Hotel California

They should never have let Charlie Huddy go. The year they did it, Craig MacTavish stood in front of a microphone and told us he’d been too long at the fair. I was a little upset about his resignation, because MacT was a good teacher for fans and a very funny man. In terms of entertainment, MacT was one of the best coaches in the history of the game, and he could coach a team at even strength just like ringing a bell.

I heard a rumor (that should be Edmonton’s theme song) right away they were going to keep Charlie Huddy from the staff and let everyone else go. Important, because Huddy was bringing along the blue (taught Laddy Smid the backdoor play, the single most difficult chore in the history of man) and fun veterans like Lubomir Visnovsky, Sheldon Souray, Tom Gilbert and Denis Grebeshkov. Huddy had applied an extra coat of tinfoil on Grebeshkov and that group was coming along.

A good defensive group is a Godsend for an NHL team and it takes time to move a mountain. Huddy was (is!) good at getting the best out of his defense and the Oilers benefited from his expertise for the first eight seasons of this century.

I don’t know Jack Diddly about Jim Johnson but do know these defensive chemistry sets take a long time to develop and year two is better than year one and on it goes. Fans want everyone fired and I get that, but I’ll tell you Charlie Huddy helped and he seemed to have a better group every year (except after they traded Pronger, no man could overcome that). Fire the mall if you must, but relationships build and starting at Mile One has its own challenges across the board.

THE ATHLETIC!

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 RED RUM, YEAR OVER YEAR

  • January 2016: 2-2-0, goal differential -1 (4 points)
  • January 2017: 2-2-0, goal differential -2 (4 points)
  • January 2018: 1-3-0, goal differential -12 (2 points)

Goodness this is a difficult post-Christmas run. The Oilers aren’t close, as reflected in the goal differential we’re seeing in January. There are only six more games this month, I may have to start referencing the Donner party again.

 AFTER 43, YEAR OVER YEAR

  • Oilers 15-16: 17-23-3, goal differential -25 (37 points)
  • Oilers 16-17: 21-15-7, goal differential +6 (49 points)
  • Oilers 17-18: 18-22-3, goal differential -23 (39 points)
The 2015-16 Oilers finished with 70 points, can this team beat that total? It never occurred to me that question would have to be asked. What an astonishing season, not because it’s bad, but because it’s so bad.

 WHAT TO EXPECT FROM DECEMBER

  • At home to: Los Angeles, Anaheim (Expected 0-1-1) (Actual 1-1-0)
  • On the road to: Dallas, Chicago, Nashville, Arizona, Vegas (Expected 2-2-1) (Actual 0-2-0)
  • At home to: Vancouver, Buffalo, Calgary (Expected 2-1-0) (Actual 0-0-0)
  • Overall expected result: 4-4-2, 10 points in 10 games
  • Current results: 1-3-0, two points in four games

We’re off the grid now, this team might lose all three games before the break. There are no breakout passes, there is no coverage, scoring chances occur mainly via brilliant individual efforts and they are rare indeed.

LAST NIGHT

Connor McDavid was brilliant, Darnell Nurse was high event, I’d bring back Mike Cammalleri next season over some of the younger wingers, Yohann Auvitu is a pretty interesting player and this team is just waiting to lose right now.

DEFENSE, LAST NIGHT

  • Klefbom-Benning went 11-14 in 13:01 together, 0-1 in both GF and HDSC’s. I think both men are playing better than they have in recent weeks, seem to be recovering and heading in a better direction. We may not see the six true blue healthy together this season. Went 11-4 against Bouma-Panik-Wingels, 1-7 in 4:40 against Hartman-Schmaltz-Kane.
  • Nurse-Russell were 13-21 in 15:34, a trying and high event afternoon. Were 1-2 in GF, 2-6 in HDSC’s. Both men played a high risk game, both men need to have calm feet in order to be successful. Nurse has struggled since Christmas, might be time to move him down to the third pairing for a couple of weeks. Paring were 8-19 in 11:21 against the Kane line, that’s the heart of the order. Safe to say the Swedish pairing needs to reform and take on these giants.
  • Davidson-Larsson were 4-12 in 13:00, going 0-1 GF and 1-2 HDSC’s. Oilers seem to be running two shutdown blue on the same pairing quite a bit lately, I would prefer the Swedes together and Nurse with Benning. That leaves Davidson, Sekera and Russell as the other pairing. Were 4-6 in 5:22 against the Toews line, 0-1 against Kane.
  • I’d suggest Quenneville was fine with McLellan running Nurse-Russell against the Kane line and so both men basically hard matched. That’s the only way I can see arriving at Kane’s icetime breaking 11:21 Nurse-Russell, 4:40 Klefbom-Benning and 2:55 Davidson-Larsson. I’d run Klefbom-Larsson starting now.
  • Cam Talbot stopped 25 of 29, .862.
  • NaturalStatTrick and NHL.com.

FORWARDS, LAST NIGHT

  • Khaira-Strome-Cammalleri went 11-3, 1-2 in GF and 0-1 in HDSC’s. My opinion is that Cammalleri looked good, while the other two gents were shy without the puck on goals against. In the comments section there was some disagreement about Strome’s guilt, so I will reiterate my opinion on Strome’s role in the GA may not be universal. Line did well in possession and did not do well in execution.
  • Auvitu-Letestu-Kassian was a nifty little line, Auvitu adds a “suicide bomber” element to the trio and gets Letestu out of the house. Went 7-7, 0-1 GF and 1-0 HDSC’s.
  • Maroon-McDavid-Draisaitl were 16-20 in 15:31, 0-0 GF and 4-2 HDSC’s. The fact this group didn’t win the possession battle in what should be an important game tells you the goose is cooked. Went 13-14 against the Toews line. Leon’s in a little danger here imo, despite having a good season to my eye. One of my theories about the Hall exit pertains to performance after the season was lost, and LD’s contract makes him a possible early trade option (saving Nuge and Oscar). The young man is going to have to perform well in nothing road games through Easter.
  • Lucic-Nuge-Puljujarvi faced Everest. Went 9-20, 0-1  GF and 0-5 HDSC’s. Of course they faced the Kane line (11:58) and went 9-20 against them, and you cannot
  • Kane played 10:55 against Nuge (22-6); 4:40 against Connor McDavid (4-3), 2:40 against Strome (0-1) and 1:09 against Letestu (0-0) at 5×5. The Nuge line was sacrificed in the name of McDavid’s line providing offense, offense that never came. That is confirmation that the season is dead. Hallelujah, amen.

I expect we’ll see Wayne Gretzky, Kevin Lowe and Keith Gretzky in more prominent roles, Chiarelli (who has already muted himself/been muted) probably takes on some kind of advisory role in an organization that most closely resembles the Hotel California.

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341 Responses to "Hotel California"

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  1. dustrock says:

    Chiarelli did an interview with Spector (sigh), says nothing to see here, please move on, ignore the burning fireworks factory.

    Talked about bringing in another assistant (rather than letting some go?) but is not doing it.

    Basically says we’re not doing anything, they can work it out.

    And maybe they will.

    But this season is lost.

  2. dustrock says:

    And I’d add, if guys like Klefbom and Larsson aren’t 100%, they should not be playing at all.

  3. JD_Wry says:

    Chiarelli has, among other possible solutions, considered bringing in another assistant — like long-time NHL assistant coach Perry Pearn — to help assistants Jay Woodcroft (power play) and Jim Johnson (penalty kill).

    Think on it Pete. Let us know.

    We’ll speculate on what ‘other possible solutions’ may mean while you think.

  4. HiddenDarts says:

    Just simply couldn’t watch the games this weekend. Just couldn’t set myself up for that kind of heartache.

    As a result, I’m in a surprisingly good mood this morning. The team is toast, the playoffs are pushed to 2019 at the earliest, and I’m happy as a clam.

    Not sure there’s really anyone to blame here, but I see the same exact “no one has heart”, “problems in the dressing room”, “Coaches are garbage” and “we shouldn’t have let [INSERT 4th Line GLUE GUY] go!”

    Hate to say this, but are we as Oilers fans not the absolute definition of insanity?? They suck us in, get us hoping for victory and then proceed to suck while looking absolutely atrocious.

    We need a new hobby, friends. Better for the soul.

  5. Admiral Ackbar says:

    If Chiarelli is on the chopping block, it seems they’ve found the culprit. He’s done more bad than good by my eye although he’s done far more good than the previous guy. We’ve set a low bar the past 10 years. What’s wrong with this organization?!

  6. frjohnk says:

    – after all these years, we are still looking for a top pairing Dman

    -our collection of wingers the worst in the league? If not, probably close.

    -goaltending not close to last year

    -time to sell off the UFA’s, see who should be brought back as RFA’s

  7. Wilde says:

    Fellas, what we have here is an innovative look at a modern dynasty. You simply alternate between 100 and 70 point seasons, repeatedly injecting lottery talent into the roster every other year, along with 4-in-the-top-100 selections filling the cupboards. Luminous intellectualism.

    God damn it.

    I hope Peter hits every red light when he has a full bladder, until he day he checks out.

    Disdain for deals of his might colour the first decisions of the GM-to-be, which is why I agree Leon might be on notice, deserved and verbalised or not.

  8. OriginalPouzar says:

    That was quite the disappointing weekend on the ice, wasn’t it?

    At least we can put the fear of our current GM making a panic move to save the season (i.e. futures for short-term stop gap help) behind us, right? I think we can at least.

    This man will be in front of the TV tomorrow night looking forward to puck drop and ready to cheer on his team and hope for a victory – at the same time, this man is also quite disappointed but is not letting bad games ruin his night and the and is not letting the disappointing season effect his mood negatively – its quite the switch from year’s past and it feels good.

    Don’t get me wrong, this man cares as much as he ever has and is as emotionally invested as he ever has been (obviously I have the time commitment to this team), he’s just not going to get pissed off or mad or angry. He’s chosen to look at the positives – there are few of them but they are there and, in particular, this man is stating to get excited about the aggregate influx of talent that should/might become associated with the organization in the spring.

    Yes, I know we are supposed to be past looking towards the draft and, yes, its disappointing that we are back there but it is what it is and, from accounts, this could be one of the best and deepest drafts in history.

    If we draft top 5 – an amazing talent is coming to our organization. If we draft 6-15 then we are still getting a potential high end player. Add that to the additional picks we should get from selling our UFAs and this spring should go a long ways to providing depth in the future.

    Go Oilers!

  9. frjohnk says:

    Wilde: I hope Peter hits every red light when he has a full bladder, until he day he checks out.

    Lol

  10. Admiral Ackbar says:

    HiddenDarts,

    You’re spot on. Self-Esteem by The Offspring comes to mind.

    I also find that avoiding this tire fire improves my enjoyment of life. Sadly, I can’t not go on this weeks-end trip to Phx & LV. Need to put together a coping strategy.

  11. Wilde says:

    dustrock:
    And I’d add, if guys like Klefbom and Larsson aren’t 100%, they should not be playing at all.

    Yes. All players dinged up should be withdrawn, optics be damned.

  12. frjohnk says:

    OriginalPouzar: If we draft top 5 – an amazing talent is coming to our organization. If we draft 6-15 then we are still getting a potential high end player. Add that to the additional picks we should get from selling our UFAs and this spring should go a long ways to providing depth in the future.

    I think you just copy and pasted this paragraph each year from 2010.

    Maybe not you every year, but someone has.

  13. OriginalPouzar says:

    Hopefully Darnell can get his game back a little bit.

    He’s struggled a bit in my opinion the last number of game. He’s still playing good, generally, but making more poor decisions and poor plays leading to scoring chances against.

    It could be over-confidence because his decision making has been so good for the most part, it could be the overall minutes and responsibility starting to grind on him, it could be the team dragging him down.

    Wait, maybe its playing with Kris Russell finally starting to drag him down? I don’t mean to single out Russell but he’s struggled mightily the last few weeks – his puck movement and zone coverage has regressed, in my opinion.

    Maybe Darnell is simply trying to keep his own cap hit manageable for us?

  14. OriginalPouzar says:

    Also, Larsson is struggling big time right now – his worst stretch as an Oiler.

    How is his back?

  15. sliderule says:

    You have a starting goalie with a save percentage of .902

    Two of the goals yesterday went right through holes that shouldn’t be there.

    That has been a theme this year.

    Those of you who have played a team game know how demoralizing soft goals can be

  16. zatch says:

    Gather round, and let me tell you the tale of Aleksi Brusilov, the most successful Russian general of WWI, which is damning with faint praise.

    Brusilov was able to achieve the Russians greatest victories of the war, and arguably the most decisive results of the whole Entente. He did this for several key reasons. One of the most notable was, due to shell shortages, he kept his pre-assault bombardments to several hours, not the customary week, and focused them on vital points in the enemy lines. This meant the enemy was surprised, and the short, precise bombardment meant artillery and troops could move through breakthrough points, unlike the Western Front where you pulverized the ground to the point no significant maneuver was possible. Another was he was fighting Austria-Hungary, not Germany, and those troops often were Slav heavy, with little motivation to fight. In addition, he was fine burning troops in costly breakthrough assaults.

    The issue was, he wasn’t aware why he’d won those battles (depending on who you ask, I subscribe to Dr. James Stokesbury’s view). The circumstances he’d found himself in dictated his actions, not his brilliance. Later on, he changed his tactics and found much less success, unable to make the connection.

    PC has only the haziest of notions on how he won that cup in Boston, and nearly won another. He doesn’t seem to understand how Tim Thomas delivered that cup to him, with the extremely significant help of Chara and Bergeron, and support from others (not trying to suggest the team wasn’t balanced/deep; it was). He doesn’t understand that his constant losing of trades with elite young talent going one way and crap coming the other way dooms teams beyond a year or two. He won that cup in spite of himself, not because he was great.

    He needs to go, and soon.

  17. dustrock says:

    I would like some kind of study into afternoon games

  18. Scungilli Slushy says:

    When a team is this down mentally everything looks awful. Nobody plays as well as they can, or the odd guy that’s finds his rhythm gets dragged down back into the mud.

    Making changes now is a bad idea. IF McLellan has an issue it might be that he isn’t enough of a motivator for this young group after coaching on vet laden teams. I believe they need to ride this out to get the right result from the season. What if Sather got canned before the team got it together? McL isn’t Sather but it takes time.

    Nobody talks about the fails the darling Jets had for years before this strong season. Chev was a bozo, afraid to trade while his team couldn’t get over, now he’s golden.

    I might be wrong but I feel goaltending really fractured team confidence at the start and as a young group they haven’t recovered. The weak play of Russell early who was talked about as ‘great with the young D’ or in other words a leader hurt as he was supposed to spell off Sekera who was the backbone of the D.

    So, a tough season. The screen cap of Nurse and McLellan I saw yesterday, both looking dejected and demoralized sums it up for me. The pressure was too much with the illnesses and injuries, it happens to teams every season.

    The tone isn’t working. It’s time to lighten things up and get some fun back on the ice, ease up and just start playing. Not a free for all, but take pressure off the players. That is what a good coach and GM would do. Doing what they are doing definitely won’t get them on a historic run, might as well try something else.

    Reading riot acts and blowing things up is an emotional response. It’s what teams that shoot themselves in the foot do so that they can run faster. Play the season out and upgrade the supporting cast where possible, hope for health and a good start by Talbot. This remains a solid team. And somehow hire Charly Huddy. I am not sold on Johnson. Or the goalie coach.

  19. frjohnk says:

    Lowetide:
    Dellow with a fantastic post.

    https://theathletic.com/204411/2018/01/08/dellow-after-41-games-edmonton-oilers/

    “The decline at 5-on-5 for the Oilers this year is a seriously underrated part of why they find themselves where they do…..

    the biggest difference between last year’s club that made the playoffs and this year’s team that is almost certainly out of it can be found at 5-on-5. The penalty kill has been a more obvious horror show than 5-on-5 because it’s awful as opposed to average but there’s been a slightly larger decline in terms of 5-0n-5 goal difference. The decline at 5-on-4 hasn’t been a positive development but in the hierarchy of Oilers’ issues this year, it sits third.”

    Fantastic article.

    Dellow for Oilers GM !!!!

  20. frjohnk says:

    Whats funny about the goaltending or Talbot is last year at 5 on 5 his save % was .929.

    This year, its .923.

    PK save % is in the gutter

  21. OriginalPouzar says:

    I thought the Oilers 5 X 5 scoring was in the to 10 of the league until the last 4 games, no?

  22. Lowetide says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    I thought the Oilers 5 X 5 scoring was in the to 10 of the league until the last 4 games, no?

    They have slipped since Christmas, are currently tied for No. 14
    https://www.naturalstattrick.com/teamtable.php

  23. OriginalPouzar says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    I thought the Oilers 5 X 5 scoring was in the to 10 of the league until the last 4 games, no?

    I haven’t had a chance to read the entire article but is it a function of more GA 5X5 as oppossed to lack of scoring goals at 5X5?

  24. OilClog says:

    Huddy for Head coach?

  25. flea says:

    They are missing a good trigger man, both on the wing and on the point. Their offense is one dimesional, easy to defend (take away the pass).

    Lucic, Maroon, Puljujarvi, all similar player types. No wingers that stop up and wait for shots.

    If Hoffman is available they should be going to get him. The draft isn’t going to provide this talent anytime soon.

    They should also trade one of their LHD for a RHD that can shoot and hit the net (Oilers D miss the net often.) Prob the best shot on the defense right now is Sekera, and he isn’t at 100%. Klefbom regressed, Nurse can’t hit the net, Benning can’t hit the net. Ironically Russell ain’t too bad, but he should be a depth option.

    Sekera or Klefbom needs to get traded for a point shot option.

    All this is for the offseason though, doubt it happens right now.

  26. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Wilde: Yes. All players dinged up should be withdrawn, optics be damned.

    They need to pull the plug soon and start working toward next season. The players are saying the right things, but they know there’s a fork in it, they’ve be on teams all their lives, they can look at sports odds, probably do.

    Trade those not coming back and sit the injured. Let’s see what OV2 has and Davidson. Give the young wingers a last chance to earn a spot. Get the offense going and try to outscore mistakes again. Make this count.

    If they start stably next season this will all be forgotten.

  27. fifthcartel says:

    I thought the way Chiarelli worded things to Spec was really funny. “I have no intentions of firing Todd,” no intention made me laugh.

    Also, it feels like Chiarelli thinks he’s way more secure than he is when I read that interview. I think most fans are unhappy with both McLellan and Chiarelli, but more vitriol directed at Chiarelli.

    I was listening to TSN 1260 and Nielson was discussing Rishaug’s segment earlier, where he said it’s interesting McLellan got the vote of confidence, but no one’s given Chiarelli a vote of confidence. So he wonders if the coaching staff stays and Chiarelli goes, which seems like a very eyebrow-raising comment from someone like Rishaug.

  28. Scungilli Slushy says:

    flea:
    They are missing a good trigger man, both on the wing and on the point. Their offense is one dimesional, easy to defend (take away the pass).

    Lucic, Maroon, Puljujarvi, all similar player types. No wingers that stop up and wait for shots.

    If Hoffman is available they should be going to get him. The draft isn’t going to provide this talent anytime soon.

    They should also trade one of their LHD for a RHD that can shoot and hit the net (Oilers D miss the net often.) Prob the best shot on the defense right now is Sekera, and he isn’t at 100%. Klefbom regressed, Nurse can’t hit the net, Benning can’t hit the net. Ironically Russell ain’t too bad, but he should be a depth option.

    Sekera or Klefbom needs to get traded for a point shot option.

    All this is for the offseason though, doubt it happens right now.

    Sekera has one more season with a NMC. He is also the best overall D when healthy. Klefbom needs to take another step and start playing more consistently for sure. But, if you trade him your left side depth of established players relies on Sekera who is over 30, in a few years it would be bad.

    Good teams don’t trade good young D. The only scenario I’d support is if they get stupid lucky and draft Dahlin, then you have some options. He’ll be in the NHL next season and would easily handle 3LD.

    Without luck they will have to ride out the NMCs one more year and then move ahead on the back end. IF they all show up the D corp would be good enough for one season.

    Klef Larsson
    Nurse Benning / Sekera
    Russell Benning Davidson OV2

    Not the best, far from the worst.

  29. Lowetide says:

    fifthcartel:
    I thought the way Chiarelli things to Spec was really funny. “I have no intentions of firing Todd,” no intention made me laugh.

    Also, it feels like Chiarelli thinks he’s way more secure than he is when I read that interview. I think most fans are unhappy with both McLellan and Chiarelli, but more vitriol directed at Chiarelli.

    I was listening to TSN 1260 and Nielson was discussing Rishaug’s segment earlier, where he said it’s interesting McLellan got the vote of confidence, but no one’s given Chiarelli a vote of confidence. So he wonders if the coaching staff stays and Chiarelli goes, which seems like a very eyebrow-raising comment from someone like Rishaug.

    The Oilers never fire people, so as I mentioned above the likely scenario is that Chiarelli continues in a role, but the final decision falls to Lowe and the loudmouth Gretzky’s. Something like that.

  30. frjohnk says:

    Lowetide: They have slipped since Christmas, are currently tied for No. 14
    https://www.naturalstattrick.com/teamtable.php

    5 on 5
    Oilers are 23rd GF/60 at 2.33
    Oilers are 22nd GA/60 at 2.56

    I showed a few days ago, that the 5 on 5 scoring is worse once a person digs deeper into the numbers. In the first 20 games, with RNH and McDavid off the ice, the bottom 6 forwards scored 2 goals.

    Either we dont scored at 5 on 5
    Or we score a bunch of goals in a game and I hate to use the word but “pad our stats”

    9 games of 4 goals for or more at 5 on 5 this year ( 43 games)
    12 games of 4 goals for or more at 5 on 5 last year ( 82 games)

    9 games of 0 goals for at 5 on 5 this year ( 43 games)
    5 games of 0 goals for at 5 on 5 last year ( 82 games)

  31. Lowetide says:

    frjohnk: 5 on 5
    Oilers are 23rd GF/60 at 2.33
    Oilers are 22nd GA/60 at 2.56

    I showed a few days ago, that the 5 on 5 scoring is worse once a person digs deeper into the numbers.In the first 20 games, with RNH and McDavid off the ice, the bottom 6 forwards scored 2 goals.

    Either we dont scored at 5 on 5
    Or we score a bunch of goals in a game and I hate to use the word but “pad our stats”

    9 games of 4 goals for or more at 5 on 5 this year ( 43 games)
    12 games of 4 goals for or more at 5 on 5 last year ( 82 games)

    9 games of 0 goals for at 5 on 5 this year ( 43 games)
    5 games of 0 goals for at 5 on 5 last year ( 82 games)

    Yes. The question I was responding to pertained to 5×5 GF total being in the top 10 recently.

  32. frjohnk says:

    frjohnk: 5 on 5
    Oilers are 23rd GF/60 at 2.33
    Oilers are 22nd GA/60 at 2.56

    I showed a few days ago, that the 5 on 5 scoring is worse once a person digs deeper into the numbers.In the first 20 games, with RNH and McDavid off the ice, the bottom 6 forwards scored 2 goals.

    Either we dont scored at 5 on 5
    Or we score a bunch of goals in a game and I hate to use the word but “pad our stats”

    9 games of 4 goals for or more at 5 on 5 this year ( 43 games)
    12 games of 4 goals for or more at 5 on 5 last year ( 82 games)

    9 games of 0 goals for at 5 on 5 this year ( 43 games)
    5 games of 0 goals for at 5 on 5 last year ( 82 games)

    So this year, we have had more games of feast ( 4 goals) or famine ( 0 goals ) at 5 on 5

    Last year, we scored 1 -3 goals a game at 5 on 5 80% of the time
    This year, its 55%.

    So we have to rely on goaltending and special teams more this year.
    But those areas are worse than last year.

    Hows that draft post coming LT?

    We wait.

  33. JimmyV1965 says:

    Scungilli Slushy:
    When a team is this down mentally everything looks awful. Nobody plays as well as they can, or the odd guy that’s finds his rhythm gets dragged down back into the mud.

    Making changes now is a bad idea. IF McLellan has an issue it might be that he isn’t enough of a motivator for this young group after coaching on vet laden teams. I believe they need to ride this out to get the right result from the season. What if Sather got canned before the team got it together? McL isn’t Sather but it takes time.

    Nobody talks about the fails the darling Jets had for years before this strong season. Chev was a bozo, afraid to trade while his team couldn’t get over, now he’s golden.

    I might be wrong but I feel goaltending really fractured team confidence at the start and as a young group they haven’t recovered. The weak play of Russell early who was talked about as ‘great with the young D’ or in other words a leader hurt as he was supposed to spell off Sekera who was the backbone of the D.

    So, a tough season. The screen cap of Nurse and McLellan I saw yesterday, both looking dejected and demoralized sums it up for me. The pressure was too much with the illnesses and injuries, it happens to teams every season.

    The tone isn’t working. It’s time to lighten things up and get some fun back on the ice, ease up and just start playing. Not a free for all, but take pressure off the players. That is what a good coach and GM would do. Doing what they are doing definitely won’t get them on a historic run, might as well try something else.

    Reading riot acts and blowing things up is an emotional response. It’s what teams that shoot themselves in the foot do so that they can run faster. Play the season out and upgrade the supporting cast where possible, hope for health and a good start by Talbot. This remains a solid team. And somehow hire Charly Huddy. I am not sold on Johnson. Or the goalie coach.

    The coach is in the same funk now that is gripping the rest of the team. Would love to see him do some innovative and quirky thing to break the team out of its morass, some kind of team building exercise. They need to find a way to make the game fun again.

  34. frjohnk says:

    Lowetide: Yes. The question I was responding to pertained to 5×5 GF total being in the top 10 recently.

    duly noted.

    I now have drank enough coffee to be awake now

  35. Scungilli Slushy says:

    frjohnk: 5 on 5
    Oilers are 23rd GF/60 at 2.33
    Oilers are 22nd GA/60 at 2.56

    I showed a few days ago, that the 5 on 5 scoring is worse once a person digs deeper into the numbers.In the first 20 games, with RNH and McDavid off the ice, the bottom 6 forwards scored 2 goals.

    Either we dont scored at 5 on 5
    Or we score a bunch of goals in a game and I hate to use the word but “pad our stats”

    9 games of 4 goals for or more at 5 on 5 this year ( 43 games)
    12 games of 4 goals for or more at 5 on 5 last year ( 82 games)

    9 games of 0 goals for at 5 on 5 this year ( 43 games)
    5 games of 0 goals for at 5 on 5 last year ( 82 games)

    Definitely things coming together to cause that. D that can’t move the puck well enough as a group and wingers not doing enough.

    Draisaitl can get by with his skating style. The others with heavy boots I think drag things down as successful play comes down to perfect execution – they can’t create pressure with speed when things aren’t working, which is likely why Cagguila gets used. Cags brings it even if ‘it’ isn’t very offensive. Slepy would have a place if he’d start motoring like he can.

    Strome doesn’t have a place on this team, not that he couldn’t help another. The Oilers need speed if a player isn’t a top scorer. Drai and Lucic are enough in the top 6 for guys without a good first step, and of course players without hands shouldn’t be playing in the top 6. I don’t think Drai is a bad skater, but he has a unique style and isn’t quick starting, fast when he gets going. He also doesn’t move his legs a lot naturally, many bigger player don’t.

    Cammalleri I am not sure about. I don’t see him top 6 steadily, I would like quicker in the bottom 6.

  36. Durag says:

    Another mind-boggling curio about this season is going to be McDavid’s point total. Did anyone think he’d be under 100? I’m not sure he’s going to hit 80 the way things are going.

  37. SayItAin'tSo, Gretz, SayItAin'tSo! says:

    flea,

    So I don’t disagree with this assessment BUT I am very worried that it leads to Whale Chasing and if there is one franchise I know that has been burned by that tactic going back decades its been the Oilers.

    I watched the Tampa Bay – Ottawa game this weekend very closely and here’s a couple things I picked up.

    1) A lot of their offensive bursts originate from the point
    2) They are constantly in motion
    3) Everyone (and I mean everyone) looks to shoot if they have anything remotely resembling a lane

    What does it mean?

    A few posters (and Dellow) have noted how much the Oilers dmen are shooting this year. In my one tiny sample size I noticed the Lightning dmen firing at will and forwards also taking shots from a long ways out if they had a lane.

    So on one hand yes, a pure shooter would help but a single individual is easy to cover and as we’ve seen this year a single individual can only impact the teams offense so much. Shooting needs to be a team mentality and that will only happen once everyone collectively remembers that scoring a goal is more (just as?) fun as assisting on one. That being said the biggest difference when watching Tampa is Point 2 from above (and this was something SwedishPoster mentioned yesterday with his PbP guys).

    Shooting from distance isn’t the greatest option for sure but if you have guys in motion and near the net when that shot takes place who can recover a puck it helps correct the percentages.

    How many games/times this year do you remember an Oiler dman shooting it only to have it end up being a wide open shot with no net presence? How many times has Maroon/Looch been ever so slightly out of position to create an effective screen? How often are the other forwards just a step or two late when a rebound does pop open?

    Dellow sort of touched on it in his post and again SwedishPoster mentioned it yesterday but ground zero for the static nature of the offense can be found on PP1. So little movement, so little creativity so much blahhh.

    I know its only one facet of what ails the team but offense isn’t very high up the list of things that coaches actively effect once you get beyond the breakout stage. Sure when you have young players you need to coach reads and position but there is a lot of leeway to make your own luck once you have the puck in the offensive zone.

    Right now the Oilers entire idea of offense seems to be “give it to McDavid and just watch, he’ll do something cool.”

    That’s bad news bears right there.

    All that being said I’m not sure how you fix this, mainly because I think it all comes back to confidence and swagger (ie the wholly intangibles). I agree with Scungili in that its time for everyone to stick a fork in it, breathe and just start having some fun. Way easier said than done, but as you watch the games since the break you can feel the tension the team is carrying through the TV.

    Just relax boys, it didn’t work out this year, that sucks and people aren’t happy. But y’all live to play another day (here or elsewhere) so don’t get too down but grip the sticks less tight and share a few laughs.

  38. P2theickles1 says:

    Time to start playing the lineup to see what we could be working with next year.

    XX-97-XX
    27-29-XX
    XX-93-98
    XX-16-44

    91 – Trade him at or before the deadline/don;’t resign
    58 – Give him a really chance with regular games and with 29 and see if anything happens (good in playoffs) if not trade at deadline/don’t resign
    55 – Trade him at or before the deadline
    19 – Trade him at or before the deadline
    18 – Trade him at or before the deadline (maybe to ARZ for Dulcair or Rieder?)
    13 – Trade him at the deadline (Can resign him in the summer if really want him back)
    27 – Id give a very hard look to see if he is movable, doesn’t fit with this team way to slow. (That assumes a new GM is brought in as Chia would never do this)

    77-6
    25-XX
    XX-83

    83 – Resign but keep that number very low and don’t go long term. Needs to show much more
    88 – Resign at low number to be the #7 dman next year (One year deal)
    62 – Trade if possible or just hold on to play in the farm and as the #8 dman next year
    4 – Look to trade him but don’t see that happening unless chia is gone
    2 – Would look to trade him for a RHD, He is one of our best when halthy but he is the oldest and highest paid and we need a RHD for second pairing and don’t think 77 or 25 should be the ones trade both very young

    This team needs to find some affordable wingers that are cablable of playing with speed and at a High level. Its a great asset to have 97-29-93 down the middle and this team should keep that going forward just need to find some wingers that can play with them.

    McD Line – Needs a big body guy to protect McD that can skate and a Shooter to score. I would give Kass a try on this line as he is quick can protect McD and was drafted in the high first round he does have the finish or did at one point in his career. Then all you would be looking for on this line is a right handed shoot first player.
    Drai Line – Lucic isn’t going anywhere sadly so this line needs a quick player but that can work the cycle as these two are good on the cycle
    Nuge Line – Give Pulj a strong two way center and not such hard minutes and then look for a more offensive minded Left winger to give this line some more offense as both are more tow way then pure offense
    Khaira Line – get a cheap right winger who is quick and great on the penalty kill

    As for Defense:
    Put the swedes together and let them take on the toughs, they are the best we have and klef showed offence last year when playing with the shutdown type in larsson.
    Nurse needs a strong vet RHD to play with. Could help his game go miles but he needs some that is strong in all areas of the game to teach the young nurse.
    Most likely Russel in the LHD on the third pairing and with a cheap benning signed you can keep there minutes reduced and let benning grow or see if he is capable of growing into a steady third pairing dman.

  39. Lowetide says:

    Durag, Fr and Say it: Great posts, and I’m going to answer some of both of your questions and none of others. 🙂

    Auditions. The reasons McDavid won’t hit 100 points are Yamamoto (which I didn’t agree with) and Puljujarvi (which I do). If McLellan ran Leon all year as 97’s RW, he would have pocketed enough EV goals (4×4 is big for those two) to push toward 100 points.The PP might have held him back.

    Auditions. It’s the reason 5×5 is suffering, PK and PP. So many players new to a role or at less than 100 games. Crazy.

  40. Thinker says:

    Lowetide: The Oilers never fire people, so as I mentioned above the likely scenario is that Chiarelli continues in a role, but the final decision falls to Lowe and the loudmouth Gretzky’s. Something like that.

    The Oilers never fire Alumni. They will fire anyone else (Tambellini, Krueger, MacGregor).

  41. fifthcartel says:

    Cody Franson on waivers.

  42. OilSafety says:

    P2theickles1,

    P2THEICKLES1
    I agree on all fronts.

    We are of like minds, I would do everything I could to move Lucic and Russell, but it probably wont happen.

    I dont see a problem trying Kassian on the top line, but am confident he has a place on the team if it doesnt pan out.

    Sekera would be the ideal trade chip if he has a great second half.

    If they do manage to move Lucic, I think you keep the Big Rig if you can sign a reasonable deal. That said, we dont need both of these guys in our top 6.

    Great post.

  43. bendelson says:

    After careful consideration, I have come to the conclusion that Maroon will be traded to St. Louis for Ivan Barbashev… I could breakdown my thought process if anyone is interested but for now I’ll just ask… What do YOU think the Oilers get for one Patty Maroon?

  44. frjohnk says:

    Lowetide:
    Durag, Fr and Say it: Great posts, and I’m going to answer some of both of your questions and none of others. 🙂

    Auditions. The reasons McDavid won’t hit 100 points are Yamamoto (which I didn’t agree with) and Puljujarvi (which I do). If McLellan ran Leon all year as 97’s RW, he would have pocketed enough EV goals (4×4 is big for those two) to push toward 100 points.The PP might have held him back.

    Auditions. It’s the reason 5×5 is suffering, PK and PP. So many players new to a role or at less than 100 games. Crazy.

    McDavid had 26 points in his last 16 games last year. This is when the Oilers went 14-2-0 to finish the year.

    So he had 74 points in his first 66 games. So far this year, he has 47 points in 43 games, he is off from last years pace, but a run, which I wouldnt rule out, could put him near the century mark.

  45. Scungilli Slushy says:

    fifthcartel:
    Cody Franson on waivers.

    I hope they pass, that ship has sailed. Bad sign if Quenneville can’t use him. He can use nearly anybody.

  46. Scungilli Slushy says:

    frjohnk: McDavid had 26 points in his last 16 games.This is when the Oilers went 14-2-0 to finish the year.

    So he had 74 points in his first 66 games.So far this year, he has 47 points in 43 games, he is off from last years pace, but a run, which I wouldnt rule out, could put him near the century mark.

    I be they start playing well when officially out. Sadly for the pick, happily for them and us.

  47. jtblack says:

    Lowetide,

    You were warning us all summer about areas of concern …. And all have affected us negatively ….. (Backup, D depth, Veteran RW)

    Still, I never saw it going this sideways 😮

  48. Cassandra says:

    I watch a lot of Devil games. And in those games Taylor Hall is a force of nature.

    Chiarelli traded this force of nature for a reasonable second pairing D with one assist this year. (One!).

    I am no less incredulous about that trade today than I was at the time. Listening to people defend it is like listening to people deny the existence of dinosaurs.

    The shame is it never should have come to that. The Reinhart trade was just as bad. What kind of person trades two high picks in a very deep draft for a player that everyone knows is a bust in the making with third pairing upside. And we did know that at the time. It was in the thread.

    If I was owner I would have fired Chiarelli for bringing that trade to the table. In life there is plenty of room for disagreement and uncertainty, but anyone who would make those two trades should never be allowed to make another decision, because there is no justification for them and there wasn’t at the time. These were black and white issues, obvious, clear, and undeniable at the time.

    And this is without bringing up all the other awful things Chiarelli has done.

    Chiarelli was handed a can’t miss Stanley Cup team and he ruined it. Now I have no faith that the OBC will be able to fix the mess he put the Oilers in. This was the best salary cap position the Oilers were going to be in for years and they have a terrible system of prospects. It is possible to get better fast in this league (see the Devils and the Avalanche) but you get better by adding good, young, players, and by having cap space. The Oilers have neither.

  49. flea says:

    Scungilli Slushy,

    I think Sekera is the one you could trade at this point, putting Klef/Nurse/Russell down the left and Larsson, New Addition, Benning down the right would be better.

    I don’t know if they would get much for Sekera though. But the defense is woefully lacking a strong shooter, they need someone who can pull the trigger.

    SayItAin'tSo, Gretz, SayItAin'tSo!,

    SayItAin'tSo, Gretz, SayItAin'tSo!,

    I dunno, though, Tampa has some pretty scary scoring threats up front. I just think that having a few good shooters opens up the offensive game for everyone. A shooter pulls up, the defense has to cover him. A defender trails in from behind, have to respect that and the zone spreads out. Right now teams just play man to man on the Oilers and block the passing lanes. It pains me to say, but McDavid’s offensive zone laps are starting to remind me of Hemsky.

    Holds it, holds it, HOLDS IT!

    Anyways, I hope they don’t blow it up, and find some more shooters for the wings. I don’t actually think the team is that far off, just a combination of bad luck and lost confidence this year. Go Oilers!

  50. Whatif says:

    If the D corps can not consistently and effectively move the puck with good passing then the forwards are stuck. They can’t be on the move to receive breakout or transition passes because they have to wait for the D men.

    Until the Oilers acquire a really solid defensive group they are going to have trouble all over the ice. They simply can’t rely on the D men to defend or generate any offense. through the neutral zone.

  51. Oil2Oilers says:

    bendelson:
    After careful consideration, I have come to the conclusion that Maroon will be traded to St. Louis for Ivan Barbashev…I could breakdown my thought process if anyone is interested but for now I’ll just ask… What do YOU think the Oilers get for one Patty Maroon?

    Magnus Paajarvi #56

  52. frjohnk says:

    bendelson:
    After careful consideration, I have come to the conclusion that Maroon will be traded to St. Louis for Ivan Barbashev…I could breakdown my thought process if anyone is interested but for now I’ll just ask… What do YOU think the Oilers get for one Patty Maroon?

    I dont know if he garners as much as some here think.

    Many in the league see him as a gritty winger that is zoomed by McDavid.

    On pace for less than 20 goals.

    Maybe a 2nd round pick, maybe a B prospect. Sad thing is that Maroon probably brings the most back in a trade for our UFA’s.

  53. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Whatif:
    If the D corps can not consistently and effectively move the puck with good passing then the forwards are stuck. They can’t be on the move to receive breakout or transition passes because they have to wait for the D men.

    Until the Oilers acquire a really solid defensive group they are going to have trouble all over the ice. They simply can’t rely on the D men to defend or generate any offense. through the neutral zone.

    Tank hard baby and hope for the best luck at the draft.

  54. Pouzar says:

    Oil2Oilers: Magnus Paajarvi #56

    Jordan Kyrou please.
    or
    Jordan Schmaltz

    F^ck it…anyone named Jordan…

  55. StixMalone says:

    Whatif:
    If the D corps can not consistently and effectively move the puck with good passing then the forwards are stuck. They can’t be on the move to receive breakout or transition passes because they have to wait for the D men.

    Until the Oilers acquire a really solid defensive group they are going to have trouble all over the ice. They simply can’t rely on the D men to defend or generate any offense. through the neutral zone.

    Yes the D are having issues. Back in too much. Can’t handle the forecheck as a result, the when in possession of puck always try the reset and wait or off the wall and out. No immediate transition. Always scramble or relinquish possession. We need a cheap Karlsson to feed those nice outlet passes.

  56. Scungilli Slushy says:

    flea: I think Sekera is the one you could trade at this point, putting Klef/Nurse/Russell down the left and Larsson, New Addition, Benning down the right would be better.

    For me Sekera is a far better player when healthy than Russell has ever been. Keep the best ones!

  57. danny says:

    Man, We aren’t at the all-star break yet and we’ve started talking about the GM / Coach / Draft ?

    I did not see this coming. I did not. Oh hi Mark.

  58. flea says:

    Scungilli Slushy,

    True enough but Russell plays a different role. Similiar to up front, I really think they lack a variety of player types on the back end. If you could get a younger RHD for Sekera I think it would be a positive.

    And i might be in the minority here but i’d pick up Franson and see what he could do on the point on the powerplay. They’d have to drop someone though so I don’t see it happening (although could prob waive Auvitu)

  59. 106 and 106 says:

    Cassandra,

    You said Hall. Lordy.

  60. Bag of Pucks says:

    Cassandra:

    Chiarelli was handed a can’t miss Stanley Cup team and he ruined it.

    I had no idea the team was that good when Pete came on-board. Here I was under the impression that they’d missed the playoffs for a solid decade.

  61. OriginalPouzar says:

    flea:

    If Hoffman is available they should be going to get him. The draft isn’t going to provide this talent anytime soon.

    Sekera or Klefbom needs to get traded for a point shot option.

    1) From accounts, this is a very high end top of the draft and its quite deep. Just drafted high-end forwards can and do make a material offensive impact right away in their rookie seasons all the time. Its not like Hoffman is scoring 40 goal – his offence could potentially be replicated by a rookie.

    With that said, no, I am not on board with relying on a just drafted teenager (or a rookie pro like Benson or Yamamoto) to fill a top 6 role going in to camp. Our GM will need to somehow find a player to at least provide some competition – its tough with the limited cap space

    2) The perverse thing here is that a guy like Klefbom may get traded over Russell – these two players are signed to essentially the same cap hit but one of them is clearly better while being younger than the other and its that player that might need to be traded because the other has a NMC.

  62. bendelson says:

    Pouzar: Jordan Kyrou please.
    or
    Jordan Schmaltz

    F^ck it…anyone named Jordan…

    Both very interesting choices… I like them both and would likely accept either in a trade for Maroon.
    I think, however, it may be asking too much. I believe they offer Jaskin – a trade I would walk away from…

  63. Lowetide says:

    jtblack:
    Lowetide,

    You were warning us all summer about areas of concern …. And all have affected us negatively ….. (Backup, D depth, Veteran RW)

    Still, I never saw it going this sideways 😮

    Nor did I. In a way, you can argue this has been such a severe series of setbacks and bad bets it is unlikely to happen again. That said, if the organization had done more in the summer they would have had more quality and depth. So there’s that.

  64. Side says:

    Peter… Chiarelli… was handed… a can’t miss Stanley Cup team…

    Where am I? Is this real life?

  65. Cassandra says:

    zatch:
    Gather round, and let me tell you the tale of Aleksi Brusilov, the most successful Russian general of WWI, which is damning with faint praise.

    Brusilov was able to achieve the Russians greatest victories of the war, and arguably the most decisive results of the whole Entente. He did this for several key reasons. One of the most notable was, due to shell shortages, he kept his pre-assault bombardments to several hours, not the customary week, and focused them on vital points in the enemy lines. This meant the enemy was surprised, and the short, precise bombardment meant artillery and troops could move through breakthrough points, unlike the Western Front where you pulverized the ground to the point no significant maneuver was possible. Another was he was fighting Austria-Hungary, not Germany, and those troops often were Slav heavy, with little motivation to fight. In addition, he was fine burning troops in costly breakthrough assaults.

    The issue was, he wasn’t aware why he’d won those battles (depending on who you ask, I subscribe to Dr. James Stokesbury’s view). The circumstances he’d found himself in dictated his actions, not his brilliance. Later on, he changed his tactics and found much less success, unable to make the connection.

    PC has only the haziest of notions on how he won that cup in Boston, and nearly won another. He doesn’t seem to understand how Tim Thomas delivered that cup to him, with the extremely significant help of Chara and Bergeron, and support from others (not trying to suggest the team wasn’t balanced/deep; it was). He doesn’t understand that his constant losing of trades with elite young talent going one way and crap coming the other way dooms teams beyond a year or two. He won that cup in spite of himself, not because he was great.

    He needs to go, and soon.

    Post of the year.

  66. StixMalone says:

    This group needs to reset. Coach should tell players not to worry about playoffs. Reset plays,positioning drills, work on pk and power play. Make practices upbeat lighten the tempo to make players comfortable with positioning. Let them smile. Coach needs to adapt as well with maybe some new strategies. I think once the birthday party in Vegas is over things will change for the team.

    If getting players out at deadline is a viable option you do it. Get wingers that can keep up and finish for Connor. Good 1st pair Rhd. Prospects that can play 3rd-4th line and can contribute perhaps on pk or as a checking line.

    Home games keep Connor away from 1st line matchups . Coach has got to strategize. Out coach opposition. It’s a thing most coaches do.

    They all worked their way into this funk. Let’s see if they can work out of it too. I’m not ready to give up on the team or the coaches yet. Even though I feel like doing so reality hits and I cannot cheer for any other team. Let the pain begin and end with this season anomaly.

  67. knighttown says:

    If I was a Pres of Hockey Ops I’d have a quantifiable way to measure my GM besides simply wins and losses.

    Here’s what I’d measure:
    1. Amatuer draft results based on NHL averages per draft position.
    2. Professional scouting and college free agents
    3. Value based trades**
    4. Hockey trades
    5. Contracts and the salary cap

    **I’d define value based trading as being more akin to purchasing. “Buying” Al Montoya costs something. Montreal isn’t trying to make their team better today, they are hoping to gain currency for an asset.

    For the value-based trades, there have been a number. Sometimes the GM is selling an asset for some currency (Justin Schultz out) and sometimes he’s buying (Patrick Maroon in). This is the easiest part of the job in that, in most cases, there are set prices for these types of assets. I think Chiarelli has done a acceptable job.

    It’s item number 4; true hockey trades that I think Chiarelli deserves whatever he gets. There is a fundamental difference in value-based trades and true hockey trades. In value-based trades there’s pretty much a price tag on the item you’re acquiring or selling. Justin Schultz at his salary and contract status is worth a 3rd rounder….it just is based on decades of these types of transactions so he receives neither a pass or a fail and most importantly, it doesn’t matter that Schultz went on to star on 2 Stanley Cup champion teams.

    Hockey-based trading has no price tags. It’s more of a bartering system or an antique sale where the value is in the eye of the beholder.

    There’s no formula for the value of a contract controlled Taylor Hall. GM #1 would strongly value his pedigree, river pushing and 5×5 scoring. GM #2 would devalue him based on his plus/minus, team record and penchant for bad turnovers.

    Peter Chiarelli has had 3 hockey-based trades…I even exclude Talbot and put his trade into the value based trade category and score Peter well there.

    1. Hall for Larsson- Personally I would have set his value much higher than Adam Larsson. I’d have had it somewhere around a true #1 defenseman below the age of 30…names like Hedman, Doughty, Karlsson, OEL and Petro. I would not have done Shattenkirk regardless of his signability.

    2. Eberle for Strome- I rate this poorly but not as poorly as trade #1 in part because Eberle was almost in the other category (like Schultz) of an asset that had to go. The bigger issue is WHY the Oilers keep painting themselves into corners where players have to go. But as a transaction goes, it was subpar but not dreadful. Strome was younger and cheaper and the “mirror-man” concept had some merit. And the cap space should have been spent earlier but if you assume you were going to be in the playoff picture, you can get a more pricey player for 2 months of salary (say Evander Kane) than having to pay the full season.

    3. Picks for Reinhart- of all the trades this one is the worst for me. With Sekera, Klefbom and Nurse on the roster moving massive value for a marginal LHD is simply a terrible decision. There was this instant pressure point to improve the roster but the pressure, in hindsight, was reckless. The need was never really there, the targeted player was awful and the price paid was way too high regardless. And arguing that Matt Barzal wasn’t going to the pick anyway doesn’t help Chiarelli’s argument. He had slid and was considered the clear BPA and only a stroke of incompetence by the Bruins left him on the board.

    So on this one move, the Oilers had four major mistakes. They tried to fill a hole that didn’t and doesn’t exist. They paid “Dougie Hamilton” price for someone they thought would be just below Dougie Hamilton so that was an overpay even if he had turned out. Then it turns out he’s an AHLer so a huge strike for the professional scouting aspect of his job. And finally, they missed on a superstar, a huge strike for the amateur scouting aspect of his job. A quadruple-whammy of mismanagement.

    On contracts, McDavid was a great signing. Drai was way too rich. Lucic has been OK so far but it’s not a bet I like long term. And Russell was a bit too rich and way too long.

  68. OriginalPouzar says:

    fifthcartel:
    I thought the way Chiarelli worded things to Spec was really funny. “I have no intentions of firing Todd,” no intention made me laugh.

    Also, it feels like Chiarelli thinks he’s way more secure than he is when I read that interview. I think most fans are unhappy with both McLellan and Chiarelli, but more vitriol directed at Chiarelli.

    I was listening to TSN 1260 and Nielson was discussing Rishaug’s segment earlier, where he said it’s interesting McLellan got the vote of confidence, but no one’s given Chiarelli a vote of confidence. So he wonders if the coaching staff stays and Chiarelli goes, which seems like a very eyebrow-raising comment from someone like Rishaug.

    Not only was there no vote of confidence for the GM but the MSM was in full on blame mode last night.

    It was wild to read the MSM on twitter last night – they weren’t throwing Chiarelli under the bus per se but they were clearing putting the blame squarely on the GM and protecting the coach. It was very surprising to see Edmonton’s MSM actually blame the GM – guys like Jim Mattheson.

    It made me think that maybe they were “asked” to provide a message from the very top (Nicholson) and that Chia may be gone sooner than we all think – that sounds a bit conspiracy theory to me though so I’m going to back off that thought.

  69. Wilde says:

    Lowetide,

    Yeah, Lady Luck and her rejection this year is particularly caustic, even given the vulnerable roster.

    It’s honestly impressive how thorough the damnation has been. Pretty well every money move has bombed.

  70. JimmyV1965 says:

    bendelson:
    After careful consideration, I have come to the conclusion that Maroon will be traded to St. Louis for Ivan Barbashev…I could breakdown my thought process if anyone is interested but for now I’ll just ask… What do YOU think the Oilers get for one Patty Maroon?

    I would much prefer a prospect over a draft pick. If we have to sweeten the offer to get a good prospect do be it.

  71. bendelson says:

    frjohnk: I dont know if he garners as much as some here think.

    Many in the league see him as a gritty winger that is zoomed by McDavid.

    On pace for less than 20 goals.

    Maybe a 2nd round pick, maybe a B prospect.Sad thing is that Maroon probably brings the most back in a trade for our UFA’s.

    26 pts in 42 playoff games… not bad.

    If a SC contender gets him for a late 2nd, I suspect said team will be very pleased.

  72. Oilin4 says:

    Prediction for the week:

    It will follow the same pattern as the entire season.

    1. The Oilers pull fans into despair (where we are now).
    2. With their backs against the wall and nothing to lose, they play well against a good team and somehow squeek out a victory (Nashville).
    3. They dominate another game (Arizona). Despite our better judgment, we all glance at the standings (Oil now 6-7 back of 8th) and imagine crazy runs and scenarios that put the team in. We know it isn’t logical – too many teams to jump, too many games in the other guys’ hands – but we do it.
    4. Vegas throttles us and we enter the break back in despair.

    (After the break, repeat)

  73. OriginalPouzar says:

    fifthcartel:
    Cody Franson on waivers.

    He got Osterle’d

  74. Pouzar says:

    bendelson: Both very interesting choices… I like them both and would likely accept either in a trade for Maroon.
    I think, however, it may be asking too much.I believe they offer Jaskin – a trade I would walk away from…

    Yeah I am dreamin for sure.

  75. OriginalPouzar says:

    bendelson: Ivan Barbashev

    I’d prefer a 2nd rounder in the current draft, no?

  76. Chris says:

    If we want to establish why the Oilers lack talent and aren’t performing well we can do so in three simple comparisons.

    Taylor Hall 15 goals and 42 pts this year. Adam Larson 3 goals 4 points on the season

    Jordan Eberle 14 goals 30 pts this year Ryan Strome 7 goals 17 points this year.

    Matt Barzal 13 goals 39 points this year, Griffen Reinhart 1 goal 7 points for the Chicago Wolves of the AHL

    Chiarelli has effectively traded away three top six players for “magic beans” as the rants against Kevin Lowe used to go. I have liked some of his smaller deals but the reality is that every time Chiarellli has stepped up to the plate with a significant move he”s lost the trade substantially. His greatest successes as an Oilers GM may be reviving the fortunes of the Islanders and Devils.

  77. Chelios is a Dinosaur says:

    Smarter people than me, please, what is worse for the organization going forward for the rest of the year:

    1. Stand pat, grind it out, put some wins together, remember that smell, move on, draft ~7-15. Make changes in the summer.

    2. Stand pat, grind it out, go down two in the first, fuck it. Everyone in the room sees everyone else and themselves as losers, for 4 long months. Draft ~1-5. Make changes in the summer.

    I’m not convinced 2 doesn’t set this team further back than 1: Certainly if that pick is not Rasmus Dahlin, I believe it could be a dangerous gamble to assume a lost season for these fragile players. If that pick is Rasmus Dahlin, even I, hardcore Oilers fan since before I could speak the words, will likely want to put an asterisk next to every W for the next 10 years. I work Toronto, have had to deal with legitimate draft taunts since Yakupov.

  78. OriginalPouzar says:

    knighttown:
    If I was a Pres of Hockey Ops I’d have a quantifiable way to measure my GM besides simply wins and losses.

    How does the analysis go when the POHO is the GM?

  79. OriginalPouzar says:

    Interesting that wikipedia has Chiarelli as the former POHO and GM of the Oilers:

    Peter Chiarelli (born August 5, 1964) is a Canadian former ice hockey player and former executive, who was the former President of Hockey Operations and General Manager of the NHL’s Edmonton Oilers.

    Is Wikipedia Speedy Turtle?

  80. StixMalone says:

    Chris,

    You can’t compare Halls points to Larsons. Forward- defencemen

  81. bendelson says:

    OriginalPouzar: I’d prefer a 2nd rounder in the current draft, no?

    I believe it’s close… but I don’t think St.L trades that pick (they have no 1st). Barbashev has 3pts in his last 2 games playing with Tarasenko(?) Pump and dump?

  82. StixMalone says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    Interesting that wikipedia has Chiarelli as the former POHO and GM of the Oilers:

    Peter Chiarelli (born August 5, 1964) is a Canadian former ice hockey player and former executive, who was the former President of Hockey Operations and General Manager of the NHL’s Edmonton Oilers.

    Is Wikipedia Speedy Turtle?

    They’re fortune tellers…

  83. Scungilli Slushy says:

    knighttown:
    If I was a Pres of Hockey Ops I’d have a quantifiable way to measure my GM besides simply wins and losses.

    Here’s what I’d measure:
    1. Amatuer draft results based on NHL averages per draft position.
    2. Professional scouting and college free agents
    3. Value based trades**
    4. Hockey trades
    5. Contracts and the salary cap

    **I’d define value based trading as being more akin to purchasing.“Buying” Al Montoya costs something.Montreal isn’t trying to make their team better today, they are hoping to gain currency for an asset.

    For the value-based trades, there have been a number.Sometimes the GM is selling an asset for some currency (Justin Schultz out) and sometimes he’s buying (Patrick Maroon in).This is the easiest part of the job in that, in most cases, there are set prices for these types of assets.I think Chiarelli has done a acceptable job.

    It’s item number 4; true hockey trades that I think Chiarelli deserves whatever he gets.There is a fundamental difference in value-based trades and true hockey trades.In value-based trades there’s pretty much a price tag on the item you’re acquiring or selling.Justin Schultz at his salary and contract status is worth a 3rd rounder….it just is based on decades of these types of transactions so he receives neither a pass or a fail and most importantly, it doesn’t matter that Schultz went on to star on 2 Stanley Cup champion teams.

    Hockey-based trading has no price tags.It’s more of a bartering system or an antique sale where the value is in the eye of the beholder.

    There’s no formula for the value of a contract controlled Taylor Hall. GM #1 would strongly value his pedigree, river pushing and 5×5 scoring.GM #2 would devalue him based on his plus/minus, team recordand penchant for bad turnovers.

    Peter Chiarelli has had 3 hockey-based trades…I even exclude Talbot and put his trade into the value based trade category and score Peter well there.

    1. Hall for Larsson- Personally I would have set his value much higher than Adam Larsson.I’d have had it somewhere around a true #1 defenseman below the age of 30…names like Hedman, Doughty, Karlsson, OEL and Petro.I would not have done Shattenkirk regardless of his signability.

    2. Eberle for Strome- I rate this poorly but not as poorly as trade #1 in part because Eberle was almost in the other category (like Schultz) of an asset that had to go.The bigger issue is WHY the Oilers keep painting themselves into corners where players have to go.But as a transaction goes, it was subpar but not dreadful.Strome was younger and cheaper and the “mirror-man” concept had some merit.And the cap space should have been spent earlier but if you assume you were going to be in the playoff picture, you can get a more pricey player for 2 months of salary (say Evander Kane) than having to pay the full season.

    3. Picks for Reinhart- of all the trades this one is the worst for me.With Sekera, Klefbom and Nurse on the roster moving massive value for a marginal LHD is simply a terrible decision.There was this instant pressure point to improve the roster but the pressure, in hindsight, was reckless.The need was never really there, the targeted player was awful and the price paid was way too high regardless. And arguing that Matt Barzal wasn’t going to the pick anyway doesn’t help Chiarelli’s argument.He had slid and was considered the clear BPA and only a stroke of incompetence by the Bruins left him on the board.

    So on this one move, the Oilers had four major mistakes.They tried to fill a hole that didn’t and doesn’t exist.They paid “Dougie Hamilton” price for someone they thought would be just below Dougie Hamilton so that was an overpay even if he had turned out.Then it turns out he’s an AHLer so a huge strike for the professional scouting aspect of his job.And finally, they missed on a superstar, a huge strike for the amateur scouting aspect of his job.A quadruple-whammy of mismanagement.

    On contracts, McDavid was a great signing.Drai was way too rich.Lucic has been OK so far but it’s not a bet I like long term.And Russell was a bit too rich and way too long.

    Nice post. I wish we knew with certainty how much of this was Chiarelli. If I knew it was all him I’d say time for a new GM.

    Terrible deals.

    I’ll never believe Eberle + wasn’t enough for Larsson at the time, if they wanted a scoring winger.

    Trading an established scorer for a less talented player is not good. I get the logic that Strome was in the NHL and the cap, but a quality prospect and vet hole plugger is far better strategic thinking.

    Reinhart is so bizarre I just can’t see that as a deal with one hand in the pot.

    Ugghhh.

  84. Pouzar says:

    bendelson: I believe it’s close… but I don’t think St.L trades that pick (they have no 1st).

    Plus the puns…man the puns (i.e. Barbashev/Side burns…….)

  85. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    OriginalPouzar: Not only was there no vote of confidence for the GM but the MSM was in full on blame mode last night.

    It was wild to read the MSM on twitter last night – they weren’t throwing Chiarelli under the bus per se but they were clearing putting the blame squarely on the GM and protecting the coach.

    – It does seem a little conspiracy, but I did think that playing Auvitu was a tell.

    – Subbing in a guy who hasn’t played in what 2 weeks, then playing him in a position I don’t think he’s played at the NHL level: thats more of a f$ck you GM, look at my options at winger, than trying to optimize the roster line-up to win a game.

    – A proper coup d’etat, you need some buy-in from the old regime. The MSM narrative fits coach’s actions: i.e.: “hey it’s not me, the GM is so sh$t , I play a bench-warmer waiver-wire D as a F”

  86. Lloyd B. says:

    Some very interesting comments in this article from the two coaches of tonights BCS game.

    Some parallels to what is lacking in the Oiler organization?

    Of course, not being in the organization, I have no idea if that is the case but it certainly seems like it looking at it from the outside.

    https://www.tsn.ca/saban-eyes-bear-bryant-s-record-of-six-national-titles-1.961709

  87. OriginalPouzar says:

    Chiarelli will be on Oilers Now at 1215.

  88. Pouzar says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    Chiarelli will be on Oilers Now at 1215.

    A re-hash of that interview on sportsnet me thinks.

  89. StixMalone says:

    Pouzar: A re-hash of that interview on sportsnet me thinks.

    I hope not…

  90. texmex says:

    Rishaug (i.e. TSN) trying to get ahead of Bob and Spector.

    Ryan Rishaug

    Verified account

    @TSNRyanRishaug
    10m10 minutes ago
    More
    Full interview with Oilers POHO Peter Chiarelli coming shortly on TSN.ca. Talked about his own job security, his coaching staff, (“I’m not firing Todd McLellan”) and Leon Draisaitl feeling the pressure of a new contract. Will post shortly.

    1 reply 2 retweets 7 likes
    Reply 1 Retweet 2 Like 7 Direct message

    Ryan Rishaug

    Verified account

    @TSNRyanRishaug
    9m9 minutes ago
    More
    Chiarelli admits he is feeling the heat himself, and rightfully so.

  91. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    I thought the Oilers 5 X 5 scoring was in the to 10 of the league until the last 4 games, no?

    EDM was 15th in 5v5 GF% on December 24

    Today they are 22nd.

    Tyler looked at goal share (for-against), not just goals for.

  92. Snowman says:

    Right on cue.

    An Oilers Org article about Keith Gretzky.

    Lowetide, the more I think about it, the more I think your Hotel California theory is actually a pretty big issue. You bring in a new voice and he only marginally changes the thinking of a top heavy group, all of whom are used to being heard.

    If a change is made it might be time remove some former Oiler greats from Hockey Ops roles of any kind.

  93. Melman says:

    Thank goodness 97 signed his extension last summer. Could you imagine trying to talk him into 8 more years this June?

  94. Thinker says:

    Snowman:
    Right on cue.

    An Oilers Org article about Keith Gretzky.

    Lowetide, the more I think about it, the more I think your Hotel California theory is actually a pretty big issue. You bring in a new voice and he only marginally changes the thinking of a top heavy group, all of whom are used to being heard.

    If a change is made it might be time remove some former Oiler greats from Hockey Ops roles of any kind.

    Was supposed to have been done. It would seem that they weaselled their way back into prominence. I hate speculating on things like this, especially when a lot of it seems to be just blaming the OBC because we are shitty again. It is hard to ignore the seemingly increasing role that Gretzky and others have had since the Audit.

  95. russ99 says:

    I just hope we don’t throw the baby away with the bath water.

    Look at every playoff team the last few years.

    They have things in common:

    Structure, forecheck, defensive systems, a rush and a cycle game.

    We toss out everything good brought in by Chiarelli and McLellan hunting for another 80s Oilers-style team with everything on the rush and the goalie can cover for all our mistakes, we’re gonna be wandering in the desert another decade.

  96. jtblack says:

    Chris:
    If we want to establish why the Oilers lack talent and aren’t performing well we can do so in three simple comparisons.

    Taylor Hall 15 goals and 42 pts this year. Adam Larson 3 goals 4 points on the season

    Jordan Eberle 14 goals 30 pts this year Ryan Strome 7 goals 17 points this year.

    Matt Barzal 13 goals 39 points this year, Griffen Reinhart 1 goal 7 points for the Chicago Wolves of the AHL

    Chiarelli has effectively traded away three top six players for “magicbeans” as the rants against Kevin Lowe used to go. I have liked some of his smaller deals but the reality is that every time Chiarellli has stepped up to the plate with a significant move he”s lost the trade substantially. His greatest successes as an Oilers GM may be reviving the fortunes of the Islanders and Devils.

    Holy crap. 111 Points out. 21 in ….

    Give Reinhart time. Bob Green still thinks he will be a Top 2 force.

  97. LMHF#1 says:

    russ99:
    I just hope we don’t throw the baby away with the bath water.

    Look at every playoff team the last few years.

    They have things in common:

    Structure, forecheck, defensive systems, a rush and a cycle game.

    The Oilers don’t have strong versions of any of these things.

    They play a fundamentally flawed defensive system, don’t maintain possession (rip around the boards), don’t carry through the D or neutral zone with speed, attack wide rather than down the middle, don’t cycle to an open shooter in the slot…I could go on.

  98. Admiral Ackbar says:

    “You can check out any time you like
    But you can never leave”

    My life as an Oilers fan. Much like heroin, it was great at first but now Oilers fandom is a dreary circling of the toilet bowl.

  99. ArmchairGM says:

    OriginalPouzar: I’d prefer a 2nd rounder in the current draft, no?

    I think so too. Barbashev strikes me as a poor-mans Ryan Strome.

  100. jtblack says:

    Scungilli Slushy,

    “and the price paid was way too high regardless. And arguing that Matt Barzal wasn’t going to the pick anyway doesn’t help Chiarelli’s argument.He had slid and was considered the clear BPA ” .

    I agree with this. Ppl say Barzal wasnt on the Oilers list; then the question is why not?

    The next yr they targeted a D man at the draft, but when JP slipped Peter almost tripped running up to grab the BPA ….

    So 2015 they were oblivious to BPA? but 2016 they happily take BPA … Too bad PC didnt run to the podium in 2015 as well .

  101. New Improved Darkness says:

    The bottom line for me is that a piece of my Oilers allegiance died inside with the seventh year of the Lucic contract.

    I try to lie to myself inside about this, but it never works.

    Year six should have been contingent on a WCF appearance. Year seven should have been contingent on a SCF appearance.

    And if the league doesn’t allow that kind of contract, the correct answer was “no thanks”.

    If a new manager takes a year to blow things up and set a new direction, he’s already got the back side of this giant contract mooning him in the face.

    Nice job security.

    We could replace Chia—after selling the farm buys the farm—but who could we get, of sound mind and moon-proof goggles?

    All we’ve got left now to bank upon for a quick ditch exit is that Drai rediscovers his inner Nietzsche (that which does not kill me, makes me worth $8.5 million × many—even while lugging around Looch × almost as many).

    I still believe that some of the other problem will sort themselves out in due course.

  102. Bag of Pucks says:

    Adam Larsson is now a magic bean. This place is going from the ridiculous to the sublime today.

  103. OriginalPouzar says:

    PC: We haven’t managed expectations well enough.

    PC: I have full confidence in our coach. He’s a forward looking professional. He’s in sync with us with respect to the overall plan going forward but there are some things we need to look closely at.

  104. OriginalPouzar says:

    PC: I know the fans are clamoring for change. We are looking at alot of things but we have an overall plan and we need to stick to it. I’m not going to do something rash but I see what everyone else does.

  105. Jaxon says:

    bendelson:
    After careful consideration, I have come to the conclusion that Maroon will be traded to St. Louis for Ivan Barbashev…I could breakdown my thought process if anyone is interested but for now I’ll just ask… What do YOU think the Oilers get for one Patty Maroon?

    Maroon (sign and trade or allow STL to negotiate before a trade?) and a 3rd to STL for Kyrou, Paajarvi, and a 5th.

  106. Jaxon says:

    Letestu and Ferlin to TBL for a 4th Round Pick (They are a contender with one of the worst faceoff % in the NHL).

  107. OriginalPouzar says:

    PC acknowledges the “game is changing”.

    PC: Smaller/fast players are going to suceeds (i.e. Yamamoto). Small d-men that can push the puck more can have succees. This doesn’t mean we are going to get smaller. There is still an element of physicality in our division.

  108. OmJo says:

    Cassandra: Chiarelli was handed a can’t miss Stanley Cup team and he ruined it.

    Could a team with McDavid and Hall pushing the top 6 overcome a lacklustre or average defence?

    If we kept Hall, we could have traded down and drafted a D instead of Puljujarvi , or keep Puljujarvi and draft a D in the 2017 draft instead of Yamamoto. Nothing against those players.

    Pouliot-McDavid-Eberle
    Hall-Nuge-Draisaitl

    That’s a very good top 6. Draisaitl likely doesn’t have a career year and get his $8.5M/year contract. Probably around $6M.

    Yes this post is a big whatif but we had the pieces due to drafting 1st overall so damn much to have the most dangerous offensive team in the NHL. Instead we have 3 regulation goals in the last 5 games.

  109. StixMalone says:

    Jaxon: Maroon (sign and trade or allow STL to negotiate before a trade?) and a 3rd to STL for Kyrou, Paajarvi, and a 5th.

    Paajarvi? I guess “once an Oiler “? No thanks…..think outside the box. No past failures….please.

  110. LMHF#1 says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    PC: I know the fans are clamoring for change.We are looking at alot of things but we have an overall plan and we need to stick to it.I’m not going to do something rash but I see what everyone else does.

    Hi Craig MacTavish! When did you start calling yourself Peter Chiarelli?

  111. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    fifthcartel:
    Cody Franson on waivers.

    Oesterle stole his lunch money. Playing and playing well on the first D pairing in Chicago. We used to have a guy in the organization with that surname didn’t we? Whatever happened to him?

  112. jtblack says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    PC: I know the fans are clamoring for change.We are looking at alot of things but we have an overall plan and we need to stick to it.I’m not going to do something rash but I see what everyone else does.

    Sadly I do agree they should not act with a panic move. BUT PC has essentailly done nothing to help his roster since last fall(2016)?? Maybe the DD trade but not sure he was much help…. So at some point he has to try and make the team better …

    UNLESS his overall plan is to wait …. and hope ……

  113. LMHF#1 says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    PC: We haven’t managed expectations well enough.

    This may seem like a throwaway line – but for me it goes back to a sad conclusion I reached at last year’s trade deadline.

    They don’t ultimately care about winning it all. They don’t want to be elite. They want to be ‘good enough’. That will make money and placate most of the seals that they need to bark.

  114. jtblack says:

    OriginalPouzar,

    thx for these updates.. I am at work

  115. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    bendelson:
    After careful consideration, I have come to the conclusion that Maroon will be traded to St. Louis for Ivan Barbashev…I could breakdown my thought process if anyone is interested but for now I’ll just ask… What do YOU think the Oilers get for one Patty Maroon?

    Barbashev would be more than fair but we already have our Russian Whipping Boy. Unless you are proposing we trade Anton. In that case we can slot Ivan right into the RWB. For Ivan’s sake I hope he stays as far away from Edmonton as possible.

  116. Jaxon says:

    StixMalone: Paajarvi? I guess “once an Oiler “? No thanks…..think outside the box. No past failures….please.

    Edmonton needs young cheap contracts, but for STL to take on Maroon’s $1.5M, I think something has to come back, probably a forward that Maroon is replacing. They won’t be sending any better roster players if the Oilers want one of their young prospects that is the real value STL is giving up. Plus, Paajarvi has some good underlying numbers (shoots a lot) and his speed and PK ability are valuable. Also, having another Finn around for Puljujarvi wouldn’t hurt either.

  117. frjohnk says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan: Oesterle stole his lunch money.Playing and playing well on the first D pairing in Chicago.We used to have a guy in the organization with that surname didn’t we?Whatever happened to him?

    No Jordans allowed.

  118. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Scungilli Slushy: I hope they pass, that ship has sailed. Bad sign if Quenneville can’t use him. He can use nearly anybody.

    Wouldn’t it be nice to have a coach like that. Probably makes a GM’s job pretty easy too.

  119. Bag of Pucks says:

    Oddly enough, lost amidst all the calls for Chiarelli’s head is the fact that arguably his most celebrated acquisition has been one of the key, if not ‘the key’, contributor to this year’s downturn. Cam Talbot sitting at .901 sv pct.

  120. Jethro Tull says:

    OriginalPouzar: I’m not going to do something rash

    like trading one of the best LW in the game. Or use two 1st rounders on any Reinhardt. Or trade our only scoring skill winger for any Strome. Or get McDavid a sniper as our lot couldn’t hit a cow’s ass with a banjo.

  121. Crazy Pedestrian says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan: Oesterle stole his lunch money.Playing and playing well on the first D pairing in Chicago.We used to have a guy in the organization with that surname didn’t we?Whatever happened to him?

    😢

  122. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    jtblack:

    UNLESS his overall plan is to wait …. and hope ……

    – See I think this was his plan, and concurred (except for the be terrible part)

    – He’s likely going to pay the price for this: but between signing Jagr and Franson, or having a growth year, he “hoped” that some of Sleppy/Caggs/Strome/Jar/Kailer/Pool emerge

    – A few did (pool + Jar), but not enough

    – There is a line from Brian Burke: “they shouldn’t call it Hockey, they should call it Goalie

    – Now how much of the state is Talbot and LB blowing, vs. how bad our players and systems are making them bad: your mileage may vary.

    – This year there are 8 teams that are in playoff position that didn’t make the playoffs last year

    – The difference between winning and losing is very small in the NHL

    – Last year the Peg sucked: they kept it intact and now they are great

    – Joe Sakic went from brutal GM to smart GM, and they traded away their best player

    – 2x Cup winner Pitts looks tired and done

    – I think Chia’s “mistakes” aren’t the reason for where this team is now. It’s fine to argue all the value he pissed away. If he does get fired, it’s pretty hard to argue against it based on this year

    – The club needs to get out of the funk/bad luck/trying to hard/bad systems/bad special teams/bad goalering without another gong show regime change IMO

    – Be like Tampa, Winnipeg, NJ, Dallas, even NYI .: Retool, learn from mistakes, and carry on next year. Try to make some hockey trades, grow. Don’t punt everyone

    – That said, it will be hard to do this, and too many competing factions within the org IMO

  123. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Crazy Pedestrian:

    That’s kind of how I feel right now too.

  124. Cassandra says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux,

    I actually agree with much of what you say concerning goaltending, luck, the difference between winning and losing, and the virtue of standing pat. The difference is that if he hadn’t bled so much talent then they would have been able to withstand that kind of downturn.

    This team has Connor McDavid. They should be leading the league in goals or close to it, and they would be leading the league in goals if they didn’t trade away all their good players for next to nothing.

    If they had built an elite team, they could have withstood the downturn of the goaltending and penalty kill and be in the fight. Instead they opted to build the Minnesota Wild under Lemaire except with Connor McDavid (to borrow Willis’ comparison) and this is what you get when things don’t go right.

    I’ll also add that Sakic didn’t trade away his best player. He traded away Matt Duchene, coming off a year worse than Eberle’s, for a monster haul of prospects. That is the opposite of what Chiarelli did.

    It is hard to take people seriously when they deny that trading a superstar for a second pair defenseman is part of the reason the team is struggling.

  125. Crazy Pedestrian says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux: – See I think this was his plan, and concurred (except for the be terrible part)

    – He’s likely going to pay the price for this: but between signing Jagr and Franson, or having a growth year, he “hoped” that some of Sleppy/Caggs/Strome/Jar/Kailer/Pool/Strome emerge

    – There is a line from Brian Burke: “they shouldn’t call it Hockey, they should call it Goalie

    – Now how much of the state is Talbot and LB blowing, vs. how bad our players and systems are making them bad: your mileage may vary.

    – This year there are 8 teams that are in playoff position that didn’t make the playoffs last year

    – The difference between winning and losing is very small in the NHL

    – Last year the Peg sucked: they kept it intact and now they are great

    – Joe Sakic went from brutal GM to smart GM, and they traded away their best player

    – 2x Cup winner Pitts looks tired and done

    – I think Chia’s “mistakes” aren’t the reason for where this team is now.It’s fine to argue all the value he pissed away.If he does get fired, it’s pretty hard to argue against it based on this year

    – The club needs to get out of the funk/bad luck/trying to hard/bad systems/bad special teams/bad goalering without another gong show regime change IMO

    – Be like Tampa, Winnipeg, NJ, Dallas, even NYI .: Retool, learn from mistakes, and carry on next year. Try to make some hockey trades, grow. Don’t punt everyone

    – That said, it will be hard to do this, and too many competing factions within the org IMO

    I agree with all this, but one problem separates the oilers from those teams…
    Edmonton’s “Fish bowl” that is a Canadian market that demands change when too much suck happens… even during the DOD, we knew the oilers were going to suck, but could only stand for it so long before a major change/firing of a coach or GM is required to reset the clock of suck..

    After a winning season, the clock of suck expires three times faster…

    Which should be right about…

  126. StixMalone says:

    Jaxon,

    I get that but Chia has to aim higher and if that includes a package deal that would help our deficiencies right away you go for it. We have enough meh players already. Paajarvi is meh. We gotta get better. Maroon makes St Lou better now. We need same back + prospects. I agree on a budget player but there has to be better is all I’m saying….

  127. frjohnk says:

    I posted this on twitter

    Best center depth in the league works with
    Lucic- pace for less than 20 G
    Maroon- pace for less than 20 G
    Kassian- 4th liner
    Cags- 4th liner
    Sleppy- inj, 4th liner
    Khaira- bottom 6 player
    JP- rookie, is good
    Cammy- wheels have fallen off, bot 6
    Strome – bottom 6
    OV2- Dman

    Woof

    Worst winger depth in the league

  128. frjohnk says:

    Bag of Pucks: Oddly enough, lost amidst all the calls for Chiarelli’s head is the fact that arguably his most celebrated acquisition has been one of the key, if not ‘the key’, contributor to this year’s downturn. Cam Talbot sitting at .901 sv pct.

    This year, he has few acquisitions since he came here that favor him.

    Maroon, Kassian. Davidson on waivers. Thats about it.

  129. Admiral Ackbar says:

    Lowetide: https://theathletic.com/204411/2018/01/08/dellow-after-41-games-edmonton-oilers/

    Certainly a great look at the analytics of ‘the problem’. I’d suggest that the largest drop off this year is the overall speed of the Oilers’ game has dropped. Whether it be due to defensive injuries and inadequate replacements or inadequate replacements brought in, it’s quite clear that the quality of the shots taken has significantly decreased this year. Shot selection, in my opinion, is a serious issue with this team as is penetration to difficult areas of the ice. As a result, it shouldn’t be a surprise that SH% has fallen off a cliff in some areas.

  130. Snowman says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux,

    I have to chuckle a bit. NJ and NYI bounced back at least partly because they got better players…from Peter Chiarelli.

    I like continuity of coaches. I cannot abide continuity of GM. He cannot evaluate talent. He was wrong last year about how good the team was. He was wrong about Reinhart, wrong about Stromes production, wrong about Cagguilas production, wrong about Slepyshevs production, wrong about not wanting Barzal, wrong about how good they were this year, wrong about Jokkinen, wrong about the defense being good enough, wrong about keeping cap space to load up later, wrong about Broissoit being an adequate backup, iffy at best on Drai’s contract, iffy at best on Lucic’s contract, iffy at best on Russells contract, he would have been insanely wrong about Hall for Ceci (if that is an accurate report).

    I like some of his deals. Maroon, Kassian, Talbot, Cammalari has been fine. That’s just too iffy a record. And I really like Larsson but even this year that’s looking worse. Hall is a beast again and Larsson is a shadow of himself.

    He just doesn’t know what he has enough of the time. Its really concerning. A lot of these things he’s admitted being off on his estimates publicly. Its painful. I don’t trust him to make a trade because he has zero track record in Edmonton of proven reliable assessment of talent here.

    If you don’t know what you’ve got how can you know what you need.

  131. frjohnk says:

    Cassandra,

    Chia built a team and lost value in his big trades that lowered the ceiling on how good they could be.

    There is no calvery coming. The team we see today, is pretty much the foundation moving forward. No prospect will really move the dial. JP is the only young player in which we could see a significant jump in impact.

    McDavid might be entering Lindros territory.

    Generational player who does not win a Cup.

  132. ArmchairGM says:

    Regarding the PK (and using our cap space to improve the team), what does everyone here think of acquiring Eric Fehr from Toronto? I’m thinking that the Leafs will want to add at the deadline for a playoff run and would be happy to get rid of Fehr’s cap burden. If they threw a mid-round pick or way should we take him off their hands? Is that even realistic?

  133. frjohnk says:

    Snowman: I have to chuckle a bit. NJ and NYI bounced back at least partly because they got better players…from Peter Chiarelli.

    Ha ha.

    I saw a tweet or a comment a couple of weeks ago.

    Who is the better GM of the Islanders?

    Garth Snow
    or
    Peter Chiarelli

  134. OriginalPouzar says:

    StixMalone: Paajarvi? I guess “once an Oiler “? No thanks…..think outside the box. No past failures….please.

    Magnus’ game would be very helpful in our lineup.

    Magnus has developed and is NOT the same player we traded away.

    He’s not going to light up the scoresheet but he does alot of things right on the ice and would be an asset to our bottom 6.

  135. Crazy Pedestrian says:

    StixMalone:
    Jaxon,

    I get that but Chia has to aim higher and if that includes a package deal that would help our deficiencies right away you go for it. We have enough meh players already. Paajarvi is meh. We gotta get better. Maroon makes St Lou better now. We need same back + prospects. I agree on a budget player but there has to be better is all I’m saying….

    I honestly don’t think the oilers will win ANY meaningful trades as long as Chia is at the helm. All the other GMs know now that he will fold like a paper bag in any negotiations. He got taken to the wood shed by Snow twice, and gift bagged NJ an elite game changer in Hall for a shutdown dman widely considered a #3D or #2D TOPS with average-at-best puck moving skills. No GM will take him seriously anymore.
    It’s unfortunate, but he has to go. I’d give tmac another chance to redeem himself, seeing as he didnt have enough skilled wingers to play with his centres three (seems he knew this when everyone was clammering for drai and McDavid to get split up), and you can’t really control crappy goaltending.

    EDIT: + what Snowman said.

  136. OriginalPouzar says:

    jtblack:
    OriginalPouzar,

    thx for these updates.. I am at work

    Hey – so am I, ha!

  137. StixMalone says:

    Chia has to make up for past sins. Time for us to rip off a team for a change. One more bad trade and Katz will be paying for unemployed staff. Not good for his real estate ventures…..

  138. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    Crazy Pedestrian,

    – I’d give the GM and coach another year. Make some changes to the coaching staff, bring in some younger bucks with a different perspective in management. Continue to draft well

    – The problem though is you have the loser regime that doesn’t have the interest of the Oil at heart, only insofar as they they hope to get their jobs back.

    – In a really good company, in any sector, you would have management that was aligned. Chia and the organization learns from what was right and what they have, adjust, improve

    – Given the parity in the league, the turn-over year to year, I just think that Chia and coach, with a management system in place, is best served working it out together

    – The Raptors are a good example: GM tells coach in the off-season: “the league has changed, you can’t play 1-1 iso, need more passing, distribution, shoot more threes”

    – GM then goes out and tweaks the roster to reflect this information, coach tweaks his systems, and the team is looking a lot better

    – Will be interesting to see what happens: I don’t think Chia is a moron, I don’t think he has free reign, and I think the coup d’etat is a real thing.

    – I mean if you go out and get a Darryl Sutter: is that really going to change things? And they aren’t going to get him, because he would fire all the jokers, and the Oil wouldn’t let him

    – They aren’t trading McD, Drai, Lucic, Nurse, Klek, Larsson, Sek, Pool, JJ, RNH, at least not trading them out of “necessity”

    – Make some moves to change a bit: using: Maroon, Strome, Letetsu, Cami, goaler better, stock the farm, and Bob’s your uncle:

    – Chia isn’t Scotty Bowman, but they aren’t this bad because of he’s a MacT2.0

  139. Thinker says:

    Well we can hope the next provincial and federal governments cut taxes, resulting in more buying power for our cap space. We can also pray for a resurgence in Alberta restoring the canadian dollar to par thus substantially boosting HRR and thus the cap. Then we can maybe hope to spend our way out of the debacle we are in.

  140. Scungilli Slushy says:

    jtblack:
    Scungilli Slushy,

    “and the price paid was way too high regardless. And arguing that Matt Barzal wasn’t going to the pick anyway doesn’t help Chiarelli’s argument.He had slid and was considered the clear BPA ” .

    I agree with this. Ppl say Barzal wasnt on the Oilers list; then the question is why not?

    The next yr they targeted a D man at the draft, but when JP slipped Peter almost tripped running up to grab the BPA ….

    So 2015 they were oblivious to BPA? but 2016 they happily take BPA … Too bad PC didnt run to the podium in 2015 as well .

    That wasn’t me

  141. flea says:

    frjohnk,

    Save the dramatics. It’s a little early to make Lindros comparison, isn’t it?

    The McDavid brand is bigger than the team. If the Oilers miss this year, that’s prob ok, they’ll “bounce back” next year. But if they don’t, I wouldn’t be surprised to see McDavid ask to get out. His agent and the league won’t let him rot here.

    All the more important to get this team fixed ASAP.

  142. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan: Oesterle stole his lunch money.Playing and playing well on the first D pairing in Chicago.We used to have a guy in the organization with that surname didn’t we?Whatever happened to him?

    If we had Keith we’d have a lot of young D looking pretty good as well.

  143. BONE207 says:

    Admiral Ackbar:
    HiddenDarts,

    You’re spot on. Self-Esteem by The Offspring comes to mind.

    I also find that avoiding this tire fire improves my enjoyment of life. Sadly, I can’t not go on this weeks-end trip to Phx & LV. Need to put together a coping strategy.

    That’s what alcohol & sex is for. You are just a bagful of $$$ away from a threesome.

  144. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    – Last thought on the current state: If you fire Chia and/or coach: your not addressing the problem

    – All evidence points to a GM that does not have full-reign

    – All evidence points to an OBC that is not happy with picking up checks: and they are meddling and have agendas, and with this terrible string of circumstances, and losing, it all comes out

    – Good organizations have management, that provide different perspectives (the Leafs are a good example IMO: good guys, none with Leaf ties, just good hockey people, different generations and perspectives). You know that Lou isn’t clamouring to punt Shanny to take his job, for example

    – Firing Chia and/or coach: your just shuffling stuff: and blaming them for the dysfunction within the organization. And no good or better coach or GM is going to accept to take over.

    – Keep and support Chia and Coach, make meaningful changes to the whole management system: that’s the opportunity this organization has for continuity and greatness for a generation

    – Maybe that’s defending Chia too much, and maybe he really is a sh$t GM, but I bet a lot he doesn’t have unfettered reigns, and that hampers the organization. Replacing Chia doesn’t change this

    – Right now the Oil are coming across as Bush: having the OBC pile on Chia is Bush

  145. BONE207 says:

    Auvitu adds a “suicide bomber” element

    LT…you kill me. Did you really move in with Willis up north?

  146. Thinker says:

    flea:
    frjohnk,

    Save the dramatics. It’s a little early to make Lindros comparison, isn’t it?

    The McDavid brand is bigger than the team. If the Oilers miss this year, that’s prob ok, they’ll “bounce back” next year. But if they don’t, I wouldn’t be surprised to see McDavid ask to get out. His agent and the league won’t let him rot here.

    All the more important to get this team fixed ASAP.

    Oilers hold the hammer. I imagine they would rather get paid full value and then some for Connor, and would be willing to sit him for forever to do it.

  147. Scungilli Slushy says:

    OriginalPouzar: Magnus’ game would be very helpful in our lineup.

    Magnus has developed and is NOT the same player we traded away.

    He’s not going to light up the scoresheet but he does alot of things right on the ice and would be an asset to our bottom 6.

    I’d rather get Barbashev, more skill, good wheels, 2 way game. I think he has more upside.

  148. StixMalone says:

    Man oh man would I love to sit in on these upcoming meetings Chia was talking about. Just to hear the ramblings and opinions of this top heavy mgmt group I’ll tag Rexall 2.0. Corporate structuring ,made up titles of position, HR and the likes.
    I would venture you would find out who’s really in charge at this meeting…..

  149. JD_Wry says:

    If I was a local media type, I’d try and get a quote or three out of the senior vice PoHO.

  150. StixMalone says:

    Scungilli Slushy: I’d rather get Barbashev, more skill, good wheels, 2 way game. I think he has more upside.

    Yes

  151. StixMalone says:

    JD_Wry:
    If I was a local media type, I’d try and get a quote or three out of the senior vice PoHO.

    If you could find him….

  152. Scungilli Slushy says:

    “PC: We haven’t managed expectations well enough.”

    Meaning downplaying Cup chatter this summer. Even with some tweaks it was a longshot at best because of youth in key positions.

    The Ducks have the Dirty Ryans, a lot of filthy experience, so they get away with the young D corp, at least until they meet deeper teams.

  153. JD_Wry says:

    StixMalone: If you could find him….

    This coming weekend in Vegas.

  154. frjohnk says:

    flea:
    frjohnk,

    Save the dramatics. It’s a little early to make Lindros comparison, isn’t it?

    The McDavid brand is bigger than the team. If the Oilers miss this year, that’s prob ok, they’ll “bounce back” next year. But if they don’t, I wouldn’t be surprised to see McDavid ask to get out. His agent and the league won’t let him rot here.

    All the more important to get this team fixed ASAP.

    Going back to Orr, each generational player at the 3 year mark were playing for a contending or at least promising team except Lindros and Lemiuex

    Orr ( team was 42-18-16 in 3rd year) won Cup in 4th year
    Lafleur (team was 45-24-9 in 3rd year)won Cup in 4th year
    Gretzky ( team was 48-17-15 in 3rd year) won Cup in 5th year
    Lemieux (team was 30-38-12 in 3rd year) won Cup in 7th year
    Lindros ( team was 28-16-4-0 in abbrev season in 3rd year) Never won a Cup
    Crosby (47-27-0-8 in 3rd year) make the Final in 4th year, won Cup in 5th year.
    McDavid ( on pace for to miss playoffs in 3rd year) Cup win? TBD

    Maybe McDavids path to Stanley takes 7 years like Mario, or does not happen like Lindros.

    So yeah, maybe a bit early to say that comment from earlier, but early results are not good. Team around Connor is just not good enough

  155. frjohnk says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux: All evidence points to a GM that does not have full-reign

    of knowledge on how to build a team around a generational player.

  156. StixMalone says:

    JD_Wry,

    Oh yeah at the birthday party!

  157. littleenglish says:

    Scungilli Slushy: dramati

    Funny thing is that he thought they were cup contenders himself

  158. vinotintazo says:

    can Hornqvist skate? I’m looking at the 2018 RW UFAs… its pretty thing haha.

  159. StixMalone says:

    I still want to know how Ian Herbers fits in the big picture. He’s a good coach with a phenomenal track record albeit University level. Surely he must weigh in to the other coaches. Obviously he’s upstairs watching this.
    I guess I’m saying are all the coaches on the same page?
    Maybe use the “keep it simple stupid” approach with the players and tweak it from there?

  160. Bag of Pucks says:

    Cassandra:
    Kinger_Oil.redux,

    It is hard to take people seriously when they deny that trading a superstar for a second pair defenseman is part of the reason the team is struggling.

    It is hard to take people seriously when they conveniently ignore that the team made the playoffs in the season immediately following that trade AND they further suggest that Chiarelli inherited a guaranteed Stanley Cup contender when what he actually inherited was one of the worst teams in NHL history.

  161. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Scungilli Slushy: If we had Keith we’d have a lot of young D lookingpretty good as well.

    So tired of if we and excuses. If we had Keith we’d find a way to F@#k him up too and then run him out of town for $0.50 on the dollar. Kind of like Larson right now. Quite a few players leaving here do much better with their new teams. Not many players coming here do better. Why is that?

  162. Bag of Pucks says:

    Why do we immediately jump to the conclusion that it’s Chiarelli’s fault for getting rid of Eberle, Hendricks, and Pouliot and not MacLellan’s fault for not getting more out of those players which would likely have reduced the wont to trade them as non-performers in the first place?

    It seems conceivable that if MacLellan were getting more out of those players, there’d be less desire to trade them, no?

    It’s interesting to note that Rutherford wasn’t looking like a particularly capable GM in Pittsburgh either until he replaced his HC.

  163. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    StixMalone: Yes

    Yes too.

  164. frjohnk says:

    Bag of Pucks: It is hard to take people seriously when they conveniently ignore that the team made the playoffs in the season immediately following that trade AND they further suggest that Chiarelli inherited a guaranteed Stanley Cup contender when what he actually inherited was one of the worst teams in NHL history.

    Team was not good, but the assets when he inherited the team were.

  165. 106 and 106 says:

    Chiarelli out again to speak out, as mentioned.

    Don’t think he’s going out the door if they are parading him around.

    Though the Oilers Keith Gretzky article on oilers is interesting….

  166. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Bag of Pucks:
    Why do we immediatelyjump to the conclusion that it’s Chiarelli’s fault for getting rid of Eberle, Hendricks, and Pouliot and not MacLellan’s fault for not getting more out of those players which would likely have reduced the wont to trade them as non-performers in the first place?

    It seems conceivable that if MacLellan were getting more out of those players, there’d be less desire to trade them, no?

    It’s interesting to note that Rutherford wasn’t looking like a particularly capable GM in Pittsburgh either until he replaced his HC.

    That’s one hell of a good question … and two absolutely outstanding observations.

  167. LMHF#1 says:

    Did Chiarelli refer to a “period of evaluation” as CHED suggests?

    We really are back right into the Tambellini/MacTavish BS.

    These guys can’t act and evaluate at the same time? Just like Lowe who couldn’t have more than one telephone conversation on a given day?

  168. frjohnk says:

    Bag of Pucks:
    Why do we immediatelyjump to the conclusion that it’s Chiarelli’s fault for getting rid of Eberle, Hendricks, and Pouliot and not MacLellan’s fault for not getting more out of those players which would likely have reduced the wont to trade them as non-performers in the first place?

    It seems conceivable that if MacLellan were getting more out of those players, there’d be less desire to trade them, no?

    It’s interesting to note that Rutherford wasn’t looking like a particularly capable GM in Pittsburgh either until he replaced his HC.

    Good points.

    Under McClellan, Oilers got rid of Yak, Schultz, Eberle, Hendricks, Pouliot at their lowest value. All have bounced back to varying degrees of success with other teams.

    On the other side of the coin is Maroon and Kassian.

    Hopefully the lesson learned will be that instead of selling for cents on the dollar, the team can fix what ails the player.

    Another audit is probably underway, or at least should be. McClellans role should be under the microscope.

  169. exoilinxs says:

    OilClog,

    At this point I would settle for a Tortorella. At least the post game interview would offer some entertainment.

  170. McSorley33 says:

    The problem with Talbot is he doesn’t F&%&kn score goals!

    The team, as reported numerous times, is too slow.

    If you watch Mark Letestu, Cammy, Maroon and Looch.

    Each line last game had a boat anchor.

  171. frjohnk says:

    LMHF#1: Did Chiarelli refer to a “period of evaluation” as CHED suggests?

    Yup.

  172. McSorley33 says:

    Bag of Pucks,

    It’s interesting to note that Rutherford wasn’t looking like a particularly capable GM in Pittsburgh either until he replaced his HC.
    ********************************************************************************
    Good point….

  173. LMHF#1 says:

    frjohnk: Yup.

    If you’ll excuse me, I’m going to go bash my head into a wall until this doesn’t enrage me any longer.

  174. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    frjohnk: Good points.

    Under McClellan, Oilers got rid of Yak, Schultz, Eberle, Hendricks, Pouliot at their lowest value.All have bounced back to varying degrees of success with other teams.

    On the other side of the coin is Maroon and Kassian.

    Hopefully the lesson learned will be that instead of selling for cents on the dollar, the team can fix what ails the player.

    Another audit is probably underway, or at least should be.McClellans role should be under the microscope.

    Hopefully the lesson learned will be that instead of materially damaging assets and selling for cents on the dollar, the team can find a way to properly develop and deploy players.

    And yes, TMacs role should be under the microscope.

  175. StixMalone says:

    Why not put Woodcroft or Johnson upstairs for a game or two. Maybe a few games from a different perspective will come up with a revelation?

  176. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    StixMalone:
    Why not put Woodcroft or Johnson upstairs for a game or two. Maybe a few games from a different perspective will come up with a revelation?

    And if that doesn’t work… I was thinking something along the lines of the Penalty Box for a game or two.

  177. Jaxon says:

    frjohnk: Going back to Orr, each generational player at the 3 year mark were playing for a contending or at least promising team except Lindros and Lemiuex

    Orr ( team was 42-18-16 in 3rd year) won Cup in 4th year
    Lafleur (team was 45-24-9in 3rd year)won Cup in 4th year
    Gretzky ( team was 48-17-15 in 3rd year) won Cup in 5th year
    Lemieux (team was 30-38-12 in 3rd year) won Cup in 7th year
    Lindros ( team was 28-16-4-0 in abbrev seasonin 3rd year) Never won a Cup
    Crosby (47-27-0-8 in 3rd year) make the Final in 4th year, won Cup in 5th year.
    McDavid ( on pace for to miss playoffs in 3rd year) Cup win? TBD

    Maybe McDavids path to Stanley takes 7 years like Mario, or does not happen like Lindros.

    So yeah, maybe a bit early to say that comment from earlier, but early results are not good.Team around Connor is just not good enough

    I agree with some of what you’re saying. Not really fair to compare them to pre-cap teams. Crosby, sure. But the rest were able to trade and buy any player their owner would allow them to. I think it’s a bit early to panic on what McDavid might do if the Oilers are not a contender this season. If he gets to 24 without an appearance in the Cup final, then I’d be concerned.

    Not saying this supports or hinders your argument, but here is some info to ponder (top fwds and D by TOI):
    2008-09 PIT Crosby(21)/Malkin(22)/Staal(20)/Gonchar(34)/Scuderi(30)/Fleury(24)
    2009-10 CHI Toews(21)/Kane(21)/Bolland(23)/Keith(26)/Seabrook(24)/Niemi(26)
    2010-11 BOS Krejci(24)/Bergeron(25)/Lucic(22)/Chara(33)/Seidenberg(29)/Thomas(36)
    2011-12 LAK Kopitar(24)/Brown(27)/Richards(26)/Doughty(22)/Mitchell(34)/Quick(26)

    2017-18 EDM McDavid(21)/Draisaitl(22)/Nugent-Hopkins(24)/Klefbom(24)/Larsson(25)/Talbot(30)

    2019-20 EDM McDavid(23)/Draisaitl(24)/Nugent-Hopkins(26)/Klefbom(26)/Larsson(27)/Talbot(32)

    Or the way things are going:
    2019-20 EDM McDavid(23)/Draisaitl(24)/Nugent-Hopkins(26)/Nurse(24)/Dahlin(19)/Ellis??(25)

    2021-22 EDM McDavid(25)/Draisaitl(26)/Nugent-Hopkins(28)/Nurse(26)/Dahlin(21)/Ellis??(27)

    Add to that 21-22 core: Puljujarvi(23), Benson(23), Samorukov (22), Klefbom(28), Larsson(29), Yamamoto(23), Bear (24), Berglund (24), Safin (22), Maximov (22), Slepyshev (27), Caggiula (27), Khaira (27), Rasanen (23), Strome (28), Benning (27), Mantha (25).

    Okay, this comment has now gone a bit off the rails, but I’m just trying to show that the future doesn’t look so bad if they don’t panic. They have McDavid tied up until 2025-26.

    It will be impossible to improve this season without bleeding future talent, and it will be tough to improve next season with the upcoming cap squeeze, but if they hold on, they will be a contender in 2019-20 and beyond. Which I know that nobody wants to hear, but I think it will prove to be true unless Chiarelli starts to blow things up. Chiarelli scares me that way.

  178. frjohnk says:

    Jaxon: /Dahlin

    Well, he would definitely push the dial.

    On the ice for the Oilers.

    And in the Toronto media as well.

  179. OmJo says:

    Bag of Pucks: It is hard to take people seriously when they conveniently ignore that the team made the playoffs in the season immediately following that trade AND they further suggest that Chiarelli inherited a guaranteed Stanley Cup contender when what he actually inherited was one of the worst teams in NHL history.

    Whoopdee doo.

    We made the playoffs in what amounted to a nearly perfect season, and are back down to reality.

    I genuinely believe the team Chiarelli inherited – if healthy – would be having more success than the team he built, the one we see today. Adam Larsson and Milan Lucic aren’t the difference between playoffs and lottery picks, apparently.

  180. Side says:

    OmJo: Whoopdee doo.

    We made the playoffs in what amounted to a nearly perfect season, and are back down to reality.

    I genuinely believe the team Chiarelli inherited – if healthy – would be having more success than the team he built, the one we see today. Adam Larsson and Milan Lucic aren’t the difference between playoffs and lottery picks, apparently.

    How can people say this, when Chiarelli inherited a team that didn’t come close to making the playoffs in 10 years? It makes no sense. The DoD teams wouldn’t have been a Stanley Cup team just because McDavid would have been added.

    The hatred for Chiarelli is reaching track suit proportions.

  181. OmJo says:

    Bag of Pucks:
    Why do we immediatelyjump to the conclusion that it’s Chiarelli’s fault for getting rid of Eberle, Hendricks, and Pouliot and not MacLellan’s fault for not getting more out of those players which would likely have reduced the wont to trade them as non-performers in the first place?

    It seems conceivable that if MacLellan were getting more out of those players, there’d be less desire to trade them, no?

    It’s interesting to note that Rutherford wasn’t looking like a particularly capable GM in Pittsburgh either until he replaced his HC.

    Could definitely see TMac behind some of those moves. Pouliot and Eberle were definitely in doghouses last season.

    But TMac didn’t sign off on Eberle for Strome trade. Trading Eberle isn’t the worst thing in the world – hell even trading Hall could have been palpable if the return was better.

    If TMac told him to trade Eberle for magic beans and give him a bunch of rookies for the wing positions then I don’t even know what to think anymore man…

  182. OmJo says:

    Side: How can people say this, when Chiarelli inherited a team that didn’t come close to making the playoffs in 10 years? It makes no sense. The DoD teams wouldn’t have been a Stanley Cup team just because McDavid would have been added.

    The hatred for Chiarelli is reaching track suit proportions.

    I think if the 15-16 roster – not the 14-15 roster, to clarify – was as healthy as the 16-17 roster they wouldn’t have been drafting Puljujarvi and been in the playoff picture.

    It has nothing to do with my feelings for Chiarelli. Hall and McDavid are substantial elite forwards in this league, the kind of players you build a team around. The kind of players who can outscore average defense.

    It’s a damn shame we only got half a season out of McDavid back then. Fuck the Flyers forever.

  183. littleenglish says:

    Side: How can people say this, when Chiarelli inherited a team that didn’t come close to making the playoffs in 10 years? It makes no sense. The DoD teams wouldn’t have been a Stanley Cup team just because McDavid would have been added.

    The hatred for Chiarelli is reaching track suit proportions.

    I think some people violently spill their coffee in the morning. Then they come here to vent.

  184. Side says:

    OmJo: I think if the 15-16 roster – not the 14-15 roster, to clarify –was as healthy as the 16-17 roster they wouldn’t have been drafting Puljujarvi and been in the playoff picture.

    It has nothing to do with my feelings for Chiarelli. Hall and McDavid are substantial elite forwards in this league, the kind of players you build a team around. The kind of players who can outscore average defense.

    It’s a damn shame we only got half a season out of McDavid back then. Fuck the Flyers forever.

    Yeah but, people are falling for Cassandra’s trolling bait. Cassandra makes a ridiculous statement like “Chiarelli inherited a can’t miss Stanley Cup team” and people seem to agree with this ridiculous statement, but they agree based on some other interpretation they had of his comment.

    Inheriting a “can’t miss Stanley Cup team” = inheriting a team that won a Stanley Cup (i.e., Chiarelli inheriting the 2016-2017 Pittsburgh Penguins)

    Inheriting a “can’t miss Stanley Cup team” =/= inheriting a team that has assets which can be traded to build a team that could win a Stanley Cup. Even the 2015-2016 Edmonton Oilers team does not count. A “can’t miss Stanley Cup team” should be able to make it to the playoffs, even if 1 or 2 of their star players are down (like the Pittsburgh Penguins).

    I do vehemently agree with your Flyers comment, though.

  185. Ryan says:

    OmJo,

    Well, you could have had:

    Nuge-McDavid-Draisaitl
    Hall-Barzal-Eberle

    As your top two lines.

  186. knighttown says:

    We all have our transactions that bug us more than they should. For years it was Petry going for SFA on a team that desperately needed a 1st pairing RHD.

    My more recent pet peeve transaction was letting Tyler Pitlick walk. I never understood why that didn’t get more play. I understand his development was painful to watch and the injury history was real and it was spectacular. I also know about the shooting percentages but he looked DAMN good last year. Big, strong player that skates really well and hits hard and seems to have an excellent shot.

    I’d put him in our top 4 wings (Pul, Lucic, Maroon) on this team and I would have said the same last year. He could slide up and down the roster and would have been pretty damned cheap.

  187. OmJo says:

    littleenglish: I think some people violently spill their coffee in the morning. Then they come here to vent.

    Good thing I don’t drink coffee lol

    Side,

    I didn’t exactly agree to the comment.

    To clarify, I don’t think the 15-16 roster would’ve been a SC contender if healthy. All I’m saying is they wouldn’t be a lottery contender either. The duo of Hall and McDavid could carry a roster to the playoffs.

    I addressed his post here. Didn’t necessarily agree to the SC part.

    https://lowetide.ca/2018/01/08/hotel-california/comment-page-1/#comment-705629

    But it shouldn’t have been very difficult to turn the 15-16 team into a contender. Shoulda, coulda, woulda…

  188. AsiaOil says:

    The “GM is an idiot” crowd don’t seem to consider the actual value of players traded.

    Eberle has 2 goal in his last 15 games and is -12 over that period
    Yakopov has 1 goal in his last 15 games and is even
    Hendricks has 1 goal in his last 15 games and is -3
    Shultz has 0 goal in his last 15 games and is +3
    Pouliot has 2 goal in his last 15 games and is -3 over that period

    That is a combined 6 goals from these 4 players over a combined 75 games (basically a season) along with a collective -15 (mostly due to Ebs). How exactly would this level of performance help the Oilers this season? Any argument that we somehow lost massive value trading these players goes against evidence. Perhaps they were simply not that good. Maybe? Possibly?

  189. Mike Wazowski says:

    dustrock,

    Depending on your definition of “dinged up” you’d be missing 1/3 of your team most of the season.

  190. Frank the dog says:

    OmJo: I think if the 15-16 roster – not the 14-15 roster, to clarify –was as healthy as the 16-17 roster they wouldn’t have been drafting Puljujarvi and been in the playoff picture.

    It has nothing to do with my feelings for Chiarelli. Hall and McDavid are substantial elite forwards in this league, the kind of players you build a team around. The kind of players who can outscore average defense.

    It’s a damn shame we only got half a season out of McDavid back then. Fuck the Flyers forever.

    This is plausible, if the 15/16 team got the same even handed refereeing as the 16/17 team, however I think the team needed Larsson’s skill set more than they needed Hall’s. Hard to say the team was less motivated than Hall given their present level of motivation. Hall certainly had the necessary “gritensity” though.
    On the other hand if Hall was still here you can be sure he’d be accused of coach killing. So there’s that.

  191. OriginalPouzar says:

    frjohnk: Good points.

    Under McClellan, Oilers got rid of Yak, Schultz, Eberle, Hendricks, Pouliot at their lowest value.All have bounced back to varying degrees of success with other teams.

    On the other side of the coin is Maroon and Kassian.

    Hopefully the lesson learned will be that instead of selling for cents on the dollar, the team can fix what ails the player.

    Another audit is probably underway, or at least should be.McClellans role should be under the microscope.

    Yes, varying degrees – both Pouliot and Yak have been healthy scratches for their team recently.

  192. frjohnk says:

    AsiaOil:
    The “GM is an idiot” crowd don’t seem to consider the actual value of players traded.

    Eberle has 2 goal in his last 15 games and is -12 over that period
    Yakopov has 1 goal in his last 15 games and is even
    Hendricks has 1 goal in his last 15 games and is -3
    Shultz has 0 goal in his last 15 games and is +3
    Pouliot has 2 goal in his last 15 games and is -3 over that period

    That is a combined 6 goals from these 4 players over the past 15 games along with a collective -15 (mostly due to Ebs). How exactly would this level of performance help the Oilers this season? Any argument that we somehow lost massive value trading these players goes against evidence. Perhaps they were simply not that good. Maybe? Possibly?

    why not use 17 games?
    how about 22 games?
    because Eberle looks better when those games are factored

    thats why cherry picking stats doesnt work

    As for “GM is an idiot crowd”

    Gregor and Struds skewered Chia and his moves today.

    Many people think Chia is worse for the Oilers than Eakins was.

    Load the cannon

  193. Mike Wazowski says:

    knighttown,

    Not sure if it was a case of “let walk”. Pitlick mentioned that he was just hoping for a one-way deal when Dallas offered him a 3-year contract. Given his injury history I can’t imagine there were many teams making an offer like that.

  194. JD_Wry says:

    StixMalone:
    Why not put Woodcroft or Johnson upstairs for a game or two. Maybe a few games from a different perspective will come up with a revelation?

    I think they’ve got enough video of special teams play.

    OmJo: and are back down to reality

    I would suggest several conference standings spots below reality. I think reality is somewhere in between, but point taken.

  195. Wyndi says:

    AsiaOil:
    The “GM is an idiot” crowd don’t seem to consider the actual value of players traded.

    Eberle has 2 goal in his last 15 games and is -12 over that period
    Yakopov has 1 goal in his last 15 games and is even
    Hendricks has 1 goal in his last 15 games and is -3
    Shultz has 0 goal in his last 15 games and is +3
    Pouliot has 2 goal in his last 15 games and is -3 over that period

    Agreed, I also like to judge hockey players exclusively by their last 15 games when they have large bodies of work. I also like to ignore assists because they don’t matter. I also like to remove Taylor Hall from my list for…reasons.

  196. OriginalPouzar says:

    knighttown:
    We all have our transactions that bug us more than they should.For years it was Petry going for SFA on a team that desperately needed a 1st pairing RHD.

    My more recent pet peeve transaction was letting Tyler Pitlick walk.I never understood why that didn’t get more play.I understand his development was painful to watch and the injury history was real and it was spectacular.I also know about the shooting percentages but he looked DAMN good last year.Big, strong player that skates really well and hits hard and seems to have an excellent shot.

    I’d put him in our top 4 wings (Pul, Lucic, Maroon) on this team and I would have said the same last year.He could slide up and down the roster and would have been pretty damned cheap.

    The contract that DAL offered Pitlick was off the charts – a 3 year term was out of the realm of reasonableness.

    Pitlick himself (in an interview the first time DAL came to EDM this year) said that he was just hoping to get a one-way contract with a team and was floored with the offer from DAL and had no choice but to jump on it.

    Its turned out to be good so far from DAL but they went off the charts with their offer.

  197. Mike Wazowski says:

    Ryan,

    What would the defence have looked like? Larsson was a much needed addition to the team. A price had to be paid to get him.

  198. OmJo says:

    AsiaOil: That is a combined 6 goals from these 4 players over a combined 75 games (basically a season) along with a collective -15 (mostly due to Ebs).

    Didn’t our bottom 6 score 2 goals in the first 20 games of the season?

    Eberle: 14 goals, 30 points in 43 games. He’d be tied for 2nd (with McDavid) for goals and 3rd (with Nuge) for points.

    Yakupov: 8 goals, 13 points in 35 games. He’d be tied for 6th (with Letestu and Puljujarvi) for goals and 10th (with Khaira) for points.

    Hendricks isn’t important for his offense and he would probably be the 13th F if he was still here. I don’t blame Chiarelli for letting him go.

    Schultz: 2 goals, 11 points in 27 games. Two defensemen on this team have more points in almost 20 more games, Russell and Nurse. But… I don’t blame Chiarelli for Schultz. I was happy with the third when he was traded, I won’t pretend like I knew it was a bad trade for us.

    Pouliot: 8 goals, 11 points in 41 games played. Our LWs, who’ve played significantly with McDavid, have 9 goals each.

    This is with all these players struggling to score in the last 15 games and zero minutes with McDavid.

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