Desjardins NHLE for NCAA

Riley Nash had a nice season with the Cornell Big Red, as they came within a game of making the Frozen Four. Nash improved season over season, although the Edmonton Oilers have suggested they’re not pleased with his progress.

There are 5 Oilers prospects in the NCAA at this time, with Nash leading the way followed by two very nice prospects (Jeff Petry and Chris Vande Velde) and rounded out by 2 marginal talents (Matt Glasser and Robby Dee).

Every season I like to list each league’s Oiler prospects and their Desjardins NHL equivalencies. For those new to the process, this is an estimate of production based on the player getting the exact same treatment in the NHL as he does in his current league. Same minutes, same time on the PP, same quality of linemates and on it goes.

The estimate was spot-on for Andrew Cogliano’s NCAA numbers, so I put quite a bit of emphasis on these numbers.

First, let’s list the NHLE’s (per 82gp)from two years ago:

2006-07
  1. C Andrew Cogliano 17-19-36 (19)
  2. R David Rohlfs 11-11-22 (22)
  3. D Taylor Chorney 6-15-21 (19)
  4. R Colin McDonald 10-3-13 (22)
  5. D Cody Wild 5-7-12 (19)
  6. C Geoff Paukovich 5-7-12 (20)
  7. C Chris VandeVelde 2-4-6 (19)
  8. L Matt Glasser 0-0-0 (19)

2007-08

  1. C Riley Nash 11-19-30 (18)
  2. C Chris Vande Velde 12-13-25 (20)
  3. D Cody Wild 4-19-23 (20)
  4. D Jeff Petry 2-17-19 (20)
  5. D Taylor Chorney 2-17-19 (20)
  6. L Matt Glasser 5-3-8 (20)
  7. C Robby Dee 1-3-4 (20)

2008-09

  1. C Riley Nash 12-22-34 (19)
  2. C Chris Vande Velde 14-13-27 (21)
  3. D Jeff Petry 2-10-12 (21)
  4. C Robby Dee 6-5-11 (21)
  5. L Matt Glasser 3-3-6 (21)

At first blush it looks like Nash and Cogliano are similar offensive talents, their 19 year old college seasons are very close. However, Nash’s club scored 92 goals in 36 games (2.56 GF per game) and Cogliano’s scored 174 goals in 41 games (4.24GF per game).

Other things that stand out are that Chris Vande Velde ran in place; Jeff Petry’s offense fell off badly, as his team’s offense disappeared (GF went from 135 in 42 gp–3.21GF per game to 62 in 38gp–1.63GF per game, a ghastly total) with the graduating class of 2008.

There will no doubt be some talk about all three Oilers prospects signing this summer, but with the exception of Nash I don’t see any Oiler prospect leaving on a high-water mark in 2009.

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64 Responses to "Desjardins NHLE for NCAA"

  1. kanadienkyle says:

    Having been at most Sioux home games, I think part of the reason VDV ran in place was that he went through a number of different line combos. Last year he was cemented on the line with Duncan and Oshie, while this year he saw time with just about everyone, not all of whom are blessed with offensive talent.

    For my money, I saw improvement in his playmaking ability, faceoffs and his play down low. By that he went from a guy with decent hands who could stand in front of the net to a guy that could not only do that, but could drive the PP from below the goal line.

  2. Lowetide says:

    kyle: He was also apparently playing with injury for a time. Shoulder, I think.

  3. Black Dog says:

    Thanks Kyle.

    I read somewhere that Petry was going back to school. What’s the word on Jean VanDeV?

  4. kanadienkyle says:

    Interesting. I had no idea about the shoulder. All the same, though the numbers were stagnant I think he took a step forward.

  5. oilerdago says:

    Good stuff Kyle. To be able to go through the season with stagnanet numbers given all the players UND lost speaks volumes about his abilities.

    Another very useful part for the future.

  6. Mr DeBakey says:

    Nash looked good to me in the games I've seen over the past couple of week-ends.

    I decided to take a small Copper & Blue holiday after watching the Phoenix game,
    Ergo, I didn't watch either game on the week-end.

    I've been reading the game thread in bits & pieces & wanted to throw another log on the Rollie re-signing fire:
    No to 2 years
    No to $3.5mm+

    One year, under $2.5

    UFAs – Scott Clemmensen, Craig Anderson, Nikolai Khabibulin, Manny Fernandez, Martin Biron, Antero Niittymaki, Tim Thomas, Jason Labarbera, Brent Johnson, Stephen Valiquette, Erik Ersberg, Kevin Weekes, Yann Danis
    Plus – Kari Lehtonen, Antti Niemi are RFAs who are available

  7. B.C.B. says:

    I am hoping VDV takes the pro-contract so we can see what he can do in springflied. If Nash followed that path I would be happy to? Does anyone think that the Oilers wouldn’t mind if Nash stayed in NCAA, because they will want to ice a winning team in springfield, and they will need a bunch of vets to do that?

  8. Bruce says:

    Does anyone think that the Oilers wouldn’t mind if Nash stayed in NCAA, because they will want to ice a winning team in springfield, and they will need a bunch of vets to do that?

    They’ll need a bunch of (good!)vets and some talented youngsters. Nash falls in the second category. If I were trying to sell tickets in SF former first-rounders on the rise are an asset. Those are the guys (most?) minor league fans want to see.

  9. reijo29 says:

    B.C.B. – I mentionned the other day that I can't see the Oil wanting VDV & Nash in the A next year and VDV definetly seems to make more sense to come out now.

    How about this idea.

    Nash can play in the W next year as a 20 year old, I think Swift Current has his rights but maybe the Oil Kings could trade for him. One year in the W could be fruitful & worthwhile. If he could tear it up as Comrie did in his short stint in Kootenay it could be great for his confidence & development.
    Thoughts?

  10. jon k says:

    With last night’s loss were are all but eliminated from the playoffs considering our remaining schedule and the teams that we now find ahead of us.

    If we were to drop 4 of the remaining games, which I think is realistic, perhaps we should look to the kind of 1st round talent we might be able to pick up?

    Jared Cowen or Evander Kane are intriguing.

  11. reijo29 says:

    jon K- Evander Kane is a Top 5 pick, Top 3 in some people's books. Cowen is a Top 8 and would have been higher if he hadn't been hurt. So neither is realistic for the Oil unless we trade up and I think if anything we will be trading our 1st rounder for proven talent.

    Please can we trade for Kovalchuk. Pretty please.

    Also, heard this AM from a good source close to Colby Armstrong that he will try and avoid re-signing with ATL at all costs, even joked that he would retire before going back, it's just such a shitty hockey environment, especially for a good ol' Saskatchewan boy.

    Kovalchuk & Armstrong for a large package centered on Cogs, Gilbert & 1st rounder maybe?
    Even if we only get Kovalchuk for 1 year.

  12. doritogrande says:

    Those are the guys (most?) minor league fans want to see.

    I don’t give a shit about how Michael Grabner is developing. I go to AHL games to watch Jason Krog light up the competition.

    For comparison, would you go to a Springfield game to watch Potulny/Willis/Stone score goals, or Schremp and Chorney go -2 on the night?

  13. doritogrande says:

    jon K- Evander Kane is a Top 5 pick, Top 3 in some people’s books. Cowen is a Top 8 and would have been higher if he hadn’t been hurt. So neither is realistic for the Oil unless we trade up and I think if anything we will be trading our 1st rounder for proven talent.

    If we go on a 2007-type run now, there’s every chance we’ll be picking in thte 5-8 range (even higher if we win the draft lottery. I think Kane might be within our reach if we flip another pick/prospect to move up a couple spots. However, the more I look closer into the draft, the more I love the Swede Paajarvi. Natural LW with size, uses it like Forsberg, and wants to win at all costs. Doesn’t care who he pisses off (see his Forsberg-like comments during the WJC) and generally backs up the smack-talk with solid performances. He’s rated in the 6-9 area by most boards, and I’d prefer him over the prospect of converting another natural C to the wings.

  14. reijo29 says:

    DoritoGrande – I haven't seen a mock draft or prospect rating that has Paajarvi below 4th, not sure where you've seen 6-9.
    Parts of his game really remind me of Ovechkin. I said parts, so no over reacting to that comment.

    Also, even if we lose every game for the rest of the year we are likely to finish no lower then 7th and likely no lower then 9th. So it would likely cost Nilsson & Pick to even move up 2 spots. Moving to 3rd would probably cost Cogs/Gags or Gilbert/Grebs plus our 1st rounder. Way too much for a guy who wouldn't be able to truly contribute for at least a year or two (likely longer).

  15. jon k says:

    ISS March Top 15:

    1. John Tavares – Ldn
    2. Victor Hedman – Modo
    3. Magnus Svensson-Paajarvi – Timra
    4. Jared Cowen – Spk
    5. Matt Duchene – Bram
    6. Evander Kane – Van
    7. Brayden Schenn – Brandon
    8. Jordan Schroeder – U.of Minn
    9. Nazem Kadri – Ldn
    10. Jacob Josefson – Djur
    11. Drew Shore – NTDP
    12. Ryan Ellis – Wind
    13. Jeremy Morin – NTDP
    14. Simon Despres – SJSD
    15. Zach Kassian – SJSD

    RLR March Top 10:

    1. John Tavares C 6-0/198 L 20 SEP 90 London
    2. Victor Hedman D 6-6/218 R 18 DEC 90 MoDo
    3. Matt Duchene C 5-11/196 L 16 JAN 91 Brampton
    4. Evander Kane C 6-1/170 L 01 AUG 91 Vancouver
    5. Magnus Pjrvi-Svensson LW 6-1/198 L 12 APR 91 Timr
    6. Jared Cowen (Injured) D 6-5/218 R 25 JAN 91 Spokane
    7. Brayden Schenn C 6-0/197 L 22 AUG 91 Brandon
    8. Oliver Ekman-Larsson D 6-1/172 L 17 JUL 91 Leksand
    9. Jordan Schroeder RW 5-8/173 R 29 SEP 90 Univ. of Minnesota
    10. Dmitri Kulikov D 6-0/187 L 29 OCT 90 Drummondville

    Based upon a prediction of winning 1 game versus Calgary and 1 game of Anaheim or LA, we should place around 11th in the West.
    I think realistically that’ll let us fall into the 8-12 range at the draft. Unfortunately it looks like there is a significant drop-off in talent after 7th overall.

  16. Traktor says:

    t’s tough to take anything from Petry’s numbers. What a complete disaster.

    It should be mentioned that he was winner or runner up in 3 categories that were voted by NCAA players.

    I believe they were:

    -Hardest shot
    -Best PP QB
    -Best 1 on 1 defender

    A little bit from each world and it’s tough to argue against what his peers think.

    I’ve seen some reports this year of untimely pinches and questionable decision making but a lot of that is probably out of necessity. When your team is down 2-0 in the first and you only average 1.62 goal per game what are you going to do?

    The good news is because he was playing on such a poor team he was being sent out every 2nd shift. I read reports this year that he was even took a stroll on the 4th line some timesas long with his regular defensive shifts.

    Overall I’m generally happy with Petry’s season.

    Riley Nash had a slight improvement in his numbers but to be honest I was hoping for a little more out of him. My personally line in the sand was 1.2 PPG this year which is 43 points. Still a good season though.

    Unfortunately Edmonton probably traded up for the wrong player though. Max Pacioretty who was selected 22nd overall is an absolute beauty. Trevor Timmins sure knows what he’s doing.

    Vande Velde had a good season in my books. New highs in goals and points and more importantly he almost doubled his PIM’s. He’s got solid 3rd line shutdown center written all over him.

    On an unrelated note as anyone seen T.J. Oshie lately? He absolutely destroyed Rick Nash twice and obliterated Dustin Brown a few nights before that. I think him and Bobby Ryan are my 2 favorite non-Oilers right now.

  17. geowal says:

    Nash can play in the W next year as a 20 year old, I think Swift Current has his rights but maybe the Oil Kings could trade for him. One year in the W could be fruitful & worthwhile. If he could tear it up as Comrie did in his short stint in Kootenay it could be great for his confidence & development.
    Thoughts?

    Even if the W would be better for his development in the oilers’ eyes (which is debateable), it would seem Nash chose NCAA and college for a reason over junior. Unless he’s soured on Cornell (and I see no reason why he would be) I can’t imagine him willingly making a move to the dub. Signing and turning pro is at least a step up and we don’t even know if he’d do that. Going to the dub is fairly lateral, and I suspect in his eyes a downgrade.

  18. reijo29 says:

    geowal – I agree with your assessment but in the WHL he would play on the 1st line, 1st PP, 1st PK and if traded to a good team he would likely get some pretty good playoffs experience and maybe a memorial cup run.

    He would also likely be signed to an NHL contract like Eberle just was. Maybe we can get him to Regina somehow and have him and Eberle play a year together, that could really good for everyone.

  19. Smytty777 says:

    Just by checking boxscores Eberle appears to be 3GP-1G-2A +2. Decent start considering how awful the Falcons are. Too small of sample size to get excited, but still nice to see.

  20. B.C.B. says:

    Crap, Smid has broken his hand an is on IR. Chorney is coming up to replace him. I think I am more scared to see Strudwick/Chorney, then Strudwick/Peckham. Maybe the Oilers have thrown in the towel and will play Peckham/Chorney?

  21. NormanMendoza says:

    reijo29,

    can’t remember where i saw the quote, but it was between Mancini, Oilers Development coach and Nash.

    Mancini stated that they want him to get more games than he does with Cornell. Nash responds that he doesn’t want to sign just to get bumped around the minors.

    He’s not going to be a big help during the Hemsky window anyway — so they might as well let him finish ripening in the college.

    I’d rather count on VDV being the better option. Maybe 09-10 in the AHL, then the following year with the big club. We’re past the point, it seems, where Marc Pouliot will ever be considered for C, where he is better.

    I don’t foresee Cogliano ever getting much better at faceoffs, so I wish they would push him to LW.

    Get the vet C for the 3-line and then VDV is the callup option.

  22. Alice says:

    The Equivalency seems to work as an Equalizer: no matter What you do your NHLE is 18-22….

    on Petry, he’s a defender so I’m not sure his boxcars are either a) important, or b) measure his learning curve. Someday he’s hoping to get paid to separate guys from the puck and get it going in the other direction. Sure, some defenders get you points too, but there are Forwards who have a role at that production clip.

  23. hunter1909 says:

    Pat Quinn and Kovalchuck are my personal 2009-10 Oilers dynamic duo.

    No more mincing, cerebral (over)coaching thank you.

  24. Dennis says:

    It’s LT point first and foremost but it just looks like there’s trouble ahead for the Oilers and Nash.

    Nash seems to want to jump straight to the bigs and who can blame him given the recent history with the 13-89 combo.

    On the other hand, the Oilers don’t seem to think he can go from Cornell straight to the bigs because of the fewer number of games and also perhaps the QualComp therein.

    Trak: Yes, I couldn’t believe that Oshie stood Nash up last night. He blasted him on Sat on the counter-attack and then last night Nash had him lined up but Oshie “hulked up’ and Nash bounced off him violently.

  25. jon k says:

    Quinn isn’t a modern systems coach and Kovalchuk is captain of his team and the only ticket seller in a poor market with a cash-strapped owner.

    I don’t see the logic behind either choice.

  26. Alice says:

    The assistants get with the systems. The HC should be the guy who you respect enough to show up and not mail it in. Quinn would be fine, and probably wants to retire someday so you don’t have to sack him 9yrs hence.

  27. Coach pb9617 says:

    Nash can play in the W next year as a 20 year old, I think Swift Current has his rights but maybe the Oil Kings could trade for him. One year in the W could be fruitful & worthwhile. If he could tear it up as Comrie did in his short stint in Kootenay it could be great for his confidence & development.
    Thoughts?

    The step from the NCAA, especially final 16 level hockey to the W is a long, long, step down.

  28. Coach pb9617 says:

    Also, heard this AM from a good source close to Colby Armstrong that he will try and avoid re-signing with ATL at all costs, even joked that he would retire before going back, it’s just such a shitty hockey environment, especially for a good ol’ Saskatchewan boy.

    I’m making my Oh face.

    Armstrong and Bouwmeester in, Souray, Nilsson, Staios, Moreau, Schremp, and Wilhorny out.

  29. Bruce says:

    I saw one of the Oshie hits on Nash, where he just steamrolled him in the corner, looked like a clean but vicious dart. Hard to believe he’s 5-11, 170, running over dudes like Nash. The reaction of the CBJ announcers was quite comical … “He can’t do that” or “They can’t allow that” or some such, as if Oshie had just taken a can of spray paint to the Mona Lisa or something. I seem to recall Nash Himself landing a couple of pretty cruel blows against unwitting Oilers, and I’m sure those same announcers liked those hits just fine.

    Oshie is looking REAL good. Besides those hits he scored a dazzling goal-of-the-year candidate the other day. Oshie (+16) been playing quite a bit on a dynamite kid line with Patrik Berglund (+21) and David Perron (+14), the only three double-digit plusses on the surging Blues. No doubt Andy Murray has managed their ice time, but you sure can’t argue with the results.

  30. Sean says:

    Quinn would seem like a realistic candidate with the Olympic connection to Tambellini and Lowe.

    Put MacT upstairs and form the most expensive management team in hockey? haha

  31. doritogrande says:

    reijo29:

    Paajarvi is listed as the #7 prospect according to the TSN.ca rankings (http://tsn.ca/nhl/feature/?id=9267). These rankings are compiled by Bob MacKenzie who has, at least for the last couple years, been the best predictor of draft-eligible talent. LT will I’m sure agree with me on this point. There’s a couple of sticking points with the TSN rankings (I can’t in good conscience believe Schroeder falls out of the Top-10 and Cowen will likely get nicked out of the top-10 because of injury, Duchene and Kane should be flip-flopped) but they’re closer to my estimates than the other scouting lists that have been produced.

    This Chorney recall business is bullshit when we’re still fighting for the playoffs. Peckham is the best bet to step in and contribute effectively on the blueline. Or maybe this is just semantics, and MacT turns Liam Reddox into the ultimate Toby Petersen clone.

  32. Ribs says:

    Yea, Chorney? Really?

    Is this guy related to Katz or something? I still haven’t figured it out.

  33. B.C.B. says:

    DG and Ribs: I think MacT will rotate between Chorney and Peckham. If one has a bad game the other one will draw in till they screw up. But it does put our playoff chances in a terrible position.

  34. doritogrande says:

    I think MacT will rotate between Chorney and Peckham.

    Unless I’ve missed something, Peckham hasn’t been recalled. Only Chorney. And given that Springfield is all the way across the continent, they won’t be shuffling them back and forth.

  35. B.C.B. says:

    DG: Peckham is on the Oilers roster, as it is listed on the Oilers website. I have been under the impression that he has been the 7th d-man, and in the press box or the last couple games. I think Chorney’s recall is to have seven defense men on the roster.

  36. Asiaoil says:

    Hey coach – yeah it cracks me up that people think Nash is better off as a 20 year old in the CHL playing against 16 year olds – as opposed to mostly playing against guys his own age or older in the NCAA. Also while you play less inthe NCAA than in the CHL – you practice and train off-ice a hell of a lot more. Any issues about Nash at Cornell says more about the Oilers and their preference for compliant, subservient players than about Nash’s commitment or development.

  37. Jfry says:

    am i the only one who wants to see all these kids stay in as long as they can? it begs the question of why you draft a college kid in the first round, if in fact you’re looking for “now”…but we’re not, so let them stew…

    with the salary cap going down in the future…having all these kids (eberle, nash, petry, etc) stewing as long as possible only helps us moving forward…gilbert’s model is what we should be hoping for out of all of our NCAA kids and ideally we want eberle going the distance in the W…

    get games, don’t get hurt ’cause men are bigger and gain wisdom…

    prospects that are rushed get hurt and stagnated…if, as LT says, the 2003 class is finally starting to smell right, you keep the 2007 class in the oven for as long as you can.

    i’d rather three years of riley straight outta he’s 4th year, than wasting his first two years of his rookie contract trying to gain weight in the AHL. Cornell has a much better chance of turning him into Horcoff and the AHL has a much better chance of turning him into Pouliot, is my point of view.

  38. reijo29 says:

    Coach – Agree, the WHL is a step down (not quite as big as you seem to think) from the Final 16 in NCAA but Nash plays his season in the IVY League only a handful of games in Playoffs & against Non-Conference Teams.
    On top of that my point with the WHL idea is that it accomplishes several things.
    -Only 1 rookie C on AHL Team
    -Double the games in regular season & playoffs. Plus an elite role on the team that he goes to.
    -Allows Nash to attend Training Camp not just rookie camp. (I know he can do this if he goes to the AHL, as well).

    hunter1909 – Agree 100% with Kovalchuk & Pat Quinn (with 2 young assistants neither named Buchberger) but would add Bouwmeester & Colby Armstrong to that list.

    Coach – I think you will have to substitute Cogliano/Gagner & Gilbert/Grebs/Smid for Souray & Nilsson in a trade with Atlanta.
    Souray won't waive NTC clause to go to Atlanta, I know him well enough to guarantee that & Atlanta will want young NHL Players as cheap as possible (1st contract ideally).

    Might be able to do Penner, One of Cogliano/Nilsson, One of Gibby/Grebs/Smid, Schremp, our 1st rounder this year plus a conditional pick (if Kovalchuk signs long term) for Kovalchuk & Armstrong.
    It's seems like a lot but I would do it in a heart beat.

    Remember Atlanta got – Colby Armstrong, Erik Christenson, Angelo Esposito & a late 1st Rounder for Marian Hossa to play in 20 games+Playoffs. We would be getting Kovalchuk for minimum of a year.

    Then hopefully find a couple teams that would take Moreau & Staios, hopefully get a bag of pucks and a bushel of broken sticks in return.
    Just to clear cap space for Bouwmeester, their 4.4 million would probably cover more then 2/3 of what he would want(6.5).

    Goalies
    ??? (2-3 million)
    JDD or Sabourin

    Just crunched numbers and I think Nilsson & 1 of Horcoff/Visnovsky/Souray would need to be moved as well for younger/cheaper talent.

    doritogrande – I stand corrected I haven't spent as much time checking lists as I normally do. Everything I read & heard about Parjavi around WJC time was that he was likely the 3rd pick after Tavares/Hedman. Plus, I read something (Hockey News Online I think) just last week that had him listed as 3rd on 2 NHL GMs list & 4th behind Kane on another list. GMs were obviously not named.

  39. Smarmy Boss says:

    I’m all for drafting for Jared Cowen. (Blown knee withstanding)

    He’s like a Bouwmeester without the weird, introverted personality.

  40. HBomb says:

    RE: Cowen. Ok, like Bouwmeester, great.

    Let’s get both then. When Bouwmeester is on the wrong side of 30, Cowen will just be hitting his prime.

  41. jon k says:

    Not trying to be an ass but some of these trade proposals and ideas being thrown around should really stay on HF. Some of them are pretty far-fetched.

    Bouwmeester has much better offensive ability and pure skating than Cowen. Size and defensive ability are similar though. I would love to have him. Based on size, junior career and skillset he seems like Robyn Regehr might be a good career projection.

  42. doritogrande says:

    Bouwmeester has much better offensive ability and pure skating than Cowen. Size and defensive ability are similar though. I would love to have him. Based on size, junior career and skillset he seems like Robyn Regehr might be a good career projection.

    Wrong again. Dude’s going to be a Bryan Allen type.

  43. Dennis says:

    coach: BIG ups for the Office Space joke. I can’t believe how underrated that movie is.

    Bruce: I’ve watched a lot of hockey since Christmas and I’m say to report that local coverage is as myopic as ever.

    In yesterday’s BJ loss, the play-by-play guy – who’s from Ottawa and should know better – said on no less than four seperate occasions that the Blues David Perron “should receive an Academy Award” for the penalty he drew.

    Suffice to say, the Colu TV crew isn’t handling the team’s success well.

  44. Bill Needle says:

    If I were Nash, I’d stay in Cornell for my graduate degree before I spent one minute in Swift Current.
    No Oiler prospects should be making any deals with the group of clowns the Oilers have in management, they’ll all be gone the second they’re mathematically out of the playoffs.

  45. jon k says:

    doritogrand: Wrong again?

    Care to back up your assertion with something other than a flat denial?

    Because most would characterize Bryan Allen at 4th overall in an exceptionally weak draft as a pretty scathing comparison to Cowen who was originally ranked in the top 5 of a very deep draft. Granted Allen has played very well this season with mixed opposition (5th in D man qualcomp on FLA, 2nd in qualteam).

    Other than that Allen and Regehr both had very similar junior stats to Cowen, with both having a lot more PIMs. By my eye they’re fairly similar similar players with Regehr being more physical as an NHL pro, so I’m not really sure where your criticism and hostility are coming from other than some sort of internet self esteem issue.

  46. Coach pb9617 says:

    Hey coach – yeah it cracks me up that people think Nash is better off as a 20 year old in the CHL playing against 16 year olds – as opposed to mostly playing against guys his own age or older in the NCAA. Also while you play less inthe NCAA than in the CHL – you practice and train off-ice a hell of a lot more. Any issues about Nash at Cornell says more about the Oilers and their preference for compliant, subservient players than about Nash’s commitment or development.

    Indeed, AO, well-said.

  47. Coach pb9617 says:

    it begs the question of why you draft a college kid in the first round, if in fact you’re looking for “now”…but we’re not, so let them stew..

    That’s raising the question, not begging.

    Coach – I think you will have to substitute Cogliano/Gagner & Gilbert/Grebs/Smid for Souray & Nilsson in a trade with Atlanta.
    Souray won't waive NTC clause to go to Atlanta, I know him well enough to guarantee that & Atlanta will want young NHL Players as cheap as possible (1st contract ideally).

    I’ve got Souray headed to Columbus for Klesla as the main pieces to clear cap space for Bouwmeester. Columbus has functioned for most of the year without Klesla, but their power play is abysmal. The Oilers have a couple of elite power play Dmen and Howson and Edmonton have a history. Columbus gets their power play and Edmonton gets the cap space for Bouwmeester.

    Penner-Horcoff-Hemsky
    O’Sullivan-Gagner-Cogliano
    Veilleaux-Brodziak-Pisani
    Jacques-Pouliot-Stortini
    MacIntyre

    Bouwmeester – Gilbert
    Vishnovsky – Grebeshkov
    Klesla – Smid
    Peckham

    coach: BIG ups for the Office Space joke. I can’t believe how underrated that movie is.

    Anything that brings Armstrong to the Oilers is a good thing and makes me, well, you know. I can’t believe that he’d be available, but if he is, I’ve got no issues with Nilsson, Schremp, Staios and Wilhorny for Army and a late pick. That kid has a whole bunch of stuff that this team needs.

  48. Schitzo says:

    Another important factor under this CBA – if Nash spends 4 years in college, he signs his first SPC at age 22, meaning it’s a 2 year deal instead of 3.

    If he can transition straight to the NHL, I think that’s better for the organization than him wasting his entire entry-level deal in Springfield.

    On the other hand, if he still needs a year in the AHL after college (like Gilbert did), he’s due for his first payday after a single NHL season.

    At the extreme other end of the spectrum, if he left college right now and spent 3 years in the AHL, he’d have basically zero bargaining power to sign his next contract.

  49. Schitzo says:

    spent 3 years in the AHL, he’d have basically zero bargaining power to sign his next contract.

    The Rob Schremp effect, if you will.

  50. blackadder says:

    From what I know all three (Nash, VDV, Petry) made some good strides this year, although two were victims of playing on a poor team. I doubt VDV played with anyone as talented as Oshie at any point this year.

    All three would be better served staying in college – they’re in decent programs with good coaching where they can take time to practice and learn the game. The last place any of them should be is in the WHL or, even worse, Springfield, until the Oilers can get their development act together. There’s a reason why guys like Pouliot, Schremp, Jacques, MacDonald, Syvret, Bisaillon and, going back a few years – Rita, Winchester, Semenov etc. never seemed to develop and that’s because the Oilers are completely clueless when it comes to running a development program

  51. Icecastles says:

    Oilers are completely clueless when it comes to running a development program

    Agreed wholeheartedly Blackadder, though be prepared for Quain to flame you mightily for saying so. ;)

    In other news, nice interview with Ken Hitchcock on NHL.com today.

    Favourite quote: “All of the things that people do in everyday life, for us, stops. You spend little or no time with it. You exist. It’s like you sleep, you come to the rink, you work at preparing your team, you go home and you rest.”

    I read that and just pine for what is so completely missing with our team this year.

  52. Dennis says:

    One thing that I always grudgingly admired about Hitchcock was how much smoke he’d blow up the Oilers collective ass before his Stars once again knocked them out of the playoffs.

    I was reminded of this just last Fri when I watched some of the BJ’s 5-0 win over Cgy and heard Loubardis breathlessly recount how Hitch had during that morning’s skate opined just how dangerous this Flames club was;)

    BTW, did anyone else see the “7th man” video that’s posted over at the Oilers official site?

    So many things went through my head when I saw it but the first two words were hokey and manipulative.

  53. raventalon40 says:

    Maybe the Oilers have thrown in the towel and will play Peckham/Chorney?

    I’d rather see the Oilers contend for draft picks 5-7 than barely miss the playoffs again after a lacklustre season. Every other year they make an exciting run and at least give the opposing teams some blood and vinegar. With the salary spent on players this year and the lack of consistency and desire shown by the team, I don’t know what else is left to expect except a successful summer draft.

  54. raventalon40 says:

    exciting run

    Including last year when they barely missed the playoffs.

  55. quain says:

    Agreed wholeheartedly Blackadder, though be prepared for Quain to flame you mightily for saying so. ;)

    Holy fuck. Once again: AHL DEVELOPMENT and CRAIG MACTAVISH CAN’T COACH ROOKIES are two different things. If Blackadder’s premise is that the Falcons suck for developing guys right now, well, I don’t think I’ve ever disagreed with that or even voiced an opinion. I don’t think he needs to be too prepared.

  56. Icecastles says:

    did anyone else see the “7th man” video that’s posted over at the Oilers official site?

    So many things went through my head when I saw it but the first two words were hokey and manipulative.

    Totally. And I might add sad and desperate to the list of adjectives. Seeing Horc staring into the camera and virtually begging the fans to support them just felt like the ultimate admission that they they don’t know what else to try, and they don’t feel like they have earned the fans’ unsolicited support. It’s a dark day when the Oilers post a video asking their fans to cheer for them.

  57. doritogrande says:

    Care to back up your assertion with something other than a flat denial?

    Sure. It seems to me that Robyn Regehr > Bryan Allen in terms of statistics, quality of assignment and likely mobility. Bryan Allen plays a big 6'4", as does the even bigger Cowan. Scouting reports indicate that Cowan doesn't have great mobility likely as a result of his size. He may eventually acquire said skill, but it seems a stretch to compare him to Regehr who plays the game with the speed of a much smaller defender.

    Cowan may be able to translate some offense to the big league, but we're not talking about a great deal in terms of points. Looking at the statistics Regehr is no slouch in this department omitting the current season. He's also getting the job done with a much harder assignment and is playing with checkers most of the time. Not being Phaneufed, to use the common phrase.

    Cowan is coming off a major injury early in his career. To my knowledge, Allen has had issues with injuries in the past (take my word here, I watched him dominate the ice when he was here in Winnipeg), he's just played through them. It takes a while to get your prospect career back on track after a serious injury, that fact Oilers fans I'm sure can all agree on.

    This is no slight on Bryan Allen. I love him as a player and think he's exactly the kind of defenseman the Oilers are lacking. If you want, you can take the time to check through the various "let's get Bouwmeester" threads here, you'll find me pimping Allen in a couple of them instead of the Edmonton native. I just don't buy into the hype surrounding Cowan. If you're looking for a solid defending defenseman I prefer Simon Despres.

    I meant no hostility, and hope you don't take these comments as a shot at you.

  58. Icecastles says:

    quain said: Holy fuck. etc etc etc

    Well, the important thing is that Quain gets a chance to bitch about something. :)

    Seriously though, we’re all having a bit of fun here and just trying to find some levity in a very disappointing end to the hockey season. I’m not jumping on you or trying to get you worked up. Though in fairness, last time I posted that the development system sucks and that a lot of young players have been mismanaged (note that the word “manage” is different than the word “coach”), you jumped all over my post, flamed away, then ranted about MacT being great with rookies – something I’d never alluded to and that I completely agree with you on.

    I can almost see the vein throbbing in your neck and your face going red as you hammer furiously at your keyboard. That can’t be healthy. For you or the keyboard. :)

  59. hunter1909 says:

    “One thing that I always grudgingly admired about Hitchcock was how much smoke he’d blow up the Oilers collective ass before his Stars once again knocked them out of the playoffs.

    I was reminded of this just last Fri when I watched some of the BJ’s 5-0 win over Cgy and heard Loubardis breathlessly recount how Hitch had during that morning’s skate opined just how dangerous this Flames club was;)”

    By comparison MacTavish gives off the impression like he’s HAL the robot in 2001 A Space Odyssey. Logically there, seemingly, but kinda not there at all in the heart and soul department.

  60. Icecastles says:

    By comparison MacTavish gives off the impression like he’s HAL the robot in 2001 A Space Odyssey.

    Dave Bowman as Tambelini: Hello, Mac do you read me, Mac?

    HAL 9000 as MacT: Affirmative, Steve, I read you.

    Tambelini: Put Penner back on the first line, Mac. They’re not producing without him.

    MacT: I’m sorry Steve, I’m afraid I can’t do that.

    Tambelini: What’s the problem?

    MacT: I think you know what the problem is just as well as I do.

    Tambelini: What are you talking about?

    MacT: This mission is too important for me to allow you to jeopardize it.

    Tambelini: I don’t know what you’re talking about, Mac?

    MacT: I know you and Kevin were planning to fire me, and I’m afraid that’s something I cannot allow to happen.

  61. Icecastles says:

    Original version of the above dialogue, for any non-2001 fans.

    (1:26 to 2:10)

  62. Icecastles says:

    And this must be his meeting with management in mid-April.

    “I know everything hasn’t been quite right with me… I can see you’re very upset about this. I know I’ve made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal. I’ve still got the greatest enthusiasm and confidence in the mission, and I want to help you.”

  63. jon k says:

    dorito: Cool, I just thought I picked up some snark coming my way. Dangers of the internet and all that. :)

    I generally view Regehr as being held back by a lack of top-end speed and I think his offensive game has been overrated and perhaps inflated by being relied upon as a PP QB for several seasons.

    My view of Cowen has been that he would be a superior defender to Allen, hence my preference for a Regehr-type projection over Allen.

    That being said, a defense-first defenseman with good size would be a good asset for the Oilers’ prospect pool.

    Which made me think the other day about whether or not BPA is the best strategy is the post-lockout NHL. It seems that less and less there are hockey deals that see teams swap assets from positions of strength. Rather, it seems there has been less overall movement, with the same or more movement at the trade deadline involving contracts that are rentals or salary dumps.

    Especially involving high first round picks, how often do you see these blue chippers moved to fill roster holes since the new CBA?

  64. dawgbone says:

    Asiaoil, the problem is he doesn’t seem to be training off ice very hard. He’s gained 6 lbs in 2 years in the absolute best growing time for young players.

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