Pushing the River

In 1979, NHL teams had a watershed draft pool to choose from, and some teams procured talent for a generation (Edmonton was one). In Toronto, Punch Imlach was trying to figure out things on the fly:

When our first choice came, one player available was Laurie Boschman. He’d played with Brandon, centering a line with Brian Propp and Ray Allison on the wings. Even though Boschman was the center, I said Propp got all the goals. I think we should go with the goal scorers.” But the scouts said Boschman did all the work and was the smart one on the line. I’d been in that situation in Buffalo once, picking a kid named Claude Deziel who had scored a lot in junior on a line centered by Pierre Larouche. Later, Deziel never played in the NHL. Larouche did, and scored plenty. So when the Leafs scouts told me Boschman was the guy who made their line work, I had to think of Larouche. 

  • “Can he skate?” I asked. 
  • “Good skater,” they said. 

So that’s how Boschman was taken and when you figure Propp got 34 goals for Philadelphia and Boschman got 16 for the the Leafs maybe we were wrong in the choice. (Punch Imlach and Scott Young, Heaven and Hell in the NHL).

THE ATHLETIC

Give The Athletic as a gift or get it yourself and join the fun! Offer is here, less than $4 a month! I find myself reading both the hockey (Willis, Dellow, Pronman, et cetera) and the baseball coverage a lot, it’s a pure pleasure to visit. We’ll sell you the whole seat, but you’ll only need the edge.

RYAN MARTINDALE

  • Stu MacGregor during Ryan Martindale’s draft weekend: “He was their top line centerman, he played with Toffoli. He was a very solid, big guy. He has to improve his game in some areas, but he has size and skill. His overall commitment needs to be there every night. He’s a big kid that has a lot of talent.”

Los Angeles drafted Tyler Toffoli No. 47 overall, Martindale was plucked at No. 61 by the Edmonton Oilers. There were no expectations (that I recall) about Martindale being the superior player (to Toffoli), but Toronto’s drafting of Boschman in 1979 (over a clearly superior Brian Propp, who scored 28 more goals and 45 more points) was looking like a bad decision by Christmas of that year.

One of the things we can do in the modern era is measure 5-on-5 offense, and even more targeted, 5-on-5 primary points (goals and first assists). I thought about the Imlach quote, and the MacGregor quote, in the hours after the Oilers drafted Ryan McLeod. I reached out to Brock Otten, to ask him about McLeod’s linemates and his answer is worth quoting:

  • Brock Otten:Well let’s just say that the Steelheads throw their lines in a blender most days. Very little consistency from game to game. Heck, they change from period to period. He played with his brother a fair amount in November/December when Michael returned from injury. After the trade deadline, it was Carter, Foget, Tippett, Washkurak, Schwindt, you name it.”

So that gives us some idea about where he played in the lineup and indicates no one was zooming his numbers. Where did he finish among Mississauga forwards in primary points per game?

This is a very encouraging table, despite Ryan McLeod’s position here. First, based on Otten’s verbal we can discount Tippet and Michael McLeod as zooming his results, although they did spend time with the Oilers’ pick.

The primary points per game total (remember, this is 5-on-5 via Prospect-stats.com) posted by Michael McLeod at 17 (0.53) and Owen Tippett at 17 (0.75) isn’t far away from the number each man posted this past season. I know there has been much talk of Kailer Yamamoto not progressing year over year (0.77 to 0.75 in this discipline) and Tippett’s numbers illuminate the Yamamoto progress.

OHL FORWARDS, FIRST TWO ROUNDS 2018 NHL DRAFT

These eight men were chosen inside the first two rounds of the 2018 NHL draft. As you can see, teams went for positional need early and often, passing on promising talent to grab centers and speed early on. I think Edmonton made out very well based on these totals, Florida (Noel) and Los Angeles (Thomas) also getting terrific value.

PRIMARY POINTS PER GAME, OILERS FORWARDS 2013-18 DRAFT

  • Connor McDavid. Oh my.
  • Leon Draisaitl and Kailer Yamamoto posted solid numbers, seems to be a line in the sand after that before Benson.
  • Added to draft year 5-on-5 primary numbers from Jordan Eberle (0.56), Taylor Hall (0.72), Ryan Nugent-Hopkins (0.46) and Nail Yakupov (0.71), there should be a clear top-six forward group on the roster at this time.

I don’t see any obvious options for signing/trade here, Aidan Muir does offer size but injuries impacted his college career. The two high picks (McLeod and Glover) are surprising misses from organizations who usually cash in that area of the draft.

CONCRETE CHANGES

Glen Gulutzan made some comments yesterday (here) and it sounds like the Oilers will have some new wrinkles at 5-on-5. It’s a vague reference to changes, but I do like the idea of moving the puck up rapidly.

LOWDOWN WITH LOWETIDE

We are live on location today at Rogers Place for the Hlinka-Gretzky tournament! Starting at 10, TSN1260, scheduled to appear:

  • Steve Lansky, BigMouthSports. We’ll chat about his vacation, the Prospects and the Hlinka-Gretzky.
  • JP Shadrick, Jaguars Radio Network. We’ll preview Jacksonville’s season.

We’ll also talk CFL and have plenty from Rogers Place as we set the stage for the big weekend of hockey at the Hlinka-Gretzky. Talk soon!

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78 Responses to "Pushing the River"

  1. Wilde says:

    After those words about Martindale, I looked up his hockeydb, looked at his points per game and birth month, sighed and said McLeod. Alt-tabbed back and there you were with the same thing.

    Speaking of words, I wrote a literal billion of them about Yamamoto’s recent past and immediate future:

    https://petropraxis.blogspot.com/2018/08/what-really-happened-with-yamamoto.html

  2. OriginalPouzar says:

    Oilers prospect system comes in at 22 on Pronman’s raking – which is pretty good as he values high end talent over depth (Oilers are accumulating depth but still lack high end, can’t miss prospects).

  3. OriginalPouzar says:

    Sounds like McLeod will be able to fit right in with the line deployment in Edmonton if McLellan is still around (and, if he is still around by the time McLeod is in the NHL (if he ever is), that is likely a very good thing).

  4. OriginalPouzar says:

    Yes, it was a nice verbal for Gulutzan regarding playing quicker but it really was no secret that this is what the Oilers need to do. At least we know the coaching staff sees it as well.

    Now, can they do it?

    I’ve been a believer that the main issue, and reason for the D to D and constant resets, was a personnel issue – having Sekera back (and healthier) and Klefbom as healthy as he’s been in years, should really help.

    Of course, our current top 2 d-prospects excel at transitioning the puck – unfortunately one was just drafted and the other showed last year that there is still much work to do before he is ready for an NHL job.

  5. OriginalPouzar says:

    Maksimov’s P1/60 in his draft year seems a little shy but we know about his huge spike in goals in his draft plus 1 year.

    I wonder how his 18 year old (draft plus 1) numbers compare to the peers?

  6. Wilde says:

    I really want to investigate Gulutzan’s comments here:

    —————————————————————————————————

    Gulutzan finished by listing the areas that could look noticeably different.

    “Maybe our transition, forecheck and the way we defend,” he added. “It’s not anything too different than maybe two or three teams have employed throughout our League but we think it’s going to suit our guys really well.”

    —————————————————————————————————

    And try to find out which teams he’s talking about,

  7. ArmchairGM says:

    More evidence for putting Puljujarvi at 1RW:

    Puljujarvi with Nugent-Hopkins:
    TOI: 135:21
    CF%: 54.51
    FF%: 51.65
    SF%: 50.00
    GF%: 77.78
    GF: 7
    GA: 2
    GF/60: 3.10
    GA/60: 0.89
    +/-/60: +2.21
    OZ Start%: 52.94

    Puljujarvi with McDavid:
    TOI: 256:57
    CF%: 54.61
    FF%: 55.79
    SF%: 53.35
    GF%: 61.90
    GF: 13
    GA: 8
    GF/60: 3.04
    GA/60: 1.87
    +/-/60: +1.17
    OZ Start%: 54.91

    Nugent-Hopkins with McDavid:
    TOI: 300:31
    CF%: 54.73
    FF%: 55.03
    SF%: 55.46
    GF%: 62.22
    GF: 28
    GA: 17
    GF/60: 5.59
    GA/60: 3.39
    +/-/60: +2.20
    OZ Start%: 62.73

    Rattie with McDavid:
    TOI: 158:57
    CF%: 46.84
    FF%: 46.27
    SF%: 43.50
    GF%: 52.00
    GF: 13
    GA: 12
    GF/60: 4.91
    GA/60: 4.53
    +/-/60: +0.38
    OZ Start%: 56.84

    All numbers 5v5 for 2017-18 via naturalstattrick.com

    So Nugent-Hopkins sets McDavid on fire offensively, that we already knew. Rattie with the pair sinks the line down to almost even – most of his “w/McDavid” numbers were with Nuge on the other wing.

    Puljujarvi with Nugent-Hopkins is dynamite, that I didn’t know. To put that +2.21/60 into perspective, the best line in the league last year put up +2.07/60. Bergeron was +1.12, Stamkos +1.22 and McDavid +0.90. Now, those guys are playing top competition more often, but these are steller results.

    The Puljujarvi with McDavid numbers are interesting – reasonable amount of track and Nuge wasn’t on the ice at the same time, the most common LW’s were Lucic and Slepyshev. 3.04-1.87 is nearly exactly what Marchand-Bergeron posted last year: 3.10-1.88 for +1.22. I’m willing to bet a lot of money that adding RNH to the left side improves the offensive production of this line without giving up much (if anything) on the defensive side of the puck.

    Nugent-Hopkins – McDavid – Puljujarvi

    This is the 1-line of the future. How soon can we get Jesse signed to a Jarnkrok-like contract?

  8. Wilde says:

    Also from Gulutzan:

    “We went over all that stuff in July but I think it’s going to be important for the three new coaches here just to get our feet wet with the skillset of the players,” Gulutzan added. “You can run those power-plays and they have been run with great success in the League with all lefties and all righties.”

    Think the lack of obsession for a righty lessens the chances Bouchard makes the team?

  9. 36 percent body fat says:

    in regards to mcdavid before he was in the nhl.

    Sam Gagner “mr. orr, you need to come see this 11 year old named David McConor. He is better than me”

    Orr, “a lot of players were better than you at 11”

    Gagner “i mean he is better than me now”

  10. Jaxon says:

    Speaking of 5v5 Primary Pts in Draft Age seasons, I’ve compiled most of the Canadian Junior and USHL forwards that have been in the Oilers system (or camp invites) since 2005 draft. McLeod does not show well here. This is their Projected (Age/Era/TOI Adjusted) 5v5 Primary Points from their draft season:

    YEAR Name Projected 5v5 P1 Pts
    2015 Connor McDavid 44
    2007 Sam Gagner 32
    2010 Taylor Hall 30
    2011 Ryan Strome 28
    2014 Leon Draisaitl 26
    2008 Jordan Eberle 25
    2018 Tristen Nielsen (last 39 GP) 25
    2005 Gilbert Brule 25
    2017 Kailer Yamamoto 24
    2005 Benoit Pouliot 23
    2012 Nail Yakupov 23
    2011 Ty Rattie 22
    2009 Taylor Beck 21
    2016 Tyler Benson 21
    2005 Ryan O’Marra 20
    2015 Tyler Soy 20
    2014 Rihards Bukarts 20
    2013 Greg Chase 19
    2018 Pavel Gogolev 19
    2011 Ryan Nugent-Hopkins 19
    2014 Vladimir Tkachev 19
    2011 Tobias Rieder 19
    2012 Mitchell Moroz 18
    2012 Daniil Zharkov 18
    2009 Zack Kassian 18
    2017 Kirill Maksimov 17
    2013 Jackson Houck 17
    2013 Kyle Platzer 17
    2009 Mitchell Callahan 16
    2010 Curtis Hamilton 16
    2013 Marc-Olivier Roy 15
    2011 Mitch Holmberg 15
    2018 Ryan McLeod 15
    2007 C.J. Stretch 15
    2017 Trey Fix-Wolansky 14
    2006 Milan Lucic 13
    2002 Kyle Brodziak 13
    2014 Chad Butcher 13
    2011 Travis Ewanyk 12
    2015 Cameron Hebig 11
    2011 Joshua Winquist 11

    PS – added Tristen Nielsen and Pavel Gogolev as I think they should be training camp invites or signed to ELCs.

    PPS Here is my formula for Projected 5v5 Primary Points:
    (Estimated 5v5 Primary Points/60 (via prospect-stats.com) ) / (60 minutes) x (Median Forward 5v5 TOI for Top 6 in the NHL of 14.416667 via NHL.com) x (82 Games) x (Age Adjustment to 17.5 years old (1-(Draft Age on Sept.15 – 17.5) x 0.1672 via Rhys Jessop’s formula)) x (League Equivalency Adjustment Via Vollman’s Updated Numbers) x (League Specific Era Adjustment) x (Inflation Factor of 1.525 to bring Numbers in line with players who jumped directly into the NHL)

  11. jtblack says:

    Thanks LT! great stuff

    Remember, Connor just put up 108 points with a tweener on RW, a sub par D core, a slow transition system, a dismal PP & 1 month of the Flu.

    Trying to be realistic, but I feel he will be right around 125 Points this year!

  12. McNuge93 says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    Yes, it was a nice verbal for Gulutzan regarding playing quicker but it really was no secret that this is what the Oilers need to do.At least we know the coaching staff sees it as well.

    Now, can they do it?

    I’ve been a believer that the main issue, and reason for the D to D and constant resets, was a personnel issue – having Sekera back (and healthier) and Klefbom as healthy as he’s been in years, should really help.

    Of course, our current top 2 d-prospects excel at transitioning the puck – unfortunately one was just drafted and the other showed last year that there is still much work to do before he is ready for an NHL job.

    Do we know status of Sekera and Klefbom recoveries? Just fearing that when camp begins they’re not as healthy as hoped.

  13. jtblack says:

    36 percent body fat:
    in regards to mcdavid before he was in the nhl.

    Sam Gagner “mr. orr, you need to come see this 11 year old named David McConor.He is better than me”

    Orr, “a lot of players were better than you at 11”

    Gagner “i mean he is better than me now”

    This made me Laugh!

  14. jtblack says:

    Jaxon:
    Speaking of 5v5 Primary Pts in Draft Age seasons, I’ve compiled most of the Canadian Junior and USHL forwards that have been in the Oilers system (or camp invites) since 2005 draft. McLeod does not show well here. This is their Projected (Age/Era/TOI Adjusted) 5v5 Primary Points from their draft season:

    YEARNameProjected 5v5 P1 Pts
    2015Connor McDavid44
    2007Sam Gagner32
    2010Taylor Hall30
    2011Ryan Strome28
    2014Leon Draisaitl26
    2008Jordan Eberle25
    2018Tristen Nielsen (last 39 GP) 25
    2005Gilbert Brule25
    2017Kailer Yamamoto24
    2005Benoit Pouliot23
    2012Nail Yakupov23
    2011Ty Rattie22
    2009Taylor Beck21
    2016Tyler Benson21
    2005Ryan O’Marra20
    2015Tyler Soy20
    2014Rihards Bukarts20
    2013Greg Chase19
    2018Pavel Gogolev19
    2011Ryan Nugent-Hopkins19
    2014Vladimir Tkachev19
    2011Tobias Rieder19
    2012Mitchell Moroz18
    2012Daniil Zharkov18
    2009Zack Kassian18
    2017Kirill Maksimov17
    2013Jackson Houck17
    2013Kyle Platzer17
    2009Mitchell Callahan16
    2010Curtis Hamilton16
    2013Marc-Olivier Roy15
    2011Mitch Holmberg15
    2018Ryan McLeod15
    2007C.J. Stretch15
    2017Trey Fix-Wolansky14
    2006Milan Lucic13
    2002Kyle Brodziak13
    2014Chad Butcher13
    2011Travis Ewanyk12
    2015Cameron Hebig11
    2011Joshua Winquist11

    PS – added Tristen Nielsen and Pavel Gogolev as I think they should be training camp invites or signed to ELCs.

    PPS Here is my formula for Projected 5v5 Primary Points:
    (Estimated 5v5 Primary Points/60 (via prospect-stats.com) ) / (60 minutes) x (Median Forward 5v5 TOI for Top 6 in the NHL of 14.416667 via NHL.com) x (82 Games) x (Age Adjustment to 17.5 years old (1-(Draft Age on Sept.15 – 17.5) x 0.1672 via Rhys Jessop’s formula)) x (League Equivalency Adjustment Via Vollman’s Updated Numbers) x (League Specific Era Adjustment) x (Inflation Factor of 1.525 to bring Numbers in line with players who jumped directly into the NHL)

    I really believe the hope for McLeod is a todd Marchant type.

    Speed on a bottom 2 line. Good PK guy Maybe shutdown type centre? By all metrics, its quite clear his O will be shy at the NHL level

  15. barry.moore23 says:

    36 percent body fat:
    in regards to mcdavid before he was in the nhl.

    Sam Gagner “mr. orr, you need to come see this 11 year old named David McConor.He is better than me”

    Orr, “a lot of players were better than you at 11”

    Gagner “i mean he is better than me now”

    That made my day. Go Oilers !!

  16. Melvis says:

    Is anybody watching any u18 games and how the Canadian team transitions the puck? I’m finding it pretty interesting – as well as the coaching staff responsible.

    Very little d to d passing and a very Vegas approach to constant attack with speed and forward momentum through all four lines.

    I think I’ll be glued to the game tonight.

  17. Melvis says:

    Wilde,

    I’m going to take a wild guess. In a word – Vegas.

  18. Richard S.S. says:

    Wow, Ryan McLeod is barely 18. He’s basically played on his line with almost everybody on his Team except the Goalies and his Coaches. He has to continually adjust to each new linemate each time they play on his line. Why? No consistency. Anyone who decides he might be offensively lacking is premature, much too soon to judge something like that.

  19. jtblack says:

    Melvis:
    Is anybody watching any u18 games and how the Canadian team transitions the puck? I’m finding it pretty interesting – as well as the coaching staff responsible.

    Very little d to d passing and a very Vegas approach to constant attack with speed and forward momentum through all four lines.

    I think I’ll be glued to the game tonight.

    Watched every game and willl be watching tonight.

    Team is stacked with 2019 Talent & a few 2020’s. Great Hockey.

  20. jtblack says:

    Richard S.S.:
    Wow, Ryan McLeod is barely 18. He’s basically played on his line with almost everybody on his Team except the Goalies and his Coaches. He has to continually adjust to each new linemate each time they play on his line.Why?No consistency.Anyone who decides he might be offensively lacking is premature, much too soon to judge something like that.

    McLeod is 19 nxt month. He has played 3 yrs of Junior.

    In his 2nd yr of Junior he had 42 Points in 68 games. So if he was born 6 days earlier and draft eligible in 2017 he would prob have been a 4th or 5th round pick.

    Unless he explodes for 110 points this year, you are looking at a checker. And that’s IF he ever arrives in the NHL

  21. Leroy Draisdale says:

    Melvis,

    Is it on tv or would i have to stream it?

  22. ArmchairGM says:

    Just for fun, here’s the Oiler’s 5v5 P1 list for draft+1:

    McDavid: NHL
    Draisaitl: 0.66 (-0.18)
    Yamamoto: 0.75 (-0.02)
    Benson: 0.73 (+0.16)
    Roy: 0.49 (+0.03)
    Chase: 0.64 (+0.19)
    McLeod: N/A
    Houck: 0.45 (+0.06)
    Maksimov: 0.58 (+0.23)

    Interesting that the two best prospects (non-McDavid division) slid backwards in draft+1 in this particular metric. Maksimov skyrocketed, and considering his late birthday (June 1999, just 4 months older than Bouchard) I think there’s a player there. Safin was at 0.43 this year.

    *****************************************************************************************************************

    For reference, Alexis Lafreniere at age 15.929 was 2nd in the QMJHL at 0.88 5v5 P1/60, and first on his team. Only Vitali Abramov (age 19.357) was better at 1.12 – Filip Zadina (age 17.802) was 3rd at 0.82. This kid has got the goods.

    Can’t wait to see Quinton Byfield in the O this year too.

  23. hunter1909 says:

    OriginalPouzar: Yes, it was a nice verbal for Gulutzan regarding playing quicker but it really was no secret that this is what the Oilers need to do. At least we know the coaching staff sees it as well.
    Now, can they do it?

    Thanks to a near generation of Lowe+MacT the term “talk is cheap” comes to mind.

    Or… Lowe+MacT + the EIG; Lowe+MacT with Eakins; Lowe without MacT and Kreuger; Lowe, Howson and MacT; MacT standing behind the bench while his head coach Todd Nelson sweated; Chiarelli fucking everything up and yet he’s impossible to blame due to the Lowe+MacT +Howson influence still in the team;

    Pat Quinn would have made the conference finals in 2016 with that team McLellan choked away.

  24. blainer says:

    I like what I’ve seen in the highlights from McLeod. Excellent skater with a decent shot and hands.

    His numbers are similar to Patrice Bergeons in his draft year and Bergeron made the bruins and played his draft +1 year in the NHL.

    I can say I would find it very acceptable if Mcleod is the next Bergeron.

    Not expecting this by any means but one never knows for sure how any of these players will turn out. My spidey senses tell me we have a great prospect.. Time will tell ..

  25. Melvis says:

    Leroy Draisdale,

    TSN 2 at 7:00 central time.

  26. Professor Q says:

    ArmchairGM,

    Holy crap. Lafreniere could be the next Crosby! Too bad Veleno couldn’t live up to the Exceptional Status, though (still good).

  27. Jaxon says:

    jtblack,

    My optimism for McLeod (if I have any) is that there may be a chance he has been held back by playing in his brother’s shadow. This year, without his brother and next year in pro with a team with no connection to his family will be very telling for me. I think playing on the same team as your brother could have a huge impact (positives and negatives). Without considering that, his production is very underwhelming. His stored will always be an asset, though, so he may have to become a Cogliano to make it.

  28. VOR says:

    jtblack: McLeod is 19 nxt month.He has played 3 yrs of Junior.

    In his 2nd yr of Junior he had 42 Points in 68 games.So if he was born 6 days earlier and draft eligible in 2017 he would prob have been a 4th or 5th round pick.

    Unless he explodes for 110 points this year, you are looking at a checker.And that’s IF he ever arrives in the NHL

    Ryan McLeod is an unique player.

    He has blinding speed, McLeod is also big, really strong, and has high hockey IQ. He is capable of dominating at both ends of the ice. Not to mention he has a plus shot with a very quick release.

    None of which makes him unique.

    He has real consistency issues. And that doesn’t make him unique.

    Then you look at his heat maps and you see it. His goals come in the paint by and large as do his shots. It looks remarkably like Ryan Smyth’s heat map. Okay, so he is a dazzlingly skater who goes to the hardest areas of the ice. This shows up again in the fact he is a puck retrieval genius.

    But while that makes him unusual I wouldn’t say unique. But if you look at the heat map of his primary assists. It is a bright blob of colour in the crease.

    Ryan McLeod is a blazing fast two way player who loves the hard areas. He loves those places because planted in the crease he can use his magic hands to create major offence. If the kid wants it he will be a dominant NHL player.

  29. Bank Shot says:

    I don’t get too optimistic about any prospects until they turn pro.

    Most juniors that get drafted do pretty damn well in their their last couple of draft years.

    Seeing what they do in a pro training camp with a more extended look, and their results in the AHL really tends to separate the wheat form the chaff.

  30. Professor Q says:

    VOR,

    How would one know if he has blinding speed, though, if they can’t see? 😋

  31. Munny says:

    VOR,

    Have your thoughts on McLeod evolved somewhat, VOR?

  32. Bruce McCurdy says:

    VOR: Ryan McLeod is an unique player.

    He has blinding speed, McLeod is also big, really strong, and has high hockey IQ. He is capable of dominating at both ends of the ice. Not to mention he has a plus shot with a very quick release.

    None of which makes him unique.

    He has real consistency issues. And that doesn’t make him unique.

    Then you look at his heat maps and you see it. His goals come in the paint by and large as do his shots. It looks remarkably like Ryan Smyth’s heat map. Okay, so he is a dazzlingly skater who goes to the hardest areas of the ice. This shows up again in the fact he is a puck retrieval genius.

    But while that makes him unusual I wouldn’t say unique. But if you look at the heat map of his primary assists. It is a bright blob of colour in the crease.

    Ryan McLeod is a blazing fast two way player who loves the hard areas. He loves those places because planted in the crease he can use his magic hands to create major offence. If the kid wants it he will be a dominant NHL player.

    The heat maps show that McLeod is effective when he gets in close to the net, or perhaps that he is INeffective from outside.

    Funny thing, I read quite a few scouting reports on this guy and many of them criticized him as being something of a perimeter player who needed to do more to get the hard areas. Which maybe just speaks to those consistency issues you mention.

  33. Silver Streak says:

    I caught the USA / Russia game in Red Deer on Wednesday….almost a full house…..very surprised at the quality of play….these kids are all 6` or better and 170 lbs of bone and muscle, Russia is soooo
    very strong on their skates….and play a very quick crisp disciplined game. I have not yet seen Canada in person, however, I think Russia is the team to beat.

  34. Bruce McCurdy says:

    Another case in point: this snippet from Pronman’s review linked above which I clicked through to after posting the above comment:

    “McLeod gains the zone as well as anyone due to his speed, skill and size. Too often, though, once inside the zone, he can be passive, not looking to make quick plays to the net and preferring to be stationary. There are questions about his physical game and how he’ll be able to win battles and get inside versus pros.”

  35. Melvis says:

    Bruce McCurdy: The heat maps show that McLeod is effective when he gets in close to the net, or perhaps that he is INeffective from outside.

    Funny thing, I read quite a few scouting reports on this guy and many of them criticized him as being something of a perimeter player who needed to do more to get the hard areas. Which maybe just speaks to those consistency issues you mention.

    My scouting reports strongly suggest you need to get into the hard areas and write a book;-)

    No I’m not drunk – not yet anyway.

  36. rickithebear says:

    jtblack:
    Thanks LT! great stuff

    Remember, Connor just put up 108 points with a tweener on RW, a sub par D core, a slow transition system, a dismal PP & 1 month of the Flu.

    Trying to be realistic, but I feel he will be right around 125 Points this year!

    Our coach asked us to run a largely
    3-1-1-1 system all year.
    With
    4-1-1 perimeter pressure in our own zone.

    If we do get pocession.
    How often are we transition passing?
    How often is NZ trap set up when forward transition separation has occurred?

    GA prevention gets you to
    playoffs,
    advance final 8 & conf final
    A potential to cup
    With 20-50% superior success rate
    compared to equal GF production by rank.

    A mistake for forward on offensive attack is not getting a goal.
    Dmen and goalie a mistake on defence is giving up a goal.
    We’re is the importance in high repeatable baseline ( no mistake) play.

    Shouldn’t we be sure we have the most traditional critical def structure.
    2-1 vs 3 fwds
    Rather than
    1-1 vs 3 fwds

    All the skate the puck up, attack Oz dmen lovers Seem to Think
    1-1 vs 3fwds is great or OK.

    I will continue to push
    2-1 vs 3
    And
    1-1 vs 3

    You continue to tell me why 400% less affective even goal production offence driven by dmen
    Justifies the natural odd man structure from that action.

    I have never articulated the natural occurance and criticality of base line play variance in Gf vs GA play.

    We have measured players by offence all these years.

    Until I broke down the 2 critical cores to defence.
    HD density
    And
    Open shot prevention.

    And looked at past playoff
    appearance potential
    Playoff advancement
    Championship success 2 conf champ in the final
    Is driven by GA.

  37. Leroy Draisdale says:

    Melvis,

    Awesome, thanks!

  38. Leroy Draisdale says:

    Wilde,

    Great blog, I really enjoyed your take and share your optimism!

  39. jtblack says:

    VOR: Ryan McLeod is an unique player.

    He has blinding speed, McLeod is also big, really strong, and has high hockey IQ. He is capable of dominating at both ends of the ice. Not to mention he has a plus shot with a very quick release.

    None of which makes him unique.

    He has real consistency issues. And that doesn’t make him unique.

    Then you look at his heat maps and you see it. His goals come in the paint by and large as do his shots. It looks remarkably like Ryan Smyth’s heat map. Okay, so he is a dazzlingly skater who goes to the hardest areas of the ice. This shows up again in the fact he is a puck retrieval genius.

    But while that makes him unusual I wouldn’t say unique. But if you look at the heat map of his primary assists. It is a bright blob of colour in the crease.

    Ryan McLeod is a blazing fast two way player who loves the hard areas. He loves those places because planted in the crease he can use his magic hands to create major offence. If the kid wants it he will be a dominant NHL player.

    McLeod is a lot closer to Steve Kelly, than he is to Ryan Smyth.

  40. VOR says:

    Bruce McCurdy:
    Another case in point: this snippet from Pronman’s review linked above which I clicked through to after posting the above comment:

    “McLeod gains the zone as well as anyone due to his speed, skill and size. Too often, though, once inside the zone, he can be passive, not looking to make quick plays to the net and preferring to be stationary. There are questions about his physical game and how he’ll be able to win battles and get inside versus pros.”

    I am a bit obsessed with Ryan McLeod. That has lead to me collecting scouting reports, statistical info like the heat maps I posted and the info at Canuck’s Army, and my talking to scouts and coaches.

    I think Ryan McLeod is a perimeter player most nights and most shifts. Then for whatever reason he decides he wants it and he turns into this all world power forward who owns the other team’s crease. From the perimeter he isn’t very good at all. Inside he is amazing.

    Scouts notice the lack of effort. Some decide he can’t get to the hard areas. Others that he won’t.

    If he can’t get to the hard areas he was a wasted draft pick.

    If he won’t go to the hard areas the Oilers are in with a chance.

  41. dustrock says:

    That primary points for Nuge in his draft year is pretty telling. Love the guy but for an overall #1 pick in his draft year, that’s too low.

  42. Wilde says:

    Leroy Draisdale:
    Wilde,

    Great blog, I really enjoyed your take and share your optimism!

    Thank you, there was a ton of moving parts to talk about, more than I thought when i started writing

  43. VOR says:

    jtblack: McLeod is a lot closer to Steve Kelly, than he is to Ryan Smyth.

    Actually scouting reports on Steve Kelly suggested he was incredibly hard working. There were concerns about his talent pre-draft but not his work ethic.

    Nobody doubts Ryan McLeod’s talent. His work ethic, heart and consistency on the other hand are very much in dispute, as are his strength, and many scouts believe he is a perimeter player who won’t get anything done at the NHL level.

    So you need to compare McLeod to all the blazingly fast guys the Oilers have drafted who had no character and wouldn’t go to the hard areas. The guys with great talent and fast boots but, “a ten cent brain, and no heart at all.”

  44. pts2pndr says:

    Richard S.S.:
    Wow, Ryan McLeod is barely 18. He’s basically played on his line with almost everybody on his Team except the Goalies and his Coaches. He has to continually adjust to each new linemate each time they play on his line.Why?No consistency.Anyone who decides he might be offensively lacking is premature, much too soon to judge something like that.

    I believe that at times the coaching staff affords playing time according to draft ranking. A first rounder has to prove he doesn’t belong while a second round or later has to prove early that he does. Given that players may mature at a different rate this seems counter productive to achieving the best results. As fans we also have a tendency to prejudge based on past results! Maybe it is just human nature!

  45. frjohnk says:

    rickithebear: Our coach asked us to run a largely
    3-1-1-1 system all year.
    With
    4-1-1 perimeter pressure in our own zone.

    If we do get pocession.
    How often are we transition passing?
    How often is NZ trap set up when forward transitionseparation has occurred?

    GA prevention gets you to
    playoffs,
    advance final 8 & conf final
    A potential to cup
    With 20-50% superior success rate
    compared to equal GF production by rank.

    A mistake for forward on offensive attack is not getting a goal.
    Dmen and goalie a mistake on defence is giving up a goal.
    We’re is the importance in high repeatable baseline ( no mistake) play.

    Shouldn’t we be sure we have the most traditional critical def structure.
    2-1 vs 3 fwds
    Rather than
    1-1 vs 3 fwds

    All the skate the puck up, attack Oz dmen lovers Seem to Think
    1-1 vs 3fwds is great or OK.

    I will continue to push
    2-1 vs 3
    And
    1-1 vs 3

    You continue to tell me why 400% less affective even goal production offence driven by dmen
    Justifies the natural odd man structure from that action.

    I have never articulated the natural occurance and criticality of base line play variance in Gf vs GA play.

    We have measured players by offence all these years.

    Until I broke down the 2 critical cores to defence.
    HD density
    And
    Open shot prevention.

    And looked at past playoff
    appearance potential
    Playoff advancement
    Championship success 2 conf champ in the final
    Is driven by GA.

    rickithebear: Our coach asked us to run a largely
    3-1-1-1 system all year.
    With
    4-1-1 perimeter pressure in our own zone.

    If we do get pocession.
    How often are we transition passing?
    How often is NZ trap set up when forward transitionseparation has occurred?

    GA prevention gets you to
    playoffs,
    advance final 8 & conf final
    A potential to cup
    With 20-50% superior success rate
    compared to equal GF production by rank.

    A mistake for forward on offensive attack is not getting a goal.
    Dmen and goalie a mistake on defence is giving up a goal.
    We’re is the importance in high repeatable baseline ( no mistake) play.

    Shouldn’t we be sure we have the most traditional critical def structure.
    2-1 vs 3 fwds
    Rather than
    1-1 vs 3 fwds

    All the skate the puck up, attack Oz dmen lovers Seem to Think
    1-1 vs 3fwds is great or OK.

    I will continue to push
    2-1 vs 3
    And
    1-1 vs 3

    You continue to tell me why 400% less affective even goal production offence driven by dmen
    Justifies the natural odd man structure from that action.

    I have never articulated the natural occurance and criticality of base line play variance in Gf vs GA play.

    We have measured players by offence all these years.

    Until I broke down the 2 critical cores to defence.
    HD density
    And
    Open shot prevention.

    And looked at past playoff
    appearance potential
    Playoff advancement
    Championship success 2 conf champ in the final
    Is driven by GA.

    You use shot location when looking at shots.

    What numbers do you have from 16-17 and 17-18 that are from the high danger area against Oiler goalies?

    I have to dig them up, but both years, I found Oilers goalies saw more rubber from the high danger area than league average. There was not much of a discrepancy over both years when looking at shots against from the high danger area per 60 at 5 on 5.

    And I believe shots against from the arrow were about the same from both years.

  46. Bos8 says:

    I want to see McLeod with Connor for a few shifts. I’m selfish like that.

    In his hilites I saw some creative thinking in the Ozone rather than linear. Big fan on the possibilities. Improbable Dream? Maybe.

  47. frjohnk says:

    frjohnk:
    You use shot location when looking at shots.

    What numbers do you have from 16-17 and 17-18 that are from the high danger area against Oiler goalies?

    I have to dig them up, but both years, I found Oilers goalies saw more rubber from the high danger area than league average.There was not much of a discrepancy over both years when looking at shots against from the high danger area per 60 at 5 on 5.

    And I believe shots againstfrom the arrow were about the same from both years.

    Here is what our goalies faced from the different locations and how the numbers compared to the league average over the last two years

    All numbers here are at 5 on 5

    16-17

    LowDangerSA/60
    Cam Talbot 11.89
    Jonas Gustavsson 9.74
    Laurent Brossoit 11.46
    Oiler Average 11.71
    League Average 14.66

    MedDangerSA/60
    Cam Talbot 10.79
    Jonas Gustavsson 11.25
    Laurent Brossoit 12.58
    Oiler Average 10.95
    League Average 10.3

    HighDangerSA/60
    Cam Talbot 6.29
    Jonas Gustavsson 4.76
    Laurent Brossoit 4.7
    Oiler Average 6.08
    League Average 5.69

    17-18
    LDSA/60
    Cam Talbot 14.5
    Laurent Brossoit 11.6
    Oiler Average 14.05
    League Average 14.54

    MDSA/60
    Cam Talbot 11.3
    Laurent Brossoit 10.4
    Oiler Average 11.2
    League Average 10.56

    HDSA/60
    Cam Talbot 6.8
    Laurent Brossoit 5.1
    Oiler Average 6.5
    League Average 5.75

    * I did not put Montayos numbers in as I would have to separate his time from Montreal and Edmonton. Dont feel like doing that as it wouldnt tell us anything we did not already know.

    In both years, Oiler goalies saw more shots per 60 minutes at 5 on 5 from the medium and high danger areas than the league average.

    Shots against from the home plate area ( or to be really technical, “The Arrow” TM Bruce McCurdy)

    16-17
    Oilers 17.03
    league Average 15.99

    17-18
    Oilers 17.74
    League Average 16.31

    If we look at expected goals against from Corisca which measures a weighting of every shot that includes shot location PLUS shot type and the probability that shot will go based on league averages

    16-17
    Expected Goals Against/60
    Oilers 2.41
    League Average 2.27
    League Best (Wild) 1.91
    League Worst ( Ari) 2.68

    17-18
    Expected Goals Against/60
    Oilers 2.61
    League Average 2.36
    League Best (Wild) 1.95
    League Worst (Rangers) 2.8

  48. pts2pndr says:

    Bruce McCurdy:
    Another case in point: this snippet from Pronman’s review linked above which I clicked through to after posting the above comment:

    “McLeod gains the zone as well as anyone due to his speed, skill and size. Too often, though, once inside the zone, he can be passive, not looking to make quick plays to the net and preferring to be stationary. There are questions about his physical game and how he’ll be able to win battles and get inside versus pros.”

    Sometimes a very fast player may appear passive when he has to wait for his wingers to catch up!😉

  49. pts2pndr says:

    Bos8:
    I want to see McLeod with Connor for a few shifts.I’m selfish like that.

    In his hilites I saw some creative thinking in the Ozone rather than linear.Big fan on the possibilities.Improbable Dream?Maybe.

    That would be fun to watch! Somewhat like Anderson and Messier in the day!

  50. OriginalPouzar says:

    Wilde:
    After those words about Martindale, I looked up his hockeydb, looked at his points per game and birth month, sighed and said McLeod. Alt-tabbed back and there you were with the same thing.

    Speaking of words, I wrote a literal billion of them about Yamamoto’s recent past and immediate future:

    https://petropraxis.blogspot.com/2018/08/what-really-happened-with-yamamoto.html

    Nice piece – thanks for sharing.

    With that said, I must mention that is wasn’t a “literal” billion words, it was a “figurative” billion words – sorry but a massive pet peeve of mine (the mis-use of the word “literal”).

  51. OriginalPouzar says:

    Jaxon:

    PS – added Tristen Nielsen and Pavel Gogolev as I think they should be training camp invites or signed to ELCs.

    How do you sign an 18 year old?

  52. OriginalPouzar says:

    jtblack:
    Thanks LT! great stuff

    Remember, Connor just put up 108 points with a tweener on RW, a sub par D core, a slow transition system, a dismal PP & 1 month of the Flu.

    Trying to be realistic, but I feel he will be right around 125 Points this year!

    and 84 of those points were at even strength – the most this century.

  53. OriginalPouzar says:

    McNuge93: Do we knowstatus of Sekera and Klefbom recoveries? Just fearing that when camp begins they’re not as healthy as hoped.

    Yes on Klefbom – he was able to start training at 100% a mere 5 weeks after the surgery – he is healthier than he’s ever been as an Oiler (from accounts).

    No, we don’t have a specific update on Sekera (that I know of) but we know the history of this type of surgery and recovery. Its fairly well established that often a player can come back and play 6-8 months removed from the surgery but that it often takes 12-18 months for a more complete recovery which includes mental recovery (i.e. the mental ability to trust the knee, etc.).

    Sekera will be a further 6 months removed from the surgery, he will have the off-season to train, he will have a full training camp and he will be without the brace that he was very express limited his mobility big time.

    We don’t know how close to 100% he’ll be but we do know (well, we can be pretty sure) that he will be MUCH healthier than what we saw earlier this year.

  54. OriginalPouzar says:

    jtblack: McLeod is 19 nxt month.He has played 3 yrs of Junior.

    In his 2nd yr of Junior he had 42 Points in 68 games.So if he was born 6 days earlier and draft eligible in 2017 he would prob have been a 4th or 5th round pick.

    Unless he explodes for 110 points this year, you are looking at a checker.And that’s IF he ever arrives in the NHL

    and there is nothing wrong with that – if a 2nd round pick turns in to an every day NHL player in the middle 6, its a very successful pick.

    I truly think the majority of fans have an unrealistic expectation of what most draft picks will become (not necessarily those in this community which is exceptionally knowledgeable).

    Even if McLeod was picked where he was generally ranked (bottom third of the first round), the expectation should be about the same.

  55. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    VOR:
    https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/prospect-interest-411-ryan-mcleod/

    Thanks for that Vor.

    EDM lacks that player.

    One thing that pissed me off to no end is the number of fly-bys of the net this forward crew does.

    Stop at the goddamn net!!!!

  56. Georgexs says:

    OriginalPouzar: Nice piece – thanks for sharing.

    With that said, I must mention that is wasn’t a “literal” billion words, it was a “figurative” billion words – sorry but a massive pet peeve of mine (the mis-use of the word “literal”).

    Did you “literally” read Wilde’s piece to confirm it was a “figurative” billion words? Or did you “figuratively” read Wilde’s piece to post that it wasn’t a “literal” billion words?

  57. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Professor Q:
    ArmchairGM,

    Holy crap. Lafreniere could be the next Crosby! Too bad Veleno couldn’t live up to the Exceptional Status, though (still good).

    Yeah he killed the Q as an *almost* 16 year old this year.

    Late birthday so he’s not draft eligible until the 2020 draft.

    He might be the 2nd best player in the NHL by the time he’s 19.

    Montreal might tank for two years to be in the mix…….

  58. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    VOR: I am a bit obsessed with Ryan McLeod. That has lead to me collecting scouting reports, statistical info like the heat maps I posted and the info at Canuck’s Army, and my talking to scouts and coaches.

    I think Ryan McLeod is a perimeter player most nights and most shifts. Then for whatever reason he decides he wants it and he turns into this all world power forward who owns the other team’s crease. From the perimeter he isn’t very good at all. Inside he is amazing.

    Scouts notice the lack of effort. Some decide he can’t get to the hard areas. Others that he won’t.

    If he can’t get to the hard areas he was a wasted draft pick.

    If he won’t go to the hard areas the Oilers are in with a chance.

    I hope someone on the team gives him the “bags of money” talk.

    Player/coach: “see this area?” *points to the crease*

    P/C: “there are giant bags of money sitting here. All you have to do it take the punishment to get and stay here. If you do, you get the giant bags of money. If you don’t then the next guy gets told ” see this area……”

    Note: if giant bags of money doesn’t motivate McLeod then find out what does.

    Given that his name is McLeod it’s in his DNA to be motivated by giant bags of money.

  59. frjohnk says:

    Woodguy v2.0: Montreal might tank for two years to be in the mix…….

    Never count out the Oilers.
    Never.

  60. Georgexs says:

    “One of the things we can do in the modern era is measure 5-on-5 offense, and even more targeted, 5-on-5 primary points (goals and first assists).”

    If the point is to measure a forward’s contribution to 5v5 offense, you should use P60 instead of P160. Generally, you lose a little information when you throw away secondary assists. It’s not a good habit.

  61. MrFancypantss says:

    Hi Lowetide,
    Huge fan of the site, visit it all summer long just to stay engaged with the team we all love.
    I’m also a fan of the EPL and one of their long time scout sites have started putting wee numbers next to the members names to signify how long they’ve been members.
    Not sure what goes into this but with so many hardcore posters here it may be a cool thing?
    Cheers!

  62. Jaxon says:

    OriginalPouzar: How do you sign an 18 year old?

    Any player who goes undrafted is eligible to sign an ELC with anyone right after the draft up until his junior training camp starts or he can sign a PTO and then they don’t have to go back to Junior until NHL season starts. At least that is my understanding. So Nielsen and Gogolev could be signed. I think Nielsen is a great fit and he slipped through the draft in a year with a slow start followed by injury followed by really lighting it up. I really hope they sign him. I think he’s a hidden gem.

  63. Jaxon says:

    VOR: I think Ryan McLeod is a perimeter player most nights and most shifts. Then for whatever reason he decides he wants it and he turns into this all world power forward who owns the other team’s crease.

    I’m hoping this is the big brother effect I was referring to earlier. He’ll be interesting to watch this year and next without his brother. Is he guilty of subconsciously giving his brother too much room to be the star? Maybe. Brother dynamics can be pretty powerful.

  64. pts2pndr says:

    Woodguy v2.0: I hope someone on the team gives him the “bags of money” talk.

    Player/coach: “see this area?” *points to the crease*

    P/C: “there are giant bags of money sitting here.All you have to do it take the punishment to get and stay here.If you do, you get the giant bags of money. If you don’t then the next guy gets told ” see this area……”

    Note: if giant bags of money doesn’t motivate McLeod then find out what does.

    Given that his name is McLeod it’s in his DNA to be motivated by giant bags of money.

    Oop so much for political correctness! 🙈I subscribe to the theory fhat once you find the individuals currency the motivation of said individual becomes easy!👍🏾

  65. OriginalPouzar says:

    Jaxon: Any player who goes undrafted is eligible to sign an ELC with anyone right after the draft up until his junior training camp starts or he can sign a PTO and then they don’t have to go back to Junior until NHL season starts. At least that is my understanding. So Nielsen and Gogolev could be signed. I think Nielsen is a great fit and he slipped through the draft in a year with a slow start followed by injury followed by really lighting it up. I really hope they sign him. I think he’s a hidden gem.

    It seems you are right, Section 8.9(b)(ii):

    Eligibility for Play in the League. No Player shall be eligible for play in the League
    unless he:

    (a) had been claimed in the last Entry Draft, or was ineligible for claim under Section
    8.4; or

    (b) had been eligible for claim in the last Entry Draft, but was unclaimed, and:

    (ii) had played hockey in North America the prior season and was under age
    20 at the time of the last Entry Draft, and signed an SPC which was signed
    and registered with the League between the conclusion of the Entry Draft
    and commencement of the Major Juniors season (except that if such
    Player had signed an NHL try-out form, which was signed and registered
    with the League during the aforesaid time period, then the deadline for
    signing and registering with the League an SPC with such try-out Club
    shall be the commencement of the NHL Season).

  66. Scungilli Slushy says:

    jtblack: I really believe the hope for McLeod is a todd Marchant type.

    Speed on a bottom 2 line.Good PK guyMaybe shutdown type centre?By all metrics, its quite clear his O will be shy at the NHL level

    Somebody needs to spit in his cornflakes. He just needs more agro. It probably won’t change, but it could. He seems like Pajaarvi to me, big and very fast, more skilled but lacking an attacking mentality.

  67. Scungilli Slushy says:

    dustrock:
    That primary points for Nuge in his draft year is pretty telling. Love the guy but for an overall #1 pick in his draft year, that’s too low.

    It’s a cohort effect like Yak’s year, just not a lot of high end offensive options. If Galch has been healthy that season he’d be an Oiler or on the Islanders.

    While the oilers had the 1OVs , they didn’t get lucky in who was available 2 times. Not that Nuge isn’t awesome, just that they could have had 3 franchise and one generational player, 3 of which they would have traded for lesser players:)

  68. blackadder says:

    Silver Streak,

    I was there, too. Fun game to watch, plenty of skill on display. Shocked Russia lost today after watching them dominate the Americans in Red Deer.

  69. leadfarmer says:

    MrFancypantss:
    Hi Lowetide,
    Huge fan of the site, visit it all summer long just to stay engaged with the team we all love.
    I’m also a fan of the EPL and one of their long time scout sites have started putting wee numbers next to the members names to signify how long they’ve been members.
    Not sure what goes into this but with so many hardcore posters here it may be a cool thing?
    Cheers!

    September marks my 10th year here. I didn’t really start posting until a few years in though. Plenty of guys were here already
    LT who and what was the first comment on your site

  70. Lowetide says:

    leadfarmer: September marks my 10th year here.I didn’t really start posting until a few years in though.Plenty of guys were here already
    LT who and what was the first comment on your site

    There have been 746,976 comments before this one on the blog, the first one related to my accidentally deleting the previous blog. It is from March 4, 2007 and from kinger who has been most generous over the years. It went like this:

    I happen to use google desktop and have its indexing function on. I have a number of your posts in complete form (271 views cached). Would you like me to email them to you?

  71. Wilde says:

    Lowetide,

    Holy shit, Kinger is the elder dragon?

    Also, I like to read old posts but it only goes back to 2013.

  72. Lowetide says:

    Wilde:
    Lowetide,

    Holy shit, Kinger is the elder dragon?

    Also, I like to read old posts but it only goes back to 2013.

    I have pulled back several years worth, will place them back into the system in due time.

  73. OriginalPouzar says:

    Was this inaugural comment post written in point form?

  74. Melvis says:

    Hollow victory. Nothing to celebrate about yesterday’s game. And although the score see sawed back and forth, it wasn’t very good hockey. Of course, I’m a homie, but USA got robbed on a bad call.

  75. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    Lowetide: I have pulled back several years worth, will place them back into the system in due time.

    – neat. I had another nick before kinger. Kingervision I think.

    – winning hunters tourney when I called the team crap has been a highlight

    – calling drai dasshitty a low.

    – there was a convo many years ago about formatting and the etiquette etc. Woodguy actually inspired my formatting.

    – I once posted a long one after having a few pops with healy Shannon and the rest of the crew in the platinum lounge where they kindly allowed me to buy them a drink and we shot the sh?t about the oil and what ails them.

    – it was a wall of text that some poster put into paragraphs

    – a single thought per line line: that’s been my thing since.

  76. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Georgexs:
    “One of the things we can do in the modern era is measure 5-on-5 offense, and even more targeted, 5-on-5 primary points (goals and first assists).”

    If the point is to measure a forward’s contribution to 5v5 offense, you should use P60 instead of P160. Generally, you lose a little information when you throw away secondary assists. It’s not a good habit.

    I’ve read that P1/60 predicts future P/60 better than P/60 due to the high variance in 2nd assist rates

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