GOSPEL

One of the players who may surprise in 2014-15 is Mark Arcobello. Able to play center capably, the knock isn’t defense or positioning, but rather offensive potential. CAN Arcobello play with top-end skill and deliver?

MARK ARCOBELLO PLAYER CARD, EXTRA SKATER

arco player card

In exactly half a season, Arcobello played well enough to be considered a solid utility outfielder, who can bat in the 2, 3 and 4 slots. Kind of a modern Mitch Webster, if you’re an Expo fan. Does that give the Oilers enough confidence to deal Sam Gagner? Or is it best to keep the powder dry and hope Gagner returns to previous levels.

SAM GAGNER PLAYER CARD

gagner player card

I have suggested all spring that dealing Sam Gagner is the better plan. Even if you get draft picks in exchange, there’s $4.8 million in your back pocket for Kulemin, Grabbo, Moss, whomever. Agree? Or are we warming again to Samwise?

5×5/60 2013-14

  1. Taylor Hall 2.91
  2. Jordan Eberle 2.03
  3. David Perron 1.96
  4. Mark Arcobello 1.82
  5. Nugent-Hopkins 1.56
  6. Sam Gagner 1.47
  7. Yakupov 1.43

We know Gagner was injured this season, so his 5×5/60 number needs to be taken in context. Last season, he delivered 1.84/60. If we’re to justify Sam Gagner as a RW for $4.8M a year, playing a complementary role with impact players, is 1.84/60 enough? Who was he playing with in 12-13?

Gagner’s WOWY linemates in 12-13 (in minutes)

  1. Magnus Paajarvi 314
  2. Ales Hemsky 300
  3. Nail Yakupov 277
  4. Jordan Eberle 166

If the Oilers dealt Eberle (settle down) in a deal for Sean Couturier, and ran Couturier-Hall-Perron as a tough minutes line and Nuge-Yakupov-Gagner as a soft minutes offensive line, could Gagner post over 2.00/60 at 5×5?

Would that be enough? I’ve always liked Gagner, but when I close my eyes I see him curling and heading north miles before the sortie is over. Arcobello? Small, not as skilled, but aware and intelligent, and clearly, and this is important, a man who has learned the lessons required and adopted them as gospel.

written by

The author didn‘t add any Information to his profile yet.
Related Posts

55 Responses to "GOSPEL"

  1. RexLibris says:

    Arcobello over Gagner? Probably. Means the Oilers aren’t going to make any huge strides this next season (as in playoffs) with him as 2C, but it should help and maybe he becomes a good 3C behind a veteran 2C UFA like Grabovski.

  2. Rondo says:

    If Oilers traded Eberle for Couturier they might have a different pick for the #3 spot.

  3. bucknuck says:

    Last year Arco was clearly the better of the two. I’d love to see them duke it out for 2C and whoever loses gets dealt. Competition from within… but I no longer trust Eakins to be impartial or to employ common sense or advanced statistics.

  4. spoiler says:

    I like Arco–a lot–but if I’m sitting in the GM’s chair, I don’t know enough yet to trust Arco can pull it off. If it turns out he can’t, that he ends up being the Dubnyk of 2Cs, there is no way to fix that in-season without getting slaughtered. You are dooming your coach.

    The shooting percentage especially worries me. Was that a freak of nature or are we talking Todd Marchant? Not that Marchant wasn’t useful, just not at 2C.

  5. Younger Oil says:

    If Arco can deliver comparable offence to Gagner when playing with skill, with far superior defensive ability, at 1/8 the price, I don’t see how anyone could be forkeeping Gagner over Arco.

    Sure, Arco might not be a #2C, but he’s a much better candidate than Gagner.

    Adding in the fact that the extra $4.2M in cap space from taking Arco over Gagner could buy most of a 2C, or a couple third line wingers, or a top 4 Dman, in addition to the return that we get from Gagner (likely a couple of top 100 bullets for Stu, or a quality 3rd line winger), and I just don’t see a case to keep Gagner. The only counterargument that keeps popping up is that his trade value is at an all time low, which is true, but he has an NTC next season (if I’m not mistaken), so we have to keep him for the whole year in all likelihood, and his value isn’t likely to go up enough in a year to get a much bigger return, and wouldn’t be enough of an improvement to justify not dealing him now for some cap room to help get players we need now and slightly worse picks.

    To me, the biggest questions are:

    1. Is Arcobello is better than Draisaitl right now? Would he be able to keep Draisatl out of the NHL in the fall? Could anyone?
    2. How much greater of a return could we get from Gagner by retaining half of his salary?

    Because if trading Gagner right now gives us a 2nd and a 4th, and gives us the room to sign two of Kulemin/Moss/Winnik, to me it isn’t even a question. Trade the man.

  6. godot10 says:

    Hendricks and Arcobello should be slotted for the 4th line. (With Lander, Pitlick, Gazdic, and Joenssu).

    Please, let us have a real 4th line for a change. One that can be relied on for a Dzone draw against the weaker lines of the opposition.

  7. spoiler says:

    godot10: Hendricks and Arcobello should be slotted for the 4th line. (With Lander, Pitlick, Gazdic, and Joenssu).Please, let us have a real 4th line for a change. One that can be relied on for a Dzone draw against the weaker lines of the opposition.

    Yes. Ideally Arcobello is your 4C… and he should make a damn good one. Maybe he is good enough for 3C once Gordon’s contract ends. A la Brodziak and Marchant. Except he’s like found money. Love him. Hell maybe he finds his shooting hands and can play 2C. But I would want him to force his way into that role, not earn it by default.

  8. Racki says:

    I am sold that if the Oilers were able to sign a guy like Grabo, or Stastny (even better) or someone in between or acquire someone like Schenn or Couturier, I would be pretty happy with moving Gagner out. I’d be fine with him staying on wing here too. I just don’t want to see him back as the #2C is all. I don’t want to see Lander anywhere near there either. If MacTavish checks off one of the top LHD or #2C needs, I will forgive him for any mistakes he’s ever made as coach, player or manager. That would be pretty superb.

    I will say I am not sure how I feel about Eberle for Couturier. But at the same time, getting a big C with defensive prowess (who was good offensively in jr) would likely go a long ways. So i’m sure in the long run I’d love that.

  9. Dee Dee says:

    With the Bruins being a natural trading partner and Marchand being in their doghouse right now, how about a swap for Gagner?

    Similar contracts, both are under performing, both could use fresh starts.

    A Perron Marchand line would be awesome to see, would just need a pesky center to form the most aggravating line in the NHL!

  10. RexLibris says:

    I’ve always suggested to Flames’ fans that Mikael Backlund may be a good to decent 2C but that real success would be finding a way to push him to 3C.

    If we apply the same ideology to the Oilers, then Arcobello ought not be playing any higher in the proverbial rotation than 3C for this team to have a fighting chance. It isn’t that I don’t like the player, I do. But he is not likely an NHL-caliber second-line center.

    Will Draisaitl be one? Maybe, but ideally we shouldn’t definitively know the answer to that until the fall of 2017.

    For the Oilers to win or break even on any trade of Sam Gagner they either need to a) get a 2C in return who can better complement the talents available – Bailey would seem to fit this bill – or b) use the cap space made available to acquire a veteran and appropriate 2C by way of free-agency.

    The former seems a long shot, although we are talking about Garth Snow and the Islanders, and the latter…well, now we’re talking free-agency and the Oilers. That’s a tale with more tears than laughter.

    The funny thing is, if they were to try and trade Gagner for Backlund straight across Burke would probably laugh in MacTavish’s face.

  11. Lowetide says:

    The 10 most intimidating prospects in the 2014 draft, including a damn good fight by Nick Ritchie.

    http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2078951-ranking-the-10-most-intimidating-prospects-in-the-2014-nhl-draft

  12. spoiler says:

    RexLibris: For the Oilers to win or break even on any trade of Sam Gagner they either need to a) get a 2C in return who can better complement the talents available – Bailey would seem to fit this bill – or b) use the cap space made available to acquire a veteran and appropriate 2C by way of free-agency.

    They could also find the 2C by trading the 3rd overall or other asset(s).

    Bailey is a very similar player to Gagner. To me that would be like trading the problem for the exact same problem. I don’t see why either team would make that deal. But I am okay with trading him for a winger, or even picks, if we can be sure 2C can be solved by trade or free agency.

    Free agency looks anything but certain. I would like to think that we can come out of the frenzy with one of Stastny, Legwand or Grabovski, but I think that result is unlikely.

    That leaves trade, or putting him in a position where he can succeed. I’m all for the trade rumour from the last thread… 3rd overall for the Schenn brothers… but there’s a new gunslinger riding the range in Phillytown and no one knows how quick his draw is yet. Gagner for picks would seem to make perfect sense after a deal like that.

  13. sliderule says:

    Looking back I was trying to figure oiler thinking for moving our centres.

    Did we move Brodziak because we had Cogliano and Map?

    Did we move Cogliano because we had Lander?

    Did we move Horcoff because we were feeling sorry for him?

    Are we going to move Gagner because we have signed an AHL center and will draft a magic bean.

    If any of my questions are correct why do we continue with the insanity?

  14. Lowetide says:

    sliderule:
    Looking back I was trying to figure oiler thinking for moving our centres.

    Did we move Brodziak because we had Cogliano and Map?

    Did we move Cogliano because we had Lander?

    Did we move Horcoff because we were feeling sorry for him?

    Are we going to move Gagner because we have signed an AHL center and will draft a magic bean.

    If any of my questions are correct why do we continue with the insanity?

    They felt Pouliot would slide into that role, remember it well. And he SHOULD have too.

  15. sliderule says:

    Lowetide,

    I guess we know how that worked out.

  16. RexLibris says:

    Lowetide: They felt Pouliot would slide into that role, remember it well. And he SHOULD have too.

    I’m fairly certain this is part of the LT drinking game. “Every time he manages to work Pouliot into any discussion, Oilers or otherwise, take a shot.”

    Just out of morbid curiosity (and an innate desire to be a smartass), tell me again about how Marc-Antoine Pouliot nearly made the cut for the first moon landing but Buzz Aldrin was chosen on account of his having gone to a better prep school.

    :)

    Now I know why my family members don’t return my phone calls.

  17. Lowetide says:

    Burke traded up for the Rake and he traded up for the Twins. Will he trade up for the future? http://www.puckrant.com/slapshot/BURKE_NO_1

  18. LostBoy says:

    Sam Gagner is a smart hockey player who has delivered 50 points per 82 GP over a seven season career. A career which started prematurely as a teenager and has mostly been played without a lot of help and a revolving door at head coach. And it includes two teenaged seasons. And that’s up until the age of 24. He’s only just entering his prime.

    Sam Gagner has scored 8 points in an NHL hockey game, against an elite team. You have to go all the way back to Mario in 80s hockey to find the last person to do that.

    Sam Gagner suffered a horrific injury, and basically lost a season to it.

    Trading him for 3rd round picks is f-wording insanity.

    His lockout season works out to 65 points over a full 82 game schedule. Then he got scrambled.

    He’s only about to turn 25. His last uncompromised season would have been 65 points. He’s scored 8 in a game.

    Only a franchise like the Edmonton Oilers would consider trading a player like this for two third round picks.

    You know how hard it is to trade for a career average 45-50 point C still in his 20s? Never mind one still young enough that he hasn’t entered his prime, yet has put those numbers up for 7 f-wording seasons??

    And we’re just going to give one away. Apparently.

  19. LostBoy says:

    Can’t let it go:

    In the lockout season, Gagner had the 17th highest point total among NHL C. That is, league average 1C production.

    That’s more than Logan Couture, Jeff Carter, David Krejci, etc., etc.

    Then Kassian smashed his face in.

    I’m aware of the defensive issues and I don’t think he’s some kind of Hockey Jesus.

    But talking about pissing him away for two third round picks? Can anyone suggest another player with his comparables and age ever traded for less?

  20. gogliano says:

    Sam Gagner is either a dumb hockey player or an irresponsible hockey player. Maybe it has to do with the knock on the noggin. But he has been playing dumb hockey for some time now.

  21. LostBoy says:

    gogliano,

    Like what, a whole season? The previous two seasons combined he was -1. He was -29 this past season. It wasn’t a knock on the noggin. His jaw was shattered.

    What, any way you look at it, traditional or advanced or by eye, was wrong with his 2012-2013 season, that would lead you to flush him for two third round picks?

  22. OilClog says:

    Unless Arco develops a better shot he won’t last in the top 6, he should be bottom 6.

    Unless were moving one of the other winger neither 89 or 26 should be 2C or top 6, they don’t fill the need.

  23. mumbai max says:

    Gagner goes, get what you can. Addition by subtraction. Those who question the math of that statement have never worked/played with a bad ‘teammate’. No room for lazy defensively if the culture is going to change. I do not think you can blame the jaw for everything. He is just not interested in hustling back and checking his man. Is that going to change after 7 years?

    Get the best possible 2C through trade or FA. Stastny, Grabovski, Legwand, Couturier, Kadri, etc.etc.

    Arco starts at 4C with Hendricks/Pinozzoto and Lander/Pitlick (or such players, insert your favourites). Try to forget Gazdic.

    p.s. Why do I keep waking up after nightmares about Phaneuf and Kadri!?

  24. Lowetide says:

    OilClog:
    Unless Arco develops a better shot he won’t last in the top 6, he should be bottom 6.

    Unless were moving one of the other winger neither 89 or 26 should be 2C or top 6, they don’t fill the need.

    Exactly my conclusion. I also concluded that:

    1. Hall
    2. Eberle
    3. Perron
    4. Yakupov

    were all better bets on wing than 89. Gagner for picks. It’s the right thing to do.

  25. mumbai max says:

    LostBoy:
    Sam Gagner is a smart hockey player who has delivered 50 points per 82 GP over a seven season career.A career which started prematurely as a teenager and has mostly been played without a lot of help and a revolving door at head coach.And it includes two teenaged seasons.And that’s up until the age of 24.He’s only just entering his prime.

    Sam Gagner has scored 8 points in an NHL hockey game, against an elite team.You have to go all the way back to Mario in 80s hockey to find the last person to do that.

    Sam Gagner suffered a horrific injury, and basically lost a season to it.

    Trading him for 3rd round picks is f-wording insanity.

    His lockout season works out to 65 points over a full 82 game schedule.Then he got scrambled.

    He’s only about to turn 25.His last uncompromised season would have been 65 points.He’s scored 8 in a game.

    Only a franchise like the Edmonton Oilers would consider trading a player like this for two third round picks.

    You know how hard it is to trade for a career average 45-50 point C still in his 20s?Never mind one still young enough that he hasn’t entered his prime, yet has put those numbers up for 7 f-wording seasons??

    And we’re just going to give one away.Apparently.

    If this is the general perception in the GM community, why is his value so low? Market value is what a player can ACTUALLY get on the market. No amount of top hat and cane (or Kane) can change the fact that 29 GM’s think that Gagner is a poor risk. Addition by subtraction, in this case both attitude and salary.

  26. mumbai max says:

    Lowetide: Exactly my conclusion. I also concluded that:

    1. Hall
    2. Eberle
    3. Perron
    4. Yakupov

    were all better bets on wing than 89. Gagner for picks. It’s the right thing to do.

    Gagner for the best of what is on offer, be it picks or a 3rd line Cliffordesque player. It’s the right thing to do. Tie goes to a real NHL player.

  27. LostBoy says:

    mumbai max,

    Um:

    a) the GM community is interested in getting a valuable player at the lowest price possible

    and

    b) this is why it’s insanity to trade him for magic beans at this point.

    I’m not arguing about his current trade value (in some other thread I already agreed Lowetide’s notion of a trade for picks with NYI is about what you could get).

    I’m arguing that making that deal is a really, really bad idea.

    And I’m asking whether anyone can point to a player of Gagner’s age and numbers ever having been traded for that little.

    I don’t know what you mean by attitude.

  28. flyfish1168 says:

    JMHO. Poor Sam has had 5 different coaches in his 7 years as an Oiler.Last year was a bad your because of $hithead. I would like to see eakins and Gagner together another year. Lets see if eakins can bring more out of Gagner. Move him to the wing even if it is on the 3rd line. If someone is struggleing on the 1 or 2nd line then we can move gagner up. Having him as a backup on any line to take draws is not a bad thing. It would be an advantage on the PP or PK as the back up F/O guy.

    It hard to replace a good guy in the dressing room. Someone everyone can relate to and was even thought of as potential captain material and recommend by Horcoff. We need to stop getting 0.75 to the dollar.JMHO

  29. Racki says:

    Lowetide: They felt Pouliot would slide into that role, remember it well. And he SHOULD have too.

    I hate to be that guy that is all “I KNEW IT!” way after the fact, but I hated Pouliot. Well, not hate, but I seriously disliked him. Didn’t see what MacT did, and to me it was obvious Brodziak was a better player. I honestly didn’t think there was any indication that Pouliot was a better player than Brodziak and ever was going to be a better player than Brodziak, other than Pouliot’s draft ranking. I’ve been wrong about many a player, so not trying to sound like I am an amazing judge of talent. Just can’t see how people could think Pouliot was better. And don’t get me started on Glencross…. :P

    But hey, on a good note, these bad moves resulted in Hall, Nuge, etc..

  30. hoser313 says:

    Much as it pains me to watch the coverage issues, the smart play is to keep Gagner for another year at 2C (yes 2C) so his value recovers. The key is that if the coverage issues persist then Eakins has to be firm in giving 2C ice to someone else (Arco) to make his point.

    More overreactions by management are not needed (ahem, Smid, MacIntyre).

    Agree with several posters on here that we should not be just giving away players.

    Next year then there should be a proper competition between Gagner, Arco, and Draisatl for 2C. THEN you trade the ones you don’t need at a higher price.

  31. Racki says:

    Lowetide:
    Pouliot was a nice player, he really was.

    A better organization would have saved them both.

    Maybe as a depth guy, but I didn’t see it. Seemed like one of those non-factor types. Of course on this team, he’d be a lock on line 4. But that isn’t saying too much. Tolerable 4th liner, but replaceable, and the fact he petered out of the league probably emphasizes that a fair bit.

    Brodziak.. still going, and we can see why. Even boosted his stock to at least a 3rd line center for a little while.

  32. spoiler says:

    What if all three recent rumours were true? A big what-if I know but if we combine Gagner for picks, Engelland for UFA signing, and the trade for Schenn brothers, where does that put us?

    Let’s say it ends up being the 3rd overall, cap space, Gazdic and Simpson for the Schenns and Gagner for a 2nd and a third rounder. After losing the first rounder, trading Gagner for picks serves a purpose. If trading Gazdic somehow helps improve this team, then I`m okay with picking up the more versatile and more capable Engelland.

    Can we then swing a Winnik on June 1? Maybe.
    Or at least someone off the same tree? Okay fine.

    How about a sleeper UFA like D. Roy? Or Setoguchi? B. Pouliot? I think something like that’s do-able, but let’s then also say a top pairing Dman is very very unlikely…

    That puts us here:

    HALL NUGE EBER
    YAKU SCHE SETO
    PERR GORD WINN
    LAND ARCO HEND
    PITL
    ENGE

    MARI PETR
    FERE SCHU
    KLEF SCHE
    FEDU
    ENGE

    Is that better than last year? Ideally we add a top pairing D, but if that`s impossible…

  33. Racki says:

    spoiler,

    It kills me that you don’t spell the whole names out. :P Makes me have to think too hard. lol

  34. Hammers says:

    Here is the problem Gags shot at 7% last year but typically has been at 12% . We all say trade him , basically a 45 point per year player who got his jaw broken . Lets say it was Hall or RNH would we give them the benefit of the broken jaw ???? Yes . Is Sam a weak defensive player ? Yes has been for 7 years . My gut says McT may hang on for another year figuring our best place would be 20th if he gets a “D” that counts . So the real question LT is this . Is Sam as good as the contract everyone or nearly everyone wanted him to get last year or can McT make enough moves to push for a playoff spot without him getting very little in return .As for Arco he is a stop gap player at 600 K that’s why its a 1 year deal .The real question is can any of those top 3 centers play next year .

  35. Hammers says:

    I have been blowing my top for at least 3 years on needing better “D” and Ference was the answer . Anybody who thinks this through must admit an improved “D” makes it better for all last years top 6 not just Gags . We need puck movers with some defensive awareness who can make a pass that hits the stick not the boards or a players skates . I’m saying now if Gags goes to the right team he is a 50+ point per year player but I’m not saying don’t trade him just not for 2 3rd rd picks .

  36. Rod from Viking says:

    I hope Chicago gets knocked out tomorrow, that would add another possible trade pardner for Gagner to go with Toronto and other teams that had a premature play-off ejectulation. Sam is a good team mate but needs a fresh start and will be able to go where he wants due to his no-trade that is verbal until July one and then part of his contract after that.

  37. slopitch says:

    Draft Draisaitl, keep Gagner and leave Draisatl in juniors. A year from now, Gagner’s value is recovered a bit and Draisatl is ready to go. Trade from a position of strength and not at historically low value.

    Even better is to run Gagner as 3C (or wing) with PP time and top 6 injury replacement. I’m just not sure who 2C is…

  38. spoiler says:

    Rod from Viking: I hope Chicago gets knocked out tomorrow, that would add another possible trade pardner for Gagner to go with Toronto and other teams that had a premature play-off ejectulation. Sam is a good team mate but needs a fresh start and will be able to go where he wants due to his no-trade that is verbal until July one and then part of his contract after that.

    I`ve been wondering to myself a lot lately whether Sharp might become available this summer if the Hawks lose. And then the Hawks turn around and sign Stastny.

    Toronto is a very possible destination for Gagner. More so than the oft-mentioned Isles, I would say.

  39. spoiler says:

    slopitch: Draft Draisaitl, keep Gagner and leave Draisatl in juniors. A year from now, Gagner’s value is recovered a bit and Draisatl is ready to go. Trade from a position of strength and not at historically low value.
    Even better is to run Gagner as 3C (or wing) with PP time and top 6 injury replacement. I’m just not sure who 2C is…

    It will be longer than that before we can reasonably expect that Draisaitl is “ready to go`. At least in a contributing way.

  40. Caramel Obvious says:

    We have to give up the numbered line nomenclature. It doesn’t communicate anything of value.

    If Eakins goes with the heavy zone starts that means there are four lines on the team:

    Change on the fly/fast break line: Hall/Nuge/Eberle
    All situations matchup line: Perron/Blank/Blank
    Offensive zone start line: Yakupov/Arcobello/Lander
    Defensive zone start line: Hendricks/Gordon/Blank

    If the Oilers are smart that’s your forward group. Sign Grabovski and Kulemin for the Perron line and you have something that is rational and decent.

    At 4.8 million dollars Gagner is overpaid. Try and trade him to Nashville.

    The real problem is that there are no neat solutions like this for the D. Anton Stralman would help but they need to add two defensemen at a minimum.

  41. bendelson says:

    An Arcobello thread and no sign of our friend Stevezee? He must be incommunicado in the deep woods somewhere with bear spray likely replacing his trusty iPhone.

    The countdown to a simultaneous supernova event is on people and it will save us all from the madness that surrounds the Oiler organisation.

    Kaboom! (don’t look directly into the light). Playoffs!

    And for the analytics crowd, yes, math supports this theory of an awaiting stellar explosion. It happens on average three times every century. Patience is required.

    (True, this interstellar event may, in actuality, have absolutely nothing to do with the game of hockey… But one has to hang their hat on something right?).

    In other news, new leads suggest Bigfoot is not only real, but living out his golden years comfortably in Coombs. Locals have agreed to keep it quiet so long as he leaves the goats alone.

    Hanging on to reality by a thread,
    Bendelson

  42. PaperDesigner says:

    The problem with dealing Gagner in order to gain the cap space of his contract is the assumption the Oilers will correctly identify the player they should sign with that money. I have very little confidence that dealing Gagner will mean inking competent free agent replacements.

    I’d rather hang on to him. You might get more for him, dealing him in the final year of his contract anyway.

  43. stevezie says:

    bendelson: An Arcobello thread and no sign of our friend Stevezee? He must be incommunicado in the deep woods somewhere with bear spray likely replacing his trusty iPhone.

    You have no idea how close to the truth that is. Or maybe you do? How much of myself have I revealed?

  44. bendelson says:

    stevezie: You have no idea how close to the truth that is. Or maybe you do? How much of myself have I revealed?

    Not much. I have hidden talents…
    Good to hear from you.

  45. godot10 says:

    If Chicago loses, they are probably going after Kesler, not Gagner.

    We should stop obsessing about Gagner. If he has to be kept for another year as a soft minutes centre, there is nothing wrong with that. He will reestablish value. Eakins made everyone looks worse than they are, resetting everyone’s value lower because of how bad the team was. Thing should only be able to get better. I don’t expect much better, because of my opinion of the coach.

    Don’t think 1-2-3-4.

    Think two tough minutes lines built around Nugent-Hopkins and Gordon.
    A soft minutes o-zone start line built around Gagner or his replacement.
    And a 4th line of Hendricks/Lander/Arcobello/Pitlick/Gazdic/Joensuu.

    The work for MacT to do at forward.
    1) Replace Gagner, if possible, but don’t give him away for picks.
    2) 2 really solid two-way veteran wingers, like Kulemin and Bourque.

    A team’s 4th line has to be able to take d-zone draws against the weaker lines (every line except the top line) of the opposition, clear the zone, and get off the ice if the matchup is poor. It is the #1 function and role of a 4th line in the modern NHL, more than energy or toughness. The 4th liners should also be able to kill penalties.

    Hendricks, Lander, Arcobello, and Pitlick should be able to do that.

  46. cahill says:

    First, loved the Mitch Webster reference. Long time since I heard that name. Arcobello is a beautiful player, he reminds me of Todd White.

    Whether to trade Gagner or not depends upon if you see him as a center or not. If the Oilers do not see him as a center than I think you have to trade him. Get some assets and turn the page.

    If you think that he’s part of the future at center than you insulate him with two-way players.

    If Gagner isn’t part of the future start setting up a free agency board of players that can fill Gagner’s role, players like Grabovski, Legwand, Stastny & Goc. Figure out the dollar amount and the likelihood of being able to sign the player. And get some assets preferably live bodies. If you are going to trade to the Islanders yeah I’d want Bailey and Nelson but another player that makes sense is Scott Mayfield 6’4 RHS defenseman that is waiver eligible for the next two seasons.

    I think that Arco is a guy that can help ease (in addition to a player like Grabo or Goc) the loss of Gagner and play on a soft minutes line until the 3rd overall is ready. But the Oilers should sign a poor man’s Gagner to push Arcobello.

    A guy like PM Bouchard or Brian Gibbons. Prior to this season Bouchard averaged around 1.8 Pts/60 which is on par or better than Samwise but had a horrible PDO 937 and is due for a bounceback season offensively. Gibbons this year averaged over 2 Pts/60 he basically split his time with Crosby & B. Sutter so that number is likely inflated but still a good offensive player.

    I’m not sure what the option is. There really is solid points for and against keeping Gagner. I think if you limited him to 17 minutes a night. Gave him some really solid two-way wingers he would be fine. But it isn’t really the end of the world if you trade him. There are options (Arcobello included) that can replace Gagner and trading him gets additional assets.

  47. russ99 says:

    This is a really easy choice. Do you want offense or defense from your second line center?

    I want offense.

    If MacT can live with Gagner’s cap hit and NTC, I’m OK with that, as long as the many other flaws in the roster are taken care of.

    Personally, I’d prefer an upgrade and the cap room, something like Spezza – RNH as our top 2 centers.

    Since so many are tossing around that inane “sheltered second line” concept that doesn’t really exist in the real world, can you live with more offense and less defense from such a line anchored by Gagner – with the caveat that we will have improved our defensemen and that Eakins has a change in philosophy to use a shutdown third line vs. the toughs?

    As for Arco, I’d prefer him as a 4th line left winger. He could do some real damage there if that line was less fighter top-heavy, had a good NHL defensive center (like Trevor Lewis) and was used better.

  48. Shau-co says:

    Lowetide,

    Normally I agree with most of your positions. However, this time it just feels so wrong that I am actually questioning if you’ve been influenced somehow to think this way…

    Too often the Oilers have given up on players too soon and sold or traded at lows. I understand that you don’t need to win every trade and sometimes it makes sense to move on, but I just don’t see that with Gagner at all. If we move him for another real player, I will be ok with that but not for picks. Please, not for picks… At least bring in a young player from another team (e.g., how the Islanders gave up on Niederreiter too soon).

  49. G Money says:

    godot10,

    I find I agree with almost everything you said here.

    Anyone got a forecast for Hell today? Chilly? :-)

  50. slopitch says:

    spoiler,

    Fair enough. I do see the oilers in a better position a year from now though.

  51. spoiler says:

    G Money: I find I agree with almost everything you said here.

    I don`t…

    I think it would be far smarter for the Hawks to pick up Stastny for nothing than trade assets for Kesler. A clever GM would rather trade Sharp for a 1st and hire Stastny for nothing but money, than trade Sharp straight across for Kesler. JMO.

  52. G Money says:

    spoiler,

    Sure, if you want to deconstruct the “almost everything”, yes, that might be one of them.

    You might say: “The Hawks will be more interested in Kesler, Stastny, or Grabo moreso than Gagner.” for me to agree with it more.

    I’d also poke some fun at Godot’s obsessive blaming of everything bad on Eakins.

    I might express concern around a tough minutes line built around RNH (unless Hall & Ebs are there as well).

    But minor variations for the most part. Still agree with almost everything Godot posted there, and still looking for that Hadean weather forecast …

  53. limit says:

    Lowetide,

    Not totally sure how to interpret but what happened to MAP here in 2009-10 with -18 Corsi

    http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_statistics.php?
    ds=30&s=30&f1=2009_s&f2=5v5&f4=C+LW+RW&f5=EDM&f7=20-&c=0+1+3+5+4+6+7+8+13+14+29+30+32+33+34+45+46+63+67

  54. PerryK says:

    The question isn’t Gagner or Arcobello. The point is “NO GAGNER EVER AGAIN”! Cannot watch another season with Gagner playing for my OIlers!

Leave a Reply

Want to join the discussion?
Feel free to contribute!

Leave a Reply

© Copyright - Lowetide.ca