No Reddox Redux

According to tsn, Liam Reddox has rejected his qualifying offer from the Oilers. tsn suggests he is likely headed for Europe for the coming season. At first blush I’m not certain what to make of this news. It could mean the Oilers suggested to Reddox he might not be a regular under Pat Quinn or it could indicate that Reddox and his agent want him traded elsewhere.

Either way, it is certainly a move that screams “unusual” and I’d expect there’s a story behind it.

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62 Responses to "No Reddox Redux"

  1. bookie says:

    I hate to say it, but is this related to our being a crappy place to play again?

    Maybe Reddox just feels the new coach is going to sit him or have him in the minors and he sees himself as a top sixer and figures that he can prove it by tearing up the Euro Leagues. I hope to hell that he doesn't succeed, I am not sure I could handle that.

    In any case, as LT said, something feels bad about this. I hope that Reddox is not a Canary in the Oil Mine and that the players are as 'Heatleyed out' with this team as some fans are.

  2. PDO says:

    HFBoards is currently celebrating. Can't really figure out why.

    Losing a cheap player who can fill out the bottom of the roster certainly isn't a good thing.

  3. Bank Shot says:

    "I hope to hell that he doesn't succeed, I am not sure I could handle that."

    I hope to hell he does. I'm pretty sure the Oilers would still hold his rights, and they could use another decent player if Reddox improves his game in Europe. Or at least it would raise his trade value.

  4. Lowetide says:

    bookie: I think the Oilers may have decided that forwards 10-14 (4th liners and beyond) are going to be bang crash types with size.

    That means that Jacques, Stortini, MacIntyre and even players like Paukovich may win jobs.

    It may also be true that this is a move made so that a skilled man like Schremp, Potulny or new hire Minard get playing time.

    One thing is certainly true: this is about the Oilers wanting to change things up. I don't like the fact that they invested a lot of at-bats in Reddox and then let him slip through the cracks, though.

    It's not certain he's an NHL player but the entire story has yet to be written.

    One final thing: I'm ALL IN FAVOR if this means more actual NHL players on the roster.

    So, sign one please.

  5. Jonathan Willis says:

    I imagine Reddox saw which way the wind was blowing and after talking with his agent figured there was more money in Europe than the AHL.

  6. LP says:

    LT – You are always mentioning that the Oilers need to field more actual NHL players. What by your definition makes one an 'actual' nhler? Whoe on the current roster qualifies?

  7. Lowetide says:

    LP: By "actual NHL player" I mean a guy who can play the game at par. Organizations invest oodles of playing time in kids who can't do that and the more of them there are on the roster the more likely the team will lose games.

    Sam Gagner and Andrew Cogliano will certainly one day be "actual NHL players" but right now the Oilers bleed chances when they're out there.

    Actual NHL players:

    1. Khabibulin
    2. Visnovsky
    3. Souray
    4. Gilbert
    5. Grebeshkov
    6. Staios
    7. Horcoff
    8. Penner
    9. O'Sullivan
    10. Moreau
    11. Hemsky
    12. Pisani

    That's about right, Stortini could be on that list too but here's terribly low event.

  8. Smytty777 says:

    I'm assuming this opens up another roster spot under the 50 contract cap. I agree with LT's assessment, if this means an actual NHLer (Malhotra), then I am very much in support of it. Even it means Alexandre Giroux I'm happy.

  9. Boondock says:

    Money can't be the issue, he hasn't earned any type of big deal. Guaranteed he's been looking for a one-way deal and is only be offered a two-way.

  10. General Factotum says:

    If I'm right, one thing Reddox's departure won't do is clear out any cap room to sign a Malhotra or equivalent. He's one of the few who wouldn't have had to clear waivers to be sent down.

    I think Jonathan is right. He saw that he was almost certainly AHL-bound and decided Europe was a better option right now.

  11. godot10 says:

    Cam Barker and Kris Versteeg didn't sign their qualifying offers either, you know.

    Stortini didn't sign his qualifying offer last year either. He signed a two-year deal after further negotiation.

    The story isn't that he rejected his qualifying offer. That happens all the time.

    The story is that it looks as if he has decided to go to Europe, where he will likely get more money, and will be able to work on his offensive game.

    He has to clear waivers, right…so this is basically a judgement on his part that it is unlikely any other NHL team would claim him,

    and/or

    that he thinks he can improve as a hockey player more in Europe than in the AHL, or being a 4th line forward (or sitting in the pressbox) in the NHL.

    Looks like Reddox is one smart cookie.

    I don't think the Oilers lose his rights if he only stays over there a couple of years, right?

  12. Lowetide says:

    Well if the Oilers lost him over the one-way deal it makes little sense. Reddox would make 600k or so on a one way deal and even if he played in the minors all year who cares?

  13. Lowetide says:

    godot10: I believe the Oilers secured his rights when they sent out the QO.

  14. Ribs says:

    Anywhere but Springfield!

  15. hunter1909 says:

    I kind of really hate saying this, but since when is a bottom six fringe player anything worth worrying particularly hard about?

    It kind of seems like worrying about something relatively minor.

    Then again, it's summer, aka silly season.

  16. PDO says:

    Dawgbone posted this over @ HF…

    NHL:

    Reddox: 46GP 5G 7A 12PTS

    Brule: 72GP 3G 9A 12PTS

    AHL:

    Reddox: 79GP 21G 32A 53PTS

    Brule: 54GP 18G 16A 34PTS

    It's worth mentioning, isn't it?

  17. Master Lok says:

    Good lord LT. By your estimate, we only have six actual NHL forwards. Basically two thirds of these guys would all be playing for the PK unit already. That's bad.

  18. PDO says:

    That's over the past 2 seasons, forgot to add that ;).

  19. kris says:

    Maybe not a bad thing. Maybe it's even ideal.

    Reddox can go and develop for a year against good comp., and we don't have to have his contract count against the 50 contract limit, which we're now approaching.

  20. Rich says:

    I have to think the JW nailed this. Reddox has a lot of heart, but does not have the size to separate bigger guys from the puck the way JFJ, Zorg and SMac can and that's what Quinn wants on his 4th line – energy time players.

    This is however yet one more frustration with last year. It was a wasted year for JDD, for Reddox, and to a great degree for Pouliot (played out of position all year).

    I hope the organization is learning from this.

  21. Stuart van says:

    Is Reddox just Thoreson Redux?

    It's tough to be a small 4th liner, even if you get more than you give.

    Can't blame the guy for wanting to get the best paycheck he can. But if he rejects the offer, he's still Oiler's property, isn't he?

  22. godot10 says:

    Last year wasn't a wasted year for Reddox. It has probably helped him get a pretty good ticket to play in Europe.

    Reddox could see the brick wall being placed in front of his NHL dreams in the logjam of players the Oilers have fighting for the bottom jobs in the NHL and the top jobs in the AHL,

    and has decided on taking the road less travelled to get to a permanent NHL job.

  23. RyanB says:

    I'm pretty sure that because he received a qualifying offer from the Oil they retain his rights. As a Group 2 FA I think the Oilers can take him to arbitration if they want but I don't know what the deadline on that decision would be.

  24. oil dude says:

    Guaranteed he's been looking for a one-way deal and is only be offered a two-way.

    This is my gut feeling as well. You cant give one way contracts to every blue collar prospect who has a cup of coffee in the show. The Oilers blew 1M on Roy and Sabourin together last year in the minors. They just signed Minard, Arsene, and Nickerson for a total of 500K AHL money (as per Gregor at ON). Take Reddox's money and contract and sign another high end AHL veteran if the NHL forward group is already settled on.

  25. jon k says:

    I'd say it's a guy making a money move for the immediate future. Reddox's value to clubs in Europe is going to be artificially inflated by the argument that Reddox "made it" in the NHL.

    Obviously this assumes that yes, he likely wasn't going to be an NHL regular under Quinn and Renney.

    Can't say I blame or miss him either way. On the "meh" scale it's somewhere slightly below Brodziak getting traded.

  26. Jfry says:

    i think the story is 45K in the AHL or 750K in the RSL or swedish elite league.

    no way he plays on the bottom 6 of a quinn team.

  27. Mr DeBakey says:

    What are ya worried about, Liam.. you'd actually have to earn a spot?

    The best thing about MacT being gone is Bulls–t comments like that one will start to fade away.

    At least until fans decide that Quinn is just as stupid as MacT.

    Reddox earned his spot

  28. Lowetide says:

    Mr. DeBakey: Agreed. The idea that an NHL coach would elevate a lesser player for any reason is batshit crazy. I can agree that coaches develop their favorite player types but MacT saw something in Reddox and that's the truth.

  29. Matt N says:

    Correct me if I am wrong but Dejardin lists the SEL NHLE as .78 and the AHL NHLE as .44.

    If this is correct, and the SEL is a more difficult league why does the NHL not use the SEL as more of a development league?

    Why not have some of the NHL/ AHL"tweeners" or CHL stars who have nothing left to prove go over and play against men?

  30. bookie says:

    I hope to hell he does. I'm pretty sure the Oilers would still hold his rights, and they could use another decent player if Reddox improves his game in Europe.

    Good point, I didnt think about that.

    Also, to whoever pointed out that this really has no consequence and we are like a bunch of old ladies gossiping cause there is nothing else to talk about over summer – Stop being so correct.

  31. kris says:

    Is the Heatley saga over yet?

  32. Traktor says:

    It's pretty hard to make league min and not earn your contract but Reddox did exactly that last year.

    Negative 0.88 differential playing against weak competition.

    Only Steve Mac was worse last year.

  33. dstaples says:

    Moreau was not an actual NHLer last year, in my estimation. Gilbert was borderline, given his defensive woes. But the rest I agree with.

    And, of course, I'd add Smid to your list, but that's just me, and a few other Smid fans.

  34. Lowetide says:

    david staples: It's an established level of ability, so Ethan rifles (and Staios) get some leeway because they're veterans. But yeah, I agree.

    Smid? Nah, he's in the group who aren't yet established. In fact, iirc he had a better season in 07-08 than this last one.

  35. dstaples says:

    Of course, Moreau wasn't horrid at even strength, but what really sticks with me is that weak penalty killing (though Horc wasn't much better on the kill, even his ardent boosters would have to admit).

    Let's hope it was the bad hand holding back Moreau . . .

    To me, he has got to earn a job in training camp, that's where he's at in his career right now. He can get still get it done as fourth liner at even strength, but any bigger role, especially as a penalty killer must only go to him on merit.

    Staios, I still like him OK. He was a chameleon player, horrid with Strudwick, OK with Smid, good with Souray. He's passable.

  36. dstaples says:

    You really think Smid took a step back, LT? I saw far more defensive awareness, which led to him passing the puck more rapidly and more often to the right guy. Without the puck, he seemed to be far more aware of the man in the slot, plus he was never tougher than last year. To me, Smid took a step forward last season, which is why I'd hate to see him leave.

    I'm just waiting with dread for the day a certain agent comes forward with some awful news, such as, Smid to Omsk. I've heard no rumrous about this, other than what went on with Smid last year, though part of that was his relationship with Huddy and MacTavish.

  37. Lowetide says:

    DanMan: You'll never believe me, but I'm protecting you. :-)

    David Staples: I think Moreau must have decided to go walk-about some nights, but he's a veteran and it'll take at least a couple of seasons before he gets less than a full 550 at-bats.

    I don't think Smid took a step back especially, just that his numbers were better a year ago. For the record, I've always liked Smid and have taken considerable heat over the years for being "in favor" of the deal that brought him here.

  38. DanMan says:

    How could I not believe you, LT?

    Your credibility is through the roof. Thanks for having my back.

    P.S. The eagle has left the nest.

  39. Art Vandelay says:

    I believe it indicates the Reddox sucks.

  40. Schitzo says:

    The craziest thing about Moreau was that he managed to compensate for a poorer-than-usual defensive season by putting up an excellent (by Moreau standards) offensive season.

    At this rate he'll be Huselius in no time.

  41. Chris says:

    To some degree players like Moreau and Staois make me wish it was possible to cut players like they do in the NFL. If you aren't living up to your contract you can be dropped like a bad habit if you can't be traded. Its really these guaranteed contracts that make the salary cap a tough thing to work around.

  42. Steven says:

    Why does his rejection of the qualifying offer mean that he won't be in EDM? Aren't those just formalities anyway? Isn't he still and RFA and the property of the Oilers?

  43. mc79hockey says:

    Moreau was not an actual NHLer last year, in my estimation. Gilbert was borderline, given his defensive woes. But the rest I agree with.

    Gilbert has been elite offensive ES guy for two years running. 15th in ESP/60 amongst guys who played at least 70 games and 10 minutes a night in 2007-08 and 4th last year.

  44. bookie says:

    I really think that it is important to note that by the standards of 'real NHLers' being discussed here, only about 2/3 guys playing in the NHL are real NHLers – anyone willing to tell that to them?

  45. SK Oiler Fan says:

    Speaking of undersized players not cracking the lineup: An interview with the most interesting man in the Oilogosphere:

    http://www.thepipelineshow.com/clips/season_4/Rob_Schremp_July14.mp3

    Summary:
    - Sounded excited about proving himself to the new coaching staff. What he really means: excited Mac-Crazy is gone.

    - Seemed like a very positive interview until he got worked up about people questioning his skating.

  46. quain says:

    Moreau was not an actual NHLer last year, in my estimation. Gilbert was borderline, given his defensive woes. But the rest I agree with.

    And, of course, I'd add Smid to your list, but that's just me, and a few other Smid fans.

    Really? You're going to tank Gilbert and raise up Smid in the same post?

    I'm all for giving guys like Horcoff, who, at times, have trouble bringing the offense but bring the defense, their props.

    But, at the end of the day, hockey is about scoring more than you give up. It would be great if Gilbert tightened up his defense, and I'd wager he will, but outscoring is outscoring no matter how high the numbers get. Gilbert does it. Smid doesn't.

  47. mc79hockey says:

    - Seemed like a very positive interview until he got worked up about people questioning his skating.

    Man, I'm no scout but his scouting is pretty obviously atrocious.

  48. PDO says:

    If Schremp's skating is only atrocious, Rosie O'Donnel is only ugly…

    Way OT, but Tanguay is looking for $25,000,000/5 years.

    Nobody is coming close.

    Oilers have apparently dabbled, but nothing crazy.

    Why don't we offer him $27,500,000 / 10 years and front load the shit out of it?

  49. Coach pb9617 says:

    Sucks to see the little guy go. The raving lunatic used him all wrong last year, but I think he's going to be a decent bottom sixer. At least he could get the puck into the corner to get a change.

  50. Bill Needle says:

    I preferred the days when MacT was just a crappy coach, which he often was, and not a raving lunatic, which I'm pretty sure he wasn't.

  51. dstaples says:

    No quibble with Gilbert on offence, MC79. He's fanatastic.

    On defence, major quibble. So far, the guy is a goal against waiting to happen, especially against tougher competition. Is there an Oilers defenceman weaker on the boards/corners?

    If there's goals and scoring chances when he's on the ice, he's often in the middle of them.

    Good news is that defenders can pick up their defensive game as they get smarter, older, meaner. It happens all the time, and Gilbert seems like a smart player so we can expect it with him.

    For now, I'd put him in the "still learning" category.

  52. PDO says:

    Souray and Gilbert had damn near identical GAON/60…

  53. NBOilerFan says:

    Reddox has some nice parts to his game, most importantly I think he understands it more then most young guys and knew how to keep it simple and make it work for him.

    But this is no loss whatsoever. He saw the writing on the wall… and it had a horizontal line that had 5'-10" 180lbs written beside it.

    Give (a hopefully repaired) JFJ, Minard, heck even give Paukovich a look.

    As Tambs said, in order to be harder to play against, we need to get bigger… plain and simple. It's not the only criteria, but its an important one.

    I'm sure we all have a couple players/prospects that we have been rooting for, just like Lowetide has his Pouliot and Trukhno, and one of mine is JF Jacques.

    I'm hoping this is the year of the Crazy Train. He didn't capitalize in 06/07 and of course the injury bug last year hurt, but I saw a much more mature player who seemed to have turned the corner upon his return last season as far as understanding his role and making smart plays with the puck and the game seems to be coming to him. Plus he is BIG.

    The year of the Crazy Train.

  54. digger says:

    Way OT for this thread, but a couple of Finnish posters are reporting that the Oilers have signed Toni Rajala to a 3 yr deal, and that he will be playing in Brandon next season, pending approval from Ilves (which sounds like a formality at this point):

    http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=656868&page=4

  55. Coach pb9617 says:

    I preferred the days when MacT was just a crappy coach, which he often was, and not a raving lunatic, which I'm pretty sure he wasn't.

    This is incorrect.

  56. HBomb says:

    It's Liam Reddox people. I can summarize my thoughts on the matter in three simple words:

    No big loss.

    If he wanted a one-way deal, I'm glad the Oilers said no. There's no place for him in their top 14 forwards.

    Penner-Horcoff-Hemsky
    O'Sullivan-Gagner-Nilsson
    Moreau-Cogliano-Pisani
    Jacques-Pouliot-Stortini
    EXT: Potulny, MacIntyre, Brule

    That's one heavy already.

  57. uni says:

    NBOilerFan: Quinn likes big bodies as much as the next guy. Add skating ability and a mean streak to the equation in JFJ and his stock only rises.

    Considering the patience Quinn brought along Antropov and Ponikarovsky with, I'm hoping JFJ has a similar development curve. If JFJ turns into a 20G 40A crash'n'bang type in the show I think Quinn might get beatified.

  58. godot10 says:

    //Moreau was not an actual NHLer last year, in my estimation. Gilbert was borderline, given his defensive woes. But the rest I agree with.//

    Gilbert played the toughest or 2nd toughest defensive minutes on the Oilers, maintaining top tier offensive performance, all with a bad back. Gilbert, Souray, and Staios were also the top 3 penalty killing option.

    And he's a borderline NHL'er?

  59. doritogrande says:

    Uni:

    That's a bit overly optimistic for JFJ don't you think? I'm a JFJ fan too, but I don't think he's ever going to be a 20-goal scorer at this level, let alone a player hitting 60 points in a season.

    He's got good speed for a big guy and he hits like a Mack truck, but Ethan Moreau has more hockey sense than poor Crazytrain.

    IMO, best case scenario here is he develops into an energetic defensive stalwart who can play the body. A Travis Moen if you will. Capable of topping out at 30 points per season.

  60. Master Lok says:

    Considering Crazy Train's history of 0 pts and 959 games or something like that, I'd be happy if JFJ scored 10 goals in a season. That would be a breakthrough.

  61. uni says:

    doritogrande:

    Yep, I think you misunderstood my post, we both agree fully. If JFJ carves out a Moreau type niche in the NHL I'd be happy. I was just saying that if he ever became a 40P guy that Quinn should be sainted cause there'd have to be some kind of divine intervention.

    I would have said deified, but I think godhood only comes with a Stanley Cup.

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