RE 15-16 ANTON LANDER: DARK ANGEL

You will hear, from time to time, about heart and character and leadership. These are things that have extreme value to hockey teams, and managers spend dear picks on those prospects who display those things. No matter how much leadership you own, you have to have the skill and speed. Have to. (Dark Angel).

ANTON LANDER 13-14

  • 5×5 points per 60: 0.21 (16th among forwards)
  • 5×4 points per 60: nil
  • Qual Comp: 13th toughest competition among regulars (fourth line)
  • Qual Team: 9th best competition among regulars (third line)
  • Corsi for 5×5 %: 43.9
  • Corsi for 5×5 % REL: -.2
  • Zone Start: 40% (6th toughest on the team among regular forwards)
  • Shots on goal/percentage: nil
  • Boxcars: 27, 0-1-1

ANTON LANDER 14-15

  • 5×5 points per 60: 1.60 (5th among regular forwards)
  • 5×4 points per 60: 5.52 (2nd among regular forwards)
  • Qual Comp: 13th toughest competition among regulars (fourth line)
  • Qual Team: 12th best competition among regulars (fourth line)
  • Corsi for 5×5 %: 48.6
  • Corsi for 5×5 % REL: 5.2
  • Zone Start: 49.4%
  • Shots on goal/percentage: 61 shots/9.8%
  • Boxcars: 38, 6-14-20

ANTON LANDER 15-16

  • 5×5 points per 60: 0.33 (15th among regular forwards)
  • 5×4 points per 60: nil (in 49 minutes and 51 seconds)
  • Corsi for 5×5 %: 47.3
  • Qual Comp: 4th line competition
  • Qual Team: 4th line teammates
  • Corsi for 5×5 % REL: -8.1
  • Shots on goal/percentage: 54 shots/1.9%
  • Boxcars: 61, 1-2-3 .049

VOLLMAN SLEDGEHAMMER

OILERS FORWA 15-16FINALLander is in a soft minutes area of the graph, and Edmonton badly needed him to deliver something. Anything.

RE 15-16: 75GP, 12-15-27 .360

ACTUAL 15-16: 61GP, 1-2-3 .049

  1. How bad was it? Last season, the NHL employed 378 forwards who played more than 400 minutes. Lander’s 0.33 points-per-60 at 5×5 ranked him No. 375 overall—ahead of Boyd Gordon, Paul Gaustad and Jacob Josefsen.
  2. What is his next NHL job? What is his next NHL job?
  3. Seriously. It sure is.
  4. Will they bring him back? Lander is signed for another season, so unless the team trades him then training camp is likely. I am very doubtful about his NHL chances in 2016-17.
  5. He looked so good in pre-season. Yes. I was at the game where he scored a hat trick, looked strong and in good places. Bah. What an awful season.
  6. I think he has it. I think it doesn’t matter.
  7. It’s over? Look, Peter Chiarelli and Todd McLellan cannot afford to have a repeat of the collapsed third line. Lander is in an awful spot on this roster, and, although I like the player, he scored one goal all year. Hard to make an argument in favor of giving him another shot.
  8. So he comes to camp and then what? He comes to camp as the No. 5 or No. 6 center and he has a very good chance of getting sent down early. The Oilers have most of the management and coaching staff at the World Cup of Hockey, so he might get a break—but the odds of the coach counting on him again are very low.
  9. Why are you so down on him? What evidence can I use to be positive? Look, the Oilers invested 550 minutes at even strength to Anton Lander, and the return was below the Mendoza line. This is serious stuff here. He scored three points at even strength, one of those a second assist. As impressive as Connor McDavid was (28 points in 625 even-strength minutes) at 5×5, the Oilers gave it all back and more with Lander. The team can’t do that again, it would be treason.
  10. Good grief. Take a pill. Seriously? I will tell you, I have cheered for teams that have done this in one form or another since the beginning of time. The Montreal Expos used to employ Tim Raines in left field and he was way above average for that position. Music! But they gave it all back with Doug Flynn at second base. You can’t do that! You are wasting your advantage with below replacement level performance.
  11. Todd Nelson got more out of him. Yes. And the Oilers drafted Connor McDavid. There are facts everywhere. This is the real fact: Lander needed to be better in the role provided and he was not—that is the story here.
  12. He was snakebit! Okay, Marshall Dillon. Look, I like Anton Lander, but even when the good half season happened under Todd Nelson there were skating issues. He was 1.60/60 at 5×5 last season, if he could have managed it again we would have a different conversation.
  13. Who did he play with? Iiro Pakarinen (50.8 Corsi for 5×5 percentage in 152 minutes); Lauri Korpikoski (41.6 in 148) and Teddy Purcell (47.8 in 125 minutes).
  14. Who did he play most with in 2014-15? Matt Fraser. Seven points in 214 minutes but the possession number was 41.7.
  15. What happens now? We will see. He has a contract and the team may not trade him this summer. I expect there will be added competition at the position, and would guess that there are several names ahead of him on the current depth chart. McDavid, Nuge, Leon, Letestu, but also (possibly) Jujhar Khaira and Bogdan Yakimov.
  16. What about PK? Maybe. I will tell you that is a thin resume for a guy who accomplished so little at even strength (and he did get some PP time). I think he might have to regain his career in the minors or Europe, or perhaps another organization. It will be extremely difficult to bring him back this coming year.
  17. Why this song? It is an incredible song. It is about a dream, an ideal, something that recurs without being real or getting closer. It is about things that we want, we know we want, but those things—sometimes—are never gifted to us.

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61 Responses to "RE 15-16 ANTON LANDER: DARK ANGEL"

  1. Richard S.S. says:

    You do good work Lowetide, but I missed today’s Podcasts. Did you work today?

  2. Lowetide says:

    Richard S.S.:
    You do good work Lowetide, but I missed today’s Podcasts.Did you work today?

    Yes. Do you follow me on twitter? I will send them out.

  3. Barcs says:

    Gagner, Lander, Schultz, Yak….

    So many guys that just couldn’t take that next step. Makes me sad. Really rooted for Lander and Yak, above all.

    I wonder if Detroit doesn’t scoop up Anton for a conditional 7th or some such.

  4. Richard S.S. says:

    I’m on sites like this. I can send out bland texts and almost as bland e-mails. That’s as much as I know how to do. I spent the first 55 years of my life not using the Internet unless it was the M-net. Since I took a fun job, I’ve needed the webby, but I don’t know how to do more.

    Do I follow you on Twitter? Sorry, no.

  5. Lowetide says:

    Richard S.S.:
    I’m on sites like this. I can send out bland texts and almost as bland e-mails.That’s as much as I know how to do.I spent the first 55 years of my life not using the Internet unless it was the M-net.Since I took a fun job, I’ve needed the webby, but I don’t know how to do more.

    Do I follow you on Twitter?Sorry, no.

    Ah, okay, just makes it easier for me to know
    http://www.tsn.ca/radio/edmonton-1260/the-lowdown-with-lowetide-1.503598

    Hour 2
    http://www.tsn.ca/radio/edmonton-1260/the-lowdown-with-lowetide-june-8-hour-2-1.503637

  6. Factotum says:

    IMO Anton’s problem is that he just gets there (wherever “there” happens to be at the time) a half-step too late – over and over and over again. He has a nice toolbox, but there’s a tragic flaw – he’s just not quite quick enough for the NHL.

    I really like him, and have been cheering like hell for the guy, but he sure looks like a tweener. Such a pity.

  7. Centre of attention says:

    Lander had about a dozen 10-bell chances this last season that he should of and could of buried. Lady lucky thought otherwise, poor Lander couldn’t buy a bounce.

    C’est la vie, Anton. Sail on good sir.

    On another note: Lets all start arguing about who the 3rd line center will be next year. Even if Nuge is here, ideally he is still in the top 6.

    We have talked about Bozak, Backes, Shaw. Lets hear some more hard targets?

    We need a strong third line, that is how the Pens are dominating the Sharks. HBK is eating what ever the Sharks are offering for breakfast. Now that I think of it, maybe DeBoer should think about moving Marleau back to 3C?

  8. Water Fire says:

    Of course it all depends on what malarkey Chia gets up to but given things they could run a nice set up like
    Nuge
    McDavid
    Draisaitl

    for a few seasons. I’d run them pretty even to keep everyone fresh and also hungry hot line gets more TOI. The oilers have been overplaying guys and they fade and are more prone to injury.

  9. Kiltymcbagpipes says:

    Centre of attention:
    Lander had about a dozen 10-bell chances this last season that he should of and could of buried. Lady lucky thought otherwise, poor Lander couldn’t buy a bounce.

    C’est la vie, Anton. Sail on good sir.

    On another note: Lets all start arguing about who the 3rd line center will be next year. Even if Nuge is here, ideally he is still in the top 6.

    We have talked about Bozak, Backes, Shaw. Lets hear some more hard targets?

    We need a strong third line, that is how the Pens are dominating the Sharks. HBK is eating what ever the Sharks are offering for breakfast. Now that I think of it, maybe DeBoer should think about moving Marleau back to 3C?

    S.Gagner, B.Gordon, J.Stoll and M.Arcobello are available they might look good in an Oilers uniform…..

  10. jake70 says:

    ‘But they gave it all back with Doug Flynn at second base. You can’t do that! You are wasting your advantage with below replacement level performance.’

    Why do you hate Doug Flynn? 🙂 Argenis “Angel” Salazar – Shortstop 1983 Montreal – BA-0.216, 1984 BA- 0.155.

  11. Lowetide says:

    jake70:
    ‘But they gave it all back with Doug Flynn at second base. You can’t do that! You are wasting your advantage with below replacement level performance.’

    Why do you hate Doug Flynn?:-) Argenis “Angel” Salazar– Shortstop 1983 Montreal – BA-0.216,1984BA- 0.155.

    Because Flynn played a lot. Bah. Damn. Gack!

  12. Lowetide says:

    Centre of attention:
    Lander had about a dozen 10-bell chances this last season that he should of and could of buried. Lady lucky thought otherwise, poor Lander couldn’t buy a bounce.

    C’est la vie, Anton. Sail on good sir.

    On another note: Lets all start arguing about who the 3rd line center will be next year. Even if Nuge is here, ideally he is still in the top 6.

    We have talked about Bozak, Backes, Shaw. Lets hear some more hard targets?

    We need a strong third line, that is how the Pens are dominating the Sharks. HBK is eating what ever the Sharks are offering for breakfast. Now that I think of it, maybe DeBoer should think about moving Marleau back to 3C?

    Shaw. He is the top option imo.

  13. Richard S.S. says:

    Thank you Lowetide, I totally forgot about the Golf thingy. Leon Draisaitl has an excellent chance to be at least twice as good as Nuge. Right now, I think it’s equal.

  14. jake70 says:

    Lowetide: Because Flynn played a lot. Bah. Damn. Gack!

    One hell of a middle infield eh?, at least Dave and Duke made you lke they could compete……then Carter gone before “85, then Hawk told Cubs to fill in the salary on his contract after 1986, that’s how desperate he was to play on natural grass….yeah..bah…….what a mess.

  15. LadiesloveSmid says:

    Kiltymcbagpipes,

    as long as they’re not soft, I’m good

  16. Mr DeBakey says:

    Richard S.S.: Leon Draisaitl has an excellent chance to be at least twice as good as Nuge.

    No he doesn’t.
    He has zero “chance to be at least twice as good as Nuge.”

  17. LadiesloveSmid says:

    Richard S.S.:
    Thank you Lowetide, I totally forgot about the Golf thingy.Leon Draisaitl has an excellent chance to be at least twice as good as Nuge.Right now, I think it’s equal.

    how so? Draisaitl’s 51 in 71 unimpressive when you consider RNH’s 52 in 62 as an 18YO. If Drai puts up 65-70P this coming season and RNH doesn’t take a step forward I will concede he is a bit better, not close to 2x.

    I actually might trade Draisaitl and take Dubois to replace him. Dubois’d be that big centre they need, protected in the expansion, and Draisaitl’s value is likely damn high right now.

  18. Centre of attention says:

    Lowetide: Shaw. He is the top option imo.

    Who is your runner up?

    I heard about Hamonic resurfacing. Hall was apparently involved, maybe Ryan Strome is coming back too? He’s a right shot and has played center. I want more than Hamonic that’s for sure.

    Here is the link to the current Hall conspiracy.
    http://btihockey.com/hamonic-still-available/

    Brock Nelson has been known to center the second line as well from time to time. Could pass for a 3C no problem.

    Things to think about during these long days of waiting.

  19. Lowetide says:

    Centre of attention: Who is your runner up?

    I heard about Hamonic resurfacing. Hall was apparently involved, maybe Ryan Strome is coming back too? He’s a right shot and has played center. I want more than Hamonic that’s for sure.

    Here is the link to the current Hall conspiracy.
    http://btihockey.com/hamonic-still-available/

    Brock Nelson has been known to center the second line as well from time to time. Could pass for a 3C no problem.

    Things to think about during these long days of waiting.

    Complete list here. Backes, Shaw, Bozak, Nash, McNeill
    https://lowetide.ca/2016/05/04/heart-like-a-wheel/

  20. hunter1909 says:

    LadiesloveSmid: I actually might trade Draisaitl and take Dubois to replace him. Dubois’d be that big centre they need, protected in the expansion, and Draisaitl’s value is likely damn high right now.

    Trading emerging star Draisaitl for a rookie reminds me of that fable where a dog, seeing it’s own reflection in water drops a bone in it’s mouth to grab at the bone it sees in the water.

    Another thing: There’s zero guarantee 2016’s latest rookie won’t turn out exactly like Yakupov, Gagner, Rita, Rob Schremp, or any of the other Oilers busts.

  21. Centre of attention says:

    Lowetide: Complete list here. Backes, Shaw, Bozak, Nash, McNeill
    https://lowetide.ca/2016/05/04/heart-like-a-wheel/

    Slim pickin’s after Shaw/Bozak/Backes I think. Tough call for Chiarelli. 3rd line center could be arguably a harder problem to solve than a couple RHD.

    *edit* Especially if they trade Nuge.

  22. digger50 says:

    Yak plus for R Strome = third line Center. My favourite would be Sgaw but if Strome can fit the bill he is more cost effective.

  23. Lowetide says:

    Centre of attention: Slim pickin’s after Shaw/Bozak/Backes I think. Tough call for Chiarelli. 3rd line center could be arguably a harder problem to solve than a couple RHD.

    Shaw might be most available.

  24. hunter1909 says:

    Great point on Lander, Lowetide. Namely that he can’t skate at NHL level.

    Sad how management spends years, carefully developing these hopeless players.

  25. stush18 says:

    I really hope lander somehow pots 30 points next year, and solidifies himself on this team. He’s always been one of my favourites, he seems to play the game right, except his skating is holding him back

  26. GCW_69 says:

    The last thread got me thinking about what the ultimate Oiler summer would look like. For me, focusing in on players that are either available via free agency, or are rumoured to be available via trade, or have some other organization reason for being potentially available (Strome and Severson having issues with their coaches), I came up with the below. This would be a very aggressive summer. Last summer Stan Bowman made 5 trades and signed 3 free agents, setting the upper limit around 8 transactions.

    1. Hall for Lindholm
    2. Yakupov (and Musil or Sleppy) for Severson
    3. Reinhart for Shaw
    4. 2017 1st and Hendricks to NYI for Strome
    5. Sign FA Lucic
    6. Sign FA Parenteau
    7. Sign FA Enroth or similar
    8. Sign FA Sceviour

    CapFriendly.com Armchair-GM User-Generated Roster

    FORWARDS (13)
    Rightwing: J. Eberle ($6,000,000) – R. Strome ($2,500,000) – P. Parenteau ($1,800,000) – Z. Kassian ($1,500,000)
    Centre: C. McDavid ($925,000) – R. Nugent-Hopkins ($6,000,000) – L. Draisaitl ($925,000) – M. Letestu ($1,800,000) – C. Sceviour ($850,000)
    Leftwing: M. Lucic ($6,500,000) – B. Pouliot ($4,000,000) – A. Shaw ($3,000,000) – P. Maroon ($1,500,000)

    DEFENSE (7)
    Right: A. Sekera ($5,500,000) – D. Severson ($605,833) – M. Fayne ($3,625,000)
    Left: H. Lindholm ($6,500,000) – O. Klefbom ($4,167,000) – B. Davidson ($1,425,000) – J. Oesterle ($750,000)

    GOALTENDER (2)
    C. Talbot ($4,166,667) – J. Enroth ($1,500,000)

    AHL BURIED
    A. Lander ($37,500)

    BUYOUTS
    L. Korpikoski ($500,000)

    DETAILS
    Roster Size: 22
    NHL Salary Cap: $74,000,000
    Cap Hit: $66,077,000
    Cap Space: $7,923,000

    It’s a winning roster. Three scoring lines. Lots of back up options at centre if an injury occurs with Strome and Shaw. And it appears to be a sustainable roster if they move on from Fayne, Pouliot, Nuge/Eberle and the fourth line at the right times.

    The defense isn’t completely balanced, and if Nurse is the real deal, a decision between Nurse and Klefbom would eventually need to be made, but if so, then they would have Nurse/Klefbom plus Sekera (assuming he was willing to wave his NMC or his modified NTC has kicked in) to go to market with to find a true 1RD and restock the prospect pool.

  27. smellyglove says:

    Another promising pick/prospect turned to dust.

  28. Rondo says:

    Hockey Prospects – Has Dubois ranked higher than Tkachuk

    Craig Buttons final list- Has Dubois ranked higher than Tkachuk

    Corey Pronman- Has Dubois ranked higher than Tkachuk

    The Draft Analyst-Has Dubois ranked higher than Tkachuk

    Hmmm

  29. stevezie says:

    hunter1909,

    Betting on Dubois is quickly replace Drai is silly.

    Turning Drai into a defender, replacing him wih an established and seeing what happens with Dubois (or whoever)? That has some merit.

    There’s other moves I’d rather make, but that makes some sense.

  30. Melman says:

    stush18:
    I really hope lander somehow pots 30 points next year, and solidifies himself on this team. He’s always been one of my favourites, he seems to play the game right, except his skating is holding him back

    LT have you ever had a skating coach, either Pelletier or otherwise, on your show? I’m curious how much a player COULD improve their skating. With all th fitness etc. these guys do I just wonder how much they can move the needle.

  31. Магия 10 says:

    hunter1909: Trading emerging star Draisaitl for a rookie reminds me of that fable where a dog, seeing it’s own reflection in water drops a bone in it’s mouth to grab at the bone it sees in the water

    Delusions of gander.

    Hunter, what do you think we could pick up if we drop Hall?

    /Drops mic

  32. Магия 10 says:

    stevezie: Turning Drai into a defender

    ~ Did he play D when he was younger? ~

  33. smellyglove says:

    What do people round these parts thing Drai will turn into? He seems pretty hot an cold, but man does he work well with Hall.

  34. Магия 10 says:

    smellyglove:
    What do people round these parts thing Drai will turn into? He seems pretty hot an cold, but man does he work well with Hall.

    ~ If you trade then both you can get 2 dreamy D.~

  35. NYCOIL "Gentleman Backpacker" says:

    Man, the people have turned againsr Nuge and Hall it seems.
    This is the most dangerous Oiler summer of our lifetimes.

  36. Lowetide says:

    NYCOIL “Gentleman Backpacker”:
    Man, the people have turned againsr Nuge and Hall it seems.
    This is the most dangerous Oiler summer of our lifetimes.

    I don’t know if it is a case of turning against them, it is more a realistic approach to the process of import/export.

  37. Магия 10 says:

    NYCOIL “Gentleman Backpacker”:
    Man, the people have turned againsr Nuge and Hall it seems.
    This is the most dangerous Oiler summer of our lifetimes.

    I tossed it out at the end of a dead thread, but after years without nails they all want to melt down all the hammers.

  38. Магия 10 says:

    Lowetide: I don’t know if it is a case of turning against them, it is more a realistic approach to the process of import/export.

    Dougie Hamilton says hi.

  39. PunjabiOil says:

    Lowetide – I must say your blog is second to none. It’s become a daily staple to read, and I never say enough how much I appreciate your tireless writing and content. Do you still accept paypal donations – can’t seem to find the link? If so, would like to send an appreciation gesture your way.

  40. Lowetide says:

    Магия 10: Dougie Hamilton says hi.

    As will Nuge from Colorado, if it comes to pass. Nothing stated here will impact that, should it happen. I suspect people are preparing for this, in their own way.

  41. Lowetide says:

    PunjabiOil:
    Lowetide – I must say your blog is second to none.It’s become a daily staple to read, and I never say enough how much I appreciate your tireless writing and content. Do you still accept paypal donations – can’t seem to find the link?If so, would like to send an appreciation gesture your way.

    It should show up on the right hand side, if not right click the title and the new window should have it.

  42. PunjabiOil says:

    Donated. Encourage other Lowetiders to do the same. Thanks for all you do.

    PS – had to disable adblock to find said link.

  43. NYCOIL "Gentleman Backpacker" says:

    Lowetide: I don’t know if it is a case of turning against them, it is more a realistic approach to the process of import/export.

    I think I am probably one of the more balanced posters when it comes to possible solutions for addressing needs on this team, do you not agree? Many times I am accused of being too generous to the other teams.

    But when I read that Drai can be twice the player Nuge is, for example, that goes to show how much we have started to question our own best players.

    I have no issue with a Hall for Lindholm trade because Lindholm is a fantastic player. I don’t think Nuge for Barrie is a good trade at all. Nuge is not expendable based on a good 40 game stretch for LD. That type of thinking ia what got this team in trouble in the first place: assuming players would develop in a linear way.

    I think that this Anton Lander RE is proof in the pudding that you cannot assume anything when it comes to young players and small sample sizes, don’t you? And that is fully acknowledging Draisaitl is a much more talented player than Lander.

    But UNTIL Draisaitl is scoring 65-70 points against decent competition and Nuge is not, I can’t get behind a team running Draisaitl and McDavid as its top two centres.

    Can you?

  44. digger50 says:

    GCW_69,

    Like your roster, great moves. Prefer to keep Hall. Move Pouliott instead and gain his 4m cap space. Lindholm replaced with Demers via FA – or perhaps Barrie for Pouliott / picks and trade down combination.

  45. stush18 says:

    NYCOIL “Gentleman Backpacker”: I think I am probably one of the more balanced posters when it comes to possible solutions for addressing needs on this team, do you not agree? Many times I am accused of being too generous to the other teams.

    But when I read that Drai can be twice the player Nuge is, for example, that goes to show how much we have started to question our own best players.

    I have no issue with a Hall for Lindholm trade because Lindholm is a fantastic player. I don’t think Nuge for Barrie is a good trade at all. Nuge is not expendable based on a good 40 game stretch for LD. That type of thinking ia what got this team in trouble in the first place: assuming players would develop in a linear way.

    I think that this Anton Lander RE is proof in the pudding that you cannot assume anything when it comes to young players and small sample sizes, don’t you? And that is fully acknowledging Draisaitl is a much more talented player than Lander.

    But UNTIL Draisaitl is scoring 65-70 points against decent competition and Nuge is not, I can’t get behind a team running Draisaitl and McDavid as its top two centres.

    Can you?

    Depends who the third line centre is.

    I’d like to run
    Hall-nuge-drai
    Maroon-mcdavid-ebs
    Xxx-helm-kass

    With pouliot being traded for vatanen and having
    Sekera-fayne
    Klef-vatanen
    Davidson-xxx

    With xx being deangelo or severson or what not.

    I think we really need to consider the effect the injuries had, as well as the importance the draft pick has with expansion happening. That said, if you can trade hall for lindholm plus, and sign lucic, I do it all day.

    Lucic-mcdavid-ebs
    Poo-nuge-drai
    Maroon-helm-kass

    Lindholm-Klef
    Sekera-fayne
    Reinhart-davidson

    Looks better by my eye

  46. NYCOIL "Gentleman Backpacker" says:

    stush18,

    You have Nuge in the lineup. And I said I have no issue with Hall for Lindholm. Did you read my post at all? I feel like your comment is fine and have no issue with it, but it completely and utterly missed my point so maybe you meant to reply to someone else?

  47. Oilspill says:

    NHL level? What is the standard? For those who understand the game skating is one variable to one’s GAME. Look at Mark Stone. Said he’d never make it because of his skating. Now look. Puck awareness, finding open ice, agility, toughness etc. Hate to say but he skates well enough. There are other factors.

    hunter1909:
    Great point on Lander, Lowetide. Namely that he can’t skate at NHL level.

    Sad how management spends years, carefully developing these hopeless players.

    Since

  48. Oilspill says:

    Rondo:
    Hockey Prospects –Has Dubois ranked higher than Tkachuk
    Why do you thing Hall Ebs and RNH are being shopped?

    Craig Buttons final list- Has Dubois ranked higher than Tkachuk

    Corey Pronman- Has Dubois ranked higher than Tkachuk

    The Draft Analyst-Has Dubois ranked higher than Tkachuk

    Hmmm

    Remember you draft what you need. Has nothing to do with what writers say. That’s why teams have scouting staffs. We need big and skilled with emphasis on tough.

  49. Магия 10 says:

    Lowetide: As will Nuge from Colorado, if it comes to pass. Nothing stated here will impact that, should it happen. I suspect people are preparing for this, in their own way.

    The seismic shift here from overvaluing current players to undervaluing them is about something owner than market value. Says Dougie.

  50. Lowetide says:

    Магия 10: The seismic shift here from overvaluing current players to undervaluing them is about something owner than market value. Says Dougie.

    Meh. People who may know things are indicating RNH may be on the way for Tyson Barrie. I don’t want Nuge traded, robbing Peter to pay Paul. That said, the distancing may have already begun. NYC above talks eloquently about claims Drai>Nuge, and any fool knows that simply isnt true, may never be true, in fact a good chance it will not be true.

    If Hall is dealt, suspect more of the samemcoming to grips will occur. People frame issues to survive circumstance, happens all the time on much bigger items.

  51. bbf_iii says:

    Oilspill: Remember you draft what you need. Has nothing to do with what writers say. That’s why teams have scouting staffs. We need big and skilled with emphasis on tough.

    Setting aside the issues concerning drafting for need, especially at 4th overall, why does “big and skilled with emphasis on tough” not apply to Dubois? He’s taller and heaver than Tkachuk, scored more and has more PIMs (if that’s your thing).

  52. hunter1909 says:

    Oilspill: NHL level? What is the standard?

    AHL players don’t need to skate as well as NHLers. Lander has success in the AHL with his skating deficiencies. To attempt to answer your question, What is the standard = NHL speed vs AHL pluggers.

    Oilspill: For those who understand the game

    Oic. You dismiss everything I say, because in your opinion I don’t even understand the game. Not a lot I can say more.

    Oilspill: Look at Mark Stone. Said he’d never make it because of his skating.

    According to you, Mark Stone’s case means there is actually no real issue with poor skating in the NHL. Of course you understand the game better than I do. And you might be correct. I’m no expert, like Glen Sather. That said I would happily go head to head against Lowe+MacT on any hockey management level. They know next to nothing other than how to run a franchise into the ditch.

    Oilspill: Now look. Puck awareness, finding open ice, agility, toughness etc. Hate to say but he skates well enough.

    You might be right. Still, Lander is a bust.

    Oilspill: There are other factors.

    I recall Don Cherry talking about how AHLers often were as good as NHLers but for one major flaw that they couldn’t overcome. What do you think is going on in Lander’s case? And, do you really think management is about to let him go another season without scoring?

  53. hunter1909 says:

    Lowetide: If Hall is dealt

    Kind of idiotic, trading away the team’s best winger. It’s worse than trading RNH, given that Leon MIGHT be able to stand in on the 2nd line.

  54. Pouzar says:

    Lowetide: Meh. People who may know things are indicating RNH may be on the way for Tyson Barrie. I don’t want Nuge traded, robbing Peter to pay Paul. That said, the distancing may have already begun. NYC above talks eloquently about claims Drai>Nuge, and any fool knows that simply isnt true, may never be true, in fact a good chance it will not be true.

    If Hall is dealt, suspect more of the samemcoming to grips will occur. People frame issues to survive circumstance, happens all the time on much bigger items.

    Man trading Nuge f^cking depresses me to no end.
    I can’t believe this is a thing.

  55. Water Fire says:

    Are people going to be disappointed if they get the chance to see Schultz + 25% playing half assed defense and getting half the points they used when playing for the Oilers, all for our best centre or winger.

    Those people will have me weeping at the forefront. The team would not be better. I hope Chia is smarter than these rumours. It would be hard to get over after so much.

    Hall and McDavid are the drivers. You can build two great scoring lines around them. Trade the passengers, please.

    EDIT and wingers always before centres unless the return is clearly elite.

  56. Lowetide says:

    Pouzar: Man trading Nuge f^cking depresses me to no end.
    I can’t believe this is a thing.

    Yep. It will no go well imo.

  57. Магия 10 says:

    Lowetide: Meh. People who may know things are indicating RNH may be on the way for Tyson Barrie. I don’t want Nuge traded, robbing Peter to pay Paul. That said, the distancing may have already begun. NYC above talks eloquently about claims Drai>Nuge, and any fool knows that simply isnt true, may never be true, in fact a good chance it will not be true.

    If Hall is dealt, suspect more of the samemcoming to grips will occur. People frame issues to survive circumstance, happens all the time on much bigger items.

    Yeah. Framing is a valid coping mechanism. But right up to they make a bad move and far after I’d rather call a spade a spade. Whether some Austins move or not I doubt Chia’s thinking is anything like some of the overcorrection of fans trying to run ahead of events.

    Who knows he might even believe in Pens Unicorns when the fan based has moved on to other dreams.

    Thanks for the candor.

  58. Spydyr says:

    Only two years to late.He should of been gone long ago.

  59. Pink Socks says:

    I don’t get the premise of moving RNH for Barrie, neither do I get Hall for Lindholm. In both cases, while perceived value may be the same, Chia gives up the better player. If Hall moves, it sure as hell better be for a Karlsson or Subban type of D regardless of how Lindholm is trending. If one of the Austins is moved I far prefer it being Eberle and filling the RW hole through FA or even Yak who I daily wish could put it all together. Drai has had success on the right side, Kassian can move up when injuries derail the season again, and a FA acquisition of a Stempniak type saves on the cap. If Eberle is not moved, and we need to move one of our prized young forwards; let it be Drai while his value is huge. The hole left by Drai or Eberle leaving is far less significant than Hall or RNH leaving.

  60. rickithebear says:

    NYCOIL “Gentleman Backpacker”:
    Man, the people have turned againsr Nuge and Hall it seems.
    This is the most dangerous Oiler summer of our lifetimes.

    It is the morning drive and afternoon drive Moron’s at TSN 1260 driving the TSN/Leafs owners “do not look at us, Look how Bad Hall, RNH, and the oilers are.”

    The are part of the alien hoard trying to ruin the good in alberta.

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