The Edmonton Oilers are going through this experience with Philip Broberg and Dylan Holloway currently. It would help this team enormously if both men could help. On the other hand, good players, men with NHL ability, sometimes spend their careers in lesser leagues. It is not a perfect system.
THE ATHLETIC
- New Lowetide: Which Edmonton Oilers prospects spiked in January?
- New DNB: Jeff Jackson Q&A
- Lowetide: Why Oilers defenceman Vincent Desharnais’ next contract could be bigger than expected
- DNB: Oilers winning streak lives, but improvement is needed: ‘We got a lot more in our group’
- Lowetide: Why Oilers forward Sam Gagner is having success in his role
- DNB: Stuart Skinner’s superb play should give Oilers more trade deadline flexibility
- DNB: Why Oilers signing Corey Perry isn’t a surprise — even in these circumstances
- Lowetide: How the Oilers winning the Stanley Cup in 2024 could impact future
- Lowetide: The Edmonton Oilers’ 6 biggest 2023-24 first half surprises
- DNB: Oilers win 13th straight, most by Canadian team in NHL history
- Lowetide: 5 AHL Oilers prospects with the most value ahead of NHL trade deadline
- DNB: Edmonton Oilers midseason report cards
- Lowetide: Revisiting Oilers’ Dylan Holloway pick at the 2020 NHL Draft
- DNB: Oilers are back as a Western Conference power
- DNB: Projecting the Oilers’ 2025-26 salary-cap situation with a Leon Draisaitl extension
- Lowetide: Ranking Edmonton Oilers GM Ken Holland’s 10 biggest moves
- Lowetide: Edmonton Oilers top 20 prospects ranking, winter 2023
AL ARBOUR
At age 20, Al Arbour spent half a season with the Detroit Red Wings (53-54). He didn’t play in the post season, mostly because the team was a stunner, one of the long forgotten “greatest teams ever.” They won the Stanley, beginning a long run of winning teams for Arbour. Like the great Reggie Smith, it has gone pretty much unnoticed by fans. Aside from Gordie and Ted Lindsay and Alex Delvecchio up front, the blueline boasted Red Kelly, Marcel Pronovost and Bob Goldham, all outstanding defensemen at that time. Arbour struggled through the 50s to crack that deep Red Wing roster, spending time in the WHL (was on the 2nd All Star team representing the Edmonton Flyers, 54-55).
He finally played a full season with the Red Wings in 57-58. In those days the NHL made every effort to improve poor clubs through the Intra League draft (playoff teams could protect only 16 players, non-playoff teams 18). That’s how Chicago got Al Arbour in the summer of 1958, and they played him as a regular for three seasons, highlighted by a tremendous run to the Stanley in 1961 (old timers often say the SC semifinal that season between the Hawks and MTL was the greatest ever. Habs coach Toe Blake was pretty pissed, so it must have been a good one). Arbour on a championship team again, this time a team that had very little pedigree (but a lot of emerging talent).
That summer, fate dealt him a cruel blow as the same Intra League draft saw Arbour get picked up by the emerging Toronto Maple Leafs. It was unfortunate because the Leafs had so much depth Arbour would spend much of the 60s in the minor leagues. He was an NHL regular in 1961-62 though and won the Cup again that spring, this time with the Leafs.
Toronto picked up Kent Douglas that summer, and he won the Calder. Arbour? Back in the AHL although fully qualified to play in the show, he began a run of post-season awards in the AHL:
- AHL First All Star Team (1963, 1964, 1966)
- Won Eddie Shore Award (Outstanding Defenceman, AHL) 1965
Toronto kept protecting him in the Intra League draft and then burying him in the minors. Rochester won a couple of championships in those years, and they probably would have been an outstanding expansion team had they gone as a group to the NHL.
The expansion draft came in 1967, and Al Arbour was among the first picks (by St. Louis). He quickly became the captain and on-ice leader, and after helping them to three straight finals he retired as a player to become coach of the Blues, October 10 1971.
Al Arbour was known as a smart hockey player, a leader and a top quality defenseman. He represents well all those players Rube Foster was talking about: several generations of men who were major league quality but due to the 6-team era played their games in Rochester, in Cleveland, in San Diego.
Arbour’s Championships
- Won Stanley Cup: Player 1961, 1962, 1964.
- Won Stanley Cup: Coach 1980, 1981, 1982, 1983.
- WHL champions 1952-53.
- Calder Trophy (AHL champs) 1965, 1966.
TEEMU HARTIKAINEN
He is in the Swiss league now, and he’s not scoring as before. He is 33, was a productive player in the KHL and I’ve always believed he could have had an NHL career.
At noon today, Sports 1440, we review the weekend and the Oilers winning streak. Rachel Doerrie from Staph and Graph podcast, Jason Gregor and an NFL guest will join us. You can reach me at Lowetide on twitter, in the comments section or on the Sports 1440 text line at 1.833.401.1440 directly.
New for The Athletic: Will the Edmonton Oilers go all-in at the 2024 trade deadline?
https://theathletic.com/5230037/2024/01/29/edmonton-oilers-trade-targets-deadline/
I don’t expect much action at the deadline. Broberg is our defensive upgrade, Perry is the vet forward and Campbell is goalie insurance.
Maybe a RH 4C with size like Nic Dowd. Liked him since his LA days. His offensive production is typical (38 games 7-6-13) but his GF% is through the roof (67%) on a bad CF% (41%) because of what looks like a hot SP. If you split him out from his most common 4th linemates (Malenstyn and Aube-Kubel) his on-ice numbers float back up to above team average (about 50%). He PKs and has a good FO%. Cap hit of $1.3 million for another year.
Chaulk says Broberg was over 30 minutes on Friday night – with the OT and bunch of special teams. Was tough for him the next night in the back to backs but Chaulk is nothing but glowing – tough not to be for anyone that is watching these games.
As for my funsies points predictions for the All Star Break, I was a LOT further off,Which shows what I know!
These are the results:
Team Prediction (actual) variance
Arizona 50 (49) -1, close.
Nashville 59 (54-56, one game to go) -3 to -5. Whiff! Poor Nashville.
Calgary 49 (49) 0. direct hit.
Edmonton 56 (59) +3 Whiff. A very pleasant way to be wrong.
Los Angeles 56 (54-56, one game to go), close and possible direct hit.
Seattle 55 (52-54, one game to go) -1 to -3.Either close to iffy, depending on last game.
Vancouver 67 (71) +4 Whiff. That PDO pony has to stop to graze SOMETIME, doesn’t it???
Vegas 59 (64) +5 Whiff again. How are they doing it with all their injuries etc? I am hoping this magic show of theirs becomes less David Copperfield and more Penn and Teller…
I am going to do another one during the All Star Break for the eve of the trade deadline totals. I hope you are enjoying this as much as I am, no problem with a little fun ribbing on my Whiffs, so don’t worry!
Lol. Love it. Btw, Penn and Tellar put on a pretty good show!
Coach Chaulk also informs that Tulio was hurt in his fight and its a bit worse than Lavoie and will miss the next game.
Coach also confirms that Lavoie did hurt his hand in the fight – “got to try and miss the helmet next time”.
The last several games before have been most instructive regarding the winning streak. In the last 3 games in particular teams like Chicago and Columbus were low in the standings but both also brought their A games; holding the Oilers to low scoring first 2 periods by sheer emotion.
Every team Oilers face are bringing their A games.
Now people in Toronto are saying Oilers are playing the best hockey in the NHL, hands down.
Meanwhile, Calgary fans are apoplectic with panic, grief, and delusions about: “when Oilers finally play a good team” etc.
Vancouver fans say Oilers are peaking at the wrong time, lol, as if there is no other team Oilers would love to face in the 1st round. That series goes to the Oilers in 4, 5 tops.
Someone posted yesterday, slagging Rasmus Andersson as a Ceci upgrade.
Are you kidding me?
If Calgary was crazy enough to trade us Rasmus Andersson, depending on the cost, I don’t see a scenario where you don’t seriously consider it.
2 more years at $4.55m. 27. Right hand shot. Plays 24 minutes per night. Plays a hair under two minutes per game more than Nurse. Can run a power play. Positive FF% against elites two of the last three years.
1.51.3 points/60 at 5v5.That my friends is an insane value contract.
He’s like the right-handed Chyckrun
What player type would you want to pair with Nurse?
A speedy guy who can make outlet passes or a big, probably slow, shutdown guy who can’t make outlet passes?
He’s a much better player than Chychrun.
If it was structured like the Ekholm deal (Ceci + Bourgault + 1st) I’d do that all day long. And I like Ceci.
The knocks on Chychrun don’t apply here.
He’s not made of glass.
He has had a positive goal share for the past three years. He kills penalties.
Chychrun also is more of a transition player like Nurse who likes to skate the puck. Andersson is a better outlet passer, imo, than Chychrun.
Yeah – that’s been me pushing Rasmus Andersson as a hypothetical trade target. Full disclosure though … I think hell will freeze over before the Flames send us their number 1 defenseman.
Andersson’s been their number 1 when they were a good regular season team (until the Oilers broke them in the playoffs) and their number 1 over the past couple seasons when they’ve been mediocre … he is absolutely not the reason that the Flames are mediocre but he is playing too many minutes, as their 3rd pairing has been a tire fire.
Scale his TOI back 2 minutes/game and pair him with a proper LHD like Nurse, and he’d absolutely be an upgrade over Ceci, with 2 more years of term left after this one on a cap friendly deal.
Calgary would never trade him to us though, and even if they would consider it, I think it’d take a lot more than Ceci + Bourgault + 1st, as he’s younger, and has a lower cap hit than Ekholm.
Tanev is a more realistic target.
He isn’t approaching 1.5 P/60 at 5v5, even with a career high this year, and his Rel fancies are pretty all pretty unimpressive.
I definitely still agree he’s a major value contract though, and would be an Ekholm type add to the team.
I just can’t imaging the price would be reasonable, and it’s hard to see how the Oilers fit in $4.55M even if it is good value.
I’m sorry, but slagging is a bit harsh of a description of my reluctance to acquire Andersson as an upgrade over Ceci.
Slagging: to criticize in an abusive and insulting manner.
My point was that over the years he hasn’t been able to put up the results vs elites that Ceci has, and where he was able to do better than break even he relied on a PDO heater.
RA:
https://puckiq.com/players/8478397
CC:
https://puckiq.com/players/8476879
Factor in the AAV, and acquisition cost, and it’s not a clear cut win. Then you have the inconsistency that plagues Andersson and it’s less of a slam dunk, IMO.
I view Andersson like you. He’s an offensive d-man that cheats for offence. His defensive play is very average. When you watch the highlights of the Oilers vs Flames in the second round, Andersson is the guy gifting the Oilers glorious chances.
Andersson is a better player, but if I were to upgrade Ceci, I just want a Mr.Reliable guy, like Ekholm.
I’m not sure that there is an actual upgrade out there on Ceci that will be availible on trade deadline day.
Tanev
I believe the deadline for the NHLPA (on behalf of Perry) to file a grievance on the contract termination is either today or tomorrow.
I’ve got to presume this happens. I mean, as of now, we have a precedent where a $4MM contract is terminated (which can only be done with cause or agreement) for cause but the player was never ineligible to play in the league or sign another contract at any point – he could have signed somewhere the next day.
Now, what happened definitely doesn’t need to be made public but it sure needs to be detailed for the other 31 teams as we have a precedent for contract termination with, as of now, no consequence to the team
The other 31 organizations need to know the type of circumstance that can lead to this type of clean termination.
I would think there will be a grievance and a settlement where Perry is provided a financial amount and the Hawks hit with a retroactive cap hit which won’t matter.
Jiricek in Columbus has gone to the media with regards to his displeasure at being in the minors. 20 years old. For RHD, CBJ has signed Severson and Gudbranson the past two summers, and has Peeke and Boqvist on NHL deals with term.
It’s not just the Oilers who have to deal with players being unhappy that they are blocked from more regular playing time in the NHL.
I wonder if Edmonton and Columbus could just swap their disgruntled young defensemen?
Only if he’s as good as Bro, which seems unlikely as Peeke and Boq aren’t that good for various reasons and he can’t take steal their jobs
Said with tongue in cheek of course.
I like Broberg, and I think the organization likes him plenty too. They’ve put a lot of development time in to Broberg, and that’s the kind of thing that pays off in the long run. The AHL is a tough league full of guys who are hungry for an NHL job… going down and dominating that level of competition is never a bad thing for a young player who didn’t come to North America fully ready for how intense the NHL can be.
I bring up the Jiricek news only to highlight that Broberg’s situation is not unique. Mostly we’ve heard about him being disgruntled at the lack of playing time in the NHL from third party sources, rather than the player himself, which is a good sign that player accepts that he has to bide his time. It’s a bad sign when the player himself is lamenting his plight to reporters the way Jiricek did.
I’ve never thought that the Oilers have ever seriously considered trading Broberg, and that most of the noise we’re hearing is from “insiders” trying to drum up click bait.
BTW remember when people thought Kekalainen was some sort of savant GM hiring because he wasn’t from traditional hockey circles. Yeah no, he’s been terrible, his team hasn’t won squat under him, and CBJ is a tire fire now.
The whole “he’s a Finn, so he had intel about JP before the draft” angle was so lazy. Really made me shake my head.
Per DNB, Lavoie is having an x-ray on his hand today……. Mike Griffith tweeted no break but I guess we’ll see.
X-Ray negative. Good stuff.
Did they notice he’s alien?
Has to be the reason for the lack of human love
DNB? He seems very empathetic.
I think Dylan Holloway is proving in real time that he can help, and is helping.
He’s added an element of speed, size and skill with a crazy motor to the bottom six and makes this team deeper and better even if his offence likely remains shy on that line. He is proving to be a legit NHL player and looks to be on the precipice of pushing for top 6 time (in due course or if an injury provides the opportunity).
I am highly confidant that Broberg can play 3LD, every day, 14 minutes of 5 on 5 with a depth PK role, right now and in the playoffs.
Of course, he is blocked by a shockingly healthy veteran stable of LD but, of course, at some point, someone is going to get banged up, etc.
I think Broberg can help, right now, and, at some point soon, he’s going to be needed in this lineup and it will be up to him to make it hard for the coaching staff to take him out.
It should also be pointed out that Kulak has been on the ice for something like 1 goal against in the month of January, and has formed a really effective pairing with Vinny. Good, health, solid play, the cap crunch and Broberg’s waiver eligibility are all conspiring keep Brogerg in the AHL for now.
Kulak should pretty easy to unload in the summer with two years left at a very manageable cap hit, with no trade protection.
Broberg will be the full-time 3LD next season, and until then he can continue to hone his craft in the Bake, and be the ultimate injury insurance going into the playoffs.
The shockingly healthy part is the truth. When was the last injury that took a player out for more than a game in the top 6?
For some detail. Oiler current top 6 dmen have played a total of 758 games including pre, regular and post season over the last season and a half. Latest numbers I can find show nhl players get injured at a rate of 9.6 times per 1000 game events.
We should have seen 7 or 8 injuries in this time span. Not looking forward to this stat regressing.
Knock on wood, but Holland has spoken in the past about valuing player ‘availability’.
IIRC it was mentioned (in general terms) around the time Chychrun was being considered.
But my point is, I think the group of Oilers D that’s been assembled has a healthier than average history (ie – the group may not fully regress to the meat).
Not sure how many realize the talent that played here for the Edmonton Flyers. Basically the AHL of the day for the Red Wings. Johnny Bucyk Norm Ullman and many more. A few ended up on the WHA Oilers.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edmonton_Flyers
That’s how I feel about the Edmonton Trappers. The list of fantastic ballplayers is staggering. Jim Edmonds, Jason Giambi, Fernando Valenzuela, Johan Santana, Matt Stairs, Tim Salmon, Dante Bichette, David Eckstein…
And 50HR (for the Trappers) man Ron Kittle.
I remember watching Devon White as well and how even to my untrained youthful eye how his talent stood out.
The 86 team that lost in the ALCS had Wally Joyner , Dick Schofield and Gary Pettis starting. All 3 went through Edmonton. All in all I agree we saw terrific talent.
Pretty sure Devon White was genetically spliced with a gazelle….
Remember the Devon White catch in the World Series for a triple-play that the umps ruled wasn’t a triple-play?
What a talent. Loved watching that guy.
I have the baseball card to prove it.
Gruber made that tag!
As a child, my fav team was that NYI dynasty – Trottier, Bossy, Gillies, Potvin, Smith, etc all coached by the mastermind Arbour. Lucky me, I moved to Edm in the early 90’s just to switch allegiances to my previously hated Oilers as they entered their incompetent phase.
Thanks for the Arbour history. I have even more respect for what he accomplished beyond those first childhood hockey memories
My fandom goes:
1. Edmonton
2. NY Islanders
The mentor franchise is to be respected.
I can absolutely respect something I despise, as was the case with the Islanders. Or Michael Bolton… I respect the talent but not a fan of either!
Michael Bolton has talent?
He has a helluva voice. Just uses it to produce crappy music!
I hated Billy Smith. The guy was the dirtiest goalie ever!
Until he met one Mr Pouzar
’Me married, no need pretty’
Classic
Just looked up this reference… Classic indeed…
In the penalty box the other guy yelling at him Pouzar says “hockey is man’s game, maybe you should play chess”. Apparently wasn’t taken well
Another Pouzarism was told by one of the old Oilers, I think it was Lowe.
Pouzar had just taken a hellish hit and was rithing on the ice. The trainer rushed over and the players gathered around very concerned.
Pouzar still down looked at them and said “Hollywood more penalty”.
Awesome
That, my friend is the ultimate hockey quote. Love it to death.
Don’t forget about Ron Hextall
My all time fav goalie. Wish there were some like him today. No one ran him without a payment due.
This idea of over baking hockey players is bad thinking for today’s NHL player. Review the Elite Prospects for players in the 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s, 00s, 10s, 20s. You will see an amateur system that has changes so significantly that Sam Pollock would not recognize it.
Today’s kids begin to be 12-month hockey players, around 10 years old. The youth hockey players of today are exposed to better training than a lot of college programs. Next time you drive to Banff on the north side of highway 1 you with see The Edge school, with the attached indoor hockey rink, stop in and peak at the focus of the school. Or if you have time head to the southeast edge of town and stop in at the Foothills Soccer Club, these organizations are not alone, and they are breaking the mold of youth athletes.
Over baking some of these 20–23-year-old hockey players is a mistake; it is a missed opportunity for cap strapped teams.
Some teams are cap strapped pretenders, some teams are cap strapped contenders.
I think the Perry signing is based off what the leadership on the team felt it missed in last year’s playoffs, which was a Duncan Keith-style presence.
You’re probably correct about the move away from slow-baking as development. But then I wonder if the intangibles of veteran leadership amount to a quantitative impact vs. youth for a contending team, which is recognized in this room in particular.
Well. We saw instances of the extreme opposite through DoD so there’s gotta be some give n take.
My point is don’t compare 20 year olds from the 20s with the kids from the 00 or 10s.
Today there are 66 NHL players that have played at least 25 games, that are age 22 or younger all adding value to their teams at a significant discount. The Oilers have zero players in this cohort and are cap starved.
I don’t know which 66 players you are referring to, but I wonder about the context… As in, is the player more advanced in his development than others his age? Are the teams they play for in a Stanley Cup window? Are they productive players or are they essentially being developed in the NHL by teams short on talent or cap space to fill out a roster etc? I think circumstance dictates how these players are handled. Some kids are just ready sooner than others and those players should certainly get fast tracked if the conditions are right.
Take Hollywood as an example; Was he ready last season or did he need just a bit longer in the oven? To be fair, if he hadn’t been injured this season, he would fit your criteria to a tee…
I hear your point. In the Oilers case Kulak is blocking an 8th overall. Brett Kulak is a fine 3rd pairing NHLer, that is not deniable. is he so good and adds so much to the Oilers he is blocking Broberg, I will debate this point all day.
It’s funny. I was going to check what the numbers looked like 10 and 20 years ago. I went to last year so I could use 41 games as a cutoff for a full season.
In 22-23 there were only 26 NHL players who’d played 41 or more games and who hadn’t turned 22 by May 1st 2023. 2 of the 26 were Broberg and Holloway.
10 years earlier (12-13) there were 36 NHLers who who played half a season at age 22 or under (I picked poorly since this was a lockout season with a shorter season – everyone played the same # of games though). 3 of the 36 were Oilers (Hall, Nuge and Yakupov). Evander Kane was also an under 22 NHLer that year.
20 years ago (02-03) there were 24 NHLers who played half the season at 22 or younger. Hemsky was the only Oilers. Though 1/24 is still a little more than average across 30 teams.
I dunno, the Oilers were quite over-represented in 22 and under players last season. Also in 12-13. Doesn’t appear to be that much of a change over time either (though I just picked 3 seasons).
Use capfriendly active players, age slider and minimum 25 games hit refresh. 66 name will appear.
Sure, I guess I’m just not seeing the Oilers under Holland missing out on having young, cheap/ELC players on the roster and contributing.
Holloway this season, Holloway/Broberg last season, McLeod/Bouchard the year before, Yamamoto, Puljujarvi, Bear, Jones before that.
You gotta know when to play em
Know when to waive em
Know when to trade away
Know when to run
You should always count your money
When you’re at the negotiating table
There’s not time enough for counting
When the dealings done
Since games are won on goal differential, not strictly GF%, I thought I would look at who the biggest contributors have been during the 16 game win streak. All numbers are 5v5:
Draisaitl +14 (20-6)
McLeod +14 (17-3)!!
Bouchard +13 (21-8)
McDavid +12 (20-8)
Ekholm +11 (18-7)
Foegele +9 (17-8)
Hyman +9 (16-7)
Nurse +7 (18-11)
Kulak +6 (8-2)
Ceci +5 (15-10)
Nugent-Hopkins +4 (12-8)
Desharnais +4 (6-2)
Janmark +4 (4-0)
Brown +2 (4-2)
Gagner +1 (3-2)
Hamblin +1 (2-1)
Holloway +1 (2-1)
Kane even (8-8)
Erne even (2-2)
Ryan -2 (2-4)
Perry, Lavoie and Kemp are 0-0 goals.
5v5 goal differential per sixty:
McLeod +4.46
Draisaitl +3.37
McDavid +2.67
Bouchard +2.64
Foegele +2.59
Ekholm +2.37
Hyman +2.10
Kulak +1.66
Janmark +1.50
Nurse +1.46
Gagner +1.42
Holloway +1.30
Desharnais +1.10
Ceci +1.07
Nugent-Hopkins +1.02
All others less than 1.00 GD/60.
Seems like a real team effort, with McLeod, Bouchard and Foegele really stepping up to help the usual suspect: McDavid, Draisaitl and Hyman. I’m impressed how the bottom-6 has performed too. Holloway showing well in a small sample, looking forward to seeing him put together a healthy run after the all star break.
How do you see G Diff and GF% as different? I was pondering this a few says ago and perhaps don’t have enough math to have come up with a difference
Player A is 15-10 goals.
Player B is 2-1 goals.
Both have a 66.67 GF%. Player A is +5 goal differential and Player B is +1.
Player A is more valuable to the team as he contributed five more goals than allowed.
Goal differential per sixty gives more context. While McLeod and Kulak have nearly identical GF%, the Oilers have outscored the opposition by nearly 4.5 goals per sixty minutes of McLeod’s ice time, but have outscored by 1.66 goals with Kulak on ice. Ergo, McLeod has had a far greater impact.
I see thx. Actual goals vs ratio
After experiencing the DoD and watching GM after GM and coach after coach toss young, promising players into the deep, shark infested waters of the NHL before they could swim, I was very happy that the Oilers brought in Ken Holland and his EZ Bake oven. His approach, though glacial in nature, has developed two young players (Hollywood and Broberg) into proper ‘ready for the Bigs’ players. Holloway’s game was looking very promising before he was injured and still does now that he’s back. Meanwhile, Broberg is dominating in the A (from all reports I’ve seen anyway), and will make one helluva Black Ace for the upcoming playoff run before settling into his permanent role on the squad next season. I would be absolutely, positively shocked if Holland dealt him at the deadline. Just isn’t his M.O. to trade a big, strapping Swede who projects as a top 4 d-man, who also happens to be KH’s first ever pick with the Oil. He is Fully Completely invested in this player…
The way he slow-baked Bouchard for instance, or has left Lavoie in and set it to broil, just to get some extra crispy on him, I think checks out re Broberg. Holland brought his methods into a scenario where patience had been long spent. His objective of course, is to bring a Stanley Cup to Edmonton. A prospect whereby even as favorites, one can rarely claim more than 15% odds of that actually happening. If he’s successful, I’ll be grateful irrespective of the path that got us there. Would be awesome for Broberg to get some time late in season, and as a 7 if necessary in playoff play. Sorry for the meandering reply. I don’t really have a point.
You’re right to include Bouch and Lavoie as well. One a bonafide success and the other is the ‘next project’.
I have found it very interesting that so many posters here would seemingly prefer to repeat the mistakes of the past by rushing players up. The DoD continues to seep into the minds of some, or perhaps is so deeply ingrained that it never left. I know I still have to stave off those demons from time to time…
I agree with the overarching sentiment but this is likely Holland’s last year with the team and we have no idea what internal dynamic he has with Jackson. There is a chance that Holland has lost the chair already.
Fair enough. Even with that in mind though, it doesn’t change what KH has already accomplished and the change in the development mindset he has brought to this organization. Whether that continues without him, should he leave, is anyone’s guess, but I think he has rebooted this franchise with his proven methods.
Broberg should have been tried in the Ceci spot this year to see if he was an answer or a potential answer in the future to a notable weakness on the team, to assess whether assets have to expended to upgrade the position.
When a team has seven competent D, they should use seven D for six spots over the entire season, to keep them fresh and healthy for the playoffs, and to make them more interchangeable.
The last month and the last week of the NHL schedule for the Oilers is a beast. They will need seven D for it, and one should have been using the regular season to prepare for it.
So if one of the current six gets nicked, the adjustments would be more seamless.
You beat this drum soundly and often, which you are entitled to do. However, I disagree. Given the circumstances, I think Broberg is exactly where he should be, playing big, important minutes and owning the AHL rather than floating in and out of the line up here. He’s being put in positions to succeed and he’ll be ready to jump into the lineup when needed in the playoffs. Should be fairly seamless integration as he has familiarity with the big club already.
They did try Broberg on the right side, didn’t they?
There are often other considerations than what the coach and/or GM want, especially nowadays. Usually injuries would be the cover to experiment
And Holland isn’t exactly cutting edge, he’s very traditional in approach
It was not feasible to try a player that was 7th on the depth chart coming out of camp (he had an injury at camp that limited his effectiveness) on the top pairing playing the toughest minutes on the team (elite comp without high McDavid minutes).
Even taking away that would be an his off-side, something he had rarely done in North America (never in the AHL and sporadic in his limited minutes in the NHL).
——————-
I agree with the original post in the thread and the real “issue” was the long term contract to Kulak with Broberg “coming” and Nurse/Ekholm already locked in.
I get having to win the spot over a vet but they locked in that LD for 4 years.
It was Ekholm and Kulak who had injury issues in camp, not Broberg.
Broberg had lots of playing time in pre-season, on both sides.
No. 2 in total five-on-five icetime through the pre-season.
https://www.naturalstattrick.com/playerteams.php?fromseason=20232024&thruseason=20232024&stype=1&sit=5v5&score=all&stdoi=oi&rate=y&team=EDM&pos=D&loc=B&toi=0&gpfilt=none&fd=&td=&tgp=410&lines=single&draftteam=ALL
He played most often with Deslauriers and Ceci
https://www.naturalstattrick.com/playerreport.php?fromseason=20232024&thruseason=20232024&stype=1&sit=5v5&stdoi=oi&rate=n&v=t&playerid=8481598
Maybe it was the prior exhibition that Broberg had a tweak that he played through in camp.
Either way, the point was, his play in camp wasn’t indicative of his placement in the toughest role in the team on his non-natural side.
I wouldn’t equate exhibition game reps on the right side to, well, anything.
Agree – putting Broberg on his off-side next to Nurse is the kind of bat-$hit crazy that previous managers would have done.
At the time that Kulak was signed to that deal, Broberg was no sure thing. Lots of young defensemen look promising after their draft year, and get over hyped by online scouts, then face plant as pros in the NHL. See Ty Smith.
I think Vinny benefitted by having Kulak as a partner … Kulak is a really solid pro that knows how to look after himself on and off the ice.
This summer, move Kulak to a team that needs a solid pro to shelter their kids, sign Desharnais with the freed up cap space, and then Broberg slides in to a sheltered role at 3LD with a solid mentor in Vinny.
Suppose one of Ceci, Bouchard, or Desharnais, or whatever veteran scrub Holland trades for at the deadline (if he doesn’t upgrade Ceci) gets injured in the playoffs, who plays right D other than Broberg.
The OIlers had 7D for six spots. They should have played all seven, sitting one a night, nobody for two games in a row. Broberg would have got to play with pretty much everybody equally, 50% on the left side, and 50% on the right side, for 70-80% of the games.
And one would have been able to make a better informed decision at the trade deadline.
Pronger would often play with a young less experienced D in St. Louis. Marc Bergeron saw quite a bit of ice time with him in Edmonton.
Miro Heiskanen played top 4 right D as a left shot rookie at 19. Broberg is three years older. Draft+5 vs. Draft+2 With a much less capable partner than Darnell Nurse.
Remember, the Oilers right shot D are not exactly interchangeable, or easily capable of being switched between pairs. They are an idiosyncratic lot.
It is not like the Oilers D are all so young that a little bit of load management would not be useful.
The way to be prepared for hard times (i.e. injuries) is to prepare for hard times. The OIlers had an alternative to just hoping things will work out if there is an injury.
The Oilers started the season 2-9-1 – they were in no position to ice experiment with a potential lesser lineup in order to prepare for the playoffs.
I’ve been very much pro-Broberg and believe they’ve needed to find a way to get him real minutes in a 6D set-up for since October 2022 but its hard to argue with how the coaching staff has been deploying their D to this point.
There are still 38 games left and I think its reasonable to suggest Broberg will get some games and perhaps many – its a very hectic schedule starting in a few weeks.
If there was competition for ice time on the ice, maybe the players who were responsible for that 2-9-1 would have played better.
Who does this?
There must be an example or two, but I can’t think of one.
We’ve gone from one extreme situation to the next … the start of the season was not a good time to be inserting an inexperienced D-man into the top 4 mix as the team was reeling at the time. The Oilers then went on all-time heater, and the top 6 d-men have been healthy and were all playing really well over that stretch.
BTW Nurse is no Pronger, and Broberg is no Heiskanen.
They’ve already scaled Nurse’s minutes back … he’s down to 22:25 mins/game … a full 1 minute less than what he averaged last season and a full three minutes down from a few seasons ago. They’ve given all three pairings more balanced ice time since KK and Coffee took over.
No doubt we’ll see Broberg get some games before the season is over … KK and Coffey probably want to see what he looks like in the NHL as much as you do. But having 3 stable D pairings is a big reason for the improvement in their D-zone play, and there is no point messing with that right now with the team playing this well.
I would support this verbal diarrhea if the team was struggling, but they are not.
I am convinced that Broberg, Wanner and Lavoie must be a part of the future. Bourgault and all other prospects and Draft picks must be on the table this season.
Next season will be a completely different animal due to the salary handcuff that be slapped on this team. If there is any sort of plan for a sustained competitive squad in Oil Town, the unspent youth with their low cap hits, will be a key part of the formula for future success.
They don’t have a better choice, so if they toss those players away for a shot at Stanley, they aren’t doing it right.
Time will reveal all…