JERRY IT’S FRANK COSTANZA MR. STEINBRENNER’S HERE GEORGE IS DEAD, CALL ME BACK

Sam Gagner has a broken jaw.

gagner broken jawOiler options are not very good at this point. They have Hall trying center out for a spin, Nuge recovering, Boyd Gordon and not much else. Mark Arcobello, Anton Lander, Will Acton and Andrew Miller aren’t going to get it done. It’ll be about a month (or so), Oilers need to do something.

But what?

I think it’s time to look at the Nuge timeline for recovery. Seriously.

And as much as I’m onside as a MacTavish guy, the Oilers once again need to learn the lesson of depth. And at center, again!

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112 Responses to "JERRY IT’S FRANK COSTANZA MR. STEINBRENNER’S HERE GEORGE IS DEAD, CALL ME BACK"

  1. regwald says:

    Well, I guess we will see what the Tactician MacT will do now. It may be 3 or 4 weeks before he can play with a full face shield, but the team lacked center depth.

    MacT has to address this now. We wait.

  2. Woodguy says:

    Also,

    Edmonton Oilers ‏@EdmontonOilers 5m
    #Oilers assign Klefbom, Marincin, Hunt, Martindale, Miller, Bachman and Rimmer to the @OKCBarons and Khaira to Everett (WHL).

  3. slopitch says:

    Hall-Arcobello-Gordon-Lander?

    Bryan Murray probably had 6 calls from MacT last night.

    Gagner and RNH on LTIR must free up quite a bit of cap space.

  4. Woodguy says:

    Good thing Tambo didn’t pick up C Jussi Joikenen when he was on waivers last year and the Oilers really needed a C.

    Scored a natural hat trick the other night.

    Fuck.

  5. Racki says:

    Back to the topic we were talking about in the other thread…

    I agree with all the comments about how having tough guys in the lineup doesn’t prevent stuff like a dirty hit on Hall from happening. But I just feel it’s about time we had someone that drew all the other team’s attention.. our own Clutterbuck-type. Easier said than done to come by, for someone that can play a good shift, I suppose, however. But I’d rather be the side chopping down opponents than saying “let’s score a goal on that powerplay, boys!” while Hall is off in the isolation room and missing several games afterwards.

    Maybe the NHL just needs to clean up its game more. Brown can’t stop Hall from being elbowed to the head… a powerplay probably won’t stop that either because it still happens. So… fight fire with fire, I guess?

  6. 719 says:

    I am sorry to be repetitive. With Gagner confirmed out with a broken jaw, could we squeeze either Sutter (preferably) or Jokinen out of Pittsburgh? They are over the cap and we could send one of our cheaper forwards their way. For Sutter it would have to be more, but might be a price we should pay…

  7. Lowetide says:

    Racki: The guy has to be able to play, otherwise you’re

    1. Sending Jacques out with Hemsky
    2. Cluttering your 4line with guys who can’t play and won’t play when things are happening to your best players.

  8. Racki says:

    I’m hoping that there is a better answer for #2 center than Arcobello or Lander. It’s too bad Khaira doesn’t have wheels yet. He has NHL size and maybe could fill in, in a lesser scoring role. But I’m thinking we’ll see the Arco vs. Lander experiment for the remainder of pre-season.

  9. VanOil says:

    Gagner looked great in the preseason. This is horrible news. Our center depth was going to get exposed eventually hopefully we have a week to fix it. This has kind of ruined my mood so up lifted from last night.

  10. Racki says:

    Lowetide:
    Racki: The guy has to be able to play, otherwise you’re

    1. Sending Jacques out with Hemsky
    2. Cluttering your 4line with guys who can’t play and won’t play when things are happening to your best players.

    Absolutely.. this is why I’m talking about Clutterbuck types, not Brown types. But yes, for sure, it has to be someone who can play a regular scoring shift.. which I don’t think we currently have anyone that fits the bill, sadly… so at this point it’s just a whole lot of wishful thinking on my part. Although I will say, we’ve had good players gooned by Dorsett, Weise, Nystrom, and others that aren’t exactly the cream of the crop. Not sure how these teams manage to do it..

  11. 719 says:

    The fact Nurse wasn’t assigned today and also isn’t on the ice at practice concerns me.

  12. Racki says:

    719:
    The fact Nurse wasn’t assigned today and also isn’t on the ice at practice concerns me.

    Stauffer commented that he saw him in Rexall though. You’d have to think that if he had an injured shoulder (which is what it looked like), he’d have a sling or something…. so I’m guessing that if he’s hurt it isn’t anything too major.

    Damn, that kid looks super frail right now too. I am anxious to see him return to the Soo. Not because he’s bad.. I think he’s a stellar player.. but he really needs to put on some size before coming back here or I’ll be crapping my pants every time he gets hit.

  13. Gret99zky says:

    Keep the cuts coming and get this line-up set.

    Hemsky + for a center? We wait.

  14. 719 says:

    Racki,

    I hope you are right Racki. Fingers crossed.

    In other news Khudobin with a 41 save, 1 goal game yesterday.

  15. Racki says:

    Woodguy: And nothing stops those hits from happening except the player protecting themselves.

    In preseason nothing stops those at all as VAN was auditioning their grunts and they were all out to hurt someone to make the team.

    Bringing this convo over here so we don’t have to wander back and forth…..

    I definitely agree. I don’t think anything stops Hall and co from getting hit, save for them protecting themselves. Not even the fear of a powerplay really fully stops that, especially in pre-season. That one powerplay is a spec of dust compared to losing Hall or someone for a good chunk of the season. This is why I suggest us being on the offensive here for once.

    In my opinion, the Oilers should have probably dressed a similar line up to compete with the Canuck’s goon squad. They lucked out that only one major injury happened where there could have been two crippling injuries (both Hall and Gagner.. imagine that…???) plus Nurse.

  16. slopitch says:

    Use the cap space to offer sheet Stepan.

  17. RMGS says:

    Woodguy:
    Good thing Tambo didn’t pick up C Jussi Joikenen when he was on waivers last year and the Oilers really needed a C.

    Scored a natural hat trick the other night.

    Fuck.

    It’s easy to beat on “Tambo the dead horse,” but it’s MacT who did not address the center depth this summer…

  18. OilClog says:

    How is Kassian getting away without proper punishment for this. He missed his check by a country mile and wildly swung his freaking stick in the air like he was trying to hit a Nadal Backhand.. Careless, Clueless, ugly play that should of never happened. He broke his freaking jaw! Way to go Shanaban.

  19. Dead Cat Bounce says:

    Kyle Wellwood?

  20. wheatnoil says:

    RMGS: It’s easy to beat on “Tambo the dead horse,” but it’s MacT who did not address the center depth this summer…

    I’m a MacT fan and a member of a Lynch-Tambo mob. None-the-less, I think you’re right. Tambo made a ton of mistakes, I think most of us can agree. However, centre depth was an issue all summer and MacT’s failure to address it has put the team in a tough position for the month of October. MacT still has time to pull a rabbit out of his hat though. Still, this is a position that he’s now having to deal with from a position of weakness.

    What do people think of a Malhotra PTO at this point? I know he’s not the Gagner player-style (and there’s eye-sight questions), but if he help handle some tough minutes it might allow lighten the load on Gordon’s line and let them provide more offence, not to mention allow Arcobello to face softer comp as 2C.

    Option 2: Smid at 2C.

  21. wheatnoil says:

    I just noticed that Khaira was sent to the WHL, not to the OKC training camp. Looks like OKC was never an option for him.

  22. JAG-041 says:

    didn’t address centre depth except Acton and Miller
    and nearly every pick…
    sometimes you can’t get everything done at once

  23. Lowetide says:

    Dead Cat Bounce:
    Kyle Wellwood?

    Absolutely. Cap room and a need, when Gagner gets back make a decision.

  24. bookje says:

    Play Hall as first and third line centre!

  25. RexLibris says:

    As much as I wish Gagner weren’t injured, I think this may become a blessing in disguise.

    The Oilers HAVE to find a center now. And they aren’t going to part with a 1st round pick to get it, nor do they have a 2nd to offer. It means time for some creativity and an “I’ll scratch your back if you scratch mine” kind of trade, that or a waiver pickup.

    Better this happen and the team be forced to deal with it in preseason, when GMs are flush with bodies, than in late December when things begin to tighten up.

    @Woodguy

    Re: Jokinen – Amen, sir.

  26. Henry says:

    I had that injury playing ball. Surgery, wired shut five weeks, lingering trigeminal neuralgia and lost a lot of weight on a liquid diet.

    The diet part has got to be a killer for a professional athlete.

  27. bookje says:

    Grebeshov would be a natural at centre.

  28. Racki says:

    At this point, the Oilers need a throw away player of some sort. Someone to just stop the bleeding for now. They aren’t working with a lot of cap space available here.. If they pick someone up, it won’t be pretty. May have to live with Arco in that role.

  29. Woodguy says:

    Racki: Absolutely.. this is why I’m talking about Clutterbuck types, not Brown types. But yes, for sure, it has to be someone who can play a regular scoring shift.. which I don’t think we currently have anyone that fits the bill, sadly… so at this point it’s just a whole lot of wishful thinking on my part. Although I will say, we’ve had good players gooned by Dorsett, Weise, Nystrom, and others that aren’t exactly the cream of the crop. Not sure how these teams manage to do it..

    Having a Clutterbuck may fulfil the need to be the aggressor sometimes, but it still does nothing to stop the other guy’s Clutterbuck from cheap shotting your own guys.

  30. RMGS says:

    JAG-041:
    didn’t address centre depth except Acton and Miller
    and nearly every pick…
    sometimes you can’t get everything done at once

    So, we’re talking NHL center depth, right?

  31. Woodguy says:

    Henry:
    I had that injury playing ball.Surgery, wired shut five weeks, lingering trigeminal neuralgia and lost a lot of weight on a liquid diet.

    The diet part has got to be a killer for a professional athlete.

    Crosby said losing the muscle mass due to lack of good nutrition and inactivity was the toughest part of his jaw injury.

  32. RexLibris says:

    Lowetide: Absolutely. Cap room and a need, when Gagner gets back make a decision.

    Your opinion: given the long history of accusations about Wellwood’s fitness level (deservedly or not), do you think he’d be a fit for Eakins?

  33. Dead Cat Bounce says:

    Lowetide: Absolutely. Cap room and a need, when Gagner gets back make a decision.

    He’s signed with a Swiss team on a contract that ends October 13th.

    http://www.evz.ch/detail/news/artikel/zeige/der-evz-verpflichtet-kyle-wellwood/

  34. iHockeyWpg says:

    So I’m assuming that last season’s final standings dictate the pecking order for waiver wire selection. The Oilers will have to wait for 6 teams to pass before they can claim a waived centre. Correct?

  35. Lowetide says:

    RexLibris: Your opinion: given the long history of accusations about Wellwood’s fitness level (deservedly or not), do you think he’d be a fit for Eakins?

    When you’re drowning, you grab a rope.

  36. Woodguy says:

    RMGS: It’s easy to beat on “Tambo the dead horse,” but it’s MacT who did not address the center depth this summer…

    I’m not letting MacT off the hook.

    There was a point last year where picking up Joikenen off waivers should have been a no-brainer

    Just bitching about spilled milk.

  37. Racki says:

    Woodguy: Having a Clutterbuck may fulfil the need to be the aggressor sometimes, but it still does nothing to stop the other guy’s Clutterbuck from cheap shotting your own guys.

    Oh I know, that was purely for my own cheap “need to be the aggressor sometimes”. ;) There really is no answer for those types of players.. just tired of being the team that has sand kicked in its face all the time.

  38. Racki says:

    iHockeyWpg:
    So I’m assuming that last season’s final standings dictate the pecking order for waiver wire selection.The Oilers will have to wait for 6 teams to pass before they can claim a waived centre.Correct?

    Correct

    Woodguy: I’m not letting MacT off the hook.

    There was a point last year where picking up Joikenen off waivers should have been a no-brainer

    Just bitching about spilled milk.

    Tambo needs more than 24-48 hrs to evaluate!

  39. G Money says:

    Racki: Although I will say, we’ve had good players gooned by Dorsett, Weise, Nystrom, and others that aren’t exactly the cream of the crop. Not sure how these teams manage to do it..

    CONTROVERSIAL POSTING ALERT:

    I think the answer there is – change of mindset.

    The other teams send these players out with the deliberate intent of targeting the other teams high end players with cheap shots. They aren’t out there long enough to do much damage to their own team, and if they can get in that slewfoot, head shot, stick to the jaw, etc. – pays for itself.

    The Oiler response (if there is one), and the attitude on these boards is to send out a goon to “protect” our players – which as has been pointed out over and over, doesn’t work.

    So the next time we play the Canucks, we don’t “protect” our players. We send out a disposable player for a few minutes whose sole purpose is to apply stick or knee or elbow to a Sedin head or a Luongo knee or whatever.

    Yes, I know – it is filthy, disgusting, underhanded, uncivilized, and a pukingly gross approach to hockey (or anything for that matter).

    But guess what – the other choice it seems to me is to forever be the victim.

    In the real world, if a guy does what the Canucks did last night (overall, not just Kassian), the police put them in jail.

    In the NHL, the sheriff consistently looks the other way. Do you seriously believe there will be any consequences for Wiese or for Kassian? Not a chance.

    Rough justice. What keeps you off our skill players is NOT our goon beating up on your goon – it is that a Sedin or Burrows will join Sammy on the IR.

    I think it is past time to consider the tactic.

  40. wheatnoil says:

    Racki:
    Tambo needs more than 24-48 hrs to evaluate!

    There’s a strong possibility that Tambo is still evaluating and may show up at a press conference with his decision, not yet having got to the email that told him he was fired.

  41. RexLibris says:

    Oilers have just over $1 million in cap space ($1.3 per capgeek). I think Wellwood could be had for something in that range. Then, when Gagner or RNH come back, look into a trade. Or waive someone like Grebeshkov or Jones if it comes to it and hope someone bites.

  42. RexLibris says:

    Lowetide: When you’re drowning, you grab a rope.

    Provided it isn’t the hangman’s.

  43. Gret99zky says:

    Yak at center? Gotta get him off the 3rd line anyway.

    Bloody putting players out of their natural position.

    With Nurse looking so beauty, trade Klefbom for a center.

  44. G Money says:

    Dead Cat Bounce:
    Kyle Wellwood?

    Yup. Thought he’d be a great fit at 4C (actual NHL player and can play up the lineup when injuries hit). All the more obvious when injuries do hit.

  45. Lowetide says:

    RexLibris: Provided it isn’t the hangman’s.

    Wellwood can play. Is he better than Arcobello without being as fit as Arcobello? Probably.

  46. wordbird says:

    <a href="#

    G Money: I think the answer there is – change of mindset.

    In the NHL, the sheriff consistently looks the other way. Do you seriously believe there will be any consequences for Wiese or for Kassian? Not a chance.

    Rough justice. What keeps you off our skill players is NOT our goon beating up on your goon – it is thata Sedin or Burrows will join Sammy on the IR.

    I think it is past time to consider the tactic.

    Rough justice. What keeps you off our skill players is NOT our goon beating up on your goon – it is thata Sedin or Burrows will join Sammy on the IR.

    I think it is past time to consider the tactic.

    yes. this.
    forget who said it last night in the GDT, but it’s about making yourself “spiky”. a guy wants to take a run at you? fill his mouth with your stick.
    not sure who you train a team to be dirtier, but i can think of a few former Oilers who could probly run a good “dirty” workshop for an afternoon at practice. :p

  47. Ribs says:

    Yikes. We knew trouble was ahead at center but it wasn’t supposed to come this early.

    If Nuge wasn’t coming back earlier than expected before, I’m sure he is now.

  48. Gret99zky says:

    Some are reporting the Nuge is practicing at Millenium Place in a full contact scrimmage.

    Rush?

  49. Lowetide says:

    Gret99zky:
    Some are reporting the Nuge is practicing at Millenium Place in a full contact scrimmage.

    Rush?

    NOOOOOOOOOOO!

  50. gcw_rocks says:

    Good thing MacT brought in lots on NHL calibre centre depth just in case there was an injury or something like this could be devastating.

    When MacT talked about being comfortable with his roster the team got dumber, not smarter. And now they pay the price.

    The Oilers continue to prove Tambo was part of the problem, not the problem.

  51. Woodguy says:

    gcw_rocks:
    Good thing MacT brought in lots on NHL calibre centre depth just in case there was an injury or something like this could be devastating.

    When MacT talked about being comfortable with his roster the team got dumber, not smarter.And now they pay the price.

    The Oilers continue to prove Tambo was part of the problem, not the problem.

    Yes, ignore 234 good things, find 1 or 2 not so good things and declare everything awful.

    Who could live up to that standard?

  52. jp says:

    RexLibris:
    As much as I wish Gagner weren’t injured, I think this may become a blessing in disguise.

    Exactly. Lets hope this forces a move before the season starts.

    Presumably there was a hope Arcobello/Miller/Lander/Acton would show well at TC. But with none of them even grabbing the 4C job it’s scary to think of a Hall-Gordon-plus 2 of those guys depth chart.

    Maybe we see a decent D prospect heading away.

  53. OilLeak says:

    And Arcobello just made the team.

  54. jake70 says:

    Really enjoyed the game last night. The Oilers looked like, well, a normal NHL team you expected to win the game.

    I was concerned when , in pre-game I heard someone say the Canucks left 50M in salary back in Vancouver. They sent the meat tenderizers and we iced most of our opening night forwards. Gagner hurt……why did they dress all their healthy top 6 forwards? Katz in the building?

    Lol on grabbing a rope by picking up Wellwood……that’s right LT, we are Oiler fans……we don’t put water in our wine, we are used to putting wine in our damn water.

  55. gr8one says:

    Well fuck.

  56. Ribs says:

    …And if anyone missed it ….


    Edmonton Oilers ‏@EdmontonOilers 1h
    #Oilers assign Klefbom, Marincin, Hunt, Martindale, Miller, Bachman and Rimmer to the @OKCBarons and Khaira to Everett (WHL).

    Clarification on @Bacher31′s assignment to the @OKCBarons. He has been put on waivers today for the purpose of assignment.

    - Edit – Ah, I see it above now. Yup.

  57. B S says:

    Hypothetical situation. Kassian has been taking runs at your players during the first period, clearly intending to hurt someone. Steve MacIntyre is sitting at the end of the bench on top of his hands, keeping them warm.

    Do you A) tell your players to keep their heads up and try not to get hurt. B) tell them to get “prickly” and take at least a 2 min penalty anytime Kassian lines them up, or C) walk down to Big Mac, tell him penalties be damned, and whisper “Kassian” in his ear.

    Question, if MacIntyre turns Kassian into Ivanans in the 1st period, does Gagner’s jaw break?

    I’m not actually trying to advocate a goon, I’m just pointing out that many of you have the wrong impression of how “goon hockey” is played. When the opposing coach (lets call him Sutter) plays his resident meathead (lets call him Ivanans) with 2.5 minutes left in a 4-0 hockey game, you don’t wait for said meathead to take runs at your players, you send out your heavyweight to take him out of the game ASAP : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NhzXA2Z9CQ

  58. Ribs says:

    I guess the surprise there is Klefbom. I thought he’d get a bigger push, but I guess he must be clearly not ready.

  59. iHockeyWpg says:

    Anyone have video link of Gagner’s injury? Not on Oiler web site or TSN.
    Thanks

  60. Lowetide says:

    B S:
    Hypothetical situation. Kassian has been taking runs at your players during the first period, clearly intending to hurt someone. Steve MacIntyre is sitting at the end of the bench on top of his hands, keeping them warm.

    Do you A) tell your players to keep their heads up and try not to get hurt. B) tell them to get “prickly” and take at least a 2 min penalty anytime Kassian lines them up, or C) walk down to Big Mac, tell him penalties be damned, and whisper “Kassian” in his ear.

    Question, if MacIntyre turns Kassian into Ivanans in the 1st period, does Gagner’s jaw break?

    I’m not actually trying to advocate a goon, I’m just pointing out that many of you have the wrong impression of how “goon hockey” is played. When the opposing coach (lets call him Sutter) plays his resident meathead (lets call him Ivanans) with 2.5 minutes left in a 4-0 hockey game, you don’t wait for said meathead to take runs at your players, you send out your heavyweight to take him out of the game ASAP : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NhzXA2Z9CQ

    Kassian won’t engage! I don’t know why this seems to escape people, but it does all the time. Here’s the deal: if you REALLY want to do something to address this, then get MacIntyre to swing his stick into Daniel Sedin’s head. Past the helmet, through the bone, and into the skull.

    But at that point I’m not watching it, because it’s not hockey.

  61. Dead Cat Bounce says:

    iHockeyWpg:
    Anyone have video link of Gagner’s injury?Not on Oiler web site or TSN.
    Thanks

    Here:

    http://kuklaskorner.com/hockey/comments/sam-gagner-out-with-a-broken-jaw

  62. bookje says:

    Gret99zky:
    Some are reporting the Nuge is practicing at Millenium Place in a full contact scrimmage.

    Rush?

    “Put some tape on it and get out there like we did it in the old days, we need a centre!”

  63. jp says:

    Woodguy:
    Also,

    Edmonton Oilers ‏@EdmontonOilers 5m
    #Oilers assign Klefbom, Marincin, Hunt, Martindale, Miller, Bachman and Rimmer to the @OKCBarons and Khaira to Everett (WHL).

    Interesting that Pitlick and Fedun are still around (I didn’t miss a Pitlick injury did I?).

    Great showing so far for Fedun outlasting Klef and Marincin.

    Omark, Hamilton, Eager, Jones, Brown and Pitlick for 2-4 W spots. Omark really needs to show something if he’s hoping to stick around. Eager, Jones and Brown on 1 way deals, but I think Hamilton sticks around.

    We’re starting to get down to the real team – just short 1 or 2 NHL centers.

  64. bookje says:

    Dead Cat Bounce: He’s signed with a Swiss team on a contract that ends October 13th.

    http://www.evz.ch/detail/news/artikel/zeige/der-evz-verpflichtet-kyle-wellwood/

    Would he have to clear waivers if the Oilers signed him and brought him over? (something about playing in Europe)

    As for conditioning – Eakins could perhaps pressure him into shape.

  65. B S says:

    Lowetide,

    Why do we suddenly care if Kassian is going to “engage”. He’ll engage once you start throwing punches. As I said, this only works if “penalties be damned”. I think what bothers me most is that if the refs would actually do their damn job with a shred of decency and common sense none of this would be an issue. Kassian would keep his stick down be cause he would know that the alternative is at least a 5 min major and a suspension from meaningful games (can’t impress the new coach if you aren’t playing).

  66. pboy says:

    When do we hear about the League reviewing tape and talking to Kassian?

  67. Lowetide says:

    B S:
    Lowetide,

    Why do we suddenly care if Kassian is going to “engage”. He’ll engage once you start throwing punches. As I said, this only works if “penalties be damned”.I think what bothers me most is that if the refs would actually do their damn job with a shred of decency and common sense none of this would be an issue. Kassian would keep his stick down be cause he would know that the alternative is at least a 5 min major and a suspension from meaningful games (can’t impress the new coach if you aren’t playing).

    So now we’re not interested in winning the game, we’re interested in inflicting damage on the other team. Cool. I’ll start up the draft stuff tomorrow, because the lottery is where you’re heading.

    Edmonton has played Vancouver split squads twice this week, won them both handily. They’re on the run! And your suggestion puts them on the powerplay forever.

    No sir. No sir.

  68. Lowetide says:

    pboy:
    When do we hear about the League reviewing tape and talking to Kassian?

    Well, it’s Sunday. Then Monday comes and traffic in Manhattan is hell, plus there’s always a long lunch. So, November?

  69. Manitoba Oilers says:

    I’m guessing Gagner will be out 3-4 weeks

  70. RMGS says:

    I don’t like MacT’s chances on breaking even in a trade given the desperate circumstances. Signing Wellwood’s been mentioned, but what about Connolly?

    http://theleafsnation.com/2012/7/10/tim-connolly-a-look-at-his-role-and-his-future

  71. VanOil says:

    Some positive thoughts to balance this poor news and Goonery debate;

    Yakupov beyond “the shot” brought the “Ninja” and “Nightcrawler” I am every where act to both ends of the ice last night. The new system suits him. He is now able to carry a line regardless of skill. We might, a long with Hall, have two players capable of carrying a whole team

    Smyth is a great guy and a great Oiler, I am sure he is good in the room. I suspect he can no longer skate at an NHL level. I know he can not skate at an OIlers skill line level any more.

    Belov might be as good as advertised. small sample sizes et cetera et cetera

    Jones at Center? why not, we will hardly being ruining his stellar wing play

    Malhotra’s phone best be ringing, take the risk give him a 1 year deal ~ sight unseen.

    Oilers cap space is better than advertised as ETL bonus overages and eye of Newt make a strange brew and baby we need witch craft.

  72. Lowetide says:

    The funny thing is the Gagner injury clouds the actual game. Oilers won, had the Canucks on the run in two games this week. Skill wins. Unless you place JF Jacques on a line with Ales Hemsky.

  73. wheatnoil says:

    RMGS:
    I don’t like MacT’s chances on breaking even in a trade given the desperate circumstances. Signing Wellwood’s been mentioned, but what about Connolly?

    http://theleafsnation.com/2012/7/10/tim-connolly-a-look-at-his-role-and-his-future

    Well he played for the Marlies last year, so Eakins knows him well. He scored 12 points in 28 games for the Marlies, which isn’t fantastic. I suspect this is a situation where MacT can go to Eakins and say, “So, would Connolly be an improvement over Arcobello?” If the Oilers sign him, we know the answer is ‘yes’.

  74. TheseColoursDontRun says:

    The other day in one of the Eakins interviews someone in the MSM asked about the possibility of Eberle at centre being that he played center for two years in junior. Eakins wasn’t totally opposed to the idea. Maybe If Arco can’t handle it and MacT prefers to avoid trade rape, ebs is our guy in the short term.

  75. jp says:

    wheatnoil: Well he played for the Marlies last year, so Eakins knows him well. He scored 12 points in 28 games for the Marlies, which isn’t fantastic. I suspect this is a situation where MacT can go to Eakins and say, “So, would Connolly be an improvement over Arcobello?” If the Oilers sign him, we know the answer is ‘yes’.

    12 pts in 28 GP is pretty ugly actually. That’s Lander level.

    With Acton and Hamilton already being brought in, I think we might already have our answer to what Eakins thinks of Connolly.

    They pretty much have to bring in someone though. Don’t they?? Wellwood is looking like a cheap and decent option.

  76. B S says:

    Lowetide,

    The Oilers won a meaningless game (from a team/organization perspective) and lost their 2nd line center, with their 1st line center already out. How many games do we lose because of missing skill? A 5 min pp is not worth losing Hall for a whole season with a concussed head, the math just won’t jive. And for the record, taking a 2 or 5 min instigator is no different than taking a 2 or 5 min highsticking penalty (being “prickly”/ defending yourself).

  77. Lynas1 says:

    Lowetide,

    I used to watch wellwood play with the baby leafs back in the day. Always liked him. Better option then most. As far as I can see.

  78. Lowetide says:

    B S:
    Lowetide,

    The Oilers won a meaningless game (from a team/organization perspective) and lost their 2nd line center, with their 1st line center already out. How many games do we lose because of missing skill? A 5 min pp is not worth losing Hall for a whole season with a concussed head, the math just won’t jive. And for the record, taking a 2 or 5 min instigator is no different than taking a 2 or 5 min highsticking penalty (being “prickly”/ defending yourself).

    The Oilers spent the summer talking about possession of the puck and winning that way. They have a roster designed to use skill to outscore the opponent.

    Who would you like to have on the Hall-Hemsky line? Steve MacIntyre? He’s on waivers!

  79. fifthcartel says:

    John Shannon ‏@JSportsnet 19s

    No question…League is looking into Kassian/Gagner incident last night in Edmonton.
    Expand

  80. WheresYourTowel says:

    Name a heavyweight whose presence in the lineup would have kept last night’s shenanigans from happening.

    There isn’t one.

    Eakins is right. It’s the whole team’s responsibility to handle this stuff.

    No team in the NHL will go the entire season without a key player being injured. Many of them will be injured by another player’s carelessness or malice. The best revenge is living well, or in this case, winning.

  81. thejonrmcleod says:

    A similar play happened last season in a QMJHL game. A Moncton player along the boards in almost the exact same spot on the ice whipped his stick around and caught a Halifax player in the jaw and broke it. The Moncton player received a lengthy suspension. The player’s stick was actually caught in the glass and the result looked much work than I think his intent was.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39gNvhnwnIQ

  82. Lowetide says:

    Reinman posted the practice rosters today for Oil, probably close to tomorrow night’s game roster:

    L1: Hall-Smyth-Hemsky
    L2: Gordon-Omark-Yakupov
    L3: Lander-Jones-Hamilton
    L4: Arcobello-Joensuu-Pitlick

    D1: Ference-J Schultz
    D2: Smid-N Schultz
    D3: Belov-Larsen

    G1: Devan Dubnyk
    G2: Jason LaBarbera

  83. Racki says:

    In my opinion, the only answer is to dress the worst line up you possibly can in pre-season games vs. the Canucks from now on. This isn’t the first time they’ve goon-squaded the Oilers in pre-season either. It seems that they don’t give two shits about a loss in the pre-season, and why should they? Taking Hall, or Eberle or someone else out is going to go a lot further in the season than us fans having bragging rights that our team won a couple meaningless games.

    If the league isn’t going to do anything about it, what else can you do? When it comes to a season, it’s not just about winning the battle, but about winning the war. The Oilers might win that one game where we lose a couple of stars, but what good does it do the next 10-20 games? I am not advocating Steve MacIntyre (I don’t think……), but we need some guys on this team that are tough to play against in more than just the goal scoring sense. Insert Sean Connery Untouchables quote here.

  84. Lowetide says:

    Racki:
    In my opinion, the only answer is to dress the worst line up you possibly can in pre-season games vs. the Canucks from now on. This isn’t the first time they’ve goon-squaded the Oilers in pre-season either. It seems that they don’t give two shits about a loss in the pre-season, and why should they? Taking Hall, or Eberle or someone else out is going to go a lot further in the season than us fans having bragging rights that our team won a couple meaningless games.

    If the league isn’t going to do anything about it, what else can you do? When it comes to a season, it’s not just about winning the battle, but about winning the war. The Oilers might win that one game where we lose a couple of stars, but what good does it do the next 10-20 games? I am not advocating Steve MacIntyre (I don’t think……), but we need some guys on this team that are tough to play against in more than just the goal scoring sense. Insert Sean Connery Untouchables quote here.

    We don’t know the league isn’t going to do anything about it (although I won’t be shocked if nothing happens). However, I think I have a solution that you might like: Hall on Clutterbuck.

    Is that the kind of thing you’d like to see? They injure one of our guys, we injure one of their guys?

  85. Clarence Oveur says:

    In terms of a “Clutterbuck-type player”, I think that’s what the Oilers hope Ben Eager will be…only more useful.

    There’s really no way to deter those kind of players. All you can hope for is a suspension. A guy like Kassian, with his size and physicality, will almost always have a place on a NHL roster. Just a reality that you have to live with.

    However, it would be nice if the Oilers played the role of aggressor every once in a while…

  86. VanOil says:

    I am warming to the idea of Eberle as the second line center behind Hall.

    2 scoring lines is better than 1. The Mythical 3 scoring lines was but another summer dream.

    Gagner will at the very least have good in house medical advise. If that young lady can Doctor her man and sweat baby Nuge in the basement back to full health by Nov 1st she should be elected/aclaimed Mayor

  87. Clarence Oveur says:

    I wish the Oilers had Raffi Torres around.

    Talk about a flying missile who could play…

  88. Racki says:

    Lowetide: We don’t know the league isn’t going to do anything about it (although I won’t be shocked if nothing happens). However, I think I have a solution that you might like: Hall on Clutterbuck.

    Is that the kind of thing you’d like to see? They injure one of our guys, we injure one of their guys?

    If you’re calling my bluff, consider it a success… no I don’t like to see that kind of stuff (Hall on Clutterbuck). I did like seeing MacIntyre completely crush Dustin Boyd that one year. I don’t think that was a clean hit.. but that’s almost what I’m looking for.. something that is maybe not quite clean, not quite dirty. But I don’t want to see anyone kneeing another player, even if I despise Clutterbuck. It was definitely a taste of his own medicine though. Clutterbuck has had plenty of hits that weren’t clean in his day. But I think knees should be off-limits.

    As far as league involvement… they might penalize Kassian for his errant stick, but the guy that nearly took Hall’s head off with an elbow will go unpunished, as will the hit from behind on Nurse. Can’t see anything happening there because the league isn’t big on punishing for intent or possible outcome.

  89. Lowetide says:

    Racki: If you’re calling my bluff, consider it a success… no I don’t like to see that kind of stuff. I did like seeing MacIntyre completely crush Dustin Boyd that one year. I don’t think that was a clean hit.. but that’s almost what I’m looking for.. something that is maybe not quite clean, not quite dirty. But I don’t want to see anyone kneeing another player, even if I despise Clutterbuck.

    As far as league involvement… they might penalize Kassian for his errant stick, but the guy that nearly took Hall’s head off with an elbow will go unpunished, as will the hit from behind on Nurse. Can’t see anything happening there because the league isn’t big on punishing for intent or possible outcome.

    Actually, I wasn’t calling your bluff, I was happy Hall did that to Clutterbuck. Remember, Messier’s my all time favorite Oiler–it’s like a brush back pitch in baseball. I much prefer an actual NHL player who can play outside the law once in awhile to an enforcer who wastes a roster spot.

  90. Racki says:

    Wow, will wonders ever cease.. I stand corrected. Bob Mc just tweeted that the NHL is reviewing the Weise hit on Hall (in addition to the Kassian stick on Gagner). But reviewing is only half the battle, GI Joe.

  91. Racki says:

    Lowetide: Actually, I wasn’t calling your bluff, I was happy Hall did that to Clutterbuck. Remember, Messier’s my all time favorite Oiler–it’s like a brush back pitch in baseball. I much prefer an actual NHL player who can play outside the law once in awhile to an enforcer who wastes a roster spot.

    Ahh, I wasn’t sure. For some reason I didn’t quite get the giddy feeling I thought I would when that happened. I didn’t feel sorry for Clutterbuck though. Knees are just a touchy thing, I guess. But Moose is the ultimate example for payback…. come check me.. I dare you. There’ll be an elbow/stick to come through first. That’s not a bad idea, but I just am not sure I want that being in Hall’s hands since nowadays it comes with a suspension… and more and more as you do it. It’s like there’s no winning unless you beat them at their own game by running their stars with your own thug.

    Actually part of me inside might have done a Nail Yakupov knee slide when I saw Cal Clutterbuck writhing around on the ice… it was more the “Oh sh–.. Hall’s going to talk to Shanny for that one” that I didn’t like, perhaps.

  92. Lucinius says:

    What the NHL needs, more than anything else, is a playerbase that will call out its own in the media. Vancouver, and several other teams, have thrived by being dirty. And no one calls them on it where it matters — the mainstream media. Until that happens the league and NHLPA will never do anything to impact the benefit of being a dirty team.

    Because, let’s be honest; being dirty helps your team. Worst case scenario is you get suspended for 1-12 games. You could be putting the better players of rivals out for months. Until suspension lengths start at being the length of the victim’s injury +1-12 games nothing will ever change.

  93. G Money says:

    Lowetide: We don’t know the league isn’t going to do anything about it (although I won’t be shocked if nothing happens). However, I think I have a solution that you might like: Hall on Clutterbuck.
    Is that the kind of thing you’d like to see? They injure one of our guys, we injure one of their guys?

    The safe bet is that nothing will happen. The league is consistently full of excuse makers for the dirty crap.

    And is that what I want to see, an eye for an eye? Yes, absofuckinglutely yes. The intent here is not to turn hockey into MMA, the point is that once it becomes obvious that you will give as good as you get, it turns into old fashioned MAD – mutually assured destruction – and the end result is a cold war, where hockey players deal mostly with hockey instead of surgery.

    “Take out Sammy and my goon will (try to) beat up your goon” has no deterrence value at all. “Take out Sammy and it’ll cost you a Sedin” just might.

    I’m certainly tired of our players being the only ones on IR from unrelenting cheap shots deliverd by league-sanctioned scum.

  94. tcho says:

    If the NHL does something meaningful about this, fine. If not, it’s time for some frontier justice Bobby Clarke style imo. It can’t be open season for every ape-on-skates on the Oilers young skill players.

    And, of course, it HAD to be a centre…

  95. Lowetide says:

    Racki: What the NHL needs, more than anything else, is a playerbase that will call out its own in the media. Vancouver, and several other teams, have thrived by being dirty. And no one calls them on it where it matters — the mainstream media. Until that happens the league and NHLPA will never do anything to impact the benefit of being a dirty team.

    The Oilers put up with more crap than the Wild than anyone over the years imo, and it doesn’t hurt to let them know the dog bites. Pronger was gold for that, he was filthy. Jason Smith too, but more subtle (Satan is more subtle than pronger).

    Anyway, if the Oilers and Canucks meet early in the season and Ryan Hamilton cuts Sedin with a late hit or a hip check that looks dirty on film? Hey, Kassian on Gagner baby.

    THAT is a long way from an enforcer, though.

  96. G Money says:

    VanOil: I am warming to the idea of Eberle as the second line center behind Hall.

    I think so too.

    Perron-Hall-Hemsky and Smyth-Eberle-Yak (or variations thereof) as the top 6 are far more heartwarming than any lineup that has Acrobello in it, Gordon above third line, or this pale watered down Omark we’re seeing anywhere on wing.

    I drew up the lines as above because the last few games do suggest – as someone previously posted – that it sure is looking like Yak can carry a line all by himself. Put him with Smyth and Eberle and you might still have a robust second line.

  97. G Money says:

    Lucinius: Until that happens the league and NHLPA will never do anything to impact the benefit of being a dirty team.

    Actually, the NHLPA is one of the worst offenders in this matter.

    There have been proposals that would harshly punish the dirty players, but I know the NHLPA in most cases has vigorously opposed the idea that their members could somehow be fined, suspended, etc. by another avenue.

    And in so doing, they are protecting the 10% of their membership who are scum at the cost of the health of the other 90% – or more often, the elite 20%.

  98. Colonel Obvious says:

    Lowetide is right on this. There really are only three options.

    1) Let the league enforce the rules to protect the players. Do nothing to retaliate, score on power play, win games. Or:
    2) Put up you best Sean Connery imitation and put one of them in the morgue for everyone of theirs in the hospital.
    3) Make guys like Wiese pay the price by fighting after the fact. We’ll call this the Spector option.

    Now none of these are really acceptable. In the first place, the league won’t suspend players the way they should and so your guys are always going to get run sometime. But at least you have a chance to win. The second won’t work because the league will punish the deliberate retaliations and, like lowetide said, it isn’t really hockey. The Spector option is the worst of all. It doesn’t protect the players and it doesn’t help you win games. It’s just stupid all the way around.

    So the best you can do is to bite the bullet and accept the injuries. If you must act tough then I agree that you should avoid the Weise’s of the world and try putting the Sedins in the hospital. But fighting after the fact is totally pointless. There is no deterrent and no revenge, just a wasted roster spot on a useless player.

  99. Manitoba Oilers says:

    Dreger said Gagner will have surgery to fix jaw as early as tommorow

  100. Lucinius says:

    G Money,

    Don’t get me started on the NHLPA. God damn. I loathe the player unions in pro sports. They’re worse than useless as they actively harm the ability to enhance player safety.

  101. Wolfie says:

    The only way to stop crap like this from happening is for the league to impose sanctions against teams that condone such actions. It was obvious the Canucks were taking liberties last night. It isn’t the first time either.

    I have no problem with guys playing hard within the rules. But, if you cause injury with a clearly illegal play you should have the book thrown at you and your team.

    It’s not ok anymore and the NHL better be careful because a precedent has been set by the lawsuit the NFLPA alumni brought against the NFL. The league must take player safety seriously or risk serious financial penalties.

    I have a couple of ideas. Some of which would probably need to be negotiated into the CBA. The league already allows for fines and suspensions to coaches who send the goon squad for “message sending”. This needs to be expanded to include dirty play.

    Firstly, why would the league allow borderline players to take out stars? Why would the PA allow it? After all, fans pay money to see the skill not the stick and elbow swinging Neanderthals. Referees need to be more aware of situations like last night where there is clearly roster discrepancies. They need to be proactive and be very harsh with any shenanigans. Especially in pre-season.

    So, my proposal is two-fold. Along with suspensions and fines to players it should also extend to the coach for icing said player and to the franchise for hiring that player. The league could fine the franchise and have it count against cap-space and they could take away draft picks. It could be done on a sliding scale based on injury and value of the injured player.

    Any here think this stuff would continue to happen if Vancouver were fined the equivalent of Gagner’s pro-rated salary for the duration of his injury and a pick in next summer’s draft?

  102. Racki says:

    Lowetide: The Oilers put up with more crap than the Wild than anyone over the years imo, and it doesn’t hurt to let them know the dog bites. Pronger was gold for that, he was filthy. Jason Smith too, but more subtle (Satan is more subtle than pronger).

    Anyway, if the Oilers and Canucks meet early in the season and Ryan Hamilton cuts Sedin with a late hit or a hip check that looks dirty on film? Hey, Kassian on Gagner baby.

    THAT is a long way from an enforcer, though.

    I’m with you there, and I think I even talked myself out of not liking Hall’s knee on Clutterbuck. F— Clutterbuck.. he’s attempted to injure enough guys in the league that it was about time he got his. I don’t want Hall doing that though.

    The league wants to be in charge of player safety, but let’s face it… they aren’t. They try to be, but they can’t do it. There will always be guys like Clutterbuck, Torres, Cooke, etc earning jobs by playing a game that borders on dirty. They may have a short shelf life, but someone else will come along and fill the job. I still think the league needs to nix the instigator rule… to an extent. I know this is impossible to police, but the league should protect Steve MacIntyre from randomly jumping Daniel Sedin, for sure… but they should turn a blind eye to MacIntyre beating the piss out of Weise after he takes a run at Hall. I know this type of hockey only works in my world, but the players did a much better of policing themselves.

    Taylor Hall gets run more times in a month than Wayne Gretzky was run in his entire career.. in a time when teams employed thugs in bulk. We can’t expect MacIntyre to ride shotgun for Hall, no, but if the instigator was thrown out, it might deter a player if they knew on their next shift Big Mac was hopping over the boards to put them in the same ward as Ivanins. Don’t get me wrong though.. I think the heavyweight is a big side show nowadays, but I think a lot of that has to do with the instigator rule.

    I’ve almost come full circle here. haha I honestly don’t know what the solution is.. I’m just tired of seeing the Oil get kicked around with no answer. One powerplay in a game isn’t going to do anything for us. A suspension that takes that player out of the game vs. OTHER TEAMS (most likely) isn’t going to do much for us either.

  103. Lowetide says:

    Racki: I think the solution is to score on the ensuing PP, have the NHL be stronger in penalty and then once or twice a year do something ghastly. I don’t like it, but the last option should be enforcer. He hurts the team. All ways.

  104. Bank Shot says:

    Would have been nice if MacT would have addressed toughness a little more over the offseason.

    Ference was a start, but when he was acquired and instantly became the Oilers toughest hockey player while only having a 5’10″ frame that shows just how far they need to go.

    You don’t need an enforcer, but I think you do need guys like Matt Greene that will give Kesler a nice forearm shiver.

  105. Racki says:

    Lowetide:
    Racki: I think the solution is to score on the ensuing PP, have the NHL be stronger in penalty and then once or twice a year do something ghastly. I don’t like it, but the last option should be enforcer. He hurts the team. All ways.

    Yah, but which do you think does more long term damage to a team…. Gagner out for .. let’s guess a month… or the Oilers get a PP goal in a 5-2 win, plus Kassian suspended for even half a dozen games. Kassian could get suspended for his entire career and the Canucks wouldn’t even show a dent on their team.

    I don’t have a solution though. Other than fighting fire with fire.. our own Kassian/Clutterbuck types making dirty hits on them when the opportunity strikes. Agree that the enforcer should be last resort, and it’s been proven (at least under the instigator) that it solves nothing.

    The NHL has to do more to clean up the game somehow. I like someone else’s suggestion about forfeiting draft picks. Hit ‘em where it matters. You know no matter what the league decides, Kassian will be playing his next game before Gagner does, for starters. And of the games Kassian misses.. most (or all? Not looking at schedule) will involve teams outside of the Oilers. One measly powerplay goal does not equate to the damage of not having Sam Gagner in the lineup.

  106. godot10 says:

    One would have hoped that MacT payed more attention to OKC in the playoffs last year.

    Anton Lander can hold the fort at centre between two good wingers. The Oilers can provide him with one decent one and one great one.

    Smyth/Hamilton, Hall, Hemsky
    Perron, Gordon, Eberle
    Jonesuu, Lander, Yakupov
    Hamilton/Smyth, Acton, Brown
    Eager, Arcobello.

  107. Colonel Obvious says:

    The solution is simple. Suspend everything, and suspend hard. If suspensions started at ten games this kind of thing wouldn’t happen. If Weise gets ten games for attempt to injure that sends a message like none other. Keep your fucking elbows down.

    This will never happen because the league doesn’t have the courage to stand up to their own teams. Every time Shanahan tries to get tough you can see the calls from the general managers telling him to back off. I thought Shanahan had stones but he’s clearly had them clipped by his buddies in the various front offices.

  108. wheatnoil says:

    Here’s an idea that might fix the problem, (which will NEVER happen, but hey, while we’re blue-skying):

    For every game that a player is suspended, the offending team has to transfer $100K in straight cash & salary cap room to the victim team.

    Example: If Kassian is suspended for 6 games, Vancouver transfers $600K in cash and salary cap room to the Oilers.

    (I know, it’ll never happen, but it would be both fun and effective at eliminating these events. The entire team is penalized while not changing total HRR / money to the players, just shifting it around. GMs & coaches would have to be very careful about the roster they build and how they play.)

  109. godot10 says:

    As for Kassian, one figures San Jose and LA will take out their pound of flesh out of a dirty Vancouver for the teams in the Pacific division.

    A goon is pointless. You want to get big skilled players over time. For now, LA and San Jose will have to police the division. LA and San Jose have real toughness and that will show up the pointlessness of Vancouver’s cheap and dirty (and mostly cowardly) tough guys.

    The Oilers have to build a team that can handle the “cleaner” team toughness of LA and San Jose, the way Chicago handled LA and Boston. Chicken shit goons to fight Vancouver’s chicken shit goons is a pointless self-defeating diversion.

    Mike Gillis is an idiot. I said this when he was being proclaimed as the latest genius. Nonis built Vancouver. Gillis surfed the wave and the wave has collapsed, and Gillis is Wiley Coyote now looking down and seeing nothing beneath him.

  110. B S says:

    @LT,

    If we’re talking about a preseason game against a rival known for gooning this time of year, I pickup MacIntyre in a heartbeat. I then forgo retaliation and get pre-emptive as soon as it becomes clear that the other team doesn’t want to play hockey. At the start of the regular season, I send him back down. That or offer Big Mac a contract to provide fighting lessons to all my players.

    The Oilers are going to need some toughness now that their goon is out with a broken jaw.

    Wolfie,

    If I thought the league would even enforce this I would support it. Hit them in the cap-space, nice, long term cost to the organization rather than an expendable player. Unfortunately the league doesn’t even enforce the rules it already has in place. Refs are too busy “managing” the game rather than calling the god-damned penalties in a consistent fashion that would make the boundaries clear for each game, and cut-down on a lot of the dirty play. If a player didn’t think he could get away with an errant stick, or an elbow, he wouldn’t do it. Sort of like when you speed on the highway. If you KNEW you were going to get caught, you wouldn’t do it, but because there’s a chance you’ll get away with it…

  111. prairieschooner says:

    This just means the Hall at centre experiment will be extended 4 weeks longer.
    It sounds like Nuge is going to miss no more than 2 weeks if at all, so leave Hall as number 1 centre and let the Nuge find his feet on the 2 line

  112. FastOil says:

    Woodguy: Yes, ignore 234 good things, find 1 or 2 not so good things and declare everything awful.

    Who could live upto that standard?

    I can’t agree with this. No pass can be given being short on quality NHL centres. You can’t win without them. The only position more important is net. Defence by committee works better than centre by committee.

    The team needed one the day he set foot in his new office. Moving a first and/or a top level asset seems to work for other GM’s filling holes. It happens every year. To me it is a sign of a really good GM. Not to ‘win every trade’ but by at least trading talent to a place your team needs it more and not screwing it up.

    Questions about the decisions being taken are valid. No one is perfect, but that doesn’t mean we can’t wonder. The biggest question marks on the team are Sam ‘can’t quite get there’ Gagner and no first pairing D. MacT seemed willing to deal for a goalie when he already has a good one and for an unproven aging isn’t really a power forward, but hasn’t made a hard go at C which matters more. More indicting is that there is no one in the system even close at C. No one.

    Gagner getting pushed to wing would be a nice luxury, more so than Belov pushing Potter to the minors.

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