ARCO!

The Edmonton Oilers have extended Mark Arcboello for next season. No details yet, but Arcobello showed well enough during his time in Edmonton to justify a one-way contract. Among Oiler fringe players, Arcobello showed more and received less than the others in the group this season. I’ve wondered about this signing—this is a player who looks like he can survive in the NHL—because he spent half the season in the AHL after a splendid first half in Edmonton.

arco player cardThere’s some nice things here, beginning with a 48% Corsi for 5×5 on an Oiler team well below 45% (this screenshot was from earlier in the year). Where does Arcobello fit into next season? I expect he’ll be a depth player who can jump into a top 6 role as required. He can play center or wing, and move the puck well. He is also (it’s true) very good at puck retrieval and separating bigger men from the puck.

A surprise, welcome signing. Welcome to the 2014-15 Edmonton Oilers, Mark Arcobello!!! What the hell did you just do?????????/////

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84 Responses to "ARCO!"

  1. crude says:

    Best news in a while.

  2. FPB94 says:

    This is part of what makes the Oilers a horrible team. A guy like him is killing the minors and did well in the pros, having his pro place taken by scrubs like Joenssuu and Gazdic.

    Good thing he got another contract. But this team’s moronic persistence on subjective factors (like truculence) over talent is annoying.

    For once the Oilers got a free (good) player and he was rotting in the minors (for a good part of the season)

  3. regwald says:

    I would assume it is a one way contract else why would he sign an extension so early without it.

  4. Ducey says:

    FPB94,

    He is injured.

    Should they call him up so he can make an NHL salary on IR?

  5. FPB94 says:

    Ducey,

    That’d be pretty classy.

    Typo (or more brain fart, should have read he was) My bad.

  6. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    I think there are two things we can say for sure(ish) now.

    1. it sure looks like Arco and MacT had some kind of agreement in principle: you go help the kids learn how to win in OKC. We’ll take care of you as far as next season is concern. you’ve earned your stripes.

    2. with Arco injured, there’s no reason to not get it down now.

    at any rate, this is a great sign. let’s hope the rest of the moves reflect possession hockey thinking.

  7. Ducey says:

    FPB94:
    Ducey,

    That’d be pretty classy.

    So would apologizing for your earlier diatribe…

    Edit: I see you now have.

  8. su_dhillon says:

    Pleasantly surprised with signing though if he was in their plans for next year all along, the last 4 months makes a lot less sense.

    Either way a player that can seemingly play a number of roles for little money is a good thing.

    His chance to play up in the order probably directly tied to Gagner, but I would love to see a scenario where a guy like Archo plays on the 4th line with 2 other actual players and provides the team with more than just grit, or hustle or glue or pushback or whatever it is that people think 4th lines are supposed to do.

  9. Bar_Qu says:

    This, more than anything recently, gives me hope for this team next year. It’s a value signing, to a guy who can play above his level a place on the team.

    I think this is the hammer knocking nails in the coffin of Lander’s career as an Oiler, tho.

  10. Bag of Pucks says:

    Late to the party today, but I found a lot of interest to be found in the previous thread and just wanted to chime in with a couple thoughts re:the discussion of Millenial work ethic / entitlement

    I agree with those that react strongly to this assertion feeling it is stereotyping their generation. It is. I’ve been a senior manager in a corporate environment for 20+ years and laziness / entitlement isn’t an age specific issue. There are plenty of hard working young people and plenty of lazy old employees (to be fair to the latter group however, they’re tired! They been busting their hump for a good while).

    The one thing I think we can all agree on is life gets easier with each passing generation (far less manual labour and far more creature comforts & access to information). I know young adults the age of my sons that have barely done a day of manual labour in their life, if at all. That was unheard of 20 years ago. 100 years ago, people worked damn hard 12-16 hours a day because they had to, to survive. Nowadays, you’re lucky if you get 4-6 hours of actual productivity out of an employee.

    Those on the cusp of adult life have always complained that their lot in life will be tougher because of the crap world left to them by the previous generation. But these complaints rarely hold up under closer scrutiny. On almost every meaningful quality of life metric, life is good now and getting better, particularly if you’re educated, have a good attitude and a strong work ethic. We have first world problems in this country, and those aren’t REAL problems at all IMO.

    The one trend I have personally noticed with Millenials is they aren’t as naturally respectful or deferential of authority as their parent’s generation were. The previous generation was taught/raised to respect authority as a ‘given’ facet of work life. Many of the current generation don’t buy into the concept of blindly obeying their leaders. This can be a good thing as it forces management to be more communicative and modern mgmt practices are much more focused on transparency and ‘buy-in’ than they were say, 20 years ago. Conversely, I have watched a plethora of talented young individuals make career limiting moves, if not committing outright career suicide, simply because of their inability to respect authority when appropriate. Complaining is never productive (unless it’s accompanied by solutions), but this is a truism that many new to the workforce struggle to assimilate.

    And one issue that never goes away is the generation gap. Kids fresh out of school almost always overrate the importance of their education and the veteran employees almost always overrate the importance of their experience. In actuality, both groups can learn from each other, and those cultures that strive to cross this gap and achieve this balance tend to be the best companies to work for.

  11. spoiler says:

    You mean the Oilogoshpere panic over losing Arcobello meant we were pushing the button too soon? Shocking.

  12. Woodguy says:

    This is good.

    I was afraid that the Oilers were overlooking his ability to win battles and make the puck go the right way because he’s short.

    The Oilers have 4 types of players

    Good small players
    Not good small players

    Good larger players
    Not good larger players

    More good players, regardless of size please.

    Gregor goes on and on about the wrong mix on the team.

    He’s right about the wrong mix.

    There are too many not good players mixed in with the handful of good players.

    Arco is a good player.

  13. Acumen says:

    On Arcobello, I was cautiously optimistic this would be the case: that they promised him a one-way contract for an AHL-scale hit to help OKC with the stretch run. Eakins said on a couple occasions they were aware of how he was blowing the roof off the joint, and it just made sense that some communication along these lines took place.

    On the Millenial discussion, sweeping generalizations are sweeping generalizations. They’re ignorant, arrogant, and disrespectful, no matter what a google search over a pot of coffee will tell you. If Clay were speaking to his own personal experiences and offering them up an anecdote as a possible explanation for the problems at hand, that would be one thing. But he wasn’t. You could replace “millenials” with any national, racial, gendered, or socio-economic grouping and cite research. You would still sound like a dingus.

    That is all, now let us relish in the hard work and stick-to-itiveness of Marco the Millenial and thank the Gords that the organization didn’t screw this up.

    Today is a good day.

  14. Bruce McCurdy says:

    Am pleased but not that surprised at this news (though it is earlier than I might have expected). For all the ” Arco’s gone cuz Oilers screwed him over” talk, fact remains this was the org that gave him his first shot at the pros, at the AA, AAA, & AAAA (or whatever the Oilers are) levels. This org showed more belief in him than any other. Had to be a 1-way though, presumably the $$$ are reasonable.

  15. FPB94 says:

    Bag of Pucks,

    People have been complaining about the next generation for 4000 years. You can read on the Greeks already complaining about the next one.

    AKA everybody’s who’s ever always thought their generation was better than the next.

  16. rich says:

    Arcobello helps fill out the bottom 6. Decent center who can win a faceoff. Not afraid to hit and can forecheck. This is a very useful player.

    He can also be a stopgap person on the 2nd line for a short period when there is an injury.

    Nice signing. Glad he will be back.

  17. gogliano says:

    Bag of Pucks:
    Late to the party today, but I found a lot of interest to be found in the previous thread and just wanted to chime in with a couple thoughts re:the discussion of Millenial work ethic / entitlement

    I agree with those that react strongly to this assertion feeling it is stereotyping their generation. It is. I’ve been a senior manager in a corporate environment for 20+ years and laziness / entitlement isn’t an age specific issue. There are plenty of hard working young people and plenty of lazy old employees (to be fair to the latter group however, they’re tired! They been busting their hump for a good while).

    The one thing I think we can all agree on is life gets easier with each passing generation (far less manual labour and far more creature comforts & access to information). I know young adults the age of my sons that have barely done a day of manual labour in their life, if at all. That was unheard of 20 years ago. 100 years ago, people worked damn hard 12-16 hours a day because they had to, to survive. Nowadays, you’re lucky if you get 4-6 hours of actual productivity out of an employee.

    Those on the cusp of adult life have always complained that their lot in life will be tougher because of the crap world left to them by the previous generation. But these complaints rarely hold up under closer scrutiny. On almost every meaningful quality of life metric, life is good now and getting better, particularly if you’re educated, have a good attitude and a strong work ethic. We have first world problems in this country, and those aren’t REAL problems at all IMO.

    The one trend I have personally noticed with Millenials is they aren’t as naturally respectful or deferential of authority as their parent’s generation were. The previous generation was taught/raised to respect authority as a ‘given’ facet of work life. Many of the current generation don’t buy into the concept of blindly obeying their leaders. This can be a good thing as it forces management to be more communicative and modern mgmt practices are much more focused on transparency and ‘buy-in’ than they were say, 20 years ago. Conversely, I have watched a plethora of talented young individuals make career limiting moves, if not committing outright career suicide, simply because of their inability torespect authority when appropriate. Complaining is never productive (unless it’s accompanied by solutions), but this is a truism that many new to the workforce struggle to assimilate.

    And one issue that never goes away is the generation gap. Kids fresh out of school almost always overrate the importance of their education and the veteran employees almost always overrate the importance of their experience. In actuality, both groups can learn from each other, and those cultures that strive to cross this gap and achieve this balance tend to be the best companies to work for.

    Yeah, the boomers are renowned for their respect for authority. I’d wager that the Millenials lack of respect for authority, if it is exists, is a direct result of the boomer culture and its conception of parenting.

    But whatever. Nice signing, Arco is a player and the signing suggests a plan by MacT. Him hitting the AHL looks a lot better if he was returning and it turns out he was returning.

  18. Bag of Pucks says:

    FPB94:
    Bag of Pucks,

    People have been complaining about the next generation for 4000 years. You can read on the Greeks already complaining about the next one.

    AKA everybody’s who’s ever always thought their generation was better than the next.

    Yep, that’s the generation gap I was referring to.

    People are people. The world/technology is evolving around us at a rapid rate. That’s the bigger issue imo.

  19. justDOit says:

    Good news indeed. Does anyone know his waiver status for next season then?

  20. justDOit says:

    OilersNow @OilersNow
    Follow
    Todd Nelson confirms on Oilers Now that Will Acton has been called up by the Oilers. #Oilers #NHL

  21. book¡je says:

    Bruce McCurdy:
    Am pleased but not that surprised at this news (though it is earlier than I might have expected). For all the ” Arco’s gone cuz Oilers screwed him over” talk, fact remains this was the org that gave him his first shotat the pros, at the AA, AAA, & AAAA (or whatever the Oilers are) levels. This org showed more belief in him than any other. Had to be a 1-way though, presumably the $$$ are reasonable.

    I agree. I also suspect that they did give him a “You’ve done a really good job here, but the season is lost so we are going to give you a chance to provide some leadership at the AHL level” talk.

  22. frjohnk says:

    Martin St. Louis GP G A Pts
    1999-00 Calgary NHL 56 3 15 18
    1999-00 St John AHL 17 15 11 26

    Marco Arcobello

    2013-13 Edmonton 41 4 14 18
    Oklahoma City 15 10 18 28

    Similar sized players, put up similar numbers at about the same age. I’m not suggesting Arco is the next St. Louis, because he isn’t. But for the small chance he becomes a good nhler and puts up a decent amount of points, the last thing the oilers need to do in this rebuild, is remake a mistake like the flames did and let a good player slip through their hands.

    Worst case scenario for the oilers is that he lights up the AHL next year. Good signing.

  23. jb says:

    Let’s be honest here. If Eakins had made the right move, playing Arco ahead of Gagner, you’d kill every bit of value Gagner has… It just wasn’t an option. Neither player would make or break this shit season. Now there’s a backup plan in place, you either find a way to get that Coutourier type center, or you can ditch Gagner and his 5 million, replace him with Arco and spent the difference on he back end. Either way you come out ahead.

    Would anyone bet on Gagner still being an Oiler next year? Or are we still trading Yak for Christian Ehrhoff? Lol…

  24. Caramel Obvious says:

    FPB94:
    Bag of Pucks,

    People have been complaining about the next generation for 4000 years. You can read on the Greeks already complaining about the next one.

    AKA everybody’s who’s ever always thought their generation was better than the next.

    It is incredible how false this statement is. It is unequivocal that the generation gap is not a universal feature of all societies.

    Now it is true that Plato, for instance, made very similar observations concerning the inheritance of customs, ideas, traditions, from one generation to the next that are remarkably similar to what is heard “these days.” But that’s because the context is the same.

    The “generation gap” and the suspicion of traditional authority is a feature of the democratic city and the democratic soul. It isn’t a universal feature of human beings. To say “it was ever thus” conceals a great deal about what is distinctive of contemporary society.

    Acumen,

    There is nothing wrong with generalizations. Indeed, to think is to generalize.

  25. Bag of Pucks says:

    gogliano: Yeah, the boomers are renowned for their respect for authority.I’d wager that the Millenials lack of respect for authority, if it is exists, is a direct result of the boomer culture and its conception of parenting.

    One of the key behaviours associated with ‘entitlement’ thinking is a tendency to assign blame rather than accept personal responsibility or accountability for an issue. Your reply is pretty ironic (and quite funny) with that in mind.

  26. OilClog says:

    So Arco is here next year.

    Does that mean Lander has failed in his audition again?

    Or is he simply replacing Smyth as the utility guy?

  27. spoiler says:

    Bruce McCurdy: Am pleased but not that surprised at this news (though it is earlier than I might have expected). For all the ” Arco’s gone cuz Oilers screwed him over” talk, fact remains this was the org that gave him his first shot at the pros, at the AA, AAA, & AAAA (or whatever the Oilers are) levels. This org showed more belief in him than any other. Had to be a 1-way though, presumably the $$$ are reasonable.

    I said this like two weeks ago, but was informed that the Oilers had irreparably damaged whatever goodwill they had with Arco by stranding him in the minors.

  28. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    Ducey:
    FPB94,

    He is injured.

    Should they call him up so he can make an NHL salary on IR?

    I don’t think this is possible.

    I believe all transactions (up/down) are dependent on the player not being injured. (I could be wrong)

    they could have given him a signing bonus if they wanted to slip him some cash (but it would count to the bonus cap next year I believe)

  29. FPB94 says:

    Caramel Obvious,

    Straw harder please.

    I said ”People have been complaining for 4000 years” (People can be a small percentage of civilizations) and you transformed it to ”Every person of every civilization known to man ever did that”.

    Of course civilizations who enforce their doctrines will have less conflict with their youth because they’re lawfully imposing their will on them.

  30. Lois Lowe says:

    You people should all get off my lawn.

  31. FPB94 says:

    Bag of Pucks,

    Well the boomers have statistically hoarded an historical amount of resources for themselves..

  32. book¡je says:

    Lois Lowe:
    You people should all get off my lawn.

    WHY ARE YOU RUINING MY LIFE?

  33. book¡je says:

    FPB94:
    Bag of Pucks,

    Well the boomers have statistically hoarded an historical amount of resources for themselves..

    Sure, but they did so in such an inefficient way that they likely benefited from them far less than the current generation so…

  34. book¡je says:

    When I was young, I always respected those in positions of authority even if 80% of that respect was feigned because a lot of them didn’t deserve my respect. I’m not sure that is better than what happens today.

  35. FPB94 says:

    book¡je,

    I’d like to see somebody 23 out of college trying and get a loan for a house today and not get rejected.

    Our ”main” problem at the moment is the lost of social integration. Canada has one of the highest bachelor’s and master’s unemployment rate. Companies don’t care for their role as industrial citizens and the government doesn’t care to remind them. Cue tu Switzerland or Germany where the companies are made accountable by having to hire and give a hand in the formation of local graduates.

  36. Lois Lowe says:

    I used to be with it, but then they changed what *it* was. Now what I’m with isn’t *it*, and what’s *it* seems weird and scary to me.

  37. Bag of Pucks says:

    book¡je: Sure, but they did so in such an inefficient way that they likely benefited from them far less than the current generation so…

    No, you’re absolutely right. Throwing a perfectly good cellphone into recycling every year because it doesn’t run the latest app is a HUGELY efficient and environmentally conscious usage of resource material.

  38. Bag of Pucks says:

    FPB94:
    book¡je,

    I’d like to see somebody 23 out of college trying and get a loan for a house today and not get rejected.

    What makes you think this was any different 20 years ago? An established credit rating doesn’t happen overnight for anyone. THAT is entitlement thinking.

  39. FPB94 says:

    Bag of Pucks,

    Insinuating the expensive cellphone market isn’t filled with the older demographic.

    Bag of Pucks,

    It sure as hell was easier in the 60′s-70′s. (It went downhill by the 80′s with the crisis).

    It’s easier to frown upon people not being able to get much done when it was easier before. Stats are clear on this one; over time it takes more weeks of job to pay for an education and you get your first house on average much later.

  40. justDOit says:

    “The 25-year-old native of Milford, Conn., has 18 points in 41 games this season.”

    Milford. Sounds like a great little town.

  41. Bag of Pucks says:

    book¡je:
    When I was young, I always respected those in positions of authority even if 80% of that respect was feigned because a lot of them didn’t deserve my respect.I’m not sure that is better than what happens today.

    I found the use of the word ‘deserve’ in that sentence interesting. I’m not sure why that is.

  42. Lois Lowe says:

    My education has cost more than my parent’s first house by fairly substantial margin.

  43. RexLibris says:

    On Arcobello: good news. Does this impact Lander? I don’t think so, I think it means that MacTavish believes that a forward can be any type of forward provided he knows how to play center once in awhile.

    I’d rather have Lander on the 4th line wing than Joensuu at this point, not least because he is a more versatile type of player. Like LT likes to say, wide range of skills. Arcobello can play center or wing.

    Arcobello seems to me to be the kind of player we had hoped Omark might become.

    A quick (and facetious) note about the previous thread and the Oilers learning to play the Eakins way. After seeing some stats from the Rangers game and the season-to-date I started thinking about how often people said that the Oilers needed to learn how to play without the puck. Well, good news, they’ve had nearly an entire season of practice at it now. Eakins doesn’t need to bag-skate these guys because they spend a good part of the game doing it to themselves chasing the puck hither and yon.

  44. RexLibris says:

    Lois Lowe:
    My education has cost more than my parent’s first house by fairly substantial margin.

    But it is priceless.

  45. Bag of Pucks says:

    Lois Lowe:
    My education has cost more than my parent’s first house by fairly substantial margin.

    Seriously, we’re complaining about inflation now?

  46. Ducey says:

    Lois Lowe: My education has cost more than my parent’s first house by fairly substantial margin.

    Maybe you should charge admission to stand on your lawn. It would likely solve several of your problems.

  47. russ99 says:

    If they don’t actually use the guy, then it’s 1 of 50 contracts wasted.

    I really have to wonder why Arco signed, he could get a better opportunity to play in the NHL elsewhere, albeit probably not a one-way contract.

  48. bendelson says:

    book¡je,

    I respect approximately 80% of this comment.

  49. book¡je says:

    FPB94:
    book¡je,

    I’d like to see somebody 23 out of college trying and get a loan for a house today and not get rejected.

    Our ”main” problem at the moment is the lost of social integration. Canada has one of the highest bachelor’s and master’s unemployment rate. Companies don’t care for their role as industrial citizens and the government doesn’t care to remind them. Cue tu Switzerland or Germany where the companies are made accountable by having to hire and give a hand in the formation of local graduates.

    Universities here also need to actively work with industries to make this happen. I can say from experience that programs who work with industry benefit from doing so. You don’t need to (and should not) give up academic independence or a critical approach, but it is useful to connect with industry (regardless of what that ‘industry’ is).

  50. rickithebear says:

    Arco is a pocession player who is not afarid to hit players like W. Mitchell.
    He show the abilty to use lower center of gravity to target contact on the thigh and hip area. Drives the players off the puck and retrieves pocession.

    He has great footspeed and is able to use that speed to press the zone.

    Arco is not a 4th line player.

    When you look at hiS WOWY.

    He was 2.25 GF/60 and 1.38 AG/60 when facing the other teams best with Hall and Perron.

    He was 1.90 GF/60 and 1.51 GA/60 with Smyth-Jones versus 2nds.

    When he played wing with any of our centers (Gordon, RNH, Gagner) he wa
    .762GF/60 and 3.82 GA/60s

    Arco with Gazdic, Jeonsuu, Yak was awful.
    1.75 GF/60 and 4.05 Ga/60
    but there results were best with him.

    In fact 7/8 forwards with greater than 20 min played had there best results with him!

    He is a 2.05 EVGF/60 and 1.41 EVGa/60 player 3rd line or better playing center.

    I would hope that he is paired with Hall next year.
    2.92 GF/60 and 2.14 GA/60

    It could free up a gagner move at the draft.

  51. Bag of Pucks says:

    FPB94:

    Bag of Pucks,

    Stats are clear on this one; over time it takes more weeks of job to pay for an education and you get your first house on average much later.

    Thanks for reinforcing my point on ‘first world problems’

    Wah, I own my own house, but I’m going to have to work a little longer to pay for it. Life is SO unfair!

  52. book¡je says:

    Bag of Pucks: What makes you think this was any different 20 years ago? An established credit rating doesn’t happen overnight for anyone. THAT is entitlement thinking.

    Depending where you live, the accessibility of home ownership has declined a fair bit. I am 43 and could have bought a home in Edmonton when I was 20 pretty easily. A 20 year old today doesn’t stand a chance of doing so.

    With that said, I work with lots of young university students and they range from very ambitious through to quite lazy, from highly respectful to fairly disrespectful, etc. I haven’t been doing this long enough to know if there has been some huge shift, but I suspect that the distributions along these types of continuum hasn’t changed near as much as some ‘old’ or ‘young’ people suggest it has.

  53. Lois Lowe says:

    Ducey,

    You, sir, would make Adam Smith proud.

  54. FPB94 says:

    Bag of Pucks,

    Thanks for reinforcing my point on boomers.

    ”Oh god i fucked up and now everybody’s gonna have it worst, if they complain about my obvious huge mistakes i’ll just call them whiners and keep saying ”wah”’ cause that puts me on a pedestal”

  55. book¡je says:

    Bag of Pucks: No, you’re absolutely right. Throwing a perfectly good cellphone into recycling every year because it doesn’t run the latest app is a HUGELY efficient and environmentally conscious usage of resource material.

    I don’t think you have a clear understanding of efficiency. That cel phone likley produced far more information in it’s one year than a calculator did over 20 years before you threw it out. Similarly, a 1973 T-bird got about 8 mpg, while a large inefficient car today would get about 25-30mpg.

    In any case, its clear you mis-understood the point and/or are trolling. I feel sorry for your generation – whatever generation that is.

  56. Marc says:

    FPB94:
    This is part of what makes the Oilers a horrible team. A guy like him is killing the minors and did well in the pros, having his pro place taken by scrubs like Joenssuu and Gazdic.

    Good thing he got another contract. But this team’s moronic persistence on subjective factors (like truculence) over talent is annoying.

    For once the Oilers got a free (good) player and he was rotting in the minors (for a good part of the season)

    They weren’t just dicking him around. The timing of his sending down in January strongly suggests that they:
    a. wanted him to be able to play for OKC in their playoff run; and
    b. didn’t want to lose him on waivers.

    Arcobello has (and has had since they sent him down) ten NHL games left until he becomes waiver eligible. They send him down ten games before the trade deadline because he had to be on the OKC roster prior to the deadline to play in the playoffs. If he had played in Edmonton until the trade deadline he would have had to go through waivers to get eligible to play for OKC in the playoffs and almost certainly would have been claimed.

    They may have been planning to bring him back up to play 9 more games (keep in mind that teams can still claim players off waivers after the trade deadline, they just won’t be eligible for the playoff roster) but OKC needed all the help they could get just to make the playoffs, and then he got hurt.

    It’s unlikely that he was ever going to be allowed to play more than 50 games at the NHL level this season, so as to keep him waiver exempt. I suspect the Oilers made that clear from the outset, but softened the blow by giving him a huge ($175K) AHL salary on his two way deal when, as an RFA he had no leverage to demand it.

  57. book¡je says:

    Lois Lowe:
    Ducey,

    You, sir, would make Adam Smith proud.

    or at least Miltion Friedman – Smith was a bit more complex.

  58. admiralmark says:

    spoiler:
    You mean the Oilogoshpere panic over losing Arcobello meant we werepushing the button too soon?Shocking.

    Ha ha now they can focus their fears on Simpson.

  59. Bag of Pucks says:

    FPB94:
    Bag of Pucks,

    Thanks for reinforcing my point on boomers.

    ”Oh god i fucked up and now everybody’s gonna have it worst, if they complain about my obvious huge mistakes i’ll just call them whiners and keep saying ”wah”’ cause that puts me on a pedestal”

    I think what you’re going to find and it is a very common perspective/journey to the human existence is that people in their twenties tend to blame their parents (and/or their generation) for much of what’s wrong with the world. It’s natural, the parents are pushing these young adults out of the nest into an uncertain, daunting world and the process is fraught with anxiety and uncertainty for all involved (parents and child alike).

    As you age, possibly have children of your own, you gain more appreciation for the challenges your parents faced and you gain a newfound appreciation that they in all likelihood probably did the best they could with the opportunities they had – and you lose this grip on demonizing the previous generation(s) as you age and inevitably become more like your parents. You also likely gain appreciation for how hard they worked, as did their parents before them, etc.

    Or you stay an entitled douche for life. That happens too.

  60. book¡je says:

    Bag of Pucks: You’re taking credit for the fact that you arrived when technology, likely designed by the previous generation, became more efficient?

    Is ‘your’ generation going to be the one to eliminate ‘planned obsolescence?’ If no, you really don’t have a leg to stand on with this argument. The generation after you will make more efficient products and on and on it goes.

    Taking credit for engineering evolution. Incredible.

    Wait, what generation do you think I am? I used the example of the 73 thunderbird because I used to drive one (though it was used when I got it). Just for fun, please go back to my original post and realize that in a sense I was defending the heavy resource use of earlier generations because they didn’t have the current modern efficiencies which, as you noted, were designed by that generation for the next one. Got it?

    My overall point is that intergenerational arguing is somewhat ridiculous.

  61. FPB94 says:

    Bag of Pucks,

    Linking appreciating your parents to a sociological perspective on generational impact. Nice mental gymnastics there.

    ”Either you agree with me or you’re a douche”.

    YOU’RE WRONG. VERY WRONG. TRUCULENCE

  62. Bag of Pucks says:

    book¡je: Wait, what generation do you think I am?I used the example of the 73 thunderbird because I used to drive one (though it was used when I got it).Just for fun, please go back to my original post and realize that in a sense I was defending the heavy resource use of earlier generations because they didn’t have the current modern efficiencies which, as you noted, were designed by that generation for the next one.Got it?

    My overall point is that intergenerational arguing is somewhat ridiculous.

    I deleted my post after re-reading yours.

    I understand the concept of efficiency. Implicitly.

  63. Bag of Pucks says:

    FPB94:
    Bag of Pucks,

    Linking appreciating your parents to a sociological perspective on generational impact. Nice mental gymnastics there.

    ”Either you agree with me or you’re a douche”.

    YOU’RE WRONG. VERY WRONG. TRUCULENCE

    Tell you what. You’re right. Life’s harder for your generation than the last. Sucks to be you.

    There, does that make you happy?

  64. Bag of Pucks says:

    book¡je
    My overall point is that intergenerational arguing is somewhat ridiculous.

    Fair point. Have arrived at the same conclusion. Peace out.

  65. hunter1909 says:

    Bag of Pucks: It’s natural

    Nothing natural about the current housing market and affordability. But I get it, you never had to worry about such trifles, because you were presumably being so respectful etc.

    Bag of Pucks: As you age,

    When my 85 year old gran tells me something I’ll listen. When some random internet type tries the same thing…

    Bag of Pucks: You also likely gain appreciation for how hard they worked, as did their parents before them, etc.

    This is hilarious. In 2014, re advising the young – this is off the charts.

  66. Bag of Pucks says:

    Hunter, I’m of the opinion that complaining about something is as effective as pissing in the wind.

    Every generation has faced obstacles and every person (regardless of age) is faced with the choice to do something about the challenges they face in life, or waste their time complaining about them instead.

    I am also keenly appreciative of the challenges young people face today in getting off to a good start in life. For my eldest son who will be finishing school soon, we’ve addressed the housing affordability issue with him by an offer whereby my wife and I purchase an income property with a basement income suite. The upstairs rental income will service the mortgage, while my son’s ‘pseudo’ rent payments will accrue until the combination of those and the increased equity from anticipated market appreciation make it viable for him to buy the home outright from us. To his credit, he’s still mulling it over as there’s a big part of him that wants full independence and to make his own way in this world. Time will tell.

    I’m not insensitive to these challenges. What I find hard to digest is this assertion that the previous generation didn’t face their own unique and seemingly equally insurmountable obstacles. How many of my father’s generation didn’t have the option to finish high school because of work demands on the farm?

    It’s myopic and entitled to think we/you/I have it any worse than any previous generation. And again, what are we complaining about? We have shelter, food in our bellies, and pretty cushy existences compared to the bulk of the world.

  67. Henry says:

    This thread and the previous have been great entertainment. I’m a prof and my colleagues and I discuss the merits, particularly the work ethic of various generations a lot, actually too much. I’d offer my thoughts but I’m afraid I’ll get in trouble.

    I will say this: Jonathon Toews, Crosby, Pietrelangelo and a host of others are part of the same lazy GenY/Millenial culture as the Oilers that mailed it in yesterday. Marc Arcobello is a Yalie – possibly the most entitled group of kids on the planet – but he worked his way from Stockton to the NHL by being a good smart versatile soldier.

    I don’t think the perceived or actual mores of a generation have much to do with the Oiler’s problems. They are stuck in a rut of losing and have to dig out. They know this, but still can’t or won’t. Losing this much is hard on the psyche of an elite athlete. Eakins and MacT have to get them out of it. As a group they have the talent to do it. Well, not with three rookies on the D.

  68. book¡je says:

    Henry,

    Hey I didnt have time to read your comment, did I miss anything important and will it be on the test?
    thansks

    bookjiekickass69@student.ca

  69. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    This whole thread was terrible until here:

    book¡je:
    Henry,

    Hey I didnt have time to read your comment, did I miss anything important and will it be on the test?
    thansks

    bookjiekickass69@student.ca

    all it needs is a 2am timestamp dated 2 weeks after the final exam has been conducted.

  70. Henry says:

    book¡je,

    I don’t give tests much. Just read theses. They are generally too fucking long but I still ask for more. Because I can and somebody did it to me.

    Still, F.

  71. rich says:

    Reading today’s thread was far better than last night’s game.

    LT – you need to start charging admission.

  72. thejonrmcleod says:

    Romulus Apotheosis:
    …this is a great sign.

    Did you intend the double meaning?

  73. Lowetide says:

    rich:
    Reading today’s thread was far better than last night’s game.

    LT – you need to start charging admission.

    I think the key is NOT charging. :-)

  74. Lowetide says:

    DVD tweeted out Arco’s deal a one-way. Nice. Sorry if it is up the thread, been beesy.

  75. russ99 says:

    Marc,

    That could be the case, however the Oilers have a track record of dumping players that haven’t established themselves when they cross that waiver threshold.

    IMO this bought Arco training camp to break into the roster. Otherwise he’ll either be claimed on waivers or buried in OKC.

  76. RexLibris says:

    book¡je: Universities here also need to actively work with industries to make this happen.I can say from experience that programs who work with industry benefit from doing so.You don’t need to (and should not) give up academic independence or a critical approach, but it is useful to connect with industry (regardless of what that ‘industry’ is).

    Disentangling the university philosophy from the customer and product ideologies would help, too. “The customer is always right” is almost entirely at odds with the university student process.

    Mark Edmundson wrote a fantastic book about this issue “Why Teach”. Highly recommend it to anyone, regardless of whether they are in education. At its core it has some very compelling points about the way that modern society has structured priorities.

  77. spoiler says:

    Bag of Pucks: Seriously, we’re complaining about inflation now?

    Inflation isn’t something that should be taken seriously or with a large dose of criticism? I know it is probably beyond our purview here, except with respect to the cap and salaries, but this seems a tad offhand.

  78. spoiler says:

    russ99: That could be the case, however the Oilers have a track record of dumping players that haven’t established themselves when they cross that waiver threshold.
    IMO this bought Arco training camp to break into the roster. Otherwise he’ll either be claimed on waivers or buried in OKC.

    Part of the reason it is a one-way is to give him some protection from a waiver pick up. Makes the cap challenged teams, as well as the ones on a budget, think twice before pulling the trigger.

  79. prairieschooner says:

    Were we panicking for nothing?

    Answer

    Because Oilers

  80. RexLibris says:

    Lowetide:
    DVD tweeted out Arco’s deal a one-way. Nice. Sorry if it is up the thread, been beesy.

    Adding apiculture to your resume!? Where do you find the time?

  81. Big Dan says:

    justDOit: “The 25-year-old native of Milford, Conn., has 18 points in 41 games this season.”Milford. Sounds like a great little town.

    Milford is actually a rather big city, houses the head office of Subway Restaurants. I believe it’s a stone’s throw from Hartford, I believe. A real shithole from what I remember when I was there a decade ago.

  82. gogliano says:

    Bag of Pucks: One of the key behaviours associated with ‘entitlement’ thinking is a tendency to assign blame rather than accept personal responsibility or accountability for an issue. Your reply is pretty ironic (and quite funny) with that in mind.

    Except I’m not a Millenial (significantly older), so if you want to assign “irony” to something in our little exchange you’ll need to look elsewhere.

  83. Numenius says:

    Very happy about this signing.

    I think Arco will provide a lot of what Hemsky would have provided had he stayed and maybe more.

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