RE 17-18 PATRICK MAROON: NO WAY BACK

Although there is plenty of competition, I think the best Peter Chiarelli trade in terms of value gap is the Patrick Maroon deal. For the cost of defender Martin Gernat and a fourth-round pick (Jack Kopacka)—this is not a high price—Edmonton received a big forward with soft hands and an ability to think the game with Connor McDavid. That’s a brilliant trade. (No Way Back)

PATRICK MAROON 2016-17

  • 5×5 points per 60: 1.82 (3rd among regular forwards)
  • 5×4 points per 60: 1.96 (8th among regular forwards)
  • Corsi for 5×5 %: 53.3
  • Corsi Rel 5×5 %: +3.9
  • DFF Elite 5×5 %: 54.1
  • DFF Elite Rel 5×5 %: +6.4 (36 percent of TOI v. elites)
  • Shots on goal/percentage: 178 shots/15.2%
  • Boxcars: 81, 27-15-42
  • (All numbers via Puck IQStats.HockeyAnalysis.com and hockey-reference)

RE 17-18: 72GP, 23-17-40 (.556)

  1. How good was Maroon as a goal scorer last season? He posted 24-12-36 at evens, 24-11-35 at 5×5. Tremendous season, those 24 goals at 5×5 rank him No. 1 on the Oilers and No. 5 across the entire league.
  2. You’re shortchanging him here. I have Maroon scoring more points per game (he scored 42 in 81 games a year ago) but his goal total dips from 27 to 23.
  3. Why did you reduce his goal scoring? Maroon had an 8.7 percent shooting percentage in Anaheim and is 16.1 percent so far in Edmonton. I have him closer to his career average of 11.8 percent and believe that is a reasonable adjustment.
  4. He’s playing with McDavid, fool! Even with that, I don’t think Maroon will get a big power-play push. I think 23 goals is fair for Maroon. His spike in goals has a lot to do with his linemate for sure, but he should get credit for scoring 24 times at evens.
  5. If he plays the entire season with McDavid, he’ll score 35! I don’t think Maroon will play the whole year with 97, suspect Milan Lucic and Jussi Jokinen get a chance. Maybe Drake Caggiula too on LW for that matter. I think Maroon plays most of the year with 97, though.
  6. Why would you move him off the top line? I think there’s some proof that Maroon could help another line more than Milan Lucic. Based on only one season but I think that’s worth contemplating. Maroon might be more valuable helping Leon Draisaitl establish himself as a bona fide tough minute center.
  7. How so? The possession numbers for Maroon are excellent, using both Puck IQ and Stats.HockeyAnalysis.com.
  8. Explain. As above, Maroon plays Elite level opposition 36 percent of the time, getting 54.1 percent of possession. Now a lot of that has to do with playing with 97, as does the 54.0 percent total against mid-level and 60.60 against the lowest (gritensity) levels.
  9. What about the wowy’s? Maroon was 2.88/60 scoring at 5×5 and had a Corsi for 5×5 of 52.9 with Maroon. Without? He was 1.13 and 54.1.
  10. Impressive in possession! Yes, he’s a good hockey player full stop. I think he can help another line, although his boxcars would suffer.
  11. How was he in the playoffs? Went 13, 3-5-8. Good production, although that line struggled to equal regular-season production.
  12. Will 17-18 be his last season with the Oilers?  I don’t think so. Maroon is 29 and has scored 35 goals in 97 regular-season games with Edmonton. That is good production.
  13. What will his contract look like? Peter Chiarelli probably has to get him in around $4.5 million times two or three, somewhere in there.
  14. Maroon can make more on the open market. Maybe, we’ll have to see what his numbers look like at the end of the season. It’s also possible the chance of playing for Stanley will have appeal for Maroon.
  15. Why did the Oilers sign Milan Lucic when they had Maroon on the team? I think it’s important to remember that Maroon worked very hard to get into the best condition of his life to play last season with the Oilers. Credit where due, he took advantage of a fantastic situation. However, the Oilers brought in Lucic to replace Hall without knowing Maroon would be the superior player.
  16. What if Maroon does it again? Plays better than Lucic? He’s going to get paid, of course, and probably by the Oilers.
  17. Where does that put Lucic? I imagine Milan Lucic is in a similar position to the one Patrick Maroon saw himself in one year ago. This is a fantastic opportunity, and Lucic can be a great story or a bad one inside this Oilers organization over the next several years.
  18. So he’s working out with a cyborg? That would be appropriate. Lucic didn’t make it to the NHL and build his career on talent alone, perhaps there is a way to help speed and quickness.
  19. What is the future at LW? Lots of movement, I imagine, unless the clubs signs both Maroon and Jussi Jokinen past this year. Edmonton’s depth chart on LW, after the Hall trade, has no young players at the top. The depth chart is a very veteran group (Maroon, Lucic, Jokinen) with only Drake Caggiula and Tyler Benson on the horizon.
  20. What about Jesse Puljujarvi? We’ve discussed him as a RW, perhaps that’s an option. Anton Slepyshev has played portside as well.
  21. Are there any 2018 free agents who make sense for Edmonton? Evander Kane, John Tavares, Patric Hornqvist, there are a few attractive options. Maroon is known to the team and successful in his role, plus I do think the club may be able to get him below $5 million a season.
  22. Why this song? Maroon’s story is universal so lots of songs fit him. I like this one because the spirit of the song is final, as in ‘no way back’ because this is the right place and time. Kind of a threat and a promise, one Maroon delivered all on his own. The contract might mean separation, but if the Oilers and Maroon can find a way to make it work, this player should be here for the good times.

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47 Responses to "RE 17-18 PATRICK MAROON: NO WAY BACK"

  1. Ryan says:

    “What about the wowy’s? Maroon was 2.88/60 scoring at 5×5 and had a Corsi for 5×5 of 52.9 with Maroon. Without? He was 2.90 and 52.9.”

    Typo alert!

  2. OriginalPouzar says:

    His ES goal scoring was off the charts last year – I don’t think its repeatable, even playing with McDavid but who knows?

    1LW is his job to lose our of camp – hopefully he runs with it yet again.

    If he does, then the verbal (including myself) of him pricing himself out of Edmonton will come true – unless he take a pretty massive home town discount.’

    Love the Big Rig – hopefully we don’t lose him after this season – he’s more than just goals with McDavid, he’s a personality, he’s part of the swagger, he’s part of the new tough team persona.

  3. OriginalPouzar says:

    Alan, do you think its possible to fit $4.5 under the cap? Even if we trade Nuge to save a couple of million?

    Maybe the rising Cdn.$ will help the cap rise more significantly than anticipated or maybe each of Slep, Drake, Benning, Nurse, etc. all take value deals (or don’t progress) but I can’t imagine fitting Maroon at $4.5M in. This is why my previous post said we’d require a big home town discount.

    Is it wise to sacrifice Nuge to make room for the Big Rig?

  4. NYC-Back-to-Tokyo Oil (Gentleman Backpacker) says:

    Very reasonable expectations.

    I think he might take a little less to play on this team. 3x 4m.

  5. godot10 says:

    1) The OIlers cannot afford to re-sign Maroon without trading Lucic.
    2) The Oilers cannot trade Lucic. NMC

    Re-signing Maroon would be a mistake anyways.

  6. Lowetide says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    Alan, do you think its possible to fit $4.5 under the cap?Even if we trade Nuge to save a couple of million?

    Maybe the rising Cdn.$ will help the cap rise more significantly than anticipated ormaybe each of Slep, Drake, Benning, Nurse, etc. all take value deals (or don’t progress) but I can’t imagine fitting Maroon at $4.5M in. This is why my previous post said we’d require a big home town discount.

    Is it wise to sacrifice Nuge to make room for the Big Rig?

    The Oilers have so many contracts up next season it’s insane. I think signing Maroon will be important, but would put Matt Benning ahead and Darnell Nurse has to be in there somewhere. I don’t know where Strome, Slepyshev and others would rank in there.

  7. Todd Macallan says:

    Great read on Dmitri Samorukov: http://thehockeywriters.com/dmitri-samorukov-fully-focused-nhl-oilers/

    Cool that he and Kirill Maksimov played together for 7 yrs growing up.

  8. NYC-Back-to-Tokyo Oil (Gentleman Backpacker) says:

    I think the cap will be over 80m next year. Could be as high as s 82m but maybe the players don’t use the escalator? Or maybe they will keep using it until the CBA expires and we have s lockout over that issue.

    If Nurse and Benning are signed to reasonable bridge deals there should be room for Maroon. Strome I have no idea what they do with. Nuge I am assuming is already gone.

  9. Brantford Boy says:

    “Edmonton received a big forward with soft hands and an ability to think the game with Connor McDavid. That’s a brilliant trade.” – and we got Anaheim to retain 50%… Chiarelli should give Poile on his next contract, see if there is anymore magic…

  10. Richard S.S. says:

    Consider $2.0 Million is the average amount to sign each of the 11 other roster spots. If Maroon gets $4.5 Million to sign, then Chiarelli must sign two players for $1.0 Million or less and one players for $1.5 Million or less. This is the easiest way to work it out.

  11. Richard S.S. says:

    I have used a $77.0 Million Cap with Draisaitl signing for $8.0 – $8.5 Million to get my numbers.

  12. Thinker says:

    Take away Maroon’s value deal, and we are a pretty shitty team on the wings. Unless Pulijarvi steps up, we might not have a bonifide top line winger that can score.

  13. Lowetide says:

    Thinker:
    Take away Maroon’s value deal, and we are a pretty shitty team on the wings. Unless Pulijarvi steps up, we might not have a bonifide top line winger that can score.

    Leon Draisaitl can.

  14. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    – Great post LT! I have moved towards the Crosby theory: I don’t think LW’s matter much when you have an elite C in this league.

    – Maroon has taken the opportunity: but his skill-set is not rare IMO. He’s a great passenger with McD. And I’m not insulting him at all: respect big time. At a certain price I hope they can sign him, but suspect a team would sign him for 4+ years a la Blake Wheeler: Maroon should take that offer.

  15. Richard S.S. says:

    Lowetide,

    Both of the Oilers’ top two Centers on the same line in 2018/19? Oh my god!

  16. Thinker says:

    Lowetide: Leon Draisaitl can.

    He doesn’t count as a wing in my noggin. Especially when Nuge is gone next June.

  17. Jaxon says:

    As a father, I still see a big chance he signs with STL for a bargain long term deal with a NMC. As extreme as $3M x 7 yrs. Quality of life, reduced stress of a big contact, happiness of seeing your kid grow up in your hometown. And STL is no slouch as far as Cup contenders go either. Only one win less than Edmonton last season.

  18. Lowetide says:

    Jaxon:
    As a father, I still see a big chance he signs with STL for a bargain long term deal with aNMC.

    There’s no one alive who could fault Maroon for that decision.

  19. OriginalPouzar says:

    NYC-Back-to-Tokyo Oil (Gentleman Backpacker):
    I think the cap will be over 80m next year. Could be as highas s 82m but maybe the players don’t use the escalator?Or maybe they will keep using it until the CBA expires and we have s lockout over that issue.

    If Nurse and Benning are signed to reasonable bridge deals there should be room for Maroon. Strome I have no idea what they do with. Nuge I am assuming is already gone.

    In that scenario, why not keep Nuge (assuming he has a bounce-back year offensively) and let Maroon go – I’d rather have the over-paid center than the early 30s winger even though, as I stated above, Maroon is part of the swagger, the team toughness, etc.

    We need cheap wingers producing in the top 6.

  20. OmJo says:

    I hope Maroon is working as hard this summer as he did last summer. If his Sh% comes back down to normal but McDavid starts shooting more, what he loses in goals could easily be made up in assists.

    If Maroon does play himself out of Edmonton (ie play like last season and earn too much $$$), do the Oilers consider trading him to St. Louis at the deadline instead of losing him for nothing?

    I could see Maroon giving us a hometown discount, to be honest I think he really likes it here and if he did give us a discount he’d have a pretty good shot at a cup run. But… he could very well give a hometown discount to his hometown team to be able to spend the rest of his career closer to his son. I won’t forget that emotional interview with JP when his son was watching him play.

  21. Gordies Elbow says:

    On a $75M cap, half the HRR last season works out to $2.25B (75×30.) According to Forbes, revenues were about 63% from the US, and 37% from Canada. Since June 16th, the Canadian dollar has risen 5.8%.

    If the Canadian dollar stays at $0.80 USD, the cap will likely come in around $76.6M (which given expected GDP growth and continued US political turmoil, is not an unfair bet.) VGK revenues will likely be above league mean, and with jersey ads (boo) and the escalator, 17-18 is looking like $80-82M.

    Edmonton’s in a really good spot, with the best player in the world under contract for the next nine years, and it’s not unreasonable that his first season comes in at 15% of the cap.

  22. GCW_69 says:

    Just got around to reading the posts of the last couple of days. Finding Leivo got me thinking.

    For the Oilers cap structure to work going forward, they need to do a few things:

    1) Hold 4-5 contract spots open until July 9th or 10th.
    2( Become bargain bin savants – they need to use those open spots to find the next Jokinens, Versteegs, etc. to fill out the roster with predicable talent at cost effective prices. That may mean offering one way contracts as opposed to try out contracts to lock them in
    3) They need to develop systems and coaching methods to bring in these bargain bin players and easily slot them into the core without major disruption.
    4) They need to play some of the bargain bin finds high enough in the order, long enough that it boosts their stats and makes them more attractive in free agency the following year, or get them a Cup. Or both. Doing that with the outgoing players will incent the next round of bargain bin types to choose Edmonton.
    5) They can’t fall in love with the bargain bin players and sign them to market deals. Needs to be a flow through process.

    The wing and the bottom six should be prime ground for this kind of sourcing strategy.

    if you become good at it, maybe you pick up a Markov quality player to help round out your team?

    You can’t tell me that equivalents to Lowe, Callahan, Ferlin, and Stanton aren’t available later on and that’s why you can’t wait. These guys are utterly and totally replaceable.

    Go Oilers!

  23. stush18 says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux:
    – Great post LT!I have moved towards the Crosby theory: I don’t think LW’s matter much when you have an elite C in this league.

    – Maroon has taken the opportunity: but his skill-set is not rare IMO.He’s a great passenger with McD.And I’m not insulting him at all: respect big time.At a certain price I hope they can sign him, but suspect a team would sign him for 4+ years a la Blake Wheeler: Maroon should take that offer.

    I’m sorry but LWs like him are not found on a tree.

    Chemistry is a thing. Team Canada decided to put Chris Kunitz on their roster because they were so worried about it.

  24. Woogie63 says:

    Without McDavid, Maroon is Kassian ….maybe.

    Every GM will have a question what this 29 year old player will be without 97. Suspect this deal is easier for the Oilers than this thread would lead one to believe.

  25. stush18 says:

    OmJo:
    I hope Maroon is working as hard this summer as he did last summer. If his Sh% comes back down to normal but McDavid starts shooting more, what he loses in goals could easily be made up in assists.

    If Maroon does play himself out of Edmonton (ie play like last season and earn too much $$$), do the Oilers consider trading him to St. Louis at the deadline instead of losing him for nothing?

    I could see Maroon giving us a hometown discount, to be honest I think he really likes it here and if he did give us a discount he’d have a pretty good shot at a cup run. But… he could very well give a hometown discount to his hometown team to be able to spend the rest of his career closer to his son. I won’t forget that emotional interview with JP when his son was watching him play.

    No. They’ll keep him for the run

  26. OriginalPouzar says:

    OmJo:
    I hope Maroon is working as hard this summer as he did last summer. If his Sh% comes back down to normal but McDavid starts shooting more, what he loses in goals could easily be made up in assists.

    If Maroon does play himself out of Edmonton (ie play like last season and earn too much $$$), do the Oilers consider trading him to St. Louis at the deadline instead of losing him for nothing?

    I could see Maroon giving us a hometown discount, to be honest I think he really likes it here and if he did give us a discount he’d have a pretty good shot at a cup run. But… he could very well give a hometown discount to his hometown team to be able to spend the rest of his career closer to his son. I won’t forget that emotional interview with JP when his son was watching him play.

    If Maroon is a material part of the offence once again the team will almost certainly not sell him at the deadline if they are in a playoff spot – they would have to take the risk.

    Part of me thinks the Big Rig could take a bit of a discount, however, lets not forget, Patty has been a late bloomer and not a full time NHLer until somewhat recently. If he has a season anywhere similar to last season, I would think he’ll take his best opportunity to get a nice medium term contract with a solid cap hit – don’t see him taking a discount when taking his career in to account.

  27. jm363561 says:

    “…he’s more than just goals with McDavid, he’s a personality, he’s part of the swagger, he’s part of the new tough team persona.”
    ========
    I completely agree with this – “intangibles”, they really are a thing.

    I am probably the only poster who takes any interest in + / – which, over 82 games, mean something IMHO. Maroon’s is +13 (McD +27, Leon +7).

  28. jtblack says:

    jm363561,

    +1. Good points

  29. Thinker says:

    jm363561:
    “…he’s more than just goals with McDavid, he’s a personality, he’s part of the swagger, he’s part of the new tough team persona.”
    ========
    I completely agree with this – “intangibles”, they really are a thing.

    I am probably the only poster who takes any interest in + / – which, over 82 games, mean something IMHO. Maroon’s is +13 (McD +27, Leon +7).

    What is the variability in +/- year over year for the average player?

  30. dustrock says:

    Maroon had a phenomenal season and probably missed 5 gimmes to boot.

    Cost benefit analysis says you trade him this year regardless (sell high as possible) but I realize hockey teams don’t think like that.

  31. Lowetide says:

    jm363561:
    “…he’s more than just goals with McDavid, he’s a personality, he’s part of the swagger, he’s part of the new tough team persona.”
    ========
    I completely agree with this – “intangibles”, they really are a thing.

    I am probably the only poster who takes any interest in + / – which, over 82 games, mean something IMHO. Maroon’s is +13 (McD +27, Leon +7).

    Plus minus has real meaning in my opinion, but has to beplaced in context (as you have done here).

  32. NYC-Back-to-Tokyo Oil (Gentleman Backpacker) says:

    Woogie63:

    Every GM will have a question what this 29 year old player will be without 97.Suspect this deal is easier for the Oilersthan this thread would lead one to believe.

    I agree with this. I think it probably comes down to Edmonton vs. St. Louis.
    If St. Louis doesn’t have the room then he is familiar with Edmonton and knows he has a good thing going here.

    Suspect 3 x $4m is enough to get it done unless St. Louis offers something similar, in which case, whatever the Oilers offer is likely moot. And as others have said, no one can fault him for choosing that option.

  33. stush18 says:

    dustrock,

    What’s the cost analysis on us winning the cup?

    If you are within a window to win the cup, you can’t Ben moving out a piece to sell high, no matter the deal.

  34. NYC-Back-to-Tokyo Oil (Gentleman Backpacker) says:

    OriginalPouzar: In that scenario, why not keep Nuge (assuming he has a bounce-back year offensively) and let Maroon go – I’d rather have the over-paid center than the early 30s winger even though, as I stated above, Maroon is part of the swagger, the team toughness, etc.

    We need cheap wingers producing in the top 6.

    I like the Nuge, but 3C making $6M is tough. I hope he finds his offensive game this year and gets face-offs up a few percentage points just for at least showing the coaches he is working on it.

    If he can score 60+ points this year while spending half his time on a McDavid line, get his offensive confidence going and then he can centre a 3rd unicorn line well, music, and you do what you can to keep him for sure.

    I am just being realistic about what I think Chia might be thinking. You would think another Eberle-for-Strome type deal would be coming. Get that 3C into the $4m range.

    I think, though, that Chia is sitting on the Sekera situation and others, saving the cap room because he is very leery about bonus overages going forward. He has learned from the debacle in Boston, for the most part, even though certain deals to depth players are, let’s be nice and say… “full value” to the player.

  35. NYC-Back-to-Tokyo Oil (Gentleman Backpacker) says:

    stush18:
    dustrock,

    What’s the cost analysis on us winning the cup?

    If you are within a window to win the cup, you can’t Ben moving out a piece to sell high, no matter the deal.

    That, and I don’t think Maroon at the deadline will fetch as much as people think, anyway. He wouldn’t get a 1st, maybe a late-2nd at best. Other teams know he is in the perfect spot on McDavid’s port side and that they can’t expect that same production if he is on, say, Stastny’s wing.

    Value-wise, Oilers have gotten their money’s worth on that deal already. Everything else is gravy. You keep him, even with the risk he walks, but I suspect come March we might be cheering his “below market” extension he signed with us on his way to another 25 goal season and before another playoff run.

  36. kgo says:

    People here put too much weight on Maroon’s emotional interview. An NHLer living in the same house as his child will only see them marginally more than not. His son is in school, the player on the road etc…if Patrick remains Connors LW, I bet he takes a reasonable deal $3Mx3 for example

  37. maudite says:

    GCW_69:
    Just got around to reading the posts of the last couple of days.Finding Leivo got me thinking.

    For the Oilers cap structure to work going forward, they need to do a few things:

    1) Hold 4-5 contract spots open until July 9th or 10th.
    2( Become bargain bin savants – they need to use those open spots to find the next Jokinens, Versteegs, etc. to fill out the roster with predicable talent at cost effective prices.That may mean offering one way contracts as opposed to try out contracts to lock them in
    3) They need to develop systems and coaching methods to bring in these bargain bin players and easily slot them into the core without major disruption.
    4) They need to play some of the bargain bin finds high enough in the order, long enough that it boosts their stats and makes them more attractive in free agency the following year, or get them a Cup. Or both.Doing that with the outgoing players will incent the next round of bargain bin types to choose Edmonton.
    5) They can’t fall in love with the bargain bin players and sign them to market deals. Needs to be a flow through process.

    The wing and the bottom six should be prime ground for this kind of sourcing strategy.

    if you become good at it, maybe you pick up a Markov quality player to help round out your team?

    You can’t tell me that equivalents to Lowe, Callahan, Ferlin, and Stanton aren’t available later on and that’s why you can’t wait.These guys are utterly and totally replaceable.

    Go Oilers!

    We need to all sit in a room licking stamps and flooding this post to the head office of the oilers via mail. The value of “playing with” or “sheltered behind” Mcdavid is the extra found money behind his contract.

    Chia has been decent finding value but just makes me a little nervous handing out NMC and longer contracts to pieces that might hamstring this team in the midterm of McJesus contract.

    Perfectly said!

  38. The Swiss says:

    I think the Nuge is a much more valuable player up and down the ice than Maroon (and less replaceable) so I’d be gutted if they sacrificed him to keep the Big Rig. Although Maroon had a huge season, he’s 29 and a big body that will deteriorate faster than a smaller guy. GM’s around the league know that he can’t produce anywhere near what he did last year on McDavid’s wing. He played with Perry and Getzlaf a fair bit and didn’t produce anything spectacular. I don’t see anyone giving him over 4M. He should thank God he has the opportunity to play with McDavid and sign a 3 year deal at around 3.5M to stay. He’s a great fit with the Oilers… why not roll with that?

  39. Revolved says:

    10. Impressive in possession! Yes, he’s a good hockey player full stop. I think he can help another line, although his boxcars would suffer.

    This is it right here. I have previously suggested that he might be most valuable with Nuge, as he helped improve the results from those tough minutes possession wise, which is likely the best way to defend against elite opposition.

    The issue is that we need a finisher on McDavid’s wing, and no one has shown Maroon’s ability for this. This team’s success was highly dependent on the top line killing it, and Maroon was a big part of that. Let’s just hope someone else can fill that role so that Maroon can help another line, his production sinks and we can afford him next summer.

  40. Hilmar says:

    I’m risking going a bit off topic here, and I haven’t had the time to read through all the threads during the summer and had even less time to reply when some thought struck me, so excuse me if my points have been thoroughly handled before.

    I have seen repeated a few times in the comments that “Nuge has a muffin of a shot”, I would like to begin my reply with some anecdotal evidence, almost 7 beautiful minutes of it in fact.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9_1Ax2ELfc

    I have always thought that Nuge has a very sneaky, accurate shot, but that he doesn’t get it off enough, and I think that has become more evident since he lost his 1PP time, to another player not shooting enough, mind you.

    I would put myself in the camp of being interested in seeing RNH getting a look on McDavid’s wing, mostly because I believe he could do wonders with the time and open ice that McDavid’s speed and passing would provide him. I believe he would be a massive threat as a shooter and I bet he’d be better than most on the team at thinking the game at McDavid’s level.

    I also agree with the people who have mentioned that McDavid’s d-zone coverage is the weakest part of his game (his shot is fine). If Nuge can be the defensive responsibility on the line it might be the best alternative for the team.

    Another point I’d like to make, I guess it has been mentioned, but I think it needs more emphasis, and that is the fact that Caggiula is going to start the season slotted in his proper place on the wing. His numbers from last season has to be looked at through the lens of playing center for far longer than most people would deem reasonable.

    Look at how well Hall did at center after “playing some in junior…”, or whatever. Different levels of competition I guess, but I have pretty big hopes for the offence of this team to be something special to behold this upcoming season.

  41. GCW_69 says:

    maudite: We need to all sit in a room licking stamps and flooding this post to the head office of the oilers via mail.The value of “playing with” or “sheltered behind” Mcdavid is the extra found money behind his contract.

    Chia has been decent finding value but just makes me a little nervous handing out NMC and longer contracts to pieces that might hamstring this team in the midterm of McJesus contract.

    Perfectly said!

    Thank you for the kind words!

  42. russ99 says:

    The Swiss:
    I think the Nuge is a much more valuable player up and down the ice than Maroon (and less replaceable) so I’d be gutted if they sacrificed him to keep the Big Rig.Although Maroon had a huge season, he’s 29 and a big body that will deteriorate faster than a smaller guy.GM’s around the league know that he can’t produce anywhere near what he did last year on McDavid’s wing.He played with Perry and Getzlaf a fair bit and didn’t produce anything spectacular.I don’t see anyone giving him over 4M.He should thank God he has the opportunity to play with McDavid and sign a 3 year deal at around 3.5M to stay.He’s a great fit with the Oilers… why not roll with that?

    Meh.

    Third line defensive centers with some secondary scoring are readily available in FA for roughly half of RNH’s contract.

    I don’t think either Maroon or RNH will be back in 18-19, and other than the players with NMCs, the future of this club is the young players in the McDavid core, and fill-in veterans will need to be a lot less expensive.

    IMO, Lucic’s big issue last year was conditioning. He’s not the fastest skater, but has been adequate in the past, he’s just run out of gas extending the cycle and going back.

    I hope he’s put in a hard summer’s work on that, if so, he’ll be a much better player this year.

  43. russ99 says:

    Hilmar:
    I’m risking going a bit off topic here, and I haven’t had the time to read through all the threads during the summer and had even less time to reply when some thought struck me, so excuse me if my points have been thoroughly handled before.

    I have seen repeated a few times in the comments that “Nuge has a muffin of a shot”, I would like to begin my reply with some anecdotal evidence, almost 7 beautiful minutes of it in fact.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9_1Ax2ELfc

    I have always thought that Nuge has a very sneaky, accurate shot, but that he doesn’t get it off enough, and I think that has become more evident since he lost his 1PP time, to another player not shooting enough, mind you.

    I would put myself in the camp of being interested in seeing RNH getting a look on McDavid’s wing, mostly because I believe he could do wonders with the time and open ice that McDavid’s speed and passing would provide him. I believe he would be a massive threat as a shooter and I bet he’d be better than most on the team at thinking the game at McDavid’s level.

    I also agree with the people who have mentioned that McDavid’s d-zone coverage is the weakest part of his game (his shot is fine). If Nuge can be the defensive responsibility on the line it might be the best alternative for the team.

    Another point I’d like to make, I guess it has been mentioned, but I think it needs more emphasis, and that is the fact that Caggiula is going to start the season slotted in his proper place on the wing. His numbers from last season has to be looked at through the lens of playing center for far longer than most people would deem reasonable.

    Look at how well Hall did at center after “playing some in junior…”, or whatever. Different levels of competition I guess, but I have pretty big hopes for the offence of this team to be something special to behold this upcoming season.

    We’re complaining about the defensive play of a 20 year old center?

    That game takes time, and not only is he adequate now (getting back and being in the right spots is not an issue), I have no doubts McDavid will eventually excel at that part of his game too.

    RNH’s career shooting percentage is 10.7% and been on the down slope for the last two years. He’s not a shooter, and when he shoots, all too often it goes to the goalie’s breadbasket. We’ve not seen yet any tangible results of McDavid’s stated focus to shoot more, and until he does it’s senseless to put a passer on his line.

    Love the justification being thrown around here for a favorite player to be propped up that not only doesn’t have the chops for the role, nor deserves such a role after years of declining and timid play.

  44. Professor Q says:

    I always find it funny when people suggest people who are larger degrade faster than people are smaller.

    That’s not how it works, regardless of other factors and regardless of extreme degrees (overly small vs overly large and the associated health problems).

  45. SteveAustinLO says:

    Respectfully, the best trade Pistol has made for the Oilers is Talbot. Even if he paid a premium (say… the Reinhart package), it would STILL be his best. We are very lucky to have Dadbot. Top 5 goalie in the league.

  46. Hilmar says:

    russ99: We’re complaining about the defensive play of a 20 year old center?

    That game takes time, and not only is he adequate now (getting back and being in the right spots is not an issue), I have no doubts McDavid will eventually excel at that part of his game too.

    RNH’s career shooting percentage is 10.7% and been on the down slope for the last two years. He’s not a shooter, and when he shoots, all too often it goes to the goalie’s breadbasket. We’ve not seen yet any tangible results of McDavid’s stated focus to shoot more, and until he does it’s senseless to put a passer on his line.

    Love the justification being thrown around here for a favorite player to be propped up that not only doesn’t have the chops for the role, nor deserves such a role after years of declining and timid play.

    Maybe I’ve missed a lot of the conversation and you’re reading stuff into my post, but I’m not complaining about McDavid’s defensive play, I’m just stating that I think it’s the weakest part of his game, that is a relative, and subjective observation, if you feel like some other aspect of his game is weaker, then by all means, let me know.

    I have no doubts that he’ll eventually be an excellent defensive player, but maybe he’d benefit from some help this upcoming season, still not the major point of my post.

    With regards to RNH, I’d think his sh% decline has at least something to do with how he’s been deployed and the players he’s played with. I think his numbers would have been much better if he had had more time and space in the offensive zone, but TMac has pretty much admitted that he’s sent him out to the sharks to survive.

    I believe McDavid will figure out how to shoot the puck in the NHL before he figures out the defensive game, so I don’t see a problem with having two great passers on that line.

    And your last paragraph is just useless condescension. If Draisaitl can take the second line C role, then why not try and see if McDavid and RNH has some chemistry? I’m not saying he should keep the spot the entire season, but I’d find it interesting to see it tried, at least in training camp if nothing else.

    How do you know RNH doensn’t have the chops if he’s not been played on McDavid’s wing before?

    And I don’t think deserves comes much into the picture at this point, it’s find him a place that works or sell him for scraps.

  47. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    stush18: I’m sorry but LWs like him are not found on a tree.

    Chemistry is a thing. Team Canada decided to put Chris Kunitz on their roster because they were so worried about it.

    – I guess it depends on how rare you think things grow on trees..

    – In the last 3 years, Kunitz scores at a rate of 46% less when not playing with Crosby (he played almost exactly 1500 together and apart): Centres matter way more than wingers.

    – Take away the 600 minutes he played with Backstrom, and you have a capable winger who needs an awesome C to post crooked numbers: lots of wingers like that IMO:

    – Don’t pay Maroon for what others can do. Now if you can find McD a Kurri: that’s different: they made beautiful music together!

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