GAGNER CROSSROADS

If you want me to keep my mouth shut, it’s gonna cost you some dough. I figure a thousand bucks is reasonable, so I want two.

-Tom Reagan

Sam Gagner is in a very unique position. He can file for arbitration this summer, accept the one year offering and reach free agency earlier than any player in history. Those who question Gagner’s value would be in for quite a surprise next July, as Gagner the free agent–with 7 years (by that time) NHL experience and only 24 (next July)–can sign for only money. The number and term could be explosive.

Gagner and his agent clearly know this, but from what we know there’s a desire to return to this young Oiler group. Anecdotal information suggests Gagner has been helpful in the recruitment of several valuable free agents (Justin Schultz the most famous example) and at MacT’s first media conference the new GM went out of his way to arm player and representation with ammo for the arb hearing.

I don’t think there’s a bad guy in here, both sides appear to have a healthy respect for each other and acknowledge the process. Sam Gagner has leverage and has the right to use it, and the Oilers are in a tough spot (really no choice here, they don’t have the depth to hold firm) and the best window for them was one year ago. I am a flat out fan of Sam Gagner, hope he signs long term and helps win a Stanley for this group. I still expect a release on Sam’s contract soon, but the days roll by and we’re into mid-July soon. The clock ticks. We wait.

scarlett-johansson-gif-26

The Oilers depth chart remains out of balance, and as the free agents dwindle the trade route emerges as the best available option. Edmonton has some nice things–next year’s draft picks (most of them), enough blueline depth to trade one or two of the close-to-ready prospects, and perhaps a young roster player or two if that’s required. If we look at the team position by position, there’s still an extreme need for a top pairing blue and another strong NHL option at center. If this Craig MacTavish resembles the coach Craig MacTavish I’d bet money on another center coming in over the next couple of weeks. I think a LW with size for the 2line is also on the list.

GOALIES

  1. NHL: Devan Dubnyk, Jason LaBarbera
  2. AHL: Richard Bachman, Olivier Roy, Tyler Bunz
  3. Europe: Frans Tuohimaa

I like what MacT has done here, adding a solid (but clearly a) NHL backup and backing THAT up with Bachman who can certainly play. I’m comfortable suggesting the club is stronger at this position than one year ago (DD-Khabi-Danis) and that the problems here are longer term. Edmonton should (and I suggest will) be in on college free agency and the 2014 entry draft, and of course next summer this will be a position in extreme transition.

LEFT DEFENSE

  1. NHL: Ladislav Smid (20:19 TOI); Andrew Ference (19:29TOI); Nick Schultz (18:37TOI); Anton Belov (22:11TOI KHL)
  2. AHL: Oscar Klefbom, Martin Marincin, Brandon Davidson, Brad Hunt, Martin Gernat, David Musil

This is probably the position of greatest depth in the organization. The Oilers have three LD who can play regular minutes (all are PK options, none are PP options) plus Belov who is an established KHL player with a lot of experience. The options here are solid, and make the AHL list even stronger. The potential Barons offer a ridiculous combination of mobility, defensive acumen and potential. The odds of Gernat or Musil getting lost in the flood are exceptional, I think we’ll see someone traded from this list before Christmas.

RIGHT DEFENSE

  1. NHL: Jeff Petry (21:54 TOI); Justin Schultz (21:26 TOI); Corey Potter (17:27 TOI); Philip Larsen (17:18 TOI)
  2. AHL: Taylor Fedun

Oilers have a nice player in Petry (although he struggled last season) and Schultz has all kinds of potential and should emerge as a more complete player this coming season (based on the scouting reports that suggested his defensive coverage was excellent). Potter and Larsen look about equal, as is reflected by the time on ice given them by their NHL coaches. The RH side in OKC is poor, with only Fedun a right side shot. Lee Moffie is a LH shot if you’re wondering and the Barons have already signed Joey Leach–also a left shot. Tom Gilbert would be a nice fit here.

CENTER

  1. NHL: Sam Gagner (19:24 TOI); Ryan Nugent-Hopkins (18:51 TOI); Boyd Gordon (15:00 TOI); Anton Lander (11:01 TOI)
  2. AHL: Andrew Miller, Wil Acton, Ryan Martindale, Travis Ewanyk

I went into this summer firmly believing MacT would add two items to this group and so far we have only one. Gagner is key to this position because he’s at an age where he has to either take on tougher opposition or slay the soft parade (which he did not do this past season). Nuge continues to be a wunderkind and the only concern is injury, with Boyd Gordon a strong solution to 3line C and needing only right-thinking wingers to form a shutdown line of good quality. The AHL group is not inspiring, the Barons have signed CJ Stretch to an AHL contract and he’ll play.

LEFT WING

  1. NHL: Taylor Hall (18:37 TOI); Ryan Smyth (15:22 TOI); Magnus Paajarvi (14:07 TOI); Jesse Joensu (10:08 TOI); Ben Eager (9:39 TOI)
  2. AHL: Toni Rajala, Ryan Hamilton, Curtis Hamilton, Kale Kessy

This should be the last season Taylor Hall lags behind someone in TOI, for crying out loud let’s get that straightened out right bloody now. Smyth’s minutes will fade, the question today is who gets those minutes? Internal options are Paajarvi and the unknowable Joensu–a pro scouts find–and external options range from Omark (I kid) to Jagr. The minor league team has two players of interest: the tse tse fly Rajala and the new hire Ryan Hamilton. Expect some movement here.

RIGHT WING

  1. NHL: Jordan Eberle (18:59 TOI); Ales Hemsky (15:4 TOI); Nail Yakupov (14:33 TOI); Ryan Jones (12:58 TOI); Mike Brown (8:47)
  2. AHL: Mark Arcobello, Tyler Pitlick, Cameron Abney

So much natural talent at this position it’s ridiculous. Eberle leads the way, Yakupov is pushing and will eventually own the 1line slot but it may not be this season. Jones is back in the fold and has an excellent chance of playing top 9 minutes and Brown is the enforcer for the 4line. Hemsky’s gone, the only question now is will the club get a useable player or draft picks. The Barons have a brilliant player in Arcobello, a struggling prospect in Pitlick and the enforcer Abney (now joined by Erick Lizon, signed recently to an AHL deal. The position lacks a Pisani, as it has for several years now.

MACT’S LIST

  1. Sign Sam Gagner to a multi-year deal that has begins with a number in the 4′s
  2. Get Paajarvi signed and then find a role that suits him (suspect it’s 3line).
  3. Find a 2line L who can complement Gagner-Yakupov with puck retrieval, blocking out the sun, etc
  4. Find a 4line C
  5. Deal Hemsky for immediate help (even if its a checker).
  6. Top 4 defender (signed Ference, that’s the big move this summer)
  7. Find a 3line C (Gordon an ideal fit)
  8. NHL goalie (LaBarbera was a nice option)
  9. Find a 3line R Joensu is the option I’ll puck, but it would be foolish to exclude Ryan Jones based on salary
  10. Deal Horcoff or slot him into the 3line job for which he is actually ideal. Continued to improve D depth.
  11. Decide on Lander/Belanger or other for 13F. Lander it is!
  12. Better blue depth (MacT has done this with Belov and Larsen, plus Klefbom/Fedun/Marincin)
  13. AHL #1/NHL #3 goalie Bachman is an outstanding solution
  14. Sign Paul Ranger (should have said ‘sign Marlies)

Still work to do, hard to say when the opportunity to add to this group arises. There’s often a quiet period, as teams look at their roster and evaluate needs. The Oilers remain far from finished, there are some nice bets added and three quality additions (top 2D, scoring L and two-way C) would go a long way to making this a playoff team. And you know, if they solve the C situation by signing Grabovski, Eakins can move Gagner over to the wing (left) on that line and MacT solves two problems with one signing (although he still needs to sign Samwise). Dustin Penner remains a phone call away.

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193 Responses to "GAGNER CROSSROADS"

  1. Lucinius says:

    I’m hoping for a Grabovski signing, moving Gagner to LW and going with that as the second line to start the season. Then you move Hemsky for a better fit on the third line (someone who can play LW or RW is fine, as Paajarvi can play both wings). That would give the Oilers three good lines and help cover for RNH getting time to heal before coming back (can start the season with Gags on the first line, Grabovski on the second line).

    Fourth line can then be some mixture of Lander, Smyth, Jones, Brown, Joensu.

    Still need a top flight D-man, though.. preferably on the right side to give us;

    Smid — New Guy
    Ference — Petry
    Belov — J. Schultz
    Potter, Larsen

    Meaning you move N. Schultz for help; either in a package to get the New Guy, or a better 4th line C.

  2. Woodguy says:

    The possibility for the fabled 3 for 1 remains.

    Leaving Gagner off the list for now, the 3 big bullets are:

    Paajarvi – Stauffer says almost every team has called about him
    Hemsky – If the Oilers keep 1/2 his salary he has more value than a pick
    1st next year – always valuable

    Secondary bullets – Someone from the AHL blue (except Klef, I don’t think they trade him unless its for a Pieterangelo or Weber)

    You can look at those 3 bullets and estimate that if Paajarvi signs for something like $1.5MM, then the package can have a cap hit of $4MM with two players who can play top 9 NHL minutes.

    That might be very enticing for a team that is cap strapped.

    Just Paajarvi + 1st + AHL D would be enticing as well given only a $1.5 cap for this year, but I think would get less than the first package.

    Also,

    I wonder if MacT wants to sign Grabbo, but thinks it would send the wrong message in terms of getting Sam done before arbitration.

  3. Ice Sage says:

    Thanks – another great reset summary. Progress is being made.

    DP is just a phone call away for every GM, of course. Once bitten twice shy for MacT – consistent effort and self-discipline are gospel for Eakins so I can’t see a second helping of pancakes in Oil-town.

    Here’s hoping Gagner + co. don’t give MacT the “high hat”

  4. Lucinius says:

    Woodguy,

    Trading Paajarvi makes me cringe. The guy just fits too well here and fills an important role with potential left to improve. Imo, unless its for a true #1 D-man, trading Paajarvi is the height of horrendous asset management.

  5. murphy says:

    I’m hoping 1,2 and 4 get done asap along with signing grabo! Man Lapierre would have looked good as the 4th line center! How mact didn’t get that done for 1.5 a year i dont know.

  6. Lowetide says:

    Lucinius:
    Woodguy,

    Trading Paajarvi makes me cringe. The guy just fits too well here and fills an important role with potential left to improve. Imo, unless its for a true #1 D-man, trading Paajarvi is the height of horrendous asset management.

    You have to give to get, though. I hope they can do it with N Schultz and binder twine, but they can’t. It’s going to hurt, whatever it is.

  7. Woodguy says:

    I also wonder if MacT’s obvious displeasure (sadness?) at not getting Clarkson was more than just not getting the player.

    If MacT got Clarkson (big, tough LW who can win puck battles, exactly what MacT wants) then all of his trading ammo can be focused on getting the true 1LD.

    Now that he has the 2LW and “true” 1LD positions still not filled, he doesn’t have the ammo to trade for both.

    Also,

    I firmly believe the plan was (is?) to sign Gagner long term, move him to RW, then trade either Eberle or Yak in the WOW trade to get a true 1LD or even 1RD.

    Now that plan is off the rails a bit, and if they don’t cave to Sam (because fucking Tambellini gave him ALL OF THE LEVERAGE with the last contract) then the plan disintegrates even further.

  8. Chris Hext---formerly EasyOil--- says:

    Is Arcobello not a C, LT? Or are you projecting him at the position he’s most likely to play in the NHL?

  9. Lucinius says:

    Lowetide,

    I know, I know. Paajarvi makes a fantastic trade asset. Unfortunately.. the Oilers need him too much, imo. They just don’t have the LW depth to trade him without merely opening yet another hole in their line up.

    Any trade the Oilers make, imo, has to revolve around Hemsky, N. Schultz, and guys like Rajala, Musil, Gernat, Harski’s rights, etc..

    I’d try to avoid trading Paajarvi, Klefbom, Marincin.

  10. murphy says:

    Lowetide,

    I don’t see how they can justify trading paajarvi when he can fill a role no one else on the team currently can, is cheap and is only getting better.

    Gagner and eberle are very similar players (i think gagners a winger parading as a center), eberle so far is more elite in the ability to take on the toughs and come out with a nice looking corsi but gagner obviously has a big fan in mact. Bottom line is you send one of them away.

  11. Lowetide says:

    Chris Hext—formerly EasyOil—:
    Is Arcobello not a C, LT?Or are you projecting him at the position he’s most likely to play in the NHL?

    He can play either, I put him there because the current AHL depth is bloody awful at RW.

  12. Professor Q says:

    Woodguy:
    I also wonder if MacT’s obvious displeasure (sadness?) at not getting Clarkson was more than just not getting the player.

    If MacT got Clarkson (big, tough LW who can win puck battles, exactly what MacT wants) then all of his trading ammo can be focused on getting the true 1LD.

    Now that he has the 2LW and “true” 1LD positions still not filled, he doesn’t have the ammo to trade for both.

    Also,

    I firmly believe the plan was (is?) to sign Gagner long term, move him to RW, then trade either Eberle or Yak in the WOW trade to get a true 1LD or even 1RD.

    Now that plan is off the rails a bit, and if they don’t cave to Sam (because fucking Tambellini gave him ALL OF THE LEVERAGE with the last contract) then the plan disintegrates even further.

    Trading Yak is asinine. Probably Eberle as well.

  13. Beaker says:

    Woodguy:

    If MacT got Clarkson (big, tough LW who can win puck battles, exactly what MacT wants) then all of his trading ammo can be focused on getting the true 1LD.

    Except Clarksons a RW

  14. hags9k says:

    I wonder if MacT has given any thought to moving Eberle to C. He played some with the Pats. Certainly has the brains for it but I’m not sure the skating would be there. Last season would have been the time to try it though as we can’t play hardball with Sam when we don’t know what 4 or 14 at C will look like.

    We’re going to have to pay the man. Then Eakins is going to have to turn him into a 2 way beauty.

    My dream for balance continues to be Hemsky+(+retaining some salary) for Hartnell. Philly may be cash strapped enough and Holmgren is definitely not scared to trade away fan favorites.

  15. Woodguy says:

    Beaker,

    He plays both.

  16. Yeti says:

    Professor Q: Trading Yak is asinine. Probably Eberle as well.

    That entirely depends on what is coming back.

  17. Woodguy says:

    Professor Q,

    Ask MacTavish how important Pronger was the 2006 team.

    Those guys don’t come cheap.

    One of those two would have to be in the package.

  18. DBO says:

    Nice summary LT. There are still teams with either cap issues or internal cap issues and a few with massive unbalance (us being one) . Target those.

    So who has a glut of expensive forwards and needs veteran defense?

  19. wheatnoil says:

    I’ve always been a big pusher of moving Paajarvi to centre. Good defensive knowledge (used to be a defenseman and all) and great speed. Could end up being a solid 3C in the future.

  20. Rosco says:

    Woodguy:
    I also wonder if MacT’s obvious displeasure (sadness?) at not getting Clarkson was more than just not getting the player.

    If MacT got Clarkson (big, tough LW who can win puck battles, exactly what MacT wants) then all of his trading ammo can be focused on getting the true 1LD.

    Now that he has the 2LW and “true” 1LD positions still not filled, he doesn’t have the ammo to trade for both.

    Also,

    I firmly believe the plan was (is?) to sign Gagner long term, move him to RW, then trade either Eberle or Yak in the WOW trade to get a true 1LD or even 1RD.

    Now that plan is off the rails a bit, and if they don’t cave to Sam (because fucking Tambellini gave him ALL OF THE LEVERAGE with the last contract) then the plan disintegrates even further.

    This is why an Offer Sheet (for a 1 LD) should be part of the plan if it hasn’t been included already. Assuming of course you can fill the other spot (2 LW) by way of LD prospects, etc and with out having to use picks.

  21. Professor Q says:

    Yeti: That entirely depends on what is coming back.

    In which case it would still send a negative message to any potential FA: play well for us and fill a need, and we’ll trade you any way!

  22. oilabroad says:

    If the plan is to sign gagner in order to move him over to the wing, why not simply sign and trade him as a center. Teams are screaming for centers right now, and gagners value would be high after putting up big points last year. MPS is unique in his skill set amongst the kids, you move gagner over the wing and he is exactly what we have too much of; small talented one dimensional wingers. Not only that, but he would be a lesser copy of the ones we have. IMO Gagner should be the centerpiece of any big trade, not MPS…

  23. Professor Q says:

    Woodguy,

    Pronger actually did come cheap…

  24. Beaker says:

    Woodguy:
    Beaker,

    He plays both.

    This isn’t sarcasm but an actual question: Does he really? Or does he play both like Yak plays both?

  25. hags9k says:

    Trading Gagner leaves a ridiculous void at center ice. Trading a RW is the obvious move. I wouldn’t move Yak or Ebs but if the return for Hemsky is going to be similar to the dirty Russian we may have no choice…When you factor in the Bert and Ernie quotient it leaves MacT taking calls on Yakupov. Man that would sting but if the return is a true top pairing D, wouldn’t it improve the club? We are emotionally attached to this kid but his trade may be the key to a balanced roster and god willing, a winning season.

  26. DBO says:

    Also look at the teams that have been quiet but who need a change. Washington has cap issues and has a few pieces that would fit. Wonder what it would take to get Laich? He makes $4 mill. Can play centre or LW, and is big enough. Perfect fit and Washington could use Schultz Sr. Question is what else needs to be added?

  27. Woodguy says:

    Professor Q:
    Woodguy,

    Pronger actually did come cheap…

    That’s true and kuddos for Lowe for being the one there.

    Today is the closest the NHL has come to that situation since.

    Cap coming down and team needing to shed big salary, which is why guys who are not normally available, might be for the right package.

    STL has some pretty good D right now and not a lot of money….

    They have cap room, but the $ to use it all isn’t there…

    How Doug Armstrong hasn’t won GM of the year with one of the best teams with one of the lowest payrolls is beyond the pale.

  28. Woodguy says:

    Beaker: This isn’t sarcasm but an actual question: Does he really? Or does he play both like Yak plays both?

    I’ve read he plays both.

    If you look at the OIlers RW depth chart, I doubt he was slotted to play there…..unless one of Yak or Eberle was on the way out…or they moved Yak back to LW.

  29. Woodguy says:

    Professor Q:
    Woodguy,

    Pronger actually did come cheap…

    Here’s his other two trades after STL-EDM:

    2006-Jul-03 Traded from Edmonton Oilers to Anaheim Ducks for Ladislav Smid, Joffrey Lupul, round 1 pick in the 2007 draft (Nick Ross), round 1 pick in the 2008 draft (Jordan Eberle) and round 2 pick in the 2008 draft (Travis Hamonic)

    2009-Jun-26 Traded from Anaheim Ducks with Ryan Dingle to Philadelphia Flyers for Joffrey Lupul, Luca Sbisa, future considerations, round 1 pick in the 2009 draft (John Moore) and round 1 pick in the 2010 draft (Emerson Etem)

  30. Yeti says:

    Professor Q: In which case it would still send a negative message to any potential FA: play well for us and fill a need, and we’ll trade you any way!

    I’ve no idea how trading Yak for a major player would send any message whatsoever to a FA.

  31. Woodguy says:

    Professor Q: In which case it would still send a negative message to any potential FA: play well for us and fill a need, and we’ll trade you any way!

    So hockey teams should never trade anyone?

    Or hockey teams that trade never attract free agents?

    Or hockey teams that trade never win the cup?

    All of this?

  32. hags9k says:

    Maybe we should take a flier on Malhotra for 4C? Cheap, good leader, potential value contract or else short term mentor for Lander.

  33. sumaclab says:

    With Eakins now the coach MP gets a reset. He starts the year at 3rd line LW with I bet Acton and Jones. The Oilers will use speed on their 3rd line to push the attack. I do not think MacT poached Acton and Hamilton just because he thought they would be AHLer’s this season. Eakins knows these 2 players. Trusts them. Hamilton 30 goals with the Toronto Marlies this year. The guy has size and knows where the net is. Acton. If he plays anything like his dad will be a PKilling machine. He and Jones may be on the 1st unit PK come October. The theme with all of these signings is experience. These guys like Jonesuu all have pro experience. Are 25ish. These guys tend to know what it takes to be a pro player.Belov is what 28? Eakins will have a core of young players in RNH,Hall,Ebs and Yakupov but he’ll be going into next season with a group of seasoned veterans who have been around the block.

    The real question for me is how much term will Gagner be asking for in his new deal. Will it be 7 years? I would not do anything more than 5 at 5.5 per season.

    I would think that the Oilers have discussed Grabbo already with Eakins. I suspect that the pro scouts and Eakins have already decided one way or the other on Grabbo. IMO there is to much risk signing him. Find a better option through a trade.

    The Oilers also need a Goon. Gotta happen.Brown will be an island. Got to get another guy who is willing.Either on defence or up front. Can’t rely on Potter or the Shultz’s to drop the mits. Team toughness? BS. Parros signed in Montreal because they got Gionta,Gallagher and Brier. The Montreal Smurfs needed a pitbull to guard their backs. I don’t want Yak etal going to war against L.A.,San Jose and St Louis without that option in the lineup when needed. Do you?

  34. oilabroad says:

    hags9k,

    how does moving gagner to right wing not have the same effect at center as trading him? this is macts plan not mine

  35. hags9k says:

    oilabroad,

    Both are a bad idea in my opinion. If we are moving him over to RW it must mean there is a deal in the works sending out a RW for a C. I don’t see it. If it’s Hemsky then I doubt he brings back a 2C upgrade on Samwise. If it’s Ebs or Yak then we are nuts not to be getting a D man instead of a C.

    I say just re-sign the guy. He’s our 2C, and people should get used to the idea.

  36. wordbird says:

    sumaclab: I would think that the Oilers have discussed Grabbo already with Eakins. I suspect that the pro scouts and Eakins have already decided one way or the other on Grabbo. IMO there is to much risk signing him. Find a better option through a trade.

    Been thinking the same thing. Sure MacT has picked Eakins brain a bunch already (hence the Whack-O-Marlies). Not sure i agree on the amount of risk though. Grabovski might be moody/petulant/a complete dick, but the guy can play. Honestly, i think if Grabbo was as bad as some are making him out to be, he’d have been beaking off at Carlyle during the season every chance he could get. The fact he blew up on the radio after being bought out seems pretty understandable, given the circumstances. If the money makes sense and he’ll come here. do the deal.

    speaking of Magnus, i’ll bet Eakins can’t wait for a chance to groom him into an extremely useful piece. So hopefully #91 is staying put.

  37. Lowetide says:

    The only way we’ll know if the Oilers like Grabovski is if they sign him or are reported in the race to sign him.

  38. godot10 says:

    There really aren’t many goon teams in the Oilers division (or Conference) There are heavy physical teams with big players who can play. The goons are mostly in the Eastern Conference now.

    Hamilton and Acton are 4th line types at best. The 4th liners are going to have to play hard, because these two guys will be knocking at the door.

    sumaclab:

    The Oilers also need a Goon. Gotta happen.Brown will be an island. Got to get another guy who is willing.Either on defence or up front. Can’t rely on Potter or the Shultz’s to drop the mits. Team toughness? BS. Parros signed in Montreal because they got Gionta,Gallagher and Brier. The Montreal Smurfs needed a pitbull to guard their backs. I don’t want Yak etal going to war against L.A.,San Jose and St Louis without that option in the lineup when needed. Do you?

  39. Rosco says:

    Would Eberle, and a D Prospect not named Klefbom for McDonagh , Kreider and Boyle not work for both teams? Keep Hemsky for the year on a soft min line with Gagner and Kreider.

  40. oilabroad says:

    hags9k,

    Or we could sign a guy like grabo, and trade gagner for a D?? why do we need to simply accept gagner is our second line center? based on the rest of the make up of the top 6, he simply is not the right guy. It makes less sense to me to move him over to the wing and trade a blue chipper. If MacT does not see him as a fit at center, than move him for the right player with the right skill set based on the makeup of the rest of the top 6, why try to fit a round peg into a square hole??

  41. DBO says:

    What worries me is no word from anywhere on Gagner or Grabbo. We are not usually CIA sneaky, so it seems to me that there is just nothing to report. And that scares me. Gagner walking for nothing next year is unacceptable. And him as a RW is not a true option if we want any kind of balance. So unless they plan on running Yak at LW, then he has to play centre or he goes.

  42. Lucinius says:

    DBO,

    The Grabovski silence is likely due to him getting married yesterday. There’s no real word on who is trying to sign him.

  43. Woodguy says:

    Lowetide:
    The only way we’ll know if the Oilers like Grabovski is if they sign him or are reported in the race to sign him.

    This is all we have so far:

    Tracy Lane ‏@TreenasOil Protected account 5 Jul
    Oilers talking to grabovsky as per Garfield
    Expand Reply Favorite

    She had Gordon first on July 5th too.

    I had the day off and was listening to Bob’s show (sorry LT) and had all the usual suspects up on twitter watch and she had it first with these two:

    Tracy Lane ‏@TreenasOil Protected account 5 Jul
    Oilers sign Gordon as per Garfield
    Expand Reply Favorite

    Tracy Lane ‏@TreenasOil Protected account 5 Jul
    Oilers close to signing Boyd Gordon as per Garfield
    Collapse Reply Favorite

  44. 99thoilerfan says:

    Quick Poll Question:

    If you had a choice who would we keep, Eberle or Gagner? ( both is not an answer )

    I will start : Eberle

  45. DBO says:

    I may not be as high on Grabbo as some of you. he seems like Horcoff part 2 to me. One huge offensive season leading into free agency. he is solid two ways, but not overly physical. And he will get a 5 or 6 year deal from someone, so he will be declining at the same time Horcoff did. If we got him on a good deal, then great. But not at $5 mill, and not for 5 + years.

    I would target Laich or Dubinsky for our #2 centre. Both have solid skill, both play physical, and both are signed for under $5 mill. Both are on teams who may need to shed salary, so picks or prospects or a combo may work in a deal. You can then move Gagner for that dman, or player with size.

  46. hags9k says:

    oilabroad,

    First I don’t think Gagner brings back near the same quality of defender in trade compared to one of the blue chippers. Secondly, I don’t see Grabo coming here when you marry MacT’s comments stressing character, to the Grabo comments leaving T.O. And lastly I just think they might feel that Gags IS in fact a fit for the top 6. He’s the only other C. He’s our own draft pick and I think we will commit to him. Seems to me he’s already said this much and they are just doing a push and pull on the dollars.

  47. godot10 says:

    The Oilers have the #2 and #3 defenders in the pipeline. (Petry, JSchultz, Klefbom, Marincin, Nurse, Gernat). A little patience is in order.

    I am opposed to whale hunting for a really big name D. Not value for money.

    I am fine with offer sheeting at the #1+#3 compensation level for McDonagh or Alzner types.

    Eberle and Yakupov over Gagner. Goal scorers are far more difficult to find and acquire. Gagner’s skill set is far more easily replaceable. This is not a difficult choice.

    I’m fine with up to 5 x $5 million for Gagner. He is 24. The Oilers aren’t likely to have a replacement for 2 or 3 years anyway. and Gagner with 2 or 3 years left will be a tradeable contract.

  48. theres oil in virginia says:

    Excellent article and comments. Very refreshing.

  49. DBO says:

    Stauffer keeps mentioning St. Louis on twitter. Always a tell for the org.

    So who would we want? Perrn has been mentioned, Oshie would be nice but he is not a fit based on position. And they need to shed salary, not add. So, who then?

    I would like to see Steen. He has one more year left at $3.365 mill. He is not tall (5’11) but he is 212 lbs (so not small). He has 30 goal potential, can play LW or centre and is 29 (right in the age wheelhouse). And he plays PK and PP. I would target him for sure. Would probably only take a prospect and pick, since St. Louis has less then $8 mill in cap space and Stewart and Pietrangelo to sign.

  50. Big Dan says:

    So Belov’s a left defense too? That glut on the left side further enforces this group’s expectation that Nick Schultz will be dealt. Since Ottawa traded away Gonchar, perhaps they’d be interested in picking up Schultz as part of the Hemsky deal – if that deal bears fruit.

    I know they’d prefer Smid – they’ve been salivating over him for years – but they’d have to settle.

  51. sumaclab says:

    Eberle or Gagner? Eberle because his upside is more than Gagner’s. I think Gagner is a 50-65 point guy. While I think Ebs is a 75-85 point guy in the very near future. Like this year.I see the development of the first line taking a huge step forward this year. A healthy Hall,RNH nd Ebs. No nagging shoulders and hands. Training camp together with a new coach and system that utilizes their speed and talent. This team won’t have the same headaches as last years squad. Horcoff and Hemsky will be gone. This team will belong to Hall and Ebbs,Rnh and Gagner. It will their team. hall will take this team on his back and carry them to the next level. The defence is better already. The goaltending is solid.There will be a veteran 3rd and 4th line that will compete. Those 2 lines will be made up of current NHLers and Ahlers looking to prove themselves for the first time. The coach won’t have players like Belanger and whitney to contend with in the locker room.No Bulin DUI / jail stuff. Less drama off the ice and hopefully more on the ice. No more ST and his dithering. More of the MacT Bold.Sounds like a coffee flavor? My only concern is the opening theme music.Should be something voted on by the players. The Cotton eyed joe has to go and rest of the 80s and 90s crap. Get a DJ in who’s record collection wasn’t based on 45rpm’s. Get the crowds cranked before and during the games.
    The Oilers should be using the Epo center a lot more during and after games. Host some after parties or for games like when the Flames come to town host a fan event at the Expo center for those who can’t get tickets inside Rexall. Oilers need to do more promotion on game day at places like O2s and The Pint and some of the other place along Jasper Ave. Send a promotions team downtown to encourage fans watching the games. If were promotions manager I would Rock the Avenue on Whyte with an opening night concert with Big screens in the Park for fans to watch the game. BBQ’s and music. The Oilers need to make game night more of an event. For everybody. Not just the seat holders.

  52. striatic says:

    can we please just nix the idea of trading Eberle or Yakupov for D right now?

    we aren’t winning the cup next year, ok? you don’t trade away the future of the franchise for D when your organization has a wealth of defensive prospects and a shot at acquiring a #1 D in next year’s UFA class.

  53. Rondo says:

    DBO,

    Funny I would much rather have T.J. Oshie , Gagner would move to wing.

  54. Acumen says:

    hags9k:
    Maybe we should take a flier on Malhotra for 4C?Cheap, good leader, potential value contract or else short term mentor for Lander.

    Love this idea. Get him signed to a cheap ‘show me’ contract, maybe with a team option for a second year, and he is either damaged goods but a good placeholder for Lander or an ace 4th liner that kills penalties and wins faceoffs (also the lefty to Gordon’s right).

    Moderate (but mitigated) risk, high reward.

  55. Rondo says:

    Acumen,

    Malhotra is not playing for a good reason. I know he would like to play , but his eye is bad, also insurance issues.

    Talk to any Doctor familiar with his eye injury. No way should he be playing.

  56. VOR says:

    I’d would just like to point out that there is a team out there in horrible cap hell that isn’t being talked about much. That would be the Detroit Red Wings. It isn’t that they can’t field a full team. It is the quality of the guys they still have unsigned and how little room they have to work with in protecting their great young RFAs. Cleary, Brunner, White as UFAs and Nyquist, Andersson (who was spectacular in the playoffs as the 3C/4C), and Smith. This when Detroit has $2.3 million in cap space.

    Holland has used one compliance buyout all ready. The likely buyout targets of Samuelsson and Bertuzzi are non starters as 35+, who as I understand it aren’t eligible. Helm is injured and if healthy they would desperately want to keep him. Quincey would seem obvious but you would still need a D man to replace him. That leaves one of Tootoo or Eaves with Tootoo being the most likely.

    The Oilers can actually offer any # of options to Detroit. My personal favorite is Nick Schultz minus half his salary, Pitlick, and a 2nd for Quincey, Eaves, Tootoo, Jarnkrok and Jurco. Detroit gets $4.6 million more cap room and we get two great young players and very little long term risk – Eaves and Quincey are free agents next year and Tootoo the year after. All of Eaves, Quincey, and Tootoo are real NHL players just not stars of any kind. Jarnkrok is likely to be a long time NHL star and Jurco is a pure dark horse.

  57. Kris11 says:

    Wow, if Grobovski gets married and signs with the Oilers on the same weekend that would be really tragic.

    In one weekend, he’ll have seen the end of his sex life and his career.

  58. fifthcartel says:

    DBO,

    Doubt Sobotka is available, but with the addition of Roy and LaPierre maybe we can add him to our center depth.

  59. Kris11 says:

    Also, wouldn’t it be funny if their first married fight was that Grabovski wanted to play with the kids in Edmonton, but she thought Edmonton was too cold.

  60. hags9k says:

    Rondo,

    I will admit to being no eye doctor, but his comments are that his vision is improving and he can play. It is definitely a risk, but so is running Lander out there to start the year. I don’t think the dollars would need to be very high to get him. He could be that moneyball player getting shunned by a perceived flaw. What if he is ok? Couldn’t hurt to bring him to camp.

  61. Kris11 says:

    Malhotra needs one of those Borg eye-cover things.

  62. striatic says:

    for what reason should Gagner not get the Filppula contract?

  63. Professor Q says:

    striatic:
    can we please just nix the idea of trading Eberle or Yakupov for D right now?

    we aren’t winning the cup next year, ok? you don’t trade away the future of the franchise for D when your organization has a wealth of defensive prospects and a shot at acquiring a #1 D in next year’s UFA class.

    Precisely what I meant. I was in no way meaning that no team should ever trade anyone, just that it would be way too early for Edmonton to trade these high skilled guys. At least, in my tragically hopeful mind that is.

  64. Acumen says:

    Rondo:
    Acumen,

    Malhotrais not playing for a good reason. I know he would like to play , but his eye is bad, also insurance issues.

    Talk to any Doctor familiar with hiseye injury.Noway should he be playing.

    I’ll take your word on that, didn’t know it was that serious. I just knew he had a bad eye injury.

    There’s a few other guys I still like on the scrap heap. Dave Steckel would be a nice guy to crash and bang with the big Finn and Smytty on the 4th line, ditto for Jeff Halpern if he still has a pulse. There’s still options. Not great options, but it’s the 4th line.

  65. Henry says:

    St Louis has $20M on defense before Pietrelangelo is signed. They need to sign their top scorer too. JayBo has an NTC, but I think they have to work on getting him before he plants roots in StLouis. StL gave up a 1st for him, but may have to take less to fix their cap problem.

  66. Henry says:

    My recollection of the original kid line had Nillson on RW, Gagner lining up on LW and Cogliano mainly taking (and losing) the draws. Is this correct?

    Could Gagner effectively slot to LW with some time at C if they go after Grabovski? This sort of versatility would be much like Chicago seems to use Sharp.

  67. Acumen says:

    Henry,

    I’m pretty sure it was Nilsson was on the left, Gagner on the right.

  68. Henry says:

    Acumen:
    Henry,

    I’m pretty sure it was Nilsson was on the left, Gagner on the right

    Based on their handedness you would think so, but that’s not the way I remember them playing. Could be wrong.
    .

  69. JohnnyRocket says:

    LT,

    Love Miller’s Crossing. On of my all time favorites. Crisp dialogue, great plot, excellent performances, memorable characters. I try and watch it once a year.

    I think the bold move is coming. I was thinking that they might have loaded up on picks with the thought that they could use next year picks for trade bait/offer sheets. The time for both couldn’t be better. Particularly for offer sheets. Place the boots to the Rangers, Detroit, or Philly.

    Then sign the Nuge’s extension before the end of the week.

  70. Wes Mantooth-11 says:

    Henry,

    Jay-Bo doesn’t have a NTC he waived it to be moved from Calgary to St.Louis.

    Jay-Bo can be moved at anytime.

  71. Lowetide says:

    JohnnyRocket:
    LT,

    Love Miller’s Crossing. On of my all time favorites. Crisp dialogue, great plot, excellent performances, memorable characters. I try and watch it once a year.

    I think the bold move is coming. I was thinking that they might have loaded up on picks with the thought that they could use next year picks for trade bait/offer sheets. The time for both couldn’t be better. Particularly for offer sheets. Place the boots to the Rangers, Detroit, or Philly.

    Then sign the Nuge’s extension before the end of the week.

    One of my favorites too. I love the lead character, root for him the entire time and did the first time I saw it. One of the best heroes in movie history imo, because, well, he isn’t. :-)

  72. Captain Happy says:

    Henry:
    St Louis has $20M on defense before Pietrelangelo is signed.They need to sign their top scorer too.JayBo has an NTC, but I think they have to work on getting him before he plants roots in StLouis.StL gave up a 1st for him, but may have to take less to fix their cap problem.

    Andy Strickland ‏@andystrickland 39m

    Doug Armstrong tells me there will be no issue fitting Pietrangelo and Stewart under the cap with roster as it currently sits #stlblues

  73. Captain Happy says:

    @ LT

    Andy Strickland would be a great guest on your show next week.

  74. Captain Happy says:

    Bob Stauffer ‏@Bob_Stauffer 1h

    St. Louis now have 14 NHL forwards and still need to sign Chris Stewart who gives the team “balls” as per a source close to the team…

  75. Henry says:

    Wes Mantooth-11:
    Henry,

    Jay-Bo doesn’t have a NTC he waived it to be moved from Calgary to St.Louis.

    Jay-Bo can be moved at anytime.

    If that’s the case, JayBo can really solve some problems with minutes. StL just signed Roy to put them in a pickle waiting for someone to put together an offer sheet or two. If I’m them I would unload salary now and sign Piet and Stewart fast.

  76. Henry says:

    Captain Happy:
    Bob Stauffer ‏@Bob_Stauffer 1h

    St. Louis now have 14 NHL forwards and still need to sign Chris Stewart who gives the team “balls” as per a source close to the team…

    Is that source Garfield? as per

  77. Woodguy says:

    VOR:
    I’d would just like to point out that there is a team out there in horrible cap hell that isn’t being talked about much. That would be the Detroit Red Wings. It isn’t that they can’t field a full team. It is the quality of the guys they still have unsigned and how little room they have to work with in protecting their great young RFAs. Cleary, Brunner, White as UFAs and Nyquist, Andersson (who was spectacular in the playoffs as the 3C/4C), and Smith. This when Detroit has $2.3 million in cap space.

    Holland has used one compliance buyout all ready. The likely buyout targets of Samuelsson and Bertuzzi are non starters as 35+, who as I understand it aren’t eligible. Helm is injured and if healthy they would desperately want to keep him. Quincey would seem obvious but you would still need a D man to replace him. That leaves one of Tootoo or Eaves with Tootoo being the most likely.

    The Oilers can actually offer any # of options to Detroit. My personal favorite is Nick Schultz minus half his salary, Pitlick, and a 2nd for Quincey, Eaves, Tootoo, Jarnkrok and Jurco. Detroit gets $4.6 million more cap room and we get two great young players and very little long term risk – Eaves and Quincey are free agents next year and Tootoo the year after. All of Eaves, Quincey, and Tootoo are real NHL players just not stars of any kind. Jarnkrok is likely to be a long time NHL star and Jurco is a pure dark horse.

    PDO was kicking around the idea of offer-sheeting Brendan Smith

    I also think Joakim Andersson will be a very good C. He might be able to be pried loose with the Weiss signing.

  78. Captain Happy says:

    Henry: Is that source Garfield?as per

    If you’re suggesting Stauffer is Garfield, I think you’re getting pretty warm.

  79. VOR says:

    Captain Happy,

    Do you really think that Doug Armstrong would say, “I am so screwed. I have $7,850,000 to sign two guys who want $10,000,000 between them?” Not unless he was an idiot. It would be way worse than saying Hemsky and Horcoff are on their way out. Way worse.

    No you say you’ve got it all under control and then you quietly shop Perron or Bouwmeester.

    I am not saying he doesn’t have it under control just saying Armstrong would say them same thing either way.

  80. VOR says:

    Woodguy,

    I did consider asking for both Andersson and Jarnkrok and solving our center problem for the foreseeable future. If Helm was healthy Holland would do that deal. The Red Wings really don’t want to lose Smith and Nyquist and they need cap space desperately. I’ve heard that Helm is giving his back a test at Detroit’s prospect camp and he is cautiously optimistic. With Weiss and Helm both on the active roster Andersson might well be available.

  81. Halfwise says:

    LT you mentioned the lack of a Pisani, but I would suggest that is Paajarvi’s destiny, if he is here to fulfill it and if he gets some coaching in that direction. Versatile, big enough, responsible, affordable. All this talk of trading him just furrows my brow.

    On D the depth chart varies widely based on what we don’t know about Belov, and to a lesser extent Klefbom.

    Need Torres-type lizard brain in a Penner frame, on 2LW.

    Gagner has all the leverage (thanks, Tambo!) and there is no reason for him to rush to sign anything. Nod, smile, frown, stay silent and watch the dollars go up week by week.

  82. Captain Happy says:

    VOR:
    Captain Happy,

    Do you really think that Doug Armstrong would say, “I am so screwed. I have $7,850,000 to sign two guys who want $10,000,000 between them?”Not unless he was an idiot. It would be way worse than saying Hemsky and Horcoff are on their way out. Way worse.

    No you say you’ve got it all under control and then you quietly shop Perron or Bouwmeester.

    I am not saying he doesn’t have it under control just saying Armstrong would say them same thing either way.

    If you look closely at STL’s cap payroll, they really have no concerns at all.

    They have SEVEN NHL quality centres on their roster…Backes, Berglund, Roy, Oshie, Sobotka, Lapierre and Aucoin. Obviously Aucoin will be sent down but that still leaves 6 so STL will likely be doing something else there.

    Earlier there were rumours they were shopping Berglund ($3.25M) and would use that money to pay Stewart, give or take.

    Even with 24 players on the payroll, they still have almost $8M in cap space to sign Pietrangelo.

    The wonder of it all is how STL was able to amass that sheer amount of NHL talent while being just barely over the floor for the past several seasons.

    Armstrong should win GM of the Year hands down.

  83. G Money says:

    VOR: I am not saying he doesn’t have it under control just saying Armstrong would say them same thing either way.

    I think it’s fair to say that, unless he already has deals in place, he doesn’t yet have it under control.

    On the surface, St Louis look OK because they’ve got a full roster of 24 players and 7.85M left under the cap.

    In reality, those 24 don’t include Stewart or Pieterangelo, and 7.85M in room is probably overstating available room as I don’t think St Louis is a ‘spend to the cap’ type of team.

    If their budget is say 5M under the cap, that leaves them 2.85M to sign two guys who will take about, as you say, 10M in total.

    A bit of simple math means:
    - 3 players must leave St Louis’ roster to get to 23 (24 + Stewart + Pieterangelo – 3 = 23 man roster)
    - Those 3 players must take 7M in salary with them.

  84. jfry says:

    Mact signs another tweener dman? His version of potter from the looks of it. Maybe we only dress three forward lines and 9 d every game?

  85. G Money says:

    In case anyone’s wondering why St Louis would NOT spend to the cap, I would point them at the Forbes list from last November which ranked St Louis 30th out of 30 teams for revenue (revenue in 2011 being a mere $89 million, with an operating loss of -$10M).

  86. Madtown Oil says:

    I realize this doesn’t solve the size issue, but how about signing Cleary for LW. Keep Hemsky and run a 3rd line of Cleary, Gordon, Hemsky, and then run Smyth, TBD, Jones 4th line. That is a significant improvement on the bottom 6….one of the biggest problems in 2013.

  87. Henry says:

    G Money:
    In case anyone’s wondering why St Louis would NOT spend to the cap, I would point them at the Forbes list from last November which ranked St Louis 30th out of 30 teams for revenue (revenue in 2011 being a mere $89 million, with an operating loss of -$10M).

    G Money,

    That is surprising. St Louis is a great sports town.

    The Blues are very well run on the hockey side, looks like the business side missed somehow. It is not a big city anymore though.

  88. Racki says:

    jfry:
    Mact signs another tweener dman? His version of potter from the looks of it. Maybe we only dress three forward lines and 9 d every game?

    I’m not sure if you are aware, but the Oilers have a farm team.. it’s pretty much without doubt that the signing was for OKC, with the opportunity for him to play at NHL level in case of injuries or if he really impresses. I doubt this was a signing for the Oilers, specifically.

  89. G Money says:

    Detroit do have some cap troubles, since they have to get Nyquist, Andersson, and Smith under contract for $2.3M. But (correct me if I’m wrong), none of those guys are such marquee players like a Pieterangelo that their RFA contracts will be overly massive.

    I think Detroit can solve the problem by sending a couple of mid-line ($2-$3M) out the door for cheap.

    Not sure if I would call that cap hell though, maybe more like cap severe discomfort.

  90. Lowetide says:

    Halfwise:
    LT you mentioned the lack of a Pisani, but I would suggest that is Paajarvi’s destiny, if he is here to fulfill it and if he gets some coaching in that direction. Versatile, big enough, responsible, affordable. All this talk of trading him just furrows my brow.

    On D the depth chart varies widely based on what we don’t know about Belov, and to a lesser extent Klefbom.

    Need Torres-type lizard brain in a Penner frame, on 2LW.

    Gagner has all the leverage (thanks, Tambo!) and there is no reason for him to rush to sign anything. Nod, smile, frown, stay silent and watch the dollars go up week by week.

    True, and I agree. Paajarvi is going to be a solid 2-way forward one day very soon. His shot differential was a mess this past season but he was part of that 2line Bermuda triangle.

  91. VanOil says:

    Henry: G Money,

    That is surprising.St Louis is a great sports town.

    The Blues are very well run on the hockey side, looks like the business side missed somehow.It is not a big city anymore though.

    My recent impression of St Louis was that they would steal the tires of your car at the lights. Mrs Pronger should thank the Oilers for prying her pampered arse out of there. Hopefully the City can recover it reminds me of 80s Liverpool boarded up buildings every where.

  92. Captain Happy says:

    G Money:
    In case anyone’s wondering why St Louis would NOT spend to the cap, I would point them at the Forbes list from last November which ranked St Louis 30th out of 30 teams for revenue (revenue in 2011 being a mere $89 million, with an operating loss of -$10M).

    Actually, the value of the franchise was 30th while their revenue was $89M.

    That’s ahead of:

    NYI – $66M

    PHX – $83M

    CLB – $85M

    CAR – $85M

    FLA – $87M

    TBL – $88M

    NSH – $88M

    If the Forbes list is accurate (who the hell knows) , STL had an operating loss of $10M.

    A long playoff run can wipe that out in a hurry and it should be noted than STL has a new ownership group with deeper pockets.

    http://blues.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=631301

  93. fifthcartel says:

    Despite what Armstrong says, unless Pietrangeo or Stewart signs at a huge discount, they’re going to have to move some salary out.

  94. VanOil says:

    I would not wail hunt for a Dman. One of our unbelievable group of prospects will surely turn into a 1LD within a few years. Just in time for Nuge’s beard years.

    A Center is the first priority and a 2LW would be nice. Signing Gagner and MPS is an easy way to make this team better.

  95. G Money says:

    Henry,

    I think it would be fair to say that St Louis is a superbly run hockey organization in a questionable hockey market.

    However you slice it, Missouri is really a southern state despite its midwesternish location, and from a grassroots hockey perspective, it is not markedly different from Florida, Georgia, or Arizona. It’s also a city of <3M people, which for a southern US hockey market is tiny.

    They do claim a high attendance, but I think they only achieve that by heavily discounting tickets, hence the low revenues.

  96. Captain Happy says:

    James Mirtle James Mirtle ‏@mirtle 1m

    New Jersey trades Henrik Tallinder to the Sabres for Riley Boychuk.
    Expand

  97. theres oil in virginia says:

    Racki: I’m not sure if you are aware, but the Oilers have a farm team.. it’s pretty much without doubt that the signing was for OKC, with the opportunity for him to play at NHL level in case of injuries or if he really impresses. I doubt this was a signing for the Oilers, specifically.

    I think also that re-entry waivers was eliminated in the new CBA. If so, then it sure is easier to bring in guys that might come on strong at the AHL level and be safe to call up if they did so.

  98. Captain Happy says:

    fifthcartel:
    Despite what Armstrong says, unless Pietrangeo or Stewart signs at a huge discount, they’re going to have to move some salary out.

    That’s why they’re shopping Perron and, perhaps, Berglund.

  99. G Money says:

    Captain Happy: NYI – $66M
    PHX – $83M
    CLB – $85M
    CAR – $85M
    FLA – $87M
    TBL – $88M
    NSH – $88M

    I stand corrected on the revenue front.

    That puts them 23rd out of 30 teams for revenue, and within a few millions of dollars a year ahead of such stellar markets as the Florida and Arizona teams … it changes the details but not the point.

  100. dessert1111 says:

    MacT isn’t done yet…will at least add a LW and a C. I’d like a 3RW and top pairing D as well, but I am not 100% sure those moves can happen.

    Trading chips: 1 or 2 LH defensemen; Hemsky; draft picks; prospects

    I expect two holes left. If there is 1 or 0, I will be impressed with MacT. If there are no more moves I will be very disappointed, but I can’t imagine for one minute that MacT looks at the LW and C depth chart and thinks this team is competitive.

  101. G Money says:

    I am digging through the cap/roster situations of a few teams as I wait for my kids to get ready to go to the park …

    Now that the free agent market is drying up, the next likely avenue to fill some of the remaining roster gaps without creating new roster gaps is by taking salary from cap-trouble teams.

    Another team on the radar is the LA Kings – 4 players still to sign, and $5.2M to do it. That list of 4 includes RFAs Kyle Clifford, Jake Muzzin, Trevor Lewis, and Jordan Nolan.

    It’s possible they may be able to fit all those guys under the cap, but its equally likely they may need to move someone out.

  102. Магия¹º says:

    From the “sometimes it’s better for a team not to offer until both sides are ready to close” file:

    “The Senators are believed to have offered a one-year contract in the $4 million zone.
    Oh, man. You can totally see how things fell apart right then and there.”

    http://www.cbc.ca/sports/hockey/nhl/story/2013/07/07/sp-nhl-friedman-daniel-alfredsson-ottawa-senators-negotiations.html

    When the Sens were ready to deal all they got was radio silence.

  103. Captain Happy says:

    G Money: I stand corrected on the revenue front.

    That puts them 23rd out of 30 teams for revenue, and within a few millions of dollars a year ahead of such stellar markets as the Florida and Arizona teams … it changes the details but not the point.

    No argument from me.

    But, since neither of us is privy to the budget decisions of the STL ownership and management, we don’t know if they have an internal budget or will spend to the cap.

    Last season’s payroll was $52M and they’re currently sitting at $56M with Pietrangelo and Stewart yet to sign but also with a 24 man roster before those signings.

    Obviously, once those signings are done, they will have to shed a minimum of 3 and possibly 4 players to get down to a roster of 22 or 23.

    With the signings of Roy and Lapierre it appears they will move a centre or two or move Oshie or Berglund to wing.

    In any event, I think they’re a great trade target for the Oilers since they likely aren’t going to want to add salary so picks and prospects would likely get the job done.

  104. Young Oil says:

    I like Gagner, but I think it has much more value to the team to sign Grabovski, then try to trade Gagner+N.Schultz +pick/prospect for a top pairing RD.

    On a side note, do you think it’s possible that the Rangers have any interest in Hemsky? Their depth at right wing is mediocre at best, as they have Dorsett penciled in as their #2 RW. I like the idea of getting Kreider and Boyle in return. Maybe Hemsky ($2M retained)+Musil+later pick for Kreider and Boyle could work? That adds instant size to our bottom 6.

    Also, like almost every year, there are rumors that Jagr could be coming to Edmonton. He would look great on our second line for a year!

    RNH-Hall Eberle
    Jagr-Grabovski-Yakupov
    Paajarvi-Gordon-Kreider
    Joensuu-Boyle-Jones
    Smyth-Lander-Brown

    Smid-#1RD
    Belov-Petry
    Ference-J.Schultz
    Potter/Larsen/Klefbom

    Dubnyk
    Labarbera

    I know a couple players are out of their preferred position, but I really like the look of that lineup.

    I know it’s never going to happen, but one can dream.

  105. Wes Mantooth-11 says:

    Captain Happy: That’s why they’re shopping Perron and, perhaps, Berglund.

    Correct me if I’m wrong, but Schwartz is also a centre who play’s LW very effectively, could be another reason to move out Perron, ya.?

  106. Oildrum says:

    Finally someone brought up the idea of getting Penner back. There’s your big LWer that can protect Gagner and Yak plus he can chip in with 20 goals (especially on that line) I would say 2yr/6mil. Then trade Hemmer and a prospect and/or 1st round in 2014 for the next center. I think our D, with what we have on the roster and possibly from the farm (Klefbom, etc), will be OK.

  107. Captain Happy says:

    Wes Mantooth-11: Correct me if I’m wrong, but Schwartz is also a centre who play’sLW very effectively, could be another reason to move out Perron, ya.?

    Yes…a bit of changing of the guard there with Schwartz, Tarasenko and Rattie all needing ice time.

  108. Магия¹º says:

    Oildrum: Finally someone brought up the idea of getting Penner back

    Make it Penner, Gilbert, and Omark. Now that’s bold.

  109. "Steve Smith" says:

    Oildrum:
    Finally someone brought up the idea of getting Penner back.

    You must be new here.

  110. G Money says:

    Captain Happy: But, since neither of us is privy to the budget decisions of the STL ownership and management, we don’t know if they have an internal budget or will spend to the cap.
    Last season’s payroll was $52M and they’re currently sitting at $56M with Pietrangelo and Stewart yet to sign but also with a 24 man roster before those signings.
    Obviously, once those signings are done, they will have to shed a minimum of 3 and possibly 4 players to get down to a roster of 22 or 23.
    With the signings of Roy and Lapierre it appears they will move a centre or two or move Oshie or Berglund to wing.
    In any event, I think they’re a great trade target for the Oilers since they likely aren’t going to want to add salary so picks and prospects would likely get the job done.

    So you’re saying no-one has a crystal ball about these things??? Will try to remember that next time someone tries to “book” a prediction!

    And that said, while we cannot predict, we can simply make reasonable assumptions and try to ascertain what might happen. My numbers were based on a cap spend for Stl of $59M – an increase of $7M from last year, in a year when the cap went down. Reasonable?

    Other than that, we are in violent agreement.

  111. prairieschooner says:

    Lets stop talking about trading guys like Ebs and Yak, we have suffered for years to acquire them.
    Management has had their job done for the last few years with 1 st round picks
    We have our top shelf youngsters and they are improving with age
    Management are responsible for complimenting our stars.
    We have a good looking pipeline of D men coming, we just need to buy some time till they are ready
    ( This does not preclude us from having a run in the play offs as part of the development process)
    Free agency is where we can effectively ramp up the “supporting cast”
    that’s why we re signed Ryan Jones (cough)
    If teams are in cap hell that is their problem we do not have to do them any favours in fact I am hoping MacT is talking with all of those teams and lets them know he is talking with a bunch of teams to create some urgency. If nothing gets done Coach Eakins will have to do a hell of a job to get us into the playoffs.

  112. jb says:

    What do we expect from our 3rd line? Gordons’ known to drown his line mates offensively.. Belanger proportions here..

    Steckel as a 3/4 line c?

  113. VOR says:

    G Money,

    Brendan Smith is a future NHL 2D that Detroit is quietly nurturing. Nyquist has proven he can tear up the AHL and is in the Datysuk mode (a forecheck savant), Andersson would have escaped all notice if he hadn’t been superb in the playoffs, large kid, very fast, massively outplays in the playoffs, and dominates the faceoff circle when it matters. All three kids were impressive in Detroit’s Stanley Cup playoff success. Then there are Cleary, Brunner, and White who are UFAs and who were important players all year for Detroit. Lets be really kind and say that you can sign them all for $10,000,000 so that leaves Holland $7,700,000 short.

    I am assuming Holland doesn’t just want to win now but in the future as well. You don’t do that by letting good players evaporate. I would think a GM watching three future stars leave town for absolutely no return would be heart sick and that is what is going to happen here if Holland doesn’t figure a way out.

    Detroit’s trade options are smaller than you might think. Samuelsson and Bertuzzi have no trade contracts and want to be in Detroit. Helm is hurt and untradeable. Abdelkader and Miller are cheap heart and soul guys that will do whatever it takes to win and will be vital in any cup run. That leaves you only Quincey, Tootoo and Eaves to trade. They are over paid spare parts with very little trade value so to get them gone you are going to have to offer something extra, some vig to the loan shark. Holland could compliance Quincey but would then have to find another cheap alternative that can play equally well. Not to mention he may need that compliance buy out next year.

    I’d say Holland is in hell. Can you imagine watching a kid you spotted and developed becoming a star on another team and you had to let him go for nothing because you gave some absurd money to Daniel Alfredsson? It is like he forgot how to add suddenly. He isn’t the only NHL GM with this increasingly common disease.

  114. Oildrum says:

    Finally someone is talking about Penner.

    1. Sign Penner. (2yr/6mil) Fills the need of big LWer to play with Gagner and Yak. Could probably chip in with 15-20 goals.

    2. Trade Hemmer and a prospect and/or 1st round 2014 for the center we need. (I know he’s old but what about Thornton in SJ. Maybe Pavelski. They need to shed cap space. Thornton played off his ass in this years playoffs)

    3. Our “D”, with what we have on the starting roster and in the A, should be OK

  115. Lowetide says:

    jb:
    What do we expect from our 3rd line? Gordons’ known to drown his line mates offensively.. Belanger proportions here..

    Steckel as a 3/4 line c?

    Gordon doesn’t play with the top drawer guys either. He’s a guy who can stifle the other team’s best offensive options. Expecting him to score a lot of EV points will leave fans disappointed. Preventing goals has value, and Gordon has a fine resume.

  116. "Steve Smith" says:

    Oildrum:
    Finally someone is talking about Penner.

    For the first time in the thread, no less!

  117. Магия¹º says:

    jb: Belanger proportions here

    Lowetide: He’s a guy who can stifle the other team’s best offensive options

    You’re only the new triangle guy if you can stifle the offense of your linemates.

  118. Магия¹º says:

    “Steve Smith”: For the first time in the thread, no less!

    Wonder if Danny can create a sticky thread for IHOP aquisitions.

  119. striatic says:

    i would like to sign Vinny Prospal to a one year, 2.5 to 3 million dollar deal.

    Hall, RNH, Eberle – 1st Toughs
    PRV, Gagner, Yakupov – Softs
    Prospal, Gordon, Hemsky – 2nd Toughs
    Smyth, Lander, Jones
    Joensuu, Brown

    Vinny has decent possession stats, +3.0 CorsiRel and had 30P in 48GP last season. He’s old, but that’s why you sign him to one year as a patch. He comes here for the money, and to play with countryman Hemsky.

    Then you flip him and Hemsky for picks or prospects at the deadline.

  120. TheOtherJohn says:

    jb:
    What do we expect from our 3rd line? Gordons’ known to drown his line mates offensively.. Belanger proportions here..

    Steckel as a 3/4 line c?

    from @Mc79hockey

    PHX had 52% of the shot attempts when Gordon was on the ice despite him starting in o-zone just 32.6% of the tie.

    P.S. pretty good #’s

  121. Lowetide says:

    “Steve Smith”: For the first time in the thread, no less!

    lol. I was going to post what you posted last time, but then saw you’d done it. Now I just don’t know. Well maybe people are coming here unaware of the spell Penner casts on us here.

    Anyway, I think IHOP is still open in the west end just in case it happens.

  122. Woodguy says:

    Captain Happy,

    STL 2003-2010 Drafted player who played at least 5 games in the NHL:

    2010
    2010 Jaden Schwartz 52
    2010 Vladimir Tarasenko 38

    2009
    2009 David Rundblad 38

    2008 Entry
    2008 Entry Alex Pietrangelo 224
    2008 Entry Phil McRae 15
    2008 Entry Jake Allen 15

    2007 Entry

    2007 Lars Eller 209
    2007 Ian Cole 67
    2007 David Perron 340
    2007 Aaron Palushaj 66
    2007 Cade Fairchild 5
    2007 Anthony Peluso 5
         
    2006 Entry

    2006 Erik Johnson 329
    2006 Patrik Berglund 358
    2006 Tomas Kana 6

    2005 Entry

    2005 T.J. Oshie 292
    2005 Ben Bishop 45
    2005 Ryan Reaves 131
    2005 Nick Drazenovic 11

    2004 Entry

    2004 Marek Schwarz 6
    2004 Carl Soderberg 6
    2004 Nikita Nikitin 140
    2004 Roman Polak 352
         
    2003 Entry

    2003 Shawn Belle 20
    2003 David Backes 494
    2003 Alexandre Bolduc 62
    2003 Lee Stempniak 564

    That’s a ton of players to have hit the NHL.

    They have Ty Rattie coming too, among others. (like 6’2 LW Dmitri Jaskinm, who put up 99pts in 51 games in Q last year as a 20 year old.)

    They don’t rush their prospects to the NHL either.

    In terms of drafting a developing, I think STL is the model franchise.

  123. Captain Happy says:

    Woodguy,

    Wow.

    I had the impression they were doing well but that is spectacular.

    The conventional wisdom is that getting two good players out of every draft is excellent work but they’re averaging four.

  124. Woodguy says:

    Woodguy,

    They have Ty Rattie coming too

    KIlls me that the OIlers drafted Musil one pick before Rattie.

  125. Lois Lowe says:

    Lowetide:

    Anyway, I think IHOP is still open in the west end just in case it happens.

    I always figured he was more of a De Dutch guy.

  126. striatic says:

    we need to remember that while the team wants to “win now”, that picks and prospects are still vitally important to the team, especially next year’s picks who on a 4 year development track will be making an impact in year 4 of the Hall contract.

  127. spoiler says:

    The trick would be to turn Hemsky into a 1st rounder.

    Phoenix has no roster players to trade for scoring. Would they be willing to trade next year’s first for instant scoring help?

    Would Hemsky and Rajala or a 3rd bring a 1st back? If we give some salary help?

    With two firsts, options open up. The cap-strapped teams don’t want salary coming back and 1st rounders should be very attractive to them.

    For example, would Schultz, Prospect D not Klef or Nurse, PHO 2014 1st and 2015 2nd get you McDonagh? Brent Burns? Could get Coburn without the prospect or the 2nd, is my guess.

    Would the EDM 2014 1st and Marincin/2nd get you Chris Stewart? Add Jones if they need an NHL body coming back.

    My point is, if we can parlay Hemsky into a 1st rounder rather than a player, we should have more options for fleecing a cap-strung team.

    Also, would you pitch the NYR on flipping Stepan for Gagner and Marincin/2nd, since Gagner should cost less, and would help them out with their cap troubles? Stepan was at nearly a PPG this chopped season, and is better in his own end…

  128. Магия¹º says:

    Woodguy,

    They have Ty Rattie coming too

    KIlls me that the OIlers drafted Musil one pick before Rattie.

    And they had every opportunity to see Rattie good. The Oil Kings best had to watch Baertschi and Rattie like (but of course) hawks.

  129. Woodguy says:

    Captain Happy:
    Woodguy,

    Wow.

    I had the impression they were doing well but that is spectacular.

    The conventional wisdom is that getting two good players out of every draft is excellent work but they’re averaging four.

    Their 2011 looks really good too.

    Here’s who they’re graduating to pro next year from that draft:

    Ty Rattie 110pts 62gms WHL RW 6’0
    Dmitri Jaskin 99pts 51gms QMJHL LW 6’2″
    Joel Edmunson 25pts 63gms WHL 6’5 Dman
    Jordan Binnington 50gp .932 SV% for Owen Sound in OHL 6’2″ Goalie
    Yannick Veilleux 65gp 73pts 101PIM QMJHL 6’2 LW
    Jani Hakanpaa huge 6’5″ 210lb Fin who got in 14 games in Periora last year

    That’s one hell of a draft class.

    I understand over-agers scoring rates in the CHL, but its still pretty impressive.

    Imagine if the OIlers drafted RNH, Klefbom and Rattie in 2011.

    Lordy.

  130. sumaclab says:

    Lowetide. Where is our good friend and last years whipping boy going to turn up? Whitney is not signed on day3? If he signs for more than minimum anywhere I’ll be shocked. Penner? Anybody that thought MacT was hard on him better think how hard a guy like Eakins would be on him. Pancakes indeed. If I am coming to training camp this fall I would be in shape both physicaly and mentally. Better come to camp with a clear head and leave all the emotional baggage and other mind clutter at the dressing room door. There is going to be focus here that we have not seen for a long time.

  131. Магия¹º says:

    Captain Happy:
    Woodguy,

    Wow.

    I had the impression they were doing well but that is spectacular.

    The conventional wisdom is that getting two good players out of every draft is excellent work but they’re averaging four.

    Good results. But hard to average 4 when only 2007 is close to having 4 guys who’ve played the equivalent of a full season. Numbers don’t always play with the same intensity (or poise) you find in them.

  132. Captain Happy says:

    Woodguy,

    It apears STL could whiff at every draft for the next 3 years and still be fine.

    And their draft guru, Kelkalainen, is now GM in Columbus working with former STL Hockey Ops head John Davidson.

    It’ll be interesting to watch and see if the can continue that success.

  133. Captain Happy says:

    Магия¹º,

    Point taken but Woodguy was using a minimum of 5 games played in the NHL.

    Most draft picks never make it at all.

  134. Woodguy says:

    Let’s not forget who ran STL’s amateur drafting up until 2010

    Jarmo Kekalainen, current GM of CBJ.

    Edit…See that Cappy Happy beat to the that one.

  135. VOR says:

    LT,

    You want to trade Hemsky for a first, how about we hold on to half his salary and then trade him to Nashville for Austin Watson?

  136. Lowetide says:

    sumaclab:
    Lowetide. Where is our good friend and last years whipping boy going to turn up? Whitney is not signed on day3?If he signs for more than minimum anywhere I’ll be shocked. Penner? Anybody that thought MacT was hard on him better think how hard a guy like Eakins would be on him. Pancakes indeed. If I am coming to training camp this fall I would be in shape both physicaly and mentally. Better come to camp with a clear head and leave all the emotional baggage and other mind clutter at the dressing room door. There is going to be focus here that we have not seen for a long time.

    There’s a rumor out there that Toronto likes Whitney a lot. Seriously.

  137. Woodguy says:

    Woodguy,

    Ty Rattie 110pts 62gms WHL RW 6’0
    Dmitri Jaskin 99pts 51gms QMJHL LW 6’2″
    Joel Edmunson 25pts 63gms WHL 6’5 Dman
    Jordan Binnington 50gp .932 SV% for Owen Sound in OHL 6’2″ Goalie
    Yannick Veilleux 65gp 73pts 101PIM QMJHL 6’2 LW
    Jani Hakanpaa huge 6’5″ 210lb Fin who got in 14 games in Periora last year
    That’s one hell of a draft class.

    Just noticed that they didn’t have a first round draft pick that year.

    2011 was also called a “weak” draft.

    STL seemed to do ok.

  138. Lowetide says:

    VOR:
    LT,

    You want to trade Hemsky for a first, how about we hold on to half his salary and then trade him to Nashville for Austin Watson?

    I don’t want to trade Hemsky at all.

  139. Woodguy says:

    Lowetide: There’s a rumor out there that Toronto likes Whitney a lot. Seriously.

    That would be the icing on the cake as Nonis trades or buys out most of their puck possession players.

    They still have some good players there, but they rode luck really hard last year and when they come crashing down in 13/14 I can’t wait to read/hear the explanations as to why.

    Most will have to do with character, grit, good in the room etc, I’m sure.

    Sexier than “we weren’t as good as our results last year and overall they got worse as an organization”

  140. SpotTheLoon says:

    LT:

    Yes, there is talk of Penner but, realistically, do you think he would sign here? Just curious what your thoughts are.

    I like Hemsky a lot but what is your reasoning behind not wanting to trade him? Again, just curious.

  141. Lois Lowe says:

    Lowetide: There’s a rumor out there that Toronto likes Whitney a lot. Seriously.

    I guess having two bottom lines of stick optional forwards isn’t enough, they need a skating optional D man as well.

  142. speeds says:

    Woodguy:
    Woodguy,

    Ty Rattie 110pts 62gms WHL RW 6’0
    Dmitri Jaskin 99pts 51gms QMJHL LW 6’2″
    Joel Edmunson 25pts 63gms WHL 6’5 Dman
    Jordan Binnington 50gp .932 SV% for Owen Sound in OHL 6’2″ Goalie
    Yannick Veilleux 65gp 73pts 101PIM QMJHL 6’2 LW
    Jani Hakanpaa huge 6’5″ 210lb Fin who got in 14 games in Periora last year
    That’s one hell of a draft class.

    Just noticed that they didn’t have a first round draft pick that year.

    2011 was also called a “weak” draft.

    STL seemed to do ok.

    They didn’t have their first round pick because it was moved in the Erik Johnson trade, but the pick that turned into Rattie was acquired from COL in that trade.

    Shattenkirk, Stewart and 32OV (Rattie) for E.Johnson, McClement and 11OV (Siemens)

  143. jb says:

    Lowetide: Gordon doesn’t play with the top drawer guys either. He’s a guy who can stifle the other team’s best offensive options. Expecting him to score a lot of EV points will leave fans disappointed. Preventing goals has value, and Gordon has a fine resume.

    I agree, preventing goals has value close to scoring goals, though its far harder to measure. I just see Gordon as more of a 4th line center on a good team, I think you need a little more out of a 3rd liner. If Pjaarvi’s strapped to Gordon all year on the 3rd line we should expect an extremely low event line that could fall negative due to inability to capitalize.. They’d only be drawing 2-4th line competition.. Possibly not good enough.

    TheOtherJohn: from @Mc79hockey

    PHX had 52% of the shot attempts when Gordon was on the ice despite him starting in o-zone just 32.6% of the tie.

    P.S. pretty good #’s

    Strong numbers I agree, I see that as an indicator of a strong possession player with the ability to generate enough chances to outscore in theory… A guy like Gordon might do next do nothing with the 7 chances created, while the 3 shots given up were rockets from the slot… I don’t mean to be negative here, I like Gordon, we’re just being extremely optimistic with the guy abilities.

  144. Lowetide says:

    SpotTheLoon:
    LT:

    Yes, there is talk of Penner but, realistically, do you think he would sign here?Just curious what your thoughts are.

    I like Hemsky a lot but what is your reasoning behind not wanting to trade him?Again, just curious.

    I always liked Penner, was sorry he left. But he’s not coming back.

  145. Henry says:

    G Money:
    Henry,

    I think it would be fair to say that St Louis is a superbly run hockey organization in a questionable hockey market.

    However you slice it, Missouri is really a southern state despite its midwesternish location, and from a grassroots hockey perspective, it is not markedly different from Florida, Georgia, or Arizona.It’s also a city of <3M people, which for a southern US hockey market is tiny.

    They do claim a high attendance, but I think they only achieve that by heavily discounting tickets, hence the low revenues.

    G Money,

    I think you could be right. I share some of the thoughts of notes of Vanoil as well. StLouis the city has been hurt over the past 30 years. The suburbs are pretty affluent though.

    It is a strong sports town particularly for baseball and has a long hockey tradition.

    If they move, I hope it is to Houston. I personally know at least a dozen people that would go to games with me.

  146. Henry says:

    Lowetide: There’s a rumor out there that Toronto likes Whitney a lot. Seriously.

    Wasn’t the rumour after the Lubo/Whitney deal that Carlyle and Whitney were at each other’s throats?

  147. Rondo says:

    Penner couldn’t motivate himself with a Stanley Cup team in the regular season, what makes you think this will change?

  148. godot10 says:

    VOR:
    G Money,

    Brendan Smith is a future NHL 2D that Detroit is quietly nurturing. Nyquist has proven he can tear up the AHL and is in the Datysuk mode (a forecheck savant), Andersson would have escaped all notice if he hadn’t been superb in the playoffs, large kid, very fast, massively outplays in the playoffs, and dominates the faceoff circle when it matters. All three kids were impressive in Detroit’s Stanley Cup playoff success. Then there are Cleary, Brunner, and White who are UFAs and who were important players all year for Detroit. Lets be really kind and say that you can sign them all for $10,000,000 so that leaves Holland $7,700,000 short.

    Detroit has no need to sign Cleary, Brunner, or White.

    The only Detroit signing that they have left that impacts the cap is Brendan Smith, and if you look at Petry’s deal, it means Detroit only has to get rid of one player by training camp.

    Nyquist and Andersson will both be signed for less than $1 million or very close to it, and if they make the team, they will be replacing guys who make less than $1 million. So any forwards earning that little which get sent to the minors have essentially no cap impact.

    Plus if Helm is injured he goes on LTIR at the start of the season, and Detroit has no cap problem at all.

  149. SpotTheLoon says:

    Rondo,

    I still remember the last year Penner was here. He generally played hard and contributed quite significantly. I felt like he was really getting it and buying into the system.

  150. spoiler says:

    I bet Van wishes they had the space to pay Penner. Detroit too. Phoenix has the space to do it, and would like the free size and scoring, but he’s not really a Tippett kind of player.

    I think he will end up in Toronto, if he isn’t addicted to sunshine.

  151. striatic says:

    i guess i’m the only guy in the Vinny Prospal fan club.

    whee!

  152. Woodguy says:

    jb: I agree, preventing goals has value close to scoring goals, though its far harder to measure. I just see Gordon as more of a 4th line center on a good team, I think you need a little more out of a 3rd liner. If Pjaarvi’s strapped to Gordon all year on the 3rd line we should expect an extremely low event line that could fall negative due to inability to capitalize.. They’d only be drawing 2-4th line competition.. Possibly not good enough.

    Strong numbers I agree, I see that as an indicator of a strong possession player with the ability to generate enough chances to outscore in theory… A guy like Gordon might do next do nothing with the 7 chances created, while the 3 shots given up were rockets from the slot… I don’t mean to be negative here, I like Gordon, we’re just being extremely optimistic with the guy abilities.

    Everything you say makes sense.

    Given the how other teams have brutalized the Oiler’s 3rd line in recent years, if this year’s 3rd line can keep their head near level its a big improvement.

  153. Woodguy says:

    striatic:
    i guess i’m the only guy in the Vinny Prospal fan club.

    whee!

    I liked Vinny.

    Got him with my last pick in the 07/08 playoff draft and he scored 13pts in 17gms.

    He’s 38 and has stated that he’ll play for CBJ or not at all.

    http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-puck-daddy/does-columbus-vinny-prospal-gentleman-agreement-violate-nhl-040011113.html

  154. striatic says:

    Woodguy: He’s 38 and has stated that he’ll play for CBJ or not at all.

    i figured maybe with the Howson connection we could snag him. he was the guy who brought him to CBJ initially right? then the Hemsky connection and the fact CBJ hasn’t signed him yet.

  155. sliderule says:

    Jim Nill may have made his first mistake in trading for Seguin.

  156. Nostradumbass says:

    Tom Reagan “I am awake”

    Tad “your eyes are shut”

    Tom Reagan ” Who you gonna believe”

  157. Kris11 says:

    The new coach mentions fitness every time he speaks.

    MacT really clashed with Penner.

    Dustin Penner has as much chance of coming back here as Mike Comrie did.

    Oh, wait…

  158. Kris11 says:

    Also, we could use Souray.

  159. hags9k says:

    striatic,

    I’m with you. I’m going to be happy to see them add any NHL hockey player. Any. Vinny P would be just fine.

    There’s about as good a chance Penner comes back as Eakins hiring Aunt Jemimi as an assistant coach.

  160. BONVIE says:

    Oilers Should ensure that they have lots of cap room and offer Pieterangelo a long term deal for 8.4 million for 5 or 7 years, go with the longest term they can get. I think he is the premier Defenseman right now who has the widest range of skills, and he has clearly arrived as one of the top 5 Dman in the league and his upside should continue throughout the entire length of the contract. He also is right side.

    THIS defines bold!!

  161. bookje says:

    Lowetide: I always liked Penner, was sorry he left. But he’s not coming back.

    Can you please add ‘Book it!’ To that statement.

  162. hags9k says:

    BONVIE,

    Don’t we think Justin Schultz will develop into a 1RHD? I’d love to get Pietrangelo but wouldn’t we rather a 1LHD at this point? Like an OEL maybe. I suppose some aren’t convinced JS will be more than a 3- 4 and PP specialist maybe.

  163. Captain Happy says:

    sliderule:
    Jim Nill may have made his first mistake in trading for Seguin.

    I guess you could also say the Hawks made a mistake in drafting Patrick Kane.

    Young kids do stupid stuff.

    Most of them grow up.

  164. bookje says:

    Lowetide: There’s a rumor out there that Toronto likes Whitney a lot. Seriously.

    You need a better BS filter, Souray to Toronro is about as likely to be true as those asinine Khabibulin to Chicago rumors were. Total BS.

    Wait, what’s that…..?

  165. sliderule says:

    Captain Happy,

    Sequins smarmy smart ass stuff is why he was disliked by teammates and traded..

    A holes usually don’t improve they get worse.

  166. bookje says:

    Tyler Seguin’s comment that ‘his account was hacked’ are absolutely stupid. Why is it that when all of these celebrity accounts get ‘hacked’, they only make or two moronic comments and then delete them 20 minutes later. If I hacked an account, I would be sending out rapid fire texts – one after the other and they would be increasingly ridiculous.

    As far as I am concerned Tyler Seguin is a lobotomised baboon!

  167. Lowetide says:

    There’s a Derek Sanderson story that I’ve always remembered, it was in his book (don’t remember which one–I gotta be me? can’t remember). Anyway, it’s 1971 and they all love Orr, I mean LOVe the guy would never let him down.

    The thing is, Orr wants to win the Stanley Cup and that’s pretty much the deal with him. It’s 1971 and they roll over Montreal one night and then party too much and get their clocks cleaned the next game. The dressing room is set up so that when you walk in after a game, Orr is the first guy you see.

    So sanderson tells this story where he walks into the dressing room after that Montral playoff loss and he’s ashamed, and he’s not the only one, but he’s ashamed of himself and he can’t look at Orr. Won’t do it. And so he walks to his stall, and looks down, then around, and then finally looks over at Orr.

    And Orr is looking at him.

    Sanderson never did get it together. And I’ve never been in a situation as close as a locker room, but I think the Orr in that Boston room knew about Seguin.

    And that’s a damn shame. How can you save somebody when they don’t care to save themselves? I sincerely hope this young man gets it together, but I wouldn’t bet a dime on him.

  168. bookje says:

    Uhm, I would like to appologise to everyone who was offended by my previous comment, particularly to the baboon population who have undergone cranial reparatory surgery involving a partial or complete lobotomy. If any one was offended, I am deeply sorry. My account was hacked and it was mere co-incidence that this account hacking took place while I was tremendously drunk at a club.

    Again, sorry to the baboons!

  169. lance says:

    Finally caught up! We drove from Phoenix to San Diego to photograph a new restaurant on the beach in the theme of a pool for opening night on July 4. I told the architect that because of projects like this that NHL free agents don’t want to sign in Edmonton. It was worth a guffaw.

    Meanwhile, back at the ranch…

    In any normal multimillion dollar industry a guy who in the first couple weeks publicly devalues two assets then tries to buy that Clarkson millstone, after getting the job with zero experience on the resume would be immediately cut loose. 42M? for a one time 40 point scorer? My God.

    After a pretty decent run as GM, since moving upstairs, it seemed to me Lowe had an obvious plan. Albeit not very creative–ditching the team’s centres to bomb in the standings thereby finally getting elite level talent–clearly did happen. Adding the Russians to create competition within the organization? Maybe even astute.

    MacTavish seems to have entered with the airs of a college grad about to take the world by storm, when instead he clearly should have been telling the media that he was ready to learn from his peers and grow into the position.

    I get the idea of selling the sizzle, and I appreciate some GM’s are better at checkers than GO, but this last week looks like MacT is wholly under-qualified and clearly should never have been hired in the first place.

    And I don’t want to give him time. I want Monday morning for Katz to call in MacT and tells him he can do whatever he wants except trade Hall Ebs Nuge Yak MPS Jultz Petry Klef Gernat Marincin and Nurse or sign a contract for more than 4M without calling him first. Keys to the car rescinded until further notice.

  170. Thor762 says:

    Yes Kane did something stupid himself before but I highly doubt Kane ever had to have a security guard stationed outside his hotel room door to prevent him from slipping out to go partying during the playoffs. Seguin is on the fast track to being a has been if that behaviour doesn’t change.

    Thank the hockey gods that the Oilers drafted Hall.

  171. sliderule says:

    Lowetide,

    I went to the wha game between oilers and Sandersons team .Can’t remember team name.

    I was really excited as he was one of the big signings.

    My first clue that the league was going to have problems was that their uniforms were incredibly dirty.

    The second clue was that Sanderson circled at center ice.

    So help me god he never saw his own end.

    There were better times to come for oilers but for me that was a real disappointment as it was first live game featuring NHL players I had seen.

  172. Captain Happy says:

    Lowetide,

    I don’t know if you spent anytime around the 80′s Oilers LT but I can tell you they had way more than their share of “party boys”.

    If some of their antics had been pulled in more politically correct times like these, I’m thinking the dynasty would be viewed in a different light.

    And that was from the top on down.

  173. Lowetide says:

    Captain Happy:
    Lowetide,

    I don’t know if you spent anytime around the 80′s Oilers LT but I can tell you they had way more than their share of “party boys”.

    If some of their antics had been pulled in more politically correct times like these, I’m thinking the dynasty would be viewed in a different light.

    And that was from the top on down.

    Sure. But Seguin’s sins came in a Stanley cup final. No way that is forgiven, in 1971 or 1985 or 2013.

  174. Woodguy says:

    Captain Happy:
    Lowetide,

    I don’t know if you spent anytime around the 80′s Oilers LT but I can tell you they had way more than their share of “party boys”.

    If some of their antics had been pulled in more politically correct times like these, I’m thinking the dynasty would be viewed in a different light.

    And that was from the top on down.

    Sather certainly kept a pile of stuff out of the papers.

    The difference was partying hard the night before a playoff game and not though.

    After losing to NYI they figured it out.

  175. striatic says:

    Lowetide: Sure. But Seguin’s sins came in a Stanley cup final. No way that is forgiven, in 1971 or 1985 or 2013.

    exactly. it all comes down to “is Hockey the most important thing to you?”

    if it is, as it clearly is with Kane, it doesn’t matter if partying comes second.

    the issue is when Hockey comes second, as appeared to be the case this year with Seguin.

  176. striatic says:

    bookje: Tyler Seguin’s comment that ‘his account was hacked’ are absolutely stupid.

    it isn’t so stupid, although it is unlikely his account was “hacked” in the traditional sense.

    most likely that some of his buddies got ahold of his phone.

    still, doesn’t speak well of Seguin if that’s the kind of company he is keeping.

  177. dangilitis says:

    sliderule,

    Referring to the twitter. Kane punched a cab driver I believe, and was this year’s Conn Smythe. It’s nice to have players to cheer for who you think are good people as well, but don’t mistake this as evidence that Seguin is going to be a cancer to the team. Taylor > Tyler, but if MacT could have landed Seguin and Peverley for Gagner + something, I would have made the trade in a heartbeat. Problem is that Erikson is a better player than Gagner, and is an underrated return for a team in cap hell.

  178. dangilitis says:

    That being said, they then used that 6 million to sign Iginla…

  179. spoiler says:

    Eskies lose this one, right? Shotgun blast into the left tarsus?

  180. Kris11 says:

    You can drink and beat innocent cab-drivers, but only if you can show up on the ice. Some guys can do exactly that. Not aure if it is biology or what, but that is it.

    At this point, on the ice, Seguin is a disappointment, and a partier. That is his problem.

    NB: some guys can drink and party and even not work out and be dominant athletes. Other guys have to be dedicated 24/7 to make it work. When Seguin started to stagnate, I bet the Bruins came to him and said he had to work harder and party less, even if other guys partied more, to become the player he should be given his 2nd overall pedigree. I bet he said “Whatever” and he then scored one goal in a playoff run where a few more goals could have got them the cup, and the players and management were so pissed, they told the kid they were through.

    Again, you can party and not work out if you can back it up on the ice (like the 80′s Oilers) but not if you’re playing at Seguin’s level, behind a lot of better players.

  181. dangilitis says:

    Thor762:
    Yes Kane did something stupid himself before but I highly doubt Kane ever had to have a security guard stationed outside his hotel room door to prevent him from slipping out to go partying during the playoffs.Seguin is on the fast track to being a has been if that behaviour doesn’t change.

    Thank the hockey gods that the Oilers drafted Hall.

    I remember watching Oil Change and listening to Hall’s interview by the Oil. For a teenager to come across as such an intelligent hockey player really opened my eyes to why the decision was likely an easy one come draft day. I think they were asking him at one point about his brutal hit in OHL – Hall’s response was immediate and blunt and something to the effect of – if I chipped and chased at that point, it would have just been an average hockey play and I am not in the business of doing these things all the time. Wow.

    Lets thank the hockey gods that the Oilers drafting approach of “he’s got character” worked out…

    And Kane did many stupid things. There is great leadership in Chicago with captain serious, and while I give Kaner credit where credit is due now, I don’t think any of us can speak much to how committed he was in the first three years of his career. Seguin is more under the spotlight because of his immediate start to his career on a team competing for the cup. He has also been handled kind of like Thornton initiially was, and Thornton did not enjoy success until being shipped to SJ. Not to defend Seguin, but just to say I think he will do well in Dallas, and he’ll have a great mentor there in Horcoff to straighten him out and do a bit of babysitting…

  182. sliderule says:

    Woodguy,

    There was lots of partying with the 80s oil but it was mostly team stuff and didn’t affect their play.

    It sounds like Seguin is a wildcard who was not well liked and partied outside team constraints.

  183. TheOtherJohn says:

    bookje:
    Uhm, I would like to appologise to everyone who was offended by my previous comment, particularly to the baboon population who have undergone cranial reparatory surgery involving a partial or complete lobotomy. If any one was offended, I am deeply sorry.My account was hacked and it was mere co-incidence that this account hacking took place while I was tremendously drunk at a club.

    Again, sorry to the baboons!

    Not to worry I just thought someone hacked your account 2-3 years ago and kept posting ridiculous comments here daily. Think that was about when you started posting here as DSF and whatever your new name is this week.

  184. dangilitis says:

    What are everyone’s top options for these big tasks?

    1. Find a 2line L who can complement Gagner-Yakupov with puck retrieval, blocking out the sun, etc:
    a) Grabo/Gagner (If get a center like Grabovski) – I don’t think Grabovski is an ideal solution, but a lot of people seem to be trumpeting him as the solution, so I will defer here. Only UFA option who would legitimately push Paajarvi to the 3rd line where I think he best fits next year and would improve bottom 6.
    b) Raymond – not ideal, but IMO could buy him low. Previous seasons showed he faced harder competition and kept head above water. An option to vie with Paajarvi for 2nd or 3rd line LW, certainly not a clear # 2 but improves LW depth.
    c) Penner – unlikely, but what other options are available at this point? No assets to lose now and we can look back and say that we got him back and kept Klefbom (and some dude named Teubert). I think he could compete with Paajarvi for 2nd line LW and ihop for the Edmonton title of house of pancakes.
    d) Gagne – is this guy healthy finally? Also a buy low guy who didn’t fair too badly but would be a possible 3rd line LW who would be unlikely to compete with Paajarvi.
    e) Prospal or Morrow – non-ideal stop gaps, more likely 3rd liners but certainly upgrade of bottom 6 over Hartikkainen

    Trade candidates: Perron, Perron, Hagelin, Kulemin, Jokinen, Glencross

    2. Find a 4line C:
    It is baffling why this hasn’t happened yet, considering some of the reasonable UFA signings. Adding Grabo provides depth if a center goes down, but that’s not really why you pick him up.
    How about Wellwood? Gomez? Hecht?
    Trade candidates: None – why? Because I would rather have Lander as 4th line center, however, than giving up assets (includes Hemsky) to get a 4th line center. This should be a waiver pickup or UFA signing and they effed up really bad last year before settling with Smithson.

    3. Deal Hemsky for immediate help (even if its a checker)/
    4. Top 4 defender (signed Ference, that’s the big move this summer):
    Obviously Ference is not enough and is a questionable top 4, so these two should be linked in an ideal world. Hemsky at 2.5 million is actually a steal, sorry to say, and I think him + one of three less puck moving D-men (Ference, Smid, N Schultz) could and should be used to upgrade that position. It wouldn’t necessarily result in a top pairing D man (unless Smid is involved), but an upgrade is an upgrade and would be a smart use of a Hemsky trade.

    5. Find a 3line R (Joensu is the option I’ll puck, but it would be foolish to exclude Ryan Jones based on salary):
    Hemsky is the answer to this one if he can’t be traded to provide us the answer to # 1 or #4, otherwise he should not be traded. I don’t care if his house is for sale. Maybe he’s more valuable at trade deadline.
    Otherwise, UFA options:
    a) Brunner, b) Boyes, c) Cleary, d) Mueller

  185. bookje says:

    TheOtherJohn: Not to worry I just thought someone hacked your account 2-3 years ago and kept posting ridiculous comments here daily. Think that was about when you started posting here as DSF and whatever your new name is this week.

    I think you have me confused with Captain Happy. The similarities are none.

  186. TheOtherJohn says:

    Good one!

  187. PunjabiOil says:

    I’m all for advanced statistics, but character isn’t something it always takes into account.

    Was petrified in the summer of 2010 that the Oil would take Seguin over Hall. Lowe later admitted after the draft that they made their decision back in May, and the Taylor vs Tyler showdown was a smokescreen.

    Seguin’s warning signs was there (the immature version of me on HFboards exaggerated a bit, but point stands)

    http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?p=26379563&highlight=#post26379563

    Seguin’s interview answers were definitely artificial, canned in the pilot Oil change episode. The Oilers got it right. One of the scouts mentioned how Hall breathed hockey and could name all the cup winners and runner ups for the past 20-30 years, whereas Seguin couldn’t name when the Oilers won.

    This isn’t to suggest character should triumph talent evaluation. That said, if the players are close, and your character evaluation suggests player A has both the mentality and desirability to improve his game more than player B, then a selection of a Darnell Nurse over Valeri Nichuskin may very well be justifiable.

  188. Captain Happy says:

    Woodguy: Sather certainly kept a pile of stuff out of the papers.

    The difference was partying hard the night before a playoff game and not though.

    After losing to NYI they figured it out.

    No they didn’t.

  189. Lowetide says:

    Captain Happy: No they didn’t.

    5 Stanleys say otherwise.

  190. PunjabiOil says:

    As per the NIKE Tiger Woods slogan, ”Winning takes care of everything”

  191. G Money says:

    The idea that the 80′s Oilers partied and this somehow excuses Seguin’s behaviour now is not valid.

    It was a different time. *EVERYONE* partied. Hell, you probably didn’t fit in to an NHL team if you didn’t smoke, drink, do recreational drugs, or party (preferably all four). Do that now and you’re begging to be traded a la Seguin (or Heatley for that matter).

    It was also standard practice to show up fat and happy for training camp and using that to get yourself into shape. Do that now and you’re begging for an end to your career a la Peckham.

    So whatever the Oilers did back then – it was simply par for the course in the NHL. Today, none of that is acceptable. If that is truly Seguin’s issue – and it seems like there is at least some anecdotal evidence that it is – he is in fact putting his career at risk, and NOTHING the Oilers did in the 80s excuses it.

    P.S. I did get the inside scoop on some of the Oiler doings of those days – I lived two blocks from P. Pocklington, and went to school with his stepdaughter. Some buddies of mine lived on 72nd Ave where Messier trashed his Porsche, and we went and inspected the damage … good times.

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