FARM WORKERS 2014

Each year, I look back on the AHL season for Oiler prospects and see if there are any clues in regard to development. This season, the Barons sent some actual talent to the big leagues, two bona fide defenseman, a real center and some other things. Music! The original Farm Workers is here, the post below is just updating.

  1. Men who are over 30 and come out of the minors to establish (0r re-establish) themselves are pretty much a thing of the past. You’ll find the odd goalie or defenseman but unlike the orginal 6 era very few teams have enough depth and free agency makes it impossible to keep them on the farm. Which is a good thing. BARONS 13-14: None this year, no Yann Danis and no Josh Green’s. Richard Bachman felt like this player type, but is miles from 30.
  2. Pretty much everyone who is in the AHL past (say) 21 has some issues and is going to do some meandering (this is universal from 1965 through 2009). BARONS 13-14:  One of the reasons I love doing this each season is that things become clear. The “issues” players are obvious. Anton Lander, who imo has offense and speed issues; Roman Horak, who has fled the scene; Mark Arcobello, who punched his ticket; Tyler Pitlick, who may or may not be hurting himself as you read this now. A nice group to be sure, and for the Oilers a step up from the recent past. Flawed players just the same, and we should not be surprised if none of them work out. The thing to remember about these players? There’s another cluster just around the corner.
  3. We shouldn’t expect Rob Schremp to play more career games than Sam Gagner or Andrew Cogliano. Whatever that line in the sand is, that line sticks. BARONS 13-14: Of course it’s true, the years Pitlick lost to injury and struggles mean he’ll never get to Gags or Cogs. Klefbom and Marincin didn’t spend enough time in the minors to be severely harmed, but defensemen have their own issues (injury, crisis of confidence, new coaches, etc).
  4. No minor league regular is likely to do anything incredible like play in 1,000 NHL games. It is a rare thing for a player to spend a couple of seasons in the minors and then go on to a 1,000 NHL game calibre career. BARONS 13-14: Marincin and Klefbom have a chance, they really do, but let’s get them past 100 games before we get too excited. The two impressive callups arrived at 20, flew their sorties, used their perfectly good brains to figure out the different between calm and chaos, and flew the silver bird to the promised land.
  5. If you haven’t established yourself as a prospect of interest by 22 you are in trouble. The players who have graduated to useful NHL careers have at least played some NHL games by the end of their entry level deals. BARONS 13-14: I think this is probably the most important point in the group. There’s a difference between Tyler Pitlick and Curtis Hamilton, though it may only be 10 NHL games right now. It’s there. Musil, Gernat, hell even Lander. If you’re not established, then you’re not going to have a career, or at least you’ll have to pursue it elsewhere. I think we can make a statement here, and ask people to argue against it. NHL teams, as a rule, make their decisions on prospects during their entry level deals. If they haven’t played in the NHL for their drafting team by 22, even just a little bit, they are probably not going to in the following seasons.
  6. Exceptions are college men. Playing 4 NCAA seasons means turning pro at 22, meaning a “late start” for some quality prospects. BARONS 13-14: Yes. Yes all over. The college men for the Barons—Mark Arcobello, Taylor Fedun, Andrew Miller, Brad Hunt—they’re just terrific at delivering value. Sign them for nothing, send them to Black Rock, and they arrive two years later useful. Jesus, if I owned an NHL team college signing season would be bigger than the draft. Why not? Spend your brains out! Mark Arcobello didn’t cost a second round pick, but he’s kicking all their asses (Marincin excepted). There’s a lesson there.
  7. A large group of players on the current team could be described in the “tweener” division. History tells us we’ll have our answers on men like Schremp, Spurgeon, Roy and Reddox very soon. It also tells us we already have our answer on Colin McDonald. BARONS 13-14: These guys are taking the milk run, and very few ever make it. I would include Curtis Hamilton, Will Acton, Steve Pinizzotto, Ryan Hamilton, but also Travis Ewanyk, Kale Kessy, and we should probably keep Brandon Davidson in mind here—although that’s not fair as a statement yet. And as it turned out, McDonald surprised us, although late in the game.
  8. If we make a list of the minor league RFA’s each summer, we can probably as a group pick the cuts and be fairly close. That 50 man list gets a haircut every summer. BARONS 13-14: MacT has killed most of them already—Martindale, Roy, Abney—the man is a steamroller, baby. He’ll have to decide on Tyler Pitlick, Curtis Hamilton, Andrew Miller, Richard Bachman. Roman Horak is already gone to Europe. I really like MacT’s handling of all the chaff, suspect he’ll have a harder time when it’s his kids, though. GMs always do.
  9. Daniel Cleary, Fernando Pisani and Jason Chimera became productive players in the toughest league on the planet. THEY are the stars in this study. BARONS 13-14: Yes. Yes. YES! Marincin, Klefbom and one or two others are very likely to be the stars of this show. The AHL doesn’t give you jacks and kings, but the league does supply those important role players. Klefbom and Marincin may well grow into top 4D (Marincin appears to be there, but let’s allow for some uncertainty), and those AHL sorties flown were important to development.
  10. For Rob Schremp fans, there’s exactly ONE pure offensive player who made it: Mike Walton. BARONS 13-14: Yes. Yes. Yes. Lordy we’ve seen a parade of scorers who didn’t make the grade. On the other hand, Mark Arcobello, who offers a range of skills, found his way through the minor league jungle with aplomb.
  11. The future NHLERS are……..If I’m a betting man, these are the winners from the current group to be the new Cleary and Chimera. Here are the names I’ve mentioned over the years (a sample):
  • 2008: Theo Peckham and Gilbert Brule. Both were lost along the way.
  • 2011: Theo Peckham and Devan Dubnyk. Well, DD was there until this season, Peckham had a great chance but blew it.
  • 2012: Linus Omark, Magnus Paajarvi, Anton Lander, Teemu Hartikainen and Tyler Pitlick. Still waiting, would bet a lot on Paajarvi.
  • 2013: Magnus Paajarvi, Anton Lander, Teemu Hartikainen and Martin Marincin. Four names, I think a couple of them will make it.
  • 2014: This season, I’m choosing three players: Martin Marincin, Oscar Klefbom and Mark Arcobello.

The MacGregor drafting era began sending players to OKC in 2010. Teemu Hartikainen was the first, and the production line continues through this season. The 2010 entry draft has produced its second NHL player, the 2011 draft also has two in the show. We’ve seen some progress via the college signing route, and await a minor league free agent signing to show NHL ability.

When we began this look at the Oilers farm workers in 2008, the club badly needed quality AHL grads and there were very few. Those players who did arrive (like Colin McDonald) did so in another town, and I do think we may see that again with Teemu Hartikainen. The Edmonton Oilers have to draft players who they can grind into useful NHL men, and perhaps this season—more than any other in recent memory—provides us with some evidence things are finally in place.

Todd Nelson, Stu MacGregor and the others involved in procurement and development have to be on the same page. I believe Steve Tambellini pointed this organization in the right direction, it’s up to Craig MacTavish to make it go.

 

THE LOWDOWN

10 this morning, TSN 1260, I love doing this show. Scheduled to appear: Scott Cullen (TSN), Steve Hamilton (Oil Kings), Andrew Berkshire (Habs Eyes on the Prize) and Derek from Fear the Fin! 10-1260 text @Lowetide_ on twitter, questions are welcome, hope you tune in!

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76 Responses to "FARM WORKERS 2014"

  1. Lowetide says:

    Igor Eronko ‏@IgorEronko 2m

    #Oilers D Philip Larsen signed 1-year deal with #Yugra of #KHL

  2. wintoon says:

    Agree wholeheartedly with the comment to focus on college kids. The cost/potential return metric is off the charts. I am looking forward to seeing what Simpson can accomplish in the AHL this year.

  3. RexLibris says:

    Lowetide:
    Igor Eronko ‏@IgorEronko 2m

    #Oilers D Philip Larsen signed 1-year deal with #Yugra of #KHL

    Can’t wait for the 7th round of the draft next, no wait, the year after next!

  4. mumbai max says:

    Lowetide:
    Igor Eronko ‏@IgorEronko 2m

    #Oilers D Philip Larsen signed 1-year deal with #Yugra of #KHL

    Lucky him!

    Isn’t that the land of the Tatars and Yak City?

    I could be wrong about that, but it certainly IS Kansas.

  5. Woodguy says:

    Lowetide:
    Igor Eronko ‏@IgorEronko 2m

    #Oilers D Philip Larsen signed 1-year deal with #Yugra of #KHL

    So is he off the 50 man, or do the Oilers need to decline to qualify him?

  6. Kris11 says:

    Phillip Larsen is so unimportant to me that I don’t know and don’t care how to spell his name.

    My therapy is progressing, it seems.

  7. Reg Dunlop says:

    For a comparable to MarkArc, see Joe Mullen. College plus a couple seasons tearing up the minors then a real NHL career. I hope he gets a real chance at #2 centre this year.

  8. OilClog says:

    Larsen bolted.

    How come anyone that can run is running?

    Not that Larsen is much of a game changer but were now in a much higher danger of seeing the likes of Fraser back in Oiler silks.

  9. spoiler says:

    Lowetide: Igor Eronko ‏@IgorEronko 2m#Oilers D Philip Larsen signed 1-year deal with #Yugra of #KHL

    Dammit! That totally blows the fun I get from toying with him at wing on my roster mockups.

  10. OilClog says:

    Reg Dunlop:
    For a comparable to MarkArc, see Joe Mullen. College plus a couple seasons tearing up the minors then a real NHL career. I hope he gets a real chance at #2 centre this year.

    But it just doesn’t work, Arco is awesome. But if were giving him a real chance to hold down #2 spot were battling for a lottery pick again.

  11. Woodguy says:

    OilClog,

    How come anyone that can run is running?

    Exit interviews with the players (Larsen, Horak) may have gone this way:

    Player: Do you want me back?

    GM: You are welcome to come back and compete for a roster spot

    P: Can I get a one way contract

    GM: No

    P: Can I be assured of X games in the NHL?

    GM: No?

    P: I can make 10x in the KHL that I can in the AHL

    GM: Yes

    P: Ok then.

    GM: Ok then.

  12. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    Woodguy: So is he off the 50 man, or do the Oilers need to decline to qualify him?

    Even qualified he’s off the list, no.

    Harti not on TOR:

    http://www.capgeek.com/mapleleafs/reserve-list/

    Tyrvainen not on the Oilers list:

    http://www.capgeek.com/oilers/reserve-list/

  13. Reg Dunlop says:

    OilClog,

    Could be but if we see #89 in that spot not only will we be the favorite in the McDavid sweps I will probably have an aneurysm yelling at my TV. There is a chance with Mark that next year could be better, and who doesn’t love an underdog of Rudy proportions.

  14. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    Woodguy:
    OilClog,

    How come anyone that can run is running?

    Exit interviews with the players (Larsen, Horak) may have gone this way:

    Player: Do you want me back?

    GM: You are welcome to come back and compete for a roster spot

    P: Can I get a one way contract

    GM: No

    P: Can I be assured of X games in the NHL?

    GM: No?

    P: I can make 10x in the KHL that I can in the AHL

    GM: Yes

    P: Ok then.

    GM: Ok then.

    This. This needs to be like bronzed or something.

  15. Jordan says:

    Lowetide,

    Too bad – I really liked Larsen in the Toby Petersen role with the Oilers this year, if MacT decided that a lottery ticket for McDavid. Everyone would hate him but the coach, who figured out how to use him without having actual hockey options.

    BTW, I loved Dennis’ responses to my questions last week. They were killer. Thanks so much for asking them!

    I couldn’t help but howl when Rene got the hat trick last night. Oh my god, I can’t wait to hear the magic that comes out of of my favourite maritimer’s mouth tomorrow!

    “Will we have to trade Yakupov and the 3rd OV for Bourque? He’s so CLUTCH.”

    “If somehow MacT managed to become Glen Sather (circa. 1986) and had his way with every other GM in the league to transform the Oilers into a contender in one summer, what would he accomplish this offseason?”

    “Have you played the Lowedown drinking game yet? Whether you have or haven’t, what’s your poison of choice (and it can’t be Oilers Cool-aid because we all kill ourselves with it enough the rest of the time that it doesn’t count).”

  16. Henry says:

    Woodguy:
    OilClog,

    How come anyone that can run is running?

    Exit interviews with the players (Larsen, Horak) may have gone this way:

    Player: Do you want me back?

    GM: You are welcome to come back and compete for a roster spot

    P: Can I get a one way contract

    GM: No

    P: Can I be assured of X games in the NHL?

    GM: No?

    P: I can make 10x in the KHL that I can in the AHL

    GM: Yes

    P: Ok then.

    GM: Ok then.

    Woodguy,

    I wonder if Taylor Fedun’s interview went that way. I hope he is the 7th defenseman with the big club this year. I also hope he signs the Arco/Lander $600K one way contract. That will leave plenty of capspace for whale hunting.

  17. Caramel Obvious says:

    A lot of Gagner talk in the last thread. I don’t want him traded for picks either. However, we have to come to terms with his value.

    Is Gagner better than Derek Brassard or Kris Versteeg?

    If he isn’t, and he has a 4.8 million contract, what do you think his trade value is?

    If you do think he’s better than Brassard or Versteeg, who do you think his comparables are?

    Honest questions. I think Gagner is the kind of player with the kind of contract who, rightly or wrongly, often has negative value.

  18. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    Henry: Woodguy,

    I wonder if Taylor Fedun’s interview went that way.I hope he is the 7th defenseman with the big club this year.I also hope he signs the Arco/Lander $600K one way contract.That will leave plenty of capspace for whale hunting.

    I think Fedun gives the NA a few more shots before resigning himself to Europe. But, that’s just a guess.

  19. Logan91 says:

    People in Pittsburgh this morning suggesting a Neal trade for Perron and Moroz.

  20. Henry says:

    Romulus Apotheosis,

    With the Larson and Belov experiment over, I think it makes sense to go with the guy they know. He was #1 for a year and a half in OKC, faster than Belov and bigger than Larsen.

    Smart hockey players don’t grow on trees.

  21. Henry says:

    Logan91,

    Neal has four years left at $5M. Perron has 2 more at $4M. Moroz might end up a valuable hockey player.

    It’s an interesting deal. Why does Pittsburgh do it? To save $1M?

    If done, it would be nice to have the rights to Niskanen thrown in.

  22. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    Henry:
    Romulus Apotheosis,

    With the Larson and Belov experiment over, I think it makes sense to go with the guy they know.He was #1 for a year and a half in OKC, faster than Belov and bigger than Larsen.

    Smart hockey players don’t grow on trees.

    I don’t think the Larsen and Belov situations are analogous.

    But I agree that Fedun might get a shot as the 7. Being a RHD probably helps.

  23. Hammers says:

    Henry: Logan91, Neal has four years left at $5M. Perron has 2 more at $4M. Moroz might end up a valuable hockey player. It’s an interesting deal. Why does Pittsburgh do it? To save $1M? If done, it would be nice to have the rights to Niskanen thrown in.

    Why would you . Neal on the downward slope & Perron just in the midst of his career with Moroz an unknown at this stage but potential . Do Gags & Musil for Neal .

  24. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    Logan91:
    People in Pittsburgh this morning suggesting a Neal trade for Perron and Moroz.

    have you got a link. I’d be interested to read this.

  25. TheOtherJohn says:

    Hammers: Why would you . Neal on the downward slope & Perron just in the midst of his career with Moroz an unknown at this stage but potential . Do Gags & Musil for Neal .

    Neal 1 year older than Perron

    Same # of games 50 more goals 60 more points

  26. Woodguy says:

    Romulus Apotheosis: I think Fedun gives the NA a few more shots before resigning himself to Europe. But, that’s just a guess.

    Given his academic record I don’t think the Oilers are competing with European leagues wrt Fedun, I think they are competing against companies like 3M and BASF.

    It really depends on how much Fedun wants to play hockey.

  27. Bruce McCurdy says:

    It is a rare thing for a player to spend a couple of seasons in the minors and then go on to a 1,000 NHL game calibre career.

    The list of players with 1000 NHL GP & 100 AHL GP is a short one. Active** players who have done this include:

    Sean O’Donnell: 1224 + 211 (+ 61 in IHL)
    Patrik Elias: 1155 + 134
    Adrian Aucoin: 1108 + 113
    Vinny Prospal: 1108 + 255
    Mike Knuble: 1068 + 149
    Wade Redden: 1023 + 119
    Steve Sullivan: 1011 + 143

    **Active players as identified by Hockey-reference. In fact just Elias of this group was in the NHL this season. Marty St. Louis was closest of the rest with 95 AHL games and 56 in the IHL along with 1060 in the NHL, so consider him an honourary member of the 1000/100 club.

  28. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    Woodguy: Given his academic record I don’t think the Oilers are competing with European leagues wrt Fedun, I think they are competing against companies like 3M and BASF.

    It really depends on how much Fedun wants to play hockey.

    haha…

    Ivy grads are always in demand. But, several years out from degree… I highly doubt he’s got recruiters knocking on his door for job-jobs.

    And, if he didn’t bolt for private sector work in his educated field after breaking his femur, he probably won’t now.

  29. Lois Lowe says:

    Hammers,

    You do that deal in an instant and don’t think twice.

  30. russ99 says:

    Kind of sad that younger and European players are thinking the KHL is better for them than fighting for a spot on our roster.

    I’d think the sad state of the OKC roster has to play a part in that.

  31. justDOit says:

    Bruce McCurdy:

    Sean O’Donnell: 1224 + 211 (+ 61 in IHL)
    Patrik Elias: 1155 + 134
    Adrian Aucoin: 1108 + 113
    Vinny Prospal: 1108 + 255
    Mike Knuble: 1068 + 149
    Wade Redden: 1023 + 119
    Steve Sullivan: 1011 + 143

    I think Redden’s AHL time was mostly due to buried salary at the end of his career, no?

  32. Ribs says:

    Hammers: Why would you . Neal on the downward slope & Perron just in the midst of his career with Moroz an unknown at this stage but potential . Do Gags & Musil for Neal .

    Neal’s on the downward slope? We’re talking about James Neal, right?

  33. justDOit says:

    Ribs: Neal’s on the downward slope? We’re talking about James Neal, right?

    Exactly – had me thinking of Harry Neale.

  34. Ribs says:

    I wonder if the Larsen news means a Schultz deal is close to being finished.

  35. Jordan says:

    justDOit: Exactly – had me thinking of Harry Neale.

    Awe… here I was thinking we might have a trade for Neal Young.

    …But then I realized that he would never waive his NTC to play for a team called the ‘Oil’ers.

  36. Racki says:

    OilClog:
    Larsen bolted.

    How come anyone that can run is running?

    Not that Larsen is much of a game changer but were now in a much higher danger of seeing the likes of Fraser back in Oiler silks.

    These guys that are ‘running’ are fringe NHLers. Questionable if good enough for Oilers, let alone another team. If Justin Schultz jets for Europe, you worry. Larsen? “OK see Ya. Thanks for your service last year”.

    I consider them failed experiments. I suspect this isn’t the last the NHL sees of Belov but would expect Larsen doesn’t come back.

  37. Woodguy says:

    Henry: Woodguy,

    I wonder if Taylor Fedun’s interview went that way.I hope he is the 7th defenseman with the big club this year.I also hope he signs the Arco/Lander $600K one way contract.That will leave plenty of capspace for whale hunting.

    I think Fedun would look at another year of a 2 way contract.

  38. Woodguy says:

    Racki: These guys that are ‘running’are fringe NHLers. Questionable if good enough for Oilers, let alone another team. If Justin Schultz jets for Europe, you worry. Larsen? “OK see Ya. Thanks for your service last year”.

    I consider them failed experiments. I suspect this isn’t the last the NHL sees of Belov but would expect Larsen doesn’t come back.

    Belov signed a 4 year deal and he’s 28 this summer.

    I doubt he’ll come back.

    The fact that he didn’t even try to get on another NHL team (signed in KHL before was FA in NHL) says that his mind was made up to go home.

  39. Woodguy says:

    Romulus Apotheosis:
      (Quote)  (Reply)

    Mechanical engineering (honors) degree from Princeton doesn’t go stale.

  40. Woodguy says:

    russ99:
    Kind of sad that younger and European players are thinking the KHL is better for them than fighting for a spot on our roster.

    I’d think the sad state of the OKC roster has to play a part in that.

    No.

    Guaranteed money in the AHL runs as high as 80K, lots at 65K.

    Guaranteed money in the KHL can easily be 500K for these guys.

    Omark got $1MM one year.

    its not much of a choice if you are a young man on the fringe.

    Nothing to do with the organization.

    If MacT thought you were the top end of the fringe then you got a guaranteed contract (Arco, Lander)

    If you are not the top of the fringe, then good luck and I’d go to the KHL too.

    They are fringe and there’s a fresh crop every year.

  41. djs says:

    Long time reader first time poster…and completely off topic of the article…

    Interesting rumor re: Neal. I would love to see us keep Perron, though, and play him with Neal and the German (assuming that’s who we take at 3OV). How that trade would work…I’m not sure. I’ll leave that up to LT and ROM etc lol.

    Probably continuing down the pipe dream with this next one, but wouldn’t it just be great to see

    Nuge-Hall-Ebs
    The German-Perron-Neal
    Grabo-Kulemin-Yak
    Gordon-Arco/Lander-Hendricks
    Gazdic

    The d is such a mess I don’t even want to go there aha.

    Why can’t we have nice things???

  42. Woodguy says:

    Hammers,

    Do Gags & Musil for Neal .

    Why not throw in a 2nd and get Malkin instead?

  43. Racki says:

    Woodguy: Belov signed a 4 year deal and he’s 28 this summer.

    I doubt he’ll come back.

    The fact that he didn’t even try to get on another NHL team (signed in KHL before was FA in NHL) says that his mind was made up to go home.

    I didn’t know it was four years. And I didn’t expect him to come back to Edmonton, but figured elsewhere. He’d still be at a good age when the deal is done. More unlikely now though, knowing it’s 4 years.

    Either way, like I said.. No big losses here. The Oilers can worry if they lose core guys not failed experiments, as you undoubtedly can agree. The KHL doesn’t attract those kinds of players though, typically.

  44. Racki says:

    Woodguy:
    Hammers,

    Do Gags & Musil for Neal .

    Why not throw in a 2nd and get Malkin instead?

    The Oilers already lost their 2014 2nd rounder. Let’s not cripple the team here!

  45. Ribs says:

    Woodguy,

    We don’t want Malkin. He’s washed up!

  46. Rondo says:

    Not a big fan of Neal the way he has played in Pitt. Also he is one of the dirtiest players in the league. Played well in Dallas but lost his drive in Pitt.

  47. Lowetide says:

    No to the Neal deal as proposed. Like him, though.

  48. OilClog says:

    Racki: These guys that are ‘running’are fringe NHLers. Questionable if good enough for Oilers, let alone another team. If Justin Schultz jets for Europe, you worry. Larsen? “OK see Ya. Thanks for your service last year”.

    I consider them failed experiments. I suspect this isn’t the last the NHL sees of Belov but would expect Larsen doesn’t come back.

    How is Larsen a failed experiment? Did we pick him off a trash heap? Is he not what 25? How is Belov a failed talent? The Oilers failed Belov. Proof is pretty much in the pudding (WHC’s)

    A failed experiment is placing Lander on the 2nd line wing for more then a shift…

    A failed experiment is having the Nuge play PK1 instead of focusing on PP.(which is really where he strengths lie)

    A failed experiment is adding Fraser to a roster, Fraser is not an NHL player.

    Larsen wasn’t a failed experiment.

    Belov wasn’t a failed experiment.

    Well at least on their ends.. The Oilers definitely failed.

  49. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    Woodguy: Mechanical engineering (honors) degree from Princeton doesn’t go stale.

    It’s a rat race my friend. All degrees are less sexy to employers if you haven’t entered the market in that field and moved up progressively right away.

    He’ll look fine on the market if/when he enters it. But, there’s no way he’s beating off offers. I’d be surprised if he had any unsolicited in the past 2 years.

  50. Woodguy says:

    Romulus Apotheosis: It’s a rat race my friend. All degrees are less sexy to employers if you haven’t entered the market in that field and moved up progressively right away.

    He’ll look fine on the market if/when he enters it. But, there’s no way he’s beating off offers. I’d be surprised if he had any unsolicited in the past 2 years.

    I don’t think he has unsolicited offers, but he chooses to enter his trade an ivy league honors degree gets you starting in the low 6 figures.

  51. Racki says:

    OilClog: How is Larsen a failed experiment? Did we pick him off a trash heap? Is he not what 25? How is Belov a failed talent? The Oilers failed Belov. Proof is pretty much in the pudding (WHC’s)

    A failed experiment is placing Lander on the 2nd line wing for more then a shift…

    A failed experiment is having the Nuge play PK1 instead of focusing on PP.(which is really where he strengths lie)

    A failed experiment is adding Fraser to a roster, Fraser is not an NHL player.

    Larsen wasn’t a failed experiment.

    Belov wasn’t a failed experiment.

    Well at least on their ends.. The Oilers definitely failed.

    So.. What you’re saying is you took a year off of watching the Oilers? At least in the case of Larsen.. He may be young buy there is zero future there, IMHO. He didn’t show any potential whatsoever. There should be visible results at 24 and there weren’t. Belov.. Potential there. If he wanted to be an NHLer so much he wouldn’t be in the KHL. What can you do about it? He was a UFA. It’s not like he couldn’t have just signed with any other teams other than the Oilers. You think the Oilers killed the NHL for him? If so, he’s probably got much to learn about the world. I could have seen him making a comeback, but really he left because he wanted security. He said that himself. Would you like the Oilers to have given a guy 4 years that was still proving himself? (wouldn’t be a first, mind you)

    The last thing the Oilers need is more players that haven’t found their NHL game yet.

  52. Woodguy says:

    I missed when I mentioned 3M and BASF as I had Chemical Engineering in my head.

    Mechanical engineer with an honors degree from ivy league works tomorrow in Alberta for low 6 figures.

  53. haters says:

    Imagine if you will a world where oiler fans didn’t run off horcoff and MacT signed Gordon still and the bottom two lines had those 2 gentlemen centering them. Seems nice no ? Now how about we rethink trashing Gagner for draft picks and hockey pucks and chalk last season up to coming in halfway thru the season after being viscously assaulted and trying to adapt to a new system … Or we can let him find his mojo he had in 12-13 in another city … Wtvr who really cares anymore

  54. Romulus Apotheosis says:

    Woodguy:
    I missed when I mentioned 3M and BASF as I had Chemical Engineering in my head.

    Mechanical engineer with an honors degree from ivy league works tomorrow in Alberta for low 6 figures.

    I don’t doubt it.

    The way you phrased it, I thought you meant he had offers on the table and was having to choose.

  55. Henry says:

    Woodguy: I don’t think he has unsolicited offers, but he chooses to enter his trade an ivy league honors degree gets you starting in the low 6 figures.

    Woodguy,

    Is the job market that strong in Alberta? I did a PhD from the same school and it didn’t work out that well for me. Of course I went academic. Goddamit.

  56. commonfan14 says:

    Jordan: justDOit: Exactly – had me thinking of Harry Neale.
    Awe… here I was thinking we might have a trade for Neal Young.

    “I guess I showed Neal who’s Neal.”

  57. Woodguy says:

    Henry: Woodguy,

    Is the job market that strong in Alberta?I did a PhD from the same school and it didn’t work out that well for me.Of course I went academic.Goddamit.

    Yes it is.

    Skilled trades like welders and pipe fitters make 6 figures in 8 months if you are willing to work in the bush.

    The Oil companies and Oil field service companies (and lots of engineering firms here too) snap up engineers pretty quick.

  58. slopitch says:

    Im just listening to Gregor interview a scout – not liking the one dimensional type report for Reinhart. Says Bennett and Draisatl are both better 2 way players and that Reinhart tends to look lost in his own end.

  59. slopitch says:

    Lowetide,

    Its a good interview. That must have been a pre-recording or you are really fast sir ;)

  60. Racki says:

    slopitch:
    Lowetide,

    Its a good interview. That must have been a pre-recording or you are really fast sir

    Lowetide’s new article is on the interview with Kyle woodlief which I think was yesterday. Today Gregor interviewed the guy from McKeen’s Hockey

  61. Marc says:

    Woodguy: I don’t think he has unsolicited offers, but he chooses to enter his trade an ivy league honors degree gets you starting in the low 6 figures.

    For what it’s worth, a lot of Ivy League grads don’t actually end up working in their field of study. Lots of firms, particularly in finance and consulting, hire based on how bright they think you are rather than on what you actually learned in university.

    If Princeton’s hockey team is anything like Dartmouth’s, half of Fedun’s teammates are working in finance now. He’ll have interviews on Wall Street with a couple of phone calls, if that’s what he wants.

  62. Woodguy says:

    Marc: For what it’s worth, a lot of Ivy League grads don’t actually end up working in their field of study. Lots of firms, particularly in finance and consulting, hire based on how bright they think you are rather than on what you actually learned in university.

    If Princeton’s hockey team is anything like Dartmouth’s, half of Fedun’s teammates are working in finance now. He’ll have interviews on Wall Street with a couple of phone calls, if that’s what he wants.

    Do a lot of MechEng go into finance?

    I honestly don’t know.

  63. slopitch says:

    Racki,

    Cool thanks. I didnt catch the name of the guy from McKeens either. The message is similar though – not much to separate the group of 4 according to these guys.

  64. Bruce McCurdy says:

    justDOit: I think Redden’s AHL time was mostly due to buried salary at the end of his career, no?

    Yes of course, I meant to mention that his is an unusual case, but thanks. It is in fact not-unheard of for guys with many NHL years under their belts to keep going in the minors for several more years, but that’s not often as many as 1000 games. Might be an interesting off-season project, today I just went for the low-hanging fruit in response to LT’s intriguing comment.

  65. Woodguy says:

    Lowetide:
    http://oilersnation.com/2014/5/28/is-leon-draisaitl-nhl-ready

    Is Leon NHL ready?

    Sure if the Oilers have 3 lines that can handle actual NHL comp and then can ice a line of X-LD-Yak.

    So they answer is no.

    Teams like MTL, NYR (kind-of), CHI and LAK have the semblance of 3 scoring lines and a checking line.

    Pretenders like EDM, CAL etc ice 2 scoring line, 1 checking line and 1 “energy” line because that’s what they do.

    Unicorns and teams playing for a Pennant.

    Neither of those resemble the Oilers as they are currently built, nor resemble the verbal from the GM.

  66. Marc says:

    Woodguy: Do a lot of MechEng go into finance?

    I honestly don’t know.

    Yup. A lot of hedge funds and investment banks like people with science/engineering backgrounds because their comfort level with math/numbers allows them to be trained up in quantitative trading strategies relatively quickly and successfully.

    Of all the people I know who did engineering at Dartmouth, I can’t off the top of my head think of any that are actually in the business of making/building stuff now. Some are patent lawyers and the rest are in finance.

  67. Bruce McCurdy says:

    russ99:
    Kind of sad that younger and European players are thinking the KHL is better for them than fighting for a spot on our roster.

    I’d think the sad state of the OKC roster has to play a part in that.

    Sorry, Russ, but that’s a non sequitur.

    Woodguy: If MacT thought you were the top end of the fringe then you got a guaranteed contract (Arco, Lander)
    If you are not the top of the fringe, then good luck and I’d go to the KHL too.

    This all day long. Woodguy nailed it with that imagined conversation — spoken like a man who has been involved in the odd failed negotiation simply because a deal didn’t make sense for both sides.

    For the Euros it’s definitely the second option. Beyond the entry level contract the priority list looks something like this:

    1. NHL … 2. Euro league ………………………………. 3. AHL

    For a North American already finished his ELC the spacing above might be a little different:

    1. NHL ………………………. 2. AHL … 3. Euro ……….

    …with the AHL a nose in front because of its more direct connection to the NHL. Whereas many Euros have a solid domestic league in their native country in addition to the KHL. Closer to home, way more money, expenses paid, lesser travel, fewer games are all options in one or another of those leagues, with the future option of “NHL” remaining wide open for a young guy like Larsen or Horak. I’m not a betting man but I’d hypothetically put even money on at least one of those guys returning at some point.

    Woodguy is exactly right about the guys at the top of the fringe, it seemed apparent all along that it would take a one-way to keep either guy here. I was surprised at the low dollar amount, but no matter what those guys won’t be making $80 or $105 K next year, they’ll be getting paid a working man’s rate, fair for where they are in the development stage.

  68. Lowetide says:

    The one that got away, at least a little, was Horak. He was quality on the wing from all we read and might have been a solid contributor at not a lot of $$

  69. Bruce McCurdy says:

    Lowetide:
    The one that got away, at least a little, was Horak. He was quality on the wing from all we read and might have been a solid contributor at not a lot of $$

    Agreed. To me he was “top end of the fringe”. Would have liked to see them keep him.

    In other news, Olivier Roy’s team just knocked Laurent Brossoit’s team out of the playoffs.

    In other-other news, Ladislav Smid remains a player in the National Hockey League.

    FFS.

  70. Racki says:

    slopitch:
    Racki,

    Cool thanks. I didnt catch the name of the guy from McKeens either. The message is similar though – not much to separate the group of 4 according to these guys.

    His last name is McKeen (thus the name of the website), but I don’t know his first name.

  71. gcw_rocks says:

    Exceptions are college men. Playing 4 NCAA seasons means turning pro at 22, meaning a “late start” for some quality prospects. BARONS 13-14: Yes. Yes all over. The college men for the Barons—Mark Arcobello, Taylor Fedun, Andrew Miller, Brad Hunt—they’re just terrific at delivering value. Sign them for nothing, send them to Black Rock, and they arrive two years later useful. Jesus, if I owned an NHL team college signing season would be bigger than the draft. Why not? Spend your brains out! Mark Arcobello didn’t cost a second round pick, but he’s kicking all their asses (Marincin excepted). There’s a lesson there.

    I would love to hear you put that directly to MacT or Bob green on your radio show sometime. Oilers need to be more aggressive here.

  72. slopitch says:

    @Racki: ok. There are writers not named Dobber on dobberhockey too ;)

    That Neal offer is interesting. I think Perron did a lot playing with C’s not named Malkin or Crosby. I’d pass too.

    Great game so far tonight. The champs won’t go out quietly.

  73. Racki says:

    slopitch:
    @Racki: ok. There are writers not named Dobber on dobberhockey too

    That Neal offer is interesting. I think Perron did a lot playing with C’s not named Malkin or Crosby. I’d pass too.

    Great game so far tonight. The champs won’t go out quietly.

    Hah, I know, but for real his last name is McKeen.. I just can’t remember the first name.

    Also I missed most of the Neal talk.

    My take: Neal would make sense if you give up a “smurf” type to get him. Perron? He has no size issues. Why move him? Perron works out very well here.. as good as James Neal is, he could suffer offensively here.

  74. spoiler says:

    Racki: Hah, I know, but for real his last name is McKeen..

    I doubt that. McKeen’s has many writers and scouts and the publication was originally founded by a fellow named Iain Morrell.

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