Oilers at Canucks, G30/08-09

My wife’s family lives in Medicine Hat so I’ve been driving down there three or four times a year for more than 25 years. It’s a nice little city, I always thought it would be a good place to raise a family and certainly a good place for a hockey fan.

The Tigers rule the city and surrounding area. When they’re Memorial Cup worthy there’s a measurable buzz from early spring right through the WHL playoffs and into the Memorial Cup tournament.

Trevor Linden is Medicine Hat’s golden boy. Talk to a Medicine Hat native about Linden and you get the kind of respect and tone that people use only when speaking of greatness. He’s the town DiMaggio.

Since I’ve been to Medicine Hat over 100 times let me put all the Linden information to good use. Here’s a few things you’re not likely to read many places:

  • The family name was originally “Van der Linden.”
  • His brother Jamie played 4 NHL games.
  • The trade that sent Linden back to Vancouver (from Washington) included the Canucks 3rd rd pick going the other way. That third round pick eventually made its way to Edmonton and was used on Zack Stortini.
  • He was involved in some of the biggest trades of his era, including the monster that sent him to the Islanders for Todd Bertuzzi, Bryan McCabe and the draft pick that turned into Jarkko Ruutu.
  • He was born the day Apollo 13 launched.
  • He was born the day after the Beatles broke up.

The Oilers stepped into the elevator shaft last night and awoke this morning looking like Ray Milland in The Lost Weekend. They’ll be Psycho Killer’s tonight. Book it.

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385 Responses to "Oilers at Canucks, G30/08-09"

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  1. Coach pb9617 says:

    Will the blender blend before the game tonight? 78 up to replace 51?

  2. Swabbubba says:

    Lets see the they are not wearing the 3rd jersey , not at home, so we can remove 2 strikes against this team. So we are starting out even. Listened to the Post Game show on CHED that was the most brutal thing I have heard in awhile. I am ashamed of some of the so called fans that called in last night. So they stunk the joint out the bounces went absolutely Chicago way. working out the kinks as they say. Hope to see the Oil play within themselves execute the small things and the big things will come

  3. oilerdago says:

    Hope you are right LT but at the end of the 2nd period, the guys on the radio thought we’d come out in the 3rd period and play for pride and oops – that did not happen.

    In the cold grey of a new day it seems that the coaches are in a tough spot. You’re damned for making line changes, then damned for staying too long with lines that don’t work.

    Can’t say I’d want to wake up and be in MacT’s shoes today. It’s probably more frustrating for him right now then for us fans.

  4. bookie says:

    More than any time in the past, this looks like the little engine that coudn’t

    I really cannot predict if this team will fall flat or play with some pride.

  5. Steve says:

    Canucks at Oilers: Lowetide is negative in the game day post. The Oilers win soundly. Lowetide concludes that there’s a causal relationship there, and resolves to continue being negative in game day threads.

    Hawks at Oilers: Lowetide is positive in the game day post. The Oilers lose 9-2.

    Oilers at Canucks: Lowetide is positive in the game day post.

    WHO ARE YOU WORKING FOR?!?

  6. HBomb says:

    Cruising around this morning, I had a read of this and could not believe how some people are assigning blame.

    http://tinyurl.com/5vt64k

    Horcoff and Gilbert are the problems now? That's basically completely contradictory to all the numbers I've seen AND what I've watched on the ice.

    Anyone paying attention knows that the Oilers top end guys aren't the problem. It's lines 2 & 3 and that third D pairing. As RiversQ said, this team has a top three and a bottom nine at forward right now….

  7. doritogrande says:

    Both goalies let in a couple they shouldn’t have yesterday, along with quite a few they really shouldn’t be blamed for. Who do you start?

    I go with the dude that’s well rested. And that’s Deslauriers.

  8. Coach pb9617 says:

    In the cold grey of a new day it seems that the coaches are in a tough spot. You’re damned for making line changes, then damned for staying too long with lines that don’t work.

    He’s partly to blame here.

    He didn’t put 10-27-83 together until the 20th game. It was blatantly obvious that they needed to be the 1.

    Sure, he’s not to blame for Cole and Gagner’s current inabilities, nor is he to blame for not having a 3rd line center, which leaves him with one line.

    He is to blame for leaving some bad players in some bad situations – Moreau, Gagner, Strudwick, Staios all come to mind.

  9. Coach pb9617 says:

    Horcoff and Gilbert are the problems now? That’s basically completely contradictory to all the numbers I’ve seen AND what I’ve watched on the ice.

    Was it LT that said you can immediately tell everything you need to know about a hockey fan based on his words about Horcoff?

  10. Oilman says:

    So let me get this straight – the Beatles broke up the day before Apollo 13 launched!

  11. HBomb says:

    Was it LT that said you can immediately tell everything you need to know about a hockey fan based on his words about Horcoff?

    The bad combination is that the people who don’t “get” Horcoff also tend to be the ones who like to scream the loudest.

    All statistical evidence is to the contrary of the arguments people use against the guy. Good hockey player having a pretty solid year with a bit of a low shooting percentage.

    Not even on my “list of problems” with this team, let alone near the top of it.

  12. Oilman says:

    So let me get this straight – the Beatles broke up the day before Apollo 13 launched!

  13. oilerdago says:

    Horcoff and Gilbert are the least of the problems right now. This team desperately needs, 2nd line scoring, the ability to kill penalties and character.

    Until those issues are resolved, you can nitpick all you want about this guy and that one and it does not matter.

    The current 2nd line is not cutting it and you have a kid pressing who needs a breather to help him find his confidence.

  14. doritogrande says:

    “The bad combination is that the people who don’t “get” Horcoff also tend to be the ones who like to scream the loudest.”

    I resent that. I converted last year thank you very much. I’m pretty sure the only one who screams louder than me is you…hammered to the point of passing out.

  15. rickibear says:

    Coach: Brodziak is not the problem on the M-B-C line.

    OilerDa:Cogliano-Brodziak-Nilsson for our second line please.

    I would expect a Strudwick-Pouliot-Storitini 4th line based on the nasty mood of both teams.

  16. Coach pb9617 says:

    Coach: Brodziak is not the problem on the M-B-C line.

    Last night he was and based on Mac’s past reactions, he’ll bear the brunt.

  17. HBomb says:

    I resent that. I converted last year thank you very much. I’m pretty sure the only one who screams louder than me is you…hammered to the point of passing out.

    That’s what she said?

    Anyways, some people have to stand up and defend the guy. Damn good hockey player who is inexplicably a whipping boy for many.

  18. Temujin says:

    There’s simply no way the Canucks lose this game. They’d never blow an important ceremonial game like this one.

    Yergh.

    Whatever drinks are being mixed in HBomb’s blender tonight, I’ll have six.

  19. goldenchild says:

    I will be at the game in a corp box with 20 canuck fans, if we see a performance like last night I will have to leave the firm, seriously.

    I dont even know what to think about last night doesnt seem real, I mean on Sat night we looked like a pretty solid group, Last night I thought they started well and then all of a sudden your left there with a blank look on your face like one of Bernie Madoff’s clients screaming What the Fuck?

    The one thing that is absolutely obvious is this team cant kill penalties for shit and there is going to be no great run of 5 or 6 in a row, 8 out of 10 unless that thing is solved and with the rosters current constitution it aint getting fixed. They need outside help, Marty Reasoner we speak your name.

  20. Scott says:

    Well negativity certainly didn’t work yesterday, so hopefully positivity will turn things around here. The weather here in Vancouver definitely feels more like Edmonton. Hopefully the boys remember they’re on the road.

  21. mc79hockey says:

    This is one of those games that makes me feel old, because the Linden year was the first draft that I paid attention to. My parents, who met in Vancouver while they were attending UBC, continued to buy the Vancouver Sun even after they no longer lived there. There was tons of draft coverage that year as the Dys were picking second and Linden got all the hype. Obviously tons of guys picked since then have come and gone but Linden made an impression on me, just because it was the first draft I followed and he got tons of publicity. There’s a generation of kids in BC who think that the guy walks on water – my sister wore 16 for 15 years because of him. He was the start of something of a renaissance of Canucks hockey (maybe that should be “naissance”) and I’ve always been a bit of a fan. Nice to see him get his due in Vancouver tonight – I might try to sneak home early to catch some of the coverage, although the 1.5 hour ceremony seems a little absurd.

    Also goldenchild – lawyer?

  22. Yeti says:

    Some of you are really missing the point regarding the PK. Is it the fault of the coaches or the players? Who cares? Should we not be congratulating them for getting into the spirit of giving so early on in the season? Their generosity should leave some of you ashamed.

  23. Bruce says:

    Yergh.

    Temujin: Yeah, I remember that. It was fun, and I’m no Flames fan. (I do like Iginla, though.)

    The most surprising thing was at the end of the night I gained the slightest modicum of respect for Vancouver fans, hanging in there through the end of yet another disappointing season and an awful beating by one western Canadian rival having already blown their playoff opportunity in an inexplicable home loss against the other, and still saluting their man at the end it all. After all the Bertuzzi love that nauseated me in the past, at least Linden is a solid citizen. I hope they put on a good show for him tonight … pre-game. Then I hope we go all Chicago on you. :)

  24. kanadienkyle says:

    MC, what is the lawyer count around here anyways? Add me to the mix (MN Bar).

  25. Lord Bob says:

    I, also, have been called to the bar.

    Especially after games like the one yesterday.

    (rimshot)

  26. Scott says:

    Was it LT that said you can immediately tell everything you need to know about a hockey fan based on his words about Horcoff?

    This comment seems to have been lifted from jesussaves.cc. Seriously. Horcoff is the Oilogosphere’s Hockey Jesus. Now, Shawn Horcoff is a very good hockey player who is underrated in many places, but in the Oilogosphere… well… not so much.

  27. Scott says:

    Are you hooked on cybersex but can’t seem to get free? Shawn Horcoff can set. you. free.

  28. mc79hockey says:

    As I understand things, there are at least six or seven of us floating around these parts, although some are still in law school: me, Schitzo, erasmus (or something like that), jon k, one other, you, possibly this goldenchild fellow…it’s astounding. There’s a guy named Pat H. who posts here sometimes who’s a lawyer as well.

  29. Traktor says:

    Shawn Horcoff is not the problem. Never was. He’s on pace for 62 points which is basically what should be expected out of him.

    The problem however is Shawn Horcoff is the Oilers 2nd best forward.

    What I don’t understand is MacT supporters have given Craig a free pass his entire career because “you can’t make chicken salad out of chicken crap” yet they think Horc is a first line talent. Can’t have it both ways.

    Can’t blame Horcoff though. He’s doing the best he can with the talents God gave him.

    Our top 6 looks like this:

    Hemsky 30 points in 29 games
    Horcoff 22 points in 29 games
    Cogliano 15 points in 29 games
    Penner 14 points in 25 games
    Nilsson 9 points in 25 games
    Cole 8 points in 29 games

    How in the world someone can say the 3rd/4th lines are the problem when our top 6 is as pathetic as it is beats me. Nobody wins games with a top 6 like this regardless how the bottom 6 is playing.

    Marc Pouliot has more points than Sam Gagner.

    Bigger issues than our 3rd pairing and no Marty Sakic, IMO.

  30. Doogie2K says:

    So let me get this straight – the Beatles broke up the day before Apollo 13 launched!

    Causality!

    Re: Horcoff. We all know that he had a rough first 10-15 as he got back into game shape/didn’t necessarily play with 83. Since then, he’s been great, but last night wasn’t exactly full of things you’d like to point to. He’s my goat on the 4-1 goal for his Flamingo routine.

    Also, I’m sick as hell and I have a Human Physiology final in less than two hours. This should be fun. Hopefully my seat is near the front so I don’t have to sprint far.

  31. Loxy says:

    There’s a generation of kids in BC who think that the guy walks on water

    And thus the Canucks are retiring the jersey of a career 2nd liner.

    My news station is doing Trevor Linden day. But if you ask the real hockey fans or the sports department, they don’t think he was good enough to have his jersey retired.

  32. Bruce says:

    Horcoff and Gilbert are the problems now?

    Haven’t read the HF thread and won’t. But …

    Gilbert was on the ice for 6 GA last night, including one (Keith’s) he essentially scored on his own net when he was so weak on the puck at the edge of his own crease that Ladd was able to check his stick and knock it in the net.

    Don’t get me wrong, I like Tom Gilbert just fine, but if people were frustrated with his effort last night, I can certainly understand it. I was one of them.

    As for Horcoff, among the 305 NHL players with 20+ Gp and at least 1:00 SH TOI/GP, his rating of -12.56/60 ranks 303rd. That’s even worse than Ethan Moreau (-12.46, 301st), and two goals a game worse than Steve Staios (-10.57, way up in 291st). Our veterans are having a Horrible time on the PK, and to somehow absolve Horcoff because we all know how good he is doesn’t seem right. Horc is my favourite Oiler, but surely it’s fair to say he hasn’t been part of the solution on the PK unit that continues to kill us.

  33. Coach pb9617 says:


    Hemsky 30 points in 29 games
    Horcoff 22 points in 29 games
    Penner 14 points in 25 games

    Penner has been a top 6 player for only 9 games. In those 9 games:

    Penner: 4 G, 5 A, 9 P

    Also, just for kicks in those same 9 games:
    Hemsky: 5 G, 4 A, 9 P
    Horcoff: 3 G, 8 A, 11 P

    The top line is producing at lease 1 PPG each. Of course, these are the counting numbers and they discount the underlying numbers which should all sorts of good things that you’ll ignore to try and make some sort of point.

    I can’t figure out if you are purposefully obtuse or if it’s natural.

  34. Bruce says:

    BTW, to expand on just how bad our PK is, we got 9 guys who have met the 20+/1:00+ threshold. 1 of them (Strudwick) ranks in the top 250 in the NHL in +-/60, the other 8 in the bottom 50.

    Given all the PK experience among our coaching staff, not to mention management, the complete collapse of a traditional team strength is the abiding mystery of the not-so-young season.

  35. knighttown says:

    Haven’t read the HF thread and won’t. But …

    Gilbert was on the ice for 6 GA last night, including one (Keith’s) he essentially scored on his own net when he was so weak on the puck at the edge of his own crease that Ladd was able to check his stick and knock it in the net.

    Don’t get me wrong, I like Tom Gilbert just fine, but if people were frustrated with his effort last night, I can certainly understand it. I was one of them.

    As for Horcoff, among the 305 NHL players with 20+ Gp and at least 1:00 SH TOI/GP, his rating of -12.56/60 ranks 303rd. That’s even worse than Ethan Moreau (-12.46, 301st), and two goals a game worse than Steve Staios (-10.57, way up in 291st). Our veterans are having a Horrible time on the PK, and to somehow absolve Horcoff because we all know how good he is doesn’t seem right. Horc is my favourite Oiler, but surely it’s fair to say he hasn’t been part of the solution on the PK unit that continues to kill us.

    Excellent post Bruce. I was trying to sum up a way to say, “I like Horcoff and Gilbert but man did they suck last night, in many cases against the 4th line” and well, you managed to do it with math. Very cool, in a geeky sort of way.

  36. Traktor says:

    “I can’t figure out if you are purposefully obtuse or if it’s natural.”

    The top 6 players I listed are our top 6 point producers. Seems you’re the dense one if you couldn’t figure that out.

    If you’re going to debate the fact that every top 9 forward except Hemsky and maybe Cogs is on pace for a worse season than last year isn’t a problem then you’re an idiot.

  37. Coach pb9617 says:

    As for Horcoff, among the 305 NHL players with 20+ Gp and at least 1:00 SH TOI/GP, his rating of -12.56/60 ranks 303rd. That’s even worse than Ethan Moreau (-12.46, 301st), and two goals a game worse than Steve Staios (-10.57, way up in 291st). Our veterans are having a Horrible time on the PK,

    Which screams system/coaching/Buchberger to me.

    What are the odds that three historically average to good PKers go south all at once on their own?

  38. knighttown says:

    @Coach

    No question, Horpensky is/are all serviceable top sixers but Traktor’s point still stands. When you’re 4,5,6 parts of your Top 6 are that unproductive it is pretty clear that we have a Top 3 and a bottom 9. Not too worried about Pouliot, Brodziak and Stortini at this point.

  39. doritogrande says:

    “Also, I’m sick as hell and I have a Human Physiology final in less than two hours. This should be fun. Hopefully my seat is near the front so I don’t have to sprint far.”

    Definitely something you don’t want to study for while sick. I’ve been through that ringer before, both using a human as a study example and a mink. We spent the first 3-hour lab period peeling off fat and connective tissue before we got to the muscle systems. From there on we hit up bones, blood vessels and organ systems. I stared at the same dead-ass mink 3 times a week for the next two months.

    I now shoot minks on site.

  40. Bruce says:

    DG: If I had a thing for dead minks, I’m not sure I would be admitting to it.

  41. doritogrande says:

    Bruce:

    You misunderstand. I want those little shits to die for what they did to me and the rest of my Chordate Zoology classmates. Yellow Perch too, for that matter.

  42. Traktor says:

    Bruce: Nice job on those PK stats. To say the lack of another Reasoner type is the root of out PK problems when Horcoff, Moreau, and Steady are struggling so badly seems like flawed logic to me.

  43. Coach pb9617 says:

    No question, Horpensky is/are all serviceable top sixers but Traktor’s point still stands. When you’re 4,5,6 parts of your Top 6 are that unproductive it is pretty clear that we have a Top 3 and a bottom 9. Not too worried about Pouliot, Brodziak and Stortini at this point.

    His point half stands.

  44. quain says:

    I’m going to make the next sixty comments completely useless by summarizing them into three lines:

    “Shawn Horcoff isn’t the reason this team sucks.”

    “He still sucks.”

    “You suck.”

    There, let’s skip it and focus on something more important: what kind of pizza should I order to go with the 5-1 win tonight?

  45. Coach pb9617 says:

    If you’re going to debate the fact that every top 9 forward except Hemsky and maybe Cogs is on pace for a worse season than last year isn’t a problem then you’re an idiot.

    If things hold up, Horcoff ends with 86 points, Hemsky ends with 84 and Penner with 77.

    The first line is good. Very good. If they put up 247 points while playing the toughest minutes and outscoring 2.67 – 1.57, 2.83 – 2.20, and 3.26 – 1.63 they’re a great line.

    The first line is not the problem. Now STFU and and go away.

  46. Temujin says:

    And thus the Canucks are retiring the jersey of a career 2nd liner

    Clearly Linden is getting this honour because of many things, not simply his point totals.

    All of you lawyer-types should go out and find real jobs.

  47. Coach pb9617 says:

    There, let’s skip it and focus on something more important: what kind of pizza should I order to go with the 5-1 win tonight?

    Bacon and Tomato

  48. goldenchild says:

    Not a Lawyer, I work in an investement firm- Portfolio Management. I forgot this place was Boston Legal.

  49. Traktor says:

    “If things hold up, Horcoff ends with 86 points”

    Ok fan boy.

  50. HBomb says:

    There, let’s skip it and focus on something more important: what kind of pizza should I order to go with the 5-1 win tonight?

    If you’re near St. Albert or Sherwood Park, go for Nitza’s pizza with hot pepperoni and donair sauce. Delicious.

    If not, Chicago Deep Dish is THE way to go.

  51. HBomb says:

    Traktor: I think you’re missing the point. Seems like the common call is for a “superstar” first line center to replace Horcoff and that would solve all the teams woes.

    From where I sit, some better 3rd liners and more production from the 2nd line are bigger concerns right now. Trading Shawn Horcoff for Jason Spezza doesn’t solve those issues.

    Bruce: The PK is ugly across the board, which leads me to believe it’s a system problem. And yes, Horcoff and Gilbert were just as bad as the other 18 guys last night – but over the course of the last month and a half, they’ve been doing their jobs quite well.

  52. Coach pb9617 says:

    “If things hold up, Horcoff ends with 86 points”

    Ok fan boy.

    To show how debates are won, I’ll finish this out for you.

    Last year, after the hiccup of the first 20 games, Horpensky was just over a combined 3 PPG line. This year, after being reunited, they are again just over a combined 3 PPG line. Horcoff has 11 points in 9 games since being reunited.

    If the line continues to put up 3 PPG, they will end with 247. Of those 247 points, 86 will be from Horcoff.

    Last year, before his injury, Horcoff put up 50 points in 53 games, a shde under a PPG, but again, he didn’t have the luxury of chemistry for the first quarter of the season.

    Combine 247 points with the highest qualcomp on the team and a goal per 60 outscore average and it’s a top-shelf line.

    I eagerly await your reply.

  53. Bill Needle says:

    “And thus the Canucks are retiring the jersey of a career 2nd liner”

    Does that mean the Oilers can start embroidering a No. 10 banner and affix grommets?

  54. mc79hockey says:

    I’m cool with the retirement of Linden’s number and I will be vicious in my personal attacks on anyone who opposes the retirement of 94 in due course.

  55. Coach pb9617 says:

    I will be vicious in my personal attacks on anyone who opposes the retirement of 94 in due course.

    Oh fun.

    I oppose all jersey retirements.

  56. HBomb says:

    I have no issues with the Canucks retiring Linden’s number whatsoever. The guy was “Mr. Canuck”. Should have played his whole career there (although the trade sending him to the Islanders did help that franchise).

    Sometimes guys numbers are retired because of dominance in a league-wide perspective. Other times, as in Linden’s case, it’s what they meant to a franchise.

    And if Smyth’s 94 was retired after he came back as a UFA in summer 2012 and won a Stanley as a member of the Oilers in his final year, you would not hear a peep out of me. I’d support it 100%.

  57. Loxy says:

    I guess the Canucks should be able to retire SOMEONE’s number. I mean, the next chance they’ll have is if Luongo stays past this contract.

  58. boopronger says:

    Chicken club from panago

  59. hunter1909 says:

    It’s boards like this where the truest Oiler fans go to.

    I have a question to you guys:

    After last night’s FIASCO, which ones among you actually believe that this team is going anywhere, other than the toilet?

    Seriously.

  60. Traktor says:

    You can’t just copy and paste 20 games here and 20 games there. It doesn’t work that way.

    I was one of the guys who was saying Cole should be on the 3rd line to start the year before the season started – because 27 10 83 where pretty damn good last year. I’m not going to deny that line hasn’t been good because it’s by far been the best line we’ve iced this season.

    Let’s not drink the koolaid though and pretend that Horcoff is a 86 point player because he’s not.

    I think the maximum potential of that line is something like,

    Hemsky 90 points
    Horcoff 75 points
    Penner 65 points

    Realistically we’re looking at,

    Hemsky 80 points
    Horcoff 65-70 points
    Penner 55-60 points

    Good enough to battle for 8th place but definitely not good enough to win a Stanley.

    I fear Hemsky is going to get the Sundin treatment and play with inferior players his entire career. I’m sure he’ll bolt once his contract is up though.

  61. quain says:

    I guess the Canucks should be able to retire SOMEONE’s number. I mean, the next chance they’ll have is if Luongo stays past this contract.

    Hey, hey, let’s not forget their 7th Canuck, or whatever it was, banner. Linden is joining a proud lineage.

  62. quain says:

    After last night’s FIASCO, which ones among you actually believe that this team is going anywhere, other than the toilet?

    Seriously.

    Well, when we shelled Columbus 7-2 I totally bought my 2008-2009 Stanley Cup Champions banner, but then we lost 9-2 and I burned my house down.

  63. Temujin says:

    Apart from Ryan Smyth, are there any Oiler players since 1993 that any of you would consider worthy of jersey retirement?

    The two major pre-game Canucks ceremonies this year have been the Luc Bourdon memorial and the 7th man head-scratcher. I don’t think you can find two further extremes when it comes to ceremony than that. One was beautifully done while the other was a complete travesty. I’m hoping the Linden one is closer to the former than the latter, but at an hour in duration I’m starting to wonder if it will be long on cheese and short on substance.

  64. mc79hockey says:

    I say no other post-93 jersey retirees at this point in time.

    Re: Bourdon – I thought it was just creepy that they played “Big League” in it, given that that’s basically his story.

  65. Coach pb9617 says:

    You can’t just copy and paste 20 games here and 20 games there. It doesn’t work that way.

    Who is cutting and pasting?

    Since Horpensky has been a line:

    Horcoff has 61 points in 62 games
    Hemsky has 44 points in 54 games
    Penner has 41 points in 62 games

    Playing on the Hormythsky two years prior Horcoff had:

    73 points in 79 games

    In their last 36 games together (which would be the games AFTER they found their chemistry last year):

    Horcoff: 37 pts in 36 games
    Hemsky: 34 pts in 29 games
    Penner: 29 pts in 36 games

    Again, these are the counting stats you’re so fond of, not the other underlying stats that you don’t need to see.

    They bear out that Horcoff is a PPG scorer with Penner and Hemsky.

  66. uni says:

    Also of note is that Linden trade led to the acquisition of the second Sedin twin. McCabe was the cornerstone in that trade for the draft pick from Chicago who then turned around and traded him to Toronto for a season of Karpotsev and a lower pick.

  67. uni says:

    Cripes, when you look at it, Linden’s trade led to them netting both a Sedin AND Luongo…christ…now if that isn’t a good turnaround for a franchise I don’t know what is.

  68. Temujin says:

    I thought it was just creepy that they played “Big League” in it, given that that’s basically his story.

    Nah, not creepy. Appropriate, imo.

    I guess when you consider the greatness of the Oilers in the 80′s it is tough to justify retiring anyone else’s number. Though Kelly Buchberger’s contribution to the club should not be underestimated. :-0

  69. kanadienkyle says:

    Thats pretty solid law school/lawyer representation.Maybe an all Oil-fan multi-national is in order?

    File grievances with the NHL as a sideline for all slights to the Oildrop, both real and perceived.

  70. mc79hockey says:

    Lowetide LLP. Sounds like we’ve got Alberta, Ontario and MN (Minnesota?) covered. Top notch.

  71. Doogie2K says:

    Fortunately, my exam was multiple-choice, not cadaveric; I already did that one last year.

    And now that I’m done that, I’m going to get a ride home, then curl up with Star Trek II and wait for death. Wake me up when the Linden ceremony ends.

  72. Coach pb9617 says:

    Lowetide LLP. Sounds like we’ve got Alberta, Ontario and MN (Minnesota?) covered. Top notch.

    Going to need huge amounts of liability insurance with the copious quantites of alcohol consumed by the partners.

  73. Jonathan says:

    Linden absolutely deserves to have his jersey retired as a Canuck – what he means to that team is difficult to overstate. That can say a lot of bad things about the team, but IMO heis impact on the franchise was such that he deserves it.

    On the personnel issue – the Oilers’ problem isn’t Horcoff, Penner and Hemsky. The problem is that this team was created with a tough-matchups top three (HH and Cole) and a sheltered-minutes top-three (Kid Line) with Penner able to fill in wherever. Penner’s doing well on that top unit, but Cole has imploded, the kids (outside of Cogliano) have all struggled, and the third line is missing a cog and bleeding chances against.

    The PK is a coaching issue – too many guys are having sub-par seasons. Given how successful MacT-coached teams have been on the PK historically, I’d be inclined to blame Buchberger.

    Right now, this team needs Erik Cole to be Erik Cole – and it needs that second line to get going. Development be damned; sit Gagner for a bit, and play Pouliot-Cogliano and Nilsson, or put Schremp back up there. Traktor’s bang on when he says that the top-six hasn’t done the job.

    RE:Horcoff. He isn’t an elite offensive producer. He’s an offensive producer who can play top-minutes, but he’s the kind of guy that needs someone scoring behind him with the sheltered minutes. I don’t see that as a problem – I think it’s harder to get a tough-minutes outscorer than a sheltered-minutes killer, but this team is way better when it has both.

  74. Lord Bob says:

    First off, I wouldn’t retire Ryan Smyth’s number. He was never captain, never won a Cup, never won an individual award, never made a first- or second All-Star team… I mean, if we were the Canucks I’d see the argument, but he doesn’t deserve to stand with the Kurris and Andersons just because he was the best of a sorry lot for a few years.

  75. J says:

    Penner is easily the most frustrating to cheer for hockey player ever. The guy has 2 speeds on and off. He is exceptionally soft for a monster and if passed to, is a complete black hole will shoot no matter how many people are in front of him. I don’t know if he has any trade value but if he does please get rid of him

  76. HBomb says:

    Lord Bob: a guy like Smyth and the second “tier” of players from the glory years (Huddy being a great example) is possibly good reasoning that this team needs to create a 2nd tier of recognition somehow. What that is, I have no idea.

    General comment: something just occurred to me when I saw a picture of Trevor Linden on the TSN webpage – were Linden and Dwayne Roloson separated at birth or something? Some scary similarities between the two, IMO…

  77. J says:

    ya dwayne was the feral twin

  78. Dennis says:

    I just got around to listening to MacT’s podcast and I really don’t see any hope in sight for our PK.

    There was a question from the scrum about if the Oilers are to change their approach to how they kill penalties and MacT just went all over the board and basically didn’t say anything.

    Look, the Oilers are flat out ostriching when it comes to their PK unit. Someone somewhere has told them to stop blocking shots and it’s absolutely killing that unit’s effectiveness. Plus, they no longer use six forwards and they aren’t aggressive in down-ice pressuring so it basically runs like this:

    If they are lucky enough to win a draw they clear the zone but they don’t bother to pressure the attacking team so those guys come in over our blue and set up and it’s holding-on-for-dear-life time.

    Is this that fucking Buchberger’s fault? I honestly don’t know how else to explain it. But I do know that if we keep rolling like we do then we’re not gonna improve on the PK unless the netminder is Beyond lights out every night.

    And, yes, it’s 89-26-12 who are killing us at evens when it comes to scoring plus the fact that 18′s on the downswing and we’re, wait for it, developing Brodziak.

  79. Dennis says:

    Two other things:

    - Ty’s slipping because you know that anyone who drops a Ponzi scheme reference is someone who works in the financial district.

    - I was glad that Linden retired just like I was glad that Yzerman quit and why I’ll be glad when that Chipmunk fuck in Dallas shuts it down. Oiler-killers the fucking lot of them.

  80. J says:

    Why do they always hire my least favorite ex-oilers(chuck you’re ok)

  81. quain says:

    General comment: something just occurred to me when I saw a picture of Trevor Linden on the TSN webpage – were Linden and Dwayne Roloson separated at birth or something? Some scary similarities between the two, IMO…

    God, I saw that picture this morning and wondered ‘why the hell is Roloson on the front page?’ I’m glad I’m not losing it.

  82. mc79hockey says:

    - Ty’s slipping because you know that anyone who drops a Ponzi scheme reference is someone who works in the financial district.

    I was torn between the financial reference and the reference to his firm. I could drop a Ponzi reference – it’s all over the news right now you know. Any well read person could refer to it.

    /defensive.

  83. PDO says:

    If 10 finishes his career here… he would be the first significant player in Oiler history to play here start to finish.

    Just saying.

  84. Steve says:

    1. I’m not sure if I count as a regular, but I am a law student. Sorry for devaluing all of your LL.B.s by admitting that.

    2. Would we be talking about retiring Smyth’s number if it was, say, 6, instead of 94? Honest question to which I don’t know the answer (but I think it’s “yes”).

  85. mc79hockey says:

    All you LL.B’s can refer to me as Dr. mc79hockey, J.D., thank you very much.

    Re: Smyth and 6. I say no but then I think that 6 looks stupid on a forward. Forwards shouldn’t wear anything lower than 7.

  86. Steve says:

    If 10 finishes his career here… he would be the first significant player in Oiler history to play here start to finish.

    How many players have even finished multi-year NHL careers as Oilers since 2000? Oates, Cross, Ulanov, Sanderson, Markkanen…

  87. rickibear says:

    "And this?

    http://www.behindthenet.ca/2008/basic_5_on_5.php?sort=6&mingp=20&mintoi=&team=EDM&pos=F"

    Look at the Qual of teammates. 35 worst in the league.
    You do realize he has not played with offensive talent this year till Moreau and Cole. If you can call them that.

    You do realize Brodziak was the 12th best Center in the league for EV Goals and 1assists/60 with 1.87/60 last year. 0.97G/60 + 0.90 1Assist/60. Mr. Horcoff was Eleventh 1.88/60.

    We have two choices He really sucks this year or His linemates do.

    Hmmm. He is .66G/60. 5th on the team. 0 1assist/60. I will bet that he is not scoring as much based on the Quality of feeds he has been getting from the likes of:
    Storitini 0.01 Assist/60
    Boulerice 0.01 Assist/60
    MacIntyre 0.01 Assist/60
    Cole 0.17 1Assist/60
    Moreau 0.50 1Assist/60

    I am also sure that his Assist rate is greatly affected by who he is feeding.
    Storitini 0.0G/60
    Boulerice 0.0G/60
    MacIntyre 0.0G/60
    Cole 0.17G/60
    Moreau has a decent rate. But it is not like you can play off cole in his current performance.

    I will take his GA/60 this year that is an imporovement.

    Corsi numbers: Better than or on par with most of the players he has played with.

    Play him with Cogliano and Nilson. Use the talents he has.

  88. HBomb says:

    Ok, we’ve got a whole slug of lawyers here. Fantastic.

    Any other engineers in the crowd? Anyone?

  89. Schitzo says:

    All you LL.B’s can refer to me as Dr. mc79hockey, J.D., thank you very much.

    American degree, or the wank-job that is U of T?

  90. oilerdago says:

    How about an ad guy? I think we’re just below lawyers, but at least above used car salesmen?

    And Jonathan is bang on with the Oilers issues but I’d rather try Cole on the 2nd line to jump start him and HS Gagner for a game or two to take the pressure off him.

    That can’t be worse than anything else that’s been tried.

  91. Scott says:

    HBomb:

    Do we have to admit it?

    Steve:

    I think Cross finished as a Red Wing.

  92. mc79hockey says:

    American degree, or the wank-job that is U of T?

    Fucking UofA students. Think that you spell “FINEST LAW SCHOOL IN THE LAND” “W A N K – J O B”.

  93. Schitzo says:

    Damn, I just noticed the WJHC wraps up on a monday – why on earth would they not hold the medal games on the weekend?

  94. Traktor says:

    I agree about Brodziak. He started the year glued to Smack and then MacT questions why Brodziak isn’t motivated playing with a goon in a contract year? MacT even said last year that Brodziak makes plays that grinders don’t make (after Brodziak went around a defender using a toe drag and set up Glenx with a backhand pass for a tap-in) yet he doesn’t give the guy any opportunity besides grinder opportunities.

    Would it really hurt to see what he could do with Nilsson and Cogs? God forbid Gagner doesn’t get fed on a silver platter.

  95. Loxy says:

    Re: Linden jersey retirement

    As someone in Vancouver, I can see what he means to this team and especially the city. I accept what they are doing tonight but all the fuss surrounding it is getting annoying.

    For instance, the webpoll at http://www.news1130.com (which may or may not be the station I’m a reporter for):

    How do you feel about Trevor Linden?
    Great Canuck
    Greatest Canuck
    (Those are the only options)

    People call our listener line over and over talking about why he should be in the hall of fame.

    Maybe that’s why I’m getting bitter on the subject.

  96. Mustafa Hirji says:

    Not an engineer, but for what it is worth, I have an engineering degree.

  97. Coach pb9617 says:

    Ricki:

    Those links were being used to support Horcoff, not deride Brodziak.

  98. HBomb says:

    Scott: admitting it is the first step to recovery. The best thing I ever did was making peace with the fact I’ve sold my soul to big oil and am probably headed to hell because of it.

  99. Lord Bob says:

    HBomb:

    Yeah, some sort of second tier would be great. Bring in Lowe, Huddy, Weight, and Smyth straight off. Maybe just an “Oilers Order of Excellence” that ranks below having your number retired or something.

    We would, of course, need some sort of room to keep those honours in. But I’m sure the new arena will have one!

  100. Jonathan says:

    HBomb: I did my first year (which admittedly is largely pre-engineering stuff) before the idea of a massive student loan scared me into the oilpatch.

    Right now I’m an instrument mechanic, but I’m doing quality control for a fabrication shop.

    Still sort of hope to go back and get a degree in something, but at this rate it’ll probably be some sort of business schooling – I’m settling into a “company lifer” role.

  101. Jonathan says:

    Lord Bob: Agreed.

    HBomb: Which outfit (or do you mind?)

  102. Oilman says:

    Someone somewhere has told them to stop blocking shots and it’s absolutely killing that unit’s effectiveness. Plus, they no longer use six forwards and they aren’t aggressive

    I said this a while back – I think MacT is a little gunshy about the shot blocking since he’s had guys go down in the last few seasons from shot blocking injuries – perhaps he figured they could find their way into the playoffs with a healthy non-blocking crew with “active sticks”, but it ain’t working. Time to break out the rubber pucks and practice the shot blocking like they used to.

  103. DeBakey says:

    6 looks stupid on a forward. Forwards shouldn’t wear anything lower than 7.

    Ron Ellis wore 6.
    I don’t recall it looking particularly stupid

  104. Oilman says:

    jonathon – I know the question wasn’t asked of me but I worked for Suncor for several years, selling my soul little by little, until I realized that the pigeonholing, career stagnation and long stretches apart from family was no longer worth the coin – so I moved into – drumroll – municiple engineering!

  105. Jonathan says:

    Oilman: We do a fair bit of work for Suncor – I actually met a few of their engineers about two years ago. Have you ever been to a little fab shop in Fort St. John?

  106. doritogrande says:

    Exams finally done, I’m left with a beer and my NHL09. Gonna kick Phoenix’s tanned ass.

    No Oilers for me tonight as I’ve got ultimate tonight and we’re doing a guy’s night at the local sushi bar beforehand.

    I look forward to H-bomb yelling some more in the comments section.

    @ showerhead:

    If you get here later, how’d you find the exam? I think I did okay on the multiple choice, and took the short answer behind the barn and raped it. Repeatedly.

  107. HBomb says:

    For all this talk about Brodziak, have we ever had an open debate on Brodziak vs. Pouliot?

    I think it’s an interesting one. There’s some pretty negative sentiments towards MAP in E-town, and I think a lot of that is a product on the fact that any of Zach Parise, Ryan Getzlaf, and Mike Richards COULD have been had instead of him……but looking beyond this “misfire” at the drafting table by Prendergast and Co…..I think he’s a better player but will always carry the burden of where he was drafted in 2003.

    Not that I have a problem with Brodziak either. Good player too, and 78/51 will probably be a very good bottom six center duo in 2-3 seasons. Right now though, we could use John Madden.

  108. Oilman says:

    Jonathon – never had the pleasure. Worked in the mining side.

  109. Jonathan says:

    Oilman: If you’d been here, you wouldn’t call it a pleasure :) It was about -35 the week those three fellows were up.

  110. HBomb says:

    DG: No yelling for me tonight. I’m drinking a bottle of wine and relaxing. After last night, I don’t think I have much left in the way of anger.

    Jonathan: I’ll say this much – I work in a refinery.

  111. relic says:

    HBOMB, it’s not too late to repent. there’s plenty of work in the renewable energy sector.

  112. HBomb says:

    HBOMB, it’s not too late to repent. there’s plenty of work in the renewable energy sector

    All joking aside, I like my job too much. I find my work interesting.

  113. Oilman says:

    jonathon, -35 might have been a tropical vacation coming from fort mac.

  114. doritogrande says:

    “DG: No yelling for me tonight. I’m drinking a bottle of wine and relaxing. After last night, I don’t think I have much left in the way of anger.”

    See, I thought the same way when I left yesterday, but then my summer team got lit-up by a bunch of guys that aren’t even close to their level. Every second word coming out of my mouth was shit. And every other word was a 50-50 split of “holy” and “Oh”.

    Wasn’t the best evening.

  115. Jonathan says:

    Oilman: Nice. I’ll say this for Fort St. John – it’s a heck of a lot nicer than Fort Nelson or Fort Mac. And, just in case Tyler’s reading this, it’s nicer than Dawson too ;)

  116. pboy says:

    I would take Brodziak over Pouliot. Neither guy has ever been given decent linemates but Brodziak has done more with what little he’s been given.

    Now if Bucky is truly the problem with the PK, that still has to go back to MacT, doesn’t it??? He’s the final authority out there and if Bucky has switched how we kill penalties, is it not MacT’s job to evaluate what the fuck is happening and make what changes he feels needs to be made so we can right this ship? For the last decade or so, the Oilers have been in the first division in PK, now we are the worst team in the league? For as inconsistent as this team has been so far this season, if we had anywhere near our normal counting numbers at the PK, we would be at the top of the NW right now.

  117. mjsh says:

    How about an ad guy? I think we’re just below lawyers, but at least above used car salesmen?

    How about a used car salesman who was dumb enough to start in engineering. LOL. and we are above who?

    Oilman, were you in McMurray? I was there from 1985 to 2000.

    Every team has a blow out loss during the year. Things happen. Having said that, I am somewhat worried now about this team. The PK thing is very strange, it would appear that Mac T. was right that we needed to keep Reasoner. I do like Brodziak but he looks far too often that he needs a kick in the pants too. Souray looked last night like he did not care and he was not the only one. We have to think there is something wrong in the room with this team. All day. I have looked to see if a trade was made. That apparently is the next thing to happen before the coaching change.

  118. Oilman says:

    yep – lived there from 1997 – 2005.

    Jonathon – saying that “at least a place is nicer than Fort Mac” is not a ringing endorsement:o)

  119. Jonathan says:

    Oilman: Oh but I didn’t – I said it was a heck of a lot nicer than Fort Mac :)

    Well, I’m not fooling anybody. I’d probably hate it too, except that I was born and raised here.

  120. mc79hockey says:

    Fuck that noise – FSJ is a shithole. How old are you Jonathan? Did you play hockey in FSJ growing up?

  121. gary b says:

    i think the Oil needs to call up one of THESE guys:

    http://flickr.com/photos/nhl_mutants/

  122. Temujin says:

    My office has received a large meat and cheese tray, three boxes of chocolates, and bottle of Pinot Noir from various clients. Typically I hate Christmas, but since taking over the company I used to be an employee of, it’s a lot more enjoyable! Merry Christmas indeed. Think I’ll be drinking me some wine during the game.

    If anyone else cares to send booze or food, I can give you the mailing address.

  123. Temujin says:

    And for the record, Smithers BC is exceptionally beautiful this time of year.

  124. Kris says:

    I think the brass must know -or believe- that the problem with the PK and lines 2-4 is structural.

    I mean everybody’s yearning for Reasoner and Glencross, but really if management wanted another 3rd or 4th liner who could kill penalties, they would’ve got one by now; they’re not that expensive. I think they must believe an added veteran won’t change the equation in the bottom 6.

    Of course, it’s possible that brass want Brodz and Poo to develop by trial and error and believe that bringing in outside help will hurt the young bottom-sixers’ development. But I doubt this because a veteran hand could easily have been given Reddox’s minutes.

    Unfortunately, then, it would seem brass believes a quick fix won’t do.

    And since a coaching change isn’t happening, brass will likely blame the ‘imbalanced mix’ we have at forward. Thus, I bet they’re trying to bring in a high value, two-way center to either settle down the second line or anchor a really fantastic third line with Cole. But a player like that -even if available- is going to cost a lot.

  125. CrazyCoach says:

    If Joe McGrath were here, he’d be running into that dressing room right now and calling the whole team out.

    “What about Once an Oiler Forever an Oilers coach?”

    “What about MacT’s contribution to the dynasty?”

    “What about the Boys on the Bus?”

    “Oh piss on that Oilers Forever bullshit, piss on MacT, piss on the Boys on the bus! They came here tonight to see the Edmonton Oilers, the experts 09 pick to win the NW Division! Not this, bunch of puuu…..ssies!”

    Maybe it’s time for Katz to show Tambo the standings and say, “YOu see this. It used to mean a banner every year!”

  126. Jonathan says:

    Tyler: I’m 23. I lived out of town (Mile 66 on the Alaska Highway, roughly 30-40 minutes out) so I missed out on playing any team sports as a kid.

    I actually didn’t even start playing hockey until I was thirteen, and it was just rec/drop-in type stuff. Still play, but I don’t have many fun stories as a result.

    I take it you played in Dawson’s Crack?

  127. goldenchild says:

    TSX kept teasing us but never opened today because of “tech” problems which is unfuckinbelieveable. So I had some time to kill today, luckily 100+ posts in the pregame and I read them all. I am impressed you would think people posting on blogs in the middle day would be unemployed and living in their moms basement with no disposable cash but this is one goddamn professional group. Advertisers should be knocking down Lowetides door trying to sell us their SAAB’s and espresso machines.

  128. CrazyCoach says:

    Smithers is awesome in winter. Great ski hill, and every time we played them I was always amazed that their whole team could really skate. I wasn’t surprised to see Hamhuis have the wheels he has. The Watson boys were an exception to the skating rule in SMithers.

  129. CrazyCoach says:

    By the way, working on a Masters in Sports Management here.

  130. Baroque says:

    Biologist/chemist/general laboratory analyst. :)

    But I have a sister working on her PhD in mechanical engineering – after working for a printing press manufacturer and a few other companies for a while, she decided she wanted to do research and teach. So, in a few years (hopefully) she will be a professor.

    Almost my whole family is math and science nerds.

  131. Coach pb9617 says:

    Emery and Labarbera next year for half of the current tender payroll?

  132. Jonathan says:

    Coachpb: It’ll be Deslauriers and somebody, which isn’t good news, because while I think Deslauriers will be fine as backup, I don’t see a starter beyond Backstrom.

  133. docweb says:

    HBomb, Lord Bob:
    Not positive on this but I think the Maple Leafs have a “sweater hanging” which basically honours the player and RARELY actually retire a number. As much as most things the Buds do are ridiculous I like that idea and would fit well with the type of players you are talking about.

  134. Coach pb9617 says:

    Coachpb: It’ll be Deslauriers and somebody, which isn’t good news, because while I think Deslauriers will be fine as backup, I don’t see a starter beyond Backstrom.

    Fernandez and Deslauriers.

  135. Bendelson says:

    Moreau and Staios are KILLING the Oilers.

    Maybe MacT shares the blame for continuing to go back to these ‘do gooders’ in the wrong situations, but seriously…

    Captain Moreau is constantly out of position, taking stupid penalty after stupid penalty, and absolutely murdering the PK.

    Asst. Captain Staios is a frickin’ gong show. Trying hard, always out of position, blindly ‘ringing the puck around the boards’ and doing his part to kill the PK. Last night was a very bad night for old Stevie Staios… again.

    It makes for very tough decisions for the coach and GM when your so called ‘leaders’ and ‘veterans’ keep shitting the bed.

    Yes Cole, Gagner, Garon are major dissappointments, but our ‘heart and soul’ is what is killing this team.

    Souray/Horcoff are the captains of this bus.

    Ethan and Stevie maybe ‘dressing room’ leaders, but on the ice, the coach needs to stay away from these two as legitimate options – they just aren’t good enough for important minutes.

  136. Jonathan says:

    Fernandez and Deslauriers.

    Fernandez and Roloson ;)

  137. HBomb says:

    Fuck that noise – FSJ is a shithole. How old are you Jonathan? Did you play hockey in FSJ growing up?

    How did that saying go? Fort St. John is the asshole of the earth and Dawson Creek is 100 miles UP the asshole of the earth? Or is it the other way around?

    docweb: The only two retired numbers in Leaf land are Ace Bailey and Tim Horton. The rest of the guys they’ve honored with photo banners as part of their “Level of Excellence” or something like that.

    Bendelson: MacT’s two favorites are Moreau and Staios. I’m convinced you will never see those two benched. Constant worship of 4th liners and 3rd pairing d-men is part of the clusterfuck of problems with the organization. Schremp goes but Reddox remains? Same thing….

  138. Temujin says:

    Not positive on this but I think the Maple Leafs have a “sweater hanging” which basically honours the player and RARELY actually retire a number.

    I like this idea too.

  139. Temujin says:

    Hbomb: It’s Bailey and Barilko, not Horton :-)

    I wouldn’t know that except for the catchy song by the Tragically Hip.

  140. Schitzo says:

    So is the actual game starting at 8 MST, or is that the start of the ceremony?

  141. HBomb says:

    Temujin: well I stand corrected, I could have sworn it was Horton and Bailey. Weird.

  142. Art Vandelay says:

    What’s the big deal about Trevor Linden?

    Sincerely,
    Murray Craven

    /lowetide and needle know what I’m talkin’ ’bout.

  143. Temujin says:

    I guess because Horton didn’t die as a Leaf (he was with the Sabres), they don’t give a shit about him :-0

    The ceremony starts at 6 pacific, which is 5 mountain. Game at 6:30 mountain.

    The ceremony is supposed to be an hour long.

  144. rickibear says:

    “Those links were being used to support Horcoff, not deride Brodziak”

    Sorry Coach. I am a big Brodziak fan. He could be a great Center on the cheap for the next 5 years. Help in the cap woes to come. I think he can become the next Horcoff.

    Lw-Horcoff_rw
    Penner-Gagner-hemsky
    Cogliano-Brodziak-Nilsson.

    I drool for Omark to be like the other 21Yr old or younger Top 10 SEL scorers from the past 33Yrs.

    Kent Nilsson 75-76 1.24 pts/gm NHL career.
    Tomas Gradin 75-76 .88
    Benjt Lundholm 75-76 .52
    Bo Berglund 76-77 .52
    Mats Naslund 79-80 .98
    Hakan Loob 81-82 .96
    Patrik Sundstrom 81-82 .87
    Tomas Sandstrom 82-83 .87
    Marcus Naslund 92-93 .80
    Peter Forsberg 92-93 1.25
    H. Sedin 99-00 .68
    D. Sedin 99-00 .69
    Kristian Huselius 00-01 .66
    Henrik Zetterberg 00-01 .94
    Linus Omark 08-09 ????
    Johan Harju 08-09 ????

    Uh do think Tampa would trade Harju for stuff.

  145. mc79hockey says:

    Lowetide is one of the OSHL boys?!?

    (I really know nothing about the OSHL other than it’s got a funny blog.)

  146. Schitzo says:

    I think you counted backwards, Temujin – 6 PST is 7 MST.

    Oilers website has the game starting at 8:30

  147. HBomb says:

    rickibear:

    Pisani-Horcoff-Cole?

    I liked that line, all three games it got together.

    But I’m liking Horpensky a ton right now….why break that up?

  148. Coach pb9617 says:

    I am a big Brodziak fan.

    Really? Hm, couldn’t tell.

    :)

  149. docweb says:

    HBomb: Perhaps Tyler or Pat could enlighten us with exactly what they call it and any sort of criteria they use.

  150. Temujin says:

    I think you counted backwards, Temujin – 6 PST is 7 MST.

    Oilers website has the game starting at 8:30

    Bwa ha ha ha. It’s not the Wisers, honest.

    Thanks for the correction.

  151. Schitzo says:

    Bwa ha ha ha. It’s not the Wisers, honest.

    Thanks for the correction.

    See, this is why I don’t trust the guys who work in advertising. Nowhere are you informed that joining the Wiserhood will make you lose the ability to tell time!

  152. Temujin says:

    The Wiserhood doesn’t tell you a lot of things. And if you keep asking questions I won’t be allowed to post here anymore.

  153. rickibear says:

    “But I’m liking Horpensky a ton right now….why break that up?”

    I am thinking more January on. Plus do you believe Cole will be here past the trade deadline?

    As been said on this board many times. Penner reacts off of the center who reacts off Hemsky. Gagner can slot in that role. He has the smarts. It worked well last year before the EV anchor from LA played C.

    Horcoff can generate on his own. During the life of Horcoffs contract, prospects(Omark, Eberle, ETC) will be on either side of him.

  154. Oilmaniac says:

    HBomb said…
    Was it LT that said you can immediately tell everything you need to know about a hockey fan based on his words about Horcoff?

    The bad combination is that the people who don’t “get” Horcoff also tend to be the ones who like to scream the loudest.

    Im getting to the party late, but im glad to see some people have been hammering on Hbomb for this garbage.. I’ve laid down a fair amount of criticism of horcoff, particularly over the first 10-15 games when the offense dried up… ‘getting’ horcoff is like ‘getting’ toby peterson… yes, hes good at some stuff but you have to counter balance that with what he doesnt bring…

    I’ve been quiet about mr. horcoff for a while because i think he has shook off the rust acquired w the injury.. and I’ve actually seen him throw a hit now (I think i posted after about 12 games, which to that point he had thrown 1 recorded hit… thats shit btw!) yes, yes, hitting isnt his game but leading is… hardwork, persistence.. finishing checks.. for 5.5 these are the intangibles he better be doing because his scoring, well, isnt what hes being paid for.. well it is!, but you know what i mean…

    so what dont I ‘get’ about horcoff,.. *grumble grumble*

    Aside: perhaps my problem is more with the contract than w horcoff, because i like him as an oiler, but i dont see him producing the results lowe thought he could magically manifest… same story w penner?.. w gilbert?.. Staios, Moreau? bah im off topic…

  155. Lowetide says:

    Hey look kids, there’s Big Ben and that one-legged girl Paul McCartney was dating.

  156. quain says:

    I think, of all the dead horses that get beaten here daily, that ‘Shawn Horcoff is a bum’ is my favourite.

  157. Temujin says:

    How come no one here seems to be talking about this?

    Or, maybe I don’t wanna open that can of worms…

  158. Oilmaniac says:

    Put me down for no F’n way does smyth get his number retired.. Lord Bob spelt it out wonderfully..
    (except he was an all-star once.. kind of..)

    plus, the way he left.. regardless of ‘fault’.. left a bad taste imo..

  159. Lowetide says:

    Temujin: I’m raising 2 teenagers. If the town billionaire wants a new rink I’ll help him right after my children draw their first check.

    Until then, I’m a Dad.

  160. Dennis says:

    Tem: I can’t believe the city would put up with Katz only putting in 100 mill of his own cash on a building that looks to cost between 400 and 500 million.

    It’s not really something I could support if I was a citizen of Edmonton but it’s their money.

    As for the guy who mentioned 34-10-26, it would be easy to go back and see how they did chances-wise but maybe that would be an option with them playing the toughs and then 27-89-83 taking on the secondary toughs or perhaps the soft.

    You’d probably let them take on the second toughest and then it’s 12-13-plus vs the soft; plus being 78 or 88 or even 51.

    BTW, we haven’t heard a peep about it lately but 34 will have been injured four weeks from tomorrow so he should be say only two weeks away from returning.

  161. quain says:

    Have they stopped selling calzones in this world? I’ve gone through four pizza joints without finding one that’ll make me a calzone. This is a bloody atrocity.

  162. mc79hockey says:

    Tem: I can’t believe the city would put up with Katz only putting in 100 mill of his own cash on a building that looks to cost between 400 and 500 million.

    It’s not really something I could support if I was a citizen of Edmonton but it’s their money.

    The feds are spending money on everything else these days, they might as well build an arena in Edmonton. Maybe move some of the auto workers out there.

  163. Bruce says:

    Excellent post Bruce. I was trying to sum up a way to say, “I like Horcoff and Gilbert but man did they suck last night, in many cases against the 4th line” and well, you managed to do it with math. Very cool, in a geeky sort of way.

    Uhh, thanks, Knighttown, geeky is where it’s at. As for math, saying things like “Gilbert was on the ice for 6 GA last night” and “by a significant metric Horcoff is in the lowest one percentile of penalty killers in the league” is math by blunt instrument. Yergh.

    @Rickibear: Good stuff re: Brodziak. I like your technique of measuring goals and first assists. Not “better than” points necessarily, but it shines a different light on things. The real finishers should do well in both.

  164. Bruce says:

    The feds are spending money on everything else these days, they might as well build an arena in Edmonton. Maybe move some of the auto workers out there.

    Maple Leaf Gardens was built in 6 months during the last depression.

  165. docweb says:

    Given the number of LLB’s who comment on this site…are their comments any reflection on the adversarial position of their line of work? Don’t get me wrong…if I was in a pinch I’d want my lawyer to fight tooth and nail. On this site…not so much.

  166. mc79hockey says:

    Maple Leaf Gardens was built in 6 months during the last depression.

    And with private money! Surely Alberta’s unemployed will work for shares in Rexall Sports.

  167. Erin says:

    Do you guys get this whole ceremony?

    Introducing every single Canuck ever.

  168. Loxy says:

    Whoops, that should’ve been Loxy posting.

    Do you guys get this whole ceremony?

    Introducing every single Canuck ever.

  169. Lowetide says:

    Canucks have the most guys in history who scored 30 goals one season and 12 the next. It’s incredible.

  170. PDO says:

    With everyone stating their professions… any doctors/nurses in the house?

    My frostbite blistered on a few fingers… I was put on antibiotics.

    Problem being, I believe this means I can’t drink? Until they’re all done? I can accept not being able to play hockey (open wounds + hockey glove = more infection), but I can’t wrap my around why I can’t drink this weekend….

    Being done school and told you can’t drink all break is a real kick in the junk… :(

  171. mc79hockey says:

    I’m surprised that the Canucks didn’t just tie this into the opening ceremonies for the Olympics.

    “Playing in Vancouver was the greatest honour of my career. I now declare the 20th Winter Games open!”

    Then he could breathe fire and light the torch or something.

  172. Loxy says:

    Any other broadcasters out there?

    ….Linden is going to cry in… 5…4…3…2…

  173. bookie says:

    Seeing as someone raised the new arena, I will throw in my $0.25. Event centers like Commonwealth and the Colosseum are a boon to the community and should be financed with public money. Yes its a subsidy to the Oilers and the Eskimoes and a bunch of other people. So what, it makes our city suck less than it would without.

    I study places for a living (Cities, towns, etc.) and places that do not invest in landmarks, public space (parks, event centres, etc), libraries, etc slowly wither up and die. There are some things in life that are simply more efficient when everyone contributes.

    Even if you never go to a game or an event, you benefit by being in a city with an NHL team, with events happening, and with a ‘sense of place’.

    To be quite honest, I would much rather that we scrap the $500,000,000 intersection by South Edmonton Common that services a bunch of suberb dwellers and build something for the City (and I mean the core of the city, not the surrounding wasteland of SUV’s and beer bellies).

    If you want to live in a craphole city like Saskatoon, move there, but I would like to live in an exciting and vibrant city with an awesome downtown and with fantastic ‘things’ – this doesn’t happen without public contributions.

  174. mc79hockey says:

    I would like to live in an exciting and vibrant city with an awesome downtown and with fantastic ‘things’ – this doesn’t happen without public contributions.

    I’m sorry, but they obviously do. There are shiny monuments to our way of life in Vancouver, Toronto, Ottawa and Montreal, all built with minimal public funds. Certainly with nothing near the 80% public funding that the Oilers want.

    I don’t have a problem with most of your post – if you guys want to spend your money on a rink, spend it on a rink. Go wild. At least have an honest fucking debate about it though.

  175. Loxy says:

    Oh man, someone just had to bring up the rink.

  176. quain says:

    Well, if public investment is important, I don’t see how you can argue that $400M is better spent on replacing a rink that currently works just fine, producing a net gain of what? 2,000 seats? Rather than, you know, libraries and parks… stuff that is accessible to the public for free.

  177. quain says:

    Oh man, someone just had to bring up the rink.

    Yeah, but it’s more fun than arguing about whether they should fire MacT or debating whether Horcoff is just overpaid or if he’s a fourth liner who is stealing from the team.

  178. bookie says:

    Hey, I have a challange for all of you “Trade analysts” out there. I started thinking about this from Lowetide’s Linden post. What player, by way of trade, turned into the best collection of current NHLer’s.

    So for example, lets say Marty Sacknuts was traded in 1992 for a 2nd round draft pick and Billy pugface. The draft pick was used to pick some guy who was then traded for another 2nd round pick and Stevo Speedster (so now we are at Billy Pugface, Stevo Speedster, and two second round picks). Those picks are use to get two more players who are then traded….ect.

    I bet that some guy like Brian Glynn has somehow turned into four superstars and eight league stars or something like that.

    Anyway, I am too stupid to do this and don’t pay enough attention, but if someone were to do it, it would be AWESOME.

  179. Traktor says:

    Only a matter of time before PJO shows up and copy & pastes all his old arguments against the EIG and portrays Katz to be the most evil bastard on earth.

    It's quite sad, really.

  180. Oilmaniac says:

    Its frustrating being ignored, except for fuckin quain provide meaningless quibs..

    yes yes.. the horcoff thing has been done to death but it was brought up again, with or without your input..

    I’ll take it as an indicator that I need to play w numbers to have a notable opinion… quain stfu

  181. bookie says:

    I agree with the honest debate about it, but my experience with Edmontonians is that they bitch and complain about every cent of tax dollars that goes to something beyond basic infrastructure. So, to get anything done, its just easier to push it through and feel the wrath later.

    I should note that I am a lifelong Edmontonian, so its not as though I don’t love this city, but I do think its filled with cheapskates.

    I also think that sometimes taxpayers are not aware of the $$ of real business and of big developments, etc. I have been involved in a lot of big developments and money like this is spent quite frequently, but just in smaller chunks. So, there is no public uproar about the cost to build a section of the Henday, or to repave a bunch of roads, or to put new water mains in even though these things may cost more than the money for a new building.

    At the same time, I agree that without public oversight, politicians and people like me would be happy to spend other peoples money building crazy ass things cause we think its a good idea.

  182. docweb says:

    PDO: Just because you are on antibiotics does not mean you cannot drink. But…the “party line” is that 2 drinks per day and 14 drinks per week (for a male) is medically acceptable. NOT 14 drinks in one day however. For females 1 drink per day and 7 per week.
    Somehow I don’t think that is followed by the folks here much. Having suffered through the last game I empathize though. “cracks a Pil”

  183. mc79hockey says:

    You can trace Steve Smith through Dave Manson, Mats Lindgren, Boris Mironov, Jason Bonsignore, Kirk Maltby, Dan McGillis, Dan Cleary, Ethan Moreau, Tommy Salo, Janne Niinimaa, Tom Gilbert, Raffi Torres, Roman Hamrlik, Eric Brewer, Chris Pronger, the Pronger Five Assets, Joni Pitkanen and Erik Cole. It’s one of my favourite things about hte Oilers. When Brule was dressing, you could trace 20% of the roster on a given night right back to him. That’s pretty cool.

    Hattip: OilFans

  184. Lowetide says:

    Broadcaster. Started in 1980 and have enjoyed it tremendously. Best moments include meeting Messier and John Candy (who was hilarious, told my wife and I about the scene in Planes, Trains and Automobiles where he plays the piano while driving–the Ray Charles “Mess Around” scene).

    Good living, crazy people but in a good way. :-)

  185. jon k says:

    PDO: I’m not a nurse or doctor by any standard, but I think I can answer your question by virtue of having taken a lot of antibiotics recently.

    You can have alcohol without any nasty side effects. My understanding is that the alcohol merely negates the efficacy of the antibiotics.

  186. quain says:

    Its frustrating being ignored, except for fuckin quain provide meaningless quibs..

    In all fairness, quibs isn’t a word and clearly they have meaning if they’re portraying my dislike for the Horcoff conversation.

  187. PDO says:

    PDO: Just because you are on antibiotics does not mean you cannot drink. But…the “party line” is that 2 drinks per day and 14 drinks per week (for a male) is medically acceptable. NOT 14 drinks in one day however. For females 1 drink per day and 7 per week.
    Somehow I don’t think that is followed by the folks here much. Having suffered through the last game I empathize though. “cracks a Pil”

    I’m just fine with only a beer or two until the weekend.. heck, I can probably hold out until XMas… but with all that family here on Christmas? Guess I’ll hope it’s mostly cleared up by then, lol.

    Thanks!

  188. Lowetide says:

    PDO: You should talk to someone about this imo. With respect to docweb and jonk, who both sound like reasonable people, this is the internet and you may have some kind of circumstances we’re not aware of so please consult a medical person who knows your situation.

    Seriously.

  189. mc79hockey says:

    In the alternative PDO, take their advice and if there’s any complications, Lowetide LLP will spring into action.

  190. PDO says:

    LT:

    MC brings a good point ;). Seriously though, I’ve been goggling it out of curiosity all night. Not finding a whole lot, and found some extra information on the particular drug I’m on as well. Obviously not something I’d take lightly… thanks though, obviously always better to stay safe.

  191. Oilmaniac says:

    quain;

    http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/quib

    quib -> quip, gibe

    gibe

    –verb (used without object) 1. to utter mocking or scoffing words; jeer.
    –verb (used with object) 2. to taunt; deride.
    –noun 3. a taunting or sarcastic remark.

    So go fuck yourself..

  192. Lowetide says:

    Boys: It isn’t cool to be this angry before the game. Save the rage so it can build.

  193. Loxy says:


    Broadcaster. Started in 1980 and have enjoyed it tremendously.

    Good living, crazy people but in a good way. :-)

    Me and LT.

    Yep. :)

    …Me and LT.

  194. Iztok says:

    Has Petri Skriko spoken yet?

  195. jon k says:

    I disclosed my lack of medical knowledge, any action taken resultant of my advice is done at the risk of the actor. :)

  196. Kyle says:

    JK are you coming out Friday?

  197. quain says:

    Google screwed me, I knew the define: command was a lie.

    And LT, I don’t appreciate the pluralization of that boys, I’m not angry and I’m not even sure what Oilmaniac is so upset about… well aside from my lack of knowledge of quib.

  198. Dennis says:

    Erin: so you ALSO loved Smid right from the beginning;)

    BTW, I just watched “The Ruins” and had no idea that when the blonde did the nude scene it was Joy from that California-centric episode of Mad Men!!

    Good times.

    BTW, the Canucks are a sad organization.

    Oh, and I look forward to Duhatschek talking about what a stooge Linden was while he was repping the PA andJames Mirtle’s subsequent descent into alcoholism.

  199. Coach pb9617 says:

    Save the rage so it can build.

    A combination of a bellyfull of pho, Nyquil, and two glasses of bourbon, up, say that I won’t have the rage anytime in the next twelve hours.

    I do plan on using the DVR on this one so I can remember what I’m about to watch.

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