G60 2017-18: Avalanche at Oilers

Tonight may be the final game as Oilers for several at Rogers, including Patrick Maroon, Mark Letestu and Mike Cammalleri. Could we see Anton Slepyshev heading out of town? Drake Caggiula? Ryan Strome? Based on some of the teams who have been following the Oilers around lately, anything is possible.

THE ATHLETIC!

BABY BLUE, YEAR OVER YEAR

  • February 2016: 3-7-0, goal differential -7 (6 points)
  • February 2017: 5-5-0, goal differential -2 (10 points)
  • February 2018: 2-7-1, goal differential -8 (5 points)
  • February 23, 2016: Ottawa 4, Edmonton 1 (Source)
  • February 26, 2017: Nashville 5, Edmonton 4 (Source)

February hasn’t ever been a stellar month during the McLellan era, a win tonight by this year’s version of the team puts them ahead of 15-16 and within striking distance of the playoff team. There were rumors of a possible Sekera return earlier in the week.

AFTER 59, YEAR OVER YEAR

  • Oilers 15-16: 22-31-6, goal differential -41 (50 points)
  • Oilers 16-17: 32-19-8, goal differential +20 (72 points)
  • Oilers 17-18: 24-31-4, goal differential -31 (52 points)
  • February 20, 2016: Colorado 3, Edmonton 2 (Source)
  • February 21, 2017: Tampa Bay 4, Edmonton 1 (Source)

Barring a winning streak of more than six games, it’s safe to say that this team’s outer marker (in terms of points) is about 75. On Boxing Day this team was 17-17-2 with some real issues and some walking around money, but the general manager didn’t make a move. Why? Why would a GM, who was already in an uncomfortable spot, pass on the opportunity to help his cause? More in a minute.

WHAT TO EXPECT FROM FEBRUARY

  • At home to: Colorado, Tampa Bay (Expected 0-1-1) (Actual 1-0-1)
  • On the road to: Los AngelesAnaheimSan Jose (Expected 1-1-1) (Actual 0-3-0)
  • At home to: Florida (Expected 1-0-0) (Actual 0-1-0)
  • On the road to: Vegas, Arizona, Colorado (Expected 2-1-0) (Actual 1-2-0)
  • At home to: Boston, Colorado (Expected 1-1-0) (Actual 0-1-0)
  • On the road to: Los Angeles, Anaheim, San Jose (Expected 0-2-1) (Actual 0-0-0)
  • Overall expected result: 5-6-3, 13 points in 14 games
  • Current results: 2-7-1, five points in 10 games 

Why didn’t Chiarelli pull the trigger and add a more substantial backup goalie, or a right-wing for Connor McDavid? You could argue he thought Andrej Sekera would give the team a boost but I’m not buying. Sekera’s injury is known to include subpar performance in the month or more after return. It’s an interesting question.

WHAT’S HE BUILDING IN THERE?

According to CapFriendly, Edmonton has reached the trade deadline with $8 million in cap space (and they also project it to be $37 million in deadline dollars, meaning they could take on an enormous amount of money) with some bonuses (McDavid, Nurse) eating into that total.

What was the plan? Some say add at the deadline but as the numbers above show, Edmonton couldn’t possibly spend all of their cap room if they so desired at this deadline. Possible reasons include:

  • Chiarelli was told to back off and put the trade book away.
  • The prices were too dear.
  • All trades would have impacted future cap.
  • There were so many holes the general manager decided his own team was a lost cause.

Either way, the team didn’t add a substantial backup goalie, didn’t find an upgrade on the wing and we now arrive at the deadline with gigantic cap room, but only for a minute.

PROJECTED CAP SITUATION ENTERING SUMMER

I have estimated some contracts and used Jesse Puljujarvi’s full bonus number. There isn’t much room here, I do expect the team to move Oscar Klefbom out, likely in exchange for a righty blue who can help on the power play. I wouldn’t make that move, for me Klefbom is the last defender on the trade list.

Jim Matheson has Toronto, Pittsburgh and Columbus interested in Mark Letestu, three is a fine number for your No. 4 center at this time of year. In my article for The Athletic this morning, I mention Sonny Milano of the Blue Jackets as a possible target. It would probably take more than six weeks of Letestu, but the Jackets are an interesting team to ponder.

LOWDOWN WITH LOWETIDE

All hell appears to be breaking loose at the trade deadline, we’ll chat about it this morning at 10, TSN1260. Scheduled to appear:

  • Bruce McCurdy, Cult of Hockey. Heartbreak in women’s hockey at the Olympics, Oilers at the deadline.
  • Rob Vollman, NHL.com & ESPN. Why do fans overrate the trade value of players on their favorite team?
  • Frank Seravalli, TSN. Deadline gone wild.

10-1260 text, @Lowetide on twitter. Talk soon!

 

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550 Responses to "G60 2017-18: Avalanche at Oilers"

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  1. 36 percent body fat says:

    so with all the cap space we should be selling it at the deadline,

    The two largest UFA contracts out need to retain 50% to maximize the value of the return.

    Taking a large UFA contract from another team for the rest of the year in exchange for an upgraded pick works too.

    If your keeping the coach and GM the following players need to be gone so they can not do more damage to this team; Caggulia, that is all. Maybe Benning, I think they see him as a top 4 d, and he is a 6 – 7. If they give him that ice time or money oilers are screwed.

    Letestu, Maroon, Cammy need to be salvaged for futures, and we need to see what Rattie can do in the NHL because I guarentee he is better than CRAPGULIA

  2. OriginalPouzar says:

    “There isn’t much room here, I do expect the team to move Oscar Klefbom out, likely in exchange for a righty blue who can help on the power play. I wouldn’t make that move, for me Klefbom is the last defender on the trade list.”

    ——————–

    I agree with the above statement – the number one need is the 1/2 right shot D and that can only happen if one of the four $4M plus contracts for left shot d-men are disposed of.

    The potential to trade Klefbom for this to happen is the perverse result of the egregious Russell contract and NMC. I don’t hate the player, not at all, I hate the contract for a player that is fourth on the left shot depth chart.

    ————————————

    LT, what about a buyout or Russell in order to free up the cap space? Its saves $3M for each of the next few years and there is only one year where the cap hit is over $1M ($3.6M cap hit in the potential lockout year).

    Also, do we think that Sekera loves Edmonton so much that he wouldn’t waive his NMC for numerous teams? Sekera is materially better than Russell (even if he’s only at 90% in the fall) but its better than moving Klefbom.

  3. OriginalPouzar says:

    I could get on board with trading Klefbom if the trade provides full value and opens up the cap space to acquire a 1/2 right shot D.

    Something like Klefbom in exchange for – Josh Ho Sang, Anthony Beauvillier and the flames 1st round pick.

    We could plug Anthony Beauvillier right into the lineup next year on an ELC and potentially Ho Sang as well.

  4. Scungilli Slushy says:

    I don’t think we’ll see a big trade now with all of the stability verbal. I can see PC trading Klef which would be Ill advised, post season.

    PC needs to have a hard word with Lucic and Russell if he wants to save his credibility. He has too much tied up in them for what they bring. Or if he likes a worse team Sekera instead of Russell.

    He could have Klef Larsson Nurse xxx which would be a very nice group especially with Sekera anchoring another pair.

    I shudder to think what actually happens.

  5. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Plausible Cap scenario from Pete’s seat.

    Enter the year with a 8.007MM cap space.

    Lost 852K due to overage last year, so real space is $7.18MM

    Need to account for 2.85MM for 97’s bonuses.

    That leave $4.33 to account for bonuses for: 98, 25, 83, 58, 91 (total possible $4.675)

    So Peter has that to start with and knows he won’t need all of the $4.33 for the other bonuses, but the joy of cap space is that it has a multiplier at the deadline (about start of the year cap space x 4.65)

    Peter has a deal in place to add…..oh let’s say James Neal from VGK sometime when his cap can handle it in January or February.

    But Peter over estimates his team and they fall even further off the map than anyone saw (the realists among us (including myself imo) had them fighting for playoff spot and not in the tank)

    Add to that VGK kicking ass so GMGM probably doesn’t trade Neal now even if EDM was in a playoff spot.

    Best laid plans and all……

  6. prefonmich says:

    OriginalPouzar,

    I think the chances of a buyout of Russell would be slim and none with current coach and gm. Coach loves him like you love your morning workouts and gm just inked him to a 4 year deal. Maybe a trade with salary retained? Still unlikely until at least next year this time I think. Maybe if we had a creative gm that could take on a bloated.contract for the end of this year to a team that needs a Rick Nash type but doesn’t have space. Does that team exist?

  7. OriginalPouzar says:

    I see no reason to trade Anton Slepyshev at this point.

    I’m sure the trade return would be nominal and I believe he has more value in our lineup next year than what we’d receive in return. He finally looks healthy and up to speed (skating well) and playing well.

    I think he could establish himself as a solid middle six winger next season.

    We have no winger depth and his cheap.

    I see no reason to dispose of this asset.

    Not to mention – he could help show Svechnikov the ins and outs of professional hockey next year…..

  8. dustrock says:

    http://ohlprospects.blogspot.ca/

    Brock Otten has his compiled OHL prospects rankings up, he’s got scouts and analysts including guys like Pronman and Kournianos.

    Always worth a read.

    Svechnikov was #1 if there was any doubt (OHL only).

  9. OriginalPouzar says:

    prefonmich:
    OriginalPouzar,

    I think the chances of a buyout of Russell would be slim and none with current coach and gm. Coach loves him like you love your morning workouts and gm just inked him to a 4 year deal. Maybe a trade with salary retained? Still unlikely until at least next year this time I think. Maybe if we had a creative gm that could take on a bloated.contract for the end of this year to a team that needs a Rick Nash type but doesn’t have space. Does that team exist?

    I don’t disagree – I don’t think the current management would buy out Russell but I just wish it was an option to save us from a Klefbom (or Sekera) trade – a left shot D needs to go to open up cap space for a right shot D.

    Yes, a trade with retaining salary would be MUCH better but I think Russell is the one NMC we have that would very likely refuse to waive for almost any destination – this guy wants to be in Alberta.

    Of course, I don’t actually believe that management is looking to fill that 1/2RD slot and are more focused on a top 6 winger which, in my opinion, is the exact wrong thing to do.

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  12. who says:

    OriginalPouzar: I don’t disagree – I don’t think the current management would buy out Russell but I just wish it was an option to save us from a Klefbom (or Sekera) trade – a left shot D needs to go to open up cap space for a right shot D.

    Yes, a trade with retaining salary would be MUCH better but I think Russell is the one NMC we have that would very likely refuse to waive for almost any destination – this guy wants to be in Alberta.

    Of course, I don’t actually believe that management is looking to fill that 1/2RD slot and are more focused on a top 6 winger which, in my opinion, is the exact wrong thing to do.

    I think you need to take a longer term view on this OP.
    If you don’t want them to trade Klefbom you should be hoping they are NOT pursuing a righty dman at this time. They are better off waiting until summer 2019. At that time both Sekera and Russell will be somewhat tradeable and Sekera, in particular, should have more trade value than he does right now.

  13. russ99 says:

    The season is lost, make decisions on RFAs now and move those not coming back at the deadline for assets. We need prospects and picks.

    As for next year’s cap, you can lock down Strome at either under $3M for a multi-year deal or not on the roster. As for defense, I doubt we bring back both of Benning and Davidson.

    My pick is Davidson, Benning looks like the second coming of Cam Barker with better wheels at this point, and the right side is less of an issue if we acquire someone there.

    As for NMCs, the probabilities of getting players to waive are:

    Lucic – 25% – to a chosen destination, and we’re getting a bad contract back. Would rather give him another year with likely a different coach and better fitness/nutrition with the writing on the wall.

    Sekera – 10% – Sends a bad message to FAs on a player coming back from major injury, and he asked for the NMC because he was tired of changing teams.

    Russell – <5% – Wants to play close to home and he's valued by the current and likely future regime.

  14. russ99 says:

    LT: Cap Friendly has Puljujarvi’s cap hit at $925,000.

    Are you including bonuses to get to that $3.425M, or assuming the Oilers will sign him to an extension a year early?

  15. frjohnk says:

    russ99:
    LT: Cap Friendly has Puljujarvi’s cap hit at $925,000.

    Are you including bonuses to get to that $3.425M, or assuming the Oilers will sign him to an extension a year early?

    including bonuses.

  16. ArmchairGM says:

    I’ll ask again (since I didn’t see a response last time – apologies in advance if I missed it): why are you projecting Benning, a legitimate 3RD and sometimes 2RD) at $1.1M while waiver-wire pick-up, PB warmer and utility 4-5 LD Davidson gets $1.8M?? Isn’t that contract exactly the kind of overpay Chairelli is (in)famous for?

  17. Oilman99 says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    “There isn’t much room here, I do expect the team to move Oscar Klefbom out, likely in exchange for a righty blue who can help on the power play. I wouldn’t make that move, for me Klefbom is the last defender on the trade list.”

    ——————–

    I agree with the above statement – the number one need is the 1/2 right shot D and that can only happen if one of the four $4M plus contracts for left shot d-men are disposed of.

    The potential to trade Klefbom for this to happen is the perverse result of the egregious Russell contract and NMC.I don’t hate the player, not at all, I hate the contract for a player that is fourth on the left shot depth chart.

    ————————————

    LT, what about a buyout or Russell in order to free up the cap space?Its saves $3M for each of the next few years and there is only one year where the cap hit is over $1M ($3.6M cap hit in the potential lockout year).

    Also, do we think that Sekera loves Edmonton so much that he wouldn’t waive his NMC for numerous teams? Sekera is materially better than Russell (even if he’s only at 90% in the fall) but its better than moving Klefbom.

    Klefbom trade makes no sense, by the time this team is competitive again Sekera and Russell will be aged out. There are no top six forwards unless JP improves greatly in the last 25 games,this is a train wreck right now with no quick fix for several years.

  18. Death By Misadventure says:

    LT, what’s the plan for draft articles? Frankly I’ve tuned out the season completely at this point and the trade deadline is of little interest when the sexy move is Letestu.

  19. frjohnk says:

    LT, looking at the roster next year, we have $6M to fill
    1LW
    3RW
    4LW
    4C
    13th forward
    7th Dman

    So basically $1M on average per spot. And thats with the salary cap moving up $5M to $80M. It could go higher.

    I keep saying the Oilers will have to look at possibly trading both RNH and Klefbom for lesser, cheaper players.

    Otherwise, Caggula might be that 1LW. Im not joking. We cant add a substansal player on Connors wing unless we clear money out. Or put RNH there?

    There is always the 1st round pick we can plug into that spot.

    That would go over well.

  20. frjohnk says:

    ArmchairGM:
    I’ll ask again (since I didn’t see a response last time – apologies in advance if I missed it): why are you projecting Benning, a legitimate 3RD and sometimes 2RD) at $1.1M while waiver-wire pick-up, PB warmer and utility 4-5 LD Davidson gets $1.8M?? Isn’t that contract exactly the kind of overpay Chairelli is (in)famous for?

    Davidson has to be qualified at $1.8M or he becomes UFA.

  21. Oilman99 says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    I could get on board with trading Klefbom if the trade provides full value and opens up the cap space to acquire a 1/2 right shot D.

    Something like Klefbom in exchange for – Josh Ho Sang, Anthony Beauvillier and the flames 1st round pick.

    We could plug Anthony Beauvillierright into the lineup next year on an ELC and potentially Ho Sang as well.

    The only way to get cap space is a multi player deal for Drai. His salary is a choke on any real cap space possibility.

  22. ArmchairGM says:

    frjohnk: Davidson has to be qualified at $1.8M or he becomes UFA.

    CapFriendly has his QO at $1.55M. Personally I think he’d trade dollars for term, say $925k x 3. If he goes to UFA status no team in the league is going to give him much over the minimum salary anyway.

  23. frjohnk says:

    Oilman99: The only way to get cap space is a multi player deal for Drai. His salary is a choke on any real cap space possibility.

    Draisaitl is the 2nd last player the Oilers should trade.

    Trading him for 3 pieces would most likely be disastrous. Think Joe Thornton trade from the Bruins.

  24. frjohnk says:

    ArmchairGM: CapFriendly has his QO at $1.55M. Personally I think he’d trade dollars for term, say $925k x 3. If he goes to UFA status no team in the league is going to give him much over the minimum salary anyway.

    Thanks.

    I agree we need a bunch of value contracts and giving Davidson more term instead of his QO would be a move worth considering

  25. jtblack says:

    “Either way, the team didn’t add a substantial backup goalie, didn’t find an upgrade on the wing ” ….

    PC should have done both in August.

    Its better for a GM to do nothing than to continually be on the wrong side of Trades ; so the conclusion is that Edm needs a GM who understands how to Balance a roster and who can properly evaluate talent.

    Frustrating year ……..

  26. Jordan says:

    If this team trades Kelfbom and keeps Russell instead of buying him out, I’m going to be very dissapointed.

    One of these players has upside and a future. The other… has a very real negative impact on the transition game for the team.

    Get good players, KEEP GOOD PLAYERS.

  27. Gayfish says:

    Just took a flip through the 2018 ufa to see if there was a team we could help out at the deadline. Not really seeing one, as the really bad contracts (Rick Nash, etc) are on teams that are out of it. I do wonder if St.Louis wants to get rid of Stasny. They only have $1million in deadline cash according to capgeek. Maroon for Stasny and a package of sweeteners allows them to go out and make another move. Only problem is that he is their 2C, and they would need another deal on the table.

  28. vinotintazo says:

    jtblack: Either way, the team didn’t add a substantial backup goalie, didn’t find an upgrade on the wing

    Pete gave Brossoit, Sleppy, Puljujaarvi, Caggiula, and Khaira a chance to cover those spots, after last year I think most would agree that Brossoit and Sleppy were trending up. Brossoit was a great back up last year and Sleppy looked good when he played.

    Puljujaarvi beiing a #4 pick history tells us they should be playing in year 1 or 2 on the NHL.

    Cagguila was ok and Khaira barely played.

    In hindsight looks like only Khaira has covered the bet. Sleppy being injured and inconsistent didnt help, he has looked ok recently but its probably a 3/4 line Winger.

    IDK about Caggiula he basically played 3C 3/4 of last season and was ok. Maybe just try him at 3LW and leave him there, he just not a top6 guy IMO.

  29. Gayfish says:

    vinotintazo: Pete gave Brossoit, Sleppy, Puljujaarvi, Caggiula, and Khaira a chance to cover those spots, after last year I think most would agree that Brossoit and Sleppy were trending up. Brossoit was a great back up last year and Sleppy looked good when he played.

    Puljujaarvi beiing a #4 pick history tells us they should be playing in year 1 or 2 on the NHL.

    Cagguila was ok and Khaira barely played.

    In hindsight looks like only Khaira has covered the bet. Sleppy being injured and inconsistent didnt help, he has looked ok recently but its probably a 3/4 line Winger.

    IDK about Caggiula he basically played 3C 3/4 of last season and was ok. Maybe just try him at 3W and leave him there, he just not a top6 guy IMO.

    Slepyshev’s 20pt pace from last year was a fools bet.

  30. Gayfish says:

    russ99:
    The season is lost, make decisions on RFAs now and move those not coming back at the deadline for assets. We need prospects and picks.

    As for next year’s cap, you can lock down Strome at either under $3M for a multi-year deal or not on the roster. As for defense, I doubt we bring back both of Benning and Davidson.

    My pick is Davidson, Benning looks like the second coming of Cam Barker with better wheels at this point, and the right side is less of an issue if we acquire someone there.

    As for NMCs, the probabilities of getting players to waive are:

    Lucic – 25% – to a chosen destination, and we’re getting a bad contract back. Would rather give him another year with likely a different coach and better fitness/nutrition with the writing on the wall.

    Sekera – 10% – Sends a bad message to FAs on a player coming back from major injury, and he asked for the NMC because he was tired of changing teams.

    Russell – <5% – Wants to play close to home and he’s valued by the current and likely future regime.

    Lucic isn’t getting better. He worked hard last summer. Fitness and Nutrition isn’t the problem. If you could turn his salary into two legit 2nd line wingers, you might have a playoff team. That would be the building cheap wings we keep talking about. Not plugging dogshit Caggiula in the top 6.

  31. frjohnk says:

    Gayfish: Lucic isn’t getting better. He worked hard last summer.

    There was talk last summer about how Lucic hired a trainer so he could be faster.
    Summer of 16, Eberle hired a shooting trainer.

    *Conspiracy theory alert.*

    Those trainers were not worth their money.

    *Double conspiracy theory alert.*

    Those trainers were actually the same guy

  32. vinotintazo says:

    Gayfish: Slepyshev’s 20pt pace from last year was a fools bet.

    in hindsight sure, he looked great in the playoffs and most agreed there is a player there.

  33. OriginalPouzar says:

    Oilman99: Klefbom trade makes no sense, by the time this team is competitive again Sekera and Russell will be aged out. There are no top six forwards unless JP improves greatly in the last 25 games,this is a train wreck right now with no quick fix for several years.

    It is far from ideal and should only be explored as a last resort if we can’t dispose of, firstly, Kris Russell or, secondly, Sekera. A 1/2 RD needs to be the primary target for this team.

    There are quite a few forwards in our system that could very well provide full value for the ELCs in our top 6 within the next few years. Nope, not all of them will be able to do so but we only need 1 or 2 to do so.

  34. OriginalPouzar says:

    frjohnk: Draisaitl is the 2nd last player the Oilers should trade.

    Trading him for 3 pieces would most likely be disastrous.Think Joe Thornton trade from the Bruins.

    Drai is proving to be an elite offensive center when away from McDavid.

    There is no trade for Drai that we win.

  35. OriginalPouzar says:

    Jordan:
    If this team trades Kelfbom and keeps Russell instead of buying him out, I’m going to be very dissapointed.

    One of these players has upside and a future.The other… has a very real negative impact on the transition game for the team.

    Get good players, KEEP GOOD PLAYERS.

    100% agreed. Buyouts are generally terrible but I can’t be on board with the scenario of Russell’s NMC leading to a Klefbom trade.

    Caveat: If we get full value in a trade for Klef that also opens up cap space, it should be explored – for example:

    Anthony Beauvillier
    Josh Ho Sang
    flames 1st round pick

    Acquire 1/2 RD with cap space

  36. Primetime says:

    Favourite past time of all Oiler fans now is trying to help Chia find a way out of his own mess…he should host an open line show for all the suggestions…MacT can man the white board behind and write down all the good ideas..LOL.

    I know we all want the superstar moves to rocket us to greatness, but clearly these are not coming (or at least we shouldn’t trust Chia to be the one to make those moves). I’ve been trying to figure out somewhat realistic ways to fix SOME of our many holes, in a non spectacular way. One that has kicked through my mind:

    LHD Kris Russell ($4 mill/year x 3) for RHD Michael Stone ($3.5 mill/year x 2)

    Why:
    – heard some chatter that Calgary would like to move on from Stone to make room for Rasmus Anderson (already have Harmonic and Hamilton ahead of him on RHD)
    – Calgary would be the only potential team that Russell would waive for
    – Was “beloved” in the room when he played there, and expected to re-sign with them when we “won”
    – would immediately help Flames 3rd pair for this year/steady veteran for Rasmus to partner with next year
    – Stone, while not a superstar RHD, would reduce the pressure to make a panic trade with Klefbom (or Nuge) to get one
    – while rare, Oiler/Flames trades have happened in the past (Smid/Broissot)

    We would likely have to eat at least $0.5 mill/year on Russell to keep Flames Cap hit the same. Would we have to add much more than that? Would this actually help our club get better next year? it doesn’t change the cap dollars so needs to help on-ice performance.

    Any honest opinions on this option?

  37. OmJo says:

    Nothing against Klefbom and I’d rather we keep him (that contract is gold!) but if Hall gets you Adam Larsson Klefbom doesn’t get you a 1RD, unless that teams owner is trying to shed salary *cough* Ottawa *cough*

  38. OriginalPouzar says:

    No Maroon or Caggulia.

    Drake is sick and Marron has a “minor injury” which I do think is true.

  39. OriginalPouzar says:

    Sekera cleared but won’t play.

    Oil will dress 7D and Auvitu could play some forward.

  40. Gayfish says:

    vinotintazo: in hindsight sure, he looked great in the playoffs and most agreed there is a player there.

    Not hindsight. He was on a 20pt playoff pace as well (all goals), not that small sample sizes are good bets. A lot of intelligent people advised against the bet. It was stupid at the time, and I said that. Was it hindsight to think Eberle would recover to an extent? Chiarelli made a bunch of unintelligent bets and went big on them. It would look even worse if Khaira didn’t come outta nowhere ala Randy Orton.

  41. Gayfish says:

    OmJo:
    Nothing against Klefbom and I’d rather we keep him (that contract is gold!) but if Hall gets you Adam Larsson Klefbom doesn’t get you a 1RD, unless that teams owner is trying to shed salary *cough* Ottawa *cough*

    If that logic applies, Kbomb should get you Tarasenko.

  42. vinotintazo says:

    Gayfish: Not hindsight. He was on a 20pt playoff pace as well (all goals), not that small sample sizes are good bets. A lot of intelligent people advised against the bet. It was stupid at the time, and I said that. Was it hindsight to think Eberle would recover to an extent? Chiarelli made a bunch of unintelligent bets and went big on them. It would look even worse if Khaira didn’t come outta nowhere ala Randy Orton.

    with McD and Drai talking 21M, you need cheap wingers, I dont mind the Eberle trade, Strome making 1/2 and if he can be a great 3C I’m ok with that.

    It was a shame that we could not resign Pitlick who looks like will play his first almost-full NHL season after 8 years.

  43. Woogie63 says:

    Two players that could turn out to be Maroon type value are;

    1. Chris Wagner RC on UFA earning .675M as a Letestu replacement could “Pitlick” him and offer 3X$1.1 … this would lower our 4C by $700K and bring in a very PKers

    2. Julius Honka RHD on a RFA with a chance to grow. We could have Sekera or Russell ease out of the 2RHD role and slide Honka into that role … do the Stars have room for this player.

    On LT’s list above

    Strome and Davidison will need to decide if they want to be Oilers or leave. That not huge issue we have at least 4 NHL centers without Strome. Davidson has out price himself for a 7th Dman on a team with a generational player.

    Hopkins – McDavid -XXX
    Lucic – Driasaitl – JP
    Slepy- JJ- Yama
    Caggs- Wagner – Kassian

    Klef – Larsson
    Nurse – Sekera
    Russell – Benning
    Honka

    Talbot
    Montoya

    Nurse at $4.5 (maybe less term)
    Caggs, Slepy at $1.3 each; Benning $1.1

    is $73 cap it seems to give you lots of cap to get a perm. winger for Conner

  44. Bruce McCurdy says:

    All this talk about Russell’s toxic contract and nobody ever mentions that he’s the 4th highest paid D on the club while also being the 1st highest scoring D on the club (4-17-21). I read all kinds of talk about how he is killing the transition game & yet there he is at 1.19 EVP/60 (behind only Auvitu! 1.29) with Fenwick & shots north of 50%.

    It’s not my favourite contract either because term or that NMC, but the thought of buying it out, carrying a Pouliot-level residual for six years, signing another player to replace him & somehow coming out ahead doesn’t pass the smell test. Put another way, he’s coming a lot closer to covering his bet $$ wise in the current season than quite a few teammates are.

  45. godot10 says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    “There isn’t much room here, I do expect the team to move Oscar Klefbom out, likely in exchange for a righty blue who can help on the power play. I wouldn’t make that move, for me Klefbom is the last defender on the trade list.”

    ——————–

    I agree with the above statement – the number one need is the 1/2 right shot D and that can only happen if one of the four $4M plus contracts for left shot d-men are disposed of.

    The potential to trade Klefbom for this to happen is the perverse result of the egregious Russell contract and NMC.I don’t hate the player, not at all, I hate the contract for a player that is fourth on the left shot depth chart.

    ————————————

    LT, what about a buyout or Russell in order to free up the cap space?Its saves $3M for each of the next few years and there is only one year where the cap hit is over $1M ($3.6M cap hit in the potential lockout year).

    Also, do we think that Sekera loves Edmonton so much that he wouldn’t waive his NMC for numerous teams? Sekera is materially better than Russell (even if he’s only at 90% in the fall) but its better than moving Klefbom.

    Any team with Connor and McDavid and a reasonable NHL defense should be in the hunt for a playoff spot. Not guaranteed, but in the hunt. The problem is not the lack of a 2nd right D, or a scoring winger. The problem is coaching.

    The coaching problem means the players cannot be properly evaluated and valued, and thus more personnel mistakes will be made by the GM as a result.

    The majority of players are underperforming. The coach’s systems don’t work. The trainwreck is worse than I imagined and predicited it would be two years ago.

    This teams needs interim coaches and a permanent new coaching staff next year.

    Travis Green and Jan Bednar are doing more with nothing than McLellan is doing with something. The horrid special teams are not an accident. Hockey teams with competent coaching don’t implode.

    Too many people here are discussing and debating the upholstery on the Titanic.

  46. Dicky94 says:

    Bruce McCurdy,

    I agree. It’s not a bad contract if he can produce the way he has this year. Not bad at all considering the year the team has had.

  47. godot10 says:

    vinotintazo:

    Puljujaarvi beiing a #4 pick history tells us they should be playing in year 1 or 2 on the NHL.

    Puljujarvi’s problem is that, like Klefbom, he is listening to the coaching staff.

  48. godot10 says:

    Primetime:
    Favourite past time of all Oiler fans now is trying to help Chia find a way out of his own mess…he should host an open line show for all the suggestions…MacT can man the white board behind and write down all the good ideas..LOL.

    I know we all want the superstar moves to rocket us to greatness, but clearly these are not coming (or at least we shouldn’t trust Chia to be the one to make those moves).I’ve been trying to figure out somewhat realistic ways to fix SOME of our many holes, in a non spectacular way.One that has kicked through my mind:

    LHD Kris Russell ($4 mill/year x 3) for RHD Michael Stone ($3.5 mill/year x 2)

    Why:
    –heard some chatter that Calgary would like to move on from Stone to make room for Rasmus Anderson (already have Harmonic and Hamilton ahead of him on RHD)
    –Calgary would be the only potential team that Russell would waive for
    –Was “beloved” in the room when he played there, and expected to re-sign with them when we “won”
    –would immediately help Flames 3rd pair for this year/steady veteran for Rasmus to partner with next year
    – Stone, while not a superstar RHD, would reduce the pressure to make a panic trade with Klefbom (or Nuge) to get one
    – while rare, Oiler/Flames trades have happened in the past (Smid/Broissot)

    We would likely have to eat at least $0.5 mill/year on Russell to keep Flames Cap hit the same.Would we have to add much more than that?Would this actually help our club get better next year? it doesn’t change the cap dollars so needs to help on-ice performance.

    Any honest opinions on this option?

    A really good idea.

  49. godot10 says:

    vinotintazo: with McD and Drai talking 21M, you need cheap wingers, I dont mind the Eberle trade, Strome making 1/2 and if he can be a great 3C I’m ok with that.

    It was a shame that we could not resign Pitlick who looks like will play his first almost-full NHL season after 8 years.

    Strome CANNOT be a great #3C. We have six years of evidence for that. He is at best a replacement level #3C.

  50. Jaxon says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    “There isn’t much room here, I do expect the team to move Oscar Klefbom out, likely in exchange for a righty blue who can help on the power play. I wouldn’t make that move, for me Klefbom is the last defender on the trade list.”

    ——————–

    I agree with the above statement – the number one need is the 1/2 right shot D and that can only happen if one of the four $4M plus contracts for left shot d-men are disposed of.

    The potential to trade Klefbom for this to happen is the perverse result of the egregious Russell contract and NMC.I don’t hate the player, not at all, I hate the contract for a player that is fourth on the left shot depth chart.

    ————————————

    LT, what about a buyout or Russell in order to free up the cap space?Its saves $3M for each of the next few years and there is only one year where the cap hit is over $1M ($3.6M cap hit in the potential lockout year).

    Also, do we think that Sekera loves Edmonton so much that he wouldn’t waive his NMC for numerous teams? Sekera is materially better than Russell (even if he’s only at 90% in the fall) but its better than moving Klefbom.

    Asm many here may know, I’ve been on the buyout Russell train from day one, but Beer League Heroes brought up some interesting points in a recent post. Maybe we’re mistaken about his NMC. Maybe he has no clauses until his 3rd & 4th years and then only a limited no trade clause.

    http://www.beerleagueheroes.com/kris-russells-nmc-means-nothing-heres/

    How awesome would that be?

  51. godot10 says:

    Bruce McCurdy:
    All this talk about Russell’s toxic contract and nobody ever mentions that he’s the 4th highest paid D on the club while also being the 1st highest scoring D on the club (4-17-21). I read all kinds of talk about how he is killing the transition game & yet there he is at 1.19 EVP/60 (behind only Auvitu! 1.29) with Fenwick & shots north of 50%.

    It’s not my favourite contract either because term or that NMC, but the thought of buying it out, carrying a Pouliot-level residual for six years, signing another player to replace him & somehow coming out ahead doesn’t pass the smell test. Put another way, he’s coming a lot closer to covering his bet $$ wise in the current season than quite a few teammates are.

    In actual dollars, Russell is the 2nd highest paid D on the team this year (and next), and since Sekera has missed most of the games, he has usually been the highest paid Oilers’ D on the ice.

  52. PigeonCamera says:

    I don’t post very often, but I’m seeing a really shitty trend today…why are we starting to use derogatory names for players?

    Caggiula gets unwarranted minutes and plays too far up the lineup; I think most will agree with that. But he’s not the flipping coach, and I fail to understand why he’s now Garbagiula and Dogshit Caggiula. This forum is supposed to be better than that. Asinine nicknames reflect poorly on the person using them.

    Just my two cents.

  53. godot10 says:

    Jaxon: Asm many here may know, I’ve been on the buyout Russell train from day one, but Beer League Heroes brought up some interesting points in a recent post. Maybe we’re mistaken about his NMC. Maybe he has no clauses until his 3rd & 4th years and then only a limited no trade clause.

    http://www.beerleagueheroes.com/kris-russells-nmc-means-nothing-heres/

    How awesome would that be?

    There is a lot of fake news out there. Russell has a full NMC the first two years, and a NMC (for waivers) with a NTC (lists of 10 and 15 teams) for the last two years.

  54. OriginalPouzar says:

    Primetime:
    Favourite past time of all Oiler fans now is trying to help Chia find a way out of his own mess…he should host an open line show for all the suggestions…MacT can man the white board behind and write down all the good ideas..LOL.

    I know we all want the superstar moves to rocket us to greatness, but clearly these are not coming (or at least we shouldn’t trust Chia to be the one to make those moves).I’ve been trying to figure out somewhat realistic ways to fix SOME of our many holes, in a non spectacular way.One that has kicked through my mind:

    LHD Kris Russell ($4 mill/year x 3) for RHD Michael Stone ($3.5 mill/year x 2)

    Why:
    –heard some chatter that Calgary would like to move on from Stone to make room for Rasmus Anderson (already have Harmonic and Hamilton ahead of him on RHD)
    –Calgary would be the only potential team that Russell would waive for
    –Was “beloved” in the room when he played there, and expected to re-sign with them when we “won”
    –would immediately help Flames 3rd pair for this year/steady veteran for Rasmus to partner with next year
    – Stone, while not a superstar RHD, would reduce the pressure to make a panic trade with Klefbom (or Nuge) to get one
    – while rare, Oiler/Flames trades have happened in the past (Smid/Broissot)

    We would likely have to eat at least $0.5 mill/year on Russell to keep Flames Cap hit the same.Would we have to add much more than that?Would this actually help our club get better next year? it doesn’t change the cap dollars so needs to help on-ice performance.

    Any honest opinions on this option?

    100% – done.

    Would prefer a better puck mover for the 2nd pairing RHD but Stone is less money for less term and with no trade protection. Its a no-brainer.

    I would like to throw out some fantasy: Maroon plus Jones for Adam Fox (OK, fine Rasmus Andresson).

  55. jtblack says:

    Remember the time Talbot said this team would make the Playoffs 🙂

  56. OmJo says:

    Caught the end of the lowdown where they were discussing who/what is a generational player wrt whether Hall is one or not.

    I think at most there are generational players for each position? Or at the very least one forward, defenceman, and goaltender.

    That said, Hall is definitely a franchise player. But generational? I don’t know, I’m leaning towards no. I think he could have been. Back to back Memorial Cup MVPs don’t happen very often. In fact, it’s only happened once. If the team was managed properly and he was given proper support early on, I think Hall could be in the discussion as a generational player. That didn’t happen. New Jersey is doing what the Oilers should have done 7 years ago, and we’re seeing immediate results.

    Could he have gotten +100pts on last years or this years roster, like McDavid? McDavid was lucky, his being drafted sparked a fire under Katz’s ass to fix this shit up. While it hasn’t been perfect, or even good (IMO), it’s still less of a gong show than the DoD. Does a generational player need to be a 100+ point player every season in the “new” NHL?

    Can there only be one generational player in the league?

    Disclaimer: I’m not saying Hall > McDavid

  57. jtblack says:

    OmJo,

    Of you polled 1,000 Fans on whether Taylor Hall is a Generational Player, I think the poll comes back with 1,000 No’s. IMHO

  58. OmJo says:

    Primetime:
    Favourite past time of all Oiler fans now is trying to help Chia find a way out of his own mess…he should host an open line show for all the suggestions…MacT can man the white board behind and write down all the good ideas..LOL.

    I know we all want the superstar moves to rocket us to greatness, but clearly these are not coming (or at least we shouldn’t trust Chia to be the one to make those moves).I’ve been trying to figure out somewhat realistic ways to fix SOME of our many holes, in a non spectacular way.One that has kicked through my mind:

    LHD Kris Russell ($4 mill/year x 3) for RHD Michael Stone ($3.5 mill/year x 2)

    Why:
    –heard some chatter that Calgary would like to move on from Stone to make room for Rasmus Anderson (already have Harmonic and Hamilton ahead of him on RHD)
    –Calgary would be the only potential team that Russell would waive for
    –Was “beloved” in the room when he played there, and expected to re-sign with them when we “won”
    –would immediately help Flames 3rd pair for this year/steady veteran for Rasmus to partner with next year
    – Stone, while not a superstar RHD, would reduce the pressure to make a panic trade with Klefbom (or Nuge) to get one
    – while rare, Oiler/Flames trades have happened in the past (Smid/Broissot)

    We would likely have to eat at least $0.5 mill/year on Russell to keep Flames Cap hit the same.Would we have to add much more than that?Would this actually help our club get better next year? it doesn’t change the cap dollars so needs to help on-ice performance.

    Any honest opinions on this option?

    This might be the most realistic and likely way of getting rid of Russell I have ever read.

    (Sorry OP, I just don’t see Chiarelli buying out Russell, or Lucic, for that matter :P)

  59. OmJo says:

    jtblack:
    OmJo,

    Of you polled 1,000 Fans on whether Taylor Hall is a Generational Player, I think the poll comes back with 1,000 No’s. IMHO

    Yeah, I would be one of those no’s myself. Although I think he’s trending in the right direction to get into the conversation, turn a few no’s into maybe’s.

    My main question was whether people think there can only be one generational player at a time.

  60. OriginalPouzar says:

    godot10: Strome CANNOT be a great #3C.We have six years of evidence for that.He is at best a replacement level #3C.

    He’s moved up from a replacement level NHLer/waiver wire pick up to a replacement level 3C?

    Good to see you are noticing a solid uptick in his play and a new skill-set (PK) over the last two months.

  61. OriginalPouzar says:

    OmJo: This might be the most realistic and likely way of getting rid of Russell I have ever read.

    (Sorry OP, I just don’t see Chiarelli buying out Russell, or Lucic, for that matter :P)

    I don’t see it either but I do prefer it as an option over trading Klefbom for cents on the dollar in a down year.

    I have my opinions, clearly, I don’t think management is really on board with any of them – unfortunately.

    The Lucic contract structure precludes a buyout – the cap hit for the initial term of it is essentially full cost (like $5M or so/season).

  62. npanciroli says:

    IMO you need to somehow turn Sekera or Russell into a #2 RHD. Whether that is trading them for something else and signing one or 1 for 1 trade whatever. Trading Klefbom would be a disaster as the better bet is he turns it around next year.

    Then you fix Mcdavid’s winger issue with RNH IMO.

    RNH McDavid JP
    Lucic Draisaitl X
    Khaira Strome Slepyshev
    Cagguila X Kassian

    Nurse Larsson
    Klefbom X
    Sekera/Russell Benning
    Davidson

    The depth isn’t as bad as people think IMO but need to deploy things in a better way that makes sense.

    Cammalleri/Letestu/Maroon/Auvitu turn these into ELC contracts or picks.

  63. godot10 says:

    OriginalPouzar: He’s moved up from a replacement level NHLer/waiver wire pick up to a replacement level 3C?

    Good to see you are noticing a solid uptick in his play and a new skill-set (PK) over the last two months.

    I said “at best”….i.e. in the best of all possible outcomes, that is all he is. He is likely less than that.

  64. vinotintazo says:

    jtblack:
    Remember the time Talbot said this team would make the Playoffs 🙂

    I think we’re like 3-10 since he said that haha.

  65. flyfish1168 says:

    If PC trades Oscar we will be crying for a LHD to move the puck down and QB the PP down the road. Everyone including Friedman comments how he is possibly playing injured. I hate PC enough but this would be a final nail. Would love for him to admit his mistakes on a few signing and try to get out of them 1st as appose to trading Oscar. JMHO

  66. OilClog says:

    Is Strome being able to play on the PK a new skill set?

    Absolutely not, it just took his new coaches 2/3’s of a season to put him there.

    Is it ridiculous to think the Oilers can cobble together 3-4 cheap wingers that can score with the talented C’s? Yes.

    They have 1 maybe 2 guys in the system that may turn into top 6 forwards over the next 3 years as it currently stands.

    The cheap scoring forwards available in free agency are the Mike Cammaleri’s of the league now. It’s nowhere near enough.

    If they try to make this roster work as it’s constructed in 3-4years they’ll be tearing it down for another rebuild. Tear it down now so in 3-4yrs maybe Mcdavid isn’t asking for a trade.

    Even with Mcdavid there’s no daylight in the Oilers future for the next few seasons.

    Trading Klef to the islanders for 3 pieces isn’t helping anything and recent history suggests it would be at most a 1-1 trade.

  67. OriginalPouzar says:

    There is no speculation regarding Klefbom playing injured, its fact. Coach expressly stated that he was hurt prior to the season starting – it was speculated prior to Christmas but confirmed when he was given a few days off and a shot.

    While I don’t think he’s 100% now, he has been playing better (not great, but better) the last few months and I’m assuming he will be 100% for camp this fall.

  68. Georges says:

    Bruce McCurdy:
    All this talk about Russell’s toxic contract and nobody ever mentions that he’s the 4th highest paid D on the club while also being the 1st highest scoring D on the club (4-17-21). I read all kinds of talk about how he is killing the transition game & yet there he is at 1.19 EVP/60 (behind only Auvitu! 1.29) with Fenwick & shots north of 50%.

    It’s not my favourite contract either because term or that NMC, but the thought of buying it out, carrying a Pouliot-level residual for six years, signing another player to replace him & somehow coming out ahead doesn’t pass the smell test. Put another way, he’s coming a lot closer to covering his bet $$ wise in the current season than quite a few teammates are.

    It’s mentioned. The numbers are right there and easy to look up.

    But if there was a requirement on here to check opinions (Russell is a 5/6/7 D who can’t move the puck) against numbers (Russell is 35th among D on EV points, best in our group), I suspect people would post a lot less. I could be wrong. Being wrong doesn’t stop me from posting either, I guess.

    I think it’s because Russell fired that wicked shot through Brossoit’s pads. Or because he fell down in Philadelphia. Or because he coughed up the puck in Vancouver. Or because he coughed up the puck in Anaheim. Or because he didn’t make a play against Dallas. Or because he’s a terrible puck mover even though he’s shy of 50 on CF% and north of 50 on FF%. Or, or, or… a mind will barely budge once it’s made up. By individual events or, even worse, a bad reading of aggregate data (I’m looking at you CF% Rel).

    Yeah, the other 3 defensemen from our top 4 last season have had a tougher year. It must be because they’re dragging Russell around.

  69. Pouzar says:

    The Boston Bruins have traded forward Frank Vatrano to the Florida Panthers for a 2018 third-round pick.

  70. Pouzar says:

    OmJo: Although I think he’s trending in the right direction to get into the conversation, turn a few no’s into maybe’s.

    Players tend to peak at age 24-25 and gradually decline to age 30.
    Hall will be 27 next season. Maybe he bucks the trend, Staying healthy would help.
    Helluva hockeyer though.

  71. OmJo says:

    Bruce McCurdy:
    All this talk about Russell’s toxic contract and nobody ever mentions that he’s the 4th highest paid D on the club while also being the 1st highest scoring D on the club (4-17-21). I read all kinds of talk about how he is killing the transition game & yet there he is at 1.19 EVP/60 (behind only Auvitu! 1.29) with Fenwick & shots north of 50%.

    It’s not my favourite contract either because term or that NMC, but the thought of buying it out, carrying a Pouliot-level residual for six years, signing another player to replace him & somehow coming out ahead doesn’t pass the smell test. Put another way, he’s coming a lot closer to covering his bet $$ wise in the current season than quite a few teammates are.

    He’s 1st on a roster with a struggling and injured Sekera and Klefbom for most of the season. Nurse is right on his tail wrt points, they have the same amount of ESP.

    Sekera, Klefbom and Nurse are all better defencemen than him.

  72. digger50 says:

    PigeonCamera:
    I don’t post very often, but I’m seeing a really shitty trend today…why are we starting to use derogatory names for players?

    Caggiula gets unwarranted minutes and plays too far up the lineup; I think most will agree with that.But he’s not the flipping coach, and I fail to understand why he’s now Garbagiula and Dogshit Caggiula.This forum is supposed to be better than that.Asinine nicknames reflect poorly on the person using them.

    Just my two cents.

    Good post and good reminder.

    All the smart folks here keep talking about how we previously have run players out of town despite evidence they were improperly deployed.

    And then comes the Caggiula gate. The kid plays hard, that’s his job. His deployment comes from the coach, that’s his job. so please place your dog shit comments where they belong.

  73. Georges says:

    This was a quote from our HC around September:

    “I think it is insane if you just watch a group of three guys go out there and get nothing done. You have to help them. You have got to do some shuffling. It often sends messages to the team, it sends messages to the individual. I’m far from ‘Let’s keep them together for the next three weeks and see what they can do.’ Cause if it’s not working for three weeks you never get that time back. You’re done. Your season is over. Often I don’t even let it go for three periods. If you’re not performing, if you’re not awake and you’re not contributing we begin to shuffling things around and we look for a team response and then an individual response.”

    When I posted it in September, I also included this quote from Daniel Kahneman on Israeli Air Force instructors training cadets (from his book, Thinking Fast and Slow):

    “Naturally, [the instructor] praised only a cadet whose performance was far better than average. But the cadet was probably just lucky on that particular attempt and therefore likely to deteriorate regardless of whether or not he was praised. Similarly, the instructor would shout into a cadet’s earphones only when the cadet’s performance was unusually bad and therefore likely to improve regardless of what the instructor did. The instructor had attached a causal interpretation to the inevitable fluctuations of the random process.”

    Our HC likes to talk about the work he and his staff put into the players’ belief systems. I hear that and I wonder, does he have any self-awareness? Can’t he see that not letting “it” go for even three periods doesn’t communicate “I believe in you”; it screams the opposite. That, whenever he shuffles things around (which he admits is “often”), he’s telling players, you’re not awake, you’re not contributing, you’re not performing.

    To let players grow and take responsibility for their performance as individuals and as a unit, you have to sometimes let “it” go. Take the good and the bad that comes from the fluctuations of a random process. Let the players own the results as a line or as a defensive pair. Help them identify and solve problems. Otherwise, the belief system talk is just talk. By overreacting to randomness (with more randomness), he thinks he’s doing something. He is, but it’s not what he thinks he’s doing.

    (Also nice to read his plan for making sure the season wasn’t over in 3 weeks.)

  74. frjohnk says:

    Bruce McCurdy,

    The issue I have with Russell is the NMC.

    Comparing him to last year.

    -He has scored better this year
    -His contribution for offense ( passes that lead to shots and shots by him on net) is middle of the pack in the league ( last year he was at the bottom of the league)

    He has shown improvement in puck transition.
    – his stats in a limited sample size show he is one of the better defensemen IN THE LEAGUE in getting the puck out of the zone with possession per 60 minutes. he is at the 88th percentile

    Yes the above statement is not a typo.

    -his possession exit% is still lacking. Its at the 38th percentile.

    This means while he gets the puck out alot with possession, it also means he gets alot at bats in regards to getting the puck out, so he is not very successful in getting the puck out with possession.

    This, I believe, ties into a few things.

    -He allows zone entries with possession at an alarming rate. He is in the 12th percentile here.

    -But I would bet money that Russell is at the top of the list in the league for loose puck recoveries (this is tracked as I have seen these numbers for the St Louis Blues and Arizona Coytotes, but have not seen these numbers for any Oilers) My eye test would suggest this.

    So while he is in our end quite a bit, IMO, he recoveries pucks better than average and a good possibility he is our best D at puck recovery in the D zone, this allows him a high amount of chances to get the puck out of our zone.

    Our D has been a disappointment this year. Kris Russell is not at the top of that list this year.

  75. Bank Shot says:

    Pouzar: Players tend to peak at age 24-25 and gradually decline to age 30.
    Hall will be 27 next season. Maybe he bucks the trend, Staying healthy would help.
    Helluva hockeyer though.

    Hall’s production is almost certain to tumble next year. His on-ice shooting percentages are through the roof.

    Same as when Eberle scored 76 points and landed that big contract.

  76. frjohnk says:

    Maroon injured not playing tonight. Though he will travel with team.

    Wouldn’t be surprised some teams would be a bit hesitant on trading for him now.

  77. who says:

    ArmchairGM:
    I’ll ask again (since I didn’t see a response last time – apologies in advance if I missed it): why are you projecting Benning, a legitimate 3RD and sometimes 2RD) at $1.1M while waiver-wire pick-up, PB warmer and utility 4-5 LD Davidson gets $1.8M?? Isn’t that contract exactly the kind of overpay Chairelli is (in)famous for?

    I don’t know what the salary projections for next year are but if I am looking to win games this season I am playing Davidson over Benning. And that includes on the right side.
    In fact if Benning could get you a decent young winger I would do the deal.
    My reasoning is that Benning is never going to be more than a third pairing guy. And in a year or two there are several dmen in the system that may have caught him. Players like Bear, Mantha, Berglund, Marino probably all have similar, or higher upsides. And Benning is never going to fill the 2RD hole on this team.
    However, because people are so fixated on handness, he currently has more trade value than Davidson.
    I wonder if the overpay, that currently exists in trade value or contract cost, for righty dmen is considerably greater than the uptick in performance from playing on your strong side.
    Something to consider in a cap world.

  78. GMB3 says:

    Bruce McCurdy,

    I see you’ve been spending lots of quality time with Kurt and David. In a year where Sekera is injured, Larsson has missed time, and Kbomb has played hurt, Russell leads our D in points. Looking at his career statistics, he’s had a few decent seasons point wise, but they tend to be the outlier. That doesn’t change the fact it kills our cap structure moving forward.

    30 year old undersized “defensive dman” who struggles with gap control, breaking up the cycle, moving the puck quickly, with too much term and an NMC. When you have 3 LD that you’ve made big commitments too and have shown glimpses of more potential, why sign that contract. The narrative has been that this is a “growth team” yet there’s been a few panic trades and signings that don’t align.

  79. Woogie63 says:

    Remember when Pittsburgh won the Stanley Cup with;

    Cole, Dailey, Dumoulin, Letang, LoveJoy, Maatta, Pouliout and Shultz

    and damn if they did not go an win it again with;

    Cole, Dailey, Dumoulin, Letang, Hainsey, Maata, Shultz and Streit

    Kris Russell would have played every game on either of these teams

  80. GMB3 says:

    Georges,

    I remember you posting this at the time. I really like that excerpt. Thanks for posting this again.

  81. godot10 says:

    frjohnk:
    Bruce McCurdy,

    -He has scored better this year
    -His contribution for offense ( passes that lead to shots and shots by him on net) is middle of the pack in the league ( last year he was at the bottom of the league)
    **CREDIT DARNELL NURSE**

    He has shown improvement in puck transition.
    – his stats in a limited sample size show he is one of the better defensemen IN THE LEAGUE in getting the puck out of the zone with possession per 60 minutes.he is at the 88th percentile

    **UNLESS THIS IS SUCCESS AS A PERCENTAGE OF OPPORTUNITIES, AND IS NOT A RAW NUMBER, IT IS A MISLEADING STATISTIC**

    **ALL A LARGE NUMBER OF ZONE EXITS, NOT EXPRESSED AS A PERCENTAGE OF OPPORTUNITIES MEANS IS THAT THE DEFENSEMEN IS SPENDING A LOT OF TIME IN HIS OWN END, WHICH IS A BAD***

    Yes the above statement is not a typo.

    -his possession exit% is still lacking. Its at the 38th percentile.

    *THIS SUGGEST THE PREVIOUS STAT IS MISLEADING**

    This means while he gets the puck out alot with possession, it also means he gets alot at bats in regards to getting the puck out, so he is not very successful in getting the puck out with possession.

    This, I believe, ties into a few things.

    -He allows zone entries with possession at an alarming rate.He is in the 12th percentile here.

    **AND SINCE THE COACH LOVES RUSSELL SO MUCH, THE OTHER D ARE STARTING TO COPY RUSSELL**

    -But I would bet money that Russell is at the top of the list in the league for loose puck recoveries (this is tracked as I have seen these numbers for the St Louis Blues and Arizona Coytotes, but have not seen these numbers for any Oilers) My eye test would suggest this.

    **BUT HE IS CHEATING AT THE BLUELINE, SO WHY WOULD THIS NOT BE THE CASE**

    So while he is in our end quite a bit, IMO, he recoveries pucks better than average and a good possibility he is our best D at puck recovery in the D zone, this allows him a high amount of chances to get the puck out of our zone.

    Our D has been a disappointment this year.Kris Russell is not at the top of that list this year.

    BLOCK CAP, my idiot commentary.

  82. GMB3 says:

    Woogie63:
    Remember when Pittsburgh won the Stanley Cup with;

    Cole, Dailey, Dumoulin, Letang, LoveJoy, Maatta, Pouliout and Shultz

    anddamn if they did not go an win it again with;

    Cole, Dailey, Dumoulin, Letang, Hainsey, Maata, Shultz and Streit

    Kris Russell would have played every game on either of these teams

    Sure, he can play hockey, this doesn’t change the fact we had significant money tied up in our left side already with Nurse due for a raise (a young, huge, mean, Chiarelli-type player, that they clearly think highly of and have invested a lot of time in his development).

    Pittsburgh also ran have Crosby, Malkin, and Kessell. If we kept Hall, maybe the comparison to Pittsburgh’s D is more apt, if that’s the outline you would like to follow.

    Using Pittsburgh as an example of the type of D corps you can win with isnt a good defence of the player or his contract. Yeah they had a below average D corps but good to great goaltending and three elite forwards surrounded by a bunch of inexpensive fast and skilled wingers.

  83. sliderule says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    There is no speculation regarding Klefbom playing injured, its fact. Coach expressly stated that he was hurt prior to the season starting – it was speculated prior to Christmas but confirmed when he was given a few days off and a shot.

    While I don’t think he’s 100% now, he has been playing better (not great, but better) the last few months and I’m assuming he will be 100% for camp this fall.

    I heard that Klefbom had his shoulder scoped when he went on IR.

    I still think he will be the LD traded

    Not enough gritinsity for our big minds

  84. godot10 says:

    Bank Shot: Hall’s production is almost certain to tumble next year. His on-ice shooting percentages are through the roof.

    Same as when Eberle scored 76 points and landed that big contract.

    This is NOT Hall’s best year. This is his second best year to the Krueger season. It is not the outlier.

    This production is reflective of when he is not being tied down by horrifically bad (Eakins) or moderately bad (McLellan) coaching.

  85. jtblack says:

    OmJo: Yeah, I would be one of those no’s myself. Although I think he’s trending in the right direction to get into the conversation, turn a few no’s into maybe’s.

    My main question was whether people think there can only be one generational player at a time.

    Well I believe their can be more than one. Example Gretzky & Lemieux. But when you use the word “Generational” ; it means completely Exceptional, not just good or great.

    I would throw out ORR, GRETZ, LEMIEUX, LINDROS, CROSBY, MCDAVID.

    Prob a few others to debate. but not Hall or a Hall type player. Yes Hall is having an excellent year, but by no means does that make a player Generational

  86. Professor Q says:

    sliderule: I heard that Klefbom had his shoulder scoped when he went on IR.

    I still think he will be the LD traded

    Not enough gritinsity for our big minds

    The LD scared me for a moment, thinking you meant Leon would be traded…

  87. sliderule says:

    frjohnk:
    Maroon injured not playing tonight. Though he will travel with team.

    Wouldn’t be surprised some teams would be a bit hesitant on trading for him now.

    I would hope oil do not play him

    Too much injury risk for best asset at deadline

  88. godot10 says:

    jtblack: Well I believe their can be more than one.Example Gretzky & Lemieux. But when you use the word “Generational” ; it means completely Exceptional, not just good or great.

    I would throw out ORR, GRETZ, LEMIEUX, LINDROS, CROSBY, MCDAVID.

    Prob a few others to debate.but not Hall or a Hall type player. Yes Hall is having an excellent year, but by no means does that make a player Generational

    McDavid is trending to not being generational. Generational players tend not to stall in their third season. The Klingon behind the bench has put an inhibitor on McDavid’s warp drive.

  89. jtblack says:

    godot10: McDavid is trending to not being generational.Generational players tend not to stall in their third season.The Klingon behind the bench has put an inhibitor on McDavid’s warp drive.

    I think the Coach hasnt helped much but I still think Connor IS GENERATIONAL FULL STOP.

  90. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    digger50: Good post and good reminder.

    All the smart folks here keep talking about how we previously have run players out of town despite evidence they were improperly deployed.

    And then comes the Caggiula gate. The kid plays hard, that’s his job. His deployment comes from the coach, that’s his job.so please place your dog shit comments where they belong.

    The entire coaching staff is dog shit.

    Did I do that right?

  91. GMB3 says:

    jtblack: Well I believe their can be more than one.Example Gretzky & Lemieux. But when you use the word “Generational” ; it means completely Exceptional, not just good or great.

    I would throw out ORR, GRETZ, LEMIEUX, LINDROS, CROSBY, MCDAVID.

    Prob a few others to debate.but not Hall or a Hall type player. Yes Hall is having an excellent year, but by no means does that make a player Generational

    I agree with that. He’s probably not a hall of famer at this point. He’s had a few elite years but I think more of his career he has been a “very good” player, but maybe not an elite one. Although I fully admit I am biased to guys who score more goals than he has.

    It’s tough to get a full read of how his value stacks up because he’s had injury issues and he played on one of the most embarrassing eras in NHL history

  92. Material pocession says:

    OmJo: He’s 1st on a roster with a struggling and injured Sekera and Klefbom for most of the season. Nurse is right on his tail wrt points, they have the same amount of ESP.

    Sekera, Klefbom and Nurse are all better defencemen than him.

    Russell is a defensive defenseman who is leading the Oilers defense in points. So how great are those other defensemen? Defensively, Klefbom has played poorly this year and Sekera has been brutal since his return from injury. That’s not a very convincing argument that they are better than Russell at this point in time. Perhaps Sekera recovers but we’ve seen the opposite in previous years (Ryan Whitney) so there is no guarantee. Perhaps Klefbom’s shoulder has affected his offensive and defensive ability but that’s a real stretch. Erik Karlsson had half his ankle surgically removed in the offseason and is still putting up big numbers, so you have to wonder how much Klefbom’s struggles have been physical and how much is mental. Russell seems to be one of the few players on the team who have played up to his contract (CMD, RNH, Drai is close, Nurse, Davidson, JJ, Maroon are the others that I can think of).

    And just think how great Russell would be if he wasn’t being coached to give up the blue line, reset, and dump it when he has open forwards to pass to 🙂

  93. GMB3 says:

    jtblack: I think the Coach hasnt helped much but I still think Connor IS GENERATIONALFULL STOP.

    Yeah that’s a ridiculous take

  94. OriginalPouzar says:

    frjohnk:
    Maroon injured not playing tonight. Though he will travel with team.

    Wouldn’t be surprised some teams would be a bit hesitant on trading for him now.

    Coach says he will play on Saturday (or very likely will play on Saturday).

  95. GMB3 says:

    Material pocession,

    Those are very good points but completely different injuries poke holes in the comparison. I’m biased since I’ve torn my rotator cuff and labrum playing ball but just because Karlssons been successful since his surgery doesn’t really have anything to do with Klef.

  96. Bank Shot says:

    godot10: This is NOT Hall’s best year.This is his second best year to the Krueger season.It is not the outlier.

    This production is reflective of when he is not being tied down by horrifically bad (Eakins) or moderately bad (McLellan) coaching.

    Hall’s other year’s over a ppg had some crazy luck based stuff going on too.

    His Individual Points Percentage in one of his big years (can’t remember which one) was over 100% at one point. He literally was in one every single goal scored when he was on the ice, and also got points from one or two after he had left the ice.

    He was way over what even the best players can consistently do.

    It was like that in both of his previous big seasons.

    Now this season Hall has the on ice shooting percentage of the gods.

    I’ll bet money on his production dropping next season.

  97. godot10 says:

    jtblack: I think the Coach hasnt helped much but I still think Connor IS GENERATIONALFULL STOP.

    McDavid has fewer point per game this year than last year (when he lead the league), and isn’t even leading the league this year. Not exactly the usual production of a supposed generational player.

    At some point, claims have to be backed up by production. Again I mainly blame the Klingon.

  98. Fairplay says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan: The entire coaching staff is dog shit.

    Did I do that right?

    I am a long time reader but have never posted. I wouldn’t go as far as to say the coaching staff is dog shit. The sole reason players and coaches don’t like Edmonton is because of these kind of terms the fans and media use when times are tough. Yes the coaching is to blame you can’t tell me any other coach would make Connor play with Caggiula and Leon with Lucic and Cammelari. How are they supposed to succeed with that. They are arguably the best 1C/2C in the league now. But their wingers shuffle multiple times per game. But when they don’t get shuffled this is who they have to put on their back.

  99. frjohnk says:

    godot10,

    OK, that kind of “idiot commentary” about Russell will just get you “blocked.”

  100. frjohnk says:

    godot10: I mainly blame the Klingon

    Godot on fire today.

  101. Lowetide says:

    godot10: McDavid is trending to not being generational.Generational players tend not to stall in their third season.The Klingon behind the bench has put an inhibitor on McDavid’s warp drive.

    Restrictor plate McLellan?

  102. Bling says:

    Any talk of trading Klefbom is ludicrous.

    Stop trading good, young NHL D.

    If you’re Oilers management, at some point you have to look around the league and notice that very few teams make the types of deals that you make on an annual basis.

    That should be sobering.

    Klefbom/Larsson, when healthy, are a bonafide too pairing, full-stop.

    Stop trying to create more problems.

  103. Material pocession says:

    GMB3:
    Material pocession,

    Those are very good points but completely different injuries poke holes in the comparison. I’m biased since I’ve torn my rotator cuff and labrum playing ball but just because Karlssons been successful since his surgery doesn’t really have anything to do with Klef.

    I should have been more succinct in my criticism. How does Klefbom’s shoulder injury prevent him from making consistently good defensive reads? I can see how it would impact his shot and passing, but all aspects of his game have been in the tank this year and it all can’t be blamed on injury.

  104. Material pocession says:

    Bling:
    Any talk of trading Klefbom is ludicrous.

    Stop trading good, young NHL D.

    If you’re Oilers management, at some point you have to look around the league and notice that very few teams make the types of deals that you make on an annual basis.

    That should be sobering.

    Klefbom/Larsson, when healthy, are a bonafide too pairing, full-stop.

    Stop trying to create more problems.

    What is so ludicrous about trading him for an equivalent RH defenseman? It helps to balance the roster. We aren’t saying ‘get rid of Klefbom for lesser players or draft picks’. How do you balance the defense without trading one of Klefbom, Nurse, RNH, Yamamoto, or the 1st round draft pick? And I’m talking about an impact player in return, not another 3rd pairing type.

  105. SayItAin'tSo, Gretz, SayItAin'tSo! says:

    One slight bone of contention re: the Krueger Year (and I say this as a Krueger fan who still feels nothing but disgust for how and why he was terminated by MacT) and anyone’s production numbers that season.

    The Krueger Year was also the season half played, where our star quartet (sans Nuge for a while) were able to play together in Oklahoma City for three months before jumping back into NHL competition with a minuscule training camp for others to get up to speed. IIRC the Oilers had a great run that season and were within 1 point of the Spring Dance in the final month before they turned in a 1-9-0 stretch in April when it mattered.

    I like Ralph Krueger and he had a lesser team that year than did TMac this year but he was also gifted a weird opportunity that had his star players, playing together in a competitive league while a large majority of NHLers were either scattered across Europe or weren’t playing at all. And despite that giant head start the team still collapsed, lost 9 of ten and missed the playoffs.

    While I understand and to an extent agree that coaching is an issue this year its also dangerous to look back and conveniently forget just how badly the Ralph team flopped when the cards were on the table and a chance to make the Dance were up for grabs.

    Winning in the NHL isn’t easy, it really isn’t easy for a bunch of young guys who have a rabid fan base and the rest of the league looking to stop them at every turn. It wasn’t easy in 2012/2013 and as we’re finding out its not easy in 2017/2018 either.

  106. frjohnk says:

    Material pocession: How does Klefbom’s shoulder injury prevent him from making consistently good defensive reads?

    From what I can gather, something to do with Star Trek, Klingons and coaching.

    Maybe Klefbom’s shoulder was hit by a tractor beam?

  107. who says:

    Material pocession: What is so ludicrous about trading him for an equivalent RH defenseman?It helps to balance the roster.We aren’t saying ‘get rid of Klefbom for lesser players or draft picks’.How do you balance the defense without trading one of Klefbom, Nurse, RNH, Yamamoto, or the 1st round draft pick?And I’m talking about an impact player in return, not another 3rd pairing type.

    Would you trade Klefbom straight up for Barrie?

  108. Side says:

    godot has been drinking early, I see.

  109. frjohnk says:

    Side:
    godot has been drinking early, I see.

    or its very late

  110. vinotintazo says:

    godot’s oilers:
    Coach: Tod Nelson
    Assistants:Babcock, Quenville

    Hall-McD-Puljujaarvi
    Drai-RNH-Ebs
    Beauvillier-Barzal-Reider
    Maroon-Lander-Pitlick
    Khaira-Sleppy

    Klefbom-Petry
    Sekera-Demers
    Nurse-Schultz
    Benning

    Talbot
    Brossoit

    I kid 😀

  111. Nix says:

    Bruce McCurdy:
    All this talk about Russell’s toxic contract and nobody ever mentions that he’s the 4th highest paid D on the club while also being the 1st highest scoring D on the club (4-17-21). I read all kinds of talk about how he is killing the transition game & yet there he is at 1.19 EVP/60 (behind only Auvitu! 1.29) with Fenwick & shots north of 50%.

    It’s not my favourite contract either because term or that NMC, but the thought of buying it out, carrying a Pouliot-level residual for six years, signing another player to replace him & somehow coming out ahead doesn’t pass the smell test. Put another way, he’s coming a lot closer to covering his bet $$ wise in the current season than quite a few teammates are.

    But what’s his ‘unforced chip it up the boards giving possession to the other team for no damn reason’ P/60? It’s constant, its distracting, and it’s maddening. Oil are a better team if he isn’t on it and that’s a hill I’d die on. Davidson isn’t spectacular but you don’t notice him for all the wrong reasons either, unlike Russell. I get clinchy in the butt every time he has the puck just goddamn DARING him to make a short and simple transition pass but nope. Boards and out it is. Can only imagine how frustrating it is for his teammates. And the leaps in logic some go through to justify his defending when he creates the danger in the first place makes it so much worse. ‘Hey guyzz, ah got drunk and ragepunched another hole in muh wall but look how good I am at sheetrock repair!’ Unreal.

  112. OriginalPouzar says:

    Safin, Maksimov and Wells in action tonight.

  113. Material pocession says:

    who: Would you trade Klefbom straight up for Barrie?

    I would trade him for Barrie but Colorado would have to add.

  114. godot10 says:

    frjohnk: or its very late

    It’s five o’clock somewhere.
    #WastingAwayAgainInDementorville

  115. russ99 says:

    Nix: But what’s his ‘unforced chip it up the boards giving possession to the other team for no damn reason’ P/60? It’s constant, its distracting, and it’s maddening. Oil are a better team if he isn’t on it and that’s a hill I’d die on. Davidson isn’t spectacular but you don’t notice him for all the wrong reasons either, unlike Russell. I get clinchy in the butt every time he has the puck just goddamn DARING him to make a short and simple transition pass but nope. Boards and out it is. Can only imagine how frustrating it is for his teammates. And the leaps in logic some go through to justify his defending when he creates the danger in the first place makes it so much worse. ‘Hey guyzz, ah got drunk and ragepunched another hole in muh wall but look how good I am at sheetrock repair!’ Unreal.

    That’s systemic, all our defensemen do it. The forward is an outlet on the boards, and the ring-around is supposed to break the press and start the breakout.

    Much like the “Russell Reset” things that all our defensemen do are being pinned on one player due to one major flaw in his game, the inability to skate the puck out.

    And frankly I’d attribute that on a dual rush bias and Corsi preference. Fast breakout carry/passes to spring the rush never added up to an automatic goal in this era of hockey, so I don’t see the allure, other than the usual “Oilers Hockey” trope.

  116. SayItAin'tSo, Gretz, SayItAin'tSo! says:

    who,

    No I wouldn’t.

    I’m getting a bit tired of waiting because of injuries but I remain convinced Klef has top-pairing dman potential that is good in all three zones and in all situations. He’s also relatively young and cost controlled into the future.

    Barrie is a known quantity and he comes with some drawbacks.

    I don’t think that targeting a 1RHD is a smart approach at all (of course if you can acquire Doughty at a reasonable cost you do it) but this is whale hunting and it’s a dangerous track.

  117. commonfan29 says:

    McClellan isn’t a Klingon – he’s Riker.

    Someone needs to clue him in that the show is better when he’s not so trim.

  118. JD_Wry says:

    Lowetide: Restrictor plate McLellan?

    Wouldn’t someone named Montoya know how to cheat that?

  119. Lowetide says:

    JD_Wry: Wouldn’t someone named Montoya know how to cheat that?

    Well you’d think, right?

  120. Bank Shot says:

    Oilers should be in on Karlsson.

  121. Nix says:

    russ99: That’s systemic, all our defensemen do it. The forward is an outlet on the boards, and the ring-around is supposed to break the press and start the breakout.

    Much like the “Russell Reset” things that all our defensemen do are being pinned on one player due to one major flaw in his game, the inability to skate the puck out.

    And frankly I’d attribute that on a dual rush bias and Corsi preference. Fast breakout carry/passes to spring the rush never added up to an automatic goal in this era of hockey, so I don’t see the allure, other than the usual “Oilers Hockey” trope.

    Agreed, fair enough. I do appreciate analytics though not versed myself. It’s one of the reasons I enjoy this site so much because I can gain insight into a world of math that is fascinating. Thank you all for that. So Ill attempt to use very simple math myself. Full stop, it is 100% zero fun to watch Kris Russell play hockey.

  122. Georges says:

    Nix: Agreed, fair enough. I do appreciate analytics though not versed myself. It’s one of the reasons I enjoy this site so much because I can gain insight into a world of math that is fascinating. Thank you all for that. So Ill attempt to use very simple math myself. Full stop, it is 100% zero fun to watch Kris Russell play hockey.

    Ha! Nicely done.

  123. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    OmJo:
    Caught the end of the lowdown where they were discussing who/what is a generational player wrt whether Hall is one or not.

    I think at most there are generational players for each position? Or at the very least one forward, defenceman, and goaltender.

    That said, Hall is definitely a franchise player. But generational? I don’t know, I’m leaning towards no. I think he could have been. Back to back Memorial Cup MVPs don’t happen very often. In fact, it’s only happened once. If the team was managed properly and he was given proper support early on, I think Hall could be in the discussion as a generational player. That didn’t happen. New Jersey is doing what the Oilers should have done 7 years ago, and we’re seeing immediate results.

    Could he have gotten +100pts on last years or this years roster, like McDavid? McDavid was lucky, his being drafted sparked a fire under Katz’s ass to fix this shit up. While it hasn’t been perfect, or even good (IMO), it’s still less of a gong show than the DoD. Does a generational player need to be a 100+ point player every season in the “new” NHL?

    Can there only be one generational player in the league?

    Disclaimer: I’m not saying Hall > McDavid

    I’m a pretty big Hall fan (who knew?) , but he’s not generational.

    Franchise player?

    Yeah, that’s not a debate.

  124. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Primetime:
    Favourite past time of all Oiler fans now is trying to help Chia find a way out of his own mess…he should host an open line show for all the suggestions…MacT can man the white board behind and write down all the good ideas..LOL.

    I know we all want the superstar moves to rocket us to greatness, but clearly these are not coming (or at least we shouldn’t trust Chia to be the one to make those moves).I’ve been trying to figure out somewhat realistic ways to fix SOME of our many holes, in a non spectacular way.One that has kicked through my mind:

    LHD Kris Russell ($4 mill/year x 3) for RHD Michael Stone ($3.5 mill/year x 2)

    Why:
    –heard some chatter that Calgary would like to move on from Stone to make room for Rasmus Anderson (already have Harmonic and Hamilton ahead of him on RHD)
    –Calgary would be the only potential team that Russell would waive for
    –Was “beloved” in the room when he played there, and expected to re-sign with them when we “won”
    –would immediately help Flames 3rd pair for this year/steady veteran for Rasmus to partner with next year
    – Stone, while not a superstar RHD, would reduce the pressure to make a panic trade with Klefbom (or Nuge) to get one
    – while rare, Oiler/Flames trades have happened in the past (Smid/Broissot)

    We would likely have to eat at least $0.5 mill/year on Russell to keep Flames Cap hit the same.Would we have to add much more than that?Would this actually help our club get better next year? it doesn’t change the cap dollars so needs to help on-ice performance.

    Any honest opinions on this option?

    I don’t rate Stone as high as Russell.

    Stone has never shown any decent results above 3rd pair (and sometimes not even then) unless he was with OEL.

    Russell can be a decent 4 with a good partner and play the right side in a pinch.

    I’ll try to post some of these results when I get to a PC

  125. OmJo says:

    Material pocession: Russell is a defensive defenseman who is leading the Oilers defense in points.So how great are those other defensemen?Defensively, Klefbom has played poorly this year and Sekera has been brutal since his return from injury.That’s not a very convincing argument that they are better than Russell at this point in time.Perhaps Sekera recovers but we’ve seen the opposite in previous years (Ryan Whitney) so there is no guarantee.Perhaps Klefbom’s shoulder has affected his offensive and defensive ability but that’s a real stretch.Erik Karlsson had half his ankle surgically removed in the offseason and is still putting up big numbers, so you have to wonder how much Klefbom’s struggles have been physical and how much is mental.Russell seems to be one of the few players on the team who have played up to his contract (CMD, RNH, Drai is close, Nurse, Davidson, JJ, Maroon are the others that I can think of).

    And just think how great Russell would be if he wasn’t being coached to give up the blue line, reset, and dump it when he has open forwards to pass to 🙂

    What?

    Okay, I’ll cede the point that a healthy Russell is better than a fresh-of-LTIR Sekera and playing-injured Klefbom. He’s on pace for 29pts this season. Klefbom has 38pts last season and Sekera had 35pts last season. That’s when they were healthy – Sekera did that playing with Russell, who had 13pts.

    I didn’t say they are better at this point in time, I said/meant they are better, period. Is this really something worth arguing? I thought this was universally accepted as fact by now. Russell is our 4th best LD, and our 3rd best RD (tongue-in-cheek).

    Perhaps Klefbom’s shoulder has affected his offensive and defensive ability but that’s a real stretch.Erik Karlsson had half his ankle surgically removed in the offseason and is still putting up big numbers, so you have to wonder how much Klefbom’s struggles have been physical and how much is mental.

    First things first, Klefbom is not in the same league of defencemen as Erik Karlsson. And Karlsson isn’t stuck playing with Matt Benning, who is struggling mightily himself this season – though Karlsson would likely be able push his pairing regardless of who he plays with. That said, Erik Karlsson isn’t producing this season like he has in the past, for obvious reasons. But.. There’s no comparison. Secondly, and maybe more importantly, Klefbom is playing injured. How is suggesting his present shoulder injury affecting his game a stretch?

  126. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    frjohnk:
    Bruce McCurdy,

    The issue I have with Russell is the NMC.

    Comparing him to last year.

    -He has scored better this year
    -His contribution for offense ( passes that lead to shots and shots by him on net) is middle of the pack in the league ( last year he was at the bottom of the league)

    He has shown improvement in puck transition.
    – his stats in a limited sample size show he is one of the better defensemen IN THE LEAGUE in getting the puck out of the zone with possession per 60 minutes.he is at the 88th percentile

    Yes the above statement is not a typo.

    -his possession exit% is still lacking. Its at the 38th percentile.

    This means while he gets the puck out alot with possession, it also means he gets alot at bats in regards to getting the puck out, so he is not very successful in getting the puck out with possession.

    This, I believe, ties into a few things.

    -He allows zone entries with possession at an alarming rate.He is in the 12th percentile here.

    -But I would bet money that Russell is at the top of the list in the league for loose puck recoveries (this is tracked as I have seen these numbers for the St Louis Blues and Arizona Coytotes, but have not seen these numbers for any Oilers) My eye test would suggest this.

    So while he is in our end quite a bit, IMO, he recoveries pucks better than average and a good possibility he is our best D at puck recovery in the D zone, this allows him a high amount of chances to get the puck out of our zone.

    Our D has been a disappointment this year.Kris Russell is not at the top of that list this year.

    Agreed.

  127. Pouzar says:

    I have it on good authority that Nic Petan has sold his condo.

    Now that’s the inside stuff!

    Suck it Dreger!

  128. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Lowetide: Restrictor plate McLellan?

    Todd the Pakled.

    Joe made him go.

    Now Connor makes him go.

  129. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Fairplay: I am a long time reader but have never posted. I wouldn’t go as far as to say the coaching staff is dog shit. The sole reason players and coaches don’t like Edmonton is because of these kind of terms the fans and media use when times are tough. Yes the coaching is to blame you can’t tell me any other coach would make Connor play with Caggiula and Leon with Lucic and Cammelari. How are they supposed to succeed with that. They are arguably the best 1C/2C in the league now. But their wingers shuffle multiple times per game. But when they don’t get shuffled this is who they have to put on their back.

    Welcome to the posting side Fairplay.

    Agree with your dog shit take, something along the lines of puppy poo is probably closer to the truth.

    Have to disagree when you say the sole reason players and coaches don’t like Edmonton is because of these kind of terms the fans and media use when times are tough.

    I think a much bigger problem resides with upper management, and in particular, ownership. It isn’t the fans and the media that would make both Krueger and Nelson run not walk if either were offered the head coaching position for next season. They both know exactly what the problem is in Edmonton.

  130. OmJo says:

    godot10: McDavid has fewer point per game this year than last year (when he lead the league), and isn’t even leading the league this year.Not exactly the usual production of a supposed generational player.

    At some point, claims have to be backed up by production.Again I mainly blame the Klingon.

    Lol. Who is this?
    05-06 1.26ppg
    06-07 1.52ppg
    07-08 1.36ppg
    08-09 1.34ppg

    Is Player X not generational?

    McDavid leads the league in even strength points this season, and is 1pt away from being 2nd in league scoring. And this is with the worst winger depth in the NHL.

    Since 15-16, he’s 5th in points (217), behind Kane (252), Crosby (240), Kucherov (229), and Wheeler (221). For even strength points, he’s 3rd behind Kane (175) and Crosby (161).

    So what?

    He’s played 186 games. Nobody has a higher p/gp pace than he does (1.17) since he entered the league.

    And that is with McLellan behind the bench.

    He’s generational, I don’t think that’s disputable at this point.

  131. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    I hate the Russell reset.

    Last game I saw an EDM Dman skate the puck like lightning and I didn’t recognize the player immediately like you usually do because I hadn’t see it 100 times.

    Russell was lightning with the puck a couple times when he skated it out.

    Blew my mind.

    He needs someone to coach him to do that, because boy howdy it was good.

    Had a history of it in junior but not in the NHL.

    Has wheels, should use them more.

  132. Dicky94 says:

    Pouzar,

    Right on. Now drive him to the airport so he can go to Edmonton.

  133. Pouzar says:

    I apologize for saying “Caggiula sucks” but I never called him “dog” anything if that was aimed at me.
    I already posted clarifying my disdain for TMcs deployment of Caggs and that I had nothing against the young man.

    FULL DISCLOSURE: I “may” have called TMc/Chia a village idiot.

  134. Pouzar says:

    Dicky94:
    Pouzar,

    Right on. Now drive him to the airport so he can go to Edmonton.

    I’m ready bro!

  135. OmJo says:

    vinotintazo: Coach: Tod Nelson
    Assistants:Babcock, Quenville

    Okay this made me lol

  136. OmJo says:

    Woodguy v2.0: I’m a pretty big Hall fan (who knew?) , but he’s not generational.

    Franchise player?

    Yeah, that’s not a debate.

    Would you agree that he could have been generational if drafted to a more organized/competent team?

    I know it’s a “what if” thing but still.

  137. Andy Dufresne says:

    godot10: Strome CANNOT be a great #3C.We have six years of evidence for that.He is at best a replacement level #3C.

    Ill be happy when they resign him. He is a 30 pt 3rd line center can play PK and PP2. He’ll come in at 2×2.5 and will be even more valuable to us if we have to move Nuge.

  138. NYC-Back-to-Tokyo Oil (Gentleman Backpacker) says:

    Pouzar: I’m ready bro!

    Don’t forget to pick up his mother, too. I hope she is part of the Petan deal. By that I do not mean anything bad, by the way. She would be great on interviews with Gene and would quickly be welcomed by the community.

  139. NYC-Back-to-Tokyo Oil (Gentleman Backpacker) says:

    OmJo: Would you agree that he could have been generational if drafted to a more organized/competent team?

    I know it’s a “what if” thing but still.

    I love Hall but he wouldn’t have been generational, even on the Bruins, let’s say.

    And although it is blasphemous, Godot does have a point that McDavid’s 3rd season is not generational.

  140. OmJo says:

    Strome has 22:27 of PK TOI this season. He had 55:57 in his entire time on the Islanders.

    Where is this idea that he is a proven PKer come from?

  141. Pouzar says:

    NYC-Back-to-Tokyo Oil (Gentleman Backpacker): Don’t forget to pick up his mother, too. I hope she is part of the Petan deal. By that I do not mean anything bad, by the way. She would be great on interviews with Gene and would quickly be welcomed by the community.

    Oh man “Mom” jokes already? I haven’t even called him dog shit yet!

  142. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Woodguy v2.0:
    I hate the Russell reset.

    Last game I saw an EDM Dman skate the puck like lightning and I didn’t recognize the player immediately like you usually do because I hadn’t see it 100 times.

    Russell was lightning with the puck a couple times when he skated it out.

    Blew my mind.

    He needs someone to coach him to do that, because boy howdy it was good.

    Had a history of it in junior but not in the NHL.

    Has wheels, should use them more.

    +1

  143. OmJo says:

    Taylor Hall extends his point streak to 20 games.

  144. Andy Dufresne says:

    Bruce McCurdy:
    All this talk about Russell’s toxic contract and nobody ever mentions that he’s the 4th highest paid D on the club while also being the 1st highest scoring D on the club (4-17-21). I read all kinds of talk about how he is killing the transition game & yet there he is at 1.19 EVP/60 (behind only Auvitu! 1.29) with Fenwick & shots north of 50%.

    It’s not my favourite contract either because term or that NMC, but the thought of buying it out, carrying a Pouliot-level residual for six years, signing another player to replace him & somehow coming out ahead doesn’t pass the smell test. Put another way, he’s coming a lot closer to covering his bet $$ wise in the current season than quite a few teammates are.

    Thank You!

  145. Pouzar says:

    OmJo:
    Strome has 22:27 of PK TOI this season. He had 55:57 in his entire time on the Islanders.

    Where is this idea that he is a proven PKer come from?

    Strome, the PKer, wasn’t built in a day!

    How’d I do JDi????

  146. Andy Dufresne says:

    jtblack:
    Remember the time Talbot said this team would make the Playoffs

    He’s a smart guy…not once did he say 2018

  147. NYC-Back-to-Tokyo Oil (Gentleman Backpacker) says:

    Pouzar: Oh man “Mom” jokes already? I haven’t even called him dog shit yet!

    No joke. She is lovely.

  148. Andy Dufresne says:

    Pouzar,

    Strome wasn’t built in a day! Perfect!

  149. OmJo says:

    Pouzar: Strome, the PKer, wasn’t built in a day!

    How’d I do JDi????

    You’re right, it was built in a week after Nuge got injured 😛

  150. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    OmJo: Would you agree that he could have been generational if drafted to a more organized/competent team?

    I know it’s a “what if” thing but still.

    No.

    Generational last 10 years:

    McDavid
    Crosby
    Malkin
    Ovechkin

    Maaaaaaaaaaybe Pat Kane.

    A generational player doesn’t win their minutes, they dominate them while putting up gaudy point totals because everything runs through them.

    Ovi might even be a debate because so many of his points come on the PP but fancy stats people tend to over emphasis 5v5 and PP goals count too

  151. anonymous says:

    NYC-Back-to-Tokyo Oil (Gentleman Backpacker): I love Hall but he wouldn’t have been generational, even on the Bruins, let’s say.

    And although it is blasphemous, Godot does have a point that McDavid’s 3rd season is not generational.

    I’d argue that the last generational player was Lemieux. I’d only have Orr, Gretzky and Lemieux on the list. Crosby is great but I put him in the Yzerman, Forsberg, Lindros mix. Mcdavid should be next. Only the Oilers could screw this up

  152. Andy Dufresne says:

    jtblack:
    OmJo,

    Of you polled 1,000 Fans on whether Taylor Hall is a Generational Player, I think the poll comes back with 1,000 No’s. IMHO

    I think he meant GenerationX Not GenerationL

  153. Scungilli Slushy says:

    I’ve said before that I think if healthy they can get by one more season with the D they have, and it would be preferable to trading Klef.

    I don’t think Klef brings a RD because no team has a surplus and Klef wouldn’t have the same value as one as good as he is because scarcity.

    I think it far more likely they use Nuge and Benning if they are going after a D. Benning to create a spot. There is more likelihood a team gives up a good RD for a good centre. There are more teams looking for centres than LD. For example the Avs and Canes.

    The question then is replacing Nuge’s points.

  154. OmJo says:

    NYC-Back-to-Tokyo Oil (Gentleman Backpacker): I love Hall but he wouldn’t have been generational, even on the Bruins, let’s say.

    And although it is blasphemous, Godot does have a point that McDavid’s 3rd season is not generational.

    I was doing a search to see if Hall was ever projected to even be generational. Didn’t find much, but I found this gem of a comment: http://nhltraderumors.co/2014/12/potential-taylor-hall-landing-spots/

    Snake Fox
    December 23, 2014 at 3:02 am

    Why the hell would we trade Ryan Strome for Hall? Strome is both better and younger than Hall is, and is just breaking out this season. I understand that Hall was a former #1 overall pick, but Strome was a #5 pick just a year later. Pass.

    On a serious note, what McDavid has done this season is incredible to me. He’s had next to no support on the wing and is still right up there in the scoring race – well, for 2nd place. Kucherov will be hard to catch up to.

  155. Lowetide says:

    Woodguy v2.0: Todd the Pakled.

    Joe made him go.

    Now Connor makes him go.

    We look for things that make us go.

  156. Nix says:

    Andy Dufresne:
    Pouzar,

    Strome wasn’t built in a day!Perfect!

    This is straight up gold:)

  157. NYC-Back-to-Tokyo Oil (Gentleman Backpacker) says:

    Woodguy v2.0: No.

    Generational last 10 years:

    McDavid
    Crosby
    Malkin
    Ovechkin

    Maaaaaaaaaaybe Pat Kane.

    A generational player doesn’t win their minutes, they dominate them while putting up gaudy point totals because everything runs through them.

    Ovi might even be a debate because so many of his points come on the PP but fancy stats people tend to over emphasis 5v5 and PP goals count too

    Pat Kane? Nope.

    And I am going to say this–

    Ovi is a generational goal scorer, at least as much as Crosby is a point-getter, probably more.

    McDavid is not there yet. He should be but this year #becauseoilers he is not. He is a generational skater though, so like Ovi with his goal scoring that should be his ticket.

    Malkin franchise but not generational. McDavid is on Malkin’s level right now. Both have more talent than Crosby, but can they realize it on the ice?

  158. Professor Q says:

    anonymous: I’d argue that the last generational player was Lemieux. I’d only have Orr, Gretzky and Lemieux on the list. Crosby is great but I put him in the Yzerman, Forsberg, Lindros mix. Mcdavid should be next. Only the Oilers could screw this up

    I’m sure Howie Morenz, Maurice Richard, Patrick Roy, Martin Brodeur, etc. could also possibly count? Or maybe Pseudo-Generational?

  159. OriginalPouzar says:

    Maksimov with a first period assist.

  160. OmJo says:

    anonymous,

    Woodguy v2.0,

    Andy Dufresne,

    Maybe I’m not completely grasping what generational means, like how good one has to be to be considered it lol. I guess some players will have to settle on just being franchise players.

    As an aside, I don’t think I’d consider Patrick Kane generational.

  161. Melvis says:

    test

  162. Professor Q says:

    Lowetide: We look for things that make us go.

    Is that why we constantly are looking for alcoholic beverages in this group?

  163. Andy Dufresne says:

    Woodguy v2.0,

    Brett Hull
    Zach Parise
    Mathew Tkachuk

    Theyre all 2nd generational talents

    But seriously Nick Lidstrom

  164. NYC-Back-to-Tokyo Oil (Gentleman Backpacker) says:

    OmJo,

    He is incredible, no doubt about it. Last year being Art Ross winner by a lot, only 100pt player, looked to be generational. This year held back by his team. #becauseoilers

    To me generational is reserved for guys heads and shoulders above their peers. There is still time for Connor but he has not yet separated himself year in year out.

    I would bet he gets there because he has the talent.

  165. who says:

    Material pocession: I would trade him for Barrie but Colorado would have to add.

    Agreed.
    But I think some people here think we should make that trade even up just because Barrie shoots right. And Colorado may insist on it because of perceived value of righty dmen.
    Never mind the fact that Barrie makes 1.35 million more than Klefbom and is under contract for 3 less years.
    Is he 30 % better than Klefbom on the right side. Cause that’s what the contract says he should be. I don’t think so.

  166. OmJo says:

    Professor Q,

    What does it take for a goaltender to be generational? I’d say Brodeur and Roy were generational goaltenders.

    I would also consider Lundqvist as one, or as close to one as one can get without being one.

  167. RonnieB says:

    Woodguy v2.0: No.

    Generational last 10 years:

    McDavid
    Crosby
    Malkin
    Ovechkin

    Maaaaaaaaaaybe Pat Kane.

    A generational player doesn’t win their minutes, they dominate them while putting up gaudy point totals because everything runs through them.

    Ovi might even be a debate because so many of his points come on the PP but fancy stats people tend to over emphasis 5v5 and PP goals count too

    Last 10 years. Just curious if you would put any D in that group. Karlsson, Weber, Chara, Doughty, Subban for instance.

  168. Andy Dufresne says:

    godot10: In actual dollars, Russell is the 2nd highest paid D on the team this year (and next), and since Sekera has missed most of the games, he has usuly been the highest paid Oilers’ D on the ice.

    OK. Ill bite. What are actual dollars?

  169. OmJo says:

    Andy Dufresne: Mathew Tkachuk

    Okay where are the pitchforks?

  170. anonymous says:

    Professor Q: I’m sure Howie Morenz, Maurice Richard, Patrick Roy, Martin Brodeur, etc. could also possibly count? Or maybe Pseudo-Generational?

    I look at the big three and how much separation between the rest of the field. Nobody did it like them. Coffey was close but I have to believe he loses a lot of points without the oilers. Maybe there needs to be another category.

  171. --hudson-- says:

    According to the Athletic, 30 year old Jack Johnson turned down a 7 year $21M contract last summer. Wow that’s a bullet dodged by Columbus. What was Jack Johnson thinking?

    Kekalainen is a highly respected talent evaluator, but I’ll never believe Lucic or Russell cannot be traded. There’s too much evidence of poor decisions by NHL managers.

  172. OriginalPouzar says:

    Maksimov with a goal early in the 2nd to go with his assist.

    Keep it rolling Krill!

  173. OmJo says:

    Tyson Barrie is not the answer. Tyson Barrie is a $5.5M/year defenceman who needs to be given sheltered minutes and cannot penalty kill because he’s not very good defensively.

    Trading Klefbom for Barrie is a horrible trade for the Oilers.

  174. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    OmJo:
    Tyson Barrie is not the answer. Tyson Barrie is a $5.5M/year defenceman who needs to be given sheltered minutes and cannot penalty kill because he’s not very good defensively.

    Trading Klefbom for Barrie is a horrible trade for the Oilers.

    I think Klef is slightly better defensively, but Barrie is better offensively.

    ymmv

  175. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    Maksimov with a goal early in the 2nd to go with his assist.

    Keep it rolling Krill!

    If Krill ever scores regularly for EDM I set the over/under on the number of Maximus memes at 34210984320

  176. Nix says:

    Woodguy v2.0: No.

    Generational last 10 years:

    McDavid
    Crosby
    Malkin
    Ovechkin

    Maaaaaaaaaaybe Pat Kane.

    A generational player doesn’t win their minutes, they dominate them while putting up gaudy point totals because everything runs through them.

    Ovi might even be a debate because so many of his points come on the PP but fancy stats people tend to over emphasis 5v5 and PP goals count too

    Glad you threw Malkin in there. Been a Pens fan since 93 and watched nearly every Penguins game for years even if just in condensed form sometimes.
    Guaranteed if it wasn’t for the primetime showcase of his peer Ovechkin vs his teammate Crosby, Malkin would be nightly news. He’s just an absolute beast and god help the team that pisses him off. He has that rare ability to turn it up several notches just to spite the opponent. Saw him outplay Crosby routinely and we all know what Sid brings to the table. Malkins ‘fun to watch p/60’ is off the charts..

  177. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    RonnieB: Last 10 years. Just curious if you would put any D in that group. Karlsson, Weber, Chara, Doughty, Subban for instance.

    Great question that I haven’t thought about.

    Off the top of my head I’d say Chara and Karlsson for sure, but no to the rest.

  178. JD_Wry says:

    Pouzar: How’d I do JDi????

    Steal that one from the reddit Oilers sub?

  179. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Nix: Glad you threw Malkin in there. Been a Pens fan since 93 and watched nearly every Penguins game for years even if just in condensed form sometimes.
    Guaranteed if it wasn’t for the primetime showcase of his peer Ovechkin vs his teammate Crosby, Malkin would be nightly news. He’s just an absolute beast and god help the team that pisses him off. He has that rare ability to turn it up several notches just to spite the opponent. Saw him outplay Crosby routinely and we all know what Sid brings to the table. Malkins ‘fun to watch p/60’ is off the charts..

    Malkin on a team not named the Penguins or Capitals would be so much more famous than he is now.

    Not in the top 100 of all time?

    What The Actual Fuck?

  180. Andy Dufresne says:

    Woodguy v2.0,

    Woodguy v2.0: If Krill ever scores regularly for EDM I set the over/under on the number of Maximus memes at 34210984320

    Your Krilling it!

  181. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    OmJo:
    Professor Q,

    What does it take for a goaltender to be generational? I’d say Brodeur and Roy were generational goaltenders.

    I would also consider Lundqvist as one, or as close to one as one can get without being one.

    As someone who grinded through 15ish years of goalie data, the best ones were:

    Hasek
    Roy
    Luongo
    Lundqvist

    In that order.

    Brodeur was good, but they measured goalies by GAA back then and NJD only gave up a shot against at the very last resort.

  182. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Woodguy v2.0: As someone who grinded through 15ish years of goalie data, the best ones were:

    Hasek
    Roy
    Luongo
    Lundqvist

    In that order.

    Brodeur was good, but they measured goalies by GAA back then and NJD only gave up a shot against at the very last resort.

    Fucking Hasek was IN HIS 40’s when he kept on showing up among the elite of the league.

    Unreal.

  183. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Woodguy v2.0: Fucking Hasek was IN HIS 40’s when he kept on showing up among the elite of the league.

    Unreal.

    He’s like the Jagr of goalies.

  184. Andy Dufresne says:

    Nick Lidstrom changed the way defense is played in the NHL. He is the precurssor to all the talented young Dmen who transition the puck out of their own end in a heartbeat.

    He was the anti-coke machine in an era where the big assertive D was still the fashion.

    4 Stanleys 7Norris etc.

    He may be the reason so many of the NHLs best D are Swedish

    Dominik Hasek did the same thing for the G position in his day.

  185. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Bank Shot: Hall’s production is almost certain to tumble next year. His on-ice shooting percentages are through the roof.

    Same as when Eberle scored 76 points and landed that big contract.

    Good. Good.

    Let the hate flow through you…

  186. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Andy Dufresne:
    Nick Lidstrom changed the way defense is played in the NHL. He is the precurssor to all the talented young Dmen who transition the puck out of their own end in a heartbeat.

    He was the anti-coke machine in an era where the big assertive D was still the fashion.

    4 Stanleys 7Norris etc.

    He may be the reason so many of the NHLs best D are Swedish

    Dominik Hasek did the same thing for the G position in his day.

    That’s the truth, Ruth.

  187. Professor Q says:

    JD_Wry: Steal that one from the reddit Oilers sub?

    I’ve used it here before, but I think wordplay is a beautiful thing to be shared and used frequently.

  188. Professor Q says:

    Woodguy v2.0: Fucking Hasek was IN HIS 40’s when he kept on showing up among the elite of the league.

    Unreal.

    He certainly Czeched many boxes that other great goalies didn’t have a chance at, for sure.

  189. OriginalPouzar says:

    OmJo:
    Strome has 22:27 of PK TOI this season. He had 55:57 in his entire time on the Islanders.

    Where is this idea that he is a proven PKer come from?

    He isn’t proven but almost the entirety of that PK time has been over the last 12-15 games when he was first given a shot on the PK.

    In that time, he has performed well – he looks good on the PK as he is a smart player and not many goals are being scored when he is out there. I don’t know what his shot suppression stats are like but, again, by eye, it doesn’t seem like many chances are being given up during his PK time and he’s been on the first PK forward unit for a bit.

    Small sample size but, since being given the opportunity, he is doing very well in it.

  190. NYC-Back-to-Tokyo Oil (Gentleman Backpacker) says:

    Hasek
    Lidstrom

    to me generational. Definitely so if Crosby is.

  191. Bank Shot says:

    Woodguy v2.0: Good.Good.

    Let the hate flow through you…

    I love Hall. It was a bad trade made by Chia.

    If you want to ignore Hall’s supreme luck this season that’s your prerogative.

    The most reliable stat when talking about regression is shooting percentages. No one bucks the trend long term. Hall is riding those percentages too close to the sun.

    I think anyone without an axe to grind is going to recognize that Hall is having an outlier season that he isn’t likely to repeat.

    PS. I don’t know why you are going out of your way to act like a dick. I like to talk hockey without snotty comments.

  192. Lowetide says:

    OmJo:
    Caught the end of the lowdown where they were discussing who/what is a generational player wrt whether Hall is one or not.

    I think at most there are generational players for each position? Or at the very least one forward, defenceman, and goaltender.

    That said, Hall is definitely a franchise player. But generational? I don’t know, I’m leaning towards no. I think he could have been. Back to back Memorial Cup MVPs don’t happen very often. In fact, it’s only happened once. If the team was managed properly and he was given proper support early on, I think Hall could be in the discussion as a generational player. That didn’t happen. New Jersey is doing what the Oilers should have done 7 years ago, and we’re seeing immediate results.

    Could he have gotten +100pts on last years or this years roster, like McDavid? McDavid was lucky, his being drafted sparked a fire under Katz’s ass to fix this shit up. While it hasn’t been perfect, or even good (IMO), it’s still less of a gong show than the DoD. Does a generational player need to be a 100+ point player every season in the “new” NHL?

    Can there only be one generational player in the league?

    Disclaimer: I’m not saying Hall > McDavid

    I kind of fell into that subject but it was interesting to hear the instant reaction from all who I asked (universal support for impact, most agreed with franchise, no one suggested generational). Sometimes polls and opinions are not terribly informative, I found this one to be very interesting.

  193. GMB3 says:

    Material pocession: I should have been more succinct in my criticism.How does Klefbom’s shoulder injury prevent him from making consistently good defensive reads?I can see how it would impact his shot and passing, but all aspects of his game have been in the tank this year and it all can’t be blamed on injury.

    Yeah that is true. My best guess would be that he might be playing more tentative and it effects his decision making. He’s taken a step back and playing hurt is the most logical explanation.

    That and this is the year of Murphy’s law for the Oilers

  194. Andy Dufresne says:

    Lowetide: I kind of fell into that subject but it was interesting to hear the instant reaction from all who I asked (universal support for impact, most agreed with franchise, no one suggested generational). Sometimes polls and opinions are not terribly informative, I found this one to be very interesting.

    Taylor Hall GP 508 G 177 A 267 PTS 444

    Tyler Sequin GP 568 G 218 A 260 PTS 478

    This adds some perspective to that conversation for me.

  195. Pouzar says:

    Andy Dufresne: OK.Ill bite. What are actual dollars?

    Like “Material” dollars?

  196. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Professor Q: He certainly Czeched many boxes that other great goalies didn’t have a chance at, for sure.

    4/10

    Not your best effort.

  197. GMB3 says:

    Professor Q: He certainly Czeched many boxes that other great goalies didn’t have a chance at, for sure.

    Hasek is the only goalie I’ve ever actually tuned into a game to watch. He was incredible. What an athlete

  198. Pouzar says:

    JD_Wry: Steal that one from the reddit Oilers sub?

    “Steal” is such a strong word.

  199. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Bank Shot: I love Hall. It was a bad trade made by Chia.

    If you want to ignore Hall’s supreme luck this season that’s your prerogative.

    The most reliable stat when talking about regression is shooting percentages. No one bucks the trend long term. Hall is riding those percentages too close to the sun.

    I think anyone without an axe to grind is going to recognize that Hall is having an outlier season that he isn’t likely to repeat.

    PS. I don’t know why you are going out of your way to act like a dick. I like to talk hockey without snotty comments.

    Re-read what you posted and tell me exactly how you come up with me saying all that to you when I wrote 8 words.

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