THE DEPTH CHART THIS MORNING

Ten men gone yesterday means we’re down to 45 names and more to come this week. I think we can make one call now: Ryan Hamilton makes this hockey club.

azorcan

THE CERTAIN OILERS (18)

  • Goalies (2) Devan Dubnyk and Jason LaBarbera
  • Defensemen (5) Jeff Petry and Ladislav Smid, Justin Schultz and Andrew Ferense, Nick Schultz
  • Centermen (3) Ryan Nugent-Hopkins (inj), Sam Gagner, Boyd Gordon
  • Left Wing (4) Taylor Hall, David Perron, Jesse Joensuu, Ryan Smyth
  • Right Wing (4) Jordan Eberle, Nail Yakupov, Ales Hemsky, Ryan Jones

These are the men likely to break camp in the NHL. We’re not hearing any news on RNH but I bet you money there’s an internal timeline that has him playing NHL games well before November 1st. The goaltending is set, these 5 defensemen are here until a trade is made, and the forwards here have enough value to carry the day. The PKers (Gordon, Gagner, Smyth, Jones) are in somewhat short supply but we could see some of the younger set do those chores this season. My picks for the final “5″ are underlined:

THE UNCERTAIN OILERS (15)

  • Goalies (none)
  • Defensemen (7): Anton Belov, Denis Grebeshkov, Corey Potter, Phil Larsen, Oscar Klefbom, Martin Marincin, Taylor Fedun
  • Center (4): Anton Lander, Mark Arcobello, Will Acton, Andrew Miller
  • Left Wing (3): Linus Omark, Ryan Hamilton, Ben Eager
  • Right Wing (1): Mike Brown

I also think Corey Potter may end up on the IR before the season starts, which would make 8 defensemen protected from waivers. I’m picking Acton over Lander and Ryan Hamilton over Omark, and have selected Brown ahead of Eager. If Larsen makes the grade, I’m not sure which of the underlined guys doesn’t make it. The Russian blue have some work to do, but I think they’ll both end up on the opening night roster.

THE OUTSIDERS (12)

  • Goalies (4): Richard Bachman, Olivier Roy, Tyler Bunz, Ty Rimmer
  • Defensemen (6): Brad Hunt, Martin Gernat, Brandon Davidson, David Musil, Darnell Nurse, Joey Leach
  • Centermen (3): Ryan Martindale, CJ Stretch, Travis Ewanyk
  • Left Wing (5): Curtis Hamilton, Austin Fyten, Kale Kessy, Mitchell Moroz, Jujhar Khaira
  • Right Wing (4): Tyler Pitlick, Matt Ford, Derek Nesbitt, Cameron Abney

They’re all outside. ALL. outside.

kwai

POSSIBLE LINEUP TONIGHT

  • Gagner-Omark-Jones
  • Arcobello-R Hamilton-Yakupov
  • Lander-Joensuu-Pitlick
  • Martindale-Moroz-Abney
  • Smid-Petry
  • Grebeshkov-Larsen
  • Klefbom-Davidson
  • LaBarbera-Bachman

This is an interesting roster for a few reasons:

  1. Arcobello and Yakupov play together again. If Arco is proxy for Nuge, that might be a pairing.  Coach Eakins could pair up Hall-Eberle, Gagner-Perron and Nuge-Yakupov for three sets of top drawer forwards. 
  2. Omark and Jones also get a push. I don’t have Omark making the team but would love to see it. We’re also in the area where showcase  may be happening, so Omark’s performance tonight could help his NHL chances.
  3. Lander played a lot on Saturday and did fine, but I get the sense Acton is ahead of him. With the Oilers considering Arcobello seriously, Lander may be headed for Oklahoma City again. I wonder if Lander is going to be a long term Oiler? Doesn’t seem to have a role, and this is his third training camp (and third coach).
  4. Joensuu looks like a player. I think the Oilers pro scouting staff might have found a gem. Who do we credit? That Finnish scout who helped with Belov? Don’t know.
  5. The 4line should be fun to watch, Pitlick and Martindale with Abney. Man.
  6. Klefbom! Can’t wait to see him.
  7. Phil Larsen should be fun to watch, too.
  8. Don’t get down on Brandon Davidson if he struggles tonight. He’s moving up the depth chart, but has some ways to go. If he’s solid tonight against a pretty strong Winnipeg roster, well that’s one more hurdle.

kwai1

LOWDOWN WITH LOWETIDE

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@Lowetide_ on twitter, 10-1260 via text.

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82 Responses to "THE DEPTH CHART THIS MORNING"

  1. MrDooman says:

    If you hadn’t noticed. belov arrived yesterday. Has an interview up

  2. Lowetide says:

    Yeah, I don’t think his missing time is as much an issue as many say. Belov will probably see a lot of ice this week and play on the weekend or next week.

  3. j says:

    As much as I’d like to see Omark make it, I’d rather have Hamilton show up and steal a spot. He’s got size, hands, sandpaper, experience…pretty much everything the Oil are seeking on the wings. It would be a great story to make the bigs as a 28 year old (did I get his age right?).

  4. bookje says:

    I think the Oilers are considering keeping Omark with the goal of having three scoring lines. OR they are going to keep Omark, give him a big offensive push and trade him.

    The really positive thing about this is that it shows MacT understands that you don’t let something of value go to waste. Tambellini couldn’t trade Omark, but that’s because he didn’t understand that he had to give Omark an very good opportunity to succeed. Get him some NHL points and then trade him (or keep him).

  5. bookje says:

    With the injury to RNH, I can see both Hamilton and Omark making the team.

  6. In the Grease says:

    LT, I must preface this by saying I hope Joensuu is truly that hidden gem, real deal PF – would be a godsend – but in your previous article you emphasized the “small sample size” mantra regarding all the players vying for spots, and only one exhibition game played / don’t rush to judgement – however you already have Joensuu making the club after just one pre-season game?

    If he stinks it up tonight, does he fall back into equal footing with the fight for a spot with Eager, Omark, Hamilton?

    Like I said, I pray he continues to shine but I remember being optimistic about Hartikainen at one time….

  7. Lowetide says:

    in the grease: I had Joensuu making the club before TC:

    http://lowetide.ca/blog/2013/07/re-13-14-jesse-joensuu-life-on-mars.html

  8. Truth says:

    I would guess that MacT promised Omark a fair shot if he signed. Best case he shows that he can make the team or shows enough that they can get an asset in return through trade. Worst case his defensive liability still outweighs his offensive value in the NHL and he goes to waivers. At that point I don’t think it really matters if he gets picked up by someone else or he plays in OKC. He would be a great offensive option in OKC, but it’s a waste of a development spot with the (almost) guarantee he signs elsewhere in the off-season.

    I’m pushing for him to show well so the Oilers can actually get something in return. Maybe that enforcer that can also play a little that was talked about last week.

  9. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    “Phil Larsen”

    Eakins had some nice things to say about him in his PC yesterday. Praised his speed, gaps and puck moving. I’m not sure that he isn’t a surprise win from the Horcov trade yet.

    ———
    “I also think Corey Potter may end up on the IR before the season starts”

    I think that is a solid bet. It will give them some roster flexibility and allow them to keep more beans in the bag as the first two weeks of the regular season try out rolls out.

    ——–
    “I’m picking Acton over Lander”

    It seems not very long ago you were attributing the lack of a C acquisition to the rise of Lander in the eyes of MacT. I think you said something about MacT seeing Lander follow his own path or some such.

    Seems you’ve had a sharp turn from Lander to Acton. Is this simply a “trick knee/gut feeling” kind of thing, or are you seeing something new?

    Also, I think we should be open to the possibility that even barring injury the competition for the 4 C spots stays intense through the first month of the season. Lander may well go down only to pop back up and stay after 2 or 3 weeks.

    ———-
    “Joensuu looks like a player. I think the Oilers pro scouting staff might have found a gem. Who do we credit? That Finnish scout who helped with Belov? Don’t know.”

    MATTI VIRMANEN

    F. Musil may have had a hand. These guys are amassing an interesting resume.

    ———-
    From JW more evidence that offers were on the table for Whitney last year as Tambo sat on his thumbs:

    http://blogs.edmontonjournal.com/2013/09/16/ex-edmonton-oilers-tom-gilbert-ryan-whitney-hoping-to-earn-new-contracts/

    From Matty Kharia is more an Oiler everyday (he’s got a shoulder injury):

    http://www.edmontonjournal.com/sports/hockey/edmonton-oilers/Belov+plays+catch+Oilers+training+camp/8919942/story.html

  10. In the Grease says:

    Arcobello and Yakupov play together again. If Arco is proxy for Nuge, that might be a pairing. Coach Eakins could pair up Hall-Eberle, Gagner-Perron and Nuge-Yakupov for three sets of top drawer forwards.

    Further to your idea on pairings , which I dig, taking a highly optmistic road on Joensuu, and taking into account players usual positions, could we fill in the rest of the lines? This may sound crazy, but to open the season, what if….

    Joensuu – Hall – Eberle

    Omark – Nuge – Yakupov

    Perron – Gagner – Hemsky

    Smyth – Gordon – Jones

    extra forwards: Hamilton, Brown.

    Hamilton could draw in for Omark, Brown for Jones, as size / fisticuff ratio requires

  11. steveb12344 says:

    In the Grease: LT, I must preface this by saying I hope Joensuu is truly that hidden gem, real deal PF – would be a godsend – but in your previous article you emphasized the “small sample size” mantra regarding all the players vying for spots, and only one exhibition game played / don’t rush to judgement – however you already have Joensuu making the club after just one pre-season game?If he stinks it up tonight, does he fall back into equal footing with the fight for a spot with Eager, Omark, Hamilton?Like I said, I pray he continues to shine but I remember being optimistic about Hartikainen at one time….

    The difference is that while Harski has always looked like a strong prospect, JJ actually looks like a real NHL’er. I know small samples and all, but if he turns out to be the real deal. It would be (to steal a phrase from LT) manna from heaven!!!

  12. In the Grease says:

    Lowetide,

    Ah yes I do remember reading that article now, but as I have only limited storage capacity in my brain, it was displaced by many recent articles / interpretations of reality… duly noted, apologies, and hope Joensuu tears it up against the Jets…. looking forward

  13. Jordan says:

    Martindale-Moroz-Abney

    5. The 4line should be fun to watch, Pitlick and Martindale with Abney. Man.

    One of these things is not like the other…
    One of these things just doesn’t belong…
    Can you tell me which thing is not like the others…
    By the time I finish this song…

    =)

  14. In the Grease says:

    In the Grease,

    Sorry, not to “open the season” but once Nuge returns….

  15. steveb12344 says:

    Also RE: Gilbert… The guy has the tools and he can play. Problem is he is softer than a soup sandwich!

  16. DeadmanWaking says:

    When Bolt ran 9.58 the only person muttering about sample size was the director of filling your vial. No-one was yelling “Fluke!” Between Omark and Joensuu, Omark needs to piss more drops.

  17. bookje says:

    Those of you who don’t normally read Oilersnation might want to jump over and read Gregor’s interview with Ryan Jones. In discussing Eakins, he has some insights into previous coaches -”You want to know what, there are doers and talkers and we’ve unfortunately had a lot of people who were great talkers. And I mean even to you guys, they answered all of the questions the right way but it seemed like it was never different in the room compared to when I came here all of the way through last year. ”

    Interesting insight – hopefully Eakins brings change to the team – they need it.

  18. Woodguy says:

    Alan Hull from Copper and Blue. Oilers blue depth chart, who wins 4C job? and tonight’s lineup.

    If Alan brings up Steckel again please tell him that he is as bad as Shero trading for Doug Murray at the deadline.

    By every report Steckel is done as an NHLer. Too slow to keep up to even 4th line play.

    Everyone keeps mentioning bringing in Steckel as insurance, and the only thing he will assure is that the 4th line gets out-shot for the 29th year in a row.

    He wan win a draw. Whee!!!!! So what?

  19. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    Truth: Worst case his defensive liability still outweighs his offensive value in the NHL and he goes to waivers.

    I think that is a great situation for Omark. His deal was tailored to be attractive to another team for a waiver pick up. It’s a no risk infusion of offence.

    Omark is playing for 30 GMs every night.

  20. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    Woodguy: Steckel

    He’s on a PTO with the Wild. Doesn’t mean we couldn’t nab him, but it probably makes it less likely.

    In the Grease,

    I think a lot of people are relying more on Joensuu’s somewhat large sample size in Europe, then his lack-lustre NHL play or his recent exhibition game.

    He is, though, a big wild card, as you mention.

  21. Numenius says:

    In his interview yesterday, Eakins mentioned they had a tough decision to make at forward. No doubt that decision is between Omark and R. Hamilton.

    Omark has to clear waivers to go down and Hamilton doesn’t. I wonder how much that will affect the decision if they both play well. Is there some new reason that you think Hamilton makes it over Omark, LT? Because it would make sense that (if they both show well) Omark stays and Hamilton gets sent down until the first injury. Then they don’t risk losing anyone to waivers.

    Though I agree that if Omark didn’t have to clear waivers my bet would be on going with Hamilton to start out and sending Omark down.

  22. Hammers says:

    The Omark / Hamilton question must also be seen re injuries . If you have 5 skilled wingers and 4 bangers playing what do you need of the bench when , Hemsky , Perron or an Ebs is injured . Personally I would prefer Omark . They need to hang onto skill over brawn . Actually same goes for Smyth . That’s what preseason is supposed to tell us I guess .

  23. Lowetide says:

    Numenius:
    In his interview yesterday, Eakins mentioned they had a tough decision to make at forward. No doubt that decision is between Omark and R. Hamilton.

    Omark has to clear waivers to go down and Hamilton doesn’t. I wonder how much that will affect the decision if they both play well. Is there some new reason that you think Hamilton makes it over Omark, LT? Because it would make sense that (if they both show well) Omark stays and Hamilton gets sent down until the first injury. Then they don’t risk losing anyone to waivers.

    Though I agree that if Omark didn’t have to clear waivers my bet would be on going with Hamilton to start out and sending Omark down.

    I think the Oilers still need to scratch the “David Clarkson” itch. I’m not sure Hamilton is the guy, but they’re going to give (imo) Joensuu and Hamilton every chance to play a role on this club. At some point, a guy like Hamilton is an unknown. However, he had a good game Saturday and he comes right back in the next game on a skill line. And he’s already posted some crooked boxcar numbers.

    These are important things. Small, but important.

  24. BlacqueJacque says:

    Lowetide,

    Yeah… but I just hope they don’t try to address it in free agency the way they did with Clarkson. Not whale hunting, at least. The Leafs contract offer was ludicrous, I can’t imagine what the Oilers offer was like if they were disappointed that he took 7×5.25. I mean, we still have Nuge, Yak, Schultzy to sign, plus another 15-16 roster spots to fill counting the kids.

  25. Lowetide says:

    BlacqueJacque:
    Lowetide,

    Yeah… but I just hope they don’t try to address it in free agency the way they did with Clarkson.Not whale hunting, at least.The Leafs contract offer was ludicrous, I can’t imagine what the Oilers offer was like if they were disappointed that he took 7×5.25.I mean, we still have Nuge, Yak, Schultzy to sign, plus another 15-16 roster spots to fill counting the kids.

    And that’s why Hamilton gets a lot of leeway imo.

  26. VanOil says:

    Over 82 games Depth or Squads are important as is NHL caliber Centers.

    I would run Home and Away squads in TOI order;

    Away Team
    RNH-Hall-Eberle becease it works
    Gordon-Perron-Hemsky legit responsible 2nd line
    Gagner-Joensuu-Yakupov Soft Comp/Starts – domination to follow
    Maholtra-Smyth-Lander Malhotra is worth a PTO, Lander should start on the wing, Give brutal zone starts

    Home Team at the Northlands Raceway
    RNH-Hall-Yakupov
    Gagner-Perron-Eberle
    Gordon-Omark-Hemsky
    Maholtra-Joensuu-Jones

    Defense
    Smid-Petry
    Ferrence-J.Shultz
    Crazy Ivan (G or B)-N.Shutltz

    Petry on the IR, Larson and Fedun first callups

    - Smyth should only play 50 games

    - I realize Brown beats Omark to a job (because NHL) but I prefer my supper subs to be Ole Gunnar Solskjær not Ogie Ogilthorpe

    - Teams would fear coming to Rexall, for if you dress face punchers our skill will break your ankles

  27. BlacqueJacque says:

    Lowetide,

    I know you’re a big MacT fan and I do give you a hard time about it, but what was your genuine reaction when you saw that the Oilers offered Clarkson (he of like 5 goals over the last 20 games, and 6 in the last 34 of last season – in those 34 games he also had 3 assists) that much money?

  28. speeds says:

    Numenius,

    Is it possible it relates to Mike Brown?

  29. speeds says:

    Quick RNH contract talks update from Principe:

    The Oilers have made an offer to RNH and his camp is looking it over.No snags or issues are expected. This deal could be done in a few days.— Gene Principe (@GenePrincipe) September 17, 2013

  30. bookje says:

    Re:RNH deal!

    Prediction- 7 years @$42 million.

    Additional Prediction- Immediately after the contract announcement, RNH indicates that his shoulder is now a ‘New 100%’ and that he will have to adjust to playing at this new 100% level, but he is optimistic looking forwards.

    (Sorry – as an Oilers fan, I have scars that run deep that sometimes emerge as pessimistic thoughts like this)

  31. Ryan says:

    bookje,

    For whatever reason, I seem to recall Omark getting a push two years ago early in the season. I think it was with Nuge and Hall… From what I recall, Omark wasn’t effective at all and probably because he was always a step behind.

    Omark has skill, but he lacks both size and more importantly, food speed. I’d be surprised if he showcases well enough to get any interest from other teams.

  32. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    On the “David Clarkson Itch” two thoughts have been bubbling up for me.

    1. I think they are hoping Joensuu and/or Hamilton can be something of a Bickell. A guy meandering at the bottom of the roster who can hop up and down lines, play with skilled players and add some grit. I think they are setting their sites a little lower than Lucic, losing Clarkson made this option possible.

    2. I think we need to contextualize that big contract MacT offered Clarkson. I think that deal is part of a line of thought that goes: We need top 6 toughness. We can get it here without giving up a player. We can keep our Winnik in Magnus.

    While I don’t like the contract, I think the Oilers are better with Magnus and Clarkson than they are with Perron and take your pick (Joensuu, Hamilton, etc.)

  33. BlacqueJacque says:

    Romulus Apotheosis,

    If we signed Clarkson, we would HAVE to give up players. Not immediately, but through cap issues.

    Do you give up three decent third-liners and replace them with fourth-liners in an attempt to fit Clarkson and the kids under the cap, or do you give up one of the kids?

  34. TheOtherJohn says:

    We will be judging Omark, Hamilton Joensuu and the 15 guys trying for 3 NHL spots at 6/7/PB D on the last 2-3 preseason games when they are playing against NHL rosters. The guys who can’t think fast enough do fine till the game speeds up, ditto guts with footspeed issues. There are lots of outstandinmg scorers who are unable to score when the speed of the game accelerates

  35. LostBoy says:

    Ryan:

    Omark has skill, but he lacks both size and more importantly, food speed.I’d be surprised if he showcases well enough to get any interest from other teams.

    I don’t know that I’d totally agree with that. Omark has plus speed, he just doesn’t use it much on the attack. He likes to stickhandle while gliding and very often stops skating as he enters the offensive zone. It’s almost like he prefers to slow the game down. When I see it in action I always think of it as playing the game as if it was one of those slow shootout attempts where the player goes way laterally and swoops in slowly at an angle to try to perform fancy dekery. For my money, he’s more effective when he is pumping his feet and shrugging off larger players on the forecheck. For whatever reason, he just doesn’t like to attack at speed. Hemsky goes through periods like this, when he tries to toe drag while coasting, and he’s always less effective. It’s more the default setting for Omark, but he’s also better at pulling it off at lower speeds.

  36. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    BlacqueJacque:
    Romulus Apotheosis,

    If we signed Clarkson, we would HAVE to give up players.Not immediately, but through cap issues.

    Do you give up three decent third-liners and replace them with fourth-liners in an attempt to fit Clarkson and the kids under the cap, or do you give up one of the kids?

    Well, I think MacT’s dream scenario would have been something like this:

    Sign Clarkson (way too much money)
    Sign Magnus to similar deal he got in STL
    No Perron
    Trade Horcoff’s contract
    Trade Hemsky’s contract
    Trade N. Schultz’ contract
    Replace Horcoff, Hemsky and Schultz with cheaper players (i.e., Gordon, Zach Smith (say?), Belov)

    Long term, yes, he’d have some shuffling to do, or praying that the cap rises, but I think that is what he thought was possible.

  37. crude says:

    VanOil,

    Your away team specifically is the lineup I was pencilling in in my dome earlier today. That second line with Perron and Gordon and hemsky is appealing to me. Perron having played under Hitchcock may have a defensive acumen most of the squad besides Gordon lacks. They could be a load in all zones.
    Jones and smyth could swap in and out depending on how either is rolling. And that soft comp assassin line (yak and gags and whoever) could really make hay if they find the groove. Could come a point in the season where Ebs and Yak switch places in the batting order too.

  38. bookje says:

    Ryan:
    bookje,

    For whatever reason, I seem to recall Omark getting a push two years ago early in the season.I think it was with Nuge and Hall… From what I recall, Omark wasn’t effective at all and probably because he was always a step behind.

    Omark has skill, but he lacks both size and more importantly, food speed.I’d be surprised if he showcases well enough to get any interest from other teams.

    Well, in the 2011-12 season, Omark played 14 games. He spent 38.1% of his time with Eric Belanger, 28.3% with Ryan Smith (his top linemate), 25.3% with Shawn Horcoff, 23.8% with Sam Gagner, 23.5% with MPS, 22.9% with Ales Hemsky. I can’t figure out how to get Behind the net to show me how much time he spent with RNH and Hall, but it can’t be much as it would be less than those other linemates (given how behindthenet shows the data from highest to lowest).

    In 2010, the year he played 51 games, he spent 60.5%with MPS, 42.6% with Gagner, 22% with Cogliano, and 14.8% with Liam Reddox. Hall would be less than that (as he doesn’t show up in the top 10 linemates) and RNH was not on the team yet.

    In 2011-12, he was part of the Belanger Triangle and in 2010-11 he was producing at more than 0.5 pts per game with modest linemates.

    So, I am not sure why you thought he got a push with Hall and Nuge, but it didn’t happen according to the data.

  39. spoiler says:

    I think we need to consider the outside possibility that the Oil could use Khaira’s 10 game trial exemption to cover for RNH’s injury, if they felt he was up to it. Not saying this is their number one option, but that they haven’t closed the door on this option yet. He plays a physical, hard-checking game well-suited to the 4th line.

    I think it likely they will go with a more “mature” player, but the possibility exists that they could give Khaira a couple of games with limited minutes so they can have a look at how he presently stacks up against top pros, with no consequences to his Junior eligibilty.

    And if it is an immediate fail, then it is simple to send him down after one or two games and plug in Lander or Acton.

  40. Ryan says:

    bookje,

    It happened according to IIRC…. :P

    It was a one or two game push, not extended. Renney pulled the plug because even I could see he was a step behind and it wasn’t working.

    Regardless, Omark can’t skate fast enough to keep up with our top six.

    Small, slow and skilled = AHL allstar

  41. Colonel Obvious says:

    Re: RNH contract.

    I think everyone is overvaluing the player. While clearly a good and valuable player he isn’t in Hall’s class as a player and he has never been in Hall’s class as a player.

    So while $6M a year is a decent deal by UFA standards, Hopkins isn’t a UFA. I see no reason why he should be paid like a UFA when he’s still in his entry level contract.

    The $6M/long term contracts should be reserved for the Tavares/Stamkos/Hall type player. I think the Avalanche overpaid Landeskog but even so Hopkins is a lot closer to Landeskog in value than Hall. So six years/39M is my limit.

    There is no plus side to giving him $6M a year now. If he shoots the lights out and scores at a point a game (which is not a reasonable expectation) he’s still not getting more than that one year from now.

    There is no reason to pay him like an eighty or ninety point player before he is one. If you pay for imagined future production there is only downside to the contract. Pay for what the player is, not what he might become.

  42. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    Ryan:
    bookje,

    It happened according to IIRC….

    It was a one or two game push, not extended.Renney pulled the plug because even I could see he was a step behind and it wasn’t working.

    Regardless, Omark can’t skate fast enough to keep up with our top six.

    Small, slow and skilled = AHL allstar

    remember when Renney gave Petrell the first line push? that was great!

  43. VanOil says:

    crude,

    Away from home specifically I like Gordon with Perron and Hemsky. Defensively well versed as you stated but with an offensive edge as well. Gordon would be playing with a lot more talent than he is used to.

    After reading Parkatti on C&B prediction for Yaks scoring based on minutes played. I want him to play more minutes. I also hope some one challenges him to lead the team in shots every night.

    I often refer back to a story that Tkachuk and Selanne had a $100 bet per game in there second year on who could get the most shots. I wish I could find a reference for this but even with out it I would love for our top 5 wingers to engage in this.

  44. G Money says:

    bookje: I can’t figure out how to get Behind the net to show me how much time he spent with RNH and Hall, but it can’t be much as it would be less than those other linemates (given how behindthenet shows the data from highest to lowest).

    What you want is this:

    http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/showplayer.php?pid=1420&withagainst=true&season=2010-11&sit=5v5

    In 2010, Omark spent a grand total of 15mins with Hall and 2 with Hemsky, but lots of time with Cogs, Gags, and Mags.

  45. godot10 says:

    I’m pretty sure both Omark and Hamilton have to clear waivers. Both have big AHL salaries, which act as a pretty good deterent, unless the claiming team is sold on using them in the NHL.

    As for Omark, the Oilers are no longer a particularly good fit, whereas Hamilton is. And Omark is not only competing with Hamilton, he is competing with Arcobello, who can also play centre as well as wing.

  46. godot10 says:

    I don’t see how the Oilers and Nugent-Hopkins can agree on a salary for a long term contract before he get 40 games in.

    One would think, these are just very preliminary talks.

    If Nugent-Hopkins doesn’t have the boxcars, his side will almost certainly go for a bridge contract a la Matt Duschene.

    But if Nugent-Hopkins has the boxcars, when then a Hall-like deal is possible.

  47. hunter1909 says:

    Colonel Obvious,

    Oilers have three 1st overall picks.

    So far, all appear to be developing like 1st overall picks.

    Taylor Hall, like you say, is the gold standard for salary on the team. RNH looks like a great player. It’s not smart management to play games at this point in time. So, you pay the player. If he busts, you buy him out later.

    Recalling when mighty Mike Comrie was commanding mega-attention…

  48. rickithebear says:

    No perron!
    his 31 goals 22nd LW
    and .30GPG 21st for LW
    since return from Concussion.

    right there with
    Llucic 33G .26GPG 6M
    Zetterberg 33G .26GPG 6.1M
    Landeskog 31G .26GPG 5.6M
    Parenteau 36G .28GPG 4.0M
    Benn 38G .34GPG 5.25M
    Ericksson 38g .29GPG 4.25M
    Crazy!

  49. jake70 says:

    RNH contract. The Oilers have some flexibility/bargaining power here. The certainty is the Hall (and Eberle possibly) contract, which, l’ll repeat myself, may be the most important move the Oilers have made in years, 7 years at 6M (good job Tambo – don’t ban me…lol). This is your Lidstrom comparable, your ceiling. If Hall can keep his pace up, Yak and RNH progress, but not beyond Hall’s output, you are in business. Cap stays the same, cap goes up, doesn’t matter – you have your benchmark. 6M X 4 (Hall, Eberle, Yak, RNH) – 24M max certainty the next 7-10 years is assumed. If you can keep that, and find some value contracts along the way, you might just need 2+ spaces in that SC cabinet entering the Oiler locker room. If cap goes down well, let’s not talk about that.

  50. jake70 says:

    There are several ifs in my scenario obviously. Planets, please align.

  51. Bad Seed says:

    Colonel Obvious,

    I agree with your sentiments but aren’t you handing RNH 6.5M/yr in your scenario?

  52. bookje says:

    G Money: What you want is this:

    http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/showplayer.php?pid=1420&withagainst=true&season=2010-11&sit=5v5

    In 2010, Omark spent a grand total of 15mins with Hall and 2 with Hemsky, but lots of time with Cogs, Gags, and Mags.

    Thanks for the link!

  53. Ca$h-Money! says:

    Colonel Obvious,

    6yr/$39m is more than Hall by my math….

  54. commonfan14 says:

    Colonel Obvious: There is no reason to pay him like an eighty or ninety point player before he is one.

    When was the last time an established 80-90 point player signed for only $6 million per year? The Sedins 4 years ago?

  55. Ca$h-Money! says:

    commonfan14,

    80-90 point players (like Getzlaf and Perry) are making $8.5/year… and are locked up until their late 30s.

  56. delooper says:

    Ca$h-Money!:
    commonfan14,
    80-90 point players (like Getzlaf and Perry) are making $8.5/year…and are locked up until their late 30s.

    Why are people talking about “established 80-90 point players”? The conversation is RNH and his contract. RNH is close to establishing a baseline of about 50 points per season minimum, and he’ll certainly get better. How much better, who knows.

  57. Truth says:

    I hope the Hall and Eberle contracts were the idea of Tambellini. Although they will end up being bargain contracts, I am hoping MacT takes the “bridge” contract approach to RNH. I would have no issue with them paying him $3.75M/yr until the year before he hits UFA. Then lock him up for 8 years at the contract price he earned to that point. He would then be around 32 when he becomes a UFA and an extension should be going down in price. Elite #1 centers are franchise players. It would be a shame to sign him now for 6 years for him to become a UFA when he’s 27 and looking for market value while he’s in the prime of his career.

    What would you rather:

    - 3 years at $3.75M until final year RFA + 8 years at his value (as low as $5M and up to ~ $9M/year). Retain RNH 11 years past his ELC (age 32?) with his next contract going down and a potential for him walking away.

    - 6 years @ $6M/year. Retain RNH for 6 years past his ELC (age 27?) with his next contract at huge money with the potential of him walking.

  58. bookje says:

    Truth,

    You have to remember that RNH has to agree as well. With that said, I do agree that it would be wise to stagger things a bit so that you don’t end up with all of those contracts coming up at the same time.

  59. VanOil says:

    Hall has the talent to win the Hart Trophy during his contract. Nuge has the talent to win the Art Ross and Selke during his next contract. Yakupov has the talent to win the Richard trophy during his next contract.

    Lock them up long term because:

    a) Oilers broke a scared trust 25 years ago and need to atone

    b) This is awesome return on investment potential

    c) It gives you a good shot at wining the trophy you really want

  60. Truth says:

    bookje,

    Agreed, but if I was RNH’s agent I say take the bridge contract, rack up the points with Hall, Eberle, and Yakupov as wingers and come to them looking for a monster contract pre-UFA. It motivates the player and justifies the contract he would then earn.

    Of course, he could want to hit the home run immediately at the risk of potentially lower dollars and being the next Horcoff (unlikely, I know).

  61. ashley says:

    bookje:
    Those of you who don’t normally read Oilersnation might want to jump over and read Gregor’s interview with Ryan Jones.In discussing Eakins, he has some insights into previous coaches -”You want to know what, there are doers and talkers and we’ve unfortunately had a lot of people who were great talkers. And I mean even to you guys, they answered all of the questions the right way but it seemed like it was never different in the room compared to when I came here all of the way through last year. ”

    Interesting insight – hopefully Eakins brings change to the team – they need it.

    That’s an interesting quote. A good insider look at things. Jones calls it how he sees it.

    I think it is a good example of how “articulate, positive, well-spoken” does not necessarily translate into a good coach or player.

    This may seem like an obvious point to make, but we have fallen into this trap in the last few seasons becoming enamoured with Renney and his smooth interviews, and then the ultimate smooth talker Ralph Krueger. He’s a motivational speaker, after all.

    Hell, we had people on here that wanted to make Ryan Whitney the team captain in his first offseason after having played something like 13 games with the club at least in part because he gave a great interview.

    He didn’t even know all his teammates names yet, or where the bathroom was.

  62. OilClog says:

    I was able to post twice today on OIlersnation, then I guess got banned again.. I didn’t even provoke Brownlee this time! Lolol. Sadly, I’ll miss the Nation. The Jones interview was a beauty, kinda threw Kruger under the bus lol

  63. DeadmanWaking says:

    Just for general interest:

    Harvey’s Injury Shows Pitchers Have a Speed Limit

    And based on data supplied by Sportvision, velocity certainly seems to matter. Since 2008, batters have hit only .175 against pitches thrown at 100 m.p.h. or above. Batting averages go up as the speed of the pitches goes down: .210 at 99, .213 at 98, .225 at 97, .242 at 96 and .252 at 95.

    I’m running behind on my EconTalk feed, but this one I listened to yesterday is a good one:

    Leigh Steinberg on Sports, Agents, and Athletes

    His client list has included Steve Bartkowski, Steve Young, Troy Aikman, Warren Moon, Bruce Smith, Thurman Thomas, Kordell Stewart, Jeff George, Ben Roethlisberger, Myron Rolle, Matt Leinart, Mark Brunell, Ricky Williams, Howie Long, Eric Karros, Dusty Baker, Lennox Lewis, Oscar de la Hoya and John Starks.

    Steinberg is often credited as the real life inspiration of the sports agent from the film Jerry Maguire.

    He also wrote a book Winning with Integrity: Getting What You Want Without Selling Your Soul.

    In addition to representing players, Steinberg has been a leader in advocating player safety. He has campaigned for the removal of Astroturf from stadiums and held symposia on concussions, which promote rule, equipment and diagnostic changes to better protect players.

    He talks about athletes owning up to their mistakes, without going into his own difficulties. For all that, I really have to commend his proactive position on concussions and the health of the players he represents.

    Look, anybody who says things like, what are they going to do, put a dress on the quarterback; it’s a man’s game, and all that; quarterbacks are becoming wusses–I challenge them to go out onto a collegian or professional practice field and take one hit. One direct hit. And see if they are able to get out of bed the next morning without assistance. I mean, you have no idea the automobile accident and train wreck that ensues on every play. As much sound as they do on football, we’re completely screened off from just the basic and horrible force. I’ve stood on those sidelines. And yet, I couldn’t stop my two high school sons from playing football. They played.

    Based on what this guy says, Nuge is going to want term and a good shot at the big trophy and/or any ancillary hardware. The revenue stream for a well-spoken, attractive, clean-living hero coming off a winning campaign is not insignificant, even if just a pittance compared to the pivot fish in the gridiron fishbowl.

    This is why I mostly ignore the length of a team’s non-playoff streak. It’s an ecology where the rich get richer. Once you fall out of favour, you can bounce around for a good while out in the cold. It takes one hell of a cluster to make re-admittance a slam dunk. Tambi, it turns out, was actually a mite over-qualified in cluster aggregation. There is such a thing as too much flubber.

    Hey, that’s even better on paper than it was in my head.

    Although “flub” is defined as “to make a mess of,” the word “flubber” is a contraction from “flying rubber.”

  64. denny33 says:

    bookje,

    Find it hard to believe that a team that was so embarrassing scoring goals last year – there would be no spot for hands like Omark…..If he can just hold his own in the defensive zone. I really feel he would have chemistry with some of our high end talent.

    Injuries would allow Omark to sub in on occasion to the higher line positions….

    Really would like the idea of having 3 scoring lines come to fruition…

    There are some very weak 3rd pairing defenceman in this leage and Omark and Hemsky could KILL that kind of competition….

    That could be the OIlers competitive advantage – Hemsky, Gordon, Omark versus say a Mark Stuart pairing in Winnipeg.

  65. denny33 says:

    LT – hoping Brandon Davison does not struggle tonight. Jets have deleted their whole 1st line

    Jets enforcer Peluso is on the 3rd line ……

    All AHL guys on the 3rd and 4th lines..

    Assuming Kane and Setoguchi will see Smid and Petry…

  66. bookje says:

    VanOil:
    Hall has the talent to win the Hart Trophy during his contract. Nuge has the talent to win the Art Ross and Selke during his next contract. Yakupov has the talent to win the Richard trophy during his next contract.

    Lock them up long term because:

    a) Oilers broke a scared trust 25 years ago and need to atone

    b) This is awesome return on investment potential

    c) It gives you a good shot at wining the trophy you really want

    Nothing is a sure thing, but this could be a great gamble.

  67. Colonel Obvious says:

    Ca$h-Money!:
    Colonel Obvious,

    6yr/$39m is more than Hall by my math….

    I meant 7yr/39M.

    commonfan14: When was the last time an established 80-90 point player signed for only $6 million per year?The Sedins 4 years ago?

    RNH is an RFA not a UFA so he shouldn’t be paid like one. Moreover he isn’t an established 80 pt player and shouldn’t be paid like one.

    There is no upside to signing him early and plenty of downside. Conversely there is little risk in waiting.

  68. bookje says:

    Colonel Obvious: I meant 7yr/39M.

    RNH is an RFA not a UFA so he shouldn’t be paid like one.Moreover he isn’t an established 80 pt player and shouldn’t be paid like one.

    There is no upside to signing him early and plenty of downside.Conversely there is little risk in waiting.

    Unless he becomes an established 80 pt player, then you have the upside of not having to pay him $8 plus a season.

  69. Ducey says:

    OilClog:
    I was able to post twice today on OIlersnation, then I guess got banned again.. I didn’t even provoke Brownlee this time! Lolol. Sadly, I’ll miss the Nation. The Jones interview was a beauty, kinda threw Kruger under the bus lol

    You mentioned that you got banned for no reason. That is enough of a reason for RB.

  70. hunter1909 says:

    RE Robin Brownlee, and most of what was formerly known as “the press”:

    Other than the odd article, most stuff written about the Oilers is little better than the information found on Lowetide.

    Lowetide’s outstanding collection of commentators is the envy of the NHL.

  71. BlacqueJacque says:

    hunter1909,

    Then there’s us two drunks, right Hunter? :)

  72. G Money says:

    BlacqueJacque: Then there’s us two drunks, right Hunter?

    Can I be included in the party if I’m drunk on power?

  73. BlacqueJacque says:

    G Money,

    Only if you’re at least as belligerent as me and Hunter, and you concede that you shouldn’t call Canadian whisky “whisky” while the Irish are still producing their heavenly nectar.

  74. Jordan says:

    BlacqueJacque:
    G Money,

    Only if you’re at least as belligerent as me and Hunter, and you concede that you shouldn’t call Canadian whisky “whisky” while the Irish are still producing their heavenly nectar.

    Well it’s not whisky. It’s Rye. It’s like calling White Rum … Rum. It’s not.

  75. prairieschooner says:

    Yes things are progressing fairly well with the Oilers and a level of confidence is being established with the fan base.
    Before we drink too much kool aid
    it is worth recalling that at the draft we almost traded for Cory Snider when we had a competent net minder.
    We also came very close to blowing the template by overpaying significantly for Clarkson on a long term deal.
    Other teams saved us from 2 long term Horcoffian like deals.

  76. Jordan says:

    prairieschooner,

    I like to think that it’s not so much that the Oilers were actually in the running, but rather just stringing them along to mess with all parties involved.

    Rose coloured glasses? Absolutely! Oilers are tied for first in the league baby!

  77. commonfan14 says:

    Colonel Obvious: bookje

    As bookje points out, the point is that paying him $6 million per year now based on projection avoids having to pay him like an actual 80-90 point player ($7-8 million these days) if he develops into one.

    It’s a big gamble, but it’s incorrect to say that there’s only downside, or that $6 million per year represents full market value for the kind of player they hope he becomes.

  78. OilLeak says:

    hunter1909:
    RE Robin Brownlee, and most of what was formerly known as “the press”:

    Other than the odd article, most stuff written about the Oilers is little better than the information found on Lowetide.

    Lowetide’s outstanding collection of commentators is the envy of the NHL.

    Brownlee is incapable of having an earnest discussion on any topic, he deletes my posts, flip-flops on a daily basis, and out right dismisses valid points that are contrary to his own. I don’t even bother commenting on his articles anymore as he shifts the goalposts as much as D.S.F.

  79. spoiler says:

    On RNH’s contract talks, from Dreger or tsn.ca:

    With the ugliness of the NHL lockout and a shortened season long washed away by the excitement of a new and complete year ahead, we’re re-launching The Dreger Report, a bi-weekly dispatch on NHL news and views.

    This week, TSN’s Ryan Rishaug reported that Ryan Nugent-Hopkins’ agent Rick Valette and Oilers management have begun negotiations on a contract extension.

    The brass in Edmonton loves RNH – he’s their guy. He’s considered a big part of the Oilers’ future.

    An eight-year extension to complement Jordan Eberle’s six-year, $36 million dollar and Taylor Hall’s seven-year, $42 million deal (agreed to last August) aligns with an Oilers source who says, “longer is better” – specific to Nugent-Hopkins.

    It’s not the model other teams around the NHL are using when addressing their players and their second (bridge) contracts, but Edmonton is clearly banking on its youth when it comes to a brighter future.

  80. spoiler says:

    PSGDT is up.

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