I find myself drifting back to one year ago, when I asked the following question: Have I ever seen an NHL team with such a high ceiling also show such a miserable floor? My answer last season was yes. The Montreal Canadiens of 1969-70 won Stanleys in 1969 and 1971. In 69-70, everything went sideways for the Habs. They missed the playoffs. I was thrilled! Looking back, I think Montreal’s 1970-71 rookie crop (Marc Tardif, Reggie Houle, Guy Lapointe and late in the season Ken Dryden) was a key to the recovery. The Oilers have Matt Savoie, Noah Philp, Max Wanner and Olivier Rodrigue on the horizon, not quite the same. No disrespect intended, I think those four men have a real chance.
These Oilers are meh. Motzah balls. Air Supply. According to Jim. Dull as dishwater. I don’t know how a team housing Connor McDavid can be uninteresting, but we are here.
THE NUMBERS
The numbers were better for Edmonton than the first two games, but there’s a lot of indifference in these totals. Pretty much every individual player did good things (Mattias Ekholm had an assist and was 12-5 shots at five-on-five) but we also saw chaos and drifting. Ekholm is a great damn player, I’m not picking on him, rather pointing out the general malaise on this roster runs deep.
If you want my analysis on this team and this year, it goes like this: The Edmonton Oilers are a team in the National Hockey League.
JUSTIN KIRKLAND
My happiest moment yesterday came when Flames forward Justin Kirkland scored. Drafted in 2014, he has barely played in the league. I liked him on draft day, and in recent years have watched him in the AHL. Smart, smart player. I think he could have a career as a late bloomer (he is 28) and wish him well. I ranked him No. 39 in 2014, glad to see he landed.
HAPPY THANKSGIVING!
Happy Thanksgiving! I wish the best for you and your family and hope you get to spend time today with all of your people. I had a wonderful turkey dinner last night, with good conversation and much laughter. Sincere thanks to Bob and Sophie for being such kind people.
Fall is always going to be a difficult time of year, especially October and November. In a lifetime of experiences, October 2022 and October 2023 were a time when the earth was moving under my feet and I felt out of control and in distress. I felt broken.
I am no longer there. I am grateful for the grace of time and distance, am fully aware of how lucky I have been in life, and still working through the long goodbye to my north star. I wish it on no one. I can say time heals, and there are angels among us. Be well. Love is love. Be kind to all, especially yourself.
New for The Athletic: Is there a significant trade in the Edmonton Oilers’ near future?
https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5840092/2024/10/14/edmonton-oilers-trade-timothy-liljegren/
I am still mad as hell from some of the events of the summer, and I don’t have the solution like I did last year. I do not have real belief in the roster as currently constructed. I would have done many things differently during the summer.
Turns out the Kane haters and the McLeod haters were wrong. (I concede that Jackson got reasonable value for McLeod in the trade, but McLeod would be helping right now) Kane cannot get back quickly enough.
The pressure point might be Evan Bouchard. Oilers can’t continue lapses into chaos and Darnell Nurse isn’t going to bring you a Pronger or Hasek. The Oilers one play is to send away elite offensive talent for elite defensive talent.
I’m beginning to think this is necessary. It’s a damnable shame.
Why is it a shame to send value for value if it makes you a better team?
The Oilers drafting of McDavid, Draisaitl and Bouchard is a fantastic trio in a five-year period. Offense is the rarest thing in hockey, and Bouchard’s outscoring performances are fantastic.
It’s a shame because, all things being equal, defensive players are less expensive in trade.
Another Taylor Hall for Adam Larsson deal is not something I would like to see.
yes I agree. Thats not value for value. But a top 4 D with term for anyone but Leon or Connor would be acceptable
Poster #1
Poster #2
Broberg is #5 in total time on ice on the Blues. 4th amongst D. #4 in even strength ice time. 4th amongst D. Ditto 5-on-5. On the 2nd unit PP, which plays about as often as the Oilers 2nd unit PP. Suter is playing over Broberg on the PK right now.
Broberg is the only Blues D who has not been on for a goal against (even strength and/or special teams) in 3 games. (Sort of like the Stanley Cup finals)
He has fit in seamlessly with Justin Faulk on the 2nd pair. Broberg has 1 goal and 2 assists, all at even strength in 3 games. The Blues broadcasters and media have been pleasantly surprised with his physicality, and are generally more than pleased with his overall game. They are still mostly hoping for Bouwmeester, but some are now hoping for Bouwmeester with offense.
Parayko and Leddy are the shutdown pair, and see most of the toughest minutes, and have had tough start to the regular season even though the Blues are 2W1L all on the road to start.
Faulk and Broberg have been the rocking chair pair for the Blues so far.
Holloway has been moved around. Started the 1st game on 3rd line LW. Moved to 1st line LW with Thomas in the 2nd game. And played 3rd line centre mostly in game 3.
Saad will be back from paternity leave Tuesday, but since Schenn is playing wing on the 1st line with Thomas and Neighbours, Holloway is likely to stay as #3C until Sundqvist comes back from injury. Faksa is playing 4th line centre, on a line that has been very good, so they may not want to move him.
Holloway has been fine. Again the Blues broadcasters and media have been moderately surprised by him.
The special teams D, Leddy and Parayko on PK, and Faulk, on PP and PK, are the only D and a special teams forward, Thomas on PP and PK, who play more than Broberg on the Blues. I don’t think that qualifies as being sheltered.
None of my business. But why you do invested in those two? Just to justify or to say I told you so?
I didn’t start the Broberg commentary today. If people don’t post accurately about Broberg and Holloway, I will correct the record.
Looks like Holloway with be on right wing with Schenn (at centre) and Joseph tomorrow on the 3rd line. Saad playing LW with Thomas and Neighbours.
Why am I invested? Broberg was drafted in 2019. Holloway in 2020. As Oilers. I’ve followed them for 5 effing years. Broberg was the most fascinating player at the 2018 Hlinka in Edmonton, so I was exposed to him as a prospect even before the Oilers drafted him. (I was hoping for Cozens in that draft, but when he was taken the pick before the Oilers drafted, I was fine with the choice of Broberg, moreso, when Klefdoom struck)
The Oilers were set up to seemlessly pass from Ekholm Bouchard to Broberg Bouchard and set up a decade of contention in the remainder of the McDavid era, and Jeff Jackson effed it up. And Holloway was also a near perfect complementary forward for that contending era. I am mad as hell and I am not going to take it anymore.
I get that. I always liked Broberg but not sold on Holloway
Robert Thomas (a Bergeron-like right shot centre) was picked two spots before Yamamoto. So close, yet so far. He could be a sleeper pick for Team Canada in the Four Nations as a 4th line centre or as one of the extra forwards.
Love this response and couldn’t agree more.
I’m amazed how many posters are suddenly downplaying how important these young players were going to be for the Oilers over the next few years. As soon as they signed the offer sheets they suddenly became bad players? C’mon people.
The loss of these two players has been, and will be, very large for the Oilers.
At the same time, their value markedly decreased when they signed their offer sheets and took their cap hits to triple and double their market comparables. Part of their value was them being on value contracts for the next 1-2 years (at least).
The loss strings, these two players were scheduled to be in the “middle of the lineup” on value deals – losing the players and losing the value deals was a big hit.
If you think the league hates us now. Just wait until coach Quenneville
I don’t think the league hates him or bowman.
I think the opposite is true.
Obviously 0-3 is abysmal.
but the issues with the team are obvious.
Oilers have been outscored 15-3. The goalies and the big boys are the biggest issues.
The stuff that’s being said about the character and abilities of a group of individuals who were as close to winning the Cup as these guys were less than 4 months ago is quite remarkable.
You should have heard what Oilers fans said about Grant Fuhr, and he was a key piece in the Stanley run of the 1980’s.
Coffey took his share of ridicule.
From high up (Pocklington, Sather) as well as the fans.
I recall the following after a 3 game losing streak with Knob as coach (less than a full year):
a 16 game winning streak
an 8 game winning streak
3 straight wins against the deserved Stanley Cup Champions
This team needs to settle down and ramp up all at the same time.
The 1st line needs to be a positively impactful line and that starts with McDavid and Hyman not being uncommitted in the defensive zone. Jeff Skinner was the best 2-way forward on that line last night – come on.
Settle down, play as a unit and play with commitment to battle.
It starts against Philly tomorrow – get a win and get some positive energy as you head on on the road!
Leon has had a few spurts but let’s face it he’s been awful. I expected after he signed for life the GNP of Lithuania that he would be ripping it up. The blame is squarely on the first 2 lines they can’t even draw a penalty they aren’t moving their feet. Why does everyone keep pounding Connor and Leon when they are playing like crap. Tippett-Woody-Knob they all go against what they should do which is limit their minutes and go with whose playing well. The Coach needs to send some tough love and that begins with Connor and Leon.
Haven’t seen Leon that bad.
Maybe that’s just me.
He has looked good entering the zone and to my eye there have been a number of plays that fell through simply because his linemates haven’t yet learned to play with him or off him.
I somewhat agree that I don’t think Leon has been as “disappointing” as McDavid early in the season and the reason, for me, is that I haven’t seen Leon be directly culpable on 3 goals against like McDavid (and the culpability being lack of commitment or effort in the defensive zone, as opposed to a mistake “trying to make a play”).
Neither has been particularly dynamic offensively (relative to expectations) but one of them, at least to my eye, has been “poorer” on the other side of the puck and its hurt the team.
This is not to bash McDavid – it just is what it is and even Connor called himself out post-game last night.
@JonathanWillis
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1h
These are interesting times.
On the one hand, we’re shooting 3.2% and have an 815 PDO, so there’s no where to go but up.
On the other hand, some themes have arisen.
I think it was Curlock who noted that the Oilers lost 3 speedy puck transporters in McLeod, Holloway, and Foegele while not having the puck movers on d to compensate.
The loss of these three also accounts for an inability to generate back pressure against rush chances.
No one to back check? Check.
Not enough players to transport the puck? Check.
Old and slow bottom six? Check.
In net Skinner is streaky and we couldn’t really trust Pickard much to spell him off even in the playoffs. Not finding one of the many available cheap upgrades on Pickard was probably a mistake.
Unreliable goalie tandem? Check.
Jackson fell victim to falling in love with son playoff performances thinking play would continue.
We didn’t have two d pairs that we trusted during the playoffs. Flushing Ceci was the apparent solution, but we’ve exacerbated the problem bringing in a bunch of cast offs from Arizona and a small sample size darling from San Jose.
Lacking two reliable d pairs? Check.
Complete lack of truculence on the lineup.
Not enough grit? Check.
With Hyman, Skinner, and Draisaitl, you have three guys in the top six who don’t like to play defense. Arvidsson isn’t a stalwart defensively either.
Back in the summer I always pushed back against the opinion that this team wasn’t going to miss Ryan McLeod. I was/am OK with the trade and like it but was not on board with those that said the team is better without McLeod because he is too soft and has no offence.
I cited the PK and, more importantly, his transporting the puck – he was only behind McDavid in the ability to get the puck out, through and in.
It would be helpful if Adam Henrique would show up.
I didn’t like the loss of McLeod at all though the Oilers were over the cap and he had one year left on his contract. Given those circumstances I understand why they traded him.
Still, with McLeod you can cover for two slower players on a line no problem.
I wasn’t and am still not sure what to think about Savoie. You would usually like to see more from a top 10 draft pick in their draft plus 3 during training camp. I remain hopeful.
I had said that I would have matched Holloway. Letting him go over a $2.3m offer sheet seemed pretty stupid to me.
Savoie is 20 years old and in his first year of pro hockey.
He was the best player in each Condor exhibition game and had a strong debut.
There was never an expectation that he make this team out of camp (at least not for me). Half a season (or more) of a near PPG in the AHL was/is my hope and everything is trending there at this point.
This is revisionist history. Holloway and Foegele are not puck transporters. Foeglele handled the puck like a grenade.
Curlock didn’t mention Foegele. That was my error in recollection. I bunched him in because he can skate, but I agree he wasn’t a pure puck mover like McLeod.
Foegele isn’t great with the puck, but he could skate, so he could get in on the forecheck and help to create back pressure with the back check.
I disagree with you about Holloway.
I won’t belabour the loss of speed youth and physicality. But this Management group are not setting this team up for success with their decisions. The first one, IMO was signing Skinner and not reserving the 2LW spot for an, at the time, organizational player (Holloway/Lavoie) and at the same time reserving cap space.
There is so much more to add, but I am going outside to enjoy the weather instead.
Happy Thanksgiving Everyone!
Enjoy the weather! Lavoie and Holloway were bottom 6 options. Skinner is a top level 5v5 scorer, multiple 20G seasons, and was willing to sign at a low hit. There were 2 big holes in top 6 wingers with Kane out. Neither young fella had shown enough to fill a role there, Lavoie even able to stick in the league
They would be there instead of Pod, and either Perry or Brown. Brown taking a low contract with no bonuses made it harder to break in. Janmark can PK and was so good in playoffs they kept him. After how bad McLeod was in playoffs again, keeping the much better player in Henrique is hard to argue with to me.
I had a really nice walk, thank you.
It’s all spilt milk now, but I was thinking about the logic of adding a small, not fast, not physical 32 year old 1,000 game player. He can score goals at even strength, but he is -131 for his career all on non-winning teams.
Logic dictates that he is a highly skilled scorer, so he will possibly produce more with elite passers as his centre. My question is what value does he bring to a top playoff team, who lost 2 fast physical wingers, in the playoffs?
I hope for the best, but Jeff Skinner is quickly approaching his expiry date, after having a historically poor season. As well, having a roster full of old guys and no physical reinforcements is not a formula for sustained NHL success. The old guys are inevitably going to take a beating.
It is so easy to be Debbie Downer right now, but I think this team will continue to struggle throughout the year primarily due to poor goaltending and injuries.
These have all been brutal loses, all at home, basically every single player has been awful. There is no place to go but up…but can they do so quickly and in a sustainable fashion?
BTW, I did not resurrect my profile photo from last season, I do not know how it showed up, it honestly just reappeared.
In the last 3 seasons, Jeff Skinner has more 5 on 5 goals than: Ovi, Drai, Tkachuk, Tkachuk, Nylander, Guentzel, Keller, Jon M., etc.
He was not a negative goal share player in any of those three seasons – on a non-playoff team.
Skinner does seem soft, however, he was also the one player that pushed back after Posposil took a run at McDavid, took some slashes that had the trainer out on the bench taking look.
If 24G and only -2 on a non-playoff team is a “historically bad season” – sign me up.
He’s almost the exact same age as Hyman – I sure hope 32 is not a trigger for quickly approachign an expiry date – good thing Skinner is only signed for one year on what is likely a massive value contract
Everthing you’ve written, I‘Ve read here and elsewhere, I do appreciate your passion, but there is no need to re-write the same thing 50 times….I come here several times a day and have done so for 16 years…
Skinner had his worst season last season by all metrics.
Skinner is 32, and this is an age where good players, like Skinner more often than not show significant erosion.
https://www.reddit.com/r/hockey/comments/157qnv4/the_average_age_curve_for_nhl_forwards_at_even/
This is not true.
I had not written before about him being the same age as Hyman (in response to something you posted) nor about the response to the McDavid hit (in response to something you posted.
The stuff I have posted before about his 5 on 5 goal scoring and non-negative goal shared are highly relevant to discuss the opinions provided.
Skinner has been the best forward on the squad so far, reserving spots for players is what lands a organization in lottery territory.
Skinner has been invisible until last night.
He scored on a gaping empty net.
Skinner leads the team in shots, shot attempts, high danger shot attempts, etc.
He was the best forward last night and one of the best against Chicago – at least in my opinion.
Arvidsson is the addition that, has lots of try, but has made poor plays leading to goals against and taking goals off the board with lack of smarts.
My HOPE per 60 is at an all-time low, so I probably watched less than 60% of games 2 & 3.
Arvidsson looks like a future LTIR candidate IMO.
So you make statements about Skinner being invisible when you watched just over half of the last two games?
Team is well out of balance. Not by position but by chemistry.
All calm vets. They need some fire.
They don’t have enough Jam. It is not a moar bigger thing, it’s moar tougher, moar battle, moar intensity
I seen several runs at McDavid in several games. No response.
Every single team is ready for the Oilers and study how to beat them. The Oilers responded by simply trying to do more Connor and more Leon stuff.
In fact they needed to win through beefing up the bottom six, to allow top six to do their thing.
If you are getting blown out and display low enthusiasm, can you at least throw a hit? No, we don’t feel like it. Can you take a fight? No thanks. Then What’s the plan? We are waiting on Connor.
They landed on a third line that was excellent in playoffs but no chance to perform like that for 82 games.
And they completely underestimated all the physicality coming this season. Skill alone is not going to work fellas. You better find some battle, and find some battlers in a big hurry.
Hyman, Nuge, Skinner, Brown are all pretty tame players, Nuge and Brown are smaller
Henrique hits, 38 in 22 GP last season, and he only took 14. Janmark is a gamer, Arvi, Pod plays hard, Perry. So only Ryan and Brown are vanilla in the bottom 6, and Philp likely comes up at some point. They miss Kane. When healthy he’s still a decent player and can score. But what he brings is stirring things up. Giving energy. Amping up the stakes
The other side is Knoblauch doesn’t favour hitting per se. I think that they should as you said focus on team toughness. Not running around, but being harder to play against and responding if anyone goes at Connor
I think by how they drafted management saw that a higher battle level is needed deeper through the lineup. Maybe they should have signed Clutterbuck who still plays well for the role and likes the physical, also can PK
When McDavid was announced as Conn Smythe winner, and wasn’t there to receive the award, I immediately thought:
McDavid and the Oilers are going to pay for this in spades.
Bettman hates to be shown up.
The Perry non-goal may be the first of a few calls to go against us.
The target on the Oilers back is as big as its been since 1990. Every time you level up, the target grows.
That and the defence is as marginal as we all suspected.
Yeah, I think even if the Oilers have a 20-game losing streak to start the season, no NHL team is going to take them lightly like they did last year. Oilers have to figure out how to play hockey when the season starts.
And not rely on a coaching change to snap them out of their funk.
I disagree that teams took the Oilers “lightly” last year, at any point.
Their major streak was not against a murderer’s row. By my quick review, they beat 4 playoff teams during that 16 game streak. That run was as much about the Oilers feasting on a soft schedule and grinding out wins as anything else.
That said, this team had a second gear last year as evidenced in the playoffs, particularly the Dallas series and the second half of the cup final.
So that goal Corey Perry scored with the Ducks in the playoffs against the Oilers when he was holding Talbots leg was a legit goal, but the one last night is not a goal?
*puts tinfoil hat on*
“Its the Oilers vs the NHL”
*takes it off*
Oilers have been sloppy but every team has been ready to play the Oilers. Oil made the finals last year, many media figures are picking them to win the Cup. The Oil are the measure in the West.
The Jets, Hawks and Flames have been for the most part defensively sound. Oil only have 3 goals scored, but many posts have been hit and many chances were the players have just not clicked.
They will clean up the defensive side of the game.
Their game will turn around. Time of concern yes, but lighting ones hair on fire, not yet.
I remember screaming at the TV, “look at his pads” but all focus was on Nurse and if he pushed him into the net. All commentators were focused on the wrong thing.
That was Kesler.
The Perry incident vs Talbot was with his stuck-out buttocks contacting Talbot. But the refs again determined that his skates were outside the blue paint, so it was deemed a good goal.
This was the “what do I say to Corey” Getzlaf goal.
We lost mom this summer. She was a great cook and always enjoyed the holidays. It being the first Thanksgiving without her, we feel the void in a big way.
It was almost written in stone that the Oilers would start the season this way. I am not sure there was any other way it could have gone.
Happy Thanksgiving to all.
I’m so sorry for your loss. I’m sure people say things and offer advice to help, but one of the things that really stuck with me came from a woman named Jana. I met her about three months after my wife died. She asked me how I was, and I said not well.
She said “your memories will become friends again” and that has turned out to be the case. I spent thanksgiving weekend laughing about things Jo-Anne would do and it felt wonderful. I still have difficult moments, but can also enjoy those wonderful times we shared together and hold them dear without hurting.
I wish that for you.
Thanks LT!
The loss of young fast skaters over the summer has been detrimental to both the offense and the defense. Those players, through creating chaos or open ice, not only enabled passes to connect because there was more room, but put the opposing team on its heels. The Oilers used to be the sort of team that could create chaos and space, whether through speed or agile puck-transporting, and then capitalize on it. I don’t think they are that team any more.
For some time now, I have wondered if there is a leadership problem on the team. The clip of McDavid yelling at his teammates in the dressing room during the Stanley Cup finals haunts me; in my view, it is a telling indicator that he lacks some of the essential qualities of leadership. Would you want to go to battle with someone who leads with tantrums and has nothing of value to say to the media after three losses in a row to start the season? The sullen bully boss is not someone I want to play for or battle with, I’ll tell you that.
Moreover, the fans deserve a leader who has something intelligent and insightful to say when things go wrong. A leader who is articulate and genuinely accountable to the fans rather than someone who speaks as if words do not matter and fans are unimportant. McDavid’s body language and facial expressions suggest he doesn’t have the right attitude to be a leader. He is sulky and his sulkiness permeates the whole team.
Who does that leave to be a leader on this team? Where is the mature leadership? There are too many belladonnas and not enough worker-bees. Management gave all the team’s young-blood energy and speed and fractiousness away for nothing, or next to nothing. And now it is harder than ever for the team’s creative players to find the space to make plays and complete passes.
It’s too early in the season to make these assumptions.
Oh no, McDavid must’ve studied at the foot of Ales Hemsky’s body language coach. The end is nigh.
Ha ha ha you’re actually upset at the best player on the planet yelling at his teammates for rolling over after Game 2 of the Finals, maybe their worst performance of the playoffs?
Get outta here.
This is a very dramatic way of putting it.
There are many different ways to lead, by example, by individual tempered conversations, by screaming and yelling. There is a time and place for all of them.
He wasn’t throwing anything at anyone, he wasn’t screaming in one persons face, he was showing his passion as the worlds best hockey player in the Stanley cup finals of a team that was not living up to its potential.
Do you think Michael Jordan, Kobe, Messier, Pronger, were smiling and having fun when they were losing? That’s just to name a couple of the more serious great captains of history.
One scene of Mcdavid yelling at the team is such a small glimpse into what he is as a captain. One time in a decade you’ve seen this and that is what you make your decision off of. Not every moment leads to an “inspiring” clip that will be used till the end of time and it shouldn’t, that would make it nothing special. He lead the team to within 1 goal of the Stanley cup and back from 0-3.
I would be more concerned if he was just sitting there silently not showing any emotion or acknowledging where they were at.
Mcdavid meets with the media constantly, he doesn’t throw anyone under the bus, he doesn’t call out anyone, he probably could at times, it’s either “I can be better” or “We need to be better”. Unfortunately we do not get to see the personality of most NHL players like you do in other sports but it is what the NHL wants as the face of its league, no emotion and just saying the least controversial thing everytime.
I didn’t watch this nor will I. Certain aspects of a team and individuals should be private. We’ve have gotten so personal that it’s becoming creepy.
Mcdaid was bringing the fire, because nobody else was.
He shouldn’t have to. He must be getting tired of the weight.
Most of the roster are calm veterans. They will play better when pushed, but take a while to get there.
They need some fire.
I think the point may be overstated….but I also worry that there are some important grains of truth there.
A related thought: on the 1980s Oilers, Gretzky had his Messier. Does McDavid have his Messier in Draisaitl? Drai is one of the Top 5 players in the league, and it’s fair to expect some shared leadership from him. Is he getting it?
The epitome of leading by example is winning the Conn Smyth in a losing effort. And trust me, you would not have wanted to be in the room when Mark Messier lost his temper and led by example. Your comments are insulting.
I didn’t love it as it’s not the kind of leadership I respond to either BUT they asked some of the other players about it and it appears to be a non-issue. They said it was just Connor being Connor and the standard stuff that goes on in the dressing room after a high stakes game.
The team just went to Game 7 of the final. Leadership is not in question imo.
I think you have to give McDavid some latitude to be a human being not a perfect hockey cyborg. By my eye, Connor keeps it locked down pretty tight. When guys like that blow up, it tends to be big. That’s likely better than a C that is venting his frustrations too much.
Too be honest, McDavid reminds me of Michael Jordan.
People did not find it easy to play with Jordan because of his lofty expectations.
Phil Jackson was able to guide the ship. Kris channeled his inner Phil last year. Can he do it again?
We had a good enough team to come within one game of Stanley.Why did we just keep the same team?We could have kept everyone once the third line was resigned.Fogele,Desharnais,Holloway,Broberg,McLeod,and even Ceci could have fallen under the CAP.We lost speed with McLeod and Holloway.Holloway,Fogele,and Desharnais were the only guys who seemed to finish hits.Ceci is a bonified NHL defencemen,and would have been a great #6 RH.If Kane,Drai,Nurse,McD hadn’t been injured,we would have won Stanley.Why blow up the same team who could have won this year with no injuries.Our management seems to think the have to fix what isn’t broken.The loss of Broberg and Halloway was a big mistake,considering they were our future.Thevsame can be said about losing Lavoie for nothing.Our new shiny Jackson team has no chemistry…..our team last year had finally reached that point!They now have to start over.
I guess it’s better off to find out the team is not balanced at the beginning. Better then fluking off a few wins and thinking all is just peachy. Now is Darnell Nurse the new PK Subban?All arrows point in that direction.
I’m interested to see how Knoblauch handles this.
The Oil were in such a deep hole when he took over last season that imo he was playing with house money all season.
I like and believe in Kris. Wonder if this is one of those rare moments when his cool and calm needs to be replaced with a little fire? Are we going to get a Slats trashes the whiteboard moment?
Interesting to hear Connor suggest that the team is not practicing as well as they could be.
The Stanley hangover is real and decidedly not spectacular.
I think we mostly agree that losing Bro and Holloway was a bad thing, even if they aren’t established. In 3 games Bro is 6th in D TOI, is being sheltered, has 3 points, and not great possession stats. Seems about right. Holloway is 7th in F TOI, has one point and middle looking usage. Great possession stats, mediocre goal shares
Foegele has the most F TOI, is getting an offensive push, and has no points, mixed stats results. McLeod in 4 games is 4th in F TOI, plays a more defensive role, has one point and one hit, good possession stats
To me I can’t hang this start on losing these guys. Yes they are fast and bigger, but neither Foegele Bro or McLeod are physical. The two forwards are not great offensively, Foegele because I don’t think he thinks the game well, McLeod because he’s all perimeter, and both are streaky defensively. PK is about effort, I think Stuart will bring it around, and really the biggest issue there is goalies
I liked Holloway’s game, but as LT has pointed out it’s not clear he will produce much, and he isn’t still against softer comp. I like the players they drafted this year more than these forwards in how they play and skill sets, it’s more like what’s missing
But they are a ways out, and there aren’t any easy moves to make up front this season because of contracts. They are going to have to gut it out and decide what they want and how hard they will work for it. And it starts at the top, and behind the bench. Like he did last season push the guys playing well and fade ‘anyone’ else, use the bench
That is how the coach can promote accountability and fairness and build the group. Tocchet is merciless about it, and his team plays balls out because of it, after some unhappy campers got their ducks in a row
Skinner reminds me of the Canucks Dan Cloutier. Has good stats and a good record but struggled to make big saves at big times. The 2000’s Canucks lost many series with a good team for that reason.
Cloutier is actually a pretty good comp, nice one.
Skinner beat Oetinger mano-a-mano in the Conference finals. Battled Bobrovsky to a draw in the Stanley Cup finals. Was fine against LA. The Oilers and he wobbled for a game or two against Vancovuer. Was lights out on the PK in the playoffs.
Sure, full credit to Tocchet. But how long can that last? Do teams have the energy to play balls out for 100 games a year? And do players start to tune out the coach after a while?
It works when Craig Berube comes to St. Louis halfway through 2018-19. It works in John Tortorella’s first season everywhere. But does it work in the long run?
I love how ‘According to Jim’s caught a stray in your autopsy LT.
Come for the meh hockey. Stay for the sh+tty sitcom shots.
Cover Up Stan has a real Chiapet energy. I cannot wait to see what he cooks up if the losses continue. What team currently has the rights to Spooner???
A lot of criticism of the D. Goalies and defense are at the mercy of forwards. Defense are really in no man’s land when they get inconsistent forward support and the goalies can’t make saves
Maybe the forwards are too old and slow. But Hyman Skinner and Arvi can skate. Obviously Connor can. Nuge and Drai aren’t fast without a head of steam, but that hasn’t changed. Henrique is a very smart player and has wingers that can skate
This is more a mental issue I think. Play smarter, and like losing feels like the worst thing there is. I know they do hate losing, but they need to dial that down to every skirmish and play. That is what makes Doughty so good, he’s not big and can’t skate like Makar, but he’d rather die than lose anything. Wayne was like that, I think it was Johnson who said he was the most competitive person he’d ever met or seen
They need more of that cowbell, that’s what’s missing
Agreed, the forwards have been awful esp. line 1. The D do their best but we have 2 top 4 NHL D men. We need 4 of them. Kulak is an excellent 5 imo. Nurse is a mystery right now. The rest are unproven or 6-8 Dmen. This will never fly even when the forwards wake up and start scoring which they will.
It’s definitely between the ears. Then when two goals get called back, one kind of suspect, the other was clearly offside thanks to Arvidsson, who’s only involvement in the play was being offside. The Calgary coach was praising their video guy and the fact his team stayed out of the penalty box, it was a big part of the game. I saw Stu Skinner get slashed in the back of the leg behind his net in the trapezoid, no call. I saw McDavid being interfered with constantly. But they call interference on Hyman. To add to it the Oiler PK has been poor to start off the season OMG, it has to affect the psych. Yeah, they need to play smarter. On the other hand, maybe they’re thinking too much and just need to relax. Wasn’t that Knoblauch’s message when he took over the reins last season?
It’s sad when a friend asks you if you’re coming to town to an Oilers game and you say I don’t spend money on pre Xmas break Oilers
lol, well history says that is smart. True that! See ya at game 20
I got nothing. It’s beyond baffling. I suppose they’re many reasons for this start. But still baffling. I won’t even try to analyze it. Just baffling.
The Oilers are slow and are playing slow. I won’t count Broberg because he didn’t play in the regular season, but losing McLeod and Holloway has had an impact.
I like the additions the team made in the offseason, but I think they’re going to have to adjust their style of play to match what they have.
I don’t have concerns about the 1st pair, but the rest of the D is suspect, and we all knew it was heading into the season.
All of that said, the team takes their lead from McD, as they go, the team does. They both haven’t been good enough and it brings the rest of the soldiers with them. The leaders will rebound and play to their standards, but what they’ve put out as yet simply isn’t what we have come to expect from them.
I’m not one, typically, to blame the team’s best players; but it starts with them. Two seasons of putrid play to begin the campaign; whatever they’re doing isn’t good enough.
I have no doubt this team will right the ship, they’re simply too talented. But they’re flawed and it shows.
Agreed, except they scored more than anybody already.
$7.1 million for Skinner and Arvidson wasn’t necessary.
That’s a nice defenceman. Add in Ceci’s money and they’re really cooking. Would have been better off wit Broberg and Hollaway.
Old and slow may become a reality sooner than later. Alternatively it may work and they win Stanley. The piper will just be paid a little later in that case.
Agree on Skinner but the Foegele/Arvidsson swap was okay. IIRC Skinner was signed quite late on opening day of free agency and set off a chain reaction that resulted in the offer sheets. Guessing it came down to a choice to pick two of Henrique, Skinner, or McLeod. Does going Henrique/McLeod result in a dual offer sheet or just a single to Broberg or perhaps a willingness to match one. We’ll never know but I also agree the signing of Skinner was unnecessary. Let’s hope it’s not 1088 games played without a playoff game. Have a feeling it’s going to take 25-30min/game for McD, Drai, Bouch, and Ek to avoid it.
Oilers soft as butter last night. Flames ran their show. Have to find some team toughness.
It looked that way. Oilers started well, then slowly the Flames took over the play and the third period especially. You’d think in the BOA the Oilers would bring a more physical style? Maybe throw a hit, or something. But no Flames out hit them 27 to 13.
I think their heads aren’t in it yet.
It’s not so much them losing Holloway and Broberg, harmony is disrupted in the way they were treated. Lavoie as well. Causes others to walk on eggshells.
This is a real stretch. I very much doubt that the entire first line and Bouch are walking on eggshells or feel disrupted because of the way you think the tweener Lavoie was mistreated.
This summer after Jeff and Stan had made all their moves while losing a lot of talented and well trained youth ,size and speed I shared a few opinions to my friend another oiler fan. 1.I believe we are now too slow, too old and too small 2. most of these new adds come from losing cultures which could be ingrained in their DNA ( do all your number folks in the new analytics department have a column for that Jack ) and 3. There was a lot of weddings and other life change activities going on with the core this summer which interrupted training and focus . We will see I said but I see Storm clouds on the horizon . Fingers crossed I am wrong on all these fronts
Losing cultures?
Arvidsson
Played to the finals with Nashville.
Played in the post season in every year but 1.
Emberson
Played a total of 30 games before coming to the Oilers.
Henrique
Played in the finals 2 times in his career.
Skinner
I only watched the first 2 games, was at Sebastian Bach last night, he’s busted his ass all over the ice when I see him, 4 shots a game so far.
Podkolzin
Came from an improving Canucks team, everything I’ve heard is he’s on the ice the longest of any player for practice, he’s a steady player when he’s on the ice.
Yes Skinner hasn’t been in the playoffs but that’s not a reason to say he has a losing attitude. Everything he’s done has shown to me that he’s doing what he can on the ice to help win.
Top 3 disappointments so far
3. Special Teams
2. Bouchard
1. Entire 1st line
I thought it was a mistake to break up the 2nd and 3rd lines, now none look like they have much chemistry.
I agree with this so far.
I feel bad for Emberson, I realize the numbers havent been there but this is far from a fair shake. I think he is a solid D and needs some time. This type of player treatment does not build confidence starting the way training camp was used.
I have been a Nurse supporter but he is a drag on partners, I feel for him but the decision making is poor. We really need Nurse to be the best Nurse he has been, I hope it happens, it doesn’t look good.
This is obvious but this D is just not good enough, similar to last year really but worse.
Lessons learned should be at the front of the line. Broberg says Hi 🙂
When the forwards perform poorly especially the leaders the D and tending definitely can’t hold up and don’t even tread water at this point.
Stecher wasn’t anything to right home about with Kulak and Dermott wasn’t exactly anything special with Nurse. Emberson should be back. It might have been a good thing for him to have a bird’s eye view of what he needs to do to be successful with this team. I might add that Broberg hasn’t exactly been lights out for the Blues thus far either and either has Holloway. It’s early in the season, 79 games remaining. But who’s counting?
I’m definitely not dressing Dermott over anyone they have up with the bigs currently.
Nurse may be a lost cause, his natural athletic abilities may have filled his head with the wrong energy and now he’s just being stubborn in all the wrong ways.
Broberg? Never heard of him.
I believe the D will improve, I wonder if part of Nurses issues are he’s watched Bouchard blossom and jump him in the pecking order, then Ekholm arrives and eats his lunch for the 1LD spot leaving Nurse with far less shine then he’s recieved in the past.
Bouchard has a history of slow starts and having troubles with the puck early in the season.
As mundane as he’s been, I actually think this is his “best start” in 3 seasons.
It may well be his best start, but it’s absolutely dreadful. He’s not making heads up passes, not using his shot at all like he can, looking fairly pedestrian at best. It’s hard to harp on the rest of the defense when the leaders of it are sucking eggs.
I think that is an aggressive use of the word “dreadful” but, of course, fully agree he isn’t nearly as effective (both ends) as he generally is (and will be).
I was simply noting that he was not a “top disappointment” to me as I reasonably expected a slow start from him – as per history.
— I was relieved to see the end of the train g camp : I don’t care about the stuff they most were consumed with : who is the 7ths D, will do and so who has never been in the league replace the vet plug as the 14th D. Are we going to lose some guy to waiver. None of that stuff matters to me.
— But more importantly none of it matters to the team. I go back to the things that do:
— Will McDra show up ready game one and did they learn from last year and make changes and adapt and if so what?
— Will the coach and management look back and say : hey we’ve had to fire a lot of coaches: why aren’t we as a staff prepared for the season: what will we do to be better, what did we learn
— Why do our goalies suck to start season: why can’t they adapt and improve their approach so they don’t at start of year.
— How long of an extended training Camp will Nurse and whoever his partner is going to need? Was he rushed back (highlights I see don’t show him looking 100%)
— If we knew (well I figured it was going to be the same) that nothing was going to change that mattered a lot more than the stuff that was the focus of many.
— Oh well : in San Fran now flying back today: interesting to have Canadian Thanksgiving in the US : with her parents and grandmother who still alive.
— Ate at Harris Steakhouse last night : Joe Montana’s favorite spot : had the 49ers cut . Just an old-school American steakhouse : that serves Gibsons (you don’t have to explain) and $35 corkage fee to bring in Monster Wines.
— Waiter told us when the Broncos came in for the Super Bowl week rented the whole place out and it was interesting to see all the characters and personalities sitting down to eat.
— He made a neat observation of how the team so different get together like all to the teams to do a job on Sunday’s: yet they are all so varied
Oil gonna oil. Lordy.
Drove about 7 hrs total yesterday for visiting/family on turkey wkend.
Check scores when I got home. 1-0 oil. Flip on the game, feeling optimistic. 3-4 mins later, Perry scores, YES! 2-0 looking ok. Goal taken away, and yes I know, opinions/perceptions, BUT in mine, that was a goal everyday of the week. Few minutes later Skinner gets slashed behind the net, no call.
Look at my partner (she is a gem, puts up with a short rant) I ask her if she wants to watch something else.
Channel changed.
Love hockey, don’t love the NHL and the malarky that goes with some games.
Yes, I will be back for sure.
Good work. It’s important to know when to change the channel.
It’s a shame to change the channel and miss a magnificent comeback, but I think we’ve all gotten good at identifying a mail-it-in game by the Oilers.
Gretzky and Messier had bad games but Connor and Leon have been MIA for 3 games. This Oiler team is going through the motions if we lose the next game Bowman needs to shake this group up.
Happy Thanksgiving to all!
Have a great Turkey day all!
I was happy with Prime Rib at the Keg.
“Be kind to all, especially yourself.”
LT, truer words have never been spoken.
I have not posted much this season. And the start has not exactly inspired me to do so. My poor kids are besides themselves and wonder why I am not more upset. Then they point out, “You had your cups, we’ve had nothing!” I get it.
Oh well, at least it may keep the price on McDavid down!
I am actually thankful for last season as it broke me as a fan. I no longer stress about the Oilers missteps. Just laugh. And then enjoy the dramatic turnaround.
Would you rather be a fan of Edmonton or Toronto? I’ll take a team that can’t start over a team that can’t finish every day.
I’m with you Bro…
Happy Thanksgiving All!
Agreed. That loss to San Jose last year to make it 2-9-1 just took away all the expectations, and helped me to remember that we’re cheering for laundry.
Haven’t stopped being a fan, I just take it a little more easily now.
Uncle Steve’s Early Season Observations:
-McD teams are pretty consistently under prepared to start seasons/series.
-Dermott on the second pair is so funny. Everyone talking about how Emberson is an upgrade on Ceci. The guy is already a healthy scratch replaced by an offhanded PTO.
Could it be that Ceci is not as bad as many claimed? Impossible!
When I watched Ceci last year I kept waiting for some trash defenceman to show up and he kept making simple, drama-free plays with the puck.
The bad player makes 9 mil +
The mistakes we see in these first three games were baked in weeks ago, clearly the team doesn’t know how to hold a training camp.
Last year I thought they would turn it around without a coaching change but I did submit that the start was an indication they screwed up training camp and firing the coach was accountability toward that mistake. Ok, so maybe its not coaching, but the leadership core. They need to hold themselves accountable and it can start on Tuesday against Philly.
Best words to live by…nuff said.
Happy Thanksgiving all.
Go Oilers.
Anyone think McDavid has lost a step? Thought this last season, but wrote it off to injury issues. He just doesn’t seem to have that explosiveness where he just takes off past and around and through the opposition. Maybe teams have just learned how to defend him better over time
It’s early and I hope I’m wrong. Typically McDavid will only have one or two game stretches of lackluster play before he rights the ship and goes on a 2 or 3 week tear. Hopefully we’re on the verge of one of those now
He ain’t old, but he’s no spring chicken neither 😉
When the Oilers were being introduced for the first game and as the players were being called they jogged out over a rubber mat and then hit the ice .When McDavid was introduced he did not jog he was actually very slow and looked like he was being very careful not to catch his blades on the rubber. He was almost traveling sideways over the rubber mat. I remember saying hmmm that did not look normal. But Hopefully it is nothing .
No, he just knows they have to be able to win games 2-1.
Can’t remember him accomplishing anything doing his 1 on 3-4 sorties this year.
Rinsing out my opinions from this time last year.
1_ Talent doesn’t evaporate; 2_ This is who they are, don’t get lost in the numbers, hockey is between the ears; 3_ Small sample size, actually! Three game losing streaks happen to every team all the time, calm down; 4_ Losing streaks happen because teams are playing bad not because they necessarily are bad.
On 2, especially, I am fascinated. Both by what we feel entitled toward as fans and by what the team leadership seemingly also feels entitled toward. To me, I almost don’t mind following a team of such wild highs and meh lows. Its more human. You learn more about yourself. You need to set your imagination for more possibilities. And, probably, faith, at least, in history: projecting this team especially via big data is unreliable. What’s George Mumford’s Advice/60?
Guarantee people disagree with my patience. Last year I took a ton of heat for giving them too much rope. Every time, I was told to look at how they are playing: Lazy! Disconnected! Listless! No jam! Lottery!… I held to my belief that they would turn it around and I was right.
Again, they will turn it around. Hell, I will go out on a limb: To my eye they have been trending in the right direction each game now and if they beat the Flyers, the Oilers don’t lose three in a row again this year.
But as I said last year, the Oilers are to Hockey as Disco is to music. And I didn’t just mean the pace and fun at which they play when they are flying, I extend this to the necessary duality of electrifying highs and nauseating lows. McDavid is late to the party. But who shows up to Studio 54 right when it opens? Lame tourists, that’s who. Taste the dance floor, everyone.
The Oilers will win 45+ games this season and they will make the playoffs. Even with that, the floor for this team, a great team, is baffling. Two seasons in a row. Two different coaches. I think there’s cause for concern, even with the spike we know will come. I think the Oilers defensive structure isn’t strong enough to hold for long periods. They need more support and discipline.
How many times do we talk about a basic thing like standing up at the blue line? Why does that always regress? I don’t know. The Oilers, in my opinion, have never really adopted the idea of team defense as a priority. It’s something they do until things get going offensively, but there isn’t a pure devotion to the defensive game. The Oilers are the French in World War 2.
Spot on.
100%. Game one goal two I said “I have seen this movie before” and changed the channel.
I think it is because none of the stars enjoy the defensive side. It is always a chore. In contrast with players like Toews and Kopitar, who enjoy beating opponents up and down the ice.
I do think they need to bolster their D but we talk about the defence not standing up whenever it’s the forward group not coming back and letting them step into that gap. This team has a decent defensive structure in the middle of the ice provided the forwards are doing their job. McDavid’s line has been the worst offenders so far.
And while not in an ideal manner, technically the French won WW2!
Well put. I commented that it’s the top players that are failing. Connor, Leon and Bouch are the three top players, Ekholm for a while more, and until the first three start focusing on winning every shift by playing with more brains and less trying for amazing plays this won’t change
Every top player that gets to where they want to go ultimately seems to have had this decision to make. They also seem to have decided before a decade in the league. There is also that to my eye many of the eastern teams play a more playoff style all season, many teams in the west seem to play a more offensive fancier game, and try to tighten up at playoffs. But that can only work if you are getting plus saves
I’m not sure our guys are going to change. That is fine, but it puts the ball in Bowman’s court. It means he has to find the next Ekholm for Bouch, the Kurri for McDavid, the Anderson for Drai. I like that they added more ability in the top 6, and I think it will get better as it goes, but I don’t think the balance is quite right yet
No GM is perfect, and despite the criticisms Bowman has walked through this with the Hawks one way or another, finding the pieces to build a three Cup team. These trade proof long contracts are a problem, we knew it would be, and now I think it’s making it hard to do the moves that need to be done, loving the players in question or not. No team should lock in any but the absolute top players if possible so there is the needed flexibility. Godspeed Oilers management
They looked bored with the preseason, now they look bored with the regular season.
The problem is they have to earn the right to play in the playoffs. Sooner or later, they’ve got to make the playoffs.
Connor reminds me of a person on the spectrum. He is brilliant in what drives him, but he can get stuck right there, hyper focused and sometimes not finding a new way when they limit his preferred things. He’s not a patient type, and despite the talk he loses focus on some of the details, especially if he gets frustrated. His brilliance usually over comes these things, not so far, and not always in key playoff games. Sometimes patience and trickery are the answer, as opposed to bull force onslaughts
I’m not sure what Leon’s deal is, but he’s also stubborn as a mule, and wants to try to force his will on situations, even when they aren’t working. He will try them again. The problem is taking high risk unnecessary plays out of their game and looking for other options is what needs to happen. Live to battle another play
So the coaches’ dilemma is how do they guide the team to where they want it? So far no one has figured it out with this group. I think TOI is the way, if a line is doing the right things, play them more. If you get behind, stick to the plan, don’t load up the top line if it’s not there that game
The time to do it is now. If they keep doing this and lose a bunch more games, options go away like last season. Playing cold, tired or hurt players more than others, even if they are more talented, we have seen isn’t the answer. Even world top players need a kick in the hockey pants at times, they are also human
They need to keep things in perspective. They had a ton of growth last season, that was evident. They did what they had to do. However, it’s a brand-new season and they’re back to square one having to do it all over again, that could be overwhelming at this point.
They have a veteran group; it can’t be all on Connor & Leon, and it isn’t. There’s… Hyman, Nuge, Ekholm, Bouchard, I want to say Nurse and I will, there’s Skinner & Arvidsson, Kulak, Janmark, Henrique, Brown, Perry & Ryan.
They’ve lost a few band members, but I can’t wait to see what Philp, Podkolzin, Emberson, Dermott and more coming can add to the team.
Team is the word; help out those Goaltenders, play defense. They know what they need to do, they need to adjust some things, it’s doable.
Could this all be about peaking at the right time?
I may just come back at game 20 and see where they are! lol.
The pucks will start going in but this is a flawed team. They can win but definitely are a yo yo. They have 1 solid pairing on D. They need at least 2. Nurse is not a 2nd pairing D anymore, I am not trolling, I am a supporter but he just isn’t.
Happy Thanksgiving LT and all
from the platoon in BV.
I hate to say this, but a team is not a team, when teammates are told to sit at the end of the bench while our stars are overworked trying to get back into the game. Yes, some players are better than others, but not when they are exhausted. Perhaps a road trip will help.