At some point, Carter Savoie will play hockey for the University of Denver, honing his skills at a school that once housed a teenage Glenn Anderson in his draft year. I call this ‘draft and follow’, as NHL teams select players from tier 2, Europe and US Prep Schools before they head to college and two to four years of development. Here’s a look at ‘draft and follow’ so far this century.
THE ATHLETIC!
I’m proud to be writing for The Athletic, and pleased to be part of a great team with Daniel Nugent-Bowman and Jonathan Willis. Here is our recent work.
- New Lowetide: Why is Ilya Konovalov no longer starting in the KHL?
- Lowetide: Oilers Top 20 prospects, post-draft edition.
- Lowetide: Finding Connor McDavid’s optimal linemates among 2020-21 Oilers
- Jonathan Willis: A cautious free agent period boosts an Oilers team still on the upswing
- Lowetide: Oilers prospects poised to benefit after offseason news.
- Lowetide: Oilers bring back Mike Smith for another year.
- Lowetide: Oilers sign Tyson Barrie to a team-friendly deal.
- Lowetide: Oilers sign Kyle Turris, Tyler Ennis in early hours of free agency.
- Lowetide: Ken Holland will need to be creative in free agency
- Lowetide: Jesse Puljujarvi signing overshadows a strong day for Oilers at draft
- Lowetide: Oilers draft Dylan Holloway on Day 1, with trades possible Wednesday
- Lisa Dillman: Dylan Holloway could be a ‘difference-maker’ for the Oilers
- Jonathan Willis: Oilers could benefit both now and in the future by adding a right-shot defender
- Lowetide: Ken Holland’s work week: Get good players, keep good players
- Lowetide: Oilers’ defence prospects are pushing, and changes are coming
- Lowetide: Potential trades and partners for the Oilers’ offseason
- Lowetide: Dealing a defenceman? Taking stock of Oilers’ blueline assets
- Daniel Nugent-Bowman: Q&A: Oilers GM Ken Holland on improving internally, the flat cap and goaltending
DRAFT AND COLLEGE 2000-2004
2000—D Jason Platt in the 8th round. Drafted out of Omaha (USHL) after 18-year old season. Attended college at Providence and signed with the Oilers after full four years in NCAA. Turned pro at 23, peaked with 109 AHL games.
2001—C Eddie Caron in the 2nd round. Drafted out of Phillips-Exeter Academy (USHS) after 18-year old season. Attended college at New Hampshire, transferred but it got derailed or he left Dodge and he turned pro with Greenville Grrrowl at age 22. Peaked with 54 ECHL games.
2001—C Jake Brenk in the 5th round. Drafted out of Breck School (USHS) after 18-year old season. Attended Minnesota State-Mankato all four years, turned pro at 23 by signing in Holland. Became an NHL referee.
2002—D Matt Greene in the 2nd round. Drafted out of Green Bay (USHL) after 18-year old season. Attended UND for three seasons, turned pro at 22 by signing with the Oilers. Greene would play in the SCF’s that season and enjoyed a long NHL career (615 games).
2002—G Glenn Fisher in the 5th round. Drafted out of Ft. Saskatchewan (AJHL) after 18-year old season. Attended U Denver for four years, and turned pro with the Oilers age 24. Peaked with four AHL games.
2002—L Patrick Murphy in the 7th round. Drafted out of Newmarket (OPJHL) after 18-year old season. Attended Northern Michigan for four years, and turned pro at age 23 by signing with Laredo (CHL). Played five games at that level.
2003—R Colin McDonald in the 2nd round. Drafted out of New England (EJHL) after 17-year old season. Attended Providence College for four years, turned pro at 22 by signing with the Oilers. He played 148 NHL games and is still playing NA pro.
2003—R David Rohlfs in the 5th round. Drafted out of Compuware (NAHL) after 18-year old season. Attended Michigan for four years, turned pro at 23 by signing with the Oilers. Peaked with seven AHL games.
2004—C Geoff Paukovich in the 2nd round. Drafted out of USNDTP after 17-year old season. Attended U Denver for three years, and turned pro at 21 by signing with the Oilers. Peaked with 109 AHL games. Oilers traded Jason Chimera for the draft pick that was used for Paukovich.
DRAFT AND COLLEGE 2005-2009
2005—C Andrew Cogliano in the 1st round. Drafted out of Toronto St. Mike’s (OPJHL) after 17-year old season, he played at Michigan for two years and turned pro at age 20 with the Oilers. Currently at 1,012 games and counting, he is the class of the group in NHL games. He would be an interesting addition to the current team.
2005—D Taylor Chorney in the 2nd round. Drafted out of Shattuck-St. Mary’s (USHS) after 17-year old season, he played for UND for three years and turned pro at age 21 with the Oilers. He is at NHL 166 games, he is playing in Austria and is productive (6, 3-3-6) early in the year.
2005—C Robby Dee in the 3rd round. Drafted out of Breck (USHS) after 17-year old season, he went to Omaha (USHL) for two years and then college (Maine) for four years before turning pro at age 24 in the ECHL. Peaked with three AHL games.
2005—C Chris VandeVelde in the 4th round. Drafted out of Moorhead (USHS) after 17-year old season, he went to Lincoln (USHL) for one year and then college (UND) for four years before turning pro at age 23 by signing with the Oilers. He played 278 NHL games in his career, finishing up in Austria 2018-2019.
2005—L Matt Glasser in the 7th round. Drafted out of Fort McMurray (AJHL) after 17-year old season, he stayed another year in the USHL and then hit college (U Denver) for four years before turning pro at age 23 in the CHL. Peaked with 116 CHL games.
2006—D Jeff Petry in the 2nd round. Drafted out of Des Moines (USHL) after 17-year old season, he stayed another year in the USHL and then hit college (Michigan State) for three more years before turning pro at age 22 by signing with the Oilers. Currently at 680 games, I think he’d go first overall in a re-draft of the names on this list.
2007—C Riley Nash in the 1st round. Drafted out of Salmon Arm (BCJHL) after 17-year old season, he attended Cornell (NCAA) for three years before turning pro at age 21 by signing with the Carolina Hurricanes (he wouldn’t sign with Edmonton, Tambellini traded his rights for the pick used on Martin Marincin). Currently at 541 NHL games.
2009—D Troy Hesketh in the 3rd round. Drafted out of Minnetonka (USHS) after 17-year old season, he did not progress.
2009—D Kyle Bigos in the 4th round. Drafted out of Vernon (BCJHL) after 20-year old season, he attended Merrimack College (NCAA) for four years before turning pro at age 24 by signing with the San Jose Sharks. Peaked with eight AHL games.
DRAFT AND COLLEGE 2010-2014
2010—F Kellen Jones in the 7th round. Drafted out of Vernon (BCJHL) after 20-year old season, he attended Quinnipiac (NCAA) for four years before turning pro by signing with the Oklahoma City Barons for his 24-year old season. Peaked with 175 AHL games, currently playing in the Allsvenskan.
2012—C Jujhar Khaira in the 3rd round. Drafted out of Prince George (BCJHL) after 17-year old season, he attended Michigan Tech for one year and Everett (WHL) for one year and he turned pro with the Oilers at age 20. Has played in 218 NHL games.
2013—F Aidan Muir in the 4th round. Drafted out of Victory Honda Midget (MWEHL) after 17-year old season, he played with Indiana (USHL) for a year before heading to Western Michigan. Muir played four college seasons, Oilers did not sign him to a pro deal.
2013—L Evan Campbell in the 5th round. Drafted out of Langley (BCJHL) after 20-year old season, he played with UMass-Lowell (NCAA) 2013-17. Played in one AHL game.
2014—D William Lagesson in the 4th round. Drafted out of Frolunda (Swedish Juniors) after his 17-year old year, he played the following season in the USHL before heading to the NCAA UMass-Amherst for two years. Edmonton brought him along slowly, he has played in 8 NHL games since arriving in pro hockey (North American version) 2018 fall.
2014—L Liam Coughlin in the 5th round. Drafted out of Vernon (BCJHL) after 19-year old season, he stayed there for an extra year before playing college hockey for Vermont. Now property of the Chicago Blackhawks, he has played in 2 AHL games.
2014—F Tyler Vesel in the 6th round. Drafted out of Omaha (USHL) after 20-year old season, he signed with Edmonton in 2017 and peaked with 72 AHL games. Now playing in the Allsvenskan.
DRAFT AND COLLEGE 2015-2019
2015—Caleb Jones in the 4th round. Drafted out of the US National Development Program (USHL), he changed gears and played for Portland (WHL) for his two post-draft seasons. He developed well in Bakersfield and has now played in 60 NHL games. He doesn’t qualify as draft and college (no college), but I included him because he was in this pool on draft day.
2015—John Marino in the 6th round. Drafted out of the South Shore Kings (USHL Pr), he moved up to the USHL in draft +1 (won Clark Cup) and then Harvard where he progressed in a support role. He did not sign with Edmonton forcing a trade. Marino now plays for the Pittsburgh Penguins and has 56 NHL games on his resume.
2016—Matt Cairns in the 3rd round. Drafted out of Georgetown (OJHL), he couldn’t get into the lineup in the USHL (not a good sign) so played in the BCHL to complete his year. Played sparingly in freshman season with Cornell 2017-18, more in year two and then not much in his junior year. He transferred to Minnesota-Duluth for his senior year.
2016—Graham McPhee in the 5th round. Drafted out of the US National Development Team, he attended Boston College and played a support role. Like Dillon Simpson, McPhee arrived in college very young (he was drafted while 17). He played four years in college, did not sign with the Oilers and is now playing in Vienna of the Austrian league.
2016—Aapeli Rasanen in the 7th round. Drafted out of the Finnish Jr leagues, he played for Sioux City of the USHL. He also had an uneven college career at Boston College, leaving after his junior year. He is 5, 1-2-3 in the Liiga so far in 2020-21.
2017—Skyler Brind’Amour in the 6th round. Drafted out of the U.S. National Development Team, Brind’Amour went to a lesser league (BCHL). He played two pedestrian seasons there, but held his own as as a freshman with Quinnipiac. We await the next chapter.
2017—Phillip Kemp in the 6th round. Another player drafted out of the U.S. National Development Program, Oilers spent several picks on that team during the Chiarelli years. Kemp has a defensive reputation, he has been effective at Yale in a shutdown role, adding some offense in his junior year. Has NHL potential according to Craig Button.
2018—Michael Kesselring in the 6th round. He’s a big man with raw skills, he played his draft season in a New Hampshire high school and draft +1 season in the UHSL. Played his freshman year at Northeastern and looks like he may have a chance at an NHL career. Absolutely a player to follow.
2019—Tomas Mazura in the 6th round. Confusing prospect, like Kesselring drafted out of a New Hampshire high school (which used to happen more frequently although maybe Ken Holland is bringing it back). He was 18 on draft day, turned 19 that September and is now 20 playing in Liiga-U20 league in 2020-21 (3 games, 1-2-3). Hard to assess him based on these satellite leagues he’s playing in.
DRAFT AND COLLEGE 2020-2024
2020—Carter Savoie in the 4th round. He’s off to Denver, that’s a fine program and Savoie should be playing with talent for two or four years. He’s the most offensively talented forward since Cogliano, possibly before. This will be an interesting career to follow.
THE FACTS
Since the turn of the century, Edmonton has
- chosen 35 ‘draft and college’ players
- 11 men have played in the NHL
- 22 have been chosen after their 17-year old season
- 8 have been chosen after their 18-year old season
- 1 has been chosen after his 19-year old season
- 4 have been chosen after their 20-year old season
- The 19-year old (Coughlin) was chosen in the MacT era
- Two of the four 20-year olds (Campbell and Vesel) came in the MacT era
- All of the 20-year olds were chosen from 2009-2014 (Tambellini, MacT).
- Peter Chiarelli’s choices on this list were all chosen after 17-year old seasons.
- The best players from this group—Matt Greene (18), Andrew Cogliano (17), Jeff Petry (17), Riley Nash (17), Caleb Jones (17) and John Marino (17) were chosen after 17 or 18 year old seasons.
- Only two first-round picks were in the group: Andrew Cogliano and Riley Nash.
LOWDOWN WITH LOWETIDE
At 10 this morning, we talk baseball classics and NHL’s return to play, on TSN1260. Alex Chippin from The Score will break down the NFL’s wild weekend and preview Monday’s games. Jared Diamond from the Wall Street Journal will discuss a brilliant Game 7 between the Dodgers and the Braves last night, and the WS ahead. Jason Gregor from TSN1260 talks Oilers contracts (Bear, Lagesson) and possible additions before training camp, plus a target date for training camps. 10-1260 text, @Lowetide on twitter.
Holland could be aggressively looking to top Tampa on ‘most tiny forwards’. Interesting play. Needs more beef and height on D to really follow the Bolts scheme.
The Oilers have an open spot at top 6 LW – currently being filled by either Ennis, Neal, Nygard, Benson.
The need for a LW that can produce in the top 6 is likely the most glaring current need.
NEW for The Athletic: Tyson Barrie’s skills and how Oilers coach Dave Tippett will deploy him. ‘Barrie to McDavid’ is going to be a thing.
https://theathletic.com/2147742/2020/10/20/lowetide-tyson-barries-skills-and-how-oilers-coach-dave-tippett-will-deploy-him/
LT, I’ll hammer a little for the benefit of the younger crowd…you may approve.
MacT made a terrible mistake, suffered the consequences, but turned his life around and went North.
Lessons to be learned:
1. Look back and try not to repeat the mistakes of your elders.
2. When you do make mistakes, do not let them define fine you but instead move forward and be a contributor.
3. Where a helmut on the ice, lest you trade Jeff Petry in his prime.
Lol.
Elite #1D Quinn Hughes had the fewest hits of any D in the league this season (7 hits). Even less than his little bro Jack (12 hits). Actually, if you look at hits/60 Hughes blocked fewer than Kahun, pretty remarkable for Dman.
(Johnny Hockey “lead” the league though with 1 hit on the season, oops).
And go figure, elite #1D Quinn Hughes also “lead” the league in fewest blocked shots by a “defenseman”.
I still can’t see them there but that’s fine I’m not questioning your numbers.
I know that LT seems to set some store in pts/60 but your going to have to help me with this.
So Kahun had 68 pts in 1904 minutes but one was a power play point.
So let’s say 67 pts and keep all of the minutes as if they were even strength. 67/1904*60 is 2.11/60 which I think LT says is first line production. Is that right or does pts/60 refer to more than just his points. Either way it seems pretty good doesn’t it.
Well damn, I thought you meant the Calder and Selke votes he got last season.
Those CF and FF rates are in the link I provided.
Sorry, I didn’t reply to you statement about CF% and Ff% because I didn’t see them in the stats you referenced.
You say they are slightly underwater but I didn’t see in your post how that related to his teammates.
I think LT may have answered that with his discussion of DFF%RC which I assume is somewhat related to your FF% since they both have 2F’s in them.
If your better than your teammates isn’t slightly underwater still good?
Harpers Hair,
Thank you for the reply.
Now that you point out out I see all those stats that weren’t apparent on my phone on my first viewing.
So you say he’s a left handed centre but he only took 121 faceoffs in 2 years. Sounds like he’s more a winner, presumably left wing which I think we could use.
He doesn’t hit that much but Gretzky didn’t but that much and he was pretty good. Now I’m not comparing him to Gretzky only pointing out that not hitting is not fatal to a decent career.
I notice now that you pointed out those stats to the right that he had about 50 takeaways and only 33 giveaways. That’s a pretty good day isn’t it, I’m not sure.
Thanks again for the reply.
Leon scored 105 points in his second junior season.
Kahun scored 31.
If he’s going to be playing against elites he’ll have to replace a current top six winger.
Who would you pick to get the gas pipe to make room?
Harpers Hair,
On the other hand, he scored at the same pace or slightly above Leon in jr, while they both put a sizeable gap on the rest of the field. They also played together a lot internationally
So there’s built in chemistry. And he’s a cheap, 0.5 p/g winger who can play well enough against elites, who is also young enough to grow with the cluster.
Terrible bet.
He’s a left handed centre.
His career FO winning percentage is 42.1%
He’s slightly below water with both CF% and FF%
He has a positive goal share but in his last short stop in Buffalo his PDO was 107.5
He has played 138 NHL games and has been credited with only 18 hits.
He appears to be a third line checker but doesn’t hit or block many shots.
Not surprised he’s already looking for his fourth NHL team.
Lowetide,
Thanks LT
Kahun had fine numbers as a rookie, he got a push (Toews, DeBrincat) in terms of linemates. He played 39 percent of his time in Chicago against elites and had a positive DFF%RC, meaning he did better than his teammates against the best competition.
Much the same in Pittsburgh when playing with quality (Malkin) his numbers against elites were not as strong and he played less against the best.
One fine year, one uneven one. I would suggest he would be a solid + bet for Edmonton.
Ok I’ll bite.
I’m not a youth like you so I don’t really understand this stats thing you reference but I’ll give it a shot.
Clearly I don’t understand this reference in support of a big negative for Kahuna.
It shows be been in the league 2 years
In year 1, be was with CHI and had a positive +/- on a team that was hugely negative. He got his for both the Lady Bing and the Calder. I’m not seeing the big negative.
In year 2, be was with PIT and BUF. He was a positive +/- on both teams even that BUF team that seems to have been a huge negative while he was with them.
Now that guy who’s phone doesn’t know how a guy holds his stick, I can’t remember his name says it’s what you make less what you give away. Now this Kahuna dude has never given away more than he got.
Please explain to me what was so negative about that reference.
Are you sure you want to do that?
https://www.hockey-reference.com/players/k/kahundo01.html
I think most would be ecstatic but they need to move Chiasson’s cap out for it (or most of it).
Holland isn’t going to go over the cap in the off-season materially so that he’s forced to use off-season LTIR with Klef in order to get compliant. That doesn’t just decrease the $1.5M (apx) of cap space that he continues to express he needs going in to the season, it decreases is to $0.
I think the Oilers can, essentially, go over the cap by apx $3M this off-season (including Bear and Lagesson) – they could then send down Yamamoto plus two others that would clear waivers (Neal and Chiasson, for example) – they have the min roster of 20 and with the buried apx $3M would be complaint, then place Klef on LTIR and get $4.1M in LTIR cushion).
They really have room to add apx $1M which maybe means they could add a $2M player and demote Haas or Nygard (which they probably won’t do).
– I always wonder draft trade or whatever had those two not been on the roster how much better this organization might have been.
– They did a good job of firing other GMs and coaches and manage for a decade before finally being ousted.
I would be quite alright if they signed Dominik Kahun
Surely they can beat flags at hockey.
Whatever format the season is played, it has to end by the end of April (or shortly thereafter) in order to ensure they are done the two month playoffs by July (or a week in to July).
I anticipate that NHL and NBC will want to ensure they are done at least a week prior to the Olympics.
I think Sather signed him after his “year off”.
thanks for refreshing my memory. I like MacT, though I think he proved to be a poorer manager than a player or coach.
Just wanted to correct the idea that MacT was drafted by the Oilers.
I don’t get this – his evga/60 were 2.77 over his Oiler career and his evgf/60 were 2.23.
A high negative GF%.
His two most common forward linemates during his tenure – Connor McDavid and Leon Draisaitl.
World Hockey Report
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I’m not sure the “now” is needed – I rarely know what he’s talking about.
In any event, I think he found out he’s First Nations recently (or something like that) and this has something to do with that.
Agents are being told to expect a 50 game season from January to the end of April.
godot10,
This…coupled with an all canadian division…might be one of the oddest but entertaining seasons of hockey we have seen
I was just reading up on Taylor Hall going to Buffalo, but then they start writing about Kreuger getting fired by that idiot MacT then Chicken Hawk replacing him and I had to close the virtual page.
They don’t always re-enter the draft – it depends on age.
Jarett Stoll re-entered the draft.
Ryan Mantha became a UFA.
Kinger_Oil.redux,
I wasn’t going to say anything but I think you’re vastly underrating Vish, both on the ice and off. He was a leader, a glue guy. Might not have had the point totals of some others, but his role was significant and it was important.
Guys like Mess and Gretz have referred to Lowe as “the adult in the room.”
MacT was signed as a free agent on February 1, 1985. Oilers were defending Stanley Cup champions and he filled a need (No. 3 center). In May of 1984 he was suspended for a year and Boston set him free after five NHL seasons.
The rest you can look up, and I will delete and timeout those who use this opportunity to (once again) hammer away on what happened.
This is the equivalent thinking that led me to finally learn that WW1 is what fucked up Western Civilization; not WW2 or the aftermath.
The trouble is, how can you get fired up at events that took place over a century ago.
Kinger_Oil.redux,
???
I thought the Oilers got MacT in a trade? From Boston? Or is my memory off?
Well, one’s a first pairing D man. The other a 3rd line winger.
I don’t know if this is the sort of thing that is appreciated here, but according to Oilers reddit, Dominik Kahun has just started following The Oilers on various social media platforms. The only NHL teams he follows are the ones he’s played for.
Not a sure thing, but seems like we may have signed a winger?
Joe marking his property. Hey. Connor. Hey Captain Underpants. Hey Johnny. There is a new sheriff in town. “Get off my lawn.” Alpha move from the old man.
what about thornton picking # 97 for the leafs…speed kills
Good arrow on Lindewall as he’s been called up to Allsvenskan and playing for Modo (after lighting up the J20 Nationell for the first part of the year).
NHL teams actually own the rights of CHL drafted players for a much shorter time period than those attending college (assuming normal draft age).
If a CHL drafted player isn’t signed within two years he either becomes a UFA or re-enters the draft (depending on age and when). NHL right’s for a college player extend through their senior year.
Outside of the first round, where players are likely to sign early, I see the benefit of drafting out of the college ranks – no rush to sign, they have a place to play for 3-4 years whereas a junior player likely only has 1-2 years of junior eligibility (sometimes 3 with over-age).
Oilers sign Ryan Mantha after he wasn’t signed by the Rangers and became a UFA and played an over-age season in the CHL.
I disagree on Drake.
He is a high energy player, hes game, he forechecks, hes a good skater and a bit of a pest. Like many before him, there wasn’t enough talent to help him keep his head above water.
Hes a complimentary winger, his give a dam factor was higher than 80% of the Oilers during the play in and he looked good for Chicago. As I look at our roster I see him as up upgrade over several.
Im okay with him, hes an honest player, gives what hes got.
Oh, I see – thanks and sorry.
Oilers looking good on some early Cup odds:
https://twitter.com/chartinghockey/status/1317835193898721281?s=21
– I always wonder how the Oil have done if they hadn’t drafted MacT Amd Lowe
– Certainly we would have won all the same Cups and certainly their ineptitude wouldn’t have slowly bled the Oil dry for a decade when their playing careers were over.
– I mean sure without them there is no CMD but post-cups I do wonder what competent managers would have created.
If that question is being asked in the context of who’s the better player, then yeah Petry is the obvious answer.
But Cogliano has 1000+ NHL games, 100 playoff games, and got a sniff of the Stanley Cup. I think he’s had a better career so far.
Yes. Dylan Holloway was drafted out of Wisconsin. These are players who were drafted before they attended college.
No Dylan Holloway listed……. am I missing something on the list.
Interesting conversation: who has had the better overall career – Jeff Petry or Andrew Cogliano. Seems LT votes for Petry – he probably batted higher in the order than Cog but damn Cogs made a career for himself.
Hopefully in 15 years, Holloway is in this conversation….
Cassandra,
If you had a blog devoted to interpreting Ricki and his theories I would read it every day.