Rookies will make mistakes and sometimes those mistakes cost you games. Last night, Dylan Holloway (turnover in the neutral zone led directly to a GA), Stuart Skinner (Ryan Graves goal can’t go in) and Markus Niemelainen (allowing free passage to the net the late in the game is verboten) all made errors that cost the game. A lost game like this one hurts, but the alternative, playing veterans with less upside, is worse. Suffer the pains of youth in the fall and winter, those kids will pay you back in the spring. The New Jersey Devils are fast, that’s a good team and losing to good teams is going to happen. There’s another tough one on the way Saturday. Will the gales of November come early?
THE ATHLETIC!
- New Lowetide: Oilers rookie Stuart Skinner is chasing history
- DNB: Ryan Smyth on Oilers memories, keepsakes and the current team: Q&A
- Lowetide: Edmonton Oilers start October slow but finish month strong
- Lowetide: Oilers prospect Tyler Tullio adjusting quickly to AHL
- DNB: Oilers’ Skinner, an Edmonton native, closes door on Flames
- DNB: The Oilers have a third line that’s settling in
- Lowetide: Early season trade unlikely for the Oilers
- Lowetide: How the Oilers are working to solve second-pairing issues
- Lowetide: Are the Oilers finding chemistry with their skill lines?
- Lowetide: 5 Oilers prospects delivering exceptional early performances
- DNB: 5 takeaways from the Oilers’ first 5 games
- Lowetide: Oilers’ defence depth impacted by Philip Broberg’s early woes
- DNB: Warren Foegele Q&A
- Lowetide: Did the Oilers find the right fit for winger Zach Hyman?
- DNB: Another Oilers loss isn’t ideal, but it shows why they have little to be worried about
- DNB: How the Oilers can manage Connor McDavid and star players’ workloads
- Lowetide: 6 Edmonton Oilers positives from an uneven start
- Lowetide: Why Oilers’ Evan Bouchard will be a key to 2022-23 season
- New DNB: 11 bold predictions for 2022-23 season
- Jonathan Willis: Jakob Chychrun would look good on the Oilers, but is there a deal to be had?
- Lowetide: Edmonton Oilers reasonable expectations for every player in 2022-23
- Lowetide: Oilers top-20 prospects, summer 2022
WHAT TO EXPECT IN NOVEMBER
- At home to: NAS, NJD, DAL (Expected 2-1-0 ) (Actual 1-1-0)
- On the road to: WAS, TBY, CAR, FLA (Expected 1-2-1) (Actual 0-0-0)
- At home to: LAK, VEG (Expected 1-0-1) (Actual 0-0-0)
- On the road to: NJD, NYI, NYR (Expected (1-1-1) (Actual 0-0-0)
- At home to: FLA (Expected 1-0-0) (Actual 0-0-0)
- On the road to: CHI (Expected (1-0-0) (Actual 0-0-0)
- November expected result: 7-4-3, 17 points in 14 games
- Actual November results: 1-1-0, 2 points in 2 games
- October results: 6-3-0, 12 points in 9 games
- Oilers in 2022-23: 7-4-0, 14 points in 11 games
The Oilers remain in second place Pacific, by points and by winning percentage. This was an opportunity lost to peel away from the pack, something the Vegas Golden Knights are doing in real time. It’s over, move on. Those kinds of games do linger, don’t they?
SUMMARY
- Stuart Skinner stopped 40 of 44 and went 10 out of 10 in HDSC saves. I think three of the GA were tough enough (Wood goals, Bratt goal) to say they aren’t on the goalie, but the Ryan Graves tying goal should have been stopped. That’s my opinion, you may disagree. I’m still sold on Skinner, and he had a fine evening to my eye.
- Darnell Nurse had an assist, four blocked shots, 2GV and 1TK, finished 1-0 goals at five-on-five and at 50 percent expected goals. His handling of an early two-on-one was desparate and effective. Fast and furious on the night, I thought he had a fine game.
- Cody Ceci was 1-0 goals five-on-five with a 52 percent expected goal percentage. He had a HDSC, two hits, a giveaway and three blocked shots.
- Brett Kulak had one shot and a takeaway, plus he took a penalty. Three blocked shots, 46 percent five-on-five expect goals percentage. Solid game, he’s playing consistently well now.
- Evan Bouchard made a nice play in the second period, flushing the puck from the scoring zone on a dangerous play. Finished 0-2 goals five-on-five with a 47 percent expected goal share. Two shots, two hits, GV and TK. He had a glorious chance on a two-on-one but couldn’t fine the twine.
- Markus Niemelainen had one shot, six hits, three GV and two blocked shots. He made a few mistakes in the game, none bigger than the winner. The mistake (gap) on the GWG hurts, but that’s how people learn. Mistakes.
- Tyson Barrie had two shots, two assists, took a penalty and had a giveaway. He was also helpless on the winner, that gap between the two defensemen was the Grand Canyon.
- Ryan Nugent-Hopkins made several astute plays, he always shines in these high-skill competitions. Two shots, one HDSC, two takeaways and a blocked shot. Looks like he screened the goalie on the second Wood goal.
- Connor McDavid went 1-1-2, four shots, two giveaways. The game felt like it was inevitably going to land with the Oilers, but that extra goal never came despite 97’s true brilliance.
- Zach Hyman had seven more HDSC, he must lead the league. One assist, seven shots, three TK, he’s such a productive player every night.
- Evander Kane had four shots, four hits, 1GV and didn’t post a point on the night. I thought he was productive and a threat to produce offense several times, he was credited with two HDSC.
- Leon Draisaitl scored a goal, four shots, had a giveaway. Two HDSC. His power game along the wall controlling the puck was an effective tool for Edmonton on the night.
- Kailer Yamamoto had a brilliant early chance but no cigar. Three shots, one HDSC, 2-1 GV-TK.
- Warren Foegele had one shot, two HDSC, a TK and a hit. I thought he played well, might have played more.
- Ryan McLeod had a shot, 2GV and 3TK. Turned over the puck at the NJD blue line that began the sequence that ended up in the Graves goal.
- Jesse Puljujarvi had one shot, and a takeaway. He got caught on a pick just before the Graves goal. Made some nice subtle plays to get the puck out of danger but was quiet offensively.
- Devin Shore played well, he had a shot, a HDSC and a takeaway.
- Dylan Holloway made an error on the first goal, but had several good sequences including an assist on the Ryan goal. Three hits, GV-TK, played less than five minutes. As I wrote this week in The Athletic, they need to move him to the 3line.
- Derek Ryan scored again, he’s having a productive start to the season. GV and TK.
DYLAN HOLLOWAY
The Oilers third line isn’t getting the HDSC’s needed (8.0 per 60 at five-on-five), that’s a little lower than the Draisaitl (12.4) and McDavid (16.63). The Dylan Holloway line is producing 10.01 through five games, and I believe Holloway is the key. If Jay Woodcroft tries him on the No. 3 line, I believe the results will spike for the trio.
Summarizing!
Petrov would add another goal in a 5-1 win. He now has 7 on the season.
Chiasson got off the schneid with a PP goal, his 6th tally.
Lachance, Münzenberger, Määttä, Brind’Amour, Mazura, and Schaefer were held pointless. Wanner was a scratch for MJ.
Ryan Fanti has played three games thus far for the Fort Wayne Komets. He’s 1-1-1, has allowed 11 goals in his 191 mins, sporting an .867 save percentage.
I’d be willing to assume this is more evidence that ‘tendies need time to adjust to their new teams’ tendencies.
I think he gave up 7 in his first game…..
3GA on 33 shots to pick up the W in his most recent outing.
https://lscluster.hockeytech.com/game_reports/official-game-report.php?client_code=echl&game_id=19818
Kesselring with another 6 sog, led the team
30 saves for Rodrigue in the 3-1 win.
Great night for him and Lavoie (although Ralph faded a bit as the night went on – fair enough, he’s probably still getting up to speed).
Condors kill off a 4 minute penalty including 2 full minutes of 5 on 3.
Malone, Esposito, Deharnais and Demers massive.
& Rodrigue !
Yes, thank you Bruce – Oli had a great game (and was great on that PK – a couple one timer saves that he ate up with no rebound) – 30 saves.
Good for the kid!
Nice goal from Kostin – the steal at the line (think Yamamoto on Towes), takes the puck to the net and slips it 5-hole.
Seattle finally break their goose egg. Gustavsson with a one-timer on the 5 on 3 powerplay. Schaeffer had a touch in the lead up but was not credited with an assist. On the ensuing 5 on 4, he unleashed a one-timer of his own, butt he puck was bouncing and the defender in the way took it off his helmet, nearly decapitated.
Other than that the TBirds have sucked and are losing 4-1 with a period to play.
Portland has a cheer squad. Oh my.
Beautiful backdoor pass by Janmark to Philp for basically an empty-net goal – his 2nd pro goal (and 2nd in two games).
Kemp with a great play to come off the bench, keep the puck in with speed and get it to Janmark.
Is Tullio in the lineup tonight?
How does Seaweed look?
Tullio is in.
ridiculous that he was a HS, ridiculous
Tulio is playing tonight – haven’t noticed much so far.
Deharnais is doing his thing – looks somewhat rusty though.
Kesselring is all over the ice trying to impact at both ends.
Lavoie set up by Deharnais in the slot but he misses his shot wide of all thing.
Lavoie, 20 seconds later, takes a long outlet from Griffith well in to the offensive zone on the boards – down low, he takes the puck, cuts hard towards the net on a 1 on 1 – inside/outside and a beauty finish.
His best pro goal to my eye.
He’s looked great with the puck on his stick – I’m a bit in shock!
Great to hear!
Great goal by Lavoie.
Henderson takes a 1-0 lead on a PP goal. I have Alex Peters as the guy that had no interest in trying to close off the cross-ice lane – goal close to a McDavid to Drai PP goal (high to low – cross ice).
Bourgault continues to touch the puck in good places, almost every shift.
I’m pleasantly surprised with how Lavoie has looked (last game and early in this game) going back from behind out so long, major surgery, starting to late, etc. He’s looked good with the puck on his stick and powerful in his skating (like “more powerful” then last season) – just took the puck hard to the net from the goal line.
I don’t understand how Greg McKegg has played so many NHL games. He’s “meh” at the AHL level to my eye. Based on on-ice play, I have him in healthy scratch territory.
I missed the game but looks like the Oilers played well and so did the Devils.
The team rarely blows third period leads. They are also good at coming back. I’ll give them a pass.
Hoping this game is the springboard for Campbell to grab the #1 spot for the season.
No Broberg tonight (again) – sigh.
Just listened to Stauff a bit from earlier, he did say he’s likely back in about a week.
Holloway turned the puck over in the neutral zone. It is a mistake and played it’s part in the goal against but the turnover didn’t lead to a breakaway. If McDavid made the same play we wouldn’t be hanging the entire goal on him.
Yes Holloway turned it over which contributed to the goal against, but it wasn’t an awful play that single-handedly gifted the other team a HDSC. Too much is being made of it in my mind.
I disagree
Any turnover that results in an odd man rush and an overload/scramble in our zone is precisely the root cause of the goal
This turnover was particularly poor given he wasn’t really being pressured and simply needed to dump it. And there wasn’t much cover behind him. It was a bad play but a great learning opportunity.
The unforced errors are usually killers. The rest of the players on the ice just aren’t anticipating the un forced error.
They can see and sense pressure and adjust accordingly.
I’m betting teams track unforced errors just like they do in tennis
I think that’s an overly-protective post.
It was a bad turnover that directly led to a fast break odd-man rush against and a goal.
Was it overly-egregious? No, to really, but lets call it what it was.
Other players have made that type of mistake and, yes, we assign culpability each and every time and, if McDavid did that, we would assign him culpable (although I can’t recall McDavid turning the puck over quite like that in that spot – maybe because he’s good).
Petrov opens the scoring:
https://mobile.twitter.com/OHLBattalion/status/1588675390243237888?cxt=HHwWgMDTrbX2jYwsAAAA
Rookie, rookie
Walkin’ down the street
Rookie, rookie
The kind I’d like to beat
Rookie, rookie
Won’t you pardon me
Rookie, rookie
I couldn’t help but see
Rookie, rookie
That you swat bravely as can be
Are you lunging after me?
Lemme see. Crank out another verse, or out the door for the Friday night beer run? Hmm. This sprung chicken is hitting the road, Jack.
Nurse named the 11th top shut down defender in the league by DFO:
move-over-rod-langway-canes-jaccob-slavin-is-nhls-no-1-shutdown-defenseman
Its boggling when I read/hear that Nurse is terrible defensively. Sure, he can leave position to puck chase and make the odd bad decision but he is absolutely elite at defending the rush (and similar at defending zone entry) and is a beast on the defensive boards below the hash.
He’s full value for that list.
Combine that with top end transition by skate (not by pass) and top 10 even strength point producer and doing so against top comp with some of the toughest minutes in the league – what a player
Lots of talk about Nurse and what his value is. Nice to see a little bit of recognition like this.
Just to add (again) a bit on the most tangible ways we can evaluate Nurse and his value.
This season:
-scored 11 2-5-7 (52 point pace) (and 18th among D)
-has 5 even strength points (15th among D)
-played 23:28 per game (23rd among D)
-is +7 (14th among D)
-also has a positive SF% and GF% relative to team (xGF% is basically even)
Over the past 3 seasons (this one included):
-scored 138 27-51-78 (46 point pace) (and 23rd among D)
-has 60 even strength points (13th among D)
-played 25:09 per game (8th among D)
-is +52 (7th among D)
-and also has a positive SF%, GF% and xGF% relative to team (all in the top 1/4 of the league)
I know numbers aren’t going to sway the nay sayers at this point, but this really is a pretty impressive set of numbers.
Ethan Bear +2 in 19 minutes of EV ice in an 8-5 Canucks victory.
~55% Fenwick. Played 8:40 against Zegras, second only to OEL, who played 9 minutes against him. All situations ice-time, Bear was only 2 seconds behind Hughes. I’ve seen this movie before, it’s called “Return of the Jedi.”
Boudreau and good Tippett agree: this man can play the toughs at a high level.
Meanwhile Niemo is servicing the Canadarm on the GWG against the Devils while Tyson Barrie is Matthew McConaughey in Interstellar, i.e. in another dimension.
Godspeed, Bearsy!
Strong convictions based on micro sample sizes (and a bottom feeding team at that). Carolina must be an awful judge of ability.
Would Bear still be sitting in the press box in Carolina if first Dermot and then Poolman hadn’t got injured and put on LTIR?
Maybe for Bear this is his second career “opportunity knocking” moment like when Tippett put him on the first pair in 2019 due to injuries in camp.
He needs to take advantage cause if he gets relegated again if and when those guys get healthy, he’ll be running out of chances.
Travis Dermott is primarily a left shot LD while Poolman is suffering chronic concussion related symptoms.
The path is clear for Bear to seize this opportunity.
Here is hoping Tulio is back in the lineup tonight – Broberg ask well!
There is absolutely no reason to over-react to a loss – the team was on a 5-game winning streak going in, 4th in the NHL in points percentage, etc. They lost a close game, a highly entertaining skilled game, to a good team and partially due to a couple of softies by a young tender in the 3rd.
No reason to shuffle everything all up but we know a few things:
1) It seems the third line is playing well, generally – individually and in aggregate but, damn, if they can’t piss a drop. The 4th line is even squirting drops here and there.
2) Yamamoto is struggling big time offensively. It looks like a hand injury (per Gregor’s tweet) and its getting to the point where he’s inhibiting the line’s offence – or so it seems.
3) Holloway is making big time mistakes that are leading to goal against. He’s also showing some good things on the 4th line. He very well could be destined for Bakersfield soon and that would 100% be OK. It won’t be for that long and things can and do get learned down there. At the same time, he could move up to that 3rd line to see what happens.
Given all the above, while they very well could go right back to the lineup that had them streaking, something like the following makes sense to me:
Nuge/McDavid/Puljujarvi
Kane/Drai/Hyman
Holloway/McLeod/Foegele
Shore/Ryan/Yamamoto
Holloway cannot learn how to fix his mistakes against NHL competition in the AHL. One can only do that in the NHL. He is an impact player. He has to learn what he can get away with in the NHL. He will be able to get away with everything in the AHL, and thus more AHL time will NOT help him transition.
He is an NHL player. He is a high event rookies who is going to force the play, and things will happen, good and bad. Overtime, the bad will diminish.
Well said
It’s one loss. In a game they could have won.
Niemelinen looked bad on the winner but I thought he was fine otherwise. I would leave him in the lineup until Christmas and then make a decision. If neither he nor Broberg show something by the deadline then Holland will have to go shopping. But you got to give the young guys a run of games first.
The bigger issue is that there are three, 3 million dollar, wingers that have had plenty of time to show their stuff. And it ain’t happening for them.
I was never a big Foegele fan, and I am quickly losing patience with JP and Yamamoto. These guys aren’t rookies anymore and they are being paid to produce like middle six wingers. Right now, all 3 are practically untradeable given their current level of production.
It’s not just that they are not scoring, they are killing offense on their lines.
Yamamoto is definitely the 3rd wheel on his line, he’s been fumbling pucks and getting pushed out of the play all year.
And JP and Foegele are currently a pair of cement hand wingers that are stifling whatever offense McLeod manages to create.
Yes, all 3 are good forecheckers who can create turnovers. But if you never cash, that makes you a 4th liner, who should be making less than a million.
Agreed on the kids. Keep playing them now, see what you have. The alternative is the mistake the Nashville is making with their young players. Every time one of them makes a mistake, Hynes benches them for an AHL plug. It’s no way to nurture kids.
Something will eventually have to give with the wings not producing, but this early in the season, let’s see if someone can’t force their way up. Easier to say when you’re 7-4-0 versus 4-7-0, but the point is the same.
Agreed, but by far the most likely thing is that most/all of them will start producing like have have in previous years.
All rookies going to have growing pains and especially rookie D whose mistakes tend to end up in the back of the net. Patience required. A bigger issue is the 3 amigos. Always thought Yamo at a buck fifty was just too darn small. He continually gets the crap beat out of him and you have to wonder if the pounding he takes affects his play. His contract unmovable without a sweetener. JP with his big body is a great disruptor but if he isn’t scoring at least 15 per yr he is not worth his contract. It may turn out to be a dud of a 4 th over all pick. Foegel is a big body who can skate and check but has no hands. To this point all 3 not pulling their weight. Lets hope 1 or 2 of them can turn the corner!
Yamamoto had 20 goals last season (after having one in his first 10) – he has positive value, in my opinion.
The $3M wingers have clearly been given a run of games. But you do realize that ‘young guy’ Niemalainen is 1 month younger than Puljujarvi and 4 months older than Yamamoto, right? It’s true that Foegele is a full 2 years older than the rest of them.
Tyson Barrie seems to play so much forward, you might as well slot him in the 3RW.
Zero help to his rookie d-partner last night.
McLeod-McD-Hyman
Kane-Drai-Yamo
Holloway-RNH-JP
Foegle-Shore-Ryan
Give Hollywood the most responsible veteran C who still has great skill, and a defensive presence on the other wing and let him fly. We compared him to Hall-lite who Nuge had pretty good success with as well. McLeod (RNH-lite) can hold the spot on the top line, Conner and Zach are doing most of the heavy lifting on that line together anyway
As a bonus, Foegle and Ryan played really well together for stretches last year.
Why would they want to do that to the Nuge ?
Nuge McDavid Hyman
Kane Drai JP
Holloway McLeod Yamo
Foeg Ryan Shore
Yamo needs to find his touch on a lesser line.
JP gives that 2nd line some more brushing size and if Yamo isn’t going to score I would rather have JP there.
Holloway McLeod and Yamo would give teams fits with pressure and being able to make plays
4th line essentially just don’t get scored on.
It’s the D that needs a major addition because it’s just moving around deck chairs.
I think you are on the right track but the only move I would make right now is to swap JP and Yamamoto. JP certainly hasn’t earned the promotion, but maybe the switch would jump-start both guys?
I would leave Hollaway right where he is. That line has been good since he slid into the middle. Better than the 3rd line in fact. That’s due to Hollaway, and also the fact that Ryan is a better offensive player than JP or Foegele right now.
The biggest coaching mistake last night was stapling the 4th line to the bench in the 3rd period. If Woodcroft is going to shorten the bench in the 3rd he should probably go with Hollaway, McLeod, Ryan as the 3rd line.
Foegele/Ryan have crazy good numbers together from back in Carolina as well.
Good news, they can move Ryan up with MacLeod & Foegele and move Puljujarvi down with Shore and Holloway.
Given you’ve already traded Yamo away, you may be moving Puljujarvi the wrong way.
Unless you know something that I don’t know, I believe Yamo is still with the team.
I don’t make trades.
Devil, Deville. I see what you did there.
FWIW, the Athletic’s Don Luszcczyszyn (say that 3 times fast) has published a story on the NHL’s 10 worst contracts.
Nurse’s deal is 5th after Seguin, Seth Jones, Jeff Skinner, and Vlasic.
I often wonder if athletes truly consider the expectations these lux deals create. Easier to say than do I know, but if I was them I’d probably leave a little on the table or shorten the term to land on a contract that doesn’t set such massive expectations in the local market. One would have to be phenomenally good at tuning out the noise to play under this contract pressure. Not ideal.
No surprise there if Dom has Seth Jones above. Darnell’s contract was patterned and signed immediately after that contract was consummated. If he hates one, he hates the other.
I take Nurse 8 weeks out of 7 compared to Seth Jones. I don’t have an Athletic subscription so don’t know his methodology but without looking at Capfriendly I can think of plenty of contracts worse than Nurse’s. I have zero issue with the term of the Nurse contract given the context around the leadership on this team and helping to secure new contracts with Connor and Leon. The dollar amount is definitely high by probably $1.5-2 million, but that will also be insignificant within 2-3 years with the anticipated increases in the cap.
Not so much that Dom hates it, his modelling hates it.
Between Dom and J Fresh, its typically “this is what my modelling says”, at least when they are shocked when the end results, they state it or at least joke around about it.
Alot of people, unfortunately get worked up about their player cards / views, when really its just them following their model. At least they don’t move the goal posts.
With the cap going up, his contract will be worth it.
It’ll be worth it if Leon than McDavid sign on for 5 years. If they don’t we’re rebuilding in 3 years people seem to think we have a decade to win. I seen the greatest team ever dismantled painfully in 2 years.
Still sucks that Kuzmenko chose Canucks over us. We really need an upgrade on Yamamoto
Bourgault is only two months away! -).
Not enough seats at the big table unless they trade one of the 3M gang.
I heard a rumor Holland wants to trade Yamamoto & Neimelinen to Seattle for Carson Soucy . Or did I just make that up ? LOL.
Sometimes when you start a rumour to your own surprise it really happens.
That deal would make a lot of sense. Far less expensive than Chychrun.
No way Chychrun is worth the price of admission, but Niemo appears to be just scratching the surface right now. Trading him could end up being a big mistake. To LT’s point about rookies doing their thing at this time of the year and being better for it in the spring, I would take that tradeoff for the potential upside that Niemo brings long term.
Soucy remains a 3rd pairing defenseman. He’s never been more. And he makes almost as much as Yamamoto. That would be a terrible trade IMO.
It might be that you’re underestimating Carson Soucy .
It’s not my estimation/underestimation. It’s his TOI and quality of competition.
Which I guess is his coaches estimation. They have all used Soucy consistently on the 3rd pair.
His stats would indicate he is more than a third pairing defenseman, so does his paycheck.
Same as Matt Benning before he was set free.
Do you think there’s a market for a player that gets no shots on yet playing with the best passer in the league. I don’t know what Yamo has on his Coach’s but it must be a doozy. I hear the same old Yamo tries hard. My dog is old and it tries hard to lick his nuts but he can’t anymore. It’s results that matter you’ll have Yamo’s poster boy saying that he’s hurt or he’s sick or this or that. He’s not on a ELC anymore he’s making 3 mil a year for what??
I don’t know. does it really matter, it’s just a hypothetical trade option that instantly popped into my head. To some it makes sense and I believe it does make sense. But who cares?
Why are so many guys here so primed to trade for defenceman who never play more than 60 games/season? (Soucy & Chychrun)
If not for a microscopic tick off a stick – we could have had 3 top 9 wingers with goose eggs 11 games in
Forget goals even if you want.
Foggy has 1 measly point.
JP has 1 measly point
Both these wingers have now firmly been passed by, not one, but two -4th liners.
A raw rookie in Holloway and a soon to be 36 year old Derek Ryan.
But but they’re trying hard these 3 are making 9 million they have 1 Goal between them they could be replaced by league minimum Gagner, Archie you can pick a 100 players at dumpster diving prices that could produce better then Jesse , Yam and Foegele so far this year. The Mr. nice guy approach doesn’t work for everyone Woody needs to start benching and giving ice time to players that can produce.
Auston Matthew has one point at 5 on 5.
Yes, the “$3MM men” need to produce more but, guess what? They will. Replacing those three with Gagner, Archie and a replacement level player makes the team markedly worse shifty notwithstanding a couple goals from Archie this season.
Yamo also had zero goals in his first 7 or so games last year – ended up with 20.
Good Grief.
I don’t give two shits what Toronto are Montreal problems are this is our window. We should be blitzrieging teams instead we’re just barely winning games. If Yamo is hurt why’s he playing call up Malone at least he’ll bring some energy and physicality
I’m not sure you understood the point of the post.
As an aside, who are you sending down to call up the captain of the Condors?
Who’s vault is it that our cap is so tight? Why did they sign Janmark? Does Yamo make it through waivers with another year of 3.1 million left, as of today I think he does.
I missed the game due to a flight last night but based on the extended highlights it looked like the Oilers got the majority of the glorious chances but a couple of rookie mistakes and a couple of so-so goals and that’s all she wrote. Devil’s goalie stood on their head.
I have time for Holloway’s rookie mistakes as he is going to be a material player sooner rather than later. I don’t really have much time for Niemielains mistakes. I don’t think he’ll top out higher than the third pairing if that. I’d rather watch Broberg making those errors. He’s got a better chance at becoming a player.
We definitely had our chances – but the Devils are extremely fast and for a while looked on pace to get 50 shots on us. Ended up only 43 but still….even the Oiler TV crew was praising the Devils. ( rightly so)
I said it last year and I think it is equally true this year ….very fast forward groups present challenges to half our D core. ( arguably, losing Keith and subbing in Niemo maybe makes it even worse)
Niemo
Bouchard
Barrie.
Everytime Broberg gets traction he gets injured or it seems like it anyhow.
The only logical explanation/speculation for the Broberg situation is that he played with an injury through the preseason (probably foolishly).
Broberg should be developing as a 3D with up arrows at this very moment. Very frustrating draft pick to get behind.
Especially when the BPA at that point, Trevor Zegras, would go #1OV in a redraft.
The comparison to Zegras isn’t Broberg’s fault, but it is Holland’s.
Can’t use the highlights to grade a player. Niemelainen also had some sequences last night where he showed better than I’ve seen from him before.
You can when he’s wearing the goat horns. I’ve watched him play plenty this year. He makes mistakes every game. Most number sixes in the lineup will but I would like to see someone a little steadier in that spot. Or someone with more upside.
He’s not 21. Niemelainen is probably pretty close to his final product as a player.
That was a weird ending to a great game. I felt like Edmonton had 4 or 5 great chances to put the game away …. oh well …
One thing I thought of while watching was the old “LT” remark; GET GOOD PLAYERS, KEEP GOOD PLAYERS …. Watching Holloway, Puljujarvi, McLeod on the bottom lines is a breath of fresh air (rather than Arcobello, Eager, Gazdic etc) .. Combined with 2 Unreal Top lines and a decent collection of 6 D …
I felt like Edmonton has a lot of good players all over the roster. Ending wasn’t great, but this Team is legit and FUN TO WATCH.
To my eye, ZACH HYMAN is almost underrated. He seems to have finesse, power, skill, determination and make the correct play 90% of the time. He is a pleasure to watch 🙂
Dallas is playing well, but I like Edmonton Saturday!!
As usual, our fine host sums it up – perfectly.
Rookies are going to make mistakes and cost a few games.
And as mentioned, even McLeod with a gut wrenching turnover at the end as well.
…& a pretty feeble attempt to stop Graves in the slot. Taking the body is not his natural instinct.
Agreed.
Just a real painful sequence for him.
I thought McLeod had a tough game mostly b/c his passes were off the mark.
Skinner was fine last night. The 3rd goal bounced all the way in between his legs. That goal was on Ryan Mcleod who turned it over. Oilers still having problems closing out games but are getting better. Always looking for another goal instead of making the safe play when the game is almost over. I really didn’t like Bouchard’s spin o rama back pass that almost sent the Devils in on a break away with 4 minutes left in the game. Messier was the master of the dump in when his team had the lead in the 3rd period. Niemelainen has exceeded expectations so far but he was brutal on that last goal. If this was a playoff game Bouchard and Niemelainen don’t see the ice for the last 5 mins which means Holland needs to get a steady Eddy D man at the deadline.
If you’re trying to tie up the game, Bouchard should be on the ice.
Bouchard played tthe last 2:12 of the game.
Yes if the Oilers need a goal late in the game he should be playing every second shift. If the Oilers are up by 1 with 5 minutes left (goal was scored with around 3 minutes left) I don’t have him or Niemelainen on the ice in a playoff game.
Niemo’s game is defence first and defence only. If he can’t be trusted to defend then what are we doing here?
Also, no, Skinner was not “fine” in my opinion. Sure McLeod turned the puck over but Skinner let in a C-grade shot, the 2nd of two bad goals on him when the team was up 3-1 and 3-2 in the 3rd period.
I’m very happy with the kid but he had a bad period and was a contributor to the loss.
If I remember correctly, am I might be completely full of BS, but in ’94 I seem to remember Mess icing the puck a lot deep in the third with a lead. He could do this because he had another center that won nearly every faceoff. C. MacTavish.
Mike Krushelnyski was a really good face-off man as well. These players prided themselves on this when’s the last Oiler with that mentality Jared Stoll. You would think with Adam Oates around the team years ago that players would get advice from the great faceoff specialist.
Ok LT , if Holloway goes up to the third line.Who goes down to the fourth line ?
Foegele & MacLeod have been displaying some nice chemistry. Neither player deserves a demotion. Then there’s Puljujarvi, he isn’t going to want to play on the fourth line. It’s not that easy.
They could try both. No one is going to bolt the team if they’re on the fourth line.
Foegele McLeod and Puljujarvi play low event hockey, and one can probably play them against anybody in a pinch, since they are defensively reliable. That is a useful third line. The Oilers don’t need excitement out of their third line. If they shorten the game with nothing happening anywhere, that is to the Oilers benefit.
Holloway would make it a high event line, which means work for the coach in keeping the line away from trouble.
Holloway should be developed as a centre. One has to commit to 4th line minutes, and give Holloway extra shifts with leftover top 6 players who lose out on special teams ice time.
When Holloway becomes more reliable defensively, then one can move him to the 3rd line.
With Holloway on the 4th line as centre, the Oilers have a 3A and a 3B, one low event, on high event.
Having a low event 3rd line that one can put out for tough minutes in a pinch is a good thing.
Holloway is going to force a trade of one of Foegele or Puljujarvi or Yamamoto, probably by the deadline.
?? If anyone is going to have a reaction to playing on the 4th line it’s Pulju and his agent.
There’s history there that can’t be ignored.
Who players are playing with and on what line matters big time to the player, agent, and families and affects the long term relationship between player and team
At some point, if a team has a more dynamic option, they should use it.
Godot, when you describe a low event line that is essentially shortening the game – aren’t you describing what a team like the Oilers would want over the fourth line?
I know, for Oilers fans, having a 3rd line that isn’t caved is a win but that’s not where we are any more, not if we are a true contender. There can’t be two of four lines where the hope is a saw-off. That 3rd line has to be able to piss a couple drops at some point – I think they can but results are stacking.
Not that there need to be a re-jig because the team lost a single game that dropped them to 8th in the NHL but moving Yamamoto to that 4th line, Jesse to the first line and Holloway to 3rd can also be an option.
I know the coach has spoken about Yamo contributing to the 5-game winning streak, but its clear his hand injury is rendering him ineffective in many aspects of the game and he’s cratering offence like Puljujarvi detractors could only hope.
He’s struggled but I thought he had one of his best games last night (even if he didn’t finish). Looking, he had 3SOG, 4 scoring chances, and 1 HD chance.
On the season his on ice numbers (SF, GF, xGF rates) are all a bit higher than the previous 2 years, so there doesn’t seem to be a basis for your ‘cratering offense’ comment either.
FWIW, Puljujarvi truly has ‘cratered offense’ this season. 0.44 GF/60 ON, though a ton of that is bad luck.
Both players have struggled this season, and both have more to give. This isn’t the year to make head-to-head comparison’s of their effectiveness though, if you’re trying to knock Yamamoto out of his top 6 role.
I wanted to ask earlier but didn’t want to pick. This suggests you would favour moving Holloway up even if Puljujarvi was the one headed to L4? (I assumed that was not what you were envisioning)
No, but as we approach 20 games it’s important to see who is being productive. You have to score a little to stay in the league. Here are the five-on-five points-per-60 among the young forwards.
1. Dylan Holloway 2.6
2. Kailer Yamamoto 1.15
3. Ryan McLeod 0.93
4. Warren Foegele 0.54
5. Jesse Puljujarvi 0.47
It’s 11 games. As I mentioned on Gregor’s show today, maybe they play the fourth line more than the third line. You have to score.
Yes, it’s definitely true you need to score at least a bit. I just feel like for the time being it’s best to stay the course. No question at some point (certainly by the 20 game mark, if the goals don’t start going in) some lineup movement will need to happen.
That’s the hope for sure. I’m a fan of all of these young players. The only thing I would say is that it’s kind of a mystery why they wouldn’t insert JP in place of KY, just for a few games to see what it might look like. Excluding Puljujarvi from an elite center limits him terribly.
That’s definitely fair, though Puljujarvi hasn’t made it at all difficult for Woodcroft either. You know the numbers (and I just posted some of them to OP). Puljujarvi hasn’t looked good/confident by eye either IMO.
I thought those 2 shifts (end of first/beginning of 2nd) that Puljujarvi got last night were a chance to move up. If there’d been any spark he’d have stayed there for the rest of the game (at least). Maybe that’s not enough of a chance, but he certainly didn’t seize the moment.
I thought Yamamoto had a pretty good game last night too. And FWIW, I thought coming into the year that Puljujarvi might fit best at 2RW with Hyman and Draisaitl (that could still work obviously, but I don’t feel like Puljujarvi has made any kind of case for himself to this point).
PS – D. Ryan’s ability to keep producing offense from a depth role is really impressive (even if the total boxcars remain modest).
Agreed from a short term team performance perspective, but some unwanted long term results are very possible with this player and agent if he’s 4th line getting 6 min a night.
I’m a big fan of the pump and dump to maximize asset values out and in. Takes a GM with balls to do this. This player is a prime candidate for this strategy.
4th line him and we’re back to the agent getting getting crazy ideas and negative trsde value with this player.
The 3rd line has been pretty vanilla, this is true. And it’s possible Holloway is the answer, though I’m not as sure about that as you seem to be.
For me though, being conservative is the right play here, at least for the time being.
I think that you run the risk of losing Foegele or Puljujarvi a bit if you move them down to the 4th line this early (and in favor of a rookie who hasn’t been particularly lights out to this point). That 3rd line has been quite decent on the year too, just not as dynamic as we’d like to see.
IMO you leave Holloway where he is for now. He can bide his time on the 4th line (or in Bakersfield for a bit) until an injury or trade opens something up in the top 9.
You can also re-assess if his game really takes off, and he’s playing like he’s clearly better than someone above him. But IMO that has not happened yet.
Just my 2 cents.
Agreed. I don’t know what LT was smoking this morning but I want some.
i wonder if having Nuge up on 1L is a luxury we can’t quite afford yet? Swap Holloway and Foegle, JP up with Connor… Nuge with Holloway and Mcleod for more stability further down the lineup.
You know those comedies where your laughing but crying at the same time? Thats what last night was. A comedy of errors all over the damn place.
I can’t remember the last time I saw that many missed passes, shots and giveaways in a game. It was ridiculous. I can’t figure out what happened? Even McDavid and Drai were missing routine passes that are normally automatic. Don’t even get me started on the missed goal chances. I lost count.
It’s true that the rooks cost us this game but we have to put these guys away. They were giving the puck up even more than we were, especially in the second. We had so many glorious chances but no killer instinct. zero. nothin.
Niems had a rough end to the game. He looked ok early and was physical and kept it simple. One lapse in concentration and its in the net. I would still take him over Murray, though. Unless we have someone to come in and be steady, I say stick with him. Why bring in another young defender to only start the process of acclimating him again? Hes getting closer but not quite there, yet.
Skinner has to stop that muffin, even if its a knuckle puck. I liked his game. I don’t think he had a chance on any other goals but that crappy one was really bad.
Holloway played less than 6 mins? The kid needs to go the the minors for a spell. He’s not learning jack squat here playing those kind of minutes. Maybe he would flourish on a higher line but his mistakes are ending up in the back of the net. He needs to be handling the puck close to 18 mins a night to get the feel of it again. Hes moving in the wrong direction, imo. Send him down, build him up and bring him back on the third line when hes ready. He needs more than fourth line minutes and hes not even really getting that…
Kailer and Jesse have got to produce. I like both of their games at times(Jesse’s physical play, Kailers tenacity) but they need to contribute on the scoresheet. Switch them up for a few games, see what happens. Can’t be any worse…
We had so many chances to win that game. Good thing my wife bought me virtually unbreakable fancy glasses. I cleaned up spilled ice tea three times last game cuz I always forget I’m holding the glass and the Oilers gave me plenty of reasons to rage last night.
It was a comedy of errors. A horrible game except for about 7 minutes of the 2nd. I wonder if the ice was just put in, the puck touches were so poor.
Yeah the ice looked horrible by eye
The Jersey announcers were talking about the puck bouncing all game. And it was affecting both teams.
Thanks for that, I thought it was just me.
I was at the game, & spent much of it commenting bitterly about how shittty the ice was. Puck wouldn’t lay flat, even the high skill guys (of whom tthere were many on both sides) were having lots of trouble. Have never seen McDavid have so many bobbles, even as he was often able to make the next touch with his spectacular hand-eye it’s not like the puck was behaving how he wanted it to. By the third he was so frustrated bobbling the puck through one zone entry he wound up just taking a slapshot from 50 feet out rather than even try to attack the defence.
Taking the ice out on Wednesay probably didn’t help, but that’s life in the big city. Some days the horses have to run on a sloppy track.
I heard McDavid’s mother was a mudder.
It’s the same for both teams.
100%. I think my comment reflects that reality. Gotta deal with it. But from a fan’s perspective I’d rather watch a game of high skill on both sides than endless bounces.
The OEG have tested this and they know the simplest solution to having consistently good ice is simply lowering the overall ambient temperature of the building.
Unfortunately it’s difficult to sell your patrons on having to wear a jacket or sweater when you’re also running the concessions like Woodstock 99.
I think part of it is that Oil passes weren’t calibrated to get by the kind of team speed NJ demonstrated last night. Seemed some were a case of needing to move the puck a quarter second faster, allow less time for pickup on the area passes and drop passes. Devils feasted on those.
I also noticed that, a quarter of a second faster and 2 feet further away.
Much rather have the lessons learned in November than in May or June for the skaters and the goalie.
I’m inclined to give Skinner a pass on the Graves goal. He did stop 10 of 10 HDSCs and the fact that the shot taken ended up being a wiff and not a HDSC was more good luck than good management. He was rightly expecting the high heater and got fooled by the change up in the dirt.
He looked a lot like Koskinen on that one . Had to make that save .
Rough watching that loss last night. On another note Ottawa is officially up for sale with a condition “the team must stay in Ottawa.” I did a little internet research last night and R Reynolds is interested but it seems clear he cannot afford it alone and is looking to be a partner. Now that being said he is a master of using his fame to create business and wealth, I wouldn’t be surprised if he ends up a partner and becomes a sort of face for the franchise which would likely only mean good things for Ottawa fans.
Loving the Senators – Deadpool mashups
As I said online last night, I ain’t even mad. They could have won, should have won. Ceci misses a sitter, it’s 4-2 Oilers. Skinner lets in a howler, D gets caught 7 seconds later.
Vanecek was lights out, had several huge stops in the third. I agree with McDavid that the Oilers learned a lesson there.
Sports!
They also remain 2nd in the Division and 8th in the league (points %) so it’s not like the sky is falling either.
Oilers defence is not good enough to get to the Cup.
Not yet. But like with the financial markets, don’t over-correct. Knowing Holland’s track record, it’s reasonable to expect he’ll make a deal. These minutes the kids are playing now are important. And I’d like to see Broberg when he’s ready as well.
The problem is Nurse will never be consistent top pairing D-man. It’s hard to win a cup without a top pairing D-man
Well yes, if you think Nurse isn’t a 1st pair defenseman, then you’d obviously think the Oilers D as a whole is in dire straits.
who is a top pairing dman in your book?
Hedman?
Reilly?
Seth Jones?
Dougie Hamilton?
There are not many #1 D’s in the NHL, but most teams have a #2 D-man in the first pairing. Nurse is not consistent enough to be a #2 D-man in the first pairing. He has most of the skills for a top pairing D-man with speed and strength, but is missing hockeyIQ
If this is how you’re looking at things then you really need to tell us a number.
By definition, there are 32 #1 Dmen in the league, 32 more #2 Dmen.
Everyone knows those 32 “#1 Dmen” aren’t simply the 32 “best” Dmen in the league. At the same time, “#1 D” should mean one of the best 32 (or something in that ballpark).
And “top pairing” should mean one of the best 64.
If your meaning is something different, they you should tell us what you’re actually trying to say.
So “It’s hard to win a cup without a top pairing D-man”. That’s fair.
But do you mean without a top 5? 10? 15? 30? D-man?
Not only is he a #1 d-man but he’s being doing so carrying 2nd/3rd pairing guys on the top pairing, year, after year, after year.
I’m assuming there are only about 6 of them in the entire league.
Saw a list from Jeff Veillette the other day about fans’ expectations that went something like this:
#1 D = Norris candidate
#2 D = high end #1
#3 D = low end #1
#4 D = solid #2
All I could do was nod vigorously & laugh.
Sounds about right.
that’s good
I think it’s the left side of the D.
But Nurse is not the problem.
Kulak is a likely a third pairing guy and Nemo is a rookie.
This team really misses Duncan Keith.
Nurse is playing well . The question is , should they try balancing the pairs out by splitting up the top pair of Nurse & Ceci . IMO they should. But they aren’t about to panic yet .
It took years to split 97&29.
Nurse plays about half his time with Ceci.
Almost every game Nurse takes shifts with all the righties.
This is just a wild opinion to me.
Nurse is objectively, not only a top pairing d-man but a #1 d-man and probably in the top 15 in the league. By TOI, TOI vs elites, 5 on 5 production, defence against elites, etc., etc.
Subjectively, well, I also have him in that apx 10-15 d-man category but that’s subjective opinion.
Is he an “elite #1” – nope but he’s certainly in the top 32, let alone, top 64 of d-man in the league.
i absolutely agree with you.
He plays extremely tough minutes against tough competition and consistently comes out ahead.
If you look at 5v5 production per 60 mins over the last 3 yrs nurse rates very highly.
Nattystatty
over 2500 mins of ice time
Even strength.
Nurse is.
#5 for Goals per 60 mins.
#3 in hits per 60 mins
#2 in toi per game
#4 in shots per 60 mins
#16 in ev points/60 mins
#7 in expected goals%
#7 in IXG per 60.
All whilst playing against elite competition. I would say he is pretty darn good.
Also his on ice results are outstanding.
#7 in expected goal share,
#13 in actual goal share,
#10 in High danger chance share.
Prospectunnecessarysuffixing!
All nine prospects who ply their trade on NA ice are in action this night, two of whom are coming off recent tripoint outbursts. The Reid Rocket went off for a hatty on Wednesday, while Petrov rung up 1+2 yesternight.
Youngstown (Lachance) @ 5 p.m.
St. Lawrence (Mazura) @ 5 p.m.
Quinnipiac (Brind’Amour) @ 5 p.m.
North Bay (Petrov) @ 5 p.m.
Vermont (Munzenberger, Määttä) @ 5:15 p.m.
Wheat Kings (Chiasson) @ 6 p.m.
Moose Jaw (Wanner) @ 7 p.m.
Seattle (Schaefer) @ 8 p.m.
All times, at all times, are Chauvin time.
Because a busy weekend lies ahead for your humble correspondent, a Sporadic Update Warning is now in effect.
These are welcome like a ray of sunshine and a warm breeze. Thank you, Tarkus.
You are too kind, good sir LT. Thank you for keeping the lights on and the fridge full.
Query: Is the name of the city where the Wheat Kings play still on the blacklist?
It is off the list now.
Maybe it only needs to be on the list at night?
There’s much truth to this.
You mean when Tarkus does most of the prospect reporting?
I certainly enjoy the term “kings of wheat” rather than Brandon.
Thank you.
That said, I’m looking forward to the good citizens of Brandon getting their name back. Now they’ll know where they are! 😀
Never stop with the quips Tarkus.
‘Paris of the Prairies’ would work for me
Except the ‘Paris of the Prairies’ is actually Saskatoon.
Vanecek stood tall on his head, and that played a factor in the outcome.
The boys got some great looks and needed to cash.
Curious, if Holloway is making mistakes that end up in the back of the net, why are we suggesting he moves up the depth chart?
I get that he has speed and skill, but I still think the game needs to slow down for him.
It will happen, and he needs at bats for it to happen, but lower comp on the 4th line may be the ticket.
If he plays the wing, the defensive errors should be reduced.
I thought Ryan was the C, and Holloway on LW?
now I’m really confused.
But you bring up an interesting point. Are we developing him as a LW or a C.
There’s a player there. i would like us to take a long view approach to his development.
Shore is the C.
All three players can play center at any point of the game . Holloway is in a good place playing with two versatile veterans. He’s in a position to succeed.
Holloway McLeod Yamamoto
Move Jesse up and Foggy down.
Man, Puljujarvi had two uninspiring shifts in the top 6 last night.
These are valuable lessons for Holloway at this stage of his career and he is a natural center.
Usually I’d be much more forgiving but they can’t let that game get away. Not on the Oilers Hall of Fame induction game.
Luckily other teams are struggling… Blues haven’t won a game since we beat them, Flames lost a couple. As LT said, could’ve got more separation with a win. If they make up for the mistakes in the matinee on Saturday all will be forgotten… tough task.
I can’t remember many Oiler games going well post-ceremony.
I also thought Ceci played a solid game, as usual, but there must be a category above HDSC for the sure goal he somehow missed. Perhaps a Stefan Level Danger Scoring Chance?
It was Stefan level for sure. Just incredible.
It is the harder move to miss the wide open net than it is to score.
Incredible.