53rd and 3rd

Dave Tippett made a big difference to the Edmonton Oilers in 2019-20. Special teams is the obvious area but there are other pockets of improvement that appeared upon his arrival. Young players were able to fill feature roles that previously would have been filled by a veteran. He had an impressive feel for which goalie to ride in specific areas of the campaign. A coach can help his team, even if it is outmanned. Maybe we forgot about that over the years in Edmonton.

THE ATHLETIC!

The Athletic Edmonton features a fabulous cluster of stories (some linked below, some on the site). Great perspective from a ridiculous group of writers and analysts. Proud to be part of The Athletic, check it out here.

MACT’S OILERS 2007-08

Craig MacTavish won 41 games with this roster. The team’s five on five goal differential (143-166, -23) was typical of a MacT team: Perhaps a little shy on the power play but better than expected at five on five. If MacT’s teams got goaltending, they would make the playoffs.

Using hockey-reference and even strength goals for and against, here are the goal differentials for Edmonton teams since the turn of the century. Notice what happens when MacT leaves and also notice when it corrects.

  • 2000-01: 171-156, +15 (MacT)
  • 2001-02: 142-125, +17 (MacT)
  • 2002-03: 162-161, +1 (MacT)
  • 2003-04: 164-134, +30 (MacT)
  • 2005-06: 146-161, -15 (MacT)
  • 2006-07: 133-182, -49 (MacT)
  • 2007-08: 156-181, -25 (MacT)
  • 2008-09: 165-160, +5 (MacT)
  • 2009-10: 148-206, -58 (Quinn)
  • 2010-11: 139-184, -45 (Renney)
  • 2011-12: 148-172, -24 (Renney)
  • 2012-13: 85-101, -26 (Krueger)
  • 2013-14: 149-204, -55 (Eakins)
  • 2014-15: 148-218, -70 (Eakins, MacT, Nelson)
  • 2015-16: 151-187, -36 (McLellan)
  • 2016-17: 183-159, +24 (McLellan)
  • 2017-18: 187-200, -13 (McLellan)
  • 2018-19: 172-202, -30 (McLellan, Hitchcock)
  • 2019-20: 161-174, -13 (Tippett)

MacT’s teams were mostly productive, the 2005-06 team was quality but lacked goaltending until the Dwayne Roloson trade (the other three goalies had save percentages under .900). The 2006-07 MacT team had major defensive issues but that improved in the following year and by his final season as coach MacT’s Oilers were in the black.

Beginning with Quinn, there’s a seven year period of bleeding badly until McLellan’s second campaign. The 2018-19 season, imo, was a lot about cap issues and unproven players in prominent positions.

As you can see, the 2019-20 season saw marked improvement at even-strength outscoring but there is work to be done.

LIAS ANDERSSON

Lots of Lias Andersson-Jesse Puljujarvi talk right now, I wrote about the idea just before Christmas. Apparently Ken Holland wanted a first-round pick added to Andersson, with a mid-level prospect coming back from Edmonton. There’s speculation that William Lagesson is the other piece in the puzzle but that’s not an actual factual trade proposal.

We don’t know where the pick will land, but let’s say it’s No. 21. The Rangers could use an NHL-ready left side blue (their right side is golden) and I’m a Lagesson fan. I think Dmitri Samorukov would have more potential value long term but Lagesson is a plug and play.

If the deal is Jesse Puljujarvi and William Lagesson for Lias Andersson and the pick that gets you Mavrik Bourque, I do the deal. You?

DRAFT OPTIONS

I’ll have an article up at The Athletic today or tomorrow about the Oilers situation as it pertains to the draft. It sounds like general managers will get their wish, with the timing of the draft occurring after the 2020 Stanley Cup is awarded. There’s a lot to talk about either way, we should find out about it this week.

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159 Responses to "53rd and 3rd"

  1. OriginalPouzar says:

    I think they are trying to play the 24 team inclusion as a “play-down” before they get to the real playoffs.

    Either way, I think 20 makes some more sense with 6-10 and 7-9 on each conference playing to “get in” to the real 16.

    BOG meets today.

    A chance there is some sort of Return to Play schedule set – which would include the starting of stage 2 where mandatory player quarantine is over and they will start getting players back from overseas for their 14-days, etc and facilities can be used for small groups.

    Return to play is voted on by the 31 NHLPA execs.

    BOG will also talk about the draft, of course. BOG approval is not needed. Gary and Bill can set a draft that on their own but an early draft has clearly received great push back.

    Hopefully we know more later today.

  2. Todd Macallan says:

    I am no fan of Andersson but yes I do that deal no question.

  3. OriginalPouzar says:

    I think you have to make that deal, don’t you?

    That’s essentially two players that aren’t in the starting 18 for a “prospect with issues” and a very skilled forward prospect.

    Andresson has skill – Jesse has the better potential but it won’t be realized as an Oiler. He could “pop” as a Ranger but, unfortunately, I don’t think he’ll give himself he chance to “pop” as an Oilers.

    Andresson recovered nicely back in the SHL last season.

    ——————

    If Lagesson is moved, does that mean the Rusty stays? I mean, if they move Rusty as well then we are looking at a Lennstrom as 4LD and we don’t even know if that guy can play in the NHL.

    Is Andersson the “pencilled-in” 3C in that scenario?

  4. jtblack says:

    “If the deal is Jesse Puljujarvi and William Lagesson for Lias Andersson and the pick that gets you Mavrik Bourque, I do the deal. You?”

    100%.
    That would give Edm 2 picks between #20-#25. Could get 2 Great Prospects.

    Go Kenny!

  5. jtblack says:

    OriginalPouzar,

    “A chance there is some sort of Return to Play schedule set ”

    This would be fantastic news. Was talking to some friends yesterday. We are already planning for a mid to late July Playoff Draft ?

  6. Brantford Boy says:

    LT: “If the deal is Jesse Puljujarvi and William Lagesson for Lias Andersson and the pick that gets you Mavrik Bourque, I do the deal. You?”

    I suppose… only because you’re guaranteeing Bourque… seems this Swede Andersson is having an issue getting used to the smaller ice based on the numbers…
    https://www.eliteprospects.com/player/214318/lias-andersson

    We have to get JP to play or offload for the best package… think this is the best package out there…

  7. Rondo says:

    If that the best deal you can get, I guess you take it. But why would you want a Lias Lias Andersson he h is not fast enough for the NHL. He sounds like at excellent AHL player . Reminds me of Anton Lander

  8. defmn says:

    From May 10th.

    https://www.foreverblueshirts.com/icymi-lias-andersson-for-jesse-puljujarvi-trade-may-be-revisited-at-nhl-draft/

    Oilers Like What they Saw In Lias in Sweden

    Lias Andersson hurt his value when he bolted the Rangers AHL affiliate earlier this season. However, sources told me Edmonton really liked what they saw from the Rangers former first round pick, 7th overall with HV71 in the SHL. This is sparking talk that at some point both the Rangers and Oilers will revisit this trade.

    Could the Rangers trade the Oilers Lias Andersson and their second 1st round pick (23rd overall) for Jesse Puljujarvi and another mid level prospect? Or will NJ swoop in and give up one of their 3 first round picks (6, 10, and 17) for the big scoring winger? We could find out soon if the NHL does go forward with a June draft.

  9. geowal says:

    At this point it doesn’t feel like we’d be waiting any longer for a top 20 draft pick to develop Than we’ve been waiting/will wait for Jesse to decide he feels like playing here. Possibly an exaggeration, but not by much. Reluctantly, I do the deal. And I don’t even know who Lias Anderson is other than a few descriptions above.

  10. Harpers Hair says:

    The NHL considering a plan tp play in only two hub cities.

    https://www.tsn.ca/two-hub-city-concept-featuring-24-teams-in-play-1.1476796

  11. godot10 says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    I think you have to make that deal, don’t you?

    That’s essentially two players that aren’t in the starting 18 for a “prospect with issues” and a very skilled forward prospect.

    Andresson has skill – Jesse has the better potential but it won’t be realized as an Oiler.He could “pop” as a Ranger but, unfortunately, I don’t think he’ll give himself he chance to “pop” as an Oilers.

    Andresson recovered nicely back in the SHL last season.

    ——————

    If Lagesson is moved, does that mean the Rusty stays? I mean, if they move Rusty as well then we are looking at a Lennstrom as 4LD and we don’t even know if that guy can play in the NHL.

    Is Andersson the “pencilled-in” 3C in that scenario?

    I don’t think Russell wants to move. He effectively has the power to make sure that will not happen.

    His agent gutted Chiarelli with that contract. He will be the #7D in the pressbox.

    Puljujarvi and Lagesson for Andersson and the lower of the Rangers 1sts. I am on board.

  12. HugThePost says:

    At this point, I think we have to give up on any dream that Jesse will ever play for the Oilers. What a sad saga, but there were red flags right from the beginning……..a Finnish GM not taking him when he was available at the draft………that story about the kid catching a ride with some rando after he cleaned out his locker at season’s end…….his agent continually dealing with the team through the media, etc etc.

    My interest in the Oilers has gone from obsessed 10-15 years to ago to a waxing and waning following these days so even I as a casual fan have noticed this huge eff- up

  13. defmn says:

    godot10: I don’t think Russell wants to move.He effectively has the power to make sure that will not happen.

    His agent gutted Chiarelli with that contract.He will be the #7D in the pressbox.

    I think it depends on whether Russell wants to keep playing after this contract expires.

    If he is ready to retire he digs in to stay here. If he wants to keep playing sitting in the PB as the 7th guy isn’t the best bargaining tool even if he gets into 30-40 games over the season. And players have pride. They want to play. If Holland treats him with respect – which I expect – I think something gets worked out.

  14. Death By Misadventure says:

    Oilers draft 2020 wish list:

    Draft a F in the 1st round with their pick
    Get Jesse traded for another 1st round pick
    Draft a F with the other 1st round
    Don’t draft a LHD anywhere
    Don’t draft a goalie with a 3rd pick or anywhere

  15. jp says:

    “If the deal is Jesse Puljujarvi and William Lagesson for Lias Andersson and the pick that gets you Mavrik Bourque, I do the deal. You?”

    There’s zero question in my mind.

  16. jp says:

    OriginalPouzar: Is Andersson the “pencilled-in” 3C in that scenario?

    I would suspect no.

    He could very well make the roster but I don’t see anything he’s done suggesting he’d be an upgrade on Sheahan/Haas as of today (in terms of Holland projecting him as the 3C and not trying to acquire an upgrade).

    He’s got one more year on his ELC and as waiver exempt. I’d guess he’d be as likely to be in Bakersfield next opening night as being the Oilers 3C. Or maybe he’s destined for another year in the SHL.

  17. jp says:

    godot10: I don’t think Russell wants to move. He effectively has the power to make sure that will not happen.

    I don’t agree it’s that bad. He has to pick 15 teams. Holland may well have to take back a different (but more useful) contract or add a pick, but there will be options.

  18. Harpers Hair says:

    jp: I would suspect no.

    He could very well make the roster but I don’t see anything he’s done suggesting he’d be an upgrade on Sheahan/Haas as of today (in terms of Holland projecting him as the 3C and not trying to acquire an upgrade).

    He’s got one more year on his ELC and as waiver exempt. I’d guess he’d be as likely to be in Bakersfield next opening night as being the Oilers 3C. Or maybe he’s destined for another year in the SHL.

    The question is…would he come back to North America to play in Bakersfield?

  19. Rondo says:

    Lias Andersson = Anton Lander ?

  20. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    “If the deal is Jesse Puljujarvi and William Lagesson for Lias Andersson and the pick that gets you Mavrik Bourque, I do the deal. You? ”

    Hmmmm… you’ve framed the issue in a fresh manner.

    Yesterday talk of Benson or Sammy as the prospect from EDM was floating around and I bristled. Not sure why Lagesson isn’t as dear to me… he’s an NHL ready player right now. But yet, I’ve been ready to include him as a deal sweetener for a few years so perhaps that’s why. It could be that I see Sammy with a higher potential ceiling.

    The lowest 1st round pick this year for NJD is the 17OV pick, what’s the spread in value to get there? Do they have a roster player who’d be a good fit? Wood? Bratt? Zacha?

    I guess what I’m saying is, if I’m including a B-level or better prospect, I want a roster-ready player back.

    And yes, I would be very tempted at the prospect of landing Borque plus someone else this year. But they’re a year or few away still. Need some help now as well.

  21. jp says:

    Harpers Hair: The question is…would he come back to North America to play in Bakersfield?

    Yes, an open question. Hence “maybe he’s destined for another year in Sweden”.

  22. N64 says:

    OriginalPouzar: I think they are trying to play the 24 team inclusion as a “play-down” before they get to the real playoffs.

    Either way, I think 20 makes some more sense with 6-10 and 7-9 on each conference playing to “get in” to the real 16.

    20 teams is a problem in the East as nothing separates Panthers and Rangers (different team based on pts or pts%). That can be fixed with a one game tie breaker for #10 in the East.

    22 would be better for the Round Robin, but the rightsholders will want 24 as it adds Chicago and Montreal.

    Either format I’m guessing they pick 2 US sites for the playin/playoffs.

  23. OriginalPouzar says:

    jtblack:
    OriginalPouzar,

    “A chance there is some sort of Return to Play schedule set ”

    This would be fantastic news.Was talking to some friends yesterday.We are already planning for a mid to late July Playoff Draft

    I had planned a trip to Hawaii in late winter/early spring of 2017 – made a stupid rookie mistake and didn’t think about the potential of the Oilers in the playoffs. As it turned out, I was able to not miss a second of Oilers’ hockey but the wife was none to happy that certain days mandated a return to the condo by 4 pm (time change).

    I promised myself not to make that mistake again.

    Fast forward to current times and the trip we booked a year ago to Rwanda, Uganda, DRC is scheduled for July 24. As of now its technically still on but I can’t imagine it being practical including the mandatory quarantine upon return to Canada.

    Of course, the organizer will allow us to refund or shift payment to a trip in June 2021 or late July 2021.

    My initial thought is to do the July but that would miss the Olympics. June 2021 would “hopefully” create a conflict with Oilers playoffs.

    There is talk of postponing the current trip until October and that sounds great – the 2020/21 season won’t start until December but, then again, maybe the Oilers are playing in the playoffs his October?

    Do others schedule life around the Oilers?

  24. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Felt like digging into the archives on Lias Andersson a little more, after having solely relied on blog comments for an assessment of his qualities/abilities. I don’t think skating is as big of a concern as previously mentioned — based off the following scouting reports, and my own viewing of highlights. His stride is a bit short and choppy, but his velocity is fine — good, even.

    source: https://thehockeywriters.com/the-next-ones-2017-nhl-draft-prospect-profile-lias-andersson/
    Rankings:
    THW Alternate: 16th (January)
    Future Considerations: 10th (Winter)
    ISS: 25th (January)
    Bob McKenzie: 15th (Mid-season)
    Craig Button: 9th (January)

    “He’s quick, fast, determined and skilled and can play all three positions up front. A Swiss (or Swedish) Army knife-type player who’s very adaptable and coaches will love.” – Craig Button, TSN Director of Scouting

    source: https://www.eliteprospects.com/player/214318/lias-andersson
    Rankings:
    2017 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #25 by ISS Hockey

    2017 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #13 by Future Considerations

    2017 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #12 by Hockeyprospect.com

    2017 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #17 by McKeen’s Hockey

    2017 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #13 by TSN/McKenzie

    2017 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #3 by NHL Central Scouting

    “Andersson is an excellent team player. Never takes a shift off. Also blessed with good hockey sense and plays a strong two-way game. Offensively, Andersson stands out with impressive puck skills, a good shot and fine speed. Has the tools to become a scoring line player, but could also become an excellent role player who always gives 100%. (EP 2017)”

    “He is an aggressive player who often wins races for loose pucks and he is adept at winning one on one battles, Hockeyprospect.com 2017”

    source: https://www.thedraftanalyst.com/2017-nhl-draft-headquarters/2017-draft-profiles/c-lias-andersson/
    “A shifty, elusive player with good acceleration who is quick on his feet and a has knack for making something out of nothing, Andersson has a ton of upside considering how well he fared as a teenager on a good team in an adult league. He has a very good shot, mainly for his release and accuracy rather than sheer power. Playing inside is something he’ll do with regularity, and Andersson’s proven to snap off a quick shot while cutting across or in full stride.”

    source: https://futureconsiderations.ca/player/lias-andersson/
    “A smart, mature, two-way center…good decision-making, leadership qualities and advanced understanding of the game…a true three-zone player…defensively responsible…will drop to block shots or get his body in passing lanes…dangerous forechecker who reads the defense and uses an active stick to disrupt…covers up the ice for his teammates on the backcheck and always gives an honest effort…doesn’t commit a lot of mistakes and plays a very calm game while in puck possession…has solid offensive instincts…protects the puck very well and uses all of his frame to hold opponents off the puck…possesses a nice, quick shot release…not a flashy puckhandler, but can carry it up ice and distributes it well…goes to the net and plays in traffic…has solid vision and the ability to set up his linemates…has good balance and generates healthy amounts of speed…a potential two-way guy in the Zetterberg mold. (November 2017)”

    source: https://dobberprospects.com/player/lias-andersson/
    January 2020 – The 2017 first-round draft twin of Filip Chytil has had a series of up’s and down’s with the Rangers through the years since being selected seventh overall. Unfortunately for him, the downs have been much deeper than the up’s have been high. His stature within the Ranger’s system hit and all-time low at the end of 2019 as the 21-year-old requested to be traded from the team. Unfortunately, the team hasn’t been able to offer him an optimal role for development since his arrival from Sweden. Their affiliate in Hartford has struggled until recently, and he simply isn’t cut out to center a top-six line in the NHL yet. For now, Andersson has opted to sit out of hockey within the organization, citing his trade demand as well as what has been called a mental-health break. His hiatus certainly doesn’t help his fantasy value, but Andersson still has the potential to become a reliable NHL player someday – it just probably won’t be in Manhattan. Brayden Olafson

  25. blainer says:

    I would do that for Laggesson but I say NO if includes Sammy. I am a big fan of Sammy much in the same way I was of Bear.

    If GM’s are asking for Sammy and I think they have there is a reason for it.

    Lias and Jesse are two very flawed players and I see them as a wash. Don’t think either have the right attitude to make it in the league. I find it very funny they have the same agent. If we do make that trade leave Lias in Sweden next year. That extra year might (and that is a big might) help him mature and get hungry enough to put the work in.

    I would love to see the reverse of a deal where another team takes on our Griffin Reinhart and we get the Barzal.. Is that Bourque ? If it is I’m in.

  26. jp says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey: Yesterday talk of Benson or Sammy as the prospect from EDM was floating around and I bristled. Not sure why Lagesson isn’t as dear to me… he’s an NHL ready player right now. But yet, I’ve been ready to include him as a deal sweetener for a few years so perhaps that’s why. It could be that I see Sammy with a higher potential ceiling.

    He could probably play 3rd pair now but he’s also a 24 year old through 2 pro seasons (and another in the SHL) with 8 NHL games on his resume. And he’s waiver exempt whenever next season starts.

    Never say never but in all probability Lagesson is a 3rd pairing D. There’s no question IMO that Samorukov (and Benson for that matter) have higher upside.

  27. jp says:

    blainer:
    I would do that for Laggesson but I say NO if includes Sammy. I am a big fan of Sammy much in the same way I was of Bear.

    If GM’s are asking for Sammy and I think they have there is a reason for it.

    Lias and Jesse are two very flawed players and I see them as a wash. Don’t think either have the right attitude to make it in the league. I find it very funny they have the same agent. If we do make that trade leave Lias in Sweden next year. That extra year might (and that is a big might) help him mature and get hungry enough to put the work in.

    I would love to see the reverse of a deal where another team takes on our Griffin Reinhart and we get the Barzal.. Is that Bourque ? If it is I’m in.

    If you see Puljujarvi and Andersson as a wash then that means you wouldn’t trade Samorukov for a 1st round pick?

  28. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    jp,

    Yes, agreed. Hence my reluctance at including either as a sweetener in the proposed trade.

    I like me some Wild Bill, but he’s the type of player I try to trade and upgrade elsewhere.

    Having seen some highlights of Andersson, I’d say his skating isn’t as much of a concern as I had previously believed.

    So, if the trade were 23OV + Andersson for JP + Lagesson, I’d do that trade. Although I’d prefer to see if KRusty could be moved first, as WL would be a nice fit on the team as a 6/7D at ~$800k.

  29. jp says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey: Felt like digging into the archives on Lias Andersson a little more, after having solely relied on blog comments for an assessment of his qualities/abilities. I don’t think skating is as big of a concern as previously mentioned — based off the following scouting reports, and my own viewing of highlights. His stride is a bit short and choppy, but his velocity is fine — good, even.

    Thanks a lot for this. Had been thinking of looking into his scouting reports more but hadn’t gotten to it.

    I’d also seen a couple of mentions of his “good” skating and wondered if talk of his slow boots was being exaggerated. Seems like maybe it was.

    Seems like a classic 3C by the scouting reports (good, not great skill but a solid 2-way game).

    Also seems like he was a reach at #7 vs the projections (which would place him more in the early teens).

  30. blainer says:

    jp: If you see Puljujarvi and Andersson as a wash then that means you wouldn’t trade Samorukov for a 1st round pick?

    I see them as a wash yes but I think Holland doesn’t and think he values Jesse more. I would be surprised if KH includes Sammy in this deal.

    I would not trade Sammy for a first rounder in the 20 to 30 range but that’s just me. He is close to NHL ready and a trade we would regret IMO.

  31. jp says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey:
    jp,

    Yes, agreed.Hence my reluctance at including either as a sweetener in the proposed trade.

    I like me some Wild Bill, but he’s the type of player I try to trade and upgrade elsewhere.

    Having seen some highlights of Andersson, I’d say his skating isn’t as much of a concern as I had previously believed.

    So, if the trade were 23OV + Andersson for JP + Lagesson, I’d do that trade.Although I’d prefer to see if KRusty could be moved first, as WL would be a nice fit on the team as a 6/7D at ~$800k.

    Lagesson would be nice to have as 7D, that’s where I’ve been penciling him too (assuming Russell is moved) but that’s certainly not a deal breaker.

    The way I’ve been thinking about the trade is the 1st for Puljujarvi and Andersson for the other piece. Apparently Puljujarvi’s value is more than pick 21?? I’d have happily done Puljujarvi for a 1st straight up until yesterday.

    That leaves Andersson for Lagesson/Samorukov/Benson (these are all just speculation based in “mid-prospect”). We agree that Andersson > Lagesson it seems.

    Interesting that Andersson and Samorukov were both 2017 picks and Benson a 2016 pick. I agree the two Oiler prospects look like they could be strong NHLers but I’d personally still call them vs. Andersson a wash at least (I mean that I’d still say Andersson has at least equal value to Samorukov/Benson). That’s my opinion on what I can glean so far anyway…

    It’s like Puljujarvi himself though, Andersson is being judged harshly for NHL games he played mostly at age 19 and 20 when most of his peers weren’t anywhere near the NHL.

  32. jp says:

    blainer: I see them as a wash yes but I think Holland doesn’t and think he values Jesse more.I would be surprised if KH includes Sammy in this deal.

    I would not trade Sammy for a first rounder in the 20 to 30 range but that’s just me. He is close to NHL ready and a trade we would regret IMO.

    You seem to be right about Holland valuing Puljujarvi more than Andersson (I’d agree with that myself as well).

    I don’t agree on Samorukov’s value but that’s cool (I hope you’re right and I’m wrong!).

  33. €√¥£€^$ says:

    blainer:
    I would do that for Laggesson but I say NO if includes Sammy. I am a big fan of Sammy much in the same way I was of Bear.

    If GM’s are asking for Sammy and I think they have there is a reason for it.

    Lias and Jesse are two very flawed players and I see them as a wash. Don’t think either have the right attitude to make it in the league. I find it very funny they have the same agent. If we do make that trade leave Lias in Sweden next year. That extra year might (and that is a big might) help him mature and get hungry enough to put the work in.

    I would love to see the reverse of a deal where another team takes on our Griffin Reinhart and we get the Barzal.. Is that Bourque ? If it is I’m in.

    Hi Blainer,

    I think you’ve confused Lias Andersson with Henrik Borgstrom, who has the same Agent as Jesse.

    Interesting article from January regarding Andersson:

    https://www.traderumours.com/index.php?blog=11304&s=1000

  34. digger50 says:

    My first feeling was that of disappointment regarding the proposed trade.

    Two NHL players (just emerging) for a maybe prospect and a first who again only has a 50% (?) chance of making it. We may well end up with nothing at all.

    While first rounders are important, we have the two top scorers in the league and we need to support them with as much talent as possible, as soon as possible. This team could be unstoppable but they need those few more pieces.

    Thus I was hoping for a real player for Hessie, and throw in Laggedon I am hoping for a real nice player for both of them.

    But fair enough, if a deal must be done, and not a lot of money left to pay another roster player then you do what you have to do.

    Still…..,.,JP plus Willie could equal a good third line center.

  35. Bruce McCurdy says:

    Worth noting that of the 41 games Craig MacTavish won with that 2007-08 roster, 15 of those “wins” came in the shootout.

    A dozen years on, that’s still the NHL record for shootout “wins” in a season.

  36. OriginalPouzar says:

    Rondo:
    If that the best deal you can get, I guess you take it.But why would you want a Lias Lias Andersson he h is not fast enough for the NHL. He sounds like at excellent AHL player .Reminds me of Anton Lander

    The deal also includes a first round pick in a draft where a normal “top 10 talent forward” is likely to be available in the bottom third.

  37. blainer says:

    €√¥£€^$: Hi Blainer,

    I think you’ve confused Lias Andersson with Henrik Borgstrom, who has the same Agent as Jesse.

    Interesting article from January regarding Andersson:

    https://www.traderumours.com/index.php?blog=11304&s=1000

    Cool thanks.. thought they had the same agent.. I do think KH gets a deal done on this before the draft.

  38. jp says:

    On the Lias Andersson – Anton Lander comparisons. I can definitely see where they’re coming from but would point out a few differences.

    Lander was picked #40 overall.
    Andersson was picked #7 overall.

    Andersson is 6 months older relative to draft year (October vs April birthdays).

    Andersson had better offense in the SHL.
    Draft — 42-9-10-19 (also 5th on his team and top 10 in the SHL in +/- for the SHL champs)
    Draft +1 22-7-7-14

    Lander
    Draft — 47-4-6-10
    Draft +1 49-7-9-16
    Draft +2 49-10-14-24

    Andersson had essentially the same production in the NHL in Draft +2 as Lander did in Draft +3 (both very bad).

    Draft +1 Andersson also made Sweden’s World Championship (gold medal winning) team. Lander didn’t play on the senior national team until his Draft +6.

    Who knows what Andersson will become but I do think he’s ahead of Lander at this point in their respective developments.

  39. Lowetide says:

    RE: Lias Andersson. I don’t recall ‘fast skater’ so much as ‘quick’ in the scouting reports I read on him at the time.

  40. Material Elvis says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey:
    Felt like digging into the archives on Lias Andersson a little more, after having solely relied on blog comments for an assessment of his qualities/abilities.I don’t think skating is as big of a concern as previously mentioned — based off the following scouting reports, and my own viewing of highlights.His stride is a bit short and choppy, but his velocity is fine — good, even.

    source: https://thehockeywriters.com/the-next-ones-2017-nhl-draft-prospect-profile-lias-andersson/
    Rankings: THW Alternate: 16th (January) Future Considerations: 10th (Winter) ISS: 25th (January) Bob McKenzie: 15th (Mid-season) Craig Button: 9th (January)

    “He’s quick, fast, determined and skilled and can play all three positions up front. A Swiss (or Swedish) Army knife-type player who’s very adaptable and coaches will love.” – Craig Button, TSN Director of Scouting

    source: https://www.eliteprospects.com/player/214318/lias-andersson
    Rankings:
    2017 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #25 by ISS Hockey

    2017 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #13 by Future Considerations

    2017 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #12 by Hockeyprospect.com

    2017 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #17 by McKeen’s Hockey

    2017 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #13 by TSN/McKenzie

    2017 NHL Entry Draft: Ranked #3 by NHL Central Scouting

    “Andersson is an excellent team player. Never takes a shift off. Also blessed with good hockey sense and plays a strong two-way game. Offensively, Andersson stands out with impressive puck skills, a good shot and fine speed. Has the tools to become a scoring line player, but could also become an excellent role player who always gives 100%. (EP 2017)”

    “He is an aggressive player who often wins races for loose pucks and he is adept at winning one on one battles, Hockeyprospect.com 2017”

    source: https://www.thedraftanalyst.com/2017-nhl-draft-headquarters/2017-draft-profiles/c-lias-andersson/
    “A shifty, elusive player with good acceleration who is quick on his feet and a has knack for making something out of nothing, Andersson has a ton of upside considering how well he fared as a teenager on a good team in an adult league. He has a very good shot, mainly for his release and accuracy rather than sheer power. Playing inside is something he’ll do with regularity, and Andersson’s proven to snap off a quick shot while cutting across or in full stride.”

    source: https://futureconsiderations.ca/player/lias-andersson/
    “A smart, mature, two-way center…good decision-making, leadership qualities and advanced understanding of the game…a true three-zone player…defensively responsible…will drop to block shots or get his body in passing lanes…dangerous forechecker who reads the defense and uses an active stick to disrupt…covers up the ice for his teammates on the backcheck and always gives an honest effort…doesn’t commit a lot of mistakes and plays a very calm game while in puck possession…has solid offensive instincts…protects the puck very well and uses all of his frame to hold opponents off the puck…possesses a nice, quick shot release…not a flashy puckhandler, but can carry it up ice and distributes it well…goes to the net and plays in traffic…has solid vision and the ability to set up his linemates…has good balance and generates healthy amounts of speed…a potential two-way guy in the Zetterberg mold. (November 2017)”

    source: https://dobberprospects.com/player/lias-andersson/
    January 2020 – The 2017 first-round draft twin of Filip Chytil has had a series of up’s and down’s with the Rangers through the years since being selected seventh overall. Unfortunately for him, the downs have been much deeper than the up’s have been high. His stature within the Ranger’s system hit and all-time low at the end of 2019 as the 21-year-old requested to be traded from the team. Unfortunately, the team hasn’t been able to offer him an optimal role for development since his arrival from Sweden. Their affiliate in Hartford has struggled until recently, and he simply isn’t cut out to center a top-six line in the NHL yet. For now, Andersson has opted to sit out of hockey within the organization, citing his trade demand as well as what has been called a mental-health break. His hiatus certainly doesn’t help his fantasy value, but Andersson still has the potential to become a reliable NHL player someday – it just probably won’t be in Manhattan. Brayden Olafson

    I would be very cautious basing your opinion on his junior scouting reports and junior-aged highlights. Anton Lander’s junior scouting reports talked about his speed, too. Griffin Reinhart looked amazing in junior, so did Yakupov, so did a myriad of other guys. Andersson isn’t a great skater by 2020 NHL standards; he is a downgrade from Puljujarvi. The 1st for Lagesson or whomever balances the equation. Maybe LA reaches 3C potential someday but he’s not there now and I would have him behind Ryan McLeod in the pecking order.

  41. Rondo says:

    Lowetide,

    I can’t remember when I heard it, but did hear Lias has some skating issues. If they do trade for him , I hope he turns into an all-star.

  42. blainer says:

    jp: You seem to be right about Holland valuing Puljujarvi more than Andersson (I’d agree with that myself as well).

    I don’t agree on Samorukov’s value but that’s cool (I hope you’re right and I’m wrong!).

    I really believe that Sammy arrives at the NHL level in the winter of 2021 and really think he will turn out to be as good as Bear only on the left side and meaner.

    I would not be surprised to see him playing a fair bit against the toughs and come out well doing it. He will prove to be a great player once the injuries hit. I am very high on him for sure but could also be wrong. I guess we’ll know in about a year or so.

  43. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Bruce McCurdy,

    If I recall correctly, didn’t Mike Morrison often come off the bench cold to stone the opposition as a shootout specialist?

  44. jp says:

    blainer: I really believe that Sammy arrives at the NHL level in the winter of 2021 and really think he will turn out to be as good as Bear only on the left side and meaner.

    I would not be surprised to see him playing a fair bit against the toughs and come out well doing it. He will prove to be a great player once the injuries hit. I am very high on him for sure but could also be wrong. I guess we’ll know in about a year or so.

    I’m definitely not saying it won’t happen, I just have less confidence it’ll turn out that way.

  45. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    jp,

    No sweat. I like taking a look when I have the moment. Seems like if a skater doesn’t move as fast as Connor or MacKinnon then they’re automatically judged as slow boots. From what I could tell in his highlights, he can cover ice at least adequately. And much of his SHL play was as a teenager competing against men. As you show in your Lander comparison, he acquitted himself rather well amongst older ‘peers.’

    jp,

    Agree with much of your post, especially the closing statement. He’s got plenty of time to develop further. If these two players — reportedly mishandled development wise — need a change of scenery to reach their potential, this could be a good deal for all parties.

    I just hope the scouts have done their homework well this time. As an Oilers fan it seems easier to count the pro-trades which have worked out in our favour on one hand/by memory vs. the ones that struck out miserably (how much time you got?).

    As far as trade value, I think JP+Lagesson is fair for 23OV+Andersson in aggregate.

    I’d prefer something like Wood/Bratt+17OV from NJD but I seem to have misplaced Shero’s (natch, Tom Fitzgerald’s) phone number somewhere. So I’ll let Old Dutch do the work and hope for the best.

  46. Lowetide says:

    blainer: I really believe that Sammy arrives at the NHL level in the winter of 2021 and really think he will turn out to be as good as Bear only on the left side and meaner.

    I would not be surprised to see him playing a fair bit against the toughs and come out well doing it. He will prove to be a great player once the injuries hit. I am very high on him for sure but could also be wrong. I guess we’ll know in about a year or so.

    One of the ways we can evaluate defensemen is their even strength goal differential as rookies in the AHL.

    2017-18
    Ryan Mantha 28-27 (+1)
    Ethan Bear 19-27 (-8)
    Caleb Jones 30-54 (-22)

    2018-19
    William Lagesson 62-67 (-5)

    2019-10
    Dmitri Samorukov 30-38 (-8)
    Evan Bouchard 41-51 (-10)

    Samorukov survived and survival is success.

  47. Turning Tikkanese says:

    Just a thought. If the trade for Andersson went through as posited, it could be only the beginning of draft day fun. With picks at 21 and say 24, perhaps the play is packaging them for a move up the board. Say 21 and our third to move up several spots, and 24 and a prospect to move up the board as well . Could end up as two picks in the top 10-15 of the draft if it works. Does this sound feasible?

  48. Munny says:

    blainer: I really believe that Sammy arrives at the NHL level in the winter of 2021 and really think he will turn out to be as good as Bear only on the left side and meaner.

    I would like to see Samo’s skating improve as much as Bear’s did before I feel confident about his NHL prospects.

  49. Munny says:

    So which team would Andersson be eligible to play for in the (hopefully) coming SC playoffs?

  50. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Turning Tikkanese,

    Might not be worth it, as the prospect pool needs replenished. In such a deep draft, we’re looking at purported top-10 class of talent up to about 22-23 deep and that doesn’t account for the inevitable walkabout picks.

    Still, interesting hypothesis. Not sure I’d do it, but really depends on the team’s draft board.

  51. Munny says:

    Turning Tikkanese:
    Just a thought. Ifthe trade for Andersson went through as posited, it could be only the beginning of draft day fun. With picks at 21 and say 24, perhaps the play is packaging them for a move up the board. Say 21 and our third to move up several spots, and 24 and a prospect to move up the board as well . Could end up as two picks in the top 10-15 of the draft if it works. Does this sound feasible?

    Well first you need a dance partner. A lot of teams with top 20 picks already have a cornucopia of selections and are not looking to add picks.

    Also the prices tend to be higher than what you’ve stated, IIRC.

    I think, if you were lucky enough to find a GM willing to two-step, you might be able to get up to 17 and 20, but maybe only 18 and 21.

  52. pts2pndr says:

    jtblack:
    “If the deal is Jesse Puljujarvi and William Lagesson for Lias Andersson and the pick that gets you Mavrik Bourque, I do the deal. You?”

    100%.That would give Edm 2 picks between #20-#25.Could get 2 Great Prospects.

    Go Kenny!

    Logically you are giving up two players that are young and you know can play in the NHL for a miss/tweeter and a lottery pick. I would go yes in a heartbeat if it was Russel as the D going back instead of Lagesson. Cap space and a lottery pick with Lagesson to cover left D makes more sense and in my opinion would be a more equal trade. As it stands Edmonton takes all the risk!

  53. Lowetide says:

    Munny:
    So which team would Andersson be eligible to play for in the (hopefully) coming SC playoffs?

    HV71.

  54. pts2pndr says:

    Turning Tikkanese:
    Just a thought. Ifthe trade for Andersson went through as posited, it could be only the beginning of draft day fun. With picks at 21 and say 24, perhaps the play is packaging them for a move up the board. Say 21 and our third to move up several spots, and 24 and a prospect to move up the board as well . Could end up as two picks in the top 10-15 of the draft if it works. Does this sound feasible?

    Dreaming in technicolor and about the same chance as winning Lotto max at 60 million. Doesn’t mean it can’t happen.

  55. godot10 says:

    Turning Tikkanese:
    Just a thought. Ifthe trade for Andersson went through as posited, it could be only the beginning of draft day fun. With picks at 21 and say 24, perhaps the play is packaging them for a move up the board. Say 21 and our third to move up several spots, and 24 and a prospect to move up the board as well . Could end up as two picks in the top 10-15 of the draft if it works. Does this sound feasible?

    No need to move up if one has two picks in the top 24. The draft is 25 players deep in top 15 type talent.

  56. Lowetide says:

    New for The Athletic: Why Oilers’ GM Ken Holland should shop for picks at the 2020 draft

    https://theathletic.com/1818479/2020/05/18/lowetide-why-oilers-gm-ken-holland-should-shop-for-picks-at-the-2020-draft/

  57. Turning Tikkanese says:

    Munny,
    Fair enough. What about packaging them both together to get say #3 or 4, and a mid round pick like 2nd or 3rd or 4th?

  58. blainer says:

    Lowetide: One of the ways we can evaluate defensemen is their even strength goal differential as rookies in the AHL.

    2017-18
    Ryan Mantha 28-27 (+1)
    Ethan Bear 19-27 (-8)
    Caleb Jones 30-54 (-22)

    2018-19
    William Lagesson 62-67 (-5)

    2019-10
    Dmitri Samorukov 30-38 (-8)
    Evan Bouchard 41-51 (-10)

    Samorukov survived and survival is success.

    Indeed and did this on a team that was not near as good as last year.

  59. OriginalPouzar says:

    As per State governors: sports without fans can open in Texas on May 31 and Cali first week of June.

    NHL BOG on their scheduled call now.

  60. jp says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey: I’d prefer something like Wood/Bratt+17OV from NJD

    If something like that were available then it might well be a better option. (Wood though is due $2.75M for a couple more seasons and has scored 10/11 goals and 23/24 points this year and last…). In general I hear you about getting a current NHLer for Puljujarvi + though.

    And yes, hopefully Holland and his scouts have done their homework in this case, whoever the trade target is.

  61. Harpers Hair says:

    Turning Tikkanese:
    Just a thought. Ifthe trade for Andersson went through as posited, it could be only the beginning of draft day fun. With picks at 21 and say 24, perhaps the play is packaging them for a move up the board. Say 21 and our third to move up several spots, and 24 and a prospect to move up the board as well . Could end up as two picks in the top 10-15 of the draft if it works. Does this sound feasible?

    With a flat (at best) cap likely in the foreseeable future, draft pick values will soar as teams look for cheap ELC contracts.

    Other than Montreal which has 14 picks and will be looking for prospects.

  62. blainer says:

    Munny: I would like to see Samo’s skating improve as much as Bear’s did before I feel confident about his NHL prospects.

    Bear made a huge leap in his skating to my eye in just over a few months. I would say he even got quicker as well. I agree Sammy is not quite at Bear’s level and why he will need more time in the minors to get there.

    I felt the same way when everyone here was throwing Bear in all their trade idea’s. I didn’t want to trade him either. I guess what I’m saying is I think Sammy will turn out as good. The one big difference for Bear though is he is right handed so that in my mind will make him more valuable.

    I really hope KH does not trade Sammy. He hasn’t yet so that is a good sign as I have heard rumors that there were teams interested in trading for him.

    KH is gaining my trust and seems to be a lot more patient than Chia. I have confidence he will get the correct deal for Jesse and that he will come out at least even.

  63. jp says:

    pts2pndr: Logically you are giving up two players that are young and you know can play in the NHL for a miss/tweeter and a lottery pick. I would go yes in a heartbeat if it was Russel as the D going back instead of Lagesson. Cap space and a lottery pick with Lagesson to cover left D makes more sense and in my opinion would be a more equal trade. As it stands Edmonton takes all the risk!

    I don’t know how you can call a 21 year old #7 pick who’s played 66 career NHL games a miss/tweener in the same sentence as claiming Puljujarvi and Lagesson are “two players… you know can play in the NHL”.

    I don’t disagree they can, but Puljujarvi scored 9 points and was outscored 13-26 in his last stint in the NHL while Lagesson is a 24 year old who was outscored 2-6 in this first 8 NHL games. Lots around here are calling Puljujarvi a tweener too, and Lagesson has proven nothing at all yet. You’re not using the same standards to compare “our” players to “theirs”.

  64. blainer says:

    Harpers Hair: With a flat (at best) cap likely in the foreseeable future, draft pick values will soar as teams look for cheap ELC contracts.

    Other than Montreal which has 14 picks and will be looking for prospects.

    Yup Montreal is a team that KH should be looking to deal with. That team’s GM is in the Chia style of managing.

    I agree that draft pick’s will be worth a ton this year. I can see Montreal Ottawa and maybe Jersey using some of their picks to try to get some talent to play in the here and now.

    I just cannot see the cap moving up anytime soon. The players have to be very concerned about escrow also. They are going to get hammered on escrow this year and if the season opens up with no fans next year I can see the cap dropping big time. Either way the players and owners are in for a rough time.

  65. pts2pndr says:

    Munny: I would like to see Samo’s skating improve as much as Bear’s did before I feel confident about his NHL prospects.

    Samsonov has been a plus skater since I started watching him in junior. What changed?

  66. N64 says:

    Simon Gagne on where NHL players are today:

    can’t train as much, don’t know when you’ll be cleared to play, just tons of uncertainty regarding your potential return to action.

    In other words to this extent he compared it to being in concussion protocol.

  67. pts2pndr says:

    Harpers Hair: With a flat (at best) cap likely in the foreseeable future, draft pick values will soar as teams look for cheap ELC contracts.

    Other than Montreal which has 14 picks and will be looking for prospects.

    Still need that playoff revenue. While I don’t disagree, the American fan buys into name much more that the Canadian fan. They are willing to pay to see the was good more than the may become good, unless the draft pick has been media hyped!

  68. N64 says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    As per State governors: sports without fans can open in Texas on May 31 and Cali first week of June.

    NHL BOG on their scheduled call now.

    Still would be surprised if there are any Canadian sites. Can’t see them leaving the border as a mid-playoff exposure.

    Update: I guess I’m discounting the leverage that the Canadian Rightsholders could potentially leverage in true up negotiations, but again a long shot.

  69. pts2pndr says:

    jp: I don’t know how you can call a 21 year old #7 pick who’s played 66 career NHL games a miss/tweener in the same sentence as claiming Puljujarvi and Lagesson are “two players… you know can play in the NHL”.

    I don’t disagree they can, but Puljujarvi scored 9 points and was outscored 13-26 in his last stint in the NHL while Lagesson is a 24 year old who was outscored 2-6 in this first 8 NHL games. Lots around here are calling Puljujarvi a tweener too, and Lagesson has proven nothing at all yet. You’re not using the same standards to compare “our” players to “theirs”.

  70. OriginalPouzar says:

    defmn: I think it depends on whether Russell wants to keep playing after this contract expires.

    If he is ready to retire he digs in to stay here. If he wants to keep playing sitting in the PB as the 7th guy isn’t the best bargaining tool even if he gets into 30-40 games over the season. And players have pride. They want to play. If Holland treats him with respect – which I expect – I think something gets worked out.

    Ya, I think I agree with you. While, as the #7D, I think he’d end up playing the majority of the games, without knowing what’s in Rusty’s head, I anticipate he wants to be an every day guy and, with it only being for one year, he may be more amenable to agreeing to a trade for more playing time/responsibility.

  71. pts2pndr says:

    JP had lost his desire given the way he was treated. Given his skills he will if given the chance be a top six forward in the NHL. Lagesson was the D that provided for Jones to play the game he played in the AHL that got him promoted. Lagesson has a quality that goal tenders love but fans rarely appreciate. He makes forwards that go to his net pay a price. Jones got the first call because of his perceived ability to place both sides. I believe they will both be top four NHL D moving forward. Jones has more offensive upside and Lagesson paired with Larson would make a great penalty killing shutdown tandem in my opinion.

  72. Munny says:

    Turning Tikkanese,

    I mean I’m just sheerly speculating, but my memory has it that while we hear a lot of smoke behind such proposals, they rarely spark any actual fire on draft day. Teams treasure their slots… and their boards (which are made to match)

    I’d guess that both together would interest GMs with picks somewhere in the 8-12 range, with nothing else coming back… others here may feel differently though, and of course it’s all about having the right partner to tango with, regardless. A team already holding three 1sts, for eg, won’t be taking your calls.

  73. pts2pndr says:

    blainer: Yup Montreal is a team that KH should be looking to deal with. That team’s GM is in the Chia style of managing.

    I agree that draft pick’s will be worth a ton this year. I can see Montreal Ottawa and maybe Jersey using some of their picks to try to get some talent to play in the here and now.

    I just cannot see the cap moving up anytime soon. The players have to be very concerned about escrow also. They are going to get hammered on escrow this year and if the season opens up with no fans next year I can see the cap dropping big time. Either way the players and owners are in for a rough time.

    While I agree that Montreal should be a great trading partner the centralist media has devalued every player Edmonton has To the extent that it took Hall to get Larsson. It will be interesting to watch. I believe there are mutually beneficial moves/trades that could be made between the two teams.

  74. Munny says:

    Lowetide: HV71.

    He’s only on loan, has an existing NHL contract for this year so is not prohibited from the playoffs, and would be eligible for the extended roster the NHL is tossing about,

    Larry Brooks believes that if the post-season happens, Andersson would be on the Rags 30 man.

    I could be wrong, but I don’t think the SHL has any plans to play this summer either.

    I think it is obvious we would need some clarity from the League on draft day trades before such a deal could happen.

    Same of course applies to Laggy and Pujo.

  75. jeetz says:

    The idea of having Kaapo Kakko with Puljujarvi for years is a big carrot for NYR. I am betting the NYR won’t hold up the deal for the mid prospect selection. Kemp or Brind’amour (both Americans) might get the deal done.

    Andersson is an interesting plyer.

    He was a reach as a 7th overall pick, but looking at every draft ranking I could find suggests he should have been picked anywhere from 10th to 22nd in the 1st round which suggests a 3-4 year waiting period to become an NHL player. He was probably rushed to the NHL by the NYR but being loaned to the SHL last year could be the reset he needs to re-establish himself.

    Another bonus is he has 1 more year before he would need to clear waivers. Bakersfield has recently become a great place to develop prospects. Every NHL scouting report had him as non flashy limited upside but a cant miss NHL player as a middle 6 fwd. Exactly what the Oilers need. Right now we only have Benson and Mcleod as the only true fwd prospects pushing for an NHL job next year. Andersson easily can be added into that group (might be the best one of the 3!) Definitely a guaranteed immediate callup.

    Add that to the fact we could have 2 1st round picks in the 20-25 range in a super deep draft is terrific. Those 2 players, hopefully forwards, could be added to the Lavoie cluster and could become a huge strength for the Oilers.

    Great asset management by Holland if he can get that deal done and then follow up that move at the draft

  76. OriginalPouzar says:

    As per John Shannon, no dates for the lottery or draft set today.

    There is some momentum for late Aug/Sept.

  77. jtblack says:

    pts2pndr: Logically you are giving up two players that are young and you know can play in the NHL for a miss/tweeter and a lottery pick. I would go yes in a heartbeat if it was Russel as the D going back instead of Lagesson. Cap space and a lottery pick with Lagesson to cover left D makes more sense and in my opinion would be a more equal trade. As it stands Edmonton takes all the risk!

    Just imagine if you add Seth Jarvis and Mavrik Bourque.

    Hollland is building for the long haul. 2 players of that pedigree can help this team be a real powerhouse in 2-3 years

  78. OriginalPouzar says:

    Pierre LeBrun
    @PierreVLeBrun
    Level 1:
    At first blush, doesn’t sound like there was much news on the NHL Board of Governors call today. Mostly status reports. With traction on the RTP Committee towards eventually agreeing on a format for season resumption, wouldn’t make sense for Bettman to divulge much on that yet.
    4:04 PM · May 18, 20

  79. Lowetide says:

    Munny: He’s only on loan, has an existing NHL contract for this year so is not prohibited from the playoffs, and would be eligible for the extended roster the NHL is tossing about,

    Larry Brooks believes that if the post-season happens, Andersson would be on the Rags 30 man.

    I could be wrong, but I don’t think the SHL has any plans to play this summer either.

    I think it is obvious we would need some clarity from the League on draft day trades before such a deal could happen.

    Same of course applies to Laggy and Pujo.

    So, he bolts and then comes back for the playoffs? Bold strategy, Cotton.

  80. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    I’d do that deal in a NY minute. JP will never contribute anything as an Oiler going forward and Andersson might. At worst it’s a wash with these two. So basically it’s Willie for a 1st round pick. Hmm … sign me up.

  81. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Looking at the trade from the Rangers perspective, trading Andersson closes the book on a failed draft selection. JP has better pedigree and arguably a higher ceiling than Andersson, so there is that as well. It’s hard not to be enamored with Jesse’s combination of size and speed. Fools gold in this case in my opinion, but hey. Willie is young, cheap and appears to be a solid bet to fill a 3rd pairing role now with possible 2nd pairing upside. The trade is not as compelling for the Rangers, but getting a young player who can help that defense now can’t be overlooked. I could see the Rangers making this trade.

  82. OriginalPouzar says:

    jp: He could probably play 3rd pair now but he’s also a 24 year old through 2 pro seasons (and another in the SHL) with 8 NHL games on his resume. And he’s waiver exempt whenever next season starts.

    Never say never but in all probability Lagesson is a 3rd pairing D. There’s no question IMO that Samorukov (and Benson for that matter) have higher upside.

    Small point of clarification – he’s no longer waiver exempt next season – I know that’s what you meant but just for clarification.

    Personally, I think that Lagesson as Adam Larsson type of potential – strong defensive d-man (breaking the cycle, tough to play against) but he skates and moves the puck better (well, at his current level – should develop that at the NHL level as well).

    With that said, I no longer have confidence he will get the opportunity to develop that game at the NHL level in Edmonton.

    Brandon Manning play 7-8 straight games early in the year while Lagesson sat in the press box told a tale for me.

  83. OriginalPouzar says:

    blainer: I see them as a wash yes but I think Holland doesn’t and think he values Jesse more.I would be surprised if KH includes Sammy in this deal.

    I would not trade Sammy for a first rounder in the 20 to 30 range but that’s just me. He is close to NHL ready and a trade we would regret IMO.

    I would agreed that Holland values Puljujarvi more than Andersson. While they are a draft year apart, they are only a 4 months or so apart in age and Jesse’s NHL resume is “better” and Jesse’s AHL resume is magnificent (and doesn’t get much attention).

    I am “enthused” at Andersson’s rebound in Sweden for 15 or so games.

    ——————

    The main reason for my reply was the Sammy vs. first rounder part.

    Now, as we all know, I’m a massive Sammy fan, and I think he’s got the broadest skill-set of all our D – high end defensive, aggression, good skater, good passer, good shot, good IQ, etc. I think his ceiling is top pairing but, at the same time, he also could struggle to play in the NHL – he isn’t “can’t miss” but reasonably likely to be an NHL player – where, is really up in the air.

    As far as close to ready, I would say that he need another full year (subject to just popping) – there is often massive development between 1st and 2nd year in the AHL so we should see some encouraging play but I think he needs some time. He struggled early but then did start to really gain traction before the facial injury shut him down for a while – he came back to a shit show of a team.

    For this year, I just want to see him steadily improve his consistency and play regular top 4 minutes and both special teams – start to be a young leader back there.

  84. OriginalPouzar says:

    Lowetide: One of the ways we can evaluate defensemen is their even strength goal differential as rookies in the AHL.

    2017-18
    Ryan Mantha 28-27 (+1)
    Ethan Bear 19-27 (-8)
    Caleb Jones 30-54 (-22)

    2018-19
    William Lagesson 62-67 (-5)

    2019-10
    Dmitri Samorukov 30-38 (-8)
    Evan Bouchard 41-51 (-10)

    Samorukov survived and survival is success.

    Good post and info.

    To play devil’s advocate abit (and I am a huge Sammy fan), I would say that Bouchard had the “tougher minutes” in aggregate as Sammy never really moved up from the 3rd pairing (at least not much) and Bouchard was also anchored to Keegan Lowe (yes, an AHL veteran and the captain but he had a very tough year).

  85. OriginalPouzar says:

    blainer: Bear made a huge leap in his skating to my eye in just over a few months. I would say he even got quicker as well. I agree Sammy is not quite at Bear’s level and why he will need more time in the minors to get there.

    I felt the same way when everyone here was throwing Bear in all their trade idea’s. I didn’t want to trade him either. I guess what I’m saying is I think Sammy will turn out as good. The one big difference for Bear though is he is right handed so that in my mind will make him more valuable.

    I really hope KH does not trade Sammy. He hasn’t yet so that is a good sign as I have heard rumors that there were teams interested in trading for him.

    KH is gaining my trust and seems to be a lot more patient than Chia. I have confidence he will get the correct deal for Jesse and that he will come out at least even.

    If Holland does trade Sammy, I fully expect he gets the required value for him – from the very beginning of his hire, Holland seemed to always expressly mention Sammy when talking about the top-real prospects in the org. While he didn’t draft him, it seems Holland knows what he has with the player (or could have with the player).

  86. jp says:

    OriginalPouzar: Small point of clarification – he’s no longer waiver exempt next season – I know that’s what you meant but just for clarification.

    Personally, I think that Lagesson as Adam Larsson type of potential – strong defensive d-man (breaking the cycle, tough to play against) but he skates and moves the puck better (well, at his current level – should develop that at the NHL level as well).

    With that said, I no longer have confidence he will get the opportunity to develop that game at the NHL level in Edmonton.

    Brandon Manning play 7-8 straight games early in the year while Lagesson sat in the press box told a tale for me.

    Yeah a typo on waiver exempt, I meant waiver eligible.

    I’m not down on Lagesson at all and agree he’ll very likely be an every day NHL player. And yes, there’s room for growth still, but the list of top 4 D who weren’t NHL regulars at age 24 isn’t all that long (he’s 24 for 9 more months so there’s still time i suppose). There are numerous examples sure, but considering age and where he’s at now I think the probability if him being more than a 3rd pair D isn’t particularly high. JMO.

  87. Glovjuice says:

    Harpers Hair:
    Progress on a vaccine.

    https://calgaryherald.com/pmn/business-pmn/modernas-covid-19-vaccine-shows-early-promise-shares-soar/wcm/ad9ce142-256e-400f-b132-4e2a606d9fe2/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

    Good stuff. In reading the article I thought; who in the hell “volunteers” to be injected with a trial vaccine? Do they get paid a lot? Are there not worried about side effects ? Are they just super eager to help? I don’t get it.

  88. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Munny,

    That’s an interesting point. Some time with David Pelletier in the off-season and during his time in BAK next year will hopefully see his skating take some… strides in the right direction.

    source: https://dobberprospects.com/player/dmitri-samorukov/
    “July 2018 – Dmitri Samorukov is a two-way defender with an improving offensive game. He has been praised by Guelph Storm coach/GM George Burnett for his strong skating, his ability to play in all situations (including the powerplay) and his overall determination. ”

    source: https://thehockeywriters.com/dmitri-samorukov-2017-nhl-draft-prospect-profile/
    “He’s much more fluid skating backward than forward, but that is a skill he will continue to develop.” — Sam Cosentino, Sportsnet

    source:https://lastwordonhockey.com/2017/06/15/dmitry-samorukov-scouting-report-2017-nhl-draft-77/
    Skating
    Dmitry Samorukov could use some work on his skating. His speed is decent and the acceleration is above average in both directions. However, his pivots and edgework need a bit of work. He must get quicker in transitioning from offense to defence and vice versa. He could also work on his lateral agility. One area where he excels is in his lower body strength. He is strong on the puck, and has very good balance. This is useful in winning battles in corners and clearing the crease.

  89. JimmyV1965 says:

    Am I the only one who thinks JP and Lagesson for Andersson and the 21 OV is very much a reach? Could we trade Lagesson straight across for Andersson? I’m not sure the Rangers do that. Maybe I’m wrong. Then it’s JP for the 21 OV. I’m not sure the Rangers do that either. If that’s the case, his one year in Europe has raised his trade value tremendously.

  90. JimmyV1965 says:

    If the Rangers really wanted an every day player for 21 OV, doesn’t it make more sense to trade it to the Bolts for one of the guys they have to get rid of? Or if they’re looking for a cheap young guy, wouldn’t someone like Sam Bennet fit the bill better.

  91. OriginalPouzar says:

    pts2pndr: Samsonov has been a plus skater since I started watching him in junior. What changed?

    I think you mean Samorukov and I agree with you. I think his skating is just fine if not an asset – far ahead of where Bear was in his rookie AHL season (and his AHL 2 season).

  92. OriginalPouzar says:

    N64: Still would be surprised if there are any Canadian sites. Can’t see them leaving the border as a mid-playoff exposure.

    Update: I guess I’m discounting the leverage that the Canadian Rightsholders could potentially leverage in true up negotiations, but again a long shot.

    There seems to be some traction with respect to sites that can host at least 12 teams.

    If they go with the 2 hubs route, then, yes, I believe they will be in the same country.

    There is a chance that country is Canada (Edmonton has said they can do 12) as costs would be materially cheaper.

  93. godot10 says:

    JimmyV1965:
    If the Rangers really wanted an every day player for 21 OV, doesn’t it make more sense to trade it to the Bolts for one of the guys they have to get rid of? Or if they’re looking for a cheap young guy, wouldn’t someone like Sam Bennet fit the bill better.

    They need a young cheap left shot D, preferably with some defensive chops, considering the right D guys he would be playing with (Esposito, Fox). Somebody to replace Marc Staal in a year or two in the top 4.

    Lagesson’s timeline doesn’t fit Edmonton’s timeline, but he fits the Rangers timeline.

  94. OriginalPouzar says:

    Munny: He’s only on loan, has an existing NHL contract for this year so is not prohibited from the playoffs, and would be eligible for the extended roster the NHL is tossing about,

    Larry Brooks believes that if the post-season happens, Andersson would be on the Rags 30 man.

    I could be wrong, but I don’t think the SHL has any plans to play this summer either.

    I think it is obvious we would need some clarity from the League on draft day trades before such a deal could happen.

    Same of course applies to Laggy and Pujo.

    You are right about the SHL’s plans – they cancelled the rest of the 2019/20 season so they won’t start up until the fall (if possible).

  95. leadfarmer says:

    Glovjuice: Good stuff. In reading the article I thought; who in the hell “volunteers” to be injected with a trial vaccine? Do they get paid a lot? Are there not worried about side effects ? Are they just super eager to help? I don’t get it.

    Quite a few people would.

  96. leadfarmer says:

    JimmyV1965:
    If the Rangers really wanted an every day player for 21 OV, doesn’t it make more sense to trade it to the Bolts for one of the guys they have to get rid of? Or if they’re looking for a cheap young guy, wouldn’t someone like Sam Bennet fit the bill better.

    The guy Bolts want to get rid of are guys with cap hits and rangers can’t take on those cap hits.
    They would rather re-sign Strome and Deangelo
    If you can get a first for JP in this draft you have to do it. Otherwise hang on to him and give him to Seattle.

  97. Harpers Hair says:

    OriginalPouzar: There seems to be some traction with respect to sites that can host at least 12 teams.

    If they go with the 2 hubs route, then, yes, I believe they will be in the same country.

    There is a chance that country is Canada (Edmonton has said they can do 12) as costs would be materially cheaper.

    Las Vegas seems to be the leading candidate because it checks all the boxes.

    The NHL could take over a whole hotel close to the arena.

  98. leadfarmer says:

    Glovjuice: Good stuff. In reading the article I thought; who in the hell “volunteers” to be injected with a trial vaccine? Do they get paid a lot? Are there not worried about side effects ? Are they just super eager to help? I don’t get it.

    Just wait until they start asking them to spray live virus into each nostril because the likelihood that any 1000 people or however many they plan to test it on get the virus is actually very low

  99. godot10 says:

    A little background on all the Moderna hypefest today:

    https://twitter.com/TESLAcharts/status/1262427914643083265

  100. N64 says:

    leadfarmer: Just wait until they start asking them to spray live virus into each nostril because the likelihood that any 1000 people or however many they plan to test it on get the virus is actually very low

    Challenge trials usually require treatment options to be available in case of failure:

    https://www.ctvnews.ca/mobile/health/coronavirus/hundreds-of-canadians-willing-to-be-infected-with-coronavirus-to-speed-vaccine-research-1.4942858

  101. JimmyV1965 says:

    godot10: They need a young cheap left shot D, preferably with some defensive chops, considering the right D guys he would be playing with (Esposito, Fox).Somebody to replace Marc Staal in a year or two in the top 4.

    Lagesson’s timeline doesn’t fit Edmonton’s timeline, but he fits the Rangers timeline.

    I get that, but Lagesson is good prospect, not a great prospect. I would think the Rangers could do better for Andersson. Maybe I’m wrong. I think HH said every team has a Lagesson and I actually agree with him.

  102. JimmyV1965 says:

    Harpers Hair: Las Vegas seems to be the leading candidate because it checks all the boxes.

    The NHL could take over a whole hotel close to the arena.

    Do they have enough arenas?

  103. jp says:

    JimmyV1965:
    Am I the only one who thinks JP and Lagesson forAndersson and the 21 OV is very much a reach? Could we trade Lagesson straight across for Andersson? I’m not sure the Rangers do that. Maybe I’m wrong. Then it’s JP for the 21 OV. I’m not sure the Rangers do that either.If that’s the case, his one year in Europe has raised his trade value tremendously.

    Well, we may have also been wrong about his trade value before he headed back to Finland. But I definitely agree with your take generally. I’d have thought this was a reach too if not for the Puljujarvi and a “mid-prospect” for Andersson and the first.

    If I’d found out last Friday that Puljujarvi had been traded for the Rangers 1st I’d have been pleasantly surprised. Likewise, if I’d heard that Lagesson had been moved for Lias Andersson, I’d have been happy and a bit surprised. Put them together.. still thumbs up.

    I’m a little shocked actually how many here seem to think it’s not a good idea.

  104. N64 says:

    JimmyV1965: Do they have enough arenas?

    Vegas runs everything 24 hours a day

  105. Harpers Hair says:

    JimmyV1965: Do they have enough arenas?

    Yes.

    They actually have four suitable ice sheets available for practice in the City National Arena and Las Vegas Ice centre.

  106. Glovjuice says:

    Turning Tikkanese:
    Munny,
    Fair enough. What about packaging them both together to get say #3 or 4, and a mid round pick like 2nd or 3rd or 4th?

    Man, you are a VERY slow learner. Both for 3/4 is even goofier.

  107. jp says:

    Glovjuice: Man, you are a VERY slow learner. Both for 3/4 is even goofier.

    Man, I hope you don’t talk to your kids that way.

  108. Harpers Hair says:

    defmn: How much time do they need between games to keep the ice useable is important though. If they want to run games in prime time for TV consumption I think they need at least two rinks to set up for lighting for the cameras.

    City National Arena was originally the home of the Golden Knights while T-Mobile was being built.
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/City_National_Arena

  109. OriginalPouzar says:

    Harpers Hair: Las Vegas seems to be the leading candidate because it checks all the boxes.

    The NHL could take over a whole hotel close to the arena.

    Yup, for sure.

    Edmonton checks all the boxes as well.

    If they want to go with two hubs and all else was equal (i.e. if Vancouver is able to check off all the boxes), I would anticipate they’d prefer to do it in Canada which would save 30% of the costs, appx.

  110. OriginalPouzar says:

    N64: Vegas runs everything 24 hours a day

    Well, yes, but the games will be during “waking hours” of course given TV and related revenue is the main point.

  111. Harpers Hair says:

    OriginalPouzar: Yup, for sure.

    Edmonton checks all the boxes as well.

    If they want to go with two hubs and all else was equal (i.e. if Vancouver is able to check off all the boxes), I would anticipate they’d prefer to do it in Canada which would save 30% of the costs, appx.

    As noted above, Vegas has four regulation ice rinks close to T-Mobile.

    Does Edmonton?

    I have no idea.

  112. Victoria Oil says:

    LT – Did ’53rd and 3rd’ come from the Killing of Georgie by Rod Stewart? I used to work about 4-5 blocks away from there in NYC. Would often think of that song when I was near that corner.

  113. Lowetide says:

    Victoria Oil:
    LT – Did ’53rd and 3rd’ come from the Killing of Georgie by Rod Stewart? I used to work about 4-5 blocks away from there in NYC. Would often think of that song when I was near that corner.

    No, I named it after the Ramones song ’53rd and 3rd’ which is in NYC.

  114. OriginalPouzar says:

    Harpers Hair: As noted above, Vegas has four regulation ice rinks close to T-Mobile.

    Does Edmonton?

    I have no idea.

    I don’t think there is four, no but, from accounts, they can house 12 teams without issue and I anticipate the requisite “approved ice” for the required scheduling.

    Honestly, I don’t really care where the games are hosted – I don’t see any material advantage for a “home team” but, as I said, if they can do it solely in Canada, that would increase net revenues I would think.

  115. Lowetide says:

    JimmyV1965:
    Am I the only one who thinks JP and Lagesson forAndersson and the 21 OV is very much a reach? Could we trade Lagesson straight across for Andersson? I’m not sure the Rangers do that. Maybe I’m wrong. Then it’s JP for the 21 OV. I’m not sure the Rangers do that either.If that’s the case, his one year in Europe has raised his trade value tremendously.

    I think you can make the case that NYR are giving up more than equal value in the deal. However, JP alongside Kakko has appeal and Lagesson could slide right in on the left side (I like him) if things break right.

    They’re both inexpensive too, that’s a major consideration. I do think Samorukov replacing Lagesson makes the deal more even.

  116. jp says:

    OriginalPouzar: I don’t think there is four, no but, from accounts, they can house 12 teams without issue and I anticipate the requisite “approved ice” for the required scheduling.

    Honestly, I don’t really care where the games are hosted – I don’t see any material advantage for a “home team” but, as I said, if they can do it solely in Canada, that would increase net revenues I would think.

    I have zero actual clue, but I wonder if Vegas would be happy beat any other “venue” cost-wise just for the profile boost. I can only imagine how desperate they are for any activity at all with how many empty hotel rooms and casinos they have (and the associated staff who are presumably just biding their time).

  117. Harpers Hair says:

    OriginalPouzar: I don’t think there is four, no but, from accounts, they can house 12 teams without issue and I anticipate the requisite “approved ice” for the required scheduling.

    Honestly, I don’t really care where the games are hosted – I don’t see any material advantage for a “home team” but, as I said, if they can do it solely in Canada, that would increase net revenues I would think.

    Not really.

    Edmonton is by far the furthest and toughest to reach by air.

    It also doesn’t have the TV production crews that American cities and even Vancouver have so they would all need to be imported.

    None of the National TV commentators are in Edmonton so they would also have to be brought in.

    If the NHL goes with a 24 team playoffs only 6 are Canadian while 18 are American so moving all those players becomes an issue.

    I can see the EC playing out of Vegas and the WC playing out of Minnesota if they decide to go 12/12.

  118. Harpers Hair says:

    jp: I have zero actual clue, but I wonder if Vegas would be happy beat any other “venue” cost-wise just for the profile boost. I can only imagine how desperate they are for any activity at all with how many empty hotel rooms and casinos they have (and the associated staff who are presumably just biding their time).

    The massive Mandalay Bay resort is right beside T-Mobile arena and I’m pretty sure the billionaire owners could catch Bettmans ear.

  119. jp says:

    Harpers Hair: The massive Mandalay Bay resort is right beside T-Mobile arena and I’m pretty sure the billionaire owners could catch Bettmans ear.

    If Vegas wants this then there’s not much question they could be persuasive. But who knows how it goes.

  120. Lowetide says:

    jp: If Vegas wants this then there’s not much question they could be persuasive. But who knows how it goes.

    I read somewhere that both the NHL and NBA had interest in Vegas. Might be a turf war.

  121. €√¥£€^$ says:

    N64: Still would be surprised if there are any Canadian sites. Can’t see them leaving the border as a mid-playoff exposure.

    Update: I guess I’m discounting the leverage that the Canadian Rightsholders could potentially leverage in true up negotiations, but again a long shot.

    The Canadian dollar would also be a huge factor. Otherwise I can’t see what the benefits are tin playing the games in the US if there are no fans at the rink.

    I know you are all over this, but Covid-19 risk seems to be greater risk in the US, in general.

  122. €√¥£€^$ says:

    Munny: He’s only on loan, has an existing NHL contract for this year so is not prohibited from the playoffs, and would be eligible for the extended roster the NHL is tossing about,

    Larry Brooks believes that if the post-season happens, Andersson would be on the Rags 30 man.

    I could be wrong, but I don’t think the SHL has any plans to play this summer either.

    I think it is obvious we would need some clarity from the League on draft day trades before such a deal could happen.

    Same of course applies to Laggy and Pujo.

    Difference is, JP didn’t sign a contract to play for Edm this season.

  123. Harpers Hair says:

    Lowetide: I read somewhere that both the NHL and NBA had interest in Vegas. Might be a turf war.

    Looks like Vegas could handle both.

    https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/nba-and-wnba-were-offered-a-whole-block-on-the-las-vegas-strip-to-play-and-live-by-mgm-resorts-report-says/

  124. Harpers Hair says:

    €√¥£€^$: The Canadian dollar would also be a huge factor.Otherwise I can’t see what the benefits are tin playing the games in the US if there are no fans at the rink.

    I know you are all over this, but Covid-19 risk seems to be greater risk in the US, in general.

    Pretty much everyone in the NHL is paid in US dollars.

    Can’t see how the exchange rate would affect much.

  125. JimmyV1965 says:

    Harpers Hair: Yes.

    They actually have four suitable ice sheets available for practice in the City National Arena and Las Vegas Ice centre.

    ?

  126. jp says:

    Lowetide: I read somewhere that both the NHL and NBA had interest in Vegas. Might be a turf war.

    Could be.

    And more generally on Canada vs the US, there’d be less red tape down south.

  127. OriginalPouzar says:

    Harpers Hair: Pretty much everyone in the NHL is paid in US dollars.

    Can’t see how the exchange rate would affect much.

    The cost of the bubble would be in Canadian dollars in housed in a Canadian city – the cost of testing alone would be massively decreased.

  128. JimmyV1965 says:

    Lowetide: I think you can make the case that NYR are giving up more than equal value in the deal. However, JP alongside Kakko has appeal and Lagesson could slide right in on the left side (I like him) if things break right.

    They’re both inexpensive too, that’s a major consideration. I do think Samorukov replacing Lagesson makes the deal more even.

    Would love it if Kenny could pull off the deal. I like Andersson and think he would be a nice fit here. Really, I’d be happy if we traded JP for Andersson and a third. It’s really challenging to put a trade value on JP.

  129. defmn says:

    Harpers Hair,

    Thanks.

  130. JimmyV1965 says:

    €√¥£€^$: The Canadian dollar would also be a huge factor.Otherwise I can’t see what the benefits are tin playing the games in the US if there are no fans at the rink.

    I know you are all over this, but Covid-19 risk seems to be greater risk in the US, in general.

    I’m pretty sure if you eliminate New York and a couple hot spots like Detroit, the penetration of Covid in both countries is similar.

  131. N64 says:

    €√¥£€^$: The Canadian dollar would also be a huge factor.Otherwise I can’t see what the benefits are tin playing the games in the US if there are no fans at the rink.

    I know you are all over this, but Covid-19 risk seems to be greater risk in the US, in general.

    Mostly I think all games will be on one side of the border. Don’t think the league wants to cross borders between rounds or to have all games in Canada.

    12 new cases all last week in Edmonton and same the week before. Similar in Van. So yeah those 2 cities could do the whole thing. Eastern conference would be in Edmonton.

    Myself wherever they go I’d go for FULL bubble. Arena complex + pedway + hotel all inside bubble and staff volunteering to join bubble could get cash bonuses + exclusive playoff seating, That way players are already quarantined and never have to be quarantined mid-playoff.

  132. Harpers Hair says:

    OriginalPouzar: The cost of the bubble would be in Canadian dollars in housed in a Canadian city – the cost of testing alone would be massively decreased.

    Not true at all.

    If you read the NYT article I posted, the MGM group is prepared to pay for all the testing.

    Everything else in Canada is far more expensive and taxed to the hilt,.

    When I visit my son in Tsawassen we cross the border to fill up on gas that is half the price, food that is at least 25% cheaper and a 2/4 of Miller that in Canada goes for $35 is often on sale in Point Roberts for ten bucks.

    Nothing in Canada is cheaper even given the exchange rate. Nothing.

  133. N64 says:

    JimmyV1965: I’m pretty sure if you eliminate New York and a couple hot spots like Detroit, the penetration of Covid in both countries is similar.

    Can Edmonton and Van eliminate the rest of Canada? There is almost none in either city. Covid is Canada is mostly in Ontario and Quebec neighboring surprise New York. The odd day you need the other hand hand to count the new covid cases in Edmonton.

  134. Harpers Hair says:

    N64: Can Edmonton and Van eliminate the rest of Canada? There is almost none in either city. The odd day you need the other hand hand to count the new covid cases in Edmonton.

    British Columbia had 5 new cases reported today….the same as yesterday.

    Vancouver Island hasn’t had a new case in a week and no one here is in hospital.

  135. N64 says:

    Harpers Hair: Not true at all.

    If you read the NYT article I posted, the MGM group is prepared to pay for all the testing.

    Everything else in Canada is far more expensive and taxed to the hilt,.

    When I visit my son in Tsawassen we crossthe border to fill up on gas that is half the price, food that is at least 25% cheaper and a 2/4 of Miller that in Canada goes for $35 is often on sale in Point Roberts for ten bucks.

    Nothing in Canada is cheaper even given the exchange rate. Nothing.

    Van even has lots of available Hallmark production folks ready to pitch in to produce Gary’s big “When Hockey Hope Calls the Heart” playoffs.

  136. Harpers Hair says:

    N64: Van even has lots of available Hallmark production folks ready to pitch in to produce Gary’s big “When Hockey Hope Calls the Heart” playoffs.

    Vancouver is also a major production location for Netflix and Amazon Prime Video.

    Hallmark is a bit player.

  137. N64 says:

    Harpers Hair: British Columbia had 5 new cases reported today….the same as yesterday.

    Vancouver Island hasn’t had a new case in a week and no one here is in hospital.

    Should have said it’s a toss up most days whether to use one or both THUMBS to count the cases here. 12 total over the last 7 days. Same the week before.

    Putting the Island and its hosting plans aside, Edmonton actually had a new hospital admission a few days ago after about 2 weeks of none.

  138. N64 says:

    Harpers Hair: Vancouver is also a major production location for Netflix and Amazon Prime Video.

    Hallmark is a bit player.

    Good thing the Internet was invented to spread out the hundred Christmas movies produced in Van to 2 other players.

  139. Harpers Hair says:

    N64: Good thing the Internet was invented to spread out the hundred Christmas movies produced in Van to 2 other players.

    You would be surprised how many major productions are based in Vancouver if you bothered to stay for the credits.

    My son is a DP in Vancouver and has worked on dozens of major productions.

    Hell , last summer I couldn’t drive to Comox because Deadpool had closed down the Island Highway.

    Bastards.

  140. jp says:

    Harpers Hair: Not true at all.

    If you read the NYT article I posted, the MGM group is prepared to pay for all the testing.

    Everything else in Canada is far more expensive and taxed to the hilt,.

    When I visit my son in Tsawassen we crossthe border to fill up on gas that is half the price, food that is at least 25% cheaper and a 2/4 of Miller that in Canada goes for $35 is often on sale in Point Roberts for ten bucks.

    Nothing in Canada is cheaper even given the exchange rate. Nothing.

    Your last statement isn’t correct (bread for instance is more expensive in the US for some reason). But generally you’re absolutely right, food and most other things are cheaper than in Canada, even accounting for exchange rate.

  141. jp says:

    N64: Can Edmonton and Van eliminate the rest of Canada? There is almost none in either city. Covid is Canada is mostly in Ontario and Quebec neighboring surprise New York. The odd day you need the other hand hand to count the new covid cases in Edmonton.

    Was going to say similar. FWIW Nevada has a few more cases and some less deaths per capita than Canada as a whole. I don’t have the breakdown within Canada but there’s zero question it’s far lower than Nevada when you take out Quebec/Ontario.

    Data is here. Each State is listed if you link to the US (but Provinces within Canada aren’t available):
    https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

    Aside from hotbeds like NY I don’t think it matters though. As you say the league pretty much has to run it as a full bubble, they can’t afford the risk of having to shut it down mid-playoffs.

  142. Harpers Hair says:

    jp: Your last statement isn’t correct (bread for instance is more expensive in the US for some reason). But generally you’re absolutely right, food and most other things are cheaper than in Canada, even accounting for exchange rate.

    A loaf of white bread in Bellingham costs 66 cents.

    Tell me where you can buy it cheaper.
    https://www.numbeo.com/food-prices/in/Bellingham

  143. defmn says:

    Harpers Hair: A loaf of white bread in Bellingham costs 66 cents.

    Tell me where you can buy it cheaper.
    https://www.numbeo.com/food-prices/in/Bellingham

    I agree with you in general and I think you are correct about Las Vegas being the logical choice but we just came back from Palm Springs a couple of months ago and I wouldn’t say things were cheaper there. Maybe 5-10% more than Calgary. We were in the east up until last summer and spent winters in South Carolina. Some things cheaper (gas, chicken, cheese, eggs) but many things more expensive by about the exchange rate.

    I don’t think any of this matters to the NHL though. As you say there will be mostly American teams in this thing and they will want to avoid international border crossing so I would have it south of the border as long as everything else is equal.

  144. JimmyV1965 says:

    Harpers Hair: Not true at all.

    If you read the NYT article I posted, the MGM group is prepared to pay for all the testing.

    Everything else in Canada is far more expensive and taxed to the hilt,.

    When I visit my son in Tsawassen we crossthe border to fill up on gas that is half the price, food that is at least 25% cheaper and a 2/4 of Miller that in Canada goes for $35 is often on sale in Point Roberts for ten bucks.

    Nothing in Canada is cheaper even given the exchange rate. Nothing.

    Other than fuel and booze, which is cheap everywhere in the U.S. compared to Canada, I’ve found a large variance in prices for everything in the States. Some places things are cheaper and some places they are more expensive.

  145. JimmyV1965 says:

    N64: Can Edmonton and Van eliminate the rest of Canada? There is almost none in either city. Covid is Canada is mostly in Ontario and Quebec neighboring surprise New York. The odd day you need the other hand hand to count the new covid cases in Edmonton.

    I guess that’s the point I’m making. If the NHL is most interested in placing hubs in cities where Covid numbers are low, there are plenty of places in both countries. I suspect that will only be one part of the equation though.

  146. Lowetide says:

    Groceries in Washington state are less expensive. We spent a week in Renton and have spent time in Spokane as well, you can buy a week’s worth of groceries for miles less there. Restaurant portions are also crazy big. Seriously.

  147. defmn says:

    JimmyV1965: Other than fuel and booze, which is cheap everywhere in the U.S. compared to Canada, I’ve found a large variance in prices for everything in the States. Some places things are cheaper and some places they are more expensive.

    My experience as well. Idaho is nothing like California for costs.

    Not to mention that Vancouver Island tends to be more expensive than many parts of Canada with the additional costs involved in supplying an island so HH is also comparing from a different perspective.

    I doubt any of this matters to the NHL though.

  148. jp says:

    Harpers Hair: A loaf of white bread in Bellingham costs 66 cents.

    Tell me where you can buy it cheaper.
    https://www.numbeo.com/food-prices/in/Bellingham

    Well I don’t live in Bellingham. And the loaf of white bread I’m currently eating is 624g and cost about $4 (rather than 125g/66c your site lists). Still a gap that could be location I guess.

  149. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Generally I’d agree things are cheaper in the States.

    Except healthcare. *ducks

  150. buffalobill says:

    They will not have both in the west, time zones, more likely to have one in each

  151. buffalobill says:

    If I was to guess both would be in big markets and n the east and Midwest

  152. ArmchairGM says:

    Turning Tikkanese:
    Just a thought. Ifthe trade for Andersson went through as posited, it could be only the beginning of draft day fun. With picks at 21 and say 24, perhaps the play is packaging them for a move up the board. Say 21 and our third to move up several spots, and 24 and a prospect to move up the board as well . Could end up as two picks in the top 10-15 of the draft if it works. Does this sound feasible?

    Moving up 3 or 4 spots will cost a mid-2nd*. We don’t have any mid-2nds. Moving up 10-15 spots will cost both 1sts. Is that worth it? One pick at (say) 10-12 vs two picks at 20-23? Based on the depth of the draft, I’d say its better to have more bullets.

    *At the 2018 draft, NYR traded #26 + #48 for #22: four spots for a mid-2nd. At the 2019 draft, Arizona traded #14 + #45 for #11: three spots for a mid-2nd.

  153. ArmchairGM says:

    defmn: I agree with you in general and I think you are correct about Las Vegas being the logical choice but we just came back from Palm Springs a couple of months ago and I wouldn’t say things were cheaper there. Maybe 5-10% more than Calgary. We were in the east up until last summer and spent winters in South Carolina. Some things cheaper (gas, chicken, cheese, eggs) but many things more expensive by about the exchange rate.

    +1

  154. meanashell11 says:

    Harpers Hair: You would be surprised how many major productions are based in Vancouver if you bothered to stay for the credits.

    My son is a DP in Vancouver and has worked on dozens of major productions.

    Hell , last summer I couldn’t drive to Comox because Deadpool had closed down the Island Highway.

    Bastards.

    Must be because production is cheaper in Canada!

  155. Munny says:

    Lowetide: So, he bolts and then comes back for the playoffs? Bold strategy, Cotton.

    1. He didn’t bolt from the Oilers

    2. Apparently John Davidson has mended fences with Andersson and the Rags org

    3. To repeat, Brooks believes Andersson would be named to the Ranger 30 man

    3. Mental Health is the narrative so I am surprised this is the tact you are taking, LT

    4. With my inclusion of Laggy and Pujo in the last reply, to make it evident i am pointing at a much bigger problem than just Andersson, for some reason we are still talking about the specifics of Andersson….?

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