G73 2017-18: Oilers at Hurricanes

The Edmonton Oilers continue the auditions—Ethan Bear, Ty Rattie, Pontus Aberg when they find him—as we all wait for possible front office and coaching moves that may come after the schedule completes. We’re just a little over one month from the draft lottery and Edmonton can still catch a couple of teams in the overall standings. Trade options continue to be discussed, although the options out (Nuge, Klefbom, Puljujarvi, 2018 first-round pick) are much too dear. There’s so much up in the air it’s impossible to find clarity now, at this time of year. Perhaps the auditions will change the equation.

THE ATHLETIC!

Great offer! Includes a free 7-day trial so you can try The Athletic on for size free and see if they enjoy the in-depth, ad-free coverage on the site. Offer is here.

CAROLINA IN MY MIND, YEAR OVER YEAR

  • March 2016: 5-4-0, goal differential -2 (10 points)
  • March 2017: 6-2-1, goal differential +13 (13 points)
  • March 2018: 4-4-1, goal differential -1 (9 points)
  • March 18, 2016: Edmonton 2, Vancouver 0 (Source)
  • March 23, 2017: Edmonton 7, Colorado 4 (Source)

The 2016 and 2017 teams had a nice run through the middle of March, this year’s team will try to keep pace with the first McLellan group. Oscar Klefbom is lost for the rest of the season, Dillon Simpson has been recalled and we’ll see what the lineups bring us later today.

AFTER 72, YEAR OVER YEAR

  • Oilers 15-16: 27-38-7, goal differential -49 (61 points)
  • Oilers 16-17: 39-24-9, goal differential +31 (87 points)
  • Oilers 17-18: 31-36-5, goal differential -33 (67 points)
  • March 16, 2016: Edmonton 6, St. Louis 4 (Source)
  • March 22, 2017: Anaheim 4, Edmonton 3 (Source)

The 2015-16 team won their G73, winning the 28th game of the season. Edmonton’s team of a year ago lost, but would compile 16 more points in the final nine games of the year. Amazing. The 15-16 gang would go 4-5-1 in the final 10, to finish 31-43-8, 70 points. The 16-17 crew wrecked everyone, finishing 8-2-0 on the way to 47-26-9, 103 points.

WHAT TO EXPECT FROM MARCH

  • At home to: Nashville, NY Rangers, Arizona, NY Islanders, Minnesota (Expected 2-3-0) (Actual 3-2-0)
  • On the road to: Calgary (Expected 0-1-0) (Actual 0-1-0)
  • At home to: San Jose (Expected 0-0-1) (Actual 0-0-1)
  • On the road to: Florida, Tampa Bay, Carolina, Ottawa (Expected 1-2-1) (Actual 1-1-0)
  • At home to: Los Angeles, Anaheim, Columbus (Expected 2-1-0) (Actual 0-0-0)
  • On the road to: Vancouver, Calgary (Expected 1-0-1) (Actual 0-0-0)
  • Overall expected result: 6-7-3, 15 points in 16 games
  • Current results: 4-4-1, 9 points in nine games

We didn’t have these discussions a year ago, and hopefully won’t have another chance to watch Oilers at the WHC’s until 2030 or so. That said, it should be entertaining to see McDavid and company play at the international level. No Olympics for NHL players makes this a bigger event.

THE BUTTON LIST

Craig Button’s latest draft list is out and there’s plenty of movement. Button’s appeal is that he has his own mind, he’s a scout and so the list compiled resembles no one else. His scouting background means we’re basically getting a free scouting director’s list and for me there’s a great deal of value there. Here’s my top 10 and where he ranks them:

  1. LD Rasmus Dahlin, Frolunda (SHL). Button also ranks him No. 1. Universal top pick.
  2. R Andrei Svechnikov, Barrie Colts (OHL). Button has him No. 3.
  3. L Filip Zadina, Halifax Mooseheads (QMJHL). Ranks No. 4 on Button list.
  4. LD Ty Smith, Spokane Chiefs (WHL). No. 19 on Button’s latest ranking.
  5. RD Adam Boqvist, Brynas (SuperElite). No. 6 for Craig Button.
  6. R Oliver Wahlstrom, U.S. N. D. P. (USHL). Pure scorer is No. 9 on Button list.
  7. LD Quinn Hughes, Michigan (NCAA). No. 12 for Button.
  8. L Brady Tkachuk, Boston University (NCAA). Button has him at No. 2 overall.
  9. LC Jacob Olofsson, Timra (Allsvenskan). Speedy center No. 21 on Button list.
  10. RD Evan Bouchard, London Knights (OHL). No. 5 on Craig’s list.

This is a big release, Button has his ducks pretty much in order based on his own past. International tournaments will inspire some movement from the Europeans and some of the CHL kids will spike with strong playoffs. We’re getting close now.

OILERS CURRENT PICKS FOR 2018

  • First Round—No. 7 overall
  • Second Round—No. 38 overall
  • Third Round—No. 69 overall
  • Fourth Round—No. 100 overall (Oilers acquired goaltender Al Montoya from the Montreal Canadiens in exchange for a conditional fourth-round pick in 2018. Montoya has now covered the condition. It is a fourth).
  • Fifth Round—No. 129 overall
  • Sixth Round—No. 160 overall
  • Seventh Round—No. 191 overall

I believe the Oilers will prefer to take a forward at No. 7. Button’s ‘best available’ at the number includes sniper Oliver Wahlstrom and skill center Jesperi Kotkaniemi. I could see one or both being selected. If the Oilers do take a defender, bet on a righty like Boqvist or Bouchard.

LOWDOWN WITH LOWETIDE

A busy morning, guests are fluid but we have a top drawer show heading your way at 10, TSN1260. Scheduled to appear:

  • Jonathan Willis, The Athletic. We’ll chat about his Nuge article and what RNH’s value might be.
  • Scott Cullen, TSN. Good teams are going to miss the playoffs, should the NHL tweak the playoff format?

Plus a couple of very cool guests have yet to confirm but I’m confident! 10-1260 text @Lowetide on twitter. See you on the radio!

 

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306 Responses to "G73 2017-18: Oilers at Hurricanes"

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  1. Glass says:

    I’ll be happy if we can draft at #5, and have our pick of Bouchard / Boqvist.

    Why do you think Tkachuk is #2 on his list over the other forwards? Name? Style? I’m not convinced he is a better scorer, but you guys would know better.

  2. Lowetide says:

    Glass:
    I’ll be happy if we can draft at #5, and have our pick of Bouchard / Boqvist.

    Why do you think Tkachuk is #2 on his list over the other forwards? Name? Style? I’m not convinced he is a better scorer, but you guys would know better.

    I have him at No. 8 because the offense is shy of the others. That said, I don’t have time on ice totals and that could skew things in a big way.

  3. Bad Seed says:

    I believe the Oilers will prefer to take a forward at No. 7. Button’s ‘best available’ at the number includes sniper Oliver Wahlstrom and skill center Jesperi Kotkaniemi. I could see one or both being selected.

    One or both? Do you see the Oilers getting a second first rounder in top 10?

  4. bendelson says:

    OK… I’ll ask LT.
    How do the Oilers possibly select both Wahlstrom and Kotkaniemi?

  5. slopitch says:

    Ya Id be suprised if Tkachuk slid down to where the Oilers end up. Could be 10th overall. Too bad.

    Dusty Neilson is adamant that the oilers move the pick for help now. I get the argument but with expansion coming you cant risk trading another Barzal when your 5 upgrades required from being close and likely 2-3 years away.

  6. LMHF#1 says:

    slopitch:
    Ya Id be suprised if Tkachuk slid down to where the Oilers end up. Could be 10th overall. Too bad.

    Dusty Neilson is adamant that the oilers move the pick for help now. I get the argument but with expansion moving you cant risk trading another Barzal when your 5 upgrades required from being close and likely 2-3 years away.

    Are we really going to do this again….

    You can’t let expansion impact any of your decision-making. It is too far away and challenges can be easily mitigated.

    Also – “risking another Barzal” isn’t a thing. It’s trading picks for a Reinhart rather than a known, proven quantity that is the issue. The trade that included the pick that was Milan Lucic was still a good trade.

  7. natejax97 says:

    I hope, though not a popular idea, that the Oilers take a page out of the Lightning handbook. Take this season for what it is, reload and come back in next year on a mission.

    The Lightning moved Jon Drouin for a great D prospect, left their core and their coaching staff in place, and went from 10th in the East to contender. You can argue Stamkos is the difference, but the Oilers would have been better had they not had the injuries they sustained early in the year as well.

    I know that it is so tempting to blow this up again, and that change has become the norm here, but sometimes it is better to let these guys grow up together under consistent direction.

    Now, all of this said, I would hope that the coaching staff from top to bottom is willing to change and adapt the strategies of this team to help make them successful, especially on their breakouts and maybe a little less dump and chase with the skill they have. I would also hope that they make speed and grit a priority at the draft, free agency and any upcoming trades they make. Brady Tkachuk would make a fantastic Oiler.

  8. doritogrande says:

    Is the London Knights factor still a thing? Bouchard would seem tailor-made for our needs but he’s basically getting every important minute for them. Shades of Schremp’s time there.

  9. --hudson-- says:

    One issue with Brady Tkachuk is his age. Born on Sep 16 1999, one day earlier and he’d be eligible for the 2017 draft. We hope someone else takes him high! (Unless we win one of the lottos)

  10. GMB3 says:

    slopitch:
    Ya Id be suprised if Tkachuk slid down to where the Oilers end up. Could be 10th overall. Too bad.

    Dusty Neilson is adamant that the oilers move the pick for help now. I get the argument but with expansion coming you cant risk trading another Barzal when your 5 upgrades required from being close and likely 2-3 years away.

    Dustin Neilson is a clown.

    Why is it that many Chiarelli supporters preach patience and organizational stability and then want him to make another not-patient-at-all move and trade away a top ten pick with likely a higher ceiling than the names floated as trade targets.

    Yes, let’s give him more time to make more of the same mistakes that got us into this mess.

    Some days, I like to imagine the roster if Chiarelli came in here and wasn’t preaching “I’m an impatient guy! lol”. Impatient people tend to make rash decisions.

  11. McSorley33 says:

    Quick update on Alex Debrincat:

    The rookie winger recorded his **third** hat trick of the season in the team’s 5-4 loss to the Blues on Sunday. He’s now *** tied alongside Patrick Kane with a team-high 25 goals***

    https://chicago.suntimes.com/sports/alex-debrincat-hat-trick-blackhawks-blues-highlights-nhl/

    25 goals + 20 assists in 73 games.

    Maybe we can sign an old UFA free agent to play RW with McDavid next year?

  12. hunter1909 says:

    That’s right. Hire a mulish head coach who screws up the better forwards who then need to get traded. Then, trade most of these best players away for worse players, while handing out NMC’s to further destroy the future. Finally, the defence stinks and has stunk for the past decade so what do we think they’re going to do?

    Draft another forward in the 1st round and I think I’m going to start watching English soccer next winter.

  13. Hwahl says:

    My prefered pickups based on draft position

    #1 Dahlin (obvious)
    #2-4 Zadina (filling LW role)
    #5-10 Evan Bouchard (filling a need while we actually have time to be patient)

  14. GMB3 says:

    Comparing Shane Bowers and Brady Tkachuk should make it pretty evident that Tkachuk isn’t worth a top ten pick.

  15. GMB3 says:

    McSorley33:
    Quick update on Alex Debrincat:

    The rookie winger recorded his **third** hat trick of the season in the team’s 5-4 loss to the Blues on Sunday. He’s now *** tied alongside Patrick Kane with a team-high 25 goals***

    https://chicago.suntimes.com/sports/alex-debrincat-hat-trick-blackhawks-blues-highlights-nhl/

    25 goals + 20 assists in 73 games.

    Maybe we can sign an old UFA free agent to play RW with McDavid next year?

    Yes but Tyler Benson set a record in Bantam and is from Edmonton so

  16. JustWatt says:

    I’m on board with LTs plan for the Oil: small moves around the edges. No big assets out. I want the coaching staff gone as well as the GM but if Chia leaves the big assets in place and replaces TMac with Quenville or another excellent coach then I will be pacified.

    I think you have to move forward with the defense as is next season unless you can move Russel. Increased health should help. Leave it one more season when it gets easier to change things around.

    The only big target should be another top 6 RW. Most likely to play with Drai on the 2nd line. Then you can run Nuge and 97 with someone cheap and do ok on the top line and Drai has some support on the second line. And if you want to swap Nuge and Drai you still have someone to help Nuge.

    I think the Oilers should be targeting a RD in the draft as there are so many quality choices in the top 10. They are much harder assets to acquire. That player can matriculate as the Russel contract runs out, ideally.

  17. GMB3 says:

    LMHF#1: Are we really going to do this again….

    You can’t let expansion impact any of your decision-making. It is too far away and challenges can be easily mitigated.

    Also – “risking another Barzal” isn’t a thing. It’s trading picks for a Reinhart rather than a known, proven quantity that is the issue. The trade that included the pick that was Milan Lucic was still a good trade.

    I’d argue that the trade that included the pick that was Milan Lucic is far different from a trade of a top ten pick this summer and barely comparable. Bolstering your lineup while fighting for a playoff position at the expense of a second rounder makes sense.

  18. frjohnk says:

    I wonder if the Flames fans are talking about the draft like we are 🙂

  19. JustWatt says:

    hunter1909,

    Yup. Coach out, RD draft pick in. No big assets out.

  20. JustWatt says:

    frjohnk:
    I wonder if the Flames fans are talking about the draft like we are

    If Chia trades the first rounder we will be talking about the draft like them.

  21. frjohnk says:

    If the Oilers were to trade this years pick, it should have even more value compared to other draft years because of the incoming expansion.

    Chia should be able to get Reinhart with just a 1st rounder this summer.

    Anything more and its an overpayment

  22. Ribs says:

    Who’s running the Canadian team for the WHC this year? Any word on coaching staff? Please tell me Lindy Ruff has nothing to do with this team.

  23. McSorley33 says:

    frjohnk,

    If the Oilers were to trade this years pick, it should have even more value compared to other draft years because of the incoming expansion.

    Chia should be able to get Reinhart with just a 1st rounder this summer.

    Anything more and its an overpayment

    ****************************************************************
    Bob Green, once again, whispers to Chia: “He’s a late bloomer. Let’s give Griff another chance”

    Chia: “Have you at least seen him play in the AHL this year?”

    Bob Green: ” No, of course not”

  24. dustrock says:

    natejax97:
    I hope, though not a popular idea, that the Oilers take a page out of the Lightning handbook.Take this season for what it is, reload and come back in next year on a mission.

    The Lightning moved Jon Drouin for a great D prospect, left their core and their coaching staff in place, and went from 10th in the East to contender.You can argue Stamkos is the difference, but the Oilers would have been better had they not had the injuries they sustained early in the year as well.

    I know that it is so tempting to blow this up again, and that change has become the norm here, but sometimes it is better to let these guys grow up together under consistent direction.

    The Tampa Bay story is instructive,and so is the Las Vegas story.

    But where Tampa Bay has us beat is they have one of the top 5 d-men in the entire NHL and a goalie who will be their #1 for the next 10 years.

    The craziest thing about the Oilers is that we continue to have the same problems, year over year.

  25. OmJo says:

    Going to call it now.

    Oilers draft Jesperi Kotkaniemi or Ty Smith, probably Ty if both are available.
    Oilers expect Kotkaniemi/Smith to enter the league next season, and so trade Nuge/Klefbom (depending on if we draft a C or D) for pennies on the dollar.
    We waste a year of the players ELC to find out they aren’t NHL ready.

  26. Durag says:

    GMB3:

    Impatient people tend to make rash decisions.

    They also think dogs can’t pull carts

  27. slopitch says:

    LMHF#1: Are we really going to do this again….

    You can’t let expansion impact any of your decision-making. It is too far away and challenges can be easily mitigated.

    Also – “risking another Barzal” isn’t a thing. It’s trading picks for a Reinhart rather than a known, proven quantity that is the issue. The trade that included the pick that was Milan Lucic was still a good trade.

    I think you can let expansion impact your decision making. The teams that dealt with Vegas to cut loses I think would all regret it. The Oilers shouldn’t be in win now mode. They have a bottom 5 farm system and an NHL lineup that’s a 2-3 trick pony and has cap issues. ELC often end up being one of the best ways to get value contracts. Trading picks for a quick fix has already bit them in the ass once I wouldnt go there again. The counter argument of course is “make good trades” and if you do the trade get Dougie Hamilton and not Griffin Reinhart. But if thats the case I agree and we can close up shop till October.

    How is risking another Barzal not a thing? Its a top 10 pick. The Sens could risk another Tarasenko. Or the Predators could risk another Erik Karlsson. Sure Im cherry picking a bit here but it aligns with my opinion that the Oilers should keep their picks.

  28. OmJo says:

    Ribs:
    Who’s running the Canadian team for the WHC this year? Any word on coaching staff? Please tell me Lindy Ruff has nothing to do with this team.

    You want to see McDavid and Hall play together, hey?

  29. OmJo says:

    frjohnk:
    If the Oilers were to trade this years pick, it should have even more value compared to other draft years because of the incoming expansion.

    Chia should be able to get Reinhart with just a 1st rounder this summer.

    Anything more and its an overpayment

    *Oilers trade a 1st round pick, not lottery protected because lol, to the Ottawa Senators for the rights to Maxwell Reinhart*

  30. Wilde says:

    RNH-McDavid-Rattie

    Caggiula-Draisaitl-Aberg

    Lucic-Strome-Puljujarvi

    Slepyshev-Khaira-Pakarinen

    per Stauffer

    Three of these lines are going to get absolutely caved. Most heinous is giving Draisaitl that to work with instead of Slepyshev-Puljujarvi.

    At least we’re caught up to Slepy at LW being a thing. Now they just need to notice playing Khaira-Strome together vs apart is like a 10% shot/chance share swing upwards.

  31. OilClog says:

    natejax97:
    I hope, though not a popular idea, that the Oilers take a page out of the Lightning handbook.Take this season for what it is, reload and come back in next year on a mission.

    The Lightning moved Jon Drouin for a great D prospect, left their core and their coaching staff in place, and went from 10th in the East to contender.You can argue Stamkos is the difference, but the Oilers would have been better had they not had the injuries they sustained early in the year as well.

    I know that it is so tempting to blow this up again, and that change has become the norm here, but sometimes it is better to let these guys grow up together under consistent direction.

    Now, all of this said, I would hope that the coaching staff from top to bottom is willing to change and adapt the strategies of this team to help make them successful, especially on their breakouts and maybe a little less dump and chase with the skill they have.I would also hope that they make speed and grit a priority at the draft, free agency and any upcoming trades they make.Brady Tkachuk would make a fantastic Oiler.

    Lol that’s a lot of hope.

  32. Ribs says:

    OmJo: You want to see McDavid and Hall play together, hey?

    *facepalm*

  33. Pescador says:

    hunter1909:
    That’s right. Hire a mulish head coach who screws up the better forwards who then need to get traded. Then, trade most of these best players away for worse players, while handing out NMC’s to further destroy the future. Finally, the defence stinks and has stunk for the past decade so what do we think they’re going to do?

    Draft another forward in the 1st round and I think I’m going to start watching English soccer next winter.

    Peter will trade Oscar to NJ in exchange for a signed Patrick Maroon

  34. OilClog says:

    LMHF#1: Are we really going to do this again….

    You can’t let expansion impact any of your decision-making. It is too far away and challenges can be easily mitigated.

    Also – “risking another Barzal” isn’t a thing. It’s trading picks for a Reinhart rather than a known, proven quantity that is the issue. The trade that included the pick that was Milan Lucic was still a good trade.

    But we’re suppose to be quivering in our boots at the thought of losing that important piece that holds it all together. Geeez

  35. OilClog says:

    Ribs:
    Who’s running the Canadian team for the WHC this year? Any word on coaching staff? Please tell me Lindy Ruff has nothing to do with this team.

    I like the thought of lowering Mcdavids risk of injury by being banished to the 4th line, he’s needed for next seasons 83pt pace.

  36. JimmyV1965 says:

    My first inclination is that more is less this offseason. I would be reluctant to trade RNH, Klef or the first rounder. But we have to improve our second RHD somehow and that will cost assets. We need a better backup as well but maybe we can get a relatively cheap UFA.

    I would consider trading down in the first round. We get immediate help and can still draft a good player. Not sure if drafting 10 nets you a good enuf trade chip to make it worthwhile.

    I don’t think we can arbitrarily say no to trading anyone though, other than McDavid and Drai. There should be incredible demand for RNH this offseason. If we get a good enuf deal, then I’m perfectly happy trading him.

    If we don’t trust the GM to make a good trade, then that’s a completely different issue.

  37. jtblack says:

    natejax97,

    “The Lightning moved Jon Drouin for a great D prospect, “. Yzerman moved a player from a position of abundance (F) for a player in a position of weakness (D).

    The difference is Yzerman won the trade, or at least sawed off.

    Had Yzerman moved Drouin for Griffin Reinhart you might not view it so favorably.

    The Point is you can move assets out of a position of strength to fill a position of weakness. But PC doesnt seem able to. He gets caved on his big trades. Yzerman, Sakic, Poile? not so much.

  38. OilClog says:

    Pescador: Peter will trade Oscar to NJ in exchange for a signed Patrick Maroon

    Hah! New GM Keith is sending him to Buffalo for a signed Pouliot.

  39. hunter1909 says:

    jtblack: The Point is you can move assets out of a position of strength to fill a position of weakness. But PC doesnt seem able to. He gets caved on his big trades. Yzerman, Sakic, Poile? not so much.

    Now we can expect that other GM’s refuse to offer Chi-man anything but bum deals. They know that sooner or later he’s going to cave in and offer them the moon for their garbage.

  40. Woogie63 says:

    Here are all the players selected in the first round 16-30 in 2015. Even if the Oilers pass on Barzal their is tons of talent tha would be helping us right now

    #nevertradeafirstroundpickjustasktheflamesandoilers

    1 16 NY Islanders Mathew Barzal C Seattle Thunderbirds [WHL] 74 19 54 73 32 2017-18
    1 17 Winnipeg Kyle Connor L Youngstown Phantoms [USHL] 86 27 22 49 20 2017-18
    1 18 Ottawa Thomas Chabot D Saint John Sea Dogs [QMJHL] 53 6 14 20 14 2017-18
    1 19 Detroit Evgeny Svechnikov R Cape Breton Screaming Eagles [QMJHL] 8 0 0 0 2 2017-18
    1 20 Minnesota Joel Eriksson-Ek C Farjestads BK Karlstad [SweHL] 81 7 14 21 26 2017-18
    1 21 Ottawa Colin White C U.S. National Development Team [USHL] 17 2 1 3 6 2017-18
    1 22 Washington Ilya Samsonov G Magnitogorsk-2 (Russia Jrs.)
    1 23 Vancouver Brock Boeser R Waterloo Black Hawks [USHL] 71 33 27 60 16 2017-18
    1 24 Philadelphia Travis Konecny C Ottawa 67’s [OHL] 142 30 39 69 93 2017-18
    1 25 Winnipeg Jack Roslovic C U.S. National Development Team [USHL] 30 4 8 12 2 2017-18
    1 26 Montreal Noah Juulsen D Everett Silvertips [WHL] 14 1 0 1 4 2017-18
    1 27 Anaheim Jacob Larsson D Frolunda Jrs. (Sweden) 4 0 0 0 2 2016-17
    1 28 NY Islanders Anthony Beauvillier C Shawinigan Cataractes [QMJHL] 127 23 26 49 22 2017-18
    1 29 Columbus Gabriel Carlsson D Linkopings Jrs. (Sweden) 16 0 3 3 4 2017-18
    1 30 Arizona Nick Merkley R Kelowna Rockets [WHL] 1 0 0 0 2 2017-18

  41. OilClog says:

    JimmyV1965:
    My first inclination is that more is less this offseason. I would be reluctant to trade RNH, Klef or the first rounder.But we have to improve our second RHD somehow and that will cost assets.We need a better backup as well but maybe we can get a relatively cheap UFA.

    I would consider trading down in the first round. We get immediate help and can still draft a good player.Not sure if drafting 10 nets you a good enuf trade chip to make it worthwhile.

    I don’t think we can arbitrarily say no to trading anyone though, other than McDavid and Drai. There should be incredible demand for RNH this offseason. If we get a good enuf deal, then I’m perfectly happy trading him.

    If we don’t trust the GM to make a good trade, then that’s a completely different issue.

    If the Oilers are moving out their 2nd best all around forward they need to aim for a RHD that moves Larsson into the magical 2nd pairing RHD position or it’s another bleeding assets move.

    Everyone realizes that moving Nuge creates a hole that make take another 6-12 moves to ever recover from Right?

  42. JimmyV1965 says:

    jtblack:
    natejax97,

    “The Lightning moved Jon Drouin for a great D prospect, “.Yzerman moved a player from a position of abundance (F) for a player in a position of weakness (D).

    The difference is Yzerman won the trade, or at least sawed off.

    Had Yzerman moved Drouin for Griffin Reinhart you might now view it so favorably.

    The Point is you can move assets out of a position of strength to fill a position of weakness.But PC doesnt seem able to.He gets caved on his big trades.Yzerman, Sakic, Poile? not so much.

    Ultimately that’s the issue here.

  43. jtblack says:

    So PC burned a 4th Rounder to bring a backup in that would have cost nothing in the summer?

    PC : each summer there are 6 – 10 backup Goalie available. You do not have to give up any assets to get them. Just try and lick a competent one, that is on your scouts.

    So far the Monster and LB have not worked out. Not sure about Montoya for next year????

  44. flea says:

    Doesn’t Klefbom’s injury kind of protect him from a trade this summer? I can’t see it happening. I think staying the course with the defense and adding a veteran RHD on a 1 year deal to block Bear might be enough.

    If they could get a signed OEL I would do it, just to have the Larsson Larsson top pairing. That would be scary for opposing teams.

  45. jtblack says:

    LT: If Spokane is knocked out early in the Playoffs, is Yamamoto eligible to get called up? and if yes, should they?

  46. hunter1909 says:

    At this rate, within a few more seasons Draisaitl+McDavid are going to go. Then what? Gates of 8,000 paying customers, with another 2-3000 cheapo tix sold to keep up some form of legitimacy, lol

  47. Connoreah says:

    Keep the pick and don’t let the new kid near the roster in October, regardless of how good they look in preseason.

    Don’t trade Nuge or Klef.

    Acquire Athanasiou and a better backup using secondary assets (Caggiula, Benning?) and/or future picks.

    Nuge-McDavid-JP
    Athanasiou-Drai-Yamamoto
    Lucic-Strome-Slepy
    Kassian-JJ-Aberg

    Klef-Larsson
    Nurse-Sekera
    Russel-Bear

    Talbot
    Lehner

  48. Wilde says:

    natejax97,

    This is what happened to the Lightning in 2016-17.

    – They announced Callahan was out for 5 months (Then actually adapted to shore up the depth; ie not what the Oilers did with Sekera)

    – They drafted 10 kids in the 2016 entry draft, the first 5 immediately posted up arrows

    – They negotiated well and signed Viktor Hedman to a team-friendly contract

    – Then they re-signed all of their successful pro-scouting decisions including Gourde and Morin

    – Then they re-signed their former #1 overall pick to a team friendly contract

    – They bought out a useless player in Matt Carle because his ill-advised contract wasn’t buyout proof

    – Then they stole more FA AHLers from Montreal

    – They then suffered a string of injuries COMPLETELY INCOMPARBLE to the Oilers 2017/18 season, but closely resembling the Oilers 2015-16

    – And still finished with 94 points.

    – Their AHL team lost in the Calder Cup Finals.

    The Oilers are missing the 10 drafted kids, the astute pro signings, the strong farm team (Conacher and Gourde have since come up and scored well for them), both played on the Crunch last year), will end the season about 15 points shy of Tampa’s 94, have bad money that we can’t buy out, and have a history of overpayment to go with the incoming negotiation of our much less talented RFA defenseman.

    Anyone spinning this season as our Bolts 2016, that’s not on the Oilers payroll, needs to look closer. Damn closer.

    I don’t mean this to be directly at you individually, I just see this sentiment all the time and figured I would compile my issues with it.

  49. Wilde says:

    jtblack,

    Send him to Bakersfield, you mean?

    And yeah, Portland’s a tougher matchup than it looks. The Chiefs have a ridiculous 1line of JAD, Yammer, and McIndoe, and the best defenseman in the WHL, but the rest of the team is questionable.

  50. Wilde says:

    Connoreah:
    Keep the pick and don’t let the new kid near the roster in October, regardless of how good they look in preseason.

    Don’t trade Nuge or Klef.

    Acquire Athanasiou and a better backup using secondary assets (Caggiula, Benning?) and/or future picks.

    Nuge-McDavid-JP
    Athanasiou-Drai-Yamamoto
    Lucic-Strome-Slepy
    Kassian-JJ-Aberg

    Klef-Larsson
    Nurse-Sekera
    Russel-Bear

    Talbot
    Lehner

    The F group is fine here, but that Nurse-Sekera pairing has some… history.

    And Bear’s not ready. He looks good in a number of areas but his area of numbers doesn’t.

  51. Andy Dufresne says:

    natejax97:
    I hope, though not a popular idea, that the Oilers take a page out of the Lightning handbook.Take this season for what it is, reload and come back in next year on a mission.

    The Lightning moved Jon Drouin for a great D prospect, left their core and their coaching staff in place, and went from 10th in the East to contender.You can argue Stamkos is the difference, but the Oilers would have been better had they not had the injuries they sustained early in the year as well.

    I know that it is so tempting to blow this up again, and that change has become the norm here, but sometimes it is better to let these guys grow up together under consistent direction.

    Now, all of this said, I would hope that the coaching staff from top to bottom is willing to change and adapt the strategies of this team to help make them successful, especially on their breakouts and maybe a little less dump and chase with the skill they have.I would also hope that they make speed and grit a priority at the draft, free agency and any upcoming trades they make.Brady Tkachuk would make a fantastic Oiler.

    +1

  52. Andy Dufresne says:

    GMB3: Dustin Neilson is a clown.

    Why is it that many Chiarelli supporters preach patience and organizational stability and then want him to make another not-patient-at-all move and trade away a top ten pick with likely a higher ceiling than the names floated as trade targets.

    Yes, let’s give him more time to make more of the same mistakes that got us into this mess.

    Some days, I like to imagine the roster if Chiarelli came in here and wasn’t preaching “I’m an impatient guy! lol”. Impatient people tend to make rash decisions.

    Why is it that all the Chiarelli haters scream at him all year for being Steve Tambellini last summer and are all now begging him to be SteveTambellini this summer?

    Ever think that all the screaming youve been doing is going to result in you getting exactly what you fear the most?

  53. ashley says:

    frjohnk:
    I wonder if the Flames fans are talking about the draft like we are

    https://www.prohockeyrumors.com/2018/02/calgary-flames-face-long-wait-at-2018-draft.html

    Where is that Flames guy that was “drinking schadenfreude through a fire hose” a few weeks back?

    “He who laughs last, laughs best”

  54. Andy Dufresne says:

    slopitch:
    Ya Id be suprised if Tkachuk slid down to where the Oilers end up. Could be 10th overall. Too bad.

    Dusty Neilson is adamant that the oilers move the pick for help now. I get the argument but with expansion coming you cant risk trading another Barzal when your 5 upgrades required from being close and likely 2-3 years away.

    IMO after spewing sh*t all year at what an id*ot Chiarelli is, this crowd should be on thier knees praying that we get to keep our first round pick this year.

  55. Andy Dufresne says:

    Hwahl:
    My prefered pickups based on draft position

    #1 Dahlin (obvious)
    #2-4 Zadina (filling LW role)
    #5-10 Evan Bouchard (filling a need while we actually have time to be patient)

    IMO if we are picking later than 7th (which odds/trend say we will be) we will get none of these players. We will need to win one of the lotteries to move up. We need equally to hope we dont move down because one or two other teams could leap frog us by winning the lotteries.

    IMO we need to finish in 7th to feel at all safe about picking in the top 9.

  56. OmJo says:

    Andy Dufresne: Why is it that all the Chiarelli haters scream at him all year for not being Steve Tambellini last summer and are all now begging him to be SteveTambellini this summer?

    Ever think that all the screaming youve been doing is going to result in yougetting exactly what you fear the most?

    Because last summer was the summer to make moves. The problem wasn’t that he didn’t do nothing, it was that the only thing he did do was make the team worse.

  57. Andy Dufresne says:

    NO sarcasm here……I expect the OIlers to loose another trade this summer.

    They might move Nuge for a legit scoring prospect to clear cap space…..it would be viewed as losing a trade and bleeding talent……it will clear cap space to sign a free agent like John Carlson.

  58. GMB3 says:

    The Oilers have the fourth best first line according to goal difference. 27th best 2-4th lines. So if.Cam Talbot had a better season McDavid and co would probably be closer to first and the rest of the lines would be what, in the low 20’s?

    But keep the GM and coach they are doing a really great job at molding this roster.

  59. Wilde says:

    Andy Dufresne,

    Okay so, you and Kinger both have brought up this thing where you think it’s hypocritical for people to say they want the management team to do less this summer as opposed to wanting them to do more last summer.

    Allow me an analogy.

    I go over to a friend’s house and their plant is wilting. I tell them to water it.

    I go over to the friends house the next week and their plant is dead. Should I then tell them to water it, because it’s what I said last time, and to do otherwise is hypocritical?

    No. Because the situation is vastly different and you can’t go back in time.

    They need to seed a new plant.

  60. YKOil says:

    LMHF#1: You can’t let expansion impact any of your decision-making. It is too far away and challenges can be easily mitigated.

    Don’t necessarily agree with that. Seattle will probably come in on the same player protection plan as Vegas and they will be picking off of 2019-2020 rosters. A quick look at the possible 2019-2020 roster: McDavid, Draisaitl, Nugent-Hopkins, Lucic (NMC), Puljujarvi, Benson, Yamamoto and then Nurse, Larsson, Klefbom, Bear, Sekera (NMC), Russell (NMC) means that Edmonton is on the 4×4 plan again.

    Any decent player added via trade of the 2018 pick increases the cost of protecting the decent players let unprotected so, unless your goal is to mitigate risk by dumping Lucic, Russell and Sekera BEFORE the expansion draft (a tall order in my opinion), the easiest way to mitigate risk is to keep the 2018 pick and dump one of Sekera/Russell and, if possible, Lucic (still a hard task but doable).

    [side note: NOT a fan of playing Bear past 9 games, maybe I am missing something but this burns a year doesn’t it? Bring up Jones and give him 9 games instead.]

    Of interest, say the Oiler’s do win the golden ticket and draft Dahlin… do you play him right away and increase your expansion draft “costs” or do you hold him back a year or two to ensure he isn’t eligible? What am I saying… it’s the Oiler’s, of course they would play him immediately.

    I trend toward asset protection and asset-base build right now. Given I see the Sekera and Russell contracts as the biggest threat to the Oilers ability to protect/maximize/grow the asset base those are the assets I focus my trade efforts on. (Normally I would mention Lucic’s contract but… welll… that f&*king contract will need to be paired with a late 1st rounder or a compliance buy-out to be cleared so it isn’t even an option this year).

    Teams to look to trade with re: Sekera include (in order): Buffalo [Moulson], Montreal [Schlemko], Ottawa [MacArthur, eat salary], NY Islanders [eat salary], Columbus (eat salary) and maybe Carolina [Kruger]. The info in the brackets indicate areas where the Oilers can play in order to increase trade return.

    Montreal, Buffalo, Ottawa and the NY Islanders absolutely need to improve their defenses, Columbus is looking a big turnover in their commitments on defense and Carolina is a possible play given Sekera once played there.

    The NMC’s are an issue but maybe Sekera is ready to move back east?

    Chia’s moves, dammit, depressing. F&*k.

  61. Andy Dufresne says:

    JustWatt:
    I’m on board with LTs plan for the Oil: small moves around the edges. No big assets out. I want the coaching staff gone as well as the GM but if Chia leaves the big assets in place and replaces TMac with Quenville or another excellent coach then I will be pacified.

    I think you have to move forward with the defense as is next season unless you can move Russel. Increased health should help. Leave it one more season when it gets easier to change things around.

    The only big target should be another top 6 RW.Most likely to play with Drai on the 2nd line. Then you can run Nuge and 97 with someone cheap and do ok on the top line and Drai has some support on the second line. And if you want to swap Nuge and Drai you still have someone to help Nuge.

    I think the Oilers should be targeting a RD in the draft as there are so many quality choices in the top 10. They are much harder assets to acquire. That player can matriculate as the Russel contract runs out, ideally.

    So you want to stick with Chiarellis plan. Sounds good.

  62. GMB3 says:

    Andy Dufresne: Why is it that all the Chiarelli haters scream at him all year for not being Steve Tambellini last summer and are all now begging him to be SteveTambellini this summer?

    Ever think that all the screaming youve been doing is going to result in yougetting exactly what you fear the most?

    ramble ramble dohtard ramble ramble.

    Glad we got that out of the way.

    Are you aware of the cap situation from last summer? Compare it to the situation this summer.

    Keep fighting the good fight Andy.

  63. Wilde says:

    GMB3,

    I have a feeling the data there doesn’t omit the portion of 97-29’s time together, and therefore isn’t the greatest for forecasting 1line next year, given that I doubt they can afford to pair them for that long next year.

  64. Andy Dufresne says:

    frjohnk:
    I wonder if the Flames fans are talking about the draft like we are

    LOL…..THAT has got to be painful. I know its not an exact match/comparison but I wonder if they are feeling about the Hamonic deal at least a little like we felt a year after the Reinhart deal.

  65. PhrankLee says:

    I pray for no new coach on behalf of Nuge.

    I have heard a few times that Brady Tkachuk is the tougher, meaner and more offensively gifted of the brothers Tkachuk… Would love to have him.

  66. GMB3 says:

    Wilde:
    GMB3,

    I have a feeling the data there doesn’t omit the portion of 97-29’s time together, and therefore isn’t the greatest for forecasting 1line next year, given that I doubt they can afford to pair them for that long next year.

    Yeah I’d like to see the numbers with more context, but iirc in 16-17 the GD with Eberle is comparable to Draisaitl. Moot point I know as he is no longer on the roster and we don’t have 6 million to go out and get a comparable player.

    I also think the results from the other 3 lines are skewed by Mark Letestu’s time as 4C but I’d have to actually look at the numbers and I’m away from a computer

  67. digger50 says:

    jtblack:
    So PC burned a 4th Rounder to bring a backup in that would have cost nothing in the summer?

    PC : each summer there are 6 – 10 backup Goalie available.You do not have to give up any assets to get them. Just try and lick a competent one, that is on your scouts.

    So far the Monster and LB have not worked out.Not sure about Montoya for next year????

    And……. they managed to turn the loss or a fifth rounder into the loss of a fourth rounder , just to get two or three games out of Montoya. Games that had little impact. Surely they could have protected against that loss.

  68. Wilde says:

    GMB3,

    The Puljujarvi GF diff. is also very good, and should get better as sh% improves.

    It’s lower event, though, which I’d say the 1line probably has to crest +20 5v5 for this to be a playoff team.

    I think the only line without Drai to explode like that would be if Yamamoto catches fire. Their HDCF/60 was the best in the league.

    e: Nevermind, McDavid was 77-47 5v5 last year, so 1line probably has to crest THIRTY GOALS above water for playoff contention.

  69. Andy Dufresne says:

    Wilde:
    RNH-McDavid-Rattie

    Caggiula-Draisaitl-Aberg

    Lucic-Strome-Puljujarvi

    Slepyshev-Khaira-Pakarinen

    per Stauffer

    Three of these lines are going to get absolutely caved. Most heinous is giving Draisaitl that to work with instead of Slepyshev-Puljujarvi.

    At least we’re caught up to Slepy atLWbeing a thing. Now they just need to notice playing Khaira-Strome together vs apart is like a 10% shot/chance share swing upwards.

    IMO Conner and Drai are under contract for 8 more years…..nobody is concerned with their performance over the last 10 games of the season…Decisions are still being made on pretty much every other forward. The fact that JP is being forced to earn ice time should be reasuring to those who want him here next year. If he were getting first line minutes and PP1 time it would almost certainly mean hes a potential trade chip.

  70. Andy Dufresne says:

    OilClog: Lol that’s a lot of hope.

    Unlike the majority in here….HOPING….Chiarelli does nothing over the summer.

  71. Scungilli Slushy says:

    I’m wary of Tkachuk. Because his brother outperforms his draft year numbers does not mean he will, or play the same type of game which is the appeal more than his projected NHL points.

    There is usually only one really good brother in almost every case of siblings making the league together. It would be a very Oilers kind of mistake to make. Ugh.

    Svech is going to eat Tkachuk’s lunch. Button is off on this one.

  72. GMB3 says:

    PhrankLee:
    I pray for no new coach on behalf of Nuge.

    I have heard a few times that Brady Tkachuk is the tougher, meaner and more offensively gifted of the brothers Tkachuk… Would love to have him.

    Brady’s Tkachuks rather pedestrian college numbers make me question where you get your information from

  73. JimmyV1965 says:

    OilClog: If the Oilers are moving out their 2nd best all around forward they need to aim for a RHD that moves Larsson into the magical 2nd pairing RHD position or it’s another bleeding assets move.

    Everyone realizes that moving Nuge creates a hole that make take another 6-12 moves to ever recover from Right?

    My fantasy move is trading for Karlsson. Not going to happen. Ultimately, there are very few RHD you can acquire that make trading RNH worthwhile. But there are probably about eight teams that need a C like RNH. If one of them is willing to overspend to get him, you have to consider it. And our GM should be testing the market to see what he can get.

    I love RNH but he isn’t our second best forward. The gap between Drai and RNH is immense. Not even close.

  74. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Wilde:
    natejax97,

    This is what happened to the Lightning in 2016-17.

    – They announced Callahan was out for 5 months (Then actually adapted to shore up the depth; ie not what the Oilers did with Sekera)

    – They drafted 10 kids in the 2016 entry draft, the first 5 immediately posted up arrows

    – They negotiated well and signed Viktor Hedman to a team-friendly contract

    – Then they re-signed all of their successful pro-scouting decisions including Gourde and Morin

    – Then they re-signed their former #1 overall pick to a team friendly contract

    – They bought out a useless player in Matt Carle because his ill-advised contract wasn’t buyout proof

    – Then they stole more FA AHLers from Montreal

    – They then suffered a string of injuries COMPLETELY INCOMPARBLE to the Oilers 2017/18 season, but closely resembling the Oilers 2015-16

    – And still finished with 94 points.

    – Their AHL team lost in the Calder Cup Finals.

    The Oilers are missing the 10 drafted kids, the astute pro signings, the strong farm team (Conacher and Gourde have since come up and scored well for them), both played on the Crunch last year), will end the season about 15 points shy of Tampa’s 94, have bad money that we can’t buy out, and have a history of overpayment to go with the incoming negotiation of our much less talented RFA defenseman.

    Anyone spinning this season as our Bolts 2016, that’s not on the Oilers payroll, needs to look closer. Damn closer.

    I don’t mean this to be directly at you individually, I just see this sentiment all the time and figured I would compile my issues with it.

    Nice post.

    Are you on twitter?

  75. Wilde says:

    Andy Dufresne: IMO Conner and Drai are under contract for 8 more years…..nobody is concerned with their performance over the last 10 games of the season…Decisions are still being made on pretty much every other forward. The fact that JP is being forced to earn ice time should be reasuring to those who want him here next year. If he were getting first line minutes and PP1 time it would almost certainly mean hes a potential trade chip.

    Yes, that’s the point.

    It’s a certainty that that’s not going to be a good line. Whereas say Khaira – Draisaitl – Puljujarvi playing well down the stretch would indicate that we might have a decent 2nd line in the making for next year.

    But Todd McLellan needs over a thousand minutes to figure out that Caggiula is sub-replacement level.

  76. speeds says:

    YKOil:

    [side note: NOT a fan of playing Bear past 9 games, maybe I am missing something but this burns a year doesn’t it? Bring up Jones and give him 9 games instead.]

    Bear is too old for the slide rule – his contract uses a year regardless of how many nhl games he plays.

  77. JimmyV1965 says:

    Connoreah:
    Keep the pick and don’t let the new kid near the roster in October, regardless of how good they look in preseason.

    Don’t trade Nuge or Klef.

    Acquire Athanasiou and a better backup using secondary assets (Caggiula, Benning?) and/or future picks.

    Nuge-McDavid-JP
    Athanasiou-Drai-Yamamoto
    Lucic-Strome-Slepy
    Kassian-JJ-Aberg

    Klef-Larsson
    Nurse-Sekera
    Russel-Bear

    Talbot
    Lehner

    It’s fine to slow play the offseason, but you’re not getting Athanasiou for the Drake or Benning. It’s a little unfair to tell the GM to not move assets, but let’s add Athanasiou for bubble players.

  78. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Andy Dufresne: Why is it that all the Chiarelli haters scream at him all year for not being Steve Tambellini last summer and are all now begging him to be SteveTambellini this summer?

    Ever think that all the screaming youve been doing is going to result in yougetting exactly what you fear the most?

    What exactly did Tambellini do that you’re referring to?

  79. Wilde says:

    Woodguy v2.0: Nice post.

    Are you on twitter?

    Yes, but only to follow/read, I’ve never posted anything.

  80. Andy Dufresne says:

    Wilde:
    Andy Dufresne,

    Okay so, you and Kinger both have brought up this thing where you think it’s hypocritical for people to say they want the management team to do less this summer as opposed to wanting them to do more last summer.

    Allow me an analogy.

    I go over to a friend’s house and their plant is wilting. I tell them to water it.

    I go over to the friends house the next week and their plant is dead. Should I then tell them to water it, because it’s what I said last time, and to do otherwise is hypocritical?

    No. Because the situation is vastly different and you can’t go back in time.

    They need to seed a new plant.

    I agree with the point you are trying to make. My issue is with a subset of the Chiarelli detractors.

    I have issue with much of what Chia has done. I support the critics because I am one.

    Who I take issue with are the group on the far right who rail incensently at what an id*ot he is and how he has f#cked us beyond repair and then, where rubber hits the pavement are “whiney little bitches” who are now preaching patience. Its a significant contradiction IMO.

    Less than half of the Chiarelli critics fall into this category. Each knows who he is.

    I seldom if ever take issue with the criticisms if they are reasoned, at least a little respectful, and are presented in context. Im not at all agianst crticisms just because I dont agree with them…..but there is a line I am not willing to cross in terms of people spewing hate/BS/lies.

  81. Andy Dufresne says:

    Woodguy v2.0: What exactly did Tambellini do that you’re referring to?

    Im using him as a methaphor. His nickname in here, wether deserved or otherwise was “Mr Dithers”

    Dithering.

  82. YKOil says:

    speeds: Bear is too old for the slide rule – his contract uses a year regardless of how many nhl games he plays.

    Thanks speeds, appreciated.

  83. natejax97 says:

    Wilde,

    Yes but time out just a second…

    The 2016-2017 Oilers amassed 103 points and were picked by many analysts, and Vegas odds of competing for a Stanley cup.

    The only changes they made to the roster was Eberle for Strome, and the injury to Sekera that they did not cover.

    So which team is the real team…and what kind of players are Slepy, Cags, Pulji, Benning, etc. moving forward?

    So yes, Tampa has some better depth and a few contracts that now look incredible, but that core has also been together for 4 years plus. The oilers core just wrapping up year 2.

    My point was not to draw a direct comparison from Tampa to Edmonton, that’s not fair. My point is that a down season does not and should not automatically mean removing the coaching staff. Right now Yzerman looks like a genius for not letting Cooper go and not dealing Stammer at the deadline last year. We have a world class coach, maybe 1 year great and 1 year failure means we get 1 more look, and that’s ok with me. And maybe we hang onto Nuge and Klefbom for 1 more look as well.

  84. PhrankLee says:

    GMB3: Brady’s Tkachuks rather pedestrian college numbers make me question where you get your information from

    I heard it from OP (LT) if I recall correctly. And some talking heads out here in Ontario.

    *edit..And Jimmyv1965, apparently,,ha ha.

  85. JimmyV1965 says:

    Scungilli Slushy:
    I’m wary of Tkachuk. Because his brother outperforms his draft year numbers does not mean he will, or play the same type of game which is the appeal more than his projected NHL points.

    There is usually only one really good brother in almost every case of siblings making the league together. It would be a very Oilers kind of mistake to make. Ugh.

    Svech is going to eat Tkachuk’s lunch. Button is off on this one.

    Brady is bigger, faster, tougher and more skilled than his brother. But Matt has been successful because of his hockey IQ. He’s got a brain for the game that makes his good skills even better. He’s better than than the sum of his parts. Even if Brady is a better package he might never be as good as his brother. That’s what makes him such a dangerous pick. I’m all over Svech as well. He’s going to be a beast.

  86. Andy Dufresne says:

    Wilde: Yes, that’s the point.

    It’s a certainty that that’s not going to be a good line. Whereas say Khaira – Draisaitl – Puljujarvi playing well down the stretch would indicate that we might have a decent 2nd line in the making for next year.

    But Todd McLellan needs over a thousand minutes to figure out that Caggiula is sub-replacement level.

    I here ya.

    But I think that TMac use of Caggs was driven by several factors at least one of which I completley agree with,

    1) the one agree with is TMac forced JP, JJ, Sleppy and Strome to earn minutes and PP time. It worked out very well all things concidered

    2) TMac hands are at least constrained by an inadequate/underperfoming roster.

    3) Who knows what kind of commitments are being made to these college free agent signings

    4) Caggs like Benning is a hard guy to get a hanlde on. Their numbers are weak but their play is always good enough to entice you into thinking that if you got rid of them they might blossom on another team.

    I hope they either move Caggs or sign him at league minimum as a bottom six energy type guy….problem with that is he is not a good PK man.

  87. GMB3 says:

    Andy Dufresne: I agree with the point you are trying to make.My issue is with a subset of the Chiarelli detractors.

    I have issue with much of what Chia has done. I support the critics because I am one.

    Who I take issue with are the group on the far right who rail incensently at what an id*ot he is and how he has f#cked us beyond repair and then, where rubber hits the pavement are “whiney little bitches” who are now preaching patience. Its a significant contradiction IMO.

    Less than half of the Chiarelli critics fall into this category. Each knows who he is.

    I seldom if ever take issue with the criticisms if they are reasoned, at least a little respectful, and are presented in context. Im not at all agianst crticisms just because I dont agree with them…..but there is a line I am not willing to cross in terms of people spewing hate/BS/lies.

    It’s only a significant contradiction if you’re unable to grasp the logic behind why an opinion can shift and change over time.

    The goal posts aren’t where they were 10 months ago.

    “Whiny little bitches”… is that not exactly what you are? Post after post, hour after hour, day after day, blindly arguing on a Chiarelli’s behalf with no substance or reason? Hardy har har, posts littered with donkey noises, dotards, and Chiarelli’s “poison pill”

    Last summer, many of the Chiarelli detractors are on board with the Jokinen signing. It did not work out, but it’s easy to understand the logic and the rationale behind it. The cap space was available to make a play to find some cover for Sekera’s injury. Nothing happened.

    Our prospect cupboard is bare, cap space is no longer an asset. It’s time we rebuild the cupboard, stockpile young players. Wait until Russell and Sekera become more moveable. The team will be better next year with better special teams and a return to form from Talbot.

    seems pretty simple to me

  88. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Andy Dufresne: Im using him as a methaphor. His nickname in here, wether deserved or otherwise was “Mr Dithers”

    Dithering.

    Tambellini’s moves can best be described as “signing below replacement FAs, drafting poorly after the first round and not much else”

    I don’t see how that applies to Peter at all.

  89. Wilde says:

    natejax97,

    The Oilers didn’t just “only” change out Eberle for Strome and lose Sekera. They bought out Pouliot,, lost Pitlick, and were relying on both the repetition of career years by 4 or 5 players AND a step forward by every youngster to even come close to replicating a 103 point campaign that was partially fueled by stellar goaltending.

    Tampa Bay didn’t fire their coach because they didn’t have the worst special teams in the league, even though they were more injured than the Oilers were this past season.

    They also didn’t fire their coach because he made the finals the year before.

    Our coach doesn’t have that history of success, and we already traded away Stamkos.

    It’s not one year of great and one poor, it’s two poor years and one great. McLellan was there for 2015-16.

    The lessons from Tampa are many. One of them is getting a good coach and keeping him.

  90. GMB3 says:

    natejax97:
    Wilde,

    Yes but time out just a second…

    The 2016-2017 Oilers amassed 103 points and were picked by many analysts, and Vegas odds of competing for a Stanley cup.

    The only changes they made to the roster was Eberle for Strome, and the injury to Sekera that they did not cover.

    So which team is the real team…and what kind of players are Slepy, Cags, Pulji, Benning, etc. moving forward?

    So yes, Tampa has some better depth and a few contracts that now look incredible, but that core has also been together for 4 years plus.The oilers core just wrapping up year 2.

    My point was not to draw a direct comparison from Tampa to Edmonton, that’s not fair.My point is that a down season does not and should not automatically mean removing the coaching staff.Right now Yzerman looks like a genius for not letting Cooper go and not dealing Stammer at the deadline last year.We have a world class coach, maybe 1 year great and 1 year failure means we get 1 more look, and that’s ok with me.And maybe we hang onto Nuge and Klefbom for 1 more look as well.

    The Lightning barely missed the playoffs and had fairly serious injury problems. If Draisaitl missed most the season and we finished with 94 points I’m not sure people would be calling for Todd Mclellans head.

    Our special teams are definitely world class.

  91. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Wilde: Yes, but only to follow/read, I’ve never posted anything.

    I want to put your post on twitter (with your permission) and credit your twitter account.

    You cool with that?

  92. OilClog says:

    JimmyV1965: My fantasy move is trading for Karlsson. Not going to happen. Ultimately, there are very few RHD you can acquire that make trading RNH worthwhile. But there are probably about eight teams that need a C like RNH. If one of them is willing to overspend to get him, you have to consider it. And our GM should be testing the market to see what he can get.

    I love RNH but he isn’t our second best forward. The gap between Drai and RNH is immense. Not even close.

    Hmmm… disagree.

    Pts per game – Nuge .67 – Leon .77… one has played with Hall or Mcdavids line for 90% of his time.
    Giveaway-takeaway Nuge 235-308 Drai 221-198.. clearly Nuge is better on the defensive side.

    The last 5 games of Leon playing with what Nuge has been left to play with while Nuge gets Mcdavid..
    Small sample size alert but they end up looking a lot like eachother.

    Leon 2pts -4 11sog as the second line C
    Nuge 5pts(1ppg) +6 18sog as Mcdavids Leon.

    Nuge is extremely talented, not his deal that the Oilers brow beaten him into being a Shut down C.

    It’s imperative that the Oilers find a scoring winger that can contribute now, or whoever is the 2nd line C will always be undervalued.

    Has Nuge ever been accused of only skating for himself?

    I like Leon but Nuge has extreme value, they’re equally as important.

  93. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Andy Dufresne,

    Who I take issue with are the group on the far right who rail incensently at what an id*ot he is and how he has f#cked us beyond repair and then, where rubber hits the pavement are “whiney little bitches” who are now preaching patience. Its a significant contradiction IMO.

    Less than half of the Chiarelli critics fall into this category. Each knows who he is.

    If you’re throwing shit, then name names.

    I don’t think anyone is that black and white except maybe Carmel and he’s given Peter props for a few moves.

    When you and Kinger do this is just strikes me as a weak strawman.

    Please name em so they can defend themselves.

  94. Wilde says:

    Andy Dufresne: I here ya.

    But I think that TMac use of Caggs was driven by several factors at least one of which I completley agree with,

    1) the one agree with is TMac forced JP, JJ, Sleppy and Strome to earn minutes and PP time. It worked out very well all things concidered

    2) TMac hands are at least constrained by an inadequate/underperfoming roster.

    3) Who knows what kind of commitments are being made to these college free agent signings

    4) Caggs like Benning is a hard guy to get a hanlde on. Their numbers are weak but their play is always good enough to entice you into thinking that if you got rid of them they might blossom on another team.

    I hope they either move Caggs or sign him at league minimum as a bottom six energy type guy….problem with that is he is not a good PK man.

    1) I don’t see how it can be argued that McLellan deploys based on objective merit. That’s the façade, but at any point it can be waved away with stuff like ‘needing to see if Strome and Khaira can centre their own lines” and “needing to get Lucic going” and “stopping Pulju from gripping his stick”.

    Further to that point, I don’t know what the things are that have to be considered for Tmc’s deployment to have “worked out pretty well all things considered”

    2) In terms of performance of the team, and wins and losses, yes his hands are pretty tied. But in terms of individual players’ development, 98 and 58 could probably both have had 20 more points on the season if they were deployed on skill lines with decent minutes. It would also help the team win.

    What he’s done instead is a lose-lose: suboptimal results in team performance and individual deployment both.

    3) If Caggiula’s agent managed to get him guaranteed ice time in the top 9, two years out from ink to paper, that’s another indictment of Chiarelli’s negotiation processes.

    If it was simply “x minutes”, then Caggiula should have just been put on the 4line forever, based on merit, where he’s had his only success.

    4) The numbers are pretty strong for Benning, both years, context considered. Caggiula’s one of the worst regular NHLers by the same metrics. They’re not in the same boat.

  95. OilClog says:

    Andy Dufresne: I here ya.

    But I think that TMac use of Caggs was driven by several factors at least one of which I completley agree with,

    1) the one agree with is TMac forced JP, JJ, Sleppy and Strome to earn minutes and PP time. It worked out very well all things concidered

    2) TMac hands are at least constrained by an inadequate/underperfoming roster.

    3) Who knows what kind of commitments are being made to these college free agent signings

    4) Caggs like Benning is a hard guy to get a hanlde on. Their numbers are weak but their play is always good enough to entice you into thinking that if you got rid of them they might blossom on another team.

    I hope they either move Caggs or sign him at league minimum as a bottom six energy type guy….problem with that is he is not a good PK man.

    1. Lucic defeats this philosophy
    2. TMac made several good players look inadequate with his systems while they now succeed in other towns. The performance of the roster is a indication of the coaches.
    3. If you sign with us top 6 minutes in abundance!… yea no, it’s the coaches call. Especially when the damn GM has been pining for Leon to be centering his own line for 2 years and he’s done it for about a month total over that time.
    4. What’s hard to get a handle on with Caggs? He’s a energy player with some grit that should never be above checking line status.

    Coach and GM have never been on the same page, they are both extremely guilty of pissing away talent in the wind.

    Fire the wind!

  96. speeds says:

    Some are maybe suggesting the OIlers should strongly look at moving their pick for immediate help, depending on the deal. OK, fair enough.

    But, as a counterargument and mostly for the sake of discussion, would you look at trading rnh or Klefbom in a deal involving a pick somewhere in the 4-8 range?

  97. Wilde says:

    Woodguy v2.0: I want to put your post on twitter (with your permission) and credit your twitter account.

    You cool with that?

    I’d rather just be credited as ‘token Lowetide.ca poster’

  98. pts2pndr says:

    Andy Dufresne: Why is it that all the Chiarelli haters scream at him all year forbeing Steve Tambellini last summer and are all now begging him to be SteveTambellini this summer?

    Ever think that all the screaming youve been doing is going to result in yougetting exactly what you fear the most?

    Chia made ( in my opinion) one truly egregious error last year in signing Chris Russel to a no movement contract, that for this year leaves his hands tied unless he bleeds talent trading Nuge or Klefbom! Logically speaking his options appear very limited!

  99. godot10 says:

    The Oilers greatest need is a new coaching staff.

    One cannot properly evaluate players without a good coaching staff.

  100. russ99 says:

    To me the much bigger issue for next season is what to do with all the RFAs who have performed poorly.

    We can’t dump them all, but we can’t pay these guys a lot more when you can sign a veteran NHL player after the first week of FA for $1-1.5M with vastly better results.

    I’d move anyone but McDavid, Draisaitl and Nurse if the return filled a vital need. I’d move RNH before Klefbom due to salary, that Oscar hasn’t hit his potential yet, while Nuge has likely hit his, and that 50pt two-way center is a lot easier to acquire than a quality puck moving defensemen, even if the defense part isn’t there yet.

    But I’d move either of them if we can fix some of the roster ails with good NHL talent instead of kids, retreads or has-beens.

  101. Wilde says:

    godot10,

    It’s worse than that.

    It’s not just evaluation.

    Jesse Puljujarvi arrived at a very young age. We’re watching his raw, formative momentia as a pro hockey player, under Todd McLellan. Terrifying. You don’t get this time back.

    Anton Slepyshev is being lost as an asset.

    Juhjar Khaira, most outstandingly is being wasted.

    I know you know this, but I think it should be tacked on to every argument for a coaching change.

  102. russ99 says:

    godot10:
    The Oilers greatest need is a new coaching staff.

    One cannot properly evaluate players without a good coaching staff.

    Coaches generally don’t evaluate, and the Oilers players are who they are for the most part. We’re not going to see Benning turn into a Karlsson or Caggiula turn into a Stamkos with a new coach.

  103. godot10 says:

    russ99:
    To me the much bigger issue for next season is what to do with all the RFAs who have performed poorly.

    We can’t dump them all, but we can’t pay these guys a lot more when you can sign a veteran NHL player after the first week of FA for $1-1.5M with vastly better results.

    I’d move anyone but McDavid, Draisaitl and Nurse if the return filled a vital need. I’d move RNH before Klefbom due to salary,t hat Oscar hasn’t hit his potential yet, while Nuge has likely hit his, and that 50pt two-way center is a lot easier to acquire than a quality puck moving defensemen, even if the defense part isn’t there yet.

    But I’d move either of them if we can fix some of the roster ails with good NHL talent instead of kids, retreads or has-beens.

    You likely cannot find a better winger for McDavid for the money and term than Nugent-Hopkins. You cannot find a better insurance policy for injuries to your top two centres than Nugent-Hopkins.

    Unless another GM has a lapse of sanity, it is pretty much impossible to improve the roster via a Nugent-Hopkins trade.

  104. russ99 says:

    Wilde:
    godot10,

    It’s worse than that.

    It’s not just evaluation.

    Jesse Puljujarvi arrived at a very young age. We’re watching his raw, formative momentia as a pro hockey player, under Todd McLellan. Terrifying. You don’t get this time back.

    Anton Slepyshev is being lost as an asset.

    Juhjar Khaira, most outstandingly is being wasted.

    I know you know this, but I think it should be tacked on to every argument for a coaching change.

    You develop players in the AHL, not the NHL. That’s not McLellan’s mistake.

    And secondly, he’s being sheltered. For good reason, some of his mistakes are egregious, and would shatter the confidence of a kid if he were playing a profile role, kind of the reverse of what Eakins did to Yak.

    Just because an NHL coach doesn’t deploy players like you’d prefer doesn’t mean he’s incompetent. He’s in the room and knows the mentality, fitness and compete level of his players, we don’t. All we do is speculate.

    That said, the line shuffling and position changing hurts more than it helps, and McLellan can take lessons from this season as much as the players can.

  105. godot10 says:

    russ99: Coaches generally don’t evaluate, and the Oilers players are who they are for the most part. We’re not going to see Benning turn into a Karlsson or Caggiula turn into a Stamkos with a new coach.

    I didn’t say the coaches do the evaluation. The management cannot properly evaluate the team they have assembled if they have a poor coaching staff.

    Poor coaching has led management to make the wrong decision on Schultz, Hall, Eberle, Pitlick, Kassian, and Russell.

    And arguably on Lander, Yakupov, and Pouliot. And possibly on Reinhart.

  106. russ99 says:

    godot10: You likely cannot find a better winger for McDavid for the money and term than Nugent-Hopkins. You cannot find a better insurance policy for injuries to your top two centres than Nugent-Hopkins.

    Unless another GM has a lapse of sanity, it is pretty much impossible to improve the roster via a Nugent-Hopkins trade.

    Nugent-Hopkins isn’t a winger. He’s a center and he should be used as such. This is due to us having a dearth of NHL wingers, an abberation that needs to be corrected next year.

    And you can look at the scoring charts and find lots of wingers who could help for less than $6M.

  107. Woogie63 says:

    How the Oiler’s handle Nurse this Spring/Summer will be interesting…

    Can Bob get him on Team Canada?
    Is it a bridge contract to help the 2018 cap?
    If not to the bridge is he more valuable than Klefbom or Larsson?
    Is there any truth to the Nurse/Draisaitl divide in the room?

  108. JimmyV1965 says:

    OilClog: Hmmm… disagree.

    Pts per game – Nuge .67 – Leon .77… one has played with Hall or Mcdavids line for 90% of his time.
    Giveaway-takeaway Nuge 235-308 Drai 221-198.. clearly Nuge is better on the defensive side.

    The last 5 games of Leon playing with what Nuge has been left to play with while Nuge gets Mcdavid..
    Small sample size alert but they end up looking a lot like eachother.

    Leon 2pts -4 11sog as the second line C
    Nuge 5pts(1ppg) +6 18sog as Mcdavids Leon.

    Nuge is extremely talented, not his deal that the Oilers brow beaten him into being a Shut down C.

    It’s imperative that the Oilers find a scoring winger that can contribute now, or whoever is the 2nd line C will always be undervalued.

    Has Nuge ever been accused of only skating for himself?

    I like Leon but Nuge has extreme value, they’re equally as important.

    You’re not actually comparing their career numbers are you? At this stage, Drai’s career numbers will be scewed by his first 40 games. Maybe compare the last two seasons.

  109. frjohnk says:

    We kinda knew the depth behind the first line was not great but…..

    dellowhockey
    ‏Verified account @dellowhockey
    3h3 hours ago

    The Oilers have the fourth best first line in the NHL this year by goal difference. They have the 27th best second-fourth lines. Unfortunately, lines 2-4 have gotten more than twice as much TOI as line 1.
    7 replies 7 retweets 43 likes

  110. Wilde says:

    russ99: You develop players in the AHL, not the NHL. That’s not McLellan’s mistake.

    And secondly, he’s being sheltered. For good reason, some of his mistakes are egregious, and would shatter the confidence of a kid if he were playing a profile role, kind of the reverse of what Eakins did to Yak.

    Just because an NHL coach doesn’t deploy players like you’d prefer doesn’t mean he’s incompetent. He’s in the room and knows the mentality, fitness and compete level of his players, we don’t. All we do is speculate.

    That said, the line shuffling and position changing hurts more than it helps, and McLellan can take lessons from this season as much as the players can.

    I’m not going to touch the abstractness of the NHL vs AHL for development thing.

    Here’s the thing about sheltering Puljujarvi: He doesn’t need it.

    His ‘egregious’ mistakes? No more harmful than anyone elses. Shattering his confidence by making mistakes on the top line? Maybe it would be tempered by the growth of his confidence from scoring on the top line. Isn’t this development talk? That shouldn’t happen in the NHL?

    He’s objectively been the 2nd best RW 97’s had, behind Draisaitl.

    As in, for winning games. Scoring more goals than you give up. That sort of thing.

    And I didn’t call McLellan incompetent. Why pretend I did?

  111. Durag says:

    frjohnk:
    We kinda knew the depth behind the first line was not great but…..

    dellowhockey
    ‏Verified account @dellowhockey
    3h3 hours ago

    The Oilers have the fourth best first line in the NHL this year by goal difference. They have the 27th best second-fourth lines. Unfortunately, lines 2-4 have gotten more than twice as much TOI as line 1.
    7 replies 7 retweets 43 likes

    It’s almost like the GM and the coach….are bad

  112. digger50 says:

    OilClog: Hmmm… disagree.

    Pts per game – Nuge .67 – Leon .77… one has played with Hall or Mcdavids line for 90% of his time.
    Giveaway-takeaway Nuge 235-308 Drai 221-198.. clearly Nuge is better on the defensive side.

    The last 5 games of Leon playing with what Nuge has been left to play with while Nuge gets Mcdavid..
    Small sample size alert but they end up looking a lot like eachother.

    Leon 2pts -4 11sog as the second line C
    Nuge 5pts(1ppg) +6 18sog as Mcdavids Leon.

    Nuge is extremely talented, not his deal that the Oilers brow beaten him into being a Shut down C.

    It’s imperative that the Oilers find a scoring winger that can contribute now, or whoever is the 2nd line C will always be undervalued.

    Has Nuge ever been accused of only skating for himself?

    I like Leon but Nuge has extreme value, they’re equally as important.

    Excellent eye opening post

    Thanks

  113. digger50 says:

    My kid says

    “Dad we just suck cause we sent lots of good players, and the ones we got back are not as good”

    Yup, about as simple as that.

  114. pts2pndr says:

    russ99,

    My question would be for how much less than 6 million and would they also have the versatlity to play center and kill penalties. Trading a known quantity for a looks good from a distance is a very risky proposition! Can we afford to be wrong at this stage of the game team wise?

  115. YKOil says:

    speeds:
    Some are maybe suggesting the OIlers should strongly look at moving their pick for immediate help, depending on the deal.OK, fair enough.

    But, as a counterargument and mostly for the sake of discussion, would you look at trading rnh or Klefbom in a deal involving a pick somewhere in the 4-8 range?

    Already stated where I stand on this, that said, maybe Klef if I have decided that:

    1. Lucic, Sekera and Russell will never be movable in trade and
    2. therefore I am sacrificing the 2018-2019 and 2019-2020 years outright and
    3. that 2020-2021 is when I can start test driving my ‘safe-from-expansion’ shiny 2018 draft pick because
    4. 2020-2021 is when I can trade or expire the Sekera/Russell log-jam and
    5. 2020-2021 is also when I can see the light at the end of tunnel per the Lucic chains and
    6. the team should finally be able to put together a core to support McDavid in the 4th year of his new deal

    I would also have to decide that I am man enough to apologize to McDavid and the Oilers fan-base for f&*king up half of his contract.

    Or something like that. Maybe.

    Just heard about Karlsson. May the sun find him and his, my thoughts and prayers to them.

  116. Professor Q says:

    YKOil,

    Holy moly. Indeed; heartbreaking. So many players have lost family members and children this season. Tragic, truly.

  117. jtblack says:

    godot10: I didn’t say the coaches do the evaluation.The management cannot properly evaluate the team they have assembled if they have a poor coaching staff.

    Poor coaching has led management to make the wrong decision on Schultz, Hall, Eberle, Pitlick, Kassian, and Russell.

    And arguably on Lander, Yakupov, and Pouliot.And possibly on Reinhart.

    Are you sugggesting that every player should make the NHL ? Reinhart? If you are pinning that on TMac, you are reaching.

    To your point, usage plays a great deal into the overall value a player may or may not have. And yes TMac has mishandled some of the names above.

  118. Bruce McCurdy says:

    McSorley33:
    Quick update on Alex Debrincat:

    The rookie winger recorded his **third** hat trick of the season in the team’s 5-4 loss to the Blues on Sunday. He’s now *** tied alongside Patrick Kane with a team-high 25 goals***

    https://chicago.suntimes.com/sports/alex-debrincat-hat-trick-blackhawks-blues-highlights-nhl/

    25 goals + 20 assists in 73 games.

    Maybe we can sign an old UFA free agent to play RW with McDavid next year?

    True story: I DM’d the video of DeBrincat’s hat trick goal to our kind host in response to his reference the other day of Mike Bossy’s release. That is quite a weapon.

  119. Professor Q says:

    Bruce McCurdy: True story: I DM’d the video of DeBrincat’s hat trick goal to our kind host in response to his reference the other day of Mike Bossy’s release. That is quite a weapon.

    I really wanted him on Draft Day. There were reports of issues with his attitude and aggressiveness though, and he played more with Strome than McDavid, but it could have been nice.

    Raddysh was doing well also, and is bigger. Damned Lightning…

  120. McSorley33 says:

    Bruce McCurdy,

    True story: I DM’d the video of DeBrincat’s hat trick goal to our kind host in response to his reference the other day of Mike Bossy’s release. That is quite a weapon.
    ******************************************************************************
    Indeed.

    This kid looks headed for a nice career.

  121. McSorley33 says:

    speeds,

    Great question.

  122. RonnieB says:

    digger50: And……. they managed to turn the loss or a fifth rounder into the loss of a fourth rounder , just to get two or three games out of Montoya. Games that had little impact. Surely they could have protected against that loss.

    1 There is little statistical difference between a 4th and a 5th round pick when it comes to their chance of making it to the NHL.
    2. If the Oilers see a player they want in the 4th round they should have very little trouble findind a GM willing to make a deal for one of the surplus 2019 3rd round picks.
    3. If Chiarelli openly and deliberately circumvented the terms of a trade as you suggest, do you think that would improve or hurt his ability to find willing trade partners in the future ?

  123. Gayfish says:

    Hasn’t the giveaway-takeaway stat been rebutted several times?

  124. Gayfish says:

    I really wanted benson, but about half as much as I wanted Debrincat.

  125. jtblack says:

    RonnieB: 1There is little statistical difference between a 4th and a 5th round pick when it comes to their chance of making it to the NHL.
    2.If the Oilers see a player they want in the 4th round they should have very little trouble findind a GM willing to make a deal for one of the surplus 2019 3rd round picks.
    3.If Chiarelli openly and deliberately circumvented the terms of a trade as you suggest, do you think that would improve or hurt his ability to find willing trade partners in the future ?

    Interpretation:

    1) who cares. all the same
    2) Instead of 1 – 5th round draft pick for Montoya. You are suggesting it is the 4th we gave up AND may as well burn a 3rd to pick in the 4th. **THIS IS ASSET DESTRUCTION**
    3) ????

  126. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Wilde: I’d rather just be credited as ‘token Lowetide.ca poster’

    As you wish sir.

    Will get to it when I get to a desk top.

    I appreciate the permission.

    Great post

  127. Yeti says:

    When we talk of potential trade candidates to address glaring winger or RHD holes in the roster, why does Nurse’s name not come up? For instance, if we are looking to get a strong RHD, trading Nurse from a position of strength (LD) would seem to be more productive than the other names that are being thrown around. I get that he’s part of the ‘McDavid age cluster’, but he would certainly have the kind of trade value that Klefbom wouldn’t have after a mixed season, whilst Sekera and Russel are likely unmovable owing to NTCs.

  128. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Wilde: I’d rather just be credited as ‘token Lowetide.ca poster’

    You are not a token imo.

    Voice of reason and sanity.

  129. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    godot10: You likely cannot find a better winger for McDavid for the money and term than Nugent-Hopkins. You cannot find a better insurance policy for injuries to your top two centres than Nugent-Hopkins.

    Unless another GM has a lapse of sanity, it is pretty much impossible to improve the roster via a Nugent-Hopkins trade.

    As someone who is open to trading RNH for the right return this is a very compelling argument.

    This team needs a 2RD so freaking bad though…..

    If Peter had not given Russell 2nd pair money and traded a 3rd liner for Demers we wouldn’t be having this discussion.

    I never understood “trade RNH for a winger” talk.

    2RD is a more critical spot and waaaaay tougher to get so I’m open to moving talent for that, but maybe not RNH

  130. blainer says:

    godot10: You likely cannot find a better winger for McDavid for the money and term than Nugent-Hopkins. You cannot find a better insurance policy for injuries to your top two centres than Nugent-Hopkins.

    Unless another GM has a lapse of sanity, it is pretty much impossible to improve the roster via a Nugent-Hopkins trade.

    This is the best post I have ever read from you. I could not agree more. Trading this player will set this team back big time. We will curse this trade just like Hall’s if it happens.

    For me I don’t trade Klef either but if Chia does choose between the two I keep hoppy.

    Oh and I agree with the coaching comments you make also. The deployment of our lineup has been crazy from the outset of the season. I have zero confidence in this group going forward.

    If Chia doesn’t want to make that move then he should go as well.

  131. pts2pndr says:

    Yeti:
    When we talk of potential trade candidates to address glaring winger or RHD holes in the roster, why does Nurse’s name not come up? For instance, if we are looking to get a strong RHD, trading Nurse from a position of strength (LD) would seem to be more productive than the other names that are being thrown around. I get that he’s part of the ‘McDavid age cluster’, but he would certainly have the kind of trade value that Klefbom wouldn’t have after a mixed season, whilst Sekera and Russel are likely unmovable owing to NTCs.

    Nurse’s value is greater than that of Klefbom with a chance to be a bonafide first pairing defenseman. He is younger and without a history of injury! Oh did I mention he brings a physicalty that is sorely needed on the back end. IMO he will be the full pkg d man that every team seeks! That is why you do not trade him!

  132. frjohnk says:

    Woodguy v2.0: As someone who is open to trading RNH for the right return this is a very compelling argument.

    This team needs a 2RD so freaking bad though…..

    If Peter had not given Russell 2nd pair money and traded a 3rd liner for Demers we wouldn’t be having this discussion.

    I never understood “trade RNH for a winger” talk.

    2RD is a more critical spot and waaaaay tougher to get so I’m open to moving talent for that, but maybe not RNH

    Even if the Oilers get close to full value in a RNH trade to get a RHD, its again robbing Peter to pay Paul. Its mostly a sideways move.

    Chia or whoever his replacement is if he gets loaded into the cannon, need to be creative. Instead of creating a new hole by trading good to very good players to fill a previous hole, the GM has to somehow find a way to fill a hole without creating another one. Yeah, there isnt much cap room to do a Braden Schenn type deal and there is not much for prospects, but this team needs to somehow turn a double into a triple instead of turning a triple into a double or even a single.

    EDIT: Last week, the talk was about trading RNH for Hoffman, with the Oilers playing Carolina tonight, it shouldnt be long until Spector says something about trading RNH for Faulk.

  133. pts2pndr says:

    Woodguy v2.0,

    I also agree. My question is how close are we to filling it internally ie Berglund or Bear. Would it not be more prudent to try to find an older ufa type for 1 or 2 years. Is that realistic or a mission impossible? My thought is the more right D we draft and develope is a lot like mining for gold. Your thoughts?

  134. OilClog says:

    When Nuge is moved for a 2nd pairing mythical RHD, who’s covering the 45 bases Nuge covers? Who on this roster could actually replace Nuge on the PK?

    JimmyV1965: You’re not actually comparing their career numbers are you? At this stage, Drai’s career numbers will be scewed by his first 40 games. Maybe compare the last two seasons.

    I compared the last 5 games just to put it into perspective, up to this point in their careers guess what, Nuge is the guy they throw out to cover the tough assignments while Leon has gotten Mcdavid minutes or soft comps.

    Hasn’t Nuge’s #’s been skewered since the day Eakins arrived and hammered him into a defensive position because before Mcdavid, he was the only Center on the team to have any actual hockey ability.

    PK this season.

    Nuge – Minutes – 93 – mistakes on grade A per 16 – .17
    Leon – 64 – .41

    Nuge gets traded, Leon is thrusted into his minutes.. it will not be kind at 8.5million. His offense will suffer as he’s forced to take a more defensive roll which isn’t his strong suit.

    Trading Nuge is a trade they’ll never break even let alone thoughts of winning or improving the team.

    Keeping the 3 C’s running two together and finding an actual fellow forward that can goal the puck will ensure they have a quality top 6. Trading one of the three and installing a winger.. well it will be the more of the same. 1 top line, a second line with bottom 6 parts.

    Yes the Oilers need a 2nd pairing right hand D or even better yet someone that makes Larsson that player, but taking away from the One strength the Oilers have with their 3 C’s to fill that Hole leaves this team sorely drained on actual talent for Leon and Connor to play with.

    To me especially with the recent Nuge injury Oilers team record… I can’t see another team sending back the required value no matter who the GM is. Trading Nuge is a move they lose in several aspects that will likely take the team years to recover from. Just like every other short term boneheaded rash bullshit decision they make.

  135. Wilde says:

    Yeti:
    When we talk of potential trade candidates to address glaring winger or RHD holes in the roster, why does Nurse’s name not come up? For instance, if we are looking to get a strong RHD, trading Nurse from a position of strength (LD) would seem to be more productive than the other names that are being thrown around. I get that he’s part of the ‘McDavid age cluster’, but he would certainly have the kind of trade value that Klefbom wouldn’t have after a mixed season, whilst Sekera and Russel are likely unmovable owing to NTCs.

    Because it’s been set in stone that he’s part of the indispensable nucleus of the team on measures that could not be described as objective and it has been this way for a very, very long time.

    This has extended to some of the fanbase as well.

  136. Scungilli Slushy says:

    YKOil: Don’t necessarily agree with that.Seattle will probably come in on the same player protection plan as Vegas and they will be picking off of 2019-2020 rosters.A quick look at the possible 2019-2020 roster: McDavid, Draisaitl, Nugent-Hopkins, Lucic (NMC), Puljujarvi, Benson, Yamamoto and then Nurse, Larsson, Klefbom, Bear, Sekera (NMC), Russell (NMC) means that Edmonton is on the 4×4 plan again.

    Any decent player added via trade of the 2018 pick increases the cost of protecting the decent players let unprotected so, unless your goal is to mitigate risk by dumping Lucic, Russell and Sekera BEFORE the expansion draft (a tall order in my opinion), the easiest way to mitigate risk is to keep the 2018 pick and dump one of Sekera/Russell and, if possible, Lucic (still a hard task but doable).

    [side note: NOT a fan of playing Bear past 9 games, maybe I am missing something but this burns a year doesn’t it? Bring up Jones and give him 9 games instead.]

    Of interest, say the Oiler’s do win the golden ticket and draft Dahlin… do you play him right away and increase your expansion draft “costs” or do you hold him back a year or two to ensure he isn’t eligible?What am I saying… it’s the Oiler’s, of course they would play him immediately.

    I trend toward asset protection and asset-base build right now.Given I see the Sekera and Russell contracts as the biggest threat to the Oilers ability to protect/maximize/grow the asset base those are the assets I focus my trade efforts on. (Normally I would mention Lucic’s contract but… welll… that f&*king contract will need to be paired with a late 1st rounder or a compliance buy-out to be cleared so it isn’t even an option this year).

    Teams to look to trade with re: Sekera include (in order): Buffalo [Moulson], Montreal [Schlemko], Ottawa [MacArthur, eat salary], NY Islanders [eat salary], Columbus (eat salary) and maybe Carolina [Kruger].The info in the brackets indicate areas where the Oilers can play in order to increase trade return.

    Montreal, Buffalo, Ottawa and the NY Islanders absolutely need to improve their defenses, Columbus is looking a big turnover in their commitments on defense and Carolina is a possible play given Sekera once played there.

    The NMC’s are an issue but maybe Sekera is ready to move back east?

    Chia’s moves, dammit, depressing. F&*k.

    If Luc was going to waive I think Seattle might be a team that would motivate him. Especially if he’s still underperforming. Would they take him? Maybe because of what his player type is, sweetener etc.

    As for Dahlin, unless he’s not ready every team would play him. They all want elite players.

    I think he will likely be able to play 2 D pretty quick once in. Elite players get to speed quickly.It would allow the Oilers to move a leftie for help elsewhere. A RD or significant young forward. Assuming the GM doesn’t trade him for a loss, that couldn’t happen right?

    Of course it’s not going to happen. We can dream.

  137. godot10 says:

    Yeti:
    When we talk of potential trade candidates to address glaring winger or RHD holes in the roster, why does Nurse’s name not come up? For instance, if we are looking to get a strong RHD, trading Nurse from a position of strength (LD) would seem to be more productive than the other names that are being thrown around. I get that he’s part of the ‘McDavid age cluster’, but he would certainly have the kind of trade value that Klefbom wouldn’t have after a mixed season, whilst Sekera and Russel are likely unmovable owing to NTCs.

    Nurse is good and is going to get better. Oates will help him again this summer.

    He has all the important tools in his toolbox, and the ones where you can get him signed for a long term at reasonable money.

    It would be next to impossible to find a right shot version with the equivalent tools at the same reasonable price point for the same duration.

    Sekera and Russell become limited NTC after next season. Don’t make a second mistake compounding the first one (signing Russell long term).

    A healthy Sekera should be tradeable. No reason he shouldn’t be close to normal by the fall.

    Build around Larsson, Klefbom, and Nurse.

  138. frjohnk says:

    godot10: Build around Larsson, Klefbom, and Nurse

    yup.

  139. OilClog says:

    With Nuge’s skill set he could easily reach 40 before he hangs them up, that’s 16 years from now. The Oilers have a chance to built their team for the next 12 years with 97,93, and 29 as their foundation. Why would anyone not move heaven and earth to figure out the solution to build around these guys?

    It’s great that it’s coming out that Puljujarvi is frustrated and dispirited being stuck in the bottom 6, they’ve literally shitted his ELC all over their dinner plates.

    Rattie, Aberg, and Drake the unkillable that’s the important place to concentrate development.

    Don’t be surprised when Jesse is shipped out of town for a 2021 3rd rounder if he scored 20goals for Tampa.

  140. who says:

    godot10: Nurse is good and is going to get better.Oates will help him again this summer.

    He has all the important tools in his toolbox, and the ones where you can get him signed for a long term at reasonable money.

    It would be next to impossible to find a right shot version with the equivalent tools at the same reasonable price point for the same duration.

    Sekera and Russell become limited NTC after next season. Don’t make a second mistake compounding the first one (signing Russell long term).

    A healthy Sekera should be tradeable. No reason he shouldn’t be close to normal by the fall.

    Build around Larsson, Klefbom, and Nurse.

    Double yup.
    Those three dmen, Macdavid. Drai, Nuge, JP and hopefully the 2018 1st. These are the pieces you build around. If you can improve the team by moving someone else then go ahead and do it. But leave the core alone.

  141. Scungilli Slushy says:

    OilClog:
    With Nuge’s skill set he could easily reach 40 before he hangs them up, that’s 16 years from now. The Oilers have a chance to built their team for the next 12 years with 97,93, and 29 as their foundation. Why would anyone not move heaven and earth to figure out the solution to build around these guys?

    It’s great that it’s coming out that Puljujarvi is frustrated and dispirited being stuck in the bottom 6, they’ve literally shitted his ELC all over their dinner plates.

    Rattie, Aberg, and Drake the unkillable that’s the important place to concentrate development.

    Don’t be surprised when Jesse is shipped out of town for a 2021 3rd rounder if he scored 20goals for Tampa.

    It’ll be interesting to see what they do with Drake. He’s had a glorious chance to prove himself, I still see a marginal 4th liner. He can’t get defensive play down and doesn’t have NHL finish. He’s a mature prospect, I think we know what we have.

    Sadly probably Slepy too. But I think Slepy has more use because I see his game as better overall and he’s got size with his speed, it remains a physical game after all, but I think he’s also a bottom sixer. He may prefer going home, but the NHL paycheques cash.

  142. Lowetide says:

    Rattie shouldn’t blindly shoot the puck in. Carry or pass to one of his linemates.

  143. Chelios is a Dinosaur says:

    Does Chris Russell still lead the league in blocked shots? I blinked and not sure if Quinn and Remenda covered that yet.

  144. Lowetide says:

    For The Athletic: Lacking a succession plan, the Oilers are a year away from a big payday for Cam Talbot

    https://theathletic.com/281662/2018/03/20/lowetide-lacking-a-succession-plan-oilers-a-year-away-from-big-money-for-cam-talbot/

  145. Pouzar says:

    Wilde: Because it’s been set in stone that he’s part of the indispensable nucleus of the team on measures that could not be described as objective and it has been this way for a very, very long time.

    This has extended to some of the fanbase as well.

    We should have traded him for Hamonic.

  146. Wilde says:

    That puck took 15 minutes to go through the blue into the net.

  147. Munny says:

    Some bad scramble there

  148. OmJo says:

    Literally just turned the game on and they get scored on.

    Whoops.

  149. Munny says:

    And there’s a response… Jewels

  150. OmJo says:

    OmJo:
    Literally just turned the game on and they get scored on.

    Whoops.

    And then Cagguila scored.

    Whoops.

  151. Wilde says:

    That shift by Fleury and his partner was nightmare material

  152. Chelios is a Dinosaur says:

    Is there anyone within the Oiler organization worse at their particular job/duties than Remenda is at his?

  153. Pouzar says:

    Nurse is a bum.

  154. Pouzar says:

    Didn’t love Aberg drifting to the right and losing his shooting angle.
    Attack middle son.

  155. Munny says:

    haha Benning gets it back

  156. OmJo says:

    Whoops.

  157. Wilde says:

    What a sequence by Benning god DAYUM

  158. OmJo says:

    That was a pretty nice goal, too. Nicely done Benning.

  159. Pouzar says:

    Munny:
    haha Benning gets it back

    No pun intended?

  160. Munny says:

    Nice play. Not sure if Strome will get credit

  161. Bittersomfan says:

    Wilde,

    That was a sick goal! :p

  162. OmJo says:

    Eat shit, Hurricanes!

  163. Munny says:

    I think Darling put it in himself. He’s not looked good for the Canes thus far.

  164. OilClog says:

    Nice sequence by Benning, none of it happens without Nuge’s brain.

  165. Wilde says:

    OilClog,

    93+97 have been ridiculous for 5 straight shifts now, around the whole rink

  166. Pouzar says:

    Sweet feed by JP.

    #development

  167. OilClog says:

    Scungilli Slushy: It’ll be interesting to see what they do with Drake. He’s had a glorious chance to prove himself, I still see a marginal 4th liner. He can’t get defensive play down and doesn’t have NHL finish. He’s a mature prospect, I think we know what we have.

    Sadly probably Slepy too. But I think Slepy has more use because I see his game as better overall and he’s got size with his speed, it remains a physical game after all, but I think he’s also a bottom sixer. He may prefer going home, but the NHL paycheques cash.

    I called him Liam Reddox 2.0 from the get go, it’s all my eyes could see. I was ridiculed for it by some and I’ll admit I shouldn’t of been so hasty and harsh. Yet if MacT’s coaching tenure taught us anything, it’s plug awareness.

  168. Munny says:

    Pouzar: No pun intended?

    lol. Oh you know it! Can’t let JDi down.

  169. OmJo says:

    That lone guy doing the Oiler chat. is the loudest thing in the arena.

    Nice hockey market, Bettman.

  170. Bittersomfan says:

    Hehe, one guy chanting, “lets go hurricanes”, one guy…

  171. Munny says:

    I wanna see Strome shoot there.

  172. Bittersomfan says:

    Wilde,

    If we could only find a winger for McD…

  173. OilClog says:

    Wilde:
    OilClog,

    93+97 have been ridiculous for 5 straight shifts now, around the whole rink

    Enjoy it while it lasts, he’s expendable didn’t you know. It’s just Mcdavid zooming his brain.

    Connor may kill a man with a vicious spear if they take away his new brain friend.

  174. YKOil says:

    Scungilli Slushy: If Luc was going to waive I think Seattle might be a team that would motivate him. Especially if he’s still underperforming. Would they take him? Maybe because of what his player type is, sweetener etc.

    As for Dahlin, unless he’s not ready every team would play him. They all want elite players.

    I think he will likely be able to play 2 D pretty quick once in. Elite players get to speed quickly.It would allow the Oilers to move a leftie for help elsewhere. A RD or significant young forward. Assuming the GM doesn’t trade him for a loss, that couldn’t happen right?

    Of course it’s not going to happen. We can dream.

    Depending on where the cap was, how many dead contracts I had and how hard it would be to move said contracts, I would be quite comfortable sending Dahlin back for a year or (hopefully not) two.

    I keep on hoping Lucic’ family – his or his wife’s – calls him away. Seattle would work just fine.

  175. Munny says:

    Couple of nice saves by TBot to open the PK

  176. AshetonisGod says:

    Chelios is a Dinosaur:
    Is there anyone within the Oiler organization worse at their particular job/duties than Remenda is at his?

    Charelli

  177. Munny says:

    And of all the shots to score…

  178. Bittersomfan says:

    I really like Drai, but all these no look passes… If it doesn’t work, STOP doing it.

  179. OilClog says:

    Chelios is a Dinosaur:
    Is there anyone within the Oiler organization worse at their particular job/duties than Remenda is at his?

    Peter and Todd have 100% attendance in his class.

  180. Zelepukin says:

    AshetonisGod: Charelli

    Worse than Remenda? Impossible.

  181. OmJo says:

    Bittersomfan:
    I really like Drai, but all these no look passes… If it doesn’t work, STOP doing it.

    That isn’t a philosophy taught by the coach, it makes sense the players wouldn’t adopt it either.

    McLellan’s philosophy is… if it doesn’t work, keep doing until it does work, and if it still doesn’t work after that, use Connor McDavid to make it work. And if it STILL doesn’t work even after that, then just keep trying anyway because why the hell not.

    See: Power play; penalty kill; Milan Lucic.

  182. AshetonisGod says:

    Zelepukin: Worse than Remenda? Impossible.

    Remenda is annoying. Chiarelli damages entire organizations.

  183. OilClog says:

    Remenda has called the refs out 100% more then the Coach or GM. I’m not a fan of Remenda but he’s stuck up more for the players then Management or coaches, gord dawn bizarro world out Cher

  184. Lowetide says:

    After One

    3-2 Edmonton
    Shots 15-12 Carolina
    Corsi for 5×5: 15-12 Edmonton

    A weird line for a weird period.

  185. OmJo says:

    I like Benning as 3RD next season.

  186. OmJo says:

    OilClog:
    Remenda has called the refs out 100% more then the Coach or GM. I’m not a fan of Remenda but he’s stuck up more for the players then Management or coaches, gord dawn bizarro world out Cher

    And even when the Sharks were the ones getting the bullshit calls, he still called the refs out.

    Bizzaro world indeed.

  187. Lowetide says:

    OmJo:
    I like Benning as 3RD next season.

    Klefbom-Larsson
    Nurse-Russell
    Sekera-Benning

    I know it isn’t sexy but that’s a capable blue. If Bear continues to develop maybe the team can offload one of the veterans like Russell summer 2019 to make room. And if Sekera recovers you can put him with Russell on the second pair.

  188. Munny says:

    Aberg with his first finally

  189. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Lowetide: Klefbom-Larsson
    Nurse-Russell
    Sekera-Benning

    I know it isn’t sexy but that’s a capable blue. If Bear continues to develop maybe the team can offload one of the veterans like Russell summer 2019 to make room. And if Sekera recovers you can put him with Russell on the second pair.

    That’s an important point. If they are healthy it is far from the worst. It is good enough for playoffs. There is no need to change it IMO without a significant reason like a no brainer deal.

  190. JimmyV1965 says:

    OilClog: godot10: You likely cannot find a better winger for McDavid for the money and term than Nugent-Hopkins. You cannot find a better insurance policy for injuries to your top two centres than Nugent-Hopkins.

  191. Munny says:

    Canes need a lesson, that’s Talbot, Bear and McDavid in one 4 minute stretch

  192. AshetonisGod says:

    Drai and Aberg just did what other teams always do to us in the slot!

  193. Pouzar says:

    Fire that fucking dump in to the sun.

  194. Munny says:

    80s hockey

  195. Munny says:

    Caggiula only seems to shoot when he’s a half mile from the net

  196. Bittersomfan says:

    Can’t decide if this is a good game or a horrible one.

  197. JimmyV1965 says:

    OilClog:
    When Nuge is moved for a 2nd pairing mythical RHD, who’s covering the 45 bases Nuge covers? Who on this roster could actually replace Nuge on the PK?

    I compared the last 5 games just to put it into perspective, up to this point in their careers guess what, Nuge is the guy they throw out to cover the tough assignments while Leon has gotten Mcdavid minutes or soft comps.

    Hasn’t Nuge’s #’s been skewered since the day Eakins arrived and hammered him into a defensive position because before Mcdavid, he was the only Center on the team to have any actual hockey ability.

    PK this season.

    Nuge – Minutes – 93 – mistakes on grade A per 16 – .17
    Leon – 64 – .41

    Nuge gets traded, Leon is thrusted into his minutes.. it will not be kind at 8.5million. His offense will suffer as he’s forced to take a more defensive roll which isn’t his strong suit.

    Trading Nuge is a trade they’ll never break even let alone thoughts of winning or improving the team.

    Keeping the 3 C’s running two together and finding an actual fellow forward that can goal the puck will ensure they have a quality top 6. Trading one of the three and installing a winger.. well it will be the more of the same. 1 top line, a second line with bottom 6 parts.

    Yes the Oilers need a 2nd pairing right hand D or even better yet someone that makes Larsson that player, but taking away from the One strength the Oilers have with their 3 C’s to fill that Hole leaves this team sorely drained on actual talent for Leon and Connor to play with.

    To me especially with the recent Nuge injury Oilers team record… I can’t see another team sending back the required value no matter who the GM is. Trading Nuge is a move they lose in several aspects that will likely take the team years to recover from. Just like every other short term boneheaded rash bullshit decision they make.

    If you read my post I said I’m not keen on trading RNH, but there’s about eight teams that can really use him. If you get the right deal for a RHD, you pull the trigger. There should be a lot of demand for RNH and you might get assets that exceed his value. I never said let’s go out and trade RNH. But I don’t believe we should stick our fingers in our ears, stomp our feet and refuse to trade him.

    If you think RNH is better than Drai. Fine. I disagree big time.

  198. Munny says:

    See if we can get a powerplay marker back.

  199. OilClog says:

    Lowetide: Klefbom-Larsson
    Nurse-Russell
    Sekera-Benning

    I know it isn’t sexy but that’s a capable blue. If Bear continues to develop maybe the team can offload one of the veterans like Russell summer 2019 to make room. And if Sekera recovers you can put him with Russell on the second pair.

    I like it a lot.

    Depending on Sekera’s recovery and NMC, LTIR may be the best option for everyone.

    Chris Wideman would be a nice cheap target maybe, his last contract was 2yr 1.6mil. Shoots right, 28yrs old.

  200. OilClog says:

    JimmyV1965: If you read my post I said I’m not keen on trading RNH, but there’s about eight teams that can really use him. If you get the right deal for a RHD, you pull the trigger. There should be a lot of demand for RNH and you might get assets that exceed his value. I never said let’s go out and trade RNH. But I don’t believe we should stick our fingers in our ears, stomp our feet and refuse to trade him.

    If you think RNH is better than Drai. Fine. I disagree big time.

    I never said better, I think he’s equally as talented for several of his own reasons which translate just as important to winning that Drai does.

    Do these 8 teams have the required pieces to send back? Are they willing to part with them? If that’s the sell, sell Draisaitl the return will be much more significant. And it’s pretty clear Nuge can more then fill the Drai role as it stands now.

    Edit: miss the stomping my feet part, far from it. Just providing a different view on things. Disagreements don’t cause me anger, nor will they cause me to fling shit at others for it. I tried to provide some numbers on my view, sorry you take that as childish antics.

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