HOW HIGH CAN HE FLY?

Scott Cullen released his Top 300 scorers list yesterday for 2016-17, it is always a fun time for me to review the RE. Cullen is a bright guy who has a very good knowledge of analytics, and applies the same logic and reason to sussing out offense across the NHL each season. Here are Scott’s Oilers, their rank on his list, and my RE for each in brackets:

  • No. 2 Connor McDavid 78gp, 28-58-86 1.10 (72gp, 87 pts, 1.208)
  • No. 40 Jordan Eberle 75gp, 29-31-60 0.80 (75gp, 61 pts, 0.813)
  • No. 74 Milan Lucic 74gp, 80gp, 20-33-53 0.663 (80gp, 61 pts 0.763)
  • No. 111 Leon Draisaitl 76gp, 17-31-48 0.632 (75gp, 40 pts 0.533)
  • No. 135 Ryan Nugent-Hopkins 67gp, 17-28-45 0.672 (75gp, 51 pts 0.680)
  • No. 196 Benoit Pouliot 68gp, 16-22-38 0.559 (62gp, 39 pts 0.629)
  • No. 217 Jesse Puljujarvi 75gp, 12-24-36 0.480 (65gp, 28 pts 0.431)
  • No. 241 Kris Versteeg 74gp, 13-20-33 0.446 (NA)
  • No. 250 Patrick Maroon 70gp, 12-20-32 0.457 (72gp, 27 pts 0.375)
  • No. 253 Andrej Sekera 77gp, 7-25-32 0.416 (76gp, 35 pts 0.461)
  • No. 267 Nail Yakupov 66gp, 12-18-30 0.454 (70gp, 24 pts 0.343)
  • No. 295 Oscar Klefbom 75gp, 5-23-28 0.373 (55gp, 21 pts 0.382)
  • Cullen list
  • My RE

I spend a long damn time (too long) estimating these numbers, to the point where PP time and EV time are sussed out. So, when a guy like Cullen posts his numbers and they are in the range, you are damned right I take some pride in my RE. I will have Scott on the Lowdown today to discuss his numbers and several other items.

pitlick ferguson 1415Photo by Rob Ferguson, all rights reserved

MANY ARE CALLED, FEW ARE CHOSEN

I hope to have the second installment of the WheatnOil-inspired item of last evening (forwards 21-24) tonight, but that could be aggressive. I wanted to mention something that I see as a positive in Peter Chiarelli’s team building. The Bakersfield Condors are about to get a very strong group of offensive forwards based on NHLE’s:

  • Drake Caggiula 2015-16 Age 21 (UND NCAA) 39, 25-26-51 (NHLE: 44)
  • Joey Benik 2015-16 Age 23 (St. Cloud State NCAA) 41, 23-25-48 (NHLE: 39)
  • Patrick Russell 2015-16 Age 22 (St. Cloud State NCAA) 41, 20-21-41 (NHLE: 34)
  • Jere Sallinen 2015-16 Age 25 (Jokerit Helskinki KHL) 50, 8-11-19 (NHLE: 25)

These are good numbers and we should view these prospects as legit NHL possibilities—especially considering the AHL forwards (and their NHLE totals) from one year ago:

  • R Tyler Pitlick RE 7-15-22
  • C Jujhar Khaira RE 8-13-21
  • R Anton Slepyshev RE 10-7-17
  • C Bogdan Yakimov RE 5-11-15
  • C Kyle Platzer RE 5-9-14
  • R Greg Chase RE 2-12-14

And oh by the way, in case you are thinking Tyler Pitlick is too old for consideration, think about this: On the day he played his first NHL game, Fernando Pisani was 26 years and 12 days old. Tyler Pitlick turns 25 on November 1. You never know.

SEIDENBERG?

  • Mike Halford, NBC Sports: It’s tough to see where Seidenberg would fit. One would have to think Edmonton could be in the mix, given the Oilers’ general lack of depth on defense, and Seidenberg’s relationship with former B’s GM Peter Chiarelli. But the Oilers might not be ready to offer up a contract, especially with another veteran — Kris Vetsteeg — already coming to camp on a PTO. Source

I don’t see it, honestly. We know the Oilers value the ol’ lefty-righty and one would imagine the next addition to the roster is in fact a RHD—unlikely to happen before the season, but could happen before the trade deadline.

  • Domenic Galamini: “It turns out that an unsuitably handed defenseman must have a CorsiRel that is greater than or equal to 6.2 Corsi events / 60 better than a suitably handed alternative in order to be the better option to pair with a partner-less defenseman on the roster.” Source

MOOD INDIGO

For a long time this spring and summer, we talked about a long list of possibles for RHD. Although I didn’t list Adam Larsson, the group was fairly thorough and several names did find themselves on the move:

  1. Jason Demers, Dallas Stars. The book end for Andrej Sekera?
  2. Tyson Barrie, Colorado Avalanche. Quality option for puck mover.
  3. Justin Faulk, Carolina Hurricanes. Would be higher, question availability.
  4. Travis Hamonic, NY Islanders. This is a solid player and a great option for Edmonton.
  5. Sami Vatanen, Anaheim Ducks. Solid offense, not completely proven.
  6. Radko Gudas, Philadelphia Flyers. Strong, effective defender.
  7. Michael Stone, Arizona Coyotes. Major knee surgery.
  8. David Savard, Columbus Blue Jackets. Range of skills.
  9. Jacob Trouba, Winnipeg Jets. Strange year for a talented young player.
  10. Damon Severson, New Jersey Devils. The more I look at his career, the better the fit.
  11. Mark Pysyk, Buffalo Sabres. The numbers imply there is a player here.
  12. Ryan Pulock, New York Islanders. Big shot from the point has high value. Very young.
  13. Ryan Murphy, Carolina Hurricanes. Some chaos, but good speed and puck-moving ability.
  14. Brandon Montour, Anaheim Ducks. This could be a special player.
  15. Cody Franson, Buffalo Sabres. That hammer from the point would come in handy and he fits a real need.
  16. Jordan Schmaultz, St. Louis Blues. Puck-moving prospect.
  17. Anthony DeAngelo, Tampa Bay Lightning. Another player with a puck-moving element to his game.
  18. Colin Miller, Boston Bruins. With the other Miller signing, maybe he is available.
  19. Eric Gryba, Edmonton Oilers. I think management likes him.
  20. Ville Pokka, Chicago Blackhawks. Young defender in the Chicago system.
  21. Frank Corrado, Toronto Maple Leafs. Very little evidence but he showed up in some good places.
  22. Ryan Sproul, Detroit Red Wings. Puck-moving defender in the AHL.
  23. Dennis Wideman, Calgary Flames. A year removed from a fantastic offensive season.
  24. Taylor Aronson, Nashville Predators. Minor-league defender.
  25. Matt Irwin, Boston Bruins. Depth defender.
  26. Source

There are some names still out there, ranging from Jacob Trouba to Dennis Wideman. Will Peter Chiarelli make a move? I believe the answer is yes, but increasingly it looks like the move will be made after training camp and into the season.

LOWDOWN WITH LOWETIDE

I am very much looking forward to the show today, 10 this morning TSN1260. Scheduled to appear:

  • Jonathan Willis, The World. Jon will join me to talk Versteeg deployment, McDavid expectation and where to play Brandon Davidson in the lineup.
  • Simon Boisvert, Hockey Analyst. Former QMJHL scout has an interesting take on a lot of the things we discuss here, and an uncanny knowledge of Oilers prospects. Questions welcome!
  • Scott Cullen, TSN. Projected NHL numbers and insight from recent analytics conference.

10-1260 text, @Lowetide on twitter. Talk soon!

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101 Responses to "HOW HIGH CAN HE FLY?"

  1. jp says:

    Nice job on the reasonable LT!

  2. PaperKurtRussell says:

    Speaking of the RE series LT, any chance that you loaned your alter-ego out to assist on a blog about the iPhone 7 headphone issue?? I saw this the other day, and it is uncanny how it reminded me of your style. (It’s funny, but also useful to those looking for a new phone.)

    Q: Why? In God’s name, why?

    http://finance.yahoo.com/news/life-without-iphone-headphone-jacks-the-qa-034119380.html

  3. Ca$h-McMoney! says:

    For those curious Cullen had Taylor Hall at #32 with 64pts in 74 games, a pretty big step forward vs. the past two years.

    Let the debating the value of the Hall trade begin (again)!

  4. Lowetide says:

    PaperKurtRussell:
    Speaking of the RE series LT, any chance that you loaned your alter-ego out to assist on a blog about the iPhone 7 headphone issue??I saw this the other day, and it is uncanny how it reminded me of your style.(It’s funny, but also useful to those looking for a new phone.)

    Q: Why? In God’s name, why?

    http://finance.yahoo.com/news/life-without-iphone-headphone-jacks-the-qa-034119380.html

    Haha. It is a good format, especially if the guy asking the questions has an edge.

  5. npanciroli says:

    It’s insane to think we will have a top 5 scorer this year. Hard to realize we have McDavid. I think I’m so used to being disappointed with the Oilers that I tell myself, “maybe McDavid isn’t that good?” Then I see him play and my response is, “nope.”

    When’s the last time we were this close to having a balanced roster?

  6. npanciroli says:

    PaperKurtRussell,

    Easily my favourite thing about the RE series. So funny.

  7. Jethro Tull says:

    npanciroli:
    It’s insane to think we will have a top 5 scorer this year. Hard to realize we have McDavid. I think I’m so used to being disappointed with the Oilers that I tell myself, “maybe McDavid isn’t that good?” Then I see him play and my response is, “nope.”

    When’s the last time we were this close to having a balanced roster?

    If I have a dozen eggs, does that mean I will get a dozen chickens?

  8. dustrock says:

    Well played LT, it’s hard to be reasonable when projecting points. My reasonable expectation is that McDavid has 110 points, but that’s why I don’t have a blog. 😀

  9. stevezie says:

    I think that Cullen’s predictions are fine, but I’ll add that when McDavid explodes like that he’ll almost certainly drag someone into the top twenty with him.

    He’ll probably have a Kunitz. We just don’t know who yet.

  10. digger50 says:

    I see Cullen also has Pjarvi in the NHL for a reasonable amount of time. Bruce also has a nice article out this morning on Jessie.

    Watching Austin Mathews on team NA he is certainly holding his own, if that’s any indication of what Jessie can deliver it will be awfully hard to keep Jessie off the team. One thing to note here is the biggest adaptation for him will be culture and language. These are real challenges and he would benefit from sticking with one home and one set of friends/teammates as he learns. With this mind the decision on where he plays may be driven in regards to how to manage a teenager as much as cap space and development leagues.

  11. Little Poteet says:

    Jethro Tull: If I have a dozen eggs, does that mean I will get a dozen chickens?

    No, but you could make a great omelette!

  12. Chachi says:

    stevezie:
    I think that Cullen’s predictions are fine, but I’ll add that when McDavid explodes like that he’ll almost certainly drag someone into the top twenty with him.

    He’ll probably have a Kunitz. We just don’t know who yet.

    Kunitz’s best season by the box cars was a 68 point season playing with Crosby who scored 104 points. Seems like Cullen’s estimate for Eberle fits the Kunitz mould.

  13. Drew says:

    Little Poteet: No, but you could make a great omelette!

    You have to be very careful and use not too many eggs in an omelet otherwise you get a heavy pan scramble (which are nice as well). Sometimes less is more.

  14. TO10801 says:

    Impressive work with the RE series LT. Would have been even closer to Cullen’s numbers had you known about Versteeg.

    Philly is a team that is fairly close to the cap. I would imagine they wouldn’t mind moving Streit who is perhaps a better option than Wideman especially because they have Ghost. He probably has enough left to help the PP and can do okay on the 3rd pair.

  15. stephen sheps says:

    stevezie:

    He’ll probably have a Kunitz. We just don’t know who yet.

    I for one hope that it’s Yak. For the sake of the young man’s career I really hope that it’s Yak.

    (Yak is my MAP, in case it wasn’t made clear over the years…)

  16. npanciroli says:

    Jethro Tull: If I have a dozen eggs, does that mean I will get a dozen chickens?

    I actually can’t figure out what you mean haha.

  17. Ducey says:

    Ca$h-McMoney!:
    For those curious Cullen had Taylor Hall at #32 with 64pts in 74 games, a pretty big step forward vs. the past two years.

    Let the debating the value of the Hall trade begin (again)!

    If Cullen is right on Hall (64 pts) and LT is correct on Lucic (61) maybe everyone will stop grousing for a day or two.

  18. hags9k says:

    stephen sheps,

    I’m with you. Yak for the Kunitz!

    But, does TMac agree?

  19. Doug McLachlan says:

    LT, your list of RHD used to include UFA James Wisniewski. Yes he signed a PTO with Tampa Bay but he remains available to sign.

    Tampa can’t ink him until they have Kucherov and Nesterov under contract so I am confused by the absence. I know I keep repeating myself with this but curious where on your list you would rank the Wiz?

  20. Jethro Tull says:

    npanciroli: I actually can’t figure out what you mean haha.

    We MAY have a top 5 scorer, all things being equal, barring injury/insane management decisions/Black Death. We shouldn’t count our chickens before they hatch. That would be so……Oilers.

  21. stephen sheps says:

    hags9k:
    stephen sheps,

    I’m with you.Yak for the Kunitz!

    But, does TMac agree?

    I doubt it, but we’re Oilers fans here – where hope (never) goes to die 😉

  22. G Money says:

    Jethro Tull,

    Huh, I just assumed you were hungry.

  23. LadiesloveSmid says:

    Trade a 3rd round pick for Franson or sign Wisniewski off his PTO?

  24. Jethro Tull says:

    G Money:
    Jethro Tull,

    Huh, I just assumed you were hungry.

    Oh, I am…….Hungry for McDavid to strike fear into the knavish hearts of opposing teams!

  25. maudite says:

    I like Savard but uncertain why he’d be available and imagine cost would be too high.

  26. G Money says:

    Jethro Tull: Hungry for McDavid

    *nods approvingly*

  27. Jethro Tull says:

    LT’s season-opening post should be titled ‘Dog Days are Over’ By Florence and The Machine.

    I know she sounds like an enraged barn owl in a wind-chime factory, but the missus likes her.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWOyfLBYtuU

  28. magneto says:

    digger50:
    I see Cullen also has Pjarvi in the NHL for a reasonable amount of time. Bruce also has a nice article out this morning on Jessie.

    Watching Austin Mathews on team NA he is certainly holding his own, if that’s any indication of what Jessie can deliver it will be awfully hard to keep Jessie off the team. One thing to note here is the biggest adaptation for him will be culture and language. These are real challenges and he would benefit from sticking with one home and one set of friends/teammates as he learns. With this mind the decision on where he plays may be driven in regards to how to manage a teenager as much as cap space and development leagues.

    Been discussing this with friends, I think sending him back to Finland would be a mistake. If the Oilers could have, do you think they would have brought Paigan over? You at least have control of the player.

    You can monitor everything if he is on the AHL team, both hockey and personal. Teach him the right systems and get him comfortable with the future supporting cast he will be playing with.

    One thing I think Colorado has done right is the development of Rantanen (so far)
    http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=162163

    He is really similar to Puljujarvi, and according to CapFriendly his contract does slide. It is a win- win situation. The Oilers don’t need Barkov levels of production from him this year, but they could really use Rantanen level production in Bakersfield.

  29. Ribs says:

    Sweet, Yakupov projected to get as many points as Sam Gagner this season! That’s almost as many points as Cogliano’s projected to get! Yah!

  30. Chachi says:

    magneto: Been discussing this with friends, I think sending him back to Finland would be a mistake. If the Oilers could have, do you think they would have brought Paigan over? You at least have control of the player.

    You can monitor everything if he is on the AHL team, both hockey and personal. Teach him the right systems and get him comfortable with the future supporting cast he will be playing with.

    One thing I think Colorado has done right is the development of Rantanen (so far)
    http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=162163

    He is really similar to Puljujarvi, and according to CapFriendly his contract does slide. It is a win- win situation. The Oilers don’t need Barkov levels of production from him this year, but they could really use Rantanen level production in Bakersfield.

    Yup.

  31. Pouzar says:

    sigh

  32. kinger_OIL says:

    magneto: Been discussing this with friends, I think sending him back to Finland would be a mistake. If the Oilers could have, do you think they would have brought Paigan over? You at least have control of the player.

    You can monitor everything if he is on the AHL team, both hockey and personal. Teach him the right systems and get him comfortable with the future supporting cast he will be playing with.

    One thing I think Colorado has done right is the development of Rantanen (so far)
    http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=162163

    He is really similar to Puljujarvi, and according to CapFriendly his contract does slide. It is a win- win situation. The Oilers don’t need Barkov levels of production from him this year, but they could really use Rantanen level production in Bakersfield.

    – This prompted me to do a little digging. We never heard this language from OBC: ““It was an experience for him to dip his toe in the water,” said David Oliver, Colorado’s director of player development. “With ice time comes confidence, and for his development curve we wanted to get him to the AHL to play those big minutes.””

    – Seems so intuitive, give the guy the chance to dominate, figure out how game translates into the Pro level, then earn a spot.

    http://www.thehockeynews.com/news/article/mikko-rantanen-bound-and-determined-to-take-on-the-big-boys-in-the-nhl-next-season

  33. Jethro Tull says:

    Pouzar:
    sigh

    ‘sup, bro?

  34. Pouzar says:

    magneto: I think sending him back to Finland would be a mistake.

    I can give you and Joanie 8000 examples where it was a resounding success but the narrative will never die here.

    To each their own.

    Come on down JP.

  35. npanciroli says:

    Once we see JP play some pre-season and even some games at the start of the year, can determine the best place to develop/play him.

  36. SumOil says:

    LT, I don’t know why you are selling yourself short. The amount of time and effort you put into the RE for the Oilers will be much more than what Scott Cullen would have invested in his list with regards to the Oilers.

    So in my opinion if his list is close to yours then it a validation for his list and not yours.

  37. G Money says:

    npanciroli:
    Once we see JP play some pre-season and even some games at the start of the year, can determine the best place to develop/play him.

    Exactly right.

    If he tears the doors off, in preseason, he gets (up to) 9 games. If he tears the doors off in nine games, he’s going to stay.

    If he looks close but needs to adapt to the N American game (and society), send him to the AHL, the perfect place to do that.

    If he looks like he needs to work on his overall game, send him back home to Finland, where he can do that in a familiar environment. As Pouzar has pointed out, that’s been done lots and lots of time without issue.

    What’s that old cliche? “Horses for courses” or summat?

  38. Jethro Tull says:

    JP may very well be first call up, as well.

    There are pros and cons to both, I would tend to disagree with Pouzar that sending him back to Finland would be preferable to him playing in the AHL. He’s going to have to become acclimatized and immerse himself in NA culture at some point and I can only imagine that would be easier without having to play at the NHL level.

    Also, I would point out that nobody has ever gotten better by playing at a lower level, just more ‘polished’ if you will.

    To me, it doesn’t matter if a player ‘dominates’ at the lower level, as long as he’s working at the things the coaches have outlined for him to improve upon. If JP only puts up 35pts in the AHL, but picks up the nuances of the NA ice, whilst getting his English to a level where he understands his coaches’ instructions, then I’d be happy.

    G is right. Unbiased evaluation is the way ahead. Which, of course, will not happen.

  39. stephen sheps says:

    kinger_OIL,

    fun fact – the David Oliver quoted in the article is the same David Oliver who briefly played for the Oilers in the dark ages of the mid 1990s.

  40. Pouzar says:

    Jethro Tull: There are pros and cons to both, I would tend to disagree with Pouzar that sending him back to Finland would be preferable to him playing in the AHL.

    This is not my personal opinion. The history here is on my side especially for Finnish players.
    I would argue at age 18/19 JP needs to continue to develop his individual skills(which they focus on a ton in Finland) in an atmosphere he is familiar in a league that is right there with the AHL in terms of competition. Lots of Finnish NHL players started their post draft careers in sm liiga. Let’s not forget the season is way longer in NA and he is coming off a knee injury. I think “learning the NA culture/game” can wait while he develops his skills now and plays a more offensive role in sm liiga.
    Time is on our side here for once.

  41. Jethro Tull says:

    Pouzar,

    So much of the plan relies on Kris Versteeg having a good camp!

  42. Chachi says:

    Pouzar: This is not my personal opinion. The history here is on my side especially for Finnish players.
    I would argue at age 18/19 JP needs to continue to develop his individual skills(which they focus on a ton in Finland) in an atmosphere he is familiar in a league that is right there with the AHL in terms of competition. Lots of Finnish NHL players started their post draft careers in sm liiga. Let’s not forget the season is way longer in NA and he is coming off a knee injury. I think “learning the NA culture/game” can wait while he develops his skills now and plays a more offensive role in sm liiga.
    Time is on our side here for once.

    Do the thing where you list of all the best all time Finnish players and include Toni Lydman(!?) and Tomas Sandstrom (may have been born in Finland – most definitely a Swede) but leave out Esa Tikkanen! That’s my favourite bit! Sigh, fart noises etc. etc.

  43. Pouzar says:

    Chachi: Do the thing where you list of all the best all time Finnish players and include Toni Lydman(!?) and Tomas Sandstrom (may have been born in Finland – most definitely a Swede) but leave out Esa Tikkanen! That’s my favourite bit! Sigh, fart noises etc. etc.

    Not my list. But thx for cementing my point even further.
    ET played Home!
    2 yrs post draft in SM-liiga.

  44. kinger_OIL says:

    Pouzar,

    – It’s the oilers. Here’s the RE:

    1) Versteeg will get to play a lot of minutes because he’s a vet, regardless of how he does
    2) Pool-party will play a lot of minutes because he’s the shiny new toy regardlesws of how he does
    3) Yak will play few minutes with the dregs becasue he hasn’t earned in, regardless of how he does

    – They will flush Yak, push pool-party and slot Versteeg higher in the batting order than he should.

    – It will take a few years to hopefully have pool-party be effective, and Yak plays top-6 elsewhere

    This is patented Because Oilers play-book. All rights reserved

  45. stephen sheps says:

    kinger_OIL:
    Pouzar,

    – It’s the oilers.Here’s the RE:

    1) Versteeg will get to play a lot of minutes because he’s a vet, regardless of how he does
    2) Pool-party will play a lot of minutes because he’s the shiny new toy regardlesws of how he does
    3) Yak will play few minutes with the dregs becasue he hasn’t earned in, regardless of how he does

    – They will flush Yak, push pool-party and slot Versteeg higher in the batting order than he should.

    – It will take a few years to hopefully have pool-party be effective, and Yak plays top-6 elsewhere

    This is patented Because Oilers play-book.All rights reserved

    I hate it when you’re right
    You’re often right

    *sigh

  46. John Chambers says:

    In hindsight, given that Chiarelli ultimately traded Taylor Hall, which of the following possible deals would you have made if you were GM? After the deal was made it’s reported that another GM apparently offered more. Speculating on possible trade options, which one would you have selected?

    1) Taylor Hall and Brandon Davidson to Anaheim up for Hampus Lindholm and Jakub Silfverberg.

    2) Taylor Hall and a 2nd to Brooklyn for Travis Hamonic and Ryan Strome.

    3) Taylor Hall and Mark Fayne ($1.5M retained) to Colorado for Tyson Barrie and Mikhail Grigorenko.

    4) Taylor Hal to New Jersey for Adam Larsson.

    Let’s also assume that it’s July 31st and you know that Demers is willing to sign in Edm for $5.5M x 5. Lucic also wiling to sign.

  47. Ducey says:

    As we are likely to be concerning ourselves with the draft rather than playoffs by about mid November, here is Buttons first draft ranking.
    http://www.tsn.ca/craig-s-list-nolan-patrick-stands-above-the-rest-1.566071

    He has RH puck moving D from Sweden at #2 – just saying.

  48. npanciroli says:

    kinger_OIL:
    Pouzar,

    – It’s the oilers.Here’s the RE:

    1) Versteeg will get to play a lot of minutes because he’s a vet, regardless of how he does
    2) Pool-party will play a lot of minutes because he’s the shiny new toy regardlesws of how he does
    3) Yak will play few minutes with the dregs becasue he hasn’t earned in, regardless of how he does

    – They will flush Yak, push pool-party and slot Versteeg higher in the batting order than he should.

    – It will take a few years to hopefully have pool-party be effective, and Yak plays top-6 elsewhere

    This is patented Because Oilers play-book.All rights reserved

    If I had to guess starting roster based on Oilers decision making.

    Lucic – McDavid – Eberle
    Pouliot – RNH – JP
    Maroon – Draisaitl – Versteeg

    Yakupov traded for a crummy RHD.

  49. npanciroli says:

    John Chambers,

    From the sounds of it, none of those other options happened or were possible.

    Number 1 if it existed.

  50. Pouzar says:

    kinger_OIL:
    Pouzar,

    – It’s the oilers.Here’s the RE:

    1) Versteeg will get to play a lot of minutes because he’s a vet, regardless of how he does
    2) Pool-party will play a lot of minutes because he’s the shiny new toy regardlesws of how he does
    3) Yak will play few minutes with the dregs becasue he hasn’t earned in, regardless of how he does

    – They will flush Yak, push pool-party and slot Versteeg higher in the batting order than he should.

    – It will take a few years to hopefully have pool-party be effective, and Yak plays top-6 elsewhere

    This is patented Because Oilers play-book.All rights reserved

    I should also mention I think there is a less than 1% chance he is sent back to Finland #bcOilers

  51. Caramel Batman says:

    John Chambers:
    In hindsight, given that Chiarelli ultimately traded Taylor Hall, which of the following possible deals would you have made if you were GM? After the deal was made it’s reported that another GM apparently offered more. Speculating on possible trade options, which one would you have selected?

    1) Taylor Hall and Brandon Davidson to Anaheim up for Hampus Lindholm and Jakub Silfverberg.

    2) Taylor Hall and a 2nd to Brooklyn for Travis Hamonic and Ryan Strome.

    3) Taylor Hall and Mark Fayne ($1.5M retained)to Colorado for Tyson Barrie and Mikhail Grigorenko.

    4) Taylor Hal to New Jersey for Adam Larsson.

    Let’s also assume that it’s July 31st and you know that Demers is willing to sign in Edm for $5.5M x 5. Lucic also wiling to sign.

    Great exercise. I have #4 as the worst option.

    #1 is good value but adding Davidson and Silverberg is unnecessary. If you are going to trade Davidson it has to be for a RHD. Plus Davidson is underated, so I try not to deal him at all. Still if it is Hall and Davidson for Lindholm and Vatanen, I’d think hard about doing that deal. Lindholm is the only D on your list who is worth Hall straight up. He just plays the wrong side.

    Neither 2 nor 3 provide the value but at least they are RHD and are better bets than Larsson. And even if they aren’t you added a cherry on top to swing it in their favour.

  52. Jethro Tull says:

    John Chambers,

    Demers at $5.5 for 5 would have been atrocious.

    What’s Larsson’s cap hit and term again?

  53. Jethro Tull says:

    Caramel Batman: Neither 2 nor 3 provide the value but at least they are RHD and are better bets than Larsson. And even if they aren’t you added a cherry on top to swing it in their favour.

    Tyson Barrie is the player Jultz should have been, but not top-pairing.

    Hamonic is serviceable, but not top pairing. (I know you don’t believe in lines, however, the entire hockey world traditionally likes their best d-men to play against the opposition’s best line-up.)

    The question remains – would any of the other teams make that deal?

  54. kinger_OIL says:

    stephen sheps,

    – I’m just a good reader of history, and a fan of organizational behaviour!

    – For the record, this is what I’d do:

    1) Play Yak with Lucic-McD for 20 games min, to really see what he is able to do. If he’s not up to it, safely trade him away and move on. Or he plays like the talented goal-scoring electric winger that was a 1st overall pick, or he is at least servicable. But no putting him on bench for one transgression that the Steve Austins did for years, but still played 1st line together with no ramifications. Introduce him as Neil Bovider, from Lethbridge

    2) Play pool-party a few games (if he is actually healthy enough), then set him up for success in the AHL: top line, power-play, most promising player in the AHL, Junoir MVP, hungry next year, etc

    3) Hope that Versteeg can play a little up and down the line-up: he and Kass fight for time on skill line behind Ebs and Yak.

  55. Caramel Batman says:

    Jethro Tull:
    John Chambers,

    Demers at $5.5 for 5 would have been atrocious.

    What’s Larsson’s cap hit and term again?

    It is better than Lucic at 6 x 7.

    It is a crazy world we live in where trading Hall for Larsson is a good idea because RHD are more valuable than wingers, but signing Demers instead of Lucic is a bad idea, because RHD are not more valuable than wingers.

    The difference between Hall and Lucic is far greater than the difference between Larsson and Demers.

    [Edit] You know how Woodguy is always defending Larsson by pointing out his relxGF% is a very good 2.73. Well Demers’ is an outstanding 4.99.

  56. Jethro Tull says:

    Caramel Batman,

    Demers would have fooled everyone into thinking the d was fixed. It still isn’t, but it’s better. Demers didn’t play near the minutes, nor the QoC that Larsson did, who matched up well against the murderer’s row of the East.

    Keeping Hall, signing Demers to $4.5max, and keeping our powder dry for Tyson Barrie may have been a better option, but maybe not one open to us.

  57. stephen sheps says:

    kinger_OIL:
    stephen sheps,

    – I’m just a good reader of history, and a fan of organizational behaviour!

    – For the record, this is what I’d do:

    1) Play Yak with Lucic-McD for 20 games min, to really see what he is able to do.If he’s not up to it, safely trade him away and move on. Or he plays like the talented goal-scoring electric winger that was a 1st overall pick, or he is at least serviceable. But no putting him on bench for one transgression that the Steve Austins did for years, but still played 1st line together with no ramifications.Introduce him as Neil Bovider, from Lethbridge

    2) Play pool-party a few games (if he is actually healthy enough), then set him up for success in the AHL: top line, power-play, most promising player in the AHL, Junior MVP, hungry next year, etc

    3) Hope that Versteeg can play a little up and down the line-up: he and Kass fight for time on skill line behind Ebs and Yak.

    What you have here is my ideal scenario too, but I see it going a different way in reality, by which I mean your initial 3-point prognostication. As a reader of history, I’m sure you would agree that the material and the ideal rarely line up…

  58. Ca$h-McMoney! says:

    Caramel Batman,

    Unless Demers wouldn’t sign for what you are saying he would sign for. By the time we know that Lucic is somewhere else, New Jersey has moved on, and we’re waiting until next year.

    Do nothing was likely not an option on the table for Chia.

  59. Chachi says:

    Pouzar: Not my list. But thx for cementing my point even further.
    ET played Home!
    2 yrs post draft in SM-liiga.

    That’s it! I am convinced. I will drive JP to the airport myself and tell him he can come back when Tik says he’s ready. Given that apparently even Fins don’t understand Tikkanen it will be a good 4 years before JP is ready to come back and learn the North American game in the AHL for at least a year.

  60. LadiesloveSmid says:

    I’ve got a dead horse thats meat needs tenderizing

  61. kinger_OIL says:

    stephen sheps: What you have here is my ideal scenario too, but I see it going a different way in reality, by which I mean your initial 3-point prognostication. As a reader of history, I’m sure you would agree that the material and the ideal rarely line up…

    You would change his name to Neil Bovider as well?! Neil: Nail. Yak: Bovide.

  62. Jethro Tull says:

    LadiesloveSmid:
    I’ve got a dead horse thats meat needs tenderizing

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRdxUFDoQe0

  63. stephen sheps says:

    kinger_OIL,

    well played Kinger… well played 😉

  64. Protagonist says:

    Do we have any information this “Source” guy listed at #26? Height, weight? NHLE? Seems like he might be a steal.

  65. Jethro Tull says:

    kinger_OIL: You would change his name to Neil Bovider as well?!Neil: Nail.Yak: Bovide.

    I Yak’s name was Neil Bovider, from Anysmalltown, Ruralprovince, Canada and he grew up doing 4H in the summer and he learnt to skate on the rink his dad made, then I’d be all over putting him on Connor’s line. But he’s not, so him and his strange ways can languish on the 3rd line until such time we deem him to be fit to trade for next to nothing.

  66. Oddspell says:

    Caramel Batman,

    Interesting, I actually have the Colorado deal as the worst, then NYI, then NJD, with ANA as the clear winner. No, Lindholm does’t solve our RHD issue, but he’ such a good player that I’d guess it cancels out for next season, and it sets us up for the future better than any of the other deals, so I’d take it and figure out handedness some other way. I like Larsson as a player more than both Hamonic and Barrie for this roster, and as value for Taylor Hall. As for the toss ins, when trading a player like Taylor Hall, I’m more inclined to maximize the value of the best player coming back.

    ANA is the Taylor Hall deal I would have smiled at, but I’m guessing it was never on the table.

    If NJ, NYI, and COL were the only deals on the table to improve the D, then I think Chia made the right choice, although like most Hall trade skeptics, I have a hard time believing that was the case.

  67. John Chambers says:

    John Chambers:
    In hindsight, given that Chiarelli ultimately traded Taylor Hall, which of the following possible deals would you have made if you were GM? After the deal was made it’s reported that another GM apparently offered more. Speculating on possible trade options, which one would you have selected?

    1) Taylor Hall and Brandon Davidson to Anaheim up for Hampus Lindholm and Jakub Silfverberg.

    2) Taylor Hall and a 2nd to Brooklyn for Travis Hamonic and Ryan Strome.

    3) Taylor Hall and Mark Fayne ($1.5M retained)to Colorado for Tyson Barrie and Mikhail Grigorenko.

    4) Taylor Hal to New Jersey for Adam Larsson.

    Let’s also assume that it’s July 31st and you know that Demers is willing to sign in Edm for $5.5M x 5. Lucic also wiling to sign.

    Although Lindholm is clearly the best defender on the list, his $ cost would be high and doesn’t solve the handedness problem. We probably NEED to sign Demers, meaning we can’t afford Lucic. We get the best available defenseman, but are in a worse salary cap position and have Demers – Fayne as our top 2 RD.

    The Colorado deal is okay – but you would have to sign Demers to be your shut down defender.
    A top four of:
    Sekara – Demers
    Klefbom – Barrie
    can certainly move the puck, but would be expensive and probably also means no Lucic.

    The Hamonic option is perhaps the most interesting because it means you can sign Lucic AND you get Strome. I’d have taken that deal ahead of Larsson.

  68. kinger_OIL says:

    Jethro Tull: I Yak’s name was Neil Bovider, from Anysmalltown, Ruralprovince, Canada and he grew up doing 4H in the summer and he learnt to skate on the rink his dad made, then I’d be all over putting him on Connor’s line.But he’s not, so him and his strange ways can languish on the 3rd line until such time we deem him to be fit to trade for next to nothing.

    – yeah I can’t stand his enigmatic ways, or his boisterous gestures or he way he skates or his shot or his lack of 200 foot game. I think he’s also selfish, and not a good Canadian Boy. Even when he hits and does that tazmanian devil there is something Russian about it.

    – He reminds me of Brett Hull. All that guy did was score goals and gloat. He never back checked and when he was playing with a play-maker centremen he was awesome. Calgary didn’t like his attention to defense, and he sure wasn’t a good ‘ole Calgary Boy. And I don’t care what you say, they should have kept Mike Keenan and got rid of that goal-scoring bum.

    – Neil Bovider = Brett Hull

    – A good organization will figure out that Yak needs an Adam Oates. That’s what Brian Sutter did

  69. Skeeziks says:

    kinger_OIL,

    Who is this Brett Hall fellow you are talking about? I seem to remember a guy by the name of Brett Hull who was a decent goal scorer but have never heard of this Brett Hall.

  70. kinger_OIL says:

    Skeeziks:
    kinger_OIL,

    Who is this Brett Hall fellow you are talking about? I seem to remember a guy by the name of Brett Hull who was a decent goal scorer but have never heard of this Brett Hall.

    – He’s the uncle of Neil Bovider

  71. Ducey says:

    kinger_OIL: – yeah I can’t stand his enigmatic ways, or his boisterous gestures or he way he skates or his shot or his lack of 200 foot game.I think he’s also selfish, and not a good Canadian Boy.Even when he hits and does that tazmanian devil there is something Russian about it.

    – He reminds me of Brett Hall.All that guy did was score goals and gloat.He never back checked and when he was playing with a play-maker centremen he was awesome.Calgary didn’t like his attention to defense, and he sure wasn’t a good ‘ole Calgary Boy.And I don’t care what you say, they should have kept Mike Keenan and got rid of that goal-scoring bum.

    – Neil Bovider =Brett Hall

    – A good organization will figure out that Yak needs an Adam Oates.That’s what Brian Sutter did

    I think your Yak love-meter is on the fritz.

    Yak is not Brett Hull. Not in the same area code.

    Brett Hull did plenty good without Oates.

    He put up 50 goals and 92 pts in 62 AHL games.
    Then put up 50 pts in 52 games with the Flamers
    Then put up 84 pts in 72 games (including 41 goals) in his first year in St Louis (Oates was not on the team).

    Everywhere he went he killed it. He had a laser for a shot, could find space to get it off, and was very accurate. He could gloat because he had something to gloat about. If you score 72 in a season you get some slack on your D assignments.

    Yak is coming off 11, 14, and 8 goals his last three seasons. Most of his goals are rebounds and garbage. His shot is all but a theoretical possibility because he is more Happy Gilmore than Alex Ovenchicken.

    If you are looking for a comparator for Yak, look at good ol’ Canadian boy Robbie Schremp. He didn’t get any slack. If Yak didn’t have the #1 overall tag, he likely would be out of the league already.

    Make no mistake, this is his last chance. If he stinks it out again he will be traded or waived mid season and in the KHL next year (although the Russians don’t seem to like him either).

    I hope he turns it around. I also hope I win the Lotomax on Friday.

  72. VanIsleOil says:

    LadiesloveSmid:
    I’ve got a dead horse thats meat needs tenderizing

    Here is a pic of our tawny caped crusader doing his thing again on the Hall trade. Let us move on…

    https://tinyurl.com/zefsqjj

  73. magneto says:

    Pouzar: I can give you and Joanie 8000 examples where it was a resounding success but the narrative will never die here.

    To each their own.

    Come on down JP.

    Do you see no advantage to playing a year in the AHL?
    If he is in the AHL he will be in an offensive role and given all the teaching and tools he would be given in Finland. I am in no way saying he should play in the AHL but he should be put in a position to succeed. You can guarantee that success if you have direct control (and if you are competent, but that is a different issue).

    I’d like to see a list of high draft picks that stay in their home leagues for a year or more, I am curious not accusing.

  74. Pouzar says:

    Bob Stauffer (@Bob_Stauffer) | Twitter

    https://twitter.com/Bob_Stauffer

    1 hour ago – View on Twitter

    For those asking. Jesse Puljujarvi, who did not skate in the Oilers Summer Orientation Camp, will play at Penticton Youngstars Tournament

  75. Jethro Tull says:

    VanIsleOil:
    LadiesloveSmid:
    I’ve got a dead horse thats meat needs tenderizing

    Here is a pic of our tawny caped crusader doing his thing again on the Hall trade. Let us move on…

    https://tinyurl.com/zefsqjj

    Au contraire. The beatings will continue until morale improves.

  76. Pouzar says:

    magneto: Do you see no advantage to playing a year in the AHL?

    I see a lot of advantage, after one year of playing in Finland. Again. This isn’t my opinion, it’s a track that many successful FINS/Swedes have taken. I have honestly no idea why there is so much resistance to it here. Very strange.

  77. pocession charge says:

    Jethro Tull: If Yak’s name was Neil Bovider, from Anysmalltown, Ruralprovince, Canada and he grew up doing 4H in the summer

    I don’t know about 4H, but definitely apiculture.

  78. pocession charge says:

    Jethro Tull: Au contraire.The beatings will continue until morale improves.

    Or until that horse turns into a Porsche.

  79. Oilspill says:

    Jus explain to me how 6.2 corsi events make an individual d man capable of playing the wrong side on 5×5 play. Rediculous! Beyond a stretch..c’mom.

  80. kinger_OIL says:

    Ducey,

    – I know he’s no Brett Hull. I think I might have over-played my analogy.

    – I agree its last chance. I don’t think the Oil give him that chance (and won’t be convinced he ever was given a chance. Too many Steve Austins playing bad possession hockey with no back-checking before he got here)

    – I’m just killing time: at my house while carpet cleaners/upholstery are here. Got rid of two awful cats this summer, and got the place painted, windows cleaned, gardener, etc. Our youngest son is no longer a toddler so that gives us more space as well. Feels like moving into new chapter of life. Hopefully Oil are growing up as well

  81. pocession charge says:

    Oilspill:
    Jus explain to me how 6.2 corsi events make an individual d man capable of playing the wrong side on 5×5 play. Rediculous! Beyond a stretch..c’mom.

    Green!

    Seven!

    Sudbury!

  82. magneto says:

    Pouzar: I see a lot of advantage, after one year of playing in Finland. Again. This isn’t my opinion, it’s a track that many successful FINS/Swedes have taken. I have honestly no idea why there is so much resistance to it here. Very strange.

    I’m just going through the last few drafts and looking at some higher end drafted guys.
    So going through those guys and no has tried to send one of the top guys to the AHL except for Rantanen.
    Either they are in the NHL too early, or they stay in their home leagues. Nylander got a hybrid treatment that has worked out wonderfully.
    After looking at it more I still think that it is not a bad idea for a full AHL year, but I would prefer maybe a Nylander type development plan. There aren’t any top prospects from the SM Liga or SEL (that I could find in 5 min) that spent any time in the AHL in their draft+1 year, except Rantanen and Nylander.

  83. Pouzar says:

    magneto: There aren’t any top prospects from the SM Liga or SEL (that I could find in 5 min)

    After 5 mins:

    Granlund
    OEL
    Mika Zibanejad
    Filip Forsberg
    Teuvo Teravainen

  84. The Hermit says:

    Ducey: look at good ol’ Canadian boy Robbie Schremp.

    Schremp is a Yank.

  85. magneto says:

    Pouzar: After 5 mins:

    Granlund
    OEL
    Mika Zibanejad
    Filip Forsberg
    Teuvo Teravainen

    Granlund- full year in Finland Draft +1 and 2
    OEL- only looked at forwards
    Zibenejad- 26 games in SEL and 9 in the NHL
    Forsberg- Full year in Sweden draft +1
    Teravainen- Draft +1 and 2 in Finland

    None of the forwards played in the AHL in their draft +1 years

    It’s a strategy that hasn’t been tried in the past, but some are trying it now. I don’t think you can say that Nylander or Rantanen have done anything but increase their value since their draft year by playing in the AHL.

  86. Pouzar says:

    magneto: Granlund- full year in Finland Draft +1 and 2
    OEL- only looked at forwards
    Zibenejad- 26 games in SEL and 9 in the NHL
    Forsberg- Full year in Sweden draft +1
    Teravainen- Draft +1 and 2 in Finland

    None of the forwards played in the AHL in their draft +1 years

    Yes, correct. I was thinking Draft +2. My bad. I was on a completely different point. Nothin to see here. 🙂

    Anyways……….To my original point. A shit load of really good hockey players start out in SEL or Liiga after Draft year. AFTER that, many go on to the NHL, AHL or even another year in Europe! *GASP* 🙂

  87. magneto says:

    Pouzar: Yes, correct. I was thinking Draft +2. My bad. I was on a completely different point. Nothin to see here.

    Anyways……….To my original point. A shit load of really good hockey players start out in SEL or Liiga after Draft year. AFTER that, many go on to the NHL, AHL or even another year in Europe! *GASP*

    Which is the current and past thinking, there are other options and as long as he isn’t in the NHL I don’t see the harm in learning how to play in NA, in a lesser league and in a scoring role.

    I guess it’s me, if I had these young players careers in my hands I would want to make sure they are taken care of. Seeing the Paigan stuff go down is heartbreaking, that is a potential player that has had a huge development year cut short and now you have no access to him at all. If he was in the AHL (I know that it was basically impossible, but hypothetically) you would be able to monitor him with team doctors, rehab him on your guidelines.

    What if they trade Puljujarvi? Or they continue to play him in limited minutes? These things are not likely to happen but they are things you have to account for.

  88. Chachi says:

    Pouzar: After 5 mins:

    Granlund
    OEL
    Mika Zibanejad
    Filip Forsberg
    Teuvo Teravainen

    Hmmm looks like it is a good developmental path if you would like to trade your prospects before they turn into anything in the NHL.

  89. BONE207 says:

    Pouzar,

    They look like Swedes to me. I thought we were talking Finns?

  90. BONE207 says:

    Ahhh, heck. just leave them in the minors anywhere till they are 30. I think the NHL will still allow them to win the Calder at that age, won’t they? We haven’t won that trophy yet.

    In all seriousness though, if healthy and looks good, why not play him sheltered minutes. Is he like Gaudreau or Domi or Larkin or Ghost or Parayko etc. If he is, they all survived and even thrived. As long as he earns it. Ahhh…more speculation. I’m tired of it. Let’s watch some games.

  91. magneto says:

    BONE207:
    Pouzar,

    They look like Swedes to me. I thought we were talking Finns?

    We were talking both just for sample size, leagues are pretty similar.

  92. G Money says:

    BONE207:
    Ahhh, heck. just leave them in the minors anywhere till they are 30. I think the NHL will still allow them to win the Calder at that age, won’t they? We haven’t won that trophy yet.

    In all seriousness though, if healthy and looks good, why not play him sheltered minutes. Is he like Gaudreau or Domi or Larkin or Ghost or Parayko etc. If he is, they all survived and even thrived. As long as he earns it. Ahhh…more speculation. I’m tired of it. Let’s watch some games.

    Well, see there’s the thing.

    Gaudreau played 3 years at BC after being drafted and entered the NHL at age 21.

    Max Domi played two full years of Jr after being drafted and entered the NHL at age 20.

    Dylan Larkin played a year at UMich after being drafted and entered the NHL at age 19.

    Ghostbear played two years of college after being drafted, then had a couple of mixed years before entering the NHL at the age of 22 (he’s actually 6 months older than Yak).

    Parayko played three years of college, with the last year including some AHL time, before debuting in the NHL at age 22. He’s also 5 months older than Yak.

    The latter two obviously are defensemen, but the point being … there is nothing wrong with a development path that does not include NHL time at the age of 18.

    In fact, all of the 3OV picks in the last five years – which JP should have been – spent time in a developmental league (anywhere from half a season to two full seasons) before making it full time to the NHL.

    [naturally the biggest f**kup in that list is the Oilers, who got it backward with Draisaitl – let’s hope they don’t make the same mistake with JP]

  93. rickithebear says:

    Lets not assume:
    a whole collection of drivel about shitty defensive D.

    Lets listen to what PC and Tmac had to say.
    they wanted a dominate shutdown D.

    Larson
    toughest comp/ZS faced.
    #10 HSCA D.
    #1 EVGA D.
    #12 PKGA D

    I think the coach who developed; Vlasic; Braun; Demers
    is very happy he has Larsson.

  94. Ronald Chevalier says:

    magneto,

    I heard Paigan was hurt but does anyone know the details?

  95. magneto says:

    Ronald Chevalier: Paigan

    I can not find anything at all, he is on the IR. The initial report was 3 weeks, so 2 more? Will we ever know? Oilers would know, someone ask Chia

  96. Ronald Chevalier says:

    magneto,

    Thanks, I thought I heard he took one off the pills a la Hendricks but not sure.

  97. Yegfoundation says:

    G Money: Well, see there’s the thing.

    Gaudreau played 3 years at BC after being drafted and entered the NHL at age 21.

    Max Domi played two full years of Jr after being drafted and entered the NHL at age 20.

    Dylan Larkin played a year at UMich after being drafted and entered the NHL at age 19.

    Ghostbear played two years of college after being drafted, then had a couple of mixed years before entering the NHL at the age of 22 (he’s actually 6 months older than Yak).

    Parayko played three years of college, with the last year including some AHL time, before debuting in the NHL at age 22.He’s also 5 months older than Yak.

    The latter two obviously are defensemen, but the point being … there is nothing wrong with a development path that does not include NHL time at the age of 18.

    In fact, all of the 3OV picks in the last five years – which JP should have been – spent time in a developmental league (anywhere from half a season to two full seasons) before making it full time to the NHL.

    [naturally the biggest f**kup in that list is the Oilers, who got it backward with Draisaitl – let’s hope they don’t make the same mistake with JP]

    Very well said

  98. stevezie says:

    Arriving late to help tenderize the dead horse, the reason the Larsson option is the worst of Chambers’ four is there is no sweetener.

    Is Harmonic a better bet than Larsson? They’ve both got great contracts but Larsson’s is longer. I’d say they’re pretty close and let the hard cores fight it out. But Harmonic *and* Strome? Good night Jim Kyte, it’s over.

    I don’t mind Hall for Larsson. I have a big problem with Hall for just Larsson.

    (Obviously the Anaheim deal was best and the Colorado deal wasn’t a lot better than what we got. Grigerenko ain’t much and while i like Barrie a lot, i think he’s just an inverted Larsson without that beautiful contract. I probably wouldn’t do it.)

    CB with a good point on Lucic vs Demers. You can’t claim rhD are unobtanium and wingers are nothing but have no problem with the Oiler’s signing priorities. Each argument is okay on its own, but let’s not have our arguments contain to many multitudes.

    As long as I’m going, we all love Yak but he is no Hull and being Canadian would not be enough to save him (though it would probably help). The annals are full of Canadian snipers who either couldn’t make it or were told, “You’re Canadian, stop being flashy. Play defence and hit.”

    Did i stretch too far on the Whitman reference?

  99. JDï™ says:

    stevezie: dead horse

    Isn’t it down to skeletal remains? The buzzards aren’t even interested at this point.

  100. Lowetide says:

    stevezie:
    Arriving late to help tenderize the dead horse, the reason the Larsson option is the worst of Chambers’ four is there is no sweetener.

    I think the sweetener is the contract. Helluva contract.

  101. stevezie says:

    Lowetide,

    Agree on that, but Hall was also on one helluva contract, so i want more.

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