Some Roads bring Renewal, Some Roads Hide and Wait

Although 2018-19 was Connor McDavid’s most challenging year since his rookie campaign, the quality of his time on ice was obvious. When on the ice with Leon Draisaitl at even strength (888 minutes), Edmonton outscored opponents 75-60 (55.56 percent). Music!

When McDavid was on the ice (at even strength) without Draisaitl? Goals were 22-34 (39.29 percent) and that’s a concern. Draisaitl without McDavid? 19-30 (38.78 percent). Oilers without McDavid and Draisaitl on the ice at even strength? 64-85, 42.95. What the hell? Exactly.

THE ATHLETIC!

The Athletic Edmonton features a fabulous cluster of stories (some linked below, some on the site). Great perspective from a ridiculous group of writers and analysts. Proud to be part of the group, here’s an incredible Offer!

  • New Lowetide: Kailer Yamamoto has the talent to win a job with the Oilers on merit, if he’s healthy.
  • Jonathan Willis: Jesse Puljujarvi still has upside and the Oilers’ patient approach is the right one
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: Q&A: Dave Tippett on rounding out his coaching staff, fixing Oilers’ special teams and using Connor McDavid
  • Lowetide: Handicapping the Oilers’ young defencemen and their chances of replacing Andrej Sekera
  • Lowetide: Is Kirill Maksimov progressing as the Edmonton Oilers’ next great hope for a true homegrown sniper?
  • Jonathan Willis: Oilers ease pressure on crowded defensive pipeline by trading John Marino to the Penguins
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: What the 2021-22 Oilers might look like after their steady build toward contender status
  • Lowetide: Joel Persson is ideally situated to win an opening night roster spot with the Oilers
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: What the 2019-20 Oilers might look like without trade missteps.
  • Lowetide: Finding the best candidates for the final two spots on the Oilers skill lines in 2019-20.
  • Jonathan Willis: Projecting the Oilers’ opening night lineup, line combinations and more.
  • Lowetide: Does the James Neal acquisition impact Oilers’ prospects in 2019-20?
  • Lowetide: Oilers’ acquisition of James Neal could add badly needed scoring to the top two lines.
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: Ken Holland puts his stamp on the Oilers with first big move in Lucic-Neal trade
  • Jonathan Willis: Ken Holland ends an ugly situation for the Oilers by trading Milan Lucic for James Neal
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: Potential free-agent options for the Oilers in 2020
  • Jonathan Willis: Which Oilers defencemen can make an outlet pass?
  • Lowetide: Looking ahead to Oilers training camp: 35 players for 23 jobs
  • Jonathan Willis: Josh Archibald won’t fix the Oilers’ biggest problems, but he’ll help with some key issues.
  • Lowetide: Will the 2019-20 Bakersfield Condors be the Oilers’ best minor-league team ever?
  • Lowetide: Oilers top 20 prospects summer 2019.

THE WHO BY NUMBERS

The Oilers a year ago were so bad that the McDavid double shifts went for a powder. McDavid and Ryan Nugent-Hopkins played together for 351 minutes (even strength, without Leon) and were outscored 16-19 (45.71).

McDavid with Draisaitl and Kassian at even strength? 27-22 in 292 minutes. McDavid with Kassian and without Leon? 4-7 in 145 minutes.

McDavid with Draisaitl and Chiasson at even strength? 19-15 in 263 minutes. McDavid with Chiasson and without Leon? 2-5 in 41 minutes. All of this is available via NaturalStatTrick and is a fascinating look at a frustrating season.

TIPPETT’S OPTIONS

James Neal is an obvious option to add to either the McDavid or (likely) Nuge line, Edmonton needs him to shoot the puck 200 times and post something close to a 10 percent shooting percentage. Neal delivered 141 shots last season, suspect he’ll pass that total (if healthy). I am close to the end of the RE estimates and still haven’t decided on Neal’s power-play time.

I think Tippett will try Neal with Nuge on the second line, that’s the logical solution. Part of the issue is Nuge’s performance last season with possible solutions. At even strength, his goal differentials with partner: Sam Gagner (6-12 in 130 minutes); Zack Kassian (13-10 in 193 minutes); Jujhar Khaira (8-9 in 185 minutes); Alex Chiasson (13-15 in 315 minutes).

So, I think Tippett might look at the math and the tape and decide to go Draisaitl-McDavid-Kassian, secure in the knowledge the trio were 27-22 in about 300 minutes of even strength time.

He might also decide to run Nuge with Neal and Chiasson, two more veterans. He said as much recently. Now. We know there are a bunch of options, veterans and kids, pushing for playing time on skill lines. Who would be first on your list?

THIRD LINE

We’ve been discussing Gaetan Haas as the possible third line center, although Dave Tippett did tell Daniel Nugent Bowman that Sam Gagner played some pivot for him in Phoenix. Jujhar Khaira was also mentioned recently.

I wonder about a Khaira-Gagner combination on the No. 3 line, with Gagner taking RH faceoffs and Khaira the LH faceoffs. Khaira is unable to win enough faceoffs against either left or right to be considered a strong option. I think there’s something to Khaira, he’s a worthwhile third-line option. Right now, it’s more about Haas than we’d like it to be, Holland clearly values him.

TIPPETT ON TYLER BENSON

“Tyler Benson is one of those guys. He could come in here and find a niche and push somebody out or push somebody down in the lineup. I’m hoping we have situations like that because that makes your team better.” Source

This quote has been made in one form or another by every Oilers coach since Slats. It’s a good sign, these young prospects are close enough to be evaluated seriously, and in some cases might win jobs. Important to recognize what is happening here: The head coach is discussing Benson on the NHL roster, pushing more established players down the depth chart.

TIPPETT AND KHAIRA

One of the things I’m looking forward to this winter is Tippett’s usage of players who can help but are not complete players. Brad Richardson, Jordan Martinook, et cetera. I think Khaira and Josh Archibald are two candidates and hope Tippett has enough time to see Matt Benning and what he can do to help a team.

Buck Rodgers, the old Expos manager, rebooted so many careers simply by not worrying about what the player couldn’t do, and focusing on strengths. Otis Nixon hits popups to shortstop? Well, he can bunt and run fast enough to beat out infield hits, and we can pinch run him when he isn’t in the lineup. Same with Rex Hudler. He straightened away Dennis Martinez and turned Tim Burke into a solid closer. I believe Dave Tippett will impact a few players that way.

LOWDOWN WITH LOWETIDE

A fun Friday to end the week and kickstart the long weekend. TSN1260, beginning at 10. Steve Lansky will be by to talk Jays at the trade deadline and a huge Argos win. Schuyler Dixon covers the Cowboys for AP Dallas-Ft. Worth and we’ll talk Cowboys. Matt Iwanyk will stop in to chat about tomorrow’s game (Esks-Stamps) in which the winner will be in first place.

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140 Responses to "Some Roads bring Renewal, Some Roads Hide and Wait"

  1. London Jon says:

    I would be very surprised if Haas is pencilled in by Tippett for 3C on opening night.

    He wasn’t elite playing, I believe, 2C in a very mediocre Swiss league. You’d therefore have to think he’s a weaker option than Cave and Marody. And probably even Malone, McLeod, Gagner, Granlund and Khaira.

    Marody should make a bigger year on year improvement than Haas as he’s younger and was a top tier 1C in a much better league. And he knows the team and systems.

    Looks pretty nailed on to me that Holland is going to use the last dregs is of cap space for a legit 3C. And if that guy gets jumped by Haas or Marody then great

  2. Jethro Tull says:

    London Jon,

    I hope there isn’t a huge disconnect between the GM and coach, like Chia and TMac and Chia and Hitch.

    Half the weird deployment decisions I’m convinced we’re to try to show Pete that Caggs wasn’t a first line player.

  3. BONE207 says:

    Those numbers with CONNOR & Leon!!!

    So sad…we have to teach them better defense. Bring back the trap, the 321 structure (right Ricki) & hope for a couple of extra stops from our old tenders.

    Happy Friday

  4. London Jon says:

    Jethro Tull:
    London Jon,

    I hope there isn’t a huge disconnect between the GM and coach, like Chia and TMac and Chia and Hitch.

    Half the weird deployment decisions I’m convinced we’re to try to show Pete that Caggs wasn’t a first line player.

    Yeah, there were some weird decisions that looked like the coach proving something to ChiaPete or ChiaPete trying to force something that the coach wasn’t on board with to try and save his skin.

    The comments on the Athletic around the Wild interviewing PC are pretty funny. Why wouldn’t they want him as their new GM 😂😂😂

  5. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    – Write this down: Benson isn’t on the starting roster game 1, barring a huge string of injuries. Good teams don’t operate that way. Here are the wingers with more tenure, recent acquisitions, and/or have more experience and higher up the pecking order competing for one of the 5 winger slots in the top-9, and you can pretty much slot in all of them now anyways:

    – Chiasson, Kassian, Neal, Archibald, Jurco, Jar, Gagner, Pool, Kailer, Nygard, Granlund, Marody, Malone, Gambardella (that’s 14 and I”m sure I missed some)

    – Now by the end of the year, sure all bets are off. But the off-season acquisitions were designed to get burners and prevent a Benson (or Kailer) from being on the opening day roster: His “effort:, or “showing up in real good shape” or “giving everyone a chance”are side shows. Don’t fall for the tricks of the trade. Won’t happen.

    – By the end of the year: I’m equally as certain that he will play games in the NHL (barring injury)

  6. HenryDrix says:

    Sounds like we have our Next Gen Gretzky and Kurri. Why split them up, it works soooo well.

  7. LadiesloveSmid says:

    Good Gord.

    Like they need 3 top 6 wingers but they need a damn 3C! Gaetan Haas should be counted on to be the 14th F, not the 7th.

  8. OriginalPouzar says:

    I noticed the McDavid 39% without Drai about a week ago and was shocked. That’s got to be an anomaly, right?

  9. OriginalPouzar says:

    In 17/18, McDavid was 57% without Drai and Drai was 42% without McDavid. They were 57% together.

    In 16/17, McDavid was 65% without Drai and Drai was 44% without McDavid. They were 59% together.

    In the last three years, McDavid is 55% without Drai and Drai is 41% without McDavid and they’ve been 58% together.

    This past year was an anomaly I think.

  10. Andy Dufresne says:

    “I wonder about a Khaira-Gagner combination on the No. 3 line, with Gagner taking RH faceoffs and Khaira the LH faceoffs. Khaira is unable to win enough faceoffs against either left or right to be considered a strong option. I think there’s something to Khaira, he’s a worthwhile third-line option. Right now, it’s more about Haas than we’d like it to be, Holland clearly values him.”

    Khaira has been a darling/favorite on this site for some time, and rightly so as an early 20’s, big, strong, fast moving, hard hitting forward who plays up and down the lineup at $650K.

    But Khaira is entering his 25 year old season, and just had his pay “Doubled”. This is a show me year for Khaira imo. He’s going to show us who he is one way or another. Either he steps up his offense at least a little and learns to play a role as a 3C or even 2RW (his peak level potential) at some point or he is once and for all cast as a bottom six winger. That is not to say that he is not valubale in that role. He is.

    But after this year, he loses his window of opportunity to take that next step with guys like Benson, Lavoie, Yamo and others ready to eat his lunch.

    Probability wise, Khaira is a very good 4th line winger. Maybe thats his destiny. at $1.2m he would have to be an above average 4th line winger. Which I believe he is.

    His window to turn himself into a 15-15-30 guy closes this year, imo. Does he have it in him?

  11. Rondo says:

    Minnesota is interviewing Chiarelli for the GM job.

    Reality Is Not Optional

  12. tileguy says:

    Good lord, what a walk down memmory lane reading about the Expos on Wikipedia. Gets real sad towards the end.

  13. Andy Dufresne says:

    “He might also decide to run Nuge with Neal and Chiasson, two more veterans. He said as much recently. Now. We know there are a bunch of options, veterans and kids, pushing for playing time on skill lines. Who would be first on your list?”

    The popular opinion suggests the likely candidate is Tyler Benson.

    TO be honest I’m not completely familair with Tippets coaching style when it comes to playing rookies.

    My sense is Tippet is going favour a veteran lineup. Guys he knows he can count on in certain situations (situational hockey). And count on them mostly to not make mistakes. A buttoned down, defensively responsible, hard working roster. In other words, veterans.

    IF, Tippett knows how to manage and get the most out of James Neal and Sam Gagner from previous experience then they (and probably Chaisson as well) are all counted on / lenaed on heavily as middlle six options. The roster is rounded out with other vets like Khaira, Granlund, Archibald, Jurco, and Nygard. Speed and tenaciuous forechecking and back checking. Something we havent seen in these parts (in the bottom six) for quite some time.

    Somewhat ironically, given how bad this team has been, I think this years roster is more difficult for a rookie to crack than it has been for the past couple of years.

    JP is wild card. Kind of an all or nothing propostion if he’s still here. Outside of JP I think only one rookie forward gets even a sniff this year. Either Benson or Yamo. But only as a bottom six contributor.

    I think that that is the plan. But nothing ever goes according to plan. I hope this plan goes out the window by Christmas because one of JP, Benson or Yamo completely forces the issue.

    So to answer your question. My guess is Marody. in the bottom six. Does that count?

  14. Side says:

    Rondo:
    Minnesota is interviewing Chiarelli for the GM job.

    Reality Is Not Optional

    “Should we consider hiring a fresh face? Someone with new ideas and maybe a different approach to the position?”

    “If we do that, there is a chance they may come in and screw everything up”

    “How about we hire someone more experienced? Someone who is more familiar with the other GMs? Someone we know who will most definitely screw everything up?”

    *enter Chiarelli*

    I’m starting to become convinced this is basically the GM hiring process in this league.

  15. OriginalPouzar says:

    Bling:
    Shattenkirk isn’t the answer to any question, not any more.

    People forget that a couple of years ago, when both were healthy, Klefbom/Larsson was one of the best D pairings in the NHL. A legit first pair.

    Now that Nurse has taken a step — and Benning, too — I think a return to the Nurse/Benning pairing is in the cards.

    Russell – Persson is your 3rd pairing, with Jones being rotated in.

    Last three years aggregated:

    Klefbom and Benning together – 708 minutes:

    52% CF
    53% FF
    53% SF
    51% GF
    52% xGF
    48% HDCF
    53% HDGF

    Thos would be top 4 minutes, obviously – probably with Larsson hurt so maybe top pairing comp.

  16. OriginalPouzar says:

    Last three years in 407 5 on 5 minute, Pulujuarvi/McDavid – 61.55% GF

    Pairs

    Jesse/McDavid – 61.55% GF
    Leon/Chiasson – 56%
    Nuge/Neal

  17. dustrock says:

    Is it Broberg v. Lavoie today?

  18. OriginalPouzar says:

    We’ve been discussing Gaetan Haas as the possible third line center, although Dave Tippett did tell Daniel Nugent Bowman that Sam Gagner played some pivot for him in Phoenix. Jujhar Khaira was also mentioned recently.

    ———————————————

    Earlier in the week, I believe it was on Oilers Now, Tippett spoke about the 3C options and specifcally mentioned Khaira and Haas. He said, he’s spoke to JJ a number of times this off-season and they have spoke about him playing center and Khaira was all for giving it a shot given he has some experience. When ask about Gagner as a center, Tippett was pretty clear that he likes him better as a winger and as a player that can kind of rove all over the lineup.

  19. OriginalPouzar says:

    Lavoie on the top line and Broberg on the top pairing – game at 11 on TSN.

  20. OriginalPouzar says:

    I think Benson is a legit option for 2/3 LW.

    This kid works his ass off and I’m sure he’s going to be better this year than last.

    Is he ready?

    Can’t wait to find out.

  21. McSorley33 says:

    OriginalPouzar,

    I noticed the McDavid 39% without Drai about a week ago and was shocked. That’s got to be an anomaly, right?
    **************************************************************************************************
    What about when you pair McDavid ( without Leon ) but with the First overall selection in 2011?

    That number is shocking.

    Remember when some thought RNH was a solution as a winger for McDavid?

    We are STILL here.

  22. Munny says:

    OriginalPouzar: When ask about Gagner as a center, Tippett was pretty clear that he likes him better as a winger and as a player that can kind of rove all over the lineup.

    This strikes me as Buck Rodgers 24 Century thinking. That would be the perfect deployment of Samwise.

  23. Munny says:

    I think one of Tippett’s biggest challenges will be how to deal with Neal, Chiasson and Gagner. All three vets are poorer defensive players. So how do you set up lines and matchups to cover those weaknesses? The obvious one is to keep all three away from L1 and the power vs power matchup.

    But after that? Which one of those three would you rely on to take the second toughs? If Benson is in the line up, do you want him sharing ice time and matchups with one of those three? Do you really want Neal and Chaser sharing a line? Or Neal and Gagner?

    Can Tippett improve the defensive play of these wingers, or are they what they are?

    Along with the usual crux, goalering, I think the season could rest on this issue.

  24. pts2pndr says:

    Just a few thoughts on JJ and his less than stellar results in face-offs. To become good at draws two things are very important and JJ has had neither. The first is experience at taking draws. Knowing your opponents tendencies, strengths and weakness’s only comes with said experience. Proficiency comes with practice and repetition which JJ has not had. He has had very limited time as a centre since coming up to the NHL. Most of his time as a centre has come against more experienced older centre’s that have jobs because of their proficiency at face-offs. I believe given a full year as a centre and working on the technical aspects as well as well as getting to know his opponents would make a huge improvement. He does have the strength and work ethic required by what I have observed.

  25. Andy Dufresne says:

    OriginalPouzar: Last three years in 407 5 on 5 minute, Pulujuarvi/McDavid – 61.55% GF

    During the EVA, in which they both ranged up to 300 feet from the Eagle; Armstrong and Aldrin gathered and verbally reported on the lunar surface samples.

    After Aldrin’s 93 minutes on the surface, he re-entered the LM (Lunar Module), followed 41 minutes later by Armstrong.

    Aldrin collected 12 samples (moon rocks) and Armstrong 17.

    In 93 EVA minutes together Aldrin/Armstrong 16 Moon Rocks / 60

    Aldrin w/o Armstrong 0 MR /60 in 0 Minutes
    Aldrin with Armstrong 24 MR/93min or 16 MR/60
    Armstrong w/o Aldrin 7.5 MR / 60

    Were they Elite?

    Moral of the Story: Small Sample Size is a Biatch.

    And it was widely reported that Armstrong did not like playing with Aldrin. Claimed Aldrin was a “rover” and never in the right place at the right time (low Rocket Science IQ)

    Armstong said of Aldrin ; ” He wears a strange bucket (Jofa?) Hes just a plug, A pylon, The guy can barley move up here. Makes it impossilbe to wheel..And his passes are never tape-to-tape, he’s always leading you,with suicide passes (literally). Makes it impossible to go top (moon) cheese. (top shelf, where grandma hides the cookies)…..and he’s constantly chirpping me on the closed circuit radio”

    To which Aldrin was said to reply: ” Armstrongs a pussy …wears a fishbowl (full face shield) He plays like he’s alwasy tethered, makes it impossible to dangle. And his celly…. TERRIBLE…….just.hopping around draggin his feet. Can’t believe this guys signed to a 7×6 with a NMC.

  26. Andy Dufresne says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    Lavoie on the top line and Broberg on the top pairing – game at 11 on TSN.

    Thank You.

  27. OriginalPouzar says:

    Broberg playing the right side.

    Holland in attendance.

  28. russ99 says:

    OriginalPouzar: Last three years aggregated:

    Klefbom and Benning together – 708 minutes:

    52% CF
    53% FF
    53% SF
    51% GF
    52% xGF
    48% HDCF
    53% HDGF

    Thos would be top 4 minutes, obviously – probably with Larsson hurt so maybe top pairing comp.

    But what would you give up the other way?

    Lots of mismatches and odd man breaks when those two played together.

  29. OriginalPouzar says:

    LondonJon:
    I would be very surprised if Haas is pencilled in by Tippett for 3C on opening night.

    He wasn’t elite playing, I believe, 2C in a very mediocre Swiss league. You’d therefore have to think he’s a weaker option than Cave and Marody. And probably even Malone, McLeod, Gagner, Granlund and Khaira.

    Marody should make a bigger year on year improvement than Haas as he’s younger and was a top tier 1C in a much better league. And he knows the team and systems.

    Looks pretty nailed on to me that Holland is going to use the last dregs is of cap space for a legit 3C. And if that guy gets jumped by Haas or Marody then great

    I agree on Haas. I’d be surprised if he’s an actual NHL player let alone a 3rd liner.

    As I posted the other day, what does he have on Marody except for his skating? An inferior producer in an inferior league and older.

    With that said, Tippett expressly mentioned him and Khaira as his top options for 3C.

    I would LOVE if Marody popped a bit and earned that spot.

  30. Leroy Draisdale says:

    “But what would you give up the other way?”
    According to the numbers, less goals than they score.

  31. OriginalPouzar says:

    Broberg’s staking is oubvious but I’ve been pleasantly surprised with his vision and puckmoving.

  32. dustrock says:

    Both Lavoie and Broberg sporting #25 to make it easier for Old Man Holland. I mean Old Man Dustrock.

    Lavoie has had a couple of real nice puck handling in tight, one shot up high just over the crossbar, and one nice drive and dish to Akil Thomas that just missed and drew a penalty.

    Agreed with OP that Broberg has looked very smooth and his passing is on point.

    Sweden looks terrible though.

  33. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    OriginalPouzar: I agree on Haas.I’d be surprised if he’s an actual NHL player let alone a 3rd liner.

    – My assumption is that Haas, Nygard and Persson get first cracks: but that none of them are playing by the end of the season (never mind 40 games).

    – They will do their job if they “block” Cooper, Benson and Bouchard for a bit, respectively

  34. Andy Dufresne says:

    Lavoie showing well.

    Defensively responsible in his own end. Heads up, in good position, looking all around /over his shoulder etc (ie good awareness) and not blowing the zone early.

    Really good in the neutral zone. Has stolen the puck three time in the first period (like a big tall Nuge) , two leading to grade A scoring chances, one of which he draws a panalty.

    He is constantly finding open space in the Ozone.

    He is big a strong skater (not blazing speed) but has great edges and great hands. Has dangled and beat the dman in close quarters twice.

    Looks like a top line forward on a CHL all star team.

    Small sample but man….Im happy 🙂

    Biggest surprise : Also, not afraid to throw a hard hit on the forecheck. 🙂

    Havent seen / noticed his shot much yet.

  35. rickithebear says:

    LT: never wanted to do this.

    But you lead me their.

    The median for most of post 05-06 era has been 2.35
    Having seen a extreme drop in median save% from .918 in 15-16 to .912 in 18-19
    The push to a higher % 3-1-1-1 structure has had a dramatic affect on median evga/60
    from 2.32 in 15-16
    to 2.65 in 18-19

    GA drive championships.
    7 of 8 final 4 are top GA teams.
    The teams that run a high% of 3-2-1 structure are miles ahead of 3-1-1-1 teams cause it does not require extensive forward cap cost to break even.

    In 15-16 214 of 416 260min EVTOI forwards generated 2.32 or better
    In 18-19 194 of 426 260 min EVTOI forwards generated 2.65 or better.

    The only justification for change in GA is increase in 3-1-1-1 free path to HD area.
    Cause the forwards did not drive dramatic GA changes in the previous 9 years.

  36. Andy Dufresne says:

    Broberg, Tall, Long stick. and Quick. Quick moving (feet) and quick decision making. Can skate it out but prefers to pass it out. Not much happening in the Ozone.

  37. dustrock says:

    Andy Dufresne:
    Broberg, Tall, Long stick. and Quick. Quick moving (feet) and quick decision making. Can skate it out but prefers to pass it out. Not much happening in the Ozone.

    Yeah Sweden just looks like they don’t really have a plan, Canada is pressing hard.

    Broberg might be a better passer than advertised, I thought we’d see a Nurse situation where he’d try to outskate everyone but he’s made a couple of real neat passes under pressure. His DZ awareness and stick have been pretty good too.

    Have no doubt he’ll play in the NHL given reports and the little I’ve seen, it’s really the level of offence he brings that’s the question.

    Is young Bouwmeester a bad comparison for him?

  38. Reja says:

    Andy Dufresne: During the EVA, in which they both ranged up to 300 feet from the Eagle; Armstrong and Aldrin gathered and verbally reported on the lunar surface samples.

    After Aldrin’s 93 minutes on the surface, he re-entered the LM (Lunar Module), followed 41 minutes later by Armstrong.

    Aldrin collected 12 samples (moon rocks) and Armstrong 17.

    In 93 EVA minutes together Aldrin/Armstrong 16 Moon Rocks / 60

    Aldrin w/o Armstrong 0 MR /60 in 0 Minutes
    Aldrin with Armstrong 24 MR/93min or 16 MR/60
    Armstrong w/o Aldrin 7.5 MR / 60

    Were they Elite?

    Moral of the Story: Small Sample Size is a Biatch.

    And it was widely reported that Armstrong did not like playing with Aldrin. Claimed Aldrin was a “rover” and never in the right place at the right time (low Rocket Science IQ)

    Armstong said of Aldrin ; ” He wears a strange bucket (Jofa?) Hes just a plug, A pylon, The guy can barley move up here. Makes it impossilbe to wheel..And his passes are never tape-to-tape, he’s always leading you,with suicide passes (literally). Makes it impossible to go top (moon) cheese. (top shelf, where grandma hides the cookies)…..and he’s constantly chirpping me on the closed circuit radio”

    To which Aldrin was said to reply: ” Armstrongs a pussy …wears a fishbowl (full face shield) He plays like he’s alwasy tethered, makes it impossible to dangle. And his celly…. TERRIBLE…….just.hopping around draggin his feet. Can’t believe this guys signed to a 7×6 with a NMC.

    Just found out Aldrin and Jesse have the same agent. Now it makes sense.

  39. Faustkarz says:

    rickithebear,

    “only justification for change in GA”, hasn’t goalie equipment been reduced repeatedly for the past 9 years?

    History via OilersNation:

    Summer 2011 – NHL implements rule restricting the height of a goalie’s pad to only come 55% up their thigh.

    March 2016 – NHL announces big changes will be coming to goalie equipment in the upcoming season. They admitted a full-scale change would not happen, but confirmed that pants would be smaller.

    August 2016 – In an interview with Kevin Woodley, Jason Gregor discovered that no goaltenders have been told anything regarding new equipment.

    February 2017 – NHL implements rule change to decrease goalie pants size

    May 2018 – NHL announces that goalie chest protector changes are coming next season.

  40. dustrock says:

    Good D play by Lavoie to take out the man by the net before he could get the puck.

  41. dustrock says:

    Broberg with a nice stick tie-up on the PK but still gives the goalie clear look at the shot. Well done.

  42. rickithebear says:

    Draisaitl 31evg – Mcdavid 31 evg with winger 13 evg in 888
    888/60 = 14.8
    75evg/14.8 = 5.07 evgf/60
    13/14.8 = .88 evgf/60 is what we get from the wingers.
    60ga/14.8 = 4.05 evga/60
    LT 4.05 evga/60 is not music
    2.32 x 14.8 = 34 evg
    75-34 = +41 that is music.

    No reason to break up Draisaitl – Mcdavid symbiosis.
    Just run
    Neal, Chaisson, 2+ yr contracts
    and
    Nygard, Puljujarvi, jurco players

    No doubt which 2 drives Entry for that 3-1-1-1 or 3-2-1 structure.
    3-2-1 would be music

  43. GordieHoweHatTrick says:

    Bro!

  44. rickithebear says:

    OP did you adjust for on fly change a 50-60% error in all your data.

    Shit in shit out!

  45. dustrock says:

    Broooooooooooooooooo

  46. OriginalPouzar says:

    Rodrigue comes in to the game mid-way through the 2nd period to face a 2-man advantage for a full 2 minutes.

    Broberg scores as the PP winds down.

  47. dustrock says:

    Broberg with a real nice sneaky wrister under Rodrigue’s arm.

  48. OriginalPouzar says:

    Lavoie has made some wonderful rushes to the net today.

  49. rickithebear says:

    Karz:

    I completely forgot about that?

    When I went back on my notes of my posts.
    I did say more than 2 years ago that the changes coming up might change it.
    But it related to a potential decrease in closed shots and increase in open shots.

    Is it the hit goalie rate that drops cause the change in size.
    Or
    Is it the change in higher % of 3-1-1-1.

    Yet the top 5 goalies range has gotten better.
    You would expect them all to drop.

    An anomaly that would relate to the difference in 3-1-1-1 rather than equipment size.

    Can you explain the increase in top range!

    So you are saying with reduction in equipment size some goalies got way better in save% at the top.

    A pioneering concept!

    Not what anyone would expect!

  50. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Pancakes on ON with Bob right now.

  51. Faustkarz says:

    rickithebear,

    No, I am just stating that there are most likely other circumstances than 321 to 3111 structure changes modifying Save% and GA/60 in the NHL.

    I am rejecting the language you use such as “only justification”

  52. Darth Tu says:

    rickithebear:
    Karz:

    I completely forgot about that?

    When I went back on my notes of my posts.
    I did say more than 2 years ago that the changes coming up might change it.
    But it related to a potential decrease in closed shots and increase in open shots.

    Is it the hit goalie rate that drops cause the change in size.
    Or
    Is it the change in higher % of 3-1-1-1.

    Yet the top 5 goalies range has gotten better.
    You would expect them all to drop.

    An anomaly that would relate to the difference in 3-1-1-1 rather than equipment size.

    Can you explain the increase in top range!

    So you are saying with reduction in equipment size some goalies got way better in save% at the top.

    A pioneering concept!

    Not what anyone would expect!

    I guess the key change in the chest protector might be rebound control? I’m no goalie so can’t really speak with any authority on this.

    Does anyone know if there’s been any tracking on how goals have been scored post equipment change? I seem to remember Friedman mentioning a year ago that they could track goals scored between the arms and chest area to see if there’s a noticeable increase in those areas year over year – but that’s dependent on that data being available for previous seasons (someone is going to have to watch a loooot of old tape).

    Interesting thing to think about though – why have those top 5 goalies ended up with better results post equipment change. Is it their rebound control was always better, and now ends up further heightened? Are their defenses getting in and clearing things out earlier?

  53. blainer says:

    Watching Lavoie.. Man it’s hard to believe he fell that far. Broberg also looking like a good pick.

    I believe both of these players are going to be good NHLer’s. Really nice to to see the oil finally drafting properly.

    I am not upset at all with the Broberg pick as I was really for Whalstrom last year and it looks like we took the right guy in Bouchard.

    I also wanted Nichushkin over Nurse. Another smart pick by the oil. I guess the point is that in a couple of years I think it will work out that the correct pick was Broberg over Zegras. Time will tell.

  54. jeetz says:

    Nice to hear both Broberg and Lavoie had good games today.

    Back to the Oilers lines, having Draisaitl and McDavid together is a no brainer. They are one of the most feared duos in the league. Plus it would be nice to cut their playing time back 1.5-2 min per game.

    Obviously scoring after these 2 is the question. Having Neal clearly changes the equation. Putting RNH and Neal together offers a lot of potential. I would add that this is also where Puljujarvi could find a home as well. The big knock against Neal is his play away from the puck, JP and RNH have him covered there. JP is hoping to find some offensive confidence and RHN and Neal can help him there plus being on a second line it takes some of the pressure off all 3 players. That line could easily put up 60 goals this season.

    I also see a lot of Gagner Khaira talk but if JP and Neal can find a home on the second line then the trio of Gagner Granlund and Chiasson could be a real veteran savy 3rd line that could easily play 15-17 min a game and offer 40 plus goals

    If the Oilers can run

    Draisaitl McDavid Kassian
    Neal RNH JP
    Gagner Granlund Chiasson

    That leaves lots of quality players competing for 4th line duties

  55. GMB3 says:

    blainer:
    Watching Lavoie.. Man it’s hard to believe he fell that far. Broberg also looking like a good pick.

    I believe both of these players are going to be good NHLer’s. Really nice to to see the oil finally drafting properly.

    I am not upset at all with the Broberg pick as I was really for Whalstrom last year and it looks like we took the right guy in Bouchard.

    I also wanted Nichushkin over Nurse. Another smart pick by the oil. I guess the point is that in a couple of years I think it will work out that the correct pick was Broberg over Zegras. Time will tell.

    Caulfield scoring 50 goals won’t be a good look either I’m afraid

  56. Material Elvis says:

    russ99: But what would you give up the other way?

    Lots of mismatches and odd man breaks when those two played together.

    Those are percentages so, with some simple math, you already know what you are giving up the other way.

  57. Doug McLachlan says:

    GMB3: Caulfield scoring 50 goals won’t be a good look either I’m afraid

    I really liked Caufield but understand why he fell as much as he did.

  58. Lowetide says:

    Jouni Nieminen
    @OnsideWithJouni
    ·
    31m
    Jesse Puljujärvi tonight to Kaleva Newspaper at a charity game in Oulu: “I want a new start with some other team. Playing in North America is still my goal.” “I will stay on Oulu until I have a contract. I will find a place to play somewhere”.

  59. Fuge Udvar says:

    Pavel Zacha keeps getting passed on the depth chart in New Jersey. I wonder if they are interested in Puljujarvi. Something like Zacha for Puljujarvi + Gagner with 1.5M retained. Sign Zacha to a 1.75AAV deal. No change in salary cap for us.

    Draisaitl-McDavid-Kassian
    Granlund-Nuge-Neal
    Nygard-Zacha-Chiasson
    Khaira-Haas-Archibald

    Seems like a lot of gambles but speed and shooters throughout the lineup

  60. Side says:

    Lowetide:
    Jouni Nieminen
    @OnsideWithJouni
    ·
    31m
    Jesse Puljujärvi tonight to Kaleva Newspaper at a charity game in Oulu: “I want a new start with some other team. Playing in North America is still my goal.”“I will stay on Oulu until I have a contract. I will find a place to play somewhere”.

    Oof.

  61. OriginalPouzar says:

    I believe the Liga preseason has already started – I don’t see Jesse playing in Europe this season.

    If he’s “waiting for a contract” in the NHL, he may be sitting out the season if he won’t sign with the Oilers.

    Ridiculous and disappointing.

  62. OriginalPouzar says:

    russ: But what would you give up the other way?

    Lots of mismatches and odd man breaks when those two played together.

    The data implies that the play was going the right direction generally when they were out there, doesn’t it? Perhaps there were mismatches and odd man breaks the other way as well.

  63. Drew says:

    Rondo:
    Minnesota is interviewing Chiarelli for the GM job.

    Reality Is Not Optional

    i cannot believe this will happen. if it does, can we agree that referencing nhl leaders as authority should no longer be accepted?

  64. Drew says:

    russ99: But what would you give up the other way?

    Lots of mismatches and odd man breaks when those two played together.

    i would like to see the numbers to support this?

  65. OriginalPouzar says:

    dustrock: Yeah Sweden just looks like they don’t really have a plan, Canada is pressing hard.

    Broberg might be a better passer than advertised, I thought we’d see a Nurse situation where he’d try to outskate everyone but he’s made a couple of real neat passes under pressure.His DZ awareness and stick have been pretty good too.

    I noticed the exact same thing through about 30 minutes of game play – not only the ability to transition via pass but some plus vision.

  66. Gerta Rauss says:

    Lowetide:
    Jouni Nieminen
    @OnsideWithJouni
    ·
    31m
    Jesse Puljujärvi tonight to Kaleva Newspaper at a charity game in Oulu: “I want a new start with some other team. Playing in North America is still my goal.”“I will stay on Oulu until I have a contract. I will find a place to play somewhere”.

    Not a lot of ambiguity there

    Sail on kid, we hardly knew ya

  67. OriginalPouzar says:

    rickithebear:
    OP did you adjust for on fly change a 50-60% error in all your data.

    Shit in shit out!

    Hell no and I don’t agree with the, seemingly, random error percentage.

    Please show your work for coming up with the error percentage range.

  68. OriginalPouzar says:

    I can find a way to interpret the statement that doesn’t preclude playing for the Oilers.

    Its a stretch but it can be done.

    Sigh, Jesse, sigh!

  69. Darth Tu says:

    Lowetide:
    Jouni Nieminen
    @OnsideWithJouni
    ·
    31m
    Jesse Puljujärvi tonight to Kaleva Newspaper at a charity game in Oulu: “I want a new start with some other team. Playing in North America is still my goal.”“I will stay on Oulu until I have a contract. I will find a place to play somewhere”.

    This doesn’t sound like it’s only the agent that’s driving this.

    I’m extremely disappointed. If he wants to play for another NHL team he should be heading over to camp and trying to knock it out of the park in training, preseason and then the regular season. Holland doesn’t seem like he’s going to trade JP for peanuts just to make JP happy.

  70. Side says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    I can find a way to interpret the statement that doesn’t preclude playing for the Oilers.

    Its a stretch but it can be done.

    Sigh, Jesse, sigh!

    Only one I can think of is a translation error. But.. feelin like that may be a complete stretch.

  71. Material Elvis says:

    This kid really needs a better mentor. He’s not improving his stock in the eyes of the other GM’s by playing this card. Too bad for him.

  72. pts2pndr says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    I think Benson is a legit option for 2/3 LW.

    This kid works his ass off and I’m sure he’s going to be better this year than last.

    Is he ready?

    Can’t wait to find out.

    Here is my dilemma with what you just posted. You are on record that the results of preseason should be disregarded. If this is the way things work and you have a number of players with an NHL resume vying for the same job as Benson how do you expect Benson without a NHL resume to get a shot to start the season? I believe Benson is deserving of a chance to make the team but I am of the belief that training camp and preseason performance have value and can make a difference.

  73. duct tape and foil says:

    Lowetide:
    Jouni Nieminen
    @OnsideWithJouni
    ·
    31m
    Jesse Puljujärvi tonight to Kaleva Newspaper at a charity game in Oulu: “I want a new start with some other team. Playing in North America is still my goal.”“I will stay on Oulu until I have a contract. I will find a place to play somewhere”.

    The kid is either clueless, or getting some very bad advice, or both. He is destroying his career.

    As Fuge Udvar said, NJD could be a target, either Zacha or McLeod the elder.

  74. Jethro Tull says:

    Darth Tu: This doesn’t sound like it’s only the agent that’s driving this.

    I’m extremely disappointed.If he wants to play for another NHL team he should be heading over to camp and trying to knock it out of the park in training, preseason and then the regular season.Holland doesn’t seem like he’s going to trade JP for peanuts just to make JP happy.

    Really? Shouldn’t the agent advise him against making exactly this kind of statement? Ok, the agent isn’t saying the words, but he has his fingerprints all over this.

  75. Reja says:

    Jesse’s agent made it Crystal Clear he want’s nothing to do with Edmonton even after the management changes. Jesse’s surgery and his foolish demands has killed most of his value for now. If Jesse thinks this ploy will work with Holland as Judas Priest once said You’ve Gotta Another Thing Coming.

  76. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    russ99: But what would you give up the other way?

    Lots of mismatches and odd man breaks when those two played together.

    Provide your your source of results data that had those two giving up a lot of odd man breaks.

  77. Buddy says:

    Rondo:
    Minnesota is interviewing Chiarelli for the GM job.

    Reality Is Not Optional

    After the Tampa-Ottawa trade a few days ago, I was certain he’d been rehired by the Sens.

    So I guess not then, which can only mean that he leaves a permanent imprint on his former teams’ trading methods and abilities.

  78. Woodguy v2.0 says:

    russ99: But what would you give up the other way?

    Lots of mismatches and odd man breaks when those two played together.

    Russ not understanding the ratios/rates include for and against for the 133(89906*56/965559 9656658 time.

    That’s just great.

  79. Gerta Rauss says:

    Reja,

    Jesse is Heading out to the highway

  80. OriginalPouzar says:

    The interview also states that Jesse says his body feels great and his hips as good as new.

    He believes he’ll be traded before camp.

    Bah – use those hips to play for the Oilers ya numbnutz – come on – stupid agent with bad advice.

  81. Darth Tu says:

    Jethro Tull: Really? Shouldn’t the agent advise him against making exactly this kind of statement? Ok, the agent isn’t saying the words, but he has his fingerprints all over this.

    Lehto has made his view quite clear previously, it’s not going to work for Jesse in Edmonton. I agree with you though, he should be advising Jesse to keep quiet until the situation is resolved. Whether it’s Jesse saying it, or the agent telling him to this really doesn’t help their case, or help him get a trade.

    With my original point, I was commenting more on my own (foolish) thoughts it could have worked out with JP back in Edmonton for next season. I’ve been hoping Jesse would buckle down and get back to it after taking the summer to think about the situation. That looks to be unlikely going by his comments today.

  82. duct tape and foil says:

    If I was Holland after this I would tell him and his agent to either sign his existing offer and show up at camp or go find a trade yourself. Discussions are done. Sad it comes to this.

  83. McNuge93 says:

    Reja:
    Jesse’s agent made it Crystal Clear he want’s nothing to do with Edmonton even after the management changes. Jesse’ssurgery and his foolish demands has killed most of hisvalue for now. If Jesse thinks this ploy will work with Holland as Judas Priest once said You’ve Gotta Another Thing Coming.

    Ya, it’s not like we are going to miss his 5 or 6 goals.

  84. GordieHoweHatTrick says:

    Lowetide:
    Jouni Nieminen
    @OnsideWithJouni
    ·
    31m
    Jesse Puljujärvi tonight to Kaleva Newspaper at a charity game in Oulu: “I want a new start with some other team. Playing in North America is still my goal.”“I will stay on Oulu until I have a contract. I will find a place to play somewhere”.

    Well maybe he is the stupid one and not his agent.
    Very disappointing.
    I think he could miss a season and perhaps a career.
    KH isn’t going to move him for peanuts.
    Fool.

  85. GordieHoweHatTrick says:

    Darth Tu: This doesn’t sound like it’s only the agent that’s driving this.

    I’m extremely disappointed.If he wants to play for another NHL team he should be heading over to camp and trying to knock it out of the park in training, preseason and then the regular season.Holland doesn’t seem like he’s going to trade JP for peanuts just to make JP happy.

    Hadn’t seen this when I posted the same general sentiments!

  86. Jordan says:

    Lowetide:
    Jouni Nieminen
    @OnsideWithJouni
    ·
    31m
    Jesse Puljujärvi tonight to Kaleva Newspaper at a charity game in Oulu: “I want a new start with some other team. Playing in North America is still my goal.”“I will stay on Oulu until I have a contract. I will find a place to play somewhere”.

    It seems clear to me that this young man needs some fatherly advice.

    Either that, or he needs remedial lessons in active listening.

    His actions are likely to make his getting traded much more difficult for Holland.

    Although, he did manage to trade Lucic… so maybe we can expect to be pleasantly surprised with the return for Jesse?

  87. HT Joe says:

    So, can we agree Lucic wasn’t the reason for Jesse wanting a change?

  88. OriginalPouzar says:

    ptspndr: Here is my dilemma with what you just posted. You are on record that the results of preseason should be disregarded. If this is the way things work and you have a number of players with an NHL resume vying for the same job as Benson how do you expect Benson without a NHL resume to get a shot to start the season?I believe Benson is deserving of a chance to make the team but I am of the belief that training camp and preseason performance have value and can make a difference.

    He could produce 7 points in 5 preseason games and still not be NHL ready – i stand by that.

    He can’t prove NHL readiness in preseason, he can only do that by playing in the NHL – at some point he’ll get the chance, be it October 2, November 30 or February 11 and I can’t wait to find out.

    Also, just because I believe preseason has little value with respect to proving NHL readiness of these types of prospects does not mean that the decision makers feel the same way. We consistently see coaches rely on preseason production, often to their peril.

    On the other hand, its not like he is going to replace Neal on the roster, he’s battling with the likes of Nygard and Jurco for an NHL job.

  89. JimmyV1965 says:

    Jethro Tull: Really? Shouldn’t the agent advise him against making exactly this kind of statement? Ok, the agent isn’t saying the words, but he has his fingerprints all over this.

    I would think it’s the exact opposite. Making that kind of statement does not help JP in any way, shape or form. Those are the words of a slow witted teenager with zero life experience. I find it hard to believe even the worst agent, or any adult, would recommend JP make that kind of statement now.

  90. Buddy says:

    If these statements by Jesse are accurate, then either there was some stuff going on in the dressing room that we don’t know about, or he has a lot of growing up that he needs to do in a hurry.

  91. Scungilli Slushy says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    Lavoie has made some wonderful rushes to the net today.

    I’m loving it. There has been a serious lack of forwards that attack the net for years until Connor showed up. Far too much pretty and to the perimeter.

    Being a risk to walk in or also have a shot that can score puts the D on it’s heels. Connor being awesome saw in his first year that he needed a shot to open his game and he figured it out by the following season. Perfect.

    Props to Leon for also working to elevate his game straight away. That’s the difference between stars and good players.

    Have a deficiency, fix it.

  92. duct tape and foil says:

    Life lesson incoming for Mr. Jesse Puljujärvi in 3…2…1….

  93. Scungilli Slushy says:

    OriginalPouzar: I agree on Haas.I’d be surprised if he’s an actual NHL player let alone a 3rd liner.

    As I posted the other day, what does he have on Marody except for his skating? An inferior producer in an inferior league and older.

    With that said, Tippett expressly mentioned him and Khaira as his top options for 3C.

    I would LOVE if Marody popped a bit and earned that spot.

    OriginalPouzar: I agree on Haas.I’d be surprised if he’s an actual NHL player let alone a 3rd liner.

    As I posted the other day, what does he have on Marody except for his skating? An inferior producer in an inferior league and older.

    With that said, Tippett expressly mentioned him and Khaira as his top options for 3C.

    I would LOVE if Marody popped a bit and earned that spot.

    Marginal players that can’t skate at an NHL level don’t help, at least on a strong team. There are hundreds of thousands of NHL talented players in the world. The difference is skating and personal drive.

  94. OriginalPouzar says:

    Although I only watched bits and pieces of the game today but I notices this when I watched Halifax in the playoffs, Lavoie seems to be a player that one might not notice much from shift to shift but pretty much every game he makes 2 or 3 really high level, individual offensive players – generally a combination of size, skill, speed and power.

  95. OriginalPouzar says:

    ScungilliSlushy:
    Marginal players that can’t skate at an NHL level don’t help, at least on a strong team. There are hundreds of thousands of NHL talented players in the world. The difference is skating and personal drive.

    Skating without the requisite non-skating skills, same thing – unless one has a plus IQ and can carve out that Marchant-type of career. I’m not so sure they older Haas is that player.

    Of course, I’ve never seen him play……

    I have seen Marody play, even back to watching 5 Michigan games and dozens and dozens of Condors’ games, he has the NHL skill level and NHL smarts. We’ll find out if the “questionable boots” is prohibitive.

  96. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Maybe it was more than just language issues with Jesse. Maybe it was more than just homesickness. Maybe it was more than adjusting to the smaller ice and the NHL game. Maybe it was more than problems in the dressing room. Maybe it wasn’t the agent at all. Maybe Carolina knew something from the beginning. Maybe we actually drafted the village idiot 4OV.

  97. Oilman99 says:

    Rondo:
    Minnesota is interviewing Chiarelli for the GM job.

    Reality Is Not Optional

    ALERT hot deals to come.

  98. Harpers Hair says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan:
    Maybe it was more than just language issues with Jesse. Maybe it was more than just homesickness. Maybe it was more than adjusting to the smaller ice and the NHL game. Maybe it was more than problems in the dressing room. Maybe it wasn’t the agent at all. Maybe Carolina knew something from the beginning. Maybe we actually drafted the village idiot 4OV.
    MPS V2.0
    Should never have been ranked that high in the draft

  99. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Gerta Rauss: Not a lot of ambiguity there

    Sail on kid, we hardly knew ya

    I think I know why Cpt Kirk passed on him. Yes the C thing, but going on my instincts as an employer, after JP was on the team, and the off ice news we could read, I began to wonder, as I did with Yak.

    Charming but odd behaviour off ice is a bit of a concern, if you want to play in the highest league in the world. To me it’s a sign of not being ready or able to do the ‘bro’ culture players seem to need to have.

  100. New Improved Darkness says:

    City of Champions

    [A dozen yellow men-at-work with hardhats.]

    New signage:

    World’s largest rollercoaster!

    [Five remaining men-at-work with hardhats.]

    Small sub-signage:

    Bring lunch.

    The problem being, it’s a very long ride.

  101. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan:
    Maybe it was more than just language issues with Jesse. Maybe it was more than just homesickness. Maybe it was more than adjusting to the smaller ice and the NHL game. Maybe it was more than problems in the dressing room. Maybe it wasn’t the agent at all. Maybe Carolina knew something from the beginning. Maybe we actually drafted the village idiot 4OV.

    No, consensus pick by everyone. The issues being I don’t think Pete was thinking too far outside of his heavy box.

  102. Scungilli Slushy says:

    New Improved Darkness:
    City of Champions

    [A dozen yellow men-at-work with hardhats.]

    New signage:

    World’s largest rollercoaster!

    [Five remaining men-at-work with hardhats.]

    Small sub-signage:

    Bring lunch.

    The problem being, it’s a very long ride.

    Perfect

  103. New Improved Darkness says:

    Stick tap to my lemon tree for seeding the word “rollercoaster”.

  104. Scungilli Slushy says:

    OriginalPouzar: Skating without the requisite non-skating skills, same thing – unless one has a plus IQ and can carve out that Marchant-type of career. I’m not so sure they older Haas is that player.

    Of course, I’ve never seen him play……

    I have seen Marody play, even back to watching 5 Michigan games and dozens and dozens of Condors’ games, he has the NHL skill level and NHL smarts.We’ll find out if the “questionable boots” is prohibitive.

    I think as you have said and LT has said Marody has pointed at a level that says NHL.

    Tweeners have a fatal flaw. I hope he jumped on the Connor Leon train, recognizing a smallish player has to be have enough tools to keep a spot. Maybe he’s so gifted he succeeds but his audition didn’t suggest he’s a killer in the bigs.

  105. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Scungilli Slushy: No, consensus pick by everyone. The issues being I don’t think Pete was thinking too far outside of his heavy box.

    Huh? I didn’t say he wasn’t the consensus pick. He definitely was. The physical toolbox is undeniable. We literally drafted the village idiot who just happens to have some mad physical tools. Unfortunately, the rest of the league probably recognizes this as well at this point.

  106. Jethro Tull says:

    JimmyV1965: I would think it’s the exact opposite. Making that kind of statement does not help JP in any way, shape or form. Those are the words of a slow witted teenager with zero life experience. I find it hard to believe even the worst agent, or any adult, would recommend JP make that kind of statement now.

    Yah, Jimmy, read my first line again. “Shouldn’t the agent advise him against making exactly this kind of statement?”

    I’m in your boat!

  107. Jethro Tull says:

    Darth Tu: Lehto has made his view quite clear previously, it’s not going to work for Jesse in Edmonton.I agree with you though, he should be advising Jesse to keep quiet until the situation is resolved. Whether it’s Jesse saying it, or the agent telling him to this really doesn’t help their case, or help him get a trade.

    With my original point, I was commenting more on my own (foolish) thoughts it could have worked out with JP back in Edmonton for next season.I’ve been hoping Jesse would buckle down and get back to it after taking the summer to think about the situation.That looks to be unlikely going by his comments today.

    Only in Edmonton does JP have a realistic shot of riding shotgun to the world’s best player. (Because Edmonton HAS the world’s best player and the rest of the team, Drai excepted, is frankly mediocre at best.) He’s going the way of bouncing around a couple of better teams’ 3rd/4th lines, then out the league.

    I agree. He needs to keep his mouth shut, because sewering your own value is not the way to get traded.

    I really think he’s oblivious to the opportunity here….and that’s on his agent.

  108. pts2pndr says:

    OriginalPouzar: He could produce 7 points in 5 preseason games and still not be NHL ready – i stand by that.

    He can’t prove NHL readiness in preseason, he can only do that by playing in the NHL – at some point he’ll get the chance, be it October 2, November 30 or February 11 and I can’t wait to find out.

    Also, just because I believe preseason has little value with respect to proving NHL readiness of these types of prospects does not mean that the decision makers feel the same way. We consistently see coaches rely on preseason production, often to their peril.

    On the other hand, its not like he is going to replace Neal on the roster, he’s battling with the likes of Nygard and Jurco for an NHL job.

    My difficulty is with your hard core line that training camp and preseason doesn’t have value in determining NHL readiness. I agree to a certain extent if it is a stand alone sample. In Benson’s case he is coming off a very productive AHL campaign therefore a good preseason is a continuation of good play and could get him a roster spot to start the season. My guess would be he starts in the AHL and is first call up in the event of injury or another player struggles.

  109. Reja says:

    Jesse plus will be traded before seasons start. I felt it was Lucic last game in Edmonton after his post season interviews I believe they had a deal with Van but Eriksson balked it. Calgary was plan B and it was in place or very close before July 1st that’s why Holland didn’t go after a top 6 he new he had Neal in the bank.

  110. OriginalPouzar says:

    ScungilliSlushy: I think I know why Cpt Kirk passed on him. Yes the C thing, but going on my instincts as an employer, after JP was on the team, and the off ice news we could read, I began to wonder, as I did with Yak.

    Charming but odd behaviour off ice is a bit of a concern, if you want to play in the highest league in the world. To me it’s a sign of not being ready or able to do the ‘bro’ culture players seem to need to have.

    Dougie Hamilton style?

  111. OriginalPouzar says:

    ptspndr: My difficulty is with your hard core line that training camp and preseason doesn’t have value in determining NHL readiness. I agree to a certain extent if it is a stand alone sample. In Benson’s case he is coming off a very productive AHL campaign therefore a good preseason is a continuation of good play and could get him a roster spot to start the season. My guess would be he starts in the AHL and is first call up in the event of injury or another player struggles.

    I think we are generally on the same page here.

    As oppossed to Jesse and Kailer and even Bouchard, Benson has already played AHL games, significant AHL games, and has a very high level of success – before he’s played an NHL game.

    Looking back, Jesse’s 18 year old season in the AHL was actually quite solid given he was the youngest player in the North American pro hockey – I imagine things may be different if it was 60 games played.

    Benson has already established himself as a high end AHL player and all he can do now is show continued progression in camp and exhibition – 7 points in 5 games in exhibition won’t show he’s NHL ready but it will check off the next box – a plus NHL camp. Whether that would get him on the team or he goes down to blow the doors off the AHL for a few weeks (or so), we will find out.

  112. Hankster says:

    How do we know that Jesse was not liked in the dressing room. He appears to be and sounds like a country bumpkin with very little exposure to anything. He feels left out and does not want to return to the same team. Understandable. No one here knows if mcdavid drai or nuge likes or dislikes him.

  113. Genjutsu says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan:
    Maybe it was more than just language issues with Jesse. Maybe it was more than just homesickness. Maybe it was more than adjusting to the smaller ice and the NHL game. Maybe it was more than problems in the dressing room. Maybe it wasn’t the agent at all. Maybe Carolina knew something from the beginning. Maybe we actually drafted the village idiot 4OV.

    Blame the player eh? NEVER been done in a fish bowl Canadian market.

  114. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Genjutsu: Blame the player eh? NEVER been done in a fish bowl Canadian market.

    Well reasoned observation … fresh take and insightful. Thanks for sharing that.

  115. Munny says:

    The signs that it’s more than just hockey sense with Pujo are becoming unequivocal.

  116. Munny says:

    Hankster,

    It’s kind of irrelevant. All that matters is how Jesse feels about the room and the organization, And apparently it’s not with happy thoughts. However we are also seeing some very poor judgement on display from Pujo and those observations bring a lot of things into question with regards to the player himself.

  117. Munny says:

    New Improved Darkness:
    Stick tap to my lemon tree for seeding the word “rollercoaster”.

    She was distilling some fine Lynchburg lemonade there.

  118. Scungilli Slushy says:

    OriginalPouzar: Dougie Hamilton style?

    Of Dougie I have no idea, but given a RD of his skill and size that no team seems to value as a keeper? Must be a locker room or off ice thing. Seriously. Why else?

  119. jp says:

    OriginalPouzar: Last three years aggregated:

    Klefbom and Benning together – 708 minutes:

    52% CF
    53% FF
    53% SF
    51% GF
    52% xGF
    48% HDCF
    53% HDGF

    Thos would be top 4 minutes, obviously – probably with Larsson hurt so maybe top pairing comp.

    russ99: But what would you give up the other way?

    Lots of mismatches and odd man breaks when those two played together.

    First, the rates Armchair posted would rank (among the Oilers main 6 D over the same span):

    CF-1st
    FF-1st
    SF-1st
    GF-2nd (Benning overall is was better)
    xGF-1st (Benning and Klefbom were basically the same overall)
    SCF-1st
    HDCF-5th
    HDGF-1st

    More to your point, their “against” rates (what they gave up) were also exceptional:

    CA-1st
    FA-2nd (behind Sekera, who played most of his games in 16-17 when everyone’s against numbers were better)
    SA-2nd (behind Sekera)
    GA-4th (behind Sekera, Russell and Benning overall)
    xGA-1st
    SCA-2nd (Benning overall was better)
    HDCA-1st
    HDGA-1st

    I know you can’t be convinced. But Klefbom-Benning were excellent not only in their for/against rates, but also in what they actually gave up defensively. At least by everything measurable that’s available to us.

    If you look at just the last 2 years (removing the Sekera-Russell magic from 16-17) Klefbom-Benning together were better than any other Oilers defensemen overall in every single “against” category.

    The mismatches and odd man rushes you recall were inconsequential to the overall results on the ice, as well as to the chances against, shots against, goals against, etc etc etc that the Oilers gave up with them on the ice.

    Whatever you were seeing was either:
    1) not real, or,
    2) did not matter

  120. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan: Huh? I didn’t say he wasn’t the consensus pick.He definitely was. The physical toolbox is undeniable. We literally drafted the village idiot who just happens to have some mad physical tools. Unfortunately, the rest of the league probably recognizes this as well at this point.

    Ok. But village idiot is too harsh. Every other team would have taken him if the Oilers didn’t.

    Would you call him that to his face?

    It’s easy to call it as you see it when there are no consequences isn’t it.

    To me when people act like this I think coward. Phony. I hope you aren’t.

  121. northerndancer says:

    Every day, in every part of the world, people turn away from what others see as “opportunity” and they are judged. Usually without full knowledge of that persons situation, how they see the world and how they put that ‘opportunity’ in the context of the rest of their lives. Rightly or wrongly.

    As fans we can cheer for the team or players, management etc. Trash them all, too. As players, management etc. But that doesn”t give us the right to trash them as people unless their actions are ‘trash’ or otherwise violate societal norms, etc.

    As far as I know, JP is a 20 year old kid who has not done this. He is merely chosing to turn away from what we call an opportunity. Lots of cash and fame for sure. Maybe more by our choices. Maybe what he needs by his.

    Lets keep our judging to the impact of the team rather than the value of that human being. Or speculation on their motives.

    Thanks

  122. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Scungilli Slushy: Ok. But village idiot is too harsh. Every other team would have taken him if the Oilers didn’t.

    Would you call him that to his face?

    It’s easy to call it as you see it when there are no consequences isn’t it.

    To me when people act like this I think coward. Phony. I hope you aren’t.

    Every village has one … someone has to be on the low end of the distribution. So if village idiot is too harsh, what would you suggest in this era of political correctness where everyone earns a gold star? Emotionally underdeveloped? Socially challenged? Intellectual late bloomer? Wet behind the ears? Whatever.

    I also disagree with the premise that every other team would have taken him if the Oilers didn’t. When Carolina passed it was a huge, huge, huge red flag. A sea of red flags. This is a team that had more access to information on Jesse than any other and they passed hard. Recall that there was a top three that year with a perceived fall off thereafter. What should the Oil have done once they picked their collective jaws from the floor? Trade out, if possible, or select Keith’s kid. That is the smart move when you realize you are the mark in the room … try to get out alive.

    As to the rest of the post, I will give it the response it deserves.

  123. Primetime says:

    duct tape and foil:
    If I was Holland after this I would tell him and his agent to either sign his existing offer and show up at camp or go find a trade yourself. Discussions are done. Sad it comes to this.

    Apparently this already happened a week or so ago.. One of the talking heads had tweeted that agent had been given permission to find own trade cause nothing satisfactory found by Holland.

    Personally I would rather Jesse sit in Europe for good rather than dumping him for a 3rd rounder like Chia got for Yak. Team needs to stick to its guns here

  124. Glovjuice says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan: Every village has one … someone has to be on the low end of the distribution. So if village idiot is too harsh, what would you suggest in this era of political correctness where everyone earns a gold star? Emotionally underdeveloped? Socially challenged? Intellectual late bloomer? Wet behind the ears? Whatever.

    I also disagree with the premise that every other team would have taken him if the Oilers didn’t. When Carolina passed it was a huge, huge, huge red flag. A sea of red flags. This is a team that had more access to information on Jesse than any other and they passed hard. Recall that there was a top three that year with a perceived fall off thereafter. What should the Oil have done once they picked their collective jaws from the floor? Trade out, if possible, or select Keith’s kid. That is the smart move when you realize you are the mark in the room … try to get out alive.

    As to the rest of the post, I will give it the response it deserves.

    Carolina – Lol. That’s twice now. Brutal.

  125. Glovjuice says:

    northerndancer:
    Every day, in every part of the world, people turn away fromwhat others see as “opportunity” and they are judged.Usually without full knowledge of that persons situation, how they see the world and how they put that ‘opportunity’ in the context of the rest of their lives.Rightly or wrongly.

    As fans we can cheer for the team or players, management etc.Trash them all, too.As players, management etc.But that doesn”t give us the right to trash them as people unless their actions are ‘trash’ or otherwise violate societal norms, etc.

    As far as I know, JP is a 20 year old kid who has not done this.He is merely chosing to turn away from what we call an opportunity.Lots of cash and fame for sure.Maybe more by our choices.Maybe what he needs by his.

    Lets keep our judging to the impact of the team rather than the value of that human being. Or speculation on their motives.

    Thanks

    Post of the decade.

  126. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Glovjuice: Carolina – Lol. That’s twice now. Brutal.

    Well shit … at least I’m consistent. What state is Columbus located in again … Ohiowa?

  127. Reja says:

    This might be too soon and I got jumped on this previously but I really think with Jesse out of the picture this will benefit my man weighing in at a modest 203 pounds and standing at a incredible height of 6 foot 7 the one the only Mikko KOSKINEN!

  128. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Glovjuice: Post of the decade.

    No. Not even post of the day. Jesse is not merely choosing to turn away from what we call an opportunity. That would look more like deciding to go back home to play in Europe. No, what Jesse is doing by demanding a trade more resembles immature, adolescent behavior. There is no noble aspect to this that should be admired. Just more self-centered I want what I want and I want it now.

  129. Lowetide says:

    New for The Athletic: Ken Holland’s roster construction options for the Oilers over the next seven months

    https://theathletic.com/1113749/2019/08/03/lowetide-ken-hollands-roster-construction-options-for-the-oilers-over-the-next-seven-months/

  130. GordieHoweHatTrick says:

    Gerta Rauss:
    https://www.msn.com/en-ca/sports/nhl/lucic-admits-he-put-too-much-pressure-on-himself-with-oilers/ar-AAFdOZB?li=AAggXBR&ocid=mailsignout

    Lucic comments yesterday

    Saviour. Right.
    Luc, just keep on keeping on down there in Calgary. Everything will be just fine. You still get to keep your money.

  131. OriginalPouzar says:

    Finland/Sweden at 11

    Canada/US at 2

    Haven’t seen any lineups but hope each of Silkanen, Broberg, Lavoie and Rodrigue are playing – could be none of them as they all played in their team’s previous games.

  132. OriginalPouzar says:

    I haven’t been hot on acquiring Krieder because he’s one year to UFA and then would need a fairly large raise I’m sure.

    I’m not sure if we can afford to re-sign him – he’ll be 29 when next season starts so, if we can sign him for like 4 years is that the substantial top 6 guy we want to spend out money on for next season?

    We only have the cap space for one substantial signing and that presupposes a Russell disposition for cap space.

    I dug in to the numbers on Krieder yesterday and they are phenomenal – year after year he’s strongly positive in ALL metrics, in particular goal share, and he’s strongly positive in ALL metrics relative to his teammates. He is an analytics darling and also passes the eye test and is fast.

    The more I think about it, the more I am on board trading for him but only if we can re-sign him and only for 3-4 years.

  133. ArmchairGM says:

    Lowetide: I will find a place to play somewhere”

    I don’t think he understands how this works.

  134. OriginalPouzar says:

    jp:
    First, the rates Armchair posted would rank (among the Oilers main 6 D over the same span):

    CF-1st
    FF-1st
    SF-1st
    GF-2nd (Benning overall is was better)
    xGF-1st (Benning and Klefbom were basically the same overall)
    SCF-1st
    HDCF-5th
    HDGF-1st

    More to your point, their “against” rates (what they gave up) were also exceptional:

    CA-1st
    FA-2nd (behind Sekera, who played most of his games in 16-17 when everyone’s against numbers were better)
    SA-2nd (behind Sekera)
    GA-4th (behind Sekera, Russell and Benning overall)
    xGA-1st
    SCA-2nd (Benning overall was better)
    HDCA-1st
    HDGA-1st

    I know you can’t be convinced. But Klefbom-Benning were excellent not only in their for/against rates, but also in what they actually gave up defensively. At least by everything measurable that’s available to us.

    If you look at just the last 2 years (removing the Sekera-Russell magic from 16-17) Klefbom-Benning together were better than any other Oilers defensemen overall in every single “against” category.

    The mismatches and odd man rushes you recall were inconsequential to the overall results on the ice, as well as to the chances against, shots against, goals against, etc etc etc that the Oilers gave up with them on the ice.

    Whatever you were seeing was either:
    1) not real, or,
    2) did not matter

    Clearly I agree, as I data I posted (and the great additions you made to it) are fairly evident.

    I will say that, with respect to the very end of your post, I won’t agree that if they are giving up a bunch of odd man rushes, etc. against that it “doesn’t matter”, I think it does matter, but that they are clearly on the ice for more positive chances than they give up, including high danger chances, and that is primary.

  135. OriginalPouzar says:

    ScungilliSlushy: Ok. But village idiot is too harsh. Every other team would have taken him if the Oilers didn’t.

    Would you call him that to his face?

    It’s easy to call it as you see it when there are no consequences isn’t it.

    To me when people act like this I think coward. Phony. I hope you aren’t.

    I agree and also take issue with, all of a sudden, many professing that this person (not player) is an idiot, with low intellect and stupidity. I mean, come on, the info we have on Puljujarvi as a person is minimal and its low brow to make judgement on him as a person based off of a few public comments. Yes, his current decisions seem to be poor choices but to call the person an idiot is too much. No, its not to his face but, come on Oiler Nation, lets be better!

  136. OriginalPouzar says:

    northerndancer:
    Every day, in every part of the world, people turn away fromwhat others see as “opportunity” and they are judged.Usually without full knowledge of that persons situation, how they see the world and how they put that ‘opportunity’ in the context of the rest of their lives.Rightly or wrongly.

    As fans we can cheer for the team or players, management etc.Trash them all, too.As players, management etc.But that doesn”t give us the right to trash them as people unless their actions are ‘trash’ or otherwise violate societal norms, etc.

    As far as I know, JP is a 20 year old kid who has not done this.He is merely chosing to turn away from what we call an opportunity.Lots of cash and fame for sure.Maybe more by our choices.Maybe what he needs by his.

    Lets keep our judging to the impact of the team rather than the value of that human being. Or speculation on their motives.

    Thanks

    Very well put!

  137. OriginalPouzar says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan: Every village has one … someone has to be on the low end of the distribution. So if village idiot is too harsh, what would you suggest in this era of political correctness where everyone earns a gold star? Emotionally underdeveloped? Socially challenged? Intellectual late bloomer? Wet behind the ears? Whatever.

    I also disagree with the premise that every other team would have taken him if the Oilers didn’t. When Carolina passed it was a huge, huge, huge red flag. A sea of red flags. This is a team that had more access to information on Jesse than any other and they passed hard. Recall that there was a top three that year with a perceived fall off thereafter. What should the Oil have done once they picked their collective jaws from the floor? Trade out, if possible, or select Keith’s kid. That is the smart move when you realize you are the mark in the room … try to get out alive.

    As to the rest of the post, I will give it the response it deserves.

    How about not making any overall judgement on a 21 year old kid based off of some decisions that you don’t agree with, as a biased fan, and profess that a 21 year old kid, you’ve never met and only know by a minutia of public identity, is an idiot, stupid, etc.?

  138. HT Joe says:

    As Oilers fans, we don’t get to call a player the village idiot when our collective management team has held that title for so long.
    It’s not Jesse’s fault he was drafted so high… it’s our management’s fault. He’s not the player the Oilers want him to be so they blame him for not living up to their expectations. It’s Dustin Penner vs MacT all over again (“he’s big and strong… why doesn’t he play mean too?!” except this time it’s “he’s a former 4th overall… why can’t he drive his own line and why does he need actual coaching?”).
    The Oilers with Chia and Tambellini developed a past of not doing due diligence. I don’t like Jesse’s stance now, but the Oilers aren’t getting a pass from me on this situation.

  139. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    OriginalPouzar: How about not making any overall judgement on a 21 year old kid based off of some decisions that you don’t agree with, as a biased fan, and profess that a 21 year old kid, you’ve never met and only know by a minutia of public identity, is an idiot, stupid, etc.?

    Last time I checked, 21 years old is a man. He’s playing in a man’s league, not a little boy’s league. So man up Jesse and act in an honorable and responsible fashion. Or not and take the heat. At this point I really don’t care … this player is dead to me. Not an Oiler. And there’s a very old and very appropriate saying that applies here: stupid is as stupid does. So do I know categorically that Jesse is stupid? No, and I never claimed such (you might Google the word “maybe”). But it sure is looking that way.

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