This is the lineup Edmonton sent to battle September 22, 2017. The Oilers won the game, the Pakarinen-Kelly-Yamamoto line was dominant (7-1 shots, 1-0 goals) and the Klefbom-Larsson duo was 2-0 goals.
Opening night 2017-18, the only players listed above who played for Edmonton were Adam Larsson, Drake Caggiula, Leon Draisaitl, Kailer Yamamoto, Milan Lucic and Oscar Klefbom.
The top five-on-five line opening night? Maroon-McDavid-Draisaitl. In 15:19, the trio was 34-14 Corsi, 18-5 shots, 2-0 goals, 81 percent expected goals, 12-3 HD scoring chances.
THE ATHLETIC!
- New Lowetide: The Oilers and Russian draft picks haven’t worked — yet
- DNB: How Emily Cave found that ‘joy and grief can coexist’ in writing her book about Colby
- Lowetide: Ken Holland’s Oilers roster construction missing one final piece
- DNB: What I’m hearing about the Oilers 2.0: Evan Bouchard offer sheet? Klim Kostin to KHL?
- Lowetide: Predicting Oilers star Connor McDavid’s 2023-24 stats
- DNB: Oilers GM Ken Holland on salary cap space, Steve Staios, 2023 NHL Draft
- Lowetide: What are Oilers’ best NHL Draft bets for 2023 second-round pick?
- DNB: Oilers’ offseason options: Comparing conservative and aggressive approaches
- Lowetide: What do the Oilers have in defence prospect Max Wanner?
- Lowetide: Edmonton Oilers targets early and late in NHL free agency.
- DNB: Edmonton Oilers AHL prospect stock watch: Is Raphael Lavoie NHL-ready?
- Lowetide: Edmonton Oilers position-by-position depth chart entering offseason
- DNB: Edmonton Oilers fan survey results: Belief remains in team’s Stanley Cup window
- Lowetide: Why Edmonton Oilers’ right wing overhaul is about to hit overdrive
- Lowetide: The Edmonton Oilers guide to saving an NHL Draft on just three picks
- DNB: Why the Oilers are preparing to hold on to Cody Ceci this offseason
- DNB: What I’m hearing about Oilers’ offseason plans: Trade candidates, Erik Karlsson interest, more
- Lowetide: How the Oilers may handle a change in management
- DNB: The Oilers missed a true Stanley Cup chance this year and the contention clock is ticking
- Lowetide: Can Oilers prospect Raphael Lavoie make the team in 2023-24?
- DNB: Oilers offseason priorities: A 10-step plan for ensuring success next season
- Lowetide: 7 ways the Oilers can create cap room for 2023-24
- DNB: How the Oilers roster could soon look different
- DNB: Oilers GM Ken Holland focused on ‘unfinished business’ entering final year of his contract
- Lowetide: Identifying a 2023 NHL Draft sleeper prospect for the Oilers
- Lowetide: Stock up or down for every Oilers prospect in the system
HAPPY FATHER’S DAY
Well men, it’s another Father’s Day coming around again. At my house, it’ll hit a lot different but we’ll continue traditions as best we can. Dad gets Crown Royal in this house, sometimes barbecue utensils or an apron of some sort and I do barbecue after the final hole of the U.S. Open. It’ll me more difficult this year because the Open is in Los Angeles. I love being a Dad to these two fine young people, they are quality humans and I love them to pieces.
It goes without saying Mom not being here is in every breath and that brings some challenges. I will also tell you that the pain is easing, and I am smiling again, even laughing sometimes. I know Jo-Anne wouldn’t want me to be sad, she would want me to enjoy the rest of my time and make sure the kids are okay. Nothing crazy. So that is the goal today.
We’ll play it straight up, I’ll hope for Crown Royal and brace myself for white socks in a bag. My actual gift from the kids is their goodness and how well they honour their Mom each day. Their presence in my life means Jo-Anne will always be with me in flesh and blood. And attitude. 🙂
I hope you have a great Father’s Day. Don’t you do one damn thing you don’t want to do, not today. Even if the wind blows the garbage cans down the street, even if you notice an oil spot on the driveway, even if the lawn needs mowing. I expect you’ll do all of those things and many more. Because you’re Dad and it’s a grand thing to be. Happy Father’s Day!
DID YOU KNOW?
- Leon Draisaitl will submit a 10-team no-trade list next month. It’s part of his modified no-movement deal. There’s no chance in hell the Oilers will deal him, but it’s there. I imagine Ken Holland wishes it existed on some other deals, but the 29 contract is among the most valuable in the game. He’s not going anywhere unless he decides to exercise his free agent rights summer 2025.
- Ryan Nugent-Hopkins rumours happened early June iirc, he was shipping off to Boston for Matt Grzelcyk. It didn’t make any sense then, doesn’t make sense now. Nuge has a NMC, Grzelcyk is a LH defenseman and Edmonton has the position well covered. Also, the man had 104 points, and “he’ll never do that again, trade him now!” ignores the contract (just past $5 million), his production and utility, and he owns a NMC!
- Every day on this blog, at least one person posts “I’d rather trade Darnell Nurse!” even though he has a NMC. It’s the most ridiculous waste of time, but it’ll happen today and tomorrow, and all the tomorrows to come.
- We agreed at the start of the offseason that Kailer Yamamoto was most likely gone, but one of Warren Foegele, Cody Ceci or Brett Kulak will also have to go. Based on interviews and intel, that second player is likely Foegele.
- That’s good news for Dylan Holloway, bad news for Philip Broberg. Holloway wins the 3LW job and maybe they MacGyver a way for him to play on one of the top two lines. Among Oilers forwards, no one would have a larger opportunity than Holloway if both Yamamoto and Foegele go.
- Broberg is in a tough spot if all blue remain. He would play, but not every game. Ken Holland (in his conversation with DNB, linked above) frets over Broberg’s playing time. Kurt Leavins (in his item today) brings up the idea of Broberg playing every night in Bakersfield with the Condors. The math suggests he’s ready and holding him back from establishing himself on the third pair is unwise. Puck IQ tells us he owns a DFF percentage of 61 percent versus the soft parade (Gritensity) and a 55.6 DFF percentage versus mid-level opposition (this is over both of his NHL seasons). Versus elites, his DFF percentage is 42 percent. That’s an issue, but he can be protected and those numbers should improve. I know he doesn’t have enough trade value to be a centerpiece, but sending him back to Bakersfield isn’t the way. Every indicator available tells us he is NHL-ready.
- Ken Holland’s trade for Mattias Ekholm puts the team in the same kind of spot Peter Chiarelli did when signing Kris Russell in the summer of 2017. The difference? Quality of player.
CHIARELLI’S 2017 SUMMER
When the money runs out for NHL teams it can be a long, lonely summer. Here’s what Peter Chiarelli accomplished 2017 summer. This is lifted from my July 1, 2017 article here at Lowetide:
- R Ty Rattie: The most promising of today’s signings, Ryan Rishaug had the details ($700k NHL, $275 AHL) on the one-year deal. I can see this working out, as the Oilers finally have a dearth of average sized wingers with skill.
- LD Ryan Stanton: He should also be in the mix for NHL time, Mark Spector has the contract at $700k NHL, $300k AHL and $400k guaranteed. He is a defensive defender who turns 28 later in the month. Rugged and has good size (6.02, 196).
- R Mitch Callahan. I have written about him many times, he has skill and plays an aggressive game (undersized). He has been in the AHL for six seasons and scored 43 points in 66 games for Grand Rapids in 2016-17. Had an impressive playoff run (16 points in 19 games). He has signed a two-year deal with the team. I came to like him because of his consistency with the Grand Rapids team, a club I have compared to Oilers farm teams over the years.
- LD Keegan Lowe. The Oilers have employed most of the 2012-13 Edmonton Oil Kings defense (Reinhart, Lowe, Musil, Gernat), with Lowe replacing David Musil on the Condors roster. Has two NHL games and plays a rugged style reminiscent of his father back in the day.
- G Edward Pasquale. AHL veteran goalie is 26 and has played in the AHL since 2010. His save percentages have hovered around .920 for the last several seasons and he is 6.02, 215. I don’t know much about him, but if you were making a list of things to look for in an AHL goalie he seems to fit the bill.
- R Brian Ferlin. He is another tough RW who has had some concussion issues over the last few seasons. Kirk Luedeke: He’s a big-bodied winger who has some untapped offensive tools (he was Kuraly’s USHL teammate with the Indiana Ice), but needs more time to work that out in the AHL- the B’s can’t really afford to keep him around based on the talent and experience levels of others fighting for the same position on the team. Source
- LC Grayson Downing. The one center in the group (the Condors need centers, I am beginning to wonder if Bogdan Yakimov is in fact coming over). He is 25, comes from NCAA (New Hampshire) and has skill. His AHL numbers as a rookie were impressive, he fell off this past season. He is 6.0, 195.
This cannot be close to Ken Holland’s summer. I expect he’ll get some things done that have an impact.
New for The Athletic: 5 quality Edmonton Oilers trade targets for low-budget offseason
https://theathletic.com/4620347/2023/06/19/edmonton-oilers-trade-targets-cap-2023/
Hey LT!
Happy Fathers Day.
@historyinmemes
Footage of Babe Ruth and Lou Gehrig taking batting practice, on April 11, 1931. Fox Movietone showed up and took this slow motion video of Ruth and Gehrig at batting practice before an exhibition game in Brooklyn. With modern technology, we can now witness the footage is adjusted to normal speed with sound added.
https://twitter.com/historyinmemes/status/1670499170371751936?s=20
If Holland can pull off a 2 for 1 this is the time. Kulak and Ceci for a top 4 RD on a team that needs depth.
I had mentioned this player yesterday without much of a response.
Arseni Gritsyuk. Let me say that again, Arseni Gritsyuk.
If that’s not enough for you, he’s been on fire the second half of his last season putting up 40 points in 66 KHL games. I have read reports that although he’s a little undersized, he plays with a lot of grit. He’s reportedly a good skater and shooter. Plays RW.
Scott Wheeler has a good write up him. also here.
The New Jersey Dellows are flooded with prospects (#2 on Wheeler’s list)
There were rumors that he was available at the last deadline.
What would he cost? Would you trade for him? What’s his contract status with the KHL?
The more important thing is is he a reliable two way player? We don’t need more goals
We need fellas that gut things out to win. The unglamorous part of the game
We need someone who can shoot the puck on the 2nd line at RW, no?
No more Kahun or Yamamoto types get Leon someone with edge and hands. Watching teams targeting Leon while Woody stoically twiddles his thumbs on the bench is not right.
We don’t have the cap for someone with edge and hands.
There really aren’t any great free agent right wingers available either (with edge and hands) unless Pacioretti wants to sign a league minimum to play on his off wing.
We’re shopping in the Michael Amadio aisle or playing Foegele there or hoping that Lavoie can playing top six RW.
Anyway, Arseni has an NHLe of 40. That’s not bad. Better than Kuzmenko had when I believe he was a year older.
Kus plays two ways
We do but for me not if that’s the only thing they do
Sounds like he’d be a reasonable bet as a free agent. I don’t like the idea of giving up meaningful assets to acquire him. So unless NJ is giving him away Puistola style I’d look elsewhere.
This is of course after hearing what my scouts that have watched him think.
As a frame of reference, Lavoie has an NHLe of 29. That’s quite a gap.
There’s no certainty that he’ll come over here which is why he might be less expensive to trade for.
Just spitballing some ideas here. Maybe Holland still has some connections in Russia.
Look. You’re crazy if you think the Devils are going to trade anyone named Arseni.
No doubt they’d worry about getting burned on that trade.
I had no idea that this would be an incendiary thread after no one replied to it yesterday. 😉
Nurse is such a great hockey player. I’m glad he’s on the Oilers.
He is the Ryan Suter ver 2.0, when he was in his prime.
Minute eater, can put points up, we just got him at a bad signing year.
wow, I just benchmarked my comment. Ryan Suter was an absolute beast on average time on ice from 2012-2017
Suter also signed a 13 year deal, 11 years ago at age 27.
The first 8 years of that deal paid him $10M per on a $60M cap (equivalent to $13.9M vs. todays cap).
Even if you take his 13 year AAV it was equivalent to $10.5M on todays cap.
Suter was in an entirely different salary bracket than Nurse is. More similar to Doughty or Karlsson currently, though Suter’s first 8 years salary blows even them out of the water by $2.4-$2.9M per year (20+% higher).
Pretty similar on ice impacts though.
I wasn’t comparing salaries, just on ice performance.
I think it is fair to call Nurse similar to Suter, when he was in his prime. Not the same level, but close. Lets see how much more he develops!
Well you did say it was a bad signing, so I think it’s worth mentioning that Suter was paid fully 50% more for the same years that Nurse is signed for.
I said it was a bad signing?
I said it was a bad signing year, not a bad signing – Oilers didn’t have any other options to replace their top D.
It is disappointing D signed were overpaid on that contract year. If nurses contract was a mil lower, there probably wouldn’t be as much negative discussion.
I was reading between the lines of ‘Nurse NMC/Trade him anyways’ and ‘bad signing year’. You’ve now added ‘disappointing D signed were overpaid that contract year’.
Am I wrong on your overall meaning?
Am I wrong to point out that Suter signed at age 27 for the equivalent of $13.9M rather than 9.25M?
I mean, it was a meme, sooo… sarcasm / a joke / having fun with Lowetide’s excerpt “Every day on this blog, at least one person posts “I’d rather trade Darnell Nurse!” even though he has a NMC. It’s the most ridiculous waste of time, but it’ll happen today and tomorrow, and all the tomorrows to come.”, etc.
The choice of the wording “we just got him at a bad signing year” is pretty straight forward I thought with my original post.
It was to hopefully, and now, obviously failed at trying to eliminate any shot at his contract – as that was the price to pay for D that year.
I confirmed that my other thoughts were based off of performance comparable(s), not salaries.
So yea, I guess you are wrong on the overall meaning lol.
I wasn’t trying to compare Suter and Nurse’s salaries at their respective ages.
🙂
I thought it was hilarious.
Well you were one of those trading Nurse a couple of days ago.
Your graphic was more on point re: LTs post than I realized, but you were also one of the contributors to it in the first place.
Also, apologies if era-adjusting Suter’s salary was overly aggressive on my part.
Prime Suter is in a different class than Nurse. League top end D. Nurse is a first pair D of varying performance. Upcoming is his 29YO season, he is what he is
Suter family is same as Tkachuk, don’t like them because of family history of being dirty beyond the pale
Thanks for this. He is the Nuge of the defense but in a different way. Coach: “Darnell, we need you to shut down. Darnell, we need you to play with these rookies. Darnell, we need you to be a beast. Darnell, we need you to play the power play. Darnell we need to to skate your ass off in both directions. And do all of the above. For the next 25-30 minutes. All against the elites.” He is not overpaid.
Awesome
This made me laugh out loud.
Happy fathers day Lowetide!
ty
Finally someone posting memes here. Nice work!
@Lowetide
I think I remember you (was a long time ago now and may be someone else) mentioning Ekholm has had success playing on his off side. I was trying to look up how often he has played that side in his career and could not find anything.
If I am remembering correctly, what would it look like to try and have Broberg play his natural side with Ekholm on the off side? I know the D would still either need to move someone like Ceci or sit Desharnais. Just a thought.
Play the old slowing guy on his “on” side. Play the quick 5-tool prospect on his “off’ side.
Broberg has often played on his off side…at every level he has been at for part of the time. It is easier for the young guy to do it than the old guy.
DeBoer moved Heiskanen back to his off side, after Bowness switched him back to his on side, after Montgomery started him on his off side.
Anaheim end up “losing” Theodore because they tried converting him from the his off side to his on side, where he got lost behind Lindholm and Fowler, instead of playing him on the right side ahead of guys like Montour and Vatanen and Bieksa.
Vegas quickly put him back on his off side, and he has been there ever since.
I’ve mentioned Sergachev before. He played in the top 4 on his off side, and 3rd pairing on his on side for Tampa.
To me it’s who is the best hockey player you can get to fill a spot? If Broberg off handed is the best player, play him. Instead of getting crushed with correct handedness. Is Holloway a more skilled and better suited hockey player than someone else?
Very often the easiest way is the best. Paralysis of analysis is a thing
EKholm is going to cover up all of the mistakes, so you want him to be in good position all of the time. He goes LH side imo.
That’s also my take. And he’s not 26 anymore. Let the rookie skate his ass off, which is also easy for him
Rookie Defenseman #1
55 GP
583 MIN
56.3% SF
58.3% SCF
57.5% HDCF
58.0% xGF
55.0% GF
0.82 P/60
Rookie Defenseman #2
48 GP
537 MIN
53.3% SF
54.8% SCF
57.6% HDCF
54.4% xGF
55.8% GF
0.67 P/60
(this is regular season plus playoffs for both, and of course one of them is an older rookies)
Folks can talk about their strengths and weaknesses, and what the best path forward is for them and the team.
But having those two as your 6 and 7D looks to me like a good problem to have.
Or would you rather have Nic Hague and Zach Whitecloud when in a window to win?
Good managers have big windows
Virtually all of them actually win when their best players are in their early twenties.
Because they do things other than good for winning. Keep players past when they could get something replenishing for them. Sign cap killer contracts. Believe in wrong hockey ideas. Retire too many guys, when what fans and players really want is to win, not a name bar on a jersey
That too.
None of the Knight’s good best players, or even second or third tier of players, were in their early 20s – none of the were even 25 or under – most of them were late 20s-30s.
Well those guys are Vegas’ 5/6D rather than 6/7, and they cost more than 3 times as much.
I am still pretty certain Broberg and Desharnais for barely $800k apiece is a good problem to have.
And you get what you pay for.
Breaking in a bunch of inexperienced players at the same time is not usually the hallmark of a championship team.
Oh my, a #6 and #7D.
And you just lauding Bowen Byram, Wyatt Johnston, Ty Dellandrea and Thomas Harley. Shameless.
Vegas has been playing them for three or four years. Since they were 22 and 21. They did not magically appear out of nowhere.
This is crazy. Of COURSE championship teams break in rookies, but they rarely break in a bunch at the same time. Skinner, Broberg and Holloway all played over 45 games, but only Skinner was a feature player. Vegas had Logan Thompson and Paul Cotter.
Neither played in the post season.
In case anyone is (seemingly) unclear what the Oilers ‘got’ from their #6 and #7 Dmen..
They were:
47-37 goals (56%) in the regular season
8-8 goals (50%) in the playoffs
3-2 goals (60%) vs. Vegas
Whitecloud, 26, has been there for four years starting a 22 in the playoffs. Hague is 24 and been there for 3 years.
Three years ago they were 22 and 21.
You have to play them to develop them. They don’t magically appear out of nowhere.
Yes you do,
But that makes my point for me.
How long do you think the Oilers window will be open?
Holland actually said it himself one maybe two years which aligns with what I’ve said.
Window is a measure of the GM’s balls. Small window….
Curious
Last off season everybody was trading so and so right down to the wire because the Oilers were going to be forced into cap compliance. Turns out the Oilers did not make that last minute trade, instead choosing to solve the problem by going short on the roster.
With this in mind, why is everyone trying to limit themselves under the cap again with a 23 man roster?
Holland has said they are likely to run a 22 player roster but, as we know, with one injury, that becomes 23 (presuming they have the cap space to bring up a player).
I think a large majority of the rosters posted are under 23 players. I know basically every one I’ve posted has been. Most of those LT has posted as well.
22 (instead of 23 or 21) seems to have been the sweet spot for multiple reasons including the ones OP mentions.
Desharnais is better than Broberg right now. So, not as a top prospect, but right now in real time. The team gives up too many goals. Broberg is fast and game, but he is overwhelmed, even timid. Desharnais will take on anyone in a net front battle and make them wish for Broberg. So given the teams needs right now, Desharnais should hold down the last top 6 until it is clear Brobergs value supersedes Desharnais. And really, they are not vying for the same spot.
This reflects the Oilers opinion as they could have had Broberg or brought in a Dman but they were confident in sticking with big Vince once he arrived.
Kulak is probably the best pure defender of the slot. He may not be a bargain but he is good value and with good skating should be solid for another year.
The best upgrade would be Ceci, but the target has to be relatively cheap and may only be as good as a healthy Ceci. We might lose a good prospect for minimal upgrade.
No easy solution and no point in doing anything unless there is a clear and substantial target..
Brobergs not hurting the team in the #6 or #7 spot. Hes fine.
Otherwise he could easily be moved as part of a deal to upgrade Ceci’s spot. Or there is a chance Bouchard is moved and Broberg takes Bouchards spot.
I’m not sure I agree that Deharnais is better than Broberg right now or that he’s even better at defending than Broberg is right now.
Yes, Denharnais is tougher in front of the net, no doubt, but hockey and defending is more that that one nuance.
Sure, Deharnais did have a better GA/60 than Broberg this past season but, then again, Broberg had the best xGA/60 among the D on the team and their on-ice save percentage was a major factor – Vinny having an on ice save percentage of .935 and Broberg .884. How much of the each player owns, I have no idea.
Playing tough doesn’t win. The Oilers and Panthers both tried that with the Knights
Not getting pushed out of games wins. Can take whatever is presented. I don’t feel Bro is soft or timid beyond being a skill player who is very young
I also think trying to play hockey first is the best plan. Finish checks always, but extra isn’t necessary until it perhaps presents itself, most players like delivering the odd crushing hit. Florida destroyed themselves being Tkachuks
Amen to this
Broberg is probably a better hockey player. But Desharnais is better at what the Oilers need from a third pair D man. They could play Kulak on his off side with Broberg. But Desharnais is conveniently a RHD. But it comes down to Broberg proving he belongs and Desharnais has already done that.
I don’t agree that Deharnais is better at defending than Broberg – definitely different styles of play but I don’t think that Deharnais is outright better at preventing goals despite physical traits that make one think he is.
My recollection is that the Oilers PK was getting worked and Desharnais was brought up to save our PK, which he did.
The numbers suggest similar ga/60 though Desharnais plays far more minutes on the PK that Broberg. Broberg has a higher FA/60 on the pk
Yes, I believe the PK was the prime reason that Deharnais was added to, and stayed in, the lineup.
I acknowledge Vinny has an impact on the PK (although I think its over-stated), I am generally speaking to 5 on 5 abilities (and think a healthy Ceci will improve on the PK next season).
My issue with your statement about Broberg, and to be fair, I do like what Desharnais brings, is the lack of ice time to actually have Broberg acclimatize to the NHL speed. Just using his last 21 games, he broke the 10 minute mark 4 times and was held to under 5 minutes 5 times.
In my opinion, everyone was clamouring for Holloway to get more minutes and the same should be said for Broberg. It’s like anything you try and improve at and doing it for 5-10 minutes at a time and expecting to improve. You might make small improvements here and there on certain aspects but there is a whole lot that needs to be done in repetition to improve.
Just like Desharnais in the playoffs, I don’t think you can punish Broberg for not being as good as other players or making mistakes when he isn’t playing to actually improve or show what he’s been working on in practice in an actual game.
The options of changing this are limited, either you lower the minutes one of the main 5 d men are playing or you systematically give guys nights off so Broberg can play consistently. I would not be an advocate of just removing Desharnais more often as it becomes the same problem as Broberg as a “young” player in the league.
Just my opinion.
LT, just catching up and hadn’t heard the news till now. Wow, a double nutcracker in less than 12 months. Sheesh. My heart goes out to you. I’m probably not going to be around much going forward as my life seems to be flipping a left turn right now too, but I want you to know that you and this site and all the Lowetidians here will never be far from my mind.
Hang in there, brother!
Best of luck.
Your commenting will be missed Munny
Happy Father’s Day to you LT. And to all the other dads here as well.
I think this year was a weaker year for NHL teams. Next year Dallas, Minnesota ,LA and Colorado will be stronger. If Edmonton stays the same they won’t be going to the cup
Poor take.
Calgary will also be interesting to follow.
They could well have a momentous offseason which could go either way.
The old boys club is stuck with Huberdough and Kadri. Could you imagine being Conroy and having to suckhole up to these two Prima Donna just so they give a rats ass.
Do you actually think those teams will be stronger next year? Why?
Dallas has almost $7.5 million in cap space to upgrade their D and may buy out Suter who was subpar in the playoffs.
They have 3 regulars, Wyatt Johnson, Ty Dellandrea and Thomas Harley who are all 22 and under who should improve with experience and Logan Stankhoven on the way soon.
LA is expected to add another top 6 scoring forward, perhaps PLD, will have Gavrikov all season and after dumping Cal Peterson can upgrade in goal.
Colorado can now pursue a second line centre now that they know Landeskog will be on LTIR all season. They also have a very large number of UFA forwards in the bottom 6 and can pick and choose their replacements. Important to remember that Makar and Byram are just entering their primes so some progression should be expected.
Worth noting, Colorado has almost $20 million in free cap space with only Byram as a RFA among their core without a contract.
That’ll move the chains.
I would wager Dawson Spriggings is a very busy man right now.
Just staple Broberg to Nurse for the five years and thank me later.
Sergachev logged both right side in the top 4, and left side on the 3rd pairing for a couple of seasons.
Stapling Broberg to Ekholm would be fine too, but Nurse Bouchard is a bad idea. Playing one’s best offensive (but defensively challenged) defenseman with your best shutdown defender is far less than optimal deployment.
Nurse has been tasked with compensating for the physical or executioinal limitations of his partner (Bear, Bouchard, Barrie, Ceci). Broberg is the best defender in his Swedish class, with no physical limitations, experienced in playing the right side. His only limitation is NHL experience, and he has more than Bear and Bouchard had when they played with Nurse.
Broberg has the tools to actually cover for Nurse when Nurse makes a mistake, unliek all those other guys.
The guy on the Oilers D that has to be upgraded is Ceci. I would keep all the D and trade Yamamoto and Foegele, (unless a good deal for an experienced top four RD became available, and then one of Ceci or Kulak could be moved).
Broberg needs to get stronger and learn how to play D. Not sure of his hockey IQ yet, he ‘s still very young
Nurse and Theodore (a complete left shot RD) were pretty much the best shutdown pair in the history of the World Junior Hockey Championships.
Give Nurse Theodore-lite.
They were great against kids.
They were kids too.
Broberg had two years in the SEL, and one (extreming good) year in the AHL.
Bro is a big dude. He may have worked out too much last summer. He was also seen by Team Sweden coaches as their best D, their best defensive D, used as such and wasn’t he their captain as well? He’s not a one dimensional player
So far he plays small seems to be on the recieving end 90% of the time. He gets crumbled into the boards way to often if he’s to survive in the league. He looks so Vanilla looking the brass needs to give him the green light to lug the puck up the ice and get creative offensively.
Of the Oilers d-men in the playoffs, Broberg took the LEAST amount of hits/60 among d-men and was middle of the pack in the regular season.
I know he took some shots in his earlier NHL days but this hasn’t been a thing to my eye and the numbers back that up.
That’s my take as well
He sure looked scared playing in game 5 against Vegas.
Did anybody play Eichel as hard as Broberg did? He didn’t look scared there. Have you ever scene Bouchard hang with an elite player as long along the boards?
He played a total of 6 minutes. I personally think it’s tough to make those conclusions when he’s playing probably to not make a mistake versus playing to win so he gets a few more minutes.
He’s a normal kid. What if they actually played him so he can get settled?
Reading everyone’s good comments today makes me think, the Oilers would rather play guys injured to the point of ineffectiveness, and players obviously in a spot above their capabilities and lose, than try something new with a more talented player, or a healthier one, that might at least do something positive, even if they don’t score a million goals or play like peak Gretzky or Orr
Also makes me think of team building. Ryan mentioned this when Tipp got retired. Now that Woody has one or two answers to all problems, how does this build confidence for the other players? I’d rather play half dead Kane or last year Nurse than you, buddy
You can’t ice a team of awesomeness, there is a cap. You have to build all players on the roster up to being a contributor at something. Guys, especially role guys, need a task, a job to do. A place. If you don’t do that you don’t get enough from everyone
Mark Stone said as much in his on ice interview. Back when the Knights seemed classy. That didn’t last long did it?
I think this is the most critical talking point and it is not getting enough attention.
As good as the top duo are, they have not been able to singlehandedly play the team out of a slump, and they have not been good enough on thier own, to play their way (singlehandedly) through the playoffs.
Woody has managed to get everyone pulling on the rope at one time. Then again, he has also went too far the other way reducing some players to irrelevance.
This needs to get sorted or it will not matter who comes in and who goes out.
I agree
They also need a playable system. Even the Viking regressed
Vegas knew how and had the players able to execute how to break down the man to man defensive system.
it will always be a risk when one gets down to the final eight teams that the other teams have the knowledge and the ability to execute to break it down.
In the regular season, it will never be as much of an issue, because teams will not overly adjust for a single game.
All true and the Oilers inability to play a normal defensive system with consistency is ongoing. I do not forget getting unexpectedly bounced twice by inferior teams. I don’t think that losing to anyone for any reason in playoffs is acceptable anymore. We have a lot of good players and good enough goalies, if they get appropriate help
Everyone was crying when the Oilers were playing their youngins pre Holland era. Holland will be retired before we even find out if his golden goose pick (Broberg) is a big fat dud.
History of the last three seasons does NOT show that Nurse/Bouchard is a bad idea – numbers show the opposite to this point.
History shows that the coaches like to deploy Nurse with McDavid and that works.
I would suggest that Bouchard should also get MANY McDavid minutes.
I could see Nurse/Broberg in the future but, given Darnell Nurse remains the 1LD on this team and the coaching staff’s go to d-man for the toughest comp minutes and Broberg has still been very sheltered in elite comp minutes so far, I think a jump to 35% TOI vs. elites on his off-side is aggressive right away.
Pronger could drag any partner along. Nurse pretty much has done so with flawed partners. Broberg would be the least flawed D partner (defensively) Nurse has had in the last four seasons.
Yes, Nurse has dragged his partner along for years and I’m not so sure putting a 21 year old d-man on his wrong side as his partner is changing that.
Bouchard played 246 minutes vs. elites last season and had 50% goal share.
Broberg played 62 minutes vs. elites last season and had a 50% goal share.
There are many that think that Nurse backs in and gives the blue line up too easily too often – well, numbers show that Bouch is one of the best at defending zone entires in recent times.
Bouch’s defensive deficiencies are over-stated. As one would expect, he continues to develop, he moves the puck with more urgency, he plays more physically, etc.
I’d allow Boberg to not jump from sheltered to some of the toughest minutes in the league on his offside in one swoop – that’s just me though
Happy Father’s Day to all you Dad peoples
And especially you Mr. Mitchell
Lowetide – was this the opening night roster or training camp? where were McDavid and Nuge?
September 22 date seems to indicate this would be an early training camp game.
Yeah that would make sense.
Broberg is in a tough spot if all blue remain. He would play, but not every game. Ken Holland (in his conversation with DNB, linked above) frets over Broberg’s playing time. Kurt Leavins (in his item today) brings up the idea of Broberg playing every night in Bakersfield with the Condors. The math suggests he’s ready and holding him back from establishing himself on the third pair is unwise.
I would play him every game and real minutes. I would play him over Vincent Deharnais.
Even with the attributes that Deharnais brings and his help on the PK, “NHL development” of Philip Broberg is essential to this team and extending its Stanley Cup window.
I believed he should have played every night last season and real minutes.
I think he can establish himself (pretty much already has in the opportunity provide) and push up in real time.
The coaching staff does not care what I think.
It’s amazing how much traction in ways of thinking and doing things a team has. Everybody is different but the Oilers still Oiler
Maybe it’s from over thinking things. I worry Woody suffers from this and it leads to solutions that don’t work like man on man and playing Drai against Eichel, Bjug against elites
To me it’s simple. Broberg has a special and unique tool kit. I see him as a D like Ekholm, but with better boots. Size, skill, defensive acumen, not a thug but no wallflower
Des has done well for himself. But his upside is staying in the league. Bro is a better player right now. You make space for that. He will have wobbles but you have to go through that if you want another Ekholm
I don’t ‘dislike’ players (other than Turtle and brother at the moment) so when people respond to fair criticism of players and or contracts I see it as being too sensitive, but if we’re looking for the weakest link, it’s Ceci. Every stats look, dissections of playing style and good at, not good at, says Ceci is not a 1 pair guy or good with Nurse
How do you fix that? The best teams pair a key guy with a complimentary younger guy that is probably only adequate because they are being carried. The end result though is strong pairs if they are given time to get their routines down
Regardless of the coach they default to the same things a lot. Maybe it’s a depth issue, but a lot of players have changed. Weird. But evidence says Bouch is a far better fit than Ceci with Nurse. Bro as well when he settles. Solutions in house
Or go full MacCrimmon/ Sakic/ Yzerman and trade Ceci and Kulak and whomever or whatever, and improve the quality
I would like to add that Kulak does seem to be a guy that plays better in playoffs. Foegele possibly as well, he was pretty good this season
But through the season they had a lot of pretty meh games, or bad. To me they aren’t players you can rely on, which is why despite seemingly having the tools they are a third pair and bottom 6. Multiple teams and coaches find this
“Even with the attributes that Deharnais brings and his help on the PK, “NHL development” of Philip Broberg is essential to this team and extending its Stanley Cup window.
I believed he should have played every night last season and real minutes.”
22/23 was part of the window as well, so Woodcroft’s job 1 has been to win now, which means icing the line up that he believes has the best chance to win every night. That’s a given in the playoffs, but because of the poor start to the season, the Oilers were in a win every game mode to the last day of the season to try and finish 1st. Had Broberg not been hurt out of the gate to start the season maybe things would have been different. Holland thought entering camp that Broberg would likely be the regular 3rd pair D to start the season.
On top of this, throw in Desharnais and Broberg aren’t exactly substitutes for each other (Right shot, hard checking shut down type vs. left shot, all around skating type D), for 22/23 Desharnais was the probably the better fit this past season for the role that Woodcroft and Manson needed filled.
A good course of action going forward could be for Kulak to be dealt (freeing up cap space), slot Broberg as the 3rd pair left D, and Holland and his staff sign or trade for a cheap solid veteran as injury cover for the left D in the 7 spot and who forces Broberg to compete to keep his spot (no one gifted a spot). With Nurse and Ekholm on Left D, and Broberg rising, having Kulak as the 3rd pair LD (and perhaps right side injury cover) is an expensive and perhaps unnecessary luxury.
You forget that Desharnais was injured to start the season. However it would appear to me that Kulak is blocking Broberg from playing regularly. After all Broberg & Desharnais played together in Bakersfield and were actually the top pair. If Broberg can beat out Kulak next season, which is a possibility, it could be Kulak that’s on the trade block. Broberg just needs to prove himself. It just seems to be a gamble at this time to move on from Kulak.
Ceci is the weak link. Play Broberg with Nurse, and alternative between Desharnais and Ceci with Kulak on the 3rd pairing until someone prevails.
I’m not so sure Ceci is a weak link. His injury may have impacted his play this season. Has Broberg ever even played a second with Nurse? How can you be so certain Nurse & Broberg are a good pair?
By that reasoning, perhaps the play with the dearth of good value D in FA, is to trade Kulak while his relative value is elevated, boost Broberg to 3LD, trade Yamo or even Yamo AND Foegele and go shopping in FA to improve middle six RWs. Would need to add depth on D in the Bake though in case of injury or we would be too shallow.
So… Kulak/Yamo/Foegele out for draft picks and depth D (one LD, one RD). FA market for two middle six RW? Is that what you suggest?
Yup, Foegele very well may need to go as well but damn if he’s to the best internal 2RW option at this point (and I’m a poster that has opined that he’s not a “true top 6 player” and its best served on the 3rd line in a position to succeed).
Foegele at 2RW to start with Holloway at 3LW until he pushed up for the swap – I can see the if they can find a way to keep Foegele on the roster and “bring the band back”.
They may lose the base player.
It is going to be very interesting how Holland handles the Broberg situation.
I agree sending him back to Bakersfield isn’t the way. Kulak is blocking him though, and it’s true he probably won’t play every day if the current 7 remain.
I would still be surprised if Holland trades Broberg though.
The question for me is, how is Broberg not eating Vincent Deharnais lunch at this point?
I know Vinny is older, bigger and brings size and toughness that the coach seems to prefer. But Vinny really struggled in the playoffs and Broberg couldn’t get a sniff.
Either the coach is really stubborn or Broberg is not ready.
I have no issue with the coaching staff choosing to run the giant, snarly, 26 year old RD over Broberg for the playoff run.
I know that many like yourself are reading a lot into it, but IMO there is no need to draw ‘either/or’ conclusions from it as you have.
I believe the coaching staff valued Deharnais on the penalty kill VERY highly and, given some massive periods of struggle for the PK last season, that was the primary reason for his deployment over Broberg.
To the original post in the thread – Broberg was coming along very well in the 3rd pairing before the PK started get scored on in bunches and Vinny came in.
Well Broberg was actually playing consistently up until the Ekholm trade and Kulak becoming 3LD.
After the trade deadline, yes PK would have been one of the things that favored Desharnais (along with age, experience, handedness and physicality, in no particular order).
Regarldess, I agree that Broberg showed very well when he played, and that he’s 100% ready for an every night spot among the top 6 D.
Desharnais just fits what the Oil need at this time. He is a third pair D man kills penalties well and shoots from the right side. Not to mention his size. Broberg needs to play in the top four and shoots from the left side, even if he can play his off side Desharnais checks more boxes when it comes to team needs. I wonder if Broberg could fetch a 1st round pick, considering he was a 1st rounder and is now definitely NHL ready ?
I didn’t feel this way a month ago in the wake of Kulak’s strong playoffs, but it might be fortuitous to trade Kulak on a high note, and give the 3LD role to Broberg.
I believe in defensive depth (they do get injured), but it sets up an opportunity cap-wise to upgrade at RD later in the season.
I’ve felt that way throughout, as excellent as Kulak as been, and as nice a luxury as he is at 3LD.
This is exactly how the best teams replenish. Two good players for one spot, cash in. There are GMs out there that might mistake Kulak as a solid every day top 4 and pay accordingly. Bro will be at least as good by playoffs. Just have to sign some cover for the farm which is cheap and easy relatively
Lowetide, I think I appreciate your father’s day posts more than any other. As a relatively new father, I appreciate your perspective from where you are in your journey and it gives me more gratitude and appreciation for what my days look like. Thank you for the community you have built and what you continue to put into it.
I’m off to church with the family after enjoying my wife’s bacon and eggs and deciphering messages in my four little ones hand made cards (3,4,6,8). Bbq this afternoon at my cousins place where we bring the two families together but not before I skip off to work for a few hours, because duty call on that front today. I’m thinking a nice Traditional Ale and some pumpkin pie are also in my immediate future. All in all, a darn good day.
Take care all, may your quivers be full.
I’d forgotten you’d used Grand Rapids as a comparison (benchmark?) even before Ken Holland joined the Oilers.
Allan and Fellow Lowetideians,
Happy Father’s Day to you all! It’s a beautiful June day in southern Sask. Plan to chill and then watch my daughter play soccer today, in the Provincial capital. I wonder if it’ll be safe to wear my Blue Bomber jersey!? My Rider Bride probably won’t allow me to, even on Father’s Day.
It is always a pleasure to read Allan’s daily briefs and everyone’s responses. All the best to each of you for the upcoming summer months.
Wishing you a Happy Fathers’ Day LT.