IT DON’T COME EASY

It has been an eventful day for Oilers fans, Condors fans too. Seems Peter Chiarelli and the scouts have been doing their due diligence and the result is some new hires for the farm, and some indication about how things may look in the fall.

BREAKING NEWS!

  • April 3: Bakersfield signs Ryan Mantha and Joe Gambardella to ATO’s for the rest of the season.
  • April 4: Edmonton assigns forward Jujhar Khaira to the Condors.
  • April 5: Bakersfield signs LHD Ziyat Paigin to an ATO for the rest of the season.
  • April 5: Reports have L Evan Polei also signing an ATO and a one-year AHL contract.

That’s a whole lot of things in a very short space of time. So, let’s take them one at a time and see what we can see.

  • RHD Ryan Mantha is a giant defenseman who was drafted by the NY Rangers in 2014. After two seasons, New York decided he hadn’t progressed enough and passed on signing him. He blossomed this year (65, 17-41-58) with the Niagara Ice Dogs and he’ll get a full AHL season in 2017-18. Important not to overreact to a 20-year old dominating junior, but if reports of improved development (foot speed) are true, the 6.05, 225 defender could be a real find.
  • C Joe Gambardella is a center and a fascinating addition for the Oilers. He is an aggressive forechecker and turns that skill into offense off turnovers. With an NHLE of 82, 13-25-38, he’ll be a help in Bakersfield.
  • F Jujhar Khaira is a quality player at this level, and this may be his last trip to the minors for several years. He will be waiver eligible in the fall, and it’s a good guess he lines up as 4L with the Oilers in the fall.
  • LHD Ziyat Paigin is one of the most anticipated draft picks from recent years and this ATO no doubt signals an entry-level contract in the coming days. Paigin’s handling this season was curious and I wonder if contract negotiations with Kazan Ak-Bars impacted where he spent the winter. He has been described to me as a giant (6.06, 209) defender whose offense comes mostly from his point shot. We’ll have to see how well he moves the puck, but that giant wingspan will be useful defensively.
  • L Evan Polei has been mentioned a few times on this blog over the years, his size and skill (6.02, 227 and 33 goals) are intriguing. Looks like an AHL deal and (imo) a solid player for the Condors.

TONIGHT’S LINEUP

  • Joey Laleggia-Anton Lander-Patrick Russell
  • Ryan Hamilton-Joe Gambardella-Jujhar Khaira
  • Jaedon Descheneau-Josh Currie-Jesse Puljujarvi
  • Jere Sallinen-Brodie Dupont-Scott Allen
  • Griffin Reinhart-Jordan Oesterle
  • Mark Fraser-Dillon Simpson
  • Ben Betker-Mark Fayne
  • Nick Ellis (Jonas Gustavsson)

A lot of play online about Jesse Puljujarvi playing on the 3line, but the truth is JP has been playing with Josh Currie quite a bit recently. I would rank Justin Fontaine not being in the lineup as a bigger news item, but Puljujarvi is the most important player in the minors so I get it. Gambardella is the first of the new hires, interesting to see Patrick Russell getting the push, and a reminder about not getting too upset about lineups at the beginning of the game. They could be changed by the first t.v. timeout.

NEXT YEAR CONDORS

These acquisitions give us some indications about what the Condors might look like in the fall. Here’s my estimate of the roster based on waivers, contracts and possible roles:

  • Joey Laleggia (waiver eligible)-Joe Gambardella-Justin Fontaine
  • Scott Allen-Kyle Platzer-Patrick Russell
  • Evan Polei-Josh Currie-Greg Chase
  • Braden Christoffer
  • Ziyat Paigin-Dillon Simpson
  • Caleb Jones-(veteran AHL player, less expensive Mark Fayne)
  • Ben Betker-Ethan Bear
  • Ryan Mantha
  • Nick Ellis (no backup)

We should see more NHL and AHL contracts, suspect they will come over the next several months. The key, ladies and men, is the forwards. How many F’s in tonight’s lineup are a lock for NHL careers? Not enough by plenty. There’s your need.

Note: Bakersfield loaned D Bryce Aneloski to Florida (ECHL) as part of all the movement. PS, I love this stuff! We’re searching for Larry Mavety, and it don’t come easy.

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94 Responses to "IT DON’T COME EASY"

  1. Silver Streak says:

    whats with Jesse Puljujarvi on the 3rd line…..sorry I don’t buy he`s in love with his centreman idea….
    # 3 overall draft picks should be in the bigs at this time of the year…not in Bakersfield on the 3rd damn line.
    I am feeling something other than good about this pick and his handling by the Oil…sitting in the press box till after Christmas was unforgivable, language problems were a lame excuse….they don’t speak much Finnish in California !!!

  2. Pouzar says:

    Red Sox (Sale), Celtics (Cavs), BAK with all the new kids……….DAYUM!!!!

  3. lynn says:

    Jujhar Khaira is playing RW for the Condors tonight. I think this is the first time he will play RW for the Condors. He has always played C or LW in the past. The Oilers played him at RW in his last two starts with the team.

    It seems that the Oilers are trying to add to Jujhar’s versatility.

  4. Lowetide says:

    Silver Streak:
    whats with Jesse Puljujarvi on the 3rd line…..sorry I don’t buy he`s in love with his centremanidea….

    Not quite sure what you are saying here, can you elaborate?

  5. NSmitty says:

    Does NHLE assume a similar role being played? ie. a first line forward in major junior hockey playing 18 minutes a night in the NHL

  6. Professor Q says:

    Now, I think this will good for Bakersfield, especially for a playoffs run. Young Guns in, and hopefully they get time in lieu of the veterans.

    Gambardella, Polei, Puljüjarvi, Mantha, Paigin, Ellis, and hey, the good veterans in Khaira and Lander.

    Then later on Bear and Jones.

    We might not have space for them all!

    Let alone the possibility of Foo and other rumoured signings.

    Wait, do they still have room to potentially sign Foo et al.?

  7. Silver Streak says:

    Lowetide,

    Allan….in your article you mention JP is on the 3rd line tonight as he has played a lot recently with Josh Currie…I assume that Currie is slotted as 3C and not 1C for a reason. Why can’t we get JP playing big minutes with the most skilled line mates available. Lander was a great fit for him for example.

    While I have your attention….have you had time to dig into whats happening with Spencer Foo ??

    thanks

  8. CamRent BroBot says:

    Pouzar,

    Sale looks great so far. Sucks we had to give up Kopech (never really liked Moncada) but he is a terrific talent.

  9. Lowetide says:

    Silver Streak:
    Lowetide,

    Allan….in your article you mention JP is on the 3rd line tonight as he has played a lot recently with Josh Currie…I assume that Currie is slotted as 3C and not 1C for a reason. Why can’t we get JP playing big minutes with the most skilled line matesavailable. Lander was a great fit for him for example.

    While I have your attention….have you had time to dig into whats happening with Spencer Foo ??

    thanks

    Tonight’s lineup is absolutely drunk with veterans, this is designed to win the game. That’s why fontaine being out is the big story. Puljujarvi has been spending time with Josh Currie on the 2line, which is curious but not terminal. Russell playing up is also weird, and of course we may be seeing the lines change early.

    As for Foo, I would expect something after school ends, sounds like he wants to complete his education, then decide.

  10. Professor Q says:

    Lowetide,

    Never mind, I checked it. They still have 2 more spots left to sign and I guess ATOs don’t really count?

    So they could potentially sign him to an ATO for Bakersfield and then sign him to an Entry Level deal afterwards?

  11. Philosophil says:

    ….no it don’t come easy.

    That line/song is a 70’s blast. Memories of driving from Turtleford to Brightsand in the backseat of my parents car listening to CJNB. Love the lyrical references LT, everytime.

  12. Pouzar says:

    CamRent BroBot:
    Pouzar,

    Sale looks great so far. Sucks we had to give up Kopech (never really liked Moncada) but he is a terrific talent.

    A lot to give up. I liked Benintendi more than Moncada. Wise to keep Devers since he is the future at third and I really like Travis at 1B. This organization absolutely needs to get better at developing power arms especially in relief.

  13. Craig Zonit says:

    Looks like Couture and Thornton could both be back for the Sharks.

    After posting .885 in March, Martin Jones posted .969 in two games against the Dys so far this April. Of course, not a lot of road between that and the 3 blow outs that preceded their loss against the Oilers to end March.

    Hard to say whether this matchup is favourable, but it’s the one we’ve likely got. I hope the Oilers set the tone for a tough series tomorrow.

  14. russ99 says:

    Kyle Okposo is in the hospital in ICU.

    http://buffalonews.com/2017/04/05/sabres-okposo-hospitalized-icu-department/

    Scary stuff, hope he’s going to be OK

  15. Rondo says:

    LT,

    Whats up with Markus Niemelainen ?

  16. Lowetide says:

    Rondo:
    LT,

    whats up with Markus Niemelainen ?

    His OHL season is done, back playing for Finland at the U20. Would not be at all surprised if he plays over there next season.

  17. Rondo says:

    Lowetide: His OHL season is done, back playing for Finland at the U20. Would not be at all surprised if he plays over there next season.

    Thanks, maybe we see more offense

  18. Silver Streak says:

    Lowetide,

    Spencer Foo was quoted last week saying good-by to Union….a very thoughtful thank you to all.
    He is signing somewhere….My take is he is holding out for a Caggiula type guaranteed playing time
    contract….Chiarelli maybe playing hardball…..if we lose him would be a shame.

  19. geowal says:

    If playing hardball means not guaranteeing playing time, I’m all for it

  20. Lowetide says:

    Silver Streak:
    Lowetide,

    Spencer Foo was quoted last week saying good-by to Union….a very thoughtful thank you to all.
    He is signing somewhere….My take is he is holding out for a Caggiula type guaranteed playing time
    contract….Chiarelli maybe playing hardball…..if we lose him would be a shame.

    I don’t take it being that way, to be honest. Players have the option of going right away, as is the case with Gambardella. Foo sounded like he wanted to finish school and then go from there. Maybe your scenario is the correct one, but I haven’t seen any evidence and it would be unusual behavior.

  21. Pescador says:

    Fantastic evening post Mr Tide,
    Finish school & then decide, how selfish.
    Why does S. Foo hate us?
    Don’t know if it was mentioned in the previous thread, if it was I apologize.
    That being said would anyone get tired of reading thing like;
    Patrick Kane has to score 8 points in his final 2 games to win the Hart trophy. That’s IF of course, Connor McDavid scores 0 points in the next 3.
    It’s Over!

  22. Lowetide says:

    Texas scores, 1-0.

  23. Lowetide says:

    2-0 Texas.

  24. CamRent BroBot says:

    Pouzar,

    Benintendi is fantastic. And yes, they need a lot from Devers seeing as Panda’s their only real option (unless you think Marco Hernandez can play there, but I think he profiles better as a second baseman). Yes they really do need better homegrown pitchers. It would also help if their relief acquisitions didn’t keep getting hurt.

  25. Pescador says:

    Lowetide: His OHL season is done, back playing for Finland at the U20. Would not be at all surprised if he plays over there next season.

    Playing your draft+1 season in Finland is veritable career suicide if this blog has taught me anything.
    No one mention this to Pouzar, I need time sneak out

  26. Lowetide says:

    3-0 Stars.

  27. Psyche says:

    Is there a live link to the Condors game available?

  28. Professor Q says:

    Lowetide: I don’t take it being that way, to be honest. Players have the option of going right away, as is the case with Gambardella. Foo sounded like he wanted to finish school and then go from there. Maybe your scenario is the correct one, but I haven’t seen any evidence and it would be unusual behavior.

    He did say both. First he was foregoing, then staying, then back to foregoing. He changed his mind in the span of a few days so it was confusing.

    https://www.unionathletics.com/news/2017/3/29/mens-ice-hockey-spencer-foo-to-forego-senior-season.aspx

  29. Professor Q says:

    Lowetide:
    3-0 Stars.

    Holy shit. This isn’t good at all.

  30. Lowetide says:

    Very nice worl by Gambardella, sends a pass to the slot and Mark Fraser scores. Good job by the new guy.

  31. Lowetide says:

    Puljujarvi now with Lander, took all of the first period and 3GA to get them together.

  32. zatch says:

    I need some expertise everyone. Me and some buddies are making up our All Time Teams for our favorite teams. Full playing roster and spares for each position. Each player picked is based on a particular season. Here’s what I came up with. It was hard. Any suggestions???

    F1: Hall 12-13, Gretzky 85-86, Kurri 84-85
    F2: Tikkanen 88-89, McDavid 16-17, Anderson 82-83
    F3: Simpson 88-89, Messier 89-90, Hemsky 07-08
    F4: Smyth 03-04, Weight 95-96, Eberle 11-12
    SPARE: Damphousse 91-92, Carson 88-89, Murphy 91-92

    D1: Pronger 05-06, Coffey 85-86
    D2: Lowe 83-94, Visnovsky 08-09
    D3: S. Smith 87-88, Souray 08-09
    SPARE: Hamrlik 97-98, Huddy 82-83

    G1: Salo 99-00
    G2: Moog 84-85
    SPARE: Fuhr 85-86

    I am REALLY unsure about the LW and the bottom defense. Also, that 99-00 season by Tommy Salo was extremely impressive. Can some of the Greybeards help a child of ’89?

  33. Jaxon says:

    LHD Ben Betker – 6’6″, 228lbs
    RHD Ryan Mantha – 6’6″, 225lbs
    LHD Ziyat Paigin – 6’6″, 209lbs
    LHD Griffin Reinhart – 6’4″, 212lbs
    LHD David Musil – 6’4″, 207lbs
    LHD Dillon Simpson – 6’2″, 201lbs
    RHD Ethan Bear – 5’11”, 205lbs
    LHD Caleb Jones – 6’1″, 195lbs

    That’s a pretty heavy blueline.
    Reinhart, Simpson, and Musil are all RFAs this summer. Simpson and Musil have arbitration rights.

    A highly possible pick would be RHD Conor Timmins who had an NHLE of 24 this season.
    RHD Conor Timmins – 6’1″, 185lbs.

    I know it seems odd to say this when the Oilers are fighting for 1st in the division and heading into the playoffs, but I’m really looking forward to camp next fall. I do love the anticipation of an NHL season.

    “”Well,” said Pooh, “what I like best-” and then he had to stop and think. Because although Eating Honey was a very good thing to do, there was a moment just before you began to eat it which was better than when you were, but he didn’t know what it was called.” – AA Milne

    I’m already looking forward to seeing Paigin (can he find his offence form last season?), Betker (who always seems to show well in camp), Bear (having an amazing season), Jones (ditto), Mantha (great find), Reinhart (last chance) on D, maybe hometown kid Spencer Foo on RW. Where will Puljujarvi fit in? Will Caggiula improve over this season? Will Ellis surpass Broissot and challenge for the backup job in Edmonton or be the started in Bakersfield?

    Who will they pick with their first pick? I’m betting on one of RHD Timmins, RH LW Popugayev, or LH RW Vesalainen, which would all seem to be great fits for Edmonton.

    Plus bring on the playoffs!!! Woohoo! Exciting times.

  34. Centre of attention says:

    Lowetide:
    Puljujarvi now with Lander, took all of the first period and 3GA to get them together.

    Russel back with Lander at least on that shift.

    Interesting flip flopping by the coaching staff.

  35. Centre of attention says:

    DuPont scores for Bakersfield. 4-2 Stars

  36. frjohnk says:

    zatch:
    I need some expertise everyone. Me and some buddies are making up our All Time Teams for our favorite teams. Full playing roster and spares for each position. Each player picked is based on a particular season. Here’s what I came up with. It was hard. Any suggestions???

    F1: Hall 12-13, Gretzky 85-86, Kurri 84-85
    F2: Tikkanen 88-89, McDavid 16-17, Anderson 82-83
    F3: Simpson 88-89, Messier 89-90, Hemsky 07-08
    F4: Smyth 03-04, Weight 95-96, Eberle 11-12
    SPARE: Damphousse 91-92, Carson 88-89, Murphy 91-92

    D1: Pronger 05-06, Coffey 85-86
    D2: Lowe 83-94, Visnovsky 08-09
    D3: S. Smith 87-88, Souray 08-09
    SPARE: Hamrlik 97-98, Huddy 82-83

    G1: Salo 99-00
    G2: Moog 84-85
    SPARE: Fuhr 85-86

    I am REALLY unsure about the LW and the bottom defense. Also, that 99-00 season by Tommy Salo was extremely impressive. Can some of the Greybeards help a child of ’89?

    LW is good. Hall was 3rd in allstar voting that year for LW. The year that Ovie was 1st in RW in 2nd in LW!!! Simpson was great on a line with Messier and Anderson. The rest of the LW were some of my favorites. Loved Tik, Captain Canada was my favorite Oiler in the late 90’s and 2000’s.

    You got all the best D from years past, so Id dont see anything out of line.

    Two goalies Im sure you considered are Ranford and this years Talbot.

    I

  37. frjohnk says:

    Centre of attention: Russel back with Lander at least on that shift.

    How is his “reset”?

  38. Centre of attention says:

    frjohnk: How is his “reset”?

    Haha, man that move annoys me.

  39. Professor Q says:

    Centre of attention: Haha, man that move annoys me.

    I’m always at a loss when this term comes up. Like, resetting an NES?

  40. Centre of attention says:

    Professor Q: I’m always at a loss when this term comes up. Like, resetting an NES?

    Russel likes to chill behind the net on break outs and its annoying.

    Our center (sometimes McDavid) will come onto the ice after the line change, circle low looking for that easy 5-10 foot pass but instead Russel holds, and by now the opposition forcheck is coming at him. At that point he has no chance in hell of making that breakout pass, so he then air-mails it out of the zone or rips it off the glass and we get to watch the McDavid line chase for a bit until they gain back possession.

    This is even reflected in McDavids vast drop in production whenever Russel is on the ice. 97 drops by something like an entire point-per-hour when Russel is on the ice 5 on 5.

    IIRC he’s at ~3 pts per 60 without and when Russell is on he’s at 2.2 or something. That’s a massive difference over the course of a season.

    Leaving McPoints on the table is no bueno.

    Russel can skate pretty well, he needs to use those wheels more on breakouts. (Or simply pass it with some urgency)

  41. stush18 says:

    Man is our defence looking unreal right now.

    Klefbom-Larsson
    Sekera-Russell
    Nurse-Benning
    Reinhart-Gryba
    Oesterle-Fayne
    Paigan-Simpson
    Betker-Mantha
    Jones-Bear

    Lagesson-berglund
    Nelemienen

    Seriously that’s some unreal depth. Big guys who can skate and move the puck, and smaller guys who can put up points.

    Severely underrated defence imo

  42. Lloyd B. says:

    zatch:
    I need some expertise everyone. Me and some buddies are making up our All Time Teams for our favorite teams. Full playing roster and spares for each position. Each player picked is based on a particular season. Here’s what I came up with. It was hard. Any suggestions???

    F1: Hall 12-13, Gretzky 85-86, Kurri 84-85
    F2: Tikkanen 88-89, McDavid 16-17, Anderson 82-83
    F3: Simpson 88-89, Messier 89-90, Hemsky 07-08
    F4: Smyth 03-04, Weight 95-96, Eberle 11-12
    SPARE: Damphousse 91-92, Carson 88-89, Murphy 91-92

    D1: Pronger 05-06, Coffey 85-86
    D2: Lowe 83-94, Visnovsky 08-09
    D3: S. Smith 87-88, Souray 08-09
    SPARE: Hamrlik 97-98, Huddy 82-83

    G1: Salo 99-00
    G2: Moog 84-85
    SPARE: Fuhr 85-86

    I am REALLY unsure about the LW and the bottom defense. Also, that 99-00 season by Tommy Salo was extremely impressive. Can some of the Greybeards help a child of ’89?

    I get the love you are giving McDavid, but I’m not sure rating him above Messier is correct.

    At this time he could even be below Weight. No shame in that.

    There is no doubt there are seasons to come where McDavid will pass Weight and may well come to approach Messier.

    The Oilers have been blessed with incredible centers over the years.

    That would be a difficult exercise for sure. Lots of greatness to choose from.

  43. Professor Q says:

    Puljüjarvi was playing well there.

    Nice goal by Gambit.

  44. Centre of attention says:

    Gambardella picks up a working mans goal, cleaning up a juicy rebound infront.

    now 1-1-2 on the night

  45. Lowetide says:

    Gambardella scores, now 4-3. He is 1-1-2 in his pro debut.

  46. zatch says:

    frjohnk,
    Thanks. I tried to stay pretty objective, with some subjectivity. Salo was 13th in SP that year while playing 70 games and was 10 points above average SP. Talbot is 13th, with 71 games played (so far) but is closer to the pack. That Moog season was 19 (!!!!!) points above average, and he was 3rd in SP but he only played 39 games. I may move Talbot into the spare position over Fuhr.

    Is the order of the LW’s right? I’m unsure about Tikkanen and Simpson’s overall ability, although from what I’ve been told, Tikka was a solid 2 way player. Was Smyth better than Simpson?

  47. godot10 says:

    zatch:
    I need some expertise everyone. Me and some buddies are making up our All Time Teams for our favorite teams. Full playing roster and spares for each position. Each player picked is based on a particular season. Here’s what I came up with. It was hard. Any suggestions???

    F1: Hall 12-13, Gretzky 85-86, Kurri 84-85
    F2: Tikkanen 88-89, McDavid 16-17, Anderson 82-83
    F3: Simpson 88-89, Messier 89-90, Hemsky 07-08
    F4: Smyth 03-04, Weight 95-96, Eberle 11-12
    SPARE: Damphousse 91-92, Carson 88-89, Murphy 91-92

    D1: Pronger 05-06, Coffey 85-86
    D2: Lowe 83-94, Visnovsky 08-09
    D3: S. Smith 87-88, Souray 08-09
    SPARE: Hamrlik 97-98, Huddy 82-83

    G1: Salo 99-00
    G2: Moog 84-85
    SPARE: Fuhr 85-86

    I am REALLY unsure about the LW and the bottom defense. Also, that 99-00 season by Tommy Salo was extremely impressive. Can some of the Greybeards help a child of ’89?

    Fuhr
    Ranford
    Joseph

    Coffey, Huddy
    Lowe, Pronger
    Gregg, Larsson
    Ruotsalainen

    Tikkanen, Gretzky, Kurri
    Hall, Messier, Anderson
    Smyth, Weight, Hemsky
    Simpson, McDavid, Eberle
    Hunter, MacTavish

    EDIT: if you want 8D, and 15F, then add Steve Smith and Shawn Horcoff

  48. zatch says:

    Lloyd B.,

    McDavid is having a better season than Weight or Messier had from a scoring perspective. Part of the exercise was also taking one season per player per team. So when I look at it, I don’t think Messier ever had a season as good as McDavid is now. It’s razor thin of course. I had a lot of trouble with that decision, and I think I liked McDavid as the 2C and Mess on the 3C too much. Weight certainly wasn’t close.

    It’s a bit tough, because context DOES matter. My Canucks friend left Cliff Ronning off because although he had a very good season (for a Canucks C; that franchises struggles can be explained by looking at their C history) he was zoomed almost completely by Bure.

    Anyway, as they say on TV Tropes, Your Mileage May Vary (YMMV)

  49. Professor Q says:

    Professor Q:
    Puljüjarvi was playing well there.

    Nice goal by Gambit.

    This was an auto correct mistake, but hey, it works.

  50. speeds says:

    LT (or anyone): Do you think playing Khaira on RW is a tell that JP may be heading to EDM, or unrelated to that and that’s just where they thought it was best to slot him in?

  51. leadfarmer says:

    zatch,

    Cujo, Arnott, Klima maybe? Al Hamilton probably deserves a nod

    Now do an all time Oilers crap team

  52. Lloyd B. says:

    godot10: Fuhr
    Ranford
    Joseph

    Coffey, Huddy
    Lowe, Pronger
    Gregg, Larsson
    Ruotsalainen

    Tikkanen, Gretzky, Kurri
    Hall, Messier, Anderson
    Smyth, Weight, Hemsky
    Simpson, McDavid, Eberle
    Hunter, MacTavish

    Thats very good. Goalies are in much better (and correct) order.

  53. Professor Q says:

    Wrong rubber to use in that area, Gus.

  54. zatch says:

    leadfarmer,

    CuJo and Arnott were not as good as you remember. Or I remembered. They were my childhood heroes, to the point my lucky number is 38, their numbers combined. Klima came close. I think people forget how good that Salo season was.

    godot10,

    I feel like this team is too heavy on the 80s but I sense a generation gap thing there. I can’t judge. Except for Fuhr. His numbers were typically meh his whole career. This is one a lot of other fans bases mock Edmonton for (as in Fuhr is the worst goalie in the HoF)

  55. Lloyd B. says:

    zatch:
    Lloyd B.,

    McDavid is having a better season than Weight or Messier had from a scoring perspective. Part of the exercise was also taking one season per player per team. So when I look at it, I don’t think Messier ever had a season as good as McDavid is now. It’s razor thin of course. I had a lot of trouble with that decision, and I think I liked McDavid as the 2C and Mess on the 3C too much. Weight certainly wasn’t close.

    It’s a bit tough, because context DOES matter. My Canucks friend left Cliff Ronning off because although he had a very good season (for a Canucks C; that franchises struggles can be explained by looking at their C history) he was zoomed almost completely by Bure.

    Anyway, as they say on TV Tropes, Your Mileage May Vary (YMMV)

    My mileage does vary. 🙂

    Messier had six seasons over 100 points. 129 in 89/90.

  56. godot10 says:

    zatch:
    leadfarmer,

    godot10,

    I feel like this team is too heavy on the 80s but I sense a generation gap thing there. I can’t judge. Except for Fuhr. His numbers were typically meh his whole career. This is one a lot of other fans bases mock Edmonton for (as in Fuhr is the worst goalie in the HoF)

    Stats are overrated sometimes, particularly when comparing “live” puck goaltenders with the “dead” puck goaltenders. Fuhr is arguably as good or better than any goaltender who has ever played.

  57. zatch says:

    Lloyd B.,

    Ah, see the idea was, if you could pluck out a roster of guys from your team from seasons in history, who would you take. It’s not a career aggregate thing. I think McDavid leading the league pushes him over the top.

    I shudder to think what the Habs gal is gonna bring to the table. We might load em up into NHL 17 and see what happens haha.

  58. zatch says:

    godot10,

    This is one of those things where people don’t budge haha.

    My other controversial hot take is that Richards 50 in 50 is the most overrated achievement in pro sports. Dude was playing in a AAAA league.

  59. Lloyd B. says:

    zatch:
    Lloyd B.,

    Ah, see the idea was, if you could pluck out a roster of guys from your team from seasons in history, who would you take. It’s not a career aggregate thing. I think McDavid leading the league pushes him over the top.

    I shudder to think what the Habs gal is gonna bring to the table. We might load em up into NHL 17 and see what happens haha.

    Tough exercise for sure. Hopefully the Habs gal is young ! Very young !

    You need to hope all the folks in your game picking the original 6 teams are young. Even the leafs guy. Particularly the leafs guy!! 🙂

  60. Professor Q says:

    Lloyd B.: Tough exercise for sure.Hopefully the Habs gal is young ! Very young !

    You need to hope all the folks in your game picking the original 6 teams are young. Even the leafs guy.Particularly the leafs guy!!

    Wings would definitely be tough, too!

  61. Lloyd B. says:

    Professor Q: Wings would definitely be tough, too!

    Kind of my point. Maybe they haven’t heard of Gordie Howe if they are young enough. Or have been hiding under a rock.

  62. Pescador says:

    zatch:
    godot10,

    This is one of those things where people don’t budge haha.

    My other controversial hot take is that Richards 50 in 50 is the most overrated achievement in pro sports. Dude was playing in a AAAA league.

    Clarity request: what does AAAA league mean?
    Thx

  63. jp says:

    godot10: Stats are overrated sometimes, particularly when comparing “live” puck goaltenders with the “dead” puck goaltenders. Fuhr is arguably as good or better than any goaltender who has ever played.

    zatch:
    godot10,

    This is one of those things where people don’t budge haha.

    My other controversial hot take is that Richards 50 in 50 is the most overrated achievement in pro sports. Dude was playing in a AAAA league.

    Fuhr was regarded as probably the best goalie in the world in the late 80s. His 87-88 season – lead the league in GP and wins. 1st team all-star, won the Vezina and the cup, and 2nd in Hart trophy voting. Also Team Canada’s goalie and all-star at the Canada cup that year. I’d take that over Salo.

    And say what you will about The Rocket’s 50 in 50, but no one else did it for 36 yrs, and only 4 others have ever done it (all in a much higher scoring era). The #2 scorer that year had 32 goals. Strongly disagree it’s an overrated achievement.

  64. The Original JDI says:

    leadfarmer: Now do an all time Oilers crap team

    You start with a smell that just won’t go away, put the best winger at center for a while, call out your starting goaler in the media, sign a slow KHL defender, hand the 1RD spot to a soft rookie, and have them coached by an ego maniacal rookie coach with a bunch of known unknowns. Or was that unknown knowns?

    My bad…

  65. Chachi says:

    Pescador: Clarity request: what does AAAA league mean?
    Thx

    I think AAAA means it appears first in the phone book.

  66. Pescador says:

    Chachi: I think AAAA means it appears first in the phone book.

    Everyone knows that A, Aaronson.
    Obscure Simpson reference, Patti & Selma with the phone book. What is wrong with my brain?

  67. Chachi says:

    Pescador: Everyone knows that A, Aaronson.
    Obscure Simpson reference, Patti & Selma with the phone book. What is wrong with my brain?

    Your brain seems to be working just fine.

  68. Lowetide says:

    speeds:
    LT (or anyone): Do you think playing Khaira on RW is a tell that JP may be heading to EDM, or unrelated to that and that’s just where they thought it was best to slot him in?

    Great question. I have been wondering if he might get the call, has to come soon if they want to get him another regular season game.

  69. Pescador says:

    The Original JDI,

    I understand
    The Original JDI: You start with a smell that just won’t go away, put the best winger at center for a while, call out your starting goaler in the media, sign a slow KHL defender, hand the 1RD spot to a soft rookie, and have them coached by an ego maniacal rookie coach with a bunch of known unknowns. Or was that unknown knowns?

    My bad…

    I still like him better then Tambellini

  70. Pescador says:

    Lowetide: Great question. I have been wondering if he might get the call, has to come soon if they want to get him another regular season game.

    I posted this in a previous thread,
    I would call him up for 1 more game. The one after Talbot has the new team record for wins, the one after Connor has secured all the Trophies he deserves & The one after the Oilers have secured home ice. So Vancouver it is hopefully the first one

  71. Ryan says:

    Woodguy v2.0: COME BACK GMONEY!

    Haha, I know you’re much closer to Gmoney than I am.

    Yet, I’ve previously summoned him back here a few times with the Beetlejuice method, lol.

    What’s also funny is that I used to disagree with/argue with him as much as anyone (you too for that matter, yet he and I (and you an I too) always got along really well in spite of that.

    Gmoney, gmoney, Gmoney…

  72. Lloyd B. says:

    Lowetide: Great question. I have been wondering if he might get the call, has to come soon if they want to get him another regular season game.

    JP is better off with the Condors for their run. Once their season is over they can bring him up to soak up the atmosphere and gets free tix to NHL playoffs !!

    Bringing him up now to sit in the press box doesn’t help him nor the Oilers.

  73. Lloyd B. says:

    Pescador: I posted this in a previous thread,
    I would call him up for 1 more game. The one after Talbot has the new team record for wins, the one after Connor has secured all the Trophies he deserves & The one after the Oilers have secured home ice. So Vancouver it is hopefully the first one

    So next year then.

  74. Pescador says:

    Chachi: Your brain seems to be working just fine.

    Sa

    Chachi: Your brain seems to be working just fine.

    I love this place

  75. Pescador says:

    Lloyd B.: So next year then.

    What does the B stand for?
    Banks

  76. Pescador says:

    Lloyd B.: So next year then.

    Na, I’m pretty confident it will be this Saturday

  77. The Original JDI says:

    Pescador:
    The Original JDI,

    I still like him better then Tambellini

    Also:

    Hitler >>> Stalin

    ’74 Mustang II >>> ’74 Vega

    The Six Million Dollar Man >>> The Fall Guy

    Lucky Lager >>> Urine (preferably your own)

    Kenny Rogers >>> Kenny Loggins

  78. Lloyd B. says:

    Pescador: What does the B stand for?
    Banks

    I’m one of the very few guys that uses his real name here. We do know some of the folks real names here.

    None of the trolls of course.

    I hate the anonymous stuff the internet lets folks hide behind.

    The B. shall remain my own. It is my last name. It’s not Banks.

    I am thinking of changing my name to Digger Odele. (How would I do that LT? I understand it’s a PITA at your end)

    My father passed away a year ago and his CB identifier was Digger Odele.

    For you youngins… CB was the forerunner of the cell phone.

  79. The Original JDI says:

    Lloyd B.: CB identifier

    I believe that’s called a ‘handle’, good buddy.

    What’s your 10-20?

  80. frjohnk says:

    My twitter time line absolutely blew up last night over the Hall Larsson trade.

    LT, you are gonna have to ask Scott Cullen about the trade next time he is on your show.

  81. Chachi says:

    frjohnk:
    My twitter time line absolutely blew up last night over the Hall Larsson trade.

    LT, you are gonna have to ask Scott Cullen about the trade next time he is on your show.

    Yeah, Cullen referred to Larsson as a “passenger” on the Oilers. That was bound to stir the pot.

  82. Bruce Wayne says:

    Just checked it out. Cullen absolutely crushed Oiler fanboys in those exchanges.

    Best line, because it pertains to our discussion yesterday.

    “Don’t let team results affect individual player evaluation.”

    Or as we like to say around here: “Wins don’t matter.

  83. Scungilli says:

    McDavid right now is a better offensive player than Messier and Weight. But to be a better overall player, not yet. McD says Crosby is a better player, and right now he’s correct.

    When McD gets the whole game down, both ends of the ice and playing well through games where they key on him and there is no room, then he’ll have few peers. Not there yet, he’s barely played a season’s worth of games.

  84. Chachi says:

    Bruce Wayne:
    Just checked it out.Cullen absolutely crushed Oiler fanboys in those exchanges.

    Best line, because it pertains to our discussion yesterday.

    “Don’t let team results affect individual player evaluation.”

    Or as we like to say around here:“Wins don’t matter.

    Does referring to people as “fanboys” make you feel better about yourself?

  85. russ99 says:

    Pescador: Clarity request: what does AAAA league mean?
    Thx

    Baseball reference.

    Good AAA player, dud major leaguer.

  86. Rocknrolla says:

    zatch:
    I need some expertise everyone. Me and some buddies are making up our All Time Teams for our favorite teams. Full playing roster and spares for each position. Each player picked is based on a particular season. Here’s what I came up with. It was hard. Any suggestions???

    F1: Hall 12-13, Gretzky 85-86, Kurri 84-85
    F2: Tikkanen 88-89, McDavid 16-17, Anderson 82-83
    F3: Simpson 88-89, Messier 89-90, Hemsky 07-08
    F4: Smyth 03-04, Weight 95-96, Eberle 11-12
    SPARE: Damphousse 91-92, Carson 88-89, Murphy 91-92

    D1: Pronger 05-06, Coffey 85-86
    D2: Lowe 83-94, Visnovsky 08-09
    D3: S. Smith 87-88, Souray 08-09
    SPARE: Hamrlik 97-98, Huddy 82-83

    G1: Salo 99-00
    G2: Moog 84-85
    SPARE: Fuhr 85-86

    I am REALLY unsure about the LW and the bottom defense. Also, that 99-00 season by Tommy Salo was extremely impressive. Can some of the Greybeards help a child of ’89?

    No greybeard here, but your goalies are off. Where ranford? Cujo?

  87. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Ryan: Haha, I know you’re much closer to Gmoney than I am.

    Yet, I’ve previously summoned him back here a few times with the Beetlejuice method, lol.

    What’s also funny is that I used to disagree with/argue with him as much as anyone (you too for that matter, yet he and I (and you an I too) always got along really well in spite of that.

    Gmoney, gmoney, Gmoney…

    I get along (or try) with a lot of people I disagree with.

    Learned lots from them too.

    Its the “no content” trolls that wreck the joint.

  88. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Chachi: Does referring to people as “fanboys” make you feel better about yourself?

    Agreed.

    “fanboys” is very trollish

  89. Chachi says:

    Woodguy v2.0: Agreed.

    “fanboys” is very trollish

    Especially when you are (mostly) right about something the quickest way to make someone discount your opinion is to insult other people while you try to make your point. I am wrong about everything, it is who I am, but I happen to insult people ALL the time so I speak from experience on this one.

  90. Bruce Wayne says:

    Woodguy v2.0: Agreed.

    “fanboys” is very trollish

    Oh, absolutely. I have long since stopped trying. When you are castigated as a fool for stating the obvious there is nothing to be done but trade insults. But don’t worry, I post less and less with each passing day.

  91. Chachi says:

    Bruce Wayne: Oh, absolutely.I have long since stopped trying.When you are castigated as a fool for stating the obvious there is nothing to be done but trade insults.But don’t worry, I post less and less with each passing day.

    That’s too bad, occasionally you post things that are thought provoking.

  92. Professor Q says:

    russ99: Baseball reference.

    Good AAA player, dud major leaguer.

    Ah, so *bat*teries, eh?

  93. Professor Q says:

    Chachi: That’s too bad, occasionally you post things that are thought provoking.

    Wayning of late, though, eh?

  94. Chachi says:

    Professor Q: Wayning of late, though, eh?

    HA!

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