Injuries and Other Things

During the summer we talked about depth and the number of qualified defenders on the roster. These discussions can be seen here and here. The loss of Steve Staios, who I think we can agree is a qualified NHL defenseman, has exposed the blue and shown clearly the value having a bunch of guys with NHL experience to send out every night.

The Oilers can find them too, quality players who are available and can turn away an oncoming rush with aplomb. Steve Staios, Jan Hejda (who lacked NHL experienced but was bona fide), Igor Ulanov and others were brought in representing one thing and took on major roles relative to previous expectations. Denis Grebeshkov would appear to be the latest example.

That’s a tremendous skill, like trapeze artists or George Bush in front of a microphone. The Oilers under the Kevin Lowe regime do not appear to be terribly skilled at bringing along rookie defensemen who learn on the job and eventually establish themselves as NHL players. Examples would be Alexei Semenov, Matt Greene and Ladislav Smid (who is playing better by the way).

Sure it isn’t a black and white issue, the Oilers did have success with Tom Gilbert and Matt Greene will have a career (the Kings crazy contract means he’ll be in the league somewhere 5 years from now). However, Jason Strudwick has played more than Ladislav Smid this season and that’s a perfect example of what I’m talking about here: established NHL players are more reliable and the Oilers God love ‘em don’t appear to have the secret formula that allows young defensemen to grow into more responsible roles over time.

Smid may eventually be a reliable guy who can be sent out there to weather storms, but no one can argue that his current role is as 3rd pairing D/pressbox sitter.

How is that different from what he was doing as a rookie?

———————————————

Shawn Horcoff was injured late in the game last night and despite one or two “he’s fine” comments after the game it’s a concern moving forward for this team. As much as the club could use a veteran D, they could also use more experience down the middle. Should Horcoff miss any action, it brings up the possibility of a Schremp recall and a top 4C depth chart of Gagner, Pisani, Brodziak and Pouliot. It should also be mentioned that Pisani had back spasms yesterday and his health is a concern.

This is a good hockey club, and I still think they finish 2nd in the division and 6th in the conference. However, the Mandelbaum Steamroller will have something to say about it and it looks like they’re getting ready for the first chapter in 08-09. How unique is the Mandelbaum training? Are they doing things other organizations shy away from?

I’d like to know.

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52 Responses to "Injuries and Other Things"

  1. Quain says:

    How is that different from what he was doing as a rookie?

    He looks like he knows what he’s doing now?

    Amd I think we need to ask the tough questions of Chad Moreau: How did you cause Pisani’s ulcerative colitis… and did you really instigate Staios’s personal issues?

  2. Black Dog says:

    I think the injuries are just what they are – bad luck.

    Remember a number of years ago the Habs had a few years in a row where they were devastated by injuries. Koivu was always hurt, iirc, and he was always the start of a long list. The team was never able to get off the ground as a result.

    A lot of questions about their training staff at the time and about the fragility of certain players.

    I would bet now that their man games lost to injury have been low the past few years and Saku has been healthy since he had cancer.

    Taking on a guy like Souray won’t help your injury situation but I think for the most part its a perfect storm of bad luck.

    If Horcoff and/or Pisani are out it should be interesting to see what MacT comes up in terms of lines. Even if they are ok, it might be interesting. The pieces aren’t fitting.

    I’d move Nilsson up to play with Horcoff and Hemsky and send Cole back to RW where he belongs – have him play with the other two kids for starters. Or with Pisani and Penner if they continue to use Pisani at centre.

  3. Coach pb9617 says:

    If Horc’s melon got a dent, I’m really concerned. Especially if they are handling this lightly.

  4. Lowetide says:

    Quain: The Oilers certainly have had their share of injuries that we can rule out re:the Moreau training but there are also injuries that might come from unusual or new techniques.

    I think it’s a legit question, and have never seen it addressed. Perhaps someone knows something about it and can pass the info along.

    Generally speaking, athletes who work as hard as many of the Oilers in offseason training have huge benefits but perhaps there’s a point at which they become more susceptible to injury.

    This is not a witch hunt, but I think the question has merit.

  5. Quain says:

    I don’t disagree that there’s certainly some questions to be answered, especially given Horc and Moreau both having significant shoulder injuries without much provocation. I was more making a joke about how every time an injury arises we come back to the Moreau training regime, sometimes injuries are just as simple as black dog says.

    On a similar note, I’m not sure Pisani took part in the Moreau regime. I recall an offseason interview with Brodziak, and he talked about training with Pisani and a bunch of no names.

    I think I’d be a lot happier with sports if we could get significant, credible injury updates. This ‘out with a leg’ bull needs to go.

  6. doritogrande says:

    If Horcoff goes down for any length of time, It’s my opinion that the kid line gets immediately split up.

    We get a guy to dangle with Hemsky, and another that can play the N-S game with Cole. It just makes too much sense and allows for a top-6 where everyone plays their natural positions.

    Nilsson-Gagner-Hemsky
    Penner-Cogliano-Cole

    If we’re still worried about the lack of a veteran C, then Pisani keeps his 3rd line gig with Moreau and Pou flanking him. Schremp gets the call from Springfield to fill the 4th line spot.

  7. HBomb says:

    Horcoff going down for an extended period might be THE worst-case scenario for this hockey team, no matter what some HF neophytes might try to tell you.

    Let’s hope it’s just his “bell rung” and nothing more.

    As for Camp Mandelbaum, if I became god of Oilerland (i.e. Darryl Katz for a day), my FIRST act would be to fire Chad Moreau. But that’s just my opinion on it.

  8. Coach pb9617 says:

    Injuries are gonna happen, sure. But how many years in a row can a club be top 3 in injuries in the league before you start looking for causes?

  9. Quain says:

    Top 3? We weren’t even top three last season. Off the top of my head, here are the substantial injuries to real players for our past two seasons:

    2006-2007:
    Moreau – Busted shoulder.
    Tjarnqvist – Groin.
    Hemsky/Staios – Lingering minor injuries; they were shutdown late in the season when we hit tank mode.
    Hejda – Dislocated shoulder.
    Various called up defensemen – Who cares?

    2007-2008:
    Horc – Busted shoulder.
    Moreau – Broken foot, broken leg.
    Greene – Broken leg.
    Pisani – UC.
    Souray – Busted shoulder. Pitkanen – General unhappiness.

    I find it hard to blame Chad Moreau for Souray’s shoulder injury. He was damaged goods coming in. The other two shoulder injuries deserve a bit of interest, but Horcoff lasted 50 games, and I think the further you get from the start of the season, the harder it is to blame offseason workouts.

    Like I said, maybe Chad Moreau is the problem, but a huge portion of our injuries are freak accidents and they all just blend together in brains and get poured out as poor offseason workout habits. Frankly, it seems like our team needs a milk and cookie break between periods.

  10. Loxy says:

    It’s obviously too early to tell but league-wide what are the numbers on injuries? Obviously I get my fill of Canucks news and there seems to be a shocking quantity of players out of the lineup already.

    And while the Canucks are generally made out of glass, maybe it’s indicative of a larger trend?

  11. Quain says:

    Given that both Huddy and MacT are saying Horc seems okay, I’m inclined to believe it. MacT generally doesn’t bullshit much when it comes to injuries, at least in vague terms.

    Pisani’s back is a bit more worrisome. Hopefully it doesn’t linger long.

  12. Scott says:

    I agree with Quain re: injuries

    Horcoff did an interview before the start of the season where he said:

    “it was a problem that was nagging at me for a few years… I had little troubles with it for a couple of years… by the time I had surgery it came out about four times.”

    It seems to me that this probably isn’t a reflection of Chad Moreau’s training habits. I think a more legitimate question is the Oilers treatment of injuries, and especially head injuries, given what happened with Stoll. I think it’s telling that in an interview with Kevin Lowe, he had this to say about Horcoff’s shoulder injury:

    “You can’t predict those kinds of things.” “Freak injury.”

    Given Horcoff’s comment, Lowe is either completely disingenuous or the organization has their collective hand in the sand when it comes to players getting hurt.

    “If Horcoff goes down for any length of time, It’s my opinion that the kid line gets immediately split up.”

    This exact situation happened last year and the kids didn’t get split up. Different year and all that, but I think it’s equally possible you have a guy like Pisani or maybe even Pouliot/Brodziak to take the toughs with Hemsky while the kids run wild. O where art thou Marty Reasoner!?

  13. HBomb says:

    I think a more legitimate question is the Oilers treatment of injuries

    Could be. I’ll bring up two memorable cases before Dennis beats me to it….

    1) Smyth back just after Christmas in 2002, only like six weeks after breaking his ankle.

    2) Mike York coming back to the lineup extremely early in 2003-04 (I think) from a broken wrist, and his subsequent play being totally ineffective compared to prior to his injury.

  14. LittleFury says:

    2007-2008:
    Horc – Busted shoulder.
    Moreau – Broken foot, broken leg.
    Greene – Broken leg.
    Pisani – UC.
    Souray – Busted shoulder. Pitkanen – General unhappiness.

    And Raffi is forgotten yet again.

    What’s interesting to me is how many injuries are coming to some pretty key players. I know most are freak accidents, but I wonder how much, if anything, can be placed on veterans on a young team putting themselves in spots they wouldn’t otherwise on teams that were a bit older and savvier all around. Seems as plausible as blaming the Mandelbaums.

  15. Paul says:

    I don’t like chalking injuries up to “freak things” when they are fairly prevalent. The best example I can think of is the Toronto Blue Jays, who have lost 6 pitchers in two years to season-missing injuries, but no one wants to point blame at the pitching coach or the training staff.

    That said, I don’t believe that the Oilers are in that drastic of a position, and I think a lot of their injury woes can be traced back to oft-injured players (like Moreau and Souray). Still, definitely worth putting a little pressure on Moreau and the rest of the training staff (the guys charged with keeping them healthy, making sure they’re stretched etc).

  16. goldenchild says:

    According to Tencer new lines.

    Nilsson – Horcoff – Hemsky

    Penner – Cogliano – Gagner

    Moreau – Pouliot – Cole

    MacIntyre – Brodziak – Stortini

    I will be at the game on Sat night, looks like Fernie won’t.

  17. namflashback says:

    goldenchild said:


    Nilsson – Horcoff – Hemsky

    Rowbert has earned a shot. It didn’t work last season — but that was before the good Rowbert emerged.


    Penner – Cogliano – Gagner

    Might give the line a little bit more dimension on the fore-check. Got to tire out those D a little more to allow the yellowjackets in.


    Moreau – Pouliot – Cole

    Can’t be more north-south than these three. I like the look of that.


    MacIntyre – Brodziak – Stortini

    Hordichuk is injured, so I’m not certain that SMac is required. Burrows or Kesler would never man-up versus him anyway. I guess Fernie is day-to-day or otherwise I would think they could use an actual player.

  18. Black Dog says:

    Yeah last night showed how they could use a Glencross and what a problem this 3 goalie thing is. Pisani can’t play so they end up with MacIntyre playing a game where they didn’t need his skills. And so in the second part of a BTB they are pretty well down a line.

    Guy can’t even make or take a pass.

    Oh well.

    Nilsson with Horcoff and Hemsky makes sense but I’d like to see Cole on the RW with Gagner on the left and Cogliano in the middle.

  19. raventalon40 says:

    Tjarnqvist – Groin

    I believe it was his pubic bone, actually.

    As for Camp Mandelbaum, if I became god of Oilerland (i.e. Darryl Katz for a day), my FIRST act would be to fire Chad Moreau. But that’s just my opinion on it.

    I don’t think there’s substantial proof to blame Chad Moreau for all the injuries but there are a lot of indicators that those who have trained with him seem to be at higher risk.

    But Pisani/Brodziak trained locally; Gagner trained with his father; there seems to be no unified workout strategy that is either hurting or helping the Oilers.

    The only reason I would fire Chad Moreau is because of a conflict of interest – a la Steve Tambellini hiring and mixing up the old guard of Lowe/MacTavish.

    Sometimes it’s best if people close by aren’t pulled into the fray – not for the Oilers’ benefit alone but for Chad Moreau’s as well. He has a lot of naysayers just because he’s the official trainer for the Oilers even though a lot of Oilers don’t train with him in the off-season.

    Perhaps it would be wise to make Chad Moreau director of regular season training and hire a specific guy to come up with an off-season training program for all of the Oilers, so that if problems do crop up or benefits do arise, you can pinpoint the where in the workout program it shows up. Also, if he comes up with a seperate program they can go and work out wherever theylike, whether it’s California with Chad or in Örnsköldsvik with the Sedins, and still get predictable results.

  20. Jonathan says:

    Matt Greene will have a career (the Kings crazy contract means he’ll be in the league somewhere 5 years from now).

    Well, it guarantees he’ll be collecting an NHL paycheck. Given what’s happened to similar/better players (McLaren, Vishnevski, Klee), I’d say where he collects it is up in the air.

  21. Coach pb9617 says:

    Uh, quain?

    You’re forgetting:

    Stoll, Torres, Pitkanen, Roy…

  22. CrazyCoach says:

    Hey LT,

    I’ll throw my thoughts in here for what they’re worth.

    I know a couple years back, there was much controversy in the Yankees organization, when the Yankees fired their trainer about a month into the regular season. The Yanks were devastated by lower body injuries, and in particular, hamstring pulls. In defense of the trainer, he instituted a new training regime that was against the traditional way of training. With an emphasis on sprints instead of cardio, and no weight training, Yankee players revolted by not using the new training program and insisted a squat rack and leg extension machine be brought in. Squat racks and leg extension machines are notorious for hamstring, back, and leg injuries.

    Other studies in injuries in hockey, particularly the groin, have shown that players who did not train properly were three times more likely to injure their groins. As you know a couple seasons back there was such a rash of groin injuries in the NHL, and trainers the (hockey) world over were having to re-evaluate their training methods.

    I know that when I took my Advanced Level 1 coach training 7 years ago, we were treated to a 3 hours session with Chad Bentson, who was the assistant trainer for the Canucks at the time. Wow, did I learn a lot that day, and I quickly realized that conditioning had changed so much from my early days of coaching. And here we are 7 years later and so much has changed since then.

    I guess my point here is that maybe, just maybe, some of the players are not training the proper way or they are simply not listening to Chad Moreau, or they may be saying one thing and doing another. Like the player-coach relationship which is often swayed in the players favour due to the high salary they make, players may feel they don’t have to listen to a two bit trainer.

    However having said that, I think maybe an evaluation process needs to be added to the Oilers training programs. Not sure how one would do that, but when you are dealing with multi million dollar commodities, you must ensure those commodities stay healthy.

    And that is my long winded two cents.

    PS. RAVENTALON- I have been to O-vik. Wonderful place, and Kempehallen was a great experience.

  23. dubya says:

    New forward lines according to Tencer:

    Nilsson – Horcoff – Hemsky

    Penner – Cogliano – Gagner

    Moreau – Pouliot – Cole

    MacIntyre – Brodziak – Stortini

    Also, Staois supposed to be back tomorrow.

  24. Doogie2K says:

    Stoll – Concussion
    Roy – Concussion, mostly
    Torres – blew up his knee
    Pitkanen – was mentioned, but always seemed to be a mish-mash of different shit, glazed with a general malaise sauce.

  25. Quain says:

    Good lord, I knew I forgot Torres (ACL), but I can’t believe I forgot concussion boy Stoll. Both crossed my mind, I just forgot to write them down. I included Pitkanen (general unhappiness) and Roy (call up, so who cares?), but neither was particularly substantial/long-term.

    My list was primarily to point out the variety of injuries and how few could be blamed on training. Concussions and whatever Pits whined about were in a similar boat. The ACL might be another story, but I can’t speak to ACL maintanence.

  26. Dennis says:

    It’s been awhile since 12 played with 10-83 but this version of 12 is much better and much more confident so he should be able to hang much better in this occasion.

    We know that 27/83 have played together before but have they ever played with 13? Maybe they did early on last year when 12 was getting his shot with 10-83 pre-season ending 10 injury?

    18-78-26 could be a great line possession-wise because 18′s off a wicked start EV wise and him and 26 could feed off each other and it also allows 26 to go back to his natural side.

    The 4th line is — as we’d say here in NF — in “a bit of a state” and I think last night we saw that you really don’t want 33-46 in the same game together.

    Or at least I don’t.

    One thing I’m starting to come around to is that 46 could be in some real trouble. The Oilers are in love with 33 and 78′s getting more love from macT than he ever did and did the fact that 46 threatened to play hardball in contract talks have anything to do with the Oilers picking up 33?

    Probably not because Zach isn’t a real deterrent but if the Oilers love them some Smac and MacT’s finally come around to the joys of Pouliot, I wonder where that leaves Stortini?

  27. Doogie2K says:

    I know there’s a fair bit of concern about certain injuries, particularly the shoulder injuries, being a product of Mendelbaum. So I did some quick poking through my biomechanics and physiology notes, and came up with this. Consult your local exercise physiologist for more details.

    Shoulder separation occurs when the acromioclavicular (AC) ligaments holding the clavicle (collarbone) to the scapula (shoulder blade) are torn. In most circumstances, ligaments are strengthened over the long term by working out: the ligament is stressed by the exercise, suffers light damage, but is repaired to be stronger than before by the body, to better withstand future stresses. The same is generally true of bone, tendon, and muscle as well: this is how hypertrophy (i.e. gain of muscle mass/size) occurs when doing resistance training in the first place, and why astronauts tend to lose copious amounts of bone mineral density while in space. There are, however, two places where problems can come in from this:

    1) Applying too much stress in a single contraction. This is actually quite hard to do, to structures like the tendon and muscle, as the body has mechanisms in place to prevent just such a thing happening, called the Golgi tendon organs (GTOs), which are generally only overridden in situations of extreme stress. (This is how, for example, an ordinary housewife can lift an SUV if her young child is trapped underneath it.) I didn’t ask my prof about ligament and bone; it’s obviously possible, since we see professional weightlifters break arms during their holds every few years, but it’s not horribly common, and even that might ultimately fall under the much more likely category of:
    2) Repetitive stress injury. As stated above, if you repeatedly stress a structure — say a ligament — it will weaken, and need time to heal. If you give it the time it needs, you’re golden. If you don’t, however, you lower the ultimate stress of the structure, meaning it takes less force to make the sucker pop. This can happen due to a reduction in cross-sectional area, say by small-scale tearing, or by weaking the cross-bridge structure of the collagen fibres within the elastic elements, or the trabecular structure within bone. The former is easier to detect, because it usually hurts; the latter, not so much.

    The final result: Sheldon Souray falls awkwardly after a fight, but instead of being a little sore, like you might expect, he blows the fuck out of his shoulder. Or, put more succinctly, “pop.”

  28. Doogie2K says:

    I should clarify, by the way, that I’m not saying these injuries must be a product of Camp Mendelbaum; simply that it is theoretically possible, and that there are understood phenomena behind it, which any licensed personal trainer working with elite athletes should be well aware of, given that a second-year kinesiology student can pull this shit out of his notes in ten minutes. I’d almost be inclined to blame the players for overdoing it before assuming the trainer told them to.

  29. Black Dog says:

    I’m not too worried if I’m Stortini, Dennis, not yet anyways.

    But MacIntyre really is terrible, we’re talking basic skills here. And in the second game of a BTB when other guys already have heavy legs you can’t really send someone out to pick up the extra shifts in his place.

    I think last night we really noticed where the lack of a solid fourth line to pick up some minutes can hurt. Now the Oilers deserved better – the first two Avs goals included multiple bounces for them – but they seemed to sag when they went one down and there was no Glencross/Brodziak/ Stortini line to send out there to generate some energy.

    If they were completely healthy I think Moreau/Brodziak/Stortini would be perfect for this role although kudos to Moreau for a nice start to the season. He seems to have his legs back.

    I think Cole has to play the RW.

    I think while its admirable that they are working on Penner’s allround game he would contribute more playing with 10-83 or a couple of kids.

    I think Stortini isn’t in trouble. Surely to God MacT can see what everyone else can see about MacIntyre? Of course I thought the same last year about Storini.

  30. T. says:

    I think it would have to be the org’s treatment of injuries after the fact. There’s too much variation in who trains where…

    Pisani/Brodziak train here. Doesn’t Horc train in Michigan for his summer? I thought for some reason that he trained with some of the Detroit guys – he does have a place in Michigan. When does he join the crowd at Moreau’s house of pain?

    I heard well-sourced rumblings that the entire training/medical staff was looking at an overhaul after last year. Don’t know what – if anything – actually happened.

  31. raventalon40 says:

    I should clarify, by the way, that I’m not saying these injuries must be a product of Camp Mendelbaum; simply that it is theoretically possible, and that there are understood phenomena behind it, which any licensed personal trainer working with elite athletes should be well aware of, given that a second-year kinesiology student can pull this shit out of his notes in ten minutes. I’d almost be inclined to blame the players for overdoing it before assuming the trainer told them to.

  32. Doogie2K says:

    When does he join the crowd at Moreau’s house of pain?

    I think he starts at CM (June/Julyish), then goes and skates with Michigan in August.

  33. Dennis says:

    Pat: He might not be in trouble in the “33 plays instead of him because he’s better way” but instead in the “we’ll play 33 just in case but we’re quite prepared to roll with 11 forwards plus 33 because we now believe in 78 and we like using that spot to get the other skill guys more ice” kind of way.

    In looking at the scoring chances for/against, that has worked in a few games where macT would put 34, 83 or 12 up with the 51/78 line and give them a spin.

  34. Schitzo says:

    Regarding our fourth line: I think the problem of carrying 13 forwards is becoming apparent. With Pisani hurt, we’re down to 10 real hockey players, and that’s not enough.

    Assuming MacIntyre has cemented his spot, we have two options – lose a goalie, or replace Stortini with someone who can be trusted 12 minutes a night in a pinch. If I was Stortini, I don’t know if I’d be buying any green bananas right now.

  35. toqueboy says:

    wow…i came to make a few quick comments, but the discussion has been great today and i kinda lost my way…very nice everyone.

    1) as soon as horc went down my first thought was, how the f8ck are we going to afford another decent center when we already need a centerman. as much as everyone is applauding the horcoff contract, when i saw him go down, it was the first thing i thought of and while there might be comparables, i think the most important aspect is flexibility under the cap and giving every player “market value” makes it difficult to have out performers, especially when we have injuries.

    2) on stortini being the odd man out. once we resolve the goalie issue, i think we’ll have RS up (or whoever earns the spot). And then we’ll platoon storts/mac platooning in on the 4th depending on the other team’s “threat”. i was a huge fan of stortini last year, but i think he definitely benefited (ice-time wise) from the injuries around him. I don’t think storts sees half the games last year if everyone is healthy. as good as his year was, i don’t think he’s improved enough to have jumped that far up the depth chart. A little more skill on the 4th would have been nice last night.

    3) i know everyone is pumped on Row Bert, but i’m starting to wonder about his “one move” when he breaks in…skate down the left wall, fake a slap shot, loose speed and get pushed into the corner. i know he’s got skill, but i’ve seen that move 20 times already this year.

    4) first line. i always thought hemsky was at his best when smyth chased a dman into the corner, so that hemmer could grab the puck. smyth would make his way into the crease and keep his stick down. hemmer would get the puck into the crease area. smyth would swing. to me, the best replica of that situation is penner and why are they avoiding a sampling of last year’s number one line?

    fuckin’ weekend!

  36. Scott says:

    Evidence from the Oilers website that Chad Moreau CAN'T BE TRUSTED:

    "Moreau was a member of the University of South Carolina Track & Field team for four seasons between 1992 and 1995 and earned three letters (1993-95) while with the Gamecocks. Following his graduation from South Carolina with a honours degree in Exercise Science, he enrolled in the Los Angeles College of Chiropractic in Whittier, California and graduated Magna Cum Laude and was the President’s Award recipient for outstanding leadership in 1998. In 2000 he was awarded a certified Strength & Conditioning specialty and a certified Chiropractic Sports Practitioner qualification."

  37. heed says:

    new lines for saturday per the oilers sole source interweb delivery system…

    horcoff-nilsson-hemsky
    gagner-penner-cogliano
    pouliot-moreau-cole
    brodziak-stortini-macintyre

    pisani’s back is still bothering him so he headed back to edmonton.

    looks like everyone’s back to their natural position and the might poo just might pile up some points.

  38. toqueboy says:

    @scott

    my health care doesn’t even cover chiro…sounds like a witch doctor to me.

    that being said, i have as much ‘academic’ merit as that on paper, but i’m still just a pothead.

  39. Scott says:

    “I don’t think there’s substantial proof to blame Chad Moreau for all the injuries but there are a lot of indicators that those who have trained with him seem to be at higher risk.”

    What are these indicators? Which players seem to be getting injuries that may be caused by improper training?

    As far as I recall these are the guys that have used camp Moreau and the problems they’ve had since:

    Greene – Leg
    Horcoff – Shoulder
    Moreau – Shoulder, Foot, Leg
    Lupul – Concussion
    Torres – Knee, Shoulder
    Stoll – Concussion
    Staios – None
    Pouliot – None
    Reasoner – None
    Smith – Will Play Through Anything
    Plante – None
    Schremp – None

    Horcoff trains with the Wings in Michigan. He said so in the same interview I referenced earlier, but he was there for ten days in May and went back again in June.

    I don’t see anything that would make me think firing Chad Moreau (that unqualified hack) is going to suddenly help the Oilers not get injured.

  40. raventalon40 says:

    CrazyCoach

    That’s cool, why were you in Sweden? Vacation?

  41. CrazyCoach says:

    RAVENTALON
    I went there in 2001 to visit/meet my family over there. Mt great grandfather is from Tobo, immigrated to the US in 1904, and ended up in Northern BC in 1914.

    After three weeks in which I went from Heby to O-Vik, Stockhol, Uppsala, Bjursas, Gothenburg, Malmo, and everywhere in between, I almost moved there. I also visited 4 hockey schools and took notes like a mandman.

    I went back last fall again. Plan on returning again.

  42. Vic Ferrari says:

    I’m not sure that Rutherford is qualified to make these assessments, but he’s in the ‘overtraining’ camp on the issue of injuries.

    A quote from a Larry Wigge article at NHL.com today:

    Hurricanes GM Jim Rutherford recently remarked that he wants his coaching and training staff to back off some of their physical drills. Rutherford is convinced that overtraining, specifically certain strenuous drills, is the root of injury problems is having — most notably Justin Williams, who tore his Achilles’ tendon while out on a run prior to training camp. Williams could be out at least six months after the power forward missed most of last season. “They’re working out all the time,” Rutherford said. “It’s like we’re training for the Olympics.”

  43. Loxy says:

    Horcoff trains with the Wings in Michigan. He said so in the same interview I referenced earlier, but he was there for ten days in May and went back again in June.

    I know for certain he was down at Camp Moreau for quite a while this summer.

  44. Coach pb9617 says:

    to me, the best replica of that situation is penner and why are they avoiding a sampling of last year’s number one line?

    Your lips to god’s ears.

  45. CrazyCoach says:

    Hey Vic,

    Rutherford may be on to something. The problem is that fringe players need to be in the best shape possible for camp, or they end up in the AHL. Hence the over training that is going on.

    Maybe these trainers need to suggest that some of these players play another sport during the off-season. Just like they do with kids.

    Can you imagine Macintrye on a soccer field? ha ha ha!

  46. Scott says:

    Sorry for being unclear. I meant he was down at camp Moreau for ten days in May and then was back again in June even though he was in Michigan for most of the summer.

  47. doritogrande says:

    Seriously, nobody brought up the wrist issues Hemsky played through last year?

    Does he attend Chad Moreau’s “training sessions” in the offseason, or does he stay in the Czech Republic?

  48. doritogrande says:

    To continue a point that Loxy brought up earlier, Daniel Briere out for a month with a torn ab muscle.

    http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=253644&lid=sublink01&lpos=headlines_main

    It could very well be that injuries are up this year, but at what point do we start pointing fingers at the trainers and the players' off-season training programs? It's pretty damn hard to tear an abdominal muscle without previously straining said muscle.

  49. T. says:

    Hemmer played roller hockey somewhere this past summer. Anyone remember if that was back in the Czech republic or not? I don’t know if he still goes home as much since the bar brawl/stabbing.

  50. T. says:

    Ha! And by roller hockey I mean IIHF Inline World Hockey Chamionships… and yes, in the CR.

    “Roller hockey” – Did I just date myself or what?

  51. mjsh says:

    I like the lines. Nillson will do well with Hemmer, I would rather have had Cole with the other 2 kids because of his speed and Penner with Pouliot & Moreau. Having said all that, the other lines just did not click. Too much thinking and not enough playing out there. I also think huggy bear's time is almost over. He really is not a fighter, he does not seem to be an agigator like Tootoo or the two guys in Dallas. The Big Mac Attack is not much different that the Boogie man, big, fights but not really a hockey player however, I do think the oiler need to have him in our division.

  52. Mike says:

    Horcoff update please? Anyone know what the problem is/was?

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