The Edmonton Oilers signed first-round selection Reid Schaefer yesterday, he’ll be back in the WHL with the Seattle Thunderbirds this fall. It could be his final junior season, as turning pro in time for the 2023-24 season is possible. Schaefer turns 19 on the last day of summer (September 21) and could be ready for the Bakersfield Condors one year later. Since 2007, Edmonton has used each first-round puck (plus some additional ones) and enjoyed much success. Where does Schaefer slot on the list of first-round picks based on draft season?
THE ATHLETIC!
- New DNB: Oilers depth chart: Where did they improve and where can they make more moves?
- Lowetide: Skinner’s rise shows importance of homegrown goalies
- DNB: Oilers’ Kane, Campbell signings are calculated risks in push for Stanley Cup
- Lowetide: For Oilers forward Dylan Holloway, the future may come early
- DNB: Oilers’ Brad Holland on AGM role, analytics, working with his dad: Q&A
- Lowetide: Edmonton Oilers targets early and late in NHL free agency
- Lowetide: Oilers top-20 prospects, summer 2022
- DNB: First-round pick Reid Schaefer can bring ‘big-boy hockey’ to his hometown team
- Lowetide: Edmonton Oilers prospect pipeline needs a post-draft boost
- DNB: Oilers’ Zack Kassian trade clears crucial salary cap space, so what’s next?
- Lowetide: 5 AHL players who can help the Oilers next season
- DNB: Edmonton Oilers offseason what I think and what I know 1.0
- Lowetide: Remember Oilers’ biggest summer ever? It needs to happen again
- DNB: How Oilers’ draft pick Kelly Buchberger became the long shot who delivered
- Lowetide: Could the Oilers look to RFA’s to find solutions?
- DNB: What we’re hearing on Edmonton Oilers’ Puljujarvi, more
- Lowetide: Can Oilers’ Xavier Bourgault make the 2022-23 opening night roster?
- Lowetide: Oilers’ pivotal summer and what fans want to see from Ken Holland
- Lowetide: 10 free agents for Edmonton Oilers to target this summer
- Lowetide: What Oilers assets should Ken Holland trade this summer?
- DNB: Oilers commit to coach Jay Woodcroft
- DNB: What if Edmonton Oilers trade Jesse Puljujarvi? The case for and against
- Lowetide: Oilers pro scouts have to get it right in free agency this summer
- DNB: Edmonton Oilers offseason priorities: A 10-step plan for success
NHLE’S FOR FIRST ROUNDERS SINCE 2017
A couple of things about Schaefer. He’s the latest pick in this group by some margin (Kailer Yamamoto, Jordan Eberle and Alex Pante were also later selections) and there are five forwards who posted lower NHLE’s in their draft years. I post this because it’s important to place this selection in context. Edmonton has drafted names like Tyler Pitlick, David Musil, Mitch Moroz, Tyler Benson, Ryan McLeod and Raphael Lavoie at the same point in the draft. Schaefer, based on NHLE (far from perfect), looks like a solid choice from here. While we’re here, it’s a good idea to behold Evan Bouchard!!! Connor McDavid is beyond the blue horizon, but Bouchard is special in his own way. Also, those who suggest Philip Broberg doesn’t have much offense might consider Oscar Klefbom’s number in his draft year.
This is an important piece to the puzzle, effectively moving back Schaefer’s second contract by (potentially) two seasons. It may come to nothing, the big winger could force his way up the depth chart in a quick hurry. It does give the organization more room to wheel.
50-MAN LIST
The numbers don’t rhyme, so moves will be made. A scoring right-winger is likely to be the focus, with JP, Warren Foegele the probable trade pieces. Don’t discount Xavier Bourgault making some noise in preseason and possibly getting a mid-season recall.
NEW: Four Oilers defence prospects applying for one job. Who wins? – The Athletic
https://theathletic.com/3427501/2022/07/16/edmonton-oilers-defence-prospects-roster-2022/
Great
Big day today as its the final day to file for arb.
I presume that Jesse will file and if, for some reason, he doesn’t, I think that would signal he’s got an agreement with a team on an offer sheet. If he files for arb it would mean he couldn’t sign one. I don’t see any other reason for him not to file.
I am still hopeful that he comes to a reasonable agreement with the Oilers sometime over the next while and is on the roster to start the year.
Contrast Tampa’s asset management (I actually have always kinda cringed when I hear managers use that term but…) with Ottawa’s:
Thomas Chabot
they identify him as a ‘keeper’
he finishes his entry level deal – 3 years accrued
they then sign him to a max 8 year deal taking him through his age 30 season
a kind of awkward age for the team if they want to re-sign him then. Will he want 8 more years or else leave.
Then you sign him and you have a SanJose situation happening
Brady Tkachuk
finishes entry level deal – 3 years accrued
signs a 7 year deal taking him through his 27 year old season
UFA at 27
the world is his oyster
‘Chuck to
Norris
entry level – 3 years
8 year max – through age 30
there is still meat on them bones at 30 but not enough that you are forced to sign him to a long contract
Been following closely Brisebrois and the Lightnings moves
The timing and ages of their contract signings are very educational. Educational on how to get the best years of a player.
It is hard to acquire good players.
There are 31 other front offices vying for the same good players.
When you get a good one, it behooves a team to get them for their best years.
Check this out:
I’ll take it back to Kucherov
Kucherov finishes his 3 year entry level deal (one year slid) (3 years accrued)
signs a 3 year bridge deal –> 6 years accrued
7 YEARS ACCRUED OR AGE 27 AND A PLAYER BECOMES A UFA
then they sign him to an 8 year max term deal
Age when he is finished that contract?
33
Brayden Point
Finishes his 3 year entry deal – 3 years accrued
signs a 3 year bridge deal –> 6 years accrued
signs an 8 year max deal –> 33
Cernak
3 year entry (slid twice) 3 years accrued
3 year bridge – 6 accrued
8 year max –> 33
Anthony Cirelli
3 year entry
3 year bridge
8 year max –> 33
Also did similar with Vasilevskiy (goalie UFA rules are a tad diff though)
He’s identified his keepers and signed them through their very best years of their careers (of course there are exceptions)
Bouchard
Have the Oilers identified him as a ‘keeper’? I think that they probably have.
Well let’s ‘keep’ him for the best years of his career.
Following the Tampa model …. after this season he will have 3 years accrued towards UFA status
sign him to a 3 year bridge deal covering only RFA years
then sign him to a max 8 year deal
This will take him through his 33 year old season
Oh i should correct my above post. Those Tampa players end their contract AFTER their 33 year old season.
Is Yamamoto a keeper?
Evolving Hockey has his contract at 5 years 5.25$!!!
that’s a surprisingly high cap hit to me
but also the 4 year deal would be terrible asset management as he has 4 years accrued
he would be a UFA at age 26!
Terrible idea
As they often are, EW is WAY off base on that one. They have some projections that seem logical and accurate and many that seem wildly off base.
On Bouchard, we know that Holland thinks he’s a keeper and he’s cognizant of what his cap hit will look like going forward (he expressly mentioned that he needs to look at the years ahead and gave Bouch as an example, when talking about spending cap this year).
Here is hoping that he and Bouch’s can will start working on the Klef-like extension or that bridge deal once the more urgent tasks are taken care of later this summer.
Even with Barrie here, I see Bouch spiking to 60 plus points, and that’s with Barrie getting most PP1 reps (they both will get some, that’s one change that is easy to make when the PP goes dry/stale).
CORRECTION to original post
the last contract takes them THROUGH their 33 year old season
To me this is the way. You get the the best of the career and given timelines and that the league – outside Covid – increases the cap yearly, you also have the deals avoiding signing at peak value
The best part is that if the team isn’t sentimental, the player can be dealt at full value with term, after what is the best years for most players.
Only players like Connor should be retired of you want to remain competitive. Not conducting business to stay in the hunt makes no sense to me. Man U stayed on top forever, by moving players and making deals from a position of strength
Signing guys at 27-30 for their retirement contracts is the worst. Either at max cost, too far into their decline, or both
The off-season is so fascinating with all the roster building.
Then it makes the first half of the season very interesting to see how the different teams moves play out.
Then the second half of the season is the march for playoff spots
Then it’s playoff season, the best time of all
Oilers need to pick up a dependable two way RW. I don’t think Derek Ryan can cut it on the third line anymore.
Not sure where the money will come from. Maybe Foegele for an RW.
Nothing really left in FA. Probably have to swing a trade.
I think the answer is McLeod. Assuming he gets re-signed. Derek Ryan on the 4th is a good option. He had a topsy turvy season but his good parts were very good. Agreed he’s not a viable option centring the third line though.
McLeod is C/LW, not RW though.
Depending on how the rest of the off-season procurement goes, Hyman flipping to RW is a legit option.
I vote for RFA Jesse Puljujarvi!
If Jesse wants to be paid like and accept the role of a third liner that would be great.
Not sure it’ll happen.
Even with Yamamoto and JP in the fold, I think we still lack at right wing.
Need some juice.
And the 2LD of course.
Fill those two holes and we can start talking about playing for the Cup.
LW: Kane, Nuge, Holloway
RW: Hyman, Yamamoto, Puljujarvi
C: McDavid, Drai, McLeod
Yup, RW could use a boost but, my goodness, if Holloway’s AHL game can translate early, wow.
Also, what Jesse should realize is that he doesn’t need any assurance on top 6, he has the ability to simply earn that ice on merit – my goodness, he was almost exclusively in the top 6 over the last two seasons.
He got moved down after he struggled while being less than 100% – lots and lots and lots of legit top 6 players get moved around in similar circumstances.
Sign a one-year, $2.75MM deal and come to camp and play – a top 6 spot is up for grabs and he would almost assuredly win the job.
I believe the problem is that he thinks he already won the job and wants to now be paid accordingly.
Well, he really has won the job in many ways but, of course, there is the light box-cars in the 2nd half (of course, the box-cars were ver solid in the first third of the season prior to Covid and injury).
Payment is a question but I do think he’s earned something in the $2.75M to $3.25M range.
Is $2.75 M – $3.25 top six pay? Seriously asking as I don’t know and I am not sure Puljujarvi or Yamamoto’s agents think it is.
I thought, and correct me if I’m wrong, that he wanted some sort of assurances on top 6 minutes, not necessarily that he was going to make bank this coming season.
I usually focus on the RW because I think they have their 2LD in Broberg. Not yet, of course, but under contract and progressing.
Bourgault is less certain. And there are 4th line slots yet to be filled that we tend to gloss over thinking they are easy but they are still not done.
Its a long ways from three years ago when Holland arrived to find McDavid, Draisaitl, Nuge, Nurse and a bunch of ‘others’.
Where is this coming from? You might be overthinking this. The team hasn’t played in weeks, and there is no way to predict if Derek will slow down this off season.
He was fine after the arrival of Woodcroft. His playoff stats were identical to his career playoff stats, and he was an even +/- against the Avalanche.
Of all the worries that Holland and Woodcroft may have this off season, I don’t think one more year of Derek Ryan is one of them. With Kane resigning, if we need right side improvement we can slide Hyman to starboard and depending on RFA signings this will push one of Yanamoto or Puljujarvii to 3RW
Plus, we don’t know where Holloway ends up by seasons end, and meanwhile we will still need someone to kill penalties.
Furthermore, if we were to acquire someone with more pop than Derek at right wing, we would be wasting him on the third line.
Free agency grades for every team.
https://theathletic.com/3426849/2022/07/16/nhl-free-agency-2022-team-grades/?source=user_shared_article
Did you realize that Oilers got best grades in the division?
Not at all surprising given the calamities in Calgary and Vegas
I like how you pretend as if you knew this was going to happen after you spent the last year talking about how Johnny would never leave the Flames and how Tkachuk would also stay and how Vegas were a bunch of savvy cap management geniuses who were going to be a powerhouse after acquiring Eichel.
It’s funny to think how much time and energy you wasted arguing about these things only to sweep it all under the rug and hope no one noticed..
Its amazing that anyone still tries to engage him in good faith.
Calamities seen from far off by many here on the board.
We have been warned about all the cap space about to be Weaponized by Seattle, LA, and Anaheim
@EvolvingHockey
Here are the top-15 remaining free agents and our projected most likely contracts for each. The majority of the remaining high-value players are RFAs, but 7 UFAs remain in the top 30 of all free agents, 4 of which are in the top-15 shown here.
https://twitter.com/EvolvingHockey/status/1548403406917644295?s=20&t=IKo7r56p1MKrT6XdQ_hcEQ
So they are predicting $17 M more or less for Calgary to sign Tkachuk & Mangiapane. 😉
And now I see they have Yamamoto at $5.25 for five years. I find that difficult to believe.
If it’s a 5 year deal, I think that is actually pretty accurate.
But it wouldn’t take much thought to realize that it can’t be 5 years and never can be $5.25 as an Oiler.
I would imagine Yamamoto’s agent has figured that out.
I would imagine if he was offered that he’d be over the moon
if you think he’s getting the Nuge Hyman Kane contract keep drinking
If he’s worth that I quit
Good young players are signing bridge contracts in that range and the elite ones are getting 8 year deals for big money.
Is Yamamoto so flawed he has to accept scraps?
Actually a majority of those very good young players have refused to commit to their teams for 8 years and are heading to UFA early (Matthews, Marner, MacKinnon, Makar, Rantanen, Fox, Kaprizov, Aho, B. Tkachuck, Hughes, Hirscher, Nylander, Provorov, Pastrnak among many others).
The Oilers are very lucky their superstars were willing to commit to the team and city for the max term.
At a glance, it appears these estimates are inflated by approximately 5-10%.
They have been remarkably accurate in predicting contact signings.
They were what, $2.7M low on Kane? And IIRC the Oilers also got a more favorable term than predicted.
They use a mathematical model that likely doesn’t adjust for unique situations where a large number of teams would have no interest in the Kane drama.
That would just be the most obvious problem with mathematical models.
What? Are you telling me Evolving Wild doesn’t have a formula that goes
“IF(DRAMA,”Y”,”N”)” where they exclude all formulas that include a Y value??
You have to start somewhere.
Kane’s situation is the definition of an outlier.
Math is a language that allows for precision in describing quantitative relationships between objects where the discrete comparatives essential ontological characteristic is one of sameness. As that sameness decreases its descriptive precision erodes.
Do you have an example of a mathematical model involving complex inputs that offers insight appreciably superior to what can be discerned by good judgement because I can think of several currently driving public policy in spite of them consistently missing their predictive mark by orders of probability distribution.
Just saying.
Orders
And then, as here, gets called “remarkable accuracy.”
And Then There’s Maude.
“God’ll get you for that, Walter.”
$1-2 million off on almost every contract.
About as good as just randomly guessing….
Did you notice that Colorados forwards are already over 16 mil in cap and that’s without a Kadri signing
Did you notice they just set a cap era record by going 16-4 in the playoffs?
Which has nothing to do with your all their free agents will come in under 16 mil prediction
Did you notice that the guy who just lead the playoffs in goal scoring (and scored at a top 10 rate in the regular season) re-signed with the Oilers for a 2nd line cap hit?
For 600k more than the Champs gave Artturi Lehkonen and Josh Manson, and $1M less than the retirement contract they gave Valeri Nichushkin? Huh.
Did you notice the Avalanche are overwhelming favourites to repeat as cup champions?
Did you notice that Kane had a totally unsustainable shooting percentage in leading the Oilers to a 0-4 curb stomping at the hands of the Avalanche?
Did you notice the Avalanche have made their way to a championship with ZERO dead cap while the Oilers are still paying for their past stupidity?
Did you notice the average age of the Oilers is higher than Colorado?
Did you notice that the Oilers have signed several players whose contracts will expire in their mid 30’s?
Did you notice that Colorado have four defensemen who are arguably better than any Oiler D?
No I didn’t, and I don’t much care.
Did you notice it wasn’t a curb stomping, and that the Oilers 2nd and 3rd best players were broken?
This one is true.
Did you know this one is no longer true? And did you know the only Oiler player over the age of 30 is Derek Ryan?
Did you know you’re the only person who’s ever made this outrageous claim?
Forget it, Jake. It’s Chinatown.
Yeah, responding to HH when he does this shtick is a waste of typing.
And there is a good chance that if Georgiev puts in a .8xx performance this year + Nichuskin returning to a 20 something point player + Burnaby Joe signing Kadri to a retirement contract and Colorado underperforming, that HH will say it was “no surprise that this calamity occurred”.
It’s a waste of time having any meaningful conversation with HH.
“meaningful conversation with HH”? Good joke 🙂
Well, Evander Kane is 30, turns 31 in August.
Other than that: Ya!
Did you notice you’re in error again? Colorado ‘set’ no record, they merely tied the Kings record from 2011-2012. To ‘set’ a record your results actually have to be better than anything done before. You can’t even get the meaning of a 3 letter word right. And LA won every game in regulation so one could argue their record was better.
So LA didn’t go 16-4 in 2012?
At a quick glance, it looks like Colorado may be the only team signing players to deals ABOVE the EH projections.
1) Evolving Wild has been radically off-base more than “remarkably accurate” over the years.
2) No doubt the Avs have been built well – took a decade but they just won the cup and were full value for it. At the same time, most f their moves this off-season look to be quite risky or outright wild – the acquisition cost and then contract on Georgiev, the term with the AAV on Nichushkin off one season and the Larsson contract for Manson given his age, injury history, regression the last few years and “meh” at best play for the Avs.
Gotta take off for a while.
I’ll leave you with this.
Evander Kane, Jack Campbell, Brett Kulak all Edmonton Oilers.
Johnny Gaudreau? The Devil You Say!?!
“Sunny day
Sweepin’ the clouds away
On my way to where the air is sweet”
#Giddy
#LetsNotBuryTheLead
We’re trading for Larry Robinson?
HA!
And trading Snuffleupagus (JP)
I’m pleased to see Philip Broberg listed on the NHL roster in Cap Friendly (as opposed to guys like Samorukov and Niemelainen who are listed as Non-Roster Players).
Nice landing spot for Jeff Petry.
I’m happy for him.
Friedman reporting Marino was a cap dump
and Pens are trading for Petry
Kapanen likely headed the other way.
#Habs trade Jeff Petry and Ryan Poehling to #Penguins for Mike Matheson and a 2023 4th round pick.
Pens are old!
Yep…their average age is almost 30.
The crash is going to be very hard when it comes.
@FriedgeHNIC
·
9m
Hearing Jeff Petry will be traded to PIT.
Ty Smith on to the next city. (along with a 3rd round pick)
Evan Bouchard about to become the PP Quarterback on the top Powerplay in the NHL.
I guess that settles that. 😉
Ty Smith will do well in a more structured organization, look what Pitt did for Schultz.
He will also benefit from goaltending that isn’t horrific.
Barrie is a big reason why it is the League’s best powerplay.
He moves the puck well and is good a holding the puck in the zone. He could however take shooting practice in a hotel lobby and not break a window!
He has five double-digit goal-scoring seasons in his career. He doesn’t have a Boosh bomb but he knows how to shoot pill.
And I’m not sure if I’ve seen anyone move the puck as quickly and smartly and accurately. I think it is better than “well”.
With respect to Broberg and a comparison of his numbers to where Klefbom was at the same age. The most Oskar ever put up was 38 points in a season where he got extensive time on PP1. If that’s the comparison, then that’s nothing to write home about in this era where you have guys like Makar, Fox and Josi.
Broberg may be trending to be Klefbom or better … but he’s never going to supplant Bouchard on PP1, which will always line up with 4 forwards.
So at least early in Broberg’s NHL career I am not expecting him to put up much offence. Which is fine – he needs to develop in to a defenseman who can drive play at even strength and be a good PKer.
Yup – I mentioned Broberg making hay on the PP, an opportunity that Klef didn’t have at the AHL level.
You’re correct, Broberg obviously won’t see any real PP time any time soon and may not see more than PP2 in the future in this org.
At the same time, even without the PP, Klef was a very good top 4 d-man and Broberg is tracking right with him (and is a better skater). My only hesitation with Bro tracking to be a legit top 4 guy is he’s somewhat tracking Klef for injuries, as well….
I think the cup of coffee Broberg got last season will have him better prepared for full time duty this season. He’ll move the puck just a bit quicker and have time to better protect himself in the corners.
I think we will be pretty happy with his pick in very short order.
Where does he rank in a redraft between
Seider (Det)
Broberg (Edm)
Soderstrom (Arz)
haHa. Trick question. We have to wait another 2 yrs (5 yr rule) to really know.
My guess after another 2 yrs of hard work, ups and downs, trials and tribulations….
Seider (Det)
Broberg (Edm)
Soderstrom (Arz)
Seider is awesome
I was looking earlier today and was somewhat surprised that Broberg played in 23 games last year
Broberg and Kelfbom I don’t see the similarities besides being Swedish. Once Broberg is settled in and matures he’ll be a driver from the back end the way Nurse is at times. Having the speed and skill to be able to carry the puck from end to end and causing chaos in the opponent’s end.
They have had almost identical development paths and both are developing as big, good skating, 2-way defenders.
Broberg is a much more dynamic skater than Klefbom though. Klef was a ‘good’ skater, but not at all fast, and he basically never rushed the puck up ice.
I agree with Reja, Broberg stylistically is much more similar to Nurse than he is to Klefbom (while you are correct that boxcar [until this season] and progression wise Broberg is tracking almost lock step with Klefbom).
Kelfbom scored over 5 goals once in 2016 he recorded 12 goals on his way to 34 Career Goals. Lee Fogolin career high was 13 in 1980 on his way to 44 career Goals. I just don’t get the man love for Oscar. He was undependable couldn’t figure out how to block a shot without getting hurt. He couldn’t hit the net if his life depended on it excluding the one time against San Jose. I’ll take tough as nails Lee over pretty boy Oscar any day of the week.
This is incredibly inaccurate re: Oscar. Fogolin was a beauty but he played in a higher scoring era.
Goal-scoring certainly wasn’t his forte, but he did a lot of other things very well.
Klefbom – 34 goals in 378 career games
Fogolin – 44 goals in 924 career games
different eras
Apples / Oranges
Broberg as a prospect showed much more offence than Klefbom did as a prospect and I do think he has more upside offensively, he’s never going to be the Makar type of dangler and creative playmaker in the o-zone but if he can improve his wrister, clean up his hands in tight(which is an unusual thing for a D to work on but Broberg has a knack to put himself into those situations) and keep working on those quick, clean passes in the offensive zone that I feel he’s improved the last two seasons his explosive skating and ability to move into dangerous areas will make him a real offensive threat I think, much moreso than Klefbom. He has an ability to break down the opposing teams defensive structure in a way Klefbom never had.
Wrt to ES and PP production, according to this site: https://pick224.com/ he actually put up the majority of his offence at ES in the AHL with 12 points, of which 11 were primary, 10 points on the PP and 1 SH. Interestingly enough all his four goals came at even strength. Now I don’t know how trustworthy that site is but if correct it’s surprising since most comments I’ve seen have him putting up most of his offence in the AHL on the PP. 12 points at even strength in 34 games is pretty good I’d say.
He’s also never been the type of D to just harvest points on the PP earlier in his young career, playing the point on the PP was one of the things that needed improvement at the time of the draft but just watching him last season he’s improved both his decision making with the puck on the PP and I think his slapshot looked a lot better at the end of last season compared to how it looked at the start of the season(I think his slapper started to look quite similar in style to how I remember Dave Manson shooting the puck, but it could be me projecting, it was a long time ago).
One thing about Broberg’s production in Sweden, when playing against his peers he’s produced well, he was at 1.0 ppg in juniors in his draft year, only eight games since he was a regular with the men’s team so small sample but if I were to make a guess based on hiw he looked against other junior players he’d probably kept up around that pace which is a pretty rare feat for a 17 yo in that league(and there would far less talk about low hockey IQ from a lot of prospect evaluators…).
When he moved to AIK in his D -1 where he got elevated in the lineup he was over 0.5 ppg(0.25 gpg) at 16, also very good for a D at that age. So he has a history of strong production, but because of his talent and physique he’s been pushed up the system and has been playing against men since 17. And he managed to be productive in juniors despite not really being a natural PPQB. A part of his game that looks like it’s moving in the right direction.
Just as a comparison Klefbom had 4 points in 15 games in the U20 league in his draft +1(for some reason he only played in the SHL, third tier men’s and U18 league in his draft year and D -1 but not the U20 so can’t compare those years). Broberg also produced slightly better in the SHL in their D+1 and D+2 years though neither player put up big numbers.
That’s a cool site. You can look up Klefbom on there as well.
Broberg 21-22 31GP 1G 7A1 4A2 12PTS (+10PPP) 0.39EVP/game
Klefbom 13-14 48GP 1G 5A1 3A2 9PTS (+1PPP) 0.19EVP/game
Also for fun:
Bouchard 19-20 54GP 3G 6A 10A2 19PTS (+15PPP) 0.35EVP/game
Bear —– 18-19 52GP 5G 8A 7A2 20PTS (+11PPP) 0.38EVP/game
Jones —- 18-19 50GP 3G 6A 7A2 16PTS (+13PPP) 0.32EVP/game
Lagesson 18-19 67GP 8G 5A 11A2 24PTS (+1PPP) 0.36EVP/game
(note that Bear, Jones, Lagesson were 1-2 years older than Broberg, Klefbom, Bouchard in these seasons, all having played a pro season already)
Anyway, it’s only 31 games, but Broberg shows really really well here. Huge gap between he and Klefbom at even strength in addition to Broberg getting PP minutest and points.
That’s a great post SP, an. all-timer for information and great thought – thank you.
As far as 5/5 vs. PP production and that site, I didn’t click on the link but I do recall that, early in the year, it was almost all PP. He started off with something like 9 of his first 10 points on the PP. I’m not exactly certain where it went from there – can’t really recall.
NJD acquire John Marino from Pittsburh for Ty Smith and a 3rd round pick.
Wow that’s a real hockey trade, good deal for both teams.
The pick went the wrong way.
Yeah I was thinking the same actually. Great value for Hextall and the Pens there.
The deal got them back below the cap with only Kasperi Kapanen left unsigned and they will likely trade him.
NJ must think Marino has more upside.
You we’re pumping Ty Smith’s tires pretty hard last season HH. Looks like they got over-inflated.
Yes I didn’t see the 3rd rounder. Very interesting trade the Oilers were either picking Bouchard Dobson or Smith at the 2018 draft if indeed they were picking a D at 10. Now Hexall gets Smith with pedigree for Marino with a higher cap hit. Everytime I’ve seen Marino he’s looked good, it’s to bad he didn’t want to give it a go here. You take your chances drafting Russians and Americans. I’m going to thoroughly enjoy as Keith and Matt turn the screws on Brad Treliving they’ll show no mercy as Pizza Boy gets his ass handed to him.
Ty Dellow wouldn’t make that kind of mistake, would he? I mean his analytics were probably behind bold moves like acquiring P.K. Subban, and having New Jersey sign Gusev to a $4.5 million contract. He had to be in the discussions that sent Hall out the door as well, though I admit they now have Dawson Mercer from that move.
And the product of his work, with two general managers, inspired Gaudreau to pick Columbus over New Jersey, probably for less $$ – though I my bet is that Johnny does not live up to that slighthly lower contract for more than a couple of seasons, three at most. They can take consolation that they have Palat for 5 seasons at $6 million a season through till he is 36. He does his best work in the playoffs, but the team has to get into the playoffs first – Vegas does not think that is likely yet.
I’m always good for a little Dellow drive by. 😉
NJD. Analytics Powerhouse.
And yet I see parallels to the Oilers when they had Tyler Dellow.
Take a look at Ty Smith season
Take a look at Mariano’s and to their ages and to their cap hits…..
~ Smith, Marino, Caleb Jones, Ethan Bear, Brad Hunt; Oilers could have had a championship back end ~
and the beat goes on….
Ty Smith had an absolutely horrendous year
Yep…and Marino wasn’t great either.
Analysis here:
https://theathletic.com/3428076/2022/07/16/penguins-devils-trade-smith-marino/
And here
https://twitter.com/jfreshhockey/status/1548353773994594304?s=21&t=iQCg7nuQs6SpiSyyvhwLeQ
6th percentile is still less than 78 percentile
New Jersey with just over $17.5 M on their RD – Hamilton (9), Severson (4.166), Marino (4.4).
That’s a little heavy, no?
Yeah…and they’ve been drafting D like nobody’s business the last few years.
Luke Hughes and Simon Nemec should arrive quickly.
I wonder if they will try to move a righty.
All bat no leather. Analytic dream. Winning tough games maybe not so much
Has to be another move, no?
Devils GM stated a while ago that they were going to build their D around players with length.
Ty Smith at 5’11” doesn’t fit their preferred mold
Puck Pedia
Next key dates:
Tomorrow (July 17) at 5pm Eastern Time is the deadline for players to file for arbitration
July 22 at 5pm ET, Qualifying Offers automatically expire and can no longer be accepted by the players
July 27 first day of arbitration hearings
Good on Holland to keep a pick in the first round and build the team from every angle . Every year fans want that pick traded at the deadline like most contenders do but Holland has quietly added Holloway, Bourgault and now Schaefer to the forward pipeline. In 2018 Calgary traded away their 1st, 2nd and 3rd round draft picks and are now feeling that pain. The Oilers drafted Bouchard and McLeod that year .
This is exactly right. Keeping the pipeline flowing actually extends the cup window. Being able to rely on Holloways and Bourgaults on cheap deals will be massive in the next couple years. Hopefully Schaefer can continue that.
With the salary cap it’s foolish to trade your 1st rounders with the top heavy salaries. You need the cheap ELCers to fill out your roster as well as have a impact.
Hold my beer – Joe Sakic
I’m pretty sure they cut off his bar tab when he signed Nichushkin to 8yrs x$6.125m
And overpaid in assets to acquire Georgiev and then signed him to a contract he hasn’t earned and then re-signed a regressing Josh Manson, who wasn’t very good for them, and is on the other side of the cliff with injury history added on to an anchor contract.
I know Sakic moved upstairs for two of those 3 terrible moves but I’m sure he was involved in them all.
They should give Kadri $40M plus over 7 years for the 32 year old based off a one-off career year to make a quartet of bad moves.
Unless of course your kitchen cupboards are full as well as the pantry.
This
First rounders should only be moved for significant value coming back
Lower rounds are so much lower in odds much less of a deal to move, but you still need bodies to keep the system populated
Some of that is situational though. Tampa, for example, could trade their first rounders because they had all their roster spots filled appropriately and had a pipeline of prospects they had faith in. They extended their contending window through moving their firsts. There are other examples.
I do agree that the Holland was smart to hold on to his 1st rounders. He inherited a team with about 4 or 5 players worth keeping of which a couple were very high end as in top 5-10 in the league. The rest were disposable or anchors that had to be bought out or shipped out at a loss.
When people complain about what a bad signing Kassian was – and it was – they should remember that the team didn’t have enough NHL players even with him on the roster and were considered so dysfunctional nobody wanted to sign as a UFA. Losing Kassian to free agency was the right move but it was one that Holland couldn’t really afford since he already had more holes to fill than he knew what to do with.
Anyway, even now the team is not quite set as the fourth line still needs work and the defence needs balancing but they are getting closer. I wouldn’t be surprised if next year’s first goes on offer.
Next year is supposed to be a deep draft right?
Yup. That is a two edged sword. You risk missing out on something good but the demand for that spot will return something more than other years. I would think it is available if the year gives Holland confidence that a certain pick up gets them to the end or closer to the end. The main spots on this roster are pretty much set now other than top six RW with a few prospects pushing.
The year of our 2nd that was used to divest the roster of the LWer.mentioned above. I think the plan is to use the 1st that year at the TD, if the 2nd cannot be recouped…
*Turns and looks at Jesse*
This is the correct analysis of the Kassian deal. I didn’t know such people were out there, lol…
It’s a dangerous argument to make on this board. 😉
I sort of want to agree with you, but Holland has actually never, in his whole career (the first 15 or so years of it spent as GM of a true Cup contender) traded a 1st round pick for a deadline rental.
He’s traded tons of 2nd’s. And he’s traded 1st’s for players under control for a year and a bit. Never for a true rental though. And just think, Bill Zito traded two of them, plus a former first rounder, for a 2nd round exit this year.
Anyway, I do sort of want to agree with you, but I’ve got to give some respect to Ken Holland for his discipline on that. Tough to argue that’s the wrong line in the sand either, even though it seems to be a rite of passage for teams these days.
Trade target
Still think our best 3 D target is Scott Mayfield from the Isles. No idea what they would want, but he would be a perfect 3 RD for us. Allowing us to move Barrie to address top 9 forward.
Barrie May be the guy they want – Lou has expressed his desire to acquire more offence from the backend.
people may think Barrie is worth more, but they are talking about dealing him for picks. So Mayfield would be better and frees up almost $3 million in cap space, allowing us to re-sign all of our RFAs and add a $2.5 million winger to add to the top 9.
Would Kessel or Neidereiter take $2.5 mill?
Mayfield would be great but why would Lou trade him he’s good and cheap
Maybe but he traded for Romanov who is a puck mover if young
He scored 13 points though, and 6 last year. They really only have Dobson in terms of offense from the back end.
Good gravy sometimes I forget just how young our hockey heroes are …..Mr. Schaefer looks like he would fit in on the first season of Stranger Things…..
Maybe in the face, but none of them were 6’3”, 215. He’d stick out like a sore thumb standing next to them.
I know it is a hockey blog, but…. It will be a very interesting day at the Calgary Stampede on the bulls today. If you have a moment tune in for a couple excellent match ups. Edgar Durazo is going to try ride Crank it Up, and Shane Proctor is matched up with Night Shift.
And in this heat, them Bulls gonna be ornery.
What time?
Rodeo starts at 1:30 – the Bulls take center stage around 3:50.
One summer way back when I was still a teen, my buddy decided he would be a bull rider. I went along telling him I was making a documentary titled “Eddie’s Trip to the Hospital”! We were in some tiny little town south of Calgary (I believe Okotoks) one Saturday and of course Eddie drew the meanest looking bull that was there. Two riders before him, the cowboy gets thrown, and then gored in the thigh by the bull. The clowns jump in (heh, maybe Krusty’s father was there) and get the bull out, the ambulance drives on to the field and throws him in the back and drives off. The next rider is up, he comes out of the chute, the bull bucks, the cowboy flies forward as the bulls head flies back and cracks the cowboy right in the face. Smashed. The clowns run out, get the bull away, another ambulance flies in, picks up the cowboy and takes him away. Then it was Eddie’s turn. I look at Eddie, he’s standing above the bull with his feet on the rails, he has the reins in his hand and his legs are shaking so much he could barely stand. He got on that bull and rode it for about 4 seconds. He lived to tell the story in the bar all night that night!
The best part about being out of the country at the beginning of July is not having to attend Stampede events and, in particular, not having to take clients to the rodeo.
Boo,
Day 9 for me, some of those days are a double (rodeo and chucks), everyday at Ranahans- I can’t wait for Sunday!
I met Mohammed Ali at the Stampede, even got to shake his hand.
I paid money to watch Ali fight Dave Semenko.
That’s cool!
Well thank you for telling us that. You are an important man with strong opinions and lives an interesting life.
Wait, so my personal thoughts on Stampede and Stampede week in a thread about Stampede create feelings? Good Grief!
When Cristopher Reeve (Superman) was paralyzed after being thrown from his horse it was mentioned that was the 3rd time it had happened to him. I firmly believe the 3rd strike rule is a law of nature/physics.
Johnny Cash fought his pet Ostrich and was gored in the stomach and all of his guts would fell out, except he was wearing a strong belt. Lesson learned there was don’t own Ostriches? Certainly don’t decide to fight one.
Oh, if you are every near an elephant don’t treat them like your family pet, those suckers are mean. They can coil their trunk and hit you with a single shot and drop you dead instantly.
Well the Bulls won today with 7 cowboys bucked off and only three lasted 8 second. Edgar was B.O., but Proctor scored an 83 for second place and will advance to Sunday’s finals.
How did Russell make out?
“The numbers don’t rhyme, so moves will be made. A scoring right-winger is likely to be the focus, with JP, Warren Foegele the probable trade pieces.”
Who is the Connor Brown equivelant? Sounds like our inability to move JP affected our efforts to land Brown
Connor Brown could still be traded for Jesse Puljujarvi. Washington may be just waiting for Puljujarvi to sign a contract at a number theylike.
Ottawa got their 2nd round pick for Brown that they wanted.
I’m curious. Something doesn’t add up for me.
I mean the Oilers have the 2023 2nd Round pick available to trade. So what was the hold up?
If Godot’s scenario is correct I would guess that it was the lack of a contract for Jesse. Ottawa wanted to know what it would take.
If this is a three way, Washington could be waiting for
1) Jesse sign his QO
2) Jesse to opt for arbitration
3) Jesse to sign a contract, or settle the arbitration
4) Washington wanted Brown and not Puljujarvi, and this is just my imagination getting the best of me.
It could also be a bigger deal.
Brown and Jenson for Puljujarvi, Barrie, and Samorukov.
Or something like that.
If Washington was worried about a contract in dealing for him, surely Holland would have allowed them to talk to see if the numbers worked.
Ottawa wanted a pick. The Oilers wanted a player back, Brown.
Ottawa now got what it wanted. What we don’t know is if Washington wants Puljujarvi, and this is really just a time-delayed three way deal.
Can Holland perhaps find a wider trade for Pujo that includes more asssets moving? Pujo and Barrie and a prospect maybe for a winger and a dmen back. CAR with all those RHD and Necas, I just wonder…
I think it may be the next logical step.
Ken Holland doesn’t strike me as the type to be influenced by public opinion, but I think General Mangers sometimes do things like this to obscure the return for certain players.
JP and Barrie for a pick and a player, Sounds so much better than
Barrie for a player AND
JP for 2nd
That idea makes a lot of sense, but Carolina looks like a tough fit.
The Oilers basically need to lose some salary in the transaction (a little if they’re trading Foegele, a lot of they’re keeping him).
Neclas will earn as much (or more than) Puljujarvi on his next contract, so the D would need to be cheaper than Barrie. That’s basically Coghlan or Bear.
I’m not sure if either of them makes sense (I’d do Neclas/Bear for Puljujarvi/Barrie but I’d say it’s a significant question whether Bear wants to return to the Oilers).
Carolina doesn’t look like they’re in a position to be taking on salary either.
And I think the Oilers already made their call on Bear. I doubt there is appetite for a return on either side. Bear doesn’t see himself as a 3RD and the Oilers definitely don’t see him playing higher than Ceci or Bouchard.
Yup, I don’t expect Bear will be returning.
That trade template could work, I just don’t think Carolina would be a fit for it.
They also have little need for a PP quarterback now that they’ve added Burns.
Everyone talks about Mayfield for Barrie, but I wonder if a bigger deal with the Islanders could make sense.
Barrie + Puljujarvi
for
Mayfield + Wahlstrom or Bellows
Not sure the Islanders have the cap space for that one, since they’d be taking on something like $4.5M in that deal, and have Dobson and Romanov to sign (they have about $11M to spare). Clutterbuck might not be a bad addition to the bottom 6 either.
Is Clusterbuck still playing? Damn.
It’s seems like at least 10 years ago when Hall fought him.
Clutterbuck has long been coveted by commenters here. He’s old but I’d have a lot of time for him given his likely role. Do the Isles have any intention of trading Mayfield? I thought their plan was to keep him?
NYI just gave Clutterbuck a 2 year $1.7M deal, and he’s an assistant captain. So I don’t expect they want to move him, but perhaps they’re willing to if they need the cap. Seems like he’d be a useful add-in both for the cap and on ice reasons.
And I have zero clue the teams plans for Mayfield. I read a couple of things on some NY fan blogs though and was surprised to see they don’t value him particularly. Maybe the team sees it similarly and are wouldn’t mind parting with him. I’m definitely more hopeful about it after reading more though.
That’s right. I remember seeing the A from looking him up before now that you mention it.
On Mayfield, I have this vague memory of an article stating the interest in an offenseive defenceman but that the Isles wanted to keep the Big Four.
I’ll see if I can find it but I have no idea where I saw it so not sure if I actually can.
Nope can’t find it. Sadly, I was also reminded by DDG that the Isles had already addressed their blue line needs when they traded the 1st for Romanov…
Romanov doesn’t address offense from the D though. Apparently Lou does want more of it (as OP keeps reminding us). Romanov’s NHL career says 133 4-15-19, so he’s not that guy.
Mayfield. There seems to be a pretty wide range of opinions on him. And even beyond his actual value, he’s sort of redundant on the Islanders (as 3RD behind Pulock and Dobson). In a sense like Barrie is with the Oilers.
The other thing is he’s UFA in a year. So I guess there’s either serious talks going on about an extension, or he’s a guy whose trade return could help the team long after he’s gone.
Lou has already made his one trade this year. And it was a biggie. I think given the opportunity to get such a high quality young defenceman, he decided to go that route. Now it is pretty much cap-in and cap-out for the Isles.
That’s why I included Clutterbuck 🙂
But yes, you’re probably right.
I could be wrong though. Just found this…
Nassaumen Hockey Podcast
Lamoriello likely not done after trading for Romanov. Per @KKurzNHL: “Lamoriello said Wednesday that in a perfect world he would acquire both an offensive defenseman and a more defensive-oriented defenseman, so it’s likely he’s not done trying to improve that group.” #isles
6:19 PM · Jul 7, 2022
OK, so there’s still a little bit of hope 🙂
I know I’ve mentioned Brian Lawton a lot but we are at the point where I’m wondering what the delay is – not necessarily for being hired by the Oil but being hired by a franchise.
Aside from him being connected to the Oilers (and stating he had indeed had discussions with the team), he did expressly state that he wouldn’t be returning to the NHL Network – his passion is in team management and that’s where he’ll be going forward.
Given where we are in the odd-season, I wonder what’s taking so long? Was he a candidate for the Sharks GM job and is now pivoting with Grier getting the gig?
What role does he take? If they brought him in, would it be to report directly to Ken? Is his ambition to become a GM again some day, like he was with Tampa 2008-2010? Would Edmonton be the place for him to pursue that track with Brad Holland and Keith Gretzky possibly in the succession plan? Maybe Brad being named AGM changed Lawton’s perspective.
If Lawton was even being considered the Brad Holland promotion was their decision.
There is no limit to the number of smart people a team cab have in management.
Is that right?
There is a limit to how much authority there is to hand out. I doubt Lawton has any interest in a job where he is not a decision maker.
What title do you think Lawton would be happy with?
To many Chefs in the kitchen usually doesn’t end well.
On this slow news day, we need a serious discussion on numbers. Player’s uniform numbers, it is right of passage in the NHL, once you arrive, is to leave your training camp number behind for another prospect and select a real NHL pro hockey player number. We have some work to do this off season.I propose;
Benson have the number 16 returned to him
McLeod rock number 20
Yamamoto slide in to 19
Holloway build his career in number 21
Bouchard should still give Keith a watch and wear 2
Broberg was drafted #8 and that is his number
Skinner is a 30 if I ever saw one
Campbell says he likes 36. When forced to pick an alternative, said it really didn’t matter to him. When pressed hard on it , through out the number 39.
36 That most famous of ex-Oilers….Ralph Intranuovo
No love for Dennis Bonvie?
#36 may have been worn & abandoned by more Oilers than any other #. All of Todd Marchant, Shawn Horcoff, Jarret Stoll, the immortal Marc-Antoine Pouliot & Drake Caggiula started with that number & switched out to 26, 10, 16, 78 & 91 respectively. I anticipate Dylan Holloway will join that club given the Campbell situation. Holloway has zero history with it outside of his 3:27 of action in the final game of the playoffs.
Best #36 who both wore & kept the number was Norm Maciver from 1990-92. Smart puck mover who formed a highly effective partnership with the newly-acquired Dave Manson in 1991-92. Maciver scored 40 points with a team-high +20 in 57 games, & was somehow lost to Ottawa in the waiver draft that fall. Major fail by Sather for a team that was about to fall off the cliff. I recall being disconsolate that he was left unprotected, made no sense.
30 years later both partners hold jobs in the NHL, as Maciver is an AGM in Chicago while Manson of course is an assistant coach here.
Well done.
Forget Al.
When’s you’re book coming out! 🙂
I never understood the decision to leave Maciver unprotected. There were some truly awful decisions made by Sather towards the end of his tenure in Edmonton.
I suspect Skinner actually prefers #74. He wore it in junior with both Lethbridge and Swift Current, and reclaimed that number after Bear got dealt.
Skinner wore 74 in junior. He was given 50 as a “training camp number” by Oilers & wore it for a few camps & his first NHL game but requested & got 74 after Ethan Bear was traded. Don’t see him changing it.
I still don’t understand the BS with #16 last season, that was VERY poorly handled. Now Brassard is long gone & Benson is still on the radar.
EDIT: oops, didn’t read all the replies, so am merely echoing what Tarkus said re Skinner.
Thanks Bruce. Excellent history lesson!
Now with the excitement of the draft/free agency over and entering the doldrums of summer I have to say that if the NHL doesn’t offer some sort of refereeing revamp I’m going to be hard pressed to invest much time and energy into the league in the Fall.
Every year I tell myself the reffing can’t get any worse and yet it still does.
To me it’s just a hair above WWE reffing and I half expect to see Coaches hitting players with chairs or tables soon.
All I am looking for is some sort of baseline or consistency at least, probably too much to ask. But when one fairly innocent looking play ends up with a 3 game suspension followed by an identical play a few minutes in the same game ending up with a blank stare from the ref, it just plain sucks the enjoyment out of it for me.
I feel your pain.
I think the NHL has made a reasonable effort to revamp the the officiating already, what with the introduction of technology, the video reviews, the coach’s challenge, and changing the way the game is called in general.
I believe there is more to come as a result of the demands of the gambling world.
I think it ranks right up there as one of, if not “the” hardest sport to officiate.
I yell at them all the time; But I also respect them.
I think it is fair to say, the league is more responsible for the deficiencies in officiating than the actual employees who hold those positions.
My issue is with the Refs “Managing the game” and make up calls.
If a penalty is a penalty, from the 1st minute of the first game of the season to the last minute of the Stanley Cup final game there would be more consistency and the players would adjust to it.
Very reasonable point you make Dee Dee.
One thing that stands out to me with the 50 man list is there are no anchors of a contract there. When is the last time the Oilers could say that?
Here’s hoping JP doesn’t become one.
Here’s hoping JP’s Agent does the right thing for this young man.
Sign for two years or sign a tradable contract.
Every team who out there that’s at all interested in JP wants cost certainty.
I really hope the Agent gets it right.
Arbitration ($3m+) could be a career limiting move for this young man.
I’d prefer one year to a two year deal.
A two year deal walks him right to UFA without buying any UFA years – if it’s 2-years, it should be a discounted AAV.
Agreed.
But at this point the young man’s career sort of hangs in the balance; UFA status seems so small as to be almost irrelevant.
Sekera, Neal, Klefbom, Smith, & Lucic are all anchors of one variety or another. None of them will be on the ice but they are a drag on the team in some manner.
Yes, yes, yes, yes, and yes
Little unfair to lump Klefbom and Smith in the same category as the other 3. That they are unable to play is not management’s fault and it can be largely mitigated with LTIR, though that limits trade deadline flexibility quite a bit.
Lucic and Neal are effectively a result of the same problem, both a consequence of the Lucic signing. Sekera didn’t have to be bought out, but his decline was due to significant injuries. And moving him out cleared the way for others to develop.
The Sekera signing is though of as a mistake but that player was full value for his cap hit until a single play altered his career forever. He was arguably the team’s top d-man that season.
One can argue if the buyout was necessary but the injury, and then subsequent injury, changed him from a lower end #1 full value for $5M to a 6/7D and an anchor contract.
…& none of the 3 is on the 50-man list.
I wasn’t assigning blame on any of them – just stating that it isn’t quite true that there are no anchors affecting the cap situation. I think everybody here knows the history with each of these players.
My thought was roster players that were paid above there actual value. Koskinen, Kassian etc. I don’t disagree with the drag that bought out players can be but every team has those.
Fair enough but we don’t have a player that is paid above their value because they were bought out or traded with value to get rid of the contract. Holland has done a reasonable job of that for sure but the annual payments to accomplish that have not all been made quite yet is all I’m saying.
There is little doubt Bourgault will make noise in the exhibition season – higher end skilled prospects almost always do and he even did last season. What it will mean as far as NHL readiness, we don’t know but we can presume Holland has him ear-marked for Bakersfield subject to moving out Jesse (or Yamo) with no material back-fill and essentially creating the spot
What it will mean as far as NHL readiness, we don’t know
I know but I’m not telling
“What it will mean as far as NHL readiness, we don’t know”
Technically we can’t “know”…..but we do know. Bourgault is not NHL ready..the young man is smart enough to know this himself; He speaks of the adjustments he needs to make when playing in the AHL.
The movement of JP is not going to change that; Bourgault will not be playing top six minutes in the NHL any time soon.
I also highly doubt he jumps the queue and ends up in front of Dylan Holloway in terms of being an NHL regular.
Jason Gregor made the point yesterday, “There’s no way (as a contender) that we’ll have 3 rookies in the lineup going into the playoffs”
Broberg, Holloway
Holloway and Bourgault are not competing for the same job.
You’ve missed the point. But hey, go ahead and “blue sky” this if it makes you feel better.
I sometimes I do so myself; Precisely because it does make me feel better.
I didn’t miss the point. I agree that Bourgault Will highly likely start the year in the AHL (and possibly finish it there as well).
I simply don’t think the additional point re: Holloway is relevant.
Don’t be obtuse; you read complex legal documents for a living,
Holloway was the point.
We won’t (shouldn’t?) be entering the playoffs with 3 rookies on the roster.
Holloway, Broberg. and Bourgault
You should probably go back and read what my thoughts on Bourgault on the roster are before you name call.
Rookies come in different packages. Only Bourgault could be thought of as ‘rushed’ should he make the team at some point. The other two are on a pretty standard time line for their position, draft spot etc. and where they most likely will slot in the lineup.
The league is getting younger and the kids are arriving sooner.
Luckily Gregor isn’t making that decision.
I think it is a distinct possibility that Bourgault arrives after Christmas some time unless Holland finds somebody to block his way. That could be Hyman shifting over but I doubt that is a first choice. To me that 2RW sticks out as unclaimed territory with the current personnel.
Kane – McDavid – Yamamoto
Hyman – Draisaitl – ???
Holloway – Nuge – Puljujarvi
Foegele – McLeod – Ryan
Woodcroft could shift Hyman to 2RW and move McLeod to 2LW but it doesn’t sing quite right. There is one more scoring winger spot open on this team waiting to be claimed by either Bourgault or a rejuvenated Puljujarvi or a trade.
There are other combinations possible, of course, but they are within spitting distance of 3 scoring lines and I will be very unhappy if they move Nuge into the 2LW spot. Mentoring young wingers from the 3rd line with PP & PK time is his sweet spot on this team.
Holloway, Broberg and Bourgault is not a combination that Cup contenders utilize.
Especially Ken Holland,
Especially Bouchard, Broberg, Holloway, Bourgault.
But let’s circle back to this at the All-Star break and see where things are at.
Yeah, the all-star break will bring more clarity. Off season everything looks rosy or horrible depending on the team. Then the season starts and reality starts to reveal itself. The kids will write their own story with Holland and Woodcroft watching and adjusting as they unfold.
No reason to impose artificial limits on # of rookies in the playoffs. If they are the best choice available, it shou;dn’t be off the table.
As an extreme example, Oilers entered the 1981 playoffs with all of Jari Kurri, Glenn Anderson, Paul Coffey & Andy Moog listed as rookies. Charlie Huddy too, though he was the 7th D & didn’t get in.
Seems unlikikey that the current group of 3 skaters is all headed to the Hall the way Kurri, Anderson & Coffey were; on the other hand we don’t know where they’ll be on their development curve by next April so maybe blanket statements aren’t the way to go. Similarly, we didn’t know what lay in the future in July of 1980 either.
Agreed about the rarity. You’d have to go back 30 years to one of the best teams in NHL history in one of their best draft years.
I don’t see Kurri, Anderson, Coffee and Moog when I look at
Bourgault, Holloway, Broberg, and Skinner.
Some blankets can be comfortable.:)
Care to make a gentlemen’s bet?
Will all of Broberg, Holloway and Bourgault be on the roster on day 1 of the playoffs.
I’ll give you odds. 🙂
Nobody needs to “take a bet” as none thinks this is going to be the case – it’s just some aren’t discounting the possibility based on an artificial max number of rookies.
I don’t think Bourgault breaks camp with the team but it’s not because of a max number of kids on the roster.
I agree with Bruce, there’s no need to be ruling things out as unpossible before the season starts.
You also don’t have to go back 30 years to see that sort of thing happening (the HHOF part aside).
Colorado had 3 rookies in the lineup at times last season, and 2 were regulars (Newhook mostly) in the playoffs.
Pittsburgh in 2017 had Guentzel and Wilson as regular season and playoff regulars, plus multiple others in bit roles (Josh Archibald among them).
In 2016 Pittsburgh had 11 rookies play at least one regular season game for them, with 3 (Sheary, Rust, Kuhnhackl) being regulars in the playoffs, and Sundqvist also getting a couple of games.
2015 Chicago had 3 rookies play playoff games (only 1 a regular though).
LA had 2 playoff regular rookies in 2014.
LA had 3 rookies as regulars when they won in 2012 (King, Vyonov, Nolan) plus Loktionov as an extra with a few games.
That’s the last 11 cup winners, and 2 of them had 3 rookies as regulars in the playoffs when they won.
The other things is all of Broberg, Holloway, Bourgault playing in the regular season doesn’t mean they’ll be all in the lineup once deadline adds are made.
Keep an open mind Randle! 🙂
It’s 40 years not 30;
it’s the Oilers therefore what I know, other teams have also had multiple rookies in the playoffs e.g. the 2017 Leafs who had 6 rookies (Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Brown, Kapanen & Hyman) among their 12 forwards in the playoffs
I said it’s an extreme example just to make the point that there shouldn’t be arttificial limnits;
& no thanks, I am not a betting man.
I’d put the likelihood of Oilers riding all 3 in the playoffs next year as somewhere along this handy spectrum: 0% < n < 100%. Likely towards the left end but non-zero.
Murphy, Gelinas, Graves – not that I think Bourgault breaks camp with the team.
. Also, those who suggest Philip Broberg doesn’t have much offense might consider Oscar Klefbom’s number in his draft year.
Yup, looking at boxcars for teenage d-men in the SHL rarely has value – Klef is one of many that prove that.
Looking at the boxcars will have Broberg well ahead of Klef at this stage but one must use the context of material PP time for Broberg which is where the majority of his production came from. Klef had the likes of Brad Hunt and others eating PP time ahead of him and he got nominal minute if that.
With that said, Broberg’s overall production as a 20 year old dman in the AHL is in very good light – it’s real and it’s substantial.
Defensemen get most of their points on the power play. It’s universal, with Darnell Nurse the one outlier I can recall.
Making him worth every penny of his new contract. (he says hopefully)
Scoring 5 on 5 has a lot of value.
Another step forward in the defensive side of his game and he’s a gem.
Let’s go, Darnell!
Darnell Nurse scored 26 even strength points last season…44th among NHL defensemen.
Harpers Hair was everything but a fully paid up Canucks/Flames supporter last season.
But, by the time the semis rolled around Harpers Hair got lucky when he jumped on the Avs bandwagon lol
Nurse played 71 games last year, 102nd among NHL defencemen.
Over the past 5 seasons his 140 points rank 8th in the category. He is a proven high-end point producer at even strength.
And this he knows but, of course, he is who he is.
On that note, congrats to Brad Hunt on his 2 year deal with the champs.
Guy just keeps plugging. Way to fight for the dream.
No wonder Gagner scored 8 goals in a game… and now wonder JP is on the trade block…
If Schaefer can effectively duplicate Eberle’s career I’ll be happy… 20-40-60 in 82 would be a win.
It was 8 points, not 8 goals. IIRC it was 4G 4A vs Chicago…
Mile High Hockey
Late-night Kadri news: he’s waiting on three teams to clear out cap space for him. The three teams in question are:
New York Islanders
Winnipeg Jets
Colorado Avalanche
Not even considering the Flames, music!
I would love for the flames to sign him to an $8M X 7 contract based on his outlier offensive season and at 32 years of age.
Given the the three bad transactions the Avs have made, maybe they’ve got a fourth in them.
I would think the Flames won’t be making any significant moves until the Tkachuk situation is resolved.
I wonder, if they can’t extend him, that they trade him to STL for a package including Tarasenko.
Jets a proxy to drive up the price? Seems like an odd fit for whats been described as a ‘broken’ dressing room.
Quite likely.
As I mentioned yesterday, the signing of Brad Hunt for 2 years might lead to Colorado trading Sam Girard to clear cap space for Kadri.
Various reports have said Kadri’s first choice would be a return to the Avalanche.
Yeah that’s the standard Lowe+MacT squeeze play UFA and their agents regularly employed, back when Oilers were wandering the earth like homeless vagabonds.
Only one of these teams was in on Giroux and missed.
COM’ON LOU!
Eric Francis
Flames still talking to Kadri, but not for the big dollars he’s chasing. If price tag comes down Flames are in the mix.
That said, if price comes down he’d likely return to Colorado
Kadri will go to Calgary as a Horcoff level saviour…
Setting the Calgarians back as a franchise until they finally start tanking like every recently successful NHL team I can think of(Cup winner)
Take Colorado. Where do they get MacKinnon/Makar by finishing out of the top ten in 1st round drafting?
An Eric Francis quote? Have we really sunk that low for content this early in the summer? 😉
@Peter_Baugh
According to a league source, multiple teams are trying to clear space in attempt to sign Nazem Kadri, and the center wants to be on a contender. He’s ruled out teams not viewed as such.
With all the moving pieces w/ teams’ cap situations, this might take some time to unfold.
So many words to say pretty much nothing everybody didn’t already know.
Champs and 2 non playoff teams. Avs will have all the time they need to try to find a deal that’s a net positive for landing Kadri.
Great job by Holland to get Schaefer signed before the turn of the calendar. This means his ELC could be subject to slide twice. It will this season with him back in Junior and it could the following season when he’s in the AHL (if he doesn’t play 10 NHL games).
If only LT had mentioned this in his piece 😉
Apologies, I posted this after reading the initial paragraph on the player and prior to it being set out in the 2nd.
I’ve been travelling for 29 hours so far, give me a kit-kat break.
More managerial acuity!
Remember when they forgot to sign Petrov?
Attention to detail, it’s a thing.
Again, I’m giving all the credit to Brad.
Holland & Son rule.
I think you mean Blumel and, no, I have never believed that they forgot to sign him and the situation was more complex then that.
Note, no NHL team signed him for a long time after he became a UFA.
So you’re saying you won the argument?
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jig jig..jig jig