NOTHING MATTERS, AND WHAT IF IT DID?

I’m not one to believe the general manager in the exit meeting, although sometimes the summer works out as described. Craig MacTavish, a smart man as sure as I’m sittin’ here, telegraphed too much and that’s my opinion. Sometimes a general manager will tell you what he thinks and then things don’t work out as planned.

  • Peter Chiarelli 2016 on the summer plan: “I’m looking at all options. We’ve got to improve now but there’s some pretty good future players out here and elsewhere. There’s a lot of chatter going on right now and we’ve got a month and a half to go, so we’ll see what happens, but I have to listen to everything. The Oilers have drafted in the top three in five of the last six years. The team will be moving into a new building for 2016-17 — Rogers Place — and with a promising young core already in place, the possibility is there for Edmonton to trade their first round pick this year for more immediate help. Would I look to move it? We want to win. I took the job in Edmonton to win, so as I said earlier, we’ll look at all options. There’s some pretty good players that are going to be available at four but we may look to move down and still use a pick to get an asset as part of a larger deal. We owe it to the fans to get better in a relatively short period of time and we’re going to look at all options to allow us to do that.” Source

Now, I imagine we’ll spend all damn day talking about what was heard or what was implied last summer, but let’s spend a minute on what we actually know.

  • Elliotte Friedman: I’m not sure Colorado ever got past Subban’s contract. Same with Edmonton. Chiarelli wouldn’t comment, but multiple sources said conversations between the Canadiens and Oilers did not last very long at all. The Oilers did not like the ask, and they know McDavid could become the highest-paid player in the NHL. They were not interested in pairing whatever that number will be with Subban’s $9M. An Edmonton-Montreal deal was never close. Source

Jim Matheson of the EJ talked specifically about a trade involving Subban:

  • They would have the No. 4 draft pick and presumably either winger Taylor Hall or centre Ryan Nugent-Hopkins to dangle —Montreal likes French-Canadian forward Pierre-Luc Dubois who will not be there at the Habs’ No. 9—but Bergevin seems adamant Subban will be a Canadien. He needs a big centre and the Oilers also have Leon Draisaitl who would interest them, but no dice. He won’t be going anywhere. Chiarelli would likely be leery of moving young Oscar Klefbom as well. Source

I think, and did at the time, that this deal wasn’t close. Point of interest: I would have been all-in on a Subban deal, to the point of dealing Leon and Oscar and exchanging picks. My idea doesn’t look as good today, but for me there was (and is) a lot of value in contemplating an Oilers team with Subban and Hall as part of the future. That was yesterday, but I wanted to revisit the Subban portion of last summer as an example of ideas explored and paths not chosen. If you believe Peter Chiarelli has mapped out this summer with certainty, you are going to be disappointed.

PETER CHIARELLI’S SUMMER LIST

  1. Get Connor McDavid signed to a long-term contract. ($10-13 million times 8?)
  2. Get Leon Draisaitl signed to a long-term contract. ($7-9 million times 8?)
  3. Negotiate the expansion draft rapids without giving up a valuable piece of the future. (Griffin Reinhart, Jujhar Khaira, Mark Letestu)
  4. Find a way to trade Benoit Pouliot off the roster. (trade with LV or buyout)
  5. Find a second pairing D with two-way acumen. (Hamonic, Franson, Kris Russell)
  6. Find a bottom 6F who can help the offense. (Cizikas, Sutter)
  7. Find a way to cover off buried contracts. (Fayne)
  8. Make enough cap room to get everyone in under the number with enough room to spare for the trade deadline.

POSSIBLE ASSETS OUT

  1. Jordan Eberle
  2. Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
  3. Jesse Puljujarvi
  4. No. 22 overall
  5. Caleb Jones
  6. 2018 first-round selection
  7. Anton Slepyshev
  8. Jujhar Khaira

I think we could see any of these elements sent away over the summer, in the interests of pushing for Stanley. The window is open, Edmonton no longer has Taylor Hall to shop, and increasingly I am thinking the most valuable piece might be a prospect (Puljujarvi, Jones, Slepyshev, Khaira). Vegas is going to want young players who are NHL-ready, and both Eberle and the Nuge are in a period of lower value. The play here might be Jesse Puljujarvi, and no one is predicting that outcome. I don’t think we can make very many predictions we know to be true about this summer, because we don’t know the landscape. This expansion draft makes anything possible, dream and nightmare.

written by

The author didn‘t add any Information to his profile yet.
Related Posts

68 Responses to "NOTHING MATTERS, AND WHAT IF IT DID?"

  1. Yeti says:

    Great commentary, interesting list of assets.
    Would you not consider Maroon as a potential asset or is he ‘untouchable’?

  2. Lowetide says:

    Yeti:
    Great commentary, interesting list of assets.
    Would you not consider Maroon as a potential asset or is he ‘untouchable’?

    I think the Oilers are inside the window now, and Maroon can score 25-30 on the top line. Things change in a hurry, but I suspect Maroon is here for another year and then some.

  3. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Yeti:
    Great commentary, interesting list of assets.
    Would you not consider Maroon as a potential asset or is he ‘untouchable’?

    I would. I like the player but he’s not IMO a certain 25+ scorer, and with player like that he’ll decline rapidly when it starts. Although I’m not certain the team is quite ready to lessen the bouncer squad. Anaheim would I think have intimidated the young Oilers without the guys the Ducks didn’t truly want to have a piece of.

  4. Diablo says:

    Its always interesting to revisit the past – there was a vocal majority here who was in favour of trading #4 overall, Draisaitl and Klefbom for Subban (+ keeping Hall).

    A team with Hall and Subban (team A)

    vs

    A team with Draisaitl, Klefbom, Larsson (team B)

    Team A has more offence, but team B has more depth on D and IMO has the better forward right now and in the future. They (will) both cost the same. But team B also has a top prospect in JP, whereas team A has none.

    Overall, I like Chia’s work here. Montreal fans must want to fire Bergevin into the sun right now – if they had offered to pick up some of the salary on Subban’s deal (like Toronto did when they traded Kessel), things might have been different.

  5. Doug McLachlan says:

    Last summer I was unable to imagine Hall as one of the assets heading out so I need a reminder that anyone could be dealt but JP seems like an awfully big price to pay.

    On the inexpensive to acquire front, an ELC, what are your thoughts on OHL overager Darren Raddysh? RHD who finally showed some offensive pop in his game 62-16-65 for 81pts. I know +/- is a team stat but +62 is still impressive.

  6. Lowetide says:

    Doug McLachlan:
    Last summer I was unable to imagine Hall as one of the assets heading out so Ineed a reminder that anyone could be dealt but JP seems like an awfully big price to pay.

    On the inexpensive to acquire front, an ELC, what are your thoughts on OHL overager Darren Raddysh?RHD who finally showed some offensive pop in his game 62-16-65 for 81pts. I know +/- is a team stat but +62 is still impressive.

    I had Raddysh as a possible until the Oilers signed Ryan Mantha. Along with Ethan Bear, the RH side in Bakersfield is going to be very inexperienced (with Fayne the likely top pairing RHD).

  7. Lowetide says:

    Diablo:
    Its always interesting to revisit the past – there was a vocal majority here who was in favour of trading #4 overall, Draisaitl and Klefbom for Subban (+ keeping Hall).

    A team with Hall and Subban (team A)

    vs

    A team with Draisaitl, Klefbom, Larsson (team B)

    Team A has more offence, but team B has more depth on D and IMO has the better forward right now and in the future. They (will) both cost the same. But team B also has a top prospect in JP, whereas team A has none.

    Overall, I like Chia’s work here. Montreal fans must want to fire Bergevin into the sun right now – if they had offered to pick up some of the salary on Subban’s deal (like Toronto did when they traded Kessel), things might have been different.

    I think this is a very fair assessment.

  8. russ99 says:

    Like that famous quote in Gzowski’s book, opposing GM’s want the McDavid cluster, like Montreal insisting on Leon and either Nurse or Klefbom for Subban, which I’m glad they didn’t do.

    I suspect the same thing goes this summer, and we’ll have an equally difficult time moving Eberle or RNH, when opposing GMs want Puljujarvi or our pick, or to a lesser extent, Benning, Caggiula or Slepyshev.

  9. HiddenDarts says:

    Lowetide,

    Double, DOUBLE the point on Diablo’s assessment. Taken at face value, Team B is practically a behemoth compared to the cap-strained, cap-heavy Team A.

    There’s a little fantasy here, but too much obvious truth to ignore.

  10. Woogie63 says:

    LT we have to get to #5 before we improve last year’s roster?

    Improving on a 20 minute a night dman has to be in the top three.

  11. Diablo says:

    russ99:
    Like that famous quote in Gzowski’s book, opposing GM’s want the McDavid cluster, like Montreal insisting on Leon and either Nurse or Klefbom for Subban, which I’m glad they didn’t do.

    I suspect the same thing goes this summer, and we’ll have an equally difficult time moving Eberle or RNH, when opposing GMs want Puljujarvi or our pick, or to a lesser extent, Benning, Caggiula or Slepyshev.

    Completely agree – I’m prepared to see Ebs traded for picks or B-level prospects; anything more will require Chia to pick up salary. Only caveat to that is LV – they could view Eberle’s offence more favourably, and will not be concerned by his salary – they could offer up some vets on cheap deals to improve our depth.

    We would all like to get that puck-moving RHD, but we should temper our expectations.

    LT – completely agree with your take on Chia’s media conference – he talked up Eberle as a good GM would do, but there will be a need to reset the salary structure of the team to line up with the McDavid cluster.

    As long as Chia can find a deal for Eberle this summer, then I think RNH will be here for the good times. TMac and Chia both love their centres.

  12. jtblack says:

    LT: Are you a fan of movig picks and / or high end prospects? you stated you would have probably moved Oscar and Leon and #4 for PK ….. and you also admitted, in hindsight, this would have not been a great trade.

    Even the great 80’s Oilers we all dearly Love were built through the draft. Major trades didn’t come til after they were winning cups … You would know better, if they traded any picks in the ’83- ’88 window. But they certainly didn’t in the ’79 – ’83 Window.

    In Gretzky’s 1st year the Oilers hit the motherload of all drafts (Lowe, Messier & anderson) second year, the Oilers drafted Coffey. 3rd season they drafted Fuhr. 4th Season Jim Playfair. by 1983 Beukaboom. Now times are completely different with the Cap Era but does that mean that building a team through the draft is old news?

    I get that we can get an established player who can play now vs guessing on prospects, BUT when you buy established you usually know what you are getting ( you know their ceiling and they cost more). when you have a prospect you could be getting Leon or Yak. Klefbom or Stajduhar.

    I know you are just discussing possible ideas that PC might execute. But I am curious what your MO or ideology is …

    I hope PC keeps JP. Whether his offense is light in the future or not, he represents speed, size and skill and will be valuable whether he lands as a 20 goal scorer or 40 Goal guy.

    At #22 we might get an Eberle again, who knows …

    PC traded potential on the Reinhart deal, and I think we all agree it was a miss. Also, whether he missed or not, why was the asset he got a LHD when that was about our only position of strength. I

    14 months ago this team finished 29th in the League. I hope PC still drafts, develops and builds this out for the long haul.

  13. Lois Lowe says:

    Not sure if you caught this bit of news LT, but our good friend Tony Hand was inducted into the IIHF Hall of Fame.

  14. Jordan says:

    Hope you’re all enjoying the long weekend.

    Re: List of Assets

    Excellent thought exercise and commentary.

    Is the combination of Pouliot’s season coupled with his cap hit such a problem that he’s considered a liability, and not an asset that could be dealt?

    Is the investment cost in Reinhart so high that he’s not considered an asset that could be moved?

    Are the low-costs and potential upside of slepy and jujhar not big enough values when taken in conjunction of Drai’s and CMD’s new deals that they would be among some of the most highly valued assets in the Oilers’ possession?

  15. Brantford Boy says:

    A few days ago LT posted the idea of Pouliot + #22 to Vegas to save one of our younger unprotected players. Although it was meant to be a joke (I think) it did raise some crafty ideas to get Vegas to bite. Like perhaps Pouliot + Jesse + #22 for say a young blue that is exposed. Of the top of my head I’m thinking Dumba or Trouba. I’m sure we all agree the decisions to come for the Wild, Predators, Ducks blue line are going to be difficult ones in expansion. I brought up Trouba as its pretty clear he wants out of the Peg by only signing for 2 years. Although Vegas may just want to keep him for themselves, would you do Pouliot + Jesse + #22 (more?) for Trouba? For the record I actually don’t like Dumba’s overall game very much but he does posses skills we need. Also Trouba is in a contract year so if he doesn’t like northern Canada he’s gone.

  16. Diablo says:

    Woogie63:
    LT we have to get to #5 before we improve last year’s roster?

    Improving on a 20 minute a night dman has to be in the top three.

    LT has the right order of things going by what was said Chia’s media conference – great minds think alike!

    I know we’d all like Chia to knock it out of the park this summer, but this blog has always been about ‘reasonable exceptions’ – realigning the salary cap around Connor and Leon is what we should reasonably expect a competent GM to do next.

    Done right, this team will be set up for a Decade of Domination.

    So I’ll be happy if Chia can do the following ….
    1) sign McDavid to 5 years x 9 million – this is just a little more than what Crosby got in his 2nd contract
    2) sign Leon to 8 years x 7.5 million dollars – the Tarasenko contract
    3+4+5) Trade Eberle to Las Vegas in exchange for taking Pouliot in expansion + a RHD coming back to Edmonton – that’s 10 million coming off the books for the next 2 years.
    A RHD like Pysyk, Pulock, Pokke will stabilize the D for next season until Rej gets back.
    6) use a bit of the cap savings from the Eberle deal to get another centre in FA – someone like Boyle or Bonino.

    Hanzal:
    I’d love to get Hanzal but ‘reasonable expectations’ dictates that he will be signed to a contract similar to the one that Franz Neilson signed – 5.25 million x 6 years (he was 32 years old when he signed the deal) – getting Hanzal for 4 million x 4 years is NOT a ‘reasonable expectation’

  17. digger50 says:

    Perhaps this year we see Nuge and Drai switch roles.

    Nuge. Connor. Kassian.

    Connor / Nuge become a pair with Kassian as net front presence.

    I did believe Peter when he talked about not identifying set roles and allowing Todd to switch things up.

  18. jtblack says:

    Brantford Boy,

    These are interesting exercises … Trouba is good for sure. How good on the D side? I don’t know and he’s ok on the O but not excellent.

    Eberle got 20 Goals and 51 Points last year. He finished 20th in the League for RW. I think JP will be a 25+ Goal scorer. So I guess my question back is would you trade one of the Top RW, who is young and on an ELC for Trouba? Plus throw in a pick that has a 50% chance of producing another good young cheap NHL player? Just to send out a bi of salary?

    I keep #22 and JP all day. PC might not.

    I think the Reinhart and Hall deals were also PC starting with a broken roster and knowing he HAD to address the AHL Level D … The team now just finished a great year, PC does not have to be desperate. We would like a scoring RHD, but PC does not have to make a desperate move to try and obtain one

  19. HT Joe says:

    Diablo:
    Its always interesting to revisit the past – there was a vocal majority here who was in favour of trading #4 overall, Draisaitl and Klefbom for Subban (+ keeping Hall).

    A team with Hall and Subban (team A)

    vs

    A team with Draisaitl, Klefbom, Larsson (team B)

    Team A has more offence, but team B has more depth on D and IMO has the better forward right now and in the future. They (will) both cost the same. But team B also has a top prospect in JP, whereas team A has none.

    Overall, I like Chia’s work here. Montreal fans must want to fire Bergevin into the sun right now – if they had offered to pick up some of the salary on Subban’s deal (like Toronto did when they traded Kessel), things might have been different.

    Here here! This is an excellent quote.

    Last year after the trade, I was deeply unhappy, as I felt Hall was a river pusher who was zooming Draisatl. Watching Drai this spring and watching what appears to be Hall’s career falling apart due to a pileup of injuries, I can’t disagree with anything you’ve said.

  20. J-Bo says:

    This summer is a tricky one. I find myself hoping these days of adding to the forward group without subtracting a lot. I would like us to add both Derek Ryan and Martin Hanzal while keeping both Eberle and Nuge. This requires trading Pouliot for sure and likely Fayne. This is likely not to happen. Is it even in the realm of possibility if th Oilers used some of the other chips you metioned LT to end up with this line-up to start the season:

    Nuge-McD-Eberle
    Lucic-Drai-Maroon
    Caggiula-Hanzal-Ryan
    Slepyshev-Letestu-Kassian
    Pitlick-Khaira

    Klefbom-Larsson
    Russell -Benning
    Nurse-New RHD
    Gryba

    The lineup is drunk with centres and possible line combinations. Even in the realm of possibility?

  21. jtblack says:

    Diablo,

    I absolutely agree with this line of thinking .. There may be other moves we didn’t expect but this is great tinkering and I agree. If PC does things right, this team should be considered a true cup contender for the next decade ..

  22. Thinker says:

    I still think we should be upgrading slepyshev and caggiula via free agency if possible.

  23. Diablo says:

    Brantford Boy:
    A few days ago LT posted the idea of Pouliot + #22 to Vegas to save one of our younger unprotected players.Although it was meant to be a joke (I think) it did raise some crafty ideas to get Vegas to bite.Like perhaps Pouliot + Jesse + #22 for say a young blue that is exposed.Of the top of my head I’m thinking Dumba or Trouba.I’m sure we all agree the decisions to come for the Wild, Predators, Ducks blue line are going to be difficult ones in expansion.I brought up Trouba as its pretty clear he wants out of the Peg by only signing for 2 years.Although Vegas may just want to keep him for themselves, would you do Pouliot + Jesse + #22 (more?) for Trouba?For the record I actually don’t like Dumba’s overall game very much but he does posses skills we need.Also Trouba is in a contract year so if he doesn’t like northern Canada he’s gone.

    There is absolutely no way that Trouba is exposed during the expansion draft. Zero.

    Minnesota is in a bad spot though – I’ll be interested to see which one of Brodin or Dumba is exposed.

  24. Bruce McCurdy says:

    jtblack: In Gretzky’s 1st year the Oilers hit the motherload of all drafts (Lowe, Messier & anderson) second year, the Oilers drafted Coffey. 3rd season they drafted Fuhr. 4th Season Jim Playfair. by 1983 Beukaboom.

    The 1980 draft featured not just Coffey but also Jari Kurri (4th round) & Andy Moog (7th). 1981 landed Fuhr and also Steve Smith (6th).

    That three year run that landed FIVE Hall of Famers — Messier, Anderson, Coffey, Kurri, Fuhr — and three other significant NHLers — Lowe, Moog, Smith — may be the best such series of three consecutive drafts by one team in NHL history. Maybe LT can think of another that even comes close.

  25. jtblack says:

    J-Bo,

    Maroon-McD-JP
    Lucic-Drai-Slep
    Caggiula-RNH- Pitlick
    Khaira-Letestu-Kassian

    Klefbom-Larsson
    Russell -New RHD
    Nurse-Benning
    Sekera (IR) – Gryba

    I think Eberle is gonzo as part of a package to obtain a RHD …

    I think Pitlick deserves a chance after last season.
    This lineup has size, speed and scoring throughout and is super flexible (similiar to your lineup)

  26. Diablo says:

    Thinker:
    I still think we should be upgrading slepyshev and caggiula via free agency if possible.

    If not for the salary cap ….

    Signing expensive free agents to fill depth roles is how we ended up with Pouliot and Fayne in the first place.

  27. Diablo says:

    jtblack:
    J-Bo,

    I think Pitlick deserves a chance after last season.

    I want Pitlick signed immediately after the expansion draft – this one is a no brainer. His string of bad luck can’t last forever. I’ll be mad if they let him get away.

  28. admiralmark says:

    As I watch these playoffs unfold I think of 2 things. 1) Just how close this team was to winning a cup this year. and 2) what I see as the glaring reason why we aren’t still watching the Oilers play.

    I can buy that the officiating is a major reason they did not get past the Ducks. It was a massive factor. BUT what is not being talked about enough is how McDavid for the most part of the playoffs was nullified or at the very least minimized. Why is that? And what as GM/Coach of this team needs to be done? Should be a paramount question the team is asking itself. And the answer simply does not lie with Maroon, Lucic, or Eberle. Caggiula could be 1 winger but the 2nd winger needs to be one who can cash. Love Maroon…and he’s fine to fill in during the regular season. But in the highly intense playoff atmosphere we need a winger with McD that is absolute money with the feeds McDavid is offering. Can’t afford another playoffs with cement hands playing with McD. It’s an absolute waste of his talents.

    The 2nd major hole on this team is a RHD with some offensive chops. That is a short to do list for Chiarelli. Albeit not a simple one but also not something he should not be able to accomplish. I think he’s very astute and i’m going to assume he is not telegraphing his plans for this summer. Hopefully he can fill these gaps in the team make up.

  29. jtblack says:

    Bruce McCurdy,

    PENS 2003 – 2005 nailed MA Fleury, Malkin, Croz & Letang … The huge difference is they picked #1 or 2 ; 3 seasons in a row .. The Oilers were grabbing HHOF’s much later in the draft ..

  30. jtblack says:

    Bruce McCurdy,

    HAWKS nailed

    2002 – Keith
    2003 – Seabrook, Crawford
    2004 – Bolland, Bickell
    2005 – Hjalmarsson
    2006 -Toews
    2007 – Kane

    Hence 3 Cups ….

  31. Brantford Boy says:

    Diablo,

    Zero… I would like to believe that… just with Big Buff and Enstrom having no movement clauses it only leaves one more spot if they choose 3 D-men. I think Trouba’s play (and youth) this year gets him the third spot… I very much respect the Jets GM, I brought it up as food for thought, in addition to his trade request and contract stalemate, BUT, there will be a team in a situation like this, in your example Brodin please. In my example it appears Tyler Myers would be the one on the outside looking in.

  32. Brantford Boy says:

    jtblack,

    Yes I make that trade. If JP made the roster and put up half the points Laine or Mathews did my opinion would be much different. But today, right now I make that trade.

  33. Ducey says:

    If we are interpreting the GMs comments, Nuge is not going anywhere. They want a guy who can play 2C so they have the flexibility to play Leon at RW.

    I don’t see them getting that from anyone else.

  34. Woogie63 says:

    Diablo: LT has the right order of things going by what was said Chia’s media conference – great minds think alike!

    I know we’d all like Chia to knock it out of the park this summer, but this blog has always been about ‘reasonable exceptions’ – realigning the salary cap around Connor and Leon is what we should reasonably expect a competent GM to do next.

    Done right, this team will be set up for a Decade of Domination.

    So I’ll be happy if Chia can do the following ….
    1) sign McDavid to 5 years x 9 million – this is just a little more than what Crosby got in his 2nd contract
    2) sign Leon to 8 years x 7.5 million dollars – the Tarasenko contract
    3+4+5) Trade Eberle to Las Vegas in exchange for taking Pouliot in expansion + a RHD coming back to Edmonton – that’s 10 million coming off the books for the next 2 years.
    A RHD like Pysyk, Pulock, Pokke will stabilize the D for next season until Rej gets back.
    6) use a bit of the cap savings from the Eberle deal to get another centre in FA – someone like Boyle or Bonino.

    Hanzal:
    I’d love to get Hanzal but ‘reasonable expectations’ dictates that he will be signed to a contract similar to the one that Franz Neilson signed – 5.25 million x 6 years (he was 32 years old when he signed the deal) – getting Hanzal for 4 million x 4 years is NOT a ‘reasonable expectation’

    I am not talking about hitting out of the park. Today our defense depth chart is approximately;

    Klefbom-Larsson
    Nurse-Benning
    Reinhart-Fayne

    This is a huge issue (see Dallas last year). IF we don’t want a lost year, our defense needs the GM full attention and priorization.

  35. Diablo says:

    Brantford Boy:
    Diablo,

    Zero… I would like to believe that… just with Big Buff and Enstrom having no movement clauses it only leaves one more spot if they choose 3 D-men.I think Trouba’s play (and youth) this year gets him the third spot… I very much respect the Jets GM, I brought it up as food for thought, in addition to his trade request and contract stalemate, BUT, there will be a team in a situation like this, in your example Brodin please.In my example it appears Tyler Myers would be the one on the outside looking in.

    Talk around town here in Winnipeg is that the Jets will be protecting 4+4+1
    – Scheifele, Little, Wheeler are a lock
    – Buffy, Enstrom, Trouba, Myers
    – Helly

    Leaving one more forward slot for one of Perreault, Lowry, Dano, Copp, Matthias – Perreault is like a super version of Letestu, so he’s the most likely to be protected. So they will lose a decent 3rd or 4th liner, but they have Kyle Connor, and Jack Roslovic waiting in the minors, so its not a big deal for them.

    Losing one of their top 4 D would be crippling and stupid.

  36. Optimism is like heroin says:

    Just spitballing here but I have read lots about the cap, need for a dman ,bad contracts and the expansion draft. Now in my mind there is no way Ebs just goes to vegas for free but there might be a deal there. I wonder if the deal could be made to expose pouliot to LV and then trade Eberle (+?) for a young rhd they pluck in the expansion draft. That would clear 10 M and fill the rhd we need, 3 birds and one stone.

  37. Scungilli Slushy says:

    I’m open to trading the first, but it would have to be for something that helps now and forward. The holes are known – 3C and 2 RD – for me offense isn’t the issue as much as players that can hold their own and manage the puck.

    One issue with an offensive D that isn’t your first pair is cost. With two expensive forwards in the core, adding a high priced player that needs some shelter on the back end would most likely create cap problems.

    The other thing is unless you’re talking one of a handful of defensemen, the offensive impact doesn’t always translate to the playoffs when things are tight. To me it is far more important that they are good in the D zone and can move the puck well. That also costs less.

  38. J-Bo says:

    jtblack:
    J-Bo,

    Maroon-McD-JP
    Lucic-Drai-Slep
    Caggiula-RNH- Pitlick
    Khaira-Letestu-Kassian

    Klefbom-Larsson
    Russell -New RHD
    Nurse-Benning
    Sekera (IR) – Gryba

    I think Eberle is gonzo as part of a package to obtain a RHD …

    I think Pitlick deserves a chance after last season.
    This lineup has size, speed and scoring throughout and is super flexible (similiar to your lineup)

    I do like this forward lineup and it is likely much more probable then mine, but I would rather UP start in the minors and have some more centre flexibility.

  39. Professor Q says:

    Optimism is like heroin:
    Just spitballing here but I have read lots about the cap, need for a dman ,bad contracts and the expansion draft.Now in my mind there is no way Ebs just goes to vegas for free but there might be a deal there.I wonder if the deal could be made to expose pouliot to LV and then trade Eberle (+?) for a young rhd they pluck in the expansion draft.That would clear 10 M and fill the rhd we need, 3 birds and one stone.

    Or one…Stone?

  40. JDI says:

    Professor Q,

    I’m not going to call for a complete ban for that pun – just a Sub-ban.

  41. Diablo says:

    Woogie63: I am not talking about hitting out of the park.Today our defense depth chart is approximately;

    Klefbom-Larsson
    Nurse-Benning
    Reinhart-Fayne

    This is a huge issue (see Dallas last year).IF we don’t want a lost year, our defense needs the GM full attention and priorization.

    I don’t disagree with you at all – in fact, I do think Chia will bring in another RHD – either a Euro free agent or via trade with one of the teams that (as of today) will lose a D in expansion or via trade directly with LV at the time of the expansion draft.

    I just don’t think getting a D like Faulk or Trouba is reasonable – that would fall into the home run line of thinking.

    I just want Chia to do smart things this summer
    – sign Connor and Leon
    – then reset the salary structure around them
    – get Kassian, Pitlick and Gryba signed without overpaying

    There will mostly be 3rd and 4th line forwards exposed during expansion + a few ‘name’ guys with really terrible contracts, which make Eberle’s look like great value by comparison. Eberle’s got to be worth something to Las Vegas – the question is would it be enough for them to take Pouliot (negative trade value) + pass on one of Khaira/Reinhart/Brossoit + send us a decent RHD in exchange?

    If Chia can get that move done, then it puts Fayne in the minors.

    At some point you have to run Reinhart out there – he’s no longer waiver exempt, so it would seem that next year is the year he gets a long look (as long as he’s still here after expansion).

    Use some of the cap space saved from trading Pouliot and Ebs to get a UFA centre, as long as the price is reasonable

    This is not the year to spend big though – its a flat cap with a lacklustre UFA crop and an expansion draft, which will lead to some GMs spending beyond their means.

  42. chasenic says:

    I live in Kelowna. Saw Todd McLellan at Tim Hortons when I was grabbing breakfast. I didn’t want to bother him too much but I had to say something. Told him I was a big fan and was proud of the team with how far they’ve come in the past few years. He said with winning comes expectations, lol. His response couldn’t be more accurate. I hope he has a great, relaxing summer because the pressure will be on this fall.

  43. tcho says:

    Diablo,

    I like the way you’re thinking – priorities. I might quibble with the Ebs trade, but depending on what’s coming back…

    I keep wondering if you could get LV to take Pouliout and Fayne? I wonder what kind of sweetener you’d have to throw in, and if it would be palatable? I might even be willing to do a 1st rounder just to clear the cap space.

  44. Dino says:

    admiralmark,

    Why aren’t the Oilers still playing today? Great question. I asked myself the same thing and although Mcdavid didn’t produce at god-like levels during the playoffs (most players rarely do), he still did his part. 9 points in 13 games isn’t bad production at all. Maroon had 8 points in the Anaheim series, he did his part as well. We even got some scoring from the bottom 6! That should be recipe for success right? Wrong.

    You want to know where the Oilers dropped the ball? That 18 million dollar line. Lucic, Eberle and RNH. If they had managed to piss even a drop of offence as the 2nd line and 2nd PP unit, the Oilers are probably facing the Preds tonight. How many 1 goal games and OT games were lost because our 2nd line was non existent? Especially in game 7 where a goal or two from them probably wins us the game.

    ZERO goals between RNH, Ebs and Pou and no even strength goals from Lucic? That kind of lack of production from your top 6 minute munching go-to players would hurt any team.

  45. HT Joe says:

    Dino:
    admiralmark,
    Why aren’t the Oilers still playing today?

    ZERO goals between RNH, Ebs and Pou and no even strength goals from Lucic? That kind of lack of production from your top 6 minute munching go-to players would hurt any team.

    I think our wonderful host wrote yesterday that he couldn’t ever forget Drai’s performance in the playoffs this year. I don’t think anyone will be able to forget Eberle’s performance either. I don’t care how many points Eberle has put up in regular seasons past – he didn’t demonstrate nearly enough in the playoffs this year to justify anything close to his current salary. He’s got to go before his contract costs one of the core group.

  46. Diablo says:

    Scungilli Slushy:
    I’m open to trading the first, but it would have to be for something that helps now and forward. The holes are known – 3C and 2 RD – for me offense isn’t the issue as much as players that can hold their own and manage the puck.

    One issue with an offensive D that isn’t your first pair is cost. With two expensive forwards in the core, adding a high priced player that needs some shelter on the back end would most likely create cap problems.

    The other thing is unless you’re talking one of a handful of defensemen, the offensive impact doesn’t always translate to the playoffs when things are tight. To me it is far more important that they are good in the D zone and can move the puck well. That also costs less.

    I think that Chia came to the same realization last summer – an offensive D is a nice luxury, but when every damn time the opposition enters your zone it turns into a 2 minute tire-fire, you need something more basic, like the ability to crush an opposition forward into the boards and stop a zone entry before it becomes dangerous – hence the overpay for Larsson.

    And on a team that was shaping up to be very top heavy in salary at forward, it’s a luxury that we can’t realistically afford (right now). Along with Bergevin shooting for the moon in return for Subban, Chia probably found it pretty easy to pass.

    What I’m advocating for is to clean up the forward salaries this summer and accumulate trade assets because the next chance to get a first pairing D with a flair for offence comes next summer, when the following will all be 1 year away from UFA ….
    – Doughty
    – Ekman-Larsson
    – Karlsson
    – McDonaugh
    – Gardiner
    – Ellis

    Talk about the motherload! … everyone of those guys will be under 30 if they hit UFA the following summer.

    Realistically, the last 4 guys on that list will probably get re-signed by their teams without much fuss.

    ….. but Doughty – LA is a sinking ship weighed down by terrible, never ending contracts to forwards whose best days are behind them …. and he sounded pretty damned impressed by the turn-around in Edmonton … there’s a chance there IF we can free up some cap space and keep it free for one more year.

    …. and OEL – Arizona has been terrible for his entire time there, and next year will probably be no exception … he may decide to forego signing an extension to explore his options in free agency.

    Plus, next summer the NHL will finally experience the benefits of adding an additional revenue-generating team, so the cap may start to rise again … potentially making it feasible at that time to add another big salary.

  47. godot10 says:

    Lowetide: I think the Oilers are inside the window now, and Maroon can score 25-30 on the top line. Things change in a hurry, but I suspect Maroon is here for another year and then some.

    The “then some” is terrifying. Maroon belongs to the Blair MacDonald, Dave Lumley, Brett Callighen, Warren Young, Rob Brown club.

    Some fool is going to give him a Ryan Clowe contract.

    Milk the last cheap year out of Maroon, and say sayonara.

  48. stush18 says:

    Diablo,

    My god if doughty somehow signed here… I’d literally shit my pants in excitement.

    Klefbom-larsson
    Sekera-doughty
    Nurse-benning.

    Jesus.

  49. Pastor of Disaster says:

    Totally off topic, but I saw it mentioned in last night’s thread, so it seems fair game…

    How about that Twin Peaks reboot, eh? Only watched episode 1, but Initial thoughts:

    I wish there was more of Badalamenti’s score throughout the episode. That’s my biggest critique. Also, I hope it gets more heartfelt with the characters soon, as the original series did so well.

    But the new mysteries seem intriguing: Buckhorn SD, the glass box (great scene… be glad you didn’t watch it late at night LT), the noirish Red Room, and the [SPOILER ALERT] greasy BOB-ish Dale Cooper. All compelling. That gum came back in style with a vengeance.

  50. Diablo says:

    tcho:
    Diablo,

    I like the way you’re thinking – priorities. I might quibble with the Ebs trade, but depending on what’s coming back…

    I keep wondering if you could get LV to take Pouliout and Fayne? I wonder what kind of sweetener you’dhave to throw in, and if it would be palatable? I might even be willing to do a 1st rounder just to clear the cap space.

    Yeah I don’t want to trade Ebs – he is a delightful player to watch and I think they will miss his offence in the regular season … but damn that salary cap.

    Barring a trade for Kovalchuck, no one player is going to replace that offence. But I think there will be enough growth from the likes of Slepy and Caggiula to pick up the slack … as TMac said in his presser – both of those guys have shown that they can play higher up in the lineup, but they need to do so more consistently.

    Plus Kassian and Pitlick – lol those two are like Charlie Brown – their string of bad luck can’t continue forever, can it?

  51. Woogie63 says:

    We have lost our best defenceman until February ish, our fourth best dman is a UFA in a league hungery for dman. This is +21 minutes a night … penalty killing, power play, last minutes of the game with a one goal lead.

    This is the biggest problem.

    Connor and Leon are important but they are going to sign comparable contracts, they are RFA.

    PC needs to improve TWO top 4 defence issues, this would test any GM in the league to do that in one off season, with the cap/term space he has to play with.

  52. stush18 says:

    godot10,

    The only way maroon leaves is if St. Louis offers him a similar contract imo.

    Maroon hasnt ever had the injury history the clowe did when he was signed. I’m not sure you can say the Bickell contract was bad, because you couldn’t have known he was going to be diagnosed with ALS.

    There’s nothing about his game that worries me about degrading. He scores his goals sitting in front of the net.

  53. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Diablo: but Doughty – LA is a sinking ship weighed down by terrible, never ending contracts to forwards whose best days are behind them …. and he sounded pretty damned impressed by the turn-around in Edmonton … there’s a chance there IF we can free up some cap space and keep it free for one more year.

    I have thought about Doughty as well. Their time is done now, things are up in the air with wholesale changes. It may be a pipe dream but if Doughty says he wants to explore they will likely trade him.

    The question is what is the ask? For an expiring UFA contract the price should be less than the player warrants, and Doughty’s shine has tarnished a bit the last few years. Eberle, a D prospect and a first if he signs with the Oilers?

  54. New Improved Darkness says:

    HT Joe:
    He’s got to go before his contract costs one of the core group.

    Last I looked, all 30 GMs have two eyes—though if you’re really lucky, sometimes you can catch one with extremely puffy eyelids, recently awoken from a grand opium dream to which—as legend has it—they will never return.

    Arriving precisely when you meant to requires a lot of door knocking. Pretty soon you find yourself beset by strangely persistent crows, who swoop in to pluck giant divots out of your greatcoat.

    Later you discover that the 29 divots in your greatcoat precisely aligns with 29 sets of Doberman triplets, all scent-trained since puppyhood with the same religious conviction concerning one pesky Diogenes on an elephantiasis eyelid quest.

    So, it appears I was wrong.

    Almost every GM has eight eyes, and a basement fridge of yesteryear larded to the beige gills with raw-chicken-liver Red Bull.

  55. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Scungilli Slushy: I have thought about Doughty as well. Their time is done now, things are up in the air with wholesale changes. It may be a pipe dream but if Doughty says he wants to explore they will likely trade him.

    The question is what is the ask? For an expiring UFA contract the price should be less than the player warrants, and Doughty’s shine has tarnished a bit the last few years. Eberle, a D prospect and a first if he signs with the Oilers?

    Of course that would also probably mean also the ability to move additional salary which might crash the whole shebang. It also is likely a year early, but I’d check into it.

  56. HT Joe says:

    New Improved Darkness: Almost every GM has eight eyes, and a basement fridge of yesteryear larded to the beige gills with raw-chicken-liver Red Bull.

    Then let’s hope for at least one GM, all eight eyes are puffy and he’s addle-brained thinking he can “fix” eberle to better suit the playoffs. 😉

  57. Diablo says:

    stush18:
    godot10,

    The only way maroon leaves is if St. Louis offers him a similar contract imo.

    I’m not sure you can say the Bickell contract was bad, because you couldn’t have known he was going to be diagnosed with ALS.

    There’s nothing about his game that worries me about degrading. He scores his goals sitting in front of the net.

    Multiple sclerosis not ALS – as the resident Neurologist here I feel compelled to clarify this ;-p
    MS is a condition which Bickell can still have a productive life with appropriate disease-modifying therapy, and advances are being made every year that improve the likelihood of a good long-term outcome with this diagnosis. There is no cure or therapy that can slow down the ravages of ALS unfortunately, and nothing too promising in the pipeline right now either.

    I’ve said it before – scoring goals the way Maroon does IS a skill that not all players have. It takes strength, timing and great hand-eye coordination to position yourself behind the D and get off a good shot that beats today’s goalies, who are so good at moving laterally and taking away the bottom of the net. I do not discount Maroon as a player – he fits the role of power-forward/McDavid protector very well and Connor seems to have genuine affection for the Big Rig as well. Connor needs a RH shooter for the other wing though … Eberle just doesn’t have the one-timer to be a fit on that line.

    St. Louis is the only team that concerns me in terms of being able to match a reasonable extension offered by Edmonton AND provide him with the family benefits that no value can be placed upon. Everyone else will have to offer him a Clarkson/Clowe cap-busting-type deal, and that’s pretty easy for Chia to walk away from if it does come to pass.

    Honestly, I think a 4-5 year deal around 3.5 million per season gets him extended though. If he has another good year like last, then you pay the man and keep Connor happy.

  58. Diablo says:

    Scungilli Slushy: I have thought about Doughty as well. Their time is done now, things are up in the air with wholesale changes. It may be a pipe dream but if Doughty says he wants to explore they will likely trade him.

    The question is what is the ask? For an expiring UFA contract the price should be less than the player warrants, and Doughty’s shine has tarnished a bit the last few years. Eberle, a D prospect and a first if he signs with the Oilers?

    Yeah – the Kings remind me of the Lakers a lot – they had their run over the last decade, but now are saddled with too many fading forwards on absolutely terrible deals that no one in their right mind would absorb to help them out – that’s a team that needs to trade a 1st to LV to take one of those awful contracts.

    They still have some good pieces in the 70’s line, Kopitar, Doughty-Muzzin and Quick to stay in the playoff hunt though. If they are able to convince LV to take Gaborik or Brown off their hands then they have a chance to rebuild. Their prospect cupboard is pretty empty as well.

    If not then things are going to get interesting in LA – they might have to follow the Laker’s example and blow things up to move forward. Not sure that neophyte management group they just installed has the stones to do that though.

  59. AsiaOil says:

    Eberle has significant regular season “entertainment” value to a bad team that is not likely to make the playoffs. Goals entertain, even while losing, and it’s something that the NJD, VGK and VAN of the NHL require to give their fans something to cheer about, buy tickets, and swag during their long dreary seasons. Ebs has plenty of experience doing well in this type of environment and is actually the perfect guy for these franchises to acquire. It’s not a rep a player particularly wants to have but it does carry some value. Ebs, like Hall, will end up on a loser team this summer. Bank on it.

  60. JDI says:

    AsiaOil: Bank on it.

    ELPHERLE.

  61. stush18 says:

    Diablo: Multiple sclerosis not ALS – as the resident Neurologist here I feel compelled to clarify this ;-p
    MS is a condition which Bickell can still have a productive life with appropriate disease-modifying therapy, and advances are being made every year that improve the likelihood of a good long-term outcome with this diagnosis. There is no cure or therapy that can slow down the ravages of ALS unfortunately, and nothing too promising in the pipeline right now either.

    I’ve said it before – scoring goals the way Maroon does IS a skill that not all players have. It takes strength, timing and great hand-eye coordination to position yourself behind the D and get off a good shot that beats today’s goalies, who are so good at moving laterally and taking away the bottom of the net. I do not discount Maroon as a player – he fits the role of power-forward/McDavid protector very well and Connor seems to have genuine affection for the Big Rig as well. Connor needs a RH shooter for the other wing though … Eberle just doesn’t have the one-timer to be a fit on that line.

    St. Louis is the only team that concerns me in terms of being able to match a reasonable extension offered by Edmonton AND provide him with the family benefits that no value can be placed upon. Everyone else will have to offer him a Clarkson/Clowe cap-busting-type deal, and that’s pretty easy for Chia to walk away from if it does come to pass.

    Honestly, I think a 4-5 year deal around 3.5 million per season gets him extended though. If he has another good year like last, then you pay the man and keep Connor happy.

    I knew that. Fucked up. My bad.

    And don’t get me wrong. Maroons one of my favourites. I know how hard it is to cash those goals, and it takes someone with good hockey sense to arrive at the right moment, as well as a bit of chemistry.

    I agree. I sign that deal. Then we have our 2 LW locked up long term.

  62. Diablo says:

    AsiaOil:
    Eberle has significant regular season “entertainment” value to a bad team that is not likely to make the playoffs. Goals entertain, even while losing, and it’s something that the NJD, VGK and VAN of the NHL require to give their fans something to cheer about, buy tickets, and swag during their long dreary seasons. Ebs has plenty of experience doing well in this type of environment and is actually the perfect guy for these franchises to acquire. It’s not a rep a player particularly wants to have but it does carry some value. Ebs, like Hall, will end up on a loser team this summer. Bank on it.

    Ouch!

    Good thing Ebs only has two years left in his contract! But yeah I agree with your point about about Ebs having value to those teams that struggle to produce offence. Playing top PP and 1st line RW – Ebs is a lock to put up 20-25 goals and 50-60 points. LV will be hard-pressed to acquire a player like that in the next two seasons.

  63. russ99 says:

    Considering Russell wants to come back, wants to play close to home, and the Oilers seem to want him back, but also want to improve the defense, I think there’s going to be some give on the $ and Chia may try to go one year again to keep flexibility.

    So Russell at 1/$3.5 opens a lot of doors, with Sekera stashed on LTE until close to the deadline.

    Given the above, I see two possibilities:

    Klefbom – Larsson
    Russell – Benning
    Nurse – X
    Reinhart or Oesterle, if Vegas takes Reinhart.

    With X being a better Gryba, more responsible with the puck, a leader, Gator Smith type.

    Someone like Ceci in Ottawa.

    option two:

    Klefbom – Larsson
    Benning – X
    Nurse – Russell
    Reinhart or Oesterle, if Vegas takes Reinhart.

    X being a younger 2nd Pair RHD ready to take a step up with a shot and offensive chops.

  64. digger50 says:

    godot10: Karlsson

    I doubt you meant it this way, but sounds like poor team building to milk someone dry and discard them. He is way underpaid right now, he has earned a raise. Plus he is a glue player and deserves credit for assisting with the turn north on the team.

  65. Diablo says:

    stush18: I knew that. Fucked up. My bad.

    And don’t get me wrong. Maroons one of my favourites.I know how hard it is to cash those goals, and it takes someone with good hockey sense to arrive at the right moment, as well as a bit of chemistry.

    I agree. I sign that deal. Then we have our 2 LW locked up long term.

    No worries – just making sure we don’t inadvertently start a crazy rumour that Bickell has like 2 years to live – lol.

  66. AsiaOil says:

    Diablo: Ouch!

    Good thing Ebs only has two years left in his contract! But yeah I agree with your point about about Ebs having value to those teams that struggle to produce offence. Playing top PP and 1st line RW – Ebs is a lock to put up 20-25 goals and 50-60 points. LV will be hard-pressed to acquire a player like that in the next two seasons.

    Yeah like I said…not something you really want to be known for as a player …but here we are. I make a distinction between entertainment and hockey value in trade. Eberle high in the former, relatively low in the latter. Larsson is the opposite as he is a key cog to a winning team but most fans are not lining up to buy his sweater. NHL is a business after all as we were reminded in the ANA series.

  67. Diablo says:

    AsiaOil: Yeah like I said…not something you really want to be known for as a player …but here we are. I make a distinction between entertainment and hockey value in trade. Eberle high in the former, relatively low in the latter. Larsson is the opposite as he is a key cog to a winning team but most fans are not lining up to buy his sweater. NHL is a business after all as we were reminded in the ANA series.

    Funny you should mention sweaters – I want to get a orange home jersey (after the switch to Adidas jerseys occurs). Got a McDavid blue last year.
    Was thinking of getting a Draisaitl orange jersey, but maybe I’ll get a Larsson one instead – I just love when he hammers opposing forwards in our zone.

  68. Professor Q says:

    Diablo: Funny you should mention sweaters – I want to get a orange home jersey (after the switch to Adidas jerseys occurs). Got a McDavid blue last year.
    Was thinking of getting a Draisaitl orange jersey, but maybe I’ll get a Larsson one instead – I just love when he hammers opposing forwards in our zone.

    Fits with his hair?

Leave a Reply

Want to join the discussion?
Feel free to contribute!
© Copyright - Lowetide.ca