Trade Watch Day 14 (Or So)

The Edmonton Oilers have too many forwards for two few roster spots and crunch time is coming. The truth is that’s not the real problem. The real problem is that the Oilers have procured more minute (read: mine-yute) men than they can use, and players of that type are often waiver material or available for much less than 100 cents on the dollar.

The Oilers need a veteran right-handed center to form the nucleus of a responsible 2-way line, they need to offload contract dollars before next summer and they need some Fernando Pisani insurance. Pat Quinn has evaluated the roster and based on public comments agrees with those who watched this team a year ago: the holes are real and they are spectacular.

So, if Steve Tambellini really is a better General Manager than Kevin Lowe, wouldn’t now be a good time to prove it?

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244 Responses to "Trade Watch Day 14 (Or So)"

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  1. NBOilerFan says:

    Amen to that.

    I just posted on the previous thread that I believe neither Brule nor Pouliot have proved enough at TC to keep them up. It's been said on the blogsphere for the past year that we need a veteran center, preferrably with some size, who can win draws and kill penalties.

    We are far to weak down the middle. If that means waiving or trading one or both of Brule/Pouliot, so be it. Or move one of the bigger contracts i.e. Moreau/Staios/Pisani/Nilsson.

    Lets go Tambellini, prove your worth.

  2. Woodguy says:

    Quinn commented in the paper today that while he has "input" into the roster decisions, management makes the final decisions.

    Can someone please make sure Kevin Lowe is no where near the team for the next week please?

  3. eggie says:

    They really need to sign Manny Maholtra while he's still avai… ooops.

    Ah well. At least we have Comrie?

  4. shanetrain says:

    GET RID OF HEMSKY WHILE THE VALUE IS HIGH!

    Dipsy doodle around the neutral zone, lose puck … rinse repeat.

    Enough!

    The answer to this teams problems revolves around a Hemsky trade.

  5. Woodguy says:

    They have needed a 3rd line center for 2 years now.

    There is absolutely no reason to believe they will actually address this need.

    Not until Cogliano gets traded.

    I'm not saying that's the right decision, (it could be), but they are going to keep a center spot open for him until they are able to move him.

    Bob McKenzie was mentioning on Stauffer show yesterday that Cogs/Gagner can't exist on the same team as the fill the same need, 2nd line center. I agree with him. (especially if Cogs doesn't want to play wing)

    I like Cogs a lot, but his presence helps create the unbalance in the lineup.

    Given that Tambo got a serviceable AHL/4th line NHLer in Stone for a backup goalie when the market was 5-7 round draft picks, and got 2 years of POS for 20 games of Cole, I actually have faith he will make a good deal.

    It just may take a while to find that deal.

    If they ship out Staios for a pick they can free up some $$$ to help make a Cogs trade possible (to take back more salary than they are shipping out) Staios still have the "Steady Steve" reputation in the NHL, don't kid yourself he is tradeable. Not to a team anywhere near the cap, but he is tradeable.

  6. eggie says:

    Hemsky is our only definitive 1st liner. He's our difference maker. He's our offensive catalyst not named Lubomir. He's our PP quaterback. And he's cheap.

  7. HBomb says:

    Day 14? Try day 451.

    shanetrain….seriously? Hemsky's had a bad camp, but that does not mean you even entertain the thought of trading our best forward.

    Yes, let's trade our only high-end skill guy as he enters his peak years for more grinders and pluggers. That's a great idea! (end sarcasm)

  8. Woodguy says:

    The answer to this teams problems revolves around a Hemsky trade.

    Yes, get rid of the best value contract on a team full of overpays.

    That's exactly the solution.

    Problem: This team can't check AHL players let alone a real NHL line

    Solution: Get rid of your best offensive player on a good contract.

    Kevin, is that you?

  9. eggie says:

    It's scary.

    Last offseason, the fans were shouting, "SIGN GLENCROSS! PLEASE DON'T LET HIM LEAVE". And then management didn't sign him. Then the fans yelled, "SIGN REASONER OR ANOTHER CAPABLE PKer. PLEASE!". And they didn't listen.

    This year, we're again yelling, "SIGN A CAPABLE 3RD LINE CENTER/PKer/FACEOFF MAN". They're not listening.

    With their knee-jerk reactions, fans usually aren't right when they play armchair GM. But it's becoming painfully obvious that, in the case of the Oilers, even the most obvious holes are acknowledge by the fans, but aren't being filled by management.

  10. Steve says:

    But it's becoming painfully obvious that, in the case of the Oilers, even the most obvious holes are acknowledge by the fans, but aren't being filled by management.

    Don't make the mistake of assuming that denizens of the Oilogosphere are representative of the fan base as a whole.

  11. George B says:

    Totally agree Steve.

    I lost total faith in management of this team with…"All of a sudden, I looked and gee, we have a lot of defensemen."

    The teams dysfunction in correcting holes in the last few years has been terrible.

    Goaltending monsters, Too many defensemen, Grinding wingers, PKs, 3rd line C….

  12. Black Dog says:

    I read a comment on a Journal story today where a guy advocated cutting Hemsky, Horcoff, Penner, Pisani and Moreau loose and a good number of other commenters agreed with him.

    So there you go.

  13. Boondock says:

    http://twitter.com/nielson1260

    Dustin Neilson, the new 1260 morning guy, has posted that EDM/NAS are talking trade. No clue how legit this guy's sources are or what NAS might be looking for. They were rumoured to be in the Kessel sweepstakes, which suggests they want more scoring.

  14. oilerdago says:

    It has been painfully obvious that a trade has been needed but other than Brian Burke, most GM's are shuffling the existing deck (or in the case of Tambellini, re-arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic).

    I get the sense that the solution senior management has resigned itself to this year is going to be see how much further Daddy Warbucks (Katz) is going to open his wallet to cover the mistakes (burying guys in the minors).

    In other words, I'll believe a trade when I see it.

  15. bookie says:

    I think that the management really wanted to see what Brule, Nilsson, Penner, and others were going to bring this year before they started making trades. In their perfect world (i.e. if Tambi could control things), I suspect that they would love to play 8-10 real games before dumping Nilsson or Brule or others.

    They have done their best to create urgency/oppertunity amongst these players to bring out their best (all of the talk about real oppertuniities for Rubbydubs and real concerns for the Muckymucks). They want to create a 'false presure' on those guys to show who and what they are in the Post MacT world.

    Tambi knows that trading becomes much more difficult once the seasons starts, so he will use this camp as a measure of the guys and will move one or two to fill whatever need we have.

    The fear that Tambi has is that he ships Nilsson away and Nilsson becomes Miro Satan. The others (Schemp, Brulue, etc.) are not good enough to fetch anything back in exchange. So we have to give up someone that the recipient team feels could be really good for them to get something decent back. Also, I suspect that we need to accept a similar overpay in exchange for whoever we give up.

    Now, we may also see a bigger change, someone like Cogs (a real asset with a fairly certain upside) for someone with a proven ability.

    So, my arguement all summer is that the Oilers management want to see what they have ON THE ICE before making a trade. I am starting to think that some players have made it clear enough for the GM to pull the trigger before the season. I also think that the sense that they can 'ride out' the current lack of balance may be fading (i.e. we don't look like we have 3 kick ass scoring lines).

    So, the chances of a trade before the season have increase a fair bit in my mind.

  16. NBOilerFan says:

    Boondock said…
    http://twitter.com/nielson1260

    Dustin Neilson, the new 1260 morning guy, has posted that EDM/NAS are talking trade. No clue how legit this guy's sources are or what NAS might be looking for. They were rumoured to be in the Kessel sweepstakes, which suggests they want more scoring.

    Legwand, perhaps?

    Ahhh wishful thinking.

  17. DBO says:

    Nashville hey. Well Dan Hamhuis would be my wish, but it won't happen. Would anyone do a Gagner or Cogliano (with a pick or prospect) for Hamhuis. then we could move one of our top 4 for a top 6 winger.

    Cogliano and a pick/prospect for Hamhuis
    Grebeshkov/Glbert for Horton

    2 moves and we are better. Probably not enough for hamhuis, but he's a UFA next year so he'll be getting a raise to $4.5 mill or so.

  18. bookie says:

    btw, I do like the chances of a good trade. Our defense are of much greater value than 3rd line centres right now. So I can see something like.

    Crappy Oiler Forward & Good Oiler Dman for Other teams Crappy Dman and Good Forward.

  19. spOILer says:

    The Gagner/Cogliano issue I raised 2 years ago when I first advocating trading one for J. Staal.

    The issue becomes somewhat mitigated though by one of them playing wing.

    And Bobby Mac yesterday partly blamed the Oilers' unsuccessful season on the poor showings by Gilbert and Grebs, both of whom had fine years by my estimation.

    San Jose needs a one for many deal, bad.

  20. Traktor says:

    Trade Gagner. Cogliano has always been the better player and always will be.

  21. spOILer says:

    Traktor said:

    Cogliano has always been the older player and always will be.

    Fixed it for you. No worries, free service.

  22. Ribs says:

    Man….Nashville doesn't have anyone for us. A taker for Brule/Schremp?

    ….A goalie?

  23. DBO says:

    Ribs: hamhuis is a perfect fit for our D. A top 4 guy who is a shutdown tough dman who can be paired with Vishnovsky. I would send them gagner or Cogliano in a heartbeat for him. then move an offensive dman for a top 6 forward. Maybe Greb for Stafford or Horton?

  24. Yeti says:

    Traktor – while you could prove to be correct, it seems a little premature to be making such statements. Gagner is over two years younger than Cogs. I'm betting that in two years time Gagner is a hell of a lot more valuable to this team than Cogs is at present. JMO.

  25. Jonathan Willis says:

    Love the Seinfeld reference, LT.

  26. Sean says:

    Trade Moreau – The guy has 10 ft of open space and cant receive an open ice pass. We're supposed to be a skill team and our captain is our least skilled player. I get that he is gritty but he's also taking 5 penalties for each open ice hit. Trade him and a smurf for the best possible return. I get that its preseas but I figured after this year Moreau would come out guns-a-blazing and I just don't think he has it anymore.

  27. Woodguy says:

    "Legwand, perhaps?"

    Listening to Gregor interview the beat writer for the Preds the other day, he mentioned that everyone is tired of waiting for Legwand to become what he was supposed to be when they drafted him 2nd overall.

    So he may be on the outs.

    He is 4.5M/yr until the end of 2013-2014…ugh.

    Last 4 years he has played 44,78,65,and 73 games. Not great, not terrible.

    What would you trade for him?

    Cogs is off the table imo.

    Gotta clear out 4.5M

    Staois and Nilsson make that much. What does Nashville need that you would have to add to those two?

    Hell, its old Oiler year, so why not Cogs, Grebs, and Schremp for Arnott!?

  28. Woodguy says:

    Obv. Staios and Nilsson for Legward was tongue in cheek

  29. Ribs says:

    DBO- Seems like a sidewise move to make to me. It also relies on two trades to happen to fill all of the holes. I would think it would be an unlikely situation.

  30. Rick says:

    Why would we move a skill guy at 50 cents on dollar just to make it below the cap? And for a "grindy" third line center who are a dime a dozen?

    I'd move a defenseman now to get under the cap and see how things go with the undersized skill guys then move one from a position of strength at the deadline.

  31. Rick says:

    The only other option is hiding Nilsson in Springfield, but even with his salary and poor results I doubt he clears waivers…

  32. Mr DeBakey says:

    "Legwand, perhaps?"

    Legwand is very Horcoffian

    I'd base a deal around Cogliano + Staios for Legwand.

    When the Oilers were chasing UFA Kariya a couple of July Firsts ago,
    I checked Kariya's numbers at Hockey Analysis.
    Kariya & Erat were plus players with Legwand,
    but not apart from him – GF down, GA up.

    Legwand would totally change the structure & quality of the Oiler's Top-9.

  33. hunter1909 says:

    Tambellini seems less and less like a competant GM. And more and more like a KLowe/Katz "yes man".

    In answer to your question. :)

    How can anyone so much as dare to suggest trading Moreau, Staios, Pisani, or Horcoff – the nucleus of our 2006 glory?

  34. Woodguy says:

    Tambellini seems less and less like a competant GM. And more and more like a KLowe/Katz "yes man".

    How so?

  35. bookie says:

    How can anyone so much as dare to suggest trading Moreau, Staios, Pisani, or Horcoff – the nucleus of our 2006 glory?

    Agreed, we should totally trade Moreau and Staios for Thornton and Heatly. This team is run by idiots.

  36. Traktor says:

    Trading Cogliano for Legwand would be moronic.

    Legwand is a 45 point player for **** sakes.

    Zero chance he outperforms his 4.5 million paycheck.

  37. Traktor says:

    "Why would we move a skill guy at 50 cents on dollar just to make it below the cap? And for a "grindy" third line center who are a dime a dozen?"

    Because we're idiots.

    Plus Legwand has a "wide range of skills".

  38. Mr DeBakey says:

    "Legwand is a 45 point player for **** sakes"

    Maybe even a bit less

    He got his big contract after shooting 17.6%.
    Man, evey GM falls for that.

    That's why I had Staios going back in the Package,
    dump a bad contract, add a bad one.

  39. Oilmaniac says:

    "the holes are real and they are spectacular."

    Hehe.. you've definitely not been pulling punches LT

    Eggie.. i dunno.. i cheered moving on from ol reasoner.. seeing him as a first line option made me cringe.. I wanted to see that tool out of MacT's reach.. but that doesnt mean it wasnt clear 'after' that there was a major hole, as per the beginning of the post, that hasnt been dealt with adequately..

    but yes,.. watching glencross score two (one being a breakaway shorty) was like using a knife to rip off an old scab, then using the same knife to rub salt in the wound.. all for..??

  40. Gord says:

    Cogliano's preseason faceoff percentage:

    64% last night (7/11)
    46% against Vancouver (6/13)
    55% game before that against NYI (6/11)

    He was asked to improve on the dot – so far it appears he has… Cogliano is NOT the problem on faceoffs.

  41. Smytty777 says:

    Malhotra for $700,000 in San Jose?

    *[insert appropriate swear word/curse of Oilers management here]!

  42. Boondock says:

    Nashville has quite a few bottom six guys. Maybe a Nilsson for Jones/Smithson/Ward/Guite type deal?

  43. uni says:

    It's painful watching how the cap crunch is hamstringing the Oilers, with a fair sized pool of FA players who can fill their needs but can't be signed and are getting plucked by other teams for pennies on the dollar.

    Makes me wonder about Bob Gainey's cracking under the pressure and resulting spending spree and multi-5 year contract blowout this Summer. Maybe it works, but I doubt it.

  44. Mr DeBakey says:

    "Legwand is a 45 point player for **** sakes"

    Maybe even a bit less

    But, you know, with easier match-ups, maybe more.

    Last season, whom did Legwand face the most from each team [in descending order]:
    CBS -RICK NASH
    STL -BRAD BOYES
    ANA -TODD MARCHANT
    CHI -MARTIN HAVLAT
    MIN -PIERRE-MARC BOUCHARD
    PHO -SHANE DOAN
    DET -PAVEL DATSYUK
    EDM -ALES HEMSKY
    COL -MILAN HEJDUK
    CGY -MATTHEW LOMBARDI
    VAN -HENRIK SEDIN
    ….
    I bet he looked forward to those Anaheim games

  45. Ribs says:

    Goaltender Nikolai Khabibulin allowed four goals and he was unable to play in the third period due to dehydration. -TSN

    That's just kind of funny.

  46. Undisclosed Personal Reasons says:

    Maholtra for $700K means there was no chance of him coming to Edmonton. He was looking for a contender.

  47. Bruce says:

    Ribs: Tough night for Khabibulin last night. He looked out of sync from the get-go. Wasn't using his stick to good effect either stopping the puck or handling it. He was lackadaisical on the first goal, and had real sloppy timing on the fourth. Like Vokoun on Friday, I would have given him the mercy pull after 40 minutes, dehydration or no. I guess the good news is that maybe it explains his poor night; OTOH it's not too encouraging that he became physically unable to perform in his first test of 20+ shots. Drink some water, man, this is a dry climate.

  48. Yeti says:

    Gord – we might want a slightly larger sample size before we go jumping to conclusions.

  49. Woodguy says:

    Did anyone see the Glencross interview on TSN?

    I didn't but one of my staff was telling me that Glencross said "I wanted to play for the Oilers, I wanted to sign there. I even call them myself but no one returned my calls"

    Awesome job Lowe.

    Lowe: "70 lbs salmon are jumping in the boat?? Throw them back!! I'm only after the GREAT WHITE WHALE"

    later

    …."no white whale? Grab those 12lb salmon, we need some fish!!"

  50. grant says:

    And the Cogliano overvaluing continues unabated. He can't win draws and doesn't want move to the wing, he has trade value, and Gagner has more upside. If we can address needs by moving Cogs, we simply MUST do it.

  51. kris says:

    Hahahaha.

    The following is found at the oilers.nhl.com game preview for tonight:

    "Brule can only play 3 more games in the NHL before he must clear wavers."

    I thought we were through this.

    http://oilers.nhl.com/club/preview.htm?id=2009010080&navid=DL|EDM|home

  52. George B says:

    Woodguy.

    The Yesman reference is to signing a small skilled forward to a team of small skilled forwards when the owner and the small skilled forward's dad are buddies.

    Agree that was not a good sign

  53. Master Lok says:

    Boondock said…
    http://twitter.com/nielson1260

    Dustin Neilson, the new 1260 morning guy, has posted that EDM/NAS are talking trade. No clue how legit this guy's sources are or what NAS might be looking for. They were rumoured to be in the Kessel sweepstakes, which suggests they want more scoring.

    Well, Comrie came back. Could Arnott come back?

  54. Bruce says:

    Glencross said "I wanted to play for the Oilers, I wanted to sign there. I even call them myself but no one returned my calls"

    FFS.

    Which today not only stands for the usual "FerFuxSakes" but also "First Fucking Star", which GlenX was in his old barn last night. Watching him play one excellent game after another for the friggin' Flames is goddam hard to swallow.

    Moreover, if you go through LT's archives from sping 2008, you'll find about 90% of us were on the "sign GlenX now!" bandwagon long before July 1. That was piss-poor asset management before they got distracted by the Great White Hossa was blowing spray on the distant horizon.

    Great trade by Lowe to bring the guy in, lousy move to let him walk. At least we got assets for CFP. *ducking and running"

  55. Schitzo says:

    I thought we were through this.

    I genuinely hope that Brule gets claimed. Simply to show that the media is not infallible.

  56. hunter1909 says:

    Further from my carefully researched and studiously prepared Tambellin rants coming down my sewer…err pipeline…

    Hilarious how so few talk about this guy having been the official GM for well over a year now. What exactly has he been doing, aside from chasing great white whales?

    So many mere OIler bloggers seem to address this team's weaknesses, while Tambellini talks big and carries his toothpick.

  57. William says:

    There were a fair number of people out there who where "meh" about GlenX, citing his small sample size and higher shooting % with the Oil. But man, I definitely thought he was worth a $1.5M/yr wager. The guy brought it every night (something the Oilers sure lacked last year) AND he was the fastest skater in the NHL that year FFS. Plus he made Brodz/Storts look good, lived with and bonded with the young kids, and WANTED to play in the apparent hellhole that is Edmonton.

  58. spOILer says:

    From Spectors':

    RDS.CA: reports former NY Rangers forward Jaromir Jagr is both trying to negotiate a contract extension with KHL team Avangard Omsk but has also instructed his agent to contact NHL teams to determine the possibility of an NHL return next season.

    There also a report that Philly dumped a prospect to Nashville to clear a contract so they can sign Betts.

  59. DBO says:

    One note on Glencross. he did bring it every night, but they had a small smaple size after they got him. remember that last year he had like 12 gols playing some good minutes in the top 9 of calgary. yes he brings other things, but if we signed him for $1.5 mill, people would have been pissed and it would have been viewed as a classic Oiler overpay. A million woudl hav been a good deal, and yes managament did drop the ball, but I seem to remember that while we all liked what Glencross brought, mos people weren't for giving him that much of a raise.

  60. knighttown says:

    They are trying JF Jacques at #1 LW. If people weren't sure what the coaching staff thinks we need (a power forward) that should clear it up real quick. Use a surplus defensive asset to acquire a big, tough and skilled young forward.

    #1
    Dallas- they've lost Zubov and could really use a few puck movers or PP quarterback. They've also got three great power forwards in Morrow, Ott and Neal.

    Souray + Nilsson for Morrow
    Grebs for Ott or Neal

    #2
    Phoenix
    Someone is going to rob them of Shane Doan. It's one thing for kids to put up with playing front of 200 fans but a great captain and vetern shouldn't have to.

    Doan for Cogliano and Smid

    #3
    Nashville
    That's a smart organization who loves themselves assets. They seem to know when to rebuild and in this years Western Conference, now is that time.

    Cogliano + Smid for Arnott

  61. Schitzo says:

    I'm willing to defer to Renney on whether Betts is a good fit or not. I assume that if Betts really was the answer, management would listen to Renney about it.

  62. Schitzo says:

    And knighttown – You're burning assets to pick up 33 and 34 year old players in your proposal… I can't get on board with that.

  63. kris says:

    Yeah Knighttown those are interesting ideas, but I'm with Schitzo.

    I get that we want to add veterans now, so we can make the playoffs, but this is still a team in development. You're throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

    Adding Arnott won't win us the cup, and Cogliano is one of our most important building blocks for the future.

    We need to add a cheap, perhaps flawed veteran, without giving up any youth.

    The other option is trading one of our good young, soft players, for a good young player with defensive panache, e.g. a J. Staal type. But that's easier said than done, it would seem.

  64. Perry K says:

    LT said…….

    Grebeshkov-Visnovsky: This has potentially hilarious possibilities. If Grebeshkov forgets the tinfoil hat and Lubo goes walkabout the Oilers might be looking on a few three-on-none's going the other way.

    Sorry for the comment in the wrong post, but that is hilarious!

    Laughed my a$$ off!

  65. Perry K says:

    "Woodguy said……

    I like Cogs a lot, but his presence helps create the unbalance in the lineup."

    I have to agree. May be Quinn can figure out how to play both Gagner and Cogliano at Centre and still have a productive line up. But I cannot see it from the present vantage point.

  66. Bar Qu says:

    Thank goodness we have LT to read and don't have to rely on Gregor. The guy is connected but geez does he write a lot of tripe and try to pass it off as pearls of wisdom.

    Do you think that Staios might be a calming influence on Smid, and not a detriment like many fans feel?.

    There's a phrase I feel bubbling beneath the surface to reply here, but I just can't put my finger on it.

    BTW, is there really any substance to the Nashville trade rumour? And who (besides Arnott, gag) would be helpful to the team, who Nashville would give up?

  67. NBOilerFan says:

    Where is LT?

    And where is his game day thread?

    Send the search party…. to the nearest tavern. Save him from a drowning of sorrows of which only a 14th day of trade watching can instill.

  68. NBOilerFan says:

    In teh meantime… lookslike Schremp is getting a good shot to finally show something;

    As per Tensers twitter;

    Oilers Lines Tonight vs. Tampa Bay

    Moreau – Gagner – Cogliano
    Penner – Schremp – Eberle
    Stone – Brule – Nilsson
    MacIntyre – Reddox – Stortini

    Grebeshkov – Staios
    Smid – Visnovsky
    Chorney – Gilbert

    Deslauriers
    Dubnyk

  69. doritogrande says:

    I lucked out and scored free tickets to tonight's game.

    As much as I'd like to say my focus will be completely on the Oilers, I can't pass up the chance to examine the game of one Viktor Hedman.

    Icecastles, if you're lurking I'm planning to meet up with Showerhead somewhere in the first intermission. I'll check back later if you're interested.

  70. NBOilerFan says:

    Just in case anybody hasn't seen it…

    http://www.tsn.ca/columnists/bob_mckenzie/?id=292305

    And Dave Tippett will be the new coach of the Coyotes….

    http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=292399

  71. William says:

    DBO: This is what GlenX brought to the Flames last year:

    QUALCOMP -0.013
    QUALTEAM 0.053
    CORSI 10.2
    GFON/60 3.29
    GAON/60 2.40

    He played mostly 3rd/4th line, potted 13G + 27A for 40pts, only 4 Flames played tougher competition, played with slightly above avg. teammates, and had GF differential of +0.89/60 mins. I wouldn't call $1.5M an overpay for that. Plus he actually signed at $1.3M per yr. There are a whole lot of other Oilers I would call overpays before I got down to him.

    But that ship has sailed. The thing now is for the Oilers to find and sign more players like that.

  72. kris says:

    Quite right William,

    The real sin isn't letting go of a GlennX style player, though that was a mistake.

    The real sin is not trying to bring in other GlennX style players.

    Decent 3rd liners exist. GlennX isn't the only one. They can be signed or traded for.

    I think management would respond that we have too many players, too many contracts, and are too close to the cap to bring in more players. And they'd be right.

    But that shows that the team should've found a way to dump some salary this offseason. And don't say it's impossible. Calgary did it. We should've too.

  73. doritogrande says:

    Moreau – Gagner – Cogliano

    Yet the Oilers site doesn't list Cogliano on the roster. They have Pisani listed instead of Cogliano.

    If anyone's interested, the Tampa lineup is thus:

    9 Steve Downie RW
    4 Vincent Lecavalier C
    13 Alex Tanguay LW
    19 Stephane Veilleux C
    11 Jeff Halpern C
    43 James Wright C
    12 Ryan Malone LW
    91 Steven Stamkos C
    26 Martin St. Louis RW
    17 Todd Fedoruk LW
    38 Paul Sczcechura C
    16 Drew Miller LW
    5 Mattias Ohlund D
    77 Victor Hedman D
    2 Lukas Krajicek D
    14 Andrej Meszaros D
    6 Kurtis Foster D
    8 Matt Walker D
    41 Mike Smith G

    Predictions? The Oilers are going to get hosed by a very veteran roster. I'm looking for Smac to send Downie to IR.

  74. Doogie2K says:

    Someone is going to rob them of Shane Doan. It's one thing for kids to put up with playing front of 200 fans but a great captain and vetern shouldn't have to.

    Doan for Cogliano and Smid

    We need to sign or trade for Steve Kelly so we can include him the deal. It'd be poetic.

    And Dave Tippett will be the new coach of the Coyotes….

    Don Maloney is a smart man. I do hope Niewendyk comes to regret that move.

  75. Schitzo says:

    Man, I guess Tippett must have hated being out of work. Who would willingly sign on to that mess in Phoenix right now?

    No Pouliot tonight. Good sign or bad?

  76. Doogie2K says:

    Who would willingly sign on to that mess in Phoenix right now?

    Someone who figures that if he makes the playoffs, the Jack Adams is basically his to lose.

  77. Yeti says:

    Schitzo – in Pouliot's case its probably an ugly sign.

  78. kris says:

    I want to listen to Rod Phillips have to try to say this name:

    38 Paul Sczcechura C

    "Uhh, number 38, uhh, er Schez.. uh Shurech, ehh, ehh,… uh, Shecheshecherura. Oh screw it, I quit."

  79. Traktor says:

    "Man, I guess Tippett must have hated being out of work. Who would willingly sign on to that mess in Phoenix right now?"

    The Coyotes could very well be the next Avs and for the next decade we'll wonder what would have happened if they had won a cup in Phoenix instead of KC.

    Who would have ever predicted hockey would be such a hit in KC!!??

  80. Traktor says:

    Pat Quinn said is his pregame that Marc Poolio has an minor injury.

  81. digger says:

    With 18/89/13 being a line tonight, I'll be curious to see how much Moreau sticks up for this team's two most talented primordial dwarfs.

    When Quinn said that some veterans seems to be only worried about their own preparation for the upcoming season, I wonder if thecaptain is one of them.

  82. Perry K says:

    " Schitzo said…
    Man, I guess Tippett must have hated being out of work. Who would willingly sign on to that mess in Phoenix right now?

    No Pouliot tonight. Good sign or bad?

    "

    Good for the Oilers, bad for MAP!

  83. Traktor says:

    "With 18/89/13 being a line tonight, I'll be curious to see how much Moreau sticks up for this team's two most talented primordial dwarfs."

    He stood by and watched as Cogliano was crosschecked in the back of the head by Lundmark last night so I wouldn't expect much different tonight. Although its possible that Moreau didn't see Cogliano get roughed up because of his glass eye.

  84. Showerhead says:

    Whoop! Getting ready to meet up with some friends before the game. No press passes but 8th row seats and a good camera… and all the kids are saying there's this new sport called Rob Schremp Hockey I might get to see too!

  85. Mr DeBakey says:

    Would I!?
    Would I!?

    As for the Gameday thread
    This is it, I think
    Its dated for today

    Maybe LT thought with game time at 6:00 pm Mountain time,
    Manitoba time would be 1962.

    I'm here all week
    Oh yeah
    Just say no to Jordin TooToo

  86. bookie says:

    I didn't but one of my staff was telling me that Glencross said "I wanted to play for the Oilers, I wanted to sign there. I even call them myself but no one returned my calls"

    I have no problem with quite a few moves that Lowe made, including many that are unpopular here. The GlenX screw up was one I was quite unhappy with at the time. There was almost no risk at that price.

    I actually think this is the moment that Lowe knew he was losing it and the concept of stepping away from the day to day arose. I think Lowe knows he screwed this up. He thought that he could deal with GlenX after the Jagr thing.

    If you watched Lowes interviews following the hiring of Tambellini, there was a contritness there about not being able to handle it.

    I think Lowe regrets the GlenX screw up more than most of us.

  87. Dennis says:

    Gord: nice job posting 13's latest face-off stats; I hadn't realized he'd put up three decent games in a row.

    12 to Nsh or the Preds trying Anything to get more offense always makes a lot of sense.

  88. kinger says:

    He stood by and watched as Cogliano was crosschecked in the back of the head by Lundmark last night so I wouldn't expect much different tonight. Although its possible that Moreau didn't see Cogliano get roughed up because of his glass eye.

    Before we all get huffy on Moreau let us not forget the game last year where Phaneuf rode Cogliano hard into the boards. Retribution came swiftly as Chopper responded by crosschecking Dion in the face then pummeling him to the ice.

    I'm not a big Moreau supporter and I believe he is best suited for a 4th line role, however you cannot call him out for not standing up for his teammates. This is something he has done for as long as I have followed the Oilers.

  89. quain says:

    I think Lowe regrets the GlenX screw up more than most of us.

    If Lowe regrets it, it's the kind of regret that someone has when they're screwing their secretary on their lunch break. Sure, he might feel bad about cheating on his wife right after he's done, but goddammit, he's going to plow that red-head again tomorrow.

    "Sure, I could've had Glencross… but I nearly got Hossa!"

    "Sure, I could stop cheating on my wife… but she burnt the roast last night… Annie! Get in the car, we're going for lunch! Robbie! Getcha fuckin' shinebox, I need an alibi."

  90. Thrillho says:

    Glencross is gone. It's been over a year. Let it go.

    Hejda is gone. It's been over two years. Let it go.

    I saw their value as much as anyone, but constantly talking about them isn't going to bring them back. Please let it go. Seriously.

  91. the 0 in 0rca is for 0 cups says:

    what surprises me is who, in my opinion, is looking like our best forward now.

    here's a hint: used to eat a lot of cheeseburgers, wear no shirt with white pants, had a thing for..

  92. William says:

    Thrillho: like I said, the ship has sailed on those two so no sense dwelling on it. The reason they keep coming up is because the lesson these two players teach us remains apparently unlearned/unheeded by Oilers management: two quality players on value contracts capable of outplaying their opposition and performing above replacement value. Rather key in a salary cap world.

    If you have a bunch of these guys in your lineup, you're not only winning the game-day matchups, but also saving money that can be spent on available top-end talent. Problem is the Oilers seem to put big-game hunting first and foremost, and then worry about filling in the holes afterwards. It worked in 05-06 with Pronger, but backfired dreadfully last year and this year with Jagr/Hossa/Heatley. They spent so much time trying to land Veronica that they missed out on all the Betty's that can help out elsewhere.

  93. Thrillho says:

    @William

    All good points, and I completely agree. I'm just tired of hearing about. Hopefully they've sobered up and will avoid the big game hunting from now on. (Side note: I could have used that advice a few years ago…yikes!)

    Hopefully they can find a way to have both Veronica and Betty in the future. Hmmm…

  94. Bruce says:

    Glencross is gone. It's been over a year. Let it go.

    Guilty as charged. I bought it up today cuz seeing him be First Fucking Star in our barn with the difference-making two goals last night was salt in the wound. FerFuxSakes.

    But you're right, Thrillho, we gotta move on. Whoever said we need GlenX-type players got it right. Last year we had next to nobody in the $1-2 MM bracket, and only Grebs in that range who outperformed his pact.

    Icecastles, if you're lurking I'm planning to meet up with Showerhead somewhere in the first intermission.

    Enjoy the game, DG / SH / IC? . As SK Oiler Fan did the other day, please file a report … there's nothing quite like being there.

    Manitoba time would be 1962.

    Ouch!

  95. kris says:

    "I think Lowe regrets the GlenX screw up more than most of us."

    Probably, since it's his job and just our hobby, and there's no doubt the guy is competitive.

    The question is: what does he regret and why?

    My guess is he regrets not signing either Hossa or Jagr or GlennX. He'd do the same thing all over again if he had the chance to sign a Hossa. He's never said he made a mistake going for the big fish.

    Current management has the same attitude about going for big fish and not fixing the problems on the bottom 6. And that's what we hate. I think.

  96. Thrillho says:

    @ Bruce,

    The FFS from last night pissed me off as well, but what are you gonna do, right?!

    I'm a large Stortini fan also. Friends?!

  97. spOILer says:

    Whales aren't fish. They're mammaries. Big'Uns too.

    ;o)

  98. flamingpavelbure says:

    Bubble small guys
    (Excluded Comrie because of recent contract)

    O's 4 GP 6 PTS +4
    Nilsson 3 GP 3 PTS +1
    SamWise 2 GP 2 PTS +2
    ShineBox 2 GP 1 PT Even
    Cogliano 3 GP 1 PT -2
    Reddox 2 GP 0 PT Even
    Brulé 3 GP 0 PT -1
    Eberle 3 GP 0 PT -1

    Looks like Robert mah boy stepped up :P

  99. bookie says:

    The question is: what does he regret and why?

    I think Lowe realized that he was failing at juggling so many things. I have managed multiple projects all at once and know the feeling at that moment when you realize that you dropped a ball. If I am correct it was not long after that that Lowe stepped aside.

    Glencross is gone. It's been over a year. Let it go.

    I agree, but one of my key interests is how organizations function, make decisions, etc. so I sometimes like to revisit past decisions to consider the how and why the decision happened. Not with critisism in mind, but just to develop a better understanding of process.

  100. bookie says:

    So, Grez quits as coach and it appears as though he may come out in support of the move to Hamilton…

    Interesting.

  101. Marc says:

    The 20-20 hindsight on this site is rediculous. You can only and should only judge deals based on what was known at the time. And every deal involves an element of risk and uncertainty.

    Too many people here cherry pick the evidence – if a year or two after a deal you can say it didn't work then management are idiots. But if on the other hand it did work out, well then any uncertainty that existed at the time the deal was made is conveniently overlooked.

    Glencross and Pisani are two sides of the same coin – a relatively small sample size of good numbers right before free agency. Grebs and Brule are two sides of the same coin – former first round picks mishandled by their team. Smyth and Souray are two sides of the same coin – top tier players on the downside of their career who are prone to injury.

    If you hate that Glencross left then you have to love Pisani's deal – after all, they rewarded his two good months instead of letting him walk away and become a productive two way player for another team. If you hate the Brule deal then you have to hate the Grebs deal too. After all they traded an actual NHL player, albeit a limited one, for a prospect with a high ceiling that may amount to nothing. But if you hate that Glencross left and that Pisani is overpaid and the we gave up Torres for Brule but love that we stole Grebs from the Islanders, then all you're doing is hopping on the hindsight bandwagon.

    You can critise the Oilers management for having an incoherent strategy ie. rewarding some players for two good months, but not others. But this after the fact, 20-20 hindsight stuff is bullshit. Every deal has potential benefits and potential pitfalls and you can't possibly know when the deal is made which way it's going to work out. Criticising management for taking or not taking a particular risk, when you know how the story ends is pointless and doesn't demonstrate any particular skill or knowledge, so why waste everyone's time with it?

  102. bookie says:

    it appears as though he may come out in support of the move to Hamilton…

    More in-depth reading of the article (as opposed to the headline), suggest that there is no evidence of this…sorry.

  103. bookie says:

    The 20-20 hindsight on this site is rediculous. You can only and should only judge deals based on what was known at the time. And every deal involves an element of risk and uncertainty.

    Of course that is how you evaluate things. I am not suggesting anything different. I don't cherry pick, though I know others do. I have not critised the deals for Pisani, Moreau, or Staois because they were reasonible at the time. I never had a problem with the Torres trade and still do not.

    I see nothing wrong at all with analysing things from the past, as long as the analysis reflects the context of the past.

    So, I get your point and your frustration at people who pick selective examples of draft picks (for example) or trades and do not take the context into account.

    However, I disagree that discussions about the past have no benifit.

    With regards to Glencross, I think that a lowball offer would have tied him up for a year or two and that, like Brule, the risk was almost nothing.

  104. Woodguy says:

    Orca: Not a suprise. He was one of the best last year too with less motivation due to Coach issues and idiots like Terry Jones calling him a "coach killer"

    Re: GlenX. Not crying over split milk as much as flabbergasted that he called the Oilers himself and they didn't return his freaking call.

    Late game note: Hedman not playing

    *Clap,Clap*

  105. Ribs says:

    Pre game from Schremp is pretty funny. Just imagining him trying to block shots makes me giggle.
    Link

  106. doritogrande says:

    Late game note: Hedman not playing

    Son.Of.A.Bitch.

    He was one of the biggest reasons I wanted to go watch this game.

    I'm going to try and focus on Chorney, Eberle, Gagner and our goalie at the game. And, in continuing our "hingsight is 20-20" theme of today's rantings, I'll take a look at Alex Tanguay's game. He was available, yes?

  107. Bruce says:

    I'm a large Stortini fan also.

    Thrillho: I like large Stortini myself. I didn't realize there were any small Stortini.
    Friends?!

    'course. It's all table talk.

    Re: GlenX. Not crying over split milk as much as flabbergasted that he called the Oilers himself and they didn't return his freaking call.

    Right, that was new today. AND he was FFS, FFS.

    FFS!!!

    OK, now I can move on. I wish you well Curtis, your kind of player is pure gold. (Sniff)

    But this after the fact, 20-20 hindsight stuff is bullshit.

    Well it would be, Marc, if it was all after the fact. However, the stuff I was referring to is all date-stamped pre July 1. I haven't even looked it up, I just remember the discussion well, it went on for three or four months.

    For the record, I have all day for Fernando's contract. Anybody who commands 1/22 of the total cap hit and can outperform tough opp is delivering the goods. Injuries and illness were just possible futures when the deal was signed. Unfortunately, both happened.

    one of my key interests is how organizations function, make decisions, etc. so I sometimes like to revisit past decisions to consider the how and why the decision happened. Not with critisism in mind, but just to develop a better understanding of process.

    Mine too, Bookie. Trial and error only works if the organization learns from its mistakes. First part of that is identifying said mistakes. Cue GlenX.

    Sniff, FFS.

  108. knighttown says:

    @Marc

    It's not hindsight if the opinions were given at the time of the transaction. There are a lot of smart people here who are familiar with the entire league and understand the concept of the salary cap. They'll judge a trade instantly and it'll be recorded for all of eternity.

    My recollection of the Glencross summer is that the majority of LT disciples strongly supported signing him for 1 to 1.5. When remours jumped to 2 million, things turned.

    The Glencross for Tjarnstrom trade was largely ignored. I'd compare it to the Garon for Stone trade in that, we thought we got a 4th liner or PB guy.

    I supported both Brule for Torres and Bergeron for Grebeshkov. In both cases we lost the established player but we got some monetary savings and an intriguing prospect. Brule was well known and people forget how dominant Grebs was with Manchester of the AHL the year of the lockout.

    The Penner signing was pretty evenly split. LT, I believe supported it but I hated it from Day 1. I thought there was every chance we'd give away the next Dennis Potvin in Drew Doughty and we nearly did. I hated Vanek for 4 first too.

    Anyway, the point is that you can't blast people on here for using hindsight. If we have a fault its that we stick with our beliefs for too long when all signs point to the fact that we're wrong. For example, my pet is Ladi Smid. I've posted that with a little more grooming he'll be a number 2, shutdown guy by 28 but it looks like I could be out to lunch.

  109. NBOilerFan says:

    Maybe Lowetide drove to Winnipeg?

  110. Ender says:

    For the record, I have all day for Fernando's contract. Anybody who commands 1/22 of the total cap hit and can outperform tough opp is delivering the goods. Injuries and illness were just possible futures when the deal was signed. Unfortunately, both happened.

    I endorse this. I'll also add that every time Pisani's gotten injured, he's immediately gone onto the IR. You can't call a guy overpaid if his money doesn't count towards the cap. The long periods where he was gone could easily have had another player brought in.

  111. Dennis says:

    LT: it seems odd that we don't have a game thread on the one night where the game's actually televised, no?:)

    That being said I'm sorta iffy on watching this game because we aren't dressing a lot of the established guys and I'm really not sure what the TV sightlines are like in the Moose arena; though I am sure I'll find out soon enough.

    And it's hard not to lump in the failure to sign GlenX with the failure to bring back Hejda and it especially stings when both are on the record as waiting for the Oilers to call and both are bargains.

    It looks every poorer when you consider all the other big pacts we do have on the books and it's little mistakes like these – along with the bigger ones of course – that we have put us in the hole we're in right now.

  112. bookie says:

    The game is on TSN, thus far Craig MacT has been on every pregame game. I wonder?

    If he is they will talk abotu Gretzky for most of it anyway, but it would be funny if in some oIlers analysis he called Penner a cheezburger munching prancy priss…

  113. grant says:

    You can critise the Oilers management for having an incoherent strategy ie. rewarding some players for two good months, but not others. But this after the fact, 20-20 hindsight stuff is bullshit.

    We criticize on this side of the pond. ;)

  114. PDO says:

    Fantastically played 1 on 1 against Lecavalier by Smid.

  115. Black Dog says:

    Heh. All of these folks who still defend Lowe. Three years out of the playoffs not enough for you guys? Very soon we're going to see four I think.

    Quinn twists the knife a little there. This hasn't been a strong organization for a while.

    Ha. Awesome.

    If this club doesn't make the playoffs he's the next GM.

    We should go back and look at the moves Lowe has made.

    I think that people expected more for Pronger. Dennis hated it but someone went back and got quotes from a whole bunch (including me) who thought that Lupul might work out.

    Nearly everyone hated the Smyth deal.

    A few didn't like Bergeron.

    Souray was panned. PItkanen was applauded.

    Penner was panned. LT did too. People liked the Vanek deal more.

    Folks were upset about Hejda but Glencross was definitely split. When talk was around 2 folks said let him go, when it came out that it was 1.3 then it became more even. It definitely wasn't as unanimous as some say though. A lot of folks thought it was a gamble even at that amount, iirc.

    Visnovsky was a hit. The Torres move was panned.

    That's how I remember it.

    The thing is you can argue one by one that each move could be justified. But as a body of work it speaks for itself. The biggest problem is that they moved guys out and didn't replace them with similar or better value.

    Three years out of the playoffs as a cap team is absolutely unacceptable though.

  116. PDO says:

    … and then he has a terrible turnover.

  117. PDO says:

    Penner got some love from Quinn and is wearing an A tonight…

  118. kris says:

    For everyone crying over letting GlenX go, the 630 Ched guys just reminded me that we're better off than Calgary, who lost St. Louis on waivers.

    That's gotta hurt.

  119. NBOilerFan says:

    We're getting pretty exposed so far.

    Seems like we are still trying to do to much still individually, instead of making the simple plays.

    This is gonna take some time…. sit back and relax while we take a few weeks to get comfortable, while getting thumped nightly.

  120. Dennis says:

    Pat: Yeah, I smiled as well when Quinn cut up our past peformance.

    Anyway, that's enough of this game for me.

  121. NBOilerFan says:

    On a side note – Penner looks awesome. He has been incredible so far this TC, he looks in mid-season form already.

    Plus does anyone notice that he also seems to be playing with more of an edge, or more pissed off.

    Which is exactly how we need him to be. I sure how he keeps it up and doesn't take his foot of the pedal.

  122. NBOilerFan says:

    Dennis said…
    Pat: Yeah, I smiled as well when Quinn cut up our past peformance.

    You know, I'm not all that happy with hearing Quinn so quick to call out players already. He has been vauge in some respects, such as references to "veteran players" who we really don't know who he is referring to.

    But in his post game the other night, he called out 2 defensemen pretty harshly, actually made a pretty degrading remark about one.

    I didn't like MacT's calling ut of players or singling out a couple guys, and I hope that Quinn doesn't make this too much of a habit, at least not in the media.

    He might be 100% accurate, but I still hate to see this stuff getting aired in the media so much.

  123. Black Dog says:

    NB – first game I have seen and Penner looks motivated and fit. Good sign. Generally everyone else looks pretty crappy. Just preseason though. Keep telling myself that.

    Yeah Dennis, I've been saying it for a while now. This club finishes out of the money and Quinn will be GM. He's certainly clear about what this team is lacking – in a power struggle between him and Tambellini who do you think would lose?

  124. mc79hockey says:

    Plus does anyone notice that he also seems to be playing with more of an edge, or more pissed off.

    Which is exactly how we need him to be. I sure how he keeps it up and doesn't take his foot of the pedal.

    "He really meant it this time when he said that he'd stop cheating on me."

  125. Black Dog says:

    NB – well Quinn was referring to management, which made it that much better

    As for him being honest, I'm all for it. This group of players has a weird sense of entitlement and a false idea of how good they are considering that they haven't been in the playoffs in three years. For the most part they've done fuck all.

    Yet they act like they've won multiple Cups.

    They need a fire lit under their asses.

  126. kris says:

    MC:

    This is more like the first time Penner has admitted his problem and is fixing it.

    It's not like he has a habitual problem of looking this good in camp and then falling apart.

    Thus, the analogy with a spouse who can't stop cheating, despite continually promising to do so, doesn't hold.

    And don't forget, Penner just turned 26 and is entering his prime. It's not unreasonable to expect a forward entering that period in his career to improve.

  127. PDO says:

    Rob F^**in Schremp Hockey!

  128. gary b says:

    to borrow from a certain cereal box bear…

    "Can't get enough of that Sugartits!"

  129. Black Dog says:

    I want Penner to succeed, obviously because it would be good for the club but also because he's a funny guy. The whole thing last year where he broke into guys' rooms. The wheat beverages comment.

    Funny guy.

  130. Coach pb9617 says:

    kris – MC's hate of Penner is as unreasonable as LT's hate of Smid.

  131. mc79hockey says:

    I don't hate Penner. I hope he turns into a 35 goal scorer. I'm saying that the coach had reasons to be pissed with him, other coaches had reasons to be pissed with him in the past and, while I'm fine with the principle of not overlooking what a guy can do and focusing on his faults, when the guy seems like he could be a lot more if he gave a shit, I can understand the coach's frustration.

  132. Coach pb9617 says:

    I don't hate Penner.

    And LT doesn't hate Smid.

    Tone is lost on the internet.

  133. Black Dog says:

    Nice work on that CBC spot Ty.

    Is it true that Ron MacLean is your Dad? I heard a rumour. ;)

  134. kris says:

    the guy seems like he could be a lot more if he gave a shit

    The trouble with that is, that's true of most of the guys in the league that they could be better. Player x makes mistakes. He doesn't give a shit. Player X gets beat in a puck battle. He doesn't give a shit. Etc.

    I think it's pretty common for younger guys to take years to find their game. It's not so much about work ethic, and when it is it's hard to tell from our vantage point, but realizing what you need to change to be that tiny bit better, and how to change it.

    For Penner it's about quickness, which means he has to stay light, which is damn tough for some guys. But I see some smarter decisions in his positioning, too.

    There's more to it than effort and eating right and working out. Development is a lot of things, IMO. Experience and reading the play is huge, and Penner is improving their and doesn't get the credit for it.

  135. Lowetide says:

    I'd like to say something clever like they didn't deserve a GDT but fact is that I thought it was tomorrow night.

    Honest.

    Anyway, they're shitty.

    Coach: Just because i don't march in lock step re:Smid doesn't mean I hate him. I'll like him fine right up until the time someone actually knocks his head clean off.

  136. mc79hockey says:

    Yeah, I thought it was weird that you said LT hated Smid but then it was all confusing because LT's feelings towards Smid's are a lot more positive than mine towards Penner.

  137. boopronger says:

    I never like the penner signing. I like penner though – he is funny. People were saying that he would probably be over paid in the first couple seasons but underpaid in the last couple. Well its season 3 and i dont see it happening.

    It was just frustrating to see Mactavish wail on him verbally and then penner would play good for a few games and thats it.

    He will never play consistent for a full season imo. I just dont see it.

  138. mc79hockey says:

    There's more to it than effort and eating right and working out. Development is a lot of things, IMO. Experience and reading the play is huge, and Penner is improving their and doesn't get the credit for it.

    Yeah, but I think that with MacT, effort goes an awful long way. Every year he got ragged on for having his favourites who play because they work hard. If he felt Penner's effort was unacceptable, I'm inclined to defer to him on that. It does not, in my mind, speak well of Penner that he couldn't solve that problem before. If it's solved now, well, great but given what we saw for two years, you'll forgive me if I have doubts about his conversion.

  139. Coach pb9617 says:

    Is it wrong to repeatedly say "Huh? What?" to Downie when trash-talking?

    Or maybe just mouth the words instead of say them?

    He should be a Canuck.

  140. Coach pb9617 says:

    Wow. Gilbert looked friggin nice on that rush – but that was a really dangerous pass.

  141. Coach pb9617 says:

    Coach: Just because i don't march in lock step re:Smid doesn't mean I hate him. I'll like him fine right up until the time someone actually knocks his head clean off.

    See?

  142. Coach pb9617 says:

    Yeah, but I think that with MacT, effort goes an awful long way. Every year he got ragged on for having his favourites who play because they work hard. If he felt Penner's effort was unacceptable, I'm inclined to defer to him on that. It does not, in my mind, speak well of Penner that he couldn't solve that problem before. If it's solved now, well, great but given what we saw for two years, you'll forgive me if I have doubts about his conversion.

    So if he has converted for Quinn – was MacT a bad personnel man, or is Quinn a great one?

    Carlyle may have not liked him – but he continued to put Penner in a place to succeed. MacTavish did the exact opposite to the detriment of the team.

    It was a bad year – he's admitted that.

  143. Coach pb9617 says:

    Until that pass, Grebs has been on acid all night.

  144. Jonathan Willis says:

    In Year One of the Penner deal, it looked to me like he got ice-time and opportunity way out of proportion to his results.

    In Year Two, it looked like the reverse was happening.

  145. Black Dog says:

    I'm going to step in here before coach goes down with carpel tunnel.

    I wonder what the Oilers think about the admission about the summer 'conditioning' program Penner was on. 8.5 million bucks gone so far.

    I'm hoping the guy is going to walk the walk. Definitely impressed by him tonight.

    As for Downie, pfft. What a jackass.

    Anything is fair game with that piece of shit.

  146. pboy says:

    It will be interesting to continue watching the NHL deal with Gretzky going forward. If they piss off TGO enough and he throws his support behind moving the team to Hamilton, Gary will have to move back to his lil' Keebler treehouse because he knows he isn't winning a popularity contest against Wayne in this or any other country.

  147. mc79hockey says:

    Gary will have to move back to his lil' Keebler treehouse because he knows he isn't winning a popularity contest against Wayne in this or any other country.

    I'll bet that, secretly, Gary doesn't give a shit what Wayne thinks.

  148. knighttown says:

    I didn't see the first period but Robert Nilsson was goddamned brilliant in that second. He actually should have had four points.

    -set up Brule in the slot with a backhanded flip pass from behind the net
    -set up Grebeshkov off the rush with another backhanded flip pass. Grebs then passed to Cogs but a little too much into his skates
    -perfect cycled pass to Gagner for a bomb in the high slot that nearly knocked Smith over
    -sniped one off the post and in off the Gagner feed

    I'd lose any of Brule, Pouliot, Stone, MacIntyre, Brennan, Schremp, Jacques or Stortini before Nilsson.

  149. godot10 says:

    If Gretzky wanted to coach, he could have agreed to renegotiated his salary going forward, leaving it to the courts to decide what he would get as an owner/creditor.

    He wanted $8 million to coach. $1 million to coach, and well, it seems that he doesn't like coaching that much.

    The team was in financial trouble. His salary represented 25% of the losses for the last couple of years

  150. Woodguy says:

    "I'd lose any of Brule, Pouliot, Stone, MacIntyre, Brennan, Schremp, Jacques or Stortini before Nilsson."

    Agreed.

    Its one of those night where you think, "Awesome, he finally gets it and is skating"

    Then you watch him for the next 5 games and think "Nilsson played 14 minutes tonight? I didn't see him"

    Tampa is tired, 4th in 4 nights and the Oilers are starting to take advantage. Nice to see.

    Good to see Hedman out there, the Tampa beat writer said he wasn't playing on Gregor's show.

    Cogs-Gagner-Nilsson together.

    Just have to see Horpensky in the next game and is deja vu all over again.

  151. hunter1909 says:

    Oilers need to play in the Southeast.

  152. Coach pb9617 says:

    That uh, Cogliano guy – fun on the wing.

  153. slipper says:

    sam gagner is going to make traktor look like a fool

  154. slipper says:

    andrew cogliano is going to make traktor look like a fool

  155. speeds says:

    I don't completely understand all the dislike for Nilsson among some Oilers fans. I agree he hasn't been terribly consistent, but I think the dislike for him is out of proportion to his "poorness" as a player.

  156. Black Dog says:

    speeds – Oilers fans hate Gilbert, Horcoff, Hemsky, Pisani, hey take your pick

    It makes no sense.

  157. Ribs says:

    Moreau..jeebus.

  158. Ribs says:

    Gagner sure looks better without Hemsky on his line. I hope that experiment is over for now.

  159. Ribs says:

    Cogliano sure looks better with Gagner on his line. I hope that experiment continues.

  160. raventalon40 says:

    Scott Nichol is no veteran but he's a faceoff ace. He's also a rough and tumble type of player much the same way Brule is, with less offense. Perhaps better suited to the role.

  161. slipper says:

    foster landed on his giant vagina there

  162. PDO says:

    I wanted a shootout. Damn.

    Turns out winning draws is important.

  163. Lord Bob says:

    Seems to me that the Oilers needed more Rob Schremp tonight.

  164. Ribs says:

    Meh, who needs to win faceoffs anyways.

  165. slipper says:

    cogs speed alone will always he ensure he see his share of advantageous shots, but the kid is a disaster in nearly every other facet of the game

  166. Hockey Noob says:

    Staios!!!

  167. Black Dog says:

    Is the Don Maloney who runs Phoenix the same Don Maloney who used to play for the Rangers? He looks like a washed out singer from the 70s, like Barry Manilow I'm thinking.

    Weird.

  168. pboy says:

    I'll bet that, secretly, Gary doesn't give a shit what Wayne thinks.

    I agree. The NHL is getting crushed in the PR department and if Wayne decides to get behind the "Make it 7" promotion, Gary is going to start squirming.

  169. boopronger says:

    cogs speed alone will always he ensure he see his share of advantageous shots, but the kid is a disaster in nearly every other facet of the game

    I thought Cogs won his fair share of puck battles tonight.

  170. flamingpavelbure says:

    Nilsson scores

    4 points in 4 preseason games

    Don't stick a fork in him just yet.

  171. knighttown says:

    One has to wonder just how much better Springfield is going to be this year. The whole "pushing guys down the depth chart" phenomenon is a much bigger factor than improving 1 guy.

    This was a random lineup from April of last year.

    Willis – O'Marra – Schremp
    Stone – Potulny – Trukhno
    McDonald – Spurgeon – Lerg
    Czuy – Urquhart – Benson

    Young – Roy
    Bina – Gabinet
    Kinley – Wild

    If cuts go as I expect, this is a possible lineup this year:

    Stone-Brule-Reddox
    Potulny-Schremp-Mindard
    Brennan-Linglet-Trukhno
    Pauko-O'Marra-McDonald

    Arsene-Taylor
    Peckham-Chorney
    Plante-Motin

  172. Bruce says:

    Tampa did more in 4 seconds of PP time than the Oil did in 4 minutes.

    Special teams = suckage
    Faceoffs = suckage

    Who knew?

    ***

    OTOH, who the fuck cares? It's preseason. Winnipeg fans might be bummed about missing out on the shootout, but that said, who the fuck cares about Winnipeg fans?

    Just kidding, DoritoGrande, IceCastles, Showerhead et al.

    Enjoyed seeing my man Marty St. Louis play a dominant game, his first goal was just sick.

    For the Oil, Nilsson was terrific, Gagner and Cogs looked a lot better, Penner looked solid again (loved that power move off the boards), Brule had his moments, Reddox had a strong game and how about Zorg as a centre? While I'm passing around the accolades, I should also mention that Hemsky and Horcoff had just as much influence on tonight's game than they did last night. :p

  173. doritogrande says:

    Just got back from the game, and have two things to say:

    1) Fuck you Steve Staios.

    2) I took about 12 post-its of notes on the game, I'll have a fanpost up on Copper&Blue within an hour.

  174. flamingpavelbure says:

    http://oilers.nhl.com/club/recap.htm?id=2009010080&navid=DL|EDM|home

    Time of Comment: 23:28

    Oilers site thinks 2+1 = 4 tampa bay goals lol

  175. Lord Bob says:

    I'm resisting the urge not to add a post of my own to C&B saying simply "HOCKEY JESUS!" 2,000 times.

    It's pretty sad that that sort of game from Schremp has me this excited, but I need something to cheer for.

  176. dwillms says:

    The one bubble player that stuck out most to me tonight was Stone. Played physical, forechecked well, I think they need him on this team to balance out all the small forwards.

    Through 2 periods Brule looked like he either fell down or got knocked on his ass every shift. But looked better in the 3rd and of course the great assist on the Gilbert goal.

    Eberle looked ok, got knocked off the puck easily a couple times. Should spend the year in the AHL, but since he can't I guess another year of junior.

    I counted 2 good shifts for Schremp tonight. 1 for MacIntyre.

  177. Ed says:

    Stone looks like your Pisani insurance.

  178. David says:

    I was at the game tonight, and while I'm no analyst like a lot of you here, here are a few of my observations.

    Schremp: I never would have guessed he was trying to win a roster spot. Lots of floating and zero effort. No desire to work for the puck, and scared to take a hit. At one point in the first he could have had at least a partial break but slowed up approaching the puck to avoid contact. I've been rooting for him, but yeah, he's got no business being in the NHL based on what I saw tonight.

    Brule: Impressive performance, worked hard, not afraid of contact.

    Stone: Looked good on effort alone, just needed a bit more talent.

    Nilsson: Looked the best to me of the "bubble" guys. Aggressive on the puck, not afraid to take a hit, nice goal.

    Staios: Slow. Hugely dumb penalty.

    Visnovsky: A few brutal passes, slow skating back several times.

    The Oilers definitely looked like the smaller team out there, but both teams also looked a little worn down.

  179. HBomb says:

    Moreau with a pussy block attempt on the tying goal (after Stone sacrifices his body for a proper shot-block seconds earlier), then Staios' with a dumbass penalty 190 feet from his own net.

    No wonder Quinn's been ragging on veterans and supposed "leaders". I hope they put these two assholes on waivers tomorrow. I can't stand their 4.7 million worth of dead salary cap space any longer.

    Moreau and Staios suck. End of discussion.

  180. Bruce says:

    WTF was Staios doing on that play anyway?

    Whatever else it was, it was dumb and selfish. Given it was a preseason game, I'm glad they scored. Will give Quinn lots of ammo to make his point.

  181. hunter1909 says:

    How was the game?

  182. doritogrande says:

    My post is up on the Copper&Blue fanpost section.

  183. Bruce says:

    DG: Don't see it yet.

  184. Coach pb9617 says:

    DG: Fanpost section nothing.

    It's now the front page feature.

  185. Icecastles says:

    Back from the game. Missed first half of p.1, wish I had msised all of it. Very non-committal first period from what I saw. Game got much better as it progressed though. A few observations:

    Deslauriers still drops down way too early. I'm sure 80% of the goals scored on him are over his shoulders. Being a very tall goalie I can understand the urge, but he's got to fix that.

    Moreau – hated him way less than usual. Looked like he was trying… don't know that he has the pace anymore to keep up with the game.

    Smackintyre – there's no place for him on the team. I like the guy a lot, but he's just got no skill.

    Nilsson – Kickass.

    Penner – Didn't see him a lot, but was hugely impressed when I did notice him. I'm counting on a big breakout year for him.

    Gagner – didn't seem to be that interested in the game. No hustle away from the puck.

    Stone – Damn, I like that kid. Needs to work on the skillset still, but he's certainly not afraid to battle. And an awesome hitter (as an aside, you can really hear people pound into the boards at MTS Centre. Probably because the "Friendly Manitobans" are so freaking quiet.)

    Schremp – there is no way he is even interested in getting an NHL job. After seeing him in person, I can almost guarantee that when he goes down on waivers, 29 other GMs will be fairly indifferent to Belgium.

    Smid – Another player I think has a chance to really become something this year. I like his style.

    Visnofsky – The guy sure likes dangerous passes, but he somehow makes stuff work. His shots from the point looked pretty weak… I wonder how his shoulder is doing.

    Hemsky – totally invisible again tonight. ;)

    Kotalyk – I shed a silent tear at his passing.

  186. hunter1909 says:

    "Schremp: I never would have guessed he was trying to win a roster spot. Lots of floating and zero effort. No desire to work for the puck, and scared to take a hit. At one point in the first he could have had at least a partial break but slowed up approaching the puck to avoid contact. I've been rooting for him, but yeah, he's got no business being in the NHL based on what I saw tonight."

    Isn't this a little hard on Schremp?

  187. Icecastles says:

    Hunter: I don't think so. The guy isn't failing because of a lack of skill (though the foot speed doesn't help), he's failing because he simply hasn't shown the desire. There was nothing in his game tonight that said to me that he knows or cares about what's on the line and can find the motivation to succeed.

    He should be balls-out right now to make the team. And he plays like one of his balls has re-ascended.

  188. bookie says:

    I wonder if Schemp is confident that he will be picked up and is attempting for waivers?

  189. Bling says:

    Game Thoughts

    Brule – I felt as though he was flailing around in the early going, but he picked up his game throughout. Abrasive, tenacious, loved how he used his speed to create holes in TB's defensive coverage. His confidence with the puck is increasing. Negatives: reckless at times with the puck. He had one absolutely gawd awful giveaway at his blue line, and is sometimes guilty of overplaying the puck in lieu of the simpler outlet. Certainly capable of playing 4th line C minutes. Unconvinced that he or Pouliot are an improvement, or even on par, with Brodziak.

    Vis – He seemed a little bit slow on his gap control. Did anyone else notice that? The puck would go to his corner and, at times, it really looked like he was labouring. Clearly fighting the puck a little more than what I'm used to seeing out of him. Definitely putting in the effort, though, which was nice to see.

    Gagner – I nearly choked when I saw Gagner outskate VL through the neutral zone, pivot, tie him up, and strip the puck away. Almost keeled over when he sent it over to Cogs for a 5 bell chance immediately afterwards. Good show.

    On that topic, 89's passing was on tonight. His backhand sauce is just as good as his forehand, and that's saying something, even for an NHLer. Neutral zone puck handling has improved by my eye. I still think his play recognition is a little poor; he could stand to dump the puck when the lanes going north through center ice are clogged. It'll come.

    Penner – TSN commentator (Greg Millen?) said he was quiet at one point. Completely disagree. There was a sequence in the first where he back checked a TB player breaking out 20 feet from Mike Smith all the way to the Oilers blueline. Forced the opposing TB player offside. Absolutely unreal; it really is something else to watch someone that big skating that hard. He's quite saavy with the stick checking as well, although that 6'4 frame certainly helps :P

    Offensively, he had a sick spin move off the boards that almost resulted in a goal and also a couple of real nice passes. His vision is pretty underrated, and I think he's the one guy that can play anywhere in the top 9. Belongs with Horc and Hemmer, though.

    Cogliano – Lights out awesome. Caused problems for TB on the transition all night, and was surprisingly good on the cycle as well. At one point he was out for a shift with Gagner, and 89 had it clutched on the offensive boards before being absolutely mauled. Cogs was supporting the puck, and started moving his legs as soon as the puck was in sight. Drew a penalty. Wonderful, wonderful game out of him. He belongs on the wing.

    Nilsson – Very, very good game from Bobby. Handled the puck with authority, and wasn't afraid to shoot. Dandy one timer early in the first, beauty snipe in the second, and he flat out beaned Smith near the head in the dying stages of OT. He has gotten stronger. I recall at one point he had the puck in the offensive corner, with Meszaros breathing in on him. I read the play, and figured Nilsson would dump it back behind the net or throw it out front. Instead, he engaged Meszaros (not a small guy, btw) and held the puck, waiting for support to arrive, before dishing it off. Need to see more of that out of him. He has the strength base now; let's see him use it on a consistent basis. Sewed up a spot in the top 12 tonight, but he needs to start bringing this game every night.

    Eberle – not ready, but he's unlike the other little guys on the team in that he has some juke in him. I was afraid that he would peak as a PP specialist/soft minute destroyer, but his 5on5 game has some things.

    All in all, a good game. Good guys carried the play for 2/3 of regulation and had some glorious chances to end it in the latter stages of the third and OT. What can you say? They outchanced 'em. Result didn't break right, but there's no shame in that.

    Yet :P

  190. David says:

    Hunter: I certainly don't think I was too hard on Schremp at all based on his performance. The bubble guys all seemed to be at least trying; Brule and Stone were both moving well, getting into traffic. Schremp honestly didn't look like he had anything to play for, like he couldn't have cared less if he had the puck. If I had the hands that he supposedly has and was fighting for a roster spot, I'd be busting my rump to get that puck as much as possible.

    Aside from that, it was actually a pretty decent game as far as pre-season goes.

  191. Nennog says:

    Icecastles, I hope you're kidding about Kotalik. I was at the Rangers / Caps game last night and saw again the guy adding nothing at all; losing him was one of the top moves the Oilers made this offseason.

    Got home in time for the last half of the 3rd, and it looked to me like Schremp was working hard, lots of nice chances created in that time frame.

  192. Lowetide says:

    I wonder if they send anyone out today.

  193. Peter says:

    I actually thought Schremp played alright, but he certainly was outplayed by Brule, Nilsson, and Stone. He's gone as soon as the next cuts are in. I was impressed by Reddox's hustle as well, though I don't think he should be on the team. He's a real nice call-up option though.

    Anyone else read anything into Pouliot sitting the last 2 and Brule playing 2 straight? Brule made a few poor decisions, but overall he played well. At this point, I see the roster like so:

    Penner-Horc-Hemmer
    Cogliano-Gagner-Nilsson
    O'Sullivan-Comrie-Pisani
    Jacques-Brule-Stortini
    Moreau-Stone

    cut Pouliot, MacIntyre, Schremp, Reddox, Brennan.

    I think Pouliot probably deserves a spot in the top 14, but I'd rather see Brule in there. Jacques has definitely earned a spot, as has Stone. In an ideal world, Moreau would get shipped out, clearing a spot for Pouliot. The sooner we get rid of Staios and Moreau, the better. (I couldn't believe the play Staios made last night in OT – what was the return on that one??)

  194. Mr DeBakey says:

    "Anyone else read anything into Pouliot sitting the last 2 and Brule playing"

    Groin pull,
    Pouliot with the Lower Body

  195. Woodguy says:

    I wonder if they send anyone out today.

    You would think that Quinn wants as little fluff in camp as possible now. The team needs systems work, and extra bodies are just a distraction.

    My guess: breasts du sucre, Eberle, McIntyre, Dubnyk.

    I went to double check some spellings on the Oilers website, and Brennan is not listed on their roster.

    Did I miss something?

  196. Peter says:

    I'd cut down D and G (Chorney and Dubnyk) and F (MacIntyre, Brennan, Schremp) leaving just Reddox, Brule, Pouliot, Stone competing for those last 2 spots. (Assuming Jacques and Nilsson have spots locked down.)

  197. Icecastles says:

    Nennog said…
    Icecastles, I hope you're kidding about Kotalik.

    It's his theme song I miss.

  198. Steve says:

    I suspect that MacIntyre makes it to the last round of cuts, as a courtesy.

  199. Gnash says:

    Groin pull,
    Pouliot with the Lower Body

    Are the Oilers providing injury reports in Haiku format now?

  200. doritogrande says:

    For what it's worth, TSN.ca released their fantasy point projections recently (link: http://tsn.ca/fantasy_news/feature/?ID=11939). Here's how they see the Oilers top performers:

    C:
    40. Sam Gagner 19-37-56 -6
    41. Shawn Horcoff 18-33-51 +1

    LW:
    38. Pat O'Sullivan 23-34-57 -8

    RW:
    16. Ales Hemsky 21-45-66 -5
    44. Dustin Penner 22-21-43 +3

    D:
    20. Sheldon Souray 17-28-45 -10
    28. Lubo Visnovsky 10-28-38 +4
    31. Tom Gilbert 9-31-40 Even

    G:
    16. Nik Khabibulin 30Wins 2.61 .910 3SO

    Certainly we have to take this with a grain of salt, as clearly Dustin Penner hasn't been known to play RW since he got here, geniuses. I'd be happy with those totals for Gagner and O'Sullivan, but am not holding my breath.

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