CORY SCHNEIDER?

This is going in a strange direction this morning. .931EV SP last season ranking him 9th in the entire NHL. Huh.

dreger oilersI’m not certain this is the item on the Oilers ‘to do’ list that should be ranked first. How big is the gap between Schneider and Dubnyk? IS THERE a gap between them? Vancouver selects 24th overall.

 

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  1. Bad Seed says:

    Can’t see Vancouver trading their number one goalie to a division rival. And for that matter, Edm handing a high end prospect to a rival devoid of them.

  2. gangplank says:

    not sure if worth #7. If its next year’s first rounder then ok

  3. PDO says:

    For the love of all that’s holy please let this not be true.

  4. Roke says:

    Does nobody in the NHL realise Devan Dubnyk is pretty damn good? The Oilers seem to be constantly linked with goaltending when the guy they have has been as good as Carey Price (who to be fair is overrated) over the last three seasons.

    I don’t follow the Oilers outside of reading some of the Oilogosphere but if MacT gives up anything substantive to acquire a goaltender he goes right on the “sucker GMs” list.

  5. theres oil in virginia says:

    Well, the “2 sources” part is about Schneider being “in play”. The “Oilers in on talks” part sounds like a guess by Dreger.

  6. Woodguy says:

    Holmgren would give up his first born for Schnieder and is out of conference.

    Very little chance he ends up in Edmonton unless MacT makes a dumb trade and overpays.

  7. Lucinius says:

    Pass.

    Avoid both Canuck goalies, period.

  8. PunjabiOil says:

    Schneider has 2 years left on his contract. Not long enough to consider moving the 1st.

  9. Lowetide says:

    I’m beginning to miss the guy with no ideas.

  10. Woodguy says:

    Roke:
    Does nobody in the NHL realise Devan Dubnyk is pretty damn good? The Oilers seem to be constantly linked with goaltending when the guy they have has been as good as Carey Price (who to be fair is overrated) over the last three seasons.

    I don’t follow the Oilers outside of reading some of the Oilogosphere but if MacTgives up anything substantive to acquire a goaltender he goes right on the “sucker GMs” list.

    It pisses me off constantly.

    Price is a career .915 and is in play to start for Canada at the Olympics

    Dubnyk is a career .913 and isn’t considered good enough to be a starter.

    NHL GM’s are more whacky over goalies than anything else.

    Its brutal.

  11. PDO says:

    Roke:
    Does nobody in the NHL realise Devan Dubnyk is pretty damn good? The Oilers seem to be constantly linked with goaltending when the guy they have has been as good as Carey Price (who to be fair is overrated) over the last three seasons.

    I don’t follow the Oilers outside of reading some of the Oilogosphere but if MacTgives up anything substantive to acquire a goaltender he goes right on the “sucker GMs” list.

    There’s no reason to believe Schneider is a better goalie than DD. Please god no.

  12. Lowetide says:

    This is especially galling considering the clarity of vision and the clear needs elsewhere. FOCUS! Having said that, it isn’t clear that MacT is even in on this, and certainly not clear that Gillis plans to deal him to the Oil.

    DSF remains silent.

  13. PDO says:

    Given the way everything is worded, I’m almost tempted to believe that the media believes we’re in on a goaltender. They have us in on every goalie but it always sounds like a guess.

    I hope.

  14. Lewis Grant says:

    I hate to intrude on the love-in with MacT. Look, I’ve always really liked the guy personally. But one of his first acts was to say that upgrading the goaltending was a priority. How can rumours like this be a surprise?

    If people are now realizing that expending scarce resources on a goaltender is a bad idea, I hope it’s not too late. As LT has amply demonstrated, there are much more pressing needs.

    On the pure hockey merits (ignoring our actual needs at the moment), and presuming the prospect is not a great one, I actually don’t hate that trade. Schneider is a good goaltender, and would have been a starter much earlier on most teams.

    It would be a less bad trade than Hemsky for some fourth-line plugger from Ottawa. Look, I’ve finally come around to being OK with trading Hemsky. But it’s only OK if we get some kind of (half-)decent return. That’s unlikely to happen, because Hemsky had a bad year. It’s also unlikely, because MacT has made it known to the world that Hemsky is on the trading block. The last time the entire world knew that a major Oiler was on the trading block, we ended up with Joffrey Lupul in return.

  15. Rondo says:

    Something happened this year in the playoffs when Corey Schneider didn’t start in the playoffs. Rumours in Vancouver, the problem was mental rather than physical. It seems odd Vancouver would trade Schneider.

  16. Ducey says:

    This is just speculation born of the fact that MacT is kicking tires on every player out there.

    It does signal the fact that Gillis has given up on getting anything on Luongo and will now see if he can get something special for Schneider.

    He is going to need something pretty good to justify the gong show that has been going on for the last two years in the Canucks’ net.

  17. delooper says:

    I’m in a hotel in Sapporo. The fridge in my room came stocked with Asahi beer! Not Sapporo beer! Asahi! And strangely something called “Oronamin C Drink.” I guess this is the Japanese version of Vegemite.

    Should be mid-20′s all week. I think I’m going to like Sapporo.

  18. gr8one says:

    If I had to guess I’d say this is posturing on Gillis’ and/or MacT’s part.

    The worst situation a GM can be in is other GM’s thinking that they don’t have any other options.

    At least I hope that’s all it is…

  19. bookje says:

    Dubnyk has bad body language.

  20. Andropod says:

    I do remember way back reading that Schneider said that he would never pay in Edmonton, with some insults about us thrown in for good effect. I cant even remember if the comments were about the town ort the organization, just the negativity, and this was years back.
    Does anyone else recall this, and if so, would that make any difference with a possible trade? A G with head problems and a dislike of the team/place he was going to?

  21. delooper says:

    Andropod:
    I do remember way back reading that Schneider said that he would never pay in Edmonton, with some insults about us thrownin for good effect. I cant even remember if the comments were about the town ort the organization, just the negativity, and this was years back.
    Does anyone else recall this, and if so, would that make any difference with a possible trade? A G with head problems and a dislike of the team/place he was going to?

    Edmonton taxi drivers might veto the trade then.

  22. delooper says:

    My general response to this thread is that if MacTavish is putting out the idea of a radical restructuring of the team, people should be prepared for radical rumours.

  23. bookje says:

    And sideburns

  24. commonfan14 says:

    “@Lowetide_: Dammit NHL I’m awake! Entertain me!!”

    “@DarrenDreger: It’s getting interesting. 2 sources say Corey Schneider is in play. 1st and a prospect part of asking price. Suspect Oilers in on talks.”

    Be careful what you wish for, LT.

  25. Rondo says:

    All of a sudden GM’s didn’t get stupid. If a deal is too good to be true. I know it is the time year for rumours but there should be some red flags when Vancouver is thinking about trading their #1 goalie and their backup Lou is getting old.

  26. wordbird says:

    holy cow, what NHL-on-acid world did
    I wake up in??¿!?

    and how does Gillis convince Luongo to stay after all this?

  27. Maverick says:

    I don’t see much difference between Schneider and DD, not sure that’s an upgrade. Gillis might be trying to get more out of Philly and using the Oilers as a bidding war with no intention of trading Schneider to a division rival.

    However, if Vancouver takes back 35% of Loungo’s contract for the #37 pick would that be a deal worth making??

  28. Henry says:

    If I’m MacT I rather enjoy Vancouver having 17 signed players, 10 with NTCs and $47000 of capspace. Especially when goaltending costs them $9.3M.

    I’d be happy to let them off the hook a bit for a 2nd round pick and the rights to Smithson. Not more than that.

  29. Maverick says:

    Lowetide:
    This is especially galling considering the clarity of vision and the clear needs elsewhere. FOCUS! Having said that, it isn’t clear that MacT is even in on this, and certainly not clear that Gillis plans to deal him to the Oil.

    DSF remains silent.

    Don’t wake the bear he might be “grumpy”……..Oh wait….. (nevermind)

  30. jonrmcleod says:

    I think the Flyers will be willing to pay more for Schneider than the Oilers.

  31. bookje says:

    Devon Dubnyk likes pancakes!

  32. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    Everything is happening!!! Nothing is happening!!!

    Good god stay away from Gillis’ mess. There is no need to make that idiot look good here.

  33. RexLibris says:

    Lowetide,

    Yeah, the Oilers angle seems tacked on to the tweet there. Kind of like how the Leafs are usually tacked on to every trade rumour, or the way Spezza was always mentioned as being an Oilers’ trade target.

    There is obviously a connection with MacTavish and the Wolves, but Vancouver needs to trade Luongo.

    Do you think MacTavish is entertaining talks in order to see if Luongo shakes loose via a buyout? That’d be the wisest move in terms of assets and I don’t think Luongo would be against signing here.

    As for the Coburn for Gernat and a pick talk, I’d really rather not. A pick and Musil, maybe, but please not Gernat. I don’t even care if Gernat is less-likely to be an NHLer than Musil, its the potential ceiling of Gernat, and the limited ceiling of Coburn, that worries me about that move.

  34. Woodguy says:

    Nothing to see here.

  35. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    They’ve elevated it from tweet to full-blown headline and article

    http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=426586

  36. speeds says:

    I don’t think G is the most pressing area of concern, and I think Schneider is likely to cost too much in trade value. If Dubnyk and Schneider have similar trade value (or if Schneider has more value, but not much more value) I guess I get moving Dubnyk and acquiring Schneider.

    The 7th, IMO, carries too much value to be involved in a Schneider deal, I don’t know that VAN would trade him to EDM anyways (barring an overpay, which doesn’t make a lot of sense to me (a) generally and (b) having Dubnyk.

  37. theres oil in virginia says:

    Romulus Apotheosis,

    TSN trying to up their hit count.

  38. RexLibris says:

    Romulus Apotheosis:
    They’ve elevated it from tweet to full-blown headline and article

    http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=426586

    I’m reminded of the scene in Good Morning Vietnam when they are discussing how to get Bob Hope to do a concert and someone suggests escalating the war to seal the deal.

  39. Woodguy says:

    LT,

    If you start a new thread every time a MSM type tweets a rumour you’ll have 875 threads between now and Sunday midnight.

    Not that I’d mind.

    My consumption of your free content will be a cornerstone of this weekend.

  40. dawgtoy says:

    @TheFourthPeriod: Oilers have a crapload of irons in the fire. I’d be fairly surprised if something doesn’t go down today.

  41. sumaclab says:

    Let Gillis wallow in his own filth. Our 1st? The dumbass ST would think this a good deal. Frakin swamp gas in NJ is making everybody lose their frakin sanity? Should never have held the draft in a place where the the air quality is equal to that of Jupiter. Makes everyone delusional/stupid. Monohan/Nurse/Nichushkin over Schneider? Please dear God let Paul Holmgren get this deal. Or Steve Yzerman.

  42. Captain Obvious says:

    How about this:

    David Pagnotta ‏@TheFourthPeriod 5m

    Oilers have a crapload of irons in the fire. I’d be fairly surprised if something doesn’t go down today.

  43. Lowetide says:

    Darren Dreger ‏@DarrenDreger 1m

    The Oilers continue to push hard on potential deals. Sources say Edmtn is aggressively after B.Cobourn.

  44. Woodguy says:

    dawgtoy:
    @TheFourthPeriod: Oilers have a crapload of irons in the fire.I’d be fairly surprised if something doesn’t go down today.

    Here we go!

  45. Halfwise says:

    delooper,

    Is there any Calpis in there too?

    Great beverages in Japan.

  46. DBO says:

    Lowetide:
    Darren Dreger ‏@DarrenDreger 1m

    The Oilers continue to push hard on potential deals. Sources say Edmtn is aggressively after B.Cobourn.

    I think he is the best we’ll do on the dman front. He is flawed, but he would be our number 1 and we are buying low so hopefully the cost is not high. All about value. If it is not a roster young kid then you do it short of Klefbom.

  47. RexLibris says:

    Okay, bear with me on this…

    In the 1880s the German state was brand new, having recently been cobbled together from a collection of dukedoms and smaller principalities. Within twenty years it had progressed rapidly and was emerging as a new European state that might eventually stand on the same level as France, England, Russia and the Austro-Hungarian Empire.

    In order to keep itself safe and pursue national interests when the political landscape of Europe was a cutthroat zero-sum game, Otto von Bismarck created an intricate web of treaties and negotiations with every European power that so complicated the diplomatic scene that no nation could make an aggressive move without the compliance of the German state.

    The status quo held for decades until Bismarck left the scene and his predecessors proved less adept at navigating the intricate web.

    MacTavish sounds like he has so many deals and possibilities on the go with so many teams that if anything starts to develop he’ll almost have a de facto heads up before it actually occurs. This could allow him to preempt other GMs with another deal.

    I’m just spitballing here, but it sounds like he has put himself at the center of just about every trade rumour this year.

  48. delooper says:

    Halfwise:
    delooper,

    Is there any Calpis in there too?

    Great beverages in Japan.

    Pocari Sweat, Emerald Mountain, some coffee drink, bottled water and iced tea.

  49. Mr DeBakey says:

    This is Gillis moving to plan B because Luongo is not bringing anything back.

    From PHI – 11, Hartnell, Plus?
    From Vancouver – 24, Schneider, Plus?

  50. 99thoilerfan says:

    Woodguy:
    LT,

    If you start a new thread every time a MSM type tweets a rumour you’ll have 875 threads between now and Sunday midnight.

    Not that I’d mind.

    My consumption of your free content will be a cornerstone of this weekend.

    So true……

  51. admiralmark says:

    Oilers going after Schneider is completely asinine. a) We have A goalie that finished in 12th in the league for save pctg behind a team D thats in the bottom of the league. b) It has been proven that you do not need a so called superstar goalie to win a cup. c) in a year when the draft is so laden with talent to give up a 7th overall is a supremely high price to pay + a prospect?! d) Did anybody see Schneider choke down the stretch last year? I did. e) there are not enough letters in the alphabet! This is bad news if this happens.

  52. Gordies Elbow says:

    Asking price is a first and a prospect.

    Schneider for Nurse and Marincin/Gernat/Rajala? I hope not.

    I’m starting to miss Mr. Dithers….

  53. theres oil in virginia says:

    RexLibris,

    Very interesting hypothesis. It would explain why the Oilers are being mentioned for all of these potential deals, but so far, they have done absolutely zip. Even the contract offer to Gagner amounts to nothing productive yet. As difficult as it is to be a fan waiting in anticipation, MacT waiting ’til the moment is right when he will maximize the value of his assets, and minimize the value of others’ is wise. Don’t wait too long though, because status quo is trouble for the Oilers.

  54. Halfwise says:

    delooper: Pocari Sweat, Emerald Mountain, some coffee drink, bottled water and iced tea.

    mmmm, Pocari Sweat. Natsukashii!! (for me)

  55. tsg says:

    If the Oilers trade Gagner, I wouldn’t mind seeing the 7th and Hemskey for the 5th. It’s an overpay, but at that point you have to guarantee that you’re getting a second line center replacement. (Lindholm)

  56. theres oil in virginia says:

    admiralmark,

    Agreed. Often times the trade speculation tends to have a “home team bias”, but this is the opposite. I tend to undervalue draft picks, but I wouldn’t even favor the #7 for Schneider straight up.

  57. Ca$h-Money! says:

    Gordies Elbow,

    Plenty of rumours when Tambo was in charge too. Let’s not give up hope until Tuesday.

  58. Marc says:

    Woodguy,

    Regarding your cap recapture point from the last thread, I really don’t see that as a sticking point in acquiring Luongo because the bulk of the cap benefit has already accrued to Vancouver.

    The maximum cap benefit that Edmonton could accrue from Luongo is $6.9M, which would occur if he played 5 more seasons and then retired. In that scenario the OIlers would have a dead cap penalty of $1.7M for the next 3 seasons – annoying, but hardly a killer in a $70M+ cap world.

    For the final 3 season of his contract Luongo’s salary is actually lower than his cap hit, so Edmonton’s cap benefit reduces with each additional season he plays -which in turn reduces the penalty for early retirement for Edmonton (but not for Vaqncouver). If retires a year early, for example, they is no penalty to Edmonton, but Vancouver gets a $7.5M dead cap penalty that year.

    Luongo is not a bad goalie. He has been consistently average to good for his entire career. There is no reason to think he’s be any worse than average for the next 5 or 6 years. HIs cap hit is reasonable for a starting goalie.

    I maintain that acquiring an average to good goalie for free, and flipping your existing average to good goalie for a good young player like Frattin and a decent pick or prospect would be good asset management, with no more risk than putting all your eggs in Dubnyk’s basket (which I would have no problem with).

  59. mustang says:

    Nope, don’t like this at all, if they want the #7 for Scheinder forget it. I don’t even know if he’s an upgrade on Dubie. Goaltending right now is the least of MacT’s worries, or should be. Get a proven backup and let’s go with that for now. Way bigger issues than this. My 2 cents.

  60. Woodguy says:

    Marc,

    Unless your crystal ball tells you exactly how many seasons he is going to play the uncertainty is too much imo.

  61. Gordies Elbow says:

    Ca$h-Money!:
    Gordies Elbow,

    Plenty of rumours when Tambo was in charge too.Let’s not give up hope until Tuesday.

    Good point…

    I can’t understand the rumors around goalies, though. I can’t see how spending assets to upgrade goaltending will help, and given the rumor, moving a first and a prospect seems steep.

    Could be misinformation from Van, trying to drive up interest in their goaltenders. I still think they trade Luongo for DP on the Isle, and buy out DP.

    Sounds like the next 48 hours will be interesting, to say the least.

    LT, I hope that you’ve paid the power bill for this place, sounds like many posters will be wearing out the F5 key on their keyboard.

  62. Woodguy says:

    Rich Smith ‏@ALLsportsINTEL 9m
    BREAKING NHL UPDATE – Sources reporting Oilers trade talks with the Penguins have expanded from just Letang to Letang and Fleury,
    Retweeted by Dave Labrenz, Q.C.

    Vomit.

  63. PDO says:

    I have no issue taking Luongo on waivers and flipping DD to Philly.

    I’ll weep if we trade for Fleury.

  64. rich says:

    Woodguy,

    Agreed. We don’t want no Fluery.

  65. gcw_rocks says:

    Woodguy,

    If the Oilers trade for letang and fleury anyone who said MacT was a smart man will likely need to recant.

  66. Captain Obvious says:

    Oh God. Fleury is the worst goalie in the NHL.

  67. theres oil in virginia says:

    From the TSN headline article on Dreger’s Schneider tweet, http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=426586:

    TSN Hockey Insider Darren Dreger reported Saturday morning that his sources indicate the Canucks are considering moving their 27-year-old netminder and that the Edmonton Oilers might well be in on the action.

    (emphasis mine)

    Dreger’s tweet states that his sources indicate that Schneider is in play. His tweet did not state that his sources indicate that EDM is involved. That was stated as pure speculation.

    I see this in kind of crap in scientific journals often. Someone postulates something that is not founded in observation, but the next someone comes along and says it again, but changing the wording ever-so-slightly and cites the first someone. Next thing you know, the unfounded statement is part of the conventional wisdom. It’s been established in the scientific literature.

  68. gangplank says:

    gcw_rocks,

    i feel like fleury is a salary dump to lower the price for letang. #onlythingthatmakessense

  69. admiralmark says:

    gcw_rocks,

    agreed! This ain’t happening.

  70. RexLibris says:

    Woodguy,

    How quickly would MacTavish go from fan darling and the embodiment of a promising future to being run out of town on a rail.

    The only way this works in the Oilers’ favour, and this is one heck of a logical stretch, is to then flip Fleury to Philadelphia for Coburn and a pick, and then maybe Letang to Toronto for Gardiner?

    Like I said, some mental gymnastics to justify that kind of deal. Probably better if it just doesn’t happen.

  71. Gordies Elbow says:

    Please no Fleury. Please no Fleury. Please no Fleury.

    On a related note, when would it be appropriate to begin drinking? Sun over the yardarm?

  72. RexLibris says:

    Captain Obvious:
    Oh God.Fleury is the worst goalie in the NHL.

    Only because DiPietro is always injured.

  73. RexLibris says:

    Gordies Elbow:
    Please no Fleury. Please no Fleury. Please no Fleury.

    On a related note, when would it be appropriate to begin drinking? Sun over the yardarm?

    Lower the yardarm.

  74. Ribs says:

    Schneider? Jeebus. What a waste of energy and assets that would be. What did Dubnyk ever do to deserve this?

  75. Woodguy says:

    Marc:
    Woodguy,

    Regarding your cap recapture point from the last thread, I really don’t see that as a sticking point in acquiring Luongo because the bulk of the cap benefit has already accrued to Vancouver.

    The maximum cap benefit that Edmonton could accrue from Luongo is $6.9M, which would occur if he played 5 more seasons and then retired.In that scenario the OIlers would have a dead cap penalty of $1.7M for the next 3 seasons – annoying, but hardly a killer in a $70M+ cap world.

    For the final 3 season of his contract Luongo’s salary is actually lower than his cap hit, so Edmonton’s cap benefit reduces with each additional season he plays -which in turn reduces the penalty for early retirement for Edmonton (but not for Vaqncouver). If retires a year early, for example, they is no penalty to Edmonton, but Vancouver gets a $7.5M dead cap penalty that year.

    Luongo is not a bad goalie.He has been consistently average to good for his entire career.There is no reason to think he’s be any worse than average for the next 5 or 6 years. HIs cap hit is reasonable for a starting goalie.

    I maintain that acquiring an average to good goalie for free, and flipping your existing average to good goalie for a good young player like Frattin and a decent pick or prospect would be good asset management, with no more risk than putting all your eggs in Dubnyk’s basket (which I would have no problem with).

    Thought about it some more, and the fact that you get him for free is very compelling.

    I still dislike the uncertainty of the cap recapture, but I could be sold on the whole thing.

  76. admiralmark says:

    theres oil in virginia:
    From the TSN headline article on Dreger’s Schneider tweet, http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=426586:

    TSN Hockey Insider Darren Dreger reported Saturday morning that his sources indicate the Canucks are considering moving their 27-year-old netminder and that the Edmonton Oilers might well be in on the action.

    (emphasis mine)

    Dreger’s tweet states that his sources indicate that Schneider is in play.His tweet did not state that his sources indicate that EDM is involved.That was stated as pure speculation.

    I see this in kind of crap in scientific journals often.Someone postulates something that is not founded in observation, but the next someone comes along and says it again, but changing the wording ever-so-slightly and cites the first someone.Next thing you know, the unfounded statement is part of the conventional wisdom.It’s been established in the scientific literature.

    Thanks I actually feel a little better now.

  77. Woodguy says:

    RexLibris:
    Woodguy,

    How quickly would MacTavish go from fan darling and the embodiment of a promising future to being run out of town on a rail.

    The only way this works in the Oilers’ favour, and this is one heck of a logical stretch, is to then flip Fleury to Philadelphia for Coburn and a pick, and then maybe Letang to Toronto for Gardiner?

    Like I said, some mental gymnastics to justify that kind of deal. Probably better if it just doesn’t happen.

    The MSM would talk non-stop about Fluery being a 1st overall and a cup ring.

    The Oilogosphere would wear sack cloth, smear ashes on our faces and beat ourselves with bushes.

  78. OilClog says:

    Fleury can be very good when on a hot streak.. A duo of Dubnyk/Fleury may work.. As they’re both the same streaky style. Unless they’re both cold and unconfident.. Then fuck.

    If they do bring in Letang, I think MacT won’t think twice about the contract and how the other players see it. He’ll use Letang as standard for everyone’s UFA contracts. Which for Hall is what 5-6 years away..

    Letang good.. Fleury scary.

  79. Ducey says:

    MAF has a limited NTC. Is he likely to list Edmonton as a team he wants to come to? Unlikely.

    The Oilers should have a policy against having any players whose names begin with Marc-

  80. admiralmark says:

    Woodguy,

    No offence but have you been following the Luongo saga? His wife lives in Florida. He lives in a penthouse suite at the top of the Sutton hotel. His family and him don’t really want to live in Vancouver let alone Edmonton. You would at best get an inspired Luongo for 1 year followed by demands to be traded. I agree he is a very good goalie (top 5 in my mind). But the Oilers dont need another player demanding to leave town Saga and he would be it.

  81. Ducey says:

    Woodguy:

    The Oilogosphere would wear sack cloth, smear ashes on our faces and beat ourselves with bushes.

    So nothing would change then…

  82. tsg says:

    I wouldn’t mind dealing with the Fleury contract if it meant Letang coming to the Oilers. (With either a contract extension in place, or reasonable (not the 7th) assets going in the other direction.) A quality transition game based on skill from the back end is important, and I’m a fan of offense generated from the blue line.

  83. Ribs says:

    Coburn would be…well, better than anything Tambellini brought in. Better than nothing isn’t really what I’m hoping for, but at least we could say something was done to try to make the team better.

    I don’t see how Letang fits when you have Justin Schultz.

    Fleury…C’mon now.

  84. Gordies Elbow says:

    Justin Schultz named to the NHL All-Rookie team. Can’t understand why the PHWA doesn’t like Yakupov, though.

  85. wiggs22 says:

    Lowetide: what makes Coburn better than N. Shultz? Both had off years, are both shutdown types. I don’t think it’s a huge upgrade. What am I missing?

  86. wiggs22 says:

    Also 1st time blogger here. Can’t wait to join in on some awesome topics ! go Oil !!

  87. RexLibris says:

    Gordies Elbow:
    Justin Schultz named to the NHL All-Rookie team. Can’t understand why the PHWA doesn’t like Yakupov, though.

    His sliding on the ice is too showy for an All-Star game.

    ;-)

  88. Marc says:

    Woodguy: Thought about it some more, and the fact that you get him for free is very compelling.

    I still dislike the uncertainty of the cap recapture, but I could be sold on the whole thing.

    That’s the thing for me too. As soon as you have to give something up the equation tips towards the negative.

    But for free I think the uncertainty is worth the potential return.

  89. Cactus says:

    What if we looked at the Fleury rumours a bit differently (assuming that they’re credible, which I have a hard time believing)?

    With Vokoun, the Penguins don’t need to keep MAF and if they deal him, they free up $5 million in cap space in the next two seasons. Maybe, by taking both, the cost for Letang is reduced.

    How much would the Letang cost need to be discounted before people here would feel okay with also taking MAF in the process?

  90. Gordies Elbow says:

    Rich Smith ‏@ALLsportsINTEL 48s
    NHL – Source reports preliminary talks between the Penguins & Oilers involve Pitt – Letang, Fleury / Edm – RNH, 7th pick plus 1 more piece

    Hopkins, Nurse or Monahan, and another piece?

    Right.

  91. 20feet says:

    No disrespect to Dubnyk, but I’d say the gap is significant. Schneider is the league leader in Sv% over the past 3 seasons. It depends on the asking price, but if a guy like that is on the market, you’ve got to be interested.

  92. fifthcartel says:

    So, is stuff actually happening today?!

  93. Woodguy says:

    admiralmark:
    Woodguy,

    No offence but have you been following the Luongo saga? His wife lives in Florida. He lives in a penthouse suite at the top of the Sutton hotel. His family and him don’t really want to live in Vancouver let alone Edmonton. You would at best get an inspired Luongo for 1 year followed by demands to be traded. I agree he is a very good goalie (top 5 in my mind).But the Oilers dont need another player demanding to leave town Saga and he would be it.

    Debating on the move on its merits, not it plausibility.

  94. Marc says:

    Gordies Elbow:
    Rich Smith ‏@ALLsportsINTEL 48s
    NHL – Source reports preliminary talks between the Penguins & Oilers involve Pitt – Letang, Fleury / Edm – RNH, 7th pick plus 1 more piece

    Hopkins, Nurse or Monahan, and another piece?

    Right.

    OK, now we know that this rumour is BS.

    There is simply no way the Oilers would entertain trading RNH. And I doubt very much that PIttsburgh is looking for a center.

  95. Woodguy says:

    Ducey: So nothing would change then…

    I would be sadder than I was under Tambo as the sense of futility wouldn’t have a palpable end.

  96. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    Gordies Elbow:
    Rich Smith ‏@ALLsportsINTEL 48s
    NHL – Source reports preliminary talks between the Penguins & Oilers involve Pitt – Letang, Fleury / Edm – RNH, 7th pick plus 1 more piece

    Hopkins, Nurse or Monahan, and another piece?

    Right.

    Wow…

    There is a strong imbalance in these latest rumors going against EDM. I much prefer the Coburn for a 2nd and a prospect rumors.

  97. Gordies Elbow says:

    20feet:
    No disrespect to Dubnyk, but I’d say the gap is significant.Schneider is the league leader in Sv% over the past 3 seasons.It depends on the asking price, but if a guy like that is on the market, you’ve got to be interested.

    True, but how much of the save percentage should be attributed to playing behind Edler and Hamhius, as opposed to Ryan Whitney and Justin Schultz? Is there a discernible gap between him and DD?

  98. DBO says:

    Gordies Elbow:
    Rich Smith ‏@ALLsportsINTEL 48s
    NHL – Source reports preliminary talks between the Penguins & Oilers involve Pitt – Letang, Fleury / Edm – RNH, 7th pick plus 1 more piece

    Hopkins, Nurse or Monahan, and another piece?

    Right.

    Pretty sure Rick Smith can go fuck himself.

  99. Woodguy says:

    Gordies Elbow:
    Justin Schultz named to the NHL All-Rookie team. Can’t understand why the PHWA doesn’t like Yakupov, though.

    Why would they name him to the All Rookie team? He only led all rookies goals and points.

    Surely his intangibles are a quart low and his crust is soggy.

  100. Captain Happy says:

    LOL.

    Given that Gillis has two above average goaltenders, if he can’t move the one with the anchor contract, the next logical move is to put the other one in play.

    Those of you who think Dubnyk is in the same class as Schneider are obviously in what we should call a “State Of Darkasia ®”

    2007/08

    Dubnyk 33GP AHL .904
    Schneider 36GP AHL .916

    2008/09

    Dubnyk 62GP AHL .910
    Schneider 40GP AHL .930 NHL 8GP .877

    2009/10

    Dubnyk 33GP AHL .33GP AHL .915 19GP NHL .889
    Schneider 60GP AHL .919 2GP NHL .915

    2010/11

    Dubnyk 35GP NHL .916
    Schneider 24GP NHL .929

    2011/12

    Dubnyk 47GP .914
    Schneider 33GP .937

    2012/13

    Dubnyk – 38GP .920
    Schneider 30GP.927

    Dubnyk and Schneider are not in the same area code when it comes to results.

    Now, I’m not sure Gillis would trade Schneider to Edmonton but, if he does, the Oilers are instantly a better team.

    Suggesting a #7 pick is not worth the services of one of the best young goaltenders in the league who is signed to a value contract is just hilarious.

  101. Woodguy says:

    Marc: OK, now we know that this rumour is BS.

    There is simply no way the Oilers would entertain trading RNH.And I doubt very much that PIttsburgh is looking for a center.

    This.

    RNH may be the most untouchable.

    Awful reporting.

  102. admiralmark says:

    All this goaltending chatter is nauseating. Give Dubey 1 year with another top 4 D man and then decide… Are we going for the Cup this year? Ugh… leaving the computer for sanity sake.

  103. fifthcartel says:

    Darren Dreger ‏@DarrenDreger 1m

    Buckle up. @TSNBobMcKenzie has some interesting news.

    :O

  104. DBO says:

    Darren Dreger ‏@DarrenDreger 2m
    Buckle up. @TSNBobMcKenzie has some interesting news.
    Expand Reply Retweet Favorite More

    I’m frightened

  105. Rondo says:

    DBO,

    Boston news

    Not 100 per cent yet but looks like Nathan Horton will NOT be back with BOS. B’s talking trade and Tyler Seguin’s name has been discussed

  106. DBO says:

    Bob McKenzie ‏@TSNBobMcKenzie 50s
    Not 100 per cent yet but looks like Nathan Horton will NOT be back with BOS. B’s talking trade and Tyler Seguin’s name has been discussed.

  107. Rondo says:

    Bob Stauffer ‏@Bob_Stauffer 2m
    The #Oilers had a lunch meeting with Valeri Nichushkin here in New York in last couple of days according to Head Scout Stu MacGregor

  108. Smarmy says:

    haha RNH and our first for a year of Letang and Marc Fucking Fleury…

    We shall have none of the centers!

    Something like that happened I’m Seinfeld.gif on outta my Oiler fandom.

  109. tsg says:

    If Nichushkin is the pick then I really can’t see Gagner going anywhere.

  110. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    Woodguy: Why would they name him to the All Rookie team?He only led all rookies goals and points.

    Surely his intangibles are a quart low and his crust is soggy.

    So, his intangibles are “on the charts”?

  111. DBO says:

    Jason Gregor ‏@JasonGregor 50s
    Reminder for Oilers fan trade proposals. “I have not had a team inquire about him, but I would be open to moving his rights.” MacT on Omark.

  112. remlap says:

    Has the NHL lost its mind this past week?

  113. godot10 says:

    You know what they say.

    Be careful what you wish for, because you just might get it.

    We all mostly wanted Tambellini gone….

    There are some very good rumours, and there are some literally terrifying rumours. The good MacT of the press conference seems like manic hyperactive MacT via rumour mill.

  114. sumaclab says:

    Tyler Seguin on the block in Boston. Now that is interesting. Krijji and Bergeron ahead of him. How much and why not?

  115. godot10 says:

    sumaclab:
    Tyler Seguin on the block in Boston. Now that is interesting. Krijji and Bergeron ahead of him. How much and why not?

    He’d be a $5.75 million dollar 3rd line RW on the Oilers behind Eberle and Yakupov. The Oilers need a centre. Seguin isn’t a centre anymore.

  116. Smarmy says:

    godot10: He’d be a $5.75 million dollar 3rd line RW on the Oilers behind Eberle and Yakupov.The Oilers need a centre.Seguin isn’t a centre anymore.

    This guys hip fall apart? His second season in the league had people thinking he was the better of the Hall/Seguin picks and this whole season was shit. Is his hip that bad? Or do you just write off this season?

    Also, why can’t he be a center? Can’t win draws? That’s not an issue on the Oilers.

  117. Smarmy says:

    remlap:
    Has the NHL lost its mind this past week?

    Some times Captain Obvious comes on a bit strongly when he doesn’t like something but I agree with him that NHL GMs and Owners are stupid, stupid idiots.

  118. godot10 says:

    Smarmy: This guys hip fall apart? His second season in the league had people thinking he was the better of the Hall/Seguin picks and this whole season was shit. Is his hip that bad? Or do you just write off this season?

    Also, why can’t he be a center? Can’t win draws? That’s not an issue on the Oilers.

    Julien and Ward are very good coaches. Seguin is three years in and hasn’t been able to learn and master the defensive responsibilities of the centre position. If you can’t do it in three years, with stable coaching in a stable system on a good team with legit wingers and a legit defense, then you are never going to do it.

  119. Ice Sage says:

    There’s something fishy about Seguin being shopped. Sure, he didn’t finish a lot in the playoffs but his body of work in 3 seasons has been excellent and he’s just the kind of player that the Bruins should be building around for their next success cycle. It’s either his attitude (I remember his arrogance from the pre-draft times) or his hip… this one will be too expensive.

  120. tcho says:

    Folks, I know this period of time is what passes for playoff action in Edmonton the past half decade… but let’s take a deep breath. These are rumours. Let’s try to hold off and judge MacT on what he actually DOES rather than speculation on what he might.

    Btw – is it just me, or does it seem like the MSM is getting pretty shameless in reporting such wild speculation? Seems like about 10% of what they’re reporting actually comes true, or is 10% too harsh?

  121. gcw_rocks says:

    gangplank,

    Letang on his own will cripple the Oilers cap situation. Letang and Fleury would destroy it Contracts for RNH, Yak and Schultz still to come, plus Petry needs a raise.

    Letang up to $6M I like, over that, pass. Go get Kulikov.

  122. gogliano says:

    Anyone else suspicious about seguin’s hip thing?

  123. Smarmy says:

    gogliano:
    Anyone else suspicious about seguin’s hip thing?

    He’s admitted himself that he has had the issue his whole life. Hip issues don’t improve when you play hockey for a living.

  124. Lois Lowe says:

    The only reason that the Oilers are being mentioned in every rumour is because they have a bunch of players that other teams want and have stated they are willing to deal. All of the untouchable kids are what people outside of Edmonton are focusing on.

    Need a top 6 F? The Oilers will trade you Yak and Ebs for your dregs!

    Need a puck moving d man? The Oilers have soured on Schultz and want more truculence!

  125. bookje says:

    Luongo – the cap hit is not bad (spread out well) and having a known goalie might be helpful in acquiring FA’s (like khabibulin and Heatly). Dubnyk gets no respect.

  126. flyfish1168 says:

    I think Gillis is doing a bait and switch. Wait till July 5th and then see what happens no need to be impatient and get taken for a ride. After July 5th the buy out is over and then the real trading or UFA season starts. Why help division rivals out. Let Gillis sweat it out literally.

    If we feel the need to trade for Luongo then the starting point is Nucks must take Horcoff, Hemsky and Nucks retain 30% of Lou’s contract.

  127. Smarmy says:

    Lois Lowe,

    No no no. To the MSM Yak is a dreg and a cocky one to boot.

    RNH is damaged goods. The Oilers have to package him with their first rounder to get anything of value!

  128. Ribs says:

    gogliano:
    Anyone else suspicious about seguin’s hip thing?

    I wondered about it early in the playoffs. He looked like he was really struggling with his skating. I figured it was more likely a foot injury, though. Or maybe his giant feet have just become a hinderance to his skating, hah. In any case, I hope it’s not the hip thing. That would be a shame.

  129. Gordies Elbow says:

    Lois Lowe,

    The other reason Edmonton’s being mentioned? Media’s trying to generate hits/impressions/discussions/etc.

    Want to make a great number of hits? Use the following formula:
    - One (or preferably two) major market teams (Canadian preferred.);
    - Take one or more star players from each team;
    - throw in draft picks; and,
    - season to taste

    Sounds like TSN right now – although they’ve got me, so I guess it’s working.

  130. Lois Lowe says:

    I would trade this year’s 7 plus Rajala and one of Musil/Marincin for Seguin. At least something like that makes financial sense for Boston, though I doubt they touch it.

  131. godot10 says:

    Lois Lowe:
    I would trade this year’s 7 plus Musil/Marincin for Seguin. At least something like that makes financial sense for Boston, though I doubt they touch it.

    Monahan is a centre. Seguin isn’t. Why would you trade the perfect 2nd centre to pair with Nugent-Hopkins for a RW who isn’t as good as Eberle or Yakupov?

  132. Gordies Elbow says:

    Nathan Horton’s moving on from Boston. Wonder where he’ll end up, and for how much $$$. Anyone have any guesses?

  133. theres oil in virginia says:

    Now Dreger has outright said that the Oilers have interest in Schneider:

    http://t.co/AqxHJyvMAH

    He also says Flyers want a young forward and he doesn’t think Paajarvi will be enough return to get Coburn.

  134. Lois Lowe says:

    godot10: Monahan is a centre.Seguin isn’t.Why would you trade the perfect 2nd centre to pair with Nugent-Hopkins for a RW who isn’t as good as Eberle or Yakupov?

    I still think that Seguin is a natural C who needs to play in the top 6, which is difficult behind Kreijci and Bergeron. I am also not convinced that Monahan is a “perfect 2nd C” because he’s not played a game in the show as yet. I always take the NHL player over the magic beans.

  135. Bushed says:

    I agree with Flyfish re. let Gillis sweat it out until July 5.

    Even if Gillis is gauging price point on Schnieder as TSN suggests, why would he do so?

    My guess is that ownership has told Gillis to do whatever it takes to avoid an expensive buyout. Maybe they’ve also added something about cleaning up the mess you made, and perhaps even an added “or else”.

    No reason to rush into helping Vancouver…

  136. FastOil says:

    Seguin doesn’t have enough drive for me. Another talented complementary player.

    Although the rumour is of course bunk, if taking Fleury got Letang out of Pitts, perhaps he could be moved to Philly (assuming of course he agrees). I’ll bet Holmgren thinks he’s good. Letang would have to extend as well.

  137. fifthcartel says:

    You would think with so many teams/GM’s being ‘really active’ that a trade or two would come out of it already.

  138. Woodguy says:

    Romulus Apotheosis: So, his intangibles are “on the charts”?

    Winner!

  139. mustang says:

    Gordies Elbow:
    Justin Schultz named to the NHL All-Rookie team. Can’t understand why the PHWA doesn’t like Yakupov, though.

    Let’s hope Yak uses this as motivation to blow the completion out of the water this coming season. Nothing like saying in around about way ” We don’t like you and you’re not good enough”

  140. Numenius says:

    No, no, no. Please don’t take Schneider. I don’t trust him given the rumours about his anxiety issues under pressure.

    http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=668540

  141. FastOil says:

    fifthcartel:
    You would think with so many teams/GM’s being ‘really active’ that a trade or two would come out of it already.

    Looks like they’re waiting until tomorrow. Prices must be too high currently.

  142. "Steve Smith" says:

    Numenius,

    All goalies are nuts – there’s a selection process there that makes it largely inevitable. Schneider’s form of nuts obviously doesn’t prevent him from keeping the puck out of the net; he’s quality.

    I don’t want him, because you have to give up quality to get quality, and if we’re giving up quality, I want it to be for centres or defencemen. And also because success from a goaltender seems to be about the least repeatable success in hockey, and so I’m leery of an goaltender that comes at a high cost or is signed to a long term.

  143. theres oil in virginia says:

    fifthcartel,
    FastOil,

    I wonder if it takes a trade to happen to “set the market”.

  144. Marc says:

    godot10: Monahan is a centre.Seguin isn’t.Why would you trade the perfect 2nd centre to pair with Nugent-Hopkins for a RW who isn’t as good as Eberle or Yakupov?

    Seguin is an Nhl player whose worst case scenario is good player and ceiling is elite player.

    Monahan is a prospect who may not even make the NHL and whose ceiling is more than likely good player.

    If you can get Seguin for any combination of players/picks/prospects that doesn’t include Hall, Eberle, RNH, Yak and Schultz you mkae that trade – and the odds are very good that you’ll win it.

  145. RexLibris says:

    theres oil in virginia:
    fifthcartel,
    FastOil,

    I wonder if it takes a trade to happen to “set the market”.

    I think you’re right in a sense.

    With so many GMs in one room, nobody wants to put out the signal that there is blood in the water. They are waiting for one deal to happen because it could alter other plans of theirs and perhaps create some vulnerabilities to exploit.

  146. eidy says:

    Dear mact: don’t see what all the drama is for…

    trade for cobourn- 56 and joey l, I don’t see how philly is in a position to be super choosy and demanding, they are in a cap crunch. aren’t we supposed to take advantage of them
    trade for clutter buck- pitlick and next year 2, see above

    Take monahan/nukishkin/lindholm with 7
    take theodore/santini/de la rose with 37…. they better keep some picks or else I did all this draft research for nothing

    leave draft with Monahan, theodore, coburn and clutter buck
    Move Horcoff for what you can

    and sign gagner and MPS for Christ’s sake

    next week you can get the other 5 players (not named fleury, schneider)

  147. jake70 says:

    theres oil in virginia:
    fifthcartel,
    FastOil,

    I wonder if it takes a trade to happen to “set the market”.

    In my 3rd year of chemistry, I took a course called organic synthesis, where labs were 3 hours of mixing and shaking, heating and cooling etc, and waiting……..when your end product didn’t come out of solution, first you got a sick feeling in your stomach (only had a mulligan on 1 lab all term) then you took a glass stirring rod, gently but very firmly scratched the inside surface of the beaker…….this allowed the first crystal to come out of solution, and a few minutes later , a beautiful crystal structure appeared.
    Looks like we are waiting for a GM to scratch the beaker.

  148. Numenius says:

    “Steve Smith”:
    Numenius,

    All goalies are nuts – there’s a selection process there that makes it largely inevitable.Schneiders form of nuts obviously doesn’t prevent him from keeping the puck out of the net; he’s quality.

    I don’t want him, because you have to give up quality to get quality, and if we’re giving up quality, I want it to be for centres or defencemen.And also because success from a goaltender seems to be about the least repeatable success in hockey, and so I’m leery of an goaltender that comes at a high cost or is signed to a long term.

    Schneider may be quality in the regular season, but he hasn’t been proven in the playoffs and there are signs he may not be able to handle it. I agree that one should be leery with goaltenders as a rule, and this makes me extra leery.

  149. fuzzy muppet says:

    I know this is a big no-no but:

    Eklund : 7th overall and MPS for 11 and Coburn “close”.

    I don’t like it….

  150. BONVIE says:

    Lois Lowe,

    I wouldn’t we could end up with a Whitney. It sound fishy them dealing off Seguin after this hip injury.

  151. Andropod says:

    Andropod,

    I’m talking about the likelihood of Schneider refusing the trade (if he has a NTC) , refusing to sign a contract here, or even refusing to play here.
    What is the point of giving up picks/assets for someone who does not want to play here?

  152. Numenius says:

    For what it’s worth, Eklund is saying Coburn + #11 for Paajarvi + #7 may be close.

    Seems a bit pricey to me.

    Edit: Ah, I see someone beat me to it.

  153. "Steve Smith" says:

    fuzzy muppet,

    It’s well established that posting an Eklund rumour is acceptable, provided that
    i. it’s at a time when a whole bunch of Loweride readers are refreshing the comments section frequently for any kind of trade news, and
    ii. you acknowledge in your post that absolutely no weight is to be given to the rumour.

    You’re fine.

    (Cloutier rumours, in contrast, are never acceptable.)

  154. godot10 says:

    Marc: Seguin is an Nhl player whose worst case scenario is good player and ceiling is elite player.

    Seguin is already being paid like an elite player, and has a chronic hip problem. Somebody has forgotten Ryan Whitney already.

    6 years x $5.75 million for a damaged goods 3rd line RW (behind Eberle and Yakupov).

    Where is the value for money?

  155. fuzzy muppet says:

    Via Tim pannacio:

    The Coburn trade talk is NOT about getting EDM 1stR pick (7); it’s about their 2 second-round picks which would give Flyers 3 in that round

  156. fuzzy muppet says:

    “Steve Smith”,

    “Steve Smith’s” approval?? *swoon*

  157. DBO says:

    Tim Panaccio ‏@tpanotchCSN 4m
    The Coburn trade talk is NOT about getting EDM 1stR pick (7); it’s about their 2 second-round picks which would give Flyers 3 in that round

    MacT mentioned the 2nd’s. Hope they can turn the two seconds and some B prospects into Coburn and Clutterbuck. Once again, yes they are flawed, but may be the best we can do. And I hope he gets Malone and a 3rd (Friedman I think mentioned it) for a prospect. All we would need to add then is a 3rd line centre ( Gordon) and backup goalie (Khudonbin) and assuming we re sign Gagner, we have had a really good summer. Team is improved. Cup contender? No. Playoffs? definitely.

  158. Numenius says:

    fuzzy muppet,

    Thank God.

    Edit: For “Steve Smith’s” approval, I mean. :)

  159. Marc says:

    fuzzy muppet:
    Via Tim pannacio:

    The Coburn trade talk is NOT about getting EDM 1stR pick (7); it’s about their 2 second-round picks which would give Flyers 3 in that round

    If we can get Coburn for 2 second rounders that’s a huge win. 28 year old top 4 D for two picks that history tells us each have a 1 in 4 chance of turning into an NHL player who manages more than 200 games.

  160. Lowetide says:

    At least one deal is close based on what I’ve heard. This could be a crazy afternoon/evening.

  161. Lowetide says:

    Interesting the Coburn deal involves one or both of the second rounders. Wonder if the Oilers will get one back?

  162. DeadmanWaking says:

    theres oil in virginia,

    Over the past three days I watched close to ten hours of YouTube video by prominent figures in the lipid biochemistry debate after the recent Peter Attia TED talk incited me to revisit the mother of all hairballs of dysfunctional public policy debates. In his talk Attia tears up, not having a better idea of how to cross the gap from being a type A, geek extraordinaire pretty much every waking minute of every waking day. He might actually care a lot about the overweight, diabetic woman whose foot he amputated, but when you get under his real skin he cares even more about the intricacies of Apolipoprotein B.

    It’s extremely difficult to untangle this rabicidal contretemps. What one can determine is the origins of the American heart healthy diet in the early 1980s was entirely based on junk science, in no small measure by exactly the mechanism you describe: the lasso around the original claim tends to expand with each additional retelling.

    It didn’t help that the original scientists took a narrow view of ethics. One famous study boldly announces in the abstract that, yes, they found a strong correlation between saturated fat intake and CVD. Buried in a smaller than normal font on page 250 of a 500 page document there’s a paragraph which confesses that the study found an equally strong correlation between dietary sugar intake and CVD, because in the countries studied sugar intake and saturated fat intake happen to be strongly correlated (I’ve hybridized that example from multiple anecdotes which have since blurred together in my mind). Only the most persistent reader has any hope of coming away from this study as presented with a balanced view.

    There’s a parallel debate about food labeling which works along much the same principles: the large colourful fonts scream “heart healthy” but the fine print on the back tells you that you’re consuming 80% of your RDA of sodium to achieve 10% of your RDA of vitamin C. One modern view is that your LDL level is far less informative than your trig/HDL ratio. That’s how I read food packaging when I’m in a hurry. The quickest and most useful test is the font size ratio between the claims presented on the front of the package and what’s quantified on the back of the package. The other test is the synonym test: how many different words for sugar or MSG can they smuggle onto the ingredients list?

    The Many Names of Monosodium Glutamate. You’ll notice that the correlation with the letter “y” is extremely strong. A drug that caused us to lower the relative frequency of the letter “y” on the ingredients list of the foods we purchase could very well achieve the same statistical significance on heart health outcomes that one obtains from a publishable statin drug study. It’s unfortunate that few people realize how many of these medical claims are very nearly this silly. It could turn out that the entire correlation between high cholesterol diets and heart disease derives from this newly discovered mechanism whereby gut bacteria turn lecithin/choline prevalent in egg yolks into TMAO which enters the human blood stream, where it’s known to be a risk factor. The whole “bad” cholesterol thing could have been an innocent letter Y.

    What I found the most shocking is just how hard it is to pare away the junk science once the junk science has been used to inform public policy. Here’s another one. When many of the original dietary studies were conducted, trans fats were not yet identified as a distinct category, so they got lumped in with other saturated fats. And guess what? The saturated fats (aka the non-soy BBQ horn of plenty) didn’t come off so well. Doh! If you lumped arsenic under omega-3 we’d quickly become convinced that omega-3 was public enemy number one.

    No powerful entity ever admits to pressuring a scientist to publish a favourable result. Yet somehow the scientists that take the investigation down potentially unfavourable pathways find it almost impossible to renew their grants.

    One of my favourite tidbits was the Chocolate for footballs scheme where kids could redeem Cadbury’s chocolate bar tokens to supply their school with “free” sports equipment:

    One newspaper calculated that under the scheme, one set of posts and nets for volleyball would require tokens from 5,440 bars. The Food Commission pointed out this would entail children spending more than £2,000 on chocolate and wolfing their way through 1.25 million calories.

    This transpired after JP Morgan issued a report listing Cadbury has having particularly high exposure to a looming public policy crackdown on childhood obesity, such as banning coke machines from school grounds, or worse. After the arithmetic hit the tabloids Cadbury retracted the promotion (causing some British politician to fall on his sword), but they quickly regrouped and became one of the principal sponsors of the London Five Ring Circus (I believe it has another name, but I’m not sure I’m legally allowed to use it).

    This was nearly a universal refrain from the corporations burying their heads in the sand: all the information is there, it falls to the consumer to make good choices, while making every possible effort to ensure that carefully crafted claims are incorrectly cross-linked at the first glance or the first repetition.

    In this world, the tactic is particularly effective if the cross-linking triggers loss aversion (OMG if MacT does this he might be stupider than every other GM who ever lived).

    Laurie Santos: A monkey economy as irrational as ours

  163. Numenius says:

    Marc,

    I’m sure those two second rounders would also include Paajarvi.

  164. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    Lowetide:
    Interesting the Coburn deal involves one or both of the second rounders. Wonder if the Oilers will get one back?

    Two tens for your five?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7pMYHn-1yA

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4f-nzEzLUco

  165. speeds says:

    Numenius,

    I wouldn’t trade Paajarvi for Coburn, nevermind including picks.

    2 – 2nds for Coburn seems like an overpay to me.

  166. tcho says:

    Romulus Apotheosis,

    Thanks. That’s great stuff. (and describes Tambo’s trading M.O. very well)

  167. Crooked says:

    I’m curious what MacT thought of Lack, having coached him in Chicago. The numbers match up favorably with Schneider’s, minus the winning percentage. Seems like Lack would be a good back-up option in Edmonton, or starter in OKC.

  168. fifthcartel says:

    Lowetide:
    At least one deal is close based on what I’ve heard. This could be a crazy afternoon/evening.

    Coburn/Clutterbuck?

  169. Maverick says:

    wordbird:
    SOMEBODY MAKE A DAMN DEAL ALREADY!!!

    Agreed!! I’m heading out for a nice long bike ride soon, really don’t want to take my phone with me! ;-)

  170. Lois Lowe says:

    Marc: If we can get Coburn for 2 second rounders that’s a huge win.28 year old top 4 D for two picks that history tells us each have a 1 in 4 chance of turning into an NHL player who manages more than 200 games.

    Unsurprisingly, you and I are in agreement with respect to both Seguin and Coburn.

  171. Maverick says:

    Hope the Schneider talk has died down, I think the Coburn/Clutterbuck angle is where the attention should be focussed on.

    At the end of the day if the Oilers make a trade for Coburn and make a trade for Clutterbuck and lose Martin Marincin, Tyler Pitlick the #37 and the #56 but still have the #7 pick and gain pick #70 or #72. That I think is a win.

  172. Marc says:

    Lois Lowe: Unsurprisingly, you and I are in agreement with respect to both Seguin and Coburn.

    :)

  173. dessert1111 says:

    Saw nearly 200 comments in this thread and thought for sure a trade had been made. Decided to read thru to build the excitement. …At least there is lots of chatter :D

  174. Captain Happy says:

    godot10: Seguin is already being paid like an elite player, and has a chronic hip problem.Somebody has forgotten Ryan Whitney already.

    6 years x $5.75 million for a damaged goods 3rd line RW (behind Eberle and Yakupov).

    Where is the value for money?

    Seguin is 15th in the league in ES goals over the past 2 seasons.

    http://tinyurl.com/nvuzmkw

    That’s 1 behind Eberle. who has a higher cap hit, and 10 ahead of Hall.

    I think there is some “value for money” there.

  175. rogue says:

    Lowetide;

    Is Mark Fraser of any benefit to the Oil as a 5 or 6 dman? I know naught about him.

  176. Lowetide says:

    He’d be a depth guy for sure. Oilers have a lot of them but if they aren’t bringing back Fistric or Peckham…..

  177. Bar_Qu says:

    The longer this day goes on with so many breathless rumors reported from all sources, the more I am beginning to think that this is trade deadline revisited. And I think it entirely likely nothing will actually happen.

    Now, it is also entirely possible that by the time I finish writing this comment Luongo, Schneider, Clutterbuck and Ollie Frampas will all be Oilers.

  178. Captain Happy says:

    Tampa Bay with strong interest in Tyler Seguin.

    Seguin replaces Vinny and Boston gets #3.

  179. 20feet says:

    Gordies Elbow,

    I’m not sure how much difference the quality of defensemen has on a goalie’s Sv%, but it won’t be the difference between a league leader and an average starter. So yes, I’d say the gap is discernible.

  180. Lucinius says:

    Schneider is a good goaltender. Right now he’s better than Dubnyk — however that difference is not worth the cost of what it would take to acquire someone who is on record as talking shit about your city and the potential of playing there. That never ends well. Additionally, Schneider’s numbers come from being on a much better team, which likely closes the gap between he and Dubnyk. You pass on Schneider, period, but Dubnyk is Rodney Dangerfield to the NHL.

    Seguin you pass on unless you get him cheap. Not because he’s bad (he’s good and consistent), but there are troubling signs there with the hip that could cost him severely and his position (RW) is one the Oilers are already strong on (possibly the best RW depth in the league, imo — though it came at a cost of depth.. everywhere else). Seguin will be too expensive to bring to Edmonton on the hope and prayer he can play center and the hip isn’t a long term issue despite the fact it is negatively affecting his play already.

    Cobourn… I’m not a huge fan of, but if you get him for the right price you do the deal. That price does not include; Paajarvi, Klefbom or Marincin. If any one of those are involved I tell the Flyers to stop dreaming. Paajarvi fills a hole on the Oilers as is, and does so cheaply and with potential to continue to improve and is a proven team player. Klefbom and Marincin simply have too much potential to trade them before you get some kind of result on them regarding their NHL futures; they shouldn’t be traded unless its for a blockbuster player who’s here for term.

    But, as my father always says about the Oilers;

    “They’ll fuck it up.”

    I have no faith in the Oilers making the right call because there is a long history of the personnel involved fucking things up, even with MacT from back when he was a coach.

  181. PunjabiOil says:

    Ryan Rishaug ‏@TSNRyanRishaug now

    Opinion only, if Monahan is gone, Oilers will have a very hard time passing on Nichushkin. He’s said to be ready for nhl now, top 6 powerF.

    Good.

  182. spoiler says:

    Ryan Rishaug@TSNRyanRishaug

    Opinion only, if Monahan is gone, Oilers will have a very hard time passing on Nichushkin. He’s said to be ready for nhl now, top 6 powerF

    Very bad.

    Lol!

  183. PunjabiOil says:

    I’m a little concerned if Carolina takes VN. Calgary probably takes Monahan then. Just ave a feeling the Oilers will pass on Lindolm and take Nurse instead.

  184. PunjabiOil says:

    Monahan has an October 12 birthday – so he’ll be one of the older players in the draft. Such a tough decision….

  185. spoiler says:

    Well from the twitters, it sounds like Carolina will move their pick for a legit NHL defenceman. Coburn and Phaneuf are the only two blueliners we know are in play…

  186. Ben says:

    Keep the picks. More building. More rookies in the lineup.

    DISHONOUR FOR CONNOR.

  187. Lucinius says:

    On the positive side.. at least the Oilers aren’t the Eskimos.

  188. Marc says:

    You know, I was quite disappointed when I discovered that ESPN in the UK, who have the rights to the CFL, wasn’t showing the Eskimos game.

    Now, not so much…

  189. spoiler says:

    Lucinius:
    On the positive side.. at least the Oilers aren’t the Eskimos.

    This has been an uninspiring 3 quarters of football. I will give Reilly a pass… but the D, sweet baby Jesus they have to be better.

  190. Captain Happy says:

    spoiler:
    Well from the twitters, it sounds like Carolina will move their pick for a legit NHL defenceman. Coburn and Phaneuf are the only two blueliners we know are in play…

    Apparently Alex Edler is too.

  191. spoiler says:

    Darren Dreger has the Oilers “right in the middle” of the Schneider trade talks…

    I can’t see the Canucks trading Schneider to a team within their own division. Surely the Oilers are just being used to drive up the price.

  192. Lowetide says:

    spoiler:
    Darren Dreger has the Oilers “right in the middle” of the Schneider trade talks…

    I can’t see the Canucks trading Schneider to a team within their own division.Surely the Oilers are just being used to drive up the price.

    Makes sense. I don’t know why they are so focused on goaltending.

  193. Gordies Elbow says:

    20feet:
    Gordies Elbow,

    I’m not sure how much difference the quality of defensemen has on a goalie’s Sv%, but it won’t be the difference between a league leader and an average starter.So yes, I’d say the gap is discernible.

    I’m not sure that it can be quantified, but handling more shots per game, and likely harder shots, would impact any goaltenders stats.

    When you compare the stats, Dubnyk has seen 1647 more regular season shots than Schneider. When you compare saves per minute played, Dubnyk actually saved more than Schneider (0.531 Sv/Min compared to 0.505 Sv/Min.)

    What I learned from this? Edmonton’s defense really, really sucks. Shocking, I know, but it looks like spending assets to fix the defense would be a better deal than trading for a goaltender who may (or may not) be any better than the current guy.

  194. Gordies Elbow says:

    Lowetide: Makes sense. I don’t know why they are so focused on goaltending.

    Flip a goalie to Philly for Coburn and something else?

  195. PunjabiOil says:

    The more i read on Sean Monahan, the more I’d prefer VN or EL. Maybe even Nurse?

    ________________________-

    From flamesnation:

    Conclusion

    There’s some minor red flags when it comes to Sean Monahan: he is a older than most of his draft eligible peers, he’s not an explosive skater or dominant offensive talent and his ES/PP points splits this year are worrying.

    On the other hand, he’s widely considered the best forward available out of the OHL this season and probably would have been top-end draft pick even if he was available in 2012. His combination of size, strength and hockey IQ is a good one and reminiscent of some of the better two-way players who have been picked in the top-10 recently.

  196. spoiler says:

    Gordies Elbow: Flip a goalie to Philly for Coburn and something else?

    I’d bet money that Emery will sign with the Flyers.

    Thank you Fred Stamps for being the one Eskie left worth watching.

  197. Lowetide says:

    Gordies Elbow: Flip a goalie to Philly for Coburn and something else?

    Something like that makes sense.

  198. BONVIE says:

    Gordies Elbow,

    All day long!!!! The defense is the problem and its not on the depth of it. The depth is fine but we don’t have anything even resembling a stud or a Stalwart on D. If we had a Myers, Pieterangelo, or Weber our D would instantly go from bottom feeder to above average.

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