Creating Value for Trade

by Lowetide

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fishman

Holy moly how about those Jays! They are rolling!

OriginalPouzar

I’m always a Jays fan – generally have the games on in the background on my laptop, etc. Of course, how much attention I pay over the course of 162 game season varies on how they are doing.

Well, since I got back from the Balkans in early June (8 games in to the 10 game winning streak), I am consuming every pitch – taping games and staying off socials, etc.

I’m also, for the first time in my life, listening to a TON of Blue Jay podcast content – at the gym, on the treadmill, during my walks.

Today’s game was about as engaging as I can recall. I started an hour late and didn’t even catch up until middle of the 8th as there was barely any opportunities to fast forward – handing on every pitch like the playoffs.

This team! Wow!

90s fan

LT you keep banging the Broberg drum. That boy was never going to play. We currently have 4 LHD ahead of where he’d be. I think it’s time to let that one go. Great post as always though. Thanks for the content, even in the slow days of summer.

finn_fann

Getting Walman was an absolute blessing. Subtract that move and our LD starts to look old and slow starting next year. Having Broberg could have either added to our depth going forward, or saved us having to lose a 1st round pick and sign a guy at a premium to fill the gap. So there was value lost in that imo.

leadfarmer

I think we could have gotten a pretty penny if we sold Broberg and Holloway this offseason

OriginalPouzar

Perhaps but there are events that led to that.

Drafting the kid at 8 (which was a reach at the time) but over the course of the next few years, in addition to having Nurse locked in for term at LD, Holland acquired Ekholm (LD signed for term) and Kulak an LD who he then re-signed for term.

All D good acquisitions (and the Kulak re-sign) in isolation but he completely blocked his young developing high ceiling top 10 pick.

Not to mention the Deharnais call-up when Broberg even on the right side would have been the better choice for everything hockey except the PK (which Broberg was good on) and post-whistle head-locks.

Lewis Grant

Also, let’s not forget that the Oilers D had almost zero injuries in 2023-24. If they had anywhere near a normal level of injuries, Broberg would have gotten far more playing time.

We wanted to see what we had in Des. That was reasonable.

OriginalPouzar

It was never reasonable to me (and I generally am a booster of the Condors players).

Deharnais came up in the name of the PK, and fair enough, but Broberg was rolling as the every day 3LD at the time Dehernais came up and pushed Broberg to 7D.

Broberg was better in all facets of NHL hockey except the two I mentioned (and I’m not concerned about post-whistle headlocks).

Perhaps trying Broberg on the PK first would have been a good option.

BornInAGretzkyJersey

This ignores asset management, and development timelines. Given reps sooner, Broberg would have without doubt made Kulak (of whom I’m a fan) redundant on the team. That could have aided restocking the cupboards instead of the constant drain.

90s fan

But just saying, if you want to make that move you gotta trade kulak. Cause no way he plays over Kulak. Curse of a good team. It’s hard to make it.

OriginalPouzar

Interesting article re: McFarland giving a coaching presentation about attacking off the rush back in 2022 – complete with video of the presentation (20 minutes).

No doubt he was a targeted hire and I wonder if he can have an impact on the forward group scoring goals – he’ll clearly have some strategies to employ.

https://members.thecoachessite.com/video/the-importance-of-attacking-off-the-rush-with-paul-mcfarland?utm_campaign=12099481-TCS%20Vault&utm_content=340255323&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter&hss_channel=tw-224906478

Noteworthy Timestamps:
1:00 Keep your eye on the puck
1:50 The why
4:15 Where do rushes start?
8:00 2×1 execution and purpose
11:13 Rush fundamentals
13:20 Attack nose to nose
15:10 Drive off the D heels
17:35 Finish at the net
18:15 Rush execution
21:30 Rush Delay into F3
23:55 Things to think about

P.S. For SG – note the rush fundamentals and 2 X1 execution and purpose

Last edited 5 hours ago by OriginalPouzar
Reja

The Hawks were so talented to watch they were the closest team to those mid 80’s Oilers and late 70’s Habs. It’s only been a year yet you can see the plan and path going forward by team Bowman.

BornInAGretzkyJersey

I remember being stuck in camp on a shutdown watching some of those playoff games on a 13″ CRT TV just being amazed at how rapidly CHI managed to whip the puck north in transition. Coupled with layers of puck support, and oodles of raw skill, they were a force to be reckoned with.

Pretendergast

The Keith contract was a Kenny masterclass. He accomplished his goal, get a veteran defenceman to stabilize and bring up Bouch. Check.

Then you peel back the layers and realize this man couldnt see the forest from the trees.

-Keith was only willing to waive his NMC for the Oil so he could be near his son. He requested a trade TO Edmonton.

-No salary back, hamstringing future moves but further to that. 11 days later this gave Chi room to sign Jones to his gawdy contract that Nurse then got, hamstringing further.

-This was in 2021 when the players were JUST STARTING repayment for 2020. The cap was going to be flat for years and they still gave Chicago a get out of jail card.

-3rd rounder to boot. Absolutely no nuance to any move made.

Last edited 7 hours ago by Pretendergast
BornInAGretzkyJersey

“What did you expect, to get him for free?”

Scungilli Slushy

He was very poor at trades and not great at UFA or contracts. I don’t think he assesses players well. Most of his moves were for completely obvious players, which means older. Not many moved the needle, at least enough

He also was poor at leveraging the brand and the Duo. He signed lower level college and euros, aged out WHLers with distant NHL likelihood. He has a such aversion to risk he won’t use young players, but still didn’t avoid issues with play because of the vets he likes, and probably left offense on the table. He orchestrated the offer sheets over seasons by not creating a place for NHL ready rookies

Bowman, thankfully, seems far more on point so far, and much harder working

Ancient Oilers Fan

Yes.

Isn’t it amazing that a GM with no redeeming qualities took us from bubble team to one game from winning the Stanley Cup.

Traveller

Yes, I mean what was Holland thinking. Giving away Caleb Jones, whose career high since was mostly 3rd pair defense on the worst team in the league and twice as many games in the AHL vs the NHL these past 2 seasons. And he missed out on drafting Jeremey Langlois who is now 21 and still no professional contract.

Instead he got a Hall of Fame defenseman whose contributions to the team were a major help to them getting 3 rounds in to the playoffs, having not won a round since 2017. I doubt any of the Oilers still on the team would down play the impact Keith had on them.

Holland knew that Keith could very likely help the team and he reasoned the cost was worth it. Keith played at a level to justify his cap hit that season. Bowman clearly drew a line in the sand and Holland took the deal rather than walk away.

OriginalPouzar

No issues at all with the player target or the acquisition cost.

At the same time, taking on the full cap hit if a major factor in the discussion and the conversation regarding in $5MM could have been used better is valid.

There is a valid argument that walking away would have been the “right” or “better” move.

BornInAGretzkyJersey

I’m a big fan of resumes.

Ken Holland.

bcoil

Resumes change as we age. You can’t cherry pick a few years and assume someone will be that good for the rest of their career .That includes you and me .

Reja

Exactly the team could of ran itself when you had Connor-Leon-Bouchard cheat sheet to begin with.

humantorch

I said at the time that the Keith trade should have been a fireable offense for Holland and I maintain that statement.

OriginalPouzar

The Edmonton Oilers have been scandalously poor at getting value in trade for many years. The stories are legend and painful

If the story is true, the Oilers had a trade agree to to acquire Cory Perry (and a 1st round pick) for Mike Comrie but management (ownership) required Comrie to give back a signing bonus and that cratered the deal from the Oilers side….?

Reja

The Satan trade cut pretty deep who incidentally ends up getting us Mike Comrie.

Woodguy v2.0

the truly addled general manager no longer exists.

The guy who made the Keith deal is a GM of LAK…maybe give him a call?

BornInAGretzkyJersey

Adrian Kempe.

Dare to dream.

Melman

and the Kings retain salary….because Bowman asks

OriginalPouzar

There have been some very good trades in recent years.

Of course the Ekholm trade is top of mind.

Also the Kulak deadline acquisition has turned out well – need to discount the fact that the Habs picked Lane Hutson and realize that the trade asset was a 2nd round pick and the value of a 2nd round pick is what it is.

Bowman has started off strong with respect to trades.

The Podkolzin trade was thievery even without taking in to account that Bowman took advantage of a rival team making a silly determination on a player.

The Walman trade as well – yup, they paid solid value in a first rounder but this is a strong player, in his prime, that, from all accounts, is on the verge or re-signing.

I don’t see any negative on the Howard/SOR trade. Contrary to some narratives, I don’t think that SOR is any more of a “lock” to have an impact NHL career – there is no “higher floor” there just because he “plays the game the right way” and is a good Canadian boy that is committed to winning.

A VERY good prospect, as is Issac Howard, who is just as likely to have an NHL career, has a higher offensive ceiling, is all but ready right now and will have 3 years of ELC as an Oiler.

Good start Stan.

Maybe Paul Fischer pans out as well?

MushedPeas

In the category of Oh Yeah:

I am unable to keep it in my head that Paul Fischer exists. Hope he makes me look silly for that.

Reja

I thought you might be slipping in your old age and forgot the Jarventie trade but this deal was done 10 days before Bowman hired on. I believe by this time next year will be talking of Jarventie deal in the same small thievery vein as Podkolzin.

OriginalPouzar

Similar to how I didn’t mention the 2025 first round pick to get the 2024 first round pick to draft Sam O’Reily – a targeted player that they received tremendous value for a year later.

At this point, Jarventie has played two AHL games for the org and his future impact is highly in question due to injury history.

As we all know, I am high on his NHL abilities and readiness but, of course, can just hope that health allows him to realize that potential (and that injuries have not already limited him – who knows if his knees are what they need to be….).

Lewis Grant

Yeah, I didn’t like the trade (or the pick) at the time. But he turned that #32OV into a Hobey Baker winner. Still no guarantees, but that’s strong work.

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