The QMJHL, Russia and the 2019 draft

The Edmonton Oilers signed Olivier Rodrigue yesterday, he is the fourth goaltender drafted by the organization from the QMJHL since 2000. The Quebec league and the Oilers haven’t done business much in the last 15 years, but there is quality there this season.

Russia is such an interesting subject for the Oilers, now that Ken Holland is the general manager. A franchise that cannot unlock the Russian hockey player has just hired a man who is trusted by Russian hockey players. It is going to be an interesting journey.

THE ATHLETIC!

The Athletic Edmonton features a fabulous cluster of stories (some linked below, some on the site). Great perspective from a ridiculous group of writers and analysts. Proud to be part of the group. INSANE OFFER IS HERE!

  • New Jonathan Willis: Why Ken Holland’s worst years in Detroit tell us the most about how he’ll fare in Edmonton
  • New Jonathan Willis: Three offseason scenarios and how each one would affect the Oilers salary cap
  • New Lowetide: Examining the Oilers’ goaltending options in free agency.
  • Lowetide: Ken Holland’s Oilers could go the high octane procurement route but will need a driver
  • Lowetide: How much can Connor Brown help the Oilers?
  • Lowetide: Dmitri Samorukov is off to the Memorial Cup and is the Oilers’ fastest rising prospect
  • Jonathan Willis: Craig MacTavish leaves the Oilers, signalling the first major front office change under Ken Holland
  • Lowetide: What kind of coach should Ken Holland hire for the Oilers?
  • Jonathan Willis: Every Oilers AHL prospect, rated by how close they are to the NHL
  • Jonathan Willis: A resurgent Andrej Sekera gives the Oilers much-needed defensive options
  • Lowetide: Is Joe Gambardella destined to become the Oilers’ next Fernando Pisani?
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: Protector, supporter, confidant: Connor McDavid’s mom, Kelly, is his off-ice rock through good times and bad
  • Lowetide: An offseason plan for Ken Holland to remodel the Oilers roster.
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: Ken Holland steadfast that buck stops with him as new Oilers GM.
  • Lowetide: How will Ken Holland proceed in Year 1 as Oilers general manager?
  • Jonathan Willis: What does the arrival of Ken Holland mean for the Oilers coaching search?
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: Prioritizing the roster issues that await Ken Holland in Edmonton.
  • Lowetide: Ken Holland’s procurement list for his rumored move to Edmonton will include front-office personnel
  • Jonathan Willis: A Milan Lucic trade is at the top of the to-do list for the Oilers’ next GM.

THE FINAL 2019 QMJHL LIST

1 L Jakob Pelletier, Moncton (QMJHL). Undersized skill winger with two-way ability. Intelligent, consistent and creative, great skater. Impressive production (39-50-89 in 65 games), including 5-on-5 (65, 27-28-55).

2 RC Raphael Lavoie, Halifax Mooseheads (QMJHL). Adam Sherren: “Lavoie is a big physical force who is that old fashioned power forward.” He is a strong skater and has a goal-scorer’s touch. Aggressive, a force.

3 R Nathan Légaré, Baie Comeau Drakkar (QMJHL). Power winger who can score goals, he can find open ice and cash (45 goals in 68 games) and drives to the net with abandon.

4 R Maxim Cajkovic, Saint John (QMJHL). Fantastic skater has impressive potential, played for a poor team that limited opportunity. His offensive output is miles behind his potential ala Peyton Krebs.

5 L Samuel Poulin, Sherbrooke Phoenix (QMJHL). Smart, two-way player who delivers a heavy game, speed is just okay. He can fend off defenders while buying time to find an outlet, and then deliver a quality pass.

6 LC Nikita Alexandrov, Charlottetown (QMJHL). Skill center who can impact the game as a passer or scorer. Good balance, he is aggressive and can make exceptional skill plays. Lacks consistency.

7 LD Sam Bolduc, Blainville-Boisbriand (QMJHL). Big defenseman with good speed and two-way ability. I might have him underrated here.

8 LD Artemi Knyazev, Chicoutimi (QMJHL). Two-way defenseman, he is a quality skater. Makes good passes, has puck moving ability.

9 G Colten Ellis, Rimouski (QMJHL). Has posted two quality seasons in a row, with SP’s of .913 and .910 in two consecutive seasons. It’s more rare than you’d think.

10 LD Maxence Guenette, Val d’Or (QMJHL). Smart two-way defenseman, he improved markedly offensively this season. I’m surprised there isn’t more buzz about him.

11 LC Mikhail Abramov, Victoriaville (QMJHL). Small forward with plus speed and passing ability. 54 points in 62 games.

12 R Alex Beaucage, Rouyn-Noranda (QMJHL). Impressive scorer has a quick release on his wrist shot, it’s good enough for 39 goals. His speed keeps him outside the higher regions but he’s worth a draft pick.

13 RD Jordan Spence, Moncton (QMJHL). Outstanding skater who makes good decisions with the puck. A two-way defender, his size (5.10, 164) will be an issue due to the position he plays.

14 LD Justin Bergeron, Rouyn-Noranda (QMJHL) . He isn’t getting mentioned at all, but Bergeron has good speed, creativity and is a good defender.

15 LC Valentin Nussbaumer, Shawinigan (QMJHL). He’s a smart two-way center but what will get him drafted is his speed. His boxcars (58, 17-21-38) are not fabulous for a September 2000, but someone will draft him based on speed alone.

16 G Jonathan Lemieux, Val d’Or (QMJHL). A nice step forward year over year (.902, from .867) and he was buried by an awful team in year one.

Russia, 2019

1 R Vasili Podkolzin, St. Petersburg (MHL). Smart player with tons of offensive ability, but also possesses good two-way instinct and no fear. Scouts love him, his numbers lagged after Hlinka/Gretzky. June birthday.

2 L Pavel Dorofeyev, Magnitogorsk (MHL). Dangerous skill winger who has a quick release, heavy shot and a sixth sense about where to be and when to be there.

3 LC Yegor Spiridonov, Magnitogorsk (MHL). Tenacious two-way winger with impressive skill.

4 LD Daniil Misyul, Lokomotiv (MHL). At 6.03, 176, Misyul offers NHL teams an intriguing size/speed combination on the blue line. Raw and not close to the sum of his parts, he would be a reasonable bet because of potential.

5 R Dmitri Sheshin, Magnitohorsk (MHL). Undersized skill winger is something of a wizard with the puck. Good not great speed, an intriguing skill player.

6 L Ilya Nikolayev, Yaroslavl (MHL). He’s more likely a checking center or possibly No. 2, but has played with high skill wingers and delivered.

7 L Yegor Chizhikov, Cherepovets (MHL). Haven’t read a thing on him, but he’s a July birthday and scores in every league they send him to, so I’d grab him here.

RODRIGUE

Goalies are tough to figure out and for scouts it must be a major pain in the arse to project them. I like consistent goalies, even among prospects. Olivier Rodrigue looks like a fairly consistent goaltender and that’s a good thing.

If there was an expansion draft and Edmonton could only protect on of these goalies, which one would you choose? I’d protect one of Skinner or Rodrigue but Wells could be the best of the three. There is some consistency there, although the consistent excellence of Devan Dubnyk in his draft plus two seasons (.917, .912, .912) towers over the current group.

This story has more momentum than that giant boulder headed for Indiana Jones back in the day. Dave Tippett is going to be the head coach of the Edmonton Oilers unless he asks for McDavid money. What would that look like? I’m writing today (likely up tomorrow) on that very subject.

LOWDOWN WITH LOWETIDE

A short show today, with Canada playing at the WHC’s (game is on TSN1260). We’ll be on before or around 11, with guests John Horn (French Open) and Dave Jamieson (WHC’s, Tippett). 10-1260 text, @Lowetide on twitter. Talk soon!

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217 Responses to "The QMJHL, Russia and the 2019 draft"

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  1. Lowetide says:

    I will have USHL, Sweden and the 2019 draft up tomorrow morning.

  2. Lowetide says:

    June 1 is my final list.

  3. godot10 says:

    I wonder how Seattle feels about Dave Tippett going on a year long job search around the league on their dime, when he was supposed to be preparing them for you expansion draft.

  4. Cape Breton Oilers 4EVR says:

    I remember wishing for Tippett when he was milking playoff spots out of weak coyote rosters. Now that it looks like we’re getting him, i’m getting cold feet about it. I’m not sure his resume is all that different from MacLellan’s when we hired him. We’ve just got to get this right.

  5. OriginalPouzar says:

    CAN/SUI on right now – no score with the first winding down.

    No Mantha – suspended for 1 game for a head shot.

    Go Canada!

    Leon and the Germans play at noon against CZE.

  6. OriginalPouzar says:

    Solid to see Rodrigue sign his ELC. He’ll be back in the Q next year. Will be invited to all the Team Canada summer camps, etc. and should have a very good shot at making the World Junior team.

    Too bad he hurt his groin late in the year and it slowed him down in to the playoffs.

    Miles to go on a teenage goalie but a solid prospect. #1 goalie potential – who the hell knows if he’ll get there.

  7. OriginalPouzar says:

    Do we consider Maksimov a Russian or a Canadian? Either way, hopefully his 40G potential that his elite shot has gets unlocked in due course.

  8. OriginalPouzar says:

    SUI takes a 1-0 lead late in the first on the PP (Jared M. in the penalty box).

  9. Lowetide says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    Do we consider Maksimov a Russian or a Canadian? Either way, hopefully his 40G potential that his elite shot has gets unlocked in due course.

    For my purposes (draft stuff) Maksimov is an OHL find, as that’s the league he was drafted from.

  10. russ99 says:

    Cape Breton Oilers 4EVR,

    McLellan gave us a nice bounce when we hired him. I think his later years were far below the quality of his first two with the amount of gruffness and the my way or the highway attitude. And besides, he really didn’t have the horses, other than the playoff year.

    I think McLellan will do well next season.

    For me the two biggest factors of the potential Tippett hire are:

    1. Will the coach and GM be on the same page? The track record of both are impressive but it doesn’t mean jack if they can’t work together

    2. A better NHL roster will give Tippett more to work with. Getting players with NHL experience to play in his systems would reduce the learning curve, and as we’ve seen for too many seasons to count, if young players are learning at the NHL level that leaves gaps that the opposition can exploit.

    Tippets’ teams in Phoenix rarely gave the opposition easy looks. Not sure #2 is to a point where we can assume that here, but any improvement will go a long way, and adding some help to the top 6 would allay concerns about lack of offense.

  11. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    Cape Breton Oilers 4EVR,

    – I keep going back to my post where he missed the playoffs his last 5 years.

    – But he’s a good coach because those teams outperformed.

    – Holland and Tippet: the two biggest names available and neither presumed available when the search started.

    – I would have preferred a young up and comer coach from the Cooper school.

    – Who knows : Lou turned the islanders around and he’s okder than Holland and Tippet combined.

    GOILERS!

    – Tippet will be alright but like you I don’t love it

  12. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    russ99,

    – agree: Tippet will do great next year if Sek Larsson Klefbom amd Nurse all play 65 games.

  13. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    3 R Nathan Légaré, Baie Comeau Drakkar (QMJHL). Power winger who can score goals, he can find open ice and cash (45 goals in 68 games) and drives to the net with abandon. Excellent skater.

    I’m in love with this scouting report

    6’0 205lbs so he probably already has a big hockey ass.

    Shoots right.

    Yes please.

  14. OriginalPouzar says:

    Missed it on a conference call but Canada has tied it up at 1 in the 2nd.

  15. Jethro Tull says:

    DJ Smith named Sens coach.

  16. Nit64 says:

    godot10:
    I wonder how Seattle feels about Dave Tippett going on a year long job search around the league on their dime, when he was supposed to be preparing them for you expansion draft.

    On their dime?

    1. His stated role is senior adviser.

    2. They’ve been clear publicly that their is no commitment to his being coach in waiting from either side.

    3. There is no actual coaching job there for a while.

    Actually looks like a gap year project that could have morphed into a role beyond advisor. Interesting parallel to Holland still wanting to GM.

    https://www.nhl.com/news/dave-tippett-senior-advisor-of-seattle-expansion-team-helping-design-arena-pick-front-office/c-302827712

  17. Cape Breton Oilers 4EVR says:

    russ99:
    Cape Breton Oilers 4EVR,

    McLellan gave us a nice bounce when we hired him. I think his later years were far below the quality of his first two with the amount of gruffness and the my way or the highway attitude. And besides, he really didn’t have the horses, other than the playoff year.

    I think McLellan will do well next season.

    For me the two biggest factors of the potential Tippett hire are:

    1. Will the coach and GM be on the same page? The track record of both are impressive but it doesn’t mean jack if they can’t work together

    2. A better NHL roster will give Tippett more to work with. Getting players with NHL experience to play in his systems would reduce the learning curve, and as we’ve seen for too many seasons to count, if young players are learning at the NHL level that leaves gaps that the opposition can exploit.

    Tippets’ teams in Phoenix rarely gave the opposition easy looks. Not sure #2 is to a point where we can assume that here, but any improvement will go a long way, and adding some help to the top 6 would allay concerns about lack of offense.

    it really wouldn’t take much squinting to call this roster better than the one he had in Arizona. But Mike Smith was a beast, and OEL and Yandle were beasts. We don’t have those qualities here at present. But they could do much worse than Tippett I guess. Holland is the one who has all the heavy lifting to do to get him a passable roster.

  18. incubo_nero says:

    Asking for a friend . . . is Igor Larionov still representing Nail Yakupov?
    Looked around on Google and couldn’t find any updated info.

  19. dustrock says:

    Sheshin should be one of those late round picks. One of those guys who could be a home run, with the skill he has. I doubt he makes it but as like a 4th round pick, who cares, swing for the fences, Tampa Bay style.

  20. Professor Q says:

    incubo_nero:
    Asking for a friend . . . is Igor Larionov still representing Nail Yakupov?
    Looked around on Google and couldn’t find any updated info.

    I think there was something there that happened, actually. Can’t remember what.

    I just remember wondering if it would make Nail’s close relationship with his daughter awkward at the time, so I wonder if it was a falling out or something else?

    EDIT: He is still on the The Will Sports Group’s client page, but as a Colorado player. Larionov is still listed as representing him, among other players.

    http://willsportsgroup.com/?page_id=2737&id=46

    http://willsportsgroup.com/?page_id=4622

  21. OriginalPouzar says:

    Another PP goal for the Swiss – with 3 seconds left in the second period. Nico Hischier.

    Swiss take a 2-1 lead to the third period.

  22. incubo_nero says:

    Professor Q,

    Thank you, Sir!

  23. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Cape Breton Oilers 4EVR:
    I remember wishing for Tippett when he was milking playoff spots out of weak coyote rosters.Now that it looks like we’re getting him, i’m getting cold feet about it.I’m not sure his resume is all that different from MacLellan’s when we hired him.We’ve just got to get this right.

    My cursory look with a little bit of roster examination suggests Tippett’s teams to over perform their talent a bit and McLellan’s either performed to expectation or under performed.

    I’m sure we’ll see a deep dive by a few people into Tippett’s history once he’s hired.

  24. OriginalPouzar says:

    OMG – Canada ties it up as the clock hits zero. This will be reviewed but, on the first look, it looked good to me.

  25. OriginalPouzar says:

    Should count – went in with 0.4 seconds left.

  26. Jethro Tull says:

    Woodguy v2.0: My cursory look with a little bit of roster examination suggests Tippett’s teams to over perform their talent a bit and McLellan’s either performed to expectation or under performed.

    I’m sure we’ll see a deep dive by a few people into Tippett’s history once he’s hired.

    I’m thinking that people should be diving before he’s hired.

  27. OriginalPouzar says:

    10 min of OT and then a shootout – hopefully its settled in OT.

  28. Rich M says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux:
    Cape Breton Oilers 4EVR,

    – I keep going back to my post where he missed the playoffs his last 5 years.

    – But he’s a good coach because those teams outperformed.

    – Holland and Tippet: the two biggest names available and neither presumed available when the search started.

    – I would have preferred a young up and comer coach from the Cooper school.

    – Who knows : Lou turned the islanders around and he’s okder than Holland and Tippet combined.

    GOILERS!

    – Tippet will be alright but like you I don’t love it

    Kinger – you’ve nailed my sentiments here.

    Tippet got his teams in Phoenix to outperform the talent on the roster.

    In Dallas, he took a team that was aging and hanging on to guys who were getting long in the tooth and got them to the conference semi’s his first year, was there for a retooling and got them to the conference finals in his 5th year.

    He knows what he’s doing – and as others here posted yesterday, his players really like playing for him.

    The style they play though is very hard on the eyes.

    Just the change in system though should benefit Koski the most.

    And to Cape Breton Oil 4EVR: No one every accused McLellan of getting more out of his rosters. If anything – as Godot has been pointing out for a couple of years, it seems his teams in San Jose may have under-performed.

  29. OriginalPouzar says:

    PLD with a great pass to Stone on a quick 2 on 1 and the game is over.

    Wow!

  30. Jethro Tull says:

    Rich M,

    Where as DeBoer has won cup after cup?

  31. Rich M says:

    Jethro Tull,

    I’m no fan of DeBoer, but look at him versus TMc

    TMc took a loaded team in San Jose to 1 conference final and 2 other semi’s. They had Thornton, Marleau (in their prime), Pavelski (entering his prime), Vlasic, Couture, Dan Boyle, Heatley and Clowe.

    Three other years, he was out in round 1 and he missed the playoffs once.

    DeBoer has been there 4 seasons, has 1 cup final, another conference final, one conference semi and one first round exit. He’s overseen a transition out of Marleau and the aging of Thornton and Pavelski and seems to get them to play at their peak.

    This is also the 2nd team he’s taken to the Cup Final (took NJ there against LA a few years back).

    Not saying he get’s more out of the talent than others, but at the least, he gets his teams to perform to expectations.

  32. Primetime says:

    Watching the game winning goal for Canada this morning should finally put a myth to bed…

    Stop saying Kekalainen knew there was something wrong with Puljujarvi and that’s why he passed. Kekalainen was a super scout and that’s how he made his name. We are not giving him enough credit that he saw what was RIGHT in Dubois and knew he wanted him on his team. Plain and simple. It was all about seeing what was in PLD.

    The winning goal is being celebrated by Stone, but PLD showed all his attributes, speed, power and amazing hands to set up the goal. He essentially scored it himself, just used Stone’s stick to get it in the net.

    I can see why Kekalainen did not even bother trading down one spot with Oilers to get an extra asset, just in case they took PLD. Decided just to take his man and get out of dodge. Give him credit.

  33. Darth Tu says:

    Primetime:
    Watching the game winning goal for Canada this morning should finally put a myth to bed…

    Stop saying Kekalainen knew there was something wrong with Puljujarvi and that’s why he passed.Kekalainen was a super scout and that’s how he made his name.We are not giving him enough credit that he saw what was RIGHT in Dubois and knew he wanted him on his team.Plain and simple.It was all about seeing what was in PLD.

    The winning goal is being celebrated by Stone, but PLD showed all his attributes, speed, power and amazing hands to set up the goal.He essentially scored it himself, just used Stone’s stick to get it in the net.

    I can see why Kekalainen did not even bother trading down one spot with Oilers to get an extra asset, just in case they took PLD.Decided just to take his man and get out of dodge.Give him credit.

    I completely agree with this take. I was hard on drafting Dubois that year, I mistakenly assumed that Columbus was going to take Pool Party and was hoping against hope that the Oil would take PLD with the number 4.

    Looks to have all the tools and should be a star in Columbus for many a year.

  34. OriginalPouzar says:

    On to Drai and the Germans at 12:15 – Go Germany!

  35. Death By Misadventure says:

    Woodguy v2.0:
    3 R Nathan Légaré, Baie Comeau Drakkar (QMJHL). Power winger who can score goals, he can find open ice and cash (45 goals in 68 games) and drives to the net with abandon. Excellent skater.

    I’m in love with this scouting report

    6’0 205lbs so he probably already has a big hockey ass.

    Shoots right.

    Yes please.

    Yeah that 45 goals pops out. I checked out his profile as well and looks like he has pro size already. Should be available at pick 38.

  36. Dustylegnd says:

    Cape Breton Oilers 4EVR:
    I remember wishing for Tippett when he was milking playoff spots out of weak coyote rosters.Now that it looks like we’re getting him, i’m getting cold feet about it.I’m not sure his resume is all that different from MacLellan’s when we hired him.We’ve just got to get this right.

    Who is the best coach in the league, the one who has the best players get off the Buss behind him,

    We don’t have enough scoring, we don’t have enough D men that can move the puck and skate at a plus level, we don’t have a starting goalie….there is no coach that can fix this roster

    By all reports Tippet is a coach that the players deeply respect, he is not necessarily a players coach, but he is a coach the players respect….Hitch was a coach Universally disliked by the vast majority of his players

  37. John Chambers says:

    Joakim Nygard – this guy appears to project as a 4th liner, or good AHL player.

    Why do we need this guy? We already have Gambardella, Khaira, and others slotted in these roles.

  38. Jethro Tull says:

    Primetime,

    So we’re judging players and GMs by one play in an international tournament?

    Didn’t JP also do quite well in one of those? Since we’re kind of cherry-picking, I’m going to use that in it’s singular to say Kek screwed up and should have picked JP.

    I think it’s far more nuanced than this. Kek deviated. It wasn’t as if he went completely insane and took a projected 3rd rounder. He went down 1 in a draft without much separation below #1 and 2.

    It’s not mutually exclusive either. Perhaps he saw things in both players…..

  39. leadfarmer says:

    Brock Nelson 6 per
    Holy cap

  40. Bag of Pucks says:

    John Chambers:
    Joakim Nygard – this guy appears to project as a 4th liner, or good AHL player.

    Why do we need this guy? We already have Gambardella, Khaira, and others slotted in these roles.

    Bottom 6 was putrid last season. I think anything they can do to increase competition for those roster spots is welcome.

    Gambardella and Khaira are replacement level players at this stage in their career, not guys you automatically ‘slot’ in.

    One part of Holland’s MO is he likes to bring his young skill up through the bottom 6 and rely more on vets, even stopgap vets on 1 year deals, in the Top 6.

    Players like Benson or JP or Yamamato will probably compete with Khaira and Gambardella initially in this model.

    Would not surprise me in the least to see Holland sign a couple older vets like a Filppula or Boyle or Brassard or Spezza on 1 year show me deals if the market is soft for them and the contracts cheap. A 38 year old Kronwall is out there too.

  41. silasbengtsson says:

    Woodguy v2.0:
    3 R Nathan Légaré, Baie Comeau Drakkar (QMJHL). Power winger who can score goals, he can find open ice and cash (45 goals in 68 games) and drives to the net with abandon. Excellent skater.

    I’m in love with this scouting report

    6’0 205lbs so he probably already has a big hockey ass.

    Shoots right.

    Yes please.

    He has a lot of the same buzzwords around him as Valentin Zykov, but I had yet to see a comment on his skating. That was the main shortcoming of Zykov iirc. Encouraging combination of stat line and scouting report despite playing with some quality 20 year olds.

  42. Scungilli Slushy says:

    John Chambers:
    Joakim Nygard – this guy appears to project as a 4th liner, or good AHL player.

    Why do we need this guy? We already have Gambardella, Khaira, and others slotted in these roles.

    Speed. Very fast player, apparently aggressive even if a bit small, and not without skill. This is the player type Holland mentioned just when hired. Speed, skill, motor.

    I think Joe has a shot even if they get the Swede, unless Holland thinks he’s too slow. JJ skates well for a big guy so he’s also likely safe unless traded. He also fights which may be a bigger deal if they move Lucic.

  43. Bag of Pucks says:

    In terms of asset management, the Oilers turned Paajarvi, Perron, Barbashev pick and Barzal pick into literally nothing.

    They’re the organization that traded the house for a paperclip.

  44. Dr. Taboggan says:

    Bag of Pucks:
    In terms of asset management, the Oilers turned Paajarvi, Perron, Barbashev pick and Barzal pick into literally nothing.

    They’re the organization that traded the house for a paperclip.

    This will never not be super depressing.

  45. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Jethro Tull: I’m thinking that people should be diving before he’s hired.

    Dustin Nielsen had a look at more than a few players that had their best offensive years under Tippett here: https://oilersnation.com/2019/05/23/nhl-offence-under-dave-tippett/

  46. Primetime says:

    Jethro Tull:
    Primetime,

    So we’re judging players and GMs by one play in an international tournament?

    Didn’t JP also do quite well in one of those? Since we’re kind of cherry-picking, I’m going to use that in it’s singular to say Kek screwed up and should have picked JP.

    I think it’s far more nuanced than this. Kek deviated. It wasn’t as if he went completely insane and took a projected 3rd rounder. He went down 1 in a draft without much separation below #1 and 2.

    It’s not mutually exclusive either. Perhaps he saw things in both players…..

    Sorry, think maybe you are misinterpreting the gist of my point?

    There have been many posts on this blog stating we should have known that JP is a “bust” because his fellow countryman Kekalainen didn’t draft him, so there was obviously something wrong with him.

    I am arguing that people are not giving Kek enough credit that it had nothing to do with JP’s shortcomings but rather, that Kek saw PLDs attributes as being more appealing to him. And so far, he has been correct. I’m not cherry-picking a single goal, I merely pointed out that the goal today displayed all the attributes he has in one single play. PLD’s performance the last 2 years in the NHL (20 and 27 goals) as well as playoffs speak for themselves. He’s the real deal, with 2 years of evidence to back it up.

    So my summary is, there is nothing wrong with JP, Kekalainen made a call and you can now see what he did. I will disagree that there was much nuance to it though…as you said, the top 2 were in a separate class. Kek had his choice of EVERY other kid in the draft. He felt PLD was the best and he took him. Nothing subtle or nuanced about that.

  47. Bag of Pucks says:

    Dr. Taboggan: This will never not be super depressing.

    Perron was a skill W that wanted to be here and wanted to help this culture improve, and had the temerity to suggest that Eakins wasn’t helping. So MacT trades him for magic beans and then Chiarelli spends the beans on Oil Kings nostalgia.

    It’s the kind of thing that makes someone employable only in the KHL.

    The Oilers truly are a classic Russian novel.

  48. Ryan says:

    Bag of Pucks: Perron was a skill W that wanted to be here and wanted to help this culture improve, and had the temerity to suggest that Eakins wasn’t helping. So MacT trades him for magic beans and then Chiarelli spends the beans on Oil Kings nostalgia.

    It’s the kind of thing that makes someone employable only in the KHL.

    The Oilers truly are a classic Russian novel.

    Well, in fairness, Perron could have been parlayed into Mathew Barzal, but Chiarelli prevented that from happening. Turning Perron plus into Reinhart was quite an #achomlishment.

  49. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    Primetime,

    – When C vs pure winger, all things being equal: take the C (and I was ecstatic that we got Pool).

    – Hockey hasn’t changed since I was a kid, and now coaching my son: the best players always play C from a young age. C’s can always become wingers: they give you more options

  50. JimmyV1965 says:

    leadfarmer:
    Brock Nelson 6 per
    Holy cap

    It appears the salary grid is going up significantly. Fee agency might be very dangerous this year.

  51. Munny says:

    Bag of Pucks: It’s the kind of thing that makes someone employable only in the KHL.

    The Oilers truly are a classic Russian novel.

    Which one and in what way?

  52. HT Joe says:

    Bag of Pucks: They’re the organization that traded the house for a paperclip.

    Was it at least a fancy red paperclip?

  53. Bag of Pucks says:

    Ryan: Well, in fairness, Perron could have been parlayed into Mathew Barzal, but Chiarelli prevented that from happening. Turning Perron plus into Reinhart was quite an #achomlishment.

    Yup. Watching Perron and Barbashev contribute to a Cup Finalist is as good a reason as any for Holland to keep sweeping the OBC out the door.

    Bob Green likely recommended Reinhart over Barzal. Next pink slip from Letter Kenny?

  54. Bag of Pucks says:

    Munny: Which one and in what way?

    Pretty much anything Tolstoy or Dostoyevsky.

    Oiler fan as protagonist of the proletariat doomed to love a team that spurns their love amidst a backdrop of greed, lunacy and systemic corruption. Featuring Kevin Lowe as Rasputin, the exec that can’t be killed and Wayne Gretzky as Lenin.

  55. SwedishPoster says:

    I saw that a few people asked my opinion on Nygård in yesterday’s thread.
    He is as has been mentioned a great skater, not just top speed but excellent acceleration as well, can go full throttle both with and without the puck, pretty good puck control and beats guys by quickly changing directions with the puck on his stick, his hands are pretty good but not much of a dangler. Will for sure be on highlight reels as the recipient of big hits as he has a tendency to get blown up once in a while when going full speed and trying to move around the D.
    Second in goals this season but not a great finisher tbh even if it’s gotten better, he just creates so much with his speed. Can make and take a pass but just average playmaking skills, can be creative with the puck at times though. When teams manage to slow him down he’s much less of a threat but has gotten better at the meat and potato stuff in the offensive zone, keeping play alive and so on. Good defensively, plays both on the PP and the PK. Can log big minutes and be used as a responsible defensive forward at the SHL level.
    Was the last forward cut for the swedish WHC team when Landeskog said yes to play and has looked good in international play of late. I’ve almost liked him more with Tre Kronor than in the SHL.

    Carl Hagelin is the most common comparison I’ve seen and it’s a pretty good one. Hagelin is stronger on the puck, more intense but I think Nygård has better hands.
    I’m not a massive fan but I think he could be a good bottom six option. With that kind of skating there’s always a chance you strike gold, especially if he can find his scoring touch.

  56. SwedishPoster says:

    Should also mention it’s been reported throughout the year that 24 NHL clubs have shown interest in signing him so a lot of euro scouts like him. It’s da speed.

  57. Ben says:

    SwedishPoster,

    +1 for Swedish Todd Marchant.

  58. Jethro Tull says:

    Woodguy v2.0: Dustin Nielsen had a look at more than a few players that had their best offensive years under Tippett here: https://oilersnation.com/2019/05/23/nhl-offence-under-dave-tippett/

    Thanks WG, but I was thinking more along the lines of Ken, Bob amd Darryl! But good info from Dusty.

  59. pts2pndr says:

    John Chambers:
    Joakim Nygard – this guy appears to project as a 4th liner, or good AHL player.

    Why do we need this guy? We already have Gambardella, Khaira, and others slotted in these roles.

    Speed. Reported to be one of the fastest skaters in the Swedish hockey league.

  60. Bag of Pucks says:

    Funny story about the Blues that i shared before.

    The MacT GM era was a real low point for me as an Oiler fan to the point where after he traded Perron, I decided I couldn’t take it anymore.

    I made a list of things I’d want in a new team and eventually settled on the Blues as ticking all the boxes. I informed my wife of this who promptly informed me that there was ‘no way in hell that I was switching teams’ after all the money we’d spent on the Oil and all the time I’d spent brainwashing her.

    So, I reminded her of this conversation the other night when St Loo made the Finals. Something along the lines of “my team would be in the finals now if i hadn’t let you talk me out of switching.”

    She categorically denies that conversation ever taking place! A full on bending of the space time continuum to deny objective reality.

    Women. You gotta love them!

  61. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    Bag of Pucks,

    – That’s awesome! Didn’t know untill today that Bowman took the Blues to 3 Cups in a row. I never read about this feat when people were touting how impressive Vegas has been: heck they were 1 and done!

    – Before I was born: but I think that makes what he did in his life even more impressive: went to the Habs, took a few years for the team to grow, then they won 4 with him, then he wanted the Sam Pollock job after he retired: they say no, so he moves to Buffalo

    – The GM that the Habs hired: his claim to fame was drafting Wickenhiser over a french Canadian hot-shot Denis Savard: ouch!

    – So Scotty hangs out in Buffalo, they always make the playoffs, but don’t go far, and he gets fired. Then wins the Cups in Pitts, then goes to Detroit and wins Cups…

    – But the three appearances with the expansion team Blues just adds to his resume

    – It also puts pause to the role of GM/Coach: Bowman was winning Cups with a talented Habs roster, then he got fired from Buffalo, before winning again with stacked teams in Pitss and Detroit: same guy, same acumen, different rosters, different results…

  62. Bag of Pucks says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux,

    Scotty Bowman was the Bill Belichick of the NHL.

    Ken Dryden’s book the Game is a good read for an insight into how he played that Dynasty like a symphony. Everyone had a clearly defined role and no one was ever comfortable or complacent, even the superstars.

    That said, wherever he won Cups, he had exceptional talent. Got to have the horses.

  63. OriginalPouzar says:

    Wow – Drai with a ridiculous set-up to a teammate for a one-timer on a wide-open net but he couldn’t convert – damn.

  64. OriginalPouzar says:

    Damn, Czech score early in the 3rd to take the lead.

  65. OriginalPouzar says:

    John Hoven reporting that the Kings and McLellan have not asked for permission to speak with Woodcroft – so far so good.

  66. Westchester Oil says:

    SwedishPoster,

    Thanks very much for the Nygard report. I was a bit disappointed to see that he’s 26. However, it looks like his ppg have crept up every year.

  67. Nit64 says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux:

    – That’s awesome!I just learned today that Scotty Bowman took the expansion Blues to 3 Cups in a row

    – Before I was born: but I think that makes what he did in his life even more impressive: went to the Habs, took a few years for the team to grow, then they won 4 with him, then he wanted the Sam Pollock job after he retired: they say no, so he moves to Buffalo

    – The GM that the Habs hired: his claim to fame was drafting Wickenhiser over a french Canadian hot-shot Denis Savard: ouch!

    – So Scotty hangs out in Buffalo, they always make the playoffs, but don’t go far, and he gets fired.Then wins the Cups in Pitts, then goes to Detroit and wins Cups…

    – But the three appearances with the expansion team Blues just adds to his resume

    – It also puts pause to the role of GM/Coach: Bowman was winning Cups with a talented Habs roster, then he got fired from Buffalo, before winning again with stacked teams in Pitss and Detroit: same guy, same acumen, different rosters, different results…

    Those three finals were a racket to sell hope to the expansion teams. Turned out that the Blues dominated the expansion bracket entry into Hockey’s Unsuper Bowl. Mostly through the Montreal connection sending over old vets for the Blue picks. Oh Sam. The things you did

  68. OriginalPouzar says:

    I believe this is simple positioning by the league and can’t imagine the NHL not being at the Olympics in China:

    As per Dreger:

    China will remain a primary target for the NHL, however word is starting to filter out the NHL won’t be going to China next season

  69. godot10 says:

    Dustylegnd: Who is the best coach in the league, the one who has the best players get off the Buss behind him,

    We don’t have enough scoring, we don’t have enough D men that can move the puck and skate at a plus level, we don’t have a starting goalie….there is no coach that can fix this roster

    By all reports Tippet is a coach that the players deeply respect, he is not necessarily a players coach, but he is a coach the players respect….Hitch was a coach Universally disliked by the vast majority of his players

    We are talking about a different generation of players compared to the players Tippett coached before. We saw how lousy McLellan was with the new generation.

    Tippett didn’t develop many players in Arizona.

  70. Andy Dufresne says:

    I think the biggest winner from a Tippett hire will be…….

    Mikko Koskinen

  71. OriginalPouzar says:

    Damn, Grubauer beat over the shoulder and Germany is down by 2 with less than 10 to go.

  72. RonnieB says:

    silasbengtsson: He has a lot of the same buzzwords around him as Valentin Zykov, but I had yet to see a comment on his skating. That was the main shortcoming of Zykov iirc. Encouraging combination of stat line and scouting report despite playing with some quality 20 year olds.

    Pronman has him at #29 on his list. Skating considered a big weakness, given 45/80 on Pronman scale.

  73. OriginalPouzar says:

    And Palat puts another nail on the coffin.

    A weird board bounce that left Grubauer in no man’s land.

  74. godot10 says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux:
    Bag of Pucks,

    – That’s awesome!I just learned today that Scotty Bowman took the expansion Blues to 3 Cups in a row

    There is an asterisk to that achievement. Bowman only had to beat the other expansion teams to get to the Cup final. For the firs three years, the expansion teams had their own division. In those three years, the real Stanley Cup final was the Prince of Wales conference championship.

    The Blues did acquit themselves well in those three finals though.

  75. Munny says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux: – That’s awesome! I didn’t know untill today that Bowman took the expansion Blues to 3 Cups in a row

    They played in the expansion division, needing only to beat other expansion teams to make it to the Cup Final.

  76. Pouzar says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    John Hoven reporting that the Kings and McLellan have not asked for permission to speak with Woodcroft – so far so good.

    Interesting since Hoven was on the radio here in the Peg saying it was basically a done deal.

  77. Munny says:

    Bag of Pucks: Pretty much anything Tolstoy or Dostoyevsky.

    Oiler fan as protagonist of the proletariat doomed to love a team that spurns their love amidst a backdrop of greed, lunacy and systemic corruption. Featuring Kevin Lowe as Rasputin, the exec that can’t be killed and Wayne Gretzky as Lenin.

    Well, they were both dead by the time of Rasputin and Lenin–whose stories aren’t really related either–and you can’t really mean “anything by” because that would mean all their works are essentially the same story, which of course, they are not…

  78. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    I believe this is simple positioning by the league and can’t imagine the NHL not being at the Olympics in China:

    4 real reasons why many see NHL not at Olympics:

    1) China trade war with US,aggression and human rights violations. (i.e.boycotts from before)
    2) World Cup of Hockey: players get paid more, a way better format, better for sport IMO
    3) The Olympics are a disgraceful mafia-driven corrupted thing that is waning
    4) Television delays means they won’t get much exposure or revs

    * there is no way the owners like the Olympics: and a few non-olympic hockey players I know confide they thing it’s a joke as well. It gave good exposure for awhile, but NHL’s strong preference is not to be there, and if they can bargain some global tourney with the players next go-round: NHLPA will take the money and run

  79. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    Munny,

    godot10,

    Nit64,

    – Interesting: didn’t realize the format: will be fun to read up on this

    – Makes you realize how “bush league” it was and how far it’s come.

    – Same with NBA: pre-Lakers-Celtics: an almost bankrupt league, no national TV exposure either…

  80. Andy Dufresne says:

    leadfarmer:
    Brock Nelson 6 per
    Holy cap

    Whats Anders Lee going to get ?

  81. Professor Q says:

    SwedishPoster,

    Out with the old, in with the Nygård!

  82. Nit64 says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux:
    Munny,

    godot10,

    Nit64,

    – Interesting: didn’t realize the format: will be fun to read up on this

    – Makes you realize how “bush league” it was and how far it’s come.

    – Same with NBA: pre-Lakers-Celtics:an almost bankrupt league, no national TV exposure either…

    Blues mortgaged their future to Pollock to get that streak. Or their souls given that it was Sam

  83. Nit64 says:

    With the prior relationship it’s not like they need a formal interview to be inches from dealing

  84. Professor Q says:

    Darth Tu: I completely agree with this take.I was hard on drafting Dubois that year, I mistakenly assumed that Columbus was going to take Pool Party and was hoping against hope that the Oil would take PLD with the number 4.

    Looks to have all the tools and should be a star in Columbus for many a year.

    It might show that people are putting too little credit into the Q? Or is PLD an outlier?

    Maybe Lavoie at al. should be getting more looks than they are. The NTDP can’t be that powerful, can it?

  85. Nit64 says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux:
    Munny,

    godot10,

    Nit64,

    – Interesting: didn’t realize the format: will be fun to read up on this

    – Makes you realize how “bush league” it was and how far it’s come.

    – Same with NBA: pre-Lakers-Celtics:an almost bankrupt league, no national TV exposure either…

    The Orr Goal. Did not see it live. Didn’t know many that did. Hockey ended on TV when HNIC signed off for the summer. That final was one big end credits for many.

  86. RonnieB says:

    According to Gregor, the Oilers assistant coaches all have permission to speak to other teams, and Yawney might join ToddM in LA.
    Also, Nygard has reportedly agreed to sign with the Oilers.

  87. SwedishPoster says:

    Professor Q:
    SwedishPoster,

    Out with the old, in with the Nygård!

    Nygård to the Oilers is a done deal according to a local paper for his SHL team. So in with the Nygård indeed. Translates to New farm, hopefully not a telling sign on where he ends up.

    Edit: thinking about it you could in this case translate gård to something like a manor. That’s better, stay at the manor Joakim don’t get sent down to the farm.

    In all seriousness I like it as a mud on the wall signing and with his speed he could end up a nice surprise. Thus Holland’s swedification of the Oilers has begun. He loves to litter his teams with my countrymen.

  88. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Hopefully Nygård adds some skill and speed to the bottom-6, and possibly able to move up in a pinch.

    Johan Ekberg
    @VFekberg

    Coveted swedish free agent Joakim Nygård has decided to sign for Edmonton Oilers
    https://www.vf.se/2019/05/23/avslojar-nygard-valjer-edmonton-oilers/

    2:43 PM – May 23, 2019

  89. Bag of Pucks says:

    Munny: Well, they were both dead by the time of Rasputin and Lenin–whose stories aren’t really related either–and you can’t really mean “anything by” because that would mean all their works are essentially the same, which they are not…

    Okay. The Oilers are nothing like a Russian novel.

    There, do you feel better about yourself now?

    Opening a dialogue just to score points. Imagine doing something that lame in a real social setting.

  90. OriginalPouzar says:

    Arbitrator has upheld Voynov’s one year suspension but also ruled that 41 games of it has been deemed served so he’ll be eligible to return mid way through this upcoming season.

    Some team will likely sign the guy – going to be a PR nightmare for them.

  91. godot10 says:

    Bag of Pucks: Okay. The Oilers are nothing like a Russian novel.

    What about Russian non-fiction?
    #GulagArchipelego

  92. geowal says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey:
    Hopefully Nygård adds some skill and speed to the bottom-6, and possibly able to move up in a pinch.

    Johan Ekberg
    @VFekberg

    Coveted swedish free agent Joakim Nygård has decided to sign for Edmonton Oilers
    https://www.vf.se/2019/05/23/avslojar-nygard-valjer-edmonton-oilers/

    2:43 PM – May 23, 2019

    From a roster point of view, this sounds like the Rieder replacement, (speed, wing, pk, prob bottom 6) with a fresh face and without the baggage Rieder developed for himself.

  93. Doug McLachlan says:

    silasbengtsson,

    Pronman has him #29 on his list for the Athletic.

    Skating is an issue he identifies as a concern.

  94. Jaxon says:

    5v5P1e is a projection of Primary Points adjusted for age/era/league and then given median Top 6 TOI in the NHL. 13.42 minimum eTOI/GP threshold:

    #) YEAR – Name – 5v5P1e- eTOI/GP
    1) 2005 – Sidney Crosby – 48.18 – 15.28
    2) 2015 – Connor McDavid – 44.02 – 16.89
    3) 2018 – Andrei Svechnikov – 38.80 – 15.07
    4) 2015 – Mitchell Marner – 37.49 – 13.79
    5) 2015 – Dylan Strome – 36.80 – 15.49
    6) 2014 – Robby Fabbri – 33.93 – 14.99
    7) 2007 – Patrick Kane – 32.41 – 14.22
    8) 2013 – Nathan MacKinnon – 30.49 – 15.9
    9) 2014 – Sam Bennett – 30.15 – 15.87
    10) 2014 – Spencer Watson – 30.10 – 14.21
    11) 2010 – Taylor Hall – 29.83 – 13.88
    12) 2013 – Nicolas Petan – 29.48 – 17.21
    13) 2016 – Pierre-Luc Dubois – 29.43 – 15.4
    14) 2016 – Alex DeBrincat – 29.20 – 17.03
    15) 2016 – Cameron Morrison – 29.13 – 15.25
    16) 2016 – Adam Mascherin – 29.04 – 16.06
    17) 2008 – Steven Stamkos – 28.87 – 13.74
    18) 2009 – Scott Glennie – 28.83 – 14.12
    19) 2018 – Oliver Wahlstrom – 28.79 – 16.26
    20) 2013 – Jonathan Drouin – 28.62 – 15.98
    21) 2010 – Tyler Seguin – 28.53 – 17.52
    22) 2019 – Philip Tomasino – 28.348 – 13.93*
    23) 2011 – Ryan Strome – 28.11 – 15.79
    24) 2006 – Chris Stewart – 28.11 – 13.9
    25) 2009 – Evander Kane – 28.10 – 15.13
    26) 2005 – Bobby Ryan – 28.02 – 15.93
    27) 2017 – Owen Tippett – 27.81 – 15.92
    28) 2010 – Justin Shugg – 27.73 – 13.55
    29) 2018 – Jonathan Gruden – 27.62 – 14.43
    30) 2019 – Cole Caufield – 27.357 – 13.72*
    31) 2017 – Nick Suzuki – 26.98 – 15.24
    32) 2009 – John Tavares – 26.74 – 15.87
    33) 2010 – Tyler Toffoli – 26.72 – 15.67
    34) 2014 – Nick Ritchie – 26.42 – 16.5
    35) 2019 – Jack Hughes – 26.409 – 13.42*
    36) 2014 – Nikolaj Ehlers – 26.06 – 14.99
    37) 2008 – Tyler Ennis – 26.04 – 15.06
    38) 2014 – Leon Draisaitl – 25.93 – 17.2
    39) 2005 – Evan Brophey – 25.73 – 14.67
    40) 2016 – Clayton Keller – 25.67 – 15.74
    41) 2005 – Steve Downie – 25.41 – 13.64
    42) 2019 – Dylan Cozens – 25.395 – 14.55*
    43) 2014 – Chase De Leo – 25.38 – 14.18
    44) 2019 – Bobby Brink – 25.347 – 15.97*
    45) 2017 – Gabriel Vilardi – 25.35 – 16.49
    46) 2011 – Boone Jenner – 25.32 – 14.49
    47) 2016 – Boris Katchouk – 25.28 – 14.35
    48) 2019 – Arthur Kaliyev – 25.251 – 16.16
    49) 2005 – Cal O’Reilly – 25.24 – 14.15
    50) 2011 – Shane Prince – 25.13 – 18.16
    51) 2016 – Kieffer Bellows – 25.13 – 17.51
    52) 2011 – Gabriel Landeskog – 25.12 – 15
    53) 2008 – Jordan Eberle – 25.12 – 14.35
    54) 2011 – Sven BArtschi – 25.09 – 14.81
    55) 2019 – Connor McMichael – 25.078 – 14.14*
    56) 2016 – Matthew Tkachuk – 25.03 – 14.69

    Players below 13.42 eTOI/GP threshold (new threshold to keep Hughes, was 13.74) from USNTDP:
    2019 – Alex Turcotte – 42.235 – 12.85*
    2019 – Michael Gildon – 32.279 – 10.30*
    2018 – Joel Farabee – 32.23 – 13.24
    2017 – Jacob Tortora – 27.85 – 13.06
    2019 – Matthew Boldy – 27.586 – 12.70*
    2019 – Trevor Zegras – 27.223 – 12.60*
    2019 – John Beecher – 25.867 – 10.54*

    From the 2014 to 2018 drafts, no player has made a successful jump from the USNTDP to NCAA in their draft+1 season except Clayton Keller and Dylan Larkin. Not Joel Farabee, Cam Morrison, Oliver Wahlstrom, Jacob Tortora, Jonathan Gruden, Kieffer Bellows, Evan Barratt, Shane Bowers, Josh Norris, Jake Wise, Jeremy Bracco, or Sonny Milano. Alex Tuch and Jack Roslovic have had some success but took a while to get there. When they moved to the NCAA almost all of them scored at a 15 to 20 pts in 30 to 40 games pace. Larkin and Keller are the exception; they scored at a higher rate in the NCAA and moved onto the NHL in their draft+2 season.

    I think you’d expect more from some very highly touted players in their draft year. Has the high quality and depth of teammates and the lack of competition in the USHL pumped their tires too much recently making the equivalencies off?

    Their eTOI/GP is also a concern. Usually drivers of play are getting upwards of 13.7 eTOI/GP. Many USNTDP players are getting a full minute less than that. That cutoff of 13.7 usually helps to separate the wheat from the chaff, but with how highly thought of players like Farabee, Hughes, Zegras, Boldy, and Turcotte are I wonder if the cutoff should be lower. Or, are they overrated? It will be interesting to follow this for the next few years to see how these players from 2014 through 2019 drafts do. Clayton Keller and Dylan Larkin are the only ones to break out so far. Will Hughes go straight to the NHL? Turcotte?

    Eichel, Matthews, and both Tkachuks moved on from the USNTDP before their draft season.

    I think the program may be improving but the competition is not and therefore they may lack a bit of growth during their time in the program, which is why you see elite players like Eichel, Matthews and the Tkachuks go elsewhere to continue to mature.

    All this to say, I’m still not sure what to make of the USNTDP players in this draft. I’m not sure what to make of Turcotte’s great production numbers (only below Crosby and McDavid since 2005) combined with his low eTOI. I’m not sure what to make of the fact that the supposed elite talent in the draft, Hughes, isn’t even in the top 5 in 5v5 production on his own team of players the same age as him. He’s 6th in Adjusted Primary Pts/60 on that team, and his TOI is relatively low when compared to other North American players who made it to NHL careers. He’s below the 13.7 eTOI/GP at 13.42. I was warning about Farabee’s low TOI last draft. Still not sure what he’ll turn into, but early returns are not promising. Boldy and Zegras are another half minute lower than Farabee and scoring at a lower pace (32 for Farabee to 27 projected 5v5 Primary Pts for Boldy and Zegras).

    By the numbers, I believe that Tomasino, Caufield may be safer picks than players outside Turcotte, Hughes as the production (Turcotte) and scouting reports (Hughes) are hard to ignore. Cozens and Brink (not part of the USNTDP but in the USHL) climb the board based on numbers, too. Cozens and Kaliyev -being young, big, and getting lots of ice-time this season- compare fairly well to Draisaitl.

    Here are the players who had a high rate of Adjusted 5v5 primary points but didn’t meet the 13.42 threshold:
    2019 – Alex Turcotte – 42.235 – 12.85*
    2008 – Eric O’Dell – 34.43 – 12.6
    2019 – Michael Gildon – 32.279 – 10.30*
    2018 – Joel Farabee – 32.23 – 13.24*
    2007 – Sam Gagner – 32.22 – 12.79
    2006 – Bobby Hughes – 30.95 – 12.78
    2006 – Riley Holzapfel – 30.48 – 13.17
    2013 – Oliver Bjorkstrand – 29.14 – 12.57
    2006 – John Hughes – 28.95 – 12.24
    2015 – Zachary Senyshyn – 28.68 – 11.27
    2014 – Andrew Mangiapane – 28.45 – 11.22
    2007 – Stefan Legein – 28.20 – 11.37
    2017 – Jacob Tortora – 27.85 – 13.06*
    2007 – Dale Mitchell – 27.72 – 12.68
    2008 – Greg Nemisz – 27.66 – 11.55
    2019 – Matthew Boldy – 27.586 – 12.70*
    2019 – Trevor Zegras – 27.223 – 12.60*
    2005 – Devin Setoguchi – 27.02 – 13.34
    2015 – Blake Speers – 26.97 – 12.96
    2006 – Codey Burki – 26.69 – 13.13
    2017 – Ivan Lodnia – 26.48 – 11.78
    2005 – Daniel Ryder – 26.44 – 13.13
    2010 – Austin Watson – 26.07 – 11.48
    2013 – Max Domi – 26.01 – 13.15
    2019 – John Beecher – 25.867 – 10.54*
    2005 – Radek Smolenak – 25.62 – 12.72
    2008 – Cody Hodgson – 25.47 – 11.3
    2005 – Francis Charette – 25.27 – 11.54

    It’s a pretty damning list. There are a few players who made it, but even of those who made it, most have been fringe players, spent time in the AHL, or been plagued with being inconsistent. Some had one or two great years and then flamed out.

    That is why the threshold of time on ice seems like a good indicator of NHL ability. And also why the USNTDP has me so flummoxed.

    PS Sorry again for the big wall of text.

  95. Bag of Pucks says:

    godot10: What about Russian non-fiction?
    #GulagArchipelego

    Who knows? Do you want to take the bullet on that one?

    My experience is that classic Russian novels are renowned for being dark and fatalistic and that was a good analogy to our own personal decade of darkness.

    But apparently i shouldn’t be throwing such comparisons out carelessly lest wannabe literary critics smell an opportunity to show off.

    Did the Internet create trolls or just give them the perfect environment to thrive?

  96. Nit64 says:

    Bag of Pucks: Who knows? Do you want to take the bullet on that one?

    My experience is that classic Russian novels are renowned for being dark and fatalistic and that was a good analogy to our own personal decade of darkness.

    But apparently i shouldn’t be throwing such comparisons out carelessly lest wannabe literary critics smell an opportunity to show off.

    Did the Internet create trolls or just give them the perfect environment to thrive?

    Underneath Bridges was the Mom’s Basement of the Day. Now trolls don’t even have to come above ground.

    ~ Like that great philosopher Zuckerburg told Congress: Хотели как лучше, а получилось как всегда ~

  97. silasbengtsson says:

    RonnieB: Pronman has him at #29 on his list. Skating considered a big weakness, given 45/80 on Pronman scale.

    Huh. Lowetide’s source says “excellent skating” while Pronman says it’s a weakness. All I can do now is watch and see for myself.

  98. Ben says:

    Our zero-depth recruitment strategy is really starting to pay off. Edmonton Oilers: land of opportunity!

    In Chia we trust.

  99. Nit64 says:

    geowal: From a roster point of view, this sounds like the Rieder replacement, (speed, wing, pk, prob bottom 6) with a fresh face and without the baggage Rieder developed for himself.

    And only 2 days older than Toby.

  100. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    SwedishPoster:
    I saw that a few people asked my opinion on Nygård in yesterday’s thread.
    He is as has been mentioned a great skater, not just top speed but excellent acceleration as well, can go full throttle both with and without the puck, pretty good puck control and beats guys by quickly changing directions with the puck on his stick, his hands are pretty good but not much of a dangler. Will for sure be on highlight reels as the recipient of big hits as he has a tendency to get blown up once in a while when going full speed and trying to move around the D.
    Second in goals this season but not a great finisher tbh even if it’s gotten better, he just creates so much with his speed. Can make and take a pass but just average playmaking skills, can be creative with the puck at times though. When teams manage to slow him down he’s much less of a threat but has gotten better at the meat and potato stuff in the offensive zone, keeping play alive and so on. Good defensively, plays both on the PP and the PK. Can log big minutes and be used as a responsible defensive forward at the SHL level.
    Was the last forward cut for the swedish WHC team when Landeskog said yes to play and has looked good in international play of late. I’ve almost liked him more with Tre Kronor than in the SHL.

    Carl Hagelin is the most common comparison I’ve seen and it’s a pretty good one. Hagelin is stronger on the puck, more intense but I think Nygård has better hands.
    I’m not a massive fan but I think he could be a good bottom six option. With that kind of skating there’s always a chance you strike gold, especially if he can find his scoring touch.

    Thanks SP!

    If they run 97,29 and 93 as C’s it sound like he’d slot nicely with 93 and try to create a line that can take some tougher minutes to give 97 and 29 some match up advantages when possible.

  101. Darth Tu says:

    Professor Q: It might show that people are putting too little credit into the Q? Or is PLD an outlier?

    Maybe Lavoie at al. should be getting more looks than they are. The NTDP can’t be that powerful, can it?

    It kind of depends on year for the Q – overall I tend to agree with the consensus that it’s lagged behind the other junior leagues for a bit, with the odd exceptional player still being produced. To be fair, with the exception of the OHL I think it’s pretty normal for the junior leagues see some ups and downs in this fashion, the W for example looks fantastic this year after having a bit of a meh offering last year.

    Like LT says, the US Development team has that whole all star thing going for it, so some players are zoomed a bit in there. Without a doubt though if you have guys absolutely tearing up the blacktop they’re probably still worth a look.

  102. jtblack says:

    Jaxon,

    GREAT STUFF !! very insightful

  103. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Ben:
    SwedishPoster,

    +1 for Swedish Todd Marchant.

    “With hands” Ben.

    It’s always “Todd Marchant with hands”

  104. OriginalPouzar says:

    John Chambers:
    Joakim Nygard – this guy appears to project as a 4th liner, or good AHL player.

    Why do we need this guy? We already have Gambardella, Khaira, and others slotted in these roles.

    For that exact reason: I like Joe G but he shouldn’t be slotted anywhere in the NHL but should compete for such a position and that is what this does, create extra competition, not to mention injury cover, etc. Not to mention his speed sounds elite and that is something the roster and the bottom 6 could use.

  105. OriginalPouzar says:

    Bag of Pucks: Perron was a skill W that wanted to be here and wanted to help this culture improve, and had the temerity to suggest that Eakins wasn’t helping. So MacT trades him for magic beans and then Chiarelli spends the beans on Oil Kings nostalgia.

    It’s the kind of thing that makes someone employable only in the KHL.

    The Oilers truly are a classic Russian novel.

    David Perron called out his teammates publicly for being lazy on the ice. The very next game, Perron himself made a completely lazy play giving up on a backcheck in a tie game that led to the winning goal against . Totally unacceptable and he was traded about a week later – he needed to go after that.

  106. Munny says:

    Bag of Pucks: Okay. The Oilers are nothing like a Russian novel.

    There, do you feel better about yourself now?

    Opening a dialogue just to score points. Imagine doing something that lame in a real social setting.

    I opened it up because I thought you might have something interesting and unusual to say. I didn’t know until your reply that you were talking out of your ass.

    And thus wasn’t your original analogy a case of “showing off”?

    Bag of Pucks: <p abp="2386"

    My experience is that classic Russian novels are renowned for being dark and fatalistic and that was a good analogy to our own personal decade of darkness.

    Now this is interesting, I wish you had said it in the first place.

    I don’t know if fatalism is simply what people turn to when hope seems impossible, because I have difficulty believing in pre-ordained fate on a personal level. But certainly who we are drives our own fate, which is definitely Dostoevsky-esque. And what this organisation has wrought is certainly a reflection of what it is.

    Dostoevsky’s characters never change, grow, etc… Organisations are not so limited. But it remains to be seen whether this organisation has changed enough and in the right way, to avoid the same fate as its prior iterations.

  107. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    godot10: We are talking about a different generation of players compared to the players Tippett coached before. We saw how lousy McLellan was with the new generation.

    Tippett didn’t develop many players in Arizona.

    I showed you before that more than a few young players grew well under him.

    Not just elite ones, but guys like Martinook too.

  108. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Professor Q: It might show that people are putting too little credit into the Q? Or is PLD an outlier?

    Maybe Lavoie at al. should be getting more looks than they are. The NTDP can’t be that powerful, can it?

    Lavoie is a late birthday (Sept 25) and was just under a pt/gm last year so he’s being dinged for that.

  109. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Pouzar: Interesting since Hoven was on the radio here in the Peg saying it was basically a done deal.

    Jet fuel smells better than bus diesel.

  110. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Jaxon,

    PS Sorry for the big wall of text.

    Quality wall though and that matters a lot.

  111. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Nit64,

    ~ Like that great philosopher Zuckerburg told Congress: Хотели как лучше, а получилось как всегда ~

    Ha!

    *Wiser clapping*

  112. Bag of Pucks says:

    Munny,

    No, it’s not showing off or talking out my ass. It’s an analogy that functions as shorthand in a conversation. Say ‘like a Russian novel’ and it immediately conveys an aesthetic that most people are aware of and can visualize.

    Throw in further amplification of Lowe as Rasputin and maybe it even has some comedic potential. The latter of course assumes that people aren’t taking themselves way too seriously. Never a safe assumption on the net I’m afraid.

    You are aware rhat you’re the only pedant that took exception with it, right? Maybe that should tell you something about yourself?

  113. Bag of Pucks says:

    David Perron is good enough for the Blues but not good enough for the Oilers. Got it.

    Flawless logic.

  114. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    I asked frequent Lowdown guest Simon Boisvert’s opinion on Legare’s skating (I love Twitter for this stuff)


    @woodguy55

    @simonsnake70 If I may ask, what is your opinion on Nathan Legare’s skating? I’ve read its a positive and have read its a negative. Thanks.

    @simonsnake70

    @woodguy55 He’s not slow, but he’s not fluid. If he were, he would be a sure-fire 1st round pick.

    Sounds like a good 2nd round project if you figure you can improve his skating.

  115. Bag of Pucks says:

    My sense is the team had quit on Eakins and rather than continue with the situation, Perron held a Festivus interview for the airing of his grievances. It’s a desperation gambit but possibly better than simply watching the ship sink while keeping your mouth shut to protect the brass.

    Because the OBC culture always blame the players, MacT backed his boy Dallas and put Perron in his place. Once he got the lay of the land Perron said wtf, i may as well force my way out of this untenable situation.

    It’s ironic that we lobby for the Oilers to hire a player friendly coach while simultaneously defending the most obvious example of the OBC turfing a perfectly good player because he didn’t toe the party line to conceal their ineptitude.

  116. Professor Q says:

    Bag of Pucks,

    And it could have turned out fine if the freaking pick wasn’t wasted on Griffin.

    But still, I didn’t want Perron to leave. He was good and actually one of my favourite players while he was in Edmonton. And he even said afterwards, a few times, that he will always feel like an Oiler.

    So I guess he likes the Oilers and Blues, but the Blues like him more?

  117. Bag of Pucks says:

    Professor Q:
    Bag of Pucks,

    And it could have turned out fine if the freaking pick wasn’t wasted on Griffin.

    But still, I didn’t want Perron to leave. He was good and actually one of my favourite players while he was in Edmonton. And he even said afterwards, a few times, that he will always feel like an Oiler.

    So I guess he likes the Oilers and Blues, but the Blues like him more?

    I think he’s a guy that actually cares and playing in that fundamentally broken organization was a frustrating experience for someone that really wants to win.

    That entire team could’ve been traded for taking time off on the backcheck. You need results to maintain that will to do all the little things. Losing breeds bad habits.

  118. YKOil says:

    I really like the Nelson contract.

    – 6 years is decent term on a 27 year old (28 in October) so trying to trade a 34 year old on the downslope with term
    – NTC for only the first 2 years
    – trade friendly starting in year 4 and going through to the end

    Maybe $250k to $500k over best price but that is small beans really; Lou and team know their stuff.

  119. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    My favourite thing about Perron is that he’s sneaky filthy.

    Hacks, whacks, interferes and is generally a prick to play against.

    Takes the puck to the net and goes to the net without the puck too.

    Not always “engaged” in the game, but when he is its fun to watch.

  120. Nit64 says:

    Button: “Connor McDavid isn’t interested in playing any type of game that’s about standing in a certain place.”

    ~ Don’t care who they pick for Coach as long as 97 flies First Class ~

  121. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    YKOil:
    I really like the Nelson contract.

    – 6 years is decent term on a 27 year old (28 in October) so trying to trade a 34 year old on the downslope with term
    – NTC for only the first 2 years
    – trade friendly starting in year 4 and going through to the end

    Maybe $250k to $500k over best price but that is small beans really; Lou and team know their stuff.

    I’m argue that it’s trade friendly after year 3.

    Actual dollars out for Nelson’s 6 year contract:

    8MM
    5.2MM
    8MM
    5.2MM
    5.6MM
    4.0MM

    So there is 14.8MM in actual $ left over the last 3 years with a cap of 18MM

    Source: https://www.capfriendly.com/players/brock-nelson

  122. Munny says:

    Bag of Pucks: No, it’s not showing off or talking out my ass. It’s an analogy that functions as shorthand in a conversation. Say ‘like a Russian novel’ and it immediately conveys an aesthetic that most people are aware of and can visualize.

    Russian Golden Age novels are rich, complex beasts, very psychological, and probably the first ever novels to detail the “inner life” of their characters. Polyphonic in structure too, which was also a new thing back in the day. And if one was to sum up say Anna Karenina in a very brief statement it might go something like “the importance of family in living a good life”. So I had no idea what “shorthand aesthetic” was intended by your own brief statement…

    …which is why I inquired in the first place. Christ, you could be an English teacher, for all I know, and had something really neat in mind But your first reply was confusing and seemed to indicate the original comparison was merely a throwaway line But to be sure, I stated the things that didn’t make sense to me.

    Despite the opening insult, your second reply did seem pertinent and interesting and thus I replied in kind.

    But judging from your continuing insults you seem pretty butt hurt by all of this, so I will let it go… before I find myself playing a tragic character unable to escape the plot of a classic Russian novel. 😉

    Hope (!) you have a better day.

  123. OriginalPouzar says:

    Good enough for the Blues, also “good enough” for the Blues to let go of, twice.

    Simply provided some facts and facts that, in my opinion created the circumstance where he unequivocally could not longer be an Oiler.

  124. Reja says:

    Bag of Pucks:
    Funny story about the Blues that i shared before.

    The MacT GM era was a real low point for me as an Oiler fan to the point where after he traded Perron, I decided I couldn’t take it anymore.

    I made a list of things I’d want in a new team and eventually settled on the Blues as ticking all the boxes. I informed my wife of this who promptly informed me that there was ‘no way in hell that I was switching teams’ after all the money we’d spent on the Oil and all the time I’d spent brainwashing her.

    So, I reminded her of this conversation the other night when St Loo made the Finals. Something along the lines of “my team would be in the finals now if i hadn’t let you talk me out of switching.”

    She categorically denies that conversation ever taking place! A full on bending of the space time continuum to deny objective reality.

    Women. You gotta love them!

    I didn’t know St. Loo fans existed outside of Missouri. With Perron and Maroon probably a lot of Oilers fans hoping they win.

  125. Munny says:

    Woodguy v2.0,

    Thank you for this. There are some good quotes on this page:

    https://thehockeywriters.com/nathan-legare-2019-nhl-draft-prospect-profile/

    The first quote, from an actual scout apparently, echoes Simon’s thoughts:

    “He is primarily a shooter that does not mind the physical part of the game. I am concerned about him at the professional level if he does not get the opportunity to shoot when the opposition limits his time and space. This became evident in Baie Comeau’s first-round upset loss to Moncton when they limited Légaré’s effectiveness. He needs to improve his overall skating quickness. I suspect he will likely be a late second, or early third round, player because of his style of play.”

  126. pts2pndr says:

    Professor Q:
    SwedishPoster,

    Out with the old, in with the Nygård!

    Not bad professor.

  127. pts2pndr says:

    Bag of Pucks:
    Munny,

    No, it’s not showing off or talking out my ass. It’s an analogy that functions as shorthand in a conversation. Say ‘like a Russian novel’ and it immediately conveys an aesthetic that most people are aware of and can visualize.

    Throw in further amplification of Lowe as Rasputin and maybe it even has some comedic potential. The latter of course assumes that people aren’t taking themselves way too seriously. Never a safe assumption on the net I’m afraid.

    You are aware rhat you’re the only pedant that took exception with it, right? Maybe that should tell you something about yourself?

    Poetic license??

  128. YKOil says:

    pts2pndr: Poetic license??

    From his ass? (thinking I have to, HAVE TO, jot down the best blowhole quotes from Moby Dick next time I read it)

  129. pts2pndr says:

    YKOil:
    I really like the Nelson contract.

    – 6 years is decent term on a 27 year old (28 in October) so trying to trade a 34 year old on the downslope with term
    – NTC for only the first 2 years
    – trade friendly starting in year 4 and going through to the end

    Maybe $250k to $500k over best price but that is small beans really; Lou and team know their stuff.

    Okay by current standards but I believe that will change unless the cap increases faster. At his money you only need a Lucic contract or two to put you in trouble. The reality is you are paying market price for a declining asset. Beware of the cliff as some players reach it much earlier than others. Contracts such as these are not in my opinion conducive to long term success.

  130. Jaxon says:

    Woodguy v2.0:
    My favourite thing about Perron is that he’s sneaky filthy.

    Hacks, whacks, interferes and is generally a prick to play against.

    Takes the puck to the net and goes to the net without the puck too.

    Not always “engaged” in the game, but when he is its fun to watch.

    And he does it without being a complete ass like Marchand. I really enjoyed watching him in Edmonton and was sad to see him go.

  131. Ben says:

    I am 100% here for a snarky exchange about the coherence of ‘Russian novel’ as a device for describing the culture of our shitty local hockey team. Just waiting for Munny’s Chekhovian emoji to explode.

  132. Ben says:

    Lamb and Playfair? Neither of those feel particularly inspired. Would love someone with recent special teams success.

    EDIT: Nevermind I LOVE the Playfair idea https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21nBVuCMPuQ

  133. rickithebear says:

    When I first started discussing my cup core theory & possible coaching fits for Vegas Golden Knights on HF Boards.
    My 2 top choices were Tippett then Gallant.

    We need Goals from our wingers.
    Any way possible.

    As you have stated not a high standard to beat for top 9 fwds as goal scoring wingers.

    Off to take the rest of my cancer meds.

    Then start to read
    Lone wolf and cub Vol. 3 Flute and Fallen Tiger
    Bronze Age of Swamp thing Vol 1

  134. Bag of Pucks says:

    P

    OriginalPouzar:
    Good enough for the Blues, also “good enough” for the Blues to let go of, twice.

    Simply provided some facts and facts that, in my opinion created the circumstance where he unequivocally could not longer be an Oiler.

    If Perron was a cancer everywhere he went, that argument might have legs.

    There’s a lot more smoke to indicate the OBC struggles to respect the players’ rights as individuals.

    And the OBC sided wih Eakins than fired him anyway. This was not an org that could afford to piss away productive skill Ws.

  135. Jaxon says:

    Would anyone here pay $12 million per for 1 or 2 years of Karlsson? Any chance he’d do it if Edmonton could clear enough cap space?

  136. OriginalPouzar says:

    Bag of Pucks:
    P

    If Perron was a cancer everywhere he went, that argument might have legs.

    There’s a lot more smoke to indicate the OBC struggles to respect the players’ rights as individuals.

    And the OBC sided wih Eakins than fired him anyway. This was not an org that could afford to piss away productive skill Ws.

    None of that has anything to do with what Perron said publicly and then did on the ice the very next game. What he said and then did was unacceptable no matter what the OBC had been doing.

  137. Jaxon says:

    Reja: I didn’t know St. Loo fans existed outside of Missouri. With Perron and Maroon probably a lot of Oilers fans hoping they win.

    A lot of Oiler fans have Saskatchewan roots as well (myself included) so cheering for St Louis makes sense with Jaden Schwartz, Brayden Schenn, and Tyler Bozak being from Saskatchewan, not to mention Bouwmeester and Parayko hailing from the Edmonton area. And Manitobans and Jets fans fond of Tomas Steen may cheer for his son Alex who was born in Winnipeg when his dad was a Jet. St Louis also has a history with Saskatchewan when Bill Hunter made an offer to buy the Blues in 1983 and move them to Saskatoon. I would suspect a large portion of the prairies (at least of a certain vintage) will be cheering for St Louis.

  138. Lowetide says:

    Woodguy v2.0:
    I asked frequent Lowdown guestSimon Boisvert’s opinion on Legare’s skating (I love Twitter for this stuff)


    @woodguy55


    @simonsnake70 If I may ask, what is your opinion on Nathan Legare’sskating? I’ve read its a positive and have read its a negative. Thanks.

    @simonsnake70

    @woodguy55 He’s not slow, but he’s not fluid. If he were, he would be a sure-fire 1st round pick.

    Sounds like a good 2nd round project if you figure you can improve his skating.

    Yep. My bad. I have three sources, including Adam Sherren who I quote for Q stuff. NONE of them said excellent skater. Fixed and I thank you.

  139. Bag of Pucks says:

    OriginalPouzar: None of that has anything to do with what Perron said publicly and then did on the ice the very next game.What he said and then did was unacceptable no matter what the OBC had been doing.

    I don’t have a problem with athletes being honest and transparent. I wish more of them were.

    And everyone on that team missed assignments leading to GWGs against. Trading a useful skill W for magic beans on the basis of one play is idiocy.

    The whole reason Perron went to the media is the OBC refused to listen to his concerns internally. Eakins had lost the team and MacT didn’t want to accept it. Airing the concerns publicly was a last resort for Perron.

    It’s more traditional for hockey players to suffer mgmt idiocy in silence like an RNH, but all that does is protect the inept brass.

  140. Munny says:

    Ben:
    I am 100% here for a snarky exchange about the coherence of ‘Russian novel’ as a device for describing the culture of our shitty local hockey team. Just waiting for Munny’s Chekhovian emoji to explode.

    Ha! Well if it’s on the wall of the internet, that emoji HAS to go off in the 3rd act.

  141. OriginalPouzar says:

    This was not a case of simply missing an assignment – as is clear from how the facts were laid out.

    Perron’s time as an Oiler was done at that point, final nail – good riddance.

  142. Bag of Pucks says:

    OriginalPouzar: David Perron called out his teammates publicly for being lazy on the ice.The very next game, Perron himself made a completely lazy play giving up on a backcheck in a tie game that led to the winning goal against .Totally unacceptable and he was traded about a week later – he needed to go after that.

    Here’s Perron’s actual comments btw. Not nearly as incendiary as you’re making them out to be imo.

    “Something has to change. When you are making those mistakes, something needs to happen. They are the same mistakes we were doing last year. We keep talking about how much better we are this year, but for me it is the same record now that we had last year. It is not better.”

    “It’s about a full sixty. We need to have accountability from coaches and teammates.”

    https://www.coppernblue.com/2014/11/22/7266759/david-perron-devils-post-game-oilers#

  143. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Bag of Pucks,

    Thin line between a “leader” and a “cancer” in this town.

  144. Bag of Pucks says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey:
    Bag of Pucks,

    Thin line between a “leader” and a “cancer” in this town.

    The message it sends is that mgmt and coaches can criticize players but players can never criticize mgmt and coaches. It’s a military chain of command mindset that doesn’t work particularly well with the modern athlete. It especially doesn’t work when the generals are grossly incompetent and losing the battles for years on end.

    Probably why I like Perron. Finally, a player honest enough to call that shitshow what it was.

  145. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Munny:
    Woodguy v2.0,

    Thank you for this. There are some good quotes on this page:

    https://thehockeywriters.com/nathan-legare-2019-nhl-draft-prospect-profile/

    The first quote, from an actual scout apparently, echoes Simon’s thoughts:

    “He is primarily a shooter that does not mind the physical part of the game. I am concerned about him at the professional level if he does not get the opportunity to shoot when the opposition limits his time and space. This became evident in Baie Comeau’s first-round upset loss to Moncton when they limited Légaré’s effectiveness. He needs to improve his overall skating quickness. I suspect he will likely be a late second, or early third round, player because of his style of play.”

    Sounds like a guy who could frustrate you with “what if” if he doesn’t improve that part of his game.

    Also sounds like a player if he can fix it.

    I’d interview him and people who know him extensively to figure out if he’s the type to work hard on it.

  146. Jaxon says:

    Woodguy v2.0: Sounds like a guy who could frustrate you with “what if” if he doesn’t improve that part of his game.

    Also sounds like a player if he can fix it.

    I’d interview him and people who know him extensively to figure out if he’s the type to work hard on it.

    His numbers are reminiscent of Valentin Zykov in their draft years. Which would fit the “sounds like a guy who could frustrate you” but also amaze you if he figures things out and works on certain aspects of his game. Perfect 2nd round pick.

  147. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Jaxon: And he does it without being a complete ass like Marchand. I really enjoyed watching him in Edmonton and was sad to see him go.

    Perron is the fresh, light and delicious croissant made by a Parisian Master Pastry Chef that you can get from Arno’s on 116 ave, just down from Lemarchand Mansion.

    Seriously: http://www.arnospatisserie.com/#biography

    Marchard is the sausage roll of indeterminate age in the local Husky.

    Scores more though…

  148. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    rickithebear,

    I like Tippett too.

    Hope the meds work.

  149. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    Lowetide: Yep. My bad. I have three sources, including Adam Sherren who I quote for Q stuff. NONE of them said excellent skater. Fixed and I thank you.

    Thanks for your stuff Al.

    I would have never heard of Legare if I didn’t open your post this morning.

    Now I want him as an early 3rd but he probably goes in the 2nd.

  150. Rebillled says:

    Bag of Pucks,

    Wow, I can’t believe we got Klinkhammered for that. Calling out that the team has the same shitty record and that the team keeps making the same mistakes.

    The fans are truly the ones that suffer.

  151. Bag of Pucks says:

    Woodguy v2.0: Perron is the fresh, light and delicious croissant made by a Parisian Mast Pastry Chef that you can get from Arno’s on 116 ave, just down from LemarchandMansion.

    Seriously: http://www.arnospatisserie.com/#biography

    Marchard is the sausage roll of indeterminate age in the local Husky.

    Scores more though…

    Eberle, Schultz, Perron, Petry.

    What do they all have in common? They all made obvious egregious mistakes that cost the Oilers a game and were traded soon if not immediately after.

    Making rash decisions to trade away skill on the basis of extremely small sample sizes has been one of the defining traits of this organization for years. You could argue that they never really found suitable replacements for any of those players either.

  152. Rebillled says:

    Chia got Lester Nygaard?

    Oh never mind. That’s who Chia would have got for our #8.

  153. Professor Q says:

    Bag of Pucks: The message it sends is that mgmt and coaches can criticize players but players can never criticize mgmt and coaches. It’s a military chain of command mindset that doesn’t work particularly well with the modern athlete. It especially doesn’t work when the generals are grossly incompetent and losing the battles for years on end.

    Probably why I like Perron. Finally, a player honest enough to call that shitshow what it was.

    To be fair, Hall, Souray, Whitney, and some others also said some stuff, and obviously didn’t like the losing and behaviour of some staff members.

    For some reason the Perron comments are the most remembered?

    But I do like him. Hall also, obviously.

  154. hunter1909 says:

    Hunter1909’s 2018-19 DeathMarch™ Official Update:

    Woodguy finally shamed me into this:

    Hunter1909’s Official 2018-19 DeathMarch will publish it’s opening findings at one point during the Stanley Cup Finals.

    ps: shout out to Pescador for finally getting noticed.

    thank you for your cooperation

    the deathMarch team™

  155. Bag of Pucks says:

    Professor Q: To be fair, Hall, Souray, Whitney, and some others also said some stuff, and obviously didn’t like the losing and behaviour of some staff members.

    For some reason the Perron comments are the most remembered?

    But I do like him. Hall also, obviously.

    It’s tough. I’m sure they all start off wanting to be good soldiers but losing wears on you.

    I do think pushing back is a better option than apathy though. Apathy gets you nowhere. When a player is expressing anger or frustration, it means he still cares. That’s a good thing.

    There’s 3 dynamics in any relationship: intimacy, conflict & withdrawal. In a marriage for instance, you’re in one of those 3 phases at any given time and counterintuitively withdrawal is actually worse than conflict, if you’re fighting with your wife, at least you still care. Once you stop fighting, assuming you’re not moving towards intimacy of course, it means you’re withdrawing. And withdrawal is the final stage before divorce. Once you lose emotional investment (skin in the game), you’re done. That goes for love, career, life in general.

    Hall was gutted when the Oil traded him. Despite all the losing and then being rejected, he still cared. That is one loyal soldier.

  156. Tarkus says:

    Woodguy v2.0: Thanks SP!

    If they run 97,29 and 93 as C’s it sound like he’d slot nicely with 93 and try to create a line that can take some tougher minutes to give 97 and 29 some match up advantages when possible.

    Sweet….we could run Nuge with Nyge!

  157. Bag of Pucks says:

    Raptors going home up 3-2

  158. OriginalPouzar says:

    The defensive performance by the team in the 4th Q was unreal.

  159. Nit64 says:

    hunter1909:
    Hunter1909’s 2018-19 DeathMarch™ Official Update:

    Woodguy finally shamed me into this:

    Hunter1909’s Official 2018-19 DeathMarch will publish it’s opening findings at one point during the Stanley Cup Finals.

    ps: shout out to Pescadorfor finally getting noticed.

    thank you for your cooperation

    the deathMarch team™

    Hey Hunter, make sure your army of transcribers does not miss this “winning” entry:

    https://lowetide.ca/2018/09/11/2018-19-rookie-camp-game-two-oilers-vs-nait-ooks-and-macewan-griffins/comment-page-1/#comment-760521

  160. Reja says:

    Jaxon: A lot of Oiler fans have Saskatchewan roots as well (myself included) so cheering for St Louis makes sense with Jaden Schwartz, Brayden Schenn, and Tyler Bozak being from Saskatchewan, not to mention Bouwmeester and Parayko hailing from the Edmonton area. And Manitobans and Jets fans fond of Tomas Steen may cheer for his son Alex who was born in Winnipeg when his dad was a Jet. St Louis also has a history with Saskatchewan when Bill Hunter made an offer to buy the Blues in 1983 and move them to Saskatoon. I would suspect a large portion of the prairies (at least of a certain vintage) will be cheering for St Louis.

    Saskatoon blues It’s too bad Hunter got back doored by the board of governors. The franchise does deserve a Cup gonna be tough with Rask being in the zone.

  161. Nit64 says:

    Bag of Pucks:
    Raptors going home up 3-2

    That was like watching the Oilers win a game where the first shot of every period went in the Oil net. Raptors gave up quick double digit deficits at the start of each half and spent most of both halves clawing back. Gritensity. And the best player on the court.

  162. Bruce McCurdy says:

    Primetime:
    Watching the game winning goal for Canada this morning should finally put a myth to bed…

    Stop saying Kekalainen knew there was something wrong with Puljujarvi and that’s why he passed.Kekalainen was a super scout and that’s how he made his name.We are not giving him enough credit that he saw what was RIGHT in Dubois and knew he wanted him on his team.Plain and simple.It was all about seeing what was in PLD.

    The winning goal is being celebrated by Stone, but PLD showed all his attributes, speed, power and amazing hands to set up the goal.He essentially scored it himself, just used Stone’s stick to get it in the net.

    I can see why Kekalainen did not even bother trading down one spot with Oilers to get an extra asset, just in case they took PLD.Decided just to take his man and get out of dodge.Give him credit.

    I said similar on Twitter about Kekalainen knowing what he was doing. Just a great play by PLD to chip the puck to open ice, then overpower his man on his way to it, 2 on 1, bam. Great goal.

  163. Scungilli Slushy says:

    I’m not on board with players spouting in the media.

    Should they make their feelings known? Yes, and they do behind closed doors from everything I’ve absorbed.

    There are malcontents in every industry.

    Whining is not a positive contribution.

    For 650 000 US a year as a minimum contribution player, they can tow the company line and vent appropriately if they wish, which is patently ill advised IMO.

    Only significant players should have much of an opinion as far as any team should be concerned.

    If money is the goal it’s a business, and if some can’t understand that lessons are hard. Ask for a trade, privately if you can’t hack it, which is very often honoured. GMs are not ogres, and now in a closed society being decent to players is better than not being, because scuttlebut.

  164. slopitch says:

    SwedishPoster,

    You mention he plays PK. How does he do? Might be effective with his speed.

  165. Jaxon says:

    Woodguy v2.0: JAX

    Beautifully said. I got a good chuckle out of that one because it fits.

  166. slopitch says:

    In the case of Eberle and Perron, i miss the player but i dont feel as bad about them being gone as the return was fine. The problem is that the team traded players in their prime for lesser assets or futures and the team hasnt been close to good enough since forever to be able to absorb that. Its why the oilers shouldnt be considering trading Klefbom, Nurse or Nuge unless its for a better player. That said, i do think colorado is right loaded and ready to go with Mackinnon on a bargain, Makar/Girard on ELC and Barrie on a decent deal. Watch them sniff around Nuge. Might be an opportunity to fleece them.

  167. Munny says:

    Nit64: That was like watching the Oilers win a game where the first shot of every period went in the Oil net. Raptors gave up quick double digit deficits at the start of each half and spent most of both halves clawing back. Gritensity. And the best player on the court.

    It was a heckuva gutsy win tonight. Vanvliet, Holy Jesus.

    They’ve really surprised me these last two games, especially after having blown three straight third quarter leads.

  168. Munny says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    The defensive performance by the team in the 4th Q was unreal.

    Absolutely. One of the best I’ve seen.

  169. Ivan says:

    rickithebear,

    Good to hear from ya, RB! Beat the shit outta that cancer!

  170. Munny says:

    Woodguy v2.0: Sounds like a guy who could frustrate you with “what if” if he doesn’t improve that part of his game.
    Also sounds like a player if he can fix it.
    I’d interview him and people who know him extensively to figure out if he’s the type to work hard on it.

    His coach calls him a hard-working kid with a positive attitude who has put work into learning the game… attributes his considerable season over season improvement to these qualities.

    So he sounds like a reasonable bet for a project, but as you say, probably too much to hope that he’ll still be around for our 3rd.

    But damn we need some natural goal-scorers on this team.

  171. YKOil says:

    Munny: His coach calls him a hard-working kid with a positive attitude who has put work into learning the game… attributes his considerable season over season improvement to these qualities.

    So he sounds like a reasonable bet for a project, but as you say, probably too much to hope that he’ll still be around for our 3rd.

    But damn we need some natural goal-scorers on this team.

    If you like him then you trade up for him, we have the assets for that imo.

    If he was on my radar I would go so far as to get my best skating people on it, examining the tape, to see if there is improvement there. If they are believers then so am I, and I pull the trigger on a trade.

    (Edit to add) Possible targets for a mid-to-late 2nd rounder: Washington (own pick), Montreal (Columbus pick), Detroit (Islanders and Sharks picks), Rangers (Stars and Lightning picks), Florida (Penguins pick), Carolina (own pick), Islanders (Flames pick), and finally the Devils (Bruins and Predator picks).

    Of note:

    Islanders… don’t have a lot of picks so there could be a volume deal here (Flames 2nd rounder for Islanders 3rd and Oilers 4th).

    Florida… wouldn’t it be interesting to trade for Reimer and the Penguins pick but just send them Brodziak (who they can bury) and the Oilers 4th?

  172. Maoriduvpoojt says:

    Woodguy v2.0: Thanks SP!

    If they run 97,29 and 93 as C’s it sound like he’d slot nicely with 93 and try to create a line that can take some tougher minutes to give 97 and 29 some match up advantages when possible.

    Donskoi would slot there at 3RW very nicely!

  173. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Scungilli Slushy,

    Normally I agree with most of your takes, but this is one where I do not. If I’ve misinterpreted your post, allow me to apologize in advance.

    A player’s salary shouldn’t preclude his opportunity/ability to voice his opinion.

    A player’s salary doesn’t determine his level of intelligence or ability articulate an astute observation.

    A player who opines positions that are counterproductive to winning is completely different than one who has legitimate insights that are relevant to the common goal in a team environment, IE. a championship.

    In this sense, an arbitrary salary cutoff makes little sense in determining the validity of someone’s opinion. It’s the job of management to filter the information while making decisions and, well, manage the talent. (EG. Phil Jackson managed alpha egos that were diametrically opposed to multiple consecutive championships.) Do scouts (who, likely, make less than the league minimum player’s salary) make poor observations or allow bias to inform their decision making process? How much does that influence the direction taken by management? Are there more or fewer strong insights versus poor being delivered by the scouts? Does the GM follow more or less of the strong/poor scouting evaluations? What is the overall impact on their efficacy to the success of the team? Is it the scouts’ fault, or the GM? What about executives in the capacity of player development who make public gaffes which have a tangible, if not measurable, effect on the maturation of key prospects? How does all that compare to the result of a player who makes some gaffes on the ice, and/or says the wrong thing at times — either in private or even to the media in an unguarded moment?

    My philosophy is rather simple. If someone’s opinion and body of work helps the team win, you’re in. If not, you’re out. Results and intent are what should define someone’s worth to an organization that values a winning culture.

    Maybe I missed your point, but the idea of someone’s opinion in relation to their salary falling above or below an imaginary line of merit doesn’t sit well with me.

  174. OriginalPouzar says:

    Guelph and Rouyn-Noranda tonight – quite excited for this one – winner to take on host Halifax in the Championship on Sunday.

  175. OriginalPouzar says:

    Today could be the day the head coach is named.

    Tippet has grown on me and I’m excited for him (assuming he is indeed made official as head coach).

  176. OriginalPouzar says:

    Leavins reporting the deal with Tippett is done and will be announced either today or Tuesday – including assistants.

    He is also advising that it looks like Jay Woodcroft has decided to stay in Bakersfield which is more good news.

  177. Maoriduvpoojt says:

    Nit64: Hey Hunter, make sure your army of transcribers does not miss this “winning” entry:

    https://lowetide.ca/2018/09/11/2018-19-rookie-camp-game-two-oilers-vs-nait-ooks-and-macewan-griffins/comment-page-1/#comment-760521

    ROFLMAO!!!!!!

  178. Maoriduvpoojt says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    Leavins reporting the deal with Tippett is done and will be announced either today or Tuesday – including assistants.

    He is also advising that it looks like Jay Woodcroft has decided to stay in Bakersfield which is more good news.

    I wonder if we see Reider resigned on a 1 year value deal….Tippett was his coach for his 1st 3 seasons in the NHL and in that time he scored 43 goals in 234 games, since then he has 12 goals in 145 games under 4 different coaches/3 different teams……

  179. Reja says:

    Maoriduvpoojt: I wonder if we see Reider resigned on a 1 year value deal….Tippett was his coach for his 1st 3 seasons in the NHL and in that time he scored 43 goals in 234 games, since then he has 12 goals in 145 games under 4 different coaches/3 different teams……

    Why would Holland bring back Reider I hope he aims higher than signing a player that scored a grand total of Zero goals was given every opportunity playing up and down the line-up wasn’t that effective on the PK and like so many other players that get washed out of the league he refused on going to the net.

  180. godot10 says:

    Reja: Why would Holland bring back Reider I hope he aims higher than signinga player that scored a grand total of Zero goals was given every opportunity playing up and down the line-up wasn’t that effective on the PK and like so many other players that get washed out of the league he refused on going to the net.

    There is only upside bringing Rieder back for one year at $1 million.

  181. JOFA says:

    Playfair and Lamb. Hmmm

  182. jp says:

    godot10: There is only upside bringing Rieder back for one year at $1 million.

    I agree. Though I suppose one could make the same statement on essentially every player.

  183. Reja says:

    godot10: There is only upside bringing Rieder back for one year at $1 million.

    I think he has more of a chance of being on the same line as Lander this season in Lokomotiv.

  184. Reja says:

    jp: I agree. Though I suppose one could make the same statement on essentially every player.

    If the Oilers did indeed sign Nygard for a shade under a mil who is a speedy top 9 good on the PK unit player. Does this essentially mean the Oilers have pulled out of the Tobias Reider Sweepstakes.

  185. Nit64 says:

    godot10: There is only upside bringing Rieder back for one year at $1 million.

    You can bury $1,075,000 next year. They should call those Mendoza contracts. Literally 100% replaceable in cap hit.

  186. jp says:

    Reja: If the Oilers did indeed sign Nygard for a shade under a mil who is a speedy top 9 good on the PK unit player. Does this essentiallymean the Oilers have pulled out of the Tobias Reider Sweepstakes.

    I think it’s very unlikely Rieder returns to Edmonton, and agree he’s more likely to be in the KHL than with the Oilers. And yes, to some extent his roster spot is redundant with Nygard.

    I also think he’s a very good bet to rebound and be excellent value for $1M. He scored at least 12 goals in each of his previous 4 NHL seasons and 32 in 73 AHL games before that.

  187. Professor Q says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    Leavins reporting the deal with Tippett is done and will be announced either today or Tuesday – including assistants.

    He is also advising that it looks like Jay Woodcroft has decided to stay in Bakersfield which is more good news.

    Today, or…Tuesday?

    That’s quite a discrepancy.

  188. Reja says:

    jp: I think it’s very unlikely Rieder returns to Edmonton, and agree he’s more likely to be in the KHL than with the Oilers. And yes, to some extent his roster spot is redundant with Nygard.

    I also think he’s a very good bet to rebound and be excellent value for $1M. He scored at least 12 goals in each of his previous 4 NHL seasons and 32 in 73 AHL games before that.

    Really liked the signing last year it just didn’t pan out he played on the perimeter refused to go to the tough areas. I know Bob was mean to him and embarrassed him publicly but we need wingers that can pot 15-20 in the at bats that Rieder recieved last year.

  189. jp says:

    Reja: If the Oilers did indeed sign Nygard for a shade under a mil who is a speedy top 9 good on the PK unit player. Does this essentiallymean the Oilers have pulled out of the Tobias Reider Sweepstakes.

    I also don’t think expectations for Nygard should be a top 9 forward. More like 4th line expectations with the possibility of 3rd line contribution.

    Skills can translate differently (speed), but some comparisons from the Oilers own recent past:

    Nygard has SHL seasons of 29, 34 and 35 points at ages 23, 24 and 25.

    Iiro Pakarinen scored 30 in the SM-L at age 22 before joining the Oilers.

    Jesse Joensuu had seasons of 29 and 25 (in 24 games) in the SHL and SM-L at 24 and 25 before joining the Oilers.

    Lennart Petrell scored 35 points, age 26 the season before joining the Oilers.

    It’s a tough transition for these mature European players coming to the NHL.

  190. Lowetide says:

    For The Athletic: IF the Oilers hire Dave Tippett, we can gain some interesting pieces of knowledge about him from the last Coyotes team he coached.

    https://theathletic.com/992365/2019/05/24/lowetide-dave-tippetts-roster-deployment-in-arizona-and-what-it-might-mean-for-the-oilers/

  191. OriginalPouzar says:

    Reja: Why would Holland bring back Reider I hope he aims higher than signinga player that scored a grand total of Zero goals was given every opportunity playing up and down the line-up wasn’t that effective on the PK and like so many other players that get washed out of the league he refused on going to the net.

    Rieder would likely be a solid signing – a great bet to be a big value contract. I would think he comes in well below the $2M from last season and, if the approaches historical norms, a great value contract.

    He is, of course, a MUCH better player than he showed last year.

    He will, of course, not be re-signing with the Oilers.

    Even if Holland wanted to, and Nicholson’s comments could be tossed aside, does anyone think Tobby would want to re-sign in Edmonton given what’s transpired (assuming he has other NHL options)?

  192. jp says:

    Professor Q: Today, or…Tuesday?

    That’s quite a discrepancy.

    Official things don’t happen on weekends or holidays, right? The NHL is closed on Monday.

  193. OriginalPouzar says:

    Nit64: You can bury $1,075,000 next year. They should call those Mendoza contracts. Literally 100% replaceable incap hit.

    Yup, the only risk with a contract at or under that number is a spot on the 50 max (and, of course, Katz’s pocket book if they are a one-way).

  194. Pouzar says:

    Ryan Rishaug (@TSNRyanRishaug) · Twitter
    https://twitter.com/TSNRyanRishaug

    As per @TSNBobMcKenzie on @TSN1260 radio, the deal with Tippett is not finalized yet. He has not agreed to terms and the process continues.
    39 mins ago

  195. Pouzar says:

    OriginalPouzar: Yup, the only risk with a contract at or under that number is a spot on the 50 max (and, of course, Katz’s pocket book if they are a one-way).

    I read a tweet somewhere that it was a 2 way contract.

    EDIT: It was literally the tweet before the tweet.

    Ryan Rishaug (@TSNRyanRishaug) · Twitter
    https://twitter.com/TSNRyanRishaug

    As had been reported out of Sweden, Oilers look to have landed Nygard. Likely a one year entry level deal (2way) just under a million bucks plus bonuses. Would be UFA after the upcoming season.
    14 hours ago

  196. OriginalPouzar says:

    Professor Q: Today, or…Tuesday?

    That’s quite a discrepancy.

    Generally wouldn’t happen on the weekend and they wouldn’t do in on Monday due to Game 1 of the SCF.

  197. OriginalPouzar says:

    Pouzar: I read a tweet somewhere that it was a 2 way contract.

    Yes, Nygrad is still subject to the ELC contract restrictions so it has to be two-way and maxed out at $925K (including signing bonus of 10%) plus potential performance bonuses.

    I was speaking to contracts in general at or below the fully buryable amount.

  198. OriginalPouzar says:

    jp: Official things don’t happen on weekends or holidays, right? The NHL is closed on Monday.

    Monday isn’t a holiday and the NHL is not closed – it is, however, game 1 of the SCF and Bettman does not like teams to make major announcements on game days during the SCF and its been advised that Holland will respect that.

  199. Reja says:

    jp: I also don’t think expectations for Nygard should be a top 9 forward. More like 4th line expectations with the possibility of 3rd line contribution.

    Skills can translate differently (speed), but some comparisons from the Oilers own recent past:

    Nygard has SHL seasons of 29, 34 and 35 points at ages 23, 24 and 25.

    Iiro Pakarinen scored 30 in the SM-L at age 22 before joining the Oilers.

    Jesse Joensuu had seasons of 29 and 25 (in 24 games) in the SHL and SM-L at 24 and 25 before joining the Oilers.

    Lennart Petrell scored 35 points, age 26 the season before joining the Oilers.

    It’s a tough transition for these mature European players coming to the NHL.

    You never know but if he’s a bust he can be buried I thought Jesse was good before he hurt his back
    Paki did his job on the PK with a surprisingly deceptive shot. Sounds like he’s a speed demon that.has hands will his game translate on the smaller ice service and quicker decision making in the NHL.

  200. Nit64 says:

    Ryan Rishaug
    @TSNRyanRishaug
    ·
    46m
    As per
    @TSNBobMcKenzie
    on
    @TSN1260
    radio, the deal with Tippett is not finalized yet. He has not agreed to terms and the process continues

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