McKenzie at the Draft

It’s my belief Canada is pretty normal as modern countries go. We’ve settled some important issues over many decades without bloodshed, and survived some truly unusual prime ministers.

There are things about Canada that take some explaining. Smarties, Hawkins’ Cheezies, surviving the cold, farmers making their own replacement parts out of necessity, and Toronto.

One of the curios must be the entry draft, a weekend each summer where fans of the various teams pray to any God that will listen for the strength to endure another addled draft set.

I don’t know if Bob McKenzie is a seer, saviour or enabler, but I’m happy he arrives each summer with a reasonable order. If we didn’t have Bob McKenzie, we’d have to invent him.

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THE ATHLETIC!

The Athletic Edmonton features a fabulous cluster of stories (some linked below, some on the site). Great perspective from a ridiculous group of writers and analysts. Proud to be part of The Athletic, check it out here.

McKenzie’s list

The unique quality of McKenzie’s list is that it represents the industry, or at least a portion of it. McKenzie polls a number of scouts (believe it’s 10 this year) in what might be more accurately described as a ‘poll’ that takes about 30 percent of the industry and presents it as the state of the art in real time. It’s always fun to see what McKenzie’s list would have recommended for Edmonton, and how those differences morph through the years.

2007 DRAFT EDGE OILERS

I didn’t like this draft, despite being pleased with Gagner at No. 6 (would have been equally pleased with Jakub Voracek, who turned out to be a better player). The Plante selection passed over several quality options and the Oilers traded up for a checking center in Riley Nash. Edmonton traded No. 30 and 36 to get to No. 21. It wasn’t a strong decision. The Oilers did beat the McKenzie recommendations, but it’s a stretch to suggest the organization got enough from four picks inside the top 36.

2008 DRAFT OILERS WIN

An absolute home run pick, supreme return on investment considering where Edmonton chose Eberle. He ranks No. 2 among all 2008 draftees in goals, behind only Steven Stamkos. He could score 350+ goals in his career (he’s at 225, age 30).

2009 DRAFT EDGE MCKENZIE

Ryan Ellis was the jewel available at No. 9, but Kulikov has enjoyed a strong career (11 years averaging 20 minutes a night) that ranks as superior to Paajarvi’s. Lander>Shore, I think the Oilers did just ‘okay’ in 2009.

2010 DRAFT MCKENZIE WINS

The McKenzie list graduated three bona fide NHL regulars who I think we can agree covered their draft bet. Edmonton? Full value for Hall, and some bad luck with Pitlick (who was in the range). The Marincin pick was off the board. A clear win for the McKenzie list. This isn’t 2007 disappointing, but Oilers needed to get more from this draft.

2011 DRAFT A TIE IN STRONG DRAFT

I think this is one of the best drafts of the decade for Edmonton, the dual hits in the first round had a big impact on the team’s roster depth for the last seven years of the decade. Saad would have been another major piece, but getting two men who serve in major roles can’t be overlooked.

2012 DRAFT EDGE EDMONTON

This was not a strong draft, Edmonton was unlucky to win the lottery. I’m not sure what can be said, beyond the fact the Oilers did slightly better than the McKenzie list.

2013 DRAFT EDMONTON WINS

I was a fan of MacT’s trades down and even though they didn’t work out the Oilers should do it again if the opportunity presents itself. Edmonton got a better first-round pick than McKenzie’s scouts and that fact wins the day. There are a significant number of Oilers fans who don’t rate Nurse but I think he’s been fairly consistent and his foot speed is a blessing.

2014 DRAFT EDMONTON WINS BIG

This is a long home run, the murder hornet version of the Eberle selection. The Oilers accomplished the unlikely when drafting the 20th best player in a draft at No. 1 overall earlier in the decade, and in 2014 grabbed the No. 1 player at third overall. Fantastic selection, the McKenzie list, the scouts, had the wrong man at No. 3 overall.

2015 DRAFT A TIE

Majestic moment. The power and the glory. Connor McDavid has the biggest impact on every game he’s in, beginning with the opposition coach having a terrible night’s sleep heading into game day. Superhuman hockey player. Both McKenzie and the Oilers got it right in the easiest test in draft history.

2016 DRAFT A TIE

For a draft that is now four years old, much remains up in the air. No clear winner here, I don’t think this will rival the 2012 draft in terms of farce but it does have that feel to it. Big seasons for the entire group on the way.

2017 DRAFT EDMONTON WINS

This draft has the potential to be one of the best this decade. Yamamoto took a big step forward, and Samorukov has a chance to be a top-four defenseman if he develops. A fascinating draft by Edmonton.

2018 DRAFT TOO SOON TO KNOW

I expect we’ll be looking back at this draft in 2025 and talking about most if not all of these names having NHL success. Things broke well for the McKenzie list and the Oilers in 2018.

2019 DRAFT TOO SOON TO KNOW

I’m still amazed Lavoie hung around to No. 38. For the purpose of the McKenzie list versus the Oilers it comes down to Zegras versus Broberg. Zegras finished third in scoring at Boston University, Broberg found his way in the SHL. Miles to go.

I have it at 6-2-3 with several too soon to knows thrown in for good measure. Clear victories for Edmonton in 2008, 2013 and 2014. McKenzie and his scouts win clearly in 2010.

LOWDOWN WITH LOWETIDE

At 10 this morning, we’ll talk McKenzie list and more on TSN1260. Reid Fowler from Draft Kings will review a great golf tournament on the weekend with a terrific finish (the RBC Heritage) and Jason Gregor will talk NHL return and NHL draft at 11. At 11:25, it’s Jon Abbott from TSN1040 in Vancouver to chat hub city. 10-1260 text, @Lowetide on twitter. See you on the radio!

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98 Responses to "McKenzie at the Draft"

  1. Paulie says:

    “This is a long home run, the murder hornet version of the Eberle selection.” That GOLD, baby!

  2. ArmchairGM says:

    It’ll be interesting to see if Stutzle comes in at #2 or #3 on Mackenzie’s final list. Personally I think Byfield is clearly better with a higher ceiling – Stutzle’s 5.3% shooting in DEL is worrisome as we know he gets a lot of PP time. Byfield has no weaknesses to his game.

  3. Brantford Boy says:

    “Sorry” “eh”… takes precedence over Hawkins’ Cheezies in my opinion, I know many are loyal to this brand, just never really liked them… sorry eh…

    Can you imagine Toffoli and Saad in our lineup, gotta think we’d have one a cup in 2017 and probably a favorite to repeat…

    With his warts I’m a big fan of Nurse… toughness and speed, and having a Larsson mentor show him filth is a thing… not sure had we pulled off the Schneider trade for #9 if that would have been good for the long run, immediate probably.

    Thanks for the post yesterday LT, great stuff… hopefully everyone got that sickness stuff out their system… was hard to get through the nice comments of your writing and the day of celebration.

  4. dustrock says:

    Reading through Bob’s comments this is going to be a wild draft even beyond the issues of no U-18, no playoffs etc.

    À couple of scouts had Byfield at #6? Wow

    Also interesting Lapierre is at #15. I think he could be a home run but the injury concerns are real.

    According to the list the Oilers would be able to grab Zary or Bourque at #20, sounds good to me.

  5. ArmchairGM says:

    Rondo:
    BM’s rankings

    https://www.tsn.ca/bob-mckenzie-s-final-ranking-lafreniere-the-surest-thing-in-most-uncertain-draft-year-1.1488272

    Stutzle over Byfield is a mistake IMO, we’ll look back in 10 years to confirm but I’m calling it today.

    I like Reichel at #20, I wouldn’t mind at all if the Oilers land Robert Reichel’s nephew.

    Man do I wish we had a boatload of early 2nds – if this list holds (of course it won’t) Mysak, Khusnutdinov and Wiesblat are going to be steals in that range. Ponomarev (Datsyuk the Second) in the late 2nd will make some GM look very smart too.

  6. Brantford Boy says:

    Rondo,

    What HE-double hockey sticks… both DEL players book-ending Zary at 20-23… now I’m really confused… would we…

  7. buck yoakam says:

    Like the farmer reference…my wife’s grandpa and family farmed near warner (southern alberta) and still do…without fedex running tractor parts out to you you had to be a millwright of sorts… after the second world war he purchased two aircraft just for the aluminum to make parts …we still have some gruesome looking butcher knives he made for us out of car springs…total respect for the man!

  8. meanashell11 says:

    I’ve been watching some games from earlier this season and focusing on certain players. I have to say Nurse is better than I remember, as is Jones. Remember, Nurse is close friends with McDavid, there is no way I trade him.

    And damn, Yamo is non-stop out there!

  9. JJS says:

    I would suggest 2007 is a clear win for the Oil. Close to 1400 NHL games between Gags and Nash.

    That is impressive.

  10. so polar says:

    Rondo:
    BM’s rankings

    https://www.tsn.ca/bob-mckenzie-s-final-ranking-lafreniere-the-surest-thing-in-most-uncertain-draft-year-1.1488272

    Thank you muchly.
    Here’s the updated rankings, including Wheeler, Pronman, Mckenzie, HP, and our esteemed host.

  11. OriginalPouzar says:

    Its really interesting that, over the years, the Oilers have actually outperformed McKenzie more often than not and, sometimes, in a material way.

  12. OriginalPouzar says:

    So interesting that we really have no idea where the Oilers will draft.

    It could be first, second or third overall. It could be 31st overall. It could be various places in between.

    At the end of the week, with the 1st lottery (of maybe only one) occurring, we will know if there is a “chance” for 1-3.

    Wild times!

  13. OriginalPouzar says:

    So, one of LT’s articles at The Athletic over the weekend had an interesting tidbit from Al in the comments section.

    Recall that, in the last game against the Jets, Coach T. switched thing up – he moved Nuge up with McDavid and Ennis with Drai. The third line had AA with Sheahan and Archie.

    That AA/Sheahan/Archie line dominated the metrics – 7:1 Coris and all else was in line. No goals but their metrics were fantastic and it was generally against the flow of play. The Jets didn’t dominate but they were the “better possession team” – not when that line was on the ice.

    We know that Nygard is healthy and, prior to his injury, he showed well on that line with Sheahan and Archie. At the same time, we know from Coach T’s mouth that he’s a bit worried about how long Nygard has been off – a couple months longer than everyone else – with zero puck time. Coach T. has intimated that Nygard likely needs to work his way back in to the lineup.

    We also know that Coach T. really liked that heavy fourth line of Neal/Khaira/Chiasson and intimate it was a playoff type line.

    Subject to camp or injuries changing something, I think we know what the forward lines for game 1 will look like:

    Ennis/McDavid/Kass
    Nuge/Drai/Yamamoto
    AA/Sheahan/Archie
    Neal/Khaira/Chiasson

    Nygard/Haas/Benson/Granlund/Jurco/(McLeod)

  14. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    – our 2015 draft is trending amongst the best drafts of last 10 years when all is said and done: McD, and 3 bona-fide NHL D, all with upside, whose develpment isn’t complete

    – Our roster with Jones, Bear Marino and Mcd: could have been deadly, best draft ever. McD and 2 NHL D: can’t be many better drafts than that.

    – TB had Names, Palat, Kucherov (and I guess Nesterov). But our haul bettern than than that. But then next year they go Vasil and Pacquette (and I guess Gusev).

    – In three years, they drafted 9 or 10 players on thier team now: that’ how you get ‘er done

  15. digger50 says:

    Brantford Boy:
    “Sorry” “eh”… takes precedence over Hawkins’ Cheezies in my opinion, I know many are loyal to this brand, just never really liked them… sorry eh…

    Can you imagine Toffoli and Saad in our lineup, gotta think we’d have one a cup in 2017 and probably a favorite to repeat…

    With his warts I’m a big fan of Nurse… toughness and speed, and having a Larsson mentor show him filth is a thing… not sure had we pulled off the Schneider trade for #9 if that would have been good for the long run, immediate probably.

    Thanks for the post yesterday LT, great stuff… hopefully everyone got that sickness stuff out their system… was hard to get through the nice comments of your writing and the day of celebration.

    I actually give credit to Eric Gryba for bringing Nurse along in his first year. Grubs could get walked but he sure played the corners and front of the net hard. He was also a good team guy and I think that benefitted Nurse.

    In regards to Larson, I completely agree that his mentorship is needed. He has an opportunity to show all the Oilers young d what battling in the playoffs looks like. Larson is not vocal, he leads by example, and If he shows up and plays like we know he can, what an influence he can have on that back end.

  16. meanashell11 says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    So interesting that we really have no idea where the Oilers will draft.

    It could be first, second or third overall.It could be 31st overall.It could be various places in between.

    At the end of the week, with the 1st lottery (of maybe only one) occurring, we will know if there is a “chance” for 1-3.

    Wild times!

    So if Chicago wins the lottery and we lose to Chicago we draft 1-3? That is a threat to the integrity of the league is it not? What’s to stop a team who does not think it can go all the way from losing in the play in if their opponent wins the lottery. Not like they will miss the playoff revenue.

  17. jtblack says:

    meanashell11: So if Chicago wins the lottery and we lose to Chicago we draft 1-3? That is a threat to the integrity of the league is it not? What’s to stop a team who does not think it can go all the way from losing in the play in if their opponent wins the lottery. Not like they will miss the playoff revenue.

    your scenario is not possible.

    any team that makes the final 16 is NOT eligible to be in the lottery ….

  18. ArmchairGM says:

    Any love for overager Egor Sokolov as a late-round target?

  19. defmn says:

    digger50: I actually give credit to Eric Gryba for bringing Nurse along in his first year. Grubs could get walked but he sure played the corners and front of the net hard. He was also a good team guy and I think that benefitted Nurse.

    In regards to Larson, I completely agree that his mentorship is needed. He has an opportunity to show all the Oilers young d what battling in the playoffs looks like. Larson is not vocal, he leads by example, and If he shows up and plays like we know he can, what an influence he can have on that back end.

    This is the argument I have made for re-signing Green as a mentor for Jones and Bear. As long as the money works and Green can still handle 3rd pair minutes it is invaluable to have an experienced player teaching the younger guys on the finer points of how to play their type of game.

  20. ArmchairGM says:

    jtblack: your scenario is not possible.

    any team that makes the final 16 is NOT eligible to be in the lottery ….

    That wasn’t his scenario at all.

  21. OriginalPouzar says:

    Further to our conversation from last night, Rishaug with info on the OEG entertainment in the bubble.

    Don’t know what Vancouver has proposed but I’m very confidant that anyone in the bubble will not be permitted in to general society. Any activities out and about will need to be cut off to the public.

    Of note, families not permitted in. I posited that families won’t be allowed in until later in the post-season.

    https://twitter.com/tsnryanrishaug/status/1275123759171567616?s=21

  22. Gerta Rauss says:

    meanashell11: So if Chicago wins the lottery and we lose to Chicago we draft 1-3? That is a threat to the integrity of the league is it not? What’s to stop a team who does not think it can go all the way from losing in the play in if their opponent wins the lottery. Not like they will miss the playoff revenue.

    The lottery held this week will be among the 7 teams that are not participating in the play in round

    If one of the lottery balls reveals that teams 8 thru 15 have won one(or more) of the 3 lottery spots, those results will not be made public until much later in the summer – so the teams participating in the “play in” round will know that a lottery spot is up for grabs, they just won’t know WHO won the spot until the 2nd lottery

    Once the 8 play in “losers” are determined, a 2nd lottery will be held with each of the losing teams having a 12.5% chance of acquiring that lottery spot

    If CHI beats Edmonton, CHI will not participate in either of the lottery draws, they will move on to the 16 team playoffs

    If the 3 lottery balls drawn this week are awarded to the 7 teams participating the lottery, there will be NO 2nd lottery, and the rest of the draft order will be determined by points percentage based on regular season results

  23. godot10 says:

    digger50: I actually give credit to Eric Gryba for bringing Nurse along in his first year. Grubs could get walked but he sure played the corners and front of the net hard. He was also a good team guy and I think that benefitted Nurse.

    In regards to Larson, I completely agree that his mentorship is needed. He has an opportunity to show all the Oilers young d what battling in the playoffs looks like. Larson is not vocal, he leads by example, and If he shows up and plays like we know he can, what an influence he can have on that back end.

    I believe Nurse spent more time with Sekera (when all the injuries hit), and Reinhart more time with Gryba.

  24. godot10 says:

    meanashell11: So if Chicago wins the lottery and we lose to Chicago we draft 1-3? That is a threat to the integrity of the league is it not? What’s to stop a team who does not think it can go all the way from losing in the play in if their opponent wins the lottery. Not like they will miss the playoff revenue.

    The 2nd round of the draft lottery doesn’t work that way. One no idea who has won the lottery out of the play-in teams until after all the series have been completed.

  25. ArmchairGM says:

    meanashell11: So if Chicago wins the lottery and we lose to Chicago we draft 1-3? That is a threat to the integrity of the league is it not? What’s to stop a team who does not think it can go all the way from losing in the play in if their opponent wins the lottery. Not like they will miss the playoff revenue.

    “Chicago” won’t be part of the lottery though, there will be 8 placeholders instead of actual teams, called Team A, Team B, etc. If one of these placeholders wins a 1/2/3 pick, a second lottery will be held after the play-in to determine which of the loser teams will get that pick. The remaining teams will be slotted based on regular season points percentage.

    If the Oilers lose to Chicago, they will pick no later than 15th. If they beat Chicago, they will likely pick somewhere between 20-31, depending on how many playoff rounds they win.

  26. digger50 says:

    godot10: I believe Nurse spent more time with Sekera (when all the injuries hit), and Reinhart more time with Gryba.

    Perhaps, but the comment was on the “filthy” type of mentoring. Gryba and Nurse together were a mean combination. Sekera would bring a different type of skill mentoring, which was much harder as Darnell brought to the puck up the ice, over the blue line…….and into the corner.

    I do love Nurse though and would not be looking to trade him. I see him emerging as a leader for Bear, Jones, Broberg, Laggeson…Samurokov…

  27. OriginalPouzar says:

    Reports are that Columbus and Minnesota have each been informed that they are out as a potential hub city.

    https://theathletic.com/1885921/2020/06/22/columbus-will-not-be-a-hub-city-when-nhls-season-resume/

  28. N64 says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    Further to our conversation from last night, Rishaug with info on the OEG entertainment in the bubble.

    Don’t know what Vancouver has proposed but I’m very confidant that anyone in the bubble will not be permitted in to general society.Any activities out and about will need to be cut off to the public.

    Of note, families not permitted in.I posited that families won’t be allowed in until later in the post-season.

    https://twitter.com/tsnryanrishaug/status/1275123759171567616?s=21

    Players at JW Marriot and the connected Ice District configured Olympic Village style.
    Families in the Rockies and/or Edmonton as preferred.
    JWM apparently closed to families until after play-in round.
    Staff in Delta/Sutton with dedicated routes
    Dedicated days at golf courses

    ~ Is Katz sending a DVD to all the players? ~

  29. Reja says:

    N64: Players at JW Marriot and the connected Ice District configured Olympic Village style.
    Families in the Rockies and/or Edmonton as preferred.
    JWM apparently closed to families until after play-in round.
    Staff in Delta/Sutton with dedicated routes
    Dedicated days at golf courses

    ~ Is Katz sending a DVD to all the players? ~

    If Katz can pull this off it’s going to be Ching, Ching, for himself and the city.

  30. OriginalPouzar says:

    As per Capfriendly and Friedman, the NHL/NHLPA have agreed that player contracts (along with work permits, etc.) that were set to expire on June 30 will be extended to October 31.

    Of course, that will need to be confirmed in the overall Return to Play vote.

    LeBrun has added that this is a one-off agreement and it only deals with “foreign nationals” on expiring contracts who would have their work visas expire.

  31. OriginalPouzar says:

    Fast and furious on the news today:

    Chris Johnston reporting that the NHL has expanded the phase 2 voluntary groups from 6 to 12 people effective Tuesday.

  32. Harpers Hair says:

    N64: Players at JW Marriot and the connected Ice District configured Olympic Village style.
    Families in the Rockies and/or Edmonton as preferred.
    JWM apparently closed to families until after play-in round.
    Staff in Delta/Sutton with dedicated routes
    Dedicated days at golf courses

    ~ Is Katz sending a DVD to all the players? ~

    Problem is the Marriott only has 346 rooms.

    If each team has 30 players, they will need 480 rooms.

  33. Material Elvis says:

    ArmchairGM: Stutzle over Byfield is a mistake IMO, we’ll look back in 10 years to confirm but I’m calling it today.

    I like Reichel at #20, I wouldn’t mind at all if the Oilers land Robert Reichel’s nephew.

    Man do I wish we had a boatload of early 2nds – if this list holds (of course it won’t) Mysak, Khusnutdinov and Wiesblat are going to be steals in that range. Ponomarev (Datsyuk the Second) in the late 2nd will make some GM look very smart too.

    I’ll predict that Byfield is taken before Stutzle. He’s quite a bit younger and has all the tools.

  34. N64 says:

    Harpers Hair: Problem is the Marriott only has 346 rooms.

    If each team has 30 players, they will need 480 rooms.

    Now the Black Aces are running the show???

    [ ̄ ̄]ノ( º _ ºノ)


    CBA 16.9 Single Room Accommodations. Any Player on an SPC who is not in the Entry Level
    System shall be entitled to single room accommodations for all Club road trips.

    @TSNRyanRishaug
    Notable here for players – there is room for all of them in the JW Marriott across from the arena. There was some concern about this element.

    So do we believe the TSN reporter? Or the Coombs Market goat?

    The amazing thing isn’t that a goat thinks 12×30 =480. It’s that he can ever try to multiply numbers. Actually that room count works out to 28-29 player rooms per team. And the older coaches away from the Player Village is a good idea in covid world.

    Again, I’m guessing both V’s, but I can see why they made the final 6.

    Video spotting. No DVDs:

    @TSNRyanRishaug
    The push from the Ab govt continues. This tweet and video refer to the idea that players families can spend time staying and vacationing in the Rockies while the players remain inside the bubble playing games. Part of the pitch to families.

  35. Eh Team says:

    N64: @TSNRyanRishaug
    Notable here for players – there is room for all of them in the JW Marriott across from the arena. There was some concern about this element.

    So do we believe the TSN reporter? Or the Coombs Market goat?

    The amazing thing isn’t that a goat thinks 12×30 =480. It’s that he can ever try to multiply.

    It’s not just the player, it’s players, coaches, trainers and all other support staff. They all need to be contained in the “bubble”. Even then they will be in contact with everyone else needed to put on the games (arena staff) and hotel staff, etc. Those people will be going out into the community daily.

  36. Reja says:

    N64: Now the Black Aces are running the show???

    [ ̄ ̄]ノ( º _ ºノ)


    CBA 16.9 Single Room Accommodations. Any Player on an SPC who is not in the Entry Level
    System shall be entitled to single room accommodations for all Club road trips.

    @TSNRyanRishaug
    Notable here for players – there is room for all of them in the JW Marriott across from the arena.There was some concern about this element.

    So do we believe the TSN reporter? Or the Coombs Market goat?

    The amazing thing isn’t that a goat thinks 12×30 =480. It’s that he can ever try to multiply numbers. Actually that room count works out to 28-29 player rooms per team. And the older coaches away from the Player Village is a good idea in covid world.

    Again, I’m guessing both V’s, but I can see why they made the final 6.

    Video spotting. No DVDs:

    @TSNRyanRishaug
    The push from the Ab govt continues.This tweet and video refer to the idea that players families can spend time staying and vacationing in the Rockies while the players remain inside the bubble playing games.Part of the pitch to families.


    Will they be exempt from receiving $1200 fines if they decide to sightsee in Banff?

  37. N64 says:

    Eh Team: It’s not just the player, it’s players, coaches, trainers and all other support staff. They all need to be contained in the “bubble”.Even then they will be in contact with everyone else needed to put on the games (arena staff) and hotel staff, etc.Those people will be going out into the community daily.

    Actually the coaches, trainers and all other support staff in Edmonton would get the same deal that the players will get in Vancouver i.e Hotel room in detached secondary bubble locations. The difference is Edmonton JWM moves the player into a fully connected primary bubble including the Arena complex.

  38. Victoria Oil says:

    N64: Now the Black Aces are running the show???

    [ ̄ ̄]ノ( º _ ºノ)


    CBA 16.9 Single Room Accommodations. Any Player on an SPC who is not in the Entry Level
    System shall be entitled to single room accommodations for all Club road trips.

    @TSNRyanRishaug
    Notable here for players – there is room for all of them in the JW Marriott across from the arena.There was some concern about this element.

    So do we believe the TSN reporter? Or the Coombs Market goat?

    The amazing thing isn’t that a goat thinks 12×30 =480. It’s that he can ever try to multiply numbers. Actually that room count works out to 28-29 player rooms per team. And the older coaches away from the Player Village is a good idea in covid world.

    Again, I’m guessing both V’s, but I can see why they made the final 6.

    Video spotting. No DVDs:

    @TSNRyanRishaug
    The push from the Ab govt continues.This tweet and video refer to the idea that players families can spend time staying and vacationing in the Rockies while the players remain inside the bubble playing games.Part of the pitch to families.


    Hey, be nice to the Coombs Goat. 🙂

    They don’t have calculators on the Roof.

  39. ArmchairGM says:

    N64: ~ Is Katz sending a DVD to all the players? ~

    Most NHL players: What’s a DVD?

  40. ArmchairGM says:

    Material Elvis: I’ll predict that Byfield is taken before Stutzle.He’s quite a bit younger and has all the tools.

    Unless Detroit holds the #2 slot. I can see them taking Stutzle over Byfield.

  41. OriginalPouzar says:

    meanashell11: So if Chicago wins the lottery and we lose to Chicago we draft 1-3? That is a threat to the integrity of the league is it not? What’s to stop a team who does not think it can go all the way from losing in the play in if their opponent wins the lottery. Not like they will miss the playoff revenue.

    To the extend one of the lotteries is not won by a team that is out (one of the seven teams), it will be shown as a “placeholder”.

    Once the play-in round is complete, the teams that lost will be put in to a second lottery to see who that placeholder is – they will all have equal odds in the second lottery.

    A team will not lose on purpose as they do not know which team will be the “placeholder” that won a lottery – the chances are 3%.

  42. OriginalPouzar says:

    N64: Players at JW Marriot and the connected Ice District configured Olympic Village style.
    Families in the Rockies and/or Edmonton as preferred.
    JWM apparently closed to families until after play-in round.
    Staff in Delta/Sutton with dedicated routes
    Dedicated days at golf courses

    ~ Is Katz sending a DVD to all the players? ~

    Yup, as I predicted, families won’t be allowed “in the bubble” for the first bit. I mean, the play-in round and round robin will last like 6-8 days, from accounts. No need to include family, that’s less time than a long road trip.

    I don’t think family needs to be included for the 1st real round either.

    I can see them being included after that though – those teams are looking at a month plus away.

    I am sure that family members that will want to join will need to undergo self quarantine plus testing for at least a week to 2 weeks leading up.

  43. N64 says:

    OriginalPouzar: To the extend one of the lotteries is not won by a team that is out (one of the seven teams), it will be shown as a “placeholder”.

    Once the play-in round is complete, the teams that lost will be put in to a second lottery to see who that placeholder is – they will all have equal odds in the second lottery.

    A team will not lose on purpose as they do not know which team will be the “placeholder” that won a lottery – the chances are 3%.

    Huh? That non motivating 3% only exists before the first lottery.. The catch is they know the result of the first lottery before they play.

    If the placeholder wins a lottery ticket each losing play-in team will have a 12.5% chance.

    If placeholder win all three tickets in the first draft each losing team would expect a 37.5% chance of getting a ticket.

    Nice of the NHL to let them know exactly how many door prizes are available for loser BEFORE they play

  44. N64 says:

    OriginalPouzar: I don’t think family needs to be included for the 1st real round either.

    I’d go further. I suspect all 3 provinces approved plans don’t even allow them inside the 14 day cohort quarantine. Separate quarantine. We’ll see if the PA objects, but Sportsnet has the leverage.

  45. defmn says:

    Spector makes the case for Edmonton to be one of the playoff cities.

    https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/edmonton-setting-apart-nhl-hub-city-bid/

  46. OriginalPouzar says:

    In my opinion, Kevin Woodly’s weekly spot on the Gregor show is a must listen and today was a great spot.

    From accounts, when you look at Mikko’s adjusted numbers (i.e taking in to account shot quality), he was a top 10 goalie in the NHL as far as goals saves above expected and, in 2020, a top 3.

    When I was very negative towards Mikko and his new contract, many on here would tell me that the team in front of Mikko was a major factor in his performance (which I did end up getting on board with over time) – the adjusted numbers, taking in to account shot quality (i.e. somewhat quality of team), show Mikko is a great light this year.

    —————

    They also chatted about the fact that the team scored more goals with Smith in net and why. There weren’t really any numbers to back up a position on that but, anecdotally, the puck handling was thrown out there.

    The positives with puck handling are quantified – breaking up dump ins, hits saved on d-men, etc. and the numbers apparently show that Smith is one of only a few tenders that actually change the way their opponents forecheck – he is that material in that area.

    From accounts, Mikko was very good this year as well.

    They couldn’t go further and say that it led to more goals scored but could be a factor.

    Just some interesting thoughts bandied about on the spot.

  47. TypeA says:

    Hawkin’s Cheezies are my GOAT snack.

  48. OriginalPouzar says:

    dustrock:
    Reading through Bob’s comments this is going to be a wild draft even beyond the issues of no U-18, no playoffs etc.

    À couple of scouts had Byfield at #6? Wow

    Also interesting Lapierre is at #15. I think he could be a home run but the injury concerns are real.

    According to the list the Oilers would be able to grab Zary or Bourque at #20, sounds good to me.

    From what I know, Lapierre is a top 10 talent in the draft but, yes, the injury concerns are real and they are spectacular.

    Personally, if he is available when the Oilers draft, I would pass on him. The Oilers can’t afford to have this pick bust out and need to be a bit risk adverse – from accounts, the depth of skilled offensive forward is very large and there should be a very good forward prospect available.

  49. N64 says:

    HH tells us 12*30 is 480

    OP tells us teams will not lose on purpose because the chances are only 3%. But they are actually 0% or 12.5% by the time they play

    Might have to wait for Speeds to confirm if they are wrong 😉

  50. OriginalPouzar says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux:
    – our 2015 draft is trending amongst the best drafts of last 10 years when all is said and done: McD, and 3 bona-fide NHL D, all with upside, whose develpment isn’t complete

    – Our roster with Jones, Bear Marino and Mcd: could have been deadly, best draft ever.McD and 2 NHL D: can’t be many better drafts than that.

    –TB had Names, Palat, Kucherov (and I guess Nesterov).But our haul bettern than than that.But thennext year they go Vasil and Pacquette (and I guess Gusev).

    – In three years, they drafted 9 or 10 players on thier team now: that’ how you get ‘er done

    It is turning out to be a spectacular draft – best of the modern era for the org for sure.

    Tough to beat a couple of the early drafts though:

    Lowe, Messier, Anderson drafted in 1979.

    Coffey, Kurri, Moog drafted in 1980.

  51. OriginalPouzar says:

    defmn: This is the argument I have made for re-signing Green as a mentor for Jones and Bear. As long as the money works and Green can still handle 3rd pair minutes it is invaluable to have an experienced player teaching the younger guys on the finer points of how to play their type of game.

    Hopefully the NHL is able to return to play and the Oilers make a healthy run with a healthy Mike Green.

    I need to see more of this player as I do think that Holland intends to re-sign him and I do think it could be for 2 years and over $2MM.

    Early usage (in his two games) shows the coaching staff thinks he has up the lineup game left – he did kill possession during those two games.

    Whether its Benning or Green that is re-signed, I think the term will be two years – partially for expansion draft exposure requirements – if they do end up wanting/needing to protect Jones, they will need someone to expose – could be Lagesson but he may not play enough games to qualify.

  52. OriginalPouzar says:

    Gerta Rauss: The lottery held this week will be among the 7 teams that are not participating in the play in round

    If one of the lottery balls reveals that teams 8 thru 15 have won one(or more) of the 3 lottery spots, those results will not be made public until much later in the summer – so the teams participating in the “play in” round will know that a lottery spot is up for grabs, they just won’t know WHO won the spot until the 2nd lottery

    Once the 8 play in “losers” are determined, a 2nd lottery will be held with each of the losing teams having a 12.5% chance of acquiring that lottery spot

    If CHI beats Edmonton, CHI will not participate in either of the lottery draws, they will move on to the 16 team playoffs

    If the 3 lottery balls drawn this week are awarded to the 7 teams participating the lottery, there will be NO 2nd lottery, and the rest of the draft order will be determined by points percentage based on regular season results

    Great explanation – better worded than the one I through out (after this post but before I read this post).

    Question on the last paragraph – the rest of the draft order being based on points percentage, is that for teams 8-31 or just 8-15?

    I would think 16-31 are based on real playoff results, as per normal?

  53. jp says:

    ArmchairGM:
    Any love for overager Egor Sokolov as a late-round target?

    Lordy, 6’4”, 240 lbs and 52-46-46-92 in the Q?

    He can’t be too fleet but that beast appears to have some skill.

    He’s ranked in the top 100 by McKenzie and Central Scouting so he likely won’t last too late. A worthy pick it seems though.

    Edit: Holland has a pretty strong history drafting overagers. He’s not shy and has hit on more than a few over the years.

  54. OriginalPouzar says:

    digger50: Perhaps, but the comment was on the “filthy” type of mentoring. Gryba and Nurse together were a mean combination. Sekera would bring a different type of skill mentoring, which was much harder as Darnell brought to the puck up the ice, over the blue line…….and into the corner.

    I do love Nurse though and would not be looking to trade him. I see him emerging as a leader for Bear, Jones, Broberg, Laggeson…Samurokov…

    Aside from a few (the vast minority), I don’t think anyone wants to not have Nurse on the team but, at some point, something likely needs to give with the leftorium – to open up cap space and to acquire help at another area.

    Nurse has will have trade value after this season (even with only a year to UFA status) and, if there is another d-man that shows capable of playing 2LD minutes for a vastly reduced price, it may make sense, friendship notwithstanding. Jones at $850K.

    Now, I am in no way saying that Jones could just replace Nurse and what he brings to the team – not at all. What I am saying is that, if Jones proves to be a legit 2LD, even if inferior to Nurse, the cap savings plus the asset acquisition may lead to a trade making the team better.

    I’m not advocating for a Nurse trade, and certainly not until after this season (if ever), but cap management is going to be a primary concern indefinitely, and Nurse is already expensive (value though) and will be even more expensive in a few years.

    Yes, I know the argument about “dead money” coming off the books that can be used but there will always be players needing raises. Yamamoto in one year, Nuge in one year. Bear (maybe now, maybe in a year or two). Maybe AA if he rebounds. Maybe Benson if he pops.

  55. OriginalPouzar says:

    Harpers Hair: Problem is the Marriott only has 346 rooms.

    If each team has 30 players, they will need 480 rooms.

    Ya, I did the math on that a few days ago and came to a similar conclusion (although 12 X 30 is 360 rooms).

    They are stating that all the players can fit in the Marriott and then, when the play-in is done, and they move on to real round 1, all required can fit in the Marriot.

    Doesn’t line up with the amount of rooms they have posted on their website though. Its only short by a few but teams may have more than 30 players – 28 skaters plus 3 or, even 4, goalies.

    Perhaps there are “devil in the details” about bottom end roster players at another hotel or shared rooms?

  56. OriginalPouzar says:

    N64: Now the Black Aces are running the show???

    [ ̄ ̄]ノ( º _ ºノ)


    CBA 16.9 Single Room Accommodations. Any Player on an SPC who is not in the Entry Level
    System shall be entitled to single room accommodations for all Club road trips.

    @TSNRyanRishaug
    Notable here for players – there is room for all of them in the JW Marriott across from the arena.There was some concern about this element.

    So do we believe the TSN reporter? Or the Coombs Market goat?

    The amazing thing isn’t that a goat thinks 12×30 =480. It’s that he can ever try to multiply numbers. Actually that room count works out to 28-29 player rooms per team. And the older coaches away from the Player Village is a good idea in covid world.

    Again, I’m guessing both V’s, but I can see why they made the final 6.

    Video spotting. No DVDs:

    @TSNRyanRishaug
    The push from the Ab govt continues.This tweet and video refer to the idea that players families can spend time staying and vacationing in the Rockies while the players remain inside the bubble playing games.Part of the pitch to families.


    His math was wrong but its still not enough rooms.

    I think, at minimum, teams will be allowed 28 skaters and there had/has been talk of it being 30 skaters – that’s plus unlimited goalies – each team will bring at least 3, if not 4.

  57. N64 says:

    OriginalPouzar: Ya, I did the math on that a few days ago and came to a similar conclusion (although 12 X 30 is 360 rooms).

    They are stating that all the players can fit in the Marriott and then, when the play-in is done, and they move on to real round 1, all required can fit in the Marriot.

    Doesn’t line up with the amount of rooms they have posted on their website though.Its only short by a few but teams may have more than 30 players – 28 skaters plus 3 or, even 4, goalies.

    Perhaps there are “devil in the details” about bottom end roster players at another hotel or shared rooms?

    Black aces can have roomies. Problem solved. CBA permits

  58. Rondo says:

    LT,

    Using your beliefs regarding Covid-19. Where is the virus going? Why would anyone play sports again?

    Only real possibilites of playing sports using your beliefs

    1. Vaccine
    2. Virus mutates into something much weaker
    3. Virus dies
    4. Herd immunity

    Don’t forget the regular flu kills more young people by many multiples than Covid-19. We should all live in bubbles for the rest of our lives. Why would anyone think you could play hockey this summer using your beliefs.

    I believe in option 4.

  59. McNuge93 says:

    OriginalPouzar,

    I disagree. We can aford to spend more on our defence especially once cap space opens up in the future once Russel and Neal are gone. . We need to build our defence. And keeping a guy like Nurse is key, big mean fast and decent offensively. We currently do not pay any defenceman more than $6 mil and need to be prepared to open the wallet in the future.

  60. defmn says:

    Rondo:
    LT,

    Using your beliefs regarding Covid-19. Where is the virus going? Why would anyone play sports again?

    Only realpossibilites of playing sportsusing your beliefs

    1. Vaccine
    2. Virus mutates into somethingmuch weaker
    3. Virus dies
    4. Herd immunity

    Don’t forgetthe regular flu kills more young people by many multiples than Covid-19. We should all live in bubbles for the rest of our lives.

    I believe in option 4.

    There will be more than casual interest in the infection rate in the next week or two down around Tulsa by those who host large sporting events.

  61. OriginalPouzar says:

    Eh Team: It’s not just the player, it’s players, coaches, trainers and all other support staff. They all need to be contained in the “bubble”.Even then they will be in contact with everyone else needed to put on the games (arena staff) and hotel staff, etc.Those people will be going out into the community daily.

    The issue is Edmonton only has one 5-star hotel and they want to get all the players in there during the play-in. Coaches, trainers, etc. will have to slum it at the Sutton Place, etc. for the first week.

    There is plenty of good enough hotels for everyone if they can fit the pretentious players all in the Marriot for a week.

  62. N64 says:

    Rondo: Don’t forget the regular flu kills more young people by many multiples than Covid-19. We should all live in bubbles for the rest of our lives.

    Give it a break. 1918 sure. Swine Flu. No. Seasonal flu. No.

    Sports without fans is resuming .

  63. N64 says:

    OriginalPouzar: The issue is Edmonton only has one 5-star hotel and they want to get all the players in there during the play-in.Coaches, trainers, etc. will have to slum it at the Sutton Place, etc. for the first week.

    There is plenty of good enough hotels for everyone if they can fit the pretentious players all in the Marriot for a week.

    The 5 star hotels elsewhere are not integrated into a single village witt the arena

    In Van players and staff would be in 5 star secondary bubbles. In Edmonton players get 5 star in the main bubble. Tough call for the PA?

  64. OriginalPouzar says:

    N64: Black aces can have roomies. Problem solved. CBA permits

    CBA permits but this isn’t being governed by the CBA rules in these matters. This type of nuances will be part of the Return to Play plan to be voted on.

    One would think that the PA wouldn’t have an issue with this but you never know – they are highly concerned about “life in the bubble”.

    Of course, we are talking about one week – then all who is left can have their own room at the fancy hotel.

  65. OriginalPouzar says:

    Rondo:
    LT,

    Using your beliefs regarding Covid-19. Where is the virus going? Why would anyone play sports again?

    Only realpossibilites of playing sportsusing your beliefs

    1. Vaccine
    2. Virus mutates into somethingmuch weaker
    3. Virus dies
    4. Herd immunity

    Don’t forgetthe regular flu kills more young people by many multiples than Covid-19. We should all live in bubbles for the rest of our lives. Why would anyone think you could play hockeythis summer using your beliefs.

    I believe in option 4.

    The NHL is proposing a hub city “bubble” cut off from general society.

    In theory, the players (and others) in the bubble should be safer than those in regular society.

  66. N64 says:

    OriginalPouzar: CBA permits but this isn’t being governed by the CBA rules in these matters. This type of nuances will be part of the Return to Play plan to be voted on.

    One would think that the PA wouldn’t have an issue with this but you never know – they are highly concerned about “life in the bubble”.

    Of course, we are talking about one week – then all who is left can have their own room at the fancy hotel.

    Sure, But their norms include young players rooming on road trips.i really doubt they care if black aces share at the start.

  67. Rondo says:

    N64,

    I would but you guys are wrong, and i’m using your beliefs to take it to the nth degree. Sports without fans won’t work eventually the players and staff would need to see their family.

    But I’ll stop because this is a hockey blog.

  68. OriginalPouzar says:

    McNuge93:
    OriginalPouzar,

    I disagree. We can aford to spend more on our defence especially once cap space opens up in the future once Russel and Neal are gone. . We need to build our defence. And keeping a guy like Nurse is key, big mean fast and decent offensively. We currently do not pay any defenceman more than $6 mil and need to be prepared to open the wallet in the future.

    I mentioned the theory that “dead cap space” comes off and can be used for a raise to Nurse. This was including the likes of Neal and Rusty coming off the books.

    Of course, as I said, its not just Nurse that will need to be paid, even more, but Nuge and Yamamoto and Bear and then Jones and then hopefully AA and hopefully Benson and then Bouchard.

    Its never going to stop and the team will always need to manage at the upper end of the cap – seemingly.

    I’m not saying, and I was clear on this, that i want to trade a guy like Nurse, however, at some point, the cap space gained plus the asset acquisition, when there is organizational depth at the position, may make it logical.

    I understand the other viewpoint as well and don’t necessarily disagree with it – there are many developing factors in this including Klefbom’s future ability to stay healthy, current young d-men development, etc.

  69. OriginalPouzar says:

    N64: The 5 star hotels elsewhere are not integrated into a single village witt the arena

    In Van players and staff would be in 5 star secondary bubbles. In Edmonton players get 5 star in the main bubble. Tough call for the PA?

    The players may prefer the hotel situation in Vegas or Vancouver or wherever – I’m not in their mind.

    I would think they would be fine with all players at the Marriott but who knows what is most important to them.

    All I was saying is that the CBA provisions on accomodations don’t really factor in as the entire format and all the logistics are subject to a vote that supersedes current CBA provisions.

  70. leadfarmer says:

    Rondo:
    LT,

    Using your beliefs regarding Covid-19. Where is the virus going? Why would anyone play sports again?

    Only realpossibilites of playing sportsusing your beliefs

    1. Vaccine
    2. Virus mutates into somethingmuch weaker
    3. Virus dies
    4. Herd immunity

    Don’t forgetthe regular flu kills more young people by many multiples than Covid-19. We should all live in bubbles for the rest of our lives. Why would anyone think you could play hockeythis summer using your beliefs.

    I believe in option 4.

    You need to get off that YouTube “research”. This is not the flu.
    Just because you get immune to it or get a vaccine doesn’t mean you will be immune to the virus the next time it mutates and makes it’s rounds. They are already finding this virus is different than the original strains. You don’t need to live in bubbles but you need to be cautious.

  71. Glovjuice says:

    I get the don’t bend and trade Puljujarvi for a second but isn’t this a draft where we NEED a second? Isn’t it that good of a draft ? If no, then don’t make that trade but sure seems like a lot of good players will be available in round 2.

  72. jp says:

    digger50: I actually give credit to Eric Gryba for bringing Nurse along in his first year. Grubs could get walked but he sure played the corners and front of the net hard. He was also a good team guy and I think that benefitted Nurse.

    godot10: I believe Nurse spent more time with Sekera (when all the injuries hit), and Reinhart more time with Gryba.

    Nurse played more with Sekera in his first year and more with Gryba in his 2nd.

  73. N64 says:

    OriginalPouzar: The players may prefer the hotel situation in Vegas or Vancouver or wherever – I’m not in their mind.

    I would think they would be fine with all players at the Marriott but who knows what is most important to them.

    All I was saying is that the CBA provisions on accomodations don’t really factor in as the entire format and all the logistics are subject to a vote that supersedes current CBA provisions.

    My point was that the players are going to be more interested in their 5 star deal than the staffs 4 star.

    Was referring to the CBA only as a proxy for normal expectations for black aces.

  74. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    OriginalPouzar: It is turning out to be a spectacular draft – best of the modern era for the org for sure.

    – The 20015 draft is amongst the best drafts in the league in the last 10 – 15 years. Could possibly be the best when it plays out.

    – By far the Oiler’s best. Those early years to be sure. But treding for 4 players that have impact: even those early 80’s drafts had three: But Messier, Anderson, Coffey, Lowe, Kurri, Fuhr, Moog, Smith Podnuby in 3 years: Thats multiple lines and D pairings and G for a generation of winning

    – The guy they never drafted probably helped a little bit too…

    – The equivalent would have been in the 3 years around McD’s draft you cashed: Bear, Jones, Marino, Kailer, Jessie, Benson, Skinner, Samo type thing: a bunch of players and lines that really build the foundation. We don’t have that of course….

  75. N64 says:

    leadfarmer: You need to get off that YouTube “research”. This is not the flu.
    Just because you get immune to it or get a vaccine doesn’t mean you will be immune to the virus the next time it mutates and makes it’s rounds.They are already finding this virus is different than the original strains. You don’t need to live in bubbles but you need to be cautious.

    Every bug that persists has different advantages. Influenza best trick is shape shifting. Coronaviruses in general seem to rely less on shape shifting and more on immunity decay. Hard to say what this one will do. But I would not bet the farm.

  76. N64 says:

    Reja: Will they be exempt from receiving $1200 fines if they decide to sightsee in Banff?

    More of check box item that if border opens wider the Edmonton bid will cover whatever families want.

    @TSNRyanRishaug
    Clarification on the family element, I’m told family involvement will be decided by public health officials and the NHL, based on the public health environment at the time. If the public health situation warrants it, these are options OEG has helped arrange for families.

  77. Glovjuice says:

    TypeA:
    Hawkin’s Cheezies are my GOAT snack.

    And a VERY clean ingredient list as well for a salty snack food. I have an MSc in food science (well, food microbiology) so know this sort of thing.

  78. nelson88 says:

    Don’t live in Edmonton and have been to Rogers but not to JW Marriott. Talk about it not having enough rooms for 12 team hub but isn’t the top of the tower luxury condos?. If it’s like everywhere else in the world significant portion would be Airbnb. Understand it would make “bubble” more challenging but is it feasible to use that space?

  79. till_horcoff_is_coach says:

    The lottery is going to be fascinating. There is about the same chance of a play-in loser winning first overall pick as the Senators! It’s twice as likely for a placeholder team to win then the wings.

    It’s also not unthinkable there will be 2 placeholders from the lottery. If that’s the case then each team that loses in the play-in would have a 27% chance of picking on the top 3! (1/8 + 1/7)

    The players will go all-out to win, but every fan would be grinning no-matter the result of every game. It’s certainly biased, but as a fan of play-in team that would be fantastic.

  80. N64 says:

    ArmchairGM: Most NHL players: What’s a DVD?

    Heatley knew .

  81. N64 says:

    nelson88: Talk about it not having enough rooms for 12 team hub

    Lots of room for regular roster. Some of the black aces would share 5* accomodationm. Small upgrade from the AHL.

    Still guessing Van and Vegas.

  82. jp says:

    A little more on Holland drafting overage players. Just looking through his Detroit drafts for examples of overage players that made it (so not really any context on how many were drafted or how it compares to other teams).

    1989 53rd Nic Lidstrom age 19 1564GP
    1989 116th Dallas Drake age 20 1009GP
    1990 129th Jason York age 20 757GP
    1991 76th Mike Knuble age 19 1068GP
    1992 46th Darren McCarty age 20 758GP
    1992 238th Dan McGillis age 20 634GP
    1994 257th Tomas Holmstrom age 21 1026GP
    1998 171th Pavel Datsyuk age 20 953GP
    2000 29th Nik Kronwall age 19 953GP
    2003 64th Jimmy Howard age 19 543GP
    2004 97th Johan Franzen age 24 602GP
    2008 121st Gustav Nyquist age 19 570GP
    2011 205th Aleksey Marchenko age 19 121GP
    2013 79th Mattias Janmark age 20 297GP

    Wow. Pretty sure that’s a ton of high end players drafted as overagers compared to most teams. Not certain on the full context but yeah. Come on down Egor Sokolov?

  83. Scungilli Slushy says:

    jp:
    A little more on Holland drafting overage players. Just looking through his Detroit drafts for examples of overage players that made it (so not really any context on how many were drafted or how it compares to other teams).

    1989 53rd Nic Lidstrom age 19 1564GP
    1989 116th Dallas Drake age 20 1009GP
    1990 129th Jason York age 20 757GP
    1991 76th Mike Knuble age 19 1068GP
    1992 46th Darren McCarty age 20 758GP
    1992 238th Dan McGillis age 20 634GP
    1994 257th Tomas Holmstrom age 21 1026GP
    1998 171th Pavel Datsyuk age 20 953GP
    2000 29th Nik Kronwall age 19 953GP
    2003 64th Jimmy Howard age 19 543GP
    2004 97th Johan Franzen age 24 602GP
    2008 121st Gustav Nyquist age 19 570GP
    2011 205th Aleksey Marchenko age 19 121GP
    2013 79th Mattias Janmark age 20 297GP

    Wow. Pretty sure that’s a ton of high end players drafted as overagers compared to most teams. Not certain on the full context but yeah. Come on down Egor Sokolov?

    There are few markets unexplored now as to when the Wings looked outside of the box because they were too successful, and had a long run of later picks, because of them.

  84. OriginalPouzar says:

    Glovjuice:
    I get the don’t bend and trade Puljujarvi for a second but isn’t this a draft where we NEED a second? Isn’t it that good of a draft ? If no, then don’t make that trade but sure seems like a lot of good players will be available in round 2.

    A second round pick would be great in this draft, it is, from accounts, quite deep at skilled forward.

    I wouldn’t trade Puljujarvi for a 2nd rounder straight up – even though its a deep draft, I don’t consider that appropriate value as I think he is a middle six NHL player right now, potentially even a top 6.

  85. Scungilli Slushy says:

    So if the league wants a western and eastern hub, they are going to pick Edmonton?

    TO and Vegas it will be.

  86. OriginalPouzar says:

    jp:
    Nurse played more with Sekera in his first year and more with Gryba in his 2nd.

    Ya, he split his time with Gryba and Benning – almost entirely 3rd pairing in the 2nd year (after being forced up the lineup in his rookie season).

    In that second year, other than close to 300 minutes with each of Gryba and Benning, he played 63 with Larsson.

    ————

    In is rookie year, it was Sekera (on his off-side) and Shultz and then almost 200 minutes with Clandenning.

    Ughhh.

    The defensive depth has come a LONG ways.

  87. OriginalPouzar says:

    jp:
    A little more on Holland drafting overage players. Just looking through his Detroit drafts for examples of overage players that made it (so not really any context on how many were drafted or how it compares to other teams).

    1989 53rd Nic Lidstrom age 19 1564GP
    1989 116th Dallas Drake age 20 1009GP
    1990 129th Jason York age 20 757GP
    1991 76th Mike Knuble age 19 1068GP
    1992 46th Darren McCarty age 20 758GP
    1992 238th Dan McGillis age 20 634GP
    1994 257th Tomas Holmstrom age 21 1026GP
    1998 171th Pavel Datsyuk age 20 953GP
    2000 29th Nik Kronwall age 19 953GP
    2003 64th Jimmy Howard age 19 543GP
    2004 97th Johan Franzen age 24 602GP
    2008 121st Gustav Nyquist age 19 570GP
    2011 205th Aleksey Marchenko age 19 121GP
    2013 79th Mattias Janmark age 20 297GP

    Wow. Pretty sure that’s a ton of high end players drafted as overagers compared to most teams. Not certain on the full context but yeah. Come on down Egor Sokolov?

    That’s a ridiculous list…..

  88. OriginalPouzar says:

    Scungilli Slushy:
    So if the league wants a western and eastern hub, they are going to pick Edmonton?

    TO and Vegas it will be.

    The league would prefer an Eastern and a Western Hub.

    The league would prefer a hub in the US and a hub in Canada.

    At the end of the day, those are preferences but not requirements.

    It could very well be Edmonton and Vancouver or Vegas and Vancouver.

    Yes, of course, Vegas and TO is a legit option as well but, with recent public outcry due to positive tests, and players getting “louder”, a place like TO may be falling down the list (Vegas as well).

  89. OriginalPouzar says:

    While you can understand the concern with the COVID-19 cases spiking in Nevada, a source over the weekend said the NHL bubble plans to be very tight in Phase 4 during the actual tournament and that the league at this point isn’t overly concerned and still has Vegas as a strong option.

    But I think what the Oilers stressed last week in their tweaked approach is that they can get 32 people from each of 12 NHL organizations in the JW Marriott for the play-in round, which means all the NHL roster players plus coaches and trainers. Other team staff could stay at the Delta or Sutton Place. It’s believed all 12 organizations will have about 50 people each in total (players and staff) in the hub city.

    But Vegas is appealing for all kinds of reasons, to players as well, and again what I keep being told is that the proposed Vegas bubble will be airtight, perhaps the tightest of all the bubbles being proposed. Nobody gets in that isn’t supposed to, nobody gets out. So I think the NHL feels pretty good about the proposed Vegas setup.

    https://theathletic.com/1886196/2020/06/22/lebrun-whats-next-after-nhl-narrows-focus-in-hub-city-selection-process/

  90. Gerta Rauss says:

    OriginalPouzar: Great explanation – better worded than the one I through out (after this post but before I read this post).

    Question on the last paragraph – the rest of the draft order being based on points percentage, is that for teams 8-31 or just 8-15?

    I would think 16-31 are based on real playoff results, as per normal?

    To the best of my knowledge, the league has not made public how the draft order will be determined for the playoff teams (16-31)

    When Gary gave his press conference a couple weeks ago he only mentioned the lottery format and teams 1-15

    It’ll be tricky for the league, as they’ve already pushed their chips in using points percentage for teams 8 thru 15

    This is from Wiki so it may not be 100% accurate:

    -The teams that did not qualify for the playoffs the previous season (picks 1–15)
    -The teams that made the playoffs in the previous season but did not win either their division in the regular season or play in the Conference Finals (picks 16–23 up to 27)
    -The teams that won their divisions in the previous season but did not play in the Conference Finals (potentially picks 24–27)
    -The teams that lose in Conference Finals (picks 28 and 29)
    -The team that was the runner-up in the Stanley Cup Finals (pick 30)
    -The team that won the Stanley Cup in the previous season (pick 31)

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NHL_Entry_Draft

    So there is a lot to juggle there with the teams having played a different number of games (and no official division winners determined)

    I think they’ll just use points percentage for teams 16-27 and then the conference finalists will be 28 and 29, Cup finalist will be 30, and Cup champ 31

    That’s just me guessing though

  91. OriginalPouzar says:

    I understand points percentage for teams 8-15 (non-lottery winners) but, for the teams in the 16 team playoffs, I would think its normal seeding based off of round eliminated and points percentage among the team in the eliminated group.

  92. Gerta Rauss says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    I understand points percentage for teams 8-15 (non-lottery winners) but, for the teams in the 16 team playoffs, I would think its normal seeding based off of round eliminated and points percentage among the team in the eliminated group.

    there you go, yes, that makes more sense

  93. Greenberg says:

    To LT re your Dad.
    I passed along your tribute yesterday to your father
    to someone in Port Hope, Ontario, and today I received
    this reply from her: “You have made a lot of people happy
    by sending it along . I had 7 thank yous this morning.”

    Never underestimate the influence of your well-considered
    thoughts, Blessings, k

  94. Lowetide says:

    Greenberg:
    To LT re your Dad.
    I passed along your tribute yesterday to your father
    to someone in Port Hope, Ontario, and today I received
    this reply from her: “You have made a lot of people happy
    by sending it along . I had 7 thank yous this morning.”

    Never underestimate the influence of your well-considered
    thoughts, Blessings, k

    That’s so kind of you to tell me, thanks!

  95. jp says:

    Scungilli Slushy: There are few markets unexplored now as to when the Wings looked outside of the box because they were too successful, and had a long run of later picks, because of them.

    Well Holland is still looking to overage players (Konovalov was 21 and Bumel 19 this past draft). But you’re right the market inefficiency may have corrected as the success rate has gone down in more recent years.

  96. Material Elvis says:

    ArmchairGM: Unless Detroit holds the #2 slot. I can see them taking Stutzle over Byfield.

    You don’t think they would want the future 1C? Other than Larkin, their center depth is very thin. Maybe Valeno pans out for them but Byfield is a more substantial prospect.

  97. Lowetide says:

    New for The Athletic: 10 things to look for at Oilers training camp and the 2020 playoffs

    https://theathletic.com/1884896/2020/06/23/lowetide-10-things-to-look-for-at-oilers-training-camp-and-the-2020-playoffs/

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