Farm Workers 2020

I’m in an unusually good mood when it comes to the prospects in Bakersfield and how the coaching staff is developing them. Since arriving in California, Jay Woodcroft, Dave Manson, J-F Houle, Sylvain Rodrigue and Sam Kim have helped the organization develop NHL talent.

Identifying the exact moment of graduation is difficult, but this group of coaches have been tearing up the blacktop since fall 2018 no matter the metric. It’s good news for the team, for the fans, and especially for prospects like Ryan McLeod.

THE ATHLETIC!

The Athletic Edmonton features a fabulous cluster of stories (some linked below, some on the site). Great perspective from a ridiculous group of writers and analysts. Proud to be part of The Athletic, check it out here.

GRADUATIONS AND WHO GETS CREDIT

I keep fairly close track of players who graduate from the AHL to the NHL, kind of a hobby of mine. Primary credit always to a player, but if a prospect spends a good portion of his rookie pro season in the AHL, then graduates, the coaching staff should get some credit for developing him.

  • 2019-20 grads: Ethan Bear, Kailer Yamamoto, Caleb Jones, Patrick Russell.

Bear’s first AHL coaching staff (Gerry Fleming, Tony Borgford, J-F Houle) will be forgotten save for Houle, who remains on staff. I expect Woodcroft and notably Manson will be credited with the development of Bear and Jones. I don’t know how much Yamamoto was helped so much as he remained mostly healthy and then got the call, but Woodcroft didn’t favor him from what I saw. He had to work for his opportunity and prove himself. If Edmonton wins a Stanley in the coming years with Bear, Yamamoto and Jones, the Woodcroft coaching crew will be part of the lore.

TODD NELSON

I believe he was a fine AHL coach and should be an NHL head coach by now. He coached many future NHLers over five seasons in Oklahoma City, and another pile who should have been there. Here are the NHL totals for players who spent time in the AHL with Nelson:

  1. Jeff Petry 680, 69-184-253
  2. Oscar Klefbom 378, 4-122-156
  3. Magnus Paajarvi 467, 62-62-124
  4. Tyler Pitlick 248, 41-32-73
  5. Brad Hunt 179, 18-40-58
  6. Jordan Oesterle 209, 14-40-54
  7. Mark Arcobello 139, 24-29-53
  8. Jujhar Khaira 218, 21-31-52
  9. Chris VandeVelde 278, 18-30-48
  10. Colin McDonald 148, 20-26-46
  11. Taylor Fedun 127, 8-27-35
  12. Anton Lander 215, 10-25-35
  13. Martin Marincin 227, 5-29-34
  14. Linus Omark 79, 8-24-32
  15. Liam Reddox 100, 6-18-24
  16. Iiro Pakarinen 134, 10-13-23
  17. Brandon Davidson 174, 9-14-23
  18. Teemu Hartikainen 52, 6-7-13
  19. Will Acton 33, 3-2-5
  20. Laurent Brossoit 28, 2.98 .897

This is exactly the player-types you should expect out of the AHL. Quality two-way defensemen, two-way and checking forwards and a pretty good goalie. It’s my opinion a few of these men (Omark, for sure) didn’t get a fair shake when the NHL called.

Bakersfield Condors

  1. Jesse Puljujarvi 139, 17-20-37
  2. Kailer Yamamoto 53, 12-19-31
  3. Ethan Bear 89, 6-19-25
  4. Anton Slepyshev 102, 10-13-23
  5. Caleb Jones 60, 5-10-15
  6. Josh Currie 23, 2-3-5
  7. Patrick Russell 51, 0-5-5
  8. Joe Gambardella 15, 0-3-3

More skill on this list, I expect Puljujarvi and Yamamoto will exceed Paajarvi’s career totals by some margin. Then again, Petry and Klefbom are top drawer AHL grads from the Nelson years.

I want to make a point here, try to make it every year but can never make it rhyme. I think Todd Nelson produced a lot of NHL players, but the coach in Edmonton was so slammed every year with lottery picks some of the farm workers ended up being roll ends, damaged goods and discount canned fruit with a dent or two. Hell, Renney admitted to losing Paajarvi after that strong rookie year because he needed room for Nuge.

I use NHL GP as the gospel, but for me, when looking back, there’s no way Linus Omark’s 79 games represent him, or Teemu Hartikainen’s 52 games. You can accuse me of being biased but I don’t think so. The Holland-Tippett-Woodcroft assembly line already appears more orderly, and hopefully they don’t miss the next Omark. It’s damned important.

FARM WORKERS, 2020 EDITION

It’s been a fun ride over many years, choosing ‘farm workers’ to emerge as NHL players and play 100 or more NHL games. Here are my picks by season, and NHL games played (players listed only once, in the first season I named them).

  • 2009-10: Devan Dubnyk (520).
  • 2010-11: Jeff Petry (680), Linus Omark (79), and Teemu Hartikainen (52).
  • 2011-12: Magnus Paajarvi (467) and Tyler Pitlick (248).
  • 2012-13: Anton Lander (215) and Martin Marincin (227).
  • 2013-14: Oscar Klefbom (378) and Mark Arcobello (139).
  • 2014-15: Jordan Oesterle (209), Iiro Pakarinen (134).
  • 2015-16: Jujhar Khaira (218) and Anton Slepyshev (102), Griffin Reinhart (37).
  • 2016-17: Jesse Puljujarvi (139) and Laurent Brossoit (68).
  • 2017-18: Ethan Bear (89).
  • 2018-19: Kailer Yamamoto (53); Caleb Jones (60); Cooper Marody (6); Tyler Benson (7).
  • 2019-20 (NEW): Evan Bouchard (7)

If a prospect can establish himself as an AHL regular at 20, it bodes well for an NHL career, but does not guarantee it.

A year ago, Tyler Benson became the tenth real prospect since 2010 to play as a regular at 20 (Teemu Hartikainen, Tyler Pitlick, Magnus Paajarvi, Martin Marincin, Martin Gernat, Bogdan Yakimov, Jujhar Khaira, Ethan Bear, Caleb Jones). Paajarvi, Pitlick, Marincin, Khaira and Jones have either played enough in the NHL or on on pace to accomplish it, meaning about 50 percent.

Evan Bouchard, Ryan McLeod, Dmitri Samorukov and Kirill Maksimov were AHL regulars this past season, another reason I like Woodcroft a bunch as a development coach. Kailer Yamamoto was already established as a regular in the AHL by age 20.

Pretty much everyone who is in the AHL past 21 is having some issues and may spend time meandering.

I think we’ve seen great examples of this in the last year. Ethan Bear was in the AHL at 21, spent the entire 2019-20 season (age 22) in the NHL. Caleb Jones spent some time in both leagues. Kailer Yamamoto made it at 20.

Tyler Benson lost Cooper Marody as his center and for me the dip in offense tells us the young winger will be a complementary offensive player in the NHL. No sin, but bet bottom-six instead of top-six, unless he’s lucky enough to find the kind of chem Yamamoto found with Leon Draisaitl. Luck is a thing.

If you haven’t established yourself as a prospect by age 22, you’re in trouble. The players who will be successful have played at least some games in the NHL during entry deals.

This is a weird one, but true. Those seven games played by Benson and eight games by William Lagesson in 2019-20 might not seem like much, but it’s a tell. Ryan McLeod probably gets some games in the NHL in 2020-21, I would have expected Samorukov to get a cup of coffee the following year (not sure now).

Players who were in this spot recently: Jujhar Khaira, Anton Slepyshev, Griffin Reinhart, Jordan Oesterle, Iiro Pakarinen, Laurent Brossoit. Not everyone makes it.

Exceptions are college men, who often turn pro at 22.

Lots of college men: Cooper Marody, Joe Gambardella, Tyler Vesel, Shane Starrett, Ryan Kuffner, Logan Day. Marody was the best player in the group, I believed he was on his way to an NHL career. If he has recovered, expect him to play NHL games in 2020-21. He might even get some playoff games.

No matter what you and I think about a specific AHL player, the largest category of player in the minors is ‘tweener’.

Rob Schremp was a tweener. Anton Lander too. Linus Omark’s career is judged as a tweener despite my misgivings. Kirill Maksimov, Logan Day, Joe Gambardella all qualify. I don’t believe Benson will land here, but this is the point where he’ll need to push through and win NHL work. Window closes quickly.

If we make a list of rfa’s each summer, we can probably pick the cuts and be pretty close.

A year ago, the list included Tyler Vesel, Joe Gambardella, Patrick Russell, Colin Larkin, Robin Norell and Shane Starrett. I (correctly) chose Gambardella, Russell and Starrett as keepers.

This year’s list includes (this is just among minor leaguers, Bear is an NHL player now) Ryan Mantha, Ryan Kuffner, Nolan Vesey, Cam Hebig, Logan Day, William Lagesson and Angus Redmond. I’ll pick Kuffner, Day and Lagesson as the keepers.

Dan Cleary, Fernando Pisani and Jason Chimera are the success stories in this study.

Kamamto aside, AHL grads don’t arrive in the NHL and apply for the scoring role on McDavid’s line (or Nuge, or Leon). AHL grads land on a support line and try to carve out a role. That’s the deal.

This is the job Tyler Benson will be applying for in my opinion. I like his skill, but now believe he’ll slide to the third or fourth line as an NHL player. That’s the single biggest change from a year ago among the farmhands in my opinion. He is no longer applying for the same job as Yamamoto. Interestingly, Raphael Lavoie will be, starting in 2020-21.

LOWDOWN WITH LOWETIDE

A busy morning on TSN1260, beginning at 10. Bruce McCurdy from the Cult of Hockey at the Edmonton Journal will join us to talk prospects, as the Cult’s ranking of the current Oilers group is in the early stages. Joe Osborne from OddsShark will pop in to talk golf and MMA plus your questions and comments. 10-1260 text, @Lowetide on twitter. See you on the radio!

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149 Responses to "Farm Workers 2020"

  1. Lowetide says:

    Is anyone having a difficult time reading up to date comments?

  2. jp says:

    Lowetide,

    No problem with this one.

  3. PennersPancakes says:

    Lowetide,

    This is the first one showing up on my page. I do notice issues accessing the most recent article and the comments if I am not logged in though.

  4. jp says:

    Lowetide,

    I’ve read the post now, love these farm worker write ups.

    So is Bouchard your only pick for 100 games from this season?

    No McLeod? Or Samorukov?

  5. Lowetide says:

    jp:
    Lowetide,

    I’ve read the post now, love these farm worker write ups.

    So is Bouchard your only pick for 100 games from this season?

    No McLeod? Or Samorukov?

    Not yet. They’re trending but didn’t make my list this year. McLeod was close.

  6. Elgin R says:

    I agree whole heartedly with the comment on Omark. The system was poor and did not help develop as many NHL players as it should have. That being said, what Woodcroft et al are doing (along with Holland and Gretzky) is working – so the keep them coming!

    The majority of the credit still goes to the player (Bear, Jones etc). We will see who has the talent, work ethic and drive to make it.

    What Holland will do with Lagesson will be interesting. He played ok with the Oilers so I cannot see him getting through waivers next season. Unless 2 of the current NHL defencemen are traded or not signed (Green), then he will have to trade Lagesson for peanuts. Logan Day may also be a player we shall see.

  7. JOFA says:

    Benson = Schremp 2.0

    100 games tops and then flushed from the league. He’ll have a good career in Europe.

  8. dustrock says:

    PennersPancakes:
    Lowetide,

    This is the first one showing up on my page. I do notice issues accessing the most recent article and the comments if I am not logged in though.

    Been this way forever for me. I just go to yesterday’s post and login there. Lol

  9. Reja says:

    JOFA:
    Benson = Schremp 2.0

    100 games tops and then flushed from the league. He’llhave a good career in Europe.

    Why do you dislike Benson so much?

  10. jp says:

    Elgin R:

    What Holland will do with Lagesson will be interesting.He played ok with the Oilers so I cannot see him getting through waivers next season.Unless 2 of the current NHL defencemen are traded or not signed (Green), then he will have to trade Lagesson for peanuts.Logan Day may also be a player we shall see.

    It will be. My guess is Russell and Benning traded, Green re-signed and Lagesson as 7D (though Bouchard could impact the D corps too). We’ll see.

  11. jtblack says:

    Lowetide:
    Is anyone having a difficult time reading up to date comments?

    I missed the 1st 7 from OP ….

  12. jp says:

    Lowetide: Not yet. They’re trending but didn’t make my list this year. McLeod was close.

    I was surprised since we know you’re high on McLeod. I don’t disagree though.

  13. JOFA says:

    Reja: Why do you dislike Benson so much?

    He’s a tweener IMO. Skating is a HUGE factor. Benson is a great passer. Schremp was a great passer. Both were terrible skaters. Schremp was a better goal scorer. Like I said, 100 games if he’s lucky. Book it!

  14. JOFA says:

    jtblack: I missed the 1st7from OP ….

    Hahahaha😉

  15. Eh Team says:

    JOFA: Benson = Schremp 2.0

    100 games tops and then flushed from the league. He’ll have a good career in Europe.

    The thing is that you don’t know unless players like Benson and Lagesson get a chance to succeed in the NHL. These players have established themselves as strong players in the AHL. A team can’t bring develop them to this point and then not see if they can succeed in the NHL. That’s the whole point of a farm system. To flush them now is irresponsible.

    If they make it (and they should given their track record), then you move the higher paid non-core veteran players (the Russells, and even the Larssons of the world) and plug in the young guys. That’s the way in a salary cap league and especially so when the cap will be flat for awhile. There is lots of room for Benson on the Oilers as the 3rd and 4th lines are below league average.

  16. Clarkenstein says:

    jp:
    Lowetide,

    No problem with this one.

    I did just before you posted this. Works now but always have to be logged in to see comments.

  17. JOFA says:

    Eh Team: The thing is that you don’t know unless players like Benson and Lagesson get a chance to succeed in the NHL.These players have established themselves as strong players in the AHL.A team can’t bring develop them to this point and then not see if they can succeed in the NHL.That’s the whole point of a farm system.To flush them now is irresponsible.

    If they make it (and they should given their track record), then you move the higher paid non-coreveteran players (the Russells, and even the Larssons of the world) and plug in the young guys.That’s the way in a salary cap league and especially so when the cap will be flat for awhile.There is lots of room for Benson on the Oilers as the 3rd and 4th lines are below league average.

    I would love to be wrong. I just don’t see it. We’ll know in two years tops.

  18. Hitman77 says:

    Lowetide:
    Is anyone having a difficult time reading up to date comments?

    Nope. It’s working just fine.

  19. Jaxon says:

    I still have a lot of faith that Benson will make it as a regular NHLer and have a positive impact, possibly even play on a skill line. And Benson has some pretty solid excuses for not developing at the usual rate for a solid NHLer. Those injuries cost him at least 1 year of development, possibly two. He’s a very coachable, intelligent player who will find a way. And worries about his lack of speed are highly overrated in my opinion. I also still think Woodcroft should try Benson at center this year between Lavoie and Maximov. I think his intelligent, 2-way, responsible, gritty game with elite passing is better suited to C. It may unlock the 3rd line C Edmonton has been looking for.

    On the other hand, I really don’t think McLeod will make it. I don’t think he’s shown enough offense in Junior or in his first-year pro.

  20. OriginalPouzar says:

    P. Russell did indeed graduate this past season, I mean, he spent the entire season in the big league but I would suggest he might be heading back to “upgrade” next season – either in Europe or the American league.

    A solid food soldier who can be “trusted” but, to me, he is no more than a tweener and championship teams have depth so that their lineup does not include players who’s greatest attribute is hard work and “won’t hurt you”.

    —————–

    The one “issue” i have with the coaching staff in the Bake is their refusal to give Maksimov PP minutes until the end of the season where the team was a tire fire. Yes, I know, “earn it”, but the PP struggled all season long and a couple blasts from the “Ovie spot” could have sent his confidence sky high.

  21. flyfish1168 says:

    “Renney admitted to losing Paajarvi after that strong rookie year because he needed room for Nuge”

    He was my favorite Rookie of the HOPE era. This was unfortunate the way things turned out.

    If Vegas is a sure thing as a Hub city can anyone here see Edmonton or Vancouver being the second site? This would put both hub cities outside of the eastern time zone, where they have the bigger population of viewership. This will be something the NHL will look at.

  22. OriginalPouzar says:

    Caleb Jones is indeed a “graduate” in my opinion.

    He showed in the last third of the season that he is an every day NHL d-man and played well when filling in for Klefbom in the top 4.

    This will be a massive season for Caleb’s future – does he simply show incremental improvement solidifying that 3LD and top 4 injury fill in spot or does he take another large step and show that he is a top 4 NHL d-man?

    The answer that question likely determines if he’s playing in Edmonton or Seattle in 2020/21.

    What I am almost certain of – $850K X 2 will be massive value.

  23. LadiesloveSmid says:

    I am such a big fan of Caleb Jones’ game. Really hope he plays ahead of Russell & hits it out of the park. What an awesome value contract for the next 2 seasons.

  24. OriginalPouzar says:

    Cooper Marody has been talking over the last month how he finally feels himself and 100% healthy – I am hopeful he can re-establish himself as a real NHL prospect.

    I’m not a guy that thinks “average skating” is an NHL kiss of depth but Cooper’s verbal last camp essentially discounting it as an issue completely is worrisome – acknowledge your deficiencies Coop.

    I think he may skater #28 on the playoff roster – don’t imagine he plays.

  25. OriginalPouzar says:

    I think you nailed the RFAs that will be kept.

    Kuffner is my sleeper – here is hoping he can revive that college offence.

    I had originally thought Day would be let go but Berglund staying in Europe somewhat changes things as the Condors are void of legit RD – assuming Bouchard spends most of the 2020/21 season in the NHL (if not all), I think Deharnais, on an AHL deal, is next on the depth chart.

    I think Holland is trying to get Day back to an AHL contract – maybe with a Malone style money kicker.

    Same with UFA Josh Currie.

  26. godot10 says:

    JOFA:
    Benson = Schremp 2.0

    100 games tops and then flushed from the league. He’llhave a good career in Europe.

    Benson has to realize that he has to be more than a playmaker in the NHL. He has to dig harder for the dirty areas, and get more shots. He has to have his Marty Reasoner moment, and make the changes to his game that he needs to make to be an NHL player.

    The trouble with players who were near phenoms in their teens when everyone else catches up to them is whether they can adapt. Benson has to be hungrier without the puck.

  27. JimmyV1965 says:

    jtblack: I missed the 1st7from OP ….

    LOL. I gotta admit that was pretty funny, even though I have zero issues with OPs comment volume.

  28. JOFA says:

    godot10: Benson has to realize that he has to be more than a playmaker in the NHL.He has to dig harder for the dirty areas, and get more shots.He has to have his Marty Reasoner moment, and make the changes to his game that he needs to make to be an NHL player.

    The trouble with players who were near phenoms in their teens when everyone else catches up to them is whether they can adapt.Benson has to be hungrier without the puck.

    And learn how to skate!

  29. Scungilli Slushy says:

    To me regular players are in deep if they don’t check enough boxes off of the complete player checklist

    I like all Oiler prospects. Benson is on the outside looking in because despite being highly skilled that is the only box he checks off

    He’s an average skater, not big, not a buzzsaw, not tough, doesn’t have a plus shot and isn’t a great scorer. IQ and passing are his tools.

    I think his wheels preclude him from C because it’s a lot about getting around the ice for the C. McLeod being big and an excellent skater and two way player has a better shot at C, but bottom 6 for sure.

    The Oilers could use a C like that. An upgrade on Sheahan and Khaira later on

  30. JOFA says:

    Jaxon:
    I still have a lot of faith that Benson will make it as a regular NHLer and have a positive impact, possibly even play on a skill line. And Benson has some pretty solid excuses for not developing at the usual rate for a solid NHLer. Those injuries cost him at least 1 year of development, possibly two. He’s a very coachable, intelligent player who will find a way. And worries about his lack of speed are highly overrated in my opinion. I also still think Woodcroft should try Benson at center this year between Lavoie and Maximov. I think his intelligent, 2-way, responsible, gritty game with elite passing is better suited to C. It may unlock the 3rd line C Edmonton has been looking for.

    On the other hand, I really don’t think McLeod will make it. I don’t think he’s shown enough offense in Junior or in his first-year pro.

    I think McLeod may even play more NHL games than Benson when it’s all said and done.

  31. Scungilli Slushy says:

    JOFA: I think McLeod may even play more NHL games than Benson when it’s all said and done.

    I think if McLeod was feistier he’d be getting a push and may displace Khaira on the roster. He also likely would have been gone in the first round and not an Oiler.

  32. OriginalPouzar says:

    Jordie Benn’s wife is scheduled to give birth on July 24 and he said he is absolutely going to be in Dallas for it.

    Horvat’s wife is scheduled for July 19 and he’s said he hasn’t decided what he’s going to do.

    Interesting to see what the protocol will be for players that leave during phase 3 or 4.

    Benning’s wife is due very soon – prior to stage 3.

  33. London Jon says:

    Watching the first EPL game of the restart.

    The fan noise works surprisingly well

  34. London Jon says:

    First game back and VAR invites Mr Cockup and his whole family over for a long weekend

  35. Reja says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    Jordie Benn’s wife is scheduled to give birth on July 24 and he said he is absolutely going to be in Dallas for it.

    Horvat’s wife is scheduled for July 19 and he’s said he hasn’t decided what he’s going to do.

    Interesting to see what the protocol will be for players that leave during phase 3 or 4.

    Benning’s wife is due very soon – prior to stage 3.

    It’s a good thing the Oilers were on a extended road trip last November.

  36. jtblack says:

    JimmyV1965: LOL. I gotta admit that was pretty funny, even though I have zero issues with OPs comment volume.

    I have zero issues as well But couldn’t pass up the opportunity

  37. jtblack says:

    chiasson is a poor skater. He has carved out a career.

    Samwise was slow boots. He had a good career.

    So Benson has a chance ……..

  38. jtblack says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    Jordie Benn’s wife is scheduled to give birth on July 24 and he said he is absolutely going to be in Dallas for it.

    Horvat’s wife is scheduled for July 19 and he’s said he hasn’t decided what he’s going to do.

    Interesting to see what the protocol will be for players that leave during phase 3 or 4.

    Benning’s wife is due very soon – prior to stage 3.

    What if I guy gets injured early in the playoffs. is he just supposed to sit in the hotel Room for 2 months while his team plays hockey?

  39. N64 says:

    jtblack: What if I guy gets injured early in the playoffs. is he just supposed to sit in the hotel Room for 2 months while his team plays hockey?

    apparently the 14 day quarantine to rejoin the team. breaking curfew a real bad idea this year.

  40. Reja says:

    godot10: Benson has to realize that he has to be more than a playmaker in the NHL.He has to dig harder for the dirty areas, and get more shots.He has to have his Marty Reasoner moment, and make the changes to his game that he needs to make to be an NHL player.

    The trouble with players who were near phenoms in their teens when everyone else catches up to them is whether they can adapt.Benson has to be hungrier without the puck.

    I know that missing basically 2 years of arguably the most important developmental time in a hockey career is no excuse for him not being a everyday player. Yet for some reason I don’t think this kid is going to take things for granted like somebody else in our system. I say give the kid a chance before buying him a one way bus ticket for Toledo.

  41. buck yoakam says:

    godot10,

    maybe some kids need to strive to be the next ryan smyth ..there are roles for everyone when you get to this level…understand where you best contribute…man I was watching martin st louis last night…he was smoking…again, maybe a spot in the wheel for anyone willing to work their ass off …look at the hunters and your pouzars ….role players make a huge diff in the playoffs

  42. Lowetide says:

    godot10: Benson has to realize that he has to be more than a playmaker in the NHL.He has to dig harder for the dirty areas, and get more shots.He has to have his Marty Reasoner moment, and make the changes to his game that he needs to make to be an NHL player.

    The trouble with players who were near phenoms in their teens when everyone else catches up to them is whether they can adapt.Benson has to be hungrier without the puck.

    I think he is, and showed it on the road. I don’t think the NHL is a question now.

  43. defmn says:

    jtblack:
    chiasson is a poor skater. He has carved out a career.

    Samwise was slow boots.He had a good career.

    So Benson has a chance ……..

    It seems to me that less than a year ago we heard the same thing about Bear not being fast enough for the NHL

    I think I’ll give Benson another year to define himself as well.

    I like that Holland is patient and doesn’t try to force things before he needs to.

  44. Darth Tu says:

    defmn: It seems to me that less than a year ago we heard the same thing about Bear not being fast enough for the NHL

    I think I’ll give Benson another year to define himself as well.

    I like that Holland is patient and doesn’t try to force things before he needs to.

    Great point. Benson doesn’t have to be a complete burner, but if he can work on the skating enough to get to where he needs to be then his hands can do what has to be done when he gets there.

    I keep reminding myself that he’s lost a significant amount of development time to injury. He may never be able to work all the way back from that, but there’s definitely raw talent in there.

    I’m cheering him on, and if he ends up as an everyday 3/4 LW in the NHL that represents success.

  45. defmn says:

    Darth Tu: Great point. Benson doesn’t have to be a complete burner, but if he can work on the skating enough to get to where he needs to be then his hands can do what has to be done when he gets there.

    I keep reminding myself that he’s lost a significant amount of development time to injury.He may never be able to work all the way back from that, but there’s definitely raw talent in there.

    I’m cheering him on, and if he ends up as an everyday 3/4 LW in the NHL that represents success.

    Benson was a high 2nd round pick. I think we should also remember that when Holland is being encouraged to trade Puljujarvi for that same opportunity.

  46. Darth Tu says:

    As for Samorukov, I’m still bullish on him arriving as an NHLer. The upside there if it all shakes out in the right way is huge. Here’s to him doing a job in the KHL and then pushing for the Oilers out of camp in 2021.

    If we end up in a situation where Broberg and Samorukov are arriving at the same time some interesting decisions will have to be made re: LD.

  47. Reja says:

    defmn: It seems to me that less than a year ago we heard the same thing about Bear not being fast enough for the NHL

    I think I’ll give Benson another year to define himself as well.

    I like that Holland is patient and doesn’t try to force things before he needs to.

    Also heard around here was that the best player on the planet was slow and lazy

  48. LadiesloveSmid says:

    Benson-RNH-Puljujarvi
    Ennis-Drai-Yamo

    Athanasiou-McDavid-Who Cares

  49. London Jon says:

    LadiesloveSmid:
    Benson-RNH-Puljujarvi
    Ennis-Drai-Yamo

    Athanasiou-McDavid-Who Cares

    I think Benson, Sheahan (or Haas or JJ), Archibald could be a great shutdown line. Smart players, good along the boards, able to contain and play the percentages well

  50. Klima's_Bucket says:

    With the fallout in Buffalo and a whole new crew coming in with no attachment to players and prospects, who would you target from Buffalo to add to the Oilers?

  51. London Jon says:

    I was very negative about Haas when we signed him, but I hope he comes back next year as I think he’ll step up a level in his second season now that he’s used to the league and knows what to expect.

    Same goes for Nygaard who has a good hockey brain to go with his absolute rockets for boots

  52. jp says:

    defmn: It seems to me that less than a year ago we heard the same thing about Bear not being fast enough for the NHL

    I think I’ll give Benson another year to define himself as well.

    I like that Holland is patient and doesn’t try to force things before he needs to.

    +1

  53. Reja says:

    London Jon:
    I was very negative about Haas when we signed him, but I hope he comes back next year as I think he’ll step up a level in his second season now that he’s used to the league and knows what to expect.

    Same goes for Nygaard who has a good hockey brain to go with his absolute rockets for boots

    As a 3rd, 4th liner he definitely knows how to draw penalties which is a art in itself.

  54. OriginalPouzar says:

    WHL announces that they plan to start their season on October 2 – a return to play task force has been formed and they will work with government and health officials.

    The only thing the release said about fans is the following:

    “The WHL is also working with government and health authorities in each jurisdiction on the level of spectator capacities that will be permitted in each WHL Club arena facility. The WHL is a spectator-driven league and the welcoming back of WHL fans is vital to a successful return to hockey for all 22 WHL member Clubs.”

    https://whl.ca/article/whl-announces-return-to-play-protocol-for-2020-21

    ———————

    I wonder if its feasible for the to start playing if a somewhat normal level of fans are not permitted?

    I wonder what is going to happen, in all three CHL leagues, with the higher end draft eligibles – Lafreniere, Byfield, Rossi, Perffeti, etc.

    I mean, even if the NHL was starting on time like normal, most would be heading back to their junior teams after camp – of course, Lafreniere is likely to stay (and a few others ultimately) but most will be back in junior.

    Do these guys play and risk injury before the draft? They’d be playing in the normal course – they’d be drafted put most would not have signed their ELCs so what’s the difference?

  55. OriginalPouzar says:

    Elgin R:
    I agree whole heartedly with the comment on Omark.The system was poor and did not help develop as many NHL players as it should have.That being said, what Woodcroft et al are doing (along with Holland and Gretzky) is working – so the keep them coming!

    The majority of the credit still goes to the player (Bear, Jones etc).We will see who has the talent, work ethic and drive to make it.

    What Holland will do with Lagesson will be interesting.He played ok with the Oilers so I cannot see him getting through waivers next season.Unless 2 of the current NHL defencemen are traded or not signed (Green), then he will have to trade Lagesson for peanuts.Logan Day may also be a player we shall see.

    I’m still “mad” that Coach T. and Playfair healthy scratched Lagesson for 8 straight games while a regressing and deteriorating Manning got ice.

    So much more information could have been received on this player.

    I am confident Lagesson could be an every day 3LD this season if given the chance – of course, that is Jones’ job and, as of now, there is Kris Russell in the way.

    The plan, I’m sure, is to divest of Rusty and have Lagesson as 7D (with Bouchard first call-up if a RD goes down).

    The contract i would think would be similar to Jones.

    On the off-chance that they do want/need to send him down (K. Russell’s contract ramifications), while I clearly think he is an NHL player, players of this stature clear waivers all the time in the days leading up to game 1.

    I wouldn’t be surprised if he clears – risk, for sure, but legit “names” clear each and every year.

  56. OriginalPouzar says:

    JOFA:
    Benson = Schremp 2.0

    100 games tops and then flushed from the league. He’llhave a good career in Europe.

    Based on ??????

    Let me guess “skating”.

  57. Material Elvis says:

    Klima’s_Bucket:
    With the fallout in Buffalo and a whole new crew coming in with no attachment to players and prospects, who would you target from Buffalo to add to the Oilers?

    Jack Eichel and Rasmus Dahlin. They don’t have much, even after all the years of drafting near the top. Maybe Marcus Johanssen but they would have to take money back and sounds like they are cost cutting so I doubt that would work. Jeff Skinner with 50% retained for 7 years? Damn that is a shit contract. Middlestadt for something? He has potential but not a good work ethic — can’t see Tippett falling in love with that. They have a lot of junk on the roster.

  58. OriginalPouzar says:

    jp: It will be. My guess is Russell and Benning traded, Green re-signed and Lagesson as 7D (though Bouchard could impact the D corps too). We’ll see.

    I see it as you laid out as well – with Bouch starting the year in the AHL if there is a concurrent AHL season.

    Caveats:

    1) if he can move Russell – it won’t be easy but its important

    2) I don’t really want Benning traded unless its for value as I’m sold on Green and he’s turning 35 this fall. I’m concerned that management and the coaching staff see him as a more substantial player than he currently is. I need to see him in the playoffs before being on board with Green.

    Whichever of Green or Benning are signed, I think it will be two years in order to ensure the expansion draft exposure requirement is met (they may want/need to protect Jones and Lagesson may or may not meet the games played this year).

  59. OriginalPouzar says:

    Elgin R:
    I agree whole heartedly with the comment on Omark.The system was poor and did not help develop as many NHL players as it should have.That being said, what Woodcroft et al are doing (along with Holland and Gretzky) is working – so the keep them coming!

    The majority of the credit still goes to the player (Bear, Jones etc).We will see who has the talent, work ethic and drive to make it.

    What Holland will do with Lagesson will be interesting.He played ok with the Oilers so I cannot see him getting through waivers next season.Unless 2 of the current NHL defencemen are traded or not signed (Green), then he will have to trade Lagesson for peanuts.Logan Day may also be a player we shall see.

    Sorry to quote this post again but I missed the Logan Day piece.

    Do you mean Day may be an NHL player?

    I would be shocked if Logan Day ever plays an NHL game. Yes, he put up points as an older rookie but his game is pure chaos – he’s a rover and, frankly, less than a tweener.

    In my opinion.

  60. Reja says:

    OriginalPouzar: I see it as you laid out as well – with Bouch starting the year in the AHL if there is a concurrent AHL season.

    Caveats:

    1) if he can move Russell – it won’t be easy but its important

    2) I don’t really want Benning traded unless its for value as I’m sold on Green and he’s turning 35 this fall.I’m concerned that management and the coaching staff see him as a more substantial player than he currently is. I need to see him in the playoffs before being on board with Green.

    Whichever of Green or Benning are signed, I think it will be two years in order to ensure the expansion draft exposure requirement is met (they may want/need to protect Jones and Lagesson may or may not meet the games played this year).

    If Russell gives a shit list of the teams he would except a trade to can the Oilers in good faith send him to the minors.

  61. maudite says:

    Klima’s_Bucket:
    With the fallout in Buffalo and a whole new crew coming in with no attachment to players and prospects, who would you target from Buffalo to add to the Oilers?

    I was wondering that as well…

    If okposo would waive and buffalo eat enough to make buying out Neal even cost be worth a thought?

    Sure most places be better for playing so I could see it being easy to get okposo to waive for chance to play with mcdavid…saves sabres a protected slot during expansion draft (with us eating more real dollars what level of sweetner possible…2nd rounder this year?).

    If Katz has stomach for it might be a feasible upgrade for money alone…he was buried in dzone this year 61% which is opposite of Neal 62% ozone.

    1 yearish younger than neal..(odd stat thought…PDO over whole career or 5 year segments maybe tells a story i’ve always pondered it…Like small variances above or below average might really say something about a players impact…probably dumb. Career numbers (all possession EV)

    Neal 821 GP – 289 G – 545 P – PDO 99.9 – OZS 59% – CF 53% – CFrel 2.7%
    Okposo 800 GP – 196 G – 506 P – PDO 98.5 – OZS 52% – CF 50% – CFrel 0.9%

    Don’t inherently know enough about okposo to judge if he’s broken down or slow boots but relative he did well considering usage this year. Career wise slight edge looks to be Neal for most part (not factoring PP based numbers though…). but if cost is neutral and decent asset gained possible…is this something worth pondering for a RW option?

  62. Eh Team says:

    defmn: It seems to me that less than a year ago we heard the same thing about Bear not being fast enough for the NHL

    I think I’ll give Benson another year to define himself as well.

    I like that Holland is patient and doesn’t try to force things before he needs to.

    By definition, half of the players in the NHL are below average NHL skaters. There’s lot of examples of below average skaters who can play in the NHL if they have other skills, like high hockey IQ, positional and defensive awareness and passing ability.

  63. jp says:

    Reja: If Russell gives a shit list of the teams he would except a trade to can the Oilers in good faith send him to the minors.

    He has a no-move clause so they can’t send him down, no matter what the faith.

  64. maudite says:

    maudite: I was wondering that as well…

    If okposo would waive and buffalo eat enough to make buying out Neal even cost be worth a thought?

    Sure most places be better for playing so I could see it being easy to get okposo to waive for chance to play with mcdavid…saves sabres a protected slot during expansion draft (with us eating more real dollars what level of sweetner possible…2nd rounder this year?).

    If Katz has stomach for it might be a feasible upgrade for money alone…he was buried in dzone this year 61% which is opposite of Neal 62% ozone.

    1 yearish younger than neal..(odd stat thought…PDO over whole career or 5 year segments maybe tells a story i’ve always pondered it…Like small variances above or below average might really say something about a players impact…probably dumb.Career numbers (all possession EV)

    Neal821 GP – 289 G – 545 P – PDO 99.9 – OZS 59% – CF 53% – CFrel 2.7%
    Okposo800 GP – 196 G – 506 P – PDO 98.5 – OZS 52% – CF 50% –CFrel 0.9%

    Don’t inherently know enough about okposo to judge if he’s broken down or slow boots but relative he did well considering usage this year.Career wise slight edge looks to be Neal for most part (not factoring PP based numbers though…).but if cost is neutral and decent asset gained possible…is this something worth pondering for a RW option?

    Acually, maybe just a straight across trade just for unprotecting roster spot in buffalo and okposo contract being better buyout potential….don’t know what relative value between the two might be as far as view across league….quick dive into sabres nation supports suggestion that okposo looked like over expensive but solid bottom 6 option…which has more value to us than I’d assume neal presently does…even staving off buyout for another year is of value.

    does buffalo benefit enough by 250k per year and freeing roster protection from expansion to drop buyout cost in half, on our side, if okposo is deemed expendable…
    Chess level improving away from Lucic contract one move at a time?

  65. PennersPancakes says:

    Reja: If Russell gives a shit list of the teams he would except a trade to can the Oilers in good faith send him to the minors.

    Does the cowboy have a NMC in his final year?

  66. godot10 says:

    Klima’s_Bucket:
    With the fallout in Buffalo and a whole new crew coming in with no attachment to players and prospects, who would you target from Buffalo to add to the Oilers?

    Krueger has recently completed a thorough evaluation of every player in the organization. He knows who he wants to keep and who he wants to sign.

  67. godot10 says:

    PennersPancakes: Does the cowboy have a NMC in his final year?

    He has an NMC to prevent him from being sent to the minors, and a 15-team no-trade-list.

    Russell absolutely owned Chiarelli in that deal.

  68. defmn says:

    Klima’s_Bucket:
    With the fallout in Buffalo and a whole new crew coming in with no attachment to players and prospects, who would you target from Buffalo to add to the Oilers?

    Ullmark is intriguing in goal. He’s an RFA this summer and Johannson looks like he is ready to back up Hutton. Lowetide mentioned him a month or two ago when looking for a spot to move Puljujarvi to if I remember correctly.

    26 years old and just entering his prime as a goalie.

  69. PennersPancakes says:

    godot10: He has an NMC to prevent him from being sent to the minors, and a 15-team no-trade-list.

    Russell absolutely owned Chiarelli in that deal.

    Term, money, and trade protection. The Chia trifecta

  70. OriginalPouzar says:

    Eh Team: The thing is that you don’t know unless players like Benson and Lagesson get a chance to succeed in the NHL.These players have established themselves as strong players in the AHL.A team can’t bring develop them to this point and then not see if they can succeed in the NHL.That’s the whole point of a farm system.To flush them now is irresponsible.

    The above is why it remains so mind-boggling that Lagesson was healthy scratched for 8 games in favor of Manning early in the year. Yes, Manning actually had a good game in his first game (if I recall correctly) but his game went steeply down – the coaches kept putting him right back in the lineup.

  71. Eh Team says:

    PennersPancakes: Term, money, and trade protection. The Chia trifecta

    For a player who could only get a contract after training camp started in 2016.

  72. OriginalPouzar says:

    Jaxon:
    I still have a lot of faith that Benson will make it as a regular NHLer and have a positive impact, possibly even play on a skill line. And Benson has some pretty solid excuses for not developing at the usual rate for a solid NHLer. Those injuries cost him at least 1 year of development, possibly two. He’s a very coachable, intelligent player who will find a way. And worries about his lack of speed are highly overrated in my opinion. I also still think Woodcroft should try Benson at center this year between Lavoie and Maximov. I think his intelligent, 2-way, responsible, gritty game with elite passing is better suited to C. It may unlock the 3rd line C Edmonton has been looking for.

    On the other hand, I really don’t think McLeod will make it. I don’t think he’s shown enough offense in Junior or in his first-year pro.

    With respect, are you the one that wants to move Jesse to center as well?

    I understand the premise with “playing style”, however these players are life long wingers (well, once they got to junior and European pro leagues at least) and are fighting tooth and nail to try and make it to the best league in the world – I don’t think that, at this stage of their careers, trying to learn a new position (with more important responsibilities) is something that will help them make it to the next level.

    With respect to McLeod, his 5 on 5 scoring in the AHL this year was actually pretty good – he got all but no PP time and little time with the higher end skill players and produced a bit at evens. It was an encouraging offensive year.

    That size with that speed with a defensive conscious – its tough not to see him make it as a 2-way bottom 6 and PK guy, as a floor.

  73. JOFA says:

    OriginalPouzar: Based on ??????

    Let me guess “skating”.

    Hey OP,
    Yes. I mentioned that earlier. IMO he projects to be the next Schremp. In fact I believe Schremp had more skill. The league is changing fast. Lander put up numbers in the NHL as well. Skating was always an issue there too.

    We’ll have to wait and see how it all plays out. Like I said, I hope I’m wrong, but his skating just isn’t NHL caliber IMO. Stay tuned.

    Edit: AHL not NHL

  74. RonnieB says:

    maudite: Acually, maybe just a straight across trade just for unprotecting roster spot in buffalo and okposo contract being better buyout potential….don’t know what relative value between the two might be as far as view across league….quick dive into sabres nation supports suggestion that okposo looked like over expensive but solid bottom 6 option…which has more value to us than I’d assume neal presently does…even staving off buyout for another year is of value.

    does buffalo benefit enough by 250k per year and freeing roster protection from expansion to drop buyout cost in half, on our side, if okposo is deemed expendable…
    Chess level improving away from Lucic contract one move at a time?

    I’m not sure i’m following your position accutately. Are you suggesting that an Okposo buyout would cost the Oilers less than a Neal buyout ?
    According to Capfriendly.com…
    Neal buyout would carry a cap hit of $1.916 million for each of the next 6 years.
    Okposo buyout would carry a cap hit of (by year) $4.0 $5.0 $3.0 followed by 3 years at $1,0

  75. Material Elvis says:

    OriginalPouzar: Based on ??????

    Let me guess “skating”.

    You write “skating” like it is a trivial skill. It can make you or break you. Personally, I think Benson can make it even with his poor “skating”. He needs to round out his game a bit, but he has the passing and hockey sense to make it.

  76. Reja says:

    OriginalPouzar: The above is why it remains so mind-boggling that Lagesson was healthy scratched for 8 games in favor of Manning early in the year. Yes, Manning actually had a good game in his first game (if I recall correctly) but his game went steeply down – the coaches kept putting him right back in the lineup.

    Coach Tippett went with the known rather then the unknown he was chasing W’s

  77. Reja says:

    Material Elvis: You write “skating” like it is a trivial skill.It can make you or break you.Personally, I think Benson can make it even with his poor “skating”.He needs to round out his game a bit, but he has the passing and hockey sense to make it.

    Just because a couple of posters say he has poor skating doesn’t make it necessarily so. There’s a massive difference between poor and average.

  78. OriginalPouzar says:

    flyfish1168:
    “Renney admitted to losing Paajarvi after that strong rookie year because he needed room for Nuge”

    He was my favorite Rookie of the HOPE era. This was unfortunate the way things turned out.

    If Vegas is a sure thing as a Hub city can anyone here see Edmonton or Vancouver being the second site? This would put both hub cities outside of the eastern time zone,where they have the bigger population of viewership. This will be something the NHL will look at.

    Time zones in the local don’t matter as much given no fans – its about the time of the game where there will be viewership.

    With that said, it can’t be too egregious to the players.

    They are talking 3 games per day for the play-in and round robin – apx 12, 4:30, 9 start times – I anticipate those start times are where viewership.

    For a game starting at noon out east, if its in Vegas, that’s 9am, players on ice around 8:20 – so, they are having their pre-game meal at 5:30am? I don’t think its feasible. The players won’t agree to that.

    Edmonton helps by an hour but I still don’t think it works.

    Long story short, yes, I think there will be an Eastern hub and its likely Toronto.

  79. OriginalPouzar says:

    LadiesloveSmid:
    I am such a big fan of Caleb Jones’ game. Really hope he plays ahead of Russell & hits it out of the park. What an awesome value contract for the next 2 seasons.

    Rusty’s ice time was decreases when he played in 2020 but that may just have been coaches trying to shelter him coming back from injury (similar to Benning).

    I think Tip (Playfair) likes Jones – Tip is a fan of puck moving.

    WIth that said, Tip is also a fan of his veterans and now we are in to the playoffs.

    I’m almost positive they play Green over Benning for game 1 but am not sure what we see on the left side vis-a-vis Jones vs. Rusty.

  80. OriginalPouzar says:

    Scungilli Slushy: I think if McLeod was feistier he’d be getting a push and may displace Khaira on the roster. He also likely would have been gone in the first round and not an Oiler.

    Of any “real prospect” would benefit from the teachings of the coaching staff in the AHL, McLeod is likely at the top of that list.

    He is a very nice prospect and, if he puts his tools together, he is going to be a gem but he needs time.

    He wasn’t even a full time center in the AHL, let alone a top 6 center, let alone on the verge of NHL readiness.

    The coaching staff in the Bake have talked alot about him “staying in plays”, getting between the player and the puck, embracing the dirty areas, etc.

    I think another full year in the AHL learning, if not parts of a 3rd year, will be important for this player.

    He may get a cup of coffee next year but I would like the organization to play the development game with him. He can be that 3C for the next decade, if he develops.

  81. OriginalPouzar says:

    jtblack: What if I guy gets injured early in the playoffs. is he just supposed to sit in the hotel Room for 2 months while his team plays hockey?

    Of course not – the issue is leaving the bubble and then coming back in to it.

  82. OriginalPouzar says:

    defmn: Benson was a high 2nd round pick. I think we should also remember that when Holland is being encouraged to trade Puljujarvi for that same opportunity.

    Agree with the premise.

    Benson is like 3 months older than Jesse who is like 4 months older than Yamamoto.

    The three players are within 7 months of each other yet, to some, Jesse will never make it but Benson just needs some more development time (and that is what was said about Kailer like 6 months ago).

    Jesse’s development was “uneven” similar to Benson’s.

    Maybe Jesse should get some additional time (which included this past year as a “re-start”) – don’t give up on this guy.

    Come on home Jesse.

  83. OriginalPouzar says:

    Darth Tu:
    As for Samorukov, I’m still bullish on him arriving as an NHLer. The upside there if it all shakes out in the right way is huge. Here’s to him doing a job in the KHL and then pushing for the Oilers out of camp in 2021.

    If we end up in a situation where Broberg and Samorukov are arriving at the same time some interesting decisions will have to be made re: LD.

    Definitely still bullish on Sammy – his year in the AHL was uneven but he did show solid development and was starting to gain steam when he had that face issue – team was a tire fire by the time he returned.

    I would say that his play was in line with expectations for non-high draft first year pro d-man.

    I was looking forward to him running to the top 4 role in the Bake this year but stupid COVID.

    His playing in the KHL this coming season doesn’t sour anything, in my opinion – Holland was pretty clear the organization is all for it – its about a place to play and he’ll be back in North America for the following season.

  84. OriginalPouzar says:

    Klima’s_Bucket:
    With the fallout in Buffalo and a whole new crew coming in with no attachment to players and prospects, who would you target from Buffalo to add to the Oilers?

    Linus Ullmark.

  85. OriginalPouzar says:

    London Jon:
    I was very negative about Haas when we signed him, but I hope he comes back next year as I think he’ll step up a level in his second season now that he’s used to the league and knows what to expect.

    Same goes for Nygaard who has a good hockey brain to go with his absolute rockets for boots

    I’m pretty sure Haas is coming back as he re-signed.

    Now with a year (well part of a year) under his belt in the NHL, I anticipate we’ll see him with material PK duties next year – they were a big part of his game in the Swiss league so I’ve heard.

  86. OriginalPouzar says:

    Reja: If Russell gives a shit list of the teams he would except a trade to can the Oilers in good faith send him to the minors.

    No Movement Clause

  87. OriginalPouzar says:

    PennersPancakes: Does the cowboy have a NMC in his final year?

    Yes.

  88. OriginalPouzar says:

    godot10: He has an NMC to prevent him from being sent to the minors, and a 15-team no-trade-list.

    Russell absolutely owned Chiarelli in that deal.

    Chiarelli went 0 for 4 – he lost on:

    – term
    – AAV
    – trade protection
    – signing bonus/buyout structure

  89. OriginalPouzar says:

    Reja: Coach Tippett went with the known rather then the unknown he was chasing W’s

    Ya, knowingly bad.

  90. oilsnc79 says:

    Clarkenstein: I did just before you posted this.Works now but always have to be logged in to see comments

    Yes, l get logged out about every 2 to 3 weeks. When I log back in
    I make sure to click remember me then bobs yur uncle logged in n all comments.

  91. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Jaxon,

    That’s an interesting take that’s not dissimilar to the idea of converting JP to a centre.

    Are there any prior examples of wingers converting to centre after junior and succeeding?

  92. Reja says:

    OriginalPouzar: Ya, knowingly bad.

    Never did see the logic in obtaining Manning, been a Oiler fan since day one and acquiring Manning is right up there. Unless of course Peter was trying to troll his own fan base.

  93. Harpers Hair says:

    Just listened to a fascinating interview with Pierre LeBrun.

    He pointed out that many players signed contracts with massive signing bonuses in 20/21 and 21/22 to guard against a possible work stoppage.

    Now that it appears labour peace will prevail and given the potential for massive escrow in the next couple of years, those players could very well regret the way their contracts are structured since massive amounts will be lost to escrow.

    Also, there are some owners who will be hard pressed to pay those bonuses at a time of zero revenue on July1st.

    He believes there are 5-6 teams that will be trading high end players for peanuts just to rid themselves of those contracts.

    Some teams with cash and cap space may be in a position to benefit greatly.

  94. maudite says:

    RonnieB: I’m not sure i’m following your position accutately. Are you suggesting that an Okposo buyout would cost the Oilers less than a Neal buyout ?
    According to Capfriendly.com…
    Neal buyout would carry a cap hit of $1.916 million for each of the next 6 years.
    Okposo buyout would carry a cap hit of (by year) $4.0 $5.0 $3.0 followed by 3 years at $1,0

    Yup…sorry I screwed up I wasnt scrolling far enough to see past 1 million per and not factoring signing bonuses.

    Still was wondering what might make it work.

    Breaking the expansion protection has to have value going into next year. More so as ot closes in.

    So 250K cap space
    Break protection
    3 million more paid to neal in real dollars over 3 years
    Guy that while overpaid might he better fit in bottom 6 role

    Back to likely needed ++ to make it worth bother…which means likely not worth bother. Was hoping I found an odd scavenger hunt exchange loop for potential net gain.

    Dont know enough about okposo style of game to weigh much on difference in what they might bring.

  95. jp says:

    godot10: He has an NMC to prevent him from being sent to the minors, and a 15-team no-trade-list.

    Russell absolutely owned Chiarelli in that deal.

    I guess the Reinhart trade is the Crown Jewel. But in a lot of ways that Russell contract is more galling.

  96. jp says:

    OriginalPouzar: The above is why it remains so mind-boggling that Lagesson was healthy scratched for 8 games in favor of Manning early in the year. Yes, Manning actually had a good game in his first game (if I recall correctly) but his game went steeply down – the coaches kept putting him right back in the lineup.

    I don’t mean to argue for Manning here, he was clearly not part of the future, was coming off a bad year the previous year and has proven to be dropping off badly.

    But. If you look at this completely impartially, Manning was the better NHL player this season: https://www.naturalstattrick.com/playerteams.php?fromseason=20192020&thruseason=20192020&stype=2&sit=5v5&score=all&stdoi=oi&rate=n&team=EDM&pos=D&loc=B&toi=0&gpfilt=none&fd=&td=&tgp=410&lines=single&draftteam=ALL

    He also had a history of being a solid 3rd pairing defenseman in the NHL, and was under contract being paid $2M+. I’d have preferred they get a look at Lagesson too, I just don’t see it as mind boggling at all.

  97. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Klima’s_Bucket:
    With the fallout in Buffalo and a whole new crew coming in with no attachment to players and prospects, who would you target from Buffalo to add to the Oilers?

    Eichel and Dahlin for McDavid.

  98. jp says:

    Reja: Coach Tippett went with the known rather then the unknown he was chasing W’s

    OriginalPouzar: Ya, knowingly bad.

    Good Lord.

    I’d like Russell removed from the Oilers roster too but he’s not been that bad of an NHL player. In his Oilers career he’s been +7, -11, +1 and -1 at 5v5.

    Tippett is such an idiot for playing him.

  99. hunter1909 says:

    Reja: Never did see the logic in obtaining Manning, been a Oiler fan since day one and acquiring Manning is right up there. Unless of course Peter was trying to troll his own fan base.

    Lowe+MacT are easy to understand in their well meaning, yet ham fisted approach to NHL management.

    Chiarelli comes across as being simply nasty. Like the manifestation of pure evil.

  100. hunter1909 says:

    jp: Tippett is such an idiot for playing him.

    Tippett had so many options, lol

  101. Reja says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan: Eichel and Dahlin for McDavid.

    That’s Blasphemy!

  102. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Reja: That’s Blasphemy!

    I know, but I couldn’t help myself. I haven’t had my Snickers yet.

  103. jp says:

    JOFA: Hey OP,
    Yes. I mentioned that earlier. IMO he projects to be the next Schremp. In fact I believe Schremp had more skill. The league is changing fast. Lander put up numbers in the NHL as well. Skating was always an issue there too.

    FWIW, Lander scored 14-1-4-5 and 47-9-11-20 in his first 2 AHL seasons. At comparable age to the two Benson just had.

    It wasn’t until Lander’s age 22 season when he scored like Benson has in his first 2 years pro.

  104. OriginalPouzar says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey:
    Jaxon,

    That’s an interesting take that’s not dissimilar to the idea of converting JP to a centre.

    Are there any prior examples of wingers converting to centre after junior and succeeding?

    I’m sure its happened a few times but I wouldn’t think its that common and even rarer for an AHL (or Liiga) developing prospect to convert and add that to his plate while trying to make the NHL.

    Taylor Hall – nope
    Ryan Smyth – nope

  105. OriginalPouzar says:

    Reja: Never did see the logic in obtaining Manning, been a Oiler fan since day one and acquiring Manning is right up there. Unless of course Peter was trying to troll his own fan base.

    While not quite as egregious as acquiring Manning to start with, Tippett’s decision to keep playing him in those 8 straight was, in my opinion, his worst decision(s) of the season – in particular with Lagesson on the team and knowing that the organization needed to get him in games with his ELC and waiver exempt status both expiring at the end of the season.

    Mind-boggling (and I LOVE Tip).

  106. Ryan says:

    godot10: He has an NMC to prevent him from being sent to the minors, and a 15-team no-trade-list.
    Russell absolutely owned Chiarelli in that deal.

    You forgot about the signing bonus in the last year rendering the last year of the contract buyout-proof.

    Absolutely terrible contract.

  107. OriginalPouzar says:

    Harpers Hair:
    Just listened to a fascinating interview with Pierre LeBrun.

    He pointed out that many players signed contracts with massive signing bonuses in 20/21 and 21/22 to guard against a possible work stoppage.

    Now that it appears labour peace will prevail and given the potential for massive escrow in the next couple of years, those players could very well regret the way their contracts are structured since massive amounts will be lost to escrow.

    Also, there are some owners who will be hard pressed to pay those bonuses at a time of zero revenue on July1st.

    He believes there are 5-6 teams that will be trading high end players for peanuts just to rid themselves of those contracts.

    Some teams with cash and cap space may be in a position to benefit greatly.

    The Ryan Reaves contract was back-loaded – sure, only two years but an example of term contracts to come I believe. I’ve been saying for a while now that, due to the likelihood of massive escrow over the next few years (which should decrease by year), long term contracts are likely to be back-loaded.

    We talked a tiny bit a few days ago about if the July 1 bonuses will for sure be paid – I think they will, generally, but some owners may not be able to without revenue.

    There is a total of like over $300M due on July 1 – the Leafs have $61M.

    Ottawa has a couple sizeable bonuses due on July 1 – Ryan and Anismov.

  108. OriginalPouzar says:

    Oh, and were was the LeBrun interview – Athletic podcast or elsewhere? I’ll listen at the gym tomorrow morning.

    Thanks

  109. Harpers Hair says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    Oh, and were was the LeBrun interview – Athletic podcast or elsewhere? I’ll listen at the gym tomorrow morning.

    Thanks

    TSN 1040 Vancouver.

    Should be on their website.

  110. Ryan says:

    Harpers Hair:
    Just listened to a fascinating interview with Pierre LeBrun.

    He pointed out that many players signed contracts with massive signing bonuses in 20/21 and 21/22 to guard against a possible work stoppage.

    Now that it appears labour peace will prevail and given the potential for massive escrow in the next couple of years, those players could very well regret the way their contracts are structured since massive amounts will be lost to escrow.

    Also, there are some owners who will be hard pressed to pay those bonuses at a time of zero revenue on July1st.

    He believes there are 5-6 teams that will be trading high end players for peanuts just to rid themselves of those contracts.

    Some teams with cash and cap space may be in a position to benefit greatly.

    What’s your list of cash-strapped teams?

    Here’s a slightly dated ranking of owners wealth.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/the-23-richest-billionaire-nhl-franchise-owners-2018-3#12-vancouver-canucks-owner-francesco-aquilini-33-billion-12

  111. OriginalPouzar says:

    jp: I guess the Reinhart trade is the Crown Jewel. But in a lot of ways that Russell contract is more galling.

    The contract was (and is) awful but at least Rusty provided some legit value for the team over the first 3 years – well, mostly the first two years.

    He is far from a legit 2RD but he essentially played that position for the better part of two years and, while he had his ups and downs, he played some decent hockey here and there – in particular while being shined by Sekera.

    I wouldn’t say he was $4MM of value for the first two years but not too far off given the minutes he played.

    This year his play and value regressed markedly and, well, next year, an argument can be made that he is fifth on the left side depth chart with 4 and 5 both with cap hits greater than $3M less than his.

    Ugh..

  112. OriginalPouzar says:

    jp: I don’t mean to argue for Manning here, he was clearly not part of the future, was coming off a bad year the previous year and has proven to be dropping off badly.

    But. If you look at this completely impartially, Manning was the better NHL player this season: https://www.naturalstattrick.com/playerteams.php?fromseason=20192020&thruseason=20192020&stype=2&sit=5v5&score=all&stdoi=oi&rate=n&team=EDM&pos=D&loc=B&toi=0&gpfilt=none&fd=&td=&tgp=410&lines=single&draftteam=ALL

    He also had a history of being a solid 3rd pairing defenseman in the NHL, and was under contract being paid $2M+. I’d have preferred they get a look at Lagesson too, I just don’t see it as mind boggling at all.

    Thank you for doing the research but I recall watching the games and I recall Manning being good in the first, OK in the second and then awful for the next 5-6.

    I will stick to my opinion on this one – mind-boggling that Lagesson didn’t get in to games at that point given all the circumstances.

  113. who says:

    defmn: Benson was a high 2nd round pick. I think we should also remember that when Holland is being encouraged to trade Puljujarvi for that same opportunity.

    Agreed.
    Anything less than a 1st rounder or quality prospect for JP would be a mistake.

  114. who says:

    jp: I guess the Reinhart trade is the Crown Jewel. But in a lot of ways that Russell contract is more galling.

    I don’t see how you can even mention those 2 moves in the same post.
    The Reinhart trade was an epic failure. Russell has been a solid contributor to the Oilers. He may have been slightly overpaid, but he is still a quality NHL dman.

  115. Harpers Hair says:

    Ryan: What’s your list of cash-strapped teams?

    Here’s a slightly dated ranking of owners wealth.

    https://www.businessinsider.com/the-23-richest-billionaire-nhl-franchise-owners-2018-3#12-vancouver-canucks-owner-francesco-aquilini-33-billion-12

    It’s impossible to say right now because we don’t know how the owners other businesses may be taking a massive financial hit right now.

    Many are involved in media companies that are taking huge losses right now without sports properties to broadcast.

  116. Scungilli Slushy says:

    London Jon: I think Benson, Sheahan (or Haas or JJ), Archibald could be a great shutdown line. Smart players, good along the boards, able to contain and play the percentages well

    Thing is you don’t see young players on a shutdown line. Hairy asses and failed first rounders that want to be NHL

    The 3 C is the sticking point. They have 3 top 6 C and everyone else is 4C.

    Given the talent the Oilers have Nuge will not be a 3C. He needs more ice time than that, and the team has few skilled two way wingers.

    Having a proper hopefully right shot that is healthy would be a huge boon to the coaches. They could run a skill young 4th line using the 3 line to do defending against quality.

  117. Dac189 says:

    I feel like we would have been happy with Russell at 3*3 so I don’t agree with calling it Chia’s worst move. Probably not even top 10
    There’s the Reinhardt trade
    The Hall trade
    The Eberle trade
    The Strome trade
    Two 2nds for Chiarelli and McLellan

    And my favorites
    6m*7y
    And the guy who broke the captain’s collarbone

  118. OriginalPouzar says:

    jp:
    Good Lord.

    I’d like Russell removed from the Oilers roster too but he’s not been that bad of an NHL player. In his Oilers career he’s been +7, -11, +1 and -1 at 5v5.

    Tippett is such an idiot for playing him.

    Whoa – easy there.

    That post was about Manning, not Russell.

    In fact, 30 minutes ago I spoke to Rusty helping the team over most of his contract so far.

  119. JOFA says:

    jp: FWIW, Lander scored 14-1-4-5 and 47-9-11-20 in his first 2 AHL seasons. At comparable age to the two Benson just had.

    It wasn’t until Lander’s age 22 season when he scored like Benson has in his first 2 years pro.

    JP,
    This is a good point. I’m going to guess there was an adjustment period playing in North America. In addition, he had to play a more difficult position. He also played 215 NHL games. How many do you think Benson will play?

  120. OriginalPouzar says:

    Harpers Hair,

    Thanks.

  121. OriginalPouzar says:

    Scungilli Slushy: Thing is you don’t see young players on a shutdown line. Hairy asses and failed first rounders that want to be NHL

    The 3 C is the sticking point. They have 3 top 6 C and everyone else is 4C.

    Given the talent the Oilers haveNuge will not be a 3C. He needs more ice time than that, and the team has few skilled two way wingers.

    Having a proper hopefully right shot that is healthy would be a huge boon to the coaches. They could run a skill young 4th line usingthe 3 line to do defending against quality.

    This is why most of Rusty’s money should be given to Soderberg as a two-year stop-gap to McLeod….

  122. OriginalPouzar says:

    Dac189:
    I feel like we would have been happy with Russell at 3*3 so I don’t agree with calling it Chia’s worst move. Probably not even top 10
    There’s the Reinhardt trade
    The Hall trade
    The Eberle trade
    The Strome trade
    Two 2nds for Chiarelli and McLellan

    And my favorites
    6m*7y
    And the guy who broke the captain’s collarbone

    As it turns out, for the last couple of years, Strome outplayed Eberle (even pre-Panarin) and for a fraction of the price.

  123. jp says:

    JOFA: JP,
    This is a good point. I’m going to guess there was an adjustment period playing in North America. In addition, he had to play a more difficult position. He also played 215 NHL games. How many do you think Benson will play?

    Lander had played 4 pro season in Sweden before arriving in NA so I’d argue he was more ready for pro hockey than Benson. Also injuries hampered Benson though agreed Lander had a tougher job playing C.

    Honestly, I think Benson will play more than 215 game. I agree Benson’s no sure thing though. I just wouldn’t write him off at this point.

  124. OriginalPouzar says:

    Dom had the 15 worst UFA signings of the last decade up yesterday.

    To be honest, I’ve only just skimmed it for now but was surprised to see Sekera at #9 (one behind Loui E. and two behind Lucic at #7).

    I mean, yes, of course, over the last two seasons Sekera was not worth $5.5M but that was purely due to injuries, time missed and lessening him as a player – for two years he was worth every penny.

    No mention of Jeff Skinner….

  125. jp says:

    OriginalPouzar: As it turns out, for the last couple of years, Strome outplayed Eberle (even pre-Panarin) and for a fraction of the price.

    I’d agree that Strome was better value for money than Eberle for a year or two (maybe just the one) before Panarin. I don’t recall seeing any evidence he was the actual better player…

  126. jp says:

    OriginalPouzar: Whoa – easy there.

    That post was about Manning, not Russell.

    In fact, 30 minutes ago I spoke to Rusty helping the team over most of his contract so far.

    Apologies.

  127. jp says:

    who: I don’t see how you can even mention those 2 moves in the same post.
    The Reinhart trade was an epic failure. Russell has been a solid contributor to the Oilers. He may have been slightly overpaid,but he is still a quality NHL dman.

    I agree Russell has been a fine player for the Oilers. I didn’t mean to compare the impact of the Russell deal to that of the Reinhart trade (100% agree they’re not in the same ball park).

    I was just saying Russell’s contract was particularly galling because Chiarelli gave the player all of: 1) too much money, 2) too much term, 3) trade protection, and 4) a bonus laden deal that’s difficult to buy out.

  128. Ryan says:

    jp: I’d agree that Strome was better value for money than Eberle for a year or two (maybe just the one) before Panarin. I don’t recall seeing any evidence he was the actual better player…

    He played tons with Lucic especially in his last stretch as an Oiler.

    Mclellan was stubborn and wouldn’t play him in the top six even though he was desperate for top six options.

    It was horribly frustrating to watch Mclellan staple him to Lucic and kill his trade value prior to trading him.

  129. Ryan says:

    JOFA: JP,
    This is a good point. I’m going to guess there was an adjustment period playing in North America. In addition, he had to play a more difficult position. He also played 215 NHL games. How many do you think Benson will play?

    That’s a good question. I like Benson’s vision and hope he works like hell on his skating.

    I don’t think he gets around the ice as well as Toffoli (who’s no burner himself), but if he can get up to Toffoli speed, he should have a career.

  130. OriginalPouzar says:

    jp: I’d agree that Strome was better value for money than Eberle for a year or two (maybe just the one) before Panarin. I don’t recall seeing any evidence he was the actual better player…

    They both had 19 goals the previous year but Eberle had a couple more points – of course, that includes the 1G/1A that Strome had in 18 games as an Oiler (with his most common linemates being, in order Lucic, Caggiula, Puljujarvi).

  131. JOFA says:

    jp: Lander had played 4 pro season in Sweden before arriving in NA so I’d argue he was more ready for pro hockey than Benson. Also injuries hampered Benson though agreed Lander had a tougher job playing C.

    Honestly, I think Benson will play more than 215 game. I agree Benson’s no sure thing though. I just wouldn’t write him off at this point.

    Excellent points. We’ll have to make a gentleman’s bet and await the outcome. I hope you win 😊

  132. OriginalPouzar says:

    Ryan: He played tons with Lucic especially in his last stretch as an Oiler.

    Mclellan was stubborn and wouldn’t play him in the top six even though he was desperate for top six options.

    It was horribly frustrating to watch Mclellan staple him to Lucic and kill his trade value prior to trading him.

    In his entire time as an Oiler, Strome played 58 minutes with McDavid – over 55% CF and 3GF/1GA.

    He got almost 200 minutes with Leon – 53% Coris but 60% GF (subtract the 8 minutes with Lucic out and the GF goes up to 64%).

    So, not quite a surprise that Strome has produced offensively with talent in New York….

    McLellan….

  133. Ryan says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    Dom had the 15 worst UFA signings of the last decade up yesterday.

    To be honest, I’ve only just skimmed it for now but was surprised to see Sekera at #9 (one behind Loui E. and two behind Lucic at #7).

    I mean, yes, of course, over the last two seasons Sekera was not worth $5.5M but that was purely due to injuries, time missed and lessening him as a player – for two years he was worth every penny.

    No mention of Jeff Skinner….

    Dom ruthlessly looks only at the actual results while allowing no consideration in his rankings for any charity with respect to injuries.

    Horton was 5th on the list after playing 35 games of a 7-year long contract due to injury.

  134. Dac189 says:

    OriginalPouzar,

    While I agree that the Strome deal is decent in hindsight, it was terrible when signed.
    Even Chiarelli said it had to be done because salary cap

  135. jp says:

    Ryan: He played tons with Lucic especially in his last stretch as an Oiler.

    Mclellan was stubborn and wouldn’t play him in the top six even though he was desperate for top six options.

    It was horribly frustrating to watch Mclellan staple him to Lucic and kill his trade value prior to trading him.

    I agree with all that. McLellan definitely did Strome no favours.

    But I don’t see an argument for Strome outplaying Eberle in the years pre-Panarin.

    By the boxcars:

    Eberle
    17-18 81-25-34-59
    18-19 78-19-18-37

    Strome
    17-18 82-13-21-34
    18-19 81-19-16-35

    Eberle scored 1.97 P/60 at 5v5.
    Strome scored 1.20/60 in 350 minutes with Lucic. He scored (I believe) 1.31 P/60 without him.

    Eberle was 12th in the league among forwards in SF%rel. Strome was 224th.
    Eberle was 111th in GF%rel. Strome was 165th.
    (those were out of 348 forwards with 1000 5v5 minutes)

    I wasn’t planning on looking that much. I guess his time with Panarin this year proves what Strome *could* have done in the top 6. He never actually did do it pre-Panarin though. Too bad he never got the chance.

  136. jp says:

    JOFA: Excellent points. We’ll have to make a gentleman’s bet and await the outcome. I hope you win 😊

    Sounds good. I think everyone’s rooting for me on this one 🙂

  137. Ryan says:

    OriginalPouzar: In his entire time as an Oiler, Strome played 58 minutes with McDavid – over 55% CF and 3GF/1GA.

    He got almost 200 minutes with Leon – 53% Coris but 60% GF (subtract the 8 minutes with Lucic out and the GF goes up to 64%).

    So, not quite a surprise that Strome has produced offensively with talent in New York….

    McLellan….

    Yeah, I had looked that up recently too. Leon and McDavid each respectively saw a drop in offense at 5v5 (gfon/60) with Strome, but also saw a drop in
    Gaon/60– especially Leon who got lit up at evens without McDavid from 17 to 19.

    Looking back at the numbers, you wonder why he didn’t play more with Lepn when he was without 97.

    I remember LT thought he might be moved up to take strong side draws and such at opportune times to play with 97 (right after the trade)

    Iirc, he called him a potential mirror man or some such term.

    There was certainly speculation that Strome would get a long look playing with 97. It never happened.

    I remember LT admonishing near the end that we shouldn’t trade Strome until he gets a look on 97’s RW.

  138. jp says:

    OriginalPouzar: They both had 19 goals the previous year but Eberle had a couple more points – of course, that includes the 1G/1A that Strome had in 18 games as an Oiler (with his most common linemates being, in order Lucic, Caggiula, Puljujarvi).

    Your previous post said “the last couple of years, Strome outplayed Eberle (even pre-Panarin) and for a fraction of the price”. I read that as “couple of years pre-Panarin” but see now that’s not quite what you said.

    So yeah you could fairly say that Strome was the equal or or better player over the past 2 seasons. Worth noting though that Eberle has still had a slightly better 5v5 P/60 over the past 2 seasons (1.67 vs 1.59), and Strome has benefited more by playing with Panarin than Eberle has from any of his linemates.

  139. jp says:

    Scungilli Slushy: Given the talent the Oilers have Nuge will not be a 3C. He needs more ice time than that, and the team has few skilled two way wingers.

    I don’t know that they can’t fill out 3 lines with Nuge at C…

    1) Yamamoto 0.96 P/G (1st line)
    2) Kassian 0.58 (2nd line)
    3) Neal 0.56 (2nd line)
    4) Ennis 0.53 (2nd line)
    5) Athanasiou 0.47 (2nd line)
    6) Chiasson 0.37 (3rd line)
    7) Archibald 0.34 (3rd line)

  140. jp says:

    OriginalPouzar: In his entire time as an Oiler, Strome played 58 minutes with McDavid – over 55% CF and 3GF/1GA.

    He got almost 200 minutes with Leon – 53% Coris but 60% GF (subtract the 8 minutes with Lucic out and the GF goes up to 64%).

    So, not quite a surprise that Strome has produced offensively with talent in New York….

    McLellan….

    Not directly relevant… but one of the oddities of Strome’s career was how poorly he played with Tavares.

    In his Islanders career he played 674 minutes with Tavares but only scored 1.07 P/60 (as above, he managed 1.20/60 with Lucic even)

  141. hunter1909 says:

    Ryan: Mclellan was stubborn and wouldn’t play him in the top six even though he was desperate for top six options.
    It was horribly frustrating to watch Mclellan staple him to Lucic and kill his trade value prior to trading him.

    The good news being, that McLellan made his point.

  142. Eh Team says:

    who: The Reinhart trade was an epic failure. Russell has been a solid contributor to the Oilers. He may have been slightly overpaid, but he is still a quality NHL dman.

    I’m not a big Russell fan, but I give him props for his NHL career- 800+ games. That’s a huge accomplishment, especially considering he’s a 5’10”, 170 lb d’man.

  143. Eh Team says:

    OriginalPouzar: No mention of Jeff Skinner….

    Or James Neal

  144. oilersfan says:

    Ryan,

    I agree it wasn’t a good contract

    But the bonus in the last year is a good thing..

    For a cash strapped team with cap space on the day after the bonus is paid he will be owed only $1 million of real money if the oilers retain $500,000, which is league minimum for a veteran 4/5 dman who is an excellent skater and penalty killer. I think that part of the contract would have been very tradeable if not for the covid stalling of a rising cap… the NMC on the other hand will make it much tougher to move him . I am hoping Florida would consider it as they are cash strapped, have cap space, need dmen and since they are a playoff team in a state with great weather and no state tax he would likely agree to a trade there.

  145. Lowetide says:

    New for The Athletic: Ethan Bear, Caleb Jones and the Oilers’ need for veteran insurance. Click on the link to start your free trial and read about how much Bear and Jones accomplished as rookies, and what it means in the offseason.

    https://theathletic.com/1876330/2020/06/18/lowetide-ethan-bear-caleb-jones-and-the-oilers-need-for-veteran-insurance/

  146. OriginalPouzar says:

    oilersfan:
    Ryan,

    I agree it wasn’t a good contract

    But the bonus in the last year is a good thing..

    For a cash strapped team with cap space on the day after the bonus is paid he will be owed only $1 million of real money if the oilers retain $500,000, which is league minimum for a veteran 4/5 dman who is an excellent skater and penalty killer. I think that part of the contract would have been very tradeable if not for the covid stalling of a rising cap… the NMC on the other hand will make it much tougher to move him . I am hoping Florida would consider it as they are cash strapped, have cap space, need dmen and since they are a playoff team in a state with great weather and no state tax he would likely agree to a trade there.

    The bonus makes the contract essentially buyout proof in the final year.

    There is lots of talk about cash strapped teams taking on low cash outlay and high cap hit contract but, in reality, there are very few of these teams and most are restricted more by the upper cap limit.

  147. who says:

    jp: Your previous post said “the last couple of years, Strome outplayed Eberle (even pre-Panarin) and for a fraction of the price”. I read that as “couple of years pre-Panarin” but see now that’s not quite what you said.

    So yeah you could fairly say that Strome was the equal or or better player over the past 2 seasons. Worth noting though that Eberle has still had a slightly better 5v5 P/60 over the past 2 seasons (1.67 vs 1.59), and Strome has benefited more by playing with Panarin than Eberle has from any of his linemates.

    I think Eberle has gotten just as big a boost from Barzal.

  148. jp says:

    who: I think Eberle has gotten just as big a boost from Barzal.

    He likely did in 17-18 but in the most recent 2 seasons Eberle with Barzal scored 1.72 P/60 vs 1.67 overall.

    Strome was 2.23 or 2.33 (going off memory here) with Panarin vs 1.59 overall. I think it’s clear Strome got much more of a boost.

  149. OriginalPouzar says:

    Oh, no doubt that Strome’s production this year was boosted by playing with Panarin but last season his goal totals equalled Eberle and his points were just a few behind. I acknowledge that he had a lower P/60 but I also remember his first 18 games as an Oiler mainly with Lucic, Caggiula and Puljujarvi.

    Not to mention, I believe Strome PK’d for the Rangers and played center as well (although, to be honest, haven’t checked this morning).

    My point, when I started this conversation is that the Eberle for Strome trade was actually not terrible by Chiarelli.

    Their straight up value the last two years isn’t far apart and one can argue that Strome was the better player. When taking in to account contracts, both of Eberle’s, Strome was greater value.

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