Value Contracts

In the cap NHL, a player who can fill an important role (top six F, No. 3 C, top 4D, starting goalie) is worth his weight in gold. Edmonton’s 2019-20 value contracts are neither abundant or obvious, making the season in Bakersfield even more important. Edmonton needs value contracts, how many Condors can convert to the NHL?

I like to use NHLE’s to estimate quality, and the Oilers have been improving over recent seasons. Last year, there were six forwards over 30 NHLE, as well as two defensemen. How many this year?

THE ATHLETIC

The Athletic Edmonton features a fabulous cluster of stories (some linked below, some on the site). Great perspective from a ridiculous group of writers and analysts. Proud to be part of the group.INSANE NEW OFFER IS HERE!

  • New LowetideHow high can these Condors fly?
  • Lowetide: Ron Hextall’s patient approach as GM would be shock to Oilers’ system
  • Jonathan Willis: Michael Futa’s success at the NHL Draft makes him a credible GM candidate for the Oilers
  • Lowetide: The Oilers possible summer trade pieces, and which longtime players might be saying goodbye.
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: Ten prospects likely to be available when the Oilers make their first-round pick.
  • Jonathan Willis: Bob Nicholson mostly says the right things, but stalls on making changes to the Oilers.
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: The pressure’s squarely on Bob Nicholson to make right GM hire for Oilers.
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: Oilers Report Cards: Few passing grades remain in season full of failure.
  • Lowetide: How winning the draft lottery and drafting Jack Hughes could transform the Oilers.
  • Lowetide: The Oilers have a trio of Condors blue pushing and all three are tracking well. How does this group compare to the Petry, Chorney, Wild college men from a decade ago?
  • Jonathan Willis: Connor McDavid’s frustration should be seen by the Oilers as a warning of possible disaster.
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: Oilers have another problem to solve: Lifting the cloud over a clearly frustrated Connor McDavid
  • Lowetide: What Mark Hunter’s draft record in Toronto means for his Oilers GM candidacy.
  • Lowetide: The Edmonton Oilers, the republic of Finland and the 2019 draft.
  • Lowetide: The Oilers made a rare move and shopped the QMJHL at the 2018 draft. It could happen again.
  • Lowetide: The Edmonton Oilers draft early, the WHL is loaded and there’s a lot of history.
  • Lowetide: The Edmonton Oilers and the OHL.

COMPLETE NHLE 2018-19 FORWARDS

  • Marody’s 44 points is well clear of last year’s top number (Kailer Yamamoto, 39.6) and the highest NHLE since the Oilers drafted McDavid in 2015 (63).
  • Marody’s 44 NHLE was matched by Drake Caggiula when he signed with the Oilers. Both were 21 in the years in question.
  • Benson is in an area many AHL forwards reach, but not at 20 (at least Oilers prospects). Andrew Miller was 35 NHLE in 2015, but he was 25.
  • Joe Gambardella and Josh Currie are two forwards who might be able to catch on as value contracts who can PK and score some.
  • Kirill Maksimov showed very well, but some juniors have a tough time producing offense in the first season AHL.
  • Kailer Yamamoto had injury issues, but this was a disappointing step down in NHLE.
  • Ryan McLeod’s draft +1 is beyond Marco Roy (20) in his draft +1 season, but he production is disappointing. He needs to post more offense.
  • This is the secondary offensive group. Safin had an injury riddled campaign, suspect he’ll be at the big table next Easter.
  • I like Hebig, suspect he’ll have a strong second season in the AHL.
  • Polei is another favourite.
  • McPhee and Rasanen were part of the power outage at Boston College, both need to have better seasons in 2019-20.
  • I don’t have an NHLE for Patrik Siikanen, so he isn’t listed here.

COMPLETE NHLE 2018-19 DEFENSE

  • Bouchard’s draft +1 number, like his draft NHLE, is outstanding. Defensemen are tough to project. Darnell Nurse had a draft +1 NHLE of 19, and just posted 41 points in the NHL. Boxcars depend on feature role, same as it ever was. That said, Bouchard looks terrific.
  • Joel Persson arrives this fall with expectations. A lot of smart people believe he’ll have an impact. NHLE concurs.
  • Bear, Jones and Lagesson look like they are ready. Impossible for all of them to ascend to the NHL (with Bouchard and Persson), expect a cull sometime before April 2020.
  • Samorukov had a splendid year. He could pass a lot of people now that turns pro. It might take an adjustment year but you get the feeling he might arrive well before projection.
  • Michael Kesselring stepped up in a big way after the trade. A very raw player, his spike late is encouraging.
  • Berglund’s offense went down but his TOI increased to 19:02 from 17:03. His 5-on-5 goal differential fell to 29-28 from 34-23 a year ago. I’m not certain when or if he’ll come over, Oilers have until June 1, 2020 to get him signed.
  • Desharnais is a shutdown defenseman and his college career is over. Edmonton will need to sign him (and goalie Hayden Hawkey) by August 15 of this year. I suspect Edmonton will try to sign Hawkey.
  • John Marino has spiked as a player and appears to be returning for his senior season. That’s probably bad news for Edmonton. Mark Divver broke the news.
  • Phil Kemp is another fine defensive prospect matriculating well.

Interesting tweet. One of the things Edmonton’s new general manager would probably pursue is trade ideas surrounding some of the team’s higher cap earners. The injury to Lucic could impact things.

LOWDOWN WITH LOWETIDE

At 10 this morning, we hit the air with an actual mountain of news to discuss. TSN1260, scheduled to appear:

  • Marck Zecchino, Golf Talk Canada. Tiger wins! A massive sports story.
  • Jason Gregor, TSN1260. Lucic, Oilers GM, Tiger.

10-1260 text, @Lowetide on twitter. See you on the radio!

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222 Responses to "Value Contracts"

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  1. JustWatt says:

    Having just read yesterday’s comments and looking at this article I wonder if trading both Russel and Sekera to free up cap space for a proper 2RD while letting Jones fill the 3LD spot isn’t a good idea. Then you could let Benning and Bouchard fight it out on 3RD, may the best man win. It slots players appropriately and legitimately frees up the cap space for the 2RD, the only question would be who that player would be and how to actually acquire them. I could be on board for Gardiner or Myers.

  2. Coiler says:

    I think Sekera provides value that can’t necessarily be seen in just point totals. I definitely wouldn’t buy him out or trade him unless the return was quite significant. A healthy Sekera helps that blue line big time and I think the argument could be made that had he been with the team this year their fortunes might have been a little different.

    Lucic’s contract… Ugly but I don’t think putting possible sweeteners in a deal is responsible or prudent. It sucks to high heaven but I would personally let him ride it out on the 4th line until he (through his agent) decides enough is enough and either engineers a trade where Edmonton doesn’t get a shafted or they mutually agree to terminate the contract. Giving up future assets to deal with this sort of situation is why the Oilers are in this mess in the first place.

    I like Morody and Benson’s chances of landing with the big club. Proof positive that development works.

  3. ArmchairGM says:

    JustWatt:
    Having just read yesterday’s comments and looking at this article I wonder if trading both Russel and Sekera to free up cap space for a proper 2RD while letting Jones fill the 3LD spot isn’t a good idea. Then you could let Benning and Bouchard fight it out on 3RD, may the best man win. It slots players appropriately and legitimately frees up the cap space for the 2RD, the only question would be who that player would be and how to actually acquire them. I could be on board for Gardiner or Myers.

    That’s interesting. I think I would lean towards Lagesson over Jones at 3LD due to maturity and experience. For 3RD I would not have Bouchard fighting for a spot, but allow him to acclimate to the pro game in Bakersfield. The 2 that should be vying for this spot are Benning and Persson.

  4. Wilde says:

    JustWatt: Myers.

    The Tyler Myers contract is going to hurt some NHL team long term

  5. Cassandra says:

    This playoffs is bad news for the Oilers.

    The narrative that physical play rules the day in the playoffs is wrong. The Islanders and Columbus aren’t up 3-0 with their physical play. They are up 3-0 because the neutral zone trap works if you are disciplined, fast, and the officials are unwilling to enforce the rules.

    Now, what is the biggest complaint Oiler fans have? That McDavid doesn’t get the calls he should, especially through the neutral zone.

    The NHL of the past five years was the best hockey I’ve ever seen, but with the success of Columbus and the Islanders I fear we are returning to the dark ages of boring, clog the neutral zone, hockey.

  6. who says:

    Wilde: The Tyler Myers contract is going to hurt some NHL team long term

    Why?

  7. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Wilde: The Tyler Myers contract is going to hurt some NHL team long term

    It would be very Oilers for them to give him 4 x $5MM or so.

  8. godot10 says:

    Re: McDavid and Lucic

    The Oilers era of openness lasted about 15 seconds. Openness isn’t part of the culture. The Oilers lack of openness meant that someone had to invade Lucic’s privacy just so some simple basic information could be publicly known.

    The picture would never have had to be posted online if the Oilers had issued a two-line news release.

  9. pts2pndr says:

    ArmchairGM: That’s interesting. I think I would lean towards Lagesson over Jones at 3LD due to maturity and experience. For 3RD I would not have Bouchard fighting for a spot, but allow him to acclimate to the pro game in Bakersfield. The 2 that should be vying for this spot are Benning and Persson.

    I think when Oiler fans see Lagesson they will change their minds . Lagesson is a left shot Larsson but a better passer. Our goalies will love him. Jones needs to be a little greasier in front of the net. I also like the idea of Bouchard starting in the ahl without the pressure. Let him acclimate to the pro game with lots of ice time. In my opinion he may end up being the best offensive D the club has had since Paul coffey.

  10. who says:

    Woodguy v2.0: It would be very Oilers for them to give him 4 x $5MM or so.

    I would take Myers for 4 years at 5 million all day long. Sounds like pretty good value, and not much risk, to me.
    I think he’s going to get more money and term than that.

  11. godot10 says:

    JustWatt:
    Having just read yesterday’s comments and looking at this article I wonder if trading both Russel and Sekera to free up cap space for a proper 2RD while letting Jones fill the 3LD spot isn’t a good idea. Then you could let Benning and Bouchard fight it out on 3RD, may the best man win. It slots players appropriately and legitimately frees up the cap space for the 2RD, the only question would be who that player would be and how to actually acquire them. I could be on board for Gardiner or Myers.

    It would be better to have Sekera around on the 3rd pair to mentor the young D breaking in on the 3rd pair.

    Since the OIlers are also stuck with Russell, a hockey trade for a forward by trading Benning is probably the most likely and proper option.

    I don’t think Lucic or Russell are tradeable.

  12. godot10 says:

    Coiler:
    I think Sekera provides value that can’t necessarily be seen in just point totals. I definitely wouldn’t buy him out or trade him unless the return was quite significant. A healthy Sekera helps that blue line big time and I think the argument could be made that had he been with the team this year their fortunes might have been a little different.

    Lucic’s contract… Ugly but I don’t think putting possible sweeteners in a deal is responsible or prudent. It sucks to high heaven but I would personally let him ride it out on the 4th line until he (through his agent) decides enough is enough and either engineers a trade where Edmonton doesn’t get a shafted or they mutually agree to terminate the contract. Giving up future assets to deal with this sort of situation is why the Oilers are in this mess in the first place.

    I like Morody and Benson’s chances of landing with the big club. Proof positive that development works.

    The only place for Lucic is as the #14F in the pressbox. He can’t help on the ice. Are you going to saddle Marody or Cave with him in the bottom six. Lucic can’t PK. The only place he doesn’t hurt the team is in the pressbox.

  13. Wilde says:

    Woodguy v2.0: It would be very Oilers for them to give him 4 x $5MM or so.

    We really have to stop saying these words or else it’s going to be spoken into existence

  14. Wilde says:

    who: Why?

    I don’t think he helps at 5v5 in 2nd pairing deployment

  15. Coiler says:

    godot10,

    Then have him sit in the pressbox. My point is to not give up tangible assets to get him off the books. Stealing from Peter to pay Paul is not something this team is very good at. Play hardball with him. The team has nothing to lose at this point.

  16. godot10 says:

    who: I would take Myers for 4 years at 5 million all day long. Sounds like pretty good value, and not much risk,to me.
    I think he’s going to get more money and term than that.

    That’s an awful lot for a 3rd pairing D. Nurse is unquestionably better, and a legit top 4, and many here freak out at the thought of paying him over $5 million.

  17. who says:

    godot10: That’s an awful lot for a 3rd pairing D. Nurse is unquestionably better, and a legit top 4, and many here freak out at the thought of paying him over $5 million.

    I just don’t see him as a 3rd pairing dman.
    I see a 2nd pairing right shot dman who can skate, move the puck, and run a powerplay.
    Isn’t this the exact player Edmonton has been looking for?
    I also think he has better puck skills than Nurse.

  18. Wilde says:

    Rondo:
    Central Scouting releasesfinal rankings

    https://www.nhl.com/news/jack-hughes-tops-2019-nhl-draft-final-ranking-of-north-american-skaters/c-306704716?tid=277764372

    A lot of previously-sleepers moving up here – Tomasino, Nic Robertson, Brink, Tracey.

    Some remain mysteriously (just kidding, it’s Q and EU.) low though, like Höglander, Dorofeyev, Fagemo, Pelletier, Legare, Cajkovic, Grewe.

  19. Professor Q says:

    Does the NHL get it right today with Nazem Kadri?

    We wait.

  20. JustWatt says:

    ArmchairGM: That’s interesting. I think I would lean towards Lagesson over Jones at 3LD due to maturity and experience. For 3RD I would not have Bouchard fighting for a spot, but allow him to acclimate to the pro game in Bakersfield. The 2 that should be vying for this spot are Benning and Persson.

    That works too.

  21. Primetime says:

    Cassandra:

    The narrative that physical play rules the day in the playoffs is wrong.The Islanders and Columbus aren’t up 3-0 with their physical play.

    Just using this comment to bring up a point on Eberle and the Isles. I am in no way defending Chia, and would reverse the trade in an instant if we could…but Ebs scoring in the first few games of that series is not quite vindication that Chia was totally wrong about his view on Ebs.

    His contention was that Ebs could not be effective in the playoffs in the West, specifically the big, heavy Pacific division, where Eberle became a shrinking violet and disappeared when the big boys came out. For better or worse, that’s how Chia always envisioned needing to build his team to win in the West. The fact that Ebs is scoring in a series against a much smaller Pittsburgh team that doesn’t play physical at all, doesn’t change the fact about why Chia felt he had to trade him.

    Lots of other things to pile on Chia….I believe it was still the wrong thing to do with Ebs, but at least you can follow his thinking unlike the multitude of his other moves…

  22. Durag says:

    Professor Q:
    Does the NHL get it right today with Nazem Kadri?

    We wait.

    If there’s one thing the DOPS actually does consistently, it’s bring the hammer down on repeat offenders. I say 6-8 games.

  23. dustrock says:

    Ryan Rishaug
    ‏Verified account @TSNRyanRishaug
    22m22 minutes ago

    Further to Lucic injury – Happened off ice after practice Friday in Calgary. Will remain in cast for 2 more weeks, and the injury won’t affect his regular summer training schedule. Expected to be 100% for training camp.

  24. Woogie63 says:

    jtblack:
    From a real source. not just gossip.

    Lucic was injured at a bar in Calgary the night before their last game.“Story” I heard was he got into an altercation and at some point went down and his leg buckled.

    Not meant to be gossip, LT, as I know you don’t like that. Just trying to put out the info I heard

    JT

    Second floor at the National?

  25. Professor Q says:

    Durag: If there’s one thing the DOPS actually does consistently, it’s bring the hammer down on repeat offenders. I say 6-8 games.

    At this point he should be getting the Torres and Simon treatment. Even Jesse Boulerice got 25 games for a similar incident.

    This is his, what? 6th suspension for head hits alone, let alone how many for other incidents?

  26. LadiesloveSmid says:

    Woodguy v2.0: It would be very Oilers for them to give him 4 x $5MM or so.

    Have you considered that he is tall?

  27. who says:

    Primetime: Just using this comment to bring up a point on Eberle and the Isles.I am in no way defending Chia, and would reverse the trade in an instant if we could…but Ebs scoring in the first few games of that series is not quite vindication that Chia was totally wrong about his view on Ebs.

    His contention was that Ebs could not be effective in the playoffs in the West, specifically the big, heavy Pacific division, where Eberle became a shrinking violet and disappeared when the big boys came out.For better or worse, that’s how Chia always envisioned needing to build his team to win in the West.The fact that Ebs is scoring in a series against a much smaller Pittsburgh team that doesn’t play physical at all, doesn’t change the fact about why Chia felt he had to trade him.

    Lots of other things to pile on Chia….I believe it was still the wrong thing to do with Ebs, but at least you can follow his thinking unlike the multitude of his other moves…

    I would also add that the decision to trade Eberle wasn’t made the moment he coughed up that puck against Perry. I think Eberle was traded because he was a non factor that whole year and was performing well below his cap hit. Much the same as he did this year.
    Having said that, I will say he is having one hell of a start to these playoffs. It’s nice to see. If he continues on this pace he may earn himself an extra million or 2 on his next contract. I just hope the Oilers aren’t the team giving it to him.

  28. JustWatt says:

    godot10,

    Why is Russel untradeable? Just his limited NMC? He’s a legit NHL D-man even if we don’t like him. Someone starving for D would certainly take him. People keep dumping bad contracts connected to players who can’t play on Ottawa but offer Russel who is a legit player and I bet they take him first.

  29. Wilde says:

    Primetime,

    Chiarelli’s idea about beating the Pacific was wrong, though.

    Any individual evaluation that was a part of that whole teambuilding project shouldn’t be taken at face value. Considering the severity of the result, he can’t really have been right about any of those evaluations, just varying degrees of wrong.

    And to be specific, I’m talking about the literal evaluation of Eberle in that situation, not the evaluation of the return. Both were wrong.

  30. JustWatt says:

    Wilde: I don’t think he helps at 5v5 in 2nd pairing deployment

    HIs Woodmoney’s suggest his best season was 2 seasons ago, been declining ever since. Maybe I backtrack on Myers but there are so few other options out there for top 4 RD.

  31. Primetime says:

    who,

    agreed

  32. ArmchairGM says:

    godot10: The only place for Lucic is as the #14F in the pressbox.He can’t help on the ice.Are you going to saddle Marody or Cave with him in the bottom six.Lucic can’t PK.The only place he doesn’t hurt the team is in the pressbox.

    He isn’t hurting the team. Pretty sure that Lucic is the only regular forward on the roster to post a 50 GF% with McDavid off the ice. That should count for something despite the black hole offense.

  33. Cassandra says:

    Durag: If there’s one thing the DOPS actually does consistently, it’s bring the hammer down on repeat offenders. I say 6-8 games.

    This is not at all true. Brad Marchand has been suspended 6 times. This is the number of games he has received.

    2 games
    5 games
    2 games
    3 games
    2 games
    5 games

    He has also been fined four times, bringing his total # of offenses to 10.

    So it isn’t true that they punish repeat offenders. They have repeatedly let Marchand off the hook with insignificant suspensions for dirty play.

    By contrast, Kadri has been suspended 4 times.

    So when the NHL comes down hard on Kadri it will be yet another example of arbitrary justice.

    The league is a joke. I stopped watching the Oilers because they were bad and boring. Now the playoffs are here and it is bad, boring, hockey, and to top it off arbitrary and unfair.

  34. Primetime says:

    Wilde:
    Primetime,

    Chiarelli’s idea about beating the Pacific was wrong, though.

    Absolutely, agree with you Wilde. All I’m saying is that at least you can follow HIS reasoning (which was wrong), and Ebs scoring now in a different type of series is not vindication. As Who said above there was likely more to it.

    As compared to other moves (eg. Petro, Manning) which make absolutely no sense at all….

  35. ArmchairGM says:

    godot10: I don’t think Lucic or Russell are tradeable.

    Russell is tradeable for sure, the trick is finding a taker among the 10 teams that he lists on his NMC. If a team has cap space, trading an asset that has little value (i.e. a late draft pick) for an actual NHL player is found money.

  36. 36 percent body fat says:

    Instead of culling let them develop in junior. Only trade and cull if waivers comes into effect. With Bouchard and perssons coming and the emergence of Jones and lagesson maybe it is time to get something for bear. If samorukov can stay in junior leave him there playing 30 minutes a night instead of third pair in Bakersfield.

  37. godot10 says:

    JustWatt:
    godot10,

    Why is Russel untradeable? Just his limited NMC? He’s a legit NHL D-man even if we don’t like him. Someone starving for D would certainly take him. People keep dumping bad contracts connected to players who can’t play on Ottawa but offer Russel who is a legit player and I bet they take him first.

    Ottawa won’t be on his 10-team list.

    Here is a guess at Russell’s list:

    Calgary, Tampa, Philly, Nashville, Toronto, Washington, Carolina, Islanders, Boston, Minnesota

    Took me 60 seconds to turn that limited NTC back into a full NMC.

  38. ArmchairGM says:

    dustrock:
    Ryan Rishaug
    ‏Verified account @TSNRyanRishaug
    22m22 minutes ago

    Further to Lucic injury – Happened off ice after practice Friday in Calgary.Will remain in cast for 2 more weeks, and the injury won’t affect his regular summer training schedule. Expected to be 100% for training camp.

    100%? Lucic hasn’t been 100% in several years.

  39. Wilde says:

    Primetime: Absolutely, agree with you Wilde.All I’m saying is that at least you can follow HIS reasoning (which was wrong), and Ebs scoring now in a different type of series is not vindication.As Who said above there was likely more to it.

    As compared to other moves (eg. Petro, Manning) which make absolutely no sense at all….

    If our bar for understanding his reasoning is this, then the Petrovic and Manning trades absolutely make sense. Defensemen had gone down, so he needed to get defensemen. I can easily follow that reasoning.

    In fact, I’d say conceptually those make more sense than the Eberle trade.

    The entire concept of ‘getting rid’ of a player is a fan reaction one that makes no sense and never has any logical basis. There has never been a player who was the sole disqualifying factor from a team reaching their goal. The entire concept of ‘shipping out’ a player is rather a disqualifying factor for one’s logical processes.

  40. Oilpower says:

    godot10,

    Russel for there Russian d man then Toronto flips him for a seventh and gets cap space and russel is not in a place he wants to live. So maybe that’s not how he will pick his team’s.

  41. Jaxon says:

    I think we’re being way too optimistic about Persson. He’s 25 and scoring in a lesser league. There isn’t much room, biologically, for development at 25. There may be some room for improvement due to his lack of elite competition until the past two seasons, but I wouldn’t expect it to be much considering he hasn’t made a big jump this season over last season. Think Paigin, Belov, Larsen and the many other offensive D playing in lesser European leagues with more room on a bigger ice surface. Many can’t make the transition. Or even Joey Laleggia, who had higher NHLEs at a much younger age (32 in his draft+2 season, and 36 in draft+5). Paigin had an NHLE of 48 for Sochi before he came over. Belov had an NHLE of 37 before he came over. Maybe he’ll prove me wrong, but I wouldn’t be overly concerned with that bet.

  42. godot10 says:

    Jaxon:
    I think we’re being way too optimistic about Persson. He’s 25 and scoring in a lesser league. There isn’t much room, biologically, for development at 25. There may be some room for improvement due to his lack of elite competition until the past two seasons, but I wouldn’t expect it to be much considering he hasn’t made a big jump this season over last season. Think Paigin, Belov, Larsen and the many other offensive D playing in lesser European leagues with more room on a bigger ice surface. Many can’t make the transition. Or even Joey Laleggia, who had higher NHLEs at a much younger age (32 in his draft+2 season, and 36 in draft+5). Paigin had an NHLE of 48 for Sochi before he came over. Belov had an NHLE of 37 before he came over. Maybe he’ll prove me wrong, but I wouldn’t be overly concerned with that bet.

    Brian Rafalski says hi.

  43. JimmyV1965 says:

    Cassandra: This is not at all true.Brad Marchand has been suspended 6 times.This is the number of games he has received.

    2 games
    5 games
    2 games
    3 games
    2 games
    5 games

    He has also been fined four times, bringing his total # of offenses to 10.

    So it isn’t true that they punish repeat offenders.They have repeatedly let Marchand off the hook with insignificant suspensions for dirty play.

    By contrast, Kadri has been suspended 4 times.

    So when the NHL comes down hard on Kadri it will be yet another example of arbitrary justice.

    The league is a joke.I stopped watching the Oilers because they were bad and boring.Now the playoffs are here and it is bad, boring, hockey, and to top it off arbitraryand unfair.

    You’re missing some incredible hockey

  44. Wilde says:

    Jaxon:
    I think we’re being way too optimistic about Persson. He’s 25 and scoring in a lesser league. There isn’t much room, biologically, for development at 25. There may be some room for improvement due to his lack of elite competition until the past two seasons, but I wouldn’t expect it to be much considering he hasn’t made a big jump this season over last season. Think Paigin, Belov, Larsen and the many other offensive D playing in lesser European leagues with more room on a bigger ice surface. Many can’t make the transition. Or even Joey Laleggia, who had higher NHLEs at a much younger age (32 in his draft+2 season, and 36 in draft+5). Paigin had an NHLE of 48 for Sochi before he came over. Belov had an NHLE of 37 before he came over. Maybe he’ll prove me wrong, but I wouldn’t be overly concerned with that bet.

    There’s a lot packed in here.

    – I don’t think anybody’s gone further than putting him in the mix for 3RD/#7, which I don’t think there’s a strong argument against that being the case; at least there isn’t one here

    – It’s not like Paigin failed and went home, only the second part is true

    – It should be mentioned that a lot of these guys get less of a chance than they deserve, think Auvitu

    – A lot of Persson’s powerplay success has been isolated to him, the analysis of his impact there is pretty clear now that Pettersson’s gone

  45. Pescador says:

    Jaxon,

    I’m in this camp
    Let’s see how Persson performs in the AHL before we ship off Matt Benning.
    I’m sure that is the plan

  46. Pescador says:

    Pescador:
    Jaxon,

    the plan

    Haha,
    There is no plan, there never has been

  47. pts2pndr says:

    godot10: It would be better to have Sekera around on the 3rd pair to mentor the young D breaking in on the 3rd pair.

    Since the OIlers are also stuck with Russell, a hockey trade for a forward by trading Benning is probably the most likely and proper option.

    I don’t think Lucic or Russell are tradeable.

    So what you are saying is 5.5 for a third pairing mentor for our young D is good value given we don’t even have a bonafide second pairing right D. Asking for a friend.

  48. oilersfan says:

    THere is something wrong with the theory of NHLE because it doesnt take into account age.

    Surely a 18 year old in the OHL is not the same as a 20 year old, and a 20 year old in the AHL isnt the same as a 23 or 28 year old but the NHLE is the same equivalency for all of them.

    I thought Vollman or somebody had a better version that adjust for age as well as league.

  49. pts2pndr says:

    godot10: The only place for Lucic is as the #14F in the pressbox.He can’t help on the ice.Are you going to saddle Marody or Cave with him in the bottom six.Lucic can’t PK.The only place he doesn’t hurt the team is in the pressbox.

    Valid point.

  50. Oilman99 says:

    Cassandra: This is not at all true.Brad Marchand has been suspended 6 times.This is the number of games he has received.

    2 games
    5 games
    2 games
    3 games
    2 games
    5 games

    He has also been fined four times, bringing his total # of offenses to 10.

    So it isn’t true that they punish repeat offenders.They have repeatedly let Marchand off the hook with insignificant suspensions for dirty play.

    By contrast, Kadri has been suspended 4 times.

    So when the NHL comes down hard on Kadri it will be yet another example of arbitrary justice.

    The league is a joke.I stopped watching the Oilers because they were bad and boring.Now the playoffs are here and it is bad, boring, hockey, and to top it off arbitraryand unfair.

    Seems like the hammer becomes a rubber hammer come playoff time, suspensions seem to get shortened, he may only get 3 games.

  51. Dee Dee says:

    In regards to UFA’s Oilers Management are addicted to the rush of signing their big fish.

    Just say no.

    There’s no point to engineering buyouts of boat anchors if you are going to turn around and immediately sign a new boat anchor.

    If they would have just played out Benoit Pouliot’s contract he’d be off the books by now, they are stuck with that one for 2 more years.

    Time to start looking inwards in this organization and sort through their wealth of talent to figure out who can play in the Bigs and who can’t.

    It’s too easy to flush a contract and forget about it. Make them look at the number every single day and hope some sort of learning experience happens.

    Every year that ticks off on Looch’s contract makes it more attractive to a Cap Floor team.

    The Oilers are so scared of every single one of their contracts becoming a superstar that they are willing to overpay…

    every…

    single…

    time…

  52. oilersfan says:

    godot10: Ottawa won’t be on his 10-team list.

    Here is a guess at Russell’s list:

    Calgary, Tampa, Philly, Nashville, Toronto, Washington, Carolina, Islanders, Boston, Minnesota

    Took me 60 seconds to turn that limited NTC back into a full NMC.

    Godot, why are you so sure Russell wouldnt be wiilling to go to a better team? There are several playoff teams on the bottom edge of the cutline he may consider going to…Dallas, Montreal, Phoenix, all that have the cap space. I asked Stauffer and Gregor texting into the show and they both believe Russell could be moved without adding a sweetener or retaining salary for no return other than a 7th round pick or failed prospect.

  53. godot10 says:

    pts2pndr: So what you are saying is 5.5 for a third pairing mentor for our young D is good value given we don’t even have a bonafide second pairing right D. Asking for a friend.

    I didn’t say it was good value. Injuries happened. The contract was signed 4 years ago. There is likely no good way to get rid of Lucic’s, Russell’s or Sekera’s contract.

  54. Jaxon says:

    godot10: Brian Rafalski says hi.

    Rafalski was considered the best hockey player not in the NHL at 25. That’s a big leap from Persson. Rafalski’s story has way more in common with Radulov than Persson. I doubt Persson is in the top 100 players outside the NHL. He’s mostly an interesting curio as a late bloomer with a great story.

  55. Lowetide says:

    Please don’t post personal information about anyone unless you can provide a link from a reputable news source confirming. Thanks!

  56. Lowetide says:

    oilersfan:
    THere is something wrong with the theory of NHLE because it doesnt take into account age.

    Surely a 18 year old in the OHL is not the same as a 20 year old, and a 20 year old in the AHL isnt the same as a 23 or 28 year old but the NHLE is the same equivalency for all of them.

    I thought Vollman or somebody had a better version that adjust for age as well as league.

    They do, I prefer to post the numbers and allow the reader to adjust in their way. Also, junior numbers are often crazy high anyway, adding to them skews the truth.

  57. Pescador says:

    godot10: I didn’t say it was good value.Injuries happened. The contract was signed 4 years ago.There is likely no good way to get rid of Lucic’s, Russell’s or Sekera’s contract.

    I think the Oilers could trade Russell, the question is whether or not he is willing to be traded.
    You laid it out correctly above, Russell can select 10 teams with either no use for him or no cap space in 30 seconds or less

  58. Oilman99 says:

    pts2pndr: So what you are saying is 5.5 for a third pairing mentor for our young D is good value given we don’t even have a bonafide second pairing right D. Asking for a friend.

    Russell paired with a puck moving d-man could be a viable mix for a lot of teams. His shot blocking, and compete levels are characteristics of a team player,he has more value than the naysayers realize.

  59. oilersfan says:

    pts2pndr: So what you are saying is 5.5 for a third pairing mentor for our young D is good value given we don’t even have a bonafide second pairing right D. Asking for a friend.

    What i dont think people are apprecitating about planning to try hard to trade Russell but keep Sekera is that
    1) When healthy Sekera is a much better puck mover than Russell
    2) Because Russell makes less than Sekera his contract is earier to move
    3) If Klefbom misses 20-30 games, which seems to happen often, Sekera is excellent cover. If Klefbom misses 20-30 games and the Oilers have traded Sekera and Russell, do you want Caleb Jones or Lagesson in the top pairing just long enough to kill our season ? If Klefbom hadnt been injured we may have made the playoffs this year. If he did get injured and Sekera was at the level he was at shortly after his comeback this season, i bet we win 3-4 more games. Sekera looks very good, and as OP says, with a full offseason to train and a full pre season i suspect he comes back good enough to play second pair . Injuries happen to all teams. it would be foolish to go into the season with the plan that Jones or Lagesson will play 20-30 games in the second pairing.

    Russell is a better skater than Sekera but Sekera is a better passer, has a higher hockey iq, and is better offensively. I believe Russell could be traded for a 7th round pick or failed prospect to clear up the cap space and they could then trade a second to Vegas for Colin Miller for the 2rd.

    Stauffer seems to think if Makar emerges as hoped that the oilers could trade their first this year for Tyson Barrie. Obviously Barrie would have to be extended to do that, and Russell would have to be traded to free up the cap space.

  60. Bulging Twine says:

    It’s going to be very interesting to see how all these players who are moving up a league do next year.

    Benson, McLeod, Maksimov. Does Marody gain a step and play in the NHL?

  61. Crazy Pedestrian says:

    Cassandra:
    This playoffs is bad news for the Oilers.

    The narrative that physical play rules the day in the playoffs is wrong.The Islanders and Columbus aren’t up 3-0 with their physical play.They are up 3-0 because the neutral zone trap works if you are disciplined, fast, and the officials are unwilling to enforce the rules.

    Now, what is the biggest complaint Oiler fans have?That McDavid doesn’t get the calls he should, especially through the neutral zone.

    The NHL of the past five years was the best hockey I’ve ever seen, but with the success of Columbus and the Islanders I fear we are returning to the dark ages of boring, clog the neutral zone, hockey.

    I had mentioned this at the end of last season after Vegas torched the league with the new fast and quick transition style. That the NHL, in my mind, appears to go through a cycle of playing styles, to one-up the previous one. And the style I mentioned would probably beat the “new” fast and quick transition NHL?

    High-Skill Trap and Transition.

    Now the fact that the style has already shown glimpses of changing “again”, only 2 years after it started showing, is crazy.

  62. OriginalPouzar says:

    I’ve been preaching the need for value contracts ever since it was clear this team was going to be in massive cap trouble and it was also clear that contending teams had young ELC and 2nd contract players playing material roles on their teams for cheap.

    This is one large large reason why trading that first round pick can only be done for immense value and very carefully. The 8th overall is no sure thing to “make it” but its a very good bet and a good bet to be a big value contract.

  63. OriginalPouzar says:

    I think Marino back for his college year could be interpreted as a good thing. He could have turned pro, not signed and become a UFA. Perhaps he saw the impending log-jam in the AHL with the influx of Persson, Bouchard, Samorukov to pro hockey and realized he may be at risk for ECHL time. Oilers now have his rights until August 15, 2020.

  64. pts2pndr says:

    Oilman99: Russell paired with a puck moving d-man could be a viable mix for a lot of teams. His shot blocking, and compete levels are characteristics of a team player,he has more value than the naysayers realize.

    I agree Russel has value. Russel is not however a top four right side D. We are covered on the lefft side top first and second pairing. What I am asking is Russel or for that matter Sekera good value in third pairing roles. I don’t believe that they are good value on a team with cap problems that does not have a bonafide top four right side D. They are a luxury that we can’t afford if we genuinely want to get better.

  65. JustWatt says:

    pts2pndr: So what you are saying is 5.5 for a third pairing mentor for our young D is good value given we don’t even have a bonafide second pairing right D. Asking for a friend.

    This was my thinking too. $5.5 is too much for a 3rd pairing guy. If he could successfully play 2RD with Nurse then hang on to him. But realistically a younger established top 4 RD for similar money is more ideal there and if we trade him then it frees up the cash to spend on that guy. I would be sad to see Sekera go, especially with the disappointment of the last 2 seasons but if we are talking about allocating money and cap to improve the roster then moving on from an overpaid 3 LD when there are good young cheap replacements waiting is a decent move.

  66. OriginalPouzar says:

    36 percent body fat:
    Instead of culling let them develop in junior.Only trade and cull if waivers comes into effect.With Bouchard and perssons coming and the emergence of Jones and lagesson maybe it is time to get something for bear.If samorukov can stay in junior leave him there playing 30 minutes a night instead of third pair in Bakersfield.

    I can’t think of a single reason why an over-age season in junior would be better for Samorukov’s development than playing in the AHL.

    I vehemently disagree with this idea.

  67. pts2pndr says:

    oilersfan: What i dont think people are apprecitating about planning to try hard to trade Russell but keep Sekera is that
    1) When healthy Sekera is a much better puck mover than Russell
    2) Because Russell makes less than Sekera his contract is earier to move
    3) If Klefbom misses 20-30 games, which seems to happen often, Sekera is excellent cover. If Klefbom misses 20-30 games and the Oilers have traded Sekera and Russell, do you want Caleb Jones or Lagesson in the top pairing just long enough to kill our season ? If Klefbom hadnt been injured we may have made the playoffs this year. If he did get injured and Sekera was at the level he was at shortly after his comeback this season, i bet we win 3-4 more games. Sekera looks very good, and as OP says, with a full offseason to train and a full pre season i suspect he comes back good enough to play second pair . Injuries happen to all teams. it would be foolish to go into the season with the plan that Jones or Lagesson will play 20-30 games in the second pairing.

    My question is who do you see filling the glaring hole at second pairing right D? Russel has not been the answer the last two years. Sekera is not the player of old he is an older player comming off serious injuries limiting his playing time the last two years. He appears to have lost a step and while he was good in a third pairing sheltered role can he be counted on to fill a spot higher up if required. I would suggest there is almost as much uncertainty to that as their is to the two younger healthy cheaper players available. I don’t dislike either Sekera or Russel and believe they have value. What I am saying is we do have options that should be looked at.

  68. OmJo says:

    OriginalPouzar: I can’t think of a single reason why an over-age season in junior would be better for Samorukov’s development than playing in the AHL.

    I vehemently disagree with this idea.

    The same reasoning behind keeping JP in Finland/AHL instead of the AHL: better he be in an environment where he gets more ice time, more practice, etc. to further develop.

    There’s a logjam of D in Bakersfield next season, no?

    Although personally I’d rather loan him to the KHL if possible instead of another season in the CHL.

  69. Bulging Twine says:

    Rondo:
    Central Scouting releasesfinal rankings

    https://www.nhl.com/news/jack-hughes-tops-2019-nhl-draft-final-ranking-of-north-american-skaters/c-306704716?tid=277764372

    NA Skaters:
    Krebs falls from 8 to 10
    Turcotte passes Cozens
    Caufield moves 15 to 8

    Rankings after the top 3 this year are all over the place. A lot of the same guys but in all sorts of different orders.
    Krebs is anywhere from 3 to 11+
    Dach too (one list had him 15)

  70. oilersfan says:

    pts2pndr,

    i added to my post earlier….trade Russell for nothing, trade a second for Colin Miller.

  71. Bulging Twine says:

    Did you guys see Samuel Girard play last game? What a treat to watch. When he and Mackinnon are flying around moving the puck it is quite cool.
    Unfortunately he was hurt in the third and didn’t play OT last game.
    I hope he’s back in tonight.

  72. jtblack says:

    Bulging Twine: NA Skaters:
    Krebs falls from 8 to 10
    Turcotte passes Cozens
    Caufield moves 15 to 8

    Rankings after the top 3 this year are all over the place.A lot of the same guys but in all sorts of different orders.
    Krebs is anywhere from 3 to 11+
    Dach too (one list had him 15)

    Haven’t seen Krebs at 3 on any list? Haven’t seen him above 8

  73. jtblack says:

    Lowetide:
    Please don’t post personal information about anyone unless you can provide a link from a reputable news source confirming. Thanks!

    Apologies LT.

    with that said, it brings up a conversation that should be had over a whiskey and a fire about “Reputable sources” when talking about the Oilers media sources …… 🙂

  74. Bulging Twine says:

    oilersfan:

    Stauffer seems to think if Makar emerges as hoped that the oilers could trade their first this year for Tyson Barrie. Obviously Barrie would have to be extended to do that, and Russell would have to be traded to free up the cap space.

    If Makar is all they say he is they will have Johnson, Barrie, Makar and Girard at RD.

    I would agree that Barrie would have to be extended before that trade is made. But what would his extension come in at?
    Krebs for Barrie? 18 year old for a 28 year old. Steep price.
    Also, you have an Offensive RD coming and we need offensive FW’s.
    Barrie would be nice though!

  75. jtblack says:

    There is a good chance the Oilers will have a shot at either Dylan Cozens or Kirby Dach at 8 …and obviously others …

    Getting excited for this draft!

  76. JimmyV1965 says:

    godot10: Ottawa won’t be on his 10-team list.

    Here is a guess at Russell’s list:

    Calgary, Tampa, Philly, Nashville, Toronto, Washington, Carolina, Islanders, Boston, Minnesota

    Took me 60 seconds to turn that limited NTC back into a full NMC.

    I actually think Tampa might have interest in Russell. They only have two veteran dmen signed for next year and his contract might be appealing to them. Maybe we take a forward contract back like Palat at $5.3 mill. You might even be able to package Russell with Kassian for a real hockey trade.

  77. Bulging Twine says:

    jtblack: Haven’t seen Krebs at 3 on any list?Haven’t seen him above 8

    Simon Boisvert has him #3

    ISS and ESPN has Krebs 11
    Ryan Kennedy of The Hockey News had him at 13 on Feb. 1
    Corey Pronman at The Athletic had him 12 on Jan 29
    Craig Button has him 17

  78. godot10 says:

    Crazy Pedestrian: I had mentioned this at the end of last season after Vegas torched the league with the new fast and quick transition style. That the NHL, in my mind, appears to go through a cycle of playing styles, to one-up the previous one. And the style I mentioned would probably beat the “new” fast and quick transition NHL?

    High-Skill Trap and Transition.

    Now the fact that the style has already shown glimpses of changing “again”, only 2 years after it started showing, is crazy.

    USA hockey is committed to the high skill “play fast” hockey. American coaches in the NHL began bringing it into the NHL. It is not going away.

    A lot of Canadians are going to have to rethink how they play the game.

  79. jtblack says:

    Bulging Twine: Simon Boisvert has him #3

    ISS and ESPN has Krebs 11
    Ryan Kennedy of The Hockey News had him at 13 on Feb. 1
    Corey Pronman at The Athletic had him 12 on Jan 29
    Craig Button has him 17

    SIMON !!

    thanks for source. Everyone I have seen has him between 8 – 25th .. .

    This draft is going to have some Gems go late and obviously some flops go early … Gonna be interesting to look back in 3 or 4 years …

  80. Wilde says:

    Bulging Twine:
    Did you guys see Samuel Girard play last game?What a treat to watch.When he and Mackinnon are flying around moving the puck it is quite cool.
    Unfortunately he was hurt in the third and didn’t play OT last game.
    I hope he’s back in tonight.

    One of my favourites. He’s great. I love players who have a unique combination of attributes and/or a certain signature play, like Girard’s spins or Drai’s flat-angle 1T.

  81. Wilde says:

    godot10: USA hockey is committed to the high skill “play fast” hockey.American coaches in the NHL began bringing it into the NHL. It is not going away.

    A lot of Canadians are going to have to rethink how they play the game.

    Rather, Canada is going to have to think about how they teach the game. Particularly accepting players, and accepting people.

    I would study Finland, and follow them.

    Of course that last sentence applies to more than just the game.

  82. Bulging Twine says:

    Wilde: One of my favourites. He’s great. I love players who have a unique combination of attributes and/or a certain signature play, like Girard’s spins or Drai’s flat-angle 1T.

    He had one play where he was defending a 3 on 2. The puck carrier went wide and Girard pushed wide and combined a poke check at the same time and poked the puck away but I was amazed at the distance he was able to cover with his push.
    Great great skater and puck handler

  83. Bulging Twine says:

    jtblack: SIMON !!

    thanks for source.Everyone I have seen has him between 8 – 25th .. .

    This draft is going to have some Gems go late and obviously some flops go early … Gonna be interesting to look back in 3 or 4 years …

    Simon, by the way, really likes Makar.

  84. who says:

    OmJo: The same reasoning behind keeping JP in Finland/AHL instead of the AHL: better he be in an environment where he gets more ice time, more practice, etc. to further develop.

    There’s a logjam of D in Bakersfield next season, no?

    Although personally I’d rather loan him to the KHL if possible instead of another season in the CHL.

    Samarukov will be 20 next year, an overager, with 3 years of OHL expierience. Coming off a huge year.
    Sending him back to junior makes no sense. Sending back to Europe, with a larger ice surface, makes even less sense.
    Both moves would be a step backward.
    Bakersfield is the correct destination, and the right timeline.

  85. Alpine says:

    Russell should be very much movable. There’s a handful of depth defensemen with at least one full year of term who’ve been moved for picks in the last couple years.

    In September 2018, BOS sent McQuaid to NYR for Kampfer, a 4th, and a conditional 7th. McQuaid had a 2.75 mil cap hit for one more season. He then got moved to CBJ at the deadline for basically the same package.

    Jamie Oleksiak was traded by PIT back to DAL for a 4th rd pick in the middle of last season. He currently has two years left at 2.1 mil.

    In 2017 after the expansion draft, Vegas traded Emelin to NSH for a 3rd round pick. He had one year left at 4.1 mil, Vegas retained 1 million. They also sent Methot to Dallas for a 2nd rounder, who had two years left at 4.9 million.

    Vegas had some leverage with moving players as they probably weren’t as close to being capped out as we are. But Russell is probably equal or better to most players on this list. His last year only costs 2.5 mil in salary so he ends up being even more cheaper than someone like Methot.

    What this tells me is we need to to phone Jim Nill about Russell. He just traded a 3rd round pick to rent Ben Lovejoy at the deadline. He has made two of the above trades on this list. And he’s already traded a high pick for Russell before in 2016.

    I have no idea what Russell’s trade list will look like. At least with Dallas, he’s played there before, it’s warm, the team is good, and the tax rate is favourable.

  86. till_horcoff_is_coach says:

    As a worst case, the new CBA next year shoukd have amnesty but outs and Lucic will undoubtedly be used for this. The question is if it is the oilers or another team to pay him. No need to throw futures out if it is only one more year of pain. Additionally, cap floor teams may be interested, so there will be ways after one more season to get the cap space back.

    Of course patience won’t be a strong selling point with the org right now, but no need to bleed out the team’s future just to save a year of pain

  87. Bulging Twine says:

    jtblack: SIMON !!

    thanks for source.Everyone I have seen has him between 8 – 25th .. .

    This draft is going to have some Gems go late and obviously some flops go early … Gonna be interesting to look back in 3 or 4 years …

    Yeah, with such variance we will see the quality of scouting in this one and types of players an organization prefers. Maybe at 8 you could get the third best player.
    Or 25th

  88. godot10 says:

    Alpine:
    Russell should be very much movable. There’s a handful of depth defensemen with at least one full year of term who’ve been moved for picks in the last couple years.

    In September 2018, BOS sent McQuaid to NYR for Kampfer, a 4th, and a conditional 7th. McQuaid had a 2.75 mil cap hit for one more season. He then got moved to CBJ at the deadline for basically the same package.

    Jamie Oleksiak was traded by PIT back to DAL for a 4th rd pick in the middle of last season. He currently has two years left at 2.1 mil.

    In 2017 after the expansion draft, Vegas traded Emelin to NSH for a 3rd round pick. He had one year left at 4.1 mil, Vegas retained 1 million. They also sent Methot to Dallas for a 2nd rounder, who had two years left at 4.9 million.

    Vegas had some leverage with moving players as they probably weren’t as close to being capped out as we are. But Russell is probably equal or better to most players on this list. His last year only costs 2.5 mil in salary so he ends up being even more cheaper than someone like Methot.

    What this tells me is we need to to phone Jim Nill about Russell. He just traded a 3rd round pick to rent Ben Lovejoy at the deadline. He has made two of the above trades on this list. And he’s already traded a high pick for Russell before in 2016.

    I have no idea what Russell’s trade list will look like. At least with Dallas, he’s played there before, it’s warm, the team is good, and the tax rate is favourable.

    Jim Nill already declined to sign Russell once after paying dearly for him in a trade.

  89. dustrock says:

    Canada U-18 warmup continues ahead of Thursday.

    Playing Russia. 4-2 Canada after 2, Cozens with 2 goals (penalty shot, SHG), Podkolzin with 1+1, Krebs with 1A.

  90. Bulging Twine says:

    As it turns out Girard is out tonight with a shoulder injury and Makar makes his debut.

  91. Alpine says:

    godot10,

    Well now he can get him back for not much in return, with his most expensive years in salary already paid out.

  92. Bulging Twine says:

    dustrock:
    Canada U-18 warmup continues ahead of Thursday.

    Playing Russia.4-2 Canada after 2, Cozens with 2 goals (penalty shot, SHG), Podkolzin with 1+1, Krebs with 1A.

    Are you watching? Scouting report?
    Hopefully Dach joins them and we can compare directly.

  93. pts2pndr says:

    JimmyV1965: I actually think Tampa might have interest in Russell. They only have two veteran dmen signed for next year and his contract might be appealing to them. Maybe we take a forward contract back like Palat at$5.3 mill. You might even be able to package Russell with Kassian for a real hockey trade.

    Kassian is a value contract who has shown he can play on the top line. We need to get in a position where we have the cap space to take advantage of great in season deals that come around.

  94. pts2pndr says:

    Bulging Twine: If Makar is all they say he is they will have Johnson, Barrie, Makar and Girard at RD.

    I would agree that Barrie would have to be extended before that trade is made.But what would his extension come in at?
    Krebs for Barrie?18 year old for a 28 year old.Steep price.
    Also, you have an Offensive RD coming and we need offensive FW’s.
    Barrie would be nice though!

    Looking at the players that could be available at 8 this could add to the Oiler stupid trades and might even make top three.

  95. David says:

    I would not send Samorukov back to junior.

    I would send McLeod back though.

    My philosophy is that any player you want to have offence in the NHL you have to put in offensive situations and keep their confidence up.

    McLeod could be a top line centre in junior, first power play unit player, put up big numbers (which he hasn’t really done yet) and be feeling great heading into the AHL the next year more prepared for it.

    Or he be shuffled around in the bottom six of what should be a strong Condors team next year, maybe playing some wing, maybe press box, unlikely to get much power play time, unlikely to have the stability of position and line mates that he will get in junior. He’ll likely not put up great numbers and his confidence will sag.

  96. David says:

    There is not a single realistic offer out there that could get me to move the 8th overall pick. Keep the pipeline pumping, build an organization that will be good for decades instead of scuttling our bottom to limp into the playoffs next year.

  97. Scungilli Slushy says:

    David:
    There is not a single realistic offer out there that could get me to move the 8th overall pick. Keep the pipeline pumping, build an organization that will be good for decades instead of scuttling our bottom to limp into the playoffs next year.

    It would have to be a doozie when you factor in expansion draft protected. It might be smarter to use the centre depth , bring up some skilled players, and look for second tier offensive wingers that don’t cost a first.

  98. jtblack says:

    David:
    There is not a single realistic offer out there that could get me to move the 8th overall pick. Keep the pipeline pumping, build an organization that will be good for decades instead of scuttling our bottom to limp into the playoffs next year.

    +1

  99. OriginalPouzar says:

    OmJo: The same reasoning behind keeping JP in Finland/AHL instead of the AHL: better he be in an environment where he gets more ice time, more practice, etc. to further develop.

    There’s a logjam of D in Bakersfield next season, no?

    Although personally I’d rather loan him to the KHL if possible instead of another season in the CHL.

    There is a big difference between an over-age season in junior and any real professional league. Players that play an over-age season in junior rarely become NHL players.

    The AHL is the perfect league for Samorukov next year in my opinion. To note, Willie Lagesson started the year on the 3rd pairing in the Bake.

    Not to mention, the logjam in Bakersfield projects to be on the right side (Bear, Bouchard, Persson, Jones who has played almost exclusively the right side)

  100. dustrock says:

    Bulging Twine: Are you watching?Scouting report?
    Hopefully Dach joins them and we can compare directly.

    Nah, sorry, just the boxscore. I believe the tournament starts Thursday, and sounds like Turcotte, Zegras and Dach might all be injured, which sucks because that’s probably the top 3 I wanted to watch.

  101. GMB3 says:

    Primetime: Absolutely, agree with you Wilde.All I’m saying is that at least you can follow HIS reasoning (which was wrong), and Ebs scoring now in a different type of series is not vindication.As Who said above there was likely more to it.

    As compared to other moves (eg. Petro, Manning) which make absolutely no sense at all….

    No it doesn’t? This is such flawed logic. Revisionist history.

    Eberle had plenty of chances but he hit a few posts and ran into some poor luck. The narrative that he was a non-factor all year is a joke. He had 51 points, and we would kill for that kind of secondary production now.

    There is absolutely no amount of mental gymnastics I can do to validate “Peter Chiarelli’s train of thought” just because he is scoring against Pittsburgh and not against Anaheim? Wtf.

  102. who says:

    David:
    I would not send Samorukov back to junior.

    I would send McLeod back though.

    My philosophy is that any player you want to have offence in the NHL you have to put in offensive situations and keep their confidence up.

    McLeod could be a top line centre in junior, first power play unit player, put up big numbers (which he hasn’t really done yet) and be feeling great heading into the AHL the next year more prepared for it.

    Or he be shuffled around in the bottom six of what should be a strong Condors team next year, maybe playing some wing, maybe press box, unlikely to get much power play time, unlikely to have the stability of position and line mates that he will get in junior. He’ll likely not put up great numbers and his confidence will sag.

    I think you are overthinking this.
    McLeod goes to Bakersfield for the same reason Samarukov does. He actually has played 4 years of major junior, I believe.
    There is no reason to play a 5th. That is reserved for guys who don’t get drafted, or are drafted in the last few rounds. If he didn’t gain any offensive confidence this year I doubt he will gain much more as a 20 year old.
    He will start in Bakersfield, and probably play in the top 9.

  103. JimmyV1965 says:

    pts2pndr: Kassian is a value contract who has shown he can play on the top line. We need to get in a position where we have the cap space to take advantage of great in season deals that come around.

    Actually if you think about trading guys at peak value, Kassian is probably the best candidate on the Oilers. There will be many playoff losing teams interested in an enforcer type with speed and skill. I like Kassian, but he might be a luxury we can’t afford. He could probably be traded for a player with higher skill who might be a bit smaller.

  104. who says:

    GMB3: No it doesn’t? This is such flawed logic. Revisionist history.

    Eberle had plenty of chances but he hit a few posts and ran into some poor luck. The narrative that he was a non-factor all year is a joke. He had 51 points, and we would kill for that kind of secondary production now.

    There is absolutely no amount of mental gymnastics I can do to validate “Peter Chiarelli’s train of thought” just because he is scoring against Pittsburgh and not against Anaheim? Wtf.

    Lucic had 53 points that year as well. Did you think he was a factor for Edmonton that year? Do you think he played well that 1st yesr?
    Judging a players performances based on his boxscores is easy, it’s just not always accurate.

  105. oilersfan says:

    Benning for Luke Glendenning makes a lot of sense

  106. hags9k says:

    I would stand pat on D with the exception of Russell. I would try to free that money.

    Keep Benning. Slow play the prospects, especially Bouchard who should see at least 40 games in the Bake.

    After the cull, refill the forward group with 2 free agent wingers of the best value possible. Expect only one of Benson or Morody to help next year. Let the rest marinade.

    Hire a coach who can install more defensive structure. See: Islanders, New York. The most pressing need is not more GF without 97 on ice, it is less GA across the board. With the right PK and a defense first buy in from the players, Koskinen will be an all-star.

    Keep JP, play the living shit out of him in the top 6 and PP until Xmas. Get everyone in a room and make a decision then what’s best for team and player. Craig and Kevin will know what to do. (kidding)

    Keep Sekera for the love of god! If we buy him out I’m done. (serious)

    Get good players, keep good players.

    Perron, Maroon, Eberle, Schultz all looking good out there, maybe we should start giving this loyalty thing more than lip service and keep our NHL caliber guys.

  107. jp says:

    Jaxon:
    I think we’re being way too optimistic about Persson. He’s 25 and scoring in a lesser league. There isn’t much room, biologically, for development at 25. There may be some room for improvement due to his lack of elite competition until the past two seasons, but I wouldn’t expect it to be much considering he hasn’t made a big jump this season over last season. Think Paigin, Belov, Larsen and the many other offensive D playing in lesser European leagues with more room on a bigger ice surface. Many can’t make the transition. Or even Joey Laleggia, who had higher NHLEs at a much younger age (32 in his draft+2 season, and 36 in draft+5). Paigin had an NHLE of 48 for Sochi before he came over. Belov had an NHLE of 37 before he came over. Maybe he’ll prove me wrong, but I wouldn’t be overly concerned with that bet.

    I agree we’re likely being too optimistic on him. That said, I think your two Russian comps deserve major asterisks.

    Paigin has never come close to replicating that run in Sochi, and in fact has played part of most seasons in the Russian AHL (VHL). He’s not even an established KHLer, never mind a high end one. Even in the VHL he’s only scored 0.5 PPG.

    Belov has been a KHLer for many years, but a 37 NHLE isn’t his established level. He had one other season where he scored 27 points, but he’s been between 5 and 16 points in each of his other 10 KHL seasons.

    Persson at least has consecutive seasons of NHLE over 30, and has clearly done it this year without being dragged along by elite teammates.

  108. YKOil says:

    who: I just don’t see him as a 3rd pairing dman.
    I see a 2nd pairing right shot dman who can skate, move the puck, and run a powerplay.
    Isn’t this the exact player Edmonton has been looking for?
    I also think he has better puck skills than Nurse.

    I have no issues with 4 x $5m, especially if my contract rules are followed. That said, I think some team is going to go 6 x $6m +/- and that takes a set of, extremely, team friendly terms for me to even consider.

    Contract rules (subject to circumstance):

    – declining balance Cash-to-Cap ratio
    – NMC only allowed year 1 for short contracts and years 1-2 for longer term contracts
    – NMC may last longer than 2 years but only if they do not interfere with trades
    – NTC not allowed in last year of short term contracts and last two years of longer contracts
    – short contracts is 3-4 years or less and long contracts is 4+ years (4th year leans either way)
    – strategic use of signing bonuses

    So a 4-yr contract for Myers that wouldn’t bother me at all, as I like the player for 2RHD over Russell, looks like so:

    yr
    1 .. $6.6m cash .. $5.0 cap .. $6.0m sb .. NMC
    2 .. $6.0m cash .. $5.0 cap .. $3.0m sb .. NMC
    3 .. $4.0m cash .. $5.0 cap .. $3.0m sb .. NMC/NTC 12 teams no trade
    4 .. $3.4m cash .. $5.0 cap .. $1.4m sb .. NMC/NTC 8 teams no trade

    This is trade-friendly in years 3 and 4 and if I am making this big a cash commitment I should be fine with 2 years NMC to start.

  109. YKOil says:

    JimmyV1965: I actually think Tampa might have interest in Russell. They only have two veteran dmen signed for next year and his contract might be appealing to them. Maybe we take a forward contract back like Palat at$5.3 mill. You might even be able to package Russell with Kassian for a real hockey trade.

    Tampa would want us to take Callahan over Palat methinks. If I had a 2RHD lined up I would consider it to be honest. May want a sweetener.

    The increase in Cap hit in year 1 sucks but dropping the whole Cap hit in year 2 matters.

    I see Gavel ending up in Tampa next year. Perfect #6/7 d-man for them given the cost.

  110. David says:

    who: I think you are overthinking this.
    McLeod goes to Bakersfield for the same reason Samarukov does. He actually has played 4 years of major junior, I believe.
    There is no reason to playa 5th. That is reserved for guys who don’t get drafted, or are drafted in the last few rounds. If he didn’t gain any offensive confidence this year I doubt he will gain much more as a 20 year old.
    He will start in Bakersfield, and probably play in the top 9.

    It’s not about gaining offensive confidence, it’s about keeping it.

    Most players play 2 seasons after their draft in junior, McLeod has only played one and he has yet to show that he can dominate junior.

  111. YKOil says:

    David:
    There is not a single realistic offer out there that could get me to move the 8th overall pick. Keep the pipeline pumping, build an organization that will be good for decades instead of scuttling our bottom to limp into the playoffs next year.

    I can think of a few where I would give up the pick out-right but none are just to the side of the line of realistic so… meh.

    On a trade-back-but-stay-in-the-1st-round basis there are a fair number of semi-realistic options, most involving dumping Lucic mostly out-right, so I would listen to all decent discussions in that case.

  112. dustrock says:

    Hard to figure out what the issue is with Turcotte, no clear explanation. Earlier it was said to be illness, not injury, but he hasn’t played in a while.

    I wonder if it’s mono?

    Geez, maybe his stock will slip a la Couturier and he’ll drop all the way to….8th?

  113. who says:

    David: It’s not about gaining offensive confidence, it’s about keeping it.

    Most players play 2 seasons after their draft in junior, McLeod has only played one and he has yet to show that he can dominate junior.

    All this is true but,
    1. There is a very good chance he doesn’t dominate junior as a 20 year old either. I bet the Oilers are projecting him as a 3C max, which is fine for a 40OV pick.
    2. People need to get this draft, draft + 1, draft plus 2, thing out of their heads. These players compete against kids born in their birth year from the time they start minor hockey. The only exception is at the NHL draft.
    McLeod should be compared to all the other kids from his birth year. All the high end guys, including McLeod, start major junior at 16 and play for 4 years. The fact that he was drafted a year later than most of these kids doesn’t change that fact. He’s had the same junior hockey expierience as the guys drafted the year before.

  114. incubo_nero says:

    godot10,

    If he wanted to stay in Edmonton at all costs, then yes, that list would be his strategy.

    But if we assume that he follows through on preparing a list in good faith, and believe that he wants to stay in the West, then the list looks very different and at least 4 suitable trade partners become a possibility, albeit sometimes with a non-linear return: Arizona, Vancouver, Dallas, Las Vegas. Example would be a package that involves Russell for Khudobin?

    I’m optimistic a hockey deal can be found.

  115. Pescador says:

    who: I think you are overthinking this.
    McLeod goes to Bakersfield for the same reason Samarukov does. He actually has played 4 years of major junior, I believe.
    There is no reason to playa 5th. That is reserved for guys who don’t get drafted, or are drafted in the last few rounds. If he didn’t gain any offensive confidence this year I doubt he will gain much more as a 20 year old.
    He will start in Bakersfield, and probably play in the top 9.

    Yes, especially if you factor in how rookie pros have been utilized under coach J.Woodcroft & how much success they have enjoyed.
    Looking forward to the potential D- core line up of:
    Jones – Bouchard
    Lagesson – Persson
    Samorukov – Bear

  116. godot10 says:

    Alpine:
    godot10,

    Well now he can get him back for not much in return, with his most expensive years in salary already paid out.

    Dallas doesn’t need Russell. Lindell and Heiskanen are the top two left D. And they have cheaper options for the third pairing, many of whom played well when their D was devastateg by injury this year.

  117. OriginalPouzar says:

    who: Samarukov will be 20 next year, an overager, with 3 years of OHL expierience. Coming off a huge year.
    Sending him back to junior makes no sense. Sending back to Europe, with a larger ice surface, makes even less sense.
    Both moves would be a step backward.
    Bakersfield is the correct destination, and the right timeline.

    100% agree – heading to the AHL next year is 100% in line with how these prospects are developed and what makes sense for Samorukov.

    I would posit we should be thinking 2 years of AHL time.

  118. RonnieB says:

    YKOil,

    There are 2 letters that sit right beside each other in the middle of the alphabet; together they spell a word that our last GM apparently never heard of, but i would like to believe that even Chia would have used it if asked to take on the Callahan contract.
    If we were to replace Russell with a different $4 million RHD, then trade Russell for Callahan, we would be adding $5.8 million to our Cap…not just $1.8.

  119. godot10 says:

    David:
    I would not send Samorukov back to junior.

    I would send McLeod back though.

    My philosophy is that any player you want to have offence in the NHL you have to put in offensive situations and keep their confidence up.

    McLeod could be a top line centre in junior, first power play unit player, put up big numbers (which he hasn’t really done yet) and be feeling great heading into the AHL the next year more prepared for it.

    Or he be shuffled around in the bottom six of what should be a strong Condors team next year, maybe playing some wing, maybe press box, unlikely to get much power play time, unlikely to have the stability of position and line mates that he will get in junior. He’ll likely not put up great numbers and his confidence will sag.

    A 2nd round draft pick who goes back to junior as an overager is pretty much a bust. The Condors are pretty bare at centre for next season.

  120. YKOil says:

    RonnieB:
    YKOil,
    There are 2 letters that sit right beside each other in the middle of the alphabet; together they spell a word that our last GM apparently never heard of, but i would like to believe that even Chia would have used it if asked to take on the Callahan contract.
    If we were to replace Russell with a different $4 million RHD, then trade Russell for Callahan, we would be adding $5.8 million to our Cap…not just $1.8.

    Whoever said I would take on another $4m RHD?

    Interesting, and disrespectful, way of putting words/thoughts on someone else’s accounts.

  121. Doug McLachlan says:

    With all the discussion/debate about the Oilers’ GM job, another “name” coach is off the board.

    https://www.tsn.ca/flyers-name-vigneault-head-coach-1.1291134

    Philly nabs Alain Vigneault. Not sure he was ever a realistic option for Edmonton (history of wanting a true number 1 between the pipes so I guess he’s pleased with Carter Hart – and why wouldn’t you be).

    So with Florida taking Coach Q and Philadelphia taking Vigneault who will be left for the Oilers once they have their GM?

    Looks almost certain that LA will select McLellan. I figure that Anaheim will promote Eakins from San Diego. The longer that St. Louis goes, the harder it is to see them going with anyone other than Berube.

    That leaves Buffalo, Ottawa and Edmonton plus any other coaches that don’t make it through the playoff expectations game. Could Cooper be on the block? I wouldn’t think so but this collapse has been nothing short of epic.

  122. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    LadiesloveSmid: Have you considered that he is tall?

    Whoa.

    Huge if true.

  123. dustrock says:

    Doug McLachlan,

    You would think having the best regular season in 20 years would give Cooper a bit of a lifeline. Would be absolutely flabbergasted if they let him go, but I’d give him all the money to come here, yes.

    Besides the drafting and cap management, Tampa’s PK & PP were a historically great combo this year.

    Cooper can say no healthy Hedman, no Kucherov for Game 3. It’s kind of like McLellan when the Sharks just couldn’t make the Finals, I don’t think there’s too much you can do in the playoffs to really counter that much. Either your players figure it out or they don’t.

    DeBoer is a great coach but Jones is terrible and San Jose’s defence has been pretty leaky, I dunno, do you fire DeBoer if they’re out in the first round?

  124. OriginalPouzar says:

    till_horcoff_is_coach:
    As a worst case, the new CBA next year shoukd have amnesty but outs and Lucic will undoubtedly be used for this. The question is if it is the oilers or another team to pay him. No need to throw futures out if it is only one more year of pain. Additionally, cap floor teams may be interested, so there will be ways after one more season to get the cap space back.

    Of course patience won’t be a strong selling point with the org right now, but no need to bleed out the team’s future just to save a year of pain

    From a few accounts, amnesty buyouts are far from a foregone conclusion – the circumstances surrounding their availability the last few times do not apply this time around (reduction in cap limit, change in HRR split).

    Also, I’m not 100% sure that Katz would be willing to pony up for that buyout.

  125. godot10 says:

    OriginalPouzar: From a few accounts, amnesty buyouts are far from a foregone conclusion – the circumstances surrounding their availability the last few times do not apply this time around (reduction in cap limit, change in HRR split).

    Also, I’m not 100% sure that Katz would be willing to pony up for that buyout.

    Katz is paying Lucic no matter what. Why would he balk at an amnesty buyout, which provides cap relief and no additional outlay of dollars?

  126. RonnieB says:

    YKOil: Whoever said I would take on another $4m RHD?

    Interesting, and disrespectful, way of putting words/thoughts on someone else’s accounts.

    You said ” If i had a 2RHD lined up i would consider it..”.

    My assumption is that a 2RHD would carry a Cap hit in the $4 million neighbourhood.

    I apologize for the disrespect. I can understand where you would see it that way, although i only intended it as a counterpoint.

  127. OriginalPouzar says:

    David:
    I would not send Samorukov back to junior.

    I would send McLeod back though.

    My philosophy is that any player you want to have offence in the NHL you have to put in offensive situations and keep their confidence up.

    McLeod could be a top line centre in junior, first power play unit player, put up big numbers (which he hasn’t really done yet) and be feeling great heading into the AHL the next year more prepared for it.

    Or he be shuffled around in the bottom six of what should be a strong Condors team next year, maybe playing some wing, maybe press box, unlikely to get much power play time, unlikely to have the stability of position and line mates that he will get in junior. He’ll likely not put up great numbers and his confidence will sag.

    McLeod should be in the AHL next year, in my opinion.

    There are very few circumstances where junior is better for a 20 year old’s development than the AHL and a very legit although non-elite prospect like McLeod is meant to go to the AHL. We should think of it as a 2-year or so AHL development path for a 2nd round pick.

  128. JOFA says:

    Pescador: Yes, especially if you factor in how rookie pros have been utilized under coach J.Woodcroft & how much success they have enjoyed.
    Looking forward to the potential D- core line up of:
    Jones – Bouchard
    Lagesson – Persson
    Samorukov – Bear

    I like it too. I’m guessing Jones will be up in the big league.

  129. David says:

    who: All this is true but,
    1. There is a very good chance he doesn’t dominate junior as a 20 year old either. I bet the Oilers are projecting him as a 3C max, which is fine for a 40OV pick.
    2. People need to get this draft, draft + 1, draft plus 2, thing out of their heads. These players compete against kids born in their birth year from the time they start minor hockey. The only exception is at the NHL draft.
    McLeod should be compared to all the other kids from his birth year.All the high end guys, including McLeod, start major junior at 16 and play for 4 years. The fact that he was drafted a year later than most of these kids doesn’t change that fact. He’s had the same junior hockey expierience as the guys drafted the year before.

    Ideally a future 3C in the NHL will have excellent junior numbers.

    I don’t really buy into the argument of birth year over draft class. If you believe that a handful of months makes a big difference then you have to apply that to the older players like McLeod as well. Think of him as a “super young” player from the draft prior to his. Always younger than everyone else.

    My original point was that I believe in putting players that I hope to contribute offensively in the NHL in offensive situations. Marody, who we hope can be a 3C next year (or the one after that), is the first line centre in the AHL, getting the minutes, opportunity, and line mates, and putting up huge numbers.

    I don’t want to see McLeod play 10 minutes a night and put up 25-30 points in the AHL next year when he could play 20 mins a night and put up 90+ in junior. Then when he moves into the AHL the next season maybe he can move straight to a second line centre who can put up 45+ points. This keeps him offensively minded and confident instead of training him how to be a nothing minutes 4th liner.

  130. OriginalPouzar says:

    Pescador: Yes, especially if you factor in how rookie pros have been utilized under coach J.Woodcroft & how much success they have enjoyed.
    Looking forward to the potential D- core line up of:
    Jones – Bouchard
    Lagesson – Persson
    Samorukov – Bear

    One of Jones, Bear and Lagesson will likely be in the NHL and it will likely be Jones (who has played the right side almost exclusively as a pro).

    Keegan Lowe will be a Condor (he’s the captain and signed for next year) and Logan Day has earned himself a contract as well – which he may or may not get).

    Vincent Deharnais may be signed but he could be headed to the ECHL as well.

  131. David says:

    godot10: A 2nd round draft pick who goes back to junior as an overager is pretty much a bust. The Condors are pretty bare at centre for next season.

    My point is that most 2nd round picks do go back to junior for 2 years after being drafted. McLeod is sitting at one post draft season.

  132. David says:

    godot10: A 2nd round draft pick who goes back to junior as an overager is pretty much a bust. The Condors are pretty bare at centre for next season.

    Most 2nd round picks do go back to junior for 2 years after being drafted. McLeod is sitting at one post draft season.

  133. JOFA says:

    Kadri gone for series😊

  134. ArmchairGM says:

    dustrock:
    Hard to figure out what the issue is with Turcotte, no clear explanation.Earlier it was said to be illness, not injury, but he hasn’t played in a while.

    I wonder if it’s mono?

    Geez, maybe his stock will slip a la Couturier and he’ll drop all the way to….8th?

    I’ve never prayed for anyone to get (or stay) sick, but maybe it’s time to start. 😉

  135. pts2pndr says:

    who: I would take Myers for 4 years at 5 million all day long. Sounds like pretty good value, and not much risk,to me.
    I think he’s going to get more money and term than that.

    No risk to you, so bon voyage and don’t let that anchor bother you. There is a reason when the Winnipeg D is healthy Myers plays third pairing.

  136. ArmchairGM says:

    JOFA:
    Kadri gone for series

    Meanwhile DeBrusk won’t miss a minute.

  137. pts2pndr says:

    OriginalPouzar: From a few accounts, amnesty buyouts are far from a foregone conclusion – the circumstances surrounding their availability the last few times do not apply this time around (reduction in cap limit, change in HRR split).

    Also, I’m not 100% sure that Katz would be willing to pony up for that buyout.

    Would it not be prudent to wait? This could be a defining moment re success or failure. Waiting costs little as we can healthy scratch him or play him on the fourth line rather than make another team look brilliant and for us the dunce cap award. There will be a number of teams in somewhat of a similar position as ours. We can throw good money after bad or wait one year where even if things stay the same we have a much better idea on how best to proceed.

  138. Bulging Twine says:

    LadiesloveSmid: Have you considered that he is tall?

    Woodguy v2.0: Whoa.

    Huge if true.

    If only there were a way to verify statements like this

  139. Bulging Twine says:

    Maksimov may be eliminated tonight. Down 3 games to 2

  140. pts2pndr says:

    Pescador: Yes, especially if you factor in how rookie pros have been utilized under coach J.Woodcroft & how much success they have enjoyed.
    Looking forward to the potential D- core line up of:
    Jones – Bouchard
    Lagesson – Persson
    Samorukov – Bear

    Smart money might have Bouchard with Samorukov for half a season or so. They could develope better with less pressure and develope chemistry. I think the Oilers have Bouchard penciled into next years NHL roster. Culture?

  141. who says:

    pts2pndr: No risk to you, so bon voyage and don’t let that anchor bother you. There is a reason when the Winnipeg D is healthy Myers plays third pairing.

    Yeah. That reason is Winnipeg has 2 other righty dmen that most would consider 1st pairing guys.
    Does that make Myers a poorer player?

  142. ArmchairGM says:

    Bulging Twine:
    Maksimov may be eliminated tonight.Down 3 games to 2

    Hope he has a ticket to California and his bags packed. His post-season will continue, just not in Ontario.

  143. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    who: Yeah. That reason is Winnipeg has 2 other righty dmen that most would consider 1st pairing guys.
    Does that make Myers a poorer player?

    No, the fact that Myer’s plays behind Trouba and Byfuglien doesn’t make him a poorer player.

    His mediocre to poor results while being in a 3rd pair role for the last 2 years indicate that he isn’t a top 4 talent anymore.

    The last time his results showed “Top 4 talent” were 15/16 imo.

    Then he had surgery on his knee(s) and hip and he really hasn’t been top 4 quality since.

    Injuries derail a lot of careers.

  144. Lowetide says:

    jtblack: Apologies LT.

    with that said, it brings up a conversation that should be had over a whiskey and a fire about“Reputable sources” when talking about the Oilers media sources …… 🙂

    Lol. Deal. 🙂

  145. npanciroli says:

    JOFA,

    Justice prevails.

  146. OriginalPouzar says:

    David: My point is that most 2nd round picks do go back to junior for 2 years after being drafted. McLeod is sitting at one post draft season.

    but not for an over-age 20 year old season when they are eligible for the AHL.

    They go back for draft plus 2 when they are still too young to be AHL eligible – like Nurse.

  147. OriginalPouzar says:

    pts2pndr: Would it not be prudent to wait? This could be a defining moment re success or failure. Waiting costs little as we can healthy scratch him or play him on the fourth line rather than make another team look brilliant and for us the dunce cap award. There will be a number of teams in somewhat of a similar position as ours. We can throw good money after bad or wait one year where even if things stay the same we have a much better idea on how best to proceed.

    Oh, a normal course buyout is an absolute non-option to me except in one circumstance – on the eve of the expansion draft if Lucic wouldn’t waive his NMC meaning we’d need to protect him -then he’d need to be bought out in order to not take up an important protected slot.

  148. OriginalPouzar says:

    pts2pndr: Smart money might have Bouchard with Samorukov for half a season or so. They could develope better with less pressure and develope chemistry. I think the Oilers have Bouchard penciled into next years NHL roster. Culture?

    Given Nicholson’s verbal about prospects in the AHL for longer and using Bouchard as an express example, I’m not so sure they do.

    Given Persson, Bear and Jones all potentially NHL read on the right side (yes, Jones has played the right side almost exclusively as a pro), there is zero reason to put Bouchard in the NHL. Nothing he does in camp or preseason can show NHL readiness – the only thing he can do at this point to “prove” NHL readiness over any of those prospects is perform in the AHL.

  149. YKOil says:

    RonnieB: You said ” If i had a 2RHD lined up i would consider it..”.

    My assumption is that a 2RHD would carry a Cap hit in the $4 million neighbourhood.

    I apologize for the disrespect. I can understand where you would see it that way, although i only intended it as a counterpoint.

    Thank-you for that.

    Almost every move made is done in context with other moves. A rare exception would be something like dealing Lucic wherein many, many options present themself for filling his roster spot and any move of Lucic is self-explanatory – the new cash-to-cap number is better than the old cash-to-cap number.

    For a Callahan move there are several options (not an exhaustive list):

    – the trade itself is relatively painless, Tampa just wants Russell’s versatility to play both sides

    —– is willing to trade Callahan for Russell and Manning (binning Manning in the minors)
    —– Tampa is still ahead with Russell and saves some $600k in Cap
    —– Edmonton is only out $600k in Cap and has room to add

    – 2019-20 is a year of transition – Persson is the new RHD

    —– Oilers use the Cap space to fill forward spots (Donskoi, Paajarvi, etc)
    —– Defense improves because forwards improve.

    – 2019-20 is a year of pain – Benning moves up, Bear moves up and Oilers play through

    —– Oilers do this because 2020-21 is the target year for a big-step forward
    —– Sekera is slated to be moved at the 2019-20 trade deadline or off-season prior to 2020-21
    —– Oilers WILL pay a big price to dump Lucic in the same time-frames
    —– the pain brings one last lottery draft pick (probably) but
    —– the pain also brings $18m+ in Cap space for 2020-21 off-season

    That last one is interesting. The year of pain. Not a hard thing to see happening to tell you the truth, circumstances could push this last option.

  150. YKOil says:

    OriginalPouzar: Oh, a normal course buyout is an absolute non-option to me except in one circumstance – on the eve of the expansion draft if Lucic wouldn’t waive his NMC meaning we’d need to protect him -then he’d need to be bought out in order to not take up an important protected slot.

    If we need the spot, agreed 100%

  151. oilersfan says:

    For all the talk about over ripening prospects And how the oilers let players play too young, why does nobody mention that Brandon Carlo played one year after he was drafted and so did Charlie Mcavoy. Jake de brusk 1.5 years after.

    Maybe it’s not the development as much as how good the players are

  152. oilersfan says:

    Luke Glendenning is the hard target

    Check your fancies oilers fans

    He would
    Move their PK from 31 to 20 just by winning all the face offs

  153. David says:

    OriginalPouzar: but not for an over-age 20 year old season when they are eligible for the AHL.

    They go back for draft plus 2 when they are still too young to be AHL eligible – like Nurse.

    I think for players like McLeod that have not dominated junior they should follow their draft class and play a second year in junior.

  154. oilersfan says:

    I agree with David. Pitlick and Hamilton should have stayed in the ahl an extra year. McLeod could use another year to boost his offensive confidence. Look at San Jose’s Kevin Labanc.

    Glendening for Benning would really help the oilers PK next year.

  155. Magnus says:

    Lowetide, not trying to be a jerk, but you’ve been using the word matriculate for years now and I don’t think it means what you think it means. The definition of matriculate is to be enrolled. As in to enroll in college. Not sure what you’re thinking it means, but describing players as enrolling doesn’t make much sense.

  156. who says:

    Woodguy v2.0: No, the fact that Myer’s plays behind Trouba and Byfuglien doesn’t make him a poorer player.

    His mediocre to poor results while being in a 3rd pair role for the last 2 years indicate that he isn’t a top 4 talent anymore.

    The last time his results showed “Top 4 talent” were 15/16 imo.

    Then he had surgery on his knee(s) and hip and he really hasn’t been top 4 quality since.

    Injuries derail a lot of careers.

    Yeah, I don’t think past injuries are a problem with him. Unless you are seeing something in his skating that I am not. His mobility looks just fine to me.
    Not sure what results you are referring to, but I would be comfortable with Myers at 4 years for 5 million. Especially if we can move Sekera..Think he would fill that hole at 2RD quite nicely.. I also think he might end up running the PP here.
    My one concern would be future injury. Is he more susceptible due to past surgeries? Don’t know how you know til you know..

  157. Glovjuice says:

    Bulging Twine:
    It’s going to be very interesting to see how all these players who are moving up a league do next year.

    Benson, McLeod, Maksimov.Does Marody gain a step and play in the NHL?

    Marody won’t make the NHL.

  158. Jaxon says:

    Trivia tidbit: no team has ever won the Stanley Cup in the same year they won their first President’s Trophy.

    Oilers 2nd
    Flames 2nd
    Rangers 2nd
    Stars 2nd
    Avalanche 2nd
    Red Wings 3rd
    Red Wings 6th
    Blackhawks 2nd

  159. OriginalPouzar says:

    David: I think for players like McLeod that have not dominated junior they should follow their draft class and play a second year in junior.

    I disagree for a player that has pedigree and is AHL eligible.

    In my mind the AHL is far superior for his development than the CHL.

  160. Pescador says:

    oilersfan:
    For all the talk about over ripening prospects And how the oilers let players play too young, why does nobody mention that Brandon Carlo played one year after he was drafted and so did Charlie Mcavoy. Jake de brusk 1.5 years after.

    Maybe it’s not the development as much as how good the players are

    Every player is different and should be handled accordingly.
    There is no perfect model
    Just a lot of potential mistakes and the Oilers make them repeatedly

  161. jimmers2 says:

    Magnus,

    Phil Kemp is currently enrolled at Yale, isn’t he?

  162. OriginalPouzar says:

    Right – not being an elite skater prohibits any player from making the NHL – even one that scored over a PPG as a 21 year old rookie pro.

  163. pts2pndr says:

    oilersfan:
    pts2pndr,

    i added to my post earlier….trade Russell for nothing, trade a second for Colin Miller.

    That could work.

  164. Oilman99 says:

    Bulging Twine: If Makar is all they say he is they will have Johnson, Barrie, Makar and Girard at RD.

    I would agree that Barrie would have to be extended before that trade is made.But what would his extension come in at?
    Krebs for Barrie?18 year old for a 28 year old.Steep price.
    Also, you have an Offensive RD coming and we need offensive FW’s.
    Barrie would be nice though!

    Based on the number of minutes Barrie is playing per game, there is no hope in hell Colorado would trade him.

  165. Pescador says:

    OriginalPouzar: One of Jones, Bear and Lagesson will likely be in the NHL and it will likely be Jones (who has played the right side almost exclusively as a pro).

    Keegan Lowe will be a Condor (he’s the captain and signed for next year) and Logan Day has earned himself a contract as well – which he may or may not get).

    Vincent Deharnais may be signed but he could be headed to the ECHL as well.

    Keegan Lowe is no longer a prospect & should be traded.
    Why would you block the progress of actual, material NHL prospects to give KLowe ice time?
    If the Oilers manage to Russell and the plan is to replace his minutes with one of Lagesson or Jones that would be folly.
    Currently there is not a spot for either in the top 6, let alone Bear

  166. Oilman99 says:

    ArmchairGM: Meanwhile DeBrusk won’t miss a minute.

    Watch the replay, it was an unintentional knee on knee, DeBrusk actually lifts his leg to try to miss contacting Kadri. Kadri’s hit was an intentional attempt to injure, the suspension should be longer.

  167. Oilman99 says:

    oilersfan:
    For all the talk about over ripening prospects And how the oilers let players play too young, why does nobody mention that Brandon Carlo played one year after he was drafted and so did Charlie Mcavoy. Jake de brusk 1.5 years after.

    Maybe it’s not the development as much as how good the players are

    Over ripening is BS, if the player is ready , put where he should be, in the NHL.

  168. Pescador says:

    JOFA: I like it too. I’m guessing Jones will be up in thebig league.

    I certainly loved what I saw from him when he was up with the big club. Lord knows the Oilers need more puck movers.
    Last summer there were a number of posters suggesting the same NHL roster spot out of training camp for Bear.
    Prospects & straight lines don’t agree
    Or something

  169. Rich M says:

    Magnus:
    Lowetide, not trying to be a jerk, but you’ve been using the word matriculate for years now and I don’t think it means what you think it means. The definition of matriculate is to be enrolled. As in to enroll in college. Not sure what you’re thinking it means, but describing players as enrolling doesn’t make much sense.

    Hank Stram says hi (from beyond the grave of course).

  170. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    OriginalPouzar: there is zero reason to put Bouchard in the NHL. Nothing he does in camp or preseason can show NHL readiness – the only thing he can do at this point to “prove” NHL readiness over any of those prospects is perform in the AHL.

    OriginalPouzar: I disagree for a player that has pedigree and is AHL eligible.

    In my mind the AHL is far superior for his development than the CHL.

    So Bouchard has to “prove it” to get an opportunity to make the jump to the NHL, but for McLeod “pedigree” is all that is required to make the jump to the AHL. Hmm. I think there is a bit more to it than that. This kind of reasoning is precisely why Oiler player development has been and continues to be such a shitshow.

  171. OriginalPouzar says:

    Niagara eliminates – Maksimov likely on his way to the Condors soon which is going to be awesome.

  172. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Oilman99: Over ripening is BS, if the player is ready , put where he should be, in the NHL.

    Yes. It’s called player development and asset management. You don’t purposely rush them (presumably because of need) and you don’t intentionally retard them.

  173. Buddy says:

    Just watched the highlights from the women’s US-Finland final. What a joke.

    Only way that is goalie interference is if that’s an Oiler scoring on an American team in the playoffs and Bettman is in the war room. That’s the only circumstance.

  174. pts2pndr says:

    OriginalPouzar: Given Nicholson’s verbal about prospects in the AHL for longer and using Bouchard as an express example, I’m not so sure they do.

    Given Persson, Bear and Jones all potentially NHL read on the right side (yes, Jones has played the right side almost exclusively as a pro), there is zero reason to put Bouchard in the NHL.Nothing he does in camp or preseason can show NHL readiness – the only thing he can do at this point to “prove” NHL readiness over any of those prospects is perform in the AHL.

    I agree, which is why I am of the belief he should be given a min of half a season in the ahl. If he blows the doors off in the half season the team could decide to bring him up to the big club. Giving him time to adjust to pro hockey and play lots of minutes with less pressure makes sense. There is no need to rush Bouchard.

  175. Gerta Rauss says:

    YKOil: That last one is interesting. The year of pain. Not a hard thing to see happening to tell you the truth, circumstances could push this last option.

    Tell that to Captain Janeway

  176. pts2pndr says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan:
    So Bouchard has to “prove it” to get an opportunity to make the jump to the NHL, but for McLeod “pedigree” is all that is required to make the jump to the AHL. Hmm. I think there is a bit more to it than that. This kind of reasoning is precisely why Oiler player development has been and continues to be such a shitshow.

    Not that OP needs help but you are aurgueing apples and oranges. Both players are playing in the OHL. They are now both elligible to play in the ahl and that is where op says they should play. How is that different?

  177. OriginalPouzar says:

    Pescador: Keegan Lowe is no longer a prospect & should be traded.
    Why would you block the progress of actual, material NHL prospects to give KLowe ice time?
    If the Oilers manage to Russell and the plan is to replace his minutes with one of Lagesson or Jones that would be folly.
    Currently there is not a spot for either in the top 6, let alone Bear

    Team success is also important to developing players. A winning environment is quite helpful.

    Keegan Lowe is important for team success and I would posit that it’s a poor idea to have all 6 every day dmen at 22 and under. At least one “AHL veteran” is important.

  178. Bulging Twine says:

    Oh wow Makar scores in his first game. This kids hype is skyrocketing!

  179. Ice Sage says:

    Real shame about the flames so afar this game. Real shame.

  180. Bulging Twine says:

    Flames resemble pylons right now. They can’t handle Colorado’s movement.

  181. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    pts2pndr: Not that OP needs help but you are aurgueing apples and oranges. Both players are playing in the OHL. They are now both elligible to play in the ahl and that is where op says they should play. How is that different?

    In one case he argues promotion should be based on pedigree, not merit. Then he proceeds to argue exactly the opposite in the next case. So which is it. It sounds kind of like making it up as you go. Don’t get me wrong, that’s certainly an option … the Oil have been using it for years. It just doesn’t work very well.

  182. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Ice Sage:
    Real shame about the flames so afar this game. Real shame.

    I know

    Can barely type I’m so shook up

  183. Scungilli Slushy says:

    One thing that makes McLeod’s placement less clear is he has a NHL tool kit, now and had it last year, outside of offense, which is the concern that was noted on draft day.

    If it wasn’t he’d have been a top 5 with that size, speed and defensive awareness

    It is possible he may play better at the AHL level than with teenagers. He showed really well at camp.

    It’s true every player is unique and the best plan for the player should be the deciding factor.

  184. OriginalPouzar says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan:
    So Bouchard has to “prove it” to get an opportunity to make the jump to the NHL, but for McLeod “pedigree” is all that is required to make the jump to the AHL. Hmm. I think there is a bit more to it than that. This kind of reasoning is precisely why Oiler player development has been and continues to be such a shitshow.

    What?

    There is nothing to gain from McLeod going back to junior as an overager. He’s 20 now and it’s time to make the jump to pro hockey and the AHL – it’s time to learn the pro game and play against men. Dominating Kids as an overager will do little for his development.

    For Bouchard, there is plenty to learn in the AHL as a rookie pro and that is the natural progression step. Just like the AHL is the natural progression step for McLeod.

    Camp and exhibition success for young and high talent prospect means nothing as far as NHL readiness – we have seen that year after year after year – Puljujarvi and Yamamoto and Bouchard himself are great examples.

    He may be NHL ready but the jump from the CHL to the AHL is huge let alone the NHL. I have little doubt Bouchard will excel on exhibition – he’ll produce and look great in transition but it means nothing as far as ready for regular season NHL hockey. There are 3-4 dmen in the org who have been developing in pro hockey and succeeding at the highest non NHL levels – the org has the opportunity to be low risk with their most important prospect and let him prove he’s NHL ready.

    Yes, one needs to prove NHL readiness and the same doesn’t really apply to AHL readiness for a 20 year old.

  185. Derek says:

    That Ovi-Svechnikov fight was a poor decision by the kid.

    Lordy.

  186. Pretendergast says:

    Poor taste by Ovi imo. wants to spark his team so he beats up a teenager. Kid just wants to fit in the league, Ovi knows better.

  187. Derek says:

    Pretendergast:
    Poor taste by Ovi imo. wants to spark his team so he beats up a teenager. Kid just wants to fit in the league, Ovi knows better.

    Yea, I suppose you could look at it that way. But the kid crosschecks him 3 or 4 times and asks for the fight.

    Hopefully a lesson is learned and Svenchnikov is ok.

  188. Derek says:

    Mike Smith is one more GA away from a meltdown, this could get good.

  189. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    OriginalPouzar: What?

    There is nothing to gain from McLeod going back to junior as an overager.He’s 20 now and it’s time to make the jump to pro hockey and the AHL – it’s time to learn the pro game and play against men.Dominating Kids as an overager will do little for his development.

    For Bouchard, there is plenty to learn in the AHL as a rookie pro and that is the natural progression step.Just like the AHL is the natural progression step for McLeod.

    Camp and exhibition success for young and high talent prospect means nothing as far as NHL readiness – we have seen that year after year after year – Puljujarvi and Yamamoto and Bouchard himself are great examples.

    He may be NHL ready but the jump from the CHL to the AHL is huge let alone the NHL. I have little doubt Bouchard will excel on exhibition – he’ll produce and look great in transition but it means nothing as far as ready for regular season NHL hockey.There are 3-4 dmen in the org who have been developing in pro hockey and succeeding at the highest non NHL levels – the org has the opportunity to be low risk with their most important prospect and let him prove he’s NHL ready.

    Yes, one needs to prove NHL readiness and the same doesn’t really apply to AHL readiness for a 20 year old.

    If Bouchard is NHL ready then he is NHL ready. Period. No bullshit rationalization. I don’t care about his age, where he last played, who is on the NHL roster, or who might have toiled in the AHL ahead of him and may be ready as well. Manage the fucking assets and the player development properly. That’s in the GM job description, no?

    The same goes for McLeod. If he has not dominated his competition and could benefit returning to the CHL, then fine, leave him where he is. I don’t really care where he was drafted, how old he is, that it’s his draft plus whatever year, or how desperate the big club is for forward talent.

  190. flyfish1168 says:

    I love to share the golf course with the calgary phlegms by the end of the week. It is lonely out here without them

  191. Pescador says:

    OriginalPouzar: Team success is also important to developing players.A winning environment is quite helpful.

    Keegan Lowe is important for team success and I would posit that it’s a poor idea to have all 6 every day dmen at 22 and under.At least one “AHL veteran” is important.

    Persson will be 25,
    Although we disagree,
    I appreciate the debate and I respect your opinion.
    It’s the AHL, I say play the kids.

  192. digger50 says:

    The best potential internal solution for next year is still Jessie P.

    It would be something to see a new coach unlock his potential.

  193. pts2pndr says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan: In one case he argues promotion should be based on pedigree, not merit. Then he proceeds to argue exactly the opposite in the next case. So which is it. It sounds kind of like making it up as you go. Don’t get me wrong, that’s certainly an option … the Oil have been using it for years. It just doesn’t work very well.

    I think what he is saying is that first round draft choices are often fast tracked. I understandthe premise but don’t necesarily agree. I do agree that keeing a prospect in junior for their overage year is generaly not a good idea.

  194. YKOil says:

    RonnieB: You said ” If i had a 2RHD lined up i would consider it..”.

    My assumption is that a 2RHD would carry a Cap hit in the $4 million neighbourhood.

    I apologize for the disrespect. I can understand where you would see it that way, although i only intended it as a counterpoint.

    You know, I never did mention another RHD. Given the Cap implications, there are four options:

    1. internal – Jones, Bear, etc
    2. trade for a mid-level player – Pysyk types
    3. sign 1-yr UFA veteran – Girardi, Lovejoy
    4. devote Cap resources to RHD at expense of other positions (Stralman for 2 years, Myers for 4 years, etc.)

    Reading #4 I hope you get the idea that in options #1-3 resources are used to upgrade other positions and in doing so the defense gets better because it is pressured less.

    Not great choices but the idea was that it was about moving on from Russell. Of the three Cap issues we have:

    In best-to-worstorder of usefulness and how much I like what they bring to the table (imo):

    – Sekera, Russell, Lucic,

    In worst-to-best order of the pressure actually put on the Cap versus what they bring to the table (imo):

    – Lucic, Sekera, Russell

    The Lucic contract is the issue, just is.

  195. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    pts2pndr: I think what he is saying is that first round draft choices are often fast tracked. I understandthe premise but don’t necesarily agree. I do agree that keeing a prospect in junior for their overage year is generaly not a good idea.

    Player development should be extremely player specific. We should not be talking about most players but about this particular player. Maybe he fits with the “most players” narrative but what if he doesn’t? Yes JP, I’m talking about you. And Brandon Carlo and many others. When management falls back on generalities and if/then logic, then they are relinquishing their management responsibility. You or OP or I can do just as well developing players if we are just following a script.

    OP may be right on both these guys, I have no idea. I just think the thought process on how he gets there is problematic.

  196. OriginalPouzar says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan: If Bouchard is NHL ready then he is NHL ready. Period. No bullshit rationalization. I don’t care about his age, where he last played, who is on the NHL roster, or who might have toiled in the AHL ahead of him and may be ready as well. Manage the fucking assets and the player development properly. That’s in the GM job description, no?

    The same goes for McLeod. If he has not dominated his competition and could benefit returning to the CHL, then fine, leave him where he is. I don’t really care where he was drafted, how old he is, that it’s his draft plus whatever year, or how desperate the big club is for forward talent.

    Agreed – if Bouchard is NHL ready he is NHL ready.

    The thing is there is nothing that can be done by him in preseason to show that he is NHL ready. He can produce at a PPG and make wonderful Oiler passes while looking like our top dman – that would mean nothing as far as NHL readiness. We’ve seen top performances by kids in exhibition, year after year after year, from kids that have proven once the regular season starts are not NHL ready. It’s unfortunate but there is nothing Bouchard can do on camp to prove it.

    The best he can do is go to the AHL, which is likely the proper league on any event, learn the pro game and show he’s too good for that league.

    Given the org has 3-4 dmen who have been developing in top pro leagues and succeeding – showing in pro to be on the verge of NHL readiness, there is no reason to risk stunting or delaying Bouchard’s development by throwing him to the NHL as a rookie pro.

    It is a very rare case when a solid prospect like McLeod coming off an OK year would be better served in junior than the AHL as a 20 plus year old. He didn’t crater this past year, he didn’t miss 3/4 of the year with injury – he performed all right in a secondary role on a strong team with lots of offensive options ahead of him.

  197. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Pretendergast:
    Poor taste by Ovi imo. wants to spark his team so he beats up a teenager. Kid just wants to fit in the league, Ovi knows better.

    At one time he was a vicious head hunter that went unpunished. Absolute cheap and late shots with malice, few penalties.

    IMO a filthy selfish player that can score goals at a league historic rate. I’m not sure much else will ever be said about him other than the goals. And the Cup where he decided to play a full game and they actually won.

    I wouldn’t hold him up as a role model or anything.

  198. Nit64 says:

    Magnus:
    Lowetide, not trying to be a jerk, but you’ve been using the word matriculate for years now and I don’t think it means what you think it means. The definition of matriculate is to be enrolled. As in to enroll in college. Not sure what you’re thinking it means, but describing players as enrolling doesn’t make much sense.

    Usage around the world varies from enrollment to entrance exams to high school certificates.

    u of alberta: Matriculation is the achievement of a minimum level of academic
    preparation that would allow a prospective student to undertake and successfully
    complete a particular university degree.

    u of calgary: “The basic general admission requirement to the University is Alberta Grade XII senior matriculation or equivalent with required standing in five appropriate subjects with no grade below 50.”

    dalhousie: “For the purposes of this rule junior matriculation means Nova Scotia grade 11 or equivalent, and senior matriculation means Nova Scotia grade 12 or equivalent.”

    Canadian Journal of Higher Education: “Every university in Canada has provision for admitting non-matriculated adult students”

    wikipedia: “Matriculation is the formal process of entering a university, or of becoming eligible to enter by fulfilling certain academic requirements such as a matriculation examination.”

    Live and Learn, eh? 😉

    The metaphor LT is employing is a prospect graduating from a program of apprenticeship to stable enrollment in the NHL. I don’t recall how many games LT uses for his cutoff. For NHL prospects the big complex milestone is becoming waiver eligible.

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