PUSHING THE RIVER

Oiler fans are fixated on timelines for Martin Marincin, Oscar Klefbom and Darnell Nurse, but the real story is behind them and involves names like Taylor Chorney, Alex Plante and Danny Syvret. If we take a photo of a draft cluster—let’s say 2004 through 2007—how many times did the Oilers miss in an area of the draft they should have hit?

THE BLUE, DRAFTS 2004 THROUGH 2007

  • Roman Tesluik, 2nd rd (#44) 2004: Barely made it out of junior hockey played 24 ECHL games before disappearing into the ether.
  • Taylor Chorney, 2nd rd (#36) 2005: Has played 61 NHL games and remains undersized for NHL defense. There was a small window after the lockout where NHL men were convinced smaller, quicker defensemen who lacked the physical elements would win the day. Actually, the jobs went to the larger, quicker defensemen and Chorney has been a minor leaguer as a pro (save the 61 games).
  • Danny Syvret, 3rd rd (#81) 2005: He was a famous junior player and was older, perhaps thought to be closer to NHL ready. These long years later he’s played in 59 NHL games and is an AHL mainstay.
  • Jeff Petry, 2nd rd (#45) 2006: The home run in the group, although the organization seems to be turning on him so he may end up being thrown down the Poti-Gilbert slide. Petry’s arrival in the NHL included NCAA development and some AHL time, which should be the template for these defensemen as they journey to the NHL.
  • Theo Peckham, 3rd rd (#75) 2006: Another solid pick, he’s in trouble as a prospect now but someone will give him an NHL chance again. 160 NHL games with the Oilers, I’m surprised he didn’t establish himself with Edmonton and that’s a loss for the organization.
  • Alex Plante, 1st rd (#15) 2007: This is the kill shot for the development team, the one that got Prendergast bumped out the door (well to a new position and then out) and caused the current scouting group. 10 NHL games from a defenseman in the middle of round one is not close to good enough, and I do know he had concussion problems. However, he was a project, had skating and mobility issues and there were cries at the time about this being a poor pick. And that’s not on the player, he didn’t ask to get picked at 15, that’s on the team.

That’s a first rounder, 3 second rounders and 2 third round selections in a four year draft cluster.

MACGREGOR 2009 THROUGH 2012

  • Troy Hesketh, 3rd rd (#71) 2009: A poor pick, he’s the tall tree from Minnetonka who (as far as we know) still grows there.
  • Martin Marincin, 2nd rd (#46) 2010: Made his NHL debut this week, tracking better than any of the 2004-07 group not named Petry/Peckham. The first of this cluster to make the NHL, taken about the same time as Tesluik and Petry.
  • Oscar Klefbom, 1st rd (#19) 2011: Tracking well until this season, and the North American style seems to have thrown him a curve. The hype on Klefbom was so strong it’s hard to imagine there’s no player here, but we’re going to have to wait on him.
  • David Musil, 2nd rd (#31) 2011: Picked around the same time as Taylor Chorney and there are about as many questions about Musil. He’s got size and a mean streak, but the skating issues may mean he’ll fall short of the goal.

That’s a first rounder, 2 second rounders and a third round selection in a four year cluster. I think MacGregor’s group did a much better job, and the Klefbom v Plante matchup could be a lopsided comp but then again Petry-Marincin could be just as lopsided the other way.

The point is this: When we talk about Stu MacGregor’s drafts, we should discuss the sins of 2004-07, and he was part of that scouting department so that’s fair. However, if we’re looking for Marincin and Klefbom to step in and play like they were 2007 drafts (the best D that year: Ryan McDonagh, Kevin Shattenkirk, PK Subban) we’re pissing in the wind.

The 2009 draft (the Hesketh draft) hasn’t established itself yet, let alone 2010-2012. If the Edmonton Oilers are looking to get better on defense any time soon, it’ll be via trade or free agency. The kids are developing but aren’t going to help push the river for years.

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88 Responses to "PUSHING THE RIVER"

  1. Bad Seed says:

    Klefbom struggling? But MacT said he was ready for the NHL! He wouldn’t overvalue his players, would he?

  2. sliderule says:

    Is the oiler drafting much better with Stu than KP ?i doubt it but it’s too early to tell.

    The nepotism off the wall pick of Musil isn’t tracking great but it’s early.

    What bothers me about oiler scouting is they don’t seem to cover all areas instead focusing on Dub.

    Use a million of that Rogers money add scouts and technical analysis .

    Then you tell Stu move to Edmonton were management can receive reports face to face daily.

  3. John Chambers says:

    Regardless of whether Klefbom & Marincin turn out, I think it’s fair to fell bullish about how Nurse will develop – with strong likelihood as an eventual top-pair defenseman.

    I have to think that the Winnipeg Jets are interested in obtaining an impact player. Who fom the Oilers would they covet? Eberle? Yakupov? Our upcoming 1st rounder? I would be tempted to dangle in a core piece if we could pry Jake Trouba out of their snow-covered palms.

    Nurse and Trouba for a decade? Yes please.

  4. prairieschooner says:

    I think the focus on the dub comes from the fact that the Oilers were unable to attract free agents and the feeling was that Western kids see Edmonton as a big city to play in and cold weather is routine.
    Oilers have a huge budget for technical support and analysis. They get anything they ask for.

  5. misfit says:

    It’s definitely too early to say, but the eternal optimist in me says this group will turn out better. Of course, almost all of that comes from my hopes for Klefbom. The NA transition wasn’t as smooth as most of us expected, but I still figure there’s a real shot he becomes something. Musil isn’t really tracking any better than Peckham, and Hesketh, I have no expectations for. Marincin is a real wildcard, and could be the only way that second group surpasses the first.

    I can’t help but wonder that moving on from some of the young D on the farm wouldn’t be best all around. Not just for the assets you could get in return, but by giving the ones remaining some support in the way of veteran partners to play with. We’ve got Marincin, Hunt, Musil, Klefbom, Fedun, Davidson, and Gernat all trying to learn the pro game at the same time. Yeah, they’ve got coaches, but I can’t help but think a veteran guy to play along side some of them could be helpful. The most experienced guy they’ve had this year is Grebeshkov, who’s also trying to get his game back. Maybe not the best player for a young guy to look to for guidance.

    I know he wasn’t included in the original segment, but Nurse is the real hope for our defense. It seems that most of the true #1D in the NHL were either acquired through the draft or signed as free agents. We all know our ability to do the latter, so the draft may be our only real hope. Teams typically don’t trade top pairing defenders, and when they do, it’s us.

  6. Lowetide says:

    Omark (Hunt, Horak) 1-0 OKC

  7. justDOit says:

    Omark, dragging around linemates of that quality (correct me if I’m wrong on that), and still scoring at 1.0 ppg. He’s like the little train that could – he just puts his head down and keeps going. I hope he gets his chance, and I hope the Oilers don’t blow this.

    He may even get Olympic consideration, because the shootouts become really important in the medal rounds. Imagine O! putting away Canada in the finals with a spin-move on the SO!

  8. misfit says:

    This has nothing to do with anything being talked about here (except that Plante was the guy they took with the 1st rounder), but looking back, there was really no way we could’ve ever won the Ryan Smyth trade with the Islanders.

    I mean, they were dead set on taking a defenseman with their 2nd pick in the 1st round (they came out and said as much right afterward). Even if they didn’t take Plante, the other 1st round defensemen according to most of the rankings at the time were Petrecki, Blum, Cole, and Smith. Unless they went way off the board and took Subban, they weren’t going to get anything usefull at that selection with their mandate of going D. Hell, even if they went with a forward, they would’ve ended up with Nash or possibly (but not likely) one of the other forwards taken between 15 and 21, the best of whom being Colton Gilles. That pick was doomed to failure.

    The other two pieces were O’Marra and Nilsson. Both were former 1st round picks which means they automatically checked off all of Kevin Lowe’s boxes in what he looks for in players he’s looking to acquire.

    We know they liked Nilsson (they wouldn’t have traded down in ’03 if the Islanders didn’t take him before they had the chance), but even if they had their choice of any other prospect in the islanders system, they weren’t going to come away with much better. Okposo was likely never on the table, and only Nokelainen, Comeau and Nielsen are in the NHL today. Nielsen was their 18th ranked prospect according to Hockey’s Future at the time, and as a 3rd round pick 4 years earlier, there was no way Lowe was touching that.

  9. Lowetide says:

    In 80 AHL games, Linus Omark is 35-43-78, +6. Two goals so far today included in the total.

  10. Lowetide says:

    Horak (Hunt, Omark) Now 80, 35-44-79.

  11. Ryan says:

    From the prior thread, LT said:

    Disagree. You can’t draft for need with the number one overall pick and the Oilers did select defensemen early on (Klefbom, Musil, Marincin, etc). The problem, and I’ve been saying this for so long I don’t think anyone hears me (And that’s likely my fault for being a broken record) is that this is the era where Alex Plante, Taylor Chorney and Danny Syvret are supposed to be on the team and taking the hard minutes.
    ALL of the Stu MacGregor-drafted defensemen are developing. That’s not their fault, or a surprise. The 2007 draft, the one where they club took Alex Plante and missed, is your culprit here.

    That’s a rather narrow view based on a single trajectory of the team’s fate facilitated by Lowebellini.

    There’s a number of different scenarios that could have played out instead.

    i.e. Maybe the Oilers trade down a few slots at the 2007 draft and grab either one of Ryan McDonagh or Shattenkirk instead of Gagner and Plante.

    And/or maybe the Oilers draft Kulikov instead of PRV in 2009.

    And/or maybe Tambellini takes the gift of Taylor Hall at the 2010 draft and doesn’t develop an addiction to playing the draft lottery and decides to start building a team before they draft #1 overall two more times.

    Lot’s of different scenarios could have played out. :)

  12. ohhell says:

    Agreed on the disinterest re: backchecking in their own zone discussion from earlier today, but what really stood out to me last night (went to the game despite my own personal boycott commitment) was their disinterest in putting pucks to the net. I don’t think I have ever witnessed a game where there was so much o-zone possession and so few chances generated. Sucked the life out of the building.

    I love the Oilers, love (loved?) the young guns, but fuck, the only one with a clue to getting the puck to the net is Perron and obviously he learned that in another system. This pass-first, pretty play bunch of yohos are wearing me down. Eberle alone passed up multiple centre slot shots in favor of passes to the side of the net or toe-drags that didn’t even generate chance. He’s not the only one. The one goal they scored was a puck to the net.

    Did I forget to mention the “kings of the cross-ice path through traffic”. WTF is Sam Gagner thinking? Taylor Hall is taking lessons from Sam. Why can’t Hemsky wait one millisecond more at the blueline? Why do they pass it into each other’s feet when they are 10 feet apart? What’s with the pass back to the phantom middle blue-liner on the PP? What’s with the PP? Prett-pass fuckin-fuckers make me nuts. Pretty pass goals are nice off the rush when you have a lead and the other team is taking more chances, but when you need a goal and you pass up opportunities and generate nothing it is exasperating.

    We all say “they are young, they will adapt”. I say bullshit. Any team can carry one or two of these guys, but our culture is built on it. There is a better chance of converting Perron into being a soft, selfish player than seeing these other young stars play a complete game. Fuck!

    They seem unteachable to me! Fed-up! Anybody who thought last night was a good game was obviously watching the game from a sofa with a supply of alcohol and a pretty lady to distract. That game was shit. You could hear the puck hit a players stick it was so quiet in the building.

    I need a break from this shit. It saddens me, but the only path to future success that I can see lies in dismantling some of the kids from the equation in favor of hockey players who believe in a team game and some work ethic. Fuck the Oilers.

    Rant over! (for now) Is this going to get me banned? Maybe that’s for the best. Sigh.

  13. ohhell says:

    As for drafting, I appreciate your optimistic viewpoint LT (where Stu is concerned), but the ones of this team can be traced back to poor drafting for the last 10 to 15 years. Compounding the problem of an undersized forward group that lacks puck-retrieval ability, is a bottom six that can’t stack up with most of the league. Worse yet, there is nothing in the system that looks to improve it.

    On the back end, while the prospects are looking better, there is currently no evidence that any ot them (save perhaps Nurse) will amount to anything more than a bottom-pairing defender. We can hope for more and some will be put into the position, but that will only be due to injury and a lack of depth. Top it off with the compete absence of a top-pair on the backend and things are bleak.

    In goal, well nothing needs to be said here. Since the Moog/Fuhr days, the Oilers have failed to draft a bonafide goalie in the NHL (30 years).

    The entire lack of depth on this time is due to poor drafting choices. Don’t know how to fix it. Sorry for the negativity. Fed up all around. Never should have gone to that game last night.

  14. Lowetide says:

    OHHELL: The last 15 years or so is a long time, and when we talk about the 1999-2005 or so group, we have to keep in mind the EIG flushed the minor league system entirely. So, there were kids dying on the pro hockey vine all over the place and that’s come home to roost.

    Now, the 2007 draft is a different animal. Edmonton had settled in Springfield by then and were building the system back up. However, when we talk about some of those kids from the early 2000′s it is a damn shame how they were orphaned.

  15. VOR says:

    I’ve been reading through the last few blogs and thinking about how our past shapes how we view the present.

    It isn’t just this blog, radio, TV, other blogs, newspapers everybody has the story line as the Oilers are shit.

    Now people who hate history will claim all us oldtimers knew that longest night of 1980 as we made the bitterly cold trek to the Coliseum to be out-numbered by Montreal Canadiens fans that the young men we were paying to see would one day not just be a good team but a legendary one. That is utter complete horse crap. These kids had gone 4-9-5 and got their coach fired. The new coach had inspired them to go 3-9. The Canadiens were a powerhouse headed to another 100 point season.

    Everything any of you have said here was being said back then. Don’t work hard enough, don’t care, count points not wins, too young, not talented enough, need veterans, need 1D, need goaltender, etc. Nobody was saying the Oilers were T-6 that long ago night. Not six decades, not six GMs, not six coaches, not six years, not six players, 6 games from being an elite team. Nobody was saying that and if they tell you otherwise they are lying. Every beer in town was watered down and salty. We’d run out of tears.

    It is hard to guess what happened that changed those young men from jokes to contenders. There was no trade, no free agents, not even a team meeting. Just a sudden, incredible improvement. My guess is it started the night the Canadiens came to town.

    I can’t remember much about that game. The Oilers won and then lost three in a row – as I recall two were heart-breakers, eked out a tie and then miraculously became a real team. I mention it only because the Canadiens blamed the loss on lousy officiating that let the Oilers get away with murder. That part I do remember. The Canadiens tried to work over the Oilers kids. For their troubles they ate elbow pads and sticks all night long. By the end of that strange game the Oilers were running the Canadiens and badly outplaying them as well. Their win was no fluke, they earned it.

    As fate would have it the Oilers climbed back into the playoffs, met Montreal, and swept them. So in their darkest hour, in a lost season, the Oilers figured out how to beat a great team and began the long journey to the land of legends. None of us can say for sure that one night this season these new kids won’t suddenly learn how to win against great teams. Maybe a dark savage edge lies deep in the hearts of these young men and one night there will be one cheap shot too many and their inner devils will come out.

    Maybe we are now only 1 or 2 games from the turnaround that will launch another legend.

    Yet to hear you all tell it this is impossible and you all knew in December 1980 a dynasty was emerging and are thus qualified to say for certain these Oilers are shit. Yeah, sure!

  16. ASkoreyko says:

    VOR,

    I logged in just to thank you for this post. Well said!

  17. nycoil says:

    At the time, the 2007 draft was touted to be a weak one, but 7 years on, it’s not looking like the case. Gagner could be considered a “disappointment” at this stage in his career, but he certainly wasn’t a draft miss. The Plane and Nash picks, however, well, Nash looks like he might finally be a player, but man, having one player to show for those 3 first rounders hurts. Although getting Perron now is a godsend and makes up for it a little.
    http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2007e.html

  18. fifthcartel says:

    Eric Rodgers ‏@ericrsports
    In 158:26 of time in the #OKCBarons net, Ty Rimmer now 1-0-1, with a .930 saves percentage and a 2.65 goals against. #oilers

  19. nycoil says:

    VOR,

    Wonderful post.

  20. gcw_rocks says:

    MacT is a moron. If Krueger had to go then he should have been replaced by a veteran coach like Lindy Ruff. This team really really needed experienced leadership to make sure the team learned to play the game the right way. Instead we got Eakins and look how it had turned out.

  21. wintoon says:

    Eklund just put a message that Philly and the Oilers are talking about a trade involving Couturier. I can only hope this is true. It would be a great step toward solving at least one of our problems.

  22. jb says:

    I’ve lost interest in the season for the most part.. I don’t really care where they finish in the 29th-25th range. Dealing Smid with the top 4 holes we have on the backend means defeat has been accepted, and change is coming. All I’m interested in is the inevitable next big deal. Nothing is going to change with this team until then. They all know how to deal with losing by now, and probably have no issues coasting week to week with sweet paychecks.

    Give Arcobello Gagner’s role, he’s earned it. Deal Gagner and the 1st + prospect for defensive help. Find a St. Louis Bouwmeester type addition for the top 4 as well. I’m ok with finally moving on from Hemsky to open up another 5 million to spend on the backend as well.

    For this team to be playoff caliber next year they seriously need something close to
    Chara-Nurse
    Vet-Petry
    Ference-Schultz/Marincin/Klefbom

    Even that D-core might need a year or two together before they’re, battle San Jose in the playoffs type NHL ready.

    Oh god our backend needs help. We need confidence and stability, and we’re far from having it…

    I’m also gonna bet we see Bryzgalov outplay Dubynk in the second half, proving that area still needs a solution.

  23. Lowetide says:

    Greg Chase with another goal for the Hitmen this afternoon.

  24. sliderule says:

    VOR,

    Great post.

    If you think Hall turns the puck over you should have seen Messier.Overskated the puck ,offside all the time and breakaways tell me about it couldn’t put it in the ocean.An older friend of mine long dead bless his soul ranted all the time about him.Trade him!Bench him!

    Coffey was another dividing player.Some loved him but most thought he was too soft and a liability defensively.

    If there had been an internet then it would have been at least as cranky as with today’s oilers.

    Slather had patience and didn’t dump the kids even though they made mistakes.Bench them ,yes, send them to minors like Mess,yes trade them no!!

    Just a little bit of history for those of you willing to dump them at their lowest point.

  25. Andy P says:

    wintoon:
    Eklund just put a message that Philly and the Oilers are talking about a trade involving Couturier. I can only hope this is true. It would be a great step toward solving at least one of our problems.

    Knowing this bunch they will trade Arco, a 1st and a prospect for Couturier. I’m wondering where this would leave Gags. On a wing to replace Hemmers?

  26. Lowetide says:

    sliderule:
    VOR,

    Great post.

    If you think Hall turns the puck over you should have seen Messier.Overskated the puck ,offside all the time and breakaways tell me about it couldn’t put it in the ocean.An older friend of mine long dead bless his soul ranted all the time about him.Trade him!Bench him!

    Coffey was another dividing player.Some loved him but most thought he was too soft and a liability defensively.

    If there had been an internet then it would have been at least as cranky as with today’s oilers.

    Slather had patience and didn’t dump the kids even though they made mistakes.Bench them ,yes, send them to minors like Mess,yes trade them no!!

    Just a little bit of history for those of you willing to dump them at their lowest point.

    The turnovers don’t bother me, to be honest we should expect them from such a gifted offensive player. But you know we skewered Ryan Jones for exiting the zone on jailbreaks, Gagner too recently, and Hall has a lot of that in his game. He’ll figure it out, but it’s hurting the team.

    Eberle too, Gagner too. If the Oilers had more Gordon’s and Horcoff’s it wouldn’t matter as much, just as the Habs could allow Lafleur to wheel with Lemaire and Shutt to do the work.

    This team is not the 80s Oilers. they’re going to have to work and they’re going to have to be more responsible.

  27. VOR says:

    I’m sorry LT, but did you just imply the 80s Oilers did not have to work or did not have to take responsibility?

  28. hunter1909 says:

    VOR: As fate would have it the Oilers climbed back into the playoffs, met Montreal, and swept them. So in their darkest hour, in a lost season, the Oilers figured out how to beat a great team and began the long journey to the land of legends. None of us can say for sure that one night this season these new kids won’t suddenly learn how to win against great teams. Maybe a dark savage edge lies deep in the hearts of these young men and one night there will be one cheap shot too many and their inner devils will come out.
    Maybe we are now only 1 or 2 games from the turnaround that will launch another legend.

    This is the very thing that keeps me suckered so far this season. They seem to be figuring things out with every game played, while simultaneously being inconsistent enough to appear to be spinning their wheels but I doubt it.

    This is a talented, high event team that wants to pressure to opposition like few others. This season I’m noticing more real dislike of these oilers from the other teams who really don’t seem to like playing them as in other years.

    Sure the defense is a project, and I can’t explain why am thinking this but from here on in for the rest of the season I reckon they’re going to be playing outstanding hockey 40% of the time, terrible weak hockey 20% of the time and the rest will be pure adventure.

  29. Young Oil says:

    This is just totally spitballing here, but how good of a defenceman could Gagner+J. Schultz get you in a trade? Maybe something like Tyutin+Jenner from Columbus?

  30. sliderule says:

    I watch the game on TV so I don’t see the lazy back checks.As a result I haven’t seen that much of lack of effort for most games.
    I do see the teams lack of attention to protecting the slot and crease The slot is mostly the forwards and the crease the defense. so it’s the whole team.
    Then there are the careless passes that we have seen lately in the offensive zone resulting in breakaways.
    I put both those problems on the coaches both past and present.
    If these current coaches can’t find a way to correct them then it’s on them more than the players.

  31. Ryan says:

    gcw_rocks:
    MacT is a moron. If Krueger had to go then he should have been replaced by a veteran coach like Lindy Ruff. This team really really needed experienced leadership to make sure the team learned to play the game the right way. Instead we got Eakins and look how it had turned out.

    I had faith in Mact–the buy in came from Lowetide and Dellow’s ringing endorsement though…

    1. I agree that the team needed a veteran coach and voiced that here prior to watching Eakins learn on the fly.

    Really, other than Bylsma who seemed to start the AHL coach trend, has this worked well with any other team? (not a rhetorical question).

    2. I am deeply perplexed by the Smid return

    3. Who here would have chosen Grebs over Gilbert besides Mact?

    4. Acton burning daylight in the NHL…

    I liked somethings (obviously Peron and Belov).

  32. Ryan says:

    Anyway, the real mistake Katz made was in not taking my advice before he hired Mact. :)

    My advice was to back up the Brinks truck and hire Tippet, Maloney, and anyone of significance in the Phoenix organization.

  33. Lowetide says:

    VOR:
    I’m sorry LT, but did you just imply the 80s Oilers did not have to work or did not have to take responsibility?

    Come on, VOR. You know as well as I do that team could outscore their mistakes and the other team’s too. I understand your point, but it is extremely unfair to compare any young team to that team.

  34. Andy P says:

    Young Oil:
    This is just totally spitballing here, but how good of a defenceman could Gagner+J. Schultz get you in a trade? Maybe something like Tyutin+Jenner from Columbus?

    It’s probably spitballing because those two are guaranteed to be part of the 8-9 core players he referred to that he he has no interest in trading. Until he does of course, like he told Krueger he was staying until his mini me turned up.

  35. Woodguy says:

    VOR,

    Everything any of you have said here was being said back then. Don’t work hard enough, don’t care, count points not wins, too young, not talented enough, need veterans, need 1D, need goaltender, etc

    Need veterans?

    Gary Unger
    Stan Weir
    Gary Lariviere
    Doug Hicks
    Lee Fogolin
    Brett Callighen

    All played in the playoffs that year.

    That’s 3 vet D and 2 vet C’s and a LW. Kinda of the key positions we talk about today that need filling.

    I’d guess that Ference = Fogolin and Gordon = Weir is as close as it comes.

    Also,

    Here are the ages of the “future greats” in the spring of 81.

    Gretzky – 20
    Messier – 20
    Anderson – 21
    Kurri – 21
    Coffey – 20
    Lowe -22

    Here’s the ages of the “cluster” now

    Hall – 22
    Gagner – 24
    Eberle – 23 (24 this spring)
    J.Shultz – 23
    RNH – 20 (21 this spring)
    Yak – 20

    This group still struggling to find the defensive zone with 2 hands, a flashlight and map is not like the 80/81 team.

    RNH is one of the youngest and best at it, Yak is a fresh rookie and somewhat excused from this.

    The other 4 have no age excuse, with J.Shultz having NHL games played on his side.

    By the time the core of the 80/81 team were Hall/Gagner/Eberle’s age they were winning their cups or going to the final for the first time against NYI.

    This Oilers team isn’t nearly as talented as that team.

    Nor do they have the veteran depth to help them figure it out.

    They are young men who should know better by now, and who have already been paid so the reinforcement of “what you have been doing is right” is already there.

    The analogy isn’t very strong.

  36. Woodguy says:

    For the record, I think trading Hall, RNH, Yak and J.Shutlz is folly.

    J.Shultz is taking some (earned) heat, but to suggest trading him is wrong for the same reasons the Yak suggestions are wrong.

    They are both rookies slotted about the level of competition where they should be.

    They both have a ton of talent and will be very good NHLers imo.

  37. Lowetide says:

    Woodguy:
    For the record, I think trading Hall, RNH, Yak and J.Shutlz is folly.

    J.Shultz is taking some (earned) heat, but to suggest trading him is wrong for the same reasons the Yak suggestions are wrong.

    They are both rookies slotted about the level of competition where they should be.

    They both have a ton of talent and will be very good NHLers imo.

    I don’t think anyone is seriously talking about trading these guys, right? WG, you mentioned a Dubnyk to NYI deal last night and Hickey was thrown out there. Any other items included?

  38. Woodguy says:

    Lowetide: I don’t think anyone is seriously talking about trading these guys, right? WG, you mentioned a Dubnyk to NYI deal last night and Hickey was thrown out there. Any other items included?

    Deck chairs from what I heard. Hickey and DD were the headliners.

  39. Woodguy says:

    Lowetide: I don’t think anyone is seriously talking about trading these guys, right? WG, you mentioned a Dubnyk to NYI deal last night and Hickey was thrown out there. Any other items included?

    I had read Okposo elsewhere but didn’t hear it.

    Not sure what’d he cost to get.

    2 more years left at $2.8MM, scored 20 once, big body.

    Sounds like someone that MacT would like.

  40. Lowetide says:

    Woodguy: I had read Okposo elsewhere but didn’t hear it.

    Not sure what’d he cost to get.

    2 more years left at $2.8MM, scored 20 once, big body.

    Sounds like someone that MacT would like.

    Islanders have some nice things for sure.

  41. Young Oil says:

    I forget, were we in a position to claim Hickey off of waivers? Or were the Islanders below us in the standings?

  42. Woodguy says:

    Young Oil:
    I forget, were we in a position to claim Hickey off of waivers? Or were the Islanders below us in the standings?

    Hickey was waived by the Kings at the end of training camp in January 2013.

    Oilers had 2nd pick in waiver rights due to the finish of 29th the year before.

    NYI were 4th due to their 27th place finish.

    Oilers broke camp with:

    Smid
    Petry
    N.Shultz
    J.Shultz
    Whitney
    FIstric
    Potter

  43. Pablo Aimar says:

    gcw_rocks:
    MacT is a moron. If Krueger had to go then he should have been replaced by a veteran coach like Lindy Ruff.

    Yup.

  44. nycoil says:

    Okposo has size and skill and is playing on the top line with Vanek and Tavares. I doubt the Islanders trade him without an upgrade on offense going back their way, so that would be a lot bigger of a deal than Thomas Hickey and DD.
    There is some irony in the Oilers trading for Hickey because going back to the earlier discussion about the 2007 draft, Hickey was definitely a bad pick at 4th overall.

  45. Pablo Aimar says:

    VOR:
    I’m sorry LT, but did you just imply the 80s Oilers did not have to work or did not have to take responsibility?

    I am stunned that folks are using the 1980′s Oilers as a comparison to this group. These Oilers could swap all the “superkids” for a present day version of Gretzky and be in much better shape, forget about all the other Hall of Fame players.

  46. Andy P says:

    Why no mention of Belov? Is he HS? About to be traded?

  47. Woodguy says:

    Lowetide: Islanders have some nice things for sure.

    Snow might do something really aggressive to save his job.

    MacBold might be there to help him do it.

  48. Woodguy says:

    Andy P:
    Why no mention of Belov?Is he HS? About to be traded?

    HS last game after a paper transaction to OKC (never left Edmonton) to make room for Marincin.

    With Gordon on IR there’s room for him again.

    Given Petry’s concussion I’d bet on Belov being in vs. CAR on Tuesday.

  49. Andy P says:

    Would we likely have won with Belov in the lineup last night?
    Would we likely have won with Bryz in the net? Or with BTO?

  50. theres oil in virginia says:

    I didn’t read VOR’s post as a comparison to the Oilers team of the early 80s. I read it as a comparison between where today’s team is versus where that team was at the point in time he mentions. It’s not a comparison between teams, but a comparison between timelines. Maybe I’m wrong about that, but I don’t think so. I’m not sure why there’s an objection to that idea; I think it’s quite apt.

  51. Lowetide says:

    theres oil in virginia:
    I didn’t read VOR’s post as a comparison to the Oilers team of the early 80s. I read it as a comparison between where today’s team is versus where that team was at the point in time he mentions.It’s not a comparison between teams, but a comparison between timelines.Maybe I’m wrong about that, but I don’t think so.I’m not sure why there’s an objection to that idea; I think it’s quite apt.

    No objection, it’s an excellent comparable and God I hope it comes true. The objection comes from the specific item VOR addressed to me; beyond that, I think it’s clearly a great point made.

  52. Thinker says:

    I have no problem with these players taking risks as hall did the other night, but these players have to learn to cover for one another. Hall can only be forty feet up ice if he has four men back and we are in control of the puck. The big problem I see with this team is that there are too many people unwilling to cover for one another. If hall is forty feet up ice, so is eberle and huge and gagner, and yakupov, and hemsky, and jschultz, you get the idea.

  53. Lowetide says:

    Thinker:
    I have no problem with these players taking risks as hall did the other night, but these players have to learn to cover for one another. Hall can only be forty feet up ice if he has four men back and we are in control of the puck. The big problem I see with this team is that there are too many people unwilling to cover for one another. If hall is forty feet up ice, so is eberle and huge and gagner, and yakupov, and hemsky, and jschultz, you get the idea.

    Well put. Simple things, and it’s all part of the process. The lessons learned—or not learned—are keeping them from making progress. Last night was a perfect example. They should have been scoring at will, but because they didn’t pay attention two pucks ended up in the back of the net.

    And there were more than two mistakes, against a good team that score would have been out of reach.

  54. VOR says:

    Hey LT,

    No offence but I didn’t compare them you did. As did Woodguy and others.

    My point was simply that none of you have a clue what the Oilers need or what the future holds. I didn’t know in 1980 (they weren’t Hall of Famers yet despite the magical thinking of some people). Nobody knows now. Despite that a lot of posters are making personal attacks against these young men and the level of hyperbole is insane and destructive. As far as I know none of you have ever played NHL hockey and have absolutely no way to know anything about the character of these young men. They could start tomorrow playing as a cohesive unit and working their butts off. None of you have any valid argument to say that can’t happen.

    However, despite the fact that I never compared them it annoys that both you and Woodguy are trying to re-write history. At the point I was talking about the Oilers clearly could score and equally clearly couldn’t outscore – you don’t end up 7 18 5 if you can outscore your mistakes. The night Montreal came to town they were almost exactly identical offensively but Montreal was something like forty goals better defensively (in 30 games). Part of what happened post Dec 1980 is the Oilers got better defensively and it happened quite quickly, but at the point I was describing they couldn’t outscore their mistakes. By the way in December 1980 none of the Oilers were Hall of Famers and only Gretzky was a super star. Eastern media referred to them as Wayne Gretzky and the seven dwarfs.

    Also Woodguy, clearly sitting on the bench in the playoffs or in the press box makes you a veteran team leader. Of the players who played all 9 games in the 1980-81 playoffs only Curt Brackenbury and Brett Callighen were older than 26. 5 of the Oilers top 6 scorers were 20 or younger. If you are going to misunderstand my point and try to prove me wrong about something I never said then you need to get your facts right.

  55. Andy P says:

    Lowetide,

    What about those two episodes of DD flopping about on the ice behind his net? What was that, and what does that say about his state of mind at the time?

  56. Lowetide says:

    VOR:
    Hey LT,

    a lot of posters are making personal attacks against these young men and the level of hyperbole is insane and destructive.

    If you could point them out, I’ll delete them. Personal attacks of any kind are not allowed here, posters or hockey players.

  57. Lowetide says:

    Andy P:
    Lowetide,

    What about those two episodes of DD flopping about on the ice behind his net? What was that, and what does that say about his state of mind at the time?

    Can you be more specific? Do you mean last night?

  58. RexLibris says:

    This Oilers team won’t be able to shake comparisons with the 80s Oilers, not matter what they end up accomplishing. The thumbprint of that decade is far too large on this city’s soul.

    I’ve been goaded into comparisons of the two by Flames fans and have steadfastly refused.

    Frankly I don’t even like generic player comparisons (“skates like Lafleur”, “has Stevens’-like hitting”, etc). They can be handy as broad generalizations, provided they aren’t taken as carbon-copy expectations.

    I don’t understand why Hickey would elicit any interest from this fan base and passing on him in the waiver wire last season wasn’t an error, in my opinion.

    Would he have been better than Whitney? Certainly, but that doesn’t speak to Hickey so much as to the deplorable play of Whitney by that time.

    That he was mentioned as a potential trade piece for the Oilers last night only serves to further diminish my already low opinion of the CBC broadcast.

    Reading VOR’s terrific post didn’t elicit comparisons of the 80s Oilers to today’s in my mind, but rather a comparison of the fans and our perspectives.

    I’m going to try not to put words in VOR’s mouth, but my impression is that hindsight has blinded us to the anxiety and frustration that was felt by the fan base all those years ago. There was no feeling of sated security wherein we could all calmly sit back and watch this roster grow towards some preordained destiny.

  59. RexLibris says:

    Woodguy: Snow might do something really aggressive to save his job.

    MacBold might be there to help him do it.

    Possible.

    Dubnyk? Not sure who comes back, but the Isles are in need of goaltending and we’ve clearly established that this is an area of concern for MacTavish as well.

  60. Woodguy says:

    VOR,

    No offence but I didn’t compare them you did. As did Woodguy and others.

    Oh please, you clearly did:

    Everything any of you have said here was being said back then. Don’t work hard enough, don’t care, count points not wins, too young, not talented enough, need veterans, need 1D, need goaltender, etc.

    Also,

    Also Woodguy, clearly sitting on the bench in the playoffs or in the press box makes you a veteran team leader. Of the players who played all 9 games in the 1980-81 playoffs only Curt Brackenbury and Brett Callighen were older than 26. 5 of the Oilers top 6 scorers were 20 or younger. If you are going to misunderstand my point and try to prove me wrong about something I never said then you need to get your facts right.

    Excellent arbitrary cut off line.

    You’re oh-so-fine line cuts out these players:

    Gary Unger played 8 of the 9 games and was 33
    Lee Fogolin was 26 when the playoffs started
    Stan Weir was 29 and played 5 playoff games
    Dave Lumley was 26
    Gary Larivier was 26
    Hicks was 26 in May.
    Pat Hughes was 26 in March and played 5 playoff games

    Gee I wonder why you picked 26 years old and 9 games in the playoffs as your cut off line?

    Way to cut out 7 players who where in an age bracket ahead of the younger cluster and played in the playoffs.

    Your juggling of the fact to suit your narrative never fails to amuse.

  61. Caramel Obvious says:

    Everyone please go watch Eakins media availability from today. Go listen to that and try and deny that he is the right coach for this team. A quick and very general paraphrase from near the end:

    Q: Should the team dump the puck in more to avoid turnovers/
    A: I want them to make good decisions with the puck. Sometimes you have to dump it in. However, it would be terrible to cross the red line and dump it in every time. Sure you would cut down on turnovers but you would never score. That’s their call.

    He also repeated the lowetide theme song. Skill players are going to turn over the puck. I’m not worried about turnovers. Our goal is to make smart plays with puck not try and avoid turnovers. Then he reiterated the line about how stupid it would be too dump it in every time.

    He also had a good response to the idea that they need to shoot more. Short answer, if the pass is there pass, if the shot is there shoot. It’s obvious I know but when you are dealing with mental children you have to stick to the obvious (hence my screen persona).

    Go take a listen for yourselves. Not a note wrong. We have the right coach.

  62. Hammers says:

    To be frank I don’t care anymore about the 1980 team . I did then, purchasing 4 seats a night and I was at the Montreal game . That was then . No comparables work on a 3-4 year spread let alone 33 years . . What this team did last year maybe counts but only a little due to the turnover of players and coach . What matters is the so called core plus the newbies like Gordon , Belov , Ference , Perron , Joensuu, Acton, Larsen & Gazdic then rating them from game #1 to #31 . That’s what many of us do and guess what , playing in the NHL doesn’t make you a good let alone great coach ,ask Gretzky . The truth is some of these players are getting better , some standing still and others going backwards . We can all debate who falls in each category and we can all state an opinion as that is all it is , an opinion .

  63. Lowetide says:

    Caramel Obvious:
    Everyone please go watch Eakins media availability from today.Go listen to that and try and deny that he is the right coach for this team.A quick and very general paraphrase from near the end:

    Q: Should the team dump the puck in more to avoid turnovers/
    A: I want them to make good decisions with the puck.Sometimes you have to dump it in.However, it would be terrible to cross the red line and dump it in every time.Sure you would cut down on turnovers but you would never score.That’s their call.

    He also repeated the lowetide theme song.Skill players are going to turn over the puck.I’m not worried about turnovers.Our goal is to make smart plays with puck not try and avoid turnovers.Then he reiterated the line about how stupid it would be too dump it in every time.

    He also had a good response to the idea that they need to shoot more.Short answer, if the pass is there pass, if the shot is there shoot.It’s obvious I know but when you are dealing with mental children you have to stick to the obvious (hence my screen persona).

    Go take a listen for yourselves.Not a note wrong.We have the right coach.

    I know it’s December, but that’s the first ray of sunshine I’ve seen today. Thanks for that, I’m on my way over there now!

  64. Thinker says:

    Lowetide,

    To be fair to the players though, they should have been playing with a responsible player like horcoff all the way along. This was the mandate set at the beginning of the rebuild, get veterans to help the kids mature. With all due respect to the players they brought in, like Strudwick, they were well past their prime, and stifled the defensive development of the kids.
    All along the way management has set logical goals, but has failed to reach them. This is why I think we need to clean house. I don’t want to bash MacT, but I won’t give him any credit yet either. When your GM comes out in june and says things like having players who are a threat to score, then plays plugs in august, there is a disconnect. I don’t know if KLowe is still the last decision, but the fact that each GM comes out with different ideas, only to fall back into old habits troubles me.

  65. fifthcartel says:

    I like the idea of Okposo, but it looks like he is having a pretty solid season with 26P in 30gms. I could see Dubnyk going there as a lower cost option to try and fix their goaltending.

  66. VOR says:

    Woodguy – I compared the fans. Not the teams. Fans are not part of the team.

  67. bookje says:

    Lowetide: If you could point them out, I’ll delete them. Personal attacks of any kind are not allowed here, posters or hockey players.

    That’s just because you are a total and complete asshole!

  68. bookje says:

    Lowetide: I know it’s December, but that’s the first ray of sunshine I’ve seen today. Thanks for that, I’m on my way over there now!

    Me too, I frequently think that MacT and Eakins have the pulse of this team and are simply having difficulty righting a ship that was badly taking on water. Having a goalie blow a hole in the side of it for a few weeks didn’t help.

    Other times, I am ready to send MacT, Eakins, and just about everyone else to the island and bring in a whole new management and coaching team because I am convinced they know nothing.

    I know nothing….

  69. bookje says:

    Lowetide: If you could point them out, I’ll delete them. Personal attacks of any kind are not allowed here, posters or hockey players.

    I hope witty, sarcastic,and ironic personal attacks are permitted!

  70. G Money says:

    Caramel Obvious: Go take a listen for yourselves. Not a note wrong. We have the right coach.

    A theory for you and others, Mr. Obvious…

    Assume the following:
    - Eakins is indeed a good coach (a controversial position)
    - The players are character players, they want to win, they’re willing to do what needs to be done, but have years of bad habits to overcome (less controversial, something we all have believed of guys like Hall and Eberle and even Gagner for a while now, but becoming tougher to believe as the bad games and the losses mount)
    - The [lack of] depth of the team forces many players, young and old, to play above their station – unsheltered, harder minutes, harder zone starts (probably something we all agree on)

    My theory (yes, my word, you may well ask what it is, this theory of mine. Well, this theory, that I have, that is to say, which is mine,… is mine. … Where? … Oh! Oh! What is my theory? Ahh! My theory, that I have, follows the lines that I am about to relate. The Theory, by G Money … that’s “G” for “G”, not gee. This theory, which belongs to me, is as follows… This is how it goes… The next thing that I am about to say is my theory. Ready?):

    - It has taken twentyish games for the lessons on “How to Play Defense 101″ to start sinking in. Backchecking. Puck support. Positioning.
    - After much coaching pain, the team – which, whatever else we may believe, we know is uber-talented, finally plays a game or two with energy, smarts, and responsible defense. Combined with good goaltending, this most nights will allow them to play even up or better against almost every team other than the elite eight or so.
    - This leads to a game with some actual early goals for the good guys. Early goals mean confidence. Early goals mean the other team has to open it up and play river hockey. Did I mention this team is uber-talented? Bad idea – open it up and you pay the price. Like a 7-0 or 8-2 drubbing maybe?
    - But you open it up and it becomes easy for this team. They get to play the res of the game their old way. The bad habits re-emerge and carry into the next game. Coaching after a big win is a tough proposition.
    - After losing that next game (most times), Eakins has plenty of fodder to show the team, hell, embarass them. Being character guys, they take it to heart.
    - So the next game they once again play with energy, smarts, and responsible defense. They get a lead. The sucker the other guys into playing river hockey and beat them. The goals come easy.
    - Rinse and repeat. Young kids. Years of bad habits. Full of themselves, they follow up the next game after a big win – old habits, lower effort level, not as much responsibility, with an ugly loss.

    I’m positing this theory for two reasons:
    - I’m trying to come up with a rational explanation for what we’ve seen so far this season, and in particular this bizarrely hot and cold team we’ve been seeing for the last 10 games
    - I’m looking for a bright side, the possibility and hope that this is indeed part of a process where a dozen young men (did I mention that they are uber-talented?) unlearn years of high-scoring losing habits and slowly, painfully, substitute them for lower scoring but winning habits. Because one thing I hope we can all accept – if and when they get it, man oh man is it going to be fun. I accept VOR‘s point – I lived through that early 80s era. I lived through the ultimate dark ages of the 90s too, and I didn’t stop being a fan. I can’t stop being one now, no matter what shit Tambowelini throw at me.

  71. G Money says:

    Hmmm, I just posted a long comment theorizing where we are in the process for this team and my comment is awaiting moderation. Did I end up in LT Jail without even realizing it?

    EDIT: Nope, this comment showed up. I must have had some verboten buzzwords in there without realizing it!

  72. TheOtherJohn says:

    I am glad we have the head coach & GM we have.

    Wish we had some better players but who doesn’t. Fortunately we no longer have goaltending problems or injuries and we are past the 30 games for our guys to learn Coach Eakins multiple systems. So, clearly, everything is a go.

    Not sure if anyone noticed but we are 6-3-1 in the last 10 games.

    We may have turned the corner towards becoming another really strong team. Our analytics over that 10 game period are also good. It helps a wee bit that there were some horrible teams in that stretch but it’s way better to cite the info that supports your argument than point out that over the last 15 games the Oiler record is 6-8-1. Funny how losing 5 in a row kinda screws up your record

    The beauty of having strong coaching, the team turning the corner, not having horrible goaltending, no injuries to speak of and the team finally grasping the multiple systems Coach Eakins implemented is that will all stand the team in good stead over the next 8 games. We play Carolina, Boston, Vancouver, Anaheim, LAK, Phx, STL and Winnipeg. Expect on December 23rd we will all be talking about this past stretch of 6-3-1 as being the turning point of the season. It showed the team that we can play with and beat some of the real strong teams in the WC. Predictions for that 8 game stretch: 7-1? 6-1-1? 5-2-1?

    Hope I’m not a killjoy but I’ll go with 3-4-1. And I’m being optimistic.

  73. RexLibris says:

    bookje: I hope witty, sarcastic,and ironic personal attacks are permitted!

    I hope I don’t get banned for saying that I laughed.

    ;)

    As someone who has taken their fair share of ad hominem attacks at other sites, I can say that a statement that – shall we say “bold”? – on LT’s own blog, is very obviously a bit of hyperbole wrapped in impish cheekiness. In my opinion, anyway.

  74. RexLibris says:

    G Money:
    Hmmm, I just posted a long comment theorizing where we are in the process for this team and my comment is awaiting moderation.Did I end up in LT Jail without even realizing it?

    EDIT: Nope, this comment showed up. I must have had some verboten buzzwords in there without realizing it!

    I’m pretty sure LT has his own version of the Carlin seven dirty words list. Although I believe they all relate to the value of truculence and any reference to the ’89 Flames.

  75. RexLibris says:

    TheOtherJohn,

    I’d probably go with 4-4 in that stretch.

  76. TheOtherJohn says:

    If it wasn’t for all of the positive signs my pessimistic prediction was 2-5-1,

  77. VanOil says:

    VOR,

    VOR I was 6 years old jumping up and down (and thoroughly ruining) the hide a bed in the basement when Andy Moog beat the Montreal Canadians in the Oilers first NHL playoff series win.

    I am guessing I am not as old or as wise as you. But as a 6 year old I new who won that series, Andy Moog.

    Are you suggesting that Dubnyk is Andy Moog?

    Is Hall the 3d or 4th best player in NHL and Oiler history, Mark Messier?

    Is Nuge, the Great One?

    Is Eberle, Anderson?

    Is Yak, Kurri?

    I love them all but No they are not.

    Despite what dumb-ass baby boomers might believe. Gretzky is the greatest player to ever play hockey. Kurri is the second best player to ever play hockey and the Selke trophy should be named after him. The third best player is a toss up between Messier and Coffee, both skating circles around that 60′s icon Bobby Orr. Who might be the 5th or 6th best player of all time behind Richard. Baby bommers memories be damned. Personally I have both Meeker and Howe above Orr, give or take a Howe.

    That does not mean I am against criticism that the current Oilers are not capable of more. In fact I embrace it. But that does not mean either the 1980 Oilers or the 2013 Oilers are above criticism.

    Cassie Campbell, in what could be HNICs last great night of hockey analysis, correctly identified poor play(s) that if the talented current crop of Oiler remedy would result in more wins. They are not above such criticism neither were the 4 best players of all time give or take a goalie. My memories are of a glorious team, but not a perfect one. This team, if they achieve such glory will be praised, but for now, just like that 1980 team, they deserve a kick in the ass.

  78. magisterrex says:

    So..woodguy has gone from seeing unicorns to napalming the glade he saw them in, and theotherjohn posts a reasonably positive item regarding the Oilers upcoming schedule. Am I on the right blog or is this one of those “Infinite Universes” things?

  79. hunter1909 says:

    Really like this team. Like the way they refuse to stop attacking, even when they lose because they’re learning. Eberle is a master according to everyone but certain oiler fans.

    They’ve been okay the last 10 games. Win some lose a few.

    50 games left anything can still happen. Eakins changed 5 players before a game which means he’s been extremely proactive.

  80. TheOtherJohn says:

    magisterrex:
    So..woodguy has gone from seeing unicorns to napalming the glade he saw them in, and theotherjohn posts a reasonably positive item regarding the Oilers upcoming schedule. Am I on the right blog or is this one of those “Infinite Universes” things?

    Mags

    We’ve “turned the corner” and my optimistic predictions for the next 8 games is 3-4-1. Maybe we haven’t turned the corner at all, we aren’t on our way to becoming the next legendary team and we’re still required to play the big boys out West. Having run out of excuses

  81. Andy P says:

    Lowetide: Can you be more specific? Do you mean last night?

    yes! DD fell over twice behind the net and had to be rescued by the D.

  82. DeadmanWaking says:

    The Oilers have gone sideways under coach Dallas Eakins

    One needs to be careful with Staples as he doesn’t have the sharpest eye for confounds.

    In the blue trunks (and blue cheeks) the hypothesis that the team has “gone sideways” part II.

    In the red trunks the hypothesis that the team is improving fairly rapidly under Eakins, but the new program began with a twenty-game clusterfuck and we’re only just beginning to reap the rewards now.

    There’s no way the last ten games represent a balanced sample one can split east vs. west to decide if we’ve improved more against the weak than the strong. On this point Staples has lost his mind.

    I think he knows that his conclusion is more appropriate at the end of March, but he covers his bases by amping it up before its time, so that when the time come, it’s ripe on the vine.

    While it might be good journalism, it’s sloppy thinking unless the reader recognizes it for what it is.

    As ever, we wait. On this point three to four months.

    After blowing the top half of the organization up, we wait another two, maybe three years.

    I choose the shorter line. I’m not nearly patient enough to even begin to think about the more radical solution.

  83. theres oil in virginia says:

    magisterrex:
    So..woodguy has gone from seeing unicorns to napalming the glade he saw them in, and theotherjohn posts a reasonably positive item regarding the Oilers upcoming schedule. Am I on the right blog or is this one of those “Infinite Universes” things?

    Add onto that Hunter making positive noise…I gotta change my meds! Wait, I don’t have any meds! There’s the problem.

  84. bookje says:

    RexLibris: I hope I don’t get banned for saying that I laughed.

    As someone who has taken their fair share of ad hominem attacks at other sites, I can say that a statement that – shall we say “bold”? – on LT’s own blog, is very obviously a bit of hyperbole wrapped in impish cheekiness. In my opinion, anyway.

    Yes, indeed, I typed it in a John Cleese accent.

    LT is one of the nicest people I know, or don’t know perhaps. I’m not sure what you call an online friendship where you have never met.

  85. justDOit says:

    wintoon:
    Eklund just put a message that Philly and the Oilers are talking about a trade involving Couturier. I can only hope this is true. It would be a great step toward solving at least one of our problems.

    The following is a list of trades that Ecklund has forecast accurately:

    0) Never

  86. Lowetide says:

    bookje: Yes, indeed, I typed it in a John Cleese accent.

    LT is one of the nicest people I know, or don’t know perhaps.I’m not sure what you call an online friendship where you have never met.

    I laughed. Asshole is like dink. It’s just funny.

  87. RexLibris says:

    bookje: Yes, indeed, I typed it in a John Cleese accent.

    LT is one of the nicest people I know, or don’t know perhaps.I’m not sure what you call an online friendship where you have never met.

    Full Cleese-mode might have included references like “twat”, “lisping-git”, etc.

    As to an online friendship wherein one has never met the other: I believe the term is blogosphere. Or World of Warcraft.

  88. nez29 says:

    I have to admit that I don’t always believe in advanced stats, despite being a true believer in Baseball Prospectus-style analysis of baseball. So, some the debates about the way Staples chucks numbers around are certainly warranted. Tell ya what, though; watching Gagner float around, or various Oilers firing blind spin-a-rama passes makes me ill. I can’t recall how many times I have watched an Oiler whirl around like a table hockey player and cough up the puck is simply fucking awful. Watching the defense flounder under owngoal’s inspired direction isn’t a lot of fun, either. As some others have opined, firing Bucky and Stevie would be a convincing start to me as a semi-regular paying customer. Just a thought–how many of us own ticket packages of some sort? No, I am not implying my fandom is better than anyone else’s ala SixRings.Just wonderin’.

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