Walls and Bridges

If the Edmonton Oilers do sign Derick Brassard, it makes the 23-man roster far easier to project. Jujhar Khaira can move back to the wing, Kyle Brodziak and Colby Cave can fight for the No. 4 center job, and Cooper Marody can focus on making the team in multiple positions.

THE ATHLETIC!

The Athletic Edmonton features a fabulous cluster of stories (some linked below, some on the site). Great perspective from a ridiculous group of writers and analysts. Proud to be part of the group, here’s an incredible Offer!

  • New Lowetide: Oilers end summer still shy on first-shot scoring wingers
  • Lowetide: Connor McDavid and optimal line chemistry: The Oilers need to abandon enforcer fixation and add a skill winger
  • Lowetide: Jesse Puljujarvi’s biggest hurdles: Bad timing and the indifference of the Oilers.
  • Lowetide: Projecting the Oilers 2019-20 Opening Night Lineup
  • Lowetide: Revisiting the Oilers’ 2016 draft and the opportunities missed
  • Lowetide: Examining the potential waiver-wire opportunities at hand for the Oilers
  • Lowetide: Cooper Marody’s utility gives him an edge for an Oilers roster spot in 2019-20
  • Lowetide: Ken Holland’s roster construction options for the Oilers over the next seven months.
  • Lowetide: Kailer Yamamoto has the talent to win a job with the Oilers on merit, if he’s healthy.
  • Jonathan Willis: Jesse Puljujarvi still has upside and the Oilers’ patient approach is the right one
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: Q&A: Dave Tippett on rounding out his coaching staff, fixing Oilers’ special teams and using Connor McDavid
  • Lowetide: Handicapping the Oilers’ young defencemen and their chances of replacing Andrej Sekera
  • Lowetide: Is Kirill Maksimov progressing as the Edmonton Oilers’ next great hope for a true homegrown sniper?
  • Jonathan Willis: Oilers ease pressure on crowded defensive pipeline by trading John Marino to the Penguins
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: What the 2021-22 Oilers might look like after their steady build toward contender status
  • Lowetide: Joel Persson is ideally situated to win an opening night roster spot with the Oilers
  • Jonathan Willis: Projecting the Oilers’ opening night lineup, line combinations and more.
  • Lowetide: Oilers’ acquisition of James Neal could add badly needed scoring to the top two lines.
  • Daniel Nugent-Bowman: Ken Holland puts his stamp on the Oilers with first big move in Lucic-Neal trade
  • Jonathan Willis: Ken Holland ends an ugly situation for the Oilers by trading Milan Lucic for James Neal
  • Jonathan Willis: Which Oilers defencemen can make an outlet pass?
  • Lowetide: Looking ahead to Oilers training camp: 35 players for 23 jobs
  • Jonathan Willis: Josh Archibald won’t fix the Oilers’ biggest problems, but he’ll help with some key issues.
  • Lowetide: Oilers top 20 prospects summer 2019.

PROJECTED ROSTER

Leon Draisaitl—Connor McDavid—Zack Kassian

James Neal—Ryan Nugent-Hopkins—Alex Chiasson

Markus Granlund—Derick Brassard—Josh Archibald

Jujhar Khaira—Kyle Brodziak—Sam Gagner

Colby Cave, Joakim Nygard

Oscar Klefbom—Adam Larsson

Darnell Nurse—Matt Benning

Kris Russell—Joel Persson

Caleb Jones

Mikko Koskinen (Mike Smith)

Brassard is an interesting player, and would definitely give Dave Tippett options. He isn’t a complete player (13:19 a night at evens, 1:35 on the power play but only five seconds on the PK) and his numbers have been eroding. He’s 48.1 percent on the dot.

So Brassard would get third line minutes and maybe second PP work. Could he score 15? Could he saw off the competition at 50 percent possession? That would be the ask, or the expectation. It’s a lot based on his 2018-19 season.

MORE JESSE

It’s on like Donkey Kong now, tweets and takes landing haymakers from the turnbuckle on young JP. I wrote a thread with a theory on twitter yesterday, idea being maybe there’s a deal already out there and this is the way (from the player side) to pressure Ken Holland.

I hope people understand he’s 21, and maybe remember when they were 21. Jesse Puljujarvi is doing what he thinks is best for his career, he is trying to find a better place in the sun. It’s going to be a difficult road for him now. He has no welcome signs should he return to Edmonton, and control over the coming season is in the hands of a manager known to slow play personnel decisions. He’ll get buried in this town, but not by me. I remember 21.

LOWDOWN WITH LOWETIDE

A fun, busy morning on TSN1260 beginning at 10. Bruce McCurdy from the Cult of Hockey at the Edmonton Journal has first lash, and we’ll discuss the Brassard and Puljujarvi stories. Chris Abbott from OddsShark.com will also be by to talk college football, CFL and NFL. 10-1260 text, @Lowetide twitter, all 90 minutes away!

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175 Responses to "Walls and Bridges"

  1. Offside says:

    You’re right. We all did some very immature rash things when we were 21. Although I gotta say, I doubt I would have treated my employer in quite the same way. Maybe its a generational thing, but in my day you respected the person who signs your paycheque and wait until you get another job opportunity

  2. Profit says:

    I agree with your take LT… that scenario is one of the only ones that makes sense, but I still don’t think it’s a good tactic. Holland came in and knows that Chia had a reputation for “doing favours” for people (Gryba!) and from day one spoke about the new world order in Edmonton. He is not going to sell JP off for peanuts and won’t be pressured.

    It’s just unfortunate we’re in this situation. I don’t see a clear way out.

  3. Side says:

    Offside:
    You’re right. We all did some very immature rash things when we were 21. Although I gotta say, I doubt I would have treated my employer in quite the same way. Maybe its a generational thing, but in my day you respected the person who signs your paycheque and wait until you get another job opportunity

    “maybe it’s a generational thing”

    It’s not. And there were people in your day who were also not “respectful of the person who signed their paycheques”.

    Eric Lindros didn’t even want to give his employer a chance and refused to join the Nordiques.

    Paul Coffey

    Steve Larmer

    Keith Primeau

    Do we need to dig deeper?

  4. Louis Levasseur says:

    JP is getting very bad advice or ignoring good advice. It’s way too easy to pin this on the team. We hear talk about issues in the dressing room and him not fitting in, maybe because of the language barrier. I’d say two things to that, if it’s true: (1) give it an honest effort to learn the language. Maybe the Oilers could have done more initially to make that happen, but his handlers (agents, parents, coaches) have known since he was 15 that he was probably going to make a living in the NHL, so maybe be proactive and take English lessons; (2) if you are a good guy and good teammate, language barriers are easily overcome. Look at all the Latin speaking players on the Jays. It seems to me that everybody likes Vladdy, even though his English is apparently pretty negligible. If JP is a good guy and a fun guy, all his English speaking teammates would have embraced him. At the very least taught him all the good swear words and he would have taught them how to swear in Finnish.

    Sorry, but something doesn’t add up here with our boy JP

  5. jp says:

    I’ve got this feeling that Brassard (if he does sign) might end up in the top 6.

    On one level it makes no sense because the Oilers have a gaping need at 3C.

    But on another level, well there’s a pretty big need in the top 6 as well. And Brassard’s history (prior to last season) is as a scorer.

    In either case I hope he does sign. If he can recover his game he’ll be the Oilers biggest FA add of the off season.

    Crazy top 6 Brassard lineup, version 1:
    Draisaitl-McDavid-Neal
    Nuge-Brassard-Chiasson
    Nygard-Gagner-Kassian
    Granlund-Khaira-Archibald

  6. texmex says:

    Stauffer, Gregor and Matheson are all throwing cold water on the Brassard/Oilers signing.

  7. godot10 says:

    Signing a 3rd line centre who can’t PK seems pretty unwise if it for anything more than $1 million.

    ——————————————————————–
    It’s a long way to #Tippettary. It’s a long way to go.

  8. Rondo says:

    Zacha would be an interesting player for the Oilers, wonder if NJ has interest in Jesse P

  9. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    Rondo:
    Zacha would be an interesting player for the Oilers, wonder if NJ has interest in Jesse P

    You are not getting Zacha for JP. JP has negative to zero value at this point. Every GM in the league knows the “problem” with Jesse at this point even if we as fans do not … and that problem is very likely not fixable. Time to move on.

  10. defmn says:

    Rondo:
    Zacha would be an interesting player for the Oilers, wonder if NJ has interest in Jesse P

    I think there are a few teams interested in Jesse. I just don’t think any of them are interested in paying anything substantial for him. Pretty sure every offer has been a failed prospect of their own with maybe a 4th or something like that thrown in just to sweeten the pot.

    I fear Jesse is going to be playing in Europe this year and maybe longer.

  11. OriginalPouzar says:

    A Brassard signing likely blocks Cooper Marody out of camp although, at the same time, I think he can still make the team over a Brodziak or a Cave and I wouldn’t mind seeing a Khaira/Marody/Gagner fourth line.

    Nope, don’t like a guy with skill like Marody on a “fourth line”, however, that line has skill and I wouldn’t call it a prototypical 4th line grinder type line.

    The more I look at it, although there is a worry about speed with both Marody and Gagner, the more i like it.

  12. cowboy bill says:

    Jesse Puljujarvi lives in some kind of fantasy world .

    He wants to be gifted a job as a top six forward in the NHL .
    It doesn’t seem to be working out for him in Edmonton .

    But oh no , it has nothing to do with him .
    It’s these players he has to play with , Mcdavid , Draisaitl & Nugent-Hopkins .
    They need to go so he can play in the top six . He just needs to find another team to play on ,
    because he is an NHLer , it’s not his fault . Why can’t anybody see that ?

  13. Reja says:

    Side: “maybe it’s a generational thing”

    It’s not. And there were people in your day who were also not “respectful of the person who signed their paycheques”.

    Eric Lindros didn’t even want to give his employer a chance and refused to join the Nordiques.

    Paul Coffey

    Steve Larmer

    Keith Primeau

    Do we need to dig deeper?

    Coffey, Larmer and Primeau had proven just a tad more then Jesse has at the time. It was all about old fashioned money. Lindros was a different story he didn’t want to play for the City or the team that drafted him his sense of entitlement tarnished is reputation and hockey legacy to this day.

  14. Side says:

    Reja: Coffey, Larmer and Primeau had proven just a tad more then Jesse has at the time.It was all about old fashioned money.Lindros was a different story hedidn’t want to play for the City or the team that drafted him his sense of entitlement tarnished is reputation and hockey legacy to this day.

    So it was about money, and not about wanting to play hockey. At least JP seems to want to play in the top 6, 15 minutes a night and is not holding out because of money.

    Again, the Lindros situation is also worse from a behavioral perspective.

    My comment was directed towards perceived generational differences to explain players behaviors, which I don’t really buy in cases like this. There are JP’s, Coffey’s, Lindros’ in all generations.

  15. OriginalPouzar says:

    I will hold up a welcome sign if Jesse comes back to Edmonton.

    I will rip the sign up, however, if he doesn’t work his ass off, play where placed by the coach and work to earn his way up the linep (if not there to start post-camp).

  16. Munny says:

    LT said…

    It’s on like Donkey Kong now, tweets and takes landing haymakers from the turnbuckle on young JP. I wrote a thread with a theory on twitter yesterday, idea being maybe there’s a deal already out there and this is the way (from the player side) to pressure Ken Holland.

    This doesn’t strike me as a viable theory.

    Of course the Oilers have received offers on Pujo. That’s a no-brainer. So if you’re Pujo’s camp you do everything possible to grease a trade, not everything possible to sabotage a trade.

    We’re seeing immaturity at work, not a well-executed plan or strategy. And there’s a definite whiff of vengeance/payback in the air.

    Immaturity or Jesse has a real hankering for a pay cut, and prefers trains over planes.

  17. bwar says:

    I was pretty dumb when I was 21, I made a plethora of bad decisions. I wasn’t getting paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to play a game and I didn’t have professionals hired to help me out. Big difference between a fans 21 and a professional athletes.

  18. Primetime says:

    Side: So it was about money, and not about wanting to play hockey. At least JP seems to want to play in the top 6, 15 minutes a night and is not holding out because of money.

    It may still be a bit about money, as he may see his lack of opportunity as to why he received only a qualifying offer vs. his draft class all vying for massive RFA contracts.

    That being said, interesting to see the 2 Finns from that class end up in the same spot despite different paths. Both Laine and JP highly touted and clear cut top 3 picks. One gifted top 6/PP1 minutes, the other slow played on lower lines with no PP. While Laine had initial success, it’s slowed a bit, but now both are without a signed contract with word that Winnipeg hasn’t even really started negotiating with Laine yet. Maybe Aho really was the straw that stirred the drink on that incredible World Junior line….

  19. Coiler says:

    Ahhhhh….to be 21 again. The thought that my age could magically absolve me of making the proper life altering decisions that could involve millions of dollars despite there being guidance from parents, players, agents, players from yesteryear, etc… is not acceptable.

    But wait, could it be that all those things I’ve mentioned are the real reasons why JP has “made” these decisions? Could it be that they’ve all been puppet masters and he’s been strung along this whole time?

    It could be. But then again, if Jack Johnson’s story wasn’t a dire warning to all pro players about bad influence then I don’t know what is. Either way, I’m not buying any of it. The second you turn pro the learning curve will be steep and additional hard work needs to be put in to reap the rewards. Simply put, he hasn’t put in the hard work.

    You reap what you sow JP.

  20. Munny says:

    Side,

    We always need to be careful about extrapolating from the specific to the general.

  21. Side says:

    Munny:
    Side,

    We always need to be careful about extrapolating from the specific to the general.

    Not sure why you are directing that comment to me.

  22. jp says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan:
    JP has negative to zero value at this point.

    Negative value?! OMG

  23. Bag of Pucks says:

    Side: “maybe it’s a generational thing”

    It’s not. And there were people in your day who were also not “respectful of the person who signed their paycheques”.

    Eric Lindros didn’t even want to give his employer a chance and refused to join the Nordiques.

    Paul Coffey

    Steve Larmer

    Keith Primeau

    Do we need to dig deeper?

    Possibly it’s both?

    You’re absolutely right that entitlement is not a trait exclusive to any one generation. That said, the current trends in regards to job jumping are unlike anything ever seen before. It’s a bit chicken & egg. Did the gig economy prompt rampant job jumping or vice versa? As a person who regularly interviews candidates, the changes are astonishing. Before people would make excuses for job jumping on their resume. Now it’s worn like a badge of honour. “I’m stepping over bodies to climb the ladder!”

    I think it is fair to say based on the numbers and recent trends that loyalty to employer is very much a concept that is dying with the current generation. Millennials see a job as a means to an end, not the end itself. It’s actually a healthy thing, but I would not want to be a small business owner atm, especially one dependent on skills maturation and low turnover. Getting people to grow with a company is a huge challenge now.

  24. Munny says:

    Side: Not sure why you are directing that comment to me.

    Pretty sure it was a sign of agreement, consolidating your post into one principle. But, carry on, lol.

  25. Offside says:

    Side,

    “My comment was directed towards perceived generational differences to explain players behaviors, which I don’t really buy in cases like this. There are JP’s, Coffey’s, Lindros’ in all generations.”

    Yeah – there are no examples of changes of attitudes in society changing where one generation thinks differently than another . Coming up with a few outliers does not disprove the general point. There are always exceptions to the norm

  26. Reja says:

    Side: So it was about money, and not about wanting to play hockey. At least JP seems to want to play in the top 6, 15 minutes a night and is not holding out because of money.

    Again, the Lindros situation is also worse from a behavioral perspective.

    My comment was directed towards perceived generational differences to explain players behaviors, which I don’t really buy in cases like this.There are JP’s, Coffey’s, Lindros’ in all generations.

    Arguably I see Lindros as one of a kind not seen before or since in the History of the NHL that I can recall.

  27. OriginalPouzar says:

    russ:
    Chelios is a Dinosaur,

    Tippett is so going to run a shutdown line of Granlund – Brassard – Archibald.

    Not sure if Brassard is a typical “shutdown line” type of player, however, I do believe Tippett sees Granlund/Archibald as a pair and, if signed, Brassard should slot in between them.

    Stuaffer putting some water on the Brassard signing, indicating he likely has multiple short term offers and wouldn’t be surprised to see him stay out east.

  28. dcsj says:

    The only “benefit of doubt” on the Jesse thing is maybe something is being lost in translation. But then, he keeps digging the same hole, with no attempt at correcting previous possible mistranslations. So the “benefit of doubt” is trending small

  29. Side says:

    Bag of Pucks: Possibly it’s both?

    You’re absolutely right that entitlement is not a trait exclusive to any one generation. That said, the current trends in regards to job jumping are unlike anything ever seen before. It’s a bit chicken & egg. Did the gig economy prompt rampant job jumping or vice versa? As a person who regularly interviews candidates, the changes are astonishing. Before people would make excuses for job jumping on their resume. Now it’s worn like a badge of honour. “I’m stepping over bodies to climb the ladder!”

    I think it is fair to say based on the numbers and recent trends that loyalty to employer is very much a concept that is dying with the current generation. Millennials see a job as a means to an end, not the end itself. It’s actually a healthy thing, but I would not want to be a small business owner atm, especially one dependent on skills maturation and low turnover. Getting people to grow with a company is a huge challenge now.

    Employer loyalty is a concept that should die, imo. The number of times I have seen employers turn on employees in the name of profits or change is huge. I have even seen employers ask candidates to commit to working for them full time, for at least 5 years, even though they acknowledge that they don’t pay as well or have benefits to match their competitors. Why on Earth would anyone do that?

    Employers inherently seek a profit off of the backs of their employees who make significantly less. Employees don’t owe them anything outside of loyalty, imo.

    Of course this is generally speaking, and I do acknowledge there are a lot of employers who are loyal to their employees and their employees are loyal in return.

    I just disagree with the notion of “someone hired you, so you owe them your life, even if they overwork you, don’t pay you enough, and give you poor benefits”

  30. Decidedly Skeptical Fan says:

    jp: Negative value?! OMG

    What does negative value look like? Maybe Holland can work some magic and get Seattle to accept our 4th round pick in the draft if they will take Jesse in the expansion draft.

  31. Side says:

    Munny: Pretty sure it was a sign of agreement, consolidating your post into one principle. But, carry on, lol.

    Oh, my misunderstanding then. I thought you were trying to give me advice and I was confused as to why you were directing it towards me. lol

  32. geowal says:

    Primetime: It may still be a bit about money, as he may see his lack of opportunity as to why he received only a qualifying offer vs. his draft class all vying for massive RFA contracts.

    All the other RFAs received qualifying offers too. JP is just the one who hasn’t earned something more substantial as a follow up offer.

  33. Professor Q says:

    Reja: Arguably I see Lindros as one of a kind not seen before or since in the History of the NHL that I can recall.

    There was that big guy in Calgary who passed away in the car crash. Some say he was Lindros-ite.

    Malkin and Kharlamov?

  34. JimmyV1965 says:

    Primetime: It may still be a bit about money, as he may see his lack of opportunity as to why he received only a qualifying offer vs. his draft class all vying for massive RFA contracts.

    That being said, interesting to see the 2 Finns from that class end up in the same spot despite different paths.Both Laine and JP highly touted and clear cut top 3 picks.One gifted top 6/PP1 minutes, the other slow played on lower lines with no PP.While Laine had initial success, it’s slowed a bit, but now both are without a signed contract with word that Winnipeg hasn’t even really started negotiating with Laine yet.Maybe Aho really was the straw that stirred the drink on that incredible World Junior line….

    Laine has scored 110 goals and he was still 20 years old when the season ended. I wouldn’t argue he was gifted top 6 minutes and PP time. This kid is a special talent.

  35. Side says:

    Offside:
    Side,

    “My comment was directed towards perceived generational differences to explain players behaviors, which I don’t really buy in cases like this. There are JP’s, Coffey’s, Lindros’ in all generations.”

    Yeah – there are no examples of changes of attitudes in society changing where one generation thinks differently than another . Coming up with a few outliers does not disprove the general point. There are always exceptions to the norm

    But in your example, JP is the outlier, not the norm compared to his peers that are his age or around his age.

    McDavid and Draisaitl signed a max 8 year deal, and because someone else brought it up in this thread, that is considered to be ‘loyal’ which is a characteristic that older generations like to associate themselves with.

    McDavid and Draisaitl sign an 8 year deal with a shitty team and no one applauds them or makes comments like “it’s because he’s a Gen Z and or Millenial, they are a very loyal generation”. People applaud them as individuals.

    JP wants to play meaningful hockey somewhere else and then you see “hmm, must be a generational thing”. I don’t buy the generational differences in this context, or many other contexts.

    I’m not saying generational differences don’t exist, and I’m not directing this to you only, but the amount of things they are attributed to is overblown and ridiculous.

  36. Bag of Pucks says:

    Side: Employer loyalty is a concept that should die, imo.The number of times I have seen employers turn on employees in the name of profits or change is huge.I have even seen employers ask candidates to commit to working for them full time, for at least 5 years, even though they acknowledge that they don’t pay as well or have benefits to match their competitors. Why on Earth would anyone do that?

    Employers inherently seek a profit off of the backs of their employees who make significantly less.Employees don’t owe them anything outside of loyalty, imo.

    Of course this is generally speaking, and I do acknowledge there are a lot of employers who are loyal to their employees and their employees are loyal in return.

    I just disagree with the notion of “someone hired you, so you owe them your life, even if they overwork you, don’t pay you enough, and give you poor benefits”

    I don’t see loyalty as a black & white issue. Many shades of grey. Absolutely if an employer is a taker, why be a giver?

    But conversely, as an employee, you shouldn’t take take take either just to advance your own status at the expense of an employee who’s acting as a benefactor.

    It costs companies money to train inexperienced employees and not all companies are wildly profitable. Imo an employee should stay long enough to at least pay back a return on that investment. If this trends too far in one direction, you could see companies becoming resistant to recruiting a certain type of personality profile that skews towards job jumping.

  37. Professor Q says:

    Side: So it was about money, and not about wanting to play hockey. At least JP seems to want to play in the top 6, 15 minutes a night and is not holding out because of money.

    Again, the Lindros situation is also worse from a behavioral perspective.

    My comment was directed towards perceived generational differences to explain players behaviors, which I don’t really buy in cases like this.There are JP’s, Coffey’s, Lindros’ in all generations.

    If I remember correctly, Lindros’ father was the accountant or part of the same accounting firm for the owner of the Nordiques, and knew the guy was shady and a bad apple (was he tied in with the Québec construction laundering mafia?).

    They didn’t want to associate themselves with someone who was cooking the books and being otherwise unethical. Say what you want about entitlement but if they indeed knew something more than stories and wanted to uphold their integrity, knowing they’d be painted as the villains and entitled brats so to speak in the story, then perhaps we should re-evaluate how we view the situation.

    Then, well, Québec ended up moving for various reasons, right?

  38. Primetime says:

    JimmyV1965: Laine has scored 110 goals and he was still 20 years old when the season ended.I wouldn’t argue he was gifted top 6 minutes and PP time. This kid is a special talent.

    He was put in the top 6 and PP1 right from the get go. JP would argue he could have put up similar numbers if given the same opportunity. Not saying he would but am sure that’s what he thinks.

    Yes Laine produced, but that’s after the fact. He was given the opportunity first, not asked to work his way up the lineup

  39. Primetime says:

    geowal: All the other RFAs received qualifying offers too. JP is just the one who hasn’t earned something more substantial as a follow up offer.

    Of course they did but that is the only offer JP is likely to get from the Oilers. It’s merely a formality for his draft classmates who are negotiating bigger paydays

  40. Side says:

    Bag of Pucks: I don’t see loyalty as a black & white issue. Many shades of grey. Absolutely if an employer is a taker, why be a giver?

    But conversely, as an employee, you shouldn’t take take take either just to advance your own status at the expense of an employee who’s acting as a benefactor.

    It cost companies money to train inexperienced employees and not all companies are wildly profitable. Imo an employee should stay long enough to at least pay back a return on that investment. If this trends too far in one direction, you could see companies becoming resistant to recruiting a certain type of personality profile that skews towards job jumping.

    I think it’s still a bit of an.. unwritten rule? societal norm? for employees to stay about 2 years or so in a position before looking elsewhere. And HR/hiring managers still consider how often people have hopped around employers when considering a candidate. But that also depends entirely on the field or industry they are in as well and whether it is normal for an employee with a particular skillset to be hopping around so much.

    But, that’s all anecdotal.

  41. Side says:

    Professor Q: If I remember correctly, Lindros’ father was the accountant or part of the same accounting firm for the owner of the Nordiques, and knew the guy was shady and a bad apple (was he tied in with the Québec construction laundering mafia?).

    They didn’t want to associate themselves with someone who was cooking the books and being otherwise unethical. Say what you want about entitlement but if they indeed knew something more than stories and wanted to uphold their integrity, knowing they’d be painted as the villains and entitled brats so to speak in the story, then perhaps we should re-evaluate how we view the situation.

    Then, well, Québec ended up moving for various reasons, right?

    Maybe 20 years from now we will find out that JP has been hinting at something more nefarious going on within the Oilers that he discovered. Has anyone studied JP’s face in interviews to see if his blinks are translating into morse code?

  42. Professor Q says:

    Side: Maybe 20 years from now we will find out that JP has been hinting at something more nefarious going on within the Oilers that he discovered.Has anyone studied JP’s face in interviews to see if his blinks are translating into morse code?

    I’m not sure. It’s possible. But when Koskinen, a relatively new face who is not trusted as much as some other starters, starts saying things like maybe it’s not the culture or language change that’s affecting things but Jesse’s immaturity and poor focus on training and fitness (the recent “I guess he speaks enough English to order pizza” comment etc..), maybe it really is Jesse not buying in and alienating himself, even from those who speak his language and share his culture.

  43. rickithebear says:

    LT:
    When I saw claimed Brassard signing.
    16-17 11 evg #66C; 32 evp # 49C
    .74 evg/60; 2.15 evp/60
    17-18 16 evg #36 C; 40 evp #36 C
    .88 evg/60; 2.21 evp/60
    18-19 12 evg #70 C
    .77 evg/60; 1.17 evp/60

    Brassard has seen a lot of 60-74% FO OFF ZS in his career
    Last year 50% and he crashed.

    Gagner:
    First 7 yr in EDM
    .52 to .85 evg/60
    1.56 to 1.97 evp/60
    55 – 62% FO OFF ZS 5 of 7 yrs

    ARZ, PHI, VCR
    .44 to .57 evg/69
    1.23 to 1.44 evp/60
    FO OFF ZS
    ARZ – 67%; PHI – 53%; VCR – 59%

    CBJ
    .66 evg/60; 2.10 evp/60
    57% FO OFF ZS

    Edm last yr
    .95 evg/60; 1.89 evp/60
    38% FO OFF ZS

    2 of last 3 yr Gagner has been
    .66 to .95 evg/60
    1.89 to 2.10 evp/60

    Neither guys are def specialist.
    Cannot see them getting much bench change without pocession of puck.
    For the 50% – 60% of ZS that are bench change starts.

    Brassard 48% career FO % needing a 60 -70% Face off offensive zone start.
    Not a PP fwd sub 6.00 PPGF/60

    Gagner 45.5% Career FO% with a mostly 53 -58% Face off offensive zone start.
    #58 Fwd 8.22 PPGF/60 last 3 seasons.

    Might as well give Gagner some 3C Center time.

  44. Reja says:

    Professor Q: If I remember correctly, Lindros’ father was the accountant or part of the same accounting firm for the owner of the Nordiques, and knew the guy was shady and a bad apple (was he tied in with the Québec construction laundering mafia?).

    They didn’t want to associate themselves with someone who was cooking the books and being otherwise unethical. Say what you want about entitlement but if they indeed knew something more than stories and wanted to uphold their integrity, knowing they’d be painted as the villains and entitled brats so to speak in the story, then perhaps we should re-evaluate how we view the situation.

    Then, well, Québec ended up moving for various reasons, right?

    Neat. That’s the first time I’ve seen or heard that story angle.

  45. Bag of Pucks says:

    Side: I think it’s still a bit of an.. unwritten rule? societal norm? for employees to stay about 2 years or so in a position before looking elsewhere. And HR/hiring managers still consider how often people have hopped around employers when considering a candidate.But that also depends entirely on the field or industry they are in as well and whether it is normal for an employee with a particular skillset to be hopping around so much.

    But, that’s all anecdotal or what I have experienced.

    With the NHL, the expectation is the club makes the training investment with your ELC and anticipates returns on that investment with your RFA contract.

    Fair to say that Jesse is being a bit of a taker/job jumper in wanting to leave without delivering any production or ROI of significance? The Oilers have spent considerable $s on this player and received scant in return.

  46. Offside says:

    Side,

    Thats reasonable. Although to be fair, I said “maybe” it is a generational thing rather than “must be a generational thing”. You are responding to alot of people so I’ll let it slide 😉 Maybe this is due to my generation not getting offended as easily ;p

    JP may be the outlier here. But I guess my assumption is that a player with his track record would not think of trying this during most eras in NHL history. I could be wrong

  47. rickithebear says:

    Draisaitl played wing with mcdavid 888:04 of his 1482:54
    That leaves 594:50 left to play 3C
    7:15 of his 18:08 EVTOI per gm can be at 3C

    The 3C (#63 – #93 C) got 1033:46 to 951:06
    992:30 would be approx. median.

    594.833/992.5
    59.9% of 3C EVTOI could be Draisaitl.
    Leaving other 40% for Haas, Khaira, Gagner ……….

    Can you imagine how happy wingers would be if 594 of their even minutes were with Draisaitl at center.

    How many wingers other than Drai, Chaisson, Kassian, Neal would be happy with a portion of minutes of Mcdavids non Draisaitl time.

    To have top 60 evg and evg/60 wingers who have shown top 31 winger production and rates recieving Draisaitl passes.

    Based on this our Primary ( better than 50% of EVTOI for position) forwards
    Every game our top 2 off pairs and 3C would be.

    Draisaitl – Mcdavid – xxx
    xxx – RNH – Kassian
    xxx – Draisaitl – xxx
    Draisaitl our starting 1st line winger and 3C.

    You can legitimately be an all star at Center & Wing.

  48. Side says:

    Professor Q: I’m not sure. It’s possible. But when Koskinen, a relatively new face who is not trusted as much as some other starters, starts saying things like maybe it’s not the culture or language change that’s affecting things but Jesse’s immaturity and poor focus on training and fitness (the recent “I guess he speaks enough English to order pizza” comment etc..), maybe it really is Jesse not buying in and alienating himself, even from those who speak his language and share his culture.

    I can see that for sure. I know the Oilers screwed around with his development and didn’t do him any favors in that regard, but I also do recall there was a lot of discussion (on this forum at least) about how the Oilers poorly supported Jesse off the ice (not getting an english teacher instead of a tutor soon enough, no one seeming to befriend/guide/support him off the ice, etc.). I’m starting to wonder how much of that is on Jesse now. Based on Jesse and his agents comments so far I can see it being a case of Jesse not buying in or alienating himself like you said.

    Oh to be a fly on those walls..

  49. jp says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan: What does negative value look like? Maybe Holland can work some magic and get Seattle to accept our 4th round pick in the draft if they will take Jesse in the expansion draft.

    We’ll see I guess.

  50. Side says:

    Offside:
    Side,

    Thats reasonable. Although to be fair, I said “maybe”it is a generational thing rather than “must be a generational thing”. You are responding to alot of people so I’ll let it slide Maybe this is due to my generation not getting offended as easily ;p

    JP may be the outlier here. But I guess my assumption is that a player with his track record would not think of trying this during most eras in NHL history. I could be wrong

    You’re right, you did say maybe it was and not definitely was because of a generational thing. I have seen similar comments floated on this site before so I saw it as an opportunity to rant about it.

    No offense taken on my part, but I will admit being exhausted by generational differences being associated with so many things.

    Especially when my recommended articles shown to me by the Google AI, for whatever reason, show me nothing but articles about:

    “Millenials are killing the condiment industry”

    “Baby boomers ruined America”

    “Tim Hortons has decided to improve their coffee and donuts because of millenials”

    “MILLENNIALS HATE CASH”

    “BABY BOOMERS CAN’T LEARN TECHNOLOGY”

  51. Bag of Pucks says:

    Side,

    You’re being shown that stuff because you’ve demonstrated an interest in engaging in that type of content before (like today).

    If you’re frustrated with that, you can clear cache on your device of choice, tighten your security settings so you’re not an open book to advertisers or stop engaging with the topic.

  52. Side says:

    Bag of Pucks:
    Side,

    You’re being shown that stuff because you’ve demonstrated an interest in engaging in that type of content before (like today).

    If you’re frustrated with that, you can clear cache on your device of choice, tighten your security settings so you’re not an open book to advertisers or stop engaging with the topic.

    Yeah, no luck on that front as I have tried that stuff before.

  53. John Chambers says:

    Decidedly Skeptical Fan: What does negative value look like? Maybe Holland can work some magic and get Seattle to accept our 4th round pick in the draft if they will take Jesse in the expansion draft.

    Expansion casualty might be the best outcome for JP and the Oilers.

    Two years in Finland to grow up, then sail on.

  54. Offside says:

    Side,

    Yeah click bait headlines aren’t helpful to anyone. Change is inevitable. For everything millenials have “ruined” there is probably an area where they boosted as well

  55. JimmyV1965 says:

    Primetime: He was put in the top 6 and PP1 right from the get go.JP would argue he could have put up similar numbers if given the same opportunity.Not saying he would but am sure that’s what he thinks.

    Yes Laine produced, but that’s after the fact.He was given the opportunity first, not asked to work his way up the lineup

    Laine scored 36 goals his first year. JP scored in his first game and never scored again that season. Laine scored in his first game, then scored a hat trick in his fourth game. Im not saying anything about JP. I’m simply arguing that Laine wasn’t gifted anything.

  56. OriginalPouzar says:

    LouisLevasseur:

    JP is getting very bad advice or ignoring good advice.It’s way too easy to pin this on the team.We hear talk about issues in the dressing room and him not fitting in, maybe because of the language barrier.I’d say two things to that, if it’s true: (1) give it an honest effort to learn the language.Maybe the Oilers could have done more initially to make that happen, but his handlers (agents, parents, coaches) have known since he was 15 that he was probably going to make a living in the NHL, so maybe be proactive and take English lessons (2)if you are a good guy and good teammate, language barriers are easily overcome.Look at all the Latin speaking players on the Jays.It seems to me that everybody likes Vladdy, even though his English is apparently pretty negligible.If JP is a good guy and a fun guy, all his English speaking teammates would have embraced him.At the very least taught him all the good swear words and he would have taught them how to swear in Finnish.

    Sorry, but something doesn’t add up here with our boy JP

    Not getting along with teammates is so not an excuse for refusing to come back to the team. Shit, I’m sure every NHL team has players that don’t get along or have had issues and sorted through them. Did Leon turn against the team after Darnell popped him. If that’s the case, get over it.

    If the crap about Connor/Leon not wanting to play with Jesse happens to be true (which I don’t believe), well, all of them need to grow the eff up.

    I still welcome Jesse back with open arms in mid-Sept if he signs and reports.

    Just do it kid.

  57. Side says:

    OriginalPouzar: Not getting along with teammates is so not an excuse for refusing to come back to the team. Shit, I’m sure every NHL team has players that don’t get along or have had issues and sorted through them.Did Leon turn against the team after Darnell popped him. If that’s the case, get over it.

    An example of ‘getting over it’ – see St. Louis Blues who in their huge losing streak while being in the basement of the standings, had a literal fight between teammates break out on the ice and then for them to go on to win the cup that season.

  58. Bad Seed says:

    It sure is funny that not one teammate has jumped to JP’s defence in all of this. Not one teammate saying we hope he comes back. Doesn’t seem like he has any allies on the team. Maybe he is a dick.

  59. Gerta Rauss says:

    Sounds like Bill Guerin is going to be named GM of the Minnesota Wild

    I was really pulling for Chia *chuckles*

  60. Side says:

    Bag of Pucks:
    Millennials don’t like suggestions that their generation could become the most disloyal in history in regards to average job tenure, but that’s what the data suggests.

    It’s a bit of a pickle alright.

    Or maybe it’s because millennials make up the largest workforce now and there are a lot more companies out there that are competing to attract and retain workers in a rapidly progressing and developing world which requires a larger spectrum of skills and the older generation doesn’t want to leave their current jobs because they may be tied up with pensions/retirement plans.

    Are older generations ‘more loyal’ and that’s why they didn’t leave their employer? Or did they just not have as much choice or opportunities back then as milennials do now?

    Nowadays younger generations are taught that they can simply hop on the internet and take a few hours to explore hundreds or thousands of companies spread out across the world who are looking for employees. This is something the older generations could not do until now, but again, why would they if they are already eyeing retirement or have already retired?

  61. 106 and 106 says:

    Appears Cooper Marody doesn’t feel like his skating is an issue and he wants a shot in the top 6.

    I get not being able to see your weaknesses, and he’s a great AHL skater, but in the NHL, it appears he’s a below average/replacement level skater.

  62. ArmchairGM says:

    OriginalPouzar:
    I still welcome Jesse back with open arms in mid-Sept if he signs and reports.

    As do I. Just for the record.

  63. OriginalPouzar says:

    godot:
    Signing a 3rd line centre who can’t PK seems pretty unwise if it for anything more than $1 million.

    ——————————————————————–
    It’s a long way to #Tippettary.It’s a long way to go.

    The Oilers have added lots of PK guys this off-season – Archibald, Granlund, Nygard (if he makes it), Haas (if he makes it). Brassard playing 3C and not killing penalties is fine.

  64. texmex says:

    Chris Johnston
    @reporterchris
    ·
    6m
    The wheels are in motion on free agent Derick Brassard finding a new home, but contrary to reports/speculation it won’t be in Edmonton.

  65. Bag of Pucks says:

    Side: Or maybe it’s because millennials make up the largest workforce now and there are a lot more companies out there that are competing to attract and retain workers in a rapidly progressing and developing world which requires a larger spectrum of skills and the older generation doesn’t want to leave their current jobs because they may be tied up with pensions/retirement plans.

    Are older generations ‘more loyal’ and that’s why they didn’t leave their employer? Or did they just not have as much choice or opportunities back then as milennials do now?

    Nowadays younger generations are taught that they can simply hop on the internet and take a few hours to explore hundreds or thousands of companies spread out across the world who are looking for employees.This is something the older generations could not do until now, but again, why would they if they are already eyeing retirement or have already retired?

    It’s possible those are factors as well

    And you’re somewhat stereotyping older generations here. I’m Gen X and as soon as the web/tech afforded me rhe opportunity in the mid 90s, I leveraged that new portability to work overseas. The Internet wasn’t invented by Millennials as much as they like to characterize the 40+ populace as luddites.

  66. Professor Q says:

    106 and 106:
    Appears Cooper Marody doesn’t feel like his skating is an issue and he wants a shot in the top 6.

    I get not being able to see your weaknesses, and he’s a great AHL skater, but in the NHL, it appears he’s a below average/replacement level skater.

    Maybe every Oilers prospect wants to have an assured Top 6 Role.

    Yikes.

  67. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Side: Employer loyalty is a concept that should die, imo.The number of times I have seen employers turn on employees in the name of profits or change is huge.I have even seen employers ask candidates to commit to working for them full time, for at least 5 years, even though they acknowledge that they don’t pay as well or have benefits to match their competitors. Why on Earth would anyone do that?

    Employers inherently seek a profit off of the backs of their employees who make significantly less.Employees don’t owe them anything outside of loyalty, imo.

    Of course this is generally speaking, and I do acknowledge there are a lot of employers who are loyal to their employees and their employees are loyal in return.

    I just disagree with the notion of “someone hired you, so you owe them your life, even if they overwork you, don’t pay you enough, and give you poor benefits”

    This is far too broad a statement. Working for large corporations that essentially have become stock price entities masquerading as businesses is a lot different than working for small and or private businesses.

    I have literally worked with thousands of people and have employed dozens. The number of them that sported a decent attitude, had a decent work ethic AND were actually good at the job all at the same time is maybe 5%.

    Many people are reaping what they’ve sown, and like Jesse think the world is hosing them even though they won’t put the work in that more successful people do.

    Most employers I know are dying to find for people that will show up predictably, act in a normal business like way, and be reliably competent.

    I see this across industries of various levels of education and professionalism.

  68. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Bag of Pucks: It’s possible those are factors as well

    And you’re somewhat stereotyping older generations here. I’m Gen X and as soon as the web/tech afforded me rhe opportunity in the mid 90s, I leveraged that new portability to work overseas. The Internet wasn’t invented by Millennials as much as they like to characterize the 40+ populace as luddites.

    One thing about millennials that surprises me is that while they are great with apps and using technology, an awful lot of them don’t really understand (or care) how the internet and it’s background works, what is actually going on.

    Perhaps it’s because they have never had a world without tech. It’s just there, they don’t think about it.

  69. Reja says:

    OriginalPouzar: Not getting along with teammates is so not an excuse for refusing to come back to the team. Shit, I’m sure every NHL team has players that don’t get along or have had issues and sorted through them.Did Leon turn against the team after Darnell popped him. If that’s the case, get over it.

    If the crap about Connor/Leon not wanting to play with Jesse happens to be true (which I don’t believe), well, all of them need to grow the eff up.

    I still welcome Jesse back with open arms in mid-Sept if he signs and reports.

    Just do it kid.

    Mid-sept of what year?

  70. Side says:

    Bag of Pucks: It’s possible those are factors as well

    And you’re somewhat stereotyping older generations here. I’m Gen X and as soon as the web/tech afforded me rhe opportunity in the mid 90s, I leveraged that new portability to work overseas. The Internet wasn’t invented by Millennials as much as they like to characterize the 30+ populace as luddites.

    This is another reason why generational differences are silly that you indirectly touch on.

    Most researchers indicate millennials are born early 80s. A lot of them ARE 30+ people. Everyone seemingly has a different definition of what age group falls under what generation, but sweeping generalizations are made to describe these moving target age groups.

    And you just described that you leveraged this new technology to go work overseas. Surely, you were already working somewhere else so I guess my question to you would be – why weren’t you, self described Gen X’er, loyal to your employer instead of working overseas?

    I’m guessing it’s because if the internet wasn’t around, you wouldn’t have known about the opportunity, and you wouldn’t have gone for the job. Now does that make you disloyal, or are you just, like you are saying, using these opportunities afforded to you that were not available to the generations like baby boomers?

  71. Crazy Pedestrian says:

    texmex,

    Awww…. why you gotta be like that? Way to kill the buzz man!

    We were all hoping for the best, but it turned out like always… #becauseoilers

  72. Oilman99 says:

    Primetime: It may still be a bit about money, as he may see his lack of opportunity as to why he received only a qualifying offer vs. his draft class all vying for massive RFA contracts.

    That being said, interesting to see the 2 Finns from that class end up in the same spot despite different paths.Both Laine and JP highly touted and clear cut top 3 picks.One gifted top 6/PP1 minutes, the other slow played on lower lines with no PP.While Laine had initial success, it’s slowed a bit, but now both are without a signed contract with word that Winnipeg hasn’t even really started negotiating with Laine yet.Maybe Aho really was the straw that stirred the drink on that incredible World Junior line….

    Laine has shown that he is basically a one dimensional player that teams have learned to effectively defend against. JP was a young eighteen year that didn’t realize how hard you have to work to become a legitimate NHLer, and probably didn’t choose the best agent either. Aho has has proven to be the real deal.

  73. Side says:

    Scungilli Slushy:

    Most employers I know are dying to find for people that will show up predictably, act in a normal business likeway, and be reliably competent.

    I see this across industries of various levels of education and professionalism.

    And this has always been the case, this has never changed, it’s not a generational problem.

    No matter who I talk to, across any age group, in any industry or job they have worked, past or present, there is always stories of people who were not predictable, were abnormal, were incompetent, were lazy, were *insert any other undesirable quality that gets associated with any generation*.

    It’s just how people are.

  74. Scungilli Slushy says:

    I don’t think the younger generations are any different than ever, with the exception that in this era the governments are opting out of areas they used to actively govern. As in allowing the internet and it’s business to go largely unregulated until now because it’s not surprisingly become a problem.

    the resulting explosion of media has eroded traditional systems that kept quality and integrity high in reputable organizations has led to enormous amounts of info everyone is exposed to that is far too often just plain wrong or untrue.

    The amount of unhelpful and false things I hear and read about employment and working is saddening. I feel sorry for young people around being fed a bill of goods, and finding out the hard way the world is as it always was, with the exception of the internet and smart phones destabilizing so many helpful ideas and things that lead to personal stability and a feeling of well being.

    Enough preaching, I’ll get back to work.

  75. Ben says:

    Wow, all these hot & credible Laraque scoops are going to drive Taylor Hall right back to rehab.

  76. Material Elvis says:

    Side: Maybe 20 years from now we will find out that JP has been hinting at something more nefarious going on within the Oilers that he discovered.Has anyone studied JP’s face in interviews to see if his blinks are translating into morse code?

    Not sure about eye blinks but his Nose Licking/60 rate is very high.

  77. Reja says:

    Oilman99: Laine has shown that he is basically a one dimensional player that teams have learned to effectively defend against. JP was a young eighteen year that didn’t realize how hard you have to work to become a legitimate NHLer, and probably didn’t choose the best agent either. Aho has has proven to be the real deal.

    I wonder if Kosh is thinking the same thing about his agent.

  78. Bag of Pucks says:

    Side: This is another reason why generational differences are silly that you indirectly touch on.

    Most researchers indicate millennials are born early 80s.A lot of them ARE 30+ people. Everyone seemingly has a different definition of what age group falls under what generation, but sweeping generalizations are made to describe these moving target age groups.

    And you just described that you leveraged this new technology to go work overseas.Surely, you were already working somewhere else so I guess my question to you would be – why weren’t you, self described Gen X’er, loyal to your employer instead of working overseas?

    I’m guessing it’s because if the internet wasn’t around, you wouldn’t have known about the opportunity, and you wouldn’t have gone for the job.Now does that make you disloyal, or are you just, like you are saying, using these opportunities afforded to you that were not available to the generations like baby boomers?

    I’ve given every employer I’ve worked for a minimum committment of 3 years, save one exception that caused me to move due to family reasons. I’ve also been married for 26 years and still have great relationships with a number of good friends dating back to school days. In short, loyalty is a quality I value in myself and others

    You’re trying to have your cake and eat it too in this thread imo. On one hand, you generalize in regards to previous generations. Then when this is pointed out, you use this as proof of the folly of such generalizations?

    If your point is that all people are too unique to neatly fall into generational buckets, I would agree. But there also societal trends that can be quantified by demographic that we ignore at our own peril imo.

  79. Material Elvis says:

    OriginalPouzar: Not getting along with teammates is so not an excuse for refusing to come back to the team. Shit, I’m sure every NHL team has players that don’t get along or have had issues and sorted through them.Did Leon turn against the team after Darnell popped him. If that’s the case, get over it.

    If the crap about Connor/Leon not wanting to play with Jesse happens to be true (which I don’t believe), well, all of them need to grow the eff up.

    I still welcome Jesse back with open arms in mid-Sept if he signs and reports.

    Just do it kid.

    Connor and Leon’s behavior as Oilers has been exemplary. Jesse is the one who needs to grow the eff up. He’s a distraction and not an impact player. Not sure why they would want him back at this point.

  80. Bag of Pucks says:

    Scungilli Slushy: One thing about millennials that surprises me is that while they are great with apps and using technology, an awful lot of them don’t really understand (or care) how the internet and it’s background works, what is actually going on.

    Perhaps it’s because they have never had a world without tech. It’s just there, they don’t think about it.

    I think one of the biggest issues we have in society is a propensity for individual echo chambers. With information on demand, you can now go as deep as you choose on your topics of interest.

    As a result, you can encounter people who can write you a dissertation on Cosplay but don’t have a clue how to stop their toilet running.

    This is likely not a generational thing. Plenty of older folks with narrow focuses. Technology is enabling and incentivizing this behaviour for all.

  81. Side says:

    Bag of Pucks: I’ve given every employer I’ve worked for a minimum committment of 3 years, save one exception that caused me to move due to family reasons. I’ve also been married for 26 years and still have great relationships with a number of good friends dating back to school days. In short, loyalty is a quality I value in myself and others

    You’re trying to have your cake and eat it too in this thread imo. On one hand, you generalize in regards to previous generations. Then when this is pointed out, you use this as proof of the folly of such generalizations?

    If your point is that all people are too unique to neatly fall into generational buckets, I would agree. But there also societal trends that can be quantified by demographic that we ignore at our own peril imo.

    My point is as you described, people are too unique to neatly fall into generational buckets. And yes, I generalized to demonstrate a point.

    Yes, I agree there are differences between generations – those legitimate differences are often buried under a large amount of false equivalencies though. And those false equivalencies I find are often a result of lazy reporting or used as clickbait headlines.

    People love to hate millennials and people love to blame baby boomers.

  82. dangilitis says:

    At 21 I had just started medical school, having dedicated the previous 3 years to gaining entry. Nothing was handed to me, and I was already accruing debt. Sorry if I don’t see eye to eye with the verbal from a millionaire gifted with talent and a supportive group in the city

  83. rickithebear says:

    On avg their is 3936 even center minutes available in a season

    Looking at Nat stat trick our top 3 lines by season EVTOI:

    Draisaitl – Mcdavid – xxx 890 EVTOI
    xxx – Mcdavid – xxx 575 EVTOI

    Neal – RNH – Kassian 500 EVTOI
    xxx – RNH – xxx 400 EVTOI
    RNH roughly 370 at wings

    xxx – Draisaitl – xxx 590 EVTOI
    xxx – Gagner – xxx 300 evtoi

    3936 – (1465 + 900 + 590) = 981 center minutes DZ & 3C

    Of Mcdavids (1465 x2) 2930 winger minutes.
    2040 is available to wingers other than Draisaitl.

    Of a RNH 2490 winger minutes.
    800 is available to wingers other than Neal/Kassian.

    Of Draisaitls 590 EVTOI at center.
    1180 is available to wingers.

    That is 4020 even minutes of legitimate #1 even C time available to Wingers.

    Kassian was a 1000 even min winger last year. 400 min with Brodziak DZ role.
    Suggests 600 RNH, 400 min Brodziak.
    Maybe they split 600 between Mcd and RNH.
    Heavy min PK.

    Chaisson was a 1000 even min winger his centers last year.
    RNH 300 RNH, 300 min Mcdavid, 150 Draisaitl 3C,
    200 w/ Cave, Gagner, spooner, Gambardella, Brodziak
    Repeat RNH/Mcd/ Drai, 80 Haas@3C,

    Neal Has been 1040 even min LW.
    500 RNH, 440 Mcdavid, 100 Gagner@3C

    Granlund 800 even min
    340 Drai@C, 250 Mcd, 100 RNH, 100 Gagner @3c 30 Brodziak@C

    Archibald 900 ev min Playing with 3/4C.
    340 Drai@C, 250 Mcd, 200 RNH, 110 Brodziak
    Heavy min on PK

    Gagner 760 min
    310 Mcd, 300 playing 3C, 150 Drai@C

    Jurco 730 ev min
    350 Mcd, 200 Drai@C, 180 Gagner@3C

    Nygard 600 ev min 8-9 evg
    340 Mcdavid, 120 Gagner @3C, 80 haas@3C 60 Brodziak

    Haas 880 ev min
    600 Brodziak, 100 Mcdavid, 100 Gagner @3C – Haas takes draws, 80 @3C

    Khaira has been a 750 min EVTOI fwd.
    Last yr 185 RNH@C, 175 Brodziak@C, 70 Mcd@C, 330 likely @C
    Like to see 200 RNH, 200 MCD, 400 DZ LW a 50 min bump.
    Heavy min on PK.

    Cave as 4C/W filler for injuries.
    With heavy PK minutes during those games.

  84. jp says:

    Primetime: He was put in the top 6 and PP1 right from the get go.JP would argue he could have put up similar numbers if given the same opportunity.Not saying he would but am sure that’s what he thinks.

    Yes Laine produced, but that’s after the fact.He was given the opportunity first, not asked to work his way up the lineup

    JP wasn’t asked to work his way up either.

    In 16-17 his Centers by TOI were
    Draisaitl 107
    McDavid 84
    RNH 40
    Letestu 17
    Lander 7

    He got essentially only top 6 line mates. He wasn’t able to hold a spot in the lineup (remember how near everyone thought he should have been sent down sooner than he was?) but it wasn’t because he was asked to work his way up.

  85. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    – Re: Jessie. I think he has the talent to play with skill. I don’t think he has been given a fair shake with the organization to play with skill with any consistency

    – Playing with skill and getting minutes with good players generally results in points, and points get you paid in this league

    – Jessie isn’t getting the linemates or minutes he “deserves”, given his pedigree and talents

    – I agree with Jessie: I think the Oilers have been wrong. Jessie wants to play and he wants to get paid. He will get the chance elsewhere to “prove” himself.

    – If Jessie thought there was any indication that things will be different, and that the new regime seems him as a potential elite talent, he would be happy to join

    – As it is, there has not been one message from anyone in media, or associated with the team, or a player or management stepping up for Jessie.

    – The Oilers have made up their mind on who he is, and Jessie doesn’t agree with them: its’ his prerogative to not accept another season where he plays less than 12 minutes a game, no PP time, no consistent C to play with.

    – I’m on team Jessie: and if the Oilers don’t want to believe in him other than to say: “we will trade him when it suits us”, that is their perogative. But Jessie is right: this is his career.

  86. Bag of Pucks says:

    Side: My point is as you described, people are too unique to neatly fall into generational buckets.And yes, I generalized to demonstrate a point.

    Yes, I agree there are differences between generations – those legitimate differences are often buried under a large amount of false equivalencies though.And those false equivalencies I find are often a result of lazy reporting or used as clickbait headlines.

    People love to hate millennials and people love to blame baby boomers.

    I agree with all of this and offer you the option to elegantly disengage now, to spare you the hassles of all that contextually targeted clickbait 😊

  87. rickithebear says:

    jp: JP wasn’t asked to work his way up either.

    In 16-17 his Centers by TOI were
    Draisaitl 107
    McDavid 84
    RNH 40
    Letestu 17
    Lander 7

    He got essentially only top 6 line mates. He wasn’t able to hold a spot in the lineup (remember how near everyone thought he should have been sent down sooner than he was?) but it wasn’t because he was asked to work his way up.

    He was a 6’4” 18 yr old twig who could not speak English.
    It was his ego & desire that was an issue.

    So he comes back more physically mature at 19
    EVTOI with
    Lucic 467.5 57.0% jP scored 6 evg .77 evg/60
    Mcdavid 258.75 31.6% 5 evg 1.16 evg/60 #1 RW rate
    Strome 238.5 29.1% 3 evg .76 evg/60
    Khaira 136.6 16.7% 1evg .44 evg/60
    RNH 118 14.4% 1 evg .51 evg/60
    Drai 103.75 12.7% 1 evg .59 evg/60
    Maroon 62.25 7.6% .00 evg/60
    Slepyshev 60.5 7.4% 1 evg .99 evg/60
    Kassian 58.0 7.1% .00 evg/60

    Kid generates 1.16 evg/60 with Mcd in 17-18

    Then Oilers
    Play him 67 min with Mcdavid & give 8 other wingers more Time
    Rattie 247.5 2 evg .48 evg/60

    Giving 8 wingers more EVTOI than JP was the Oilers telling JP to Fuck Off!

    Any one who thinks playing winger that got 1.16 evg/60 with Mcdavid less minutes than 8 other wingers is good player mgmt is bat shit crazy.

    The character narative From MSM is a bull shit narative.

    It is really sad!

  88. Bag of Pucks says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux,

    Team Jesse.

    I immediately pictured a greasy agent with a combover, an uber hot Nordic gal pal, and a gang of friends/sycophants playing Fortnite.

  89. Victoria Oil says:

    Islanders sign Brassard as per TSN. I haven’t seen the cap hit yet.

  90. Material Elvis says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux:

    – Jessie isn’t getting the linemates or minutes he “deserves”, given his pedigree and talents

    Pedigree maybe but those ‘talents’ have not translated into ‘results’. Why does he (or you) think that he deserves top 6 minutes? Just because he was drafted 4OV? There really isn’t much to support this notion other than a reasonable points/60 number with McDavid. All of his other numbers are middling to poor.

  91. Material Elvis says:

    Yakupov was drafted 1OV and put up way more offense than JP. Why isn’t he currently playing top 6 minutes in the NHL?!

  92. Todd Macallan says:

    Victoria Oil,

    1 x 1.2m as per twitter

  93. godot10 says:

    Jesse doesn’t have a contract. He is entitled to say what he wants. He did what he was told for three years, and it was a disaster.

    Nobody in the dressing room is stepping up to say that they want Jesse back. Jesse’s apparent belief is that the room doesn’t want him back.

    Puljujarvi was a crucial player for the organization. All sides seem to have blown it.

    Holland has to find a way to maximize value and minimize the damage. Not his or Tippett’s fault.

    ——————————————————————————
    It’s a long way to #Tippettary. It’s a long way to go.

  94. godot10 says:

    Material Elvis:
    Yakupov was drafted 1OV and put up way more offense than JP.Why isn’t he currently playing top 6 minutes in the NHL?!

    Eakins destroyed the player.

  95. jp says:

    rickithebear: He was a 6’4” 18 yr old twig who could not speak English.
    It was his ego & desire that was an issue.

    So he comes back more physically mature at 19
    EVTOI with
    Lucic 467.5 57.0%jP scored 6 evg .77 evg/60
    Mcdavid 258.75 31.6%5 evg 1.16 evg/60 #1 RW rate
    Strome 238.5 29.1% 3 evg .76 evg/60
    Khaira 136.6 16.7% 1evg.44 evg/60
    RNH 118 14.4% 1 evg.51 evg/60
    Drai 103.75 12.7% 1 evg .59 evg/60
    Maroon 62.25 7.6% .00 evg/60
    Slepyshev 60.5 7.4% 1 evg.99 evg/60
    Kassian 58.0 7.1% .00 evg/60

    Kid generates 1.16 evg/60 with Mcd in 17-18

    Then Oilers
    Play him 67 min with Mcdavid & give 8 other wingers more Time
    Rattie 247.5 2 evg .48 evg/60

    Giving 8 wingers more EVTOI than JP was the Oilers telling JP to Fuck Off!

    Any one who thinks playing winger that got 1.16 evg/60 with Mcdavid less minutes than 8 other wingers is good player mgmt is bat shit crazy.

    The character narative From MSM is a bull shit narative.

    It is really sad!

    If Puljujarvi needs to play with McDavid all the time to be happy, and needs to be played with McDavid to produce then JP has the issue (the former seems to be your speculation, the latter is closer to reality).

    I posted this to you yesterday (you didn’t reply):

    Puljujarvi’s centers in 18-19 were:
    RNH 242 (incl 25 min with RNH/McDavid)
    Draisaitl 74 (incl 19 min with Drai/McDavid)
    Strome 69
    McDavid 67
    Brodziak 52
    Cave 34

    So yeah he didn’t play a ton with McDavid, but he did get top 6 centers for what, 80+% of his minutes. You really seriously think that amount of playing time with RNH and Draisaitl is a big fuck off to JP?

    A huge issue is that he didn’t score with anyone other than McDavid.

    17-18 and 18-19 EVG/60 with:
    RNH 363min 0.66
    McDavid 326min 1.10
    Strome 307min 0.59
    Draisaitl 179 0.34
    Brodziak/Letestu/Cave 131min 0.00

    He’s scored at 3rd or 4th line rates with everyone not named Connor. That’s a tough position for the team if the ONLY spot where a player is successful is 1RW.

  96. Woogie63 says:

    I wouldn’t worry too much about the language around the Jesse negotiations, we all know that is a tactic for both sides.

    Deals that get done, generate the most total value.

    Jesse has to go through the NHL to get a $50M contract AND the Oilers need a cheap 2RW with upside.

  97. Reja says:

    Victoria Oil:
    Islanders sign Brassard as per TSN. I haven’t seen the cap hit yet.

    Oh shit back to my Jesse plus asset or roster player for a 3C that can Play 2C in a pitch PK and win a fricking faceoff when it counts.

  98. Material Elvis says:

    godot10: Eakins destroyed the player.

    And yet he never demanded a trade from the Oilers.

  99. dangilitis says:

    rickithebear: He was a 6’4” 18 yr old twig who could not speak English.
    It was his ego & desire that was an issue.

    So he comes back more physically mature at 19
    EVTOI with
    Lucic 467.5 57.0%jP scored 6 evg .77 evg/60
    Mcdavid 258.75 31.6%5 evg 1.16 evg/60 #1 RW rate
    Strome 238.5 29.1% 3 evg .76 evg/60
    Khaira 136.6 16.7% 1evg.44 evg/60
    RNH 118 14.4% 1 evg.51 evg/60
    Drai 103.75 12.7% 1 evg .59 evg/60
    Maroon 62.25 7.6% .00 evg/60
    Slepyshev 60.5 7.4% 1 evg.99 evg/60
    Kassian 58.0 7.1% .00 evg/60

    Kid generates 1.16 evg/60 with Mcd in 17-18

    Then Oilers
    Play him 67 min with Mcdavid & give 8 other wingers more Time
    Rattie 247.5 2 evg .48 evg/60

    Giving 8 wingers more EVTOI than JP was the Oilers telling JP to Fuck Off!

    Any one who thinks playing winger that got 1.16 evg/60 with Mcdavid less minutes than 8 other wingers is good player mgmt is bat shit crazy.

    The character narative From MSM is a bull shit narative.

    It is really sad!

    The list of people who produce when played with McDavid is long
    He didn’t earn 1st line minutes, nor did he earn top 6 minutes

    I’m not one for character assassinations but there is no sugar coating what he’s said thus far.

  100. oilsnc79 says:

    Victoria Oil,

    1.2 mil yr

  101. duct tape and foil says:

    I liked Jessie from day 1 even though I wanted Dubois. Never though Columbus would pass but that was a huge red flag the organization had little time to process. Do remember some rumors of Columbus passing pre-draft though.

    That said, all Jesse needed to do this summer was train hard and keep his pizza pie-hole shut. He could not manage that and it speaks to a serious lack of maturity and maybe even grey matter.

  102. Ribs says:

    Material Elvis: And yet he never demanded a trade from the Oilers.

    The fool!

  103. BornInAGretzkyJersey says:

    Reja,

    Craig Simpson told the Leafs to not draft him. They took Wendell Clark instead.

  104. defmn says:

    For what it is worth.

    https://www.beerleagueheroes.com/edmonton-oilers-edmonton-media-use-poorly-translated-quote-in-attempt-to-put-yet-another-nail-in-puljujarvis-coffin/

    I’m very lucky in that I’ve got some wonderful Finns and others who are fluent in Finnish who follow me that can help me to translate things in their proper context and this is what I was told with regards to that quote,

    Jesse actually said this, ”I think if i get the chance, I can show what I have and can do.”

    That’s very different from the quote at the top of this post, right? See, I’ve been told that Finnish can be very literal and using Google translate is a dodgy proposition.

    From @TimoKurki on Twitter,

    The article on TSN (Bardown) was done using Google Translate. Kinda lazy and unprofessional in my opinion. The only thing JP actually said was that his goal was to become a top-six forward. That’s it.

  105. jp says:

    Todd Macallan:
    Victoria Oil,

    1 x 1.2m as per twitter

    That’s too bad. I’d have loved to see him in Edmonton for that number.

  106. OriginalPouzar says:

    BadSeed:
    It sure is funny that not one teammate has jumped to JP’s defence in all of this.Not one teammate saying we hope he comes back.Doesn’t seem like he has any allies on the team.Maybe he is a dick.

    With respect, that is not confirmation, or close thereto, that he doesn’t have any allies.

  107. Reja says:

    BornInAGretzkyJersey:
    Reja,

    Craig Simpson told the Leafs to not draft him. They took Wendell Clark instead.

    In my best Ace Ventura voice “Really!” From what I remember there was no doubt who was going first and who the Leafs were choosing but then again that was many moons ago.

  108. OriginalPouzar says:

    106 AND 106:
    Appears Cooper Marody doesn’t feel like his skating is an issue and he wants a shot in the top 6.

    I get not being able to see your weaknesses, and he’s a great AHL skater, but in the NHL, it appears he’s a below average/replacement level skater.

    I suspect you didn’t listen to the entire interview or read Gregor’s piece in full?

  109. jp says:

    defmn:
    For what it is worth.

    https://www.beerleagueheroes.com/edmonton-oilers-edmonton-media-use-poorly-translated-quote-in-attempt-to-put-yet-another-nail-in-puljujarvis-coffin/

    I’m very lucky in that I’ve got some wonderful Finns and others who are fluent in Finnish who follow me that can help me to translate things in their proper context and this is what I was told with regards to that quote,

    Jesse actually said this, ”I think if i get the chance, I can show what I have and can do.”

    That’s very different from the quote at the top of this post, right? See, I’ve been told that Finnish can be very literal and using Google translate is a dodgy proposition.

    From @TimoKurki on Twitter,

    The article on TSN (Bardown) was done using Google Translate. Kinda lazy and unprofessional in my opinion. The only thing JP actually said was that his goal was to become a top-six forward. That’s it.

    Thanks. Not that it matters at this point.

  110. defmn says:

    jp: Thanks. Not that it matters at this point.

    Probably not but it does offer a different take so I thought I would post it.

  111. jp says:

    defmn: Probably not but it does offer a different take so I thought I would post it.

    Yes, and it’s appreciated. Every little bit of truth helps.

    I thought even from the poorly translated version that was his most likely meaning. It’s a shame so many jump to criticize and conclude he’s entitled (though he may well be).

    Given he wasn’t swayed by a new coach or GM this seems clearly a personal issue with teammates from here.

  112. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    rickithebear,

    – This is exactly right. The Oilers “own” pool but he has the final call

    – It’s so obvious that they have said fuck you to a 21 year old who has massive skill has done things in small samples that are elite.

    – But Holland has no clue he’s just relying on the group that mismanaged him

    – Pool is trying to save his career and increase future earnings.

    – even if he’s wrong and he isn’t a top6 winger who can score when given 18 minutes he’s right.

    – and the oil and the msm feeding us bs. That’s the playbook

  113. OriginalPouzar says:

    MateriaElvis: Connor and Leon’s behavior as Oilers has been exemplary.Jesse is the one who needs to grow the eff up.He’s a distraction and not an impact player.Not sure why they would want him back at this point.

    Agree with respect to Jesse, however, you have no idea how regarding the behavior of Leon an Connor.

    I said I would take Jesse back with open arms if he signed, shut his mouth and worked his ass off, on and off the ice.

    Why wouldn’t I? He was 20 when last season ended.

    I’m confident he is not done developing as hockey player or a person.

  114. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Side: And this has always been the case, this has never changed, it’s not a generational problem.

    No matter who I talk to, across any age group, in any industry or job they have worked, past or present, there is always stories of people who were not predictable, were abnormal, were incompetent, were lazy, were *insert any other undesirable quality that gets associated with any generation*.

    It’s just how people are.

    Right, my point being employers aren’t really the problem. Sure some treat people poorly, but most don’t. Can’t, its too hard to find good employees.

    Especially smaller businesses who actually are the largest employers in Canada last time I came across that type of info.

  115. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Side: Maybe 20 years from now we will find out that JP has been hinting at something more nefarious going on within the Oilers that he discovered.Has anyone studied JP’s face in interviews to see if his blinks are translating into morse code?

    Ha! But it’s really all in the tongue taps to the nose.

    Edit – I see Material Elvis hit that up already

  116. OriginalPouzar says:

    KingerOilredux:
    – Re: Jessie.I think he has the talent to play with skill.I don’t think he has been given a fair shake with the organization to play with skill with any consistency

    – Playing with skill and getting minutes with good players generally results in points, and points get you paid in this league

    – Jessie isn’t getting the linemates or minutes he “deserves”, given his pedigree and talents

    – I agree with Jessie: I think the Oilers have been wrong.Jessie wants to play and he wants to get paid.He will get the chance elsewhere to “prove” himself.

    – If Jessie thought there was any indication that things will be different, and that the new regime seems him as a potential elite talent, he would be happy to join

    – As it is, there has not been one message from anyone in media, or associated with the team, or a player or management stepping up for Jessie.

    – The Oilers have made up their mind on who he is, and Jessie doesn’t agree with them: its’ his prerogative to not accept another season where he plays less than 12 minutes a game, no PP time, no consistent C to play with.

    – I’m on team Jessie: and if the Oilers don’t want to believe in him other than to say: “we will trade him when it suits us”, that is their perogative.But Jessie is right: this is his career.

    I agree he can play with skill.

    I disagree that he hasn’t had a chance with good linemates – the numbers show this.

    I don’t see how Jesse can determine the organization’s plans – I haven’t heard any accounts of he or his agent actually having that level of conversation with the manager or the coach.

    I don’t agree that the org has pigeon-holed Jesse in to a non top-6 player – does that sound like Holland vis-a-vis a 21 year old?

    I believe Jesse would have every ability and opportunity to prove himself if he didn’t sour his relationship and refuse to take that opportunity.

  117. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Bag of Pucks: I think one of the biggest issues we have in society is a propensity for individual echo chambers. With information on demand, you can now go as deep as you choose on your topics of interest.

    As a result, you can encounter people who can write you a dissertation on Cosplay but don’t have a clue how to stop their toilet running.

    This is likely not a generational thing. Plenty of older folks with narrow focuses. Technology is enabling and incentivizingthis behaviour for all.

    I was thinking that regardless of the toilet they don’t understand why they keep getting directed to the same Cosplay things, or even notice it.

    Of course I’m speaking generally, but my employees have largely been of that age group. If we’re doing any tech stuff in house I have to do it as when I asked them to I found out they didn’t really have the big picture.

    I suppose that is an effect of the echo chambers that age group is being hearded into by our friends at big internet.

  118. Scungilli Slushy says:

    godot10: Eakins destroyed the player.

    I can’t agree. Yak and Jesse share the same issue. They don’t want to play an NHL style game and don’t have enough offensive juice to have that option.

    If you want to play your own way you have to be an elite offensive talent and neither are.

    Is Tippertary ragging on Connor this summer about his shitty stats from last season? Highly unlikely and unnecessary because Connor already knows he doesn’t have to be told.

  119. Glovjuice says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux:
    – Re: Jessie.I think he has the talent to play with skill.I don’t think he has been given a fair shake with the organization to play with skill with any consistency

    – Playing with skill and getting minutes with good players generally results in points, and points get you paid in this league

    – Jessie isn’t getting the linemates or minutes he “deserves”, given his pedigree and talents

    – I agree with Jessie: I think the Oilers have been wrong.Jessie wants to play and he wants to get paid.He will get the chance elsewhere to “prove” himself.

    – If Jessie thought there was any indication that things will be different, and that the new regime seems him as a potential elite talent, he would be happy to join

    – As it is, there has not been one message from anyone in media, or associated with the team, or a player or management stepping up for Jessie.

    – The Oilers have made up their mind on who he is, and Jessie doesn’t agree with them: its’ his prerogative to not accept another season where he plays less than 12 minutes a game, no PP time, no consistent C to play with.

    – I’m on team Jessie: and if the Oilers don’t want to believe in him other than to say: “we will trade him when it suits us”, that is their perogative.But Jessie is right: this is his career.

    THIS. I agree with. The group think turn on Jesse here is brutal. Oilers fans at their finest.

  120. Glovjuice says:

    Bag of Pucks: I agree with all of this and offer you the option to elegantly disengage now, to spare you the hassles of all that contextually targeted clickbait

    Please stop. This back and forth is annoying. And, both of you know this.

  121. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    Material Elvis,

    – Read the quotes from spring training last year and how awesome he was. Then look at how he was deployed in regular season. He right to feel aggrieved and based on Oiler complex treatment and narrative he needs to look out for number one because when Neal gets more props by order of magnitude from press and management than pool it’s time to move on

    – sorry pool is right. Amd even if He isn’t actually top6 he’s still right to want to leave

  122. Scungilli Slushy says:

    I hope Holland can find a home for JP. I believed in him fully, but given my feelings on matters of attitude and the coin value of the head I don’t see his future playing out to the level of his potential.

    No knives out, just another Chia screw up. Consensus and all at #4, but I wonder if they actually did much background on him. Seems like they didn’t do much background work on anything under Pete.

    It wouldn’t be outrageous to not take a pick in consensus order in the draft, surprises every time.

  123. OriginalPouzar says:

    KingerOilredux:
    rickithebear,

    – This is exactly right. The Oilers “own” pool but he has the final call

    – It’s so obvious that they have said fuck you to a 21 year old who has massive skill has done things in small samples that are elite.

    – But Holland has no clue he’s just relying on the group that mismanaged him

    – Pool is trying to save his career and increase future earnings.

    – even if he’s wrong and he isn’t a top6 winger who can score when given 18 minutes he’s right.

    – and the oil and the msm feeding us bs. That’s the playbook

    In order save his career and increase earnings he has to play hockey and, likely, play hockey in the NHL – everything he has said and done (including on his behalf by his advisers) has decreased his ability to do that.

    The best way to do that is to sign his QO, come to camp, listen and do what he’s told and compete his ass off at camp and during the regular season.

  124. OriginalPouzar says:

    Glovjuice: THIS. I agree with. The group think turn on Jesse here is brutal. Oilers fans at their finest.

    1) the post you responded to was talking about management making their mind up on the player, not the fan-base – not only do I think that’s wrong, those are two different things

    2) the fanbase has been wildly supportive of Jesse up and till very recently when Jesse went from essentially just stating he wanted a new start somewhere else and taking it to a new level of entitlement, seemingly.

  125. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    OriginalPouzar,

    – your actually wrong. Look up the numbers. He has not averaged 16 minutes a game at even strength for any stretch of time with good forwards.

    – as ricki amd others have shown over and over if you use dummy stats like per 60 he shows well. But actual minutes with actual elite: the only conclusion is that they don’t rate him. He doesn’t get a fair shake. Never has on absolute minutes. That’s what matters

    – I’m totally right on this. The minutes don’t lie. The oilers have shot the bed on pool. He’s also owned that he needs to be better. This is the Oilers. A big time organization makes it work for him. Holland though he only has everyone whose been there to tell him that pool is shit

    – so Holland he just says pool will get traded when we say so. He has no intel or perspective or fancy stats to put pause to this. If he did he’d have taken a different tack. It’s clear.

    – And maybe they are right amd pool will never be an elite winger. But I’m on team Pool. I say f-you Oilers. He’s right. Holly be grinding out a 3rd vs the 4th being offered for him. Good for him.

  126. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    OriginalPouzar: In order save his career and increase earnings he has to play hockey and, likely, play hockey in the NHL – everything he has said and done (including on his behalf by his advisers) has decreased his ability to do that.

    The best way to do that is to sign his QO, come to camp, listen and do what he’s told and compete his ass off at camp and during the regular season.

    – your wrong. Another year with the same deployment as last year and he’s signing for league minimum like Magnus. He thinks he’s better than how he’s been deployed. He thinks that. The oil don’t agree. If I’m Pool I want to go somewhere else.

    – it’s extremely naive and devoid of reality for pool or you to think he just needs to sign show up and earn his minutes. He has no indication that he won’t be anything other than scratch 4liner because Neal Chiasson Kassian etc. No one has told him he’s part of the future.

    – he knows the drill. He’s sunk here. Holland has his guys and the only ears he have tell him he’s sh$t.

    – No one is fighting for pool. MSM in Edmonton is Epstein level facilitator for their whims. They get what they want.

  127. Walter Gretzkys Neighbour says:

    I for one am exceptionally tired of every single post here turning into a “Puljujarvi is great-Puljujarvi sucks” debate that devolves into essentially an argument eerily reminiscent of and as informative as the old “I know you are but what am I” format of discourse..

    Enough already. It’s all opinions. The guy is not coming back here.

    I recall a similar polarized rants about Yakupov.

  128. OriginalPouzar says:

    I am not wrong – I never said anything about his ice time, i spoke about his linemates and opportunities with strong linemates – his most common linemate was Lucic – that was a mix of 1st to 3rd line. His 2nd and 3rd most common linemates were McDavid and Nuge, 1st and 2nd line.

    The coaches were too quick to mix lines up during games, however, he started many of his games in the top 6 – didn’t necessarily finish there but lots of ice in the top 6.

  129. OriginalPouzar says:

    KingerOilredux: – your wrong. Another year with the same deployment as last year and he’s signing for league minimum like Magnus. He thinks he’s better than how he’s been deployed.He thinks that.The oil don’t agree.If I’m Pool I want to go somewhere else.

    – it’s extremely naive and devoid of reality for pool or you to think he just needs to sign show up and earn his minutes. He has no indication that he won’t be anything other than scratch 4liner because Neal Chiasson Kassian etc. No one has told him he’s part of the future.

    – he knows the drill. He’s sunk here. Holland has his guys and the only ears he have tell him he’s sh$t.

    – No one is fighting for pool. MSM in Edmonton is Epstein level facilitator for their whims. They get what they want.

    My goodness, what arrogance to call other people “wrong” because they don’t think things will go they way you do. My goodness.

    How the eff do you know that is wrong – you have no freaking way of knowing how he will be deployed.

    As I said, sign, come to camp ready, listen to the coaches and work his ass off. You think if he does that and has success that he won’t be provided with top 6 minutes? Seriously?

    Its up to the player to earn the top 6 minutes – if he signs and comes and works, its up to him and his performance. Ya, maybe he starts on the “3rd line” with Marody and Granlund. Work, listen, play and succeed and, ya, he’ll earn his way up.

    What a joke that arrogance is.

    Unreal.

  130. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    Walter Gretzkys Neighbour,

    – I actually don’t know if he great. I’m quite clear on that. I think he could be. But my defence is for Pools actions. Which is totally correct

    – and Edmonton they are actually correct in their behaviour based on how they rate pool

    – I just object strenuously to the msm treatment of pool however. And in this case I hope when they move him he is deployed properly and becomes elite.

    – night night.

  131. Munny says:

    Glovjuice: Please stop. This back and forth is annoying. And, both of you know this.

    Stunningly ironic.

  132. Munny says:

    Side: Oh, my misunderstanding then.

    Well, probably would’ve helped if I had prefaced my response, with “I agree…”. So it’s on me too.

  133. Munny says:

    Walter Gretzkys Neighbour,

    This is how we know it’s summer, lol.

    Dead mules gonna get beat.

  134. Munny says:

    defmn,

    Thank you for this clarification. Outstanding post.

  135. Kinger_Oil.redux says:

    OriginalPouzar,

    – oh sorry I got disconnected from my first class pod which is the only way to travel before I land and check into my 5 star hotel and eat the best because that’s the only way to travel

    – were you saying something? Arrogance?

  136. Munny says:

    I don’t know about you guys, but I’m pretty okay with Brassard signing elsewhere.

  137. Material Elvis says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux:
    Material Elvis,

    – Read the quotes from spring training last year and how awesome he was. Then look at how he was deployed in regular season. He right to feel aggrieved and based on Oiler complex treatment and narrative he needs to look out for number one because when Neal gets more props by order of magnitude from press and management than pool it’s time to move on

    – sorry pool is right. Amd even if He isn’t actually top6 he’s still right to want to leave

    I watched him at training camp — he was good. Guess what? That doesn’t mean shit if he can’t carry it over into the regular season. His regular season performance was mediocre at best.

    No he isn’t right to want to leave.— that’s a quitter’s mentality and I am strongly opposed to it. I prefer a stubborn ass who wants to prove everyone wrong. Either way, he won’t be a top 6 player on any other team so I don’t know what your point is.

  138. HT Joe says:

    Walter Gretzkys Neighbour: The guy is not coming back here.

    Yeah, well, that’s just, like, your opinion, man.

    😉

  139. Munny says:

    OriginalPouzar,

    Kinger_Oil.redux,

    Gents, you’ve wandered into personal territory.

  140. Material Elvis says:

    OriginalPouzar: My goodness, what arrogance to call other people “wrong” because they don’t think things will go they way you do.My goodness.

    How the eff do you know that is wrong – you have no freaking way of knowing how he will be deployed.

    As I said, sign, come to camp ready, listen to the coaches and work his ass off.You think if he does that and has success that he won’t be provided with top 6 minutes? Seriously?

    Its up to the player to earn the top 6 minutes – if he signs and comes and works, its up to him and his performance. Ya, maybe he starts on the “3rd line” with Marody and Granlund. Work, listen, play and succeed and, ya, he’ll earn his way up.

    What a joke that arrogance is.

    Unreal.

    Agreed. This is so obvious it’s painful. I feel like we are in bizarro world right now.

  141. Walter Gretzkys Neighbour says:

    HT Joe: As

    Well done you!

  142. Material Elvis says:

    Kinger_Oil.redux:
    OriginalPouzar,

    – And maybe they are right amd pool will never be an elite winger. But I’m on team Pool. I say f-you Oilers. He’s right. Holly be grinding out a 3rd vs the 4th being offered for him. Good for him.

    He has *no leverage* Kinger, so he isn’t right. Can’t you see this?

  143. rickithebear says:

    dangilitis: The list of people who produce when played with McDavid is long
    He didn’t earn 1st line minutes, nor did he earn top 6 minutes

    I’m not one for character assassinations but there is no sugar coating what he’s said thus far.

    You & jp in bed together.

    JP was 1.16 evg/60 in 17-18

    Drai got 890 with Mcd.
    Another Wing could get 890
    570 was what was left for 2 more wingers.

    Players who got more EVTOI on Mcdavids wing.
    Ranked by evg/60
    Drai 888 1.62 evg/60
    Caggulia 144.4 1.25 evg/60
    ——————————- 1.16 JP
    Proper usage says play JP a good portion of 590 available.
    Kassian 436.4 1.10 evg/60
    RNH 418.6 1.00 evg/60
    Chaisson 305.2 .79 evg/60
    Rattie 247.5 .48 evg/60
    Lucic 108 0.00 evg/60
    Yamamotto 86.4 0.0 evg/60
    Khaira 69 0.00 evg/60

    Rolling Drai & Caggulia 850 made a lot of sense
    Kassian & JP should see 450 min
    RNH plays 2C were he was really needed.
    Chiasson gets remaining 320 with Mcdavid
    That is the .79+ wingers available to him.

    That would have made sense.
    It would have elevated Caggulias trade value

    Then if you trade Caggulllia he gets you a heck of a lot more than what we got.

    With Strome at C for rest jp minutes ends up 15-16 evg RW.

    That is proper player mgmt and handling of a Prospect.

    Holland and LT: say draft +5
    I showed his history is 23 yr 35+ gm season debut.

    Showing zholland would not think he is even close to a developed prospect.

  144. OriginalPouzar says:

    KingerOilredux:
    OriginalPouzar,

    – oh sorry I got disconnected from my first class pod which is the only way to travel before I land and check into my 5 star hotel and eat the best because that’s the only way to travel

    – were you saying something?Arrogance?

    Wow, personal shots reeking of resentment.

    Please tell me how any of that is in any way related to telling another person they are wrong because they have a different opinion?

    Feel free to talk about the gifts on you life if you can do so without disparaging others for having differing opinions.

  145. HT Joe says:

    Walter Gretzkys Neighbour: Well done you!

    Thank you. 😀

    And with that, I’m stopping before I stumble by typing something regrettable. Good night all!

  146. Munny says:

    Walter Gretzkys Neighbour: Well done you!

    Made me smile too,

  147. Munny says:

    OriginalPouzar: Wow, personal shots reeking of resentment.

    He is responding to you calling him arrogant. Also a personal shot.

  148. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Munny:
    I don’t know about you guys, but I’m pretty okay with Brassard signing elsewhere.

    Completely.

    At this point is he any better than Marody? Why play vets that get outplayed over your own that will get outplayed but have upside?

    Is he a better centre than Gagner?

    The only outside players I want, are better than the incumbents and playesr in the system, and aren’t expensive UFAs whom rarely work out, at least for long, because their best days are behind them in hockey.

    I believe if players can be evaluated well, teaching and having patience will bring the biggest payoff.

    The Oilers haven’t been able to do anything like that in ages and the results speak for themselves. And is reflected in the average fan’s opinions of the players.

    Other teams don’t have better as much as they have done better, which makes players look better.

    Holland is right in that stability and culture drive almost everything in NHL success to summize his talk so far.The playing field is so level in a capped league. No league is unscouted and all teams use stats, smart teams pay attention to them.

    Culture (team attitude) and development are the real advantages. Forming what you have (getting ideal players is not freely available these days) into something helpful is probably the only thing not dependent on other teams, your competitors.

    The real cost of Yak and JP is not dollars, it’s the burnt high draft picks that normally pay out in a quality player. Often impact player in the top 5. Yak’s draft year was a weak one for forwards admittedly.

  149. Professor Q says:

    Munny:
    I don’t know about you guys, but I’m pretty okay with Brassard signing elsewhere.

    I think it’s just the implication and fuel for the 31 other teams to use to perpetuate “Edmonton Sucks”.

  150. Professor Q says:

    Munny: He is responding to you calling him arrogant. Also a personal shot.

    I think he was talking about Jesse’s arrogance.

  151. Munny says:

    Scungilli Slushy: At this point is he any better than Marody? Why play vets that get outplayed over your own that will get outplayed but have upside?
    Is he a better centre than Gagner?

    Well, we don’t know if Marody is as good as Brassard is today at the NHL level. Or at least I sure don’t. I’d put Brassard at about Gagner’s level. With a chance at being worse.

    He’s not strong defensively, not strong in the dot, isn’t a RH shot, declining offense and doesn’t PK. I don’t think he’s a good fit.

  152. Professor Q says:

    As an aside, the new jerseys actually look pretty cool.

    When they’re official and in full uniform I think there will be a much better reception.

    Mike Smith’s new pads are outrageously dangerous. Slick!

  153. Munny says:

    Professor Q: I think it’s just the implication and fuel for the 31 other teams to use to perpetuate “Edmonton Sucks”.

    sucks… on a boat?

    😉

    (because of the implication)

  154. Reja says:

    August 21,1981 Edmonton Oilers trade the rights of Don Murdoch to the Minnesota North Stars for
    Don Jackson and a 1982 3rd round pick #59 overall (Wally Chapman)

  155. Munny says:

    Reja,

    How Sather kept turning nothing into something was amazing. Truly was OC, Opposite Chia.

  156. Lowetide says:

    There were some great points in this thread so I’m not going to delete anything. Please please please try to refrain from making a mess, though. Okay? I have been busy all afternoon and evening, just happened by. As I said, some great points and some rage that might have been deleted by authors. That said, great stuff overall.

  157. rickithebear says:

    I look at our roster and I posted a fair distribution of
    Mcdavids 1460 x 2 winger minutes
    RNH (900 – 1270) x 2 winger minutes depending if RNH plays any wing this year.
    Draisaitl s 590 x 2 3C minutes. 7:12 per game would be intelligent usage.
    Drai players 10:51 per game at wing.

    When we look at wingers best evg/60 in last 3 years.
    Draisaitl 1.25
    Neal 1.15
    Jurco 1.02
    Granlund .98
    Gagner .95
    Archibald .89
    Khaira .80
    Kassian .79
    Chaisson .78

    Their is veteran Winger evg potential with even 1C caliber slotting on
    Mcdavids, RNH, Draisaitl 3C minutes wings.

    Holland has made JP and all the AHL prospect moot pts.
    Winning coaches like to roll veteran forwards who have shown top caliber production
    And
    Trustable positional Play.

  158. jp says:

    Professor Q:
    As an aside, the new jerseys actually look pretty cool.

    When they’re official and in full uniform I think there will be a much better reception.

    Mike Smith’s new pads are outrageously dangerous. Slick!

    It wasn’t Laraque who tweeted them was it??

    I like them too though (IF THEY’RE REAL!).

  159. Dee Dee says:

    I read an article this summer might have been Matheson or Cult of Hockey that stated that Jesse Puljujarvi was running into his own players during the power play to the point where it was leading to goals against. Was one of the reason some of the players didn’t want him on the PP.

    The coaches would spend hours explaining how they wanted him to play, driving to the net for example, and he would go out and do it once or twice and then revert back to his usual playing style.

    If a player is not going to follow directions they are going to ride the bench alot.

    I think he’s a great kid with skills and size but very stubborn.

    I know playing time and which line you are playing versus results can be a chicken and egg thing but I have never believed in the old Mantra that a player has to play with specific other players to get results. If the key to unlocking Jesse is playing 20 minutes a game with McDavid and Draisaitl you can be certain that about 900 other players in the NHL believe that as well.

    I hold no ill will for the player or the team in this situation. It’s just sad to see all that potential go to waste.

  160. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Munny: Well, we don’t know if Marody is as good as Brassard is today at the NHL level. Or at least I sure don’t.I’d put Brassard at about Gagner’s level.With a chance at being worse.

    He’s not strong defensively, not strong in the dot, isn’t a RH shot, declining offense and doesn’t PK. I don’t think he’s a good fit.

    True, to me is a top tier AHL skill player who is more than a goal suck going to be less effective than a lower tier NHL player?

    To me they are going to do the same thing for the team, one has at least some potential upside.

    Being a vet and still not getting things done at a head above water level doesn’t help. This has been the Oilers for years, acquiring players like that and finding they still suck as a team.

    I’d invest in youth for a similar outscored player. Same result in the short term.

    The caveat is the young player has the jam to do what it takes physically. To not be intimidated. Any player not willing to do that shouldn’t be in the NHL outside of elite skills.

  161. Georgexs says:

    The median 6F last season had 34 points. Total scoring in 18-19 was about the same as 17-18.

    The Oilers had just 4 forwards who crossed the 34 point mark. Our 6F was Lucic with 20 points, the lowest points total for a 6F across all teams.

    Going into 18-19, we had 5 forwards who reached the 34 point mark the prior year (17-18):

    CMD, 108
    Drai, 70
    RNH, 48
    Lucic, 34
    Strome, 34

    Lucic ended up with 20. Strome had 2 points in 18 games before he was traded. Our 4th top 6 forward turned out to be Chiasson with 38 points.

    Question: The Oilers entered 18-19 with 5 potential top 6 forwards, based on the prior year’s scoring and they ended up getting top 6 production from just 4 forwards. How does this compare to other teams?

    Team, # of top 6 forwards on roster based on 17-18 scoring*, # of top 6 forwards in 18-19

    ANA, 5, 4
    ARI, 5, 4
    BOS, 6, 6
    BUF, 5, 4
    CAR, 5, 5
    CBJ, 6, 7
    CGY, 7, 7
    CHI, 5, 6
    COL, 5, 5
    DAL, 5, 3
    DET, 5, 7
    EDM, 5, 4
    FLA, 6, 6
    LAK, 5, 4
    MIN, 5, 4
    MTL, 5, 7
    NJD, 3, 5
    NSH, 7, 5
    NYI, 6, 5
    NYR, 7, 6
    OTT, 5, 8
    PHI, 6, 5
    PIT, 7, 6
    SJS, 7, 8
    STL, 8, 6
    TBL, 8, 9
    TOR, 6, 8
    VAN, 2, 3
    VGK, 7, 7
    WPG, 7, 6
    WSH, 5, 7

    * To determine each team’s roster at the start of the season, I looked at the forwards who played a game for the team in October and assumed that this was the team’s forward group to start the season.

    Notes:

    1. There’s a reasonable correlation between the two sets of numbers.

    2. The only team (of 7) that had 4 or fewer top 6 forwards in 18-19 to make the playoffs was DAL; they tied for the lowest # of top 6 forwards with 3.

    3. The only two teams that started the season with fewer than 5 top 6 forwards were NJD and VAN. Both missed the playoffs.

    4. Of the 14 teams that had 5 top 6 forwards, only 4 made the playoffs.

    5. And of the 15 teams that started the season with 6 or more top 6 forwards, 12 made the playoffs. The only 3 that didn’t were FLA, NYR, and PHI. Having 6 or more top 6 forwards seems to be a really good idea for teams wanting to make the playoffs.

    So the number of top 6 forwards a team starts the season with seems to have some value in predicting if the team makes the playoffs. At least, it did last season. I’ll have to check prior seasons.

    Not a great sign for the Oilers, who will be entering 19-20 with the same 4 top 6 forwards from last season. Neal didn’t hit the mark in 18-19. None of the new additions did either.

    … Kind of killing my optimistic, brand new season vibe… hopefully, going back prior years offers more rays of hope…

    Ha, there you go… NJD made the playoffs in 17-18 while entering the season with just 4 top 6 forwards. And 2 of them (Henrique and Johansson) didn’t even get back to top 6 status. Hall had a Hart-worthy season. They had 1OV Hischier and Jesper Bratt play to top 6 form. And then they got a platoon of 20+ point performances. That’s a recipe.

  162. Munny says:

    Georgexs,

    There are four teams on your list who managed to improve the number of top 6 scoring forwards by two players YOY, so it’s not impossible. Neal didn’t manage to be one last year but with different deployment, I don’t think he’s an unreasonable bet. The tough bit is imagining where the 6th player will come from.

    Edit:

    This analysis you’ve presented over the past few days has been excellent. Thank you for posting it.

  163. rickithebear says:

    Draisaitl played 82gm 1483 EVTOI
    18:05 per game.
    He had 888 with Mcd.
    As previous yr check on past Nat stat pairs.
    And
    Some have recently commented.
    890 min is a fair limit for range
    10:51 of wing play on Mcd line
    590 min playing 3C has fair impact
    7:12 3C per game
    Clearly covers 590/992 59.5% of 3C play.

    End up with primary ( greater than 50% of avg position evTOI) play from
    Drai #1W
    Mcdavid #1C
    RNH #2C
    Drai #3C almost Every game.
    These three should see large EVTOI and PP.
    No PK.
    How many players are a starting winger & center every game?

  164. Munny says:

    Scungilli Slushy,

    I get your point, and think it is a reasonable stance.

    What happens will probably somewhat depend on what Holland thinks of this coming season (actually thinks, not publically states). Is it a lost season before leaving the starting blocks? Then yes. invest in the future. (And I think that is precisely what you’re saying).

    However I think there is some danger to that strategy, culture-wise.

    Personally, I’d try to get a Sheahan or Eakin or Boyle or someone of that ilk onto the roster and debut Marody on the wing in a position with less consequence and responsibility. And hopefully over time, he steals the 3C’s lunch money.

  165. Scungilli Slushy says:

    Munny:
    Scungilli Slushy,

    I get your point, and think it is a reasonable stance.

    What happens will probably somewhat depend on what Holland thinks of this coming season (actually thinks, not publically states).Is it a lost season before leaving the starting blocks? Then yes. invest in the future. (And I think that is precisely what you’re saying).

    However I think there is some danger to that strategy, culture-wise.

    Personally, I’d try to get a Sheahan or Eakin or Boyle or someone of that ilk onto the roster and debut Marody on the wing in a position with less consequence and responsibility.And hopefully over time, he steals the 3C’s lunch money.

    I don’t think this is a lost season, it can be a good one.

    I’m fine bringing in a player better than Marody and if possible do it .

    I was getting at bringing in declining players that actually aren’t more helpful than Marody, and have no upside and won’t contribute more in the now. Use the at bats for future benefit if the short term results are equal . Of course it’s hard to predict if the results will be equal , but if the right things are in place risk is mitigated. Such as killing the AHL, having some bat and skill.

  166. Munny says:

    Scungilli Slushy,

    I don’t disagree with that. And I don’t mind your Mendoza line of must-be-clearly-better-than-what-we-have. Nice standard, in fact.

    But I am concerned with the incumbent players’ reading of breaking TC with Marody at 3C and I think Old Dutch is too. I think Holland has little choice but to find better than a Marody-bet for that slot. At least we both know Brassard ain’t that guy.

  167. defmn says:

    Georgexs:
    The median 6F last season had 34 points. Total scoring in 18-19 was about the same as 17-18.

    Question: The Oilers entered 18-19 with 5 potential top 6 forwards, based on the prior year’s scoring and they ended up getting top 6 production from just 4 forwards. How does this compare to other teams?

    Team, # of top 6 forwards on roster based on 17-18 scoring*, # of top 6 forwards in 18-19

    OTT, 5, 8

    That one stood out for me.

    And I would like to echo Munny’s remark. Excellent work the last few days and much appreciated.

  168. Side says:

    Glovjuice: Please stop. This back and forth is annoying. And, both of you know this.

    Not quite as annoying as self appointed forum police who don’t skip posts.

  169. Bag of Pucks says:

    Side: Not quite as annoying as self appointed forum police who don’t skip posts.

    I thought we had a good adult debate. Respectful, civil and informative.

    I guess I didn’t get the memo on how everyone is supposed to agree on everything now. Kum-ba-ya.

  170. Munny says:

    Bag of Pucks,

    Side,

    You guys did, and I, for one, enjoyed reading it.

  171. rickithebear says:

    George XS:
    Top 6 is a reference to even play.
    Scoring is diffrent than pointing.

    So you are looking at top 6 even goal production.

    I looked at Pacific and Central rosters.

    As well I presented the evg numbers for #31, #62, #93 C, LW, RW.
    So looking at top 6 #62 higher evg forward on our team.
    Drai #2 RW
    Mcd #2C
    RNH #31 C
    Neal normally #15 LW
    Kassian #37 RW
    Chaisson #44 RW
    Archibald #51RW
    Granlund #60 LW
    That is 8.

    Jurco 1.02 evg/60 600+ min at this rate is top 60 winger.

  172. Side says:

    Bag of Pucks: I thought we had a good adult debate. Respectful, civil and informative.

    I guess I didn’t get the memo on how everyone is supposed to agree on everything now. Kum-ba-ya.

    And it’s literally the slowest period of the offseason where the most exciting news is finding out who Derrick Brassard signs with.

    Oh well. I guess some would rather have no conversation than some off topic conversations.

  173. jp says:

    Munny:
    Georgexs,

    There are four teams on your list who managed to improve the number of top 6 scoring forwards by two players YOY, so it’s not impossible. Neal didn’t manage to be one last year but with different deployment, I don’t think he’s an unreasonable bet.The tough bit is imagining where the 6th player will come from.

    Edit:

    This analysis you’ve presented over the past few days has been excellent.Thank you for posting it.

    Kassian should easily manage 34 if he stays with McDavid, no? 45 point pace in the 2nd half.

    And Gagner always scores in that range (or rate). 50 points in 16-17 (we can ignore that). 74 games/31 points in 17-18. 34P/82. Last season 32 games/13 points. 33P/82. It wouldn’t be a stretch at all.

    It will be tough to go from 4 to 6 players with 34, but individually each player could easily do it.

  174. OriginalPouzar says:

    Side: And it’s literally the slowest period of the offseason where the most exciting news is finding out who Derrick Brassard signs with.

    Oh well. I guess some would rather have no conversationthan some off topic conversations.

    I thought the most exciting news of the day was that Haas was at the airport, on his way to Edmonton?

  175. Lowetide says:

    New for The Athletic: Oilers coach Dave Tippett might have to take drastic action in order to find a second outscoring line in 2019-20

    https://theathletic.com/1154077/2019/08/22/oilers-coach-dave-tippett-might-have-to-take-drastic-action-in-order-to-find-a-second-outscoring-line-in-2019-20/

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