, can he get this team six good defensemen true—without sacrificing the heart of a brilliant forward group? (Somebody Waits)

chiarellis trades

  1. He should be fired immediately. I disagree. No matter how much you hate his first summer, he is a veteran GM—first guy hired with a resume since Larry freaking Gordon—and one summer is a very small window for a GM.
  2. Why didn’t he get more done? He actually accomplished quite a bit. No. 1 goalie, top 4D in Sekera and I will add Mark Letesu as a useful—if unspectacular—addition. The problem is there was so much to do, not the least of which is replacing Jeff Petry on RHD—something that is Job 1 only 18 months after he was traded. Lordy.
  3. Yeah, but Reinhart, ugh. We have been over it on this blog, once or twice. I count Reinhart and Korpikoski as being negatives last summer. Both were problematic and it is fair to criticize Chiarelli for them. I would suggest the impact on the 2015-16 team—Reinhart being unable to help, Korpikoski hurting the team—were gigantic factors. That said, firing him, or suggesting he be fired without a massive summer, seems shortsighted to me. It is a marathon not a sprint, and we endured Steve Tambellini’s extreme caution. You can die that way, too.
  4. Why were his mistakes so massive?  Chiarelli has no fear of risk and because of it there are going to be trades like the two we saw last summer. Suspect we will get at least one more this summer, still plenty of work to do.
  5. You are predicting a bad trade from a GM you endorse? Yes. You know, Glen Sather made some crappy trades, too.
  6. Name one. Mark Messier.
  7. Reinhart was worse. Oh, go to hell.
  8. Name one more. Martin Rucinsky, Adam Graves, Miro Satan. Look, general managers do not bat .400, there are sharks in every NHL city. You can’t use one summer as a hammer to fire a guy. If you ran your business like that you would be broke by Christmas. I understand venting on the internet, but this is serious business. The Oilers are broken. Big job and it is going to involve some risk, with balance and depth so very far away.
  9. PC in Free agency? Did well, in my opinion. Added Sekera and Letestu. People criticize Sekera for not getting his shot through, but he posted a 30-point season. He is a two years removed from a 40-point year, I could see him doing it again on a team with a better power play.
  10. What was his biggest mistake last summer? Not buying out Nikita Nikitin and using that money on a bona fide RHD—even Cody Franson.
  11. Hindsight is 20/20 man. I said it at the time.
  12. Franson was not helpful. He had a decent year at evens and they didn’t use him on the power play. That is more about deployment than failure.
  13. Okay, fine. One more summer. I think he gets five years.
  14. When will this team make the playoffs? Depends on how quickly Chiarelli can get the defense straightened away, and how much of the forward group he has to use in order to procure it.
  15. Allow me to re-phrase. Can the team make the playoffs in 2017? Yes.
  16. Music! HOW? I count Andrej Sekera, Oscar Klefbom, Brandon Davidson and Mark Fayne as capable NHL defensemen. If PC can add two legit RHD—veterans—then, yes I think they can make it.
  17. One a two-way guy and another a puck mover? I think they need a two-way guy, but if they grabbed Hamonic and Demers (as a for instance) and did not procure an offensive defenseman I would be more than fine with it.
  18. What about the power play? Oilers could use Sekera and a RH forward as the hammer. They did that (kind of) a few times in the early part of the century.
  19. They gave up because it didn’t work. They gave up because of a shorthanded goal. Petr Sykora was fabulous in that role.
  20. Is there anything Chiarelli can do for you to turn on him? Sure.
  21. What? Trade Taylor Hall or the Nuge for less than full value.
  22. What is full value for Hall? An impact defenseman capable of playing in all disciplines, changing the look of the defense overnight.
  23. P.K. Subban? Why not.
  24. He isn’t coming here. Sure. I know.
  25. Who else? There really isn’t anyone who would be available. It is a dangerous conversation. It’s like that scene in Paper Moon where Tatum O’Neil is robbing the store owner blind by having her Dad distract him and then cleverly asking for change while his brain overloads.
  26. What in hell are you talking about? Let’s say you and I are talking about a trade, Hall for Hampus Lindholm. I want more than the blue, and you start talking about your first-round pick and now I am pulled into the conversation. You say ‘hey, you need a RHC, right? I have a guy!’ and bingo bango I am looking at a center, a first-round draft pick plus the blue. And then you say ‘but you know, I can’t give Lindholm and all that for Hall, but I could put Vatanen in there’.
  27. Huzzah! I’m Tatum O’Neil! You’re Tatum O’Neil.
  28. Why this song? It’s a lonely song for a lonely job. I think making a trade must be like buying a house. You are absolutely in control until the moment you buy it. And in Chiarelli’s case, you are not certain about your house inspector.

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146 Responses to "RE 15-16: PETER CHIARELLI: SOMEBODY WAITS"

  1. Doug McLachlan says:

    LT, I know the Bickell trade dampened any thought of Chicago dealing Shaw but the cap overages (for Panarin and other performance bonuses from last year) have hit the Hawks for a further $3M on the cap this year because they didn’t have sufficient room to put them under last season’s cap.

    http://www.generalfanager.com/teams/chicago-blackhawks

    They still have to fill their roster out so there may still be leverage to pull something out of Chicago – even Shaw.

  2. spoiler says:

    The reason GMs don’t “bat .400” is because a big part of their job is predicting the future, and that, while fun when there’s nothing on the line, is a fool’s errand in real life.

  3. Lowetide says:

    spoiler:
    The reason GMs don’t bat “.400” is because a big part of their job is predicting the future, and that, while fun when there’s nothing on the line, is a fool’s errand in real life.

    Yes. And, strengthening your point, experience counts for a lot, meaning PC is a far better bet than MacT. Always.

  4. Rondo says:

    “It’s tough to make predictions, especially about the future.”

    ―Yogi Berra

  5. zatch says:

    Even very good GM’s make clearly foolish moves (Chicago and LA are currently dealing with the fallout from their poor calls, Francis just signed Ward for more than 1 year league min). Issue for PC is he came into such a tirefire, those standard mistakes can be disastrous, where otherwise they’d merely be troublesome.

    Or to put it this way, PC inherited a plane 100ft off the deck. Everytime he loses altitude, it’s a goddamn Mayday.

  6. Katz the Elder says:

    “Who else? There really isn’t anyone who would be available. It is a dangerous conversation. It’s like that scene in Paper Moon where Tatum O’Neil is robbing the store owner blind by having her Dad distract him and then cleverly asking for change while his brain overloads”.

    When they start flashing small bills to even things out… RUN.

    (Ceterum autem censeo @hallsyIV non vende)

  7. Tire Fire says:

    Dear Peter Chiarelli,

    I don’t think “glasses” are what you think they are. They are there to help you see, not help others see you as some sort of villain from the future.

    – A concerned citizen

  8. AsiaOil says:

    “I would suggest the impact on the 2015-16 team—Reinhart being unable to help, Korpikoski hurting the team—were gigantic factors.”

    Put down the pipe LT – really – a 4th line winger and a rookie 3rd pair dman were GIGANTIC factors. These were trivial compared to the injuries, systems chaos, absent leadership and depth issue left behind. Almost after-thoughts in terms of impact. The traffic will return next week on it’s own without the hyperbole.

  9. maxwell_mischief says:

    PAPER MOON
    one of my favourite films of all time!

    I liked PC when he came in
    now his moustache and put on some berta beef / oilers stress lbs
    looks kinda classless
    that’s just optics though
    I trust he is a smart dude who has put some capable teams together
    probably won’t be thrilled by a lot of the moves this summer
    but here’s hoping the Oilers are better next year

    and if not

    meeeeeeeeeeeeehhhhhhhhhhhhh – what’s another year? AMIRITE

  10. Lowetide says:

    AsiaOil:
    “I would suggest the impact on the 2015-16 team—Reinhart being unable to help, Korpikoski hurting the team—were gigantic factors.”

    Put down the pipe LT – really – a 4th line winger and a rookie 3rd pair dman were GIGANTIC factors. These were trivial compared to the injuries, systems chaos, absent leadership and depth issue left behind. Almost after-thoughts in terms of impact. The traffic will return next week on it’s own without the hyperbole.

    The traffic is at peak level, June is always the busiest month. Chiarelli invested a great deal on GR and badly needed that acquisition to play. I know you don’t like my viewpoint on this, but it has never changed.

    And Korpikoski was beyond poor. He impacted the team a lot because Todd McLellan played him a lot. I light a candle every night, hoping Chiarelli will save McLellan from himself in regard to the Finn.

  11. RexLibris says:

    Name one. Mark Messier.
    Reinhart was worse. Oh, go to hell.

    You changed this.

    The first version was more accurate and echoes my feelings as well.

    I remember reading the paper the day after the trade was made. It was how I’d found out about it. Kept asking myself “who the hell is Steve Rice? and if he’s replacing Moose why the hell have I never even heard of him?” Not sure if Neil Smith had something on Slats there or if it was just Sather being generous.

    I remember a few years ago, Hockeybuzz had some discussion topic for fans from all over asking “who’s the best player your team ever traded away?”

    I read that and thought to myself “are you kidding me?”

    We could cut out the top two from our list and still give nearly every other team in the league a run for their money with Fuhr, Anderson, Coffey, Kurri and others.

    I’ve been wondering recently, for fans who lived through the dismantling during the 90s (1988 inclusive), are we going to be better prepared for the departure of Hall or will we tap into some repressed rage going back decades?

    Frankly, I’d just rather not find out either way.

  12. Магия 10 says:

    [An injured] Reinhart being unable to help out [if Davey did not deliver] , Korpikoski hurting the team—were gigantic factors.”

    FTFY.

    Reinhart? A gigantic factor down the road, perhaps? Last season, meh.

    AsiaOil: So what other deal did he miss? There are none.

    There was a big deal Chia missed. Trying to sneak Davey through waivers.

  13. AsiaOil says:

    Lowetide,

    We can go on like this forever – but what if they make the picks – that would have impacted the season even more as in zero help now or in the forseeable future. You are wildly exaggerating the impact of Reinhart and assuming Chia turned down some other “better” deal. Like what? Only young high end dmen moved last year were Hamilton and Jones. Chia offered more for the former and those picks would not get you anywhere near the latter. So what other deal did he miss? There are none.

    As for Korpse – you do know that Gordon was paid more and scored 4 points last season? He was awful and worse than Korpse plus $300,000 more expensive. I can make the case he won that trade last year as Korpse out-scored him by a very wide margin (2-2-4 versus 10-12-22). You complete ignore how bad Gordon was last year. Chia wasn’t on the bench last either if I’m not mistaken. If they send Korpse down it’s a minor hit this season – and if they can trade him without retaining salary then it’s a win given how Anton Lander bad Gordon was last season.

    You’re huffing and puffing here man 🙂

  14. spoiler says:

    Lowetide: Yes. And, strengthening your point, experience counts for a lot, meaning PC is a far better bet than MacT. Always.

    Yup yup yup!

    Lowetide: The traffic is at peak level, June is always the busiest month.

    This might be the saddest indictment of the 40 years we’ve been wandering the desert out of all the sad indictments. And they are legion. June… the month manna falls from heaven… maybe.

    *Looks furtively around for his statue of the golden whale.*

  15. Centre of attention says:

    RexLibris,

    I’ve got a pretty half-decent looking effigy of Peter Chiarelli.

    Should we burn it in Churchill square or outside OEG’s HQ? I’m leaning to Churchill, there would definitely be more exposure.

  16. Kiltymcbagpipes says:

    Is it just me or is anyone else thinking Chia is going to say screw it and trade for Lucic’s rights now making it much more likely we trade the #4 pick for defensive help? You gotta think the #4 overall pick plus one of the big 3 would get you a pretty good defenseman no? Does Goligoski signing mean Arizona would consider trading OEL for Tkachuk now?

  17. AsiaOil says:

    Hey I agree and a number of people here were certain that sending Davidson was “no big deal” and no big loss even if he was claimed. That would have been a monstrous error but it was avoided by keeping 8 dmen on the roster for a while to give Davy a bit of time. Avoiding that mistake was the best GM move of the entire season – and sometimes the best moves are the mistakes avoided. Chia sewered last season on purpose to let most of the rotten fish contracts that MacT negotiated go away – and to “see what they had” on the roster. The emergence of Davidson was the direct result of that patience – but gets little or no credit around here.

    Магия 10: There was a big deal Chia missed. Trying to sneak Davey through waivers.

  18. RexLibris says:

    Centre of attention:
    RexLibris,

    I’ve got a pretty half-decent looking effigy of Peter Chiarelli.

    Should we burn it in Churchill square or outside OEG’s HQ? I’m leaning to Churchill, there would definitely be more exposure.

    I’m pretty happy with Chiarelli right now. The beginning of the season and the first 1/3rd was no screaming hell, but how he navigated the trade deadline was encouraging.

  19. Centre of attention says:

    Kiltymcbagpipes:
    Is it just me or is anyone else thinking Chia is going to say screw it and trade for Lucic’s rights now making it much more likely we trade the #4 pick for defensive help? You gotta think the #4 overall pick plus one of the big 3 would get you a pretty good defenseman no? Does Goligoski signing mean Arizona would consider trading OEL for Tkachuk now?

    Why would trading for Lucic’s rights make it more likely that he trades the #4?

    He would be more likely to trade Hall at that point IMO.

    And Goligoski has nothing to do with OEL moving. Goligoski would be fantastic on second pair with a guy like Murphy. OEL-Stone Goligoski-Murphy would be a heck of a top 4. Tippet is a smart man and this young Chyka guy seems to know what he’s doing as well.

  20. Visually better says:

    Crazy to think that Hendricks, Fayne, Ference, Korpokoski, and Letestu add up to over 13 MILLION DOLLARS… The things we could do with that money…

  21. Centre of attention says:

    RexLibris: I’m pretty happy with Chiarelli right now. The beginning of the season and the first 1/3rd was no screaming hell, but how he navigated the trade deadline was encouraging.

    I was joking around about you bringing up rage fueled memories of the past . IE Messier and such getting traded.

    I’m about eye level with Chiarelli right now too. He has a lot on his plate and some very questionable advisers.

  22. Visually better says:

    Slepy=Hendricks, Davidson,nurse,reinhart>/=Fayne, a peg-legged pirate > Ference, Pakarinen > Korpokoski, Lander= Letestu.

    Assuming a peg legged pirate doesnt cost you 5m, you could easily replace those guys and still have 8-9 Mill left over…

  23. sliderule says:

    AsiaOil:
    Lowetide,

    We can go on like this forever – but what if they make the picks – that would have impacted the season even more as in zero help now or in the forseeable future. You are wildly exaggerating the impact of Reinhart and assuming Chia turned down some other “better” deal. Like what? Only young high end dmen moved last year were Hamilton and Jones. Chia offered more for the former and those picks would not get you anywhere near the latter. So what other deal did he miss? There are none.

    As for Korpse – you do know that Gordon was paid more and scored 4 points last season? He was awful and worse than Korpse plus $300,000 more expensive. I can make the case he won that trade last year as Korpse out-scored him by a very wide margin (2-2-4 versus 10-12-22). You complete ignore how bad Gordon was last year. Chia wasn’t on the bench last either if I’m not mistaken. If they send Korpse down it’s a minor hit this season – and if they can trade him without retaining salary then it’s a win given how Anton Lander bad Gordon was last season.

    You’re huffing and puffing here man

    You are absolutely right.

    LT is hanging out too much with the Corsi guys😄

  24. stush18 says:

    Kiltymcbagpipes:
    Is it just me or is anyone else thinking Chia is going to say screw it and trade for Lucic’s rights now making it much more likely we trade the #4 pick for defensive help? You gotta think the #4 overall pick plus one of the big 3 would get you a pretty good defenseman no? Does Goligoski signing mean Arizona would consider trading OEL for Tkachuk now?

    No. But I think it means you could swap picks and grab Connor Murphy.

    He started a higher number of games in the defensive end, and his goals for share was positive, despite a slightly neg corsi. His relative corsi was not that bad tho.

    I can’t find a split for the season, because I’m sure he took on a lot more reaponsiblilty the second half, and the coyotes really struggled the last half. I’m sure it would have affected his numbers.

    I would need someone better with numbers than me to look into him, but I’m pretty confident with running some form of

    Sekera-fayne
    Klef-vatanen
    Davidson-Murphy

  25. godot10 says:

    zatch:
    Even very good GM’s make clearly foolish moves (Chicago and LA are currently dealing with the fallout from their poor calls, Francis just signed Ward for more than 1 year league min). Issue for PC is he came into such a tirefire, those standard mistakes can be disastrous, where otherwise they’d merely be troublesome.

    Or to put it this way, PC inherited a plane 100ft off the deck. Everytime he loses altitude, it’s a goddamn Mayday.

    Ward got the 2nd year for the expansion draft. Carolina needs to expose a goaltender that will meet the minimum requirements.

  26. Centre of attention says:

    Reid Wilkins ‏@ReidWilkins 2m2 minutes ago
    Stars reporter Mike Heika believes both Demers and Russell will find new teams. Says inconsistency is Demers biggest drawback. #yeg #Oilers

    There is still hope for Demers. Light a candle.

  27. Richard S.S. says:

    Chiarelli thought he needed 1 Goalie, when it turned out he needed 3 or more. He thought he needed 3 Defenseman, when it turned out he needed 3 more. He thought he needed a couple of Forwards, when it turned out he needed at least two more. Chiarelli thought he’d done a good job with what everyone outside thought was a bad team. He didn’t realize what a black hole of a disaster the Oilers really were. He shouldn’t be fired, just extended. If he fixes this mess he desrves a lifetime contract.

  28. spoiler says:

    Centre of attention:
    Reid Wilkins ‏@ReidWilkins2m2 minutes ago
    Stars reporter Mike Heika believes both Demers and Russell will find new teams. Says inconsistency is Demers biggest drawback. #yeg #Oilers

    There is still hope for Demers. Light a candle.

    I wish it was more than Demers, because I don’t think he brings enough. And I wish there wouldn’t be a bidding war for him, but there will be.

    I’d personally aim higher, and I’d be willing to sacrifice an asset or two to do so.

  29. Centre of attention says:

    spoiler: I wish it was more than Demers, because I don’t think he brings enough.And I wish there wouldn’t be a bidding war for him, but there will be.

    I’d personally aim higher, and I’d be willing to sacrifice an asset or two to do so.

    Aim higher where? If you keep aiming higher and higher eventually the gun is pointing at your head and you are going to shoot yourself in the f*cking face.

    Keep calm, sign Demers. Maybe Vatanen shakes loose for less than we think. I remain hopeful.

  30. Bag of Pucks says:

    Man, you read down that left column: Marincin, Gernat, Scrivens, Schultz, Purcell, Larsen, and you gotta give Chia credit. Not a keeper in the bunch.

    He identified the deadwood in a hurry and moved it out for assets or cap space.

    That ‘s good GM’ing.

    Dithers would’ve held that stock until it was toilet paper.

  31. Centre of attention says:

    Bag of Pucks,

    Marincin-Larsen would make a pretty sweet 3rd pair.

    just sayin’ 😉

    *edit* glad they chose Davey over Marincin, though.

  32. AsiaOil says:

    I like Demers up to a point – and that point is reached at $5 million per year – he’s simply not worth that or more. But will he get that much? He sure could in this market but I’d be wary of betting that Jim Nill doesn’t know his business or the value of this player. Demers addresses a problem short term but likely means our defense will be stuck at simply OK for the duration of the Sekera/Demers contracts given the amount of cap those two would suck up. Do we really want to spend $10+ on our 2nd pair?

    A more reasonable idea might be to run Davidson as the 3rd pair RD with GR to start the year with Sekera-Fayne as the 2nd pair. If Davey adapts well he can move up to 2nd pair with Sekera after Christmas. Deal Nurse for Hamonic or similar – incrementally improve – and try to make another step up at the trade deadline.

    spoiler: I wish it was more than Demers, because I don’t think he brings enough.And I wish there wouldn’t be a bidding war for him, but there will be.

    I’d personally aim higher, and I’d be willing to sacrifice an asset or two to do so.

  33. Bag of Pucks says:

    Centre of attention:
    Bag of Pucks,

    Marincin-Larsen would make a pretty sweet 3rd pair.

    just sayin’

    *edit* glad they chose Davey over Marincin, though.

    To my eye, Marincin looked like Randy Gregg without the mean streak.

    That’s a joke btw ; )

    Marincin and Larsen as 3rd pairing in LA with the big bad Kings having the last change? Yikes.

  34. Woodguy says:

    AsiaOil,

    We can go on like this forever – but what if they make the picks – that would have impacted the season even more as in zero help now or in the forseeable future. You are wildly exaggerating the impact of Reinhart and assuming Chia turned down some other “better” deal. Like what? Only young high end dmen moved last year were Hamilton and Jones. Chia offered more for the former and those picks would not get you anywhere near the latter. So what other deal did he miss? There are none.

    I’m on record with Svechnikov (6’2 RW) and Meloche (6’2″ RD) at 16 and 33.

    My argument would be that both of these players helped the Oilers as much as Reinhart did this past year.

    As for Korpse – you do know that Gordon was paid more and scored 4 points last season? He was awful and worse than Korpse plus $300,000 more expensive. I can make the case he won that trade last year as Korpse out-scored him by a very wide margin (2-2-4 versus 10-12-22). You complete ignore how bad Gordon was last year. Chia wasn’t on the bench last either if I’m not mistaken. If they send Korpse down it’s a minor hit this season – and if they can trade him without retaining salary then it’s a win given how Anton Lander bad Gordon was last season.

    Oilers Goal Share with Korpse on the ice: 32.00%

    Oilers Goal Share with Korpse off the ice: 46.32%

    Yeah, that’s a pretty significant impact given that he averaged 11:07 5v5 per game.

  35. Centre of attention says:

    Bag of Pucks: To my eye, Marincin looked like Randy Gregg without the mean streak.

    That’s a joke btw ; )

    Marincin and Larsen as 3rd pairing in LA with the big bad Kings having the last change? Yikes.

    I was mostly joking around. 😛

  36. speeds says:

    Bag of Pucks:
    Man, you read down that left column: Marincin, Gernat, Scrivens, Schultz, Purcell, Larsen, and you gotta give Chia credit. Not a keeper in the bunch.

    He identified the deadwood in a hurry and moved it out for assets or cap space.

    That ‘s good GM’ing.

    Dithers would’ve held that stock until it was toilet paper.

    re: Schultz. Chia signed him when there were more than a few suggesting it might not be a bad idea to walk away or trade him.

  37. Seismic Source says:

    Injuries not being as bad, McDavid being even more dominant and Talbot not imploding at the start of the year have got to be worth a few points. Not to mention there will be no Schultz for an entire season.

    If either Griff or Nurse can legitimately stay in the lineup based on play, we will be moving on up with the status quo.

    Do not overpay for Demers.
    I’d love to see an offer sheet. If we are going to throw money at a defenseman and overpay, then lets pick a good one.

  38. stevezie says:

    Two of Chiarelli’s better moves last year were keeping Davidson and Nitkinin.

    Yes, Nitkinin.

    I remain convinced that they opened the buyout window so they coyld buy out La Femme if the thing they were working on came together but i didn’t. So Chia said, “Screw it, we’re not making the playoffs, may as well eat the bullet this year and have extra cap space next summer for the stagnant cap many are already predicting.”

    I have no evidence for this, but it fits the available facts and makes a whole lot of sense. Now we harvest.

  39. spoiler says:

    Centre of attention: Aim higher where? If you keep aiming higher and higher eventually the gun is pointing at your head and you are going to shoot yourself in the f*cking face.

    WTF?

  40. Woodguy says:

    spoiler: I wish it was more than Demers, because I don’t think he brings enough.And I wish there wouldn’t be a bidding war for him, but there will be.

    I’d personally aim higher, and I’d be willing to sacrifice an asset or two to do so.

    If they only get one I’d prefer Barrie or Hamonic.

    I don’t think Barrie’s off the market.

  41. Woodguy says:

    Seismic Source:
    Injuries not being as bad, McDavid being even more dominant and Talbot not imploding at the start of the year have got to be worth a few points. Not to mention there will be no Schultz for an entire season.

    If either Griff or Nurse can legitimately stay in the lineup based on play, we will be moving on up with the status quo.

    Do not overpay for Demers.
    I’d love to see an offer sheet. If we are going to throw money at a defenseman and overpay, then lets pick a good one.

    Seeing as Chia traded for Nielsen it makes sense that they opened the 2nd buy out window for Scrivens but then found out he made too little to buy out.

  42. spoiler says:

    Woodguy: If they only get one I’d prefer Barrie or Hamonic.

    I don’t think Barrie’s off the market.

    I agree on Barrie, and I doubt the window to the Hamonic shop is completely shuttered either.

    And then there’s the cap grief in St. Loo, Pitt, NYR etc where maybe we can be part of a ménage a trois, if we aren’t the preferred “rest stop”.

    There’s the ongoing Trouba trouble in Winnie.

    And there are teams that didn’t meet expectations this year who maybe want to shake things up… we never hear who’s available from these teams till after it happens.

  43. Pescador says:

    Seismic Source,

    Do not overpay for Demers.
    Not only will the price for Demers be over $5 mil per, I’m guessing the price for the Oilers would be that much higher then say Detriot as an example. Then there’s term, NMC I’m guessing.
    This is what makes a trade on the draft floor so important in my mind,
    Too many unknowns in Free Agency. Always long on suitors, short on supply
    My worst fear (oiler wise) is; Draft Tkachuk, trade Yak & 32 ov for a 4-5 LH dman.

  44. stush18 says:

    Woodguy:
    AsiaOil,

    We can go on like this forever – but what if they make the picks – that would have impacted the season even more as in zero help now or in the forseeable future. You are wildly exaggerating the impact of Reinhart and assuming Chia turned down some other “better” deal. Like what? Only young high end dmen moved last year were Hamilton and Jones. Chia offered more for the former and those picks would not get you anywhere near the latter. So what other deal did he miss? There are none.

    I’m on record with Svechnikov (6’2 RW) and Meloche (6’2″ RD) at 16 and 33.

    My argument would be that both of these players helped the Oilers as much as Reinhart did this past year.

    As for Korpse – you do know that Gordon was paid more and scored 4 points last season? He was awful and worse than Korpse plus $300,000 more expensive. I can make the case he won that trade last year as Korpse out-scored him by a very wide margin (2-2-4 versus 10-12-22). You complete ignore how bad Gordon was last year. Chia wasn’t on the bench last either if I’m not mistaken. If they send Korpse down it’s a minor hit this season – and if they can trade him without retaining salary then it’s a win given how Anton Lander bad Gordon was last season.

    Oilers Goal Share with Korpse on the ice: 32.00%

    Oilers Goal Share with Korpse off the ice: 46.32%

    Yeah, that’s a pretty significant impact given that he averaged 11:07 5v5 per game.

    How would have svechnikov and meloche helped more than Reinhart? Reinhart was not losing us games, the lack of depth was.

    Also could you explain goalshare? I’ve seen you using those stats a lot lately.

  45. Water Fire says:

    spoiler: I agree on Barrie, and I doubt the window to the Hamonic shop is completely shuttered either.

    And then there’s the cap grief in St. Loo, Pitt, NYR etc where maybe we can be part of a ménage a trois, if we aren’t the preferred “rest stop”.

    There’s the ongoing Trouba trouble in Winnie.

    And there are teams that didn’t meet expectations this year who maybe want to shake things up… we never hear who’s available from these teams till after it happens.

    Good points. I would let the first cap stress trade happen (I am sure the GM’s are aware of what a trade is based on) and then put a call in to the GM who has whatever is left that you want, who just saw the window start to close. I see Chia as having this type of acumen and brass.

  46. OF17 says:

    AsiaOil,

    We’re not betting that Jim Nill doesn’t know Demers. When Florida, Atlanta, and Dallas traded for Campbell, Byfuglien, Sharp, and Ladd, they weren’t betting Bowman was an idiot. It’s a cap issue. Dallas has tons of money up front and at G, most of which is difficult to impossible to trade, and has a lot of young D bubbling under. So you make due with what you have, move out soon-to-be-expensive UFAs, and try to fill the holes. What you paint as Nill being smarter than others is more him being pinned against a wall than anything.

    I also object to this sense that Jim Nill is some GM god. This is the guy that has over $10 million tied up in sub-replacement goaltending and the same guy who will likely lose both of his top-2 D because he acquired a 34 year old Oduya at $3.75 million. Seguin was a coup, and he got Johns included in the Sharp deal, but Nill is far from an infallible GM. Flashy yes, but I wouldn’t trade Chiarelli for him.

    Which brings me to your point about Demers and Sekera. Having either of the two on your 2nd pairing is an extreme luxury, the type of thing that contenders luck into every once in a while. In the meantime, having them on your first pair, or one first, one second, whatever, is exactly what a team with an abysmal defense needs to pull itself from the basement. The other option, pulling a Tambellini and waiting for the roster to sort itself out, is nowhere near appealing to me. And Hamonic isn’t getting moved without Snow taking a big reputation hit, so we’re best to forget he was even available.

    I respect you as a poster quite a bit, but you’re out to lunch on this one.

  47. Pescador says:

    My other greatest fear is my wife leaving me for Stevezie,
    Who if I remember correctly is some sort of Millionaire Dong Model.
    I can just picture the 2 of them together, laughing at me & my pathetic posts
    DAMN YOU STEVEZIE !!!

  48. Lowetide says:

    Pescador:
    My other greatest fear is my wife leaving me for Stevezie,
    Who if I remember correctly is some sort of Millionaire Dong Model.
    I can just picture the 2 of them together, laughing at me & my pathetic posts
    DAMN YOU STEVEZIE !!!

    It haunts us all.

  49. Water Fire says:

    I want to post and comment on this from TSN:

    “Ballots show Crosby edged Kessel in tight Conn Smythe vote”

    Should read:

    “Ballots show crow like voters like shiny baubles and couldn’t care less about why Kessel had the room to be so productive despite a completely one dimensional game he elevated temporarily above completely selfish”

  50. Woodguy says:

    stush18: How would have svechnikov and meloche helped more than Reinhart? Reinhart was not losing us games, the lack of depth was.

    Also could you explain goalshare? I’ve seen you using those stats a lot lately.

    Reinhart’s effect on the team was a fart in a wind storm.

    Saying that two players who played in the QMJHL helped the Oilers as much as him is to say he didn’t help at all.

    GF% is fancy +/-

    I could have used corsi as it shows the same awfulness but people relate to goals easier.

    When I used GF% ito best to include PDO to make sure there’s no small sample funny business.

  51. Ryan says:

    speeds: re: Schultz.Chia signed him when there were more than a few suggesting it might not be a bad idea to walk away or trade him.

    Lowetide being the first to make that suggestion that I can recall.

  52. Ryan says:

    Woodguy: Reinhart’s effect on the team was a fart in a wind storm.

    Saying that two players who played in the QMJHL helped the Oilers as much as him is to say he didn’t help at all.

    GF% is fancy +/-

    I could have used corsi as it shows the same awfulness but people relate to goals easier.

    When I used GF% ito best toinclude PDO to make sure there’s no small sample funny business.

    I feel bad for GM’s getting a black mark on their record for a trade I doubt they initiated or wanted.

    I’ll go to my grave doubting that Chiarelli wanted to make that deal.

  53. Lowetide says:

    Renaud Lavoie ‏@renlavoietva 5m5 minutes ago

    NHLPA will agree to exercise the escalator clause (5%) but wants to make sure everybody’s on board before making it official.

  54. Woodguy says:

    GF% is Goals For %

    To see part of a player’s impact see how his Team’s /defends with him on the ice and how they score/defend with him off the ice.

  55. Mr DeBakey says:

    Tire Fire:
    Dear Peter Chiarelli,

    I don’t think “glasses” are what you think they are. They are there to help you see, not help others see you as some sort of villain from the future.

    – A concerned citizen

    Yes, you wear them so that you’re seeing things better:

    http://www.rickstv.com/seeing/auto.htm

    https://youtu.be/xa-YGJqKHyg

  56. Cameron says:

    Pescador,

    ‘Millionaire Dong Model’ is going to be the name of my next band

  57. Mr DeBakey says:

    RexLibris: I remember reading the paper the day after the trade was made. It was how I’d found out about it. Kept asking myself “who the hell is Steve Rice? and if he’s replacing Moose why the hell have I never even heard of him?” Not sure if Neil Smith had something on Slats there or if it was just Sather being generous.

    Most [all] of those trades from that era had another component.
    A contribution to the “Save Pocklington’s Financial Ass Fund”

  58. Centre of attention says:

    spoiler: WTF?

    I was meaning to say, if you keep aiming higher and higher eventually you are going to cripple yourself with what you have to give up. As in the price for aiming that high is not worth the return.

    Bad analogy, yes.

  59. Mr DeBakey says:

    AsiaOil: As for Korpse – you do know that Gordon was paid more and scored 4 points last season?

    Yes
    But Gordon is no longer under contract.
    Korpikoski remains.

  60. Kiltymcbagpipes says:

    Centre of attention: Aim higher where? If you keep aiming higher and higher eventually the gun is pointing at your head and you are going to shoot yourself in the f*cking face.

    LMAO. Centre of Attention wins comment of the week. For some reason I pictured George Carlin saying that. Lol.

  61. Mr DeBakey says:

    Woodguy: I’m on record with Svechnikov (6’2 RW) and Meloche (6’2″ RD) at 16 and 33.
    My argument would be that both of these players helped the Oilers as much as Reinhart did this past year.

    Are you implying that Reinhart didn’t help the Oilers this year?
    But his dad played in the NHL!
    So did Matthew Tkachuk’s btw.

    Svechnikov and Meloche would’ve been sweet.

  62. stush18 says:

    Ryan: I feel bad for GM’s getting a black mark on their record for a trade I doubt they initiated or wanted.

    I’ll go to my grave doubting that Chiarelli wanted to make that deal.

    I think he panicked when Hamilton was traded

    Woodguy: Reinhart’s effect on the team was a fart in a wind storm.

    Saying that two players who played in the QMJHL helped the Oilers as much as him is to say he didn’t help at all.

    GF% is fancy +/-

    I could have used corsi as it shows the same awfulness but people relate to goals easier.

    When I used GF% ito best toinclude PDO to make sure there’s no small sample funny business.

    Wouldn’t goalshare be inherently smaller for players playing on lesser lines and higher for players on higher?

    I mean of course their goalshare is low? Because Taylor hall and Connor mcdavid are better players.

    What is the goalshare of korp, letestu, Hendricks, etc?

    For the record I think korp needs to go. His cap is too high.

  63. Pescador says:

    Was listening to the fan 590 this afternoon on my way to Butt F. Saskatchewan to visit inlaws (double wammy). 1st, What a couple of sap sucking twerps, I met vaccum cleaner salesmen less douchey then those 2.
    2nd, I caught the tale end of some interview they were referencing where Joe Sakic- “something, something, Not trading Tyson Barrie”
    Too lazy to hunt for a source, too stupid to know how to post it here.
    Make of it what you will, me personally,
    The sky is falling.

  64. Water Fire says:

    What about Eberle for Ristolainen?

    They are short at quality RW for their nice centres and have RD depth. He had a terrible +/- and maybe crazy M doesn’t like that.

  65. Pescador says:

    Cameron:
    Pescador,

    ‘Millionaire Dong Model’ is going to be the name of my next band

    Great, your band will be named after my dog.
    Wiener of course

  66. Mr DeBakey says:

    One final comment.
    For now.

    Listened to most of he N Ireland vs Ukraine game on Not-The-Team 1260 today.
    Those announcers from Radio Ulster were the best play by play guys, any sport, I’ve heard in years.
    They were a hoot.

  67. mustang says:

    stush18: No. But I think it means you could swap picks and grab Connor Murphy.

    There is no way they do that.Give up Connor Murphy to move up from 7 to 4. Connor Murphy is a damn good dman not happening. Would you do that if you were running the Coyotes?

  68. Bag of Pucks says:

    speeds: re: Schultz.Chia signed him when there were more than a few suggesting it might not be a bad idea to walk away or trade him.

    Schultz would’ve solved one of their biggest problems if he would’ve learned to play defence. I can see why they gave him a second chance. Hope is a powerful drug.

  69. godot10 says:

    Woodguy:
    AsiaOil,


    I’m on record with Svechnikov (6’2 RW) and Meloche (6’2″ RD) at 16 and 33.

    My argument would be that both of these players helped the Oilers as much as Reinhart did this past year.

    Reinhart played in the top 4D with Osterle for most of the games post trade deadline. That is a pretty big contribution that you seem to be ignoring.

  70. stush18 says:

    Water Fire:
    What about Eberle for Ristolainen?

    They are short at quality RW for their nice centres and have RD depth. He had a terrible +/- and maybe crazy M doesn’t like that.

    They have a lot of right handed prospects. And right handed players.

    Eichel, Reinhart, baptiste, Bailey, fasching all shoot right and are either ready for NHL action or soon to be. I believe Murray rushed his rebuild, but they are on the right path.

  71. AsiaOil says:

    Agree completely – we traded one year of a player who was clearly sinking into oblivion (Gordon did just that) for 2 years of a player that Chia bet might be a reclamation project. Boyd Gordon was awful last year – 4 points and -12 Rel Corsi in 10 minutes a night. Korpse was a worse possession player but out-scored Gordon by a mile. Everybody knows Korpse was bad – but compared to Gordon – he was better which is a trick. Gordon’s comp last year was Lander basically.

    So year 1 to Chia as you have to assess Korpse against the other contract which was Gordon. Year 2 is unclear – depends on whether Korpse is traded, bought out, demoted, plays bad, plays better. But just outright saying that Korpse was an awful acquisition (he was) without referencing the garbage that went the other way is not being fair.

    Mr DeBakey: Yes
    But Gordon is no longer under contract.
    Korpikoski remains.

  72. Centre of attention says:

    Kiltymcbagpipes: LMAO. Centre of Attention wins comment of the week. For some reason I pictured George Carlin saying that. Lol.

    It was actually a terrible analogy. Haha.

    My point was this though: You go chasing high end defense and you’re probably going to end up either empty handed or losing the trade.

    Keep calm, sign Demers.

  73. mustang says:

    Centre of attention: Aim higher where? If you keep aiming higher and higher eventually the gun is pointing at your head and you are going to shoot yourself in the f*cking face.

    So you are describing suicide. That would be PC trading Hall for anybody other than Subban or a Hedman. If Hall is traded I hope and pray it’s to the east, can’t have him killing us for the next 10 yrs.

  74. stush18 says:

    mustang: There is no way they do that.Give up Connor Murphy to move up from 7 to 4. Connor Murphy is a damn good dman not happening. Would you do that if you were running the Coyotes?

    You want to draft local talent Mathew tkatchuk to help Arizona with fans. Local talent and all that. They only have domi on left wing right now. Although reider and and duck air shoot lefts a well, they play off wing.

    Apparently Arizona offered a swap of picks, next a years first, and domi for Mathews. Murphy seems a lot smaller price to pay for another local boy.

  75. Water Fire says:

    Pescador:
    My other greatest fear is my wife leaving me for Stevezie,
    Who if I remember correctly is some sort of Millionaire Dong Model.
    I can just picture the 2 of them together, laughing at me & my pathetic posts
    DAMN YOU STEVEZIE !!!

    For it’s absurdity, for me, this pathetic post might be knocking on the pantheon of Tide’s door.

  76. Pescador says:

    Bag of Pucks,
    Hope is a powerful drug.

    I need some sort of Oilers rehab

  77. Pescador says:

    Water Fire: For it’s absurdity, for me, this pathetic post might be knocking on the pantheon of Tide’s door.

    I don’t understand your Greek metaphor.
    Are you laughing with me, or at me?
    Hopefully both

  78. Ryan says:

    godot10: Reinhart played in the top 4D with Osterle for most of the games post trade deadline.That is a pretty big contribution that you seem to be ignoring.

    I’m guessing that he meant that the Oilers finished second last in the entire NHL last season which is pretty much where they would have finished +/- 29 games of Griffin Reinhart.

  79. godot10 says:

    Let us not waste our time in idle discourse!
    Let us do something, while we have the chance!
    It is not every day that we are needed. Not indeed that we personally are needed.
    Others would meet the case equally well, if not better.
    To the Oilogosophere they were addressed, those cries for help still ringing in our ears!
    But at this place, at this moment of time, the Oilers are us, whether we like it or not.
    Let us make the most of it, before it is too late!
    Let us represent worthily for once the foul brood to which a cruel fate consigned us!
    What do you say?

    It is true that when with folded arms we weigh the pros and cons we are no less a credit to our species. The tiger bounds to the help of his congeners without the least reflection, or else he slinks away into the depths of the thickets.

    But that is not the question. What are we doing here, that is the question.
    And we are blessed in this, that we happen to know the answer.
    Yes, in this immense confusion one thing alone is clear.
    We are waiting for Demers to come—

  80. mustang says:

    Woodguy: If they only get one I’d prefer Barrie or Hamonic.

    I don’t think Barrie’s off the market.

    I don’t think he’s off the market either.He has been as good as gone for the past 2 months now he’s staying…I don’t buy that for a second.

  81. Water Fire says:

    stush18: They have a lot of right handed prospects. And right handed players.

    Eichel, Reinhart, baptiste, Bailey, fasching all shoot right and are either ready for NHL action or soon to be. I believe Murray rushed his rebuild, but they are on the right path.

    True but would having a proper top RW appeal because they don’t have that?

  82. LadiesloveSmid says:

    Stauffer seems to be beating the “draft Tkachuk the future #1LW so Hall is made expendable this summer” drum. Oilers brass must have a lot more confidence in Draisaitl than I. I’m not convinced he can drive a line without Hall (because he hasn’t). If McDavid is your Crosby, Hall is your Malkin. Get your Letang with different assets. Just don’t trade either of those damn players. Anyone else before them, hold off on RNH until his value regresses back. Nurse, 4th overall, Draisaitl, Eberle, whatever. I probably don’t trade Drai AND 4th, one or the other. If you trade Drai.. Dubois is his expansion-proof replacement

  83. stush18 says:

    Water Fire: True but would having a proper top RW appeal because they don’t have that?

    Reinhart played right wing. They moved him when girgensons locked down the second centre spot

  84. Water Fire says:

    Pescador: I don’t understand your Greek metaphor.
    Are you laughing with me, or at me?
    Hopefully both

    I think it was hilarious. The imagery you created there, intentionally or not, is absurd and that appeals to my sense of humour. If that’s what you would call it 🙂

  85. Water Fire says:

    stush18: Reinhart played right wing. They moved him when girgensons locked down the second centre spot

    Right but Reinhart is pretty green, I wonder if they wouldn’t like a young vet to augment the top line.

    The value to them is a prime young vet in a position they are weak in for a green RHD in a position they have depth in, both offensive. There is value both ways.

  86. mustang says:

    stush18: You want to draft local talent Mathew tkatchuk to help Arizona with fans. Local talent and all that. They only have domi on left wing right now. Although reider and and duck air shoot lefts a well, they play off wing.

    Apparently Arizona offered a swap of picks, next a years first, and domi for Mathews. Murphy seems a lot smaller price to pay for another local boy.

    I understand what your saying, but it would be awful stupid to give up a good young dman to move up 3 spots to draft a player whose dad once played on your team. Tkatchuk will probably be a good player but that’s a good example of what not to do.

    From the Oilers perspective I would do that trade in a heart beat.

  87. stush18 says:

    mustang: I understand what your saying, but it would be awful stupid to give up a good young dman to move up 3 spots to draft a player whose dad once played on your team. Tkatchuk will probably be a good player but that’s a good example of what not to do.

    From the Oilers perspective I would do that trade in a heart beat.

    Well he was raised there as well.

    And I like Murphy I would love to have him here

  88. Pouzar says:

    LadiesloveSmid: ’m not convinced he can drive a line without Hall (because he hasn’t).

    Drai with Hall 51.6%
    Drai w/o Hall 53.3%

    Just sayin

  89. LadiesloveSmid says:

    Pouzar: Drai with Hall 51.6%
    Drai w/o Hall 53.%

    Just sayin

    Drai w/ Hall: 2.32 ES P/60
    Drai w/o Hall: 1.12 ES P/60

    Just saying!!

  90. Pouzar says:

    LadiesloveSmid: Drai w/ Hall: 2.32 ES P/60
    Drai w/o Hall: 1.12 ES P/60

    Just saying!!

    and???

  91. Centre of attention says:

    LadiesloveSmid:
    Stauffer seems to be beating the “draft Tkachuk the future #1LW so Hall is made expendable this summer” drum. Oilers brass must have a lot more confidence in Draisaitl than I. I’m not convinced he can drive a line without Hall (because he hasn’t). If McDavid is your Crosby, Hall is your Malkin. Get your Letang with different assets. Just don’t trade either of those damn players. Anyone else before them, hold off on RNH until his value regresses back. Nurse, 4th overall, Draisaitl, Eberle, whatever. I probably don’t trade Drai AND 4th, one or the other. If you trade Drai.. Dubois is his expansion-proof replacement

    For what it’s worth, Stauffer bangs many different drums depending on the time of year.

  92. Cameron says:

    Pescador: Great, your band will be named after my dog.
    Wiener of course

    You’ll have to remind me, are you Leather, or Pinky?

  93. frjohnk says:

    Water Fire:
    What about Eberle for Ristolainen?

    They are short at quality RW for their nice centres and have RD depth. He had a terrible +/- and maybe crazy M doesn’t like that.

    I’ll drive EBERLE to the airport for that deal and I’m a fan of EBERLE.

    I think Buffalo would be crazy to trade Ristolianen. He has all the tools to be a dominant number 1.

    If EBERLE gets Ristolianen, I’m asking what else is Murray willing to trade.

  94. prairieschooner says:

    Perhaps the Oilers should pick projected Number 1 D man
    Olli Juolevi of London

  95. OilClog says:

    So Oilers are going to replace Hall, going into his 6th season, a true legitimate top line player.

    And replace him with a rookie, that isn’t as dominate as Hall was at the same age.

    Fuck.

  96. stush18 says:

    frjohnk: I’ll drive EBERLE to the airport for that deal and I’m a fan of EBERLE.

    I think Buffalo would be crazy to trade Ristolianen.He has all the tools to be a dominant number 1.

    If EBERLE gets Ristolianen, I’m asking what else is Murray willing to trade.

    Ya if only we could have drafted a dman like that…

  97. LadiesloveSmid says:

    Pouzar: and???

    just a quality 1st liner with Hall and a 4th liner without at ES! played so little without him mind you, which is why I said he hasn’t proven to drive a line!

  98. Pouzar says:

    LadiesloveSmid: just a quality 1st liner with Hall and a 4th liner without at ES! played so little without him mind you, which is why I said he hasn’t proven to drive a line!

    What were Hall’s numbers?

  99. stevezie says:

    Pescador:

    My other greatest fear is my wife leaving me for Stevezie,
    Who if I remember correctly is some sort of Millionaire Dong Model.
    I can just picture the 2 of them together, laughing at me & my pathetic posts
    DAMN YOU STEVEZIE !!!

    Lowetide: It haunts us all.

    Both these messages made me chuckle out loud, if only because they reminded me a handsome young would-be Edmonton MP’s outside the box campaign ad from last fall. If you didn’t see it, and judging from the voting results, you didn’t…
    https://youtu.be/uuub6jo9-bM

  100. frjohnk says:

    Pouzar: What were Hall’s numbers?

    Like Hall, the numbers were rotten 🙂

  101. Pouzar says:

    We sure have it all figured around here when it comes to the kids.
    Sweet Jezzuz we are tough on our youngins

    Drai is a 4th liner w/o Hall and Nurse will be lucky to be a top 4.

    Good times.

    I think Pitino said it best.

  102. Gerta Rauss says:

    spoiler: And then there’s the cap grief in St. Loo, Pitt, NYR etc where maybe we can be part of a ménage a trois, if we aren’t the preferred “rest stop”.

    And there are teams that didn’t meet expectations this year who maybe want to shake things up… we never hear who’s available from these teams till after it happens.

    My dark horse is MIN and Spurgeon

  103. Woodguy says:

    stush18,

    Wouldn’t goalshare be inherently smaller for players playing on lesser lines and higher for players on higher?
    I mean of course their goalshare is low? Because Taylor hall and Connor mcdavid are better players.
    What is the goalshare of korp, letestu, Hendricks, etc?
    For the record I think korp needs to go. His cap is too high.

    Yes, your 3rd and 4th liners will have worse goal share, but 32% is horrific and a 14% difference is almost as bad.

    There were 350 NHL Forwards who played at least 500 5v5 minutes last year.

    Korpse ranks 342nd in GF% ON

    Gordon ranked 344th. Ha!

  104. LadiesloveSmid says:

    Pouzar: What were Hall’s numbers?

    2.46 P/60 with Drai
    1.79 without

    Hall’s P/60 down from his other full seasons.

    He scored well with RNH (2.67 P/60) this season. Really just didn’t score with McDavid, Letestu, Lander. Did Hendricks ever centre him?

  105. Woodguy says:

    Gerta Rauss: My dark horse is MIN and Spurgeon

    Wonder if Chia would entertain solving MIN’s cap problem like CAR did for CHI?

    Ask for Dumba, with the rest of the trade being Pominville (RW, 34 this fall, 3 years left at $5.6MM) for something like 2 picks.

    Not sure I’d do that, 3 years for an almost done Pominville is a long time at $5.6MM

  106. Gerta Rauss says:

    Woodguy: Wonder if Chia would entertain solving MIN’s cap problem like CAR did for CHI?

    I was thinking Vanek

    *ducks

  107. LadiesloveSmid says:

    Pouzar:
    We sure have it all figured around here when it comes to the kids.
    Sweet Jezzuz we are tough on our youngins

    Drai is a 4th liner w/o Hall and Nurse will be lucky to be a top 4.

    Good times.

    I think Pitino said it best.

    In 350 minutes apart, as a 19YO. Don’t give me that, not what I was saying at all. Don’t trade Hall as he’s a driving force while others aren’t or aren’t ready yet.

    “Oh so you think they HAVE to keep everybody forever with no defence?!!” Man it’s easy to twist words and my panties! Awful

  108. Pouzar says:

    LadiesloveSmid: 2.46 P/60 with Drai
    1.79 without

    Hall’s P/60 down from his other full seasons.

    He scored well with RNH (2.67 P/60) this season. Really just didn’t score with McDavid, Letestu, Lander.Did Hendricks ever centre him?

    Hall-Nuge-Drai

    It was a thing.

  109. Woodguy says:

    LadiesloveSmid: 2.46 P/60 with Drai
    1.79 without

    Hall’s P/60 down from his other full seasons.

    He scored well with RNH (2.67 P/60) this season. Really just didn’t score with McDavid, Letestu, Lander.Did Hendricks ever centre him?

    Where are you getting pts/60 WOWY?

  110. Woodguy says:

    Pouzar: Hall-Nuge-Drai

    It was a thing.

    That trio scored an unreal (and unsustainable) 4.5 goals/60 when together this year in their 93 minutes together.

    Hall and DrySaddle were an ok, but not great 2.6 goals/60 when together and without RNH on the ice.

    Saddle is trending nicely, but he’s 2 years away from being competent enough to center a top 6 NHL line without big time help on each wing.

  111. spoiler says:

    Gerta Rauss: I was thinking Vanek

    *ducks

    Haha! Minny was running through my brain too. I was sitting here looking at their roster wondering how to get Spurgeon or Dumba without taking Pominville or Vanek, lol.

    Looks tough and word is they’re committed to seeing if Vanek can Lazarus his career… which means Pominville.

    We’d have to install an ice tilter under the rink in the new digs for it to work. So not completely out of the question…

  112. Woodguy says:

    Pouzar: and???

    He was 19 years old and playing top opposition in the NHL?

  113. Woodguy says:

    Gerta Rauss: I was thinking Vanek

    *ducks

    I don’t think you can get Dumba for Vanek, he’s only got a year left.

    I know Bickell only had a year left, but CHI was in much worse shape than MIN and Dumba’s more valuable than Teravainen. Not to mention that Panarin ate Teravainen’s lunch.

  114. LadiesloveSmid says:

    Woodguy: Where are you getting pts/60 WOWY?

    by hand off of hockey analysis so it’s a bit rough, also seems to be some inconsistencies of ES points on the site itself. (i.e 47P on one page, 48 the next)

  115. LadiesloveSmid says:

    Pouzar: Hall-Nuge-Drai

    It was a thing.

    Yep. Why RNH’s and Drai’s numbers can be so high. That line was dominant for a stretch, some here would like to see it again next season.

  116. Woodguy says:

    godot10: Reinhart played in the top 4D with Osterle for most of the games post trade deadline.That is a pretty big contribution that you seem to be ignoring.

    I went to check on this but naturalstatrick isn’t co-operating with me right now.

    Leave it with me.

  117. Pouzar says:

    Woodguy: I don’t think you can get Dumba for Vanek, he’s only got a year left.

    I know Bickell only had a year left, but CHI was in much worse shape than MIN and Dumba’s more valuable than Teravainen.Not to mention that Panarin ate Teravainen’s lunch.

    What’s yer take on Dumba?

  118. spoiler says:

    Woodguy: I don’t think you can get Dumba for Vanek, he’s only got a year left.

    In the lawyer from Juno’s defense, the target he mentioned (in the prior post) was Spurgeon.

  119. Woodguy says:

    spoiler: In the lawyer from Juno’s defense, the target he mentioned (in the prior post) was Spurgeon.

    Yeah, I kinda got stuck on Dumba.

    Spurgeon is worth much more to MIN than Dumba today though.

  120. John Chambers says:

    My benchmark for Draisaitl is Ryan Johansen.

    RyJo made the NHL in his draft +2 season and was pretty raw, scoring 9-12-21 in 67 games. Drai of course hit the 50-point mark.

    In draft +3 Johansen put up just 12 points in NHL games during the lockout. He scored well in the AHL, but at roughly a .8 ppg pace.

    It wasn’t until his draft +4 where he became a 30/30 player and was finally emerging as a top-6 Centre.

    By comparison then I think we can count on Drai to Centre a 3rd line, but asking him to carry a scoring line against top opposition in his upcoming draft + 3 is a bit much, and was especially so in his +2.

    The kid is the best asset the team has after McDavid and Hall.

  121. frjohnk says:

    Woodguy: That trio scored an unreal (and unsustainable) 4.5 goals/60 when together this year in their 93 minutes together.

    Hall and DrySaddle were an ok, but not great 2.6 goals/60 when together and without RNH on the ice.

    Saddle is trending nicely, but he’s 2 years away from being competent enough to center a top 6 NHL line without big time help on each wing.

    I just ran those numbers too. When Leon was first put on the wing, they play 75 minutes together ( or the equivalent of 5 games together). They played 18 more minutes together at the end of the year but no goals were scored

    In that first run together
    75 minutes

    7 goals for, 3 goals against
    53% CF%
    5.59 GF/60
    16.67% shooting percentage

    I thought they played more together in that first run, but I was wrong

  122. spoiler says:

    Woodguy: Yeah, I kinda got stuck on Dumba.

    Spurgeon is worth much more to MIN than Dumba today though.

    Actually, whenever we played them, I liked the look of Scandella. He’s not a top pairing solution to be sure, but might still strengthen our right side. Have you looked at his numbers by any chance?

  123. spoiler says:

    Woodguy,

    Meh, cancel that, he’s a lefty… could’ve sworn I had seen him playing the right point.

  124. frjohnk says:

    LadiesloveSmid: Yep. Why RNH’s and Drai’s numbers can be so high. That line was dominant for a stretch, some here would like to see it again next season.

    Not unlike the Maroon-McDavid- EBERLE line
    they played 119 minutes together
    9 goals for, 4 against
    48% CF%
    4.52 GF/60
    13% Shooting Percentage

  125. Gerta Rauss says:

    Woodguy: Yeah, I kinda got stuck on Dumba.

    Spurgeon is worth much more to MIN than Dumba today though.

    Sure

    The proposal I entered in Kinger’s contest a few weeks ago was Eberle + salary(Korp) for Spurgeon + more salary(Vanek)

    I wouldn’t think Spurgeon would be available especially after just signing a new contract(of which, the NTC kicks in in year 2) and the rational/hope is MIN being, well, irrational after a disappointing season.

  126. leadfarmer says:

    prairieschooner,

    He doesn’t project to be a #1 D. I have him below Chychrun, Sergachev and Bean. Not great numbers for a guy thats an fairly one dimensional offensive dman.

  127. RandomPoster says:

    Woodguy: There were 350 NHL Forwards who played at least 500 5v5 minutes last year.
    Korpse ranks 342nd in GF% ON
    Gordon ranked 344th. Ha!

    Chalk that up as another win for Chia! Good up arrow⬆

  128. Lowetide says:

    spoiler:
    Woodguy,

    Meh, cancel that, he’s a lefty… could’ve sworn I had seen him playing the right point.

    You have been listening to your inner Woodguy.

  129. Woodguy says:

    Pouzar: What’s yer take on Dumba?

    I like him.

    I think he can handle 2nd pairing now with a reasonable partner.

    Did ok with Brodin, but less so with Scandella in 2nd pairing minutes.

    MIN would LOVE to move Scandella. Spurgeon was zooming his numbers, but they made a mistake and paid Scandella before they figured it out.

    Did really well with Suter in 200 minutes over the last 2 years so can move up in a pinch.

    Scoring off a bit this year, but he went from 3rd pairing to 2nd pairing so I expect it to improve.

    Decent PP option, has a good shot.

    Just finished his 21 year old year with reasonable results on the 2nd pair so he’s trending well.

    You could probably put him in the same spot as you would Barrie, 2RD 1PP with Sekera as his partner.

  130. Woodguy says:

    spoiler: Actually, whenever we played them, I liked the look of Scandella.He’s not a top pairing solution to be sure, but might still strengthen our right side.Have you looked at his numbers by any chance?

    Yeah, he’s the guy they want to trade first.

    Brodin and Scandella are like oil and water together and I think Brodin is the better one.

    Like I mentioned above, Spurgeon was really making that second pairing go when Scandella came up for renewal and they paid him.

    Now they have 4 guys getting paid like top 4 Dmen and Dumba needs to get paid too.

    I think MIN moves either Brodin or Scandella, but Brodin probably gets them more back due to reputation from his killer rookie year.

  131. Woodguy says:

    Lowetide: You have been listening to your inner Woodguy.

    Bastard.

  132. Woodguy says:

    spoiler:
    Woodguy,

    Meh, cancel that, he’s a lefty… could’ve sworn I had seen him playing the right point.

    Wouldn’t doubt it, he played a lot with Brodin who’s also a lefty (although Brodin likes playing the right side)

  133. Pouzar says:

    Woodguy: I like him.

    I think he can handle 2nd pairing now with a reasonable partner.

    Did ok with Brodin, butless so with Scandella in 2nd pairing minutes.

    MIN would LOVE to move Scandella.Spurgeon was zooming his numbers, but they made a mistake and paid Scandella before they figured it out.

    Did really well with Suter in 200 minutes over the last 2 years so can move up in a pinch.

    Scoring off a bit this year, but he went from 3rd pairing to 2nd pairing so I expect it to improve.

    Decent PP option, has a good shot.

    Just finished his 21 year old year with reasonable results on the 2nd pair so he’s trending well.

    You could probably put him in the same spot as you wouldBarrie, 2RD 1PP with Sekera as his partner.

    Perfect thx.

  134. Offside says:

    OilClog:
    So Oilers are going to replace Hall, going into his 6th season, a true legitimate top line player.

    And replace him with a rookie, that isn’t as dominate as Hall was at the same age.

    Fuck.

    Not an optimal scenario but the correct framing of the transaction is ‘trading Hall for a quality D and replacing him with Tkachuk’

  135. spoiler says:

    Woodguy: Wouldn’t doubt it, he played a lot with Brodin who’s also a lefty (although Brodin likes playing the right side)

    Considering the prior history the two youngsters have, I can see Chia being tempted to deal for Brodin and pair him with KBomb… except Brodin isn’t really a Chia player type and he wouldn’t move the needle on the PP… and as far as RD go, I’m thinking that is goal #1.

  136. russ99 says:

    Lots of chatter on the Yak – Sanheim rumor with Philly.

    Wonder how much of it is reality.

    Sanheim is a really interesting prospect, but is a LH.

    If that happens, maybe move Reinhart as a piece in another deal?

  137. GCW_69 says:

    Woodguy: If they only get one I’d prefer Barrie or Hamonic.

    I don’t think Barrie’s off the market.

    If they only get one, expect to be back in the lottery this time next year.

  138. Ca$h-McMoney! says:

    russ99,

    I’d like to see that, simply because I’ve taken a liking to cheering for Philly on off nights over the last couple years (them and the Sharks) and that would be such an interesting environment for Yak. Seeing him succeed there would be nice.

    Plus god knows the actual city of Philadelphia could use an injection of kind hearted people and Yak fits that description to a T.

  139. GCW_69 says:

    russ99:
    Lots of chatter on the Yak – Sanheim rumor with Philly.

    Wonder how much of it is reality.

    Sanheim is a really interesting prospect, but is a LH.

    If that happens, maybe move Reinhart as a piece in another deal?

    That would be so Oilers – to make yet another trade for a player they don’t need who isn’t ready to make a difference yet. #infinibuild!!!!

    The madness has to stop. When Yak is traded it needs to be as part of a package for an actual NHL player. Severson from Jersey, Vatanen or Fowler from Anaheim.

  140. GCW_69 says:

    frjohnk: I’ll drive EBERLE to the airport for that deal and I’m a fan of EBERLE.

    I think Buffalo would be crazy to trade Ristolianen.He has all the tools to be a dominant number 1.

    If EBERLE gets Ristolianen, I’m asking what else is Murray willing to trade.

    I will carry Eberle’s bags for you. And like you, I am a big Eberle fan.

  141. StixMalone says:

    Offside: Not an optimal scenario but the correct framing of the transaction is ‘trading Hall for a quality D and replacing him with Tkachuk’

    That would be so Oilers. Tkachuk is not NHL ready……

  142. GCW_69 says:

    stush18: Ya if only we could have drafted a dman like that…

    I know, right? It’s crazy that some like that never comes up when they are due to draft. Still, we can’t be too harsh. It’s not like Risto was rated higher than Nurse on Bob McKenzie’s list. Oh, wait…

  143. Oilspill says:

    Hendricks has serious leadership role. He’s worth every cent for anyone who knows the game. Players respect him. Here’s a place where proxy shots dont matter.

    Visually better:
    Crazy to think that Hendricks, Fayne, Ference, Korpokoski, and Letestu add up to over 13 MILLION DOLLARS… The things we could do with that money…

  144. Ryan says:

    Prepare to be underwhelmed with our d rebuild this summer is my advice.

    The Yotes traded a fifth for the rights to Go Go. OEL and Go Go would be an excellent backbone of a d corps. Even they are also in the market for a right shot defenseman though.

    If Chiarelli trades a significant asset like the #4 or Nuge for Vatanen…

  145. Water Fire says:

    Morning blockbuster proposal. The canes have a reverse cap issue, hitting the floor. Both teams have room for contracts.

    The Canes could use another established quality centre and have defensive depth. What don’t the Oilers need:

    Nuge, Fayne, Bear (9.625M) #4 + 2nd

    for

    Faulk, Lindholm (7.53) #13 #21

    Plausible? Of course a vet centre would need to be found to replace Nuge.

  146. todds says:

    zatch,

    I don’t agree. Good GMs make trades that don’t work out, but those aren’t necessarily bad trades. Trades based on speculation for future development are risks and necessary for improvement of teams. Bad trades are where information was available at the time of the trade that indicated poor value and the trade was executed anyhow. All indications are that GR was not looking promising in the Islander system, and Korpikoski should have been well known to nhl scouts. Bad trades, both. And suggesting lack of judgement and/or systematic errors re: scouting and evaluation.

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