Green River

by Lowetide

The Oilers traded Raffi Torres for Gilbert Brule on July 1, 2008. It was one of those “we’ll trade an actual NHL player for a guy who was a lottery pick and has taken a little time to develop” kinds of deals, it usually works out as a substantial loss (NHL teams don’t trade their lottery picks three years after drafting them if things are looking up). Brule scored 17 goals and 37 points in 2009-10 under Pat Quinn (I wrote “has a nice release and can find lanes and he has some jam despite his size another smaller player”). He was one of the better possession forwards (46.48 Corsi for 5×5, but 2.00 Corsi Rel) and he was 22. Gilbert Brule was fewer than 80 games from the end of his NHL career.

THE ATHLETIC!

Give The Athletic as a gift or get it yourself and join the fun! Offer is here, less than $5 a month! I find myself reading both the hockey (Willis, Dellow, Pronman, et cetera) and the baseball coverage a lot, it’s a pure pleasure to visit. We’ll sell you the whole seat, but you’ll only need the edge.

ABERG VS. CAGGIULA

  • Aberg and Caggiula will be part of the ‘early audition’ group of Oilers wingers this fall. The club needs to find eight men and true to play alongside Connor McDavid,  Leon Draisaitl, Ryan Strome and (probably) Jujhar Khaira.
  • The ‘first eight’ group is likely to include Nuge—Rattie, Lucic—Yamamoto, Caggiula—Puljujarvi and Aberg—Kassian.
  • I think we’re about to see another winter of auditions on the wing, and it may envelope the season. Lack of scoring beyond the McDavid line may be the chief cause of the Oilers losing touch with the pack, thus inviting the organization to audition farmhands.
  • Rumors of Jason Chimera being signed probably doesn’t offer much in the way of roadblocks for the youngsters on the farm. I’m a Chimera fan, and his long career was easily predicted (foot speed for days) but the things that made him viable are finally leaving him.
  • Players who might receive playing time on the wings this year are all free agents signed by the organization beginning July 1 (they have lots of room on the 50-man), plus names like Cooper Marody, Tyler Benson, Patrick Russell, Joe Gambardella, Tyler Vesel, Cameron Hebig and Nolan Vesey.

Opening night 2009-10 Brule played on a line with Andrew Cogliano and Dustin Penner (it would have been the No. 2 line behind JF Jacques—Shawn Horcoff—Ales Hemsky). The following year, 2010-11, he would play with Magnus Paajarvi and Andrew Cogliano, a member of a line that would eventually get lost in the flood. A year later, Linus Omark was in Brule’s spot.

As things stand now, ladies and men, I suspect we can make a prediction: This 2018-19 campaign is going to see a lot of auditions for wingers on the second, third and fourth line. The organization can land some NHL wingers in free agency, as the current depth chart is not satisfactory. There’s very little money, so astute signings are required. A fascinating thread the needle summer awaits Peter Chiarelli.

50-MAN LIST

  • Brule’s first opening night was 2009-10, the right wing depth chart was Ales Hemsky—Gilbert Brule—Ryan Stone—Zack Stortini. The following year, it was Hemsky—Jordan Eberle—Brule—Steve MacIntyre. In 2011-12, right wing opening night featured Eberle—Hemsky—Magnus Paajarvi and Ryan Jones. Next season? Eberle—Hemsky—Hartikainen—Petrell.
  • How many of those RW depth charts are better than the current alignment? Tough to say, as Yamamoto and Puljujarvi may have significant careers ahead of them. Right now, it feels like a year of auditions (after a season of auditions) on the wing is ahead.

LOWDOWN WITH LOWETIDE

At 10 this morning, looong weekend ahead, summer is right there! We’ll celebrate with two top drawer guests, TSN1260.

  • Jeff Krushell, Krush Performance. Turning pro and making the next steps after the draft.
  • Rob Vollman, ESPN and NHL.com. The best mid-level free agents for teams on a budget.

10-1260 text, @Lowetide on twitter. See you on the radio!

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stephen sheps

Green River – the band that gave birth to Pearl Jam and Mudhoney. You can hear the genesis of both bands, to say nothing of the entire Seattle scene/sound that emerged half a decade or so later, especially in tracks like this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kB8l3-mGeSg

Wonder Llama

I will follow this thread just to see Brule’s WOWY’s with Bono.

knighttown

What’s crushing is that there are so many good options available with teams choosing this year not to qualify their young RFA wingers like Duclair and Rieder. But because of little things; Gryba buyout, Caggs overpay, Russell overpay we’re likely gonna be 200k short on our offers to these guys.

Were left praying for a Lucic for nothing trade and the signing of a couple of these terrific options.

Chelios is a Dinosaur

Wonder Llama,

Nicely done.

Yeti

Wonder Llama:
I will follow this thread just to see Brule’s WOWY’s with Bono.

The rub on Brule was that he didn’t play with enough edge.

Chelios is a Dinosaur

Wow, Lucic for nothing has the potential to solve a lot of problems. Lucic + for nothing also solves problems. Beyond hands and feet there’s still a player there. But he was atrocious last year, don’t think he can be trusted to play beyond the third line and I would be happy to see him on the fourth even if his play has plateaued. Hands and feet are important in hockey.

Now, I’m not the smartest person in the world, but I love it and I love the Oilers, which is why I love to follow this blog and learn a lot along the way.

But with that, I think VOR is right that Lucic has negative value. If getting out from under that player (not just the contract – the player too) costs you the 1 round 2019 pick, I think you consider it. Yes you gain an important ELC but you forfeit that under Milan’s contract anyhow. Without Lucic you have cap flexibility to establish a vision for the wings. The farm takes a hit, but PC has done a decent job of getting that ship turned around. It would be a huge admission of an error in the initial signing, sure, but no matter the wounds, the air would seem fresh and the sun would shine a bit brighter.

pts2pndr

It would seem from my prospective that there are a number of solutions that Inhave not seen proposed.
I believe a second line that would push the river already has the required bodies. Khaira Drai and JP would give the team a second line with size, speed and skill. Khaira at his price point would be a greadt add to the top six. Moving lucic to the third line and giving him second pp time as the net front presence is preferable to paying to have someone take him off our hands. If you add Khaira and Lucic’s salary together you have your 2nd and 3rd line left wingers for average salary of just over 3 million. I think at the very least the line of Khaira Drai and JP should be given the preseason and 10 games to start the season. I do not see this having any more of a negative effect than whatvwas done with Rattie on the first line. The more stability early this year the better the odds for a successful start!

maddex

Andy Strickland reporting rumblings of a Lucic deal in place…

Professor Q

stephen sheps:
Green River – the band that gave birth to Pearl Jam and Mudhoney. You can hear the genesis of both bands, to say nothing of the entire Seattle scene/sound that emerged half a decade or so later, especially in tracks like this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kB8l3-mGeSg

And before Green River was Green River, before they even became Mudhoney and Pearl Jam, they began as a grunge-punk band called Mr. Epp & The Calculations (or, “The Worst Band in the World”).

I had a physics teacher named Mr. Epp, and he’d always bring in his guitar and jam for us (also seemed to be high at times…but one shouldn’t speculate about such things).

Very insightful lessons about the physics of sound and waveforms.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8zMxKEgPxJ8

npanciroli

Andy Strickland tweeted there are rumblings that the Oilers have a deal in place for Lucic. Hold onto your butts.

Rishaug retweeted it also.

Profit

Hey LT – just wanted to let you know that I came to the site, hit refresh and I couldn’t see today’s post. It only showed yesterday’s post (and comments up to 12:38pm) but nothing after.

I had to follow the twitter link and then sign in to get to it.

Using Chrome on a Mac.

meanashell11

Chrome on a Mac as well and have had no problem this week at all.

Ribs

Everyone’s gonna lose their minds when it’s Milan Lucic for Ryan Kesler.

I had to log in to see the new postings as well since the move to https:// . Maybe if we edit our bookmarks to include the “s”, things will work as normal?

Kinger_Oil.redux

Chelios is a Dinosaur:
Wow, Lucic for nothing has the potential to solve a lot of problems. Lucic + for nothing also solves problems. Beyond hands and feet there’s still a player there. But he was atrocious last year, don’t think he can be trusted to play beyond the third line and I would be happy to see him on the fourth even if his play has plateaued. Hands and feet are important in hockey.

But with that, I think VOR is right that Lucic has negative value. If getting out from under that player (not just the contract – the player too) costs you the 1 round 2019 pick, I think you consider it.Yes you gain an important ELC but you forfeit that under Milan’s contract anyhow.

– Ricki had a good post that I commented on in last thread.

– If you believe that Lucic will have a 3% shooting, going forward, based on post-christmas, or that his shooting percentage is now 6.9% going forward, vs 14% career, the you are right

– But should his sh% return, and he’s a 15-20 goal, 45-55 point guy, next year, then you are giving up a lot at a low price, and trying to find a 15-20 goal scorer

– I’d bet a lot that Lucic plays a lot better next year: adjustments, coaching changes, professionalism.

– Baring a trade for actual NHL players, the most likely 2nd liner available to us is Lucic next year

* if the Oil decdie to make a Hockey trade for Lucic, sure, and they can allocate his $6MM in a different manner. But that’s different than giving up a 1st to get rid of a guy who is likely to revert and on top of it, giving away stuff like a first.

* Like a Lucic for a Faulk and Benning: I might not like it, but at least it’s a hockey trade. Then your looking for more F scoring

TO10801

Profit:
Hey LT – just wanted to let you know that I came to the site, hit refresh and I couldn’t see today’s post. It only showed yesterday’s post (and comments up to 12:38pm) but nothing after.

I had to follow the twitter link and then sign in to get to it.

Using Chrome on a Mac.

I’m using a desktop PC and had to do the same thing

McSorley33

knighttown,

What’s crushing is that there are so many good options available with teams choosing this year not to qualify their young RFA wingers like Duclair and Rieder. But because of little things; Gryba buyout, Caggs overpay, Russell overpay we’re likely gonna be 200k short on our offers to these guys.

Were left praying for a Lucic for nothing trade and the signing of a couple of these terrific options.
***********************************************************************************************************
Take a look at our depth chart.

Strome and Looch are #4 and #5 in scoring on our team last year…they had 13 & 10 goals despite the fact they both played the full 82 games.

Michael Traikos of National Post/ Sun chain was talking about another team and took a side swipe at the Oilers in making a point.

Do you want to have a team with a young core cast but have nothing surrounding them?

Who surrounds RNH, Dria and McDavid?

Montreal, Ottawa….can we think of any other team so thin at forward?

This upcoming year is a development year for young forwards.

The teams success, imo, is riding on JP, Yamamoto, Benson, McCleod etc,…and that is not going to happen this year. This is the cluster that is meant to surround Drai and McDavid.

Team is building for the following year. Try to move Looch this year. Then Russell next summer.

Doug McLachlan

maddex:
Andy Strickland reporting rumblings of a Lucic deal in place…

The replys to the Andy Strickland‏ tweet are a lot of fun (fear and panic on all potential sides of a Lucic deal).

Verified account @andystrickland

Follow Follow @andystrickland More

Some rumblings #Oilers have deal in place to move Lucic. We shall see

9:06 AM – 28 Jun 2018

The destination dictates the nature of the deal and the fact that everyone is assuming that the deal is post July 2nd suggests that the difference between cap$ and cash$ would be a factor in making the deal (though I suspect even the most flush teams don’t mind someone else ponying up the cash).

We are assuming the plan from Lucic’s point of view, as he needs to agree to be moved, is to go to a place that he can duck the some of the spotlight so I presume it’s the States. Interesting.

Doug McLachlan

Ribs:
Everyone’s gonna lose their minds when it’s Milan Lucic for Ryan Kesler.

I had to log in to see the new postings as well since the move to https:// . Maybe if we edit our bookmarks to include the “s”, things will work as normal?

Umm if Kesler is going to be on LTIR (his hip is disintegrating – as much as I hate him I wouldn’t wish this on anyone) that might make some sense.

How does the NMC work if the player agrees to waive for a trade as Kesler has one as well?

StixMalone

Doug McLachlan: go to a place that he can duck the some of the spotlight so I presume it’s the States. Interesting.

Agree 100%.

StixMalone

Kessler won’t come to Edmonton. The cold will flare up his arthritis….

flea

While I think the Lucic trade (if it happens) is about performance, I also believe it’s about his fit in the dressing room. They brought him in to be a leader, it obviously hasn’t worked out. I liked the signing because I thought it brought CMD and Drai some cover. The Hall era Oilers always signed these budget veterans who never had played at a high level.

knighttown

McSorley33:
knighttown,

What’s crushing is that there are so many good options available with teams choosing this year not to qualify their young RFA wingers like Duclair and Rieder. But because of little things; Gryba buyout, Caggs overpay, Russell overpay we’re likely gonna be 200k short on our offers to these guys.

Were left praying for a Lucic for nothing trade and the signing of a couple of these terrific options.
***********************************************************************************************************
Take a look at our depth chart.

Strome and Looch are #4 and #5 in scoring on our team last year…they had 13 & 10 goals despite the fact they both played the full 82 games.

Michael Traikos of National Post/ Sun chain was talking about another team and took a side swipe at the Oilers in making a point.

Do you want to have a team with a young core cast but have nothing surrounding them?

Who surrounds RNH, Dria and McDavid?

Montreal, Ottawa….can we think of any other team so thin at forward?

This upcoming year is a development year for young forwards.

The teams success, imo, is riding on JP, Yamamoto, Benson, McCleod etc,…and that is not going to happen this year. This is the cluster that is meant to surround Drai and McDavid.

Team is building for the following year. Try to move Looch this year. Then Russell next summer.

100% agree. We have arguably the best centre depth in the NHL and our leading goal scorer among wingers was Drake Caggiula with 13. That’s last by a country mile.

We all thought we’d be shopping out of the bargain bins for aging vets like Thomas Vanek and Cammo Larry but the GM’s have all decided that wing is where the cuts need to be made with the Cap coming in at 79M.

A fresh batch of these RFA/UFA wingers; Czarnik, Rieder, Duclair, Carr, Petan. Guys like Burakovsky and Skinner are out there.

You’ll never get a chance to get so much bottom 9 wing talent for such an affordable price but the key is moving Lucic.

Based on this climate (and the fact that getting out from under Hunwick cost Sheary) I’d be happy with almost any Lucic trade that frees up Cap space. He’s not just negative valued he’s nuclear negative.

I’d go as high as any prospect to Bear (not Jesse, EB or KY) and I’d absolutely trade any forward besides the Big 3 including Khaira who I like.

godot10

flea:
While I think the Lucic trade (if it happens) is about performance, I also believe it’s about his fit in the dressing room. They brought him in to be a leader, it obviously hasn’t worked out. I liked the signing because I thought it brought CMD and Drai some cover. The Hall era Oilers always signed these budget veterans who never had played at a high level.

Cover for young players is NEVER provided by 30-somethings. It is provided by players, even mediocre one in the prime years of their career, mid-to-late twenty somethings.

The Oilers have been trading away these players for a decade, leaving a giant donut hole in the roster from 25 to 29 years of age.

Stoll, Torres, Pitkanen, Hejda, Petry, Gilbert, Hall, Eberle, etc. There are more

godot10

godot10: Cover for young players is NEVER provided by 30-somethings.It is provided by players, even mediocre one in the prime years of their career, mid-to-late twenty somethings.

The Oilers have been trading away these players for a decade, leaving a giant donut hole in the roster from 25 to 29 years of age.

Stoll, Torres, Pitkanen, Hejda, Petry, Gilbert, Hall, Eberle, etc.There are more

Which is why Rieder, who is 25, is much preferable to Grabner, who is 30.

Rondo

Andy Strickland Retweeted Andy Strickland

Milan Lucic has not been asked to waive NMC at this point. Owed $3 mill in bonus money on July 1st. If a deal were to happen, sounds like it would be after July 1.Andy Strickland added,
Andy Strickland
Verified account

@andystrickland
Some rumblings #Oilers have deal in place to move Lucic. We shall

DBO

Doug McLachlan,

yep. wonder if Carolina is that place. Lucic seems like a Dundon type of player, shake it up and get some leadership. And Lucic is a name in the US for sure. that would be a selling point for sure.

Faulk maybe? Then a move or buyout of a dman. If he got Faulk and Skinner and didn’t have to eat much or give up a 1st along with Lucic I would look at that as a coup. No idea if Skinner would be willing to come here.

slopitch

I think Buffalo might have some interest in Lucic as well. But ya Id bet Carolina too.

Please please please. Cap space would really give this roster a chance to be better then last.

leadfarmer

Rondo,

3.5 million actually.
To Carolina???

Doug McLachlan

DBO,

I am now wondering about the cash part of the deal and thinking Ducks.

If Kesler is done and the NMC does not follow – would the Oilers do Lucic and the 2019 1st for Kesler and Rakell? Kesler goes LTIR and with some of our young guns we can do the paper dance to clear the cap until LTIR comes on.

Lucic is owed $22.5M more, and while last year was awful he will probably be a 40pt guy next year. Rakell is on an amazing contract but Kesler is owed $26.7M more and may not play another game.

flea

godot10,

I mean, to be fair, ML was signed at 27. He’s 30 this year. So he fits your age range technically.

Not trying to feed the troll here, I actually agree with you overall. They kept moving out the veterans in favor of young players, and then the young players got lost. By the time those young guys were the veterans, they were considered damaged goods, traded for peanuts. It was a death spiral.

I actually like a lot of Chiarelli’s moves, apart from the Hall trade. Hall and Eberle were products of the damaged goods era and the team needed to reset with CMD and start over. I think they could’ve kept one of those guys, preferably Hall, and found that RHD in an Eberle or RNH trade.

Chelios is a Dinosaur

Kinger_Oil.redux,

I would be happy for Milan to rebound to a 15-20 goal guy, though that production + can be spread across the middle of the lineup for less money and term, perhaps?

Oftentimes I watch a player and wonder why the shooting % has fallen off a cliff. Gripping the stick, taking too many shots from range, what have you. Problems that come out in the wash if theres a change in line mates, roles, whatever. With Milan I really worry that its a result of his foot speed – he simply cannot separate. The shooting % is low for the same reason his play in the neutral zone is so unreliable. If I were a betting man, it would be that Milan Lucic does not recover.

leadfarmer

I just hope we don’t blow that money on another UFA like JVR or Neal that we will regret within 2 years

Bank Shot

knighttown: 100% agree.We have arguably the best centre depth in the NHL and our leading goal scorer among wingers was Drake Caggiula with 13.That’s last by a country mile.

The Oilers also have $30 million tied up in their centers(assuming Strome gets 3 per), which is probably tops in the league by a large margin.

When you have 40% of the cap tied up in one position, other areas will suffer. Since you really need defence and goaltender, the wings are always going to suffer unless the Oilers get lucky and find a few guys that just kill it on their entry level deals.

That’s probably the best org weakness to have though as I feel like wingers are the most likely position players to outperform their entry level deals.

npanciroli

leadfarmer,

Yeah, I agree this is the concern.

Primetime

Carolina is the most speculated landing spot (by myself included) because of the word that they were looking for more truculence.

Did anyone read that article on the Athletic where they were in the draft room with the Hurricanes? Very interesting article, intent was to show how involved Dundon is in the day to day business including hockey related matters. One part that stood out to me was their discussion on trading for Ryan O’Reilly, what would it take, was he a fit etc. The reporter stated that while they love his style of play, they weren’t sure that he was fit because of his age, and whether he could relate to all the younger players on the team.

If they are worried that O’Reilly is too old for their group, doubt they are interested in the much older Lucic unfortunately…

Primetime

It was Scott Burnside and here is the quote after sitting through the meeting:

“Take the Buffalo center who is six years older than Hanifin. There’s no question the two-way center would be a nice addition to the Carolina roster and, with Jordan Staal, could create an imposing one-two punch down the middle that would make the Hurricanes much more difficult to play against. But how big a concern is that kind of age gap?”

McSorley33

I vote for Arizona being a landing spot for Looch….

trencan

leadfarmer:
I just hope we don’t blow that money on another UFA like JVR or Neal that we will regret within 2 years

Pat Maroon?

godot10

flea:
godot10,

I mean, to be fair, ML was signed at 27. He’s 30 this year. So he fits your age range technically.

Not trying to feed the troll here, I actually agree with you overall. They kept moving out the veterans in favor of young players, and then the young players got lost. By the time those young guys were the veterans, they were considered damaged goods, traded for peanuts. It was a death spiral.

I actually like a lot of Chiarelli’s moves, apart from the Hall trade. Hall and Eberle were products of the damaged goods era and the team needed to reset with CMD and start over. I think they could’ve kept one of those guys, preferably Hall, and found that RHD in an Eberle or RNH trade.

Lucic was an OLD 28 when he signed with the Oilers. Lots of wear and tear on a big men. They rarely last beyond 30.

Side

godot10: Lucic was an OLD 28 when he signed with the Oilers.Lots of wear and tear on a big men.They rarely last beyond 30.

When in doubt, just move the goal posts.

Oilin4

Everybody’s looking at getting players in the similar age range – likely looking at Vegas and trying to re-create that. Suggests there’s a market inefficiency or two for anyone willing to “take on” the “burden” of an age gap.

Pretendergast

Interestingly, this team didn’t qualify the player they were offering the Oilers for Lucic and aren’t negotiating with him. They appear to have cut him free. Maybe tough negotiating maybe he needs a last chance Texaco. Or maybe they hope it will be a wake up call.

VOR from your post last night, I’ll guess Reider, Lehner, or Carr out of Montreal are the only ones that seem to fit the reasonable name while also not being qualified. Would’ve guessed Pouliot but he got signed yesterday.

Weird that Vegas and the Hawks dont make who they offered public but I’ll throw Duclair into the fold. I’m not asking for a real answer but would i be on the right track?

Nobody in Carolina made sense to me but they seem like the most obvious destination.

Melman

McSorley33:
I vote for Arizona being a landing spot for Looch….

Could you imagine the irony and the outcry if it was Looch for Demers!

Rondo

There is more evidence that Chiarelli is working for other teams in the NHL than he works for the Oilers.

npanciroli

Melman,

This would be so awesome.

digger50

What team does Andy Strickland usually cover?

flea

Rondo,

Maybe he’s a patsy for the league. Sewer the Oilers long enough and McD demands a trade to a bigger, more visible market.

Mcdavid in NYC or LA is worth so much more to the league in many ways. TV deals, merchandising, branding, etc.

Bos8

Yep, Chia is right there with the “Elders of Zion”. Conspiracies abound.

jeetz

My guess for a number one spot is Vancouver

leadfarmer

Primetime,

Well OReilly would not come cheap. Lucic will