So, I wrote a book during the pandemic and had another one planned but never got around to it. My book is called “On the Clock” and it’s about the Edmonton Oilers and the entry draft. My second book was called “At the Deadline” and it was about Oilers deadline trades. Please read this.
The experience for me was pure joy. I still read a few chapters from time to time, and hold it dear as something good in my life. If I was ever to write a third book it would be called “What in hell happened in Cape Breton?” and it would be another pure joy.
The Cape Breton Oilers existed for eight seasons, that’s a good amount of time for an Edmonton affiliate. The teams that came out of there were exciting, high scoring and loaded with future NHL players. Let me list the notables from each season (there is overlap, as you might expect).
1988-89 (Ron Low coach): Mark Lamb, Shaun Van Allen
1989-90 (Don MacAdam): Shaun Van Allen, Chris Joseph
1990-91 (Don MacAdam): Shaun Van Allen, Shjon Podein, Francois Leroux
1991-92: (Don MacAdam): Shaun Van Allen, Shjon Podein, Steven Rice, Brad Werenka, Francois Leroux, Scott Thornton, Martin Rucinsky
1992-93 (George Burnett, won Calder Cup): Shaun Van Allen, Steven Rice, Roman Oksiuta, Scott Thornton, Kirk Maltby, Shjon Podein, Peter White, Francois Leroux
1993-94 (George Burnett): Peter White, Roman Oksiuta, Tyler Wright, Brad Werenka, Dean McAmmond, Dennis Bonvie, Greg De Vries
1994-95 (Peter Mahovlich): Peter White, David Vyborny, Todd Marchant, Miro Satan, Tyler Wright, Greg De Vries, David Oliver, Roman Oksiuta, Joaquin Gage, Steve Passmore.
1995-96 (Lorne Mollekan): Rem Murray, Greg De Vries, Dennis Bonnvie, Dean McAmmond, Tyler Wright, Ryan Smyth, Joaquin Gage, Steve Passmore, Fred Brathwaite.
When we talk about best AHL coach (and the Oilers have had some good ones), it’s important to place things in context. In 1990, the Oilers celebrated Stanley Cup No. 5, and all resources were devoted to winning another championship.
By 1991-92, Glen Sather was adding kids and trading NHL veterans, and you can see the spike in bona fide prospects. Right? So we have to view the AHL coach through the lens of what was being sent to the farm.
Over the past (more than) decade, Edmonton has enjoyed the services of Todd Nelson, Jay Woodcroft and Colin Chaulk. The talent that could come under the heading ‘draft and develop’ and ‘legit trade additions’ varies widely among those three gentlemen.
I think we can say Jay Woodcroft was the most creative, and Todd Nelson produced the most gems who had little draft pedigree. I would also suggest Chaulk has done a better job than many of you believe. I wish he were more creative, I wish the Oilers hadn’t flushed Roby Jarventie for Max Jones, but given the assets available to him, Chaulk has delivered.
The kids with draft pedigree graduated (sans Xavier Bourgault) and we’ll see about the depth additions who he has helped over time. It’s a tricky item, evaluating AHL coaches, but it’s important to factor in where an organization stands in the developmental curve when a specific coach is behind the bench.
On the Lowdown today, I’ll be joined by Kevin McCurdy to talk about player development and some of the prospects who are close to being NHL-ready. Noon to 2pm, Sports 1440 and You Tube.
Were the Edmonton Oilers’ offseason moves aided by analytics?
https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/7474279/2026/07/29/edmonton-oilers-roster-signings-trades-2026/
Your notes on Shakey and Shea and skating are scarey.
One would think that skating would be an issue with zone exits right?
Shea’s top attribute is zone exits – 12.1 zone exits per 60 last year, 88th percentile. 90th percentile for possession zone exits/60.
Stats per OilersSid.
Great, good or meh skater, zone exists are not an issue (or at least haven’t been).
If I recall, there was a concern about ability to defend off the rush and prevent zone entry with possession, both of which could be related to issues with speed. That said, I believe Shea still did a better job than Nurse, so it can’t all be related to speed either.
Fair enough.
We’ll find out.
Nurse was very poor at defending the zone entry, backing in and such but, at the same time, he was elite at not getting beat to the outside, like almost never.
Hard to get beat outside when your sitting on the goal line
Thanks.
My broader question is what defines “analytics” in this context?
I mean, we all have access to the publicly available data from NST and PuckIQ and Hockey Reference and some even Sport Logic with some more detailed micro stats but I think we can presume that is dwarfed by information available to the team and analysis of this data by a group of experts with background in numbers analysis is on a level we can’t comprehend.
I mean, the organization has made a large financial commitment to analytics and Bowman has said that analytics is part of their every day and every decision they make in all areas – I don’t think they are comparing unblock shot rates or expected goal share or even slot passes leading to chances and “with or without you” numbers.
LT, it must be such a trip.
You either opine something like Jarry being the front runner for starting job or spitball a trade with Boston, and the story gets picked up as news.
https://www.markerzone.com/news/index.php?no=598721
https://heavy.com/sports/nhl/edmonton-oilers/edmonton-oilers-linked-to-matt-poitras/
That first one is just a chatGPT article triggered by a tweet about an LT quote. it has just an insane amount of ads. Im guessing that whole site is just automated articles. Man the internet sucks now
Yesterday, one of the Habs sites I read had a rumour about the Oilers trading for Kirby Dach. Source? Our own LT imagining possibilities.
It’s mid summer. Hockeyworld is thirsty for rumours…
This is the first offseason in 3 years Connor and Company will have downtime to get healthy by playing some golf with the boys. I expect the Oilers and Panthers to meet in the Cup final. This time we have the upper hand in the goaltending department. The era of sphincter tightening on every shot is over.
I think the goaltending will be better because the team in front of the goaltenders will play a much more structured game, will manage the puck better and will vastly decrease the quantity (and quality) of the rush chances against the low-high pass to wide open dudes in the slot.
I’m not sure the personnel in net has improved as much as this post implies (give or take Levi who could just pop).
I’m not a fan of how Chaulk and Keith Gretzky deploy our prospects.
Sure the AHL is a man’s league and a big step up for some prospects coming from the Juniors and overseas. But I maintain prospects develop better with skill played with skill. Not sure there is room in modern player development for two checking lines and playing overage checkers up the lineup.
Seems like Bowman has gotten better results and a slight adjustment in tactics, and most of these guys won’t see 1000 NHL games, but is it wrong to expect more?
How does Chaulk not play skill with skill?
Each of: Samanski, Hutson, Marjala, Howard, Clattenburg and Carfagna exceeded reasonable pre-season expectations.
What more do you want from the AHL team?
It’s quite remarkable the lower level talent Bowman has brought in for virtually nothing.
Canada plays Sweden at the Summer Showcase at 5. It can be watched at ‘Hnlive” (might need to register) and TSN+ – Lafreneirre looks like he’s lining up on the 4th line…..
Connor McDavid signed less than 10 months ago and will be $12.5MM on the cap this year and next – think about that given some of the contracts out there.
Connor is taking a gamble that his health holds up. Connor-Leon-Hyman-Nuge-Ekholm-Bouchard. All of them want to win badly. If Nuge has another pop this year as I believe he was playing injured. Everyone of these deals are above par in today’s salary cap. Next year will be even better as salaries inflate. With Dickinson fresh off a deal and a healthy Frederic gives us finally a bottom six. Basically getting Murphy- Shea for the price of Nurse gives us a real shot this year. Besides seeing how the gang plays under structure and accountability this gives me a newfound jolt for this year. The biggest add is 3 goalies, 28 games each, I hope Babcock treats it like a mlb rotation the undressed goalie could go the City a day early on back-to-backs. A fresh goalie for every back-to-back may steal 10 points in the standings.
McD is taking the gamble that his lower salary will help GMSB build a Cup-winner. The man has made millions on ice. I can’t imagine he’s not turned some of that into millions off the ice. As much as I don’t care to hear him talk (he’s generally too careful to say anything off-script), what he has been clear about is winning —the Cup, Olympic Gold, 4Nations. Money is not so important. For that I give him lots of appreciation.
1) Jason Robertson taking a bigger risk – McDavid will have $127MM banked just from the Oilers even if he never signs another contract
2) I do have some reports that Nuge was dealing with an appendage issue again – it somewhat lines up as he was having a very good start to the season and, then, boom, his game cratered right at his 1000th game
3) Freddie should indeed to better than last season. Him banging in a goal early would do wonders
4) I think Shea is going to see lots of time in the top 4 through the season
5) The entire season rides on the team playing a much more structure game and managing the puck better
6) I don’t know doubt an even goalie split – that will be performance driven
7) I don’t know about a goalie travelling ahead but having the guy scheduled to play the 2nd game not dressing (or even coming to the rink) the day before will be a plus.
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Team Canada it seemed that often McDavid was trying to do too much. Cannot fault him for that, but an excellent player like Nate cant play on a line with McDavid because where does he go? Where does he fit? Their talents duplicated.
But Celebrini was different. Different skill set, less rush and puck-handling but absolutely fantastic at finding open ice, quick move and getting that shot away. These were my observations anyway.
Looking at the Oilers, the best player that can get open, receive a pass and get off an accurate shot is easily Leon. No wonder they want to play them together.
Who else? Could it be Howard?
Good points. They could have built lines around their world’s best centres. Should have. It’s pretty hard to load up a line against top teams full of top players. Showed in the final, but they had wobble all along
Take a look at some of the great lines. Bossy-Trottier-Gillis. Taylor-Dionne-Simmer. Kurri-Gretzky-Tikkanen etc these great lines always had a grunt digging out the puck. I think MacDavid-Hyman need a skilled bigger winger that loves the front of the net and keeps MacDavid save and sound. They can obtain him for Howard who still has the glow off of the Hobey Baker Award.
https://x.com/walsha/status/2082542018153291945?s=61
Considering the salary cap has resulted in the transfer of approx $4 billion in revenue from players to owners (2005 to today), my feelings haven’t changed. The fact top NHL players are now making $16M – $18M AAV underscores they would be making $30M+ without a cap.
Ya ok. It’s so much worse splitting profit evenly than before. You seem economically illiterate. The NHL doesn’t have enough teams making big fat stacks to not have a salary cap and not be a league dominated by 6 or whatever teams, which isn’t workable for a 32 + team league. And even with a cap it’s going back that way as many teams will increasingly struggle to meet the floor with cap levels far outpacing revenue increases
If NHL players want more they will have to negotiate a financial stake in real terms. They are employees now, and take no risk in big dollar risk taking. Sentiments and feelings aren’t putting your money where your mouth is
Also there’s no place in today’s NHL for escrow. If revenues fall short, adjust the cap for next year like they are boosting the cap every year lately. Zero reason the players should give ownership an interest free loan because they may have estimated wrong, was very surprised this didn’t come up in the last CBA after how Bettman screwed the players during the pandemic seasons.
How did Bettman screw the players.
The players played a truncated season with no fans and got their full compensation – the owners operated at a loss and the players got MUCH greater than 50% of HRR and then had to “pay it back” with the flat cap.
League revenue would not have grown without an sustainable economic model. Expansion would not have happened. There would have been fewer jobs for players.
50% of a massively growing pie is worth far more than 75% of nothing.
Now there should be more revenue sharing so more teams would be able to spend to the fast rising cap. With more revenue sharing the league could move from a hard cap to a flexiable cap with revenue sharing fees for spending beyong the flexible cap.
Without enhanced revenue sharing, the hard cap model is the only real sustainable economic model.
I was just reminded by dulock’s post that the likes of Kucherov, Makar and Q. Hughes are all UFAs next summer.
Where is all the talk about them wanting out because they haven’t re-signed a year in advance like we heard with McDavid until he signed last October? It was mayhem because he hadn’t re-signed yet. Not a work about Makar or Kuch (that I’ve read). There is word on Huhes as many think he will leave to join his brothers.
All of them are coming off long term contracts while NcDavid only signed a 2 year show me deal.
Hughes 6 years.
Makar 6 years
Kucherov 8 years.
They and their agents are likely assessing where the market is going to land.
If any of them sign for 2 years you might have a salient point.
3rd grade reading level on display, here.
What are you even talking about?
A year ago, McDavid was a year out from coming off an 8-year contract when he signed the 2-year extension. Prior to the the signing, half the hockey world was talking about about him not having signed yet as a daily talking point.
Those players are in the EXACT same situation as McDavid was a year ago except the two coming off 6 years deals not having been willing to give their team 8-year like McDavid did.
Good Grief.
Good grief indeed.
As I clearly stated…IF any of those players sign 2 year extensions, you have a point, otherwise you’re blathering.
Demoted to 2nd grade reading level. Yikes.
My goodness, this is 100% irrelevant to my post and the current situation.
Holy Hell.
What if it’s 3 years?
That would seem to be a lack of commitment.
What about 3.76 years?
Wild are in trouble then
Wow. The blog just witnessed the train pass your station in real time. I’ll reluctantly give you an “A” for effort, but an “F” for aim.
I’ve heard Makar wants out from Avalanche and McKinnon.
With Makar wanting out and the core of MacKinnon, Kadri, Landeskog and Burns aged out, perhaps it’s time for the Avalanche to have a firesale since they have little to no assets to use to improve their team and a 28th ranked prospect pool. Once Makar leaves this will also make the Avalanche one of the oldest teams in the league so they are basically done for.
Or at least that’s what I have been told the Oilers should do in the past under similar circumstances.
Agreed.
Whiffing last playoffs closed the window for the entire Avs franchise.
It’s over, Johnny. Over!
Everyone is criticizing the young phenoms as being mercenaries for not taking Max term on their second contracts. I see it a little differently. Taking Max term was always viewed as a hedge against a player getting a significant injury. Set yourself up for life just in case…etc.
Now the contracts are so big that they don’t need Max term to secure their post career prosperity. And I also think modern orthopedics have advanced to the point that they’re far less worried about catastrophic injury. McDavid’s knee rehab was a perfect example of that. In Bobby Orr’s day, that would have been “healed” with brutally invasive meatball surgery. Not anymore. Even knee injuries tearing multiple ligaments can be healed and rehabbed now. It’s a great time in history to be a professional athlete.
I think it’s really just their agents becoming more aware of a changing landscape.
A 21 year old signs an 8 year extension (soon to be 7 years) and is looking at their next contract at another contract age 29 that will likely take them past 35. Teams are likely to pay them BUT they’ll also be aware and account for a post 30-32 decline. In this scenario, they only get one opportunity to max out their earnings using a rising cap (ie Draisaitl who has not maximized his earnings) and even then not really. Both contracts are signed with a major uncertainty that a high level of play will continue.
A 21 year old signs a 4-5 year extension, they are signing another at age 25-26 right in the middle of their prime with the team and extension number 2 will leave them at 30-32 where they can sign the extension from scenario 1 at a similar or higher dollar (rising cap) 1,2 or 3 years later and for max term then.
Injury/decline are still big worries for players but this is about money and ensuring that they play where they want.
Shaun Van Allen, 794 games played. 45 PIMS. You’d think he would have more just based on being frustrated by being in the minors.
45 is his PIMs in 61 playoff games. He had 481 in those 794 games. https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=5886
When I was 18, before starting university, I hitchhiked from Halifax to Newfoundland via the Cabot Trail.
I met some wonderfully friendly folks on the road who were kind and generous to a kid with a dearth of real world experience.
“What the hell happened in Cape Breton” is a phrase that has been uttered for years. It’s usually accompanied by great memories, fun times and meeting wonderful people amidst learning experiences that may or may not include over-consumption of alcohol. If you’ve never been, I highly recommend, and you must drive the Cabot Trail while there.
Years ago, my son played high school hockey for Cole Harbour and the highlight of those years was playing in the Red Cup tournament in Coxheath, which is close to Sydney. It was the first time he played in a rink stuffed with 2,000 very loud hockey fans, it was the first time he saw bra’s tossed onto the ice, and unfortunately in his senior year, it marked the end of his high school hockey “career” when he took a clearing slapshot off his glove, which shattered his hand and required surgery. But if you ask him about the Red Cup and those times in Cape Breton, he’ll tell you it was one of his favourite hockey memories.
Currently been enjoying NYC so haven’t been keeping up with the craziness, but it’s really amazing that McDavid and Draisaitl have some of the most team-friendly deals in the league at the moment (could argue Bouch as well), and in a couple of years Draisaitl (along with Rantanen, MacKinnon, Marner, Eichel, Matthews) will have the most team-friendly contracts in the league by a significant margin.
Connor could easily up the AAV to 20 mil, and he surely deserves it, but these last couple of years have shown that the narrative “it is his responsibility to the NHLPA to set the market” is clearly false.
But as mentioned before, with the offer sheet and the complete loss of the second contract value, accumulating top round round picks is becoming ever less important in the NHL. NBA trades for megastars involve multiple 1st rounders, and NHL offer sheets are essentially the same now.
It’s kinda funny how contracts cycle like that. When Draisaitl signed his $8.5M x 8 year contract, there was a lot of talk about him not living up to the contract (he was 21 and had seasons of 51 and 77 points and it was the 10th highest cap hit in the league). His next season, he scored 70 points (good for 35th in the league) and the worry didn’t seem to pass for some although his contract was now 15th in the league. Then, he scored 50 goals and 105 points (#1 in goals, #4 in points) and his contract moved down to 24th in the league. Suddenly, he was a HUGE bargain.
When Draisaitl signed his $14M x 8 year deal, the cycle started again. Signed in September of 2024, that deal made him the highest paid player in 2025-26. He was #24 in goals and #9 in points last season. The deal starts to look a bit hefty. When will it become negative value?
Now, there are already 4 players with bigger cap hits and by a wide, wide margin. Bedard at 15M for a 75 point player becomes the new Draisaitl at $8.5×8. Kaprizov at $17M is a lot but he is a top 5/10 goal scorer. Then Carlsson at $18M brings Celebrini at $18.8M and we’re glad Draisaitl signed for 8 years when he did. Will it work out in the later years? That’s a solid maybe that is leaning to more likely than not. Crosby’s contract has been $8.7M for 15 straight seasons and it has always been a value deal. I think we’re about to see quite a lot of $15M+ deals over the next few years.
My hat is off to the stars who choose “team friendly” contracts. Even McD’s team friendly has made the Oilers roster budget tricky to navigate (because others will want to get paid too, because there will be missteps, because no matter how much Cap, there’s only so much to go around, and historically, only so much percentage of the Cap can be spent on the stars before the other 18-21 get hollowed out).
I was curious to watch the build around Celebrini. He’s just made that build a lot harder. As a Sharks fan I’d be asking, Does he want to be part of a Cup-contender, or…?
This is another reason to like what HuGo are building in Montreal: no contracts over $10M AAV. It’s as if their young stars are aware their contract modesty is a integral part of building towards Cup-contention, that it takes a team, not just an uber-talented player or two, to make that happen.
Celebrini is making his money now, when his cap hit does not matter…like Crosby, and McDavid, he will probably flatline his salary for most of the rest of his career.
You base this off of what, other than pure speculation?
The only thing we know is:
1) He’s signed two NHL contract
2) One being the max ELC with max bonuses and the other being a contract that makes him the highest paid player in the history of the league and for only 5 years (one UFA year).
— we visit NY once or twice a year
— it’s such a fantastic city for the buzz the variety of entertainment the food and neighbourhoods and just walking around.
— it also on a big uptick we’ve noticed over last few years : post covid markets hot
— just hope current mayor administration doesn’t take away what makes it a so great and focuses on making it better.
Will Celebrini be the highest paid next year or will Quinn Hughes?
The Wild gave Kaprizov $17M so if he doesn’t get more, it will be close.
Jason Robertson, Kucherov, Makar, & Hughes are all UFAs next summer so it’ll be interesting. Debrincat is as well but I don’t expect he’ll be the highest contract so much as he has the potential to blow open the market for the other 4. A young player could go supernova, but I doubt it. If McDavid signs an extension this summer (which seems likely), then that contract could reset the market as well.
I wonder if QH, having already made some $M, may be more interested in building a Cup-contender than his riches? I’m pretty sure leaving Vancouver wasn’t about money.
Who were the fans produced by Nelson? Some were cited yesterday and counters provided that many underperformed their draft pedigree and many got reps under a new AHL coach prior to any substantial AHL time.
What about getting a 7th rounder in Vinny to the NHL? What about Samanski?
Does Nelson have better pops on his resume?
You can look that up, OP. Hockeydb.
I looked it up – didn’t see many developmental wins.
Woodcroft gets the credit for Desharnais, not Chaulk.
I never said different.
Colin McDonald, Linus Omark, Jeff Petry, Teemu Kartikainen, Mark Arcobello, Martin Marincin, Tyler Pitlick, Anton Lander, Taylor Fedun, Chris VandeVelde, Brad Hunt, Oscar Klefbom, Justin Schultz, Jordan Oesterle, Jujhar Khaira, Iiro Pakarinen, Brandon Davidson.
With Nelson, it wasn’t so much “star power” as much as it was that he turned a lot of guys into serviceable NHL players that probably would not have made it otherwise. Oesterle (undrafted to 400+ NHL games) is a great example of that.
Nelson as head coach of the Oilers got great performances out of several unremarkable players (Yakupov, Lander, Roy, Andrew Miller, Marincin). He’s also won 3 UHL and 3 AHL championships. He has cache with Oilers fans because he was able to polish up a lot of players proportionate to other coaches.
I’d say Chaulk and Woodcroft were able to do the same but not necessarily with the same level of crap but that also has some era effects as well. Nelson was coach in an era where we were made three #1 picks, a #3 and a #7. Chaulk and Woodcroft had first round picks play significant time on their teams before graduating (Puljujarvi, Yamamoto, Bouchard, Broberg, Holloway) and I think we tend to dock them for having a better level of talent and for players not making it that maybe should have (Lavoie, Samorukov, Marody, Bourgault) but I’d also contend that recency bias is at play here.
Long story, short: All three are good, they all graduated players that should not have made it AND they all whiffed on some players that should have. Nelson has more cache because he came first.
Many of those are develpentla disappointments with their careers vs. draft pedigree.
And Justin Schultz does not count – unless he gets credit for Hall and Nuge.
I spoke to the likes of Colin McDonald and VandeVelde yesterday – Lander was a fail, Pitlick was fail, Omark was a fail, among others.
Pitlick has quietly played almost 500 NHL games. I’d say Hes a success. In reality though i think AHL coaches have far less impact on development than we think. Lander and Omark both had significant warts. Lander did have a hell of a season under Nelson in the NHL under Nelson though, he had 20 points in 34 games. I think he was playing with Hall for a bit. Nelson not coming back was probably the worst thing that could have happened to his career.
452 but, yes, good career. He was, of course, the 31st overall pick – in this day, that’s the 1st round.
I think it depends on the standard being used. Many go by games played, which is a success. But being able to keep a job in the NHL is different than having a bigger impact in it in some way
The former is probably more coaching related, the latter more draft related. The latter is of more interest to me
I think you’re forgetting how bad some of those picks actually were and ignoring the volume of scrubs that made it to the NHL. Desharnais and Samanski are a third pairing D and a fourth line centre with 30 NHL points between them. Just Oesterle has 96 points.
Woodcroft had Benson, Marody, Bear, Jones, Yamamoto, Samorukov, Lagesson, Maksimov, Lavoie, Safin, Niemelainen, Kemp, Mcphee, Berglund, etc. all are fails among others if that’s how you want to look at it and that’s a lot more talent than Nelson ever had.
Deharnais is trending to have just as impactful, if not more impactful a career as Osterle, we can say those off.
Marody, Bear, Jones, Lagesson, Samorukov, Maksimov, Safin, McPhee, Berglund – these are about 4th to 7th round picks and Jones and Bear, given the amount of NHL games they played, are great development success stories – as good as most of what Nelson had.
“saw those off”.
So, Benson – 2nd, Lavoie – 2nd, Yamamoto – 1st, don’t count. Samorukov – 3rd, Niemelainen – 3rd, Berglund – 3rd – don’t count as 3rds. Jones and Bear do count even though both played less than Khaira who doesn’t count. Petry, Marincin, Pitlick, Davidson, Lander – don’t count.
Desharnais & Samanski – super triple count.
This is what we call “making up the rules as you go along” because you don’t like the answer.
No, not at all:
1) you listed a bunch of players available to Woody that didn’t make it and I referenced a bunch off the top of my he’d that were mid to late round draft picks – I can easily make and equatable list for Nelson. The one’s I didn’t list, earlier picks that didn’t make it, well, Nelson has a nice list of 2nd and 3rd round picks that also didn’t make it.
2) You included Jones and Bear and I mentioned them given they were mid-late round picks that played beyond their draft expectation.
Osterle is referenced and I give that props but its equatable to Woody and Dehanais.
Lander was a 1st round pick and a fail – he underperformed his draft pedigree.
If we want to give Nelson Klefom then why don’t we give Woody Bouchard?
Lander was NOT a first round pick.
Like many players on the tweener borderline, whether one makes it or not depends on the team.
Lander would have had a much longer NHL career if Nelson had remained coach. Nelson knew what he could do and how to use him.
Hartikainen would have had an NHL career in the right situation.
Jarventie is probably the new Hartikainen, but they called up Jones last year rather than him, as MacT decided to sign Joensuu(?) rather than give Hartikainen a real legitimate shot.
Whereas Vandevelde and McDonald tried other NHL organizations, and made it, Lander and Hartikainen decided to go back to Europe, as European players often prefer that option, to trying another NHL organization.
Lander had 3 seasons under Nelson – wasn’t able to develop him in to an NHL player.
Hartikainen had 3 full seasons under Lander – wasn’t able to develop him in to an NHL player.
Lander and Hartikainen would have had NHL careers in the right situations, but it would have always likely been a struggle.
They chose instead to have long careers as first line players and earn modest incomes on European teams. Which is probably a more stable career and better life than going year to year on the 4th year on NHL teams.
This is 100% it. Lander put up 20 points in 38 games for Nelson and then 3 points in 61 games for Mclellan. That’s not “he forgot how to play”, that’s how the coach was using him. Nelson paired Yakupov with Roy and suddenly those two guys could score.
Toni Rajala lit the ECHL then the AHL on fire. Then went home because he didn’t want to be here. Slepyshev made it as a regular and then went home. Sometimes that’s how it goes.
So every good AHL player that isn’t good in the AHL is the failure of the NHL head coach after great work by the AHL head coach? Please.
So, you still haven’t read my original comment, huh?
So, you’re saying that I actually looked it up and referenced mine with data while you “off the top of your head” said that I was wrong.
That’s making up the rules as you go along. Ignoring all of Nelson’s wins while propping up a 3rd pairing defenceman and a 4th liner is you making up the rules as you go.
Make a set of criteria and see who is better.
#40 pick Anton Lander played 215 NHL games. #38 pick Raphael Lavoie played 16. #31 Tyler Pitlick played 451 games. #32 pick Tyler benson played 38 games. You can call them busts but Nelson’s guys had a substantially better career than Woodcroft’s guys.
FYI, Desharnais played under Woodcroft while Samanski played under Chaulk. That’s you deciding the answer without exploring the data.
Nelson is higher because he has more wins.
For every Lavoie bust under Woody there are equal busts under Nelson – I named them last night. Anton Lander’s NHL career fell short of draft day expectations – that’s not a development win.
Why aren’t we mentioning the failures of Nelson with Colton Teubert and Ryan Matrindale and Alex Plante and David Musil.
Woody has Caleb Jones and Ethan Bear and Stuart Skinner and Ryan McLeod and Kailer Yamamoto and Vincent Desharnais and Michael Kesselring – I won’t count the likes of Holloway, Bouchard and Broberg.
Glad you changed the rules again.
Now go back and read my first post.
For D, Nelson has Marincin, Osterle, Hunt, Petry, Davidson, Fedun, Chorney.
I won’t count Klefbom or Schultz.
My goodness, if you take Fedun and Chorney then you have to give Lagesson
Osterle is the equivalent of Desharnai
Marincin was another who underperformed draft day expectation. As did Chorney.
I didn’t know we were talking about developing tweeners/
Petry is a great one, although I’m not sure his half a season in the AHL was that material in his career – maybe.
Did the Oilers flush Jarventie? I mean, they qualified him to keep his RFA rights even with his signing in Europe. They’ve done this twice.
As far as “flushed for Max Jones”, Jones was not resigned until after Jarventie signed in Europe. If we are talking about opportunity last year, my memory has Jarventie with as many top 6 reps in the AHL as Jones – they were both middle six players and a bit up and down.
Jarventie did find his way to the NHL last year – of course, deployed as an after thought by Knob.
The Oilers recalled Jones, he earned the recall. Jarventie came back for a shot at the NHL, didn’t happen. I would have promoted Jarventie instead. Always go skill.
To be honest, I don’t think Jones earned his call-up last year as I thought he was “meh” in the AHL, inconsistent and didn’t commit fully. It worked as he as actually good in the NHL but I thought Jarventie had earned that call-up over him at the time (although they were still worried about his knee).
When playing musical chairs there’s only so many seats on the roster. Under another coach then K.K Jarventie might of carved out a Janmark career Jarventie did have the pedigree. He’s not the first player to be flushed out of the league because injury-wrong coach etc. As a prospect once you’ve been traded you no longer having the G.M that drafted you looking out for your better interests. There’s 100’s of players floating around the globe that could step into the NHL and not look all that far out of place.
I don’t exactly know how Jarventie feels about playing for the Oilers. But Max Jones certainly is genuinely excited to play in Edmonton for the Oilers. That in itself means something and makes me a Max Jones fan.
This is a big year for Max he has the pedigree and we all seen glimpses of him being the power forward G.M’s salivate over. He’s kinda in Kapanen shoes where both players know what they must do to stay in the league. Mad Max such seen the brinks truck back up for a 10 goal a year scorer in Dickinson. If Max happens to pop and has a career year there will be a few G.M’s interested in his services.
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Signed, sealed, extended. https://abs.twimg.com/emoji/v2/svg/2709.svg
Celebrini signs his extension.
5 year term with an $18.8m AAV starting in 2027-28.
My Flames supporting buddy was wanting Calgary to offer sheet Bedard this summer, then if not him wait and offer sheet Celebrini. Guess that’s off the table for Calgary now.
Good contract for a good young player.
I’m not sure the Flames are far enough along in their rebuild for that to make any sense.
A successful off sheet would require 4 first round picks so they are likely better off staying the course.
And, of course, whether or not Bedard would have signed with another rebuilding team is open to question.
Flames will be tanking again for DuPont. Their goaltending kinda messes that plan up they can always trade for Skinner. Conroy has zero pressure until the new rink opens and prices double-triple.
Celebrini is a special case, and truly the best candidate to replace McDavid as the generational talent. But taking the highest AAV when you aren’t the best player in the league presently is not what I would call a “good contract.” It’s a fair contract for an exceptional player and certainly a better contract than Leo’s, given that it reset the market.
If Bedard can recapture his form from pre-injury last season, that would be considered a good contract
It’s a good contract for him…. I’d say he’s better than Leo Carlson so earning $800k a year more is warranted.
$19.85MM signing bonus in year 1. That will be a big cheque.
Is Leon the last legit superstar they went full term?
Leon is a gem.
Of all the youngsters Celebrini is the only one that might be deserving of glorious pay day.
However IMO it’s coming a bit too early for these young fellas some who haven’t proven their legitimacy as of yet..
Old timey thinking.
Locking up elite players early is good business for both sides.
Well I guess I’m old school.
There was time when higher end RFAs could be locked up for a cap hit commiserate with their established abilities and likely forward progression. Guys like Calrsson are being extended for massive overpays and the term is not full. Celebrini is excluded from this as he’s a top tier superstar – the likes of Carlsson and Byram are not.
If with you on this, and my comment above about Leo C was made to point out that if “lesser” players are suddenly getting $18 mill for 5 years, then of course guys that are major difference makers are perfectly in their rights to ask for more cash.
All this to say Connor is getting PAID once this bridge deal runs out.
I don’t know about that – McDavid will have made 100 million by the time his next deal is done; with compounding interest during one of the greatest stock market booms ever, he’s got more money than he can spend in a lifetime.
Crosby kept taking under market deals for his jersey number with the aim of giving his team a chance to stay competitive. I won’t be surprised if Connor’s next deal matches Leon’s in AAV.
Got to leave some money on the table for Auston, you know!
He’s already over $100MM prior to this contract kicking in, and that’s just from his NHL earnings. Endorsements are estimated (AI) at about $5MM to $6MM per year.
I agree with the premise that he isn’t going to be looking to maximize his earnings from his NHL team.
Where he has won 0, 1 or 2 cups before his next contract I think he’s still going to want to win as primary. Of course, silly to think he’ll be anywhere near $12.5MM but I could see him in the $18MM range.
I mean, he could get whatever 20% of the cap is but, while, say, $3MM- $5MM is substantial (every for billionaires, they don’t like giving money away) will it make a difference to his day to day or his kid’s day to day? I know he’d be given up that much per year so we are talking maybe $30MM more if he does it for the rest of his career but the trade off is playing on better and more competitive hockey teams and it may be worth it to him.