Oilers 10-11

Among the things that we can call background noise is the story connecting Jaromir Jagr to the Edmonton Oilers. Recent comments from associate coach Tom Renney saying he’s keeping in touch and that Jagr has more NHL seasons ahead of him make the story worth following over the winter and into spring.

Can the Oilers afford Jagr? Would he cost north of 4M? If they add Jagr, do they need to drop a defenseman making 4M or more? Here’s a quick early look at the caphit for 2010-11:

  1. Shawn Horcoff 5.5M
  2. Dustin Penner 4.25M
  3. Ales Hemsky 4.1M
  4. Patrick O’Sullivan 2.925M
  5. Robert Nilsson 2.0M
  6. Ethan Moreau 2.0M
  7. Zack Stortini .700M
  8. Lubomir Visnovsky 5.6M
  9. Sheldon Souray 5.4M
  10. Tom Gilbert 4.0M
  11. Steve Staios 2.7M
  12. Ladislav Smid 1.3M
  13. Taylor Chorney .942M
  14. Nikolai Khabibulin 3.75M

Total dollars for 14 players is $45,167,000. Assuming the cap is $57 million for 2010-11 that gives the team $12M to sign Sam Gagner, Andrew Cogliano, Denis Grebeshkov, Gilbert Brule, Marc Pouliot, Ryan Stone, Liam Reddox, JF Jacques and Jeff Deslauriers (all rfa’s).

How much would be left for Jagr? Not close to enough, I’d expect. Steve Tambellini has to make a trade before June 30, 2010. Book it. :-)

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94 Responses to "Oilers 10-11"

  1. Bar Qu says:

    Wait a second. Tambellini needs to make a trade before a certain date to make the team better?

    Where have I heard this before? ;)

    The trade need is certain, but a more interesting question is whether it is Tambellini that actually makes the trade or his successor Pat Quinn?

  2. Lowetide says:

    Agreed. I'd bet money Pat Quinn has said (even if too himself) "I know what's wrong here and can fix it myself. I just need to get my hand on the lever and then can trade these little Barbara Ann Scott's."

    Problem is, he'd probably deal Gagner.

  3. Jonathan Willis says:

    LT:

    No, I think he would probably deal Cogliano. No player on the roster has regressed as quickly or as much as 13 under Quinn.

    Gilbert a close second, and Nilsson third (only because he wasn't much to start with).

  4. Jonathan Willis says:

    The nice thing about all these Jagr rumours is that it finally puts to rest the notion that the Oilers are only interested in the big splash, and shows they're willing to make the cheap, unheralded changes that will win them games.

  5. Lowetide says:

    Jonathan: lol. I think both Cogliano and Gilbert will find their way, of course that might be in another town. Certainly neither is being used in what would be their most-likely-to-succeed situation but that's a roster thing.

    It'll be an interesting summer next year.

  6. Brett Gee 英 明 says:

    Why bring this up again?

    I agree with Jon and the Sarcasm.

    Give up with the Big Splash and start putting together an NHL hockey team.

  7. Brett Gee 英 明 says:

    An interesting Summer just like the last 2 summers;)

  8. Black Dog says:

    Argh.

    I would have to bet that they start by moving Staios, Moreau and Nilsson. Thats almost 7 million in savings, minus their replacements of course.

    And one of the big four D moves as well, probably Grebs or Gilbert, moves I would not agree with for the longterm health of the club.

    I hate to sound like an impatient dink because organizational stability is a must, imo, but considering Tambeliini has pretty well sat in his hands since he got the job I'd honestly be happy to see him go. I'm tired of watching losing hockey and with the cap situation next season looming there is nothing to suggest that it will get any better. They're likely going to move some good players out just to get under the cap.

    Brutal.

  9. Smytty777 says:

    Wouldn't Jagr be 38 (39 in February) if he returned to the NHL. I can't see him commanding a $4M salary from anyone at this stage of his career. Although the Oilers have shown the willingness to overpay for a big name.

    Jagr might still be useful in a limited role (hammering home Hemsky's cross ice feeds on the PP), a role that Horc seems incapable of fulfilling (although maybe its because Horc is too busy filling every other role on the team).

  10. rickibear says:

    Jagr 19GM 11G 5A .85P/GM
    Mikhnov 18GM 4G 12A .89P/GM

    You go get him Steve?

  11. Vic Ferrari says:

    I don't think that these guys are going to stop until they land a very famous player. I know that Tambellini just missed out in the Jokinen bidding last winter, but I don't think even that would have satisfied them. Khabibulin is famous, but not superfamous.

    Jagr fits the bill. If Jaromir returns to the NHL, I would be shocked if any team offers him more money than the Oil.

  12. Woodguy says:

    Certainly neither is being used in what would be their most-likely-to-succeed situation but that's a roster thing.

    I agree that 13 is not being used in a proper fashion, but I'm sure how you'd characterize 77 in the same way.

    He's getting PP2 time, and now that the heavy lifters are back he's getting PK2 instead of PK1 time.

    Now that 24/44 are back he's not getting the Nash/Iginla's of the world either.

    How is 77 being misued?

  13. DBO says:

    the whole big splash thing is killing me. Why not make a big splash with some middle cost players that fill some needs and improve our team. Chicago is sitting there wanting to announce the signing of Toews, Kane and Keith but can't since it would put their payroll next year over the cap and you can't announce signings that put you over next year's cap. Why would we not try to poach some of their good players? Does it just make too much sense? They need to shed close to $4 mill in salary from next year's roster to make those 3 signings (and will have to make more in the off season). With Hossa coming back soon they will move a good forward, and because they can't move Campbell (no movement clause and crazy contract) they'll move a mid price dman. So offer them cheap young players and prospects in order to upgrade our team right now.

    A few moves and we are a much better team
    1.cogliano and Jacques + prospect/pick
    for
    Sharp/Bfuglien and Barker
    2. Waive Nilsson
    3. Move Grebeshkov/Gilbert
    for
    Gaustad (tough 2/3 center who hits, can win a faceoff and is signed to a decent deal)

    Penner-Horcoff-Hemsky
    Byfuglien-Gagner-Comrie
    Stone-Gaustad-O'Sullivan
    Moreau-Brule-Stortini

    Vish-Smid
    Souray-Barker
    Greb/Gilbert-Staios

  14. HBomb says:

    Gilbert probably should be getting time with Souray, not Staios. Seems like it worked ok to me, at least by the eyes, late last year (if anyone wishes to disprove this impression, be my guest).

    The plan should be to ditch Moreau, Staios, and Nilsson, let Comrie and Pisani's deals run out this summer, and shop around to see what one can land for a combination of Grebeshkov plus either of O'Sullivan or Cogliano, preferably a 2nd line LW with size and finish.

    Going forward, you'd be set in goal (Khabibulin), top four D (Visnovsky/Smid, Souray/Gilbert), and five-sixths of your top six (Horpensky, Gagner plus one of O'Sullivan or Cogliano). That's not a terrible start. Saved money goes towards a quality 3C, some decent vets to complement the Reddox/Stortini/Potulny/Brule in the bottom six (a recovered Pisani at about 800K-1M per year fits this bill just fine, but I have my doubts about the recovery part), as well as a veteran blue as the 5D to complemement Chorney and Peckham.

    Seems easy enough, right?

  15. HBomb says:

    Oh yeah – if I could make it work cap-wise and move Cogliano for Patrick Sharp and Grebeshkov plus O'Sullivan for, say, Brenden Morrow, who wouldn't be a fan of this top-six?

    Penner-Gagner-Hemsky
    Morrow-Horcoff-Sharp

    Sharp and Morrow fit the bill for the type of forward they should be shopping for. As do David Backes, James Neal, Dustin Brown, David Booth, Drew Stafford and soforth. Tricky part is finding a player like this that is available, because they usually aren't easy to find.

  16. DBO says:

    HBomb: agree about next year needing to upgrader certain spots. My deals above would work dollar wise for all involved. And set us up nicely for next year.

  17. Smarmy Boss says:

    ARRRRGGGHHHHH!!!!

    Just needed to get that out.

  18. Clarkenstein says:

    LT have you heard the Oilers are trying to get approval to bring Eberle until this injury things starts getting better?

  19. Jonathan Willis says:

    I'd actually be okay with Jagr at 4MM.

    It's the ZOMG11!!! STARZ!11!! menatality that I'm not okay with.

    Go ahead, chase the stars. But while you're at it, bring in Andy Hilbert on a PTO, or sign McAmmond when injuries hit, or trade something you have a lot of (small, developing NHL players) for something you need more of (guys who can play in any situation).

    I'm sorry, everyone. It's dead horse at this point.

  20. Jordan says:

    Man, if that's true, it's really going to piss of the Pats. Last I heard they were thinking about moving him, but if the Oilers are thinking of recalling him…

    Hang on. When did we run out of offensive minute-men?

    Did we make a trade!?

    No.. you're right…it is too much to hope for.

  21. Gret99zky says:

    Wait, Tambellini is going to make a trade?

    Where have I read that before?

    Hmmmmm.

  22. Ribs says:

    Jagr 19GM 11G 5A .85P/GM
    Mikhnov 18GM 4G 12A .89P/GM

    Forget Jagr! Let's get this Mikhnov guy!

    Jagr would be an impact player and $4M would be a reasonable price tag considering a guy like Kovalev is getting $5M.

    I know this is Alberta and we like to BBQ year round no matter the weather but you'd think it would be okay for our GM to start putting the deck chairs out to the shed by now. I guess we wait until Lowe's Oilers Christmas (deadline day)for something to happen. Where I'm sure expectations won't be met once again.

  23. Bar Qu says:

    I'm sorry, everyone. It's dead horse at this point.

    Man, do I hate thinking the season is over already. It feels like there's a guard walking down ahead of the team shouting 'dead man walking!'

    And as a fan you are twisting your hat in sheer frustration.

    Having said this, I would trade Cogs & Grebs or Gibs for anything middle six forward wise. Hbomb's list looks good as a start and I do like the idea of Hilbert as a band-aid this year.

    BTW, does anyone know where the definitive LTIR/cap information is found. I would like to understand what flexibility the Oil have as a result of their 110 games of injury (so far) in any other possible signings.

  24. Scott says:

    Bar Qu:

    I'm pretty sure you can't bank LTIR space.

    So, we can replace 34 and 78 with equally priced players, until they return.

  25. doritogrande says:

    So many trades, not enough focus on prospects.

    Does no one here think that Eberle and/or Paajarvi have legitimate shots at snagging top-6 roles next season?

    I understand that you have to bank on development time, but I see no reason for these two to be anywhere close to the AHL given the seasons they are having.

    Or does everyone think that they'll be starting lower on the pecking order? Quinn already is familiar with Eberle's work, and I'm guessing he'd love the chance to run with another up and coming Swede. I think the team's going to get even younger this offseason before we entertain the possibility of Jagr.

    Barring some crazy shenanigans, I could see a roster similar to:

    Penner-Horcoff-Hemsky
    Eberle-Gagner-O'Sullivan
    Paajarvi-Brule-Reddox
    Moreau-Cogliano-Stortini

    Again, youthful exuberance up front, and we'd be able to keep all our defensemen for another year before determining the best of the bunch.

    Anyone?

  26. Forain says:

    HBomb:

    I sincerely hope Patrick Sharp is on our Persons of Interest list. That's a great 2 line you've got there.

  27. hunter1909 says:

    Wow. The atmosphere in this blog is starting to approach my mentality. Weird. I never realised(I'm lying here) that standing around waiting for the Sunday afternoon hangings at Tyburn would be so much fun.

    Black Dog especially. So now you have mister optimistic basically doing the same things I'd have done, cutting the same deadwood and tossing Mister Tambellini onto the flames for good measure.

    Incredible.

  28. jon k says:

    The 2010-2011 season is supposed to be the first with the cap going down. By my recollection it would have dropped this season but the NHLPA exercised its option to artificially inflate the cap so it remained relatively stable, but now that's not an option anymore next year.

    Haven't really heard any rumblings on how this season's performance might affect the cap so far though.

    I think it's reasonable to expect a cap in the area of 54 to 55 million though.

  29. hunter1909 says:

    doritogrande: Seriously I don't wish to piss on anyone's propect parade but that Eberle kid's about the size of any of the other silly smurfs we've got. How about we let him season away down in the AHL for a season, maybe even two, before exposing him to the big mean toughs of the NHL?

    Or do we simply love our injured players that much, for all of the rationale for not icing a competitive team?

  30. doritogrande says:

    hunter:

    He's not the chicken swede that Nilsson is, nor was he pampered by the London Knights. Eberle's already well versed in physical contact in that he's coming from the Dub.

    He's also got smarts and instincts that are likely rivaled by only Gagner on this team. The game isn't about being able to take a hit, it's about knowing how to avoid the hit.

    I think he'll be fine.

  31. oilerdago says:

    LT: I think a trade before 6/30 next year can be booked as well, but does anyone now think that Tambellini is up to the task?

    I wonder if he's really his own man in this regard given all the internal jockeying.

    Next year becomes a more challenging year with the cap as Cogs/Gags come of entry levels, Grebs needs a new contract. Plus the young picks (MPS/Eberle) need a long look – which makes a young team even younger.

    Add that to the overpaid vets & boat anchors that are limiting the manueverability of the GM and I get the sense this is going to get worse before it improves. Right now, no one is stupid enough to take them Nilsson, Moreau. Staios might be tradeable at the deadline but the other two aren't unless as throw ins for someone more valuable.

    Not going to get any easier Tambs. Hope the seat you're sitting on is getting warmer.

  32. Woodguy says:

    Chicago can't possibly take back salary so if you are talking to them about someone like Sharp next summer, they probably want something like Eberle+Chorney+high pick or MPS etc.

    13 and 37 need contracts and will probably get something like 2 & 4 respectively. Chicago can't handle that.

    McKenzie says they're shopping Sopel today to be able to announce the new deals without having too much $$ on the books for next year.

  33. jon k says:

    Just to think outloud:

    Gagner 2.75
    Cogliano 2.25
    Grebeshkov 3.75
    Brule 2.0
    Pouliot 0.9
    Stone 1.0
    Reddox 1.1
    Jacques 0.9
    Deslauriers 1.25

    Total: 15.9

    45.17 + 15.9 = 61.07

    Estimated caps:
    High 57
    Low 54

    Either way we need to trade some significant salary to get under the cap, let alone consider bringing in a big ticket enigma like Jagr.

    I hope the trade comes sooner rather than later since we're not exactly world-beaters right now anyway.

  34. raventalon40 says:

    At this pace, Tambellini isn't going to make a trade before 2012.

    Book it.

  35. Gord says:

    Considering that:

    1) The salary cap is probably going down

    2) Any / every team that had been willing to spend money now has expensive contracts they want to dump

    3) There were quite a few good players taking one year discount contracts this summer

    4) The Oilers are in cap trouble going into next season

    Why would anyone consider a big name high priced player be signed by Edmonton?

    The logical plan would be to somehow dump what we can (even if we have to throw in 2nd round draft picks) then build an inexpensive core that only needs one player to take us over the top.

  36. Smarmy Boss says:

    Chicago can't possibly take back salary so if you are talking to them about someone like Sharp next summer, they probably want something like Eberle+Chorney+high pick or MPS etc.

    ha ha. Yeah okay. They won't get anything close to that package for Sharp and it's not because Sharp isn't a good player.

  37. doritogrande says:

    jon k:

    I think your number estimates are too high in most cases. Cogliano is going to be lucky to get 1.5M the way he's playing right now. Stone and Reddox should be happy with NHL minimum on a one-way contract, as should Pouliot and Jacques for that matter.

    I do however think you've nailed the numbers for Grebeshkov, Gagner and Brule.

    We still need to dump salary though. Nilsson and Moreau should be the first to go.

  38. Bar Qu says:

    Willis put up this good article, which, along with a number of other rumblings I have heard (don't remember where) lead me to think the cap will be static at worst next season. If so, that means there won't be the same kind of player firesale we thought there might be.

    Still, the Hawks are in tough and I don't think anyone will give them value for Sharp. He may be worth an overpay for the Oil however, and they do have a depth of good prospects the Hawks might be interested in. Say a Wild or Plante/Motin packaged with a cheap forward (Cogs?). I dunno, I am a lousy armchair GM, but what do you think?

  39. PierreMcGuires Ghost says:

    HBomb and I have talked alot, and I concur with that kind of direction.
    Eberle should be on our 3rd line next year, and the flotsam (Stortini, Pouliot, Reddox) and jetsam (Moreau, Pisani)should be moved along out of the system. The cap dollars that are created and holes in that part of the line-up are easily filled by more functional NHL veterans at appropriate cap hits.
    And the NHL turn-over king in Grebeshkov & OSully might well make a nice package to get another top 6 forward. I'd certainly take Morrow or use one of them plus a prospect (Omark, for example)& a pick to attain Sharp. something like Sully, Omark, and a 3rd might look pretty appealing to them.
    But the bottom line is this needs to be done by Tambo without embarassing KLo, imo. He is a proud, stubborn, and perhaps golden cow-esque memeber of the heirarchy… god forgive we show him how to clean out his own closet.

  40. Dennis says:

    Two thoughts:

    1. I know we always go back to the Yotes taking on Vandermeer's pact but who in the fuck is going to take on Sopel's?

    2. Speaking of fuck, Fuck "interesting summers."

    Seriously.

  41. bookie says:

    What they don't say is that the Oilers will be playing in Omsk next year… Its all part of the secret plan.

  42. Lowetide says:

    Traktor: You are welcome to post. But please refrain from calling people stupid. Thank you.

  43. George B says:

    Dennis, totally agree. If this summer was "Oilers address minor needs." instead of trying to land fish, I would have been far more excited.

  44. Jonathan Willis says:

    FTR:

    I don't think this season's done. With some luck the Oilers could grab a playoff spot.

    On the other hand, a lottery spot (and with bad luck this team's capable) would a) bring in a good asset and b) probably speed along the demise of the current management group.

  45. Jonathan Willis says:

    LT/Dennis:

    There's a reason 'interesting times' is considered a curse.

  46. Ribs says:

    I think Brother Magnus might be Jagr's secret lovechild from the pics posted.

  47. rickibear says:

    I don't think this season's done. With some luck the Oilers could grab a playoff spot.

    We need to play 105 pt season pace for the last 60 games for 96 points.

    just saying.

  48. BRIdub says:

    There is no way we trade for Morrow. None. Nobody trades their captain, especially not for non-star players like Grebs and Cogliano.

  49. Black Dog says:

    rickibear – book it pal, that's simple simon

    hunter – well while my optimism about all things non Oiler remains relentless my Oiler optimism deserted me a while back, I had very little hope for this club going into this season

    The biggest issue facing this club is the cap. Whether it is stagnant or drops a little they are already up against it.

    So the idea of picking up any guys making good money, guys like Sharp for example, is a pipe dream unless they clear the decks of all of the guys who are making too much for what they do – Moreau, Staios, Nilsson, for starters – plus a guy or two who are due a raise, like Grebs, or a guy who is making good money already, such as one of the other 'big three' on D.

    This is what kills me about these clowns. You're rebuilding, I guess, considering the fact that you refuse to bring in any vets as you jettison players left right and centre, but with the cap stagnating (and this has been on the horizon for a while now) you don't position yourself for a summer where you could a) pick up free agents for cheap or b)pick up useful players on salary dumps from other teams. Now there is a formula to get better by adding quality players to your young core.

    Instead you add another longterm boat anchor of a contract in goal and try to add another huge contract in Heatley.

    Even with Heatley out of the picture their hands are going to be tied next summer. Its a goddamned disgrace.

  50. Master Lok says:

    PMG:
    Eberle should be on our 3rd line next year, and the flotsam (Stortini, Pouliot, Reddox) and jetsam (Moreau, Pisani)should be moved along out of the system. The cap dollars that are created and holes in that part of the line-up are easily filled by more functional NHL veterans at appropriate cap hits.

    That doesn't make any sense.

    Moving out the jetsam (moreau, pisani) makes some sort of sense, but if Pisani could play 100%, then he would be a valuable addition but if he's out with colitis, then he would be on LTIR in any case… or retired.

    But moving out the flotsam (stortini, pouliot, reddox)? How does moving out Stortini or Reddox, who both make under a $1 million dollars and are both guys who bust their butts on the ice make us better? You certainly won't find many guys who will be cheaper.

  51. Greg MC says:

    Not 100% sure, but I think that Pisani would be ineligible for LTIR as he has a non-hockey related illness.

    When he was sidlined initially with colitis, the Oilers paid his salary anyway, but they were not legally obligated to to so. Buffalo had the same issue with Teppo Numminen. He had a heart issue, and Buffalo refused to pay his salary.

  52. Ben says:

    What's Adam Oates up to?

    Ok, how about Brind'Amour?

  53. Ender says:

    I just posted this over at C&B, but I think it's relevant here too. Not saying I support going PR before winning, but it is a strategy:

    I know people hate it when this gets brought up, but there’s a difference between Columbus and Edmonton. Even when Edmonton sucks, people still care.

    Columbus needs to win to get people into the seats – Edmonton does not. As such, Columbus needs to be run as a sports team and Edmonton can be run as a business. With a business PR often counts for more than winning, and after the Pronger debacle, the PR on Edmonton was pretty bad. Any GM in Edmonton who wanted to keep a job would have to either win big immediately or get notable hockey personalities (Canadian celebrities, if you will) to give the ticket-buying public some indication that not all was lost and that they were actually trying. Good business? Yes. Good for the team? Not so much. That’s likely why he’s been magic bullet shopping. He may or may not be a good GM, I dunno, but all of the magic bullet stuff reeks of PR to me, and yea, you overpay for PR.

    As I see it, this is why a lot of money went to Souray and Bulin and why Hossa and Heatley and Jagr were pursued so heavily. This is why Moreau continues to be captain and Gagner and Cogliano are locks on the ice no matter how poorly they’re doing.

    You just kind of need to hope that some of the smaller bets go his way or else we’re the Leafs – well, scratch that, we already are the Leafs. It’s just not quite as obvious yet.

  54. Downright Fierce says:

    Thats almost 7 million in savings, minus their replacements of course.

    BD: You of all people should know that we're not going to bring in replacements. Just send out the stale crusts and expect something to rise out of the organization.

  55. Ender says:

    As a fun exercise, think of secondary revenue streams. How many hockey sweaters, t-shirts, misc merch will sell with Jagr's name on it vs Brodziak.

    As another fun exercise, think of how much more beer the Oilers sell when they're losing ;)

  56. Woodguy says:


    ha ha. Yeah okay. They won't get anything close to that package for Sharp and it's not because Sharp isn't a good player.

    You're right that's too much.

    You'd probably need 2 good players on EL contracts though…

  57. Woodguy says:

    Ender,

    Lowe has stated more than once that you need a superstar to win a championship.

    Oilers have sold out 160 games straight without those guys. There's not much more beer to sell.

  58. Schitzo says:

    Not 100% sure, but I think that Pisani would be ineligible for LTIR as he has a non-hockey related illness.

    When he was sidlined initially with colitis, the Oilers paid his salary anyway, but they were not legally obligated to to so. Buffalo had the same issue with Teppo Numminen. He had a heart issue, and Buffalo refused to pay his salary.

    Because it's non-hockey related the Oilers have two choices. LTIR (and pay him) or suspend him.

    The team has the option, which is why Buffalo are such assholes.

    The CBA section is 16.11 and reads:


    16.11 Injured Reserve List.
    (a) The Injured Reserve List is a category of the Reserve List. A Club may place a Player on the Injured Reserve List only if such Player is reasonably expected to be injured, ill or disabled and unable to perform his duties as a hockey Player for a minimum of seven (7) days from the onset of such injury, illness or disability. …

    (b) A Player on whose behalf a Club has exercised the Bona Fide Long Term Injury/Illness Exception shall be placed on Injured Reserve for the period of such Exception, including any period the Player is on a Bona Fide Long Term Injury/Illness Exception Conditioning Loan.

  59. Ender says:

    @Woodguy

    If I've learned anything in life it's that there's always more beer. Always.

  60. dstaples says:

    Cogliano regressed? Really?

    Maybe if you apply some team plus/minus stats to his individual play, but those stats are driven by his linemates (hint: Moreau, Strudwick).

    Cogliano started slow, but has put together a string of strong games, where he's showing some newfound, ahem, crust, IMO.

  61. Jordan says:

    I had been wondering why Molson's had cut the ration of beers that their pensionners got, but I think we have the answer right here guys – The Oilers aren't going anywhere, and Burkie has sent the Leafs into the basement. Two of the biggest hockey markets in Canada need to drown their sorrows…

  62. Vic Ferrari says:

    Cogliano has been brutal. That 4v4 goal in the last game is a bad sign, he was there in support of Gilbert (who looked weak in this one, probably one of the guys who was questionable in the morning).

    Then he bolts for the Colorado end like he's been shot out a cannon. I guess he thought that Gilbert would get past the guy and hit Cogliano on a stretch pass for an odd man rush. The second COL player on the strong side (Duchene? Wolski?) lets him go and then it's two on one vs Gilbert on the wall … and it ends badly.

    If that gamble works, and Cogliano ends with a goal or an assist, he gets love. And in several parallel universes that gamble did work. But in almost all parallel universes; cats who like those gambles end up with poor chip stacks.

    He is quick though, he managed to get back into frame for Hejduk's scoring chance (a soft goal). A young Mike Comrie would still have been on the other side of the blue line.

  63. Bruce says:

    The biggest issue facing this club is the cap. Whether it is stagnant or drops a little they are already up against it.

    BDHS: Absofuckinlutely. The only reason I don't completely laugh off all talk of the Oilers taking on another Big salary is that the management itself seems to think it possible, given the consecutive off-season attempts at Vanek, Hossa and Heatley, all at north of $7 million and 5 years +. But the thought of Cogliano-for-Sharp or JFJ-for-Barker or whatever can be dimissed out of hand without some serious subtraction elsewhere on the payroll. Seems pretty clear that divestiture of salary is going to be extrememly hard to do in the present market, "present" defined as right through to at least the day they declare next year's cap.

    From an Oilers' perspective I'd argue they have their hands tied until at least summer of 2011 unless they decide to dump one of their true Value Contracts™ to a willing buyer. Not too many of those among the $2 MM + guys, are there? And how could such as exchange possible help?

  64. Bruce says:

    Speaking of fuck, Fuck "interesting summers."

    Too true, Dennis. I have spent each of those last three summers dreading the Oilers would actually take on the millstone contract of their desires, and being relieved each time they didn't get the guy cuz it would have crippled their cap. But still being dismayed at the fallout from their distraction, Hejda and Glencross being the most cited examples. And the less said about Penner and Smid wearing Trojans on their chests, the better.

    And a special commendation to you, Dennis, for your inventive use of the word "fuck" twice consecutively in a grammatically correct manner. I have heard consecutive "fuck"s, and indeed have uttered them myself on occasion, as a stream of invective without much context. Why just this past week I found myself saying "fuckfuckfuckfuckfuck" as yet another Oiler made his way down the tunnel. I believe it was young Ladi Smid, holding his head in a very convincing "concussion-like symptom" kind of way, after receiving a vicious head shot from the stick of Rick Nash. Instead of celebrating the fact that at least it was the Oilers who got the fucking powerplay this time (albeit not a long enough one), I found myself thinking how devastating such an injury to that particular player might be, to the point I was hardly watching the game. You can ask my long-suffering wife, who understands full well that Bruce gets at his very most agitated when people get hurt, but I'm pretty sure the dialog went something like this for the several minutes before Smid returned to the game:

    Bruce: Ladi's hurt. Headshot. Fuck.

    Bruce: He's gone to the room? Fuckfuckfuckfuckfuck …

    Bruce: Fuck!

    Bruce: FUCK!!

    Bruce: FUCK!!!

    … but those last "fuck"s were separated by random intervals of 30 to 60 seconds so can't be considered to be gramatically connected let alone correct. Once Ladi was safely back out there looking none the worse for wear did I turn my invective and my "fuck"s towrds Mr. Nash. But I was never able to put two different usages of the word in consecutive syllables, as you have done.

    In his wonderful book Ball Four, Jim Bouton makes mention of the swearing proclivities of his manager with the Seattle Pilots, one Joe Schultz. No monosyllabist, Schultz would string them together something like this (and I quote): "Oh, shitfuck! Fuckshit!" in which consecutive "fuck"s get uttered in two somewhat different words. (I believe they may be English for "bergfors" and "forsberg") However, I would argue that both "fuck"s are of the same general character so would not consider this example as any sort of precedent for what you have accomplished.

    I also considered but rejected a line of dialog from that movie where I think it's Kevin Costner — and Dennis, you're just the person who would know — goes completely out of character and exclaims "Fuck the fucking fucks!" I think he even repeats it to the co-star who can't believe her ears at the first such outburst. Which is impressive indeed: verb, adjective and noun within 5 syllables. But not even Kevin Costner was a sufficiently cunning linguist to give two fucks in consecutive syllables.

  65. Scott says:

    Ender,

    Your theory on beer sales depends on the demographics of the drinking population, where your groups are:

    Celebratory drinkers (LT cracks a beer as Horcoff's contract extension is announced)
    Depressive drinkers (Traktor cracks a beer as Horcoff's contract extension is announced)
    Drinkers (Hbomb invents a new drink to celebrate Tuesday)

    As an example, my home town has a 5/10/85 breakdown.

  66. Ender says:

    Scott,

    Sounds like we come from the same hometown ;).

  67. Black Dog says:

    Scott – that's Smid on the LW with Horcoff and Reddox? Is that a promotion for Reddox again?!!! MacT is back?

    Downright Fierce – oh don't I know it, pal.

    Replacements would be whatever teenagers they can bring in, likely, while they offer the moon to get Sundin out of retirement.

  68. Jordan says:

    Dammit Pat!

    Stop giving the Brain Trust Ideas!

    You know they're on here regularly looking for new ways to give us all palpitations!

  69. HBomb says:

    Scott,

    For the record, I am at the point where I am inventing new days of the week to accomodate drink recipe ideas.

  70. Jordan says:

    On another note… What would people think if Quinn did become GM and his first action was to bring back MacT?

    Yes, I have been drinking. Yes, it's only 3:30. Are there Oilers fans who don't these days?

  71. Gerta Rauss says:

    You're fucking fucked,fucker.

    -Dennis Hopper,Blue Velvet

  72. Jonathan Willis says:

    Staples:

    Cogliano played with Moreau last year, too. Either Moreau has started sucking much, much worse than he sucked last year, where he sucked quite a bit (I think there's been some but not much slide; Moreau is what he is) or Cogliano's dropped off the face of the Earth.

    Given that Cogliano's gone from a 53.2% OPCT zone start to 49.6% OPCT zone start and given that the QC curve is flatter this year because Quinn doesn't shelter his players like MacTavish does, I'd say we're seeing that Cogliano needed the protection and he's going to look bad when he isn't getting it.

  73. Jordan says:

    Thanks Gerta – More gold from Quinn today. THat guy is really open with what the team is up to. That description of the defensive breakdown, on teh COL goal was illuminating.

  74. Scott says:

    I missed that Ottawa shootout, but Quinn sure wasn't impressed with Comrie's attempt.

    "If you're going to clown around on my time, well, y'know"

  75. Bruce says:

    Gerta: Nice. 6 syllables rather than 5, but there's a nice back-to-back in there, and 3 out of 4.

    Haven't seen Blue Velvet in a very long time.

  76. Bruce says:

    Wow, TSN just showed a quote from Andrew Cogliano and the graphic said "Sam Gagner".

  77. Hockey Noob says:

    @Ender

    I've often likened Edmonton's problem to being similar to that of Toronto. With both teams, when you can fill your arena while losing hockey games/missing playoffs, it doesn't provide much impetus to win.

  78. spOILer says:

    Bruce et alii…

    I'm going off memory here, which isn't the best due to too much HBomb type activity over the years, but I believe Patton's driver when Patton's jeep broke down at a crucial time was famous for having uttered:

    "The fucking fuck's fucked,"

    thus making the first recorded instance of the grammatically correct triple use of fuck—that Lynch later stole for his screenplay.

    Rumour has it this is the exact same phrase Quinn mumbles in his sleep these days.

  79. PierreMcGuires Ghost says:

    Master Lok said:
    Moving out the jetsam (moreau, pisani) makes some sort of sense, but if Pisani could play 100%, then he would be a valuable addition but if he's out with colitis, then he would be on LTIR in any case… or retired.
    But moving out the flotsam (stortini, pouliot, reddox)? How does moving out Stortini or Reddox, who both make under a $1 million dollars and are both guys who bust their butts on the ice make us better? You certainly won't find many guys who will be cheaper.

    I didn't say how it would happen, I merely listed those that we could do easily without.
    Pisani, imo, will never be 100% again, and likely could be replaced without much effort. It wouldn't surprise me to see him shut it down.
    But I seriously question exactly how Stortini (12g in nearly 170 NHL games), Pouliot (14g in 141 NHL games) and Reddox (5 NHL goals in 5 years in the Oil org) make us "better".
    It is my opinion we could cut bait on all 3, and replace each easily… and with 3 players of differing skills sets, size, and experience. And likely for the same or less $.
    But, my apologies for not falling in love with the inventory here…

  80. Alice says:

    Fucking Fuck the fucking fuckers.

    Takes me back to simpler times, that delightful turn of phrase.

    Guy used to say that in a kitchen someplace I worked a million years ago, back in Edm, then the City of Champions, not the City of Fodder for Calgary [*chokes back tear*]

  81. PDO says:

    Not even reading this thread because this shit throws me into a blind rage that I'm not nearly drunk enough (oh, I'll be back later, don't you worry….) to handle….

    #1) We didn't get Dany Heatley. HOWEVER.

    Dustin Penner has been better this season than Heatley. Now, is a lot of that %'s, lady luck, and all that jazz? You bet.

    Fact is, this team go a giant fucking whale. An elite powerforward!

    … but hey, we still suck? I mean, could it possibly be because we don't have enough NHL players behind him?

    Nah…

    #2) Jagr would have signed here if we offered him 2 years (ex, last year and this year). Guarantee he would have been better.

    But that was "too risky."

    We really are run by a bunch of morons. Kevin Lowe can't get over the "big fish." I swear to god he thinks that if he can acquire a big fish (never mind Penner, Souray, Visnovsky, Khabibulin….) like Pronger again, this team is back in the SCF. Ignoring of course, that that teams bottom 9 forwards were quite possibly better than this teams top 9 forwards…

    Tambellini is terrified of trading away guys like Nilsson, Pouliot, Reddox, Stone, JFJ, etc, etc, because they might become something. Grow a set.

    Quinn is still trying to roll 4 lines for some inexplicable reason.

    Renney is the only guy that seems sane, but he gets the last face time of anyone outside of Batman.

  82. PDO says:

    *least face time.

  83. HBomb says:

    Why do I get the idea that PierreMaguire's Ghost and Bruce are headed towards a two-person kumite of epic proportions on the subject of Zack Stortini?

    This one might be better held on the neutral ground known as Inebriated Oiler Fans, which is basically the Oilogosphere equivalent of the LNAH.

  84. bookie says:

    Have you all heard the clip "Proper Uses of the Word Fuck". It clarifies this discussion and provides the proper quote – "Fuck the Fucking Fuckers"

  85. knighttown says:

    You can't have a Fuck-themed thread and not mention Ricky's:

    Hey Lahey! Why don't you fuck-off to Fuckoffityville!"

  86. Bruce says:

    Why do I get the idea that PierreMaguire's Ghost and Bruce are headed towards a two-person kumite of epic proportions on the subject of Zack Stortini?

    Can't imagine where you'd get that idea, HBomb. I was merely going to mildly point out that Stortini's $700 K looks mighty reasonable compared to a lot of those two-comma contracts. Glad we have at least one contract that's going to help rather than hurt against the cap. Good thing we tied him up for that extra year, that's pretty cheap for a player with his combination of youth, experience, and enthusiasm. Still improving too.

  87. SK Oiler Fan says:

    Before Tambo even thinks about big game hunting he needs to start dumping salary:
    Moreau, Staois, Nilsson, Pisani (LTIR?), Possibly one of Souray or Vis need to be culled.

    Cap flexibility is this teams biggest need right now.

    This team at best gets 6 games in the first round if completely healthy. If it happens, great, but Tambo needs to keep his eye on next year.

    The difference between the contenders and the wannabees in the west this year is larger than Craig Conroy's mouth.

    And IMHO, Eberle and PJS are not the answer next year. They are allready too young upfront. Gets some depth at center ice allready!

  88. YKOil says:

    Not a 'quite possibly' to it PDO – that team's bottom 9 was light years ahead of this team's bottom 9.

  89. PDO says:

    YK:

    I said that teams bottom 9 was better than this teams TOP 9.

    For those counting, that would be (by ESTOI/60 with at least 7 GP…):

    Horcoff, Hemsky, Penner, O'Sullivan, Gagner, Brule, JFJ, Cogliano and Nilsson.

    Vs:

    Peca, Moreau, Hemsky, Samsonov, Pisani, Stoll, Torres, Reasoner and Brodziak.

    That's damn close.

    How sad is that?

  90. Dennis says:

    Bruce: I never really thought of it like that:)

    I am just frustrated with the club so I figured I'd say fuck just for the fuck of it:)

  91. PDO says:

    Well that's awesome Dennis, because I fuck just for the fuck of it…

  92. Bruce says:

    Fuckin' aye.

  93. YKOil says:

    Ah, sorry PDO. Gotcha.

    Makes me misty when I spend some real time thinking about it. Getting more numb every year though so I guess that means I'm healing.

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