Don’t Start me Talking

NHL players are showing up at rinks and talking to people with microphones. Most of the verbal is routine but there’s a gem here and there. Steve Ewen is a fine writer for the Vancouver Province and he posts quality all winter long. A quote from a recent article via Milan Lucic: “I feel good. I felt great last year. Being in shape was not an issue for me last year. If you talk to Peter (Chiarelli, the Oilers’ general manager), he said in his year-end press conference that skating was not an issue for me last year and it wasn’t. It was just things didn’t go well.”

What I noticed? Lucic was always a fine passer and could take a pass well, but he was caught in between so many times a year ago. Was it vision? Did he train incorrectly/become top heavy ala the Ethan Moreau “Mandelbaum” era? I don’t know and that’s a fact. I can say that I’ve watched Lucic his whole NHL career, and he was not making those excellent passes we saw in the past. The only thing, aside from erosion, I can think of is ML changed his training routine a year ago. People are predicting he’ll score 40-50 points in a recovery year, but what I’m looking for is his passing acumen to return. It’s a big part of what separated him from other enforcers in the game.

THE ATHLETIC!

Give The Athletic as a gift or get it yourself and join the fun! Offer is here, less than $4 a month! I find myself reading both the hockey (Willis, Dellow, Pronman, et cetera) and the baseball coverage a lot, it’s a pure pleasure to visit. We’ll sell you the whole seat, but you’ll only need the edge.

JESSE PULJUJARVI’S COMPARABLES, DRAFT +3

Lots of talk in the last few days online about Jesse Puljujarvi and his role on the Oilers this coming season. JP’s comps (above) all took giant leaps forward in their draft +3 seasons and there’s no reason to believe it’ll be any different for Puljujarvi. The organization can do things to aid the process, including a training camp stapling to one of the high-end skill centers (97 or 29) but I can’t tell you that is going to happen. Either way, he should get power-play time. One thing I have read here and there is that Puljujarvi isn’t pushing enough to be inside the top-six. If you look at his goals per 60, there’s no real argument available:

The big Finn ranks No. 4 in goals per 60 (5-on-5, this is all NaturalStatTrick) and No. 5 in primary points per 60. It’s true there’s a gap between Nuge and JP, but the kid was also the one who was handled differently among that group during this past season. Tobias Rieder, Pontus Aberg, maybe they eat his lunch, but my feeling is Peter Chiarelli has made it fairly difficult for the coach to find alternatives. Perhaps it is happening just this way.

About damned time. Men haven’t cornered the market on intelligence or good ideas, and this kind of hiring should eventually end the centuries of mansplaining women have endured (I do it, too, but have at least become aware of it. Some of us males are not yet aware). The NHL has employed women in the past on the hockey side, but not much progress past Laura Stamm saving slow boat Bob Nystrom’s career and aiding New York City in winning four straight Stanley’s. This is long overdue. Damnable Leafs keep doing smart things.

I don’t think the Oilers would be in on Karlson but never say never. If would certainly blow the ‘summer of keeping your powder dry’ right out of the water. If the Habs are dealing Patches, I can see Edmonton making a long distance call on him for sure.

LOWDOWN WITH LOWETIDE

A busy morning and a fluid guest list. We’ll get going at 10, TSN1260, with the CFL, NFL front and center. I’ll have Rob Vollman on to talk about the two new Oilers hires this week and we’ll chat about projecting final standings in August. 10-1260 text, @Lowetide on twitter. See you on the radio!

written by

The author didn‘t add any Information to his profile yet.
Related Posts

127 Responses to "Don’t Start me Talking"

  1. Walter Gretzkys Neighbour says:

    I am cautiously optimistic that Lucic will have an improved year. I know there is all the “he’s done, finished, over the hill, caput, off a cliff, useless” feelings out there but the man undoubtedly has some pride and will want to reassert himself.

    If he can’t then all the descriptors above will apply, but let’s give him the chance. He’s signed, he’s here. It’s what we have,

    I wonder sometimes if we are not all on this site caught in our own biases with respect to how well we know the players and their benefits and shortcomings. There’s a lot of confirmation bias and availability heuristic that play with how we view our players.

    I have never spent a lot of time on other team websites but I wonder if a lot of the verbal isn’t pretty much exactly the same. Winning at a high level takes a lot of things breaking right.

    This team has some talent if things break right and some players have career years, will be on our way!

    Hey, I’m the first to post again today!! A real trend for me!

  2. OriginalPouzar says:

    You reference the exact same three comps for Puljujarvi that I like to bring up (repeatedly) – they all spent time during their draft plus 2 year, in the AHL and do “OK” in their NHL time in their draft plus 2 years. They are established themselves as top 6 NHL players in their draft plus 3 years.

    I agree, no reason to no think Jesse can (will) do the same. I believe he can but am not 100% sure that he will. I’m not sure I expect him to blow past 55-60 points but would be disappointed if he isn’t 45 plus.

    There are many other similar comparables. High talent prospects coming over from the European leagues generally take some time. Patrick Laine is clearly the outlier.

    Jesse Puljujarvi was a teenager the last time the Oilers play an NHL hockey game and Jesse Puljujarvi was eligible to play in the World Junior Hockey Championships the last time is was held.

  3. Lowetide says:

    Walter: No doubt about bias, for me Lucic struggled in year one and his passing faltered but this past season was alarming. We’ll see.

  4. OriginalPouzar says:

    1.34 G/60 is a fantastic and remarkable number but lets not forget that McDavid didn’t really start scoring goals until the last third of the season.

    It’s like he just decided he wanted to score more goals. He finished the season at 1.34 G/60 at 5 on 5 but, for the last 20 games of the season, he was scoring goals at a rate of 2.15 G/60 and 2.3 G/60 in the last 10 games.

    If Connor McDavid wants to win the Rocket Richard this year, Connor McDavid will win the Rocket Richard this year.

  5. oilersjo says:

    I think a lot of Lucic struggles last year ma have been mental. I may be wrong but I think this is probably the most negative environment he has had to deal with in his career. The mind can play tricks when a proud man is in difficulty.

  6. Lowetide says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    1.34 G/60 is a fantastic and remarkable number but lets not forget that McDavid didn’t really start scoring goals until the last third of the season.

    It’s like he just decided he wanted to score more goals. He finished the season at 1.34 G/60 at 5 on 5 but, for the last 20 games of the season, he was scoring goals at a rate of 2.15 G/60 and 2.3 G/60 in the last 10 games.

    If Connor McDavid wants to win the Rocket Richard this year, Connor McDavid will win the Rocket Richard this year.

    The one reason I’m hesitant to put a number under 94 points on this Oilers team is No. 97.

  7. Walter Gretzkys Neighbour says:

    Lowetide:
    Walter: No doubt about bias, for me Lucic struggled in year one and his passing faltered but this past season was alarming. We’ll see.

    I agree – alarming is a perfect way to describe it! And puzzling. Is there a mental component, we just don’t know.

    Watch enough sports and you see (as I know you do indeed watch enough sports!) sometimes things just break right, fall in to place, mesh – whatever and a player has a career year. Not suggesting that will happen for Lucic, but there are others on this team for whom that is a real possibility.

    A couple years ago a so so pitching Jays team had a few players catch fire and there they were – in the hunt. Isn’t that really the thing about sports anyway?

    You can (and should) use all the analytics and empirical measures you can to understand trends, probabilities etc, but in the end it comes down to – who knows random quantal fluctuations in the games!

    Having said all this – I just want EVERY SINGLE quantum fluctuation to go against the despicable Flames! And the Canucks. And maybe Montreal too….

  8. oilman says:

    Interesting you mention the Mandelbaum era…Lucic did say in the Ryan Whitney interview that he had changed trainers and is now working with Ethan Moreau’s brother. Eyesight can be such a tricky thing too. When I played goal waaaaay back I went from really good to really bad over the span of one summer. Couldn’t figure out why and it was very frustrating. A regular trip to the optometrist part way through the year revealed my prescription had worsened slightly….like from -1.0 to -1.25. I couldn’t notice the difference day to day but it made all the difference while playing. Was probably picking up the puck an extra foot or so earlier and I felt like my old self again. And that was in beer league! Can’t imagine the extra impact with the speed of the NHL but to me that makes a lot of sense.

  9. Woogie63 says:

    Good wingers need a good center to be a great winger.

  10. McNuge93 says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    1.34 G/60 is a fantastic and remarkable number but lets not forget that McDavid didn’t really start scoring goals until the last third of the season.

    It’s like he just decided he wanted to score more goals. He finished the season at 1.34 G/60 at 5 on 5 but, for the last 20 games of the season, he was scoring goals at a rate of 2.15 G/60 and 2.3 G/60 in the last 10 games.

    If Connor McDavid wants to win the Rocket Richard this year, Connor McDavid will win the Rocket Richard this year.

    Gretz did that too. He felt teams were starting to figure his bias to passing the puck so he just decided to shoot it more. He scored a few in his day.

  11. Bruce McCurdy says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    You reference the exact same three comps for Puljujarvi that I like to bring up (repeatedly) – they all spent time during their draft plus 2 year, in the AHL and do “OK” in their NHL time in their draft plus 2 years. They are established themselves as top 6 NHL players in their draft plus 3 years.

    I agree, no reason to no think Jesse can (will) do the same. I believe he can but am not 100% sure that he will.I’m not sure I expect him to blow past 55-60 points but would be disappointed if he isn’t 45 plus.

    There are many other similar comparables.High talent prospects coming over from the European leagues generally take some time.Patrick Laine is clearly the outlier.

    Jesse Puljujarvi was a teenager the last time the Oilers play an NHL hockey game and Jesse Puljujarvi was eligible to play in the World Junior Hockey Championships the last time is was held.

    Worth notng that all three of the comps were north of 0.5 P/G in their Draft +2 season, while JP was down around 0.3. So he’s got some catching up to do, or perhaps his will be a lower-yield explosion.

  12. jp says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    1.34 G/60 is a fantastic and remarkable number but lets not forget that McDavid didn’t really start scoring goals until the last third of the season.

    It’s like he just decided he wanted to score more goals. He finished the season at 1.34 G/60 at 5 on 5 but, for the last 20 games of the season, he was scoring goals at a rate of 2.15 G/60 and 2.3 G/60 in the last 10 games.

    If Connor McDavid wants to win the Rocket Richard this year, Connor McDavid will win the Rocket Richard this year.

    It felt like that for sure. But someone posted a while back that his shot rates (and also maybe HDCF?) didn’t spike. Was it scoring at will? Or was it just a streak of puck luck where everything turned to gold? I’m not sure one way or the other yet.

  13. dustrock says:

    oilersjo:
    I think a lot ofLucic struggles last year ma have been mental.I may be wrong but I think this is probably the most negative environment he hashad to deal with in his career.The mind can play tricks when a proud man isin difficulty.

    Absolutely. And as was mentioned here a few weeks ago, maybe a month ago, Looch mentioned how hard the winter was, on himself and his family.

    And me and some others discussed how tough it is to deal with SAD.

  14. Westchester Oil says:

    Hayley Wickenheiser is an intelligent person, a talented hockey player with oodles of drive, and a great Canadian.

    Kudos to the Leafs.

  15. Bruce McCurdy says:

    Jaxon: Options to send down / not make the opening roster: Puljujarvi, Yamamoto, Bear, Bouchard, Marody, Benson, Jones, Koskinen.

    Koskinen is waiver exempt and therefore the big ticket item to send down for room. Puljujarvi should be on the roster all year. Yamamoto and Bear could start in the AHL even if they show well. Bouchard is a tough one. If he plays well in pre-season I’d like to see him get a few games, but maybe it’s not as valuable if they’re playing in Europe as it’s not true-to-life experience of playing in the NHL. Marody is an outside chance anyhow, so he should be in the AHL. Benson and Jones are extreme long shots so they should be in the AHL for sure. Koskinen may be key and that may mean Montoya or someone else is on the opening roster, yet never plays a game.

    Bringing forward Jaxon’s comment from the wee hours, with full credit to him for pointing out Koskinen’s waiver exempt status which had escaped my attention. Forgot that goalies get a fourth year beyond their ELC, & wasn’t aware that extended indefinitely into the future.

    CapFriendly lists Koskinen’s waiver exempt years as:
    2009-10
    2010-11
    2011-12
    2018-19

    … Which looks more than a little weird, but it does in fact appear that the 30-year-old netminder is waiver exempt. So he represents another potential paper transaction, the problem being that i’m guessing (again) that they could only “bury” the AHL limit of $1,025,000, leaving no advantage of sending him down vs. Al Montoya. I guess they could send both out & keep one of the younger stoppers on the paper roster, which would free up a couple hundred thou. I don’t think (that word again) that they are allowed to reduce to one goalie on the roster even on paper.

    But if they need a quarter mil or so to both pay Nurse long term & keep Sekera on the roster for a day without exceeding the cap, that’s one way to do it. Another would be to not buy out Eric Gryba. 🙁

  16. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Iirc Daly mentioned that teams starting the year overseas get “expanded rosters” due to inability to have an injury replacement close at hand when in Europe unless they travel with the team.

    EDM’s opening night cap should actually be higher than the cap then.

    Has anyone seen the bar napkin Daly wrote the expanded roster size and extra cap space on?

  17. Melvis says:

    A good chunk of my data related world view includes something called bl/60. Blue Language. It can, in fact, be tracked with nothing other than a simple recording device.

    Speaking of Lucic, the needle on that meter last season was in the red zone not only when making a pass, but in taking a pass. His sense of anticipation went right out the window.

    I was watching the Cards/Dodgers game yesterday. The apples and papaya compares be damned. The Cards centerfielder Harrison Bader is physically, ALWAYS in motion. His brain even more so.

  18. Darth Tu says:

    “If the Habs are dealing Patches, I can see Edmonton making a long distance call on him for sure.”

    I’d love to see a legit scoring winger coming to the Oilers, but, any ideas on how this deal could shake out? I’m not sure how much I’d be happy with the Oil giving up prospect/draft pick wise to pick up Patches.

    Outside of the prospect pool, do we have a player that the Habs would be interested in that could be included in the deal that’s not named Nugent Hopkins or Nurse? If Sekera hadn’t been injured I’d have suggested possibly offering him up.

  19. leadfarmer says:

    Lucic says it wasnt his skatin but we will see what happens. I’m guessing he comes to camp 10 lbs lighter

  20. jake70 says:

    If you eliminate the play of Lucic in that rectanglular piece of ice that is about 25 by 10 feet from the boards out, cut in half by the left side D-zone blue line, he played alright.

  21. Richard S.S. says:

    If Milan Lucic has had his vision checked and can drop 10 lbs, he could very well score 50 or more points next year. Without doing both, that point number will be something less. Milan Lucic is an exceptional talent for what he does, but not everyone will accept limitations at any time.

  22. Gerta Rauss says:

    Darth Tu: I’d love to see a legit scoring winger coming to the Oilers, but, any ideas on how this deal could shake out? I’m not sure how much I’d be happy with the Oil giving up prospect/draft pick wise to pick up Patches

    I think MTL has piddled away most of the value of Patches-we saw what Skinner went for a few weeks ago and I think that’s a reasonable comp in this market

    ie: 2nd round pick, prospect(non elite division), bits and pieces

    I’m not sure what my threshold is for a 1 year rental, but I could see Chia making a move like this-even for a rental

    If they were to add Pacioretty without giving up a roster player(s) I think this is a playoff team

  23. Side says:

    Is Lucic losing 10 lbs a meme I missed?

    I don’t understand how him losing 10 lbs helps contribute to him scoring more. I wonder if he/the Oilers medical staff/training staff know this magical number?

  24. Jordan says:

    3 thoughts:

    1 – I was almost excited about the round table for next Wednesday, LT. If you can upgrade that last prospect for someone like Pat, Jon or Tyler, that’d be a really good panel. (don’t worry Darcy – you just need to hone your game in the minors before you come up to the big leagues).

    2 – LT, after you cut down that tree, you did create the greatest Oilers Blog in existence today. So, I don’t think you can call it a total loss.

    3 – If E.K. comes to the west, I’d be shocked if its to a team that isn’t in Nevada. The only way I see that happening is if a team overpays hard (I’m looking at you Calgary).

  25. Pretendergast says:

    Sorry for the sidetrack but watched the TSN highlights of Brock Boeser in Da Beauty League in full HD and gotta say, how is it possible in this day and age for most AHL teams to have video from a potato?
    Seeing Brock bat the puck out of the air in real time in the most ridiculously named league just bothers me, use an Iphone and youll have better quality A.

  26. Melvis says:

    Just a couple of things off the top of my head.

    Slow degeneration of eyesight can certainly affect one’s play from season to season, but can’t really account for sudden drop offs pre and post Xmas.

    SAD can be incredibly enervating, but if anyone has spent any time at all on the US northeast coast during the winter, I don’t think it plays out. Boston is pretty damn gloomy in the winter. And three months under a cloud in Van, has me running back to Saskatoon just for a respite.

    I suspect whatever one can surmise about Lucic possibly begins with family and/or home life, ends in his head and manifests itself on the ice.

    Looking back, my beer league inconsistancy and stumbling around had more to do with some on going relationship hassle.

  27. Georgexs says:

    “JP’s comps (above) all took giant leaps forward in their draft +3 seasons and there’s no reason to believe it’ll be any different for Puljujarvi. The organization can do things to aid the process, including a training camp stapling to one of the high-end skill centers (97 or 29) but I can’t tell you that is going to happen. Either way, he should get power-play time.”

    Let’s have a look.

    TOI with Centers/Linemates

    1. Nylander

    15/16

    Greening (??), 31

    16/17

    Matthews, 624
    Kadri, 360

    2. Pastrnak

    14/15

    Spooner, 215
    Krejci, 141
    Kelly, 86

    15/16

    Krejci, 499
    Bergeron, 61

    16/17

    Bergeron, 541
    Krejci, 429

    3. Rantanen

    15/16

    Duchene, 29
    Soderberg, 21

    16/17

    MacKinnon, 685
    Duchene, 350

    17/18

    MacKinnon, 946

    4. Puljujarvi

    16/17

    Drai, 107
    CMD, 84

    17/18

    CMD, 257
    Strome, 238
    RNH, 117
    Drai, 101

    Also, let’s look at PP TOI

    1. Nylander

    Season, GP, PP TOI, PP TOI/GP

    15-16, 22, 60, 2:43
    16-17, 81, 192, 2:22

    2. Pastrnak

    Season, GP, PP TOI, PP TOI/GP

    14-15, 46, 78, 1:42
    15-16, 51, 24, 0:28
    16-17, 75, 198, 2:38

    3. Rantanen

    Season, GP, PP TOI, PP TOI/GP

    15-16, 9, 0, 0
    16-17, 75, 205, 2:44
    17-18, 81, 302, 3:44

    4. Puljujarvi

    Season, GP, PP TOI, PP TOI/GP

    16-17, 28, 23, 0:49
    17-18, 65, 48, 0:44

    You can kind of see what preceded the giant leap forward and what was in place for those players in their leap years.

    None of the comp prospects you listed were asked to earn ice time or prove themselves while playing away from their team’s best offensive options. In a historic, disastrous 16-17 season for COL where nothing was working, Rantanen played all his time with MacKinnon and Duchene and was given 2:44 TOI per game on a league worst power play that managed to score 4.34 GF60. Talk about not earning it.

    Bruce has a comment up here about JP’s offense being shy in the pre-breakout season. I invite anyone who feels that way to compare the opportunities that JP has been given to those given to his peers. It’s a bad bet to stick your best young players with players who don’t have offense. You can see that the other teams didn’t do that with their top prospects. Apparently, our organization seems to prefer to do things to derail rather than aid the process and then feed the media and fans lines that raise questions about the player.

    Here’s CMD’s results with Leon on his right side:

    Season, TOI, CF%, GF60, GA60, G+/-60

    16-17, 677, 53.9, 3.63, 2.48, 1.15
    17-18, 499, 54.4, 3.73, 2.77, 0.96

    And here’s CMD with JP:

    Season, TOI, CF%, GF60, GA60, G+/-60

    16-17, 84, 54.1, 5.71, 1.43, 4.28
    17-18, 257, 54.6, 3.04, 1.87, 1.17

    You seem to respect the HC. You also seem to believe in JP.

    You see how these two things are at odds.

    I have no conflict. I think CMD is astonishingly great. I really like JP.

  28. Ryan says:

    Side:
    Is Lucic losing 10 lbs a meme I missed?

    I don’t understand how him losing 10 lbs helps contribute to him scoring more.I wonder if he/the Oilers medical staff/training staff know this magical number?

    I think this might have something to do with Newton’s second law.

  29. Ryan says:

    Georgexs,

    No clue about Draisaitl or the PP time, but IIRC Stauffer had a comment about McDavid finding him difficult to play with.

    While we can’t read minds, we can be pretty sure that McDavid and Draisaitl have some input on who plays on their lines. Albeit, it’s a dog’s breakfast for either one with the roster we have.

    Managing the PP minutes might be some attempt to manage his future cap hit. The pendulum may have swung too far in the opposite direction.

    Gagner was given every opportunity to succeed and put up points which only served to inflate his contract beyond reason.

  30. Melvis says:

    That Marlie ringer slapshot had me running scared
    That Marlie ringer slapshot just grazed my ass

    That girlfriend in the stands just stared
    Then gloated some chuckles and some sass

    That elbow to chops sent me to the room
    That pom pom girl went chicka boom, chicka boom, chicka boom boom boom.

    “Termination Blues” Melvis and the Hounddogs

  31. Side says:

    Ryan: I think this might have something to do with Newton’s second law.

    Ahh yes, I remember it now:

    “The second law states that the scoring rate of a person is dependent upon one variable – losing 10 pounds.”

    Maybe Lucic should gain 10 lbs. I remember a lot of people at the beginning of last season (myself included) were saying Lucic looked slimmer and had some more pep in his step.

    And then Christmas rolled around…

  32. jtblack says:

    I think the JP comparables help show that playing in the AHL has 0 deteriment to a players development. Yammy should play at least half the season in the Bake.

    I dont think jP is as gifted offensively as the 3 comparables, BUT:

    He was on pace for 15 Goals / 82 last yr. So even a modest improvement gets him to 20 Goals.
    .JP has never had a consistent chance on PP1. With Letestu gone I hope he fills that spot. IF he gets consistent PP time that should add another 4 – 10 Goals.

    So just by simple math, with a slight increase in productivity from JP, more quality Linemates (coach) and more PP time (coach) : JP will reach the 25+ Goal mark.

    BOOK IT!

  33. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    leadfarmer,

    How is being 10lbs lighter going to make Lucic faster? Considering his bone density (essentially an 11 on a scale of 10) wouldn’t he need muscle mass to maintain explosiveness? Isn’t his lack of first step speed in fact more related to fast twitch muscle fibre? He’s not exactly fat.

  34. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Side,

    Agreed, I think this is an overblown narrative stoked by the likes of the MSM *cough*Spec*cough.

  35. 90s fan says:

    Is there any sense to not playing JP next to MCD due to the fact its a contract year? Can we afford an explosion year?

  36. Side says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey:
    Side,

    Agreed, I think this is an overblown narrative stoked by the likes of the MSM *cough*Spec*cough.

    Yeah exactly. It’s a weird thing to suggest, particularly given Lucic’s thoughts.

    “I feel good. I felt great last year. Being in shape was not an issue for me last year. If you talk to Peter (Chiarelli, the Oilers’ general manager), he said in his year-end press conference that skating was not an issue for me last year and it wasn’t. It was just things didn’t go well.”

    I can see how that conversation would go:

    “Lucic, we know you said you felt great going into the season, and you were in shape, and Peter agrees with you… but we’re going to need you to lose 10 pounds.”

    “but… why?”

    “because, Lucic…….. because.”

  37. Georgexs says:

    Ryan:
    Georgexs,

    No clue about Draisaitl or the PP time, but IIRC Stauffer had a comment about McDavid finding him difficult to play with.

    While we can’tread minds, we can be pretty sure that McDavid and Draisaitl have some input on who plays on their lines. Albeit, it’s a dog’s breakfast for either one with the roster we have.

    Managing the PP minutes might be some attempt to manage his future cap hit. The pendulum may have swung too far in the opposite direction.

    Gagner was given every opportunity to succeed and put up points which only served to inflate his contract beyond reason.

    My response to most of this would be: “Apparently, our organization seems to prefer to do things to derail rather than aid the process and then feed the media and fans lines that raise questions about the player.”

    As for Gagner, what was beyond reason about his 2 year bridge @ $2.275 per? And then his 1 year at $3.2? Or are you talking about his 4th contract; 3 years at $4.8 after he scored 0.79 PPG in the shortened season?

    If the point is the org. is working hard to limit JP’s offense, then, again, my response would be “Apparently, our organization seems to prefer to do things to derail rather than aid the process…”

  38. Bank Shot says:

    Melvis:
    Just a couple of things off the top of my head.

    Slow degeneration of eyesight can certainly affect one’s play from season to season, but can’t really account for sudden drop offs pre and post Xmas.

    SAD can be incredibly enervating, but if anyone has spent any time at all on the US northeast coast during the winter, I don’t think it plays out. Boston is pretty damn gloomy in the winter. And three months under a cloud in Van, has me running back to Saskatoon just for a respite.

    Maybe he was SAD about being on a loser franchise that was completely eliminated from the playoffs before Xmas.

    Going back until when he was 15, Luicic has always played on playoff teams. The one year in his career before last season that he missed the playoffs it was 14/15 in Boston on a 96 point team. They were very much in it until the last day of the season.

    Maybe going home to rest for the Xmas break last year and realizing that he had absolutely nothing to play for the rest of the season got in his head. Seems relatively possible to me.

    I guess we will find out soon enough.

  39. frjohnk says:

    Georgexs,

    JP was able to play with the best center depth in the league last year

    McDavid 256 minutes
    Strome 237 minutes
    RNH 117 minutes
    Draisaitl 101 minutes
    Letestu 46 minutes

    JP results with
    Drai 2.37 pts/60
    McDavid 1.87 pts/60
    Strome 1.26 pts/60
    RNH 0.51 pts/60
    Letestu 0

    IIRC, JP had a good start with McDavid but then trailed off. I am spitballing but once JP did not produce as much with McDavid, maybe the coaching staff felt it was best to not have JP up against the best Dmen ( so the staff put him with the other centers). JP had good success with Drai as well but for whatever reason (s) JP played a bunch ( 400 minutes) with other centers with poor results. JP was definitely put into the blender.

    As for the PP1, I think everybody but the coach thought JP should have been there.

    On another note that is kinda related that I heard the other day, the coaching staff at the World Championships had a bit of trouble finding someone to fit on the other wing with McDavid. He plays at a pace most are not used to, even the best of the best, so the staff had some rotation of wingers on the McDavid Nuge line throughout the tournament.

  40. hunter1909 says:

    Bank Shot: Maybe going home to rest for the Xmas break last year and realizing that he had absolutely nothing to play for the rest of the season got in his head.

    Lucic must go. He obviously hasn’t got a clue about being a 21st century Oiler.

  41. hunter1909 says:

    Georgexs: It’s a bad bet to stick your best young players with players who don’t have offense. You can see that the other teams didn’t do that with their top prospects. Apparently, our organization seems to prefer to do things to derail rather than aid the process and then feed the media and fans lines that raise questions about the player.

    Wow. August brings out the most accurate post-modern Oilers analysis.

  42. frjohnk says:

    I know that Lucic has had two very poor years at 5 on 5 but I believe as long as Lucic stays healthy, he will rebound somewhat in this part of his game.

    Why?

    2 big reasons.

    – He will play majority of the season in the top 6.
    I dont see anybody pushing him out of the top 6 left wing spots. So he will get to play with McDavid and Drai. Two world class centers. And if injury hits one of those guys, then Lucic will play with RNH or Strome. 2 decent centers. So he will be able to play with skill.

    Last year, Lucic only scored well with RNH. In 314 minutes with RNH, Lucic scored 2.1 pts/60. The rest of the centers, Lucic scored quite poor. But the reason why Lucic scored poorly way from RNH is a poor shooting percentage. Which is the the 2nd reason why I think Lucic rebounds.

    -Shooting percentage.
    He shot 5.93% last year. ( 5 on 5)

    Up until last year, his shooting % was 13.5% for his career. ( 5 on 5)
    Last year he got 69 shot attempts off from the slot area. This is the most he has every had. So he was getting into the slot area and getting chances. They just were not going in. It happens to players. Sometimes for big stretches.

    Id be more concerned if he was not getting into the slot area and not getting shot attempts away but that was not happening.

    Heck maybe Lucic shoots 15%. That would tie his 5th highest shooting %. He is going to play with skill and he is getting to the right area. Why not?

  43. Jordan says:

    90s fan:
    Is there any sense to not playing JP next to MCD due to the fact its a contract year? Can we afford an explosion year?

    Correct.

    You need to sign him to an extension at reasonable money now.

    Every time I’ve discussed Jesse this summer, or Chia’s summer, the biggest thing for me to protect the cap situation moving forwards is a JP extension now.

    As he’s moving into the last year of his ELC, I’d sign him to 3.5Mx4-8ys and give him some security for a nice discount. Play him anywhere and let him develop.

    It’s not rocket surgery – make the bet and CYA.

  44. jake70 says:

    Just saw a report on the ticker news thing on bottom of TV screen – “report – E. Karlsson does not want to sign extension with canadian team” – this is getting stupid – get these players in front of camera and make them say why. I am sure Bettman doesn’t mind these reports.

  45. Melvis says:

    hunter1909: Wow. August brings out the most accurate post-modern Oilers analysis.

    The late August no hockey blues, and little more than 50 comments through the 24 hockey blog cycle these days should bring out a lot more flippancy, and dark humour related to Oilers. And certainly countless musings about other things.

    Maybe a few more swigs straight out of the bottle, and a bit more obstreperousness?

  46. godot10 says:

    jake70:
    dJust saw a report on the ticker news thing on bottom of TV screen – “report –E. Karlsson does not want to sign extension with canadian team”– this is getting stupid – get these players in front of camera and make them say why. I am sure Bettman doesn’t mind these reports.

    The marginal tax rate in Canada went up significantly with Trudeau, superslammed with Wynne in Ontario and Notley in Alberta. In Quebec and Manitoba itwas already high. And BC has a new NDP government which should be getting around to raising the top rates soon enough.

    On million dollar salaries, the impact is real vs. no-income-tax states in the US.

    Karlsson is also probably looking for relative anonymity also.

  47. frjohnk says:

    godot10: The marginal tax rate in Canada went up significantly with Trudeau, superslammed with Wynne in Ontario and Notley in Alberta.In Quebec and Manitoba itwas already high.And BC has a new NDP government which should be getting around to raising the top rates soon enough.

    On million dollar salaries, the impact is real vs. no-income-tax states in the US.

    Karlsson is also probably looking for relative anonymity also.

    I think one could also strike the Panthers off the list as well.

  48. jake70 says:

    godot10: The marginal tax rate in Canada went up significantly with Trudeau, superslammed with Wynne in Ontario and Notley in Alberta.In Quebec and Manitoba itwas already high.And BC has a new NDP government which should be getting around to raising the top rates soon enough.

    On million dollar salaries, the impact is real vs. no-income-tax states in the US.

    Karlsson is also probably looking for relative anonymity also.

    Maybe Canadian teams should join the SEL.

  49. RonnieB says:

    I’m amazed by the comments implying that the Oilers would prefer to see another season go down the sewer than risk JP having a breakout season as a top 6 RW which might earn him a bigger second contract. Nearly as amazing are the suggestions that the Oilers should sign JP to a long term mega million $ contract now, just in case he has a breakout season this year and merits a larger contract later.

  50. Darth Tu says:

    Gerta Rauss,

    I could probably live with a second round pick and (up to, but hopefully not including) a Caleb Jones level prospect.

  51. hunter1909 says:

    RonnieB:
    I’m amazed by the comments implying that the Oilers would prefer to see another season go down the sewer than risk JP having a breakout season as a top 6 RW which might earn him a bigger second contract. Nearly as amazing are the suggestions that the Oilers should sign JP to a long term mega million $ contract now, just in case he has a breakout season this year and merits a larger contract later.

    Neither surprises me.

    Fans of winning teams often talk more intelligently about hockey than fans of losing teams. I remember Red Wings fans used to remind me of old-time Oiler fans in that regard.

    Oilers fans of the 21st century support the worst managed NHL franchise ever. Worse than the Golden Seals, even. No shock that it affects reasoning.

  52. Georgexs says:

    hunter1909: Wow. August brings out the most accurate post-modern Oilers analysis.

    What does post-modern mean? For that matter, what does wow mean? Or accurate? Or Oilers analysis? Or August?

  53. Side says:

    hunter1909: Neither surprises me.

    Fans of winning teams often talk more intelligently about hockey than fans of losing teams. I remember Red Wings fans used to remind me of old-time Oiler fans in that regard.

    Oilers fans of the 21st century support the worst managed NHL franchise ever. Worse than the Golden Seals, even. No shock that it affects reasoning.

    Some of the craziest things I have ever read on the internet have come from fans of winning teams. Even crazier than what Oilers fans say.

    Did you meet all Red Wings fans?

    Or did you meet/read the intellectual Red Wings fans, while ignoring all of the doofus Red Wing fans?

  54. hunter1909 says:

    Side,

    Selective memory. To be sure.

  55. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Jordan,

    1 – I was almost excited about the round table for next Wednesday, LT. If you can upgrade that last prospect for someone like Pat, Jon or Tyler, that’d be a really good panel. (don’t worry Darcy – you just need to hone your game in the minors before you come up to the big leagues).

    I don’t know what this means

  56. Bruce McCurdy says:

    Georgexs: Bruce has a comment up here about JP’s offense being shy in the pre-breakout season. I invite anyone who feels that way to compare the opportunities that JP has been given to those given to his peers. It’s a bad bet to stick your best young players with players who don’t have offense. You can see that the other teams didn’t do that with their top prospects. Apparently, our organization seems to prefer to do things to derail rather than aid the process and then feed the media and fans lines that raise questions about the player.

    Fair comment. I hope you’re right.

    He really needs a better look on the PP, where he excelled as a younger player.

  57. Gerta Rauss says:

    Darth Tu,

    I think that’s about my threshold as well…I’d pay for Patches, just not a whole lot

  58. commonfan29 says:

    RonnieB,

    Absolutely.

    The Oilers should definitely handle JP in his contract year the exact same way they handled Draisaitl in his.

    That had no consequences.

  59. Bruce McCurdy says:

    Bank Shot: Maybe he was SAD about being on a loser franchise that was completely eliminated from the playoffs before Xmas.

    Going back until when he was 15, Luicic has always played on playoff teams. The one year in his career before last season that he missed the playoffs it was 14/15 in Boston on a 96 point team. They were very much in it until the last day of the season.

    Maybe going home to rest for the Xmas break last year and realizing that he had absolutely nothing to play for the rest of the season got in his head. Seems relatively possible to me.

    I guess we will find out soon enough.

    That’s not right. At Christmas the Oilers had pulled back top 17-17-2 & were right there. Then they went into the tank right after Christmas with Lucic among the worst offenders.

    A key turning point of the entire season for player & team occurred Dec 27 in Winnipeg, when with the Oilers trailing 4-3 & the goalie pulled, Lucic wired a rocket from the slot that beat Hellebuyck but grazed the post and thudded off the boards as the clock expired. Just like that a spirited game was lost, the Oilers’ 4-game win streak was over & the backslide was under way. I sometimes wonder how things might have unfolded had that bullet shot been on the other side of that post. It seemed real big in that moment & in my mind it still seems big.

  60. Side says:

    hunter1909:
    Side,

    Selective memory. To be sure.

    lol. Fair enough.

  61. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Georgexs,

    Killer posts today

  62. Bruce McCurdy says:

    Woodguy v2.0:
    Jordan,

    1 – I was almost excited about the round table for next Wednesday, LT. If you can upgrade that last prospect for someone like Pat, Jon or Tyler, that’d be a really good panel. (don’t worry Darcy – you just need to hone your game in the minors before you come up to the big leagues).

    I don’t know what this means

    I’m excited about the round table next Wednesday, knowing that the QualTeam will force me to raise my own game.

  63. Melvis says:

    Georgexs: What does post-modern mean?

    Loaded question. I still find myself swatting at fliies hovering over something called the “figure-ground relationship”.

    -Figure–ground organization is a type of perceptual grouping which is a vital necessity for recognizing objects through vision. In Gestalt psychology it is known as identifying a figure from the background. For example, you see words on a printed paper as the “figure” and the white sheet as the “background”.

    At a Peggy Guggenheim cocktail party in 1950, Clement Greenberg might have gone on at length over the matter, while Jackson Pollock was taking a piss in her fireplace.

    Thus figure and background. The notion is certainly applicable to the hockeying.

    Post modern simply means most anybody can take the piss most of the time.

  64. Bank Shot says:

    Bruce McCurdy: That’s not right. At Christmas the Oilers had pulled back top 17-17-2 & were right there. Then they went into the tank right after Christmas with Lucic among the worst offenders.

    17-17-2 is not right there. That’s miles from a playoff pace.

  65. Bank Shot says:

    Woodguy v2.0,

    No I’m not on twitter.

  66. Georgexs says:

    Melvis: Loaded question. I still find myself swatting at fliies hovering over something called the “figure-ground relationship”.

    -Figure–ground organization is a type of perceptual grouping which is a vital necessity for recognizing objects through vision. In Gestalt psychology it is known as identifying a figure from the background. For example, you see words on a printed paper as the “figure” and the white sheet as the “background”.

    At a Peggy Guggenheim cocktail party in 1950, Clement Greenberg might have gone on at length over the matter, while Jackson Pollock was taking a piss in her fireplace.

    Thus figure and background. The notion is certainly applicable to the hockeying.

    Post modern simply means most anybody can take the piss most of the time.

    Could have been the whiskey. Might have been the gin.

  67. Georgexs says:

    frjohnk:
    Georgexs,

    JP was able to play with the best center depth in the league last year

    McDavid 256 minutes
    Strome 237 minutes
    RNH 117 minutes
    Draisaitl 101 minutes
    Letestu 46 minutes

    JP results with
    Drai 2.37 pts/60
    McDavid 1.87 pts/60
    Strome 1.26 pts/60
    RNH 0.51 pts/60
    Letestu 0

    IIRC, JP had a good start with McDavid but then trailed off. I am spitballing but once JP did not produce as much with McDavid, maybe the coaching staff felt it was best to not have JP up against the best Dmen ( so the staff put him with the other centers).JP had good success with Drai as well but for whatever reason (s) JP played a bunch ( 400 minutes) with other centers with poor results.JP was definitely put into the blender.

    As for the PP1, I think everybody but the coach thought JP should have been there.

    On another note that is kinda related that I heard the other day, the coaching staff at the World Championships had a bit of trouble finding someone to fit on the other wing with McDavid.He plays at a pace most are not used to, even the best of the best, so the staff had some rotation of wingers on the McDavid Nuge line throughout the tournament.

    I think you’re agreeing with me in the first part. I could be wrong.

    As for the other note, that coaching staff over there was headed by “having a bit of trouble” Willie Desjardins, wasn’t it? The coaching life must be so very hard indeed if finding someone to play with CMD is one of the hard parts. Is this going to become a meme? Because some not best of the best players have done pretty good playing with CMD.

    I think the secret is to be on the ice when CMD is on the ice. I could be wrong.

  68. frjohnk says:

    Georgexs: I think you’re agreeing with me in the first part. I could be wrong.

    As for the other note, that coaching staff over there was headed by “having a bit of trouble” Willie Desjardins, wasn’t it? The coaching life must be so very hard indeed if finding someone to play with CMD is one of the hard parts. Is this going to become a meme? Because some not best of the best players have done pretty good playing with CMD.

    I think the secret is to be on the ice when CMD is on the ice. I could be wrong.

    I’m mostly agreeing with you ?

    As for the last part. It came from one of the players on the team. Some on here know who I’m talking about.

    Maroon who is probably slower than most guys on that team found success with McDavid. But he had quite a bit of time to build chemistry.

    McDavids speed and pace of play is the highest in the league. In a short tournament it might some guys an adjustment period to play with him.

  69. RonnieB says:

    commonfan29:
    RonnieB,

    Absolutely.

    The Oilers should definitely handle JP in his contract year the exact same way they handled Draisaitl in his.

    That had no consequences.

    IIRC, Draisaitl’s contract year resulted in the Oilers making the playoffs for the only time in the past 12 years. If JP makes a major contribution to getting us back to the playoffs i will not complain about his next contract. Also, there is still the not so small matter of him being under team control for several more years; one good year would likely just lead him to a bridge deal.

  70. Georgexs says:

    Bruce McCurdy: Fair comment. I hope you’re right.

    He really needs a better look on the PP, where he excelled as a younger player.

    I hope I’m right too. But, just by the history with the current HC, I’m guessing the odds he gets an extended look in a favorable spot are long. People’s pasts generally predict their futures. And JP’s past with this HC hasn’t been one filled with better looks. And, despite what the players may have said in the post-mortem, the blender’s not going anywhere. The HC is nervous and he’s in a tight spot. Failing with CMD isn’t a good resume highlight.

  71. Glovjuice says:

    Walter Gretzkys Neighbour: I agree – alarming is a perfect way to describe it! And puzzling. Is there a mental component, we just don’t know.

    Watch enough sports and you see (as I know you do indeed watch enough sports!) sometimes things just break right, fall in to place, mesh – whatever and a player has a career year. Not suggesting that will happen for Lucic, but there are others on this team for whom that is a real possibility.

    A couple years ago a so so pitching Jays team had a few players catch fire and there they were – in the hunt. Isn’t that really the thing about sports anyway?

    You can (and should) use all the analytics and empirical measures you can to understand trends, probabilities etc, but in the end it comes down to – who knows random quantal fluctuations in the games!

    Having said all this – I just want EVERY SINGLE quantum fluctuation to go against the despicable Flames! And the Canucks. And maybe Montreal too….

    Killer posts, sir handle of the ultimate seed.

  72. Georgexs says:

    Woodguy v2.0,

    Thank you, sir!

  73. Fuge Udvar says:

    Jordan,

    That’s assuming Puljujarvi’s camp is willing to negotiate an extension. He might want to see how this season turns out before signing long term. He wouldn’t be the first young player to bet on himself. I’m sure him and his agent are looking at the RW depth chart and seeing an opportunity to play with a high end centre.

  74. Georgexs says:

    frjohnk: I’m mostly agreeing with you

    As for the last part. It came from one of the players on the team. Some on here know who I’m talking about.

    Maroon who is probably slower than most guys on that team found success with McDavid. But he had quite a bit of time to build chemistry.

    McDavids speed and pace of play is the highest in the league. In a short tournament it might some guys an adjustment period to play with him.

    I’m sure players say lots of things (like “it is what it is”) and I’m sure there’s some adjustment involved with every new linemate. Can you think of anyone, other than Hall, who scored less with CMD than without CMD? Slepy? Caggiula? Yak? Pouliot? Khaira? The only forward who seemed to have noticeably lower offense with CMD last season was KY. I think the adjustment period is very short, because while the other guy is adjusting, CMD is busy finding routes for the puck to get into the net.

  75. Fuge Udvar says:

    commonfan29,

    If you are looking at it from Puljujarvi’s perspective that what he is hoping for. You need both sides to agree to an extension. You can’t force him into a potentially favourable extension.

  76. Scungilli Slushy says:

    The Oilers have a better roster than the Kniggets IMO. It’s on the coaches to get 100% buy in, demand accountability, but allow flexibility and allow mistakes especially with a young roster to keep morale up.

    McLellan mentioned over coaching. The Oilers have the deepest roster with NHL quality players outside of one or two, and system deeper than they’ve had in years and years. Playing well it’s a good team IMO, even if not a strong contender.

    Deploy the roster that starts the season to maximize player’s strengths. Coach in a way to have quality play AND player engagement. Between 4 guys that each could be head coaches surely they can figure it out, please!

  77. leadfarmer says:

    Bank Shot: Maybe he was SAD about being on a loser franchise that was completely eliminated from the playoffs before Xmas.

    Going back until when he was 15, Luicic has always played on playoff teams. The one year in his career before last season that he missed the playoffs it was 14/15 in Boston on a 96 point team. They were very much in it until the last day of the season.

    Maybe going home to rest for the Xmas break last year and realizing that he had absolutely nothing to play for the rest of the season got in his head. Seems relatively possible to me.

    I guess we will find out soon enough.

    I think people underestimate the not having squat to play for effect on veteran players. Sure people will say they are professional and should give 100% every day but I’m sure someone could come to your job and say the same thing.

  78. jeetz says:

    RonnieB:
    I’m amazed by the comments implying that the Oilers would prefer to see another season go down the sewer than risk JP having a breakout season as a top 6 RW which might earn him a bigger second contract. Nearly as amazing are the suggestions that the Oilers should sign JP to a long term mega million $ contract now, just in case he has a breakout season this year and merits a larger contract later.

    To add to this, even with a breakout year, JP will still likely get a bridge deal in the same area as Nurse would. 3-3.5 x 2 years. Hardly a back breaker.

    JP McD RNH for 20+ games. sit back and enjoy

  79. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Bank Shot:
    Woodguy v2.0,

    No I’m not on twitter.

    K

  80. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Walter Gretzkys Neighbour: I agree – alarming is a perfect way to describe it! And puzzling. Is there a mental component, we just don’t know.

    Watch enough sports and you see (as I know you do indeed watch enough sports!) sometimes things just break right, fall in to place, mesh – whatever and a player has a career year. Not suggesting that will happen for Lucic, but there are others on this team for whom that is a real possibility.

    A couple years ago a so so pitching Jays team had a few players catch fire and there they were – in the hunt. Isn’t that really the thing about sports anyway?

    You can (and should) use all the analytics and empirical measures you can to understand trends, probabilities etc, but in the end it comes down to – who knows random quantal fluctuations in the games!

    Having said all this – I just want EVERY SINGLE quantum fluctuation to go against the despicable Flames! And the Canucks. And maybe Montreal too….

    Agreed with Glovjuice that this is a great post and I thank him for bringing it to my attention.

    How to be successful in sport:
    1) Use all the information from all good sources to build a good team
    2) Hire a good coach to use your players to the best of their ability
    3) Hope like he’ll everything falls right and bullshit doesn’t pile up

  81. Georgexs says:

    Bruce McCurdy: I’m excited about the round table next Wednesday, knowing that the QualTeam will force me to raise my own game.

    What’s the round table next Wednesday? Is Everyone Hanging Out Without Me?

  82. OriginalPouzar says:

    If i remember correctly, McLellan spoke specifically about not using Puljujarvi on the PP around mid-season citing two reasons (1) he felt that JP was getting a bit tired and wanted to scale back his minutes a bit and (2) he felt that JP needed more work in practice on some PP related matters such as positioning thereon.

    JP started to get more PP time down the stretch, granted it was PP2 time. He didn’t do too much with that PP time and was way down the list of P/60 and P1/60 – even behind guys like Drake (who I acknowledge had more PP1 time – his PP time was split between PP1 and PP2.

    Anyways, I’m going to assume that Manny Viverios will have free reign to deploy the players on the PP as he sees fit. I also assume Jesse is in the mix for PP1 time from Manny.

  83. treevojo says:

    Woodguy v2.0:
    Jordan,

    1 – I was almost excited about the round table for next Wednesday, LT. If you can upgrade that last prospect for someone like Pat, Jon or Tyler, that’d be a really good panel. (don’t worry Darcy – you just need to hone your game in the minors before you come up to the big leagues).

    I don’t know what this means

    I took it as just a joke but can see why you would like some clarification.

  84. JimmyV1965 says:

    Bank Shot: Maybe he was SAD about being on a loser franchise that was completely eliminated from the playoffs before Xmas.

    Going back until when he was 15, Luicic has always played on playoff teams. The one year in his career before last season that he missed the playoffs it was 14/15 in Boston on a 96 point team. They were very much in it until the last day of the season.

    Maybe going home to rest for the Xmas break last year and realizing that he had absolutely nothing to play for the rest of the season got in his head. Seems relatively possible to me.

    I guess we will find out soon enough.

    The Oilers were 6 pts out of the third place at Christmas. The team’s best stretch of the season happened just before the break and people were optimist again. Lucic’s awful play after Christmas had nothing to do with the playoffs, but it was a huge contributor to the team’s precipitous decline after the holidays.

  85. JimmyV1965 says:

    Bank Shot: 17-17-2 is not right there. That’s miles from a playoff pace.

    This is not even close to true of course.

  86. jp says:

    Georgexs: I’m sure players say lots of things (like “it is what it is”) and I’m sure there’s some adjustment involved with every new linemate. Can you think of anyone, other than Hall, who scored less with CMD than without CMD? Slepy? Caggiula? Yak? Pouliot? Khaira? The only forward who seemed to have noticeably lower offense with CMD last season was KY. I think the adjustment period is very short, because while the other guy is adjusting, CMD is busy finding routes for the puck to get into the net.

    I agree with you. But KY had less offense? With McDavid? Than without? I’m confused.

  87. Jordan says:

    Woodguy v2.0:
    Jordan,
    1 – I was almost excited about the round table for next Wednesday, LT. If you can upgrade that last prospect for someone like Pat, Jon or Tyler, that’d be a really good panel. (don’t worry Darcy – you just need to hone your game in the minors before you come up to the big leagues).

    I don’t know what this means

    With some snark and sass, I was trying to say that you are following in the footsteps of some of the bigger personalities on the Oilogosphere, but that you are not yet recognized in the same light.

    Also, LT made a big deal about not addressing you about participating, as you haven’t been on the radio recently… so it seemed entirely necessary to at least poke you about it.

    Essentially, I was being a dink.

    And clearly failing to do so in a clear and coherent manner, so that while some of the intent might have gotten through, but none of the wit or humor that I desired.

    So… since I failed to create a humorous situation about you being on round table, let me instead say in honesty that I am in fact looking forwards to it, as I quite like you and Bruce and Alan.

  88. Jordan says:

    Fuge Udvar:
    Jordan,

    That’s assuming Puljujarvi’s camp is willing to negotiate an extension. He might want to see how this season turns out before signing long term. He wouldn’t be the first young player to bet on himself. I’m sure him and his agent ar97e looking at the RW depth chart and seeing an opportunity to play with a high end centre.

    Maybe you see it as betting on himself. If I were in his shoes, I’d see what’s being built here and say “If I can make myself enough to get paid so I’m looked after, I have a chance to play on two amazing centres wing for the heart of my career, and be a part of a dynasty.”

    McDavid floats all boats. The Oilers won’t move him. Lock in get a NTC if you can, and giddyup.

    Trying for more money seems like a poor substitute to being part of what could be a legendary team.

  89. Georgexs says:

    jp: I agree with you. But KY had less offense? With McDavid? Than without? I’m confused.

    Bad phrasing.

    What I meant to say was “The only forward who seemed to hurt CMD’s offense was KY.”

    I looked at CMD’s GF60 with different forwards. It was routinely high except for KY. Everyone seemed to adjust to CMD, because it seemed basically a function of being on the ice with him while he performed magic. And because goals were going in at a CMD rate while they were out there, I assumed that being with him was boosting their offense. That’s how my brain formed the argument.

    I think players routinely heap praise on CMD, along the lines of “he glides as fast as the rest of us skate.” Players who play with him probably feel a little sheepish and self-conscious because he generates multiple opportunities for every one that they’re able to cash.

  90. jp says:

    jeetz: To add to this, even with a breakout year, JP will still likely get a bridge deal in the same area as Nurse would. 3-3.5 x 2 years. Hardly a back breaker.

    JP McD RNH for 20+ games. sit back and enjoy

    Do you think Nurse’s bridge is going to be 3-3.5M? I suspect it would be signed by now if that were the final number.

  91. OriginalPouzar says:

    Georgexs: Bad phrasing.

    What I meant to say was “The only forward who seemed to hurt CMD’s offense was KY.”

    I looked at CMD’s GF60 with different forwards. It was routinely high except for KY. Everyone seemed to adjust to CMD, because it seemed basically a function of being on the ice with him while he performed magic. And because goals were going in at a CMD rate while they were out there, I assumed that being with him was boosting their offense. That’s how my brain formed the argument.

    Drake Caggulia was able to have a profound effect on McDavid’s scoring rates.

  92. ArmchairGM says:

    Georgexs:
    “JP’s comps (above) all took giant leaps forward in their draft +3 seasons and there’s no reason to believe it’ll be any different for Puljujarvi. The organization can do things to aid the process, including a training camp stapling to one of the high-end skill centers (97 or 29) but I can’t tell you that is going to happen. Either way, he should get power-play time.”

    ****

    You can kind of see what preceded the giant leap forward and what was in place for those players in their leap years.

    None of the comp prospects you listed were asked to earn ice time or prove themselves while playing away from their team’s best offensive options. In a historic, disastrous 16-17 season for COL where nothing was working, Rantanen played all his time with MacKinnon and Duchene and was given 2:44 TOI per game on a league worst power play that managed to score 4.34 GF60. Talk about not earning it.

    Bruce has a comment up here about JP’s offense being shy in the pre-breakout season. I invite anyone who feels that way to compare the opportunities that JP has been given to those given to his peers. It’s a bad bet to stick your best young players with players who don’t have offense. You can see that the other teams didn’t do that with their top prospects. Apparently, our organization seems to prefer to do things to derail rather than aid the process and then feed the media and fans lines that raise questions about the player.

    Wow Georgexs, this is pure gold. Made me think about these players’ production-per-60 given they got much more opportunity than Puljujarvi. I’ll look strickly at 5v5 here, as Puljujarvi hasn’t had the PP time comparable to the others. Numbers below are Points/60, separated by center. I’m looking at time spent with the teams top centers only. Interestingly, both Rantanen and Pastrnak played with Soderberg in their draft+1.

    DRAFT +1
    Rantanen w/ MacKinnon: 0.00 (0:43)
    Rantanen w/ Duchene: 0.00 (29:09)
    Pastrnak w/ Bergeron: 1.31 (45:49)
    Pastrnak w/ Krejci: 2.55 (141:15)
    Nylander: NO NHL TOI
    Puljujarvi w/ McDavid: 2.86 (84:01)
    Puljujarvi w/ Draisaitl: 1.67 (107:28)

    Rantanen and Nylander did nothing, Puljujarvi’s numbers were better than Pastrnak’s.

    DRAFT +2
    Rantanen w/ MacKinnon: 1.66 (684:55)
    Rantanen w/ Duchene: 0.86 (350:34)
    Pastrnak w/ Bergeron: 1.96 (61:19)
    Pastrnak w/ Krejci: 2.04 (499:06)
    Nylander w/ Kadri: 0.00 (4:57)
    Nylander w/ Bozak: 0.00 (1.45)
    Puljujarvi w/ McDavid: 1.87 (256:57)
    Puljujarvi w/ Draisaitl: 2.37 (101:22)

    Rantanen does pretty good here, Pastrnak is blossoming and Nylander is still at zero. Puljujarvi’s numbers are close to Pastrnak’s, except TOI. Opportunity is everything here.

    DRAFT +3
    Rantanen w/ MacKinnon: 2.28 (946:52)
    Rantanen w/ Duchene: 0.00 (12:48)
    Pastrnak w/ Bergeron: 2.22 (541:19)
    Pastrnak w/ Krejci: 1.54 (429:40)
    Nylander w/ Kadri: 2.17 (360:06)
    Nylander w/ Matthews: 1.82 (624:42)
    Puljujarvi w/ McDavid: we wait
    Puljujarvi w/ Draisaitl: we wait

    All three comps have arrived, all are scoring at 1st line rates, yet their production isn’t any better than what Jesse has already posted. JP clearly belongs in this company, the only question in my mind is whether he gets 900+ minutes with skill centers this year. If he does, I think we can be confident that he won’t disappoint. If he scores 2.12 in 950 minutes (his avg between McDavid and Draisaitl last year) he’ll be right in line with this group. And I don’t think it’s out of the question that he bests these draft+3 numbers either.

  93. ArmchairGM says:

    Georgexs: Bad phrasing.

    What I meant to say was “The only forward who seemed to hurt CMD’s offense was KY.”

    I looked at CMD’s GF60 with different forwards. It was routinely high except for KY. Everyone seemed to adjust to CMD, because it seemed basically a function of being on the ice with him while he performed magic. And because goals were going in at a CMD rate while they were out there, I assumed that being with him was boosting their offense. That’s how my brain formed the argument.

    I think players routinely heap praise on CMD, along the lines of “he glides as fast as the rest of us skate.” Players who play with him probably feel a little sheepish and self-conscious because he generates multiple opportunities for every one that they’re able to cash.

    KY had a terrible on-ice SH% and that isn’t all on him – all 5 guys have to own that.

  94. Walter Gretzkys Neighbour says:

    Woodguy v2.0: Agreed with Glovjuice that this is a great post and I thank him for bringing it to my attention.

    How to be successful in sport:
    1) Use all the information from all good sources to build a good team
    2) Hire a good coach to use your players to the best of their ability
    3) Hope like he’ll everything falls right and bullshit doesn’t pile up

    I consider this great praise indeed coming from you and Glovjuice! Thanks.

    A major worry is that criteria 2 above is questionable at best!

  95. jp says:

    OriginalPouzar: Drake Caggulia was able to have a profound effect on McDavid’s scoring rates.

    Not true actually. I’m not certain if George is talking McDavid’s personal scoring or team scoring while on ice – either way Caggiula was a drag on GF%, but not actual GF/60 (was looking into it regarding KY)

    McDavid’s individual scoring with Caggiula: 1.23 GF/60 (13th among the 26 Oilers to play 30 minutes with McDavid) and 4.10 P/60 (5th of 26).

    And the team with McDavid on ice: 4.10 GF/60 with Caggiula (9th of 26) but also 4.92 GA/60 (26th of 26) => 45.5 GF% (24th of 26).

    Drake Caggiula was able to have a profound effect on opposition scoring rates.

  96. Georgexs says:

    There have been 8 forwards drafted since 2000 who have played at least 40 games in the NHL and averaged >= 1.0 PPG (points per game). I call this group A1.

    6 of the 8 A1’s were drafted 1OV. Malkin was drafted 2OV after Ovechkin, another A1 forward. Barzal was taken 16th.

    On average, an A1 forward is drafted once every two years.

    This means, just by randomness, a team should get an A1 forward once every 60 years.

    (I know it’s not entirely random: bad teams have a better shot at picking high, bad teams, as we know, can stay bad for a few years, and the lottery throws a curve in there as well. My apologies for not calculating the exact expectation.)

    Which shows just how disgustingly filthy it is for PIT to end up with 2 A1 players in 2 consecutive drafts, #1 and #3 in PPG, the two best until CMD came along.

    WSH also had the unusual luck to (almost) have two A1 forwards. Backstrom is not that far off at 0.98 PPG. WSH also happens to be in the same division as the one team that had two better A1 forwards.

    I’m reminded of… You take the good, you take the bad. You take them both and there you have…

  97. Georgexs says:

    ArmchairGM,

    Terrific information. Well conceived, well laid out, and useful. Thank you.

    How do you get individual 5v5 scoring rates with linemates? I can’t find it on NST.

  98. Lowetide says:

    Georgexs:
    ArmchairGM,

    Terrific information. Well conceived, well laid out, and useful. Thank you.

    How do you get individual 5v5 scoring rates with linemates? I can’t find it on NST.

    https://www.naturalstattrick.com/playerreport.php?season=20172018&stype=2&sit=5v5&stdoi=std&rate=y&v=t&playerid=8479344

    It’s in the individual player pages, you have to hit Jesse Puljujarvi, teammates, individual, rates and it gets the numbers for you. Fabulous site.

  99. jp says:

    Georgexs: Bad phrasing.

    What I meant to say was “The only forward who seemed to hurt CMD’s offense was KY.”

    I looked at CMD’s GF60 with different forwards. It was routinely high except for KY. Everyone seemed to adjust to CMD, because it seemed basically a function of being on the ice with him while he performed magic. And because goals were going in at a CMD rate while they were out there, I assumed that being with him was boosting their offense. That’s how my brain formed the argument.

    I think players routinely heap praise on CMD, along the lines of “he glides as fast as the rest of us skate.” Players who play with him probably feel a little sheepish and self-conscious because he generates multiple opportunities for every one that they’re able to cash.

    That makes sense for sure, and absolutely agree with the general point.

    Also, zero question that whether you’re talking McDavid individual GF/60 or team GF/60 with McDavid on, KY was a big drag.

    I’ve been intrigued by the McDavid-KY underlying numbers though, as Armchair alluded to. I know you weren’t targeting KY with your statement at all, but still feel like it’s unfair to say he was a drag on CMD’s offense. Clearly the final results weren’t there, but everything else was basically remarkable.

    Of the 26 Oilers CMD played at least 30 minutes with last year, with KY he had his best CF/60 and CF%, second best FF/60 and best FF%, best SF/60 and SF%, second best SCF/60 and best SC%, best HDCF/60 and HDCF%. This with his 4th hardest zone starts. The flip side was by far CMD’s worst on ice Shooting% and his second worst PDO with KY (.966; he was only under 1000 with 2 other players).

    Maybe something real and bad was happening with KY, but it sure looks to me like it was just shit luck. Seems as though I’ve become a KY fanboy somehow. But I kinda think he’s gonna eat Rattie’s lunch in preseason and grab that 1R job for the foreseeable future.

  100. jp says:

    Jordan: With some snark and sass, I was trying to say that you are following in the footsteps of some of the bigger personalities on the Oilogosphere, but that you are not yet recognized in the same light.

    Also, LT made a big deal about not addressing you about participating, as you haven’t been on the radio recently… so it seemed entirely necessary to at least poke you about it.

    Essentially, I was being a dink.

    And clearly failing to do so in a clear and coherent manner, so that while some of the intent might have gotten through, but none of the wit or humor that I desired.

    So… since I failed to create a humorous situation about you being on round table, let me instead say in honesty that I am in fact looking forwards to it, as I quite like you and Bruce and Alan.

    What a dink.

  101. Bling says:

    ArmchairGM,

    Great post.

    I am extremely high on JP and those numbers reaffirm it.

  102. jp says:

    ArmchairGM: Wow Georgexs, this is pure gold. Made me think about these players’ production-per-60 given they got much more opportunity than Puljujarvi. I’ll look strickly at 5v5 here, as Puljujarvi hasn’t had the PP time comparable to the others. Numbers below are Points/60, separated by center. I’m looking at time spent with the teams top centers only. Interestingly, both Rantanen and Pastrnak played with Soderberg in their draft+1.

    DRAFT +1
    Rantanen w/ MacKinnon: 0.00 (0:43)
    Rantanen w/ Duchene: 0.00 (29:09)
    Pastrnak w/ Bergeron: 1.31 (45:49)
    Pastrnak w/ Krejci: 2.55 (141:15)
    Nylander: NO NHL TOI
    Puljujarvi w/ McDavid: 2.86 (84:01)
    Puljujarvi w/ Draisaitl: 1.67 (107:28)

    Rantanen and Nylander did nothing, Puljujarvi’s numbers were better than Pastrnak’s.

    DRAFT +2
    Rantanen w/ MacKinnon: 1.66 (684:55)
    Rantanen w/ Duchene: 0.86 (350:34)
    Pastrnak w/ Bergeron: 1.96 (61:19)
    Pastrnak w/ Krejci: 2.04 (499:06)
    Nylander w/ Kadri: 0.00 (4:57)
    Nylander w/ Bozak: 0.00 (1.45)
    Puljujarvi w/ McDavid: 1.87 (256:57)
    Puljujarvi w/ Draisaitl: 2.37 (101:22)

    Rantanen does pretty good here, Pastrnak is blossoming and Nylander is still at zero. Puljujarvi’s numbers are close to Pastrnak’s, except TOI. Opportunity is everything here.

    DRAFT +3
    Rantanen w/ MacKinnon: 2.28 (946:52)
    Rantanen w/ Duchene: 0.00 (12:48)
    Pastrnak w/ Bergeron: 2.22 (541:19)
    Pastrnak w/ Krejci: 1.54 (429:40)
    Nylander w/ Kadri: 2.17 (360:06)
    Nylander w/ Matthews: 1.82 (624:42)
    Puljujarvi w/ McDavid: we wait
    Puljujarvi w/ Draisaitl: we wait

    All three comps have arrived, all are scoring at 1st line rates, yet their production isn’t any better than what Jesse has already posted. JP clearly belongs in this company, the only question in my mind is whether he gets 900+ minutes with skill centers this year. If he does, I think we can be confident that he won’t disappoint. If he scores 2.12 in 950 minutes (his avg between McDavid and Draisaitl last year) he’ll be right in line with this group. And I don’t think it’s out of the question that he bests these draft+3 numbers either.

    That’s really remarkable. Thank you.

  103. Bling says:

    frjohnk:
    I know that Lucic has had two very poor years at 5 on 5 but I believe as long as Lucic stays healthy, he will rebound somewhat in this part of his game.

    Why?

    2 big reasons.

    – He will play majority of the season in the top 6.
    I dont see anybody pushing him out of the top 6 left wing spots.So he will get to play with McDavid and Drai.Two world class centers.And if injury hits one of those guys, then Lucic will play with RNH or Strome.2 decent centers.So he will be able to play with skill.

    Last year, Lucic only scored well with RNH.In 314 minutes with RNH, Lucic scored 2.1 pts/60.The rest of the centers, Lucic scored quite poor.But the reason why Lucic scored poorly way from RNH is a poor shooting percentage.Which is the the 2nd reason why I think Lucic rebounds.

    -Shooting percentage.
    He shot 5.93% last year. ( 5 on 5)

    Up until last year, his shooting % was 13.5% for his career. ( 5 on 5)
    Last year he got 69 shot attempts off from the slot area.This is the most he has every had. So he was getting into the slot area and getting chances.They just were not going in.It happens to players.Sometimes for big stretches.

    Id be more concerned if he was not getting into the slot area and not getting shot attempts away but that was not happening.

    Heck maybe Lucic shoots 15%.That would tie his 5th highest shooting %.He is going to play with skill and he is getting to the right area.Why not?

    69 shots from the slot area is great, except it’s not as though he’s the type to penetrate that area on his own. He played a ton with our best centres and one of them is a generational talent. I think they had way more to do with that number than Lucic.

    We’ve seen two seasons of EV decline from Lucic at an age where scoring line forwards start to decline. During this time, he suppressed the EV scoring of perhaps the best EV player in the NHL. His respectable pre-Christmas numbers last season were padded with 2nd assists. Despite what Chia apparently did not mention to him in his exit interview, yes, his speed is a huge damn problem!

    I really don’t buy for a second that Lucic can’t be pushed out of the top 6. RNH is the #1 LW, and Rieder could easily become the #2 LW. Scottie Upshall, who was signed to PTO, had better EV scoring rates than Lucic last season. So did almost every winger on the roster last season.

    If Lucic emerges from camp as the #2 LW, that’s more of a political statement than it is based on anything that has actually transpired in reality.

  104. Scungilli Slushy says:

    When you watch CHL scoring highlights, for many players you see them banging in pucks, completely uncovered, on9 goalies terribly out of position.

    This was clear on Yama’s highlights.

    I thought last season he played well overall, but he couldn’t finish. Muffin shots. Not many top 6 players can survive like that.

    So he got sent down to work. Many Oiler players struggled with finishing. With the sticks now anybody can have velocity. But like Laine you have to learn to get into position and use the whip to get enough KM/HR to beat an NHL goalie. And be accurate. I think every NHL player should be accurate, not all unfailing like Gretzky, but come on they are pro players, only five on the ice. It’s not football with 3 score roster players.

    Yama and JP didn’t do that well. If they learn to the rest is there already. And of course work on roofing it and hitting corners. Goalies are big and D tight, you have to hit Ricki’s ‘open’ holes with mustard to be a good scorer.

  105. Georgexs says:

    Lowetide: https://www.naturalstattrick.com/playerreport.php?season=20172018&stype=2&sit=5v5&stdoi=std&rate=y&v=t&playerid=8479344

    It’s in the individual player pages, you have to hit Jesse Puljujarvi, teammates, individual, rates and it gets the numbers for you. Fabulous site.

    Ha! I never thought to click rates with teammates.

    Sweet. Thank you.

  106. Georgexs says:

    jp: That makes sense for sure, and absolutely agree with the general point.

    Also, zero question that whether you’re talking McDavid individual GF/60 or team GF/60 with McDavid on, KY was a big drag.

    I’ve been intrigued by the McDavid-KY underlying numbers though, as Armchair alluded to. I know you weren’t targeting KY with your statement at all, but still feel like it’s unfair to say he was a drag on CMD’s offense. Clearly the final results weren’t there, but everything else was basically remarkable.

    Of the 26 Oilers CMD played at least 30 minutes with last year, with KY he had his best CF/60 and CF%, second best FF/60 and best FF%, best SF/60 and SF%, second best SCF/60 and best SC%, best HDCF/60 and HDCF%. This with his 4th hardest zone starts. The flip side was by far CMD’s worst on ice Shooting% and his second worst PDO with KY (.966; he was only under 1000 with 2 other players).

    Maybe something real and bad was happening with KY, but it sure looks to me like it was just shit luck. Seems as though I’ve become a KY fanboy somehow. But I kinda think he’s gonna eat Rattie’s lunch in preseason and grab that 1R job for the foreseeable future.

    I’m also a KY fan. That was not a shot at him at all.

    I don’t pay attention to his stats last year because he shouldn’t have been on the team.

  107. Ryan says:

    Jordan,

    Woodguy doesn’t do forum post sarcasm.

    This I know.

    In fairness, it’s almost impossible to read sarcasm into a forum post especially if it reads as having a galling tone.

  108. pts2pndr says:

    Georgexs: I hope I’m right too. But, just by the history with the current HC, I’m guessing the odds he gets an extended look in a favorable spot are long. People’s pasts generally predict their futures. And JP’s past with this HC hasn’t been one filled with better looks. And, despite what the players may have said in the post-mortem, the blender’s not going anywhere. The HC is nervous and he’s in a tight spot. Failing with CMD isn’t a good resume highlight.

    I truly hope your wrong but I wouldn’t bet against your thinking!

  109. Ryan says:

    Off topic, I find the Oilers top four d situation to be fascinating.

    I liken the Oilers having three top four d to a three legged table. If one of those three dmen gets injured, the entire season tips over. Even if one or more of those three legs don’t break, the table has plenty of wobble.

    Not exactly a set of circumstances I would like to find myself facing if I were Chiarelli.

    Now I’m nearly certain he would have been fired already had there not been mitigating circumstances to some of his failed trades, but who’s going to ever hire him if the Oilers fire him?

    As much as I am a fan of the Oilers, I am also aware that they’re a tremendous black hole where NHL coaching, playing, and managing careers go to die.

    Back to the blue line… if the most injury prone Oiler top four d gets injured, and Sekera’s also out, who are they going to run on their power play units? Russell and Benning…?

    Cmon guys.

  110. OilSlickster says:

    Georgexs,

    I was waiting for a response. Glad i did. But i spit out my coffee.

  111. Wilde says:

    Georgexs: None of the comp prospects you listed were asked to earn ice time or prove themselves while playing away from their team’s best offensive options. In a historic, disastrous 16-17 season for COL where nothing was working, Rantanen played all his time with MacKinnon and Duchene and was given 2:44 TOI per game on a league worst power play that managed to score 4.34 GF60. Talk about not earning it.
    Bruce has a comment up here about JP’s offense being shy in the pre-breakout season. I invite anyone who feels that way to compare the opportunities that JP has been given to those given to his peers. It’s a bad bet to stick your best young players with players who don’t have offense. You can see that the other teams didn’t do that with their top prospects. Apparently, our organization seems to prefer to do things to derail rather than aid the process and then feed the media and fans lines that raise questions about the player.

    We need to clone this post and huddle a stack of them next to a cannon for next season if JP starts and stays on the Strome line.

    I’ve done posts similar to this before but it’s better put here

  112. Wilde says:

    Also, I’m also going to pile beside the cannon some words about how the wingers hurt the breakout system more than the lack of ‘puck movers’ on the blue line or ‘playing slow’, or ‘team defense/commitment’, for when those things are inevitably blamed for the failings of a winger group to have even bottom third of the league level puck skill as a collective.

    No other team I watch play fumbles what should be clean plays off of the wall more than the 2017-18 Oilers. Just simple taking and making a pass. It’s so devastating not being able to do that.

  113. OriginalPouzar says:

    While I don’t doubt that wingers had culpability in the lack of ability to transition but that does not absolve the d-man if their own culpability – it was very common for a 10 foot pass (with limited pressure) to be in the skates or otherwise in a tough place to receive. It truly amazed me how often a group of NHL d-men would fail to make simple tape to tape passes.

  114. Wilde says:

    OriginalPouzar,

    Since this is basically a disagreement of the eyes I’ll reframe it as this:

    How far from league average in ability is the group of defensemen,

    and

    How far from league average in ability is the group of natural wingers?

    I’d say the wingers are demonstrably further, so if we’re faced with a problem where the two can’t collaborate successfully, I’m more comfortable betting that improving the winger group is the easier way to generate more improvement on the breakouts.

    Basically what I’m saying is that the rate at which the wingers fumbled a clean play to them is higher than the rate at which the defensemen failed to make a clean play to the wingers.

  115. Wilde says:

    Also, the better handlers/more skilled the wingers are, the less ‘on target’ the passes have to be.

    Considering forechecking pressure is a constant threat, I’d say it’s fair to expect in most situations the Dman doesn’t have to make a perfect pass, just a timely one/

  116. 99266in87 says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    While I don’t doubt that wingers had culpability in the lack of ability to transition but that does not absolve the d-man if their own culpability – it was very common for a 10 foot pass (with limited pressure) to be in the skates or otherwise in a tough place to receive.It truly amazed me how often a group of NHL d-men would fail to make simple tape to tape passes.

    Not to absolve the forwards (wingers) for having to fumble breakout passes, but to make a tape to tape pass, a good and proper target (stick) has to be presented too, or else it’s just a throw away.

  117. ArmchairGM says:

    jp: That’s really remarkable. Thank you.

    Thanks, appreciate the comments. I myself was surprised at the numbers – I went into this little exercise thinking that “Puljujarvi is shy on offence, has been since junior”, I just wanted to see what reasonable expectations were for this player. Could we expect 50% of Pastrnak’s offence? 60%? Turns out we may get a lot more than that. “Remarkable” is a good choice of words.

  118. Wilde says:

    ArmchairGM: has been since junior”

    I did a post about this at some point, but Puljujarvi was an absolute monster from about age 13 numerically in Finland, Just unreal numbers playing against kids years older than him

  119. OriginalPouzar says:

    There is a reason Puljujarvi was so highly touted and I am not concerned that he hasn’t “arrived” before his 20th birthday, in particular given the history of high talent players drafted from Europe (his comparables) and the fact that there are some good arrows (his metrics show better than the traditional box-cars).

    Jesse is going to have a fine year – its going to be great!

  120. ArmchairGM says:

    Wilde: I did a post about this at some point, but Puljujarvi was an absolute monster from about age 13 numerically in Finland, Just unreal numbers playing against kids years older than him

    Yup. As a 16-year-old, he scored 12 goals in 11 games in junior. His time in the teir 2 senior league is pretty good, but I’ve heard lots of talk here about how he ‘hasn’t had much offence is Finnish Elite and AHL , so we can’t expect much from him in NHL either’. He played 21 games in the Elite mens league AS A 16-YEAR-OLD, for crying out loud. Should we really have expected huge point production from him??

    Love the kid but I’m still surprised at how well his numbers stack up against the comps listed above. This guy has the potential to be a very good player for a very long time yet.

  121. russ99 says:

    If McLellan holds off on the constant line juggling and lets players find chemistry with each other, that could help a whole bunch of our players perform better.

    The issue for Lucic with me wasn’t skating or passing (though I agree with LT, it’s a strength when he’s going good) it was the poor efforts on the wall and in front of the net, which seemed to me based out of exasperation rather than lack of fitness.

    Just because the league is faster, doesn’t mean all steam ahead on the rush and stop doing things that some players to be more successful.

  122. Wilde says:

    ArmchairGM,

    Yeah the 16 year old thing I was like, I wonder what other guys his age put up?

    Then found out oh, no one else even got time in that league.

    The Finns should be mad at the Oilers, honestly. This guy is one of their chosen sons, the farmboy savant. He deserves better.

  123. OriginalPouzar says:

    No surprise but Toby Enstrom is signing with Modo.

    I saw a nice fit but it never seemed like it was a realistic option.

  124. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    treevojo: I took it as just a joke but can see why you would like some clarification.

    It turns out that LT had mentioned on the radio that I was on a round table next week, but didn’t tell me.

    🙂

    Hence the confusion.

  125. LadiesloveSmid says:

    Pulju’s Liiga highlights pre-draft look like he scored a ton off the left halfwall. McLellan should just lengthen his leash and see what Jesse’s one-Ts do to an abysmal PP. In a lost season I can’t believe he didn’t load him up with ice time.

Leave a Reply

Want to join the discussion?
Feel free to contribute!
© Copyright - Lowetide.ca