Game 15 2018-19: Oilers at Lightning

Sometimes I wake up and everything is dull. Turn the light on and it seems to burn dim, or maybe it’s me. We all want to look sharp in our jobs, every day, but the truth is sometimes things don’t rhyme and the extra gear doesn’t want to kick in.

And sometimes you have to give the other man his due. Oh, I understand the fourth line did you wrong and if you had five minutes with Cam Talbot you would straighten out his career. I believe you when you say Nuge needs Cod Liver Oil and that McDavid’s hair is too long and Strome’s pants are too tight and why can’t the Swedes play well in the capital. I get it, all of it.

Still, the Oildrop played a damned good team that was desperado last night and lost to them on the road after beating them at home. Edmonton isn’t a good enough team for any of us to expect a sweep of the Stanley Cup champions. One thing: The referees called that game like it was 1978 and Scotty Bowman was running the Habs in Caps uniforms.  You can hammer like Dick Pound with a tenderizer hammer at a butcher’s convention when talking about the officials last night. The players? I think there’s a little room for crediting the other guy.

THE ATHLETIC!

The Athletic Edmonton is going to bring it all season long. Proud to be part of a lineup that is ready to cover the coming year. Outstanding coverage from a large group, including Daniel Nugent-Bowman and Jonathan Willis, Lowetide, Minnia Feng and Pat McLean. If you haven’t subscribed yet, now’s your chance. Best available offer is here!

  • New Daniel Nugent-Bowman: In depth: Embattled Oilers GM Peter Chiarelli defends his record, remains bullish on the future.
  • New Lowetide: A new day dawning for Oilers prospects in Bakersfield as increased usage means greater success.
  • Lowetide: Future Oilers bubbling under in Bakersfield may get a look sooner rather than later.
  • Lowetide: Oscar Klefbom takes a step forward for the Edmonton Oilers.
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: Forty years later, remembering the forgotten trade that brought Wayne Gretzky to Edmonton.
  • Tyler Dellow: Isolating issues with the NHL’s slower paced power plays.
  • Lowetide: Oilers reach a pressure point on defence and right wing
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: Does Caggiula’s recent performance warrant another chance alongside McDavid?
  • Jonathan Willis: Predicting the impact Ethan Bear and Edmonton’s other top AHL prospects will make at the NHL level.

DEFENSE, LAST NIGHT

  • Garrison-Benning went 8-5 in 9:24, shots 4-1 and no goals. Got 4:28 with 97 (going 7-0) meaning the third pairing was 1-5 without the captain. Expect an upgrade on the third pairing at some point. Were 7-2 against Oshie-Backstrom-Stephenson but that was all McDavid.
  • Russell-Nurse were 25-17 in 19:01, shots 8-6, no goals, 6-5 HDSC. The duo was 10-6 with McDavid, 15-11 without and I think that’s success. Nurse looked calm and less prone to go walkabout last night, Russell occupied Ovechkin for the evening and probably slept in ice overnight. Were 5-14 against Ovechkin-Kuznetsov-Jaskin, bent but did not break. A nice recovery after a few tough evenings, Nurse played RH side (someone mentioned possibly to play against Ovechkin but Russell was in his face all night, too) for a time.
  • Klefbom-Larsson had their first difficult night in some time, going 24-17 in 17:55, 14-13 shots and 1-3 goals, 5-7 HDSC. Were 6-7 with McDavid, 18-10 without, but the goals against were severe and some of the blame goes to the Swedish duo. On the Vrana goal, Larsson got caught up at the blue line, Klefbom marked his man but let the slot open and 77/6 ended up covering (and not covering the pass) the same guy. You’d like Brodziak to cover the goal scorer but Larsson’s delay buggered up the coverage. The second goal was Khaira/Brodziak and the third goal was Klefbom again allowing the slot pass and Larsson caught in a tough spot, Nuge being out of the play where he should have intercepted the pass instead. This pairing has been quality, so a tough night can easily be forgiven.
  • Cam Talbot stopped 19 of 23, .826. He made a few tough stops, don’t think he was responsible for the loss, you’ll want him to be sharper as the month rolls along. I don’t blame him on any of the goals, he seems to be going down a little early but all four Capitals goals were ring-a-ding-dong-dandy chances. Oilers weren’t as sharp as they needed to be in order to beat a strong and desperate Capitals team. That’s your story.
  • NaturalStatTrick and NHL.com.

FORWARDS, LAST NIGHT

  • Nuge-McDavid-Caggiula were 23-11 in 16:16 (Nuge) and 17-9 in 13:04 (Caggiula). Leon’s presence was for 3:15, a goal for was scored, 5-3 Corsi events. McDavid went 20-12 against Oshie-Backstrom-Stephenson and 15-9 against Orlov-Niskanen. I wonder if we see Ty Rattie tonight. Nuge had a great game, save for being a few feet too high on the Backstrom-to-Oshie pass on the fourth goal. Caggiula had at least one major chance, just slid by the left post on a deflection.
  • Lucic-Strome-Puljujarvi went 14-9 in 11:21, 7-3 shots, no goals and 5-3 HDSC. My opinion is the line played well and have earned another start, but a loss and the availability of Rattie suggest we could see a shuffle. Went 10-4 against Djoos-Bowey. Lucic had a 10-bell chance but couldn’t cash, NST says he has had 11 at even strength and five on the power play, placing him inside Edmonton’s top three in both categories. I believe it, but he has just one goal. I like this line, wish they could score.
  • Rieder-Draisaitl-Chiasson were 14-11 in 12:37, 7-5 shots, no goals, 3-1 HDSC. I’m a fan of this line, the two veterans give Leon room to wheel. Edmonton probably misses out on a goal-for or two a week because skill isn’t at the highest levels, but the possession and shot metrics are improving.
  • Khaira-Brodziak-Kassian struggled in the first period and the DSP (second) goal hurt the team. Brodziak got caught up with the official, but Khaira didn’t handle the puck well and it was over in seconds. Were 7-8 in 7:13 but 1-7 shots, 0-2 goals and 0-3 HDSC. Were 4-6 against Kempny-Carlson and 0-2 goals against the Washington fourth line of Vrana-Boyd-SmithPelley. Khaira had a great chance and drew a penalty on an Ovechkin slash. I was shocked because it looked for all the world like Washington could do any damned thing and not hear a whistle last night. Long time readers of this blog know it’s rare for me to complain about the stripes, but their actions last night took a close game and gave the Capitals the upper hand. Atrocious, but I’ve been watching the NHL do this since Toe Blake coached the Canadiens.

OILERS AFTER 15 GAMES

  • Oilers in October 20155-10-0, 10 points; goal differential -8
  • Oilers in October 2016: 9-5-1, 19 points; goal differential +6
  • Oilers in October 2017: 6-8-1, 13 points; goal differential -11
  • Oilers in October 2018: 8-5-1, 17 points; goal differential +1

The 2018 Oilers once again have a chance to tie the 2016 playoff edition, although it will be a tough evening in Florida. I liked the effort last night, pretty clear after the two goals against the No. 4 line it was going to be tough to get back but the Oilers worked hard to get things closer. I suspect we’ll see the same game tonight.

OILERS IN NOVEMBER

  • Oilers in November 2015: 2-2-0, four points; goal differential 0
  • Oilers in November 2016: 2-1-1, five points; goal differential -2
  • Oilers in November 2017: 2-2-0, four points; goal differential -1
  • Oilers in November 2018: 2-1-0, four points; goal differential +3

Edmonton has a tough game tonight, I think it’s most likely a loss. If the road team can get things to overtime, that would represent a victory. Even with a loss, the November 2018 team isn’t out of place with the rest of the Chiarelli-McLellan teams since 2015.

WHAT TO EXPECT FROM NOVEMBER

  • At home to: Chicago (Expected 1-0-0) Actual (1-0-0)
  • On the road to: Detroit, Washington, Tampa Bay, Florida  (Expected 2-2-0) (Actual 1-1-0)
  • At home to: Colorado, Montreal (Expected 1-1-0) (Actual 0-0-0)
  • On the road to: Calgary (Expected 0-1-0) (Actual 0-0-0)
  • At home to: Vegas (Expected 1-0-0) (Actual 0-0-0)
  • On the road to: San Jose, Anaheim, Los Angeles (Expected 2-1-0) (Actual 0-0-0)
  • At home to: Dallas, Los Angeles  (Expected 1-0-1) (Actual 0-0-0)
  • Overall expected result: 8-5-1, 17 points in 14 games 
  • Current results: 2-1-0, 4 points in 3 games

It’s a likely loss tonight, but you never know. McDavid might decide to go off or Koskinen could stop 50. It will be a good test for this team, a 3-goal loss is possible tonight. Can the Oilers hang in if they get down early, as they did last night? Not every loss is equal and I was impressed with Edmonton’s resilience in trying to overcome general malaise, a two-goal deficit and a referee staff fresh from the Mick McGeough School of Three Blind Mice.

QUENNEVILLE FIRED

I’m absolutely certain many readers this morning are thinking about replacing Todd McLellan with Joel Quenneville, who was fired today. I can tell you, based on observing this organization since 1972, there is a less than zero chance this happens for all kinds of reasons. Todd McLellan’s Oilers have a winning record after slogging through a wild and crazy October schedule. The team appears to be on the same page. Many of the offseason and youth bets are either working or not failing. McLellan’s contract hasn’t run out.

Quenneville in Edmonton, with this roster, would be an interesting follow. That said, Todd McLellan is the head coach of the Edmonton Oilers and his team holds third place in the Pacific Division this morning. I am quite certain it’s a non-starter. Flame away.

LINEUP SHUFFLE

I would stay the course tonight unless someone is injured. Garrison-Benning needs an upgrade but are playing well enough to hold off Kevin Gravel. Puljujarvi is playing well enough to stay in the lineup, same for Caggiula and Chiasson. Mikko Koskinen will slide in for Talbot, but the rest of the lineup should remain the same sans injury or exhaustion.

LOWDOWN WITH LOWETIDE

A full boat this morning, beginning at 10, TSN 1260. Scheduled to appear:

  • Jonathan Willis, The Athletic. We’ll chat about the Nugent-Bowman article on Peter Chiarelli (up this morning) and about the Oilers staying competitive into November.
  • Matt Sammon, Director of Broadcasting and Programming, Tampa Bay Lightning. The Lightning are one of the teams who we can safely project as a strong Stanley Cup contender, we’ll check on the team heading into tonight’s game against Edmonton.
  • Scott Mitchell, TSN. Scott has a new top 50 baseball free agents out, we’ll chat Bryce Harper and other major names available.

10-1260 text, @Lowetide on twitter. Love the lineup, it’s going to be fun!

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484 Responses to "Game 15 2018-19: Oilers at Lightning"

« Older Comments
  1. Oz says:

    Glovjuice,

    BS that is what Joseph’s hit on Russell deserves

  2. Rebillled says:

    Lucic decided the Oilers couldn’t come back.

    Maybe he should have done that next game.

  3. Réal Goudenyéu says:

    Crazy Pedestrian: Except Vancouver is actually winning while doing it.
    If the oilers lose to Florida on Thursday, That will be a royal gut punch to my fandom. Watching both the fLames AND what was supposedly going to be terrible Cansucks at the top of the division.

    I hear you.

    I would submit however that the oilers schedule has been the toughest of those three teams.

    But they better make hay when they can.

  4. Crazy Pedestrian says:

    Just to put icing on the cake, The oilers just dropped out of a playoff spot with this loss…

  5. OmJo says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey:
    OmJo,

    There was plenty more behind that melee than the hit on Russell.Yamamoto was driven head first into the boards by Sergachev right after, no call.The Stralman mugging of McDavid.And a sundry list of others beforehand.Lucic picked a point late in the third with it basically out of hand to send a message.He done well.

    I saw the McDavid mugging early in the game, missed the Yamamoto and Russell hits. I thought he targetted Joseph specifically for the Russell hit (Kassian did the same).

    Glad to see we are sending messages to the league. And I’m not talking about when Chiarelli was sending emails asking somebody to trade with him.

  6. Scungilli Slushy says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey:
    OmJo,

    There was plenty more behind that melee than the hit on Russell.Yamamoto was driven head first into the boards by Sergachev right after, no call.The Stralman mugging of McDavid.And a sundry list of others beforehand.Lucic picked a point late in the third with it basically out of hand to send a message.He done well.

    If Lucic does not do whatever it takes to intimidate teams he has no use given he can’t seem to score anymore.

    Even if he takes a suspension he has the rep to survive that with the league, on a team with Connor has to count.

    Tampa is trying to prove they aren’t wussies – the Oilers of pre Connor – after crapping out in the playoffs again.

    Lucic, Kassian, and Khaira as he learns, HAVE to be the bad cops. Or there is no point in paying them. That said I do think Khaira is the best player of the 3 and a pretty good young player.

    But for Gord’s sake don’t buy out Lucic and hamstring the cap forever. Again, for no reason. Find a way to get him out if he doesn’t score or become really fearsome each game.

    And I don’t buy that with how things are now he can’t do that. I’m not talking being a hack artist like some are. He doesn’t have to do that to be respected and one to be avoided.

  7. JimmyV1965 says:

    OmJo: I’m not saying Puljujarvi = Pettersson. You asked who the Oilers where holding back.

    I’m pointing out how Pettersson is being put in a position to succeed by the Canucks while we’re expecting our top young players to “earn” the right to be put in positions to succeed. It makes no sense to me.

    Pettersson commanded his pkace in the lineup. The Canucks didn’t develop him. It was smart to let him stay an extra year abroad. That is the only comparable to JP.

  8. Crazy Pedestrian says:

    Someone help me here.

    Who the hell am I suppose to cheer for in the Ducks/FLames game tomorrow???

  9. OmJo says:

    Scungilli Slushy,

    Only way he gets bought out is with a compliance buyout after the next lockout (thanks, HHOFer Gary Bettman!) because his contract is essentially buyout proof (thanks, Peter Chiarelli!)

  10. treevojo says:

    OmJo: A sarcastic remark about Pettersson not earning his ice time, then suggesting we are screwing up Puljujarvi’s development. Sorry for the confusion, idk.

    I assumed you meant compare how they’re handled by their respective teams, not compare the players directly.

    I’ve said from day one that I didn’t think Puljujarvi should be in the NHL yet. Had he been sent back to Finland and then spent his 19 year old season in the AHL I think he would be a very different player.

    As an aside, seeing Lucic say “you’re next, you’re fucking next” was my favourite part of the game tonight.

    Honestly.

    I was never confused.

    I knew exactly what you were getting at.

    Just wanted to point out that Pettersson is closer to mcdavid/hall then he is to Jesse at the same stages in their careers.

  11. Wilde says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey:
    Wilde,

    If you could go ahead and compile another rage-edit for tonight’s game, that’d be greatttttt.

    Which plays? I was only watching intermittently after the 4-1 goal or whatever

    Saw the Joseph-on-Russell and resulting Lucic thing and then tuned back out

  12. Bank Shot says:

    Pettersen scored 1 pgg in his draft year. Puljujarvi scored 0.5ppg.

    I think everyone got fooled when Puljurjarvi lit up the world juniors.

    It’s interesting that he was ranked above Tkachuk who lit up the OHL playoffs.

    Tkachuk was suspected of being a product of his linemates where Puljujarvi was free of that criticism.

    Tkachuk stepped directly into the NHL and thrived. We are still waiting for Puljujarvi to show he belongs.

  13. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Matty:
    Did Looch just got upset with the cross check on Russell?
    McLellan:
    “Nothing wrong with that. Felt that a player took a liberty with Kris Russell. I agree with the liberty part of it. Part of the reason we have Looch here is to take care of teammates and he did that.”

  14. JimmyV1965 says:

    I thought we played well. Tampa has big time finishers. We don’t. Much more enjoyable game than last night. Shitty shitty reffing. That is the worst reffed game I can remember in a long time. Lucic deserved his penalties, but the ref let this get out of control.

  15. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Scungilli Slushy,

    As usual, nary a word out of place.

  16. OmJo says:

    Bank Shot:
    Pettersen scored 1 pgg in his draft year. Puljujarvi scored 0.5ppg.

    I think everyone got fooled when Puljurjarvi lit up the world juniors.

    It’s interesting that he was ranked above Tkachuk who lit up the OHL playoffs.

    Tkachuk was suspected of being a product of his linemates where Puljujarvi was free of that criticism.

    Puljujarvi played in the top league in Finland, against men, as a 16 and 17 year old. Pettersson didn’t play in the Swedish elite league in his draft year – he didn’t play there until he was 18. That’s something worth taking into consideration, IMO.

    Unfortunately we’ll never know how Puljujarvi would have done in the Finnish elite league as a 18 year old.

  17. HT Joe says:

    OmJo,

    I didn’t see the hit on Russel. But, I saw enough from the previous game to walk away with the thought that if the refs won’t make the calls, the Oilers have to police the games themselves.

    With a potential line brawl and McDavid on the ice, I was pretty happy to see both Lucic and Nurse out there.

  18. OmJo says:

    HT Joe:
    OmJo,

    I didn’t see the hit on Russel.But, I saw enough from the previous game to walk away with the thought that if the refs won’t make the calls, the Oilers have to police the games themselves.

    With a potential line brawl and McDavid on the ice, I was pretty happy to see both Lucic and Nurse out there.

    Yup! Nurse ragdolling Killorn with one arm was fun. Was nice to see Benning, Rattie and McDavid get their hands dirty, too. Team building 101.

  19. tileguy says:

    Crazy Pedestrian:
    Just to put icing on the cake, The oilers just dropped out of a playoff spot with this loss…

    More icing, no big blue wave rolling through the US.

  20. Scungilli Slushy says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey:
    Scungilli Slushy,

    As usual, nary a word out of place.

    Cheers.

  21. Scungilli Slushy says:

    OmJo:
    Scungilli Slushy,

    Only way he gets bought out is with a compliance buyout after the next lockout (thanks, HHOFer Gary Bettman!) because his contract is essentially buyout proof (thanks, Peter Chiarelli!)

    I hope Chia remembers that. Although he might not be the deciderer. We’re not quite clear of patently stupid decisions. Getting there I think.

  22. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Wilde,

    There were plenty from the first period on. It’s like we had the same refs from last night. They missed a pretty obvious slewfoot on Drai by Girardi at the crease, for instance.

    Kassian was really chatty in the first, something preceded that. Lucic was chirping in the second for good reason, and then the hits on Russell and Yamamoto in the third (either being worthy of a major, imo) really set him off.

  23. HT Joe says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey: Matty:
    Did Looch just got upset with the cross check on Russell?
    McLellan:
    “Nothing wrong with that. Felt that a player took a liberty with Kris Russell. I agree with the liberty part of it. Part of the reason we have Looch here is to take care of teammates and he did that.”

    https://youtu.be/NHdnuVHbWxc?t=819

    I like it.

  24. Glovjuice says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey:
    Matty:
    Did Looch just got upset with the cross check on Russell?
    McLellan:
    “Nothing wrong with that.Felt that a player took a liberty with Kris Russell.I agree with the liberty part of it.Part of the reason we have Looch here is to take care of teammates and he did that.”

    LOL – this old school bullshit is stupid.

  25. Scungilli Slushy says:

    The thing with Pettersson is less about what he did in Sweden – which was be historic – but how he has so far been in the NHL. He may not keep up the pace he’s at but his PPG is higher than Connor’s. He’s in rare air so far with his vision and ability to score, despite being a bone rack.

    This is where GM’s cut the mustard – build the best team around the crazy talent, and not hamstring self with Cap.

  26. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Glovjuice,

    Strenuously disagree.

    If you cowardly endanger our player and the refs don’t call it, face the consequences.

    Take your pick of infractions; this game was rife with exceptional examples.

  27. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Glovjuice: LOL – this old school bullshit is stupid.

    Not until the league protects the best players, like every other NA big time league does. Really. It’s a farce how the rules are subjective to teams and season state.

  28. texmex says:

    8-6-1 after that insane 15 game stretch.

    NJ, Bos(2), NYR, WIn, Nash(2), WASH (2), TB, DET, CHI (2), PIT. MINN

  29. Genjutsu says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey:
    Glovjuice,

    Strenuously disagree.

    If you cowardly endanger our player and the refs don’t call it, face the consequences.

    Take your pick of infractions; this game was rife with exceptional examples.

    If someone on the street beats your friend/wife/child with a stick do you:

    A) run and hide.
    B) hope the authorities handle it appropriately
    C) man up

    I guess A or B is what some think.

    I see things differently I guess.

  30. HT Joe says:

    Glovjuice: LOL – this old school bullshit is stupid.

    For my money, that quote from the coach is literally the opposite of referring to “that team in orange”. Seeing the coach supporting and backing up the players to the media following a potentially-contentious on-ice event is really nice to see.

  31. Wilde says:

    OmJo: Unfortunately we’ll never know how Puljujarvi would have done in the Finnish elite league as a 18 year old.

    About a point-per-game or above if we’re to look at his comparables from before him and after him, Vesalainen for example.

    Puljujarvi would have about 60 NHL points right now if his success was demonstrably a high priority of the management and coaching staffs. He was an average-ish NHL forward 5 months after his 18th birthday.

  32. Glovjuice says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey:
    Glovjuice,

    Strenuously disagree.

    If you cowardly endanger our player and the refs don’t call it, face the consequences.

    Take your pick of infractions; this game was rife with exceptional examples.

    The hit on Russel was not clean but certainly not cowardly. It was more from the side and won’t even register with the league. The Lucic Neanderthal show was cowardly and dangerous – he fuckin choked him, man; after a free blow to the head while the guy was falling.

  33. Jethro Tull says:

    The Oilers better get good at marginal picks and screens. I’ve noticed (by eye only) a few teams are very good at seemingly innocent cross overs that take out a checker. The Caps, NSH are two. Now Tampa.

    It was made illegal in rugby years ago because of the same reasons; guy has the ball, opponent goes for the tackle, guy crosses (or scissors, as it’s known in rugby) with a team mate who he gives the ball. He then continues to “accidentally” block the tackler. You can basically run the ball all the way down the field just repeating this. In hockey it allows speed to be built through the neutral zone or negates a forecheck.

  34. Glovjuice says:

    Genjutsu: If someone on the street beats your friend/wife/child with a stick do you:

    A) run and hide.
    B) hope the authorities handle it appropriately
    C) man up

    I guess A or B is what some think.

    I see things differently I guess.

    Wife, child. Street. Beat. Well, duh.

  35. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Glovjuice: The hit on Russel was not clean but certainly not cowardly. It was more from the side and won’t even register with the league. The Lucic Neanderthal show was cowardly and dangerous – he fuckin choked him, man; after a free blow to the head while the guy was falling.

    You have to take the aggregate. Somebody will be the one who gets it, deserved or not.

    The Oilers have not been a chippy team in the last years IMO, more responsive to the opponent, which as it stands with reffing is spot on.

  36. jp says:

    Glovjuice: The hit on Russel was not clean but certainly not cowardly. It was more from the side and won’t even register with the league. The Lucic Neanderthal show was cowardly and dangerous – he fuckin choked him, man; after a free blow to the head while the guy was falling.

    I’m somewhere in the middle on this whole argument, but IMO what Lucic did wasn’t particularly dangerous. It was far more intimidation than pugilism. He very easily could have obliterated the guy, but he really just gave him a facewash +

  37. drglen says:

    Those were quality tampa goals. And they had other chances with open guys. I thought the backchecking forwards were weak not the dmen. Its too bad kosk didnt grab more saves. He just wasnt confident and challenging.

    Benning played well

    Oscar could not get those shots on pp. I wish we had a stronger threat from point. Also. The leftorium on powerplay was a problem today. Good 1 time looks were to be had with a right shot on left side. Enough of this fix it

    Actually nice game from strome.

    Brodz a step behind

  38. Glovjuice says:

    Jethro Tull:
    The Oilers better get good at marginal picks and screens. I’ve noticed (by eye only) a few teams are very good at seemingly innocent cross overs that take out a checker. The Caps, NSH are two. Now Tampa.

    It was made illegal in rugby years ago because of the same reasons; guy has the ball, opponent goes for the tackle, guy crosses (or scissors, as it’s known in rugby) with a team mate who he gives the ball. He then continues to “accidentally” block the tackler. You can basically run the ball all the way down the field just repeating this. In hockey it allows speed to be built through the neutral zone or negates a forecheck.

    Astute call.

  39. JimmyV1965 says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey:
    Glovjuice,

    Strenuously disagree.

    If you cowardly endanger our player and the refs don’t call it, face the consequences.

    Take your pick of infractions; this game was rife with exceptional examples.

    +1000

  40. Wilde says:

    Jethro Tull:
    The Oilers better get good at marginal picks and screens. I’ve noticed (by eye only) a few teams are very good at seemingly innocent cross overs that take out a checker. The Caps, NSH are two. Now Tampa.

    It was made illegal in rugby years ago because of the same reasons; guy has the ball, opponent goes for the tackle, guy crosses (or scissors, as it’s known in rugby) with a team mate who he gives the ball. He then continues to “accidentally” block the tackler. You can basically run the ball all the way down the field just repeating this. In hockey it allows speed to be built through the neutral zone or negates a forecheck.

    IMO it’s a bigger competitive advantage in the OZ, where teams are bringing back the high cycle by using this – I think the smart teams know the low cycle and plain low-to-high plays aren’t very strenuous on modern defensive structures.

    The amount of pick plays in the video I cut today is hilarious, and I left out a ton.

  41. jp says:

    drglen:

    Oscar could not get those shots on pp. I wish we had a syronger threat from point. Also. The leftorium on powerplay was a problem today.Good 1 time looks were yo be had with a right shot on left side.Enough of this fix it

    Ty Rattie (a right shot) was on PP1 today. There were no 5L PPs in the game today.

  42. Glovjuice says:

    jp: I’m somewhere in the middle on this whole argument, but IMO what Lucic did wasn’t particularly dangerous. It was far more intimidation than pugilism. He very easily could have obliterated the guy, but he really just gave him a facewash +

    facewash + wow. I give up – I must be totally oblivious. Done for today. yes, I know….you are all welcome.

  43. OmJo says:

    jp: I’m somewhere in the middle on this whole argument, but IMO what Lucic did wasn’t particularly dangerous. It was far more intimidation than pugilism. He very easily could have obliterated the guy, but he really just gave him a facewash +

    The punch to the head was dangerous.

    Glovjuice: The hit on Russel was not clean but certainly not cowardly. It was more from the side and won’t even register with the league. The Lucic Neanderthal show was cowardly and dangerous – he fuckin choked him, man; after a free blow to the head while the guy was falling.

    I think it’s better to send a message before one of our players is smashed from behind headfirst into the boards and they don’t get up? Backstrom also hit Nuge from behind into the boards. I’d rather deter something bad happening instead of seeing the team react to it happening…

    The hit sent the message. The punch and alleged choke (still don’t know if that was in fact what happened) was unnecessary though, I agree.

  44. Wilde says:

    Scungilli Slushy: The Oilers have not been a chippy team in the last years IMO, more responsive to the opponent, which as it stands with reffing is spot on.

    They def were, except for the latter half of 17-18. Examples that immediately come to mind are the Brandon Manning game, and those two bouts vs NJD.

  45. Wilde says:

    How exactly do you choke another player, in gear, with your gloves on?

  46. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Jethro Tull:
    The Oilers better get good at marginal picks and screens. I’ve noticed (by eye only) a few teams are very good at seemingly innocent cross overs that take out a checker. The Caps, NSH are two. Now Tampa.

    It was made illegal in rugby years ago because of the same reasons; guy has the ball, opponent goes for the tackle, guy crosses (or scissors, as it’s known in rugby) with a team mate who he gives the ball. He then continues to “accidentally” block the tackler. You can basically run the ball all the way down the field just repeating this. In hockey it allows speed to be built through the neutral zone or negates a forecheck.

    My solution to an obvious coaching tactic like that is send two checkers and the guy tracking the ‘pick’ is full speed and nails him good, not late, but makes them pay a price, because picks are illegal, and if the ref won’t call it get them second guessing. It’s a full contact sport, and physical intimidation is a very big part of the game still.

    Scotty Bowman as Wings coach responded to a question about the trap with ‘if they try that I’ll put Federov on D and he’ll skate the puck in’.

    Whatever it takes. Hopefully the refs do what the rules say and it’s not an issue.

    I think we’re seeing more issues this season because the Oilers are winning and there is no question that Connor is a threat every shift. Teams aren’t thinking the game is ‘in the bag’ anymore. This is when the beefcakes earn their money, and most players cement their spot.

  47. OmJo says:

    Wilde:
    How exactly do you choke another player, in gear, with your gloves on?

    Joseph’s neck looked red after the scrum.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9SmVaNqCx3I

    Stop the video at around 0:17, when Lucic and Joseph get rotated around. You can see it looks like his hands are around his neck.

    Edit: Here’s a screenshot https://ibb.co/i3ZgiV

  48. jp says:

    Glovjuice,

    OmJo,

    Yeah I just re-watched it and the one punch to the head was worse than I realized. What followed really was simple intimidation though IMO. Lucic could have damaged Joseph, he did not.

  49. OmJo says:

    jp:
    Glovjuice,

    OmJo,

    Yeah I just re-watched it and the one punch to the head was worse than I realized. What followed really was simple intimidation though IMO. Lucic could have damaged Joseph, he did not.

    Oh absolutely it was mostly intimidation. He could have went all Hulk Smash on Joseph and the young man would have to have had his face scraped up off the ice afterwards.

    He was laughing about it right afterwards though. Kids these days.

  50. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Wilde: They def were, except for the latter half of 17-18.Examples that immediately come to mind are the Brandon Manning game, and those two bouts vs NJD.

    I meant overall, as in always instigating. I haven’t felt that, although they have been chippy/ dirty regularly in the past.

    Manning deserved it and still does. Repeated hack and dangerous player.

    The issue is that marginal players make a million Canadian dollars, and some will do anything to make it. It’s up to the league to decide Manning can’t attack the ‘talent’ to stay in the league. The NHL condones attacking the best players, or does by default in allowing it.

    They are starting to suspend egregious players, but still allow certain teams to get away with team muggings. How long until Connor isn’t clearly interfered with?

  51. Wilde says:

    OmJo: Joseph’s neck looked red after the scrum.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9SmVaNqCx3I

    Stop the video at around 0:17, when Lucic and Joseph get rotated around. You can see his hands around his neck.

    right, I was thinking he was just holding him by each side of the collar of his jersey, but either way I don’t think it’s straight up restricting his breathing choking

    I’m not on Milan’s side for this one, but I won’t judge him too harshly. I think the most likely player to be injured from this game is Kris Russell, but it could have easily been Brayden point out for a dozen games from Draisaitl’s flying elbow.

  52. OmJo says:

    Wilde,

    If his neck wasn’t red I would have thought the same thing. The redness made me think okay maybe his hands were around his neck.

  53. Wilde says:

    Scungilli Slushy:
    They are starting to suspend egregious players, but still allow certain teams to get away with team muggings. How long until Connor isn’t clearly interfered with?

    Perhaps never. I believe strongly that he will never get the calls any other player would, for the reason that a) the league is clueless when it comes to protecting star player’s play and safety, and b) referees don’t personally identify with star players and only respect them if they’ve won.

    It’ll be easier for McDavid to get his 2nd Stanley than his first, but his career will be over before there’s enough turnover up high in the collective team’s ownership and NHL executive positions for the game to be called by the rules.

  54. Wilde says:

    OmJo:
    Wilde,

    If his neck wasn’t red I would have thought the same thing. The redness made me think okay maybe his hands were around his neck.

    It could have been the knuckles of his gloves that did that though

  55. Scungilli Slushy says:

    OmJo:
    Wilde,

    If his neck wasn’t red I would have thought the same thing. The redness made me think okay maybe his hands were around his neck.

    To me this is the saddest part about the NHL.

    Because the league though it’s refs don’t consistently police the league, it’s up to essentially vigilante justice.

    Who obeys an enforcer that won’t hurt you? Nobody. The kid was laughing after? Because Lucic has been quite civilized the last few years. ‘I fought Lucic’ and nothing much happened so it’s a laugh.

    Chara is a savage and hurts people even when going easy as per many player’s accounts. Maroon’s was the last I read. Sadly Lucic needs to lay a big time licking on hopefully a deserving opponent to ‘refresh’ the league memory of why they don’t want to go there.

    There are only a few guys according to player’s polls that are widely feared, Lucic was #2.

    I don’t like fighting in the league anymore, but like even less liberties taken on the Oilers, especially Connor. I have had a gut full of that after the DoD and no team response, opponents do use it as a tactic if they think it will work.

    They start, we finish. Until there’s a new sheriff in head office.

  56. Pescador says:

    Glovjuice: The hit on Russel was not clean but certainly not cowardly. It was more from the side and won’t even register with the league. The Lucic Neanderthal show was cowardly and dangerous – he fuckin choked him, man; after a free blow to the head while the guy was falling.

    when you saw that poor poor Joseph laughing on the bench after
    It was at you
    Lucic and Kassian targeted him because he was running around taking liberties all night
    By all means take a hard stance, but at least get the facts straight first

  57. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Wilde: Perhaps never. I believe strongly that he will never get the calls any other player would, for the reason that a) the league is clueless when it comes to protecting star player’s play and safety, and b) referees don’t personally identify with star players and only respect them if they’ve won.

    It’ll be easier for McDavid to get his 2nd Stanley than his first, but his career will be over before there’s enough turnover up high in the collective team’s ownership and NHL executive positions for the game to be called by the rules.

    Ughhh.

  58. Pescador says:

    OmJo: Joseph’s neck looked red after the scrum.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9SmVaNqCx3I

    Stop the video at around 0:17, when Lucic and Joseph get rotated around. You can see it looks like his hands are around his neck.

    Edit: Here’s a screenshot https://ibb.co/i3ZgiV

    I watched it, didn’t see any red around the neck.
    Belly looked kinda yellow

  59. treevojo says:

    Wilde:
    How exactly do you choke with your gloves on?

    Like this?

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=D_gpwEWO-nQ

  60. Bag of Pucks says:

    Glovjuice: The hit on Russel was not clean but certainly not cowardly. It was more from the side and won’t even register with the league. The Lucic Neanderthal show was cowardly and dangerous – he fuckin choked him, man; after a free blow to the head while the guy was falling.

    Maybe figure skating is more your sport?

  61. Réal Goudenyéu says:

    tileguy: More icing, no big blue wave rolling through the US.

    Dems did fine tonight the Senate was never in play.

    They can check Trump a little now and I think that’s a good thing for America and by extension the world.

  62. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Rarely do I find myself agreeing with Kurt Leavins, but I’m willing to give the man credit where it’s due.

    From his player grades at CoH:
    source: https://edmontonjournal.com/sports/hockey/nhl/cult-of-hockey/the-edmonton-oilers-washington-capitals

    “MILAN LUCIC. 4. There are two ways to look at the Milan Lucic decision to physically engage Matthieu Joseph in the 3rd Period of tonight’s game. If you don’t care for that kind of thing, that is your prerogative. My view: Kris Russell took a cheap shot into the end boards and was cut. No call. The same player took shots at McDavid and RNH earlier but also went un-penalized. So with the game 5-2 and well out of reach, the time was right for the defacto policeman on this club to say to the Bolts and the rest of the NHL “hey, that’s not O.K.”, and to his teammates “I’m not scoring so I’ll contribute in this way instead”. I’m not sure how you will view it. But I can be confident that it will resonate loudly with Kris Russell and the rest of his teammates. Personally, I’m not at all O.K. with the Oilers best players being run at but nothing being done about it. Your mileage may vary.”

  63. Oz says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey,

    I concur 100% as this post has expressed my earlier response to Glovjuice more clearly by someone who has played the game at a much higher level than I have

  64. godot10 says:

    jp: I’m somewhere in the middle on this whole argument, but IMO what Lucic did wasn’t particularly dangerous. It was far more intimidation than pugilism. He very easily could have obliterated the guy, but he really just gave him a facewash +

    Lucic’s stalking and assault of Joseph was Bertuzzi-on-Moore-lite. It is suspension worthy. There was a total absence of a hockey play in the attack.

    One can make legal hits in hockey, for retribution. There is no need to make illegal ones.

    If they hit McDavid, hit Stamkos, Point, and Kucherov.

  65. oilinthepeg says:

    godot10: Lucic’s stalking and assault of Joseph was Bertuzzi-on-Moore-lite.It is suspension worthy.There was a total absence of a hockey play in the attack.

    This.

    The chippiness on the star players is on the refs and on the league. I’m personally sick of players ‘having to stik up for their teammates’. Just play the game. Players are paid to play hockey and win games. The play by Lucic was garbage and has no place in the game. Two wrongs don’t make a right, and if someone wants to hurt McDavid, they will do it, they’re not afraid of guys like Lucic. Like with the illegal picks and everything else in the league, players and teams will push the boundaries of what they can get away with because it works to their advantage. It’s tough to compete in a league where they don’t call plays fairly… especially since I don’t feel the Oilers play with that ‘close-to-illegal’ edge to their game. I don’t often find myself thinking that they are really pushing the refs to see what they can get away with.

    I wish Lucic put that much passion and vigor into trying to score goals because goals help win hockey games…

    Also, I’m actually not that fond of figure skating, in case someone was going to insult me for taking this stance on the topic… yeesh.

  66. "Steve Smith" says:

    oilinthepeg,
    MAYBE FIGURE SKATING IS MORE YOUR SPORT?

  67. hunter1909 says:

    …Bring out your dead…Bring out your dead!…

  68. Chelios is a Dinosaur says:

    What happens when Lucic comes off his suspension to find all 4 lines humming in his absence?

  69. treevojo says:

    oilinthepeg:

    Also, I’m actually not that fond of figure skating, in case someone was going to insult me for taking this stance on the topic… yeesh.

    Probably cause of Tonya Harding.

  70. Genjutsu says:

    Chelios is a Dinosaur:
    What happens when Lucic comes off his suspension to find all 4 lines humming in his absence?

    That’s a really nice problem to have.

  71. Crazy Pedestrian says:

    Chelios is a Dinosaur:
    What happens when Lucic comes off his suspension to find all 4 lines humming in his absence?

    Ooo… this! Very much this!!!

  72. Glovjuice says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey:
    Rarely do I find myself agreeing with Kurt Leavins, but I’m willing to give the man credit where it’s due.

    From his player grades at CoH:
    source: https://edmontonjournal.com/sports/hockey/nhl/cult-of-hockey/the-edmonton-oilers-washington-capitals

    “MILAN LUCIC. 4. There are two ways to look at the Milan Lucic decision to physically engage Matthieu Joseph in the 3rd Period of tonight’s game. If you don’t care for that kind of thing, that is your prerogative. My view: Kris Russell took a cheap shot into the end boards and was cut. No call. The same player took shots at McDavid and RNH earlier but also went un-penalized. So with the game 5-2 and well out of reach, the time was right for the defacto policeman on this club to say to the Bolts and the rest of the NHL “hey, that’s not O.K.”, and to his teammates “I’m not scoring so I’ll contribute in this way instead”. I’m not sure how you will view it. But I can be confident that it will resonate loudly with Kris Russell and the rest of his teammates. Personally, I’m not at all O.K. with the Oilers best players being run at but nothing being done about it. Your mileage may vary.”

    If what Lucic did was so important then why only a game grade of 4? What a contradiction. It’s totally nonsensical not to give a higher grade then.

  73. Glovjuice says:

    godot10: Lucic’s stalking and assault of Joseph was Bertuzzi-on-Moore-lite.It is suspension worthy.There was a total absence of a hockey play in the attack.

    One can make legal hits in hockey, for retribution. There is no need to make illegal ones.

    If they hit McDavid, hit Stamkos, Point, and Kucherov.

    Here here. Godot gets it of course.

  74. Glovjuice says:

    oilinthepeg: This.

    The chippiness on the star players is on the refs and on the league. I’m personally sick of players ‘having to stik up for their teammates’. Just play the game. Players are paid to play hockey and win games. The play by Lucic was garbage and has no place in the game. Two wrongs don’t make a right, and if someone wants to hurt McDavid, they will do it, they’re not afraid of guys like Lucic. Like with the illegal picks and everything else in the league, players and teams will push the boundaries of what they can get away with because it works to their advantage. It’s tough to compete in a league where they don’t call plays fairly… especially since I don’t feel the Oilers play with that ‘close-to-illegal’ edge to their game. I don’t often find myself thinking that they are really pushing the refs to see what they can get away with.

    I wish Lucic put that much passion and vigor into trying to score goals because goals help win hockey games…

    Also, I’m actually not that fond of figure skating, in case someone was going to insult me for taking this stance on the topic… yeesh.

    And again. Thanks. Agree 100%

  75. who says:

    I’m fine with what Lucic did last night, if he thinks Joseph was taking liberties with some of the Oilers. If we are being honest, that is partially what we are paying him for.
    In an ideal world it wouldn’t be necessary, but the NHL is not an ideal world.
    Kinda like having an army. You hope you never need one, but if you do, it’s sure nice to have one.

  76. russ99 says:

    Thought we played reasonably well considering the opposition is much better and the officiating is a joke. Got lots of good chances but for a lightning hot goalie and some dirty play.

    Good effort, results will come.

  77. Glovjuice says:

    who:
    I’m fine with what Lucic did last night, if he thinks Joseph was taking liberties with some of the Oilers. If we are being honest, that is partially what we are paying him for.
    In an ideal world it wouldn’t be necessary,but the NHL is not an ideal world.
    Kinda like having an army. You hope you never need one, but if you do, it’s sure nice to have one.

    An army has an objective to win something. Lucic won nothing. This army metaphor is silly.

  78. pts2pndr says:

    Glovjuice: The hit on Russel was not clean but certainly not cowardly. It was more from the side and won’t even register with the league. The Lucic Neanderthal show was cowardly and dangerous – he fuckin choked him, man; after a free blow to the head while the guy was falling.

    Cheap chicken—t should get exactly what Lucic did! This is not ringette. The league has to own up to the fact that they are either unable or unwilling to police their game and do away with the instigator rule. The game would clean up in less than a third of the season! The good players would once again be able to use their skill to their full ability! The cheap shot artists would have to man up and or stop their c–p!

  79. who says:

    Glovjuice: An army has an objective to win something. Lucic won nothing.This army metaphor is silly.

    I would counter with “lose the battle, win the war”. Hell, they had already lost this game, before the incident.
    What Lucic did was send a message, not just to the Lightning, but to 29 other teams. There is value in that, whether you can see it or not.
    I wonder how many people who are horrified by this have ever played competitive hockey? How many of them have found themselves in this situation? I don’t care how many PP goals you score, eventually you just get tired of taking the abuse. I don’t want to see that happen to any young, skilled player.
    The game is changing, and I love the direction it’s heading in, but I still think players have to be held accountable. In my mind, that’s what Lucic did.

  80. VOR says:

    I think intimidation is an inherent part of sport. It is expressed differently in different sports.

    In figure skating it is knowing you can skate the performance of a life time and get jobbed by the scorers. In figure skating it is knowing you will fall hundreds, even thousands of times, on hard ice, and spend your career bruised, bandaged, and limping. It is knowing that in any of those falls your skate blades or those of a partner can cut you for hundred of stitches. And if you get to be really good at the sport you get to experience all of that in front of ten thousand plus fans life and tens of millions, as much as 500 million people on TV. Figure skating isn’t even slightly intimidating.

    I have coached enough figure skaters (jump training is a common part of their practice regime) to know they are tough as nails.

  81. VOR says:

    who: I would counter with “lose the battle, win the war”. Hell,they had already lost this game, before the incident.
    What Lucic did was send a message, not just to the Lightning, but to 29 other teams. There is value in that, whether you can see it or not.
    I wonder how many people who are horrified by this have ever played competitive hockey? How many of them have found themselves in this situation? I don’t care how many PP goals you score, eventually you just get tired of taking the abuse. I don’t want to see that happen to any young, skilled player.
    The game is changing, and I love the direction it’s heading in, but I still think players have to be held accountable. In my mind,that’s what Lucic did.

    I have lost track of how many games of competitive hockey I have played over the past 54 years. Quite a few in any case. I was horrified, though maybe not for the reasons other people were.

    A pacifist I am not. I think I have made that clear. But as a goalie you know the opposition is going to try to intimidate you and take you off your game. It is hockey 101. And you know the officials aren’t going to call it. Obviously, if it bothered me I wouldn’t have played for five decades.

    I have of course wigged out and occasionally chopped a player down as they entered my crease. My position has always been to largely ignore the intimidation but when I did decide to respond to make it count. Last year I broke a guy’s ankle. Don’t want to limp for the rest of your life don’t keep Morking me.

    Hockey is a tough game and from time to time you have to make it clear your opponents can’t take liberties.

    My problem with Lucic’s play was it wasn’t effective intimidation. The guy shouldn’t be on his bench laughing he should be in an ambulance on the way to the hospital. If it is worth being intimidating then go all nuclear winter. No half way measures. Either ignore the aggro and play your game, always the better move in my opinion, or deliver a response that will be heard around the league.

    I give Lucic full marks for trying to do the right thing. But all that he accomplished was to show that you can get under the Oilers skin and that their most intimidating player is a spent force. Dumb and dumber.

  82. Leroy Draisdale says:

    treevojo: Probably cause of Tonya Harding.

    I lol’d, got a few funny looks at the office

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