Hemsky’s Heroes

Darren Dreger’s lastest column suggests “the Oilers are looking for a roster player for Ales Hemsky, which is too steep for many given his struggles.” I imagine “roster player” means someone under contract moving forward and who will be useful as part of the rebuild. The Oilers are going to need a forward to replace Hemsky next season (there’s no obvious candidate for offensive results against good competition) but it’s understandable that a team adding for a playoff run isn’t likely to offload something useful for a rental.

It’s interesting to see the men who have come to the aid of 83 over the last while: Horcoff, Hall and Gilbert (although there may be others I’m not aware of). Hemsky’s possible replacements (basically adding a fourth to Hall, Eberle and Smyth) includes Gagner (who is more comfortable at center) and a large group of question marks. Ryan Jones, Ben Eager, Magnus Paajarvi, Linus Omark and Teemu Hartikainen are all miles from being able to deliver at Hemsky’s level, and in fact none of them ever will.

It’s a huge deal–I’ve received a few emails this week suggesting massive overreaction on my part to the Hemsky situation–because of the enormous hole it puts the 12-13 team in. If the Oilers trade Hemsky for just assets–a 1st rd pick and a prospect, for instance–they’ll have assets but lose one of their best offensive players. An offensive player who can make a difference against tougher competition.

We’re beginning to hear rumblings that Hemsky has softened his stance and will accept a shorter term (2-3 year) deal from the Oilers. That combined with the knowledge that Hemsky’s unusual season (he is not at the top of his game, although trending toward the median) has caused interest and offers to recede, should tell Mr. Tambellini all he needs to know about this situation.

Protect your asset. Sign the man.

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94 Responses to "Hemsky’s Heroes"

  1. Woodguy says:

    Knocks against Hemsky:

    1) Often injured.

    -This is true over the last 3 years, but coming off of major surgery is on pace to play 70 games this year and says he feels healthy for the first time in a long time

    2) Doesn’t produce at his historical rate:

    -Off to a very slow start after surgery in the off-season. Has 15 points in the last 20 games for a .750pt/gm clip.

    3) Will wreck the cap when the kids need to be signed.

    -In the summer of 2013 when 4, 14 and 91 come due for their next contract the OIler have 7 players under contract for $17.8MM, with cap space of $46.5MM. It may be even less if an amnesty clause is worked out in the new CBA and Horcoff comes off as well. That would make it 6 players signed @12.3MM.

    -Petry and Gagner come up this summer.

    -If you can’t work out how to keep a elite/near elite player on the payroll with that much cap room, perhaps you should run and ice cream stand instead of a NHL franchise.

    There’s room.

    4) He’s not a leader

    -The Kaptain, Assistant Captain and Franchise have gone out of their way to support Hemsky publicly. That’s all you need to now about how the team feels.

    5) He’s first off the ice and has bad body language.

    -Seriously? Go fuck yourself if you think this has any bearing on anything other than perception among non-team mates.

  2. neojanus says:

    The good ol’ passion regarding our Czech-almost-phenom.

    I agree with what you’re saying Woodguy, but my only slight retort is that we don’t know for certain if the Oilers and Hemsky CAN even come to terms. We have media speculation — that helps a bit, but so much depends on the Hemsky camp here.

    My fear is that the Oilers lose him for nothing if no agreement can be made. The Oilers shouldn’t sign him for a contract that becomes an over-payment.

    Hemsky can still be the force we have seen year after year. I think the injury rut might be over (the whole team’s cursed with it and that curse is ending). Can he do it in an Oilers’ environment? That’s a tough one to answer. So much depends on how the young players maintain themselves as hockey players.

    Do I want to see Hemsky in an Oilers’ jersey? Yes.

    Do I want Tambellini to overpay? No.

    Do I want to bank 4-5 years on Hemsky? Not a chance right now.

    If he will sign for 2 years (even if the Oilers have to overpay a little bit to keep him), get it done and let this Oilers team bring the best two lines in the hockey potentially.

    If he will not bend on the 4-5 years, he’s traded himself because the Oilers have few options heading forward. They have no choice but to improve in the standings next year or the Heavens are going to rage acid and fire.

    Damn Oilers getting my heart-rate up… at least they smoked the Flames last night.

  3. copperblueandwhite says:

    Woodguy,

    Hemsky was a stud again last night…the potential of Hemsky paired with Hall is unlimited…not only will Hemmer play outstanding, Hall will mature much more quickly….Tambo is a lame brain for letting this go on for so long…give him long term and quit being numbbrained..enough of the fu*king managment already.

  4. godot10 says:

    Players like Dubinsky and Stafford should be available in the trade market under reasonable terms (from cap-stretched teams) are also potential replacements to 2nd and 3rd line depth, in addition to the Oiler prospect pool.

    Penner is a UFA.

    There are alternatives.

    That said, I might increase my 1-year offer @ $6 million to 2 years @ $6 million per, but I’m pretty sure that would be my final offer.

  5. pboy says:

    Woodguy: 5) He’s first off the ice and has bad body language.
    -Seriously? Go fuck yourself if you think this has any bearing on anything other than perception among non-team mates.

    My company has 40+ employees. I know which employees come to work late and which ones leave early. Those are the people I’m concerned with. The employees that show up on time and leave when the work day are over, I don’t give a second thought too.

    Me: You are always the 1st guy out the door at the end of the day and I’m sick of it!

    Employee (designated MSM whipping boy): It’s not like I’m leaving early. The clock hits 5 o’clock and I go home.

    Me: YOU PIECE OF SHIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  6. Wolfie says:

    There is absolutely no reason why you can’t have all these guys signed. Chicago will have 6 players under contract next year making over $5 million. Toews, Kane, Sharp, Hossa with Keith and Seabrook on the back end all making big coin.

    Looking around on CapGeek, there seems to be a bunch of different ways GMs go about building their teams. RNH, Hall, Eberle and Hemsky look like they could be a pretty good comparable the the Hawks big 4. Using the Cap as an excuse is a huge copout.

  7. Bar_Qu says:

    I was at the game last night, and since I was not expecting anything much (and the Saddledome is a better place to be social than get ramped up about hockey) I was not paying real close attention to the game until the second. What did stick out in that first period and was fairly obvious throughout the game was that the 3 best Oilers out there were Hall, Eberle and Hemsky. Eberle and Hall got most of the glory last night, but Hemsky was the one keeping pucks in, beating defenders one-on-one and playing a good two-way game (not to mention setting up some good breaks with heads-up passes).

    Unbelievable that fans could have such a short-term memory for what he brings to this team.

    Otoh, the guy I was sitting in front of remarked to his kid that Omark was in the AHL “because he was too lazy” so I may have little clue what actual Oiler fans think.

  8. maudite says:

    pboy: My company has 40+ employees. I know which employees come to work late and which ones leave early. Those are the people I’m concerned with. The employees that show up on time and leave when the work day are over, I don’t give a second thought too.Me: You are always the 1st guy out the door at the end of the day and I’m sick of it!Employee (designated MSM whipping boy): It’s not like I’m leaving early. The clock hits 5 o’clock and I go home.Me: YOU PIECE OF SHIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Pboy, straight up laughed when I read this. Confirms something that always bothered me about offices and such. People work differently. Management that doesn’t see this fails to capitalize on likely the true potential of their people. I’ve seen offices and the same type of situation numerous times.. The come early leave lates were always ladded for their dedication but by comparrsion got the same or less actually accomplished than myself and others. Some people don’t need to work as hard as others (or work in bursts that can’t be sustained 8 hours a day) to accomplish things. If the results of your people’s work has merit, they should be judged primarily on this not on the minor mechanics of how they work.

  9. ashley says:

    In the first few weeks of the season, I suggested that Renney overcoaches. I hate to pile on a guy that is injured, but it sure looks like this team would do better without all the “systems”. Sometimes less is more. Saying nothing can be better than a continuous stream of criticism and coaching.

    This young team needs to spread its wings. I was at the game last night, and I saw guys doing and trying things creatively that we haven’t seen for a long time. They don’t always work out, but this team has top tier offensive talent which won’t fluorish while constantly being told “don’t do that, don’t try this, stick to the system”. Kids who have been raised with a healthy respect for authority are particularly vulnerable to the stifling effect of overcoaching. They lose all the improvisation and creativity that brought them to this level. MPS comes immediately to mind. Gagner also to some degree. Other guys are a little more brash and choose to ignore the stream of criticism. Hall is in that category and has managed to succeed in spite of this coaching style. Also Omark. Hall is untouchable. Omark got railroaded for his insolence.

    It’s time to let these kids out of the box and see how high they can go.

    And enough already. Let’s get Omark back up here.

  10. bookje says:

    One thing I am very happy about is we are finally reaching the point where there can be no doubt about the real agenda of the Oilers. It is debatable as to whether management was really seeking a lottery pick, a 20th overal finish, or a playoff spot this season. Were they more concerned about development and a draft pick OR about making the playoffs. I felt that they were seeking 20-25th and fell short, but I (and nobody without direct insider information) really know.

    I think there can be no doubt that management will be doing whatever they can to compete for a playoff spot for next season. There can be no ‘secret agenda’ of targeting a lower finish (i.e. no secret plan to finish in the lottery). There might be an acceptance that they might not make the playoffs, but I think that without a doubt we can know that they are trying to do so.

    The clarity will prove nice as we move forwards. It starts now – with this trade deadline. The Oilers may not do anything to be more competitive for the rest of the season, but we can start judging the moves made at the deadline with the notion that this team is trying to compete in 2012/13.

  11. nathan says:

    “If he will sign for 2 years… get it done…If he will not bend on the 4-5 years, he’s traded himself”

    neojanus,

    Looks like 3 years is the over/under on term. I’m hoping the team wanted Matty to float that and that they are serious about signing Hemsky.

    Matheson, Feb 14: “if hemsky were to take a 2-yr, $4.25 mil a yr deal from oil, it would likely be done tomorrow, but oil leery of 4 to 5 yrs with inj history”

    LT, Feb 15: “believe I said something like 3 year times 5M”.

    MC79, Feb 16: “Nathan’s posting from the Oilers offices right? Love hearing this ‘ST will do three years’ meme develop”.

    MC79, Feb 20: “Wow. According to Stauffer Hemsky might be softening on term and two or three years is possible. Crazy if true”.

  12. art vandelay says:

    I respect PBoy having a company with 40+ employees, but any employee can put in face time if he knows that’s what impresses you. Show up on time. Check hockey pool online for three hours. Eat lunch at desk to really look like a grinder. Check hockey pool for three hours. Rush around with papers in hand for an hour late in the afternoon. Be the last to leave because going home early just means having to talk to the wife or listen to the brats make noise.
    Does Hemsky produce? If yes, then he’s worth something to somebody.
    Does Hemsky pull chute on practice as soon as it’s over? Who gives a sh!t.

  13. pboy says:

    art vandelay: I respect PBoy having a company with 40+ employees, but any employee can put in face time if he knows that’s what impresses you. Show up on time. Check hockey pool online for three hours. Eat lunch at desk to really look like a grinder. Check hockey pool for three hours. Rush around with papers in hand for an hour late in the afternoon. Be the last to leave because going home early just means having to talk to the wife or listen to the brats make noise.Does Hemsky produce? If yes, then he’s worth something to somebody.Does Hemsky pull chute on practice as soon as it’s over? Who gives a sh!t.

    The quality of someone’s work is paramount for me. People who are chronically late or are out the door 1/2 an hour early frequently tend to create problems for their co-workers and eventually, those problems are brought to my attention. The longer I’m in the business world, I find that the High School mentality doesn’t leave most people after they have left High School.

    If Ales Hemsky is producing on the ice and not causing problems in the locker room, it’s a no brainer to bring him back. I would be cautious about a 4 or 5 year term because I’m still not convinced he won’t be injury prone with his shoulders going forward but I want him back on a 2 to 3 year deal.

  14. stevezie says:

    Woodguy:

    5) He’s first off the ice and has bad body language.

    -Seriously?Go fuck yourself if you think this has any bearing on anything

    This is the best commentary on the body language debate I will ever read.

    As far as practise goes, maybe Hemsky could be better if he had Ryan O’Reilley’s practice/exercize ethic, but as is he’s still really good. I think he signs a Krejci-esque contract and we all go home happy. Hope is a good thing.

  15. Captain Obvious says:

    Last night’s game was bittersweet. On the one hand, it was an incredible ass kicking. If anything the score flattered the Flames. It was a sign of what this team could be if they had management that understood how much talent it takes to be excellent.* On the other hand, unless a miracle happens and Hemsky is re-signed, it was a little taste of a team that will never be. Bittersweet.

    *Really, the lesson couldn’t be clearer. To win you have to come in waves. Talent that is isolated is talent that is wasted. The Flames have some good players but they were in a wasteland last night. If you build your team that way you are relying on goaltending and luck. Talent needs talent to breathe. It is exponential. Even if Omark could replace Hemsky it would be a bad move because Omark + Hemsky is still better than Omark or Hemsky alone.

    If the rumours are true that Hemsky would sign for three years, give him 3/17 and move on. That’s a good deal with minimal risk. It’s better than trading for an inferior Stafford, paying him 12 M, and losing whatever you had to trade to get him.

  16. mattwatt says:

    Can someone please post the links of Hall, Horcoff and Gilbert discussing Hemsky? Just want to hear what they have said about Ales.

    Funny that those in the MSM kept alluding to Hemsky and his temperament, yet his teammates seemingly speak glowingly out about him. It is as if one of these groups only talks to him in short, brief passages without ever getting true insight into who he is and the other group is around him all the time, sees how he acts, and have a more complete understanding of Ales.

    Guess we should put more weight into those who only see him briefly. Makes a ton of sense.

  17. Traktor says:

    The kids all mentioned last year how Smack was such a good teammate and they loved having him on the team but nobody mentioned that last year because it didn’t fit their agenda. I get that Hemsky makes some fans weak in the knees but some of these pro-Hemsky arguments put cloud on the more reasonable objections to trading Hemsky.

    Tambellini: We would like to offer you 3 years at 5M per

    Hemsky’s agent: Gilbert and Horcoff both want Hemsky to stay, that has to be worth an extra million and couple extra years on the term.

    lulz

  18. oilswell says:

    Its been a long time coming with Hemsky. They didn’t deal him at the deadline last year or in the offseason. Quite likely because of incompetence, but even so there was a question for the 11-12 season of how much veteran help to keep for the team to develop and challenge for the playoffs. The team might have been thinking about making the team attractive to free agents in the 11-12 offseason, and keeping Hemsky for 11-12 helps makes that happen. Plus his trade value would have been low towards the end of 10-11. From one point of view, since his value is low at end of 10-11 season you might want to keep him for 11-12 to learn more about his value going forward. If he’s looking great you have a better season and either sign him because he’s a good gamble, or else trade him for higher value than you would have gotten a year back. If he’s looking sucky in 11-12 you dodge the bullet (signing him long term) and lose a little value (the difference between the assets you get at 11-12 deadline versus the asses you could have gotten at 10-11 deadline; and there may be little difference there, in fact). These might be some of the ways of defending the decision to keep Hemsky at 10-11 deadline without signing him in the summer.

    Given the decision was already made on keeping him for 11-12, the decision for 12-13 and going forward is a UFA purchase decision. Yes, the Oilers are “losing” a top RW if they don’t sign Hemsky, but realistically whatever they pay Hemsky will be very close if not identical to what they would have to pay if Hemsky were currently a member of the Detroit Red Wings and they sign him July 1 instead of today.

    Does anyone really think the Oilers will get a really significant “home town” discount for Hemsky?

    If so, then OK, there’s an argument that you need to “keep” Hemsky.

    If not, then I prefer to look at signing Hemsky as simply the first UFA signing of the 2012 offseason. The question for the Oilers “brain”trust is whether Hemsky is the UFA they should be targeting to acquire. If he is the correct UFA target, then negotiate it now and get it done using the exclusive bargaining window to see what kind of discount they can get. Realize, though, that the cost to this UFA acquisition is not only his new contract but comes at the added cost of whatever assets they could have gotten for at the trade deadline. So, say, he’s going to cost a high 2nd rounder and prospect PLUS his new contract. If he is not the best UFA option and they want to wait until 2012 or even 2013 to spend Hemsky money on a UFA, they’re best off to get the assets and broaden the search on the trade or UFA landscape.

    To me, I’m OK with them passing on Hemsky as a UFA. I love the guy and like how he plays, but given his injury issues, and given an organization that can screw so many things up, I’m hoping they change the managerial structure before handing out long term contracts, and letting Hemsky go now gives that a better chance.

  19. godot10 says:

    A professional is not measured by the clock. A professional seeks to improve where they are weak. Crosby was upset by the number of goals he was scoring so he spent hours of extra time working on his shot.

    Bowman read the riot act to Yzerman and demanded that he improve his two-way game or he would be shipped out to Ottawa? He was getting 100 points a year. I’m sure he was attending practice. He wasn’t a bad teammate. Keenan cutting him from a couple of Team Canada’s didn’t seem to bother him. But none of that was enough from Bowman who demanded more of a professional hockey player, demanded that he get better and work on his weaknesses, admit that he had weaknesses.

    Has Hemsky ever had 25 goals? Why is a professional the first off the ice when he still has such a massive deficiency in his game? Why is he satisfied with 20 goals? If he is content with 20 goals, is that a player I really want? Maybe the coach is right. Maybe you should try a different stick. Did you just laugh off the suggestion. Maybe you should mix in a little chip-n-chase, instead of trying to beat the defenseman one-on-one every damn offing time….you know, use your brain and teammates to amplify your natural physical skill.

    Why did it take an 18-year old shaming him with a top five power play to make Hemsky more aggressive on the half-wall on the PP? The 18-year old was doing it with a career AHL’er on the point in Potter. With the much maligned Horcoff too. Hemsky had basically all the same guys less Potter last year and was bottom five. Hemsky had Chris Pronger one year, and all the could do was middle-of-the-pack. Why was he content with a middling power play? He had Visnovsky and Souray other years also. Still only middling at best. The 18-year old has Corey Potter. Yep, Hemsky’s personal power play boxcars didn’t look so bad, but the team’s number were always only mediocre to awful. But I guess that was good enough.

    20 goals a season and a mediocre to awful team power play, and apparent satisfaction with that. Is THAT the guy you want to build around?

    Bowman was willing to contemplate a future without Yzerman and read the riot act. I think MacT was far too soft on Hemsky, because Hemsky was all he had and he couldn’t pull a Bowman. He set the bar low for Hemsky.

  20. Clay says:

    Hemsky is a “roster player”, and he’s quite simply better than any roster player coming back. Why can’t Tambo see this? Like Woodguy and others have stated, there’s no way that a new Hemsky contract can’t be managed under the cap.

    I thought the D pairings from last night looked great, if not understated, and there isn’t anything wrong with that. Petry was throwing bodychecks, making great decisions on both passes and skating the puck out of trouble, and generally looked like a top 4 dman (not to mention he had over 4 minutes more ice time than any Oiler).

    Whitney is looking more comfortable, and I think that he’s a smart enough hockey player that, over the long run, he’ll be able to make up for his loss of mobility with good positioning.

    Anyone else notice how long Theo “Lambchops” Peckham’s sideburns are getting these days?

    How nice was it to not have Barker out there to worry about?

  21. Traktor says:

    I have tried to stay away from the “first off the ice” argument but in professional sports I don’t think its unreasonable to expect someone struggling to put in extra work to get themselves back on track.

    If the MSM ran with the story of Khabibulin being first off the ice last year I’m sure there would be a different tone. Its not a legit reason to trade Hemsky but enough straws will eventually break the camel’s back.

  22. Doogie2K says:

    Traktor,

    The difference is, Smack was bad at hockey. Hemsky is very good at hockey. It’s not even a relevant comparison.

    Traktor:
    I have stayed away from the “first off the ice” argument but in professional sports I don’t think its unreasonable to expect someone struggling to put in extra work to get themselves back on track.

    If the MSM ran with the story of Khabibulin being first off the ice last year I’m sure there would be a different tone. Its not a legit reason to trade Hemsky but enough straws will eventually break the camel’s back.

    Renney said all the way back in December that Hemsky was working his shoulder in the training room after practice. You know, trying to get back on track.

    If you question his work ethic, I’d suggest that you didn’t really watch the game last night. There was one shift early in the second where he was all over the O-zone, breaking up Flames clearing attempts left and right. Didn’t get a shot, but kept the play alive an extra 30 seconds and made a couple of extra chances possible.

  23. DSF says:

    Pierre LeBrun @Real_ESPNLeBrun

    Three more years on Vermette’s deal paying him $3.75 M per RT @TSNBobMcKenzie: CBJ trades Antoine Vermette to PHX. #tsn

    Bob McKenzie @TSNBobMcKenzie

    PHX is also including a minor league player off their Portland farm team with the two draft picks to CBJ for Antoine Vermette. #tsn

  24. Traktor says:

    Doogie2K:
    Traktor,

    The difference is, Smack was bad at hockey. Hemsky is very good at hockey. It’s not even a relevant comparison.

    I agree that Hemsky is a better player but for a second I thought some were arguing that teammates should decide on roster decisions.

  25. Traktor says:

    DSF:
    Pierre LeBrun @Real_ESPNLeBrun

    Three more years on Vermette’s deal paying him $3.75 M per RT @TSNBobMcKenzie: CBJ trades Antoine Vermette to PHX. #tsn

    Bob McKenzie @TSNBobMcKenzie

    PHX is also including a minor league player off their Portland farm team with the two draft picks to CBJ for Antoine Vermette. #tsn

    The actual trade deadline day (27th) is going to give hockey fans blue balls.

  26. Traktor says:

    Doogie2K:
    Traktor,

    If you question his work ethic, I’d suggest that you didn’t really watch the game last night. There was one shift early in the second where he was all over the O-zone, breaking up Flames clearing attempts left and right. Didn’t get a shot, but kept the play alive an extra 30 seconds and made a couple of extra chances possible.

    Hemsky played great last night. If he played like that all year he might already have a contract extension.

  27. hags9k says:

    Traktor,

    Agreed. The season started in October.

  28. LMHF#1 says:

    Traktor: Hemsky played great last night. If he played like that all year he might already have a contract extension.

    Everyone else gets consideration for injury recovery. He should as well.

  29. Ducey says:

    That Vermette trade might impact on Hemsky. Looking just a box cars:

    Vermette 60 gp 8 G 19A 27 pts -17 12 PIM 106 shots
    Hemsky 46 gp 5 21 26 pts -14 27 PIM 79 shots

    Hemsky’s points per game are better (.45 v .56) but Vermette is a bigger body who has played almost every game the last five seasons. He also had 65 pts two years ago.

    The comparison is not perfect but some GM’s might be trying use Vermette as a benchmark in Hemsky discussions.

  30. Traktor says:

    Hemsky shot totals:

    2006/2007: 2.30 per game
    2007/2008: 2.48 per game
    2008/2009: 2.56 per game
    2009/2010: 2.59 per game
    2010/2011: 2.12 per game
    2011/2012: 1.71 per game

    Seems like Hemsky is trending in the wrong direction the last 2 years. Is it just a coincidence or does his two shoulder injuries have something to do with it?

  31. Bar_Qu says:

    One thing I did notice at the game during one of the Oilers 3 PP is when Hemsky and PRV were out there with I think it was Petry and Potter, the PP went back to the way it was last year. Pass to Hemsky and then wait until they could get it back to the point and “boom” it at the net. PRV did not move much and neither did the other fwd to try and create down low. Later on the same PP Eberle, Hall and Gagner jumped out, the puck went everywhere and ended up in the net. My buddy (the Flames fan who took me to the game) said maybe the improved PP was a result of the coaching, but I strongly feel it is entirely due to a bunch of kids who have always played a creative PP and brought that with them, rather than being coached how to play a PP.

  32. ashley says:

    Bar_Qu:
    I strongly feel it is entirely due to a bunch of kids who have always played a creative PP and brought that with them, rather than being coached how to play a PP.

    Agree. These guys have been doing this for a long time, kids or otherwise. Certainly there is a need for some degree of organization and guidance, but mostly they just need to go out there with their sticks and do what they have been doing since they were 5 years old.

  33. hags9k says:

    LMHF#1,

    This is true, especially if Souray was correct in saying we are rushing people back too soon. (RNH?) If they aren’t 100% ready to go they should not be out there obviously, but that said guys will take awhile to catch back up to game speed. Gagner comes to mind. But with 83 this year I would wager it has been as much between the ears as in the shoulder. As Kobe said about Gasol, tough to be at your best when you don’t know where you will be living in a month. But whatever the reasons, this is his UFA year and the results do matter.

    Woodguy, I’d say that when sports fans suspect attitude problems, bad body language, poor work ethic etc, that often where there is smoke there is fire. Not always but often. However, in this case I think you are right and it doesn’t mean jack and the fact his teammates are coming to bat for him like you said trumps everything. If Hall etc. remained silent about him or gave off the cliched responses then those rumours would smoulder.

    My concern with Hemmer besides the injuries, cash and term, comes down not to attitude but to style of play. As LT said the other day he has delighted and frustrated for a decade. For this fan frustrated is way out in front. I realize I’m in the minority here on this but oh well.

  34. ashley says:

    Ducey:
    That Vermette trade might impact on Hemsky.Looking just a box cars:

    Possibly, but in reality it is apples to oranges. Hemsky is in the final year of a contract, UFA next year. He is more talented and could have incredible production in the right environment. Look at Eberle last year after Hemsky, Hall, Horcoff, and Gagner got injured. Eberle was practically invisible. Now he’s a god around here. Working against Hemsky’s value are his injury history and that he may end up just being a rental.

    Vermette is a 30 year old plugger with one good year under his belt. He is under contract for 3 more years after this @ 3.75 million. That’s a lot of salary to take on for a guy heading past his prime. The trade seems fair.

  35. Traveling Man says:

    We don’t need more magic beans (late first rounder and prospect) for Hemsky. Sign Hemsky and we keep a top six forward that can be part of the team long term or after he has a bounce back season can be a trade option when we can get maximum value.
    In a couple of years we will be one of the teams looking for a top six winger to help us make the playoffs. We have him now so keep him.
    No brainer, we have a top six forward that wants to be here. How is our success at signing free agents? The guy likes it here so keep him and sign him to a three year deal.
    Just a thought. How much would we have to pay for a Hemsky caliber player to sign in Edmonton as a UFA in July? Then think about the semantics of signing him to 3 years at 5 million per versus playing hard ball for three years at say 4 million with the end result of no deal being the magic beans or losing him for nothing as a UFA.

  36. Ducey says:

    ashley,

    Good point. Vermette’s contract might have lowered the return.

  37. Woodguy says:

    Traktor: I agree that Hemsky is a better player but for a second I thought some were arguing that teammates should decide on roster decisions.

    Not pissing off your players is important.

    LT quoted George McPhee who said one of his mistakes early as a GM was not thinking about the message a trade can send to the players.

    Trading Hemksy sends a bad message about being compeitive soon, and about organizational loyalty.

    Also,

    This wasn’t a matter of players giving a pat answer when someone asks them about a player.

    Horcoff said (paraphrased) “He brings an offensive dimension that isn’t easy to replace, and that we need on this team’

    Hall said (paraphrasesd) “we can create a lot on the rush, I hope we can do that for another 5 years”

    Pretty direct comments, not “great team mate” bullshit.

  38. Woodguy says:

    Rutuu signs in CAR for 4 years.

    No term yet.

  39. Woodguy says:

    Woodguy:
    Rutuu signs in CAR for 4 years.

    No term yet.

    Oops, meant no $ yet.

  40. nathan says:

    Woodguy,

    4.4M per is being thrown around but that looks like a misread of a McKenzie tweet

  41. CJ says:

    I see this issue as win-win. Keeping Hemsky is the right thing to do. Selling him for magic beans will likely get Tambo fired by the end of next season. I also laugh at the complaints about his durablity. We will be having this same discussion about Hall in 5 years.

  42. nathan says:

    @TSNBobMcKenzie CAR and Tuomo Ruutu agree to terms on a four-year extension with an AAV of $4.75M. #TradeCentre #tsn.

  43. bookje says:

    It seems to me that Tambellini is doing the rational thing by both checking the marketplace and negotiating with the player at the same time. By only doing one or the other, I think you ‘show your cards’ and weaken your position. It also allows him to get a sense of how other GMs value Hemsky. Hemsky’s comments to the media last week probably are just part of his side of the negotiations. Negotiations are tough business when you are dealing with millions of dollars and mistakes are costly. I am glad Tambellini appears to be exploring the alternatives and will withhold judgement until the trade or signing is made.

    Sign Hemsky now you dithering moron!

  44. gogliano says:

    RNH still has two years before he gets paid and our top 3 pick from this summer is at least three years away from a top contract. I’d offer pretty high dollars to bring term down to two or even three years and throw in a limited trade clause as well (of the sort that he can eliminate 10 teams or whatever).

    His value is low right now and he is, if healthy, still a first-line winger. No reason to get rid of him unless he won’t budge on term.

    Unless the Oil are working with an internal cap the money is there. If they are working with an internal cap we have bigger problems than Hemsky/Tambo right now.

  45. Jordan says:

    bookje:
    Sign Hemsky now you dithering moron!

    My name is not Stan Weir, and I approve this message.

  46. Woodguy says:

    Oh shit.

    Stauffer has gone from “Hemsky is willing to move on term”, to “The Oilers can’t afford Hemsky due to cap flexibilty issues”

    I guess someone told him to change the narrative.

    Ruutu coming off the market drives up Hemsky’s trade value.

    Bah!

  47. rickithebear says:

    Ruutu was thought to have more value. I am oK with 4.75M @ 4years for Hemsky. half way between real value 4.5M and expected 5M.

    Thanks Carolina.

  48. Traktor says:

    If Ruutu is worth 4.75 x 4 then what is Hemsky worth?

    Using Woodguy’s measure (career points per game):

    Ruutu 0.57
    Hemsky 0.78

    Out of the many thousands of unique viewers on LT’s site it would would appear that only Godot10 was looking at things realistically.

  49. godot10 says:

    Tuomo Ruutu just signed for 4 years @ $4.75, and you guys (who supposedly think he is a great player) are insulting him by offering him 3 years @ $5 million, less than Ryan Smyth was offered 5 years ago, and less than Horcoff was offered 3 years ago, and no raise.

    I’m willing to go 2 years @ $6 million (he is a very good player with a couple of significant flaws). Which is not asking him to give up any open market money, but only asking him to share the injury risk on term. If he stays healthy, and performs, he will still be able to get full value in two years from the Oilers or on the open market.

  50. Traktor says:

    rickithebear:
    Ruutu was thought to have more value. I am oK with 4.75M @ 4years for Hemsky. half way between real value 4.5M and expected 5M.

    Thanks Carolina.

    Who thought that Ruutu was more valuable? Don’t you remember that being physical doesn’t matter?

    Hemsky’s agent will have a field day with Ruutu’s contract.

  51. nathan says:

    Staples is numerically challenged:

    “$5.2 million for a one-year deal, $4.8 million for a two-year deal, $4.5 million for a three-year deal, $4.1 million for a four-year deal, $3.6 million for a five-year deal”

    If you break out the marginal value Staples gives each extra contract year: 5.2 / 4.4 / 3.9 / 2.9 / 1.6

    HAHAHAHAHA

    4 x 4.1? 5 x 3.6? More bearish than RTB.

  52. Traktor says:

    Tambellini should call Horcoff and ask him how much Hemsky is worth in money and term.

  53. godot10 says:

    And all you guys are underestimating what the 2nd contracts for Hall, Eberle, and Nugent-Hopkins are going to cost. If you buy 2 UFA years, those contracts will likely be 7-years @ $7 million per season contracts. And if you don’t buy 2 UFA years, you are making a mistake.

    If you sign them to 2-year deals, then they can opt from arbitration in the following two years, and get to UFA status in the minimum 4 years after the ELC.

    Gagner is two years away from UFA status. Buying 2 UFA years will now almost certainly take his cap hit to $4 million, or closer to $4 million than $3.5 million. Ruutu is a 50 point player whose UFA years are going for $4.75, so expect to pay that in years 3 and 4 of the 4-year deal to Gagner which will take his cap hit to near $4 million overall.

    And do you do a Hemsky/Gilbert type of deal with Petry this summer….i.e. 6-years @ $4 million per season (3 UFA years, I think) ? Remember UFA status comes at 27.

  54. Woodguy says:

    godot10,

    I’m willing to go 2 years @ $6 million (he is a very good player with a couple of significant flaws). Which is not asking him to give up any open market money, but only asking him to share the injury risk on term. If he stays healthy, and performs, he will still be able to get full value in two years from the Oilers or on the open market.

    Would you go $17MM over 3yrs?

  55. cabbiesmacker says:

    So Tambo says he wants a roster player for Ales. Yo steve..sometimes what we want and what we get are two different things.

    ST : Yes I’ll move him but I want a roster player in return.

    Opposing Gm : You’ll get what I offer or go F urself Steve

    ST : K

    Options are pretty simple no? 1) Sign Ales on Ales terms 2) Let Ales go for nothing 3) Trade Ales for whatever is offered and 29 other GM’s know the hard place ST sleeps.

    The choice is Steves. White flag now or short bus pass later

  56. godot10 says:

    Woodguy,

    I think 2 years is one too many, but that is what happens in the UFA market…you have to buy the extra damn year. I’ll go 2 for sentimental reasons, and well, because I fear the trade market might not be there, and 2 years at $6 million per doesn’t cost Hemsky money, and shares the durability risk. And if the player is not willing to accept the performance risk of the shorter term like Hossa did a couple of times, well then I don’t know if I really want that player.

  57. LMHF#1 says:

    Woodguy:
    godot10,

    I’m willing to go 2 years @ $6 million (he is a very good player with a couple of significant flaws). Which is not asking him to give up any open market money, but only asking him to share the injury risk on term. If he stays healthy, and performs, he will still be able to get full value in two years from the Oilers or on the open market.

    Would you go $17MM over 3yrs?

    $17.5M for 3 or $23M for 4 would be quite reasonable.

  58. Traktor says:

    I will say it again:

    6 years, 36M

  59. LMHF#1 says:

    Traktor:
    I will say it again:

    6 years, 36M

    What he’ll get or what should be offered?

  60. Woodguy says:

    rickithebear:
    Ruutu was thought to have more value. I am oK with 4.75M @ 4years for Hemsky. half way between real value 4.5M and expected 5M.

    Thanks Carolina.

    Ruutu and Hemsky are comps?

    I was about to compile the numbers but Gregor just tweeted it, so I’ll steal his:

    Since lockout. Both drafted in the same year (2001)

    Ruutu:
    435 games played
    105 goals
    251 pts
    0.57 PPG

    Hemsky,
    406 games played
    101 goals
    357 pts
    0.88 PPG

    Ruutu doesn’t look like a good comp to me.

  61. rickithebear says:

    Last 5 years:
    Hemsky 15G 34A 49P per year.
    Ruutu 19G 26A 45P per year.

    how many passes die to get those 8 assists versus directly shooting @ 11%. I will take the goals.

    Woodguy I see you are taking unemployments statistical approach. have not worked for 5 years you are no longer unemployed.

    Hemsky’s games not played don’t count LOL.

  62. Woodguy says:

    Traktor:
    I will say it again:

    6 years, 36M

    What he’ll get or what you’d give him.

    I’d say that’s pretty close to what he’ll get.

  63. Traktor says:

    LMHF#1: What he’ll get or what should be offered?

    That’s his worth, at least if he hits the open market.

  64. spoiler says:

    I was willing to go as high as 5 x 5.5M (frontloaded) and still am. If he can be signed for cheaper, all the better. Obviously Tambo has greater fears than I do. However the signing of UFAs by many teams and thus removing them from the summer market is being undertaken for some reason. First, I suspect that other teams have issues attracting quality. Secondly, open market usually means a worse overpay. And lastly, teams are paying for known qualities rather than risking the unknown.

    Surely these concerns must be weighing on Tambo too?

    Which trade off does he take?

  65. Traktor says:

    Woodguy: What he’ll get or what you’d give him.

    I’d say that’s pretty close to what he’ll get.

    I would trade him for help on D or assets that can be parlayed into help on D. Its either him or Gagner.

    Crossing our fingers and hoping that a top D signs with us via free agency isn’t wise IMO.

    There has been lots of talk about Hemsky offering protection for the Kids but having some D that can get the puck of our zone is pretty beneficial as well in terms of protecting the Kids.

    I really don’t care what happens. There are pros and cons either way. My greatest fear is that Tambellini tries to boost our D but giving someone like Dennis Wideman a Souray type contract.

  66. Woodguy says:

    godot10,

    And all you guys are underestimating what the 2nd contracts for Hall, Eberle, and Nugent-Hopkins are going to cost. If you buy 2 UFA years, those contracts will likely be 7-years @ $7 million per season contracts. And if you don’t buy 2 UFA years, you are making a mistake.

    I think you are over estimating what the kids will get.

    Tavares just signed long term for $5.5MM. I think that’s a pretty good comp, he sold 2 years of UFA too. That represents a cap of 8.5% ot total team cap for the year it was signed.

    Kane and Toews both signed for 6.3MM, two other reasonable comps, although I think Toews and Kane have more value as a pair than Hall and Eberle today. They didn’t give up any UFA years. Their deals represent 10.6% of the cap when they were signed.

    Only Crosby, Malkin, Ovechkin and Stamkos got over $7MM on their second contract, and as much as I like the kids, they aren’t those 4.

    As it stands about $6MM seems like a reasonable bet. Its over 9% of the cap each, which is less than Toews and Kane, but more than Tavares. Tavares may have sold himself a little short.

    All of this assumes they don’t sign a 2nd contract before doing the UFA years in a third contract.

  67. Woodguy says:

    rickithebear:
    Last 5 years:
    Hemsky15G 34A 49P per year.
    Ruutu 19G 26A45P per year.

    how many passes die to get those 8 assists versus directly shooting @ 11%. I will take the goals.

    Woodguy I see you are taking unemployments statistical approach. have not worked for 5 years you are no longer unemployed.

    Hemsky’s games not played don’t count LOL.

    You should change your SN to “John the Baptist” because you are a lone voice calling out in the wilderness.

  68. Woodguy says:

    rickithebear,

    Woodguy I see you are taking unemployments statistical approach. have not worked for 5 years you are no longer unemployed.

    I counted all the games that Hemsky and Ruutu played since the lockout.

    What am I missing?

  69. PDO says:

    36/6 seems accurate.

    I’d like to see the Oiler’s tack on some cheap years to pull that hit down and front load him with a bit more cash as well.

  70. oilersfan says:

    Strickland from St. Louis is on the air now with Gregor. Interesting idea Gregor asking if St. Louis would trade Stewart for Hemsky. Stewart is having an off year but has been a 28 goal scorer the last two season. He is eligible for arbitration and will make 4.5 or so for the next contract. St. Louis has lots of big bodies already, I wonder if they would do this deal. I don’t want to trade Hemsky but that would be the kind of player I would like back. this team needs a power forward, and he would be fantastic with Gagner and hall.

  71. nathan says:

    rickithebear:
    Ruutu was thought to have more value. I am oK with 4.75M @ 4years for Hemsky. half way between real value 4.5M and expected 5M.

    Thanks Carolina.

    RTB,

    The weird thing is that AFTER Ruutu gets less than you expected, you jump up to 4 x 4.75M for Hemsky. Which is way more than your Feb 15 valuation : “Common sense says give him 80% of current contract (3.3M/yr) you will get a break even production”.

    I thought 5 x 5.5M might be out there from a GM. Seems even more likely. 4 x 5.25M seems a lock now.

  72. PDO says:

    6-6-6-6-6-6

    or

    8-8-7-5-5-3-3-2-1

    Both pay 36/6, but in the second option you give Hemsky a bit more “security” ($10,000,000) , along with front-loading the deal (gets him more money based on inflation) in exchange for him dropping his cap hit from 6 to 4.6 and potentially passing up on one last decent contract. After 6 years, Hemsky will be 34, and those tacked on 4 years take him to 38.. he likely retires before the end of the deal and leaves a bit of money on the table.

    Or, you could also go 9-8-7-5-4-3, which, at the very least, makes him a moveable asset in 3 years in all likelihood.

    Interesting from a risk management perspective for both parties. I think Hemsky would sign any of those deals, I can’t see Tambo offering anything other than the 1st deal, and suspect he wouldn’t anyway.

  73. Lucinius says:

    If Hemsky hits the UFA market I’ll be shocked if he gets less than 6 million a season if the deal is less than five years.I’ll also be shocked if it turns out to be an over pay when we have the opportunity to look back on it.

  74. Traktor says:

    I would rather pay him 6 straight across. I’m not a fan of front-loading contracts.

  75. nathan says:

    “4 x 5.25M seems a lock now.”

    I mean that I think there will be multiple bidders willing to go there. Which puts LT right in the middle of the road: “3 year times 5M. If it requires another year and a little more coin then I’d consider it”.

    Problem with middle of the road is that a motivated GM runs over you.

  76. FPB94 says:

    WG: Absolutely on the last point.

    Erik Cole’s the first off the ice in practice or warmups.

    He never takes a shift off in games and is like a jolly kid when he scores.

  77. Marc says:

    Woodguy:
    godot10,

    I think you are over estimating what the kids will get.

    Tavares just signed long term for $5.5MM.I think that’s a pretty good comp, he sold 2 years of UFA too.That represents a cap of 8.5% ot total team cap for the year it was signed.

    Kane and Toews both signed for 6.3MM, two other reasonable comps, although I think Toews and Kane have more value as a pair than Hall and Eberle today.They didn’t give up any UFA years.Their deals represent10.6% of the cap when they were signed.

    As it stands about $6MM seems like a reasonable bet.Its over 9% of the cap each, which is less than Toews and Kane, but more than Tavares.Tavares may have sold himself a little short.

    If the OIlers are paying Hemsky $5M+ there is no way in hell that Hall and Eberle sign for $6M when they are on the first line, first PP and outscoring him by 20+ points per season. The best players may not insist on being the best paid player at their position, but they to expect to be the best paid players on their team, as Tavares, Toews and Kane all are

    There is no question that the Oilers need Hemsky next season and cannot easily replace what he brings from within or through free agency. The fact that the Oilers have made it known that they’d like to sign him for a year or two suggests that they know it too.

    It is not at all clear that this will still be the case two or more years down the road. It is not impossible that two years from now, the OIlers will have five forwards who are clearly better than Hemsky (Hall, Eberle, RNH, Gagner, Yakupov/Grigorenko). If that is the case, all five will reasonably expect to be paid more than Hemsky when their contract comes up. If Hemsky is on $5-6M per year and producing 63 points a season (the average of his three ‘good’ years on his current contract), don’t you think all of those guys will expect $6-7M per year for producing more than that?

  78. bookje says:

    Traktor:
    I would rather pay him 6 straight across. I’m not a fan of front-loading contracts.

    Why? Frontloading would place the financial risk on Daryl Katz while providing greater flexibility in the future as Hemsky would be much more tradeable in the future with a salary that is much lower than the contract value itself. If you are not planning on trading the player in the early years of the contract, but feel that you may want to trade them later, you would be foolish not to frontload UNLESS you are concerned about the actual money spent.

    Basically, it is a way that wealthy owners who want to win can leverage their cash to make their team more competitive under the cap system.

  79. PDO says:

    Marc: If the OIlers are paying Hemsky $5M+ there is no way in hell that Hall and Eberle sign for $6M when they are on the first line, first PP and outscoring him by 20+ points per season. The best players may not insist on being the best paid player at their position, but they to expect to be the best paid players on their team, as Tavares, Toews and Kane all are

    There is no question that the Oilers need Hemsky next season and cannot easily replace what he brings from within or through free agency.The fact that the Oilers have made it known that they’d like to sign him for a year or two suggests that they know it too.

    It is not at all clear that this will still be the case two or more years down the road.It is not impossible that two years from now, the OIlers will have five forwards who are clearly better than Hemsky (Hall, Eberle, RNH, Gagner, Yakupov/Grigorenko). If that is the case, all five will reasonably expect to be paid more than Hemsky when their contract comes up. If Hemsky is on $5-6M per year and producing 63 points a season (the average of his three ‘good’ years on his current contract), don’t you think all of those guys will expect $6-7M per year for producing more than that?

    If they were UFA’s, you would be correct.

    However, they’re RFA’s.

    If the Oiler’s are smart (lol), they’ll make the kids start checking and scoring opposed to just scoring in the near future as well in order to start toning down those contract demands.

  80. Marc says:

    PDO: If they were UFA’s, you would be correct.

    However, they’re RFA’s.

    If the Oiler’s are smart (lol), they’ll make the kids start checking and scoring opposed to just scoring in the near future as well in order to start toning down those contract demands.

    Kane, Toews and Tavares all got paid as the best player on their team as RFAs. So did Crosby and Malkin.

    I’m not sure that forcing guys like this to accept less than a player they are cleary superior to is the best way to keep them happy. Or to keep them around long term.

  81. Traktor says:

    PDO: If they were UFA’s, you would be correct.

    However, they’re RFA’s.

    If the Oiler’s are smart (lol), they’ll make the kids start checking and scoring opposed to just scoring in the near future as well in order to start toning down those contract demands.

    If Hemsky gets 6M and Hall wants to be paid 6.5M-7M then you pay him 6.5M-7M. Its that simple. Strap a C on his chest and let it be known that nobody gets paid more than Hall.

    You don’t play a game of chicken with The Franchise. Just ask Dean Lombardi how that worked out.

    It might not cost 7M but Tambellini would be an idiot to not at the very least budget 7M for the kids just in case.

  82. Gret99zky says:

    So LT, in that picture, are the others players working on their games while Hemsky plays with his knob?

  83. Traktor says:

    Marc: Kane, Toews and Tavares all got paid as the best player on their team as RFAs. So did Crosby and Malkin.

    I’m not sure that forcing guys like this to accept less than a player they are cleary superior to is the best way to keep them happy. Or to keep them around long term.

    Agreed. Seems like wishful thinking.

  84. Ducey says:

    6 years and $36 million is insane.

    If he wants that, trade him. This is a guy who has averaged 62 games a season for his career (assuming he plays 68 this year) and is in the midst of his worst season.

    Waaay too much term and risk to the team.

  85. Bos8 says:

    To me it’s very simple. Hemsky looks like he will play out the season healthy and recovery rate on his type of surgeries is good. Hemsky is worth a kid and a draft pick as is. Signed to a decent three year contract, if necessary, he is tradeable for more in years to come if budget issues arise.

    Also, the team should maximize their chances to finally make the playoffs next year and continue the revenue stream. Whitney is looking better, game to game, so one solid D addition should suffice. Dubnyk playing to the end of the season should determine the need for a G addition. Trading Hemsky has negative impact strategically. Ergo…

  86. Gret99zky says:

    It’s sounding more and more like some folks round here want to protect the asset, sign the man, at ANY cost.

  87. knighttown says:

    Couple of Dennises from last night:

    -Watching Gagner and Eberle play the 2-man game on the Power Play down the left wall and goal line is an absolute treat. At least twice Gags pretended he was in trouble drawing his d-man out toward him before slipping down low to a cycling Eberle. Ebs then had momentum and the puck heading toward the net and a shit-ton of options.

    -I know they didn’t knock it out of the park scoring chance wise but I think there was some glimmer of hope with 20/91/55. You know, all three are plus skaters and seem to prefer a straight ahead game. It’d be nice to see them chip in a goal every second game without bleeding because frankly, there isn’t going to be room for everyone in the Top 6 so some cobbled together group needs to suck it up and get it done.

    -I’ve been preaching for more balanced lines (and more balanced D pairings) on the road. Excluding the 4th liners who are shit, there was no real deadly matchup last night. Almost always one of Hall, Hemmer, Horc, Belanger, Smyth, Smid, Gilbert and Petry out there.

    - The Gagner pass to Smyth looked like Ervin Johnson running the Showtime offense of the Lakers in ’85. I had to rewind cause I couldn’t even see who scored let alone where the pass came from.

    -Paajarvi’s skating is a touch overrated. It’s more like Cogliano or Ben Eager in that he’s fast straight ahead but his edges aren’t great. Very little change of pace or direction. Usually a defensemen can just match his speed and force him wide. Saying that, there was one play where he flat out blew by everyone. Needs to watch 14 consistently use his crazy edges to wrong foot the defense. Night and fucking day.

    - The mayor here in Halifax just pulled out of the race for re-election because he allegedly decided as executor of an old (unrelated) lady’s will, he’d take a healthy cut for himself. Stay classy Peter Kelly.

  88. OilClog says:

    Hemsky 6x33mil. 5.5yr.. It doesn’t really matter what years 4 or 5 are like, but this team needs him atleast for the next 3 yrs. This is a fair contract to everyone involved, keeps expectations for future negotiations with other players in perspective, shows some damn intergrity, loyalty, and respect. They can’t ask the players to give it their all for them, then turn around and be cutthroat about things. It’s the worse possible image to send out to every player in the league, coming up in the minors, and fanbase.

    Other then a few detractors, who really can’t see the top two lines of this team being dynamite with Hemsky in the mix. There are no comparables to Hemsky’s pure offensive talent (it’s not all about the goals son) on the market right now, he’s a very unique player that brings a vision very few players can match. Knock him for his injuries if you want, it’s usually those players that come back to haunt you the most down the road.

    Hemsky isn’t a player that gives up, you don’t go through injuries like this, and end up where he is if you’ve given up or not putting in the required effort. He still has plenty of hockey ahead of him, I for one, as a fan would prefer to see a player I’ve built a sporting relationship with for the past 10yrs to continue playing for the only team I know how to cheer. Unless your name is Horcoff.. I wouldn’t have much of a problem seeing you play elsewhere, take a giant pay cut and I’ll think about it.

  89. copperblueandwhite says:

    Woodguy,

    Ruutu isn’t at the same level as Hemmer but could be the benchmark plus… think a closer comp is James Neal at 6 years for $30m… .somewhere in that range would probably get it done…Tavares is making $5.5 and he’s better than all of them.

  90. rickithebear says:

    copperblueandwhite:
    Woodguy,

    Ruutu isn’t at the same level as Hemmer but could be the benchmark plus… think a closer comp is James Neal at 6 years for $30m… .somewhere inthatrange would probably get it done…Tavares is making $5.5 and he’s better than all of them.

    James neal scores goals hemsky passes alot.

  91. rickithebear says:

    Woodguy: I counted all the games that Hemsky and Ruutu played since the lockout.
    What am I missing?

    Yes GPG, APG, PPG are an good reflection of the player.

    Hemsky
    09-10 22GM 7G 15A 22P 1PPG
    10-11 47GM 14G 28A 42P .89PPG

    Zetterburg
    09-10 74GM 23G 47A 70P .95PPG
    10-11 80GM 24G 56A 80P 1.0 PPG

    Woodguy you are so correct by PPG these players are equal.
    They are so equal! LOL

  92. Traktor says:

    I just added up all the UFA’s left and they are a combined -359

  93. stevezie says:

    Cool.

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